Does anyone know when the PS3 will get the 1080p24 support update?

Maybe soon - maybe never ;-) We all know Sony...

So it is not confirmed for sure?

I'd rather have support for DTS-Master.

So it is not confirmed for sure?

Correct, i would still be asking the if question, not the when question.

Wait a minute - 1080p support already works. What is it? 1080p60? If so, why do you need 1080p24 support?

-KLH
Ken H*rrigan

Wait a minute - 1080p support already works. What is it? 1080p60? If so, why do you need 1080p24 support?

-KLH
Ken H*rrigan

To match up with a 1080p24 TV. (Do any exist yet?) That would avoid having to do 3:2 in the PS3.

To match up with a 1080p24 TV. (Do any exist yet?)

Yes, at least one I know of because I own it. It's a new projector from, guess who, SONY.

The VPL-VW50 was designed specifically to accept 1080/24p input (as well as just about everything else) with a refresh rate or 96Hz, the highest of any consumer display that I am aware of. One of the engineers that helped design this new model told me it was designed specifically with Blu-ray in mind.

BTW, I have seen what native 1080/24p looks like on this projector using the Pioneer BD player, and yes, this is something anyone with this or any other display that can accept this input will want. I eagerly await the update for the PS3 that will allow 1080/24p output. The announcement that this feature would be supported played a major factor in my decision to purchase the PS3.

Edit: The new 1080P Pioneer Elite plasma also accepts 1080/24p input.

Most of the new 1080p projectors will accept 24p. That means no more studder on scrolling scenes.

Right. The Pearl, Mits 5000, and RS1 for sure do, and probably others. If this will be added for sure at some point soon, I am in on the PS3.

Edit: The new 1080P Pioneer Elite plasma also accepts 1080/24p input.So do the non-1080p Pioneer Elites

The mitsu 52631 dlp supports it, I have it and it is awesome with 24fps.
It will do 24,30 and 60. Not wure about the other mitsu models yet, pretty sure the sammy xx88 does also.

The 1080p Brillians accept 24fps input and show it at 120fps.

I just bought a 60A2000 a few months ago. However the next tv I buy in a few years will be one that scans at 120fps. Then it can do 24 x 5 or 30 x 4 with no problems at all. :)

The mitsu 52631 dlp supports it, I have it and it is awesome with 24fps.
It will do 24,30 and 60. Not wure about the other mitsu models yet, pretty sure the sammy xx88 does also.


I own a sammy hls-6188, and I am pretty sure it does not support 24

Only a couple of higher end TVs/PJs can accept 1080p24 signal at this point. I would think, if you own a high end display, then probably you would pair it with a high end BD player like Pio or Pana for example. Therefore in my opinion 1080p24 support would be a nice feature in the future, but now that 99.99% of displays cannot even accept 1080p, this is a non-issue.

Well, I have on order the new JVC projector, so I want 24p, but I didn't want to waste extra money on a high end BD player if the image is similar, especially since I think Bluray is going to loose. That is why I went with the PS3, and Sony had better make good on their promise soon....

As per my comment i've never seen a single comment/pomise from Sony on this feature so i wouldn't go around expecting it to come true.

What? I thought it was supposed to support this out of this box?!?!?! It scares me that it doesn't support it now because I don' t think they will ever get around to it.

Well, I have on order the new JVC projector, so I want 24p, but I didn't want to waste extra money on a high end BD player if the image is similar, especially since I think Bluray is going to loose. Very interesting. So you bought a PS3 to minimize your Blu-ray damage. :cool:

But as far as I know, neither HD-XA1 nor HD-XA2 has 1080p24 playback capability. ;) Am I wrong?


fuad

But as far as I know, neither HD-XA1 nor HD-XA2 has 1080p24 playback capability. ;) Am I wrong?



The XA2 1080p is 1080p60, but it is rumored that a future firmware upgrade will support 1080p24.

Only a couple of higher end TVs/PJs can accept 1080p24 signal at this point.

First, it's much more than a couple. I can count about ten projectors that accept 1080p24 (even the cheap Panasonic AX100).

Second, so far there was no motivation for the CE companies to include 1080p24 support because there were no 1080p24 sources. Now there are. And in a week, we'll have a plethora of announcements for 1080p24 sources and displays.

I bought my HD-DVD player long before I thought about upgrading my projector. Maybe this summer or fall I will upgrade that player to a 24p as well when the prices drop if HD-DVD is still going strong. There are days when I'm convinced HD-DVD will win, other days I think Bluray will prevail. Right now I'm just trying to get the best picture I can without risking too much cash....

Most of the new 1080p projectors will accept 24p. That means no more studder on scrolling scenes.

Though the lack of judder on linear movement is dependent on the display displaying the 24p input in a manner that doesn't re-introduce judder (i.e. displaying it at 2:2 48Hz, 3:3 72Hz, 4:4 96Hz, 5:5 120Hz etc. and not simply re-introducing 3:2 to display it at 60Hz)

There is absolutely no reason why a display needs a 1080/24p input to do this though - as a 1080/60i or 1080/60p input with 3:2 can still be 3:2 reversed to 1080/24p and displayed as above - though I don't know how many displays do this.

Maybe we will get some info at CES about if/when the PS3 will get 1080p24 support.

I have never heard about PS3 supporting 24p, ever... As a PS3 owner, if it does happen, cool, but I'm definitely not holding my breath on this one.

