Microdisplay basics have just been posted at

www.hdguru.com

Learn about the three technoligies and the ones you need to buy extended protection for to cover yourself against failure

The HD guru

Thanks Gary. That's a nice article and I for one appreciate your input.

If you don't mind a suggestion, I have to tell you that I'm a little put off by some of your somewhat sensationalist titles. For example, the title of this post/article implies to me that you're revealing some great secret(s) that the retailers want to keep from consumers. Frankly I saw little new in your article that couldn't be found in a Crutchfield.com (a retailer) tutorial, for example. If you really want to reveal what retailers don't tell us, how about an article that compares dealer cost to retail price for displays (like Consumer Reports does with cars) or some information on returns (effect on cost, what happens with returned items for various retailers, etc.)? That's something that I haven't heard a retailer discuss, and the information would be interesting and perhaps useful.

FWIW

I have never seen a retailer talk about Unproven display technologies.

I don't know how relevant knowing dealer cost is to the consumer for several reasons.
Wholesale prices drop without a time schedule. The amount to the drops are not consistent and there are volume deals that are cut between the big box retailer and the TV makers that no one is privy to. Car prices that are the same from dealer to dealer , CE is not sold this way.

As for returns, that is an complicated subject as policies vary from store to store and who eats the return is part of the sales agreements between the big box retailer and the vendors. As you may know many retailers are now required to sell as open box working returned merchandise. Non- working TVs are repaired and then sold as open box. Others stores may return defectives back to the vendor.

I will say that if people woud do there homework more the would not need to return 1,2,3 or more sets to the dealers , turning new HDTVs into open box. This drives up the dealer's costs and ultimately hurt the consumer by motivating the retailers to add restocking fees or institute less liberial return polcies

www.hdguru.com

The HD Guru

Yeah, I understand what you're saying. But I still don't think your article rates such a sensationalist headline. For example, the retailer crutchfield.com site that I mentioned says about LCD (http://www.crutchfieldadvisor.com/S-z1p8vSQqtgA/learningcenter/home/tv_bigscreen.html?page=3), "LCD has been around the longest", in the DLP (http://www.crutchfieldadvisor.com/S-z1p8vSQqtgA/learningcenter/home/tv_bigscreen.html?page=2) article they mention that the technology was invented in 1987, and their heading for the LCoS (http://www.crutchfieldadvisor.com/S-z1p8vSQqtgA/learningcenter/home/tv_bigscreen.html?page=4) tutorial is, "LCosS: Combining the new with the tried and true". Maybe they didn't use the word "unproven" that you chose to describe LCoS, but they're certainly not hiding the fact that it's the newest of the RPTV technologies and maybe not entirely "tried and true". We can quibble semantics over the point all day, but I don 't see where they're keeping any great secrets that you have finally revealed to the world in your article- as I inferred from your title.

I think that you have a very helpful website, but with all due respect, I'm just saying that sometimes your headlines read more like the National Enquirer than The New York Times. I can tell you which news source I have more respect for. But hey, that's just my opinion- take it or leave it.

Regards,

kelpie

this thread title should of been "WILL DLP KILL YOUR CHILDREN FILM AT 11"

"I think that you have a very helpful website, but with all due respect, I'm just saying that sometimes your headlines read more like the National Enquirer than The New York Times. I can tell you which news source I have more respect for. But hey, that's just my opinion- take it or leave it."

I totally agree with 'kelpie' (quoted above)!!

Gary would serve a much bigger cause if he limited his articles to how his expertise can help the 'uninitiated'. Methinks he is merely looking for attention with his sensationalist titles. Sooooo NY!!

"HD Guru"

self-appointed, right?

I have never seen a retailer talk about Unproven display technologies.

I don't know how relevant knowing dealer cost is to the consumer for several reasons.
Wholesale prices drop without a time schedule. The amount to the drops are not consistent and there are volume deals that are cut between the big box retailer and the TV makers that no one is privy to. Car prices that are the same from dealer to dealer , CE is not sold this way.

As for returns, that is an complicated subject as policies vary from store to store and who eats the return is part of the sales agreements between the big box retailer and the vendors. As you may know many retailers are now required to sell as open box working returned merchandise. Non- working TVs are repaired and then sold as open box. Others stores may return defectives back to the vendor.

