http://www.joystiq.com/2007/01/05/microsoft-hd-dvd-might-be-next-betamax-switch-to-blu-ray-sti/

Yes. Certainly a PR no no.

LOL, I guess it says alot when your closest partner has no confidence in your own format

I think it was more of a poor attempt as an attack on Sony as in:

"We're not FORCING you to pay $200 extra for something that might not win" (wink wink)

Microsoft is offering both the physical medium and the downloaded HD service right now.

Instead of making their gaming console cost 200 dollars more than their competition for a format that may or may not win (his Betamax comment was directed towards Blu Ray when you consider the competition), they are giving folks the option to choose if they want an HD disc based medium or not.

This is not only a better model for gamers, its a better system for HD-DVD, as attach rates will be very high for the players.

this was not a blunder, folks.

http://www.joystiq.com/2007/01/05/microsoft-hd-dvd-might-be-next-betamax-switch-to-blu-ray-sti/

Yes. Certainly a PR no no.
Here we go again. You misunderstood what he was referring to. When he said he did not want to charge an extra $200 for something that may become the next Betamax, he was alluding to the PS3, and more specifically, Blu-Ray's inclusion in the PS3, even though the statement was in the context of a built-in HD DVD drive. In other words, he thinks it was a bad idea for Sony to include Blu-Ray in their console and require all games to be on BD media, something which may become the next Betamax.

The comment was made at last year's CES (January 2006), but the HD DVD players were only first available in April and Blu-ray players in June.

So who's to expect which format would take off at launch? Who's to expect HD DVD to garner more consumer support at launch than Blu-ray (Samsung's launch) with Blu-ray only catching up much later? It doesn't seem surprising because of the credible uncertainty... when the comment was made at last year's CES.

This is the third thread I've encountered that uses a misleading headline for a very old news/comment (Jan 2006).

The comment was made at last year's CES (January 2006), but the HD DVD players were only first available in April and Blu-ray players in June.

So who's to expect which format would take off at launch? Who's to expect HD DVD to garner more consumer support at launch than Blu-ray (Samsung's launch) with Blu-ray only catching up much later? It doesn't seem surprising because of the credible uncertainty... when the comment was made at last year's CES.

This is the third thread I've encountered that uses a misleading headline for a very old news/comment (Jan 2006).

uh no.

the statement was made a few days ago when arstechinica interviewing MS reps
http://arstechnica.com/articles/headstart.ars see page 3

I was more intrigued with the HD DVD drive as a piece of hardware. I asked if we would ever see games use the drive. A firm "no." I asked if we would ever see a 360 with an HD DVD drive built-in. Another firm "no." No hesitation.

"We don't want to charge customers $200 extra for something that may be the next Betamax," Henson told me (whoops).

Shouldn't it be, HD DVD the next Super Density Disc? Even though the Toshiba SD format was intergraded into DVD with Sony's MMCD, you see much fewer double sided disc compared to dual layered disc like in the Sony MMCD's way. Maybe that's why Sony is upset re all their multi layer development of MMCD that has been in use for DVD mostly... but didn't get as much of the royalties as initial double sided disc were much more common on DVD...

EDIT: I'm making no sense. gibberish!:D I'm still stuck on the "resolved" MMCD and SD format war!:D:D

I am telling you, that is the exact same thing they have been saying the whole time. Sony's console costs 200 dollars more than the 360, primarily due to the BR Drive. Microsoft saw no need to tie the format war into their game console.

Think of the implications... lets say HD-DVD loses, and Blu Ray wins. If this happens, Microsoft would either have to use a very expensive dual-mode drive in their next console to ensure backwards compatibility, or they will not be able to offer BC at all. Why risk your future product line on a format war? Microsoft didn't.

Now inverse that statement, and see why sony made a ballsy, unwise move with trying to tie their console and their new format together.

So ask yourself. Why would you charge all your gaming customers 200 dollars more for what may or may not be the next betamax? It's a question Sony needs to answer, IMO.