I have never heard about PS3 supporting 24p, ever... As a PS3 owner, if it does happen, cool, but I'm definitely not holding my breath on this one.


There was some info a while back on this forum about a 1080p24 update supposedly coming in March. I would just like to hear some more confirmation about this if it is true.

Why is this so important? I'm not sure I understand the signifcance of 1080p24 support.

There was some info a while back on this forum about a 1080p24 update supposedly coming in March. I would just like to hear some more confirmation about this if it is true.
http://www.beyond3d.com/forum/showthread.php?t=36188
All you need to know there.
The first in the series is about the SACD player.
http://pc.watch.impress.co.jp/docs/2.../mobile357.htm

Though PSX (the DVD recorder) was too weak to decode SACD in software, it was expected that the PS3 would be able to. SCE began the development in a relatively earlier stage. But even at the beginning of this year the SACD decoder was 6 times slower than realtime to convert surround DSD sound into PCM.
The manager of the Software Platform division at SCE who were in charge of software codecs and players estimated it'd be impossible to finish if they kept that pace. A developer from the Sony HQ who developed softwares for VAIO PC came to SCE and they assigned the development of an SACD decoder codec to him.
SACD is stored in the DST format (= compressed DSD). DST changes compression methods and parameters every 1/75 seconds, which eats huge processing load when decoding. In the first 2 months the developer optimized it into realtime processing. Then he threw away the old source code and wrote a faster new codec in 3 weeks with the knowledge he had gained. It uses 5 SPEs - 3 SPEs for DST decompression, and 2 SPEs for DSD to PCM conversion.
After that, he debugged it while consulting the professional audio equipments division of Sony that
developed the DSD format itself. It took 6 months.
Then the audio tuning specialist at the audio division of Sony began to use a PS3 to check the sound of the then unreleased HD receiver TA-DA3200ES. He pointed out where to fix in the PS3's digital audio processing to SCE. It was in the early October, and the dynamic range at that time was 140dB which was the initial goal set by another Sony developer who developed DSD. The PS3 firmware version 1.10 is this version with a few updates. The decimation filter of the SACD decoder outputs at 24bit/88.2kHz.
However, last Friday, Honda went to a place for the interview with Ken Kutaragi for some audio/videophile magazine. They brought there an even newer version with a decimation filter at 24bit/176.4kHz. Also, the 64-bit DP internal data of the decimation filter is rounded down to 30-29-bit instead of 24-bit for the output. The dynamic range is over 170dB and the theoretical number reaches 180dB in 30-bit. Honda says its sound was really good even when compared with the sound of the 1.1 version firmware. The Sony developer attributes the goodness to the fact that the software SACD codec of the PS3 processes all data in 64-bit double precision. This new firmware version will be available when the BD remote is released in December.
As for improving CD sound, upsampling is apparently easy by writing a FIR filter. But it is not yet in the PS3 software player as it takes some time to choose an appropriate upsampling function and noise shaping algorithm.


The #2 is about the BD video player.
http://pc.watch.impress.co.jp/docs/2.../mobile358.htm

Quote:
Since the standards for BD-ROM such as BDMV and BD-J were delayed, particular player functions were developed later while 2 years has already passed for the development of software decoding function for codecs such as H.264.
H.264 decoding itself was not very difficult for Cell with moderate optimization and they could play a movie in realtime at the first try unlike very difficult SACD optimization. However, because they began the development without knowing the final Blu-ray standard, they set the goal very high for decoding 2 full HD H.264 streams at 40Mbps simultaneously. Besides the clockspeed of the devkit was lower than the final product which made the development difficult. The current decoder can decode full HD H.264 with 3 SPEs.
The current BD/DVD player for the PS3 does internal pixel processing at 16-bit per RGB. (The output depends on the display color depth.) Though the 1.0 firmware was 8-bit per RGB, Kutaragi ordered the change of the design at the final product review and it was upgraded to 16-bit in the 1.1 firmware.
It's still not enough for TV and theater projectors that can display the original YCrCb stored in BD and DVD. For example the current PS3 player lacks gradation in brighter and darker parts of pictures when compared to Panasonic DMP-BD10. The reason why the internal processing is done in RGB is because RSX can't have 2 color spaces at the same time. Honda suspects they used RGB for the player because in the prototype design they planned to overlay XMB in RGB onto the picture of BD/DVD. In the final design XMB is not overlayed onto the player.
Actually Kutaragi also ordered the development of the version with YCrCb internal processing at the final review. In the firmware version released in December it becomes possible for a user to choose RGB or YCrCb.
The current player converts interlace to progressive only for SD movies. Right now SCE developers are working to improve DVD picture quality after they implemented YCrCb. After that it's planned to do something for 1080i to 1080p conversion. Though the RAM size can be an obstacle for it, SCE developers say they can do it by splitting the load between Cell and RSX.
Currently there are complaints from users about non-existent DVD upscaling in the PS3. As for the interlace-to-progressive conversion before upscaling, the current player has it already. There was a team at the division for broadcast equipments at Sony that does research for improving image quality by using the NVIDIA shader language. They ported it onto RSX. After Cell does noise reduction and other filters, RSX does interlace-to-progressive conversion. Though the current algorithm has bugs for some video sources, SCE says the conversion precision will be upgraded by future updates. Also the noise reduction filter is currently optimized for video sources with relatively many MPEG noises recorded with a video recorder. SCE knows lack of picture details because of it and will provide new default values for noise reduction by checking recording formats and media IDs for DVD discs. As for upscaling, they are doing the research to develop a high-quality multi-tap upscaling filter that balances the load between Cell and RSX. They also plan to use the non-original luminance information generated in upscaling for HDMI 1.3 deep color.
Currently it's known that the audio quality of DTS is especially good compared to other audio codecs as heard in playing 480p DVD via HDMI with more bandwidth for the audio. SCE don't know the definitive reason. They just ported the reference source code provided by DTS with as high precision as possible.
An SCE developer recommends trying 1.5x fast-forward playback in the PS3 BD player to see the power of Cell. When it's connected to a display via 1080/60p, it becomes very smooth as Cell has an enough margin for video decoding. In 1.5x fast-forward playback it decodes all frames then inserts them into 60fps with sped up audio.
SCE declared that they'd support 1080/24p in the PS3.



