Today Blu-ray snached the lead in the format war from rival HD-DVD.

Blu-ray 801 HD-DVD 816.

http://www.eproductwars.com/dvd/graphs/salesrank-time-1-1-recent144.jpg

http://www.eproductwars.com/dvd/

More accurately: The top 10 BD's are outselling HD DVD at amazon and dvdwars has finally caught up with this despite being 3 or 4 days behind real-time

am i reading it wrong?

BD sales rank: 792.9
HD DVD sales rank: 812.2

isn't hd dvd still ahead?

am i reading it wrong?

BD sales rank: 792.9
HD DVD sales rank: 812.2

isn't hd dvd still ahead?


No 1 and No 3

Which is ahead?

No, the higher up the rankings is better, with 1 being the target.

am i reading it wrong?

BD sales rank: 792.9
HD DVD sales rank: 812.2

isn't hd dvd still ahead?

I think that the numbers might be confusing. If Blu Ray was ranked #1 and HD DVD was ranked #2, would that clear it up? I think the lower the rank, the better.

The lower the number the better with 1 being the best you can get

If there were some new releases to be ordered I would have agreed the numbers had some real significance. However, since there really isn't anything "new" in HD DVD to be bought (as compared to BR's numerous listings) this should be kept in perspective. If these numbers still hold true when (if ever) there is an equal number of "new" HD DVD listings (as was the case a few short weeks ago) then I would agree that there is some merit in the interpretation.

The bottom line is that sales on the two formats are similar at this point. There are enough variables at play here (nuances of release schedules, how representative is Amazon of sales as a whole, etc) to make these numbers an imperfect metric. Certainly there are other metrics one could use such as DVDempire.com sales that give a slightly different impression.

Personally, I would speculate that the Amazon numbers are slightly biased towards HD-DVD because HD-DVD early adopters seem to be more cost/value conscious as a group, and the blu-ray buyers might be slightly more inclined to purchase in the brick and mortar stores instead.

i find it funny that when hd dvd was winning the format war pages it didnt matter ...now that BD is winning its all of the sudden relevant and important
am i the only one who notices?

The bottom line is that sales on the two formats are similar at this point. There are enough variables at play here (nuances of release schedules, how representative is Amazon of sales as a whole, etc) to make these numbers an imperfect metric. Certainly there are other metrics one could use such as DVDempire.com sales that give a slightly different impression.

Personally, I would speculate that the Amazon numbers are slightly biased towards HD-DVD because HD-DVD early adopters seem to be more cost/value conscious as a group, and the blu-ray buyers might be slightly more inclined to purchase in the brick and mortar stores instead.

Do we have Videobusiness numbers then from bricks and morter to compare?

Do we have Videobusiness numbers then from bricks and morter to compare?

I'd love to see some too.

This is just silly. When is everyone going to realize that Amazon is not the only retailer selling HD-DVDs and Blu-Ray discs? There are no sales figures tied to these whatsoever.

Plus, how is either format "selling" discs that aren't even out yet? Those are some impressive "sales"! I guess I could go spike that graph by ordering a million copies of Black Rain on either format (oh - the sales ranking for the HD-DVD vs. Blu-Ray on that one title this minute is 4,124 vs. 8,562! HD-DVD is winning on "Black Rain"! Which means... absolutely nothing.) then cancelling them before it ships.

Heck, I wonder if I can get it up to a #1 sales ranking.... at least, for a day. Because, even if I order 1,000,000 copies of Black Rain today, thereby momentarily making it the #1 selling HD disc so far (before I cancel the order), after 24 hours, it will drop back to where it was before.... despite having "sold" 1,000,000 copies.

i find it funny that when hd dvd was winning the format war pages it didnt matter ...now that BD is winning its all of the sudden relevant and important
am i the only one who notices?

You're noticing something that wasn't there that's why you're the only one! I don't think anyone said dvdwars.com didn't matter, it was just that their data was (and STILL is) flawed. hdgamedb.com is far more accurate and up to date.

