View Full Version : PowerDVD Ultra (HD-DVD and Blu-Ray)
almostinsane
08-31-07, 08:14 PM
Does MLP equal Dolby True HD and DTS HD MA? I dont think so.
the problem with non full-screen 1080p video in Power DVD is due to a registry setting in the new ATI cards. The drivers are just messed up. You can fix it yourself with a registry edit, as I linked to earlier in this thread, or go to http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=11485622#post11485622 and download arfster's tweaked drivers.
added VForceMaxResSize 2800000 = this sets the PDVD HDDVD/Bluray max render size in pixels. The formula appears to be screen width squared * 0.75, so for 1920 wide screens it needs to be at least 2764800. If the key doesn't exist at all as in the default installs, it assumes a value of approx 2 million pixels, not enough to fill a 1080p screen. The above value is OK for up to 1920 pixels wide, but if you have a 2500*1600 screen it needs to be 4687500 or greater. Since there's maybe a performance reason for a limit, it's probably worth not setting it higher than you need.
By the way, I just noticed the jaggies issue too under Vista 32 and nVidia 8600GTS. It's bad, but it's easily fixable. No need for changing the 3D settings (AA and stuff) for me. Just need to enable the minimum of either noise reduction or edge enhancement at 1%. It seems that when you enable one of this two, another layer of post-processing gets activated as well that takes care of the jaggies. If you notice, when you do this the color also changes just a little bit. It gets just a tiny little bit more saturated in my case. And whether you activate NR or EE, it really doesn't matter, you won't see any noise reduced or any edges improperly enhanced at 1%.
Although, I wonder why are there jaggies in the first place, if my monitor is 1920x1200 and thus has a 1:1 mapping with the video. The only explanation that occurs to me is that the video is not at 1080p resolution when EE or NR are disabled.
Although, I wonder why are there jaggies in the first place, if my monitor is 1920x1200 and thus has a 1:1 mapping with the video. The only explanation that occurs to me is that the video is not at 1080p resolution when EE or NR are disabled.
With an 8500GT I get jaggies under XP if Video Quality=Normal, but not if Video Quality=Best. Unfortunately I can't find any EE or NR adjustments under XP, to effect a modification of the filtering, so I have to rely on the all or nothing Video Quality settings. The sad part is that, because there is no acceleration under XP, Best quality maxes my C2D at 2.8GHz.
It is difficult to understand how jaggies can be presented from a 1080p source on a 1920x1200 display (1920x1440p72 in my case) as there is no actual scaling required. No-one wants to accept that PowerDVD might be downscaling and then upscaling under lower quality configurations.
I suppose it is remotely possible that EE or NR disabled (ie Normal Quality) tricks the software into some sort of overscan scaling which is scaled back again.
I do wish we had more fine control over what PowerDVD is filtering.
Rick Guynn
09-01-07, 08:43 AM
If a codec supports Purevideo HD, does this mean that it'll automatically support the bitstream processing and inverse transform HW acceleration of the 8600 series?
The 7 series also supports Purevideo HD, but it does not accelerate bitstream processing and inverse transform.
I would hope that the ArcSoft player supports the advanced features of the 8600 series and not just the basic 7 series features.
If it supports hardware acceleration, then whatever features are supported by the hardware then depend on the hardware driver. Hence the fact that PowerDVD supports hardware acceleration, but it hasn't worked on the NVidia 85/86 series in XP (I think a recent beta has it working again now) for a while due to lack of driver support.
nathan_h
09-01-07, 12:59 PM
It is difficult to understand how jaggies can be presented from a 1080p source on a 1920x1200 display (1920x1440p72 in my case) as there is no actual scaling required.
Since most 1080p material, is 1920x1080, if the display is something different (like 1920x1200 or 1920x1440) there is some processing taking place. I'm not sure if that explains what you are seeing.
With an 8500GT I get jaggies under XP if Video Quality=Normal, but not if Video Quality=Best. Unfortunately I can't find any EE or NR adjustments under XP, to effect a modification of the filtering, so I have to rely on the all or nothing Video Quality settings. The sad part is that, because there is no acceleration under XP, Best quality maxes my C2D at 2.8GHz.
It is difficult to understand how jaggies can be presented from a 1080p source on a 1920x1200 display (1920x1440p72 in my case) as there is no actual scaling required. No-one wants to accept that PowerDVD might be downscaling and then upscaling under lower quality configurations.
This is a totally different matter, and it's actually worse than what we're saying. PowerDVD, it seems, does downscale and upscale when in "normal" quality setting. I suspect it happens on XP and/or with HW accel disabled (though I can't test it in different conditions). I also discussed this further up in the thread. I get it on XP and an ATI X1900GT card, and because the way ATI cards behave with SD content (no levels expansion), I am pretty sure that it's HD downconverted to SD and then upscaled to the size of your screen.
I suppose it is remotely possible that EE or NR disabled (ie Normal Quality) tricks the software into some sort of overscan scaling which is scaled back again.
I do wish we had more fine control over what PowerDVD is filtering.
Under Vista, 8600GTS, and with HW accel on, the "normal", "good" and "best" quality settings don't seem to do anything for me. It's possible that with NR and EE off in the nVidia control panel the card is just doing some rescaling, but it looks like it's only reading every other line, like only one field in an interlaced sample. Of course, all the movies I've tried are 1080p. Still, as I said, not a major problem for me, so I haven't tested this thoroughly, and also I wouldn't know how to make sure that is happening when I don't have a proper test disc, only movies.
By the way, you should try the 163.44 betas. They are less buggy for me than the actual non-betas, and it seems they allow acceleration under XP. No harm in trying.
Since most 1080p material, is 1920x1080, if the display is something different (like 1920x1200 or 1920x1440) there is some processing taking place. I'm not sure if that explains what you are seeing.
If you preserve the aspect ratio, then it doesn't matter how tall your display is as long as it is 1920 pixels wide. It will still do 1:1 mapping. But nevertheless, I will see if it happens in the HDMI 1080p Sharp LCD at work, just for the kicks.
Davinleeds
09-01-07, 05:05 PM
By the way, you should try the 163.44 betas. They are less buggy for me than the actual non-betas, and it seems they allow acceleration under XP. No harm in trying.
For me, the beta just gave me black screen on PDVD. The Nvidia non beta works fine with my 8600GTS
did you try 163.44? cause there are also the 163.11, which I think some people were having trouble with.
jimwhite
09-02-07, 12:04 AM
How do you tell what build of PDVD you have and whether you need the patch or not?
:cool:
John Nelson
09-02-07, 08:48 AM
How do you tell what build of PDVD you have and whether you need the patch or not?
:cool:Start PowerDvd, right Click on the PDVD window, click "about" from the menu, then click on the box hat says "This product is licensed to". Pretty strange place to put this information.
jimwhite
09-02-07, 09:00 AM
Pretty strange place to put this information
I'll say.... :eek:
Thanks ;)
Again. Vista uses EVR so you have to adjust the NVIDIA driver settings!
1. Enable Anti-Aliasing
2. Move Edge Enhancement Slider to to the right > 0 %
That should do the trick. Play around with the settings in the driver panel 3D and video settings.Unfortunately, this doesn't work with XP and the 163.44 beta drivers. No matter what settings I make (AA, AF, EE, noise reduction), with an 8600, there are artifacts with hardware acceleration on.
Even worse, you can't turn it off. If I uncheck the hardware acceleration box, whenever I hit play PowerDVD rechecks it and the box is grayed out. The only way I could get rid of it is by reverting to older drivers that don't support it.
Is there any quality benefit to hardware acceleration? Even "best" quality mode (no acceleration) only uses 20-30% CPU, and looks great.
Is there any quality benefit to hardware acceleration? Even "best" quality mode (no acceleration) only uses 20-30% CPU, and looks great.
How are you managing to get only 20-30% CPU in Best quality mode for VC-1 without acceleration?
On my XP 8500GT C2D 2.8GHz setup, Best quality spikes 100% at times and generally runs at 90%.
How are you managing to get only 20-30% CPU in Best quality mode for VC-1 without acceleration?
On my XP 8500GT C2D 2.8GHz setup, Best quality spikes 100% at times and generally runs at 90%.
Hmm, something is wrong..? My Win XP, C2D 2.4GHz, 8500GT setup runs at 40-50% with normal VC1 ~20Mbps.
Hmm, something is wrong..? My Win XP, C2D 2.4GHz, 8500GT setup runs at 40-50% with normal VC1 ~20Mbps.
That's the CPU load I get if Video Quality=Normal, but Video Quality=Best doubles that load for me.
Normal is acceptable, but has jaggies: Best is fantastic PQ but barely runs on my setup.
In comparison, with an ATI X300 graphics card and PowerDVD 6.5, I was able to get close to Best quality at only 50% CPU.
There are so many combinations of hardware, software, OS, drivers and settings that it's almost impossible to compare apples to apples in end-user experience to work out what is going wrong.
I sometimes wonder if it is my mobo at fault because it only has a 4x PCI-E slot, but then the 8500GT isn't accelerating, so shouldn't have to be shuttling data back and forth to the CPU.
How are you managing to get only 20-30% CPU in Best quality mode for VC-1 without acceleration?Q6600 @ 3.3. The load distribution isn't perfectly even over all four cores, but it's close enough that every core is always under 50% and usually around 20-30%.
Your figure of 100% @ 2.8 sounds a bit odd, since prior to this I was running an E6600 @ 2.9 and I never had a CPU bottleneck at best quality (I can't remember what the total utilization was, but there was plenty of room to spare).
tristartristan
09-04-07, 04:38 AM
I want to know how you can be sure that PWDVD is playing in EVR mode when the information display tell you that it's in overlay mode?????????
Of course i'm in vista!:)
arfster
09-04-07, 06:38 AM
I want to know how you can be sure that PWDVD is playing in EVR mode when the information display tell you that it's in overlay mode?????????
Of course i'm in vista!:)
Vista PDVD always uses EVR for files - you can check with ffdshow audio. For disc playback it may be using EVR+custom presenter for security, or even a completely new renderer. Either way, you've got no choice in the matter :-)
tristartristan
09-04-07, 07:48 AM
thanks arfster!!
There is another thread indicating that due to AACS (again), PowerDVD is always down sampling HD audio to 48khz/16bit?
Here is a some information from amirm (Microsoft VP):
AACS requires some kind of secure output for PCM audio. If that pipeline does not exist, then the limit above must be used. Here is the relevant wording:
"1.4 Digital Outputs. A Licensed Player shall not pass, or direct to be passed Decrypted AACS Content to a digital output except:
1.4.1 A digital output of audio, or of the audio portion of other forms of
Decrypted AACS Content, in compressed audio format (such as AC3) or
in Linear PCM format in which the transmitted information is sampled at
no more than 48 kHz and no more than 16 bits.
1.4.2 An output delineated in Table D1, AACS Authorized Digital Outputs, in
accordance with any associated restrictions and obligations specified
therein;"
Can anyone confirm this? Is there someway to tell the bit rate going to the sound card (I have an X-FI)?
Is there a registry hack?
- Rich
almostinsane
09-04-07, 01:37 PM
It only downsamples if the audio is greater than 16/48.
It only downsamples if the audio is greater than 16/48.
I know, but to truly support the lossless formats, it SHOULD NOT ;)
- Rich
Are there any movies with audio greater than 16/48? All the movies I've seen in HD-DVD with TrueHD are 16/48. I don't think there's much of an audible difference, if any, if the audio is properly mastered, between so-called HD audio and uncompressed 16/48 audio anyway.