There will be 1080p/24, DTS-MA amongst other things by the time the European launch hits.

Just a quick question that I've been wondering about for some time. What's the difference between 1080p@60fps vs. 1080p@24fps and which one is considered better? Thanks...

Just a quick question that I've been wondering about for some time. What's the difference between 1080p@60fps vs. 1080p@24fps and which one is considered better? Thanks...

60fps is better for games for the obvious reason: higher fps the smoother game playback. However its different for movies. Most cinema are filmed in 24fps (HD-DVD and Blu-Ray movies are both encoded in 1080p24) and to view them on your HDTV, your TV uses what's called a 3:2 pulldown method, which in short, allows playback on your TV using 1080p60 by adding additional frames. However, 1080p60 causes noticible "juddering" in some scenes, which can be completely eliminated by using 24 (or multiples like 24,48,72). More info on this can be found here (http://www.xbox.com/en-US/hardware/accessories/20061003-hddvd.htm)

Since 1080p is relatively new and there are only a handful of these sets, there are even less TV's which can handle 1080p24. Although some TVs out there are not "officially" advertised to handle 1080p24, it CAN be done in some situations. For instance in my case, my Sony 40XBR2, not advertised to handle 1080p24, can in fact do this with a HDDVD/BD -> PC ->DVI/HDMI setup (and with other software)

As for the PS3 being able to do 1080p24 in the future, this is good news. I might pick one up myself, only thing keeping me is the lack of HDMI receivers (For sound) and not being sure if my TV can "officially" handle 1080p24. As of now, although complex, I prefer the HDDVD -> PC -> HDTV@1080p24 + 5.1 analog to speakers (for Dolby TrueHD).

http://www.beyond3d.com/forum/showthread.php?t=36188
All you need to know there.


There will be 1080p/24, DTS-MA amongst other things by the time the European launch hits.



Thanks for the info :) When is the European launch?

Bottom line: Being able to receive 1080p/24 isn't really the key. The set needs to be able to receive 1080p/24 and then to show it at a multiple of 24 fps (i.e., 48, 72, 96, or 120). Receiving 1080p/24 and then showing it a the standard 1080p/60 provides no improvement.

Bottom line: Being able to receive 1080p/24 isn't really the key. The set needs to be able to receive 1080p/24 and then to show it at a multiple of 24 fps (i.e., 48, 72, 96, or 120). Receiving 1080p/24 and then showing it a the standard 1080p/60 provides no improvement.


Good point. This is why I am interested, as my new JVC projector coming soon will accept 1080p24 AND display at a multiple, and so will many of the new projectors coming out, and some are already out (Pearl, Mits 5000, etc...).

So if your TV has 3:2 pulldown it should be turned off when playing HD-DVDs since HD-DVDs have 1080p 24 support or the same with BD if it was available?

So if your TV has 3:2 pulldown it should be turned off when playing HD-DVDs since HD-DVDs have 1080p 24 support or the same with BD if it was available?The configurable 3:2 pulldown on current displays only applies to SD signals.

Repeating for emphasis:
Bottom line: Being able to receive 1080p/24 isn't really the key. The set needs to be able to receive 1080p/24 and then to show it at a multiple of 24 fps (i.e., 48, 72, 96, or 120). Receiving 1080p/24 and then showing it a the standard 1080p/60 provides no improvement.

Thanks for the info :) When is the European launch?

Last I heard we get PS3 sometime in March.

Yes I believe it will coincide with Casino Royale on Blu-ray.

my pio 4270 accepts 1080/24 signal also...

But my question is, when i go into the ps3 settings and select 1080p, the screen blanks and wont allow me to select it. At what point will i know if the tv is accepting it and converting it or not? When i click "display" button on the tv remote, it will never say 1080p since my tv cannot actually display it... If the firmware updates the ps3 to output 1080/24, will the 1080p setting be "accepted" through the ps3 display settings?

So there is actually no confirmation whatsoever that the play station will support 1080p24 ?
Disappointing.

I have learned for some time now not to buy equipment on promised features - what would you call a feature that Sony does not even confim to be working on ?

This is everything that's known about the 1080p24 situation, and the rest of the planned updates for PS3 on the A/V side; the link I've provided is also where the 'rumors' originated from in the first place, but if you read it, I'm sure you'll recognize the validity (and awesomeness) of what you're reading. March is when a very large firmware update is scheduled for (confirmed recently along with the PS3 Euro launch date), so we're hoping that the majority of these will be addressed in it.