Another thing that's changed is Amazon's pricing, they now seem to be one of the cheapest online retailers

You're noticing something that wasn't there that's why you're the only one! I don't think anyone said dvdwars.com didn't matter, it was just that their data was (and STILL is) flawed. hdgamedb.com is far more accurate and up to date.

Another thing that's changed is Amazon's pricing, they now seem to be one of the cheapest online retailers
Maybe I should have chosen my words a little more carefully, many BD supporters discredited the numbers on dvdwars and etc. but I have seen numerous posts with links to dvdwars eproductswars and others like they are now legit numbers. run back a couple pages you will see many posts if you have not already

not that I care cuz I am format nuetral i just find it interesting that these "e numbers" werent creditable last month but they are now?

Personally, I would speculate that the Amazon numbers are slightly biased towards HD-DVD because HD-DVD early adopters seem to be more cost/value conscious as a group, and the blu-ray buyers might be slightly more inclined to purchase in the brick and mortar stores instead.

Just curious - how did you arrive at your hypothesis that Blu-Ray buyers are not cost/value conscious "as a group"?

Well, on Jan. 14, 2007, Blu-ray has indeed taken over the lead on Amazon. There has been no question that Blu-ray has caught up to HD DVD sales and this is just further proof of it. In fact, most likely, Blu-ray now leads HD DVD in sales. But considering that HD DVD sales bettered Blu-ray in 2006 by a huge margin, let's see what it looks like in Jan. 2008. The format war has and continues to be a series of chess moves by both sides and a lot of moves will be played out this year that will have a big effect on the 2007 end-of-year sales results that no one will be able to see this early, just like no one foiresaw the moves that played out in 2006 that allowed HD DVD to have the advantage it had then. We tend to get caught up in the day-to-day events here, but in then end, it's the year-end results that matter.

not that I care cuz I am format nuetral i just find it interesting that these "e numbers" werent creditable last month but they are now?

They're still not credible however they're probably equally incredible as they were to start with so the trend is valid, you just have to remember a margin of error on the actual numbers

not that I care cuz I am format nuetral i just find it interesting that these "e numbers" werent creditable last month but they are now?

They weren''t credible when they supported HD DVD. Recall that many HD DVD proponents regularly quoted Amazon as the authority to prove HD DVD was besting Blu Ray.

Well, now the tables have turned and, I guess, what's good for the goose is good for the Gander......:D

Alls fair in the Blu ray forum when it benefits Blu Ray.

Is it me or is there a missing chart on http://www.eproductwars.com/dvd/ ?
Did they take one down?

They took down the sales chart that was pictured above. Not trying to start anything here, but it seems awfully interesting that they switched the order of the charts and took that one chart down today.

OK the chart is back, I'd just never seen that happen before

They took down the sales chart that was pictured above. Not trying to start anything here, but it seems awfully interesting that they switched the order of the charts and took that one chart down today.

OK the chart is back, I'd just never seen that happen before
Yeah, I thought it was odd as well. Looks like its back though.

How long do you think it will take before the top selling BD is outselling the top selling HD DVD by a sales rank of around 1000? That was the case not long before the PS3 was released.

Well, on Jan. 14, 2007, Blu-ray has indeed taken over the lead on Amazon. There has been no question that Blu-ray has caught up to HD DVD sales and this is just further proof of it. In fact, most likely, Blu-ray now leads HD DVD in sales.

Here's the problem - stating something as "proof" does not make it so. Don't get me wrong, Blu-Ray could very well be catching up, have caught up, or even surpassed HD-DVD. You have no proof of it, though. The only proof will be when someone releases actual sales data . Until that time, instead of "proof", is what you have is a "guess". We don't even know if Amazon would even be statistically relevant. Does anyone know what percentage of HD software sales Amazon accounts for?