You can see the sample rate in PowerDVD's information tab, though I'm not completely sure, it should be the source sampling rate, and not the outgoing to the sound card one.
Here are some titles with better than 16/48:
http://bluray.highdefdigest.com/964/davematthews_liveatradiocity.html
http://bluray.highdefdigest.com/574/rememberthetitansdc.html
http://bluray.highdefdigest.com/fifthelement_remastered.html
http://bluray.highdefdigest.com/piratesofthecaribbeancurse.html
http://bluray.highdefdigest.com/piratesofthecaribbeandeadmanschest.html
http://bluray.highdefdigest.com/prestige.html
Many titles with True-HD.
I wonder if people would complain if they limited the video to 1080x768;)
- Rich
Davinleeds
09-04-07, 07:26 PM
This downsampling is truly disappointing. Kicks the feet out under the idea of a HTPC. I'd be interested to know if this applies to HD STBs also. If ACCS doesn't want full spectrum recording of movie or concert soundtracks, etc, I'd guess it applies to all systems. But then why have it on the disk if we can't access it? PS. What's in table D1? "Secure output for pcm audio" Any one know of an example?
almostinsane
09-04-07, 07:59 PM
The player needs to support the Secure Audio Path in Vista. PowerDVD doesn't so the audio is downsampled if its higher than 16/48.
http://msdn2.microsoft.com/en-us/library/bb649414.aspx
Here are some titles with better than 16/48:
http://bluray.highdefdigest.com/964/davematthews_liveatradiocity.html
http://bluray.highdefdigest.com/574/rememberthetitansdc.html
http://bluray.highdefdigest.com/fifthelement_remastered.html
http://bluray.highdefdigest.com/piratesofthecaribbeancurse.html
http://bluray.highdefdigest.com/piratesofthecaribbeandeadmanschest.html
http://bluray.highdefdigest.com/prestige.html
Many titles with True-HD.
I wonder if people would complain if they limited the video to 1080x768;)
- Rich
I see, that's what I was suspecting. Bluray titles, of course. I only have an HD-DVD player. I'll have to test it when I get the bluray drive, but do you know for sure it's downsampling? If it's an AACS restriction, then ripped movies shouldn't have this. Have you tried AnyDVD?
Also, all the quote of the other thread, and all I've read about the subject, is about digital connections. I haven't read anything about analog connections, are you sure this is also true for that? Even DVD-Audio allowed you to pump out the high-res through analog.
I know you're kidding in your comparison about them limiting the video to a lower resolution, but still, "limiting" audio to uncompressed 16/48 is not that bad. Maybe, just maybe, people with super ears and great audio equipment (much more expensive than most 1080p HDTVs, which let you see the whole 1080p resolution) could hear the difference between a well-mastered (in high-definition) 16/48 soundtrack, and a 24/96 soundtrack.
From everything reputable I've read (and in audio, there's MUCH more disreputable stuff), the reason why early cds (16/44.1) didn't sound very good was because at that time it was so expensive, or impossible, to master audio in high definition, and what caused the bad audio was that the AA filters that had to be used were too sharp around the highest frequencies, which messed with the phase around those frequencies. With mastering in high-definition, this can be avoided, and apply a "gentler" AA filter that just rolls down into the inaudible high frequencies. It's more about having room for editing and mastering, than about having a "higher resolution" end result.
We do the same thing with digital photography. As much as most fairly knowledgeable people like to diss the "megapixel war", there are upsides to having more pixels, even if you don't need to have a big final image. The advantage comes in editing. That's why one edits in 16-bits in photoshop, even if the original is an 8-bit picture, and many times even upsample the image before editing, and downsample again to the final image size and 8-bit after all is done. A native 12-megapixel image downsampled to 5 megapixels will most probably look better than a native 5-megapixel image.
The stuff one mostly reads, about "subharmonics" and other things like that, makes no sense to me, and nobody has provided evidence that it's true, or at least an indication that they've tested it properly. But anyway I believe the premise is flawed. They say that even if we can't hear frequencies over 20kHz or so, the speakers should be able to produce audible subharmonics. I understand that, but even if the speakers and other equipment and media are able to actually reproduce those ultra-high frequencies and produce those subharmonics (which I don't think they are) I think it would be undesirable. Sound produced naturally is different than reproducing that sound. If you have something that naturally produces high-frequency sound and audible subharmonics, you can actually capture the subharmonics within our audible range, so there's no need for the speaker to make them. The job of the speaker is to reproduce sound, not make it.
I see, that's what I was suspecting. Bluray titles, of course. I only have an HD-DVD player. I'll have to test it when I get the bluray drive, but do you know for sure it's downsampling? If it's an AACS restriction, then ripped movies shouldn't have this. Have you tried AnyDVD?
Also, all the quote of the other thread, and all I've read about the subject, is about digital connections. I haven't read anything about analog connections, are you sure this is also true for that? Even DVD-Audio allowed you to pump out the high-res through analog.
I know you're kidding in your comparison about them limiting the video to a lower resolution, but still, "limiting" audio to uncompressed 16/48 is not that bad. Maybe, just maybe, people with super ears and great audio equipment (much more expensive than most 1080p HDTVs, which let you see the whole 1080p resolution) could hear the difference between a well-mastered (in high-definition) 16/48 soundtrack, and a 24/96 soundtrack.
From everything reputable I've read (and in audio, there's MUCH more disreputable stuff), the reason why early cds (16/44.1) didn't sound very good was because at that time it was so expensive, or impossible, to master audio in high definition, and what caused the bad audio was that the AA filters that had to be used were too sharp around the highest frequencies, which messed with the phase around those frequencies. With mastering in high-definition, this can be avoided, and apply a "gentler" AA filter that just rolls down into the inaudible high frequencies. It's more about having room for editing and mastering, than about having a "higher resolution" end result.
We do the same thing with digital photography. As much as most fairly knowledgeable people like to diss the "megapixel war", there are upsides to having more pixels, even if you don't need to have a big final image. The advantage comes in editing. That's why one edits in 16-bits in photoshop, even if the original is an 8-bit picture, and many times even upsample the image before editing, and downsample again to the final image size and 8-bit after all is done. A native 12-megapixel image downsampled to 5 megapixels will most probably look better than a native 5-megapixel image.
The stuff one mostly reads, about "subharmonics" and other things like that, makes no sense to me, and nobody has provided evidence that it's true, or at least an indication that they've tested it properly. But anyway I believe the premise is flawed. They say that even if we can't hear frequencies over 20kHz or so, the speakers should be able to produce audible subharmonics. I understand that, but even if the speakers and other equipment and media are able to actually reproduce those ultra-high frequencies and produce those subharmonics (which I don't think they are) I think it would be undesirable. Sound produced naturally is different than reproducing that sound. If you have something that naturally produces high-frequency sound and audible subharmonics, you can actually capture the subharmonics within our audible range, so there's no need for the speaker to make them. The job of the speaker is to reproduce sound, not make it.
While I do not dispute any of your points, it just pisses me off at yet another idiotic example of DRM. It may in fact be audible, it depends somewhat on the algorthm. If it is not audible on most systems, doesn't that make it even more ridiculous.
- Rich
Perhaps someone can offer something to try to fix my PDVD stuttering. I've tried most of the tips in this thread. I am running PDVD Ultra build 3401a. MSI 8500GT and ripped The Matrix using AnyDVD HD onto a NAS drive running on a Gigabit network. I've also installed the Vista updates - particularly the compatibility and performance fixes.
The DVD itself plays fine in my LG drive on PDVD, it just stutters like mad when I'm trying to stream it through the network. Streaming SD DVDs are no problem.
Unfortunately this is the only HD DVD I have currently. Others are arriving from Amazon shortly.
I've tried playing with NVIDIA settings like Anti-Aliasing and edge enhancement. I'm running 163.44 beta drivers. This HTPC is currently connected to my Dell 2407 vis DVI. I haven't tried hooking it up to my LCD yet using HDMI.
Any suggestions are welcome.
Rich, I agree about DRM, of course it sucks. While I do not consider this specific case as particularly bad (partly because I don't have a super high-end audio system, I admit, and even then I couldn't probably tell the difference) what they're doing is just misleading and anti-consumer.
So by the way, have you tried if AnyDVD-ripped movies also suffer from this? And is there any way to know if the conversion is being done? I'll have to wait until I get my hands on some HD-DVD with high-res audio (you know any?), or the damn LG dual format drives finally come out.
Rich, I agree about DRM, of course it sucks. While I do not consider this specific case as particularly bad (partly because I don't have a super high-end audio system, I admit, and even then I couldn't probably tell the difference) what they're doing is just misleading and anti-consumer.
So by the way, have you tried if AnyDVD-ripped movies also suffer from this? And is there any way to know if the conversion is being done? I'll have to wait until I get my hands on some HD-DVD with high-res audio (you know any?), or the damn LG dual format drives finally come out.
I have tried them with DRM, but as I understand from this thread:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=892863
the down-sampling is always done.
My system includes an Integra Research Preamp and Revel speakers so I would like to get the full signal. That said, I am willing to bet the X-FI card (moded with LM4562 OpAmps) is very much the weak link.
I am ruining with AnyDVD most of the time, but the word on the other thread is that the down-sampling always occurs.
- Rich
Perhaps someone can offer something to try to fix my PDVD stuttering. I've tried most of the tips in this thread. I am running PDVD Ultra build 3401a. MSI 8500GT and ripped The Matrix using AnyDVD HD onto a NAS drive running on a Gigabit network. I've also installed the Vista updates - particularly the compatibility and performance fixes.
The DVD itself plays fine in my LG drive on PDVD, it just stutters like mad when I'm trying to stream it through the network. Streaming SD DVDs are no problem.
Unfortunately this is the only HD DVD I have currently. Others are arriving from Amazon shortly.
I've tried playing with NVIDIA settings like Anti-Aliasing and edge enhancement. I'm running 163.44 beta drivers. This HTPC is currently connected to my Dell 2407 vis DVI. I haven't tried hooking it up to my LCD yet using HDMI.
Any suggestions are welcome.
First thing I would try is copy it locally and not stream it ..you can then eliminate the network / NAS
Q6600 @ 3.3. The load distribution isn't perfectly even over all four cores, but it's close enough that every core is always under 50% and usually around 20-30%.
Your figure of 100% @ 2.8 sounds a bit odd, since prior to this I was running an E6600 @ 2.9 and I never had a CPU bottleneck at best quality (I can't remember what the total utilization was, but there was plenty of room to spare).
Ah, I should have guessed you were running a very powerful CPU. ;)
I suppose it also depends on what bitrate VC-1 material is being used. I tend to use King Kong HD-DVD for testing as it shows any aliasing issues very well during the opening titles and has robust bitrate for the movie.
Maybe there is a small contribution from the better cache on the E6600 compared to my E4500.
Perhaps the fact that I'm driving a VGA monitor at 1920x1440p72 has a bearing.
I think it's at the point where it's difficult to make comparisons or diagnose offending elements except with near identical setups: there's just too much scope for variance in results with even a small change in equipment.
I'm going to try an ATI 2400Pro next to see if that offers a better solution, although I believe it has its own issues.