So they are reusing their stand... afterall, what's more important to them is that they are able to sell their consoles first and the add-on if there is demand.

But still this is a misleading headline... I seriously don't really know what purposes it serves here except endless and unnecessary speculations because of this one statement which could apply to either format.

"We don't want to charge customers $200 extra for something that may be the next Betamax," Henson told me

sorry but this is NOT from a year ago!! MIcrosoft execs said just a couple days ago that they were not confident in HD-DVD and did not want to mess up the xbox 360 by including it inside

...HD-DVD may become the next betamax

I posted this in the morning here but the thread was deleted.



The AVS HD-DVD favoritism is still hard at work

I am telling you, that is the exact same thing they have been saying the whole time. Sony's console costs 200 dollars more than the 360, primarily due to the BR Drive. Microsoft saw no need to tie the format war into their game console.

Think of the implications... lets say HD-DVD loses, and Blu Ray wins. If this happens, Microsoft would either have to use a very expensive dual-mode drive in their next console to ensure backwards compatibility, or they will not be able to offer BC at all. Why risk your future product line on a format war? Microsoft didn't.

Now inverse that statement, and see why sony made a ballsy, unwise move with trying to tie their console and their new format together.

So ask yourself. Why would you charge all your gaming customers 200 dollars more for what may or may not be the next betamax? It's a question Sony needs to answer, IMO.
I don't get why everyone says that the PS3 is 200 more. The 60GB model is 200 more, but the 20GB model is 100 more and offers everything the premium 360 does along with blu-ray playback. Not saying I agree with blu-ray being packed into the PS3, but it is certainly not 200 more. I think people forget that the 20GB model is much more comparable to the premium 360 than the 60Gb version.

I know that everyone just wants the best version of each console, but in this case that is not the way they should be compared. Also, the price jump is 50% less painful when you think of it that way :).

sorry but this is NOT from a year ago!! MIcrosoft execs said just a couple days ago that they were not confident in HD-DVD and did not want to mess up the xbox 360 by including it inside



I posted this in the morning here but the thread was deleted.



The AVS HD-DVD favoritism is still hard at work
It's not favortism. You blatantly took something out of context and twisted it to make it say what you wanted it to say. Either you misunderstood the quote, or you intentionally lied. Either way, it was an act of desperation on your part, indicative of someone who is worried that their high-def format of choice may in fact be the losing format in this war and the next great Betamax of the 21st Century.

I think it was more of a poor attempt as an attack on Sony as in:

"We're not FORCING you to pay $200 extra for something that might not win" (wink wink)

Nah, I think he means that HD DVD might be the new Betamax and uncertainty keeps them from internationalising the add on.

Nah, I think he means that HD DVD might be the new Betamax and uncertainty keeps them from internationalising the add on.
The add-on is already international. And yes, they may offer an internalized model.

Personally I'm glad to see that someone from Microsoft recognizes the situation accurately. Guess what, HD-DVD might lose this format war! And so might Blu-Ray! Sony on the other hand has this blind arrogant mentality and completely devotes the PS3 hardware to the format expecting it to win. If I were a Sony stockholder, I'd be extremely concerned.

I think the way Microsoft sees the add-on is as a method of "not much to lose, but everything to gain" strategy. If HD-DVD loses? No big deal for Microsoft, they'll just make a Blu-Ray add on device. If Blu-Ray loses? Huge blow to Sony as their product is tied to this format. Microsoft's strategy is obviously much more brilliant.

Personally I'm glad to see that someone from Microsoft recognizes the situation accurately. Guess what, HD-DVD might lose this format war! And so might Blu-Ray! Sony on the other hand has this blind arrogant mentality and completely devotes the PS3 hardware to the format expecting it to win. If I were a Sony stockholder, I'd be extremely concerned.

I think the way Microsoft sees the add-on is as a method of "not much to lose, but everything to gain" strategy. If HD-DVD loses? No big deal for Microsoft, they'll just make a Blu-Ray add on device. If Blu-Ray loses? Huge blow to Sony as their product is tied to this format. Microsoft's strategy is obviously much more brilliant.


