I just bought a 1.2 HDMI Yamaha receiver yesterday and I am wondering if I bought too soon. Is the 1.3 HDMI signal from the PS3 "switchable" through my amp?

I just bought a 1.2 HDMI Yamaha receiver yesterday and I am wondering if I bought too soon. Is the 1.3 HDMI signal from the PS3 "switchable" through my amp?Yes.

Actually, the PS3 software only supports HDMI 1.2 functionality at this time. None of the HDMI 1.3 features are supported at this time, and even if/when they are next year, the PS3 will still work with your Yamaha receiver in HDMI 1.2 backward compatibility mode.

I'm confused...how is Sony able to "activate" 1.3 HDMI?
Thru FW??
I didn't think HDMI could be updated that way... :confused:

I'm confused...how is Sony able to "activate" 1.3 HDMI?

I didn't think HDMI could be updated that way...The PS3 uses a Silicon Image HDMI 1.3 silicon transmitter. The PS3 software only supports HDMI 1.2 functionality at this time.

To get HDMI 1.3 functionality, you must have both a HDMI 1.3 transmitter chip (hardware) and software in the player that actually supports those HDMI 1.3 features. If you are missing one or the other, you don't get HDMI 1.3 functionality.

All other BD players have a HDMI 1.1/1.2 transmitters from Silicon Image. You can upgrade a player's software, but it's not possible to upgrade HDMI 1.2 hardware to support 1.3 without replacing the chip.

when will receivers with HDMI 1.3 be available??. Im looking to get a new receiver and i dotn want to buy one that has only HDMI 1.2. Is it worth waiting? I heard only HDMI 1.3 will only offfer TruHD sound.

when will receivers with HDMI 1.3 be available??. Im looking to get a new receiver and i dotn want to buy one that has only HDMI 1.2. Is it worth waiting? I heard only HDMI 1.3 will only offfer TruHD sound.
The first 1.3 recievers will be shown at CES in Jan.
Expect to see them in stores by spring.

I think it's worth waiting.
I have the PS3 & want the 1.3 audio so I've waited over a year to update & will wait a few months more.

The first 1.3 recievers will be shown at CES in Jan.
Expect to see them in stores by spring.

I think it's worth waiting.
I have the PS3 & want the 1.3 audio so I've waited over a year to update & will wait a few months more.


oh ok great, i guess i will have to wait to b/c i want the Pioneer Elilte receiver which is like $1,200 to match my Pio 5070HD, so if ima spend that much money for a receiver i am definately going to wait. Plus I heard you can only get the TruHD sound with HDMI 1.3. Is that right?

I heard you can only get the TruHD sound with HDMI 1.3. Is that right?
Thats the way I understand it, all the Blu-Ray & HD-DVD lossless codecs are only avalible with 1.3.

If your player can decode the lossless codec, then it can transmit the data as PCM over an HDMI 1.1 link. You don't really need a HDMI 1.3 link.

There are other issues that make it desirable to have the player decode the audio signal rather than the receiver. I think that that is the trend. It's also cheaper since you don't have to replace your receiver every time a new format appears.

Thats the way I understand it, all the Blu-Ray & HD-DVD lossless codecs are only avalible with 1.3.
No because the players can decode (Toshiba and PS3) and send as lossless LPCM over HDMI 1.0 and up.

On the Blu-Ray side, only the PS3 can internally decode Dolby TrueHD lossless and unpack the data to its original LPCM uncompressed state right now. In March it should be able to do that with DTS Master Audio. You then only need a 1.1 HDMI input receiver or surround pre-amp that takes 8 channel LPCM. HDMI 1.2 might be helpful for SA-CD playback if you want to send raw DSD to the outboard decoder.

The Panasonic may have a lossless decoding upgrade in April or May.

There are some instances where internal audio decoding in the player will be required. That is if the disc was authored in advanced mode. Stupid stipulation, I know, as I'm not interested in whooshing or clicking button noises.

ok my revised question is: If i buy a Pioneer receiver now, the top of the line Elite series which has HDMI 1.2 will that specific receiver be able to receive and/or output TruHD Sound or do I have to wait until April, 2007 for Pioneer to come out with the receivers that have the new HDMI 1.3??? I do not want to waste my money on something i want to use in the near future. Please respond with knowledge. Thank you.

re Pioneer Elite Receiver - Yes if your player can decode. No if your player can't.