The bottom line is that it was possible to play HD-DVD with a lowly ATI X300 graphics card at 50% CPU (C2D 2.4GHz) and PowerDVD 6.5 with similar PQ on the same base system that now requires close to 100% CPU (C2D 2.8GHz) with an 8500GT. I blame PowerDVD 7.3 for demanding more sophisticated hardware (presumably to comply with some interpretation of DRM), when it's obvious much simpler setups are very capable of handling raw WMV9.
To take this point further, playing a King Kong evo with Haali splitter and WMV9 DMO with 8500GT, I get similar results to the X300. The offending factor in the excess CPU load seems to be PowerDVD 7.3 as I think PowerDVD 6.5 and WMV9 DMO are probably similar in their decoding requirements. It doesn't help that the end user has no fine control over the filtering that is performed by PowerDVD 7.3
Perhaps someone can offer something to try to fix my PDVD stuttering. I've tried most of the tips in this thread. I am running PDVD Ultra build 3401a. MSI 8500GT and ripped The Matrix using AnyDVD HD onto a NAS drive running on a Gigabit network. I've also installed the Vista updates - particularly the compatibility and performance fixes.
The DVD itself plays fine in my LG drive on PDVD, it just stutters like mad when I'm trying to stream it through the network. Streaming SD DVDs are no problem.
I also have the MSI 8500GT, use PDVDU 7.3.3401.a.1, and have a copy of Matrix HD-DVD on local disk (not networked). No stuttering. I strongly suspect the bandwidth you're getting from your NAS is not sufficient. The fact that your network is gigabit won't make the NAS any faster. If, for example, it's an SC-101, you'll get about 30Mbps throughput, with many dips below 20Mbps. HD video would likely stutter like mad.
I have a BFG 8600GTS in a Dell E521 (AMD 5200X2) with PDVD and I rarely get over 35% CPU useage for either Blu Ray or HD DVD playback. No stutters, nothing but smooth playback. Good luck.
briinthesky
09-05-07, 11:47 AM
I have a question for anyone using power dvd, do you manage to fill your screen ? i get about 3" of black top and bottom with full screen selected, nad its anoying.
DOES ANYONE ELSE GET THIS ?
I have tried using the nvidia control panel(xfx 8800gts) but whatever i select there is no difference.
AT the moment i am just collecting the bits to build my new htpc so this will not be the eventual card i use (whats the recomended card ?) i am connecting from the xfx card to a hdmi slot in my tv.
As an aside i find power dvd quite good other than the lack of full screen.
I have tried windvd8 and nero showtime without success, they would try to play then fail and lock up. I have so far played bd and hd dvd with no problems and good sound through amp.
Cheers.
Bc.
mikemav
09-05-07, 01:51 PM
I have a question for anyone using power dvd, do you manage to fill your screen ? i get about 3" of black top and bottom with full screen selected, nad its anoying.
DOES ANYONE ELSE GET THIS ?
I have tried using the nvidia control panel(xfx 8800gts) but whatever i select there is no difference.
AT the moment i am just collecting the bits to build my new htpc so this will not be the eventual card i use (whats the recomended card ?) i am connecting from the xfx card to a hdmi slot in my tv.
As an aside i find power dvd quite good other than the lack of full screen.
I have tried windvd8 and nero showtime without success, they would try to play then fail and lock up. I have so far played bd and hd dvd with no problems and good sound through amp.
Cheers.
Bc.
I think this is an Nvidia driver issue. Which ForceWare driver are you using, and what resolution? I had an 8600GT and all the drivers over 158.xx (the 162-something...) had a new overscan "fix " since many consumer HDTVs overscan the image, thereby cutting off the edges. Hence, now at 720p or 1080 res, the Nvidia UNDERSCANS by a ton. I have not found a way to fix this unless I switch to 50HZ or revert back to the older 158 drivers. If anyone knows how to turn it off please let me know. This should be an easily defeatable setting, not locked in. Some of us have projectors or PC monitors that don't overscan, Nvidia!
rgathright
09-05-07, 02:18 PM
I have a PC game that is requiring me to make the following changes to Divx.
"Only do this step if you have Divx Installed. Click on Start, Then click All Programs, Click on Divx, click Divx Codec, click Decoder Configuration utility. Take the Check out of Support decoding on generic Mpeg 4 videos then click Ok. click Now try the game again."
Will this change affect the playing of my X-box HD-DVD player?
georgeorwell
09-05-07, 02:20 PM
I experienced the same exact thing. Upgrading to an 8600 GT, I had to roll my drivers back to 158 to get rid of the underscan.
briinthesky
09-05-07, 03:11 PM
I am currently at 1280*960 but the display will go to 1400* 900
I will try and find some 158 drivers to try. i ahve tried the hd signal format in the control panel but nothing happened.
I tend to use King Kong HD-DVD for testing as it shows any aliasing issues very well during the opening titles and has robust bitrate for the movie.But, do you see any PQ improvement with hardware acceleration as compared to best mode?
Is it worth it to try to get hardware acceleration to work properly, or should I just not update my drivers and pray for the day when I can dump PowerDVD in favor of working software?
berggrendottk
09-05-07, 03:57 PM
Found something that might be interesting.
The file "X:\Cyberlink\PowerDVD\sscfg" contains the following:
_______________________________________________________
###
### sscfg : disable smart subtitle for below vendor/device IDs
###
## GPF and Reboot
# ATI Radeon X1600
Ven: 1002, Dev: 71c0 YUV
Ven: 1002, Dev: 71c2 YUV
## No SP/CC display in YUV mixing mode
# ATI Radeon 9200
Ven: 1002, Dev: 5960 YUV
Ven: 1002, Dev: 5961 YUV
Ven: 1002, Dev: 5962 YUV
Ven: 1002, Dev: 5964 YUV
# ATI Radeon Mobility X300
Ven: 1002, Dev: 3152 YUV
## AI44 palette incorrect
# NV Geforce FX 5200 YUV
Ven: 10DE, Dev: 0320 YUV
Ven: 10DE, Dev: 0321 YUV
Ven: 10DE, Dev: 0322 YUV
Ven: 10DE, Dev: 0323 YUV
Ven: 10DE, Dev: 0324 YUV
Ven: 10DE, Dev: 0328 YUV
Ven: 10DE, Dev: 0329 YUV
# NV Geforce FX Go 5300
Ven: 10DE, Dev: 032c YUV
# NV Geforce FX 5600
Ven: 10DE, Dev: 0311 YUV
Ven: 10DE, Dev: 0312 YUV
Ven: 10DE, Dev: 0313 YUV
Ven: 10DE, Dev: 0314 YUV
Ven: 10DE, Dev: 031a YUV
Ven: 10DE, Dev: 031b YUV
# NV Geforce FX 5700
Ven: 10DE, Dev: 0341 YUV
Ven: 10DE, Dev: 0342 YUV
Ven: 10DE, Dev: 0343 YUV
Ven: 10DE, Dev: 0344 YUV
Ven: 10DE, Dev: 0345 YUV
Ven: 10DE, Dev: 0347 YUV
Ven: 10DE, Dev: 0348 YUV
Ven: 10DE, Dev: 0349 YUV
Ven: 10DE, Dev: 034b YUV
## Pad-to-4x3, SP/CC remains on the region outside video
# NV Geforce Ti 4200/4400/4600
Ven: 10DE, Dev: 0250 YUV
Ven: 10DE, Dev: 0251 YUV
Ven: 10DE, Dev: 0252 YUV
Ven: 10DE, Dev: 0253 YUV
## Jitters when playing high bitrate content
# ATI Radeon 9500
;Ven: 1002, Dev: 4144
# ATI Radeon 9700
;Ven: 1002, Dev: 4145
;Ven: 1002, Dev: 4146
;Ven: 1002, Dev: 4147
# ATI Radeon 9800
;Ven: 1002, Dev: 4148
;Ven: 1002, Dev: 4149
;Ven: 1002, Dev: 414a
# intel 82845G
;Ven: 8086, Dev: 2562
________________________________________________
Don't know what it does or if it's even used but maybe if
someone tries to add the vendor and device id:s of the
Ati and Nvidia cards somewhere in this list maybe something
will happen?
I have a question for anyone using power dvd, do you manage to fill your screen ? i get about 3" of black top and bottom with full screen selected, nad its anoying.
DOES ANYONE ELSE GET THIS ?
I have tried using the nvidia control panel(xfx 8800gts) but whatever i select there is no difference.
AT the moment i am just collecting the bits to build my new htpc so this will not be the eventual card i use (whats the recomended card ?) i am connecting from the xfx card to a hdmi slot in my tv.
As an aside i find power dvd quite good other than the lack of full screen.
I have tried windvd8 and nero showtime without success, they would try to play then fail and lock up. I have so far played bd and hd dvd with no problems and good sound through amp.
Cheers.
Bc.
u sure its not just the movie putting the spaces there? i know some movies i have no space and some i have the 3" or so you are talking about.
I have a question for anyone using power dvd, do you manage to fill your screen ? i get about 3" of black top and bottom with full screen selected, nad its anoying.
DOES ANYONE ELSE GET THIS ?
I have tried using the nvidia control panel(xfx 8800gts) but whatever i select there is no difference.
AT the moment i am just collecting the bits to build my new htpc so this will not be the eventual card i use (whats the recomended card ?) i am connecting from the xfx card to a hdmi slot in my tv.
As an aside i find power dvd quite good other than the lack of full screen.
I have tried windvd8 and nero showtime without success, they would try to play then fail and lock up. I have so far played bd and hd dvd with no problems and good sound through amp.
Cheers.
Bc.
I'll go out on a limb here, even though I realize someone building an HTPC would know better, but I assume the aspect ratio of the movie matches that of that of your display?:confused:
alex.ba
09-06-07, 04:04 AM
I use an ATI 2600PRO with PowerDVD 7.3 (and latest Patch). After switching to the latest 7.8 drivers I get black stripes with HD DVD. Going back to 7.7 and it works fine again. Any idea what this could be?
Dazzlercee
09-06-07, 05:28 AM
I have a question for anyone using power dvd, do you manage to fill your screen ? i get about 3" of black top and bottom with full screen selected, nad its anoying.
DOES ANYONE ELSE GET THIS ?
I have tried using the nvidia control panel(xfx 8800gts) but whatever i select there is no difference.
AT the moment i am just collecting the bits to build my new htpc so this will not be the eventual card i use (whats the recomended card ?) i am connecting from the xfx card to a hdmi slot in my tv.
As an aside i find power dvd quite good other than the lack of full screen.
I have tried windvd8 and nero showtime without success, they would try to play then fail and lock up. I have so far played bd and hd dvd with no problems and good sound through amp.
Cheers.
Bc.
Driver version 163.44 seems to have fixed this issue. In all of the 162.xx drivers you could scale the image to compensate for overscan but once scaled you could not revert back to 1:1.
This is now fixed for me with 163.44 and my 8800GTS.
mikemav
09-06-07, 08:15 AM
Driver version 163.44 seems to have fixed this issue. In all of the 162.xx drivers you could scale the image to compensate for overscan but once scaled you could not revert back to 1:1.
This is now fixed for me with 163.44 and my 8800GTS.
Hi- is that a beta, or a release driver? Even if beta, if it works, I'm happy to try it. Is the underscan just gone, or is it selectable on/off, and if so, where do you select this choice? Do you have a link for these drivers? Thanks
Tried 163.44 and it fixed the underscan issue on a 8600gts. And yes, resize desktop is selectable. Just go to "Resize Desktop" tab in NV Control Panel under "Video & Television" and select "Do not resize my desktop".