Now people just need to relax a little.

http://www.beyond3d.com/forum/showpost.php?p=883605&postcount=1

its still not here!

http://www.beyond3d.com/forum/showthread.php?t=36188
All you need to know there.


There will be 1080p/24, DTS-MA amongst other things by the time the European launch hits.

Thank you! I have been trying to find that story for a while now.

its still not here!

Well the Euro launch has come and gone, and no 1080p24 or DTS MA. I hope these will still hit at some point (hopefully soon!)

Well the Euro launch has come and gone, and no 1080p24 or DTS MA. I hope these will still hit at some point (hopefully soon!)
If you were Sony what would you focus on for this big update that happens to coincide with a major launch; two features that few people understand or can utilize or "Help cure cancer!";)

He I think those two would be wonderful, but I can't blame Sony for the focus on F@H in 1.6. Sony has stated that the PS3 will do 1080p/24 hopefully sooner rather than later. I don't about MA.

How do you find out if your HDTV supports 1080p/24fps? I have a Sony 50A2000 SXRD, which has native 1080p, but nothing in the specs on video compatibility for this. Any help?

How do you find out if your HDTV supports 1080p/24fps? I have a Sony 50A2000 SXRD, which has native 1080p, but nothing in the specs on video compatibility for this. Any help?
Most displays will advertise that capability. I know the Pioneer Elites that can handle 72hz advertise it. Hopefully someone who is more familar with that particular display can give you a better answer.

From the CNET review of the 60A2000:
Around back, you'll find a solid complement of inputs, including two HDMI with 1080p input capability (they'll accept more-common 1080p/60fps sources but not 1080p/24); two component-video, one A/V with composite- and S-Video, one A/V with composite-video only; one VGA-style PC input (1,366x768 maximum resolution, a disappointment for a 1080p HDTV); and one each antenna and cable RF inputs. There are also an analog audio output and a digital optical audio output for use with the Sony's ATSC tuner. In an unusual move, the company's designers included a third component-video input on the front panel instead of an S-Video, joining it with standard composite video and analog audio inputs.

If you were Sony what would you focus on for this big update that happens to coincide with a major launch; two features that few people understand or can utilize or "Help cure cancer!";)

He I think those two would be wonderful, but I can't blame Sony for the focus on F@H in 1.6. Sony has stated that the PS3 will do 1080p/24 hopefully sooner rather than later. I don't about MA.

If it is any clue - Sony have just announced a new range of Bravia displays in Europe and Japan with 24p display options. Could be PS3 gains 24p output when they ship?

If it is any clue - Sony have just announced a new range of Bravia displays in Europe and Japan with 24p display options. Could be PS3 gains 24p output when they ship?
heh one could hope so, but in most companies it's rare that the left hand knows what the right is doing.

Sony has stated that the PS3 will do 1080p/24 hopefully sooner rather than later.

Hopefully means 1080p/24 may or may not come.
I recommend to stay clear of the PS3 if 1080p/24 is what you want.

I was interested in it for some time even though I do not like the look of a game console in my equipment rack, but no 1080p/24 means no sale.

I still hope that those who could use 1080p/24 will eventually get it from their PS3, but don't hold your breath.

Hopefully means 1080p/24 may or may not come.
I recommend to stay clear of the PS3 if 1080p/24 is what you want.

I was interested in it for some time even though I do not like the look of a game console in my equipment rack, but no 1080p/24 means no sale.

I still hope that those who could use 1080p/24 will eventually get it from their PS3, but don't hold your breath.
I added the part about sooner rather than later, but Sony has said yes to 1080p/24 on the PS3. Steer clear of the PS3 if you want 1080p/24? Well then what BR player should one purchase? What current standalone BR players support 1080p/24? I think the owners of the standalones currently available are awaiting firmware updates to enable this capability as well as advanced audio codecs.

So do you have a good reason for not wanting a "game console" to be in your equipment rack? If the G2 BR players were available and cost $500-$600 I could see why you might go with a standalone, but at the moment the PS3 seems to be the clear choice.

it's either Sony is taking their time to come out with a proper firmware or at this point not giving a damn about their customers.

it's either Sony is taking their time to come out with a proper firmware or at this point not giving a damn about their customers.

A little from column A, and a little from columb B, I suspect. ;)

What current standalone BR players support 1080p/24? The Sony and Pioneer standalone BD players will output 1080p24, if your display supports it. The manual for the second-generation Samsung BD-P1200 also mentions 1080p24 output, but until that model actually ships, we can't be certain that it will include that functionality.

I wonder if Sony realizes that the PS3 would probably be the best BD player available for years if they just added:

1) DTS HD MA
2) DTS HD (HR)
3) 1080p24

Three additions that would cement the PS3's value to all consumers for BD.

Perhaps that's why they're waiting. Perhaps they don't want to do that.

Well in the display devices forum a guy named Steve mentioned that the new line of Sony Bravia's (2007 models, which come in the S, V, W, and XBR series) will be compatible with both 1080p @ 24fps and 1080p @ 60fps) and that only the XBR series would support 120HZ refresh rate. Plus the XBR series or X2550 will come be available with a flat black bezel (XBR4) and a glossy black bezzel (XBR 5). I believe they will be shipping around the end of April or early June.