The Pioneer will accept 7.1 LPCM over HDMI 1.1 (& 1.2). But your player must decode and send the LPCM data.

ok my revised question is: If i buy a Pioneer receiver now, the top of the line Elite series which has HDMI 1.2 will that specific receiver be able to receive and/or output TruHD Sound or do I have to wait until April, 2007 for Pioneer to come out with the receivers that have the new HDMI 1.3??? I do not want to waste my money on something i want to use in the near future. Please respond with knowledge. Thank you.
If you have the Panasonic then you can use the 7.1 analog outputs to receiver TrueHD as PCM and there is a DTS-MA upgrade supposedly in the near future.
If you have the Pioneer Elite you will not be able to get DTS-MA or TrueHD, only PCM through either the analog outputs or the HDMI 1.1
If you have the PS3 you'll be able to send the TrueHD as PCM and PCM as PCM through the HDMI 1.3 port; there should also be a firmware upgrade to allow DTS-MA decoding by March.
If you have the Samsung you can send PCM through either the HDMI 1.1 port or the analog outputs. You cannot use TrueHD or DTS-MA/HD, but you can use DD+
If you have the Philips you can send PCM through either the HDMI 1.1 port or the analog outputs. You cannot use TrueHD or DTS-MA/HD or DD+

The only advantages the HDMI 1.3 receiver gives you is the ability to send the advanced audio through HDMI for the receiver to decode, but it has to be coming from a player with an HDMI 1.3 port, of which currently the PS3 is the only one.

If you have a receiver that only has analog outs and you're looking to upgrade then I'd say it's worth waiting for the HDMI 1.3 receivers. If you already have an HDMI 1.1 or up receiver then you should consider looking for a player with decoding abilities. HDMI 1.2 only adds 1 bit support for SACD for the most part. If you're a big SACD fan then you probably already have a player hooked up with analog outputs of D Link; if you don't and the PS3 is giving you the itch to check out SACD then you'll need at least an HDMI 1.2 receiver, which if you don't already have would be worth waiting 3 more weeks to find out when the Pioneer HDMI 1.3 receivers will be out.
The Pioneer will accept 7.1 LPCM over HDMI 1.1 (& 1.2). But your player must decode and send the LPCM data.
All players will send PCM data.

Panasonic does not have any decoding for the advanced audio codecs. That is coming with an update next year.

The Pioneer Elite 82 and 84 receivers do have an LFE ".1" (bass) channel level issue with PCM over HDMI. Pioneer has promised an update, but has yet to deliver it. The only receivers tested right now that seem to have the fewest issues with audio over HDMI (reported so far) are the Denon 2307, 2807, 3806, 4806 version 2, and 5806 version 2.

The only advantage in waiting for CES and new decoder announcements is to see if these issues are resolved, whether their new DSP engines will accept 192 kHz signals, and which models will have HDMI 1.3 and the new audio formats on board (all audio codecs are converted back to LPCM signals no matter where the decoding takes place).

Again, if any disc is authored in the advanced mode and there is no workaround given, then you still must have decoding of the advanced audio formats to LPCM inside the player first. That's regardless of whether your receiver or pre-amp, or player had HDMI 1.3 inputs and outputs. If a disc has an LPCM track and no Dolby TrueHD, DTS Master Audio, or Dolby Digital Plus track then these issues are moot.

Oh, and if you're confused, LPCM stands for Linear Pulse Code Modulation. It's the most widely used digital recording standard in the industry since its inception in the late 1970's. Some are also using Sony/Philips' DSD recording format (Direct Stream Digital).

Dan

Looks like Denon, who have previously stayed with HDMI 1.1 and used the D Link for DSD, have announced their HDMI 1.3 receivers.

http://www.hometheaterblog.com/hometheater/2006/12/denons_hdmi_13.html

Denon appears ready to announce that all of their A/V receivers for 2007 (scheduled to be released in the middle of the year) will support HDMI 1.3; read 36-bit color-depth and 1080p pass-through. But as you might have already guessed the good folks at Denon (and presumably Marantz) have more in-store than just the HDMI 1.3 capabilities for the yet-to-be-launched receivers.
Again, if any disc is authored in the advanced mode and there is no workaround given, then you still must have decoding of the advanced audio formats to LPCM inside the player first. That's regardless of whether your receiver or pre-amp, or player had HDMI 1.3 inputs and outputs. If a disc has an LPCM track and no Dolby TrueHD, DTS Master Audio, or Dolby Digital Plus track then these issues are moot.
This so far only applies to HD DVD, not to Blu-ray.