Hi- is that a beta, or a release driver? Even if beta, if it works, I'm happy to try it. Is the underscan just gone, or is it selectable on/off, and if so, where do you select this choice? Do you have a link for these drivers? Thanks
ya they are beta and work very well.
here is the links
http://www.nzone.com/object/nzone_downloads_rel70betadriver.html
MickeyDora
09-06-07, 12:05 PM
Will the 8800 series ever get PureVideo™ HD decoding acceleration?
I was told that the 8800's would never get it but I am still holding up hopes.
Rathbone
09-06-07, 12:29 PM
The 8800s waere designed as gamer cards an do not have the full VP2 capabilities (Purevideo HD) of the 8600s.
MickeyDora
09-06-07, 12:32 PM
Rats. I was afraid of that.
Mickey here's my feeling about this and I really feel they can do it without having to upgrade hardware. No hardware needs to change for PureVideo HD support, and it all comes down to a driver.
HDCP compliant cards like my 7600GT Diamond connected to an HDCP LCD may benefit due to the built in chip, and the 8800's I think lack that little bugger so in essence to connect to an HDCP compliant TV/monitor "via" HDMI you might be screwed in that sense. Because of this crap I had to sacrafice my 7800GT for the Diamond. But with AnyDVD it defeats the chain so why bother as long as were able to get ful res out of our content. Or am I missing something?
The HDCP chain is tight too tight.. :mad:
archibael
09-06-07, 01:06 PM
Mickey's looking for hardware acceleration of HD DVD and Blu-ray, not HDCP. AnyDVD won't help him with that.
MickeyDora
09-06-07, 01:36 PM
Mickey's looking for hardware acceleration of HD DVD and Blu-ray, not HDCP. AnyDVD won't help him with that.
Exactly. No problems here with HDCP. Would love to see the CPU usage go down with a little H/A acceleration.
mikemav
09-06-07, 08:06 PM
Tried 163.44 and it fixed the underscan issue on a 8600gts. And yes, resize desktop is selectable. Just go to "Resize Desktop" tab in NV Control Panel under "Video & Television" and select "Do not resize my desktop".
Are you on Vista? All I see under Video and Television tab is Adjust Video Color Settings and Change the signal or HD format. I don't see the resize desktop tab anywhere? Sorry if I'm being dense. 163.44 on Vista 32 bit.
Edit- this is the Nvidia Control Panel I get to (one way) by right-clicking the desktop and selecting it? Or is there another Nvidia control panel you're talking about?
almostinsane
09-06-07, 09:01 PM
Are you viewing the advanced nvidia properties?
mikemav
09-06-07, 10:16 PM
Are you viewing the advanced nvidia properties?
Yes, and only two things under video & television; nothing for resize desktop.
Also if it matters, I use 1280x720 60 Hz, DVI (to HDMI adapter) output
adg1034
09-07-07, 01:09 AM
I posted this over in the HD-DVD Players forum, but think it might work better over here.
So, yeah, like my title says, I've got major issues with greens and purples showing up in places where they shouldn't during HD-DVD playback (Xbox 360 drive connected to my PC, running PowerDVD Ultra 7.3 at 1080p via DVI on my 37" Westinghouse), as well as major amounts of noise.
I can't find a reliable way to get screen captures of this, so I guess you'll have to take my word for it, but right now, I'm watching the opening narration sequence of Serenity, and little things, like the cargo containers on the desert planet that the Alliance is terraforming, are showing up as vibrant greens, blues, and purples.
The noise isn't as concerning to me at the moment, and I have yet to make a real comparison between different discs on my PC, or different discs when my drive is connected to the Xbox (output over VGA). I'm going to check and see how Serenity looks there for comparison now, but I'd love anyone's thoughts.
Just checked Batman Begins on PowerDVD and Serenity on the Xbox player.
Batman Begins has the same problems- way oversaturated greens and purples (far beyond any color correction the disc mastering team did)- but Serenity played through the Xbox looks just fine, though it is still noisy.
This is the first/only time I have ever seen anything like this from my PC, and the colors are the only things it affects- everything else looks normal (spectacular). I really don't know what to do here, other than to only play my discs through my Xbox, but I'm not too excited at that prospect.
From looking at some earlier pages of the thread, it seems like people had problems like this before- did anyone find a solution? I literally can't watch movies like this.
EDIT: And, by changing a few settings, I got it fixed. This post (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=8861101#post8861101) was a major help.
Whew.
Knallie
09-07-07, 04:18 AM
Ok, I have tried to get this to work for ages now, and I just can't seem to get it done. Even though my system plays High Definition contect just fine without Purevideo HD acceleration, I would like to get it to work anyway.
First my system:
AMD X2 5200+
2048MB DDR2 RAM
Asus M2N32-SLI Deluxe
Asus 8600GTS Silent
Microsoft Vista x64
Nvidia 163.44 drivers
Powerdvd 7.3.3104a
Zoomplayer 5.5 alpha
Media Player Classic Home Cinema
Now, I don't have a HD dvd player or Blu-ray player for my PC yet. I do watch alot of downloaded h264 content though. Almost all of them are encoded with h264, so Purevideo HD should be able to handle them right?
They are all in the matroska container (.mkv extension). Powerdvd won't even open these files. I have tried renaming these to .avi or .mp4 or .h264. Powerdvd will atleast try opening these, but without any luck.
However, I am able to select the Cyberlink PowerDVD H.264/AVC Decoder in zoomplayer and it works fine through Haali Media Splitter. If i click the filter properties, I can even select DxvA and turn it on or off. But this doesn't do anything for my CPU usage, which stays around 50% on a 1080p h264 .mkv file. Obviously hardware acceleration isn't working.
I have searched for a way to get these mkv files to play with hardware acceleration from Purevidoe HD, but I can never find a definitive answer whether or not it's possible. Hope someone can help me out here!
Also, in the release notes it said there are different postprocessing settings for purevideo HD. Where can I find these settings? All i can find about Purevideo HD is in powerdvd, where I can tick hardware acceleration. There's no mention of purevideo HD anywhere else. Can someone clarify this for me?
Has anyone found a way to automatically (or with remote control command) exit PowerDVD after a movie is stopped or finished other than by using a mouse to click the X? I use MyMovies to launch it for HD movies and that works great but I can't figure out how to close it without use of mouse.
Thanks!
Has anyone found a way to automatically (or with remote control command) exit PowerDVD after a movie is stopped or finished other than by using a mouse to click the X? I use MyMovies to launch it for HD movies and that works great but I can't figure out how to close it without use of mouse.
Thanks!
My iMon remote's "Application Exit" button, (the top left button) works perfectly fine with closing ANY application, including PowerDVD. And the remote works just fine controlling media playback in PowerDVD as well. All of the DVD navigation controls work in PDVD with the iMon remote. I can play stop, FF, RW, access menus etc. And this is with either a local Xbox drive or an HD DVD movie from my network.
Edit: ANd the blue button brings back VMC just fine.
Hmmm, I use a Harmony 890 remote which, so far, has been able to do everything I need to do. The H890 does fine with all the navigtion stuff so if I can just figure out where I could get the IR command for Application Exit, it could easily learn it and I could just program it to be sent as an exit command from the H890. The CyberLink PowerDVD application is in the Logitech database as a DVD player but the only button I saw that even came close was an 'exit' button and I figured that was just to exit menus, not the application, so I haven't made it a part of my movie activities.
Thanks,
dsteren
09-08-07, 04:08 PM
I can't recommend this remote (Gyration Media Center remote) enough... it works great with PowerDVD and the mouse functionality as part of the remote is amazingly easy and accurate.
http://www.gyration.com/en-US/ProductDetail.html?modelnum=GYR3101US&accshow=3
Ok here is something weird. I have vista MCE, HD-DVD, My Movies, PowerDVd Ultra , and I am using an Onkyo 805 as an amp/HDMI switcher to my Infocus DLP.
I have set MCE to use the cyberlink codec for regular DVD play as well.
From within MCE everything works fine. Ripped dvds play just fine (using My Movies), physical dvd’s also play just fine from within MCE. HD-DVD’s also play just fine – after MCE kicks me out to the Powerdvd interface.
The weird part is when I try to use PowerDVD as a stand alone with MCE closed. HD-DVD’s still work just fine – BUT standard DVD’s will not play – they start to play and then PowerDVD stops and puts up the following message:
“Your Monitor is an HDCP repeater. It is prohibited from displaying protected content. (Error Code = 0106)”
Not really a problem, as I typically would play DVD’s from MCE anyway. But, this basically suggests that PowerDVD is useless if you want to use it as a stand-alone player with computer and an external amp/switcher (the 805) for regular DVDs.
But, do you see any PQ improvement with hardware acceleration as compared to best mode?
Is it worth it to try to get hardware acceleration to work properly, or should I just not update my drivers and pray for the day when I can dump PowerDVD in favor of working software?
Firstly, with XP 8500GT 1920x1440p72 PowerDVD 7.3.2911 the beta drivers 163.44 do seem to accelerate VC-1 a little, however the colours look flat and just "wrong" plus it locks up PowerDVD after a short while. I could not check the difference between Best and Normal video quality modes with HA enabled, but I left PowerDVD on Best setting. HA is not worth it at the moment with an 8500GT and XP and the current drivers.
With HA disabled, Normal video quality mode produces jaggies but CPU utilisation is around 50% (C2D 2.8GHz). Best video quality mode produces a gorgeous picture that is jaw droppingly 3D and detailed, but at a penalty of 2x Normal CPU utilisation, which overloads the CPU and causes stuttering at times.
There is still no decent solution on my setup for fantastic PQ with XP 8500GT unless you have a very powerful CPU probably around 3.3GHz and disable HA.
The story isn't much better with a 2400Pro. Under XP, HA results in 5% CPU utilisation and good colours for the main feature, however the overall PQ looks soft and "flat" compared to the 8500GT Best mode: it just doesn't jump out and grab you like the Nvidia offering. But menus appear to be sluggish and the background images jerky compared to Nvidia and when changing between elements of an HD-DVD, CPU utilisation returns briefly to astronomic levels (which indicates the HA is only being used during the actual media file playback and not inbetween). Also when attempting to play what looks like an interlaced VC-1 extra on 300 HD-DVD, it's slideshow city even though CPU utilisation remains at around 8% (software decoding indicates this extra is more computationally intensive than the main VC-1 feature: it spiked briefly to 100% CPU in Normal mode, when the main feature was only 50%). My guess is that the 2400Pro is easily overloaded by interlaced VC-1 in HA.
With HA disabled for the 2400Pro, results were very similar to the 8500GT (menus smooth and Best mode spiking 100%) however PQ was still flat and uninspiring compared to Nvidia in Best mode.
I was also unable to get 72Hz refresh for the 2400Pro: something that Nvidia does straight out of the box.
My conclusion so far is that the best PQ with XP (using 8500GT and 2400Pro) is with an 8500GT in Best video quality mode with HA disabled and a very powerful CPU.
The situation might be different with a more powerful GPU (2600Pro), but I suspect the characteristic ATI softness will remain: it's not unwatchable by any means, but when you have compared it with Nvidia Best video quality, I know which I prefer.
It would be really great if someone with a different mobo, but the same graphics card and CPU could verify my results or determine whether my setup is performing correctly: it seems strange that I'm getting 100% CPU when decoding VC-1, even in software mode, when VC-1 is computationally relatively easy to decode.