I wonder if Sony realizes that the PS3 would probably be the best BD player available for years if they just added:

1) DTS HD MA
2) DTS HD (HR)
3) 1080p24

Three additions that would cement the PS3's value to all consumers for BD.

Perhaps that's why they're waiting. Perhaps they don't want to do that.

I agree.

With my new JVC RS1 coming shortly, which accepts 1080p/24 and displays it at 96hz, I must have a 1080p/24 player so I ordered the Pioneer Elite instead of waiting for Sony to update the PS3.

As an aside, there were previous posts discussing displays that accept 1080p/24 signals. Some of the displays discussed do accept a 1080p/24 signal, BUT they do NOT display it at a multiple of 24, thereby negating the whole point of utilizing that signal.

I agree.

With my new JVC RS1 coming shortly, which accepts 1080p/24 and displays it at 96hz, I must have a 1080p/24 player so I ordered the Pioneer Elite instead of waiting for Sony to update the PS3.

As an aside, there were previous posts discussing displays that accept 1080p/24 signals. Some of the displays discussed do accept a 1080p/24 signal, BUT they do NOT display it at a multiple of 24, thereby negating the whole point of utilizing that signal.
Rob,

I know from the other thread that you are really looking forward to the Elite, but just to point out some things that I would not dare do in the Elite thread

- If you are willing to wait, all indications that the PS3 will support 1080p24

- The PS3 now supports TrueHD, and will very likely support DTS-HD MA. The Elite may support True HD in future, but will probably never support DTS-HD MA because as Sigma rep said, the chip does not have the horsepower. The PS3 has the horsepower.

- If you get a new receiver or components down the line that support HDMI 1.3, you will wish you had that. You are paying top dollar for the Elite with 1.2 when most players coming out now are 1.3.

- With the new BD spec released in Oct (Java improvements) the PS3 is the most likely of all the players to support this.

You will be spending a lot of money for the Elite to get the 24 fps now. If you can wait longer, you could end up with as good a player (e.g. the PS3) the and better in many respects and save money. The folks with the Elite already minimize any shortfalls because of the money they spent, and because they have enjoyed the 1080p24 over several months. But spending that money now is a different situation.

Just my thoughts.

John

Rob, the Anthem will also give you 1080p24

I added the part about sooner rather than later, but Sony has said yes to 1080p/24 on the PS3. Steer clear of the PS3 if you want 1080p/24? Well then what BR player should one purchase? What current standalone BR players support 1080p/24? I think the owners of the standalones currently available are awaiting firmware updates to enable this capability as well as advanced audio codecs.

So do you have a good reason for not wanting a "game console" to be in your equipment rack? If the G2 BR players were available and cost $500-$600 I could see why you might go with a standalone, but at the moment the PS3 seems to be the clear choice.

John,

Sony is probably the company I trust the least with regard to announcements. So as you say Sony has said so: Is there a set date or can owners wait for a year ? Who said it ? Was it a press release by Sony ?

Apart from that there have been posts as early as december that 1080p 24 would be added to the PS3 - so far nothing happened and I fear it never will.

Regarding standalones: You apparently do not really keep track of developments: There are as of now three players available for purchase in the US that output 1080p 24 and a cheaper Sony unit is announced, too with 1080p 24 support.

Oliver

P.S: I do think the PS3 is a great bang for the buck machine as far as BR players go and when you are happy with 1080p 60 and 1080i. But when something sounds too good to be true (like added 1080p 24 support) it probably isn't going to happen anytime soon.

Thanks for the replies.

There is absolutely no reason why a display needs a 1080/24p input to do this though - as a 1080/60i or 1080/60p input with 3:2 can still be 3:2 reversed to 1080/24p and displayed as above - though I don't know how many displays do this.

True, but I'm pretty sure the RS-1 (popular new choice) won't do that, if I recall all of the reviews correctly.

You're right, though - there's no reason the display couldn't do it. It's a matter of firmware development, though, and when the current batch of displays as being developed, I doubt there was enough customer understanding of the issue to drive that feature.

Any news / rumor / date about this firmware update ?

No ?

:(

No news. There will be an update when home launches.

I hope to get 1080p24 before next October (Home official launch date as I just read).

True, but I'm pretty sure the RS-1 (popular new choice) won't do that, if I recall all of the reviews correctly.

You're right, though - there's no reason the display couldn't do it. It's a matter of firmware development, though, and when the current batch of displays as being developed, I doubt there was enough customer understanding of the issue to drive that feature.

You two are kidding me, right ?
This is the holy grail of scaling engines - there are but a few scalers that can do this and others who can't despite claiming that it works.

What makes you believe that a projector/display manufacturer would invest any time in this in the current state of affairs ?

Oliver

Any news / rumor / date about this firmware update ?

No ?

:(

Nothing, nada, zip.
Me not buying a PS3 was mainly because of the lack of 24p output.

Back in the beginning of the year there was always somebody to tell me that this had been announced/confirmed by Sony as an upgrade.

But why would I trust that this would see the light of the day before affordable standalone players come out ? I did not and now it seems that the first cheap Sony player with 24p output will be released before the upgrade to the PS3 - just hope that the PS3 owners will not get left behind completely.

Oliver

Adding 24P out to the PS3 will not benefit the standalone players. Thats why I dont think they ever gonna out it in. The PS3 is a gaming machine.

It will be supported, it has been confirmed. PS3 gaming machine is still one of the best deals for a BD player.