And, no, it wasn't valid when HD-DVD was deemed "the winner" by Amazon sales ranking, either. Remember all those HD-DVD titles that weren't even available from Amazon for weeks after street date? Does everyone believe nobody bought a copy during that time frame?

During this week's "Buy 2 Get 1 Free" sale at Best Buy... are those getting figured into the Amazon.com sales rankings?

Here's a link to a nice article about Amazon Sales Rankings, in case some haven't already seen it:

http://ezinearticles.com/?Navigating-the-Amazon-Sales-Ranking&id=41607

Two of the BD ones are Pre-order, if that matters

These numbers are correct. I and I believe BD is outselling HD slightly RIGHT NOW. Since most of the top ten HD-DVD movies are old and the 10 BD are mostly new I think there are tons of new HD owners out there. If HD-DVD ever getts some new movies out it will change quickly.

and now HDDVD is back on top again...

yawn

Just curious - how did you arrive at your hypothesis that Blu-Ray buyers are not cost/value conscious "as a group"?

I did not say that Blu-ray owners are not cost/value conscious, but rather that I suspect they are slightly less cost-conscious than HD-DVD early adopters as a group. In practice, I don't think there is much difference except for a small subset.

In a nutshell, the thought is that those people who were willing to pay 1k or more for a 1st gen Sony, Pioneer, or Panasonic player are probably not quite as cost-sensitive when they go disk shopping as users who paid $400-500 for an A1/A2 or $200 for an xbox add-on. Amazon is well known as being a etailer that is very cost-competitive on disks and would be a first stop for a many disk buyers, especially cost-conscious ones. People who can afford to drop 1k or more on a 1st gen player would probably be a little less cost-conscious, and a little more likely to buy from wherever is convenient, including brick and mortar stores that typically charge a little more. I would speculate that this would introduce a small bias in Amazon disk sales; it is hard to say how much, maybe a few percent. Of course, I have no data to prove this. It lies firmly in the realm of speculation.

is there something wrong in your graphic? the trend is reversing?
i've just click on the link but it said HD DVD is leading...are you sur what you say? :D :D :eek:
but you're right we can trust in these figures :D

is there something wrong in your graphic? the trend is reversing?

Looks like HD DVD is back up in front....the red horse and blue horse seem to be chaging leads on a regular basis....doesn't look like pulling away to me.


http://www.hdgamedb.com/amazon/history.aspx

Here's the problem - stating something as "proof" does not make it so. Don't get me wrong, Blu-Ray could very well be catching up, have caught up, or even surpassed HD-DVD. You have no proof of it, though. The only proof will be when someone releases actual sales data . Until that time, instead of "proof", is what you have is a "guess". We don't even know if Amazon would even be statistically relevant. Does anyone know what percentage of HD software sales Amazon accounts for?

And, no, it wasn't valid when HD-DVD was deemed "the winner" by Amazon sales ranking, either. Remember all those HD-DVD titles that weren't even available from Amazon for weeks after street date? Does everyone believe nobody bought a copy during that time frame?

During this week's "Buy 2 Get 1 Free" sale at Best Buy... are those getting figured into the Amazon.com sales rankings?

Here's a link to a nice article about Amazon Sales Rankings, in case some haven't already seen it:

http://ezinearticles.com/?Navigating-the-Amazon-Sales-Ranking&id=41607

When the lead changes back and forth as it is happening now, it is hard to say who is selling more. However, when one format has the top 10 items selling more than the other format for every second of every day, we can comfortably conclude that the format with the higher sales rank also is selling more units....once the rankings switch back and forth, the data is no longer reliable as a guage of who is selling more. This is basic math :)

I'll be happy to explain to anyone who is confused about the two scenarios....

"I do not take the statistics on thedvdwars too seriously as it appears a larger percentage of HD-DVD owners buy the majority of their software from Amazon as compared to Blu-ray owners, but the gap is definately closing quickly."