I would really like to know also what filtering Cyberlink are doing in Best mode, that produces such great PQ (with HA disabled).
arfster
09-08-07, 10:55 PM
The story isn't much better with a 2400Pro. Under XP, HA results in 5% CPU utilisation and good colours for the main feature, however the overall PQ looks soft and "flat" compared to the 8500GT Best mode: it just doesn't jump out and grab you like the Nvidia offering. But menus appear to be sluggish and the background images jerky compared to Nvidia and when changing between elements of an HD-DVD, CPU utilisation returns briefly to astronomic levels (which indicates the HA is only being used during the actual media file playback and not inbetween). Also when attempting to play what looks like an interlaced VC-1 extra on 300 HD-DVD, it's slideshow city even though CPU utilisation remains at around 8% (software decoding indicates this extra is more computationally intensive than the main VC-1 feature: it spiked briefly to 100% CPU in Normal mode, when the main feature was only 50%). My guess is that the 2400Pro is easily overloaded by interlaced VC-1 in HA.
You have some weird issues - for example, vc1 interlaced with default settings is no problem at all for a 2400. It's mpeg2 interlaced that can cause issues.
Incidentally, I had the 2400pro and 8500gt also, and did a lot of comparisons. End conclusion was the scaling and decoding quality was the same - it's bit identical in many areas, and there certainly wasn't any visible difference flicking between screenshots. I ended up switching to ATI for the customisability though.
If you haven't calibrated for both though, the picture you are getting will be severely sub-optimal and thus totally invalidates any comparison, so I'd suggest that route first. However, the sheer range of problems you're having does make me suspect you have a duff card (and there seem to have been a lot of 2400s in that vein).
With HA disabled, Normal video quality mode produces jaggies but CPU utilisation is around 50% (C2D 2.8GHz). Best video quality mode produces a gorgeous picture that is jaw droppingly 3D and detailed, but at a penalty of 2x Normal CPU utilisation, which overloads the CPU and causes stuttering at times.It's odd that your CPU utilization is so high; mine is roughly half of yours in best mode (crudely correcting for differences in cores and clock rates).
But thanks for the confirmation about hardware acceleration, it just seems like more trouble than it's worth.
Now if there were only a way to install new drivers and convince PowerDVD NOT to automatically turn it on for me even if I leave the box unchecked...
It's odd that your CPU utilization is so high; mine is roughly half of yours in best mode (crudely correcting for differences in cores and clock rates).
But thanks for the confirmation about hardware acceleration, it just seems like more trouble than it's worth.
Now if there were only a way to install new drivers and convince PowerDVD NOT to automatically turn it on for me even if I leave the box unchecked...
I too would like to know why my CPU utilisation is so high.
Are you sure you are using XP? Unless you have almost identical setup to mine, it's difficult to compare results, because just one element can introduce major differences.
I'm running 163.44 drivers but disabling HA in PowerDVD. It seems to run as stably and similarly to the 158.22 drivers that I was using before (if HA disabled). I had no problem with HA staying disabled if I untick the box with both 163.44 and 158.22. That's an important difference between our setups and might give some clue as to why our CPU utilisations are so different too. Maybe you are always getting part acceleration and that is why the tick box remains checked, whereas I go from absolutely no acceleration whatsoever, to full (but broken) acceleration if HA is ticked.
You have some weird issues - for example, vc1 interlaced with default settings is no problem at all for a 2400. It's mpeg2 interlaced that can cause issues.
Incidentally, I had the 2400pro and 8500gt also, and did a lot of comparisons. End conclusion was the scaling and decoding quality was the same - it's bit identical in many areas, and there certainly wasn't any visible difference flicking between screenshots. I ended up switching to ATI for the customisability though.
If you haven't calibrated for both though, the picture you are getting will be severely sub-optimal and thus totally invalidates any comparison, so I'd suggest that route first. However, the sheer range of problems you're having does make me suspect you have a duff card (and there seem to have been a lot of 2400s in that vein).
It's difficult to understand why the 2400 would be faulty, since it seems to handle playback of the 300 and King Kong main features just fine. The 300 extras and the menus are definitely more demanding than the main feature: I attempted to play them with HA disabled and Normal video quality mode and they were averaging around 70% CPU (but spiked to 100% a few times), whereas the main feature under the same conditions was around 50%; so that's something like an extra 40% burden for the extras compared to the main feature.
My guess is that the 1920x1440p75 desktop I'm running at pushes the 2400 towards its limit with standard VC-1, but any more computationally intensive VC-1 pushes it over the edge. I probably should look at using a utility to measure GPU utilisation and see what happens between the two sources. I would guess that most others who are getting good results are using lower resolutions and refresh rates.
I'm using a SORTOverrideVidCapsSize=3000000 to ensure I get full video size presentation: maybe this also has a bearing when the default is just 1024000.
I only got the 3D effect in Nvidia in Best mode: Normal seems closer to the ATI result.
After playing with the contrast setting in PowerDVD, I have noticed setting it below the 10 that I normally use seems to "flatten" the image so that it looks more similar to ATI. Consequently, it is possible that the 3D effect I see is primarily due to boosted contrast. Nevertheless, I think even the desktop looks a little crisper with Nvidia than ATI.
ATI might be more customisable in general, but for the main element of importance to me (72Hz refresh), it is surprisingly recalcitrant. Powerstrip 3.74 won't enable customised settings for the 2400Pro and there is no entry for 72Hz in the driver at the resolution I need.
i recently ran into a problem with powerdvd sound hiccups...i've been playing it for the last few days without problem.
cpu is c2d 6670
8600gts
sound via spdif to receiver.
where in powerdvd that i can select to use spdif ? if i choose 6 channels speaker config, i heave very low volumn sound
4 channel speaker config sound fine..
is it because i've been running my htpc 24/7 and downloading tons of stuff interfere with the sounds ?
is there a 7.4 version out ? should i upgrade to that version ?
nathan_h
09-09-07, 02:42 AM
I've been using 7.3 for a while now. I upgraded to each of the two newer versions (patches) of PowerDVDUltra (or, at least, these two are the only ones I say and that I have downloaded) when doing a re-install of Vista recently.
The first (2911) patch broke SPDIF output for DVD's completely, left HD-DVD outputting only 2 channel PCM, but preserved DD in a TS file.
The second PowerDVDUltra (3104a) upgrade (patch) preserved SPDIF output for all media, but no DD or DTS passthrough, just 2 channel.
So I rolled back to the first/original version PowerDVDUltra 7.3, even though it has a weird bug with its DVD video quality, so I'll need to use another player for DVDs. But SPDIF output (DD, DTS, and DTS mixing) are all working perfectly, now, for DVDs (though I don't play them in this app, HD-DVD, Blu-Ray, and TS + other media files).
The wild card here is that not only does PowerDVDUltra have trouble with SD DVDs, so does Theatertek -- which also uses hardware acceleration with my nVidia 8500 card. But Media Player Classic (which does software decoding) has no such issues. So MPC is what I'm using for SD DVDs. (SPDIF output is working there, properly, too.)
arfster
09-09-07, 09:23 AM
My guess is that the 1920x1440p75 desktop I'm running at pushes the 2400 towards its limit with standard VC-1, but any more computationally intensive VC-1 pushes it over the edge. I probably should look at using a utility to measure GPU utilisation and see what happens between the two sources.
Yeah, that would be best. However, the way it works is that VC1 decoding is totally handled on the UVD, and that aspect can do 50mbit easily - HDDVD doesn't get anywhere near that. Postprocessing like deinterlacing and scaling are handled on the shaders (this is the bit GPU% software tools measure) after decoding, and thus bitrate or compression complexity of the original have no effect on how hard it's pushed - simply scaling alone would take nowhere near max, and even if it did you'd get framedrop and jitter rather than image quality problems.
Your SORT size should be fine - you can probably use the same value as 1920*1080p screens btw (2800000), because it should be 1:1 pixel mapped. I didn't have any issues at that res anyway, and again if it did the problem would be jitter.
The 72hz thing would be a little irritating though - I noticed that also at 1600*1200.
Hardware: on reflection the type of issues caused by screwed cards tend more to be corruption. I wonder if it could be HDCP-related though? If that were to cause it to downscale to 540p you'd get a lot of detail loss and softness, which apparently exactly what PDVD normal vid quality on Nvidias does. An easy way to test for this would be one of the 1080p lines patterns at w6rez.net - if it is downscaled then reupscaled this shows it up.
Bob Sorel
09-09-07, 09:50 AM
Is there a FAQ or a guide for setting up PowerDVD 7.3 Ultra properly? I am getting deinterlacing artifacts that I don't get when I play the same titles (both Blu-ray and HD-DVD) in hardware players and I don't have any clue how to get rid of them. BTW, you probably wouldn't notice these artifacts on a small screen, but mine is 139" wide, so even very minor artifacts are easily noticed.
I am using a Core 2 Duo 6600, 1 gig RAM, and a GeForce 7950GT video card and sending everything out to my video processor at 1080i60 (as that is the same way I am sending the signals from my hardware players - my pre/pro won't handle 1080p60 correctly, so I have to send things interlaced). Monitors are in clone mode.
Any advice?
Edit: Yes, I know there is a FAQ stickied here, but it is pretty outdated...I am looking for something current.
AnthonyB
09-09-07, 10:55 AM
Has anyone found a way to automatically (or with remote control command) exit PowerDVD after a movie is stopped or finished other than by using a mouse to click the X? I use MyMovies to launch it for HD movies and that works great but I can't figure out how to close it without use of mouse.
Thanks!
Get an MCE keyboard and you can program away to your hearts content.. I have this button, Eject BD, Eject HD, Screenshots and more all from the keyboard on my Harmony.
Are you sure you are using XP?Yes, XP and 8600 GTS. I am also upscaling the output to 2560x1440.I'm running 163.44 drivers but disabling HA in PowerDVD. It seems to run as stably and similarly to the 158.22 drivers that I was using before (if HA disabled). I had no problem with HA staying disabled if I untick the box with both 163.44 and 158.22.Did you install the latest patch? That's what seems to have broken the hardware acceleration feature. Also, make sure you check while the video is running, that's when it automatically turns it on and greys out the box.Maybe you are always getting part acceleration and that is why the tick box remains checked, whereas I go from absolutely no acceleration whatsoever, to full (but broken) acceleration if HA is ticked.No, with acceleration it uses almost zero CPU, so it's definitely not being accelerated. Plus, because of the above problem I've reverted to the 162.18 drivers which don't support acceleration at all (to force it off).
Anyway, without acceleration, and in best mode, my Q6600 is usually around 20% and peaks at 30%, so with your CPU you should be seeing around 50-70%, nowhere near 100%.
Yes, XP and 8600 GTS. I am also upscaling the output to 2560x1440.Did you install the latest patch?
I think all bets are off when you use different hardware: the 8600GTS is far more capable than the 8500GT and I'm not sure you can simply linearly scale CPUs (especially with different numbers of cores).
I'm still using PowerDVD 7.3.2911, haven't tried the latest patches.
Others seem to be having BSOD problems with 8500GT and 163.44 drivers, yet those with 8600 graphics don't seem to be in as much strife, so I guess there is a difference between the two sets of hardware.
When playing an HD-DVD, HA is greyed out but remains unticked (if it was unticked when not playing an HD-DVD).