It will be supported, it has been confirmed. PS3 gaming machine is still one of the best deals for a BD player.

Yes but thats the problem for sony. The loose money on every gaming machine they sell. And to use it only as a Bluray player will not bring that money back. So by letting things like upscaling and 24P out will force some to buy standalones instead.

Do you have a link for the confirmation that it will output 1080/24P

Yes but thats the problem for sony. The loose money on every gaming machine they sell. And to use it only as a Bluray player will not bring that money back. So by letting things like upscaling and 24P out will force some to buy standalones instead.

Do you have a link for the confirmation that it will output 1080/24P
All consoles lose money initially, except for the wii, they hope to make the loss up with sales from accessories. Is Sony delaying support for those features to sell more stand alone units, it's possible. I know the majority of people, like me, don't have a display that can handle 24 frames and as such can wait for the update.

If you have a display/projector that can handle 1080p24 or will be purchasing one within the next month, a standalone is a clear choice. Buy what you need/want you aren't hurting my feelings either way.

As far as a link, thought it was posted already. Yeah it's quoted and linked in a post on page 1.
SCE declared that they'd support 1080/24p in the PS3.
Not that this matters. Sony said the 20GB PS3 was not discontinued a couple weeks before announcing it was discontinued. Things change.

The mitsu 52631 dlp supports it, I have it and it is awesome with 24fps.
It will do 24,30 and 60. Not wure about the other mitsu models yet, pretty sure the sammy xx88 does also.
Technically speaking if you read the manual closer it can accept it....doesn't mean it displays it. I have a 732 series and it says the same thing. but I'm pretty sure it's still displaying p60 even if you input p24.

Screen shots from Joystiq of the 1.80 firmware update:
Well guys here are some pics off Joystiq so take them with a grain of salt:
This one shows off 1080p24f and DVD upscaling
http://www.blogsmithmedia.com/www.joystiq.com/media/2007/05/dvd_en_800.jpg
PS1/2 upscaling:
http://www.blogsmithmedia.com/www.joystiq.com/media/2007/05/game_en_800.jpg
Looks like networking with a laptop:
http://www.blogsmithmedia.com/www.joystiq.com/media/2007/05/dlna_client_en_800.jpg
and printing to an Epson printer connected via USB. Only Epson at this time:
http://www.blogsmithmedia.com/www.joystiq.com/media/2007/05/print_en_800.jpg
UPDATED NEWS - WEDNESDAY 23rd MAY


PS3 Firmware Version 1.80 Announced



Latest PLAYSTATION 3 Firmware Update Provides PlayStation, PlayStation 2 and DVD Upscaling

Remote Play on PSP (PlayStation Portable) via the Internet and DLNA transfer of media content also enabled

London, 24 May 2007 – Sony Computer Entertainment Europe (SCEE) announced today availability of the latest version of the PLAYSTATION®3 (PS3™) firmware. Version 1.80 features upscaling of PlayStation® and PlayStation 2 games, and DVD movies up to full 1080p HD resolution when viewed on a compatible HD TV set.

The capability to upscale DVDs to HD quality is a feature normally only associated with top range DVD players, and its inclusion in the latest firmware upgrade now allows PS3 owners with an existing DVD collection to dramatically enhance the viewing pleasure of their DVD collection when viewed through a compatible HD TV set1. Not only can DVD movies be enhanced to full 1080p HD quality but so too will PlayStation 2 and PlayStation games be upscaled to provide much improved gaming pleasure.
In a comprehensive update to PS3’s already impressive capabilities, Version 1.80 also allows users to enjoy Remote Play on their PSP across the internet, allowing them to access their PS3 anywhere in the world where a broadband internet connection is available2.

Version 1.80 also allows users on a home network to seamlessly view and play rich media content such as images, music and video on their PS3, that is stored on their DLNA3 enabled devices such as PCs and laptops elsewhere in the house, reinforcing PS3’s credentials as a home entertainment hub that truly deserves pride of place in the Living Room.

A host of other enhancements include the ability to print photo images stored on PS3’s hard disk or inserted storage media to a selection of Epson printers.

PS3 owners will be able to upgrade their PS3 with the latest Version 1.80 firmware from 24th May 2007.
- ends -

Notes

1. DVD-ROM (including DVD Video content) can only be upscaled with HDMI compatible TV sets.

2. Use of Remote Play requires a powered up PS3 with Version 1.80 as well as PSP firmware version 3.50 which will be available at the end of May.

3. DLNA – Digital Living Network Alliance. For more info on DLNA, please see http://www.dlna.org/en/consumer/home



-via Sony Press release

If true you guys can quit your bitching ;). No mention of 1080p24f in the press release so who knows. We will tomorrow.

Nice!

WAAY COOL! Can't wait until the update is available.

Tomorrow....

Well, I wonder if they fixed the WTW/BTB issue. Also, do we know if the 1080p24 is off the disc or is it 1080p24 -> 1080i60 -> 1080p24?

I wonder if you can transfer video files to the hard drive. I'd love to take an office episode, just copy it to the HDD and play it. Over the wireless network takes too long for a 3gig file. :)

Good news regardless,

Cheers,
Chris

Will i still get 1080/24 with my Monoprice 5x1 Switcher (rev 2.1)? Projector is a Epson TW1000 which supposedly supports 1080/24

Well, I wonder if they fixed the WTW/BTB issue. Also, do we know if the 1080p24 is off the disc or is it 1080p24 -> 1080i60 -> 1080p24?