I will say that if people woud do there homework more the would not need to return 1,2,3 or more sets to the dealers , turning new HDTVs into open box. This drives up the dealer's costs and ultimately hurt the consumer by motivating the retailers to add restocking fees or institute less liberial return polcies

www.hdguru.com

The HD Guru
I def agree with you here. Its sad to see how much people return and take advantage of return policies. It might be nice for a while but in the end someone has to pay and usually its the consumers who don't abuse the policy.

Also the LG LCoS RP television that never debuted stateside. That set was hyped for two straight years...then nothing. They did show it at CES behind closed doors two years ago, then never seen or mentioned since.

Maybe we'll see it this year, but I won't be holding my breath for it.

LG did show and never came to market
Hitachi showed too and never came to market
Mitsubishi shipped and then abruptly exited the market.

Do you notice a pattern here?

Never shipped LG, Hitachi,
Shipped and withdrew, Mitsubishi, Philips, Toshiba
Shipped ,withdrew and returned JVC

Do you think these companies may have had issues with LCoS Technology?

Hence, Unproven


There are billions of dollars of LCoS HDTVs in consumers' hands today. I have not seen Crutchfield mention the purchase of an extended warranty to cover problem issues associated with this technology, but they feel the need to mention -

"Manufacturing LCoS panels has challenged some of the world's largest electronics makers. Some companies have actually abandoned LCoS because of the demands of making such high-density image chips."

Why was this vauge comment made in the article?

Do you still believe The HD Guru is being "sensational"?

www.hdguru.com

The HD Guru

The HD Guru doesn't tell you that LCoS technology is questionable, arguable, controversial, debatable, hypothetical, indefinite, suspect, uncertain, unconfirmed, under examination, or unsettled. He doesn't even tell us that LCoS technology is not tried and true!


Do you still believe The HD Guru is being "sensational"?



Yes Gary, I do.

Did you find my title to this post "sensational"? Of course you did. But it's true, isn't it? I haven't seen you use one of those synonyms for “unproven” in this thread or in your linked article to describe LCoS. Does that mean that you're keeping secrets from us or that you're a shill of the LCoS manufacturers as my title might imply to some readers? No, of course it doesn't. I would never believe that about you. But it does mean that I'm being (intentionally?) misleading in my title to draw attention. Not very honorable of me, eh?

Unfortunately, you have chosen to pick a straw-man argument that was easy to knock down rather than take my friendly suggestion to heart. I never challenged your assertion that the LCoS technology is "unproven" (or any of the other synonyms above you choose to use in the future) which is the staw position that you chose to defend. In fact I praised the content of your article and website. I simply found your title to this thread and your article sensationalistic.

As I’ve said, you seem to be implying that you were revealing some great secret that the retailers are keeping from us. But then I provided a link that showed that Crutchfield- a major retailer- has very much the same information that can be found in your article on their website- they just word it differently. Crutchfield even discusses how, “Manufacturing LCoS panels has challenged some of the world's largest electronics makers. Some companies have actually abandoned LCoS because of the demands of making such high-density image chips” (direct quote from Crutchfield’s website). OK, maybe you were the very first journalist in the whole wide world to attach the word "unproven" to LCoS technology. Well Whoopee-Do! Crutchfield was the very first to say that LCoS combined the "tried and true" with the "new" (i.e. the non-tried and true)- so does that mean that they scooped your story? They talk about "tried and true", you talk about "proven"- so what? They're keeping no great secret to my read. The fact that LCoS is a new and difficult technology (and most if not all of the other information you had in your article) was already on that retailer's website. That doesn't diminish the value of your fine article, it just makes your title suspect.

IMHO, your article wasn’t really about deep dark retailer secrets, so why did the title have to imply that it was? I’m no journalist looking to sell papers (or webpage hits) and have no talent at writing, but wouldn’t it have been more intellectually (journalistically?) honest to head your article something like, “Stuff you might want to know about microdisplays before making a big purchase”? Yeah, it sure lacks the “punch” of your title, but it seems more accurate to me.

I sincerely hope this helps,

kelpie

Do you still believe The HD Guru is being "sensational"?

www.hdguru.com

The HD Guru

You know...Jimmy is pretty sweet on you. Jimmy'll see you around. Ooohhh!!!!! JIMMY'S DOWN.

:)

From the www.hdguru.com website regarding LCoS RPTV

"you are assuming the high risk of problems often associated with an unproven technology."

The HD Guru

From the www.hdguru.com website regarding LCoS RPTV

"you are assuming the high risk of problems often associated with an unproven technology."