With my issues with a 2400Pro as well, I would hazard a guess that the lower end hardware (8500GT and 2400Pro) is borderline with handling VC-1 at high overall resolutions and refresh rates. The 2400Pro is only 64bit, so maybe that has a bearing on some of the issues.
arfster
09-09-07, 09:18 PM
With my issues with a 2400Pro as well, I would hazard a guess that the lower end hardware (8500GT and 2400Pro) is borderline with handling VC-1 at high overall resolutions and refresh rates. The 2400Pro is only 64bit, so maybe that has a bearing on some of the issues.
Nah - scaling to 1080 horizontal is easy with a 2400pro and a 8500GT. On the former, the GPU% is around 20% or thereabouts. Refresh rate is irrelevant, because you're just repeating frames. You're not even talking high bitrates with HDDVD, as the card is capable of at least double what you're feeding it, while simultaneously scaling to much higher resolutions.
The performance difference between these cards and the 8600/2600 models is in deinterlacing, which is a whole different issue. Playing back progressive stuff is a piece of cake for them.
Hardware: on reflection the type of issues caused by screwed cards tend more to be corruption. I wonder if it could be HDCP-related though? If that were to cause it to downscale to 540p you'd get a lot of detail loss and softness, which apparently exactly what PDVD normal vid quality on Nvidias does. An easy way to test for this would be one of the 1080p lines patterns at w6rez.net - if it is downscaled then reupscaled this shows it up.
HDCP is not an issue, since my test King Kong on HDD has been "neutered" and the 8500GT and 2400Pro (both Gigabyte) are both supposed to be HDCP enabled. The 2400Pro is only 64bit, which I'm wondering might be a bottleneck.
In comparison, I managed to play King Kong with a C2D 2.4GHz and 128MB ATI X300 with PowerDVD 6.5 with CPU load of 50%, although PQ looked as flat as with the 2400Pro and PowerDVD 7.3.2911. Seems to me PowerDVD is the culprit somehow.
I have some test patterns, but they are in mpeg2 format and when played as a file in PowerDVD, there is no longer an option to specify the video quality. Maybe this is a VC-1 option only. They look fine with an 8500GT and no apparent downscaling (have swapped back to the 8500GT for the moment to get smooth extras playback and the crisper PQ).
When I play the 300 extras on 2400Pro HA enabled, in full screen 1920x1440p75, it's slideshow alley (is this dropped frame?), but if I switch to windowed mode it's completely smooth (albeit with scaled combing artifacts). This doesn't make a lot of sense, since it's having to decode the source in the same way in both situations and the only difference is the scaling. Yet at full screen, there shouldn't be any scaling as I'm running 1:1 and the scaling is actually in windowed mode. With HA disabled, the extra plays much smoother full screen, although it maxes the CPU and drops some frames. It's bizarre, but IMO a problem with HA.
I might change back to the 2400Pro for further testing, but it's annoying swapping cards and re-installing drivers each time.
Considering some have mentioned issues with 8500GT 163.44 and HA BSOD, yet 8600 owners don't appear to have the same problem, my suspicion is that the lower end hardware (8500GT 2400Pro64bit) is either borderline at the resolutions I'm attempting to run, or PowerDVD has been optimised for the more advanced hardware.
I think all bets are off when you use different hardware: the 8600GTS is far more capable than the 8500GT and I'm not sure you can simply linearly scale CPUs (especially with different numbers of cores).Well, since we're talking software decoding and overlay mode, I doubt GPU power is a big issue.
On the CPU end, I'm crudely approximating, but I did used to have an E6600 (dual core) @ 2.9, and never got anywhere near 100% CPU utilization.I'm still using PowerDVD 7.3.2911, haven't tried the latest patches.I think the next patch (3104a.1) is the one that breaks it.
Davinleeds
09-09-07, 10:00 PM
Still trying to figure it out: 7900GS 30%, 8600GTS 90%+.
jimwhite
09-10-07, 09:38 AM
application exit is simply Alt-F4....
:cool:
I have set MCE to use the cyberlink codec for regular DVD play as well.
How do you do this?
With this handy little free utility :)
http://mediacenterexpert.blogspot.com/2006/07/vista-media-center-decoder-utility.html
hughesne
09-10-07, 10:24 AM
Ok, i have the latest power dvd ultra, 8500GT vid card, E6750 proc with 2gb of mem, xbox 360 HD drive. Using the latest (not beta) nvidia GPU drivers on Vista 32. When i go to play a HD movie, the movie starts and lasts for about 2 seconds, then stops and an error pops up. Says to run the HD advisor, i do, all is green. Any suggestions? Should i be seeing any issue with running dual displays, 1 to my sony KDS and 1 to my cases LCD TS? I run theater tek just fine in this configuration.
Thanks.
sarah99
09-10-07, 10:56 AM
try the free trial of AnyDVD HD
With this handy little free utility :)
http://mediacenterexpert.blogspot.com/2006/07/vista-media-center-decoder-utility.html
When I tried that, I got no sound using any of the CyberLink codecs.
Right - only use the cyberlink video codec - keep audio set to S/PDIF.
"Get an MCE keyboard and you can program away to your hearts content.. I have this button, Eject BD, Eject HD, Screenshots and more all from the keyboard on my Harmony. "
"application exit is simply Alt-F4...."
Yeah, I know I could use my keyboard and Alt+F4 but I haven't found a way to teach my Harmony 890 to do that. Everything else I want to do happens with one button push for an activity; I don't want to have to use multiple devices to do what I need to do and a keyboard will not do the associated activities like turn on my eSATA HDD box, turn projector on/off, raise/lower trapdoor screen, dim lights.... What I have decided to do for now is just send a "start" command to MCE from the remote during the movie exit activities; this doesn't close PDVD but it brings MCE on top so I don't see that caustic red skin--kinda the out-of-sight/out-of-mind approach and PDVD is ready to be brought forward to top the next time I launch a movie via MyMovies. So, now the only time I have to deal with closing/minimizing PDVD is when I need to perform maintenance on the HTPC, backup movies...etc
Thanks for the suggestions!
Right - only use the cyberlink video codec - keep audio set to S/PDIF.
I think I'll keep using PDVDU independent of MCE, because I use 8-channel analog out to my receiver so that I can get uncompressed LPCM from bD. For some reason, I can no longer have MCE set to use S/PDIF and still get analog out without adjusting settings in the CP. (I think "some reason" is my upgrading to Vista.)
Ok, i have the latest power dvd ultra, 8500GT vid card, E6750 proc with 2gb of mem, xbox 360 HD drive. Using the latest (not beta) nvidia GPU drivers on Vista 32. When i go to play a HD movie, the movie starts and lasts for about 2 seconds, then stops and an error pops up. Says to run the HD advisor, i do, all is green. Any suggestions? Should i be seeing any issue with running dual displays, 1 to my sony KDS and 1 to my cases LCD TS? I run theater tek just fine in this configuration.
Thanks.
I have two monitors as well. PDVD does not like clone mode. I have to turn it off to get playback. But, advisor is red in clone mode as well. Yours isn't? Hmm... Not sure.
nathan_h
09-10-07, 06:57 PM
I've been using 7.3 for a while now. I upgraded to each of the two newer versions (patches) of PowerDVDUltra (or, at least, these two are the only ones I say and that I have downloaded) when doing a re-install of Vista recently.
The first (2911) patch broke SPDIF output for DVD's completely, left HD-DVD outputting only 2 channel PCM, but preserved DD in a TS file.
The second PowerDVDUltra (3104a) upgrade (patch) preserved SPDIF output for all media, but no DD or DTS passthrough, just 2 channel.
So I rolled back to the first/original version PowerDVDUltra 7.3, even though it has a weird bug with its DVD video quality, so I'll need to use another player for DVDs. But SPDIF output (DD, DTS, and DTS mixing) are all working perfectly, now, for DVDs (though I don't play them in this app, HD-DVD, Blu-Ray, and TS + other media files).
The wild card here is that not only does PowerDVDUltra have trouble with SD DVDs, so does Theatertek -- which also uses hardware acceleration with my nVidia 8500 card. But Media Player Classic (which does software decoding) has no such issues. So MPC is what I'm using for SD DVDs. (SPDIF output is working there, properly, too.)
Anybody else seeing something like this? I have had to stay at the original/unpatched version of PowerDVD Ultra 7.3 because 2911 and 3104a both break the SPDIF output (restrict it to 2 channel) not only for HD content, for for EVERYTHING, in all players (not just PowerDVD Ultra).
The sad part is that DVD playback looks very bad in the unpatched version of 7.3, whereas it looks find once I apply any of the patches.
(For reference, this is in Vista 32, with an 8500 video card, and drivers 163.11 for the card.)
SpHeRe31459
09-11-07, 01:53 AM
Is there a FAQ or a guide for setting up PowerDVD 7.3 Ultra properly? I am getting deinterlacing artifacts that I don't get when I play the same titles (both Blu-ray and HD-DVD) in hardware players and I don't have any clue how to get rid of them. BTW, you probably wouldn't notice these artifacts on a small screen, but mine is 139" wide, so even very minor artifacts are easily noticed.
I am using a Core 2 Duo 6600, 1 gig RAM, and a GeForce 7950GT video card and sending everything out to my video processor at 1080i60 (as that is the same way I am sending the signals from my hardware players - my pre/pro won't handle 1080p60 correctly, so I have to send things interlaced). Monitors are in clone mode.
Any advice?
Edit: Yes, I know there is a FAQ stickied here, but it is pretty outdated...I am looking for something current.
Can I ask what are these artifacts? and what OS/Drivers are you using? I just did some testing with the HD HQV disc and found that under WinXP the 163.44 beta drivers and a GeForce 8600GT have some really wierd issues that don't seem to be there under Vista, since mulitple sites have reviewed the GeForce 8600 series with the HD HQV disc and they get high scores.
I have had to stay at the original/unpatched version of PowerDVD Ultra 7.3 because 2911 and 3104a both break the SPDIF output (restrict it to 2 channel) not only for HD content, for for EVERYTHING, in all players (not just PowerDVD Ultra).Odd, SPDIF has always worked for me.
I haven't played back an HD DVD in quite awhile. Went to watch "The Host" tonight (XBox Drive + PDVD Ultra) and it played for about 45 minutes and then the computer locked up. Rebooted and started where I left off and it played for five minutes and locked up again. Rebooted and tried one more time. Played for about 30 minutes and froze again! Rats. Anyone know what I messed up?
Thanks
Favelle
09-11-07, 04:19 AM
Same here. Optical out has never failed since the original version, 2911 patch and the latest 3014a patch.
Bob Sorel
09-11-07, 11:41 AM
Can I ask what are these artifacts?
Moire patterns and small but noticeable jaggies
and what OS/Drivers are you using?
Win XP SP2...drivers are 93.71 (Wow, I didn't realize how old they are. What are the recommended drivers?)
SpHeRe31459
09-11-07, 12:48 PM
Moire patterns and small but noticeable jaggies
Win XP SP2...drivers are 93.71 (Wow, I didn't realize how old they are. What are the recommended drivers?)
Yeah you can try the latest beta 163.67 drivers (http://www.nvidia.com/object/winxp_2k_163.67.html). I'm not sure it will help though, the WinXP drivers seem to fail the HD HQV tests whereas the Vista drivers apparently don't fail.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=906270
Was this ever discussed here? In-movie experience features in King Kong, Batman Begins, and many other HD-DVDs? I can turn them on, but I can't control them. Any tips? Thanks.