I wonder if you can transfer video files to the hard drive. I'd love to take an office episode, just copy it to the HDD and play it. Over the wireless network takes too long for a 3gig file. :)

Good news regardless,

Cheers,
Chris
Sure you can, I do it all the the time. Just make sure it's in a format the PS3 can decode.

I have never heard about PS3 supporting 24p, ever... As a PS3 owner, if it does happen, cool, but I'm definitely not holding my breath on this one.
You should have held your breath. :D

well i guess i will be up all night, it is good.

It's already online, but downloading very very slow for me..

yep you are correct , it is coming good indeed.

720P Blu-Ray now works!

Its all there folks

1080 24hz
wtw btb limited or full range
720P for DVD and BD
and much much more

I must have been lucky I got it dowloading in just a short few minutes

Are the video gods appeased? ;)

Its there, not that I know what it means for my TV. The DVD upscale thing gives weird choices like double instead of 720p 1080p.

Its there, not that I know what it means for my TV. The DVD upscale thing gives weird choices like double instead of 720p 1080p.

Go to video settings for and deselect 1080i and just check 480 and 720 and you should be good. Just to note, in the area where it gives you None, normal or double scale, I selected double out of curiosity..Im not seeing any reason right now to change it to anything else during my short test..

Gotta go to bed!!! :mad:

how can i get this 24hz to work with my optoma hd70! the auto mode does nothing for my projector and obvisouly i dont want off!!

Wow it works (Pioneer PDP-5070), even though I have the system set up for 720p because that's how I want my games. FYI Planet Earth is 24p encoded. :p

Wow it works (Pioneer PDP-5070), even though I have the system set up for 720p because that's how I want my games. FYI Planet Earth is 24p encoded. :p
Aren't all BDs 1080p24f?

i tried it with casino royale. Shouldnt all the hollywood movies shot on film be 1080p/ 24??

Aren't all BDs 1080p24f?

No. Check out the Nine Inch Nails disc. It was shot 1080p30f, and is presented on BD in 1080i (and 1080p on the HD-DVD).

There are lots of ways to shoot things these days. Of course, virtually all theatrical movies will be 24f.

i tried it with casino royale. Shouldnt all the hollywood movies shot on film be 1080p/ 24??

If encoded properly.

I just tested Casino Royale and it works fine on my setup. Since the current Pioneers only take 1080p at 24fps (30 and 60fps not supported), I know that when it says 1080p it is 24fps. Casino Royale is 24fps.

it can now with the 1.8 update

No. Check out the Nine Inch Nails disc. It was shot 1080p30f, and is presented on BD in 1080i (and 1080p on the HD-DVD).

There are lots of ways to shoot things these days. Of course, virtually all theatrical movies will be 24f.



If encoded properly.

I just tested Casino Royale and it works fine on my setup. Since the current Pioneers only take 1080p at 24fps (30 and 60fps not supported), I know that when it says 1080p it is 24fps. Casino Royale is 24fps.
True, it all depends on the equipment that was used to shoot.

Does anyone know when the PS3 will get the 1080p24 support update?


ITS DOES IT NOW!!!!, with teh 1.8 update. its under BD/DVD settings.

Did you purposely type teh or was it just a typo?

Did you purposely type teh or was it just a typo?

typo

24p output works correctly for all 3 video codecs MPEG2, VC1 and AVC! Millions of blu-ray players have perfect 24p Output overnight! :D

regards,

Li On

i've posted this earlier: Can i still get 1080p/24 if my HDMI switcher supports HDMI 1.2a? My projector is a Epson EMP-TW1000. Thanks

24p output works correctly for all 3 video codecs MPEG2, VC1 and AVC! Millions of blu-ray players have perfect 24p Output overnight! :D

regards,

Li On

i dotn get it? soem blu ray movies are already 24p that doesnt mean millions of blu ray players can output the signal

24p has nothing to do with a HDMI switcher. If your display supports 24p input, use it and see for yourself.

regards,

Li On

i dotn get it? soem blu ray movies are already 24p that doesnt mean millions of blu ray players can output the signal

Whilst the BluRay discs (and HD-DVD discs) themselves contain 1080/24p video - many players output this as 1080/60p (with 3:2 frame repetition and the resulting temporal judder).

The PS3 did this until firmware 1.8. Now the PS3 will optionally output 1080/24p movies as a 1080/24p HDMI video signal - so that displays that will accept the 24p signal can display them with a non-3:2 repetition (3:3 for 72Hz displays, 4:4 for 96Hz, 5:5 for 120Hz displays) which will not have the 3:2 judder - but will have the temporal aliasing inherent in 24p capture.

(Those of us in Euroland have traditionally treated 24p as 25p and thus had 2:2 pulldown at 50i or 50p - and not had the 3:2 judder. However we get BluRay and HD-DVDs as 24p - output as 60i or 60p with 3:2 judder if we don't have 24p compatible displays)

24p doesn't work, then the PS3 is connected to my Yamaha RX-V2700 AV-Receiver :(

How many displays actually support 24p at the moment?

For the people with 24p capability...are the differences trivial?

24p doesn't work, then the PS3 is connected to my Yamaha RX-V2700 AV-Receiver :(

PS3 setting for 1080p24 mode is either Auto or Off.