This is from our forum moderator, I don't know where he gets the reasoning for it. But if it's true, it means blu-ray is probably outselling HD-DVD by a large margin at brick and mortar retailers.

Also if you go to dvdempire which only is involved in selling movies. Blu-ray has a significant margin at the moment.

Right now HD DVD is 687, Blu-Ray is 764.

Jeez, who cares?

I would dearly love to have this format war ended. But as long as High Def players stay in the $500 plus region (yeah, I know some HD DVD players are less but they lack some of the features of Blu Ray to do an apples to apples comparison) there will not be wide adoption of either format. So I say, give it a rest.

BTW: I am format neutral, own both a HD and Blu Ray player.

They've recently updated the site so that the numbers are updated every 15 minutes.

Right now only pricecut can be the savior for HD DVD...

right now its hd-dvd later its blu ray and later its hd-dvd my god do we need this kind of threads over and over again?


heh right now hd-dvd is leading in all the movies 1-10..... but doesnt meant it wont be blu ray tomorrow and hd-dvd the next day...


http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a23/subingncali/ScreenHunter_040.jpg
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a23/subingncali/ScreenHunter_041.jpg
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a23/subingncali/ScreenHunter_044.jpg

No its not in the "lead" right now, the site is just stuffing up on a regular basis. It shows Blu-ray titles in its top 10 list at the bottom of the page (that you took screens of) that are outside of the actual top 10, rather inexplicably, sometimes. Right now it doesn't show AvP but it should be at #8 on the list.

The actual "Salesrank of top 10 products:" statistic hasn't screwed up though, as far as I can tell. Blu-ray has had and held the lead on top 10 for the last 5 days without ever losing it for a single moment, gap increasing.

But Amazon sales are meaningless, and taking it from a site which is always stuffing up only exacerbates that. B&M statistics could look a lot different for all we know.

No its not in the \"lead\" right now, the site is just stuffing up on a regular basis. It shows Blu-ray titles in its top 10 list at the bottom of the page (that you took screens of) that are outside of the actual top 10, rather inexplicably, sometimes. Right now it doesn\'t show AvP but it should be at #8 on the list.

The actual \"Salesrank of top 10 products:\" statistic hasn\'t screwed up though, as far as I can tell. Blu-ray has had and held the lead on top 10 for the last 5 days without ever losing it for a single moment, gap increasing.

But Amazon sales are meaningless, and taking it from a site which is always stuffing up only exacerbates that. B&M statistics could look a lot different for all we know.
look at the screen shots above and yes it has lost the lead several times and gained it. it goes back and forward.... no need to keep posting these kind of threads over and over and over again. even if hd-dvd stays in the lead doesnt mean blu ray is exactly losing cause amazon isnt the only place people shop, and vice versa no matter what kind of polls are taken here they really dont account for all the hd-dvd/blu ray owners...

This is just silly. When is everyone going to realize that Amazon is not the only retailer selling HD-DVDs and Blu-Ray discs?

Well, we could always pick DVDEmpire sales too....damn forgot, Blu-Ray in the lead :p

look at the screen shots above and yes it has lost the lead several times and gained it. it goes back and forward..
If you read my post, you would realise that was a glitch on the site. The BRs shown down the bottom are NOT the top 10 BRs. When it happens, refresh the page and the top 10 should be fixed again. It happened to me earlier. They aren't going back and forth anymore, but again, it doesn't really matter.


l.. no need to keep posting these kind of threads over and over and over again. ..
Couldn't agree more. These are pointless.

Quote -

"BD sales rank: 792.9
HD DVD sales rank: 812.2"

HOly Cow!!! Why Aren't we Concerned about the other 791 formats!!!!!

I suppose DVD is #1 but what's all that other stuff!! If VHS tape sales are in the top 500 then I would say we still have a serious problem. I hope 8-Track tapes are down around 5786.

I wonder if it's possibe to get the sales rank of garden hoses and chia pets just for comparasion.

:) :) :)

-Brian