IAM4UK, Is DVE on PowerDVD still an issue when running AnyDVD? Cause I just got around to trying the disc, and you can easily still strip HDCP with AnyDVD enabled, just disable (uncheck) the "Remove first play title from HD-DVD" option on Video HD DVD settings in AnyDVD. The menus and everything is working OK, as far as I can tell when you do that. Is there any other problem I should be aware of?
Fredrik Rasmussen
09-12-07, 08:20 AM
No luck with DVE on PowerDVD latest patch downloaded yesterday.
Can walk around in the menus, but not press Enter and start anything.
Fredrik, Do you have AnyDVD running? Does the disc work if you disable AnyDVD? The problem I mentioned was specific to running DVE with AnyDVD.
Anyway, I even copied the disc to my hard drive, so I don't have to carry it to work. It still works OK, just unchecked the "Remove first play title from HD-DVD" option when ripping the disc. I also have the latest PowerDVD patch 3104a.1
nathan_h
09-12-07, 12:43 PM
Odd, SPDIF has always worked for me.
Same here. Optical out has never failed since the original version, 2911 patch and the latest 3014a patch.
You're running Vista 32? What sound card?
You're running Vista 32? What sound card?XP and on-board audio.
taz291819
09-12-07, 05:03 PM
No luck with DVE on PowerDVD latest patch downloaded yesterday.
Can walk around in the menus, but not press Enter and start anything.
There was a patch released yesterday, or you just downloaded it yesterday?
Two of my HTPCs, one with onboard SPDIF out, the other with onboard SPDIF as well as the SPDIF from the X-Meridian, all work fine, with PowerDVD on Vista Home Premium 32.
Can anyone try messing with the color controls in PowerDVD 3104a.1 with the Bourne Supremacy HD-DVD, please? They don't do anything over here, but for the menus and other movies either in VC-1 and H.264 they do work. It's just for this movie, and only the movie part that they don't work. Just updated to 163.67 drivers for my 8600GTS, so I'll revert to 163.44 and see if it's that, though I don't think so. It's pretty weird. Nvidia Control Panel video color controls do work, though.
EDIT: It wasn't the drivers. Reverted to PowerDVD 2605, and it can't enable HW accel with VC-1 on the 8600GTS. Updated to 2911 and when HW accel is enabled, still only with this move the color controls don't work. I'll stay here, since you can't disable HW accel for the 3104 updates. Weird. Someone has an idea as to why only this movie?
nathan_h
09-13-07, 11:28 AM
Two of my HTPCs, one with onboard SPDIF out, the other with onboard SPDIF as well as the SPDIF from the X-Meridian, all work fine, with PowerDVD on Vista Home Premium 32.
Wow, interesting. I've got a fresh install of Vista 32 (with all MS updates) with a AV710 sound card and with onboard CMEDIA audio, and both SPDIF outputs break if I install the Cyberlink PowerDVD Ultra updates. And there's almost nothing else on the computer (installed a remote access ap, and Media Player Classic, and that's it).
Hey, guys. You can add The Good Shepherd to the list of movies that don't allow messing with color with HW accel. on on PowerDVD (see my post two posts up). So it's probably some or all Universal titles. If you got one of the new ATI or nVidia cards and one of these movies, could you try see if it works? Not a huge problem, but an annoyance at best. I use calibrated computer monitors and I don't mess with them for video. I just calibrate the renderer.
The problem is that if I just calibrate from nVidia Control Panel (I "expand" levels), then the stupid Media Center always applies unwanted levels "expansion", so it will be double-expanded. So I just have to mess with contrast with every individual application's controls.
Hey, I was wondering, is PowerDVD more or less feature complete for HD DVD now? I.e. do all the advanced stuff like extras, downloads, menu navigation, PiP etc. work properly or are there still a lot of titles exhibiting buggy behavior or inaccessible features?
Also how much more power do you need to run PiP extras, do you think a 2600XT and an AMD 64 X2 4000+ could do the job? Has anyone tried the Freedom disc where you can apparently manipulate/resize/move the PiP around? (Or if there are any other discs that allow that.)
I've just tried the 163.67 Nvidia drivers with an 8500GT XP C2D 2.8GHz 1920x1440p72 VGA desktop system and PowerDVD 7.3.2911.
Playback of King Kong HA=disabled Video Quality=Best has CPU load of 90%+ but PQ is outstanding (I use a modified Theater colour mode).
With HA enabled, CPU load drops to less than 25% but brightness is raised compared to the HA=disabled appearance. There is also very fine aliasing on edges that doesn't exist in software decode mode. Of more concern is that PowerDVD crashes and locks up the system after a short period of playback. There is a message that nv4_disp.dll or similar has stopped working properly.
I have difficulty in understanding why there is a 4x decrease in CPU load for HA decoding compared to non-HA decoding, since I didn't think HA was assisting much for VC-1 (max of 50% assist?).
I wonder if PowerDVD is attempting to play IME somehow in parallel with the main feature in software decode mode, but it isn't in HA mode.
The driver 163.67 release is getting closer to proper HA support for XP, but still has a long way to go.
archibael
09-14-07, 04:13 AM
You shouldn't be at 90% load on that powerful a processor for VC-1, even completely unaccelerated. The 25% number is, in fact, closer to what you should be getting unaccelerated.
Something else is wrong.
You shouldn't be at 90% load on that powerful a processor for VC-1, even completely unaccelerated. The 25% number is, in fact, closer to what you should be getting unaccelerated.
I wish someone could help me work out what is wrong and fix it.
I think it is PowerDVD at fault.
If I play the King Kong feature_1.evo in graphedit with Haali splitter and WMV9 decoder, using the same setup as with PowerDVD, CPU usage is less than 25%. What's more, levels don't seem as crushed as with PowerDVD and in fact seem perfect with the default VMR7 renderer. I don't think the WMV9 decoder is accelerating VC-1.
It's something PowerDVD is doing in software decode mode that is sucking extra CPU.
With PowerDVD 6.5, I could play King Kong with an ATI X300 graphics card and C2D 2.4GHz at 50% CPU.
The annoying thing is that I need PowerDVD to get playback of the HD audio.
Out of curiosity, if I look in the PowerDVD About option and click on the registration field, it gives a lot of detail about PowerDVD. Of particular interest is that although it is supposed to be PowerDVD 7.3 2911, whilst the UI=2911, the DVD decoder is 2830. Is this normal?
[UPDATE: Installed PowerDVD 3104a patch and HA is automatically ticked now whenever PowerDVD plays an HD-DVD, no way to force it into software decode mode any more. Still the same issues with lockup after a while, so I'm going back to 2911.]
Dazzlercee
09-14-07, 06:43 AM
Wow, interesting. I've got a fresh install of Vista 32 (with all MS updates) with a AV710 sound card and with onboard CMEDIA audio, and both SPDIF outputs break if I install the Cyberlink PowerDVD Ultra updates. And there's almost nothing else on the computer (installed a remote access ap, and Media Player Classic, and that's it).
The latest PDVD Ultra also breaks SPDIF on my X-Meridian, I can only get 2 channel. This happens with a patched version and a full installaion of the newest build.
As a last resort I decided to enable my onboard Azalia sound and install the latest Vista drivers. After a reboot, and enabling SPDIF in PDVD I was once again able to output DD/DTS, but not from the X-Meridian.
I usually run the X-Merdian on analogue but recently I keep losing the sub channel when watching films and listening to music. If I click the subwoofer icon in the Vista sound setup it comes back on, but then drops out again after a view minutes. Anyone any ideas what could cause this? Could the output from the card be too low for my receiver to pick up on the ext. in or doesn't this really matter? All other channels are fine.
mikemav
09-14-07, 08:41 AM
Someone was mentioning a couple of pages back to me that the Nvidia beta drivers we were discussing DID have an option to not resize the desktop (underscan, to compensate for consumer display's overscan.) Does anyone see this option on any of the 163.xx drivers in Vista? I cannot locate it and want to not resize the desktop.
I've just tried the 163.67 Nvidia drivers with an 8500GT XP C2D 2.8GHz 1920x1440p72 VGA desktop system and PowerDVD 7.3.2911.
Playback of King Kong HA=disabled Video Quality=Best has CPU load of 90%+ but PQ is outstanding (I use a modified Theater colour mode).
With HA enabled, CPU load drops to less than 25% but brightness is raised compared to the HA=disabled appearance. There is also very fine aliasing on edges that doesn't exist in software decode mode. Of more concern is that PowerDVD crashes and locks up the system after a short period of playback. There is a message that nv4_disp.dll or similar has stopped working properly.
Did you try setting Edge Enhancement or Noise Reduction in nVidia Control Panel to 1? That will solve the aliasing. It's not the EE or NR themselves that fix that, it just seems that when you enable any of them even at the minimum, some other processing takes place. I can even see the colors change slightly.
About your crashes, you might wanna try drivercleaner.net or drivercleaner pro ($10 and free, respectively). It helped me a lot with ATI and C-media drivers, I don't know how much it did with nVidia ones, but I always use it now after uninstalling drivers.
Someone was mentioning a couple of pages back to me that the Nvidia beta drivers we were discussing DID have an option to not resize the desktop (underscan, to compensate for consumer display's overscan.) Does anyone see this option on any of the 163.xx drivers in Vista? I cannot locate it and want to not resize the desktop.
I've had that since the 162.22 drivers, I think. But only since 163.44 did "do not resize" work correctly. The option will only appear with HDTVs for me, and with regular computer monitors it won't resize the desktop at all (it will just depend on how you have set up your monitor, but none of this under/overscan nonsense).
skepticon
09-14-07, 09:22 AM
Hey, guys. You can add The Good Shepherd to the list of movies that don't allow messing with color with HW accel. on on PowerDVD (see my post two posts up). So it's probably some or all Universal titles. If you got one of the new ATI or nVidia cards and one of these movies, could you try see if it works? Not a huge problem, but an annoyance at best. I use calibrated computer monitors and I don't mess with them for video. I just calibrate the renderer.
The problem is that if I just calibrate from nVidia Control Panel (I "expand" levels), then the stupid Media Center always applies unwanted levels "expansion", so it will be double-expanded. So I just have to mess with contrast with every individual application's controls.
Andy, if you MUST expand color levels outputed from the HTPC, there is a setting in Media Center that will allow you to set the color levels between standard and expanded. If you are expanding with the control panel, set Media Center to standard. That way you won't be "double expanding" if you use the control panel to expand.
It sure is nice to have a display that allows more than one color profile. I just press a button on my remote to switch between video and PC levels as needed. No need for expanded color levels, and the banding that goes with it.
Did you try setting Edge Enhancement or Noise Reduction in nVidia Control Panel to 1? That will solve the aliasing. It's not the EE or NR themselves that fix that, it just seems that when you enable any of them even at the minimum, some other processing takes place. I can even see the colors change slightly.
About your crashes, you might wanna try drivercleaner.net or drivercleaner pro ($10 and free, respectively). It helped me a lot with ATI and C-media drivers, I don't know how much it did with nVidia ones, but I always use it now after uninstalling drivers.
Thanks for the suggestion: have just tried setting NR and EE to 1%, but the aliasing is still there in HA mode and it still locks up after a while. You are right: it does alter the brightness too, requiring a setting of +16 to bring it up to normal video levels. Software decode still produces the best, non-aliased PQ, but at a cost of near 100% CPU in Auto or Best video quality mode: it's crazy for my C2D 2.8GHz system.