Actually I would say instead that Sony is willing to put their money where their mouth is. Sony is putting everything behind Blu-ray, and Blu-ray customers can feel confident that their format is getting all-out backing.

On the other hand Microsoft is really only partially backing HD-DVD, and does not believe that the format is good enough to be included inside the XBOX 360, they are worried that it will become the next Betamax.

I think the key quote is:

"Early HD-DVD add-on adopters might eventually get burned (if the format fails), but this certainly won't affect all, if even a majority, of Xbox 360 owners. On the flip side, if Blu-ray flops, 100% of PlayStation 3 owners will feel the burn. Sony is still the bigger risk taker."

Sounds to me like Microsoft is simply pursuing a prudent risk management strategy.

Title edited to be accurate with article.

MIcrosoft execs said just a couple days ago that they were not confident in HD-DVD and did not want to mess up the xbox 360 by including it inside





I'm going to call blush!t here. You've gone way beyond taking some liberty in your paraphrasing. Quote the quote, that's fine. Don't reword it to your liking.

Let's be reasonable. Companies do not like to leak plans until they are ready to make the announcement. These guys were prepped prior to the interview to make sure they didn't spill any beans they weren't authorized to spill.

So, it could very well be that the response could be taken at face value... the 360 will never have integrated HD DVD drive.

Or, it could be that the question was anticipated, and a response prepared that would keep plans under wrap without having to flat-out lie. If they had responded with "no comment," everybody would take that to mean "yes," because if the answer was "no," they'd just say "no."

So instead, you say that the XBOX360 will not integrate HD DVD, because you don't want the consumer spending $200 on something that may be the next Betamax. This sounds like "no", but could actually mean one or more of the following:

(1) The next hardware revision with HD DVD will be XBOX 365, so it was not inaccurate to say the XBOX360 won't have integrated HD DVD.

(2) The next hardware revision with HD DVD will not cost more than the current premium version. Or at least not $200 more. So, it was not inaccurate to say that they are preventing the consumer from spending $200 for the feature.

(3) The KNOW that HD DVD won't be the next Betamax, so even if you spent $200 extra for it, you wouldn't be spending it on the next Betamax. Again, no inaccuracy in their response. And they get to throw in a Betamax dig.

I'm not saying I think any of these scenarios is the case. I'm saying I think it's bad etiquette for a reporter to put a company representative on the spot by asking questions about future product plans which everybody already knows they cannot answer. They should be sticking to questions about the products being presented and reviewed. But reporters do it anyway, and inevitably, the answer is meaningless. It's intended to be.

http://www.joystiq.com/2007/01/05/microsoft-hd-dvd-might-be-next-betamax-switch-to-blu-ray-sti/

Yes. Certainly a PR no no.

Thats shoking!!! a BD Fanboy taking a vague piece of info and turining into an absolute tittle.

Desperate and sad.

That's ok, I'll still hold on to my HD-DVD player. ;)

LOL, I guess it says alot when your closest partner has no confidence in your own format
Yup, they have such little confidence they put out a drive supporting that format at a price that even the company that developed the technology would be loathe to sell at.

Personally I'm glad to see that someone from Microsoft recognizes the situation accurately. Guess what, HD-DVD might lose this format war! And so might Blu-Ray! Sony on the other hand has this blind arrogant mentality and completely devotes the PS3 hardware to the format expecting it to win. If I were a Sony stockholder, I'd be extremely concerned.

I think the way Microsoft sees the add-on is as a method of "not much to lose, but everything to gain" strategy. If HD-DVD loses? No big deal for Microsoft, they'll just make a Blu-Ray add on device. If Blu-Ray loses? Huge blow to Sony as their product is tied to this format. Microsoft's strategy is obviously much more brilliant.
Exactly...and even if they DO internalize the drive, they can always make a BD addon just like they did with the HD DVD addon and then you've got both formats right there.