The HD Guru

Look again. I didn't say that you never used the word unproven, and you're just carrying on the same staw man argument anyway.

Gary, I think that I see the problem here. I don't think that you're really reading my posts. Not that they're anything particularly profound or anything- I just thought you might find them helpful.

As I said in an earlier post, I've given you my opinion and you can take it or leave it. Looks like you've chosen to leave it. So it goes....

Regards,

kelpie

...Do you still believe The HD Guru is being "sensational"?...
The HD Guru

Uh, are you really referring to yourself in the third person? As someone who retired from more than three decades in technical research and writing I find that creepy. Our editors would have penciled it out instantly because it would have made readers doubt our mental processes.

But getting back to the semantics of the word "unproven". This is a somewhat subjective term. I've had an LCoS device in my living room for 14 months and I'm totally comfortable with how "proven" it is. Many complicated new technologies have lots of initial problems. Look at the history of early electronic computers. If JVC succeeded where others failed, well kudos to JVC. So did IBM.

Uh, are you really referring to yourself in the third person? As someone who retired from more than three decades in technical research and writing I find that creepy. Our editors would have penciled it out instantly because it would have made readers doubt our mental processes.

But getting back to the semantics of the word "unproven". This is a somewhat subjective term. I've had an LCoS device in my living room for 14 months and I'm totally comfortable with how "proven" it is. Many complicated new technologies have lots of initial problems. Look at the history of early electronic computers. If JVC succeeded where others failed, well kudos to JVC. So did IBM.
I am with you :D

Self appointed, NOT

The HD "Guru" has been referred by that moniker by many top publications. He has been cited as the top journalist covering HDTV by (among others)

The Consumer Electrionics Association with the DTV Acedemy Award for Journalism

as well as sought after by the editors of the top consumer electronics publictions
including
Best Magazine (number one ce circulation)
Home Theater
Popular Science
Sound and Vision
Digital TV and has appeared and beeen mentioned in many other pubs as a top source for accurate information on HDTV including,

Ny Times, Washington Post, Newsday, Time, Newsweek, and others.

The HD Guru is now celebrating his 30th year in consumer electronics.


The HD guru


Look, I think it's great that you've parlayed a career in selling consumer electronics into a nice CE journalism gig for yourself. Nothing wrong with ambition and self-promotion, and it's wonderful to be self-employed doing something you really like to do. I owned and operated a high end home and car stereo store myself during the 1980's, and eventually went into the television broadcasting industry where I work today.

But "guru" is a little over the top, Gary.

And what's up with all the third person stuff?

Gary is so very right about Lcos being an unproven technology. Look at how Sony messed up with Lcos. JVC has being putting out supbar RPTV since it introduced D-ILA on to the market. And please don't make the arguments about how many Lcos sets Sony and JVC have sold to counter the fact that Lcos is unproven. Both companies have problems with unseemly color uniformity on their displays (I have photos that can demonstrate what I'm saying here) that they have not been able to correct.

Here we go again! :rolleyes:

I agree. That headline belongs on a different article.

I was referring to Auditor55 turning this thread into another of his "I hate JVC/Sony/SXRD/LCoS/Microdisplay/RPTV" soapbox threads.

Uh, are you really referring to yourself in the third person? As someone who retired from more than three decades in technical research and writing I find that creepy. Our editors would have penciled it out instantly because it would have made readers doubt our mental processes.

Steve doesn't think that posting about himself in the third person is creepy at all. Steve thinks that referring to himself in the third person is actually 3 times better than if Steve referred to himself in the first person.

Of course if Steve referred to himself in the second person, Steve would think that is wrong and should be avoided. :D

I was referring to Auditor55 turning this thread into another of his "I hate JVC/Sony/SXRD/LCoS/Microdisplay/RPTV" soapbox threads.

I don't hate JVC and Sony. I have a Sony Bravia 32 XBR1 LCD flat panel TV. Sony flat panel LCD's are of top quality. I don't own any JVC products right now but that is not to say I wouldn't in the future.

The reason why I'm critical of Sony and JVC on Lcos because I want them to do a better job, I believe that they can. I think the consumers (folks like you and I) deserve a better.

As far as microdisplays go, I'm a little mad because I feel that when they made them the manufacturers weren't thinking about people like me. The avid film lover!!

I think that you have a very helpful website, but with all due respect, I'm just saying that sometimes your headlines read more like the National Enquirer than The New York Times.