My Mitsu HC5000 (switched through a Yamaha RX-V2700) does not allow 1080p24. Direct connection from PS3 to HC5000 will work.

I understand from an owner of a JVC HD1 that he has the same problem (using RXV1700)

Not sure if this is a PS3 issue or just one affecting Yamaha RXV-x700 amps :(

Maybe a quick fix 1.81 to enable a FORCE ON for 1080p24 (when the content is 1080p24 encoded)

On my 720p display I lose video from BD when PS3 is set to auto for 1080p24. PS3 is connected through IScan VP50. I have to turn 1080p24 off in PS3 to get the picture back. Likely it is a display issue.

24p doesn't work, then the PS3 is connected to my Yamaha RX-V2700 AV-Receiver :(

It doesn't seem to work with the Sony STR-DA5200ES either direct to TV no problem.

I will test on the PROFHD1 24p 3:3 72 hz and get back to you.

How many displays actually support 24p at the moment?

For the people with 24p capability...are the differences trivial?
Pioneer Elites, some projectors, etc

It's becoming more common going forward.

I also can't get it to work with my optoma HD70...

I think we definitely need a "forced ON" mode for 1080P/24HZ. My 2003 Sony HS10 projector (native 720P) supports this resolution in NATIVE format, but alas Sony can't detect it as a working mode.

Noel.

I think we definitely need a "forced ON" mode for 1080P/24HZ. My 2003 Sony HS10 projector (native 720P) supports this resolution in NATIVE format, but alas Sony can't detect it as a working mode.

Noel.

Agree. Forced 24, source direct, whatever they want to call it.

I guess they did it that way so us stupid consumers would not select it and wonder why we were not getting a picture with our non 24 capable displays.

looks awesome very comparable to the bdphd1

I called Sony today and told them about the 1080/24 issue that some are having and that we need a forced option. I made the person read back what she was sending to the tech people. I hope others call and state the issue.

How can I tell if My display accepts 1080P/24? I have a Pioneer Elite 1140HD. When the blu-ray fires up, a note at the top right of the display says "1080P" for a brief moment but says nothing about 24fps. Also, all hollywood movies are shot 24fps so how do you know which blu-ray disc encodes for it?

Third question, what should I be looking for to see any difference?

60fps is better for games for the obvious reason: higher fps the smoother game playback. However its different for movies. Most cinema are filmed in 24fps (HD-DVD and Blu-Ray movies are both encoded in 1080p24) and to view them on your HDTV, your TV uses what's called a 3:2 pulldown method, which in short, allows playback on your TV using 1080p60 by adding additional frames. However, 1080p60 causes noticible "juddering" in some scenes, which can be completely eliminated by using 24 (or multiples like 24,48,72). More info on this can be found here (http://www.xbox.com/en-US/hardware/accessories/20061003-hddvd.htm)

Since 1080p is relatively new and there are only a handful of these sets, there are even less TV's which can handle 1080p24. Although some TVs out there are not "officially" advertised to handle 1080p24, it CAN be done in some situations. For instance in my case, my Sony 40XBR2, not advertised to handle 1080p24, can in fact do this with a HDDVD/BD -> PC ->DVI/HDMI setup (and with other software)

As for the PS3 being able to do 1080p24 in the future, this is good news. I might pick one up myself, only thing keeping me is the lack of HDMI receivers (For sound) and not being sure if my TV can "officially" handle 1080p24. As of now, although complex, I prefer the HDDVD -> PC -> HDTV@1080p24 + 5.1 analog to speakers (for Dolby TrueHD).

Has this been tried on the XBR2 with the new PS3 firmware 1.90 update? If the PS3 forces 1080p24 now, what does it look like on the XBR2? I am asking because if it looks better on the XBR2, I will get that. If not, I might wait for the XBR4.

How can I tell if My display accepts 1080P/24? I have a Pioneer Elite 1140HD. When the blu-ray fires up, a note at the top right of the display says "1080P" for a brief moment but says nothing about 24fps. Also, all hollywood movies are shot 24fps so how do you know which blu-ray disc encodes for it?

Third question, what should I be looking for to see any difference?
I have the same dispaly, your display accepts 1080P 24Hz and bumps it up to 72 Hz because you cant possibly watch 24 Hz, your eyes would go bonkers. This is in the manual for reference.

1080x24 even in the forced mode will not work with all receivers. The Panasonic X57 gives an error message if you default to 1080x24.

I have the same dispaly, your display accepts 1080P 24Hz and bumps it up to 72 Hz because you cant possibly watch 24 Hz, your eyes would go bonkers. This is in the manual for reference.

Aren't pretty much all 1080p displays digital? There is no reason to think of 1080p24 as 24hz, really just 24 frames/sec. Your eyes aren't going bokers in the theatre are they? Same thing, with LCD/Plasma/DLP refresh is not an issue.

If you were to have a crt display capable of 1080p, that would be a different matter.

-Tom

Aren't pretty much all 1080p displays digital? There is no reason to think of 1080p24 as 24hz, really just 24 frames/sec. Your eyes aren't going bokers in the theatre are they? Same thing, with LCD/Plasma/DLP refresh is not an issue.

If you were to have a crt display capable of 1080p, that would be a different matter.

-Tom
I see what you are saying, but most displays will go with a multiple of 24, i.e. 48/72/96/120.