If you have the Panasonic then you can use the 7.1 analog outputs to receiver TrueHD as PCM and there is a DTS-MA upgrade supposedly in the near future.
If you have the Pioneer Elite you will not be able to get DTS-MA or TrueHD, only PCM through either the analog outputs or the HDMI 1.1
If you have the PS3 you'll be able to send the TrueHD as PCM and PCM as PCM through the HDMI 1.3 port; there should also be a firmware upgrade to allow DTS-MA decoding by March.
If you have the Samsung you can send PCM through either the HDMI 1.1 port or the analog outputs. You cannot use TrueHD or DTS-MA/HD, but you can use DD+
If you have the Philips you can send PCM through either the HDMI 1.1 port or the analog outputs. You cannot use TrueHD or DTS-MA/HD or DD+

The only advantages the HDMI 1.3 receiver gives you is the ability to send the advanced audio through HDMI for the receiver to decode, but it has to be coming from a player with an HDMI 1.3 port, of which currently the PS3 is the only one.

If you have a receiver that only has analog outs and you're looking to upgrade then I'd say it's worth waiting for the HDMI 1.3 receivers. If you already have an HDMI 1.1 or up receiver then you should consider looking for a player with decoding abilities. HDMI 1.2 only adds 1 bit support for SACD for the most part. If you're a big SACD fan then you probably already have a player hooked up with analog outputs of D Link; if you don't and the PS3 is giving you the itch to check out SACD then you'll need at least an HDMI 1.2 receiver, which if you don't already have would be worth waiting 3 more weeks to find out when the Pioneer HDMI 1.3 receivers will be out.

All players will send PCM data.


Hey thats for that great response, i wish i checked back sooner but yea i will wait for the new HDMI 1.3 receivers from Pioneer to come out for my next purchase. Im a strictly HDMI user now except for the xbox 360 which is only component. So im looking for to hear the difference in the sound with TrueHD and DTS/MA.

This so far only applies to HD DVD, not to Blu-ray.

Yes, but won't that change on future discs when they get BD-J going?

While we're on the subject of HDMI, can someone explain or point me to a discussion of how the audio sync ("lip sync") feature will work in 1.3? The pessimist in me thinks it may be something as simple as getting the audio and video synchronized in the player and then sending that out, where it could of course get out of sync down the chain. Or is it more sophisticated, where devices communicate with each other and coordinate appropriately? Will it only work with 2 devices (player and display), or will it allow things like a receiver, video scaler, etc. in the way?

I don't think the new digital audio streams will work any differently than they do now via coax or optical (or i.Link or HDMI for that matter). The audio processor should have some sort of delay feature (just like now). Doing some sort of synching would be the easiest in the player where both streams are decoded.

larry

Edit: I just read that HDMI 1.3 will have a "auto lip synch feature". I will allow the TV or audio processor to report its audio processing delay. This will allow the player to delay the video for that amount of time. So it seem that may be another EDID or "handshake" data item. It would be nice if audio processors (receivers) allow this value to be set/changed by the user.

Is there anyway to look at a cable and tell if it is 1.1 1.2 or 1.3? I'm being told that with my new Samsung 720 that I can avoid some problems if I have all 1.3 cables. I bought 2 recently from Monoprice, but I don't remember if they are 1.3 or if the one that came with my DVR is 1.3 or not

Is there anyway to look at a cable and tell if it is 1.1 1.2 or 1.3? I'm being told that with my new Samsung 720 that I can avoid some problems if I have all 1.3 cables. I bought 2 recently from Monoprice, but I don't remember if they are 1.3 or if the one that came with my DVR is 1.3 or not

The monoprice ones can support all 3, but they do have ones that are certified 1.3 compatible, but I doubt it will make any difference unless your utilizing 1.3 features (dts-hd-ma bitstreaming or deep color) which are not commonly available components today.

-splints

The monoprice ones can support all 3, but they do have ones that are certified 1.3 compatible, but I doubt it will make any difference unless your utilizing 1.3 features (dts-hd-ma bitstreaming or deep color) which are not commonly available components today.

-splints

Fair enough, I don't know if the Samsung HT-AS720ST is 1.3 capable or not

The monoprice ones can support all 3, but they do have ones that are certified 1.3 compatible, but I doubt it will make any difference unless your utilizing 1.3 features (dts-hd-ma bitstreaming or deep color) which are not commonly available components today.

-splintsThe new certification level level that came out the same time as the 1.3 spec is just for higher bandwidth capabilities that can be used with 1.3. Nothing to do with any certain features - cables have no idea what is being sent over them. Read all about it in the HDMI forum here.

larry