Apart from the aliasing and crashes, the beta drivers are starting to get closer to decent HA. However, I think I still get a better PQ with similar CPU load to HA with the WMV9 decoder, so PowerDVD is woefully inefficient in software mode with particular setups.
I always use drivercleaner first when changing drivers.
I think the crashes might be an incompatibility between the 8500GT and the drivers as I believe the 8600GT doesn't exhibit the same issue. Perhaps the drivers are designed more around the 8600GT and its greater number of processing paths and the parameters confuse the 8500GT (ie like referencing 100 when the hardware limit is 40).
skepticon
09-14-07, 09:36 AM
The latest PDVD Ultra also breaks SPDIF on my X-Meridian, I can only get 2 channel. This happens with a patched version and a full installaion of the newest build.
As a last resort I decided to enable my onboard Azalia sound and install the latest Vista drivers. After a reboot, and enabling SPDIF in PDVD I was once again able to output DD/DTS, but not from the X-Meridian.
I usually run the X-Merdian on analogue but recently I keep losing the sub channel when watching films and listening to music. If I click the subwoofer icon in the Vista sound setup it comes back on, but then drops out again after a view minutes. Anyone any ideas what could cause this? Could the output from the card be too low for my receiver to pick up on the ext. in or doesn't this really matter? All other channels are fine.
Dazzlercee, I'm not certain this applies to you, but it may.
I recently upgraded my Audigy 2 to an X-Prelude. I never used to have any problems with SPDIF with my Audigy 2 in Vista, but with the X-Prelude the SPDIF was acting very flaky, refusing to pass through DD, and often not outputting anything at all. Meanwhile, the X-Prelude was working fine in XP.
I assumed it was a Vista drivers issue, but after I installed the latest (leaked) Vista SP1 beta, the X-Prelude SPDIF is working normally as one would expect it to. I think it's a Vista issue, but I couldn't tell you exactly what is going on.
If you're intrepid, you might want to give the SP1 beta a try.
Dazzlercee
09-14-07, 09:57 AM
Dazzlercee, I'm not certain this applies to you, but it may.
I recently upgraded my Audigy 2 to an X-Prelude. I never used to have any problems with SPDIF with my Audigy 2 in Vista, but with the X-Prelude the SPDIF was acting very flaky, refusing to pass through DD, and often not outputting anything at all. Meanwhile, the X-Prelude was working fine in XP.
I assumed it was a Vista drivers issue, but after I installed the latest (leaked) Vista SP1 beta, the X-Prelude SPDIF is working normally as one would expect it to. I think it's a Vista issue, but I couldn't tell you exactly what is going on.
If you're intrepid, you might want to give the SP1 beta a try.
Thanks Skepticon.
Unfortunately I installed the SP1 beta as soon as it was leaked (I'll try anything). One thought I have had is to uninstall the X-Meridian and then reinstall now that PDVD is up and running. I installed the Azalia drivers after PDVD was installed whereas the X-Merdian drivers were already on the system before I installed PDVD. The Azalia SPDIF works, the X-Meridian doesn't......worth a shot.
My main concern is loss of sub channel when using analogue. All cables have been tested and are fine, and when the sub drops out I can bring it back by clicking on the subwoofer icon in the Vista audio setup...very strange.
tristartristan
09-14-07, 10:55 AM
What does PWDVD 7.3.3104a.1 use when it play HDDVD/bluray in vista : overlay or EVR?
Thanks
Rathbone
09-14-07, 01:34 PM
What does PWDVD 7.3.3104a.1 use when it play HDDVD/bluray in vista : overlay or EVR?
Thanks
HWA on: EVR
HWA off: Overlay
arfster
09-14-07, 01:46 PM
HWA on: EVR
HWA off: Overlay
That's my best guess also, but can we actually prove it?
jpowell5
09-14-07, 02:04 PM
I recently got a HD DVD drive and have been successfully playing titles in PowerDVD 7.3 with the Universal Pictures title menu. I just rented the movie "The Host" and it has a different menu system.
PowerDVD will not allow me to select any of the title options or start the movie from the menu. I've tried every setting and get the same result with the mouse or remote.
I noticed above that someone was having a similar problem with the DVE DVD. Is this a known issue and is there a resolution?
I recently got a HD DVD drive and have been successfully playing titles in PowerDVD 7.3 with the Universal Pictures title menu. I just rented the movie "The Host" and it has a different menu system.
PowerDVD will not allow me to select any of the title options or start the movie from the menu. I've tried every setting and get the same result with the mouse or remote.
I noticed above that someone was having a similar problem with the DVE DVD. Is this a known issue and is there a resolution?
As far as I know (and I've tried both discs), the problem is not the same. The DVE HD-DVD does work OK unless you have AnyDVD enabled, but actually (in my case, and I presume others' too) when you uncheck the "Remove first play title from HD DVD" option, the menus on the DVE HD-DVD do work and everything works as it should (though the disc itself is a mess with no instructions, but that's just how the disc is, I understand). So you can still get rid of the stupid HDCP when calibrating with DVE.
It seems that when you get rid of the First Play title (which seems to be a dummy file) the menus just loop or something. I'm thinking when you try to access the videos from the menus, they first call the First Play dummy title, and if it's not there, then it goes on endless loops or just crashes. Most other discs use the First Play title to display a stupid 20-second (or whatever) logo that you can't fast forward, or worse, FBI warnings, so AnyDVD just gets rid of it by default.
As for the Host HD-DVD, the menu just does not work at all, with or without AnyDVD, with or without HDCP. It seems the HDi routines or something aren't standard, but I don't know for sure. But whatever it is, it is not AnyDVD related.
By the way, you can get around most of the Host limitations with keyboard shortcuts and right-clicks. For selecting the movie or extras you wanna watch, just right-click on the screen and then "Go To..." and select the title that has many chapters in it. That should be the movie. You can do a trial and error to see which titles are which extras. For languages and subtitles, you can toggle with the keyboard shortcuts U and H, I think (it would be nice for Cyberlink to enable right-click selection as it does for DVDs, though).
Andy, if you MUST expand color levels outputed from the HTPC, there is a setting in Media Center that will allow you to set the color levels between standard and expanded. If you are expanding with the control panel, set Media Center to standard. That way you won't be "double expanding" if you use the control panel to expand.
It sure is nice to have a display that allows more than one color profile. I just press a button on my remote to switch between video and PC levels as needed. No need for expanded color levels, and the banding that goes with it.
For the life of me, I can't find that option, I'd already looked, but since you told me, I've looked again and nothing. There must be something completely obvious I'm missing? Or maybe the Vista version doesn't have it.
skepticon
09-15-07, 08:59 AM
Hmm...you're right. With MCE2005, after you install the Nvidia drivers, you get an Nvidia settings tab within Media Center. From there you can select Standard/Extended, as well as adjust brightness, contrast, ect. In Vista, you get no such settings control. Apparently it is an "unsupported feature" in the Nvidia Vista drivers, as per the release notes. That really blows. With XP, there was also a way to force your preffered color levels through the registry (which was helpfull, because for a while the GUI controls were broken anyway). No such luck with Vista. For now anyway, Vista users are stuck with video levels when watching DVD/mpeg content in Media Center.
Sorry to get your hopes up Andy. Guess you're going to have to keep switching between brightness/contrast settings in the control panel. I hope you're at least creating profiles to make it easier on yourself.
SSSikora
09-15-07, 10:54 AM
How do I tell if EVR is being used on my system while running the latest build of PowerDVD?
Thanks
Dazzlercee
09-15-07, 11:00 AM
Thanks Skepticon.
Unfortunately I installed the SP1 beta as soon as it was leaked (I'll try anything). One thought I have had is to uninstall the X-Meridian and then reinstall now that PDVD is up and running. I installed the Azalia drivers after PDVD was installed whereas the X-Merdian drivers were already on the system before I installed PDVD. The Azalia SPDIF works, the X-Meridian doesn't......worth a shot.
My main concern is loss of sub channel when using analogue. All cables have been tested and are fine, and when the sub drops out I can bring it back by clicking on the subwoofer icon in the Vista audio setup...very strange.
I've just discoverd that on my system installing windows update KB937077 breaks SPDIF in PowerDVD. The update has something to do with HD audio devices so it is plausible that this is creating a few problems.
When I remove the update my SPDIF is restored and I can listen to DD/DTS etc through PDVD.
Worth a try for anyone with SPDIF issues with the latest PowerDVD updates.
Hmm...you're right. With MCE2005, after you install the Nvidia drivers, you get an Nvidia settings tab within Media Center. From there you can select Standard/Extended, as well as adjust brightness, contrast, ect. In Vista, you get no such settings control. Apparently it is an "unsupported feature" in the Nvidia Vista drivers, as per the release notes. That really blows. With XP, there was also a way to force your preffered color levels through the registry (which was helpfull, because for a while the GUI controls were broken anyway). No such luck with Vista. For now anyway, Vista users are stuck with video levels when watching DVD/mpeg content in Media Center.
Sorry to get your hopes up Andy. Guess you're going to have to keep switching between brightness/contrast settings in the control panel. I hope you're at least creating profiles to make it easier on yourself.
Nah, don't worry, it's not a big deal for me. I don't even use Media Center, I was just experimenting, but so far I've not found much good with it. For DVDs, PowerDVD is a much more complete solution, and for other videos, MPC home cinema is much better. I was just really trying to like Media Center, but it seems like it's just another example of companies treating the consumer as if we're too dumb for even the most basic manual control options.
So anyway, it's also good to know that it's a documented "unsupported feature" in the nVidia drivers. At least they're looking into it. So thanks for the info.
Thanks for the suggestion: have just tried setting NR and EE to 1%, but the aliasing is still there in HA mode and it still locks up after a while. You are right: it does alter the brightness too, requiring a setting of +16 to bring it up to normal video levels. Software decode still produces the best, non-aliased PQ, but at a cost of near 100% CPU in Auto or Best video quality mode: it's crazy for my C2D 2.8GHz system.
Weird, I wouldn't have thought it would alter the picture so much as for you to have to set brightness to 16. In my Vista setup, enabling EE or NR only alters colors slightly, only barely noticeable. If I have EE at 1%, The colors are indistinguishable between HW accel. on and off (with Best quality).
But I guess you have worse problems than that. You should really look into isolating your high CPU consumption problem, since it is too much and it's what's limiting you. For instance, I have an XP SP2 machine with a C2D E6600 which I ran underclocked to 1.8 GHz, and still could play HD-DVDs without problem with my ATI X1900GT card and PowerDVD 7.3 with all builds since 2911. The processor does seem to suffer a bit, but not even close to 100%, even with Best quality enabled.
In my HTPC, I'm running Vista x86 with a Pentium dual-core E2180 overclocked to 2.25GHz (Allendale but with only 1MB L2 cache), so it should still be slower than yours. And also, with HW accel. enabled I get averages around 50% CPU with VC-1 titles, and pretty much the same with HW disabled. For H.264 (Babel is the only H.264 title I've tried, though), as expected, it goes up without HW accel., and down (a lot) with it selected. But it still doesn't go near 100% either way.
Your problem indeed might be the 8500GT card, or the flaky drivers. I saw you asking about the ATI 2400pro in the ATI thread. Since I built this HTPC a few months ago, I've gone through an Nvidia 8500GT, an ATI 2400pro (sucked), ATI 2600 pro (better, but the drivers suck big time) and now I'm happy enough with