To the contrary The Enquirer reports news that's much more accurate then anyone else out there. The Times, CNN, and Fox however..... :)

I do think the title is quite misleading. I thought I was going to hear some fascinating insight into a massive cover-up. Instead, I get a copy of what every site on the web has said already. :rolleyes:

Well I want to chime in on this post as well.

First as to his name; HD Guru is perfectly acceptable. In the strictest sense of the word, guru means teacher. The term Guru (Outside of western cultures) means teacher of faith. Given he actually has a website devoted to teaching his learned knowledge of HD, I do not see it as “Self Proclaiming”.

Second, I believe this article is a good article that most people would get something out of. There is nothing profound in it, as most of the information can be gathered elsewhere. But then again, FOX, CNN, NBC etc all report the same news too. The only thing that matters is if he can help save people money and give them knowledge about their purchase.

Third, the referring to himself in third person is not always bad. There have been many who have done it before him and its just a gimmick. As a technical writer, I believe it hurts your credibility with high end knowledgeable readers. As for your average Joe, I think its just fine as the gimmicky impact would have more positive effects as a whole.

Lastly, I agree with every single poster that the title was over the top. If you posted this on some Yahoo message board, or some chat service, you may be able to get away with that title. Since you posted it on an HD forum with very educated people who also use other resources, it was a bad title. Titles should be geared to your audience, and this audience would need a lot more in the article for it to rate that title.

Those are my thoughts, good and bad. As previous posters have said…..Take them or leave them.

the thread title is obviously sensational in a deliberate attempt to attract viewers to the HD-Guru website. The article linked to on the site is for the most part accurate.

The idea that retailers are deliberately hiding these problems from buyers is laughable, for the simple reason that the overwhelming majority of sales personnel are totally unaware of them. I work in the electronics department of a major nationwide retailer and am the only person in my department that knows about green globs, collapsing light engines on Toshiba and Samsung dlps, flicker problems on Hitachi plasmas, "clouds" on Sony lcd panels, banding on Sharps, etc. Of our display sets only one actually manifests any of these defects--our Toshiba 56HM66 with a 4 inch wide shadow across the top of the screen. We're also seeing relatively poor performance on ota digital tuners on some Samsung plasmas and lcd panels.

The rest of our sales staff doesn't even know what progressive scan means.

I'd venture to argue that the percentage of Sony lcos sets with color purity problems is perhaps no higher than the percentage of HM66 Toshiba dlp sets with collapsing light engines (a problem starting to occur on HLS series Samsung 1080p sets).

JVC had some color purity problems almost exclusively on first generation lcos sets, and last year's models had some premature lamp failures.

I don't think anyone would disagree that the article is not a well written and informative. I think the title to this post is misleading and disingenuous. As far as attracting visitors to the site, I don't think that's the case, and if it is, he needs to find a better way or at least thats what Alexa says:

Traffic Rank HD Guru-307,645
Traffic Rank for Norad Tracks Santa-8,774

Perhaps a thread about tracking santa would have worked better if he was really trying to bait people. I think he wrote an informative article his little blog, and was simply telling people of it's existance.

... Both companies have problems with unseemly color uniformity on their displays (I have photos that can demonstrate what I'm saying here) that they have not been able to correct.

Yeah right. You have photos and we are supposed to take your word that these are representative of the LCoS products of both these companies both then and now. You're the guy who goes into stores and can't even see the rows of RPTVs lined up on the shelves, like I just did this afternoon in both BB and FS.

Are you ever going to get honest? Do you even know the meaning of the word?

Those discussing LCoS technology: So far, no one has mentioned the Brillian 6580iFB LCoS TV designed and manufactured here in the US. It is proven: Brillian owns many of the LCoS patents and originally used LCoS chips to make specialty heads-up displays for government and military applications. About 5 years ago they marketed a consumer 720p LCoS TV and released about 15 months ago a 1080p TV. I have had my Brillian LCoS for a year now and it's perfect: perfect color uniformity, perfect linearity, completely adjustable for professional ISF calibration, perfect convergence, very low SSE, very high pixel fill factor, etc. Wearing my physicist hat, LCoS uses basically the same phosphors as LCD except in reflection of the projection lamp light of the silicon substrate rather than transmission; hence, mechanically and electrically, LCoS shouldn't be too different in it reliability from LCD RPTVs. If you want to watch accurate TV, I think that LCoS for the price is worth considering. [Brillian stock has doubled since the launch of their 6580iFB TV] G. L. Dybwad, ABQ, NM