Thats shoking!!! a BD Fanboy taking a vague piece of info and turining into an absolute tittle.

Desperate and sad.

Well I am certainly not a BD fanboy. I own a hd-a1 and have about 30 titles. Conversely I do not own a BDP.

We don't want to charge customers $200 extra for something that may be the next Betamax

Apparently the duality of that statement is completely lost on some...


You know what this forum really needs?

This forum needs to implement a feature that blocks known Blu bots from posting in the HD DVD areas. Let them read all they like, but when they try to post, WHAM! "Your account does not have permission to post on this topic."

Any new accounts that thread crap = Immediate ban.

Hmm! UMD anyone? Seriously it was digg at Sony and their bad judgement, but whatever. I am secure in knowing that my 360 will not be obsolete in a few years because of a failed format.

i used to hate these threads, but now find them amusing. Fear, uncertainty and doubt being the weapon of choice among the BD fanboys or better know as Team Blu - just another Blu-job by the Team! I am actually starting to enjoy the free Blu-jobs. Keep up the good work Team-Blu and keep putting a smile on our faces!

Cheers,

Grant

No one knows which format, HD-DVD or Blu-ray, will prevail. Microsoft has clearly aligned itself and the Xbox 360 with HD-DVD, but it's left open the possibility of a Blu-ray switcheroo -- Peter Moore openly acknowledged as much during CES last year.

This is as misleading, misinterpreted and dishonest as any post I have read in this or any other forum. The headline is derived from a comment made at CES 2006. That was before anything was actually launched. This isn't a news item on any level.

The wording is not a direct stab at Sony, it's related to HD-DVD. The original question was about the HD-DVD addon. Therefore, the reply is to the HD-DVD addon. It was directly comparing HD-DVD as a possible DODO. The remark was indirectly a stab at Sony via HD-DVD. However it is very bad PR, because an inbuilt drive would not cost $200 more. To get at sony VIA HD-DVD is a risky thing to do.

sorry but this is NOT from a year ago!! MIcrosoft execs said just a couple days ago that they were not confident in HD-DVD and did not want to mess up the xbox 360 by including it inside



I posted this in the morning here but the thread was deleted.



The AVS HD-DVD favoritism is still hard at work

FUDruckles and poppycock. Poor reading skills doesn't make you a martyr.

sorry but this is NOT from a year ago!! MIcrosoft execs said just a couple days ago that they were not confident in HD-DVD and did not want to mess up the xbox 360 by including it inside



I posted this in the morning here but the thread was deleted.



The AVS HD-DVD favoritism is still hard at work

The Word 'May' was used to qualify the statement. So it is absolutely true, it also means BluRay 'May' be the next Betamax. A previosu poster summed it up quite well. You be crazy to pick one or the other if your primary business was Gaming. It would take a brave man to bet their job & the fortunes of a Gaming divison on a Vidoe Disc Format, for no good reason.

Msft made the right call. i.e We can't predict the future, so we will take the least risk approach. Sony need to question the wisdom of driving Bluray down the throts of their gaming community.

By the end of this battle, PS4 will be the next gen console.
No matter how you look at this some will lose, whether is the 200.00 extra from PS3 Bd player or the 200 from the X360 add on.
I would be more careful on buying a Toshiba Computer with HDDVD drive.
If Toshiba made a game console I am sure it would have a internal HDDVD drive in it.\

Hmm! UMD anyone? Seriously it was digg at Sony and their bad judgement, but whatever. I am secure in knowing that my 360 will not be obsolete in a few years because of a failed format.

How in any way would the PS3 be obsolete if Blu-Ray fails as a movie format? You'd stop playing the games?

Most would avoid buying a PS3 because they would still be paying more for Blu Ray which would then be used only for games. PS3 adopter's could in fact decide to sell their systems in disgust (I know people who say they will if that happens). It could spell disaster for a PS4 when people are getting burned more and more from a Sony console. Sure Blu Ray could still be used but isn't the main purpose of Blu Ray to be a next gen movie format.

OK this is done.