My wife told me she saw a Samsung LCD LED TV commerical at 2am this morning.

Was it LED LCD or DLP? I have seen a couple of the LED DLP ads but not LCD.

Was it LED LCD or DLP? I have seen a couple of the LED DLP ads but not LCD.

Well, I have taught her the difference between DLP and LED, so she does know the difference.

I asked her again, and she again says it was LED, and the commericial said newest technology coming soon.

I asked her what channel, and she said she was watching the Detective Dale Hinman FBI chic, which was court-tv.

I don't know I didn't see it. For all I know it was a Samsung Phone... hehe

she probably just mistook it for a 65 commercial, i've been seeing them for a while. You know, there's a lcd tv with fish and a black backround and some glass thing gets put over it that makes all the blacks look better and darker, and thats about it.

You know I designed a thermoelectric cooler for one of TI's first DLP chips back in 1991. They brought us over to Dallas TI office, which was down the street, and had 10 of the best big screens on the market. It was easy to figure out which one was DLP, because the colors were brighter, and you could see it from pretty much 170 degrees.

It blew away everything they had including Pioneers top of the line in 91, however they said nobody was going to buy a TV for more than 4 grand back then.

It was cool to watch all the little mirror squares angle on and off. It was even cooler to see the TEC I designed underneath it.

Amazing that technology has been around for 17 years, however I'm thinking this new LED technology will kill DLP. They might stick around for awhile in projector technology though.

LEDs are being used in DLP tvs. :)

LEDs are being used in DLP tvs. :)

Thats why I asked the question. There are LED engine DLPs and LED Backlit LCDs. I have seen TV spots for the LED engine DLPs but not for the other. He said "I have taught her the difference between DLP and LED". Ummmm no...

You know I designed a thermoelectric cooler for one of TI's first DLP chips back in 1991. They brought us over to Dallas TI office, which was down the street, and had 10 of the best big screens on the market. It was easy to figure out which one was DLP, because the colors were brighter, and you could see it from pretty much 170 degrees.DLP, what a brilliant idea. The implementation, via the color wheel rather than 3 RGB chips, one of the worst in history. Screwing with the human visual system, rainbows, headaches, dithering, what a shame.

Samsung marketing truly sucks the big one. I keep reading about their Bordeaux models... WTF are those?

They seem to be following the totally BAD example Sony does... where every LCD they make is a Bravia.

Samsung marketing truly sucks the big one. I keep reading about their Bordeaux models... WTF are those?

They seem to be following the totally BAD example Sony does... where every LCD they make is a Bravia.

That's what happens when Sammy hangs out (join ventures and what not) with Sony for too long. They end up picking up the bad habits from Sony. Let's just hope Sammy doesn't start charging overprices for their new models like Sony has. :(

Samsung marketing truly sucks the big one. I keep reading about their Bordeaux models... WTF are those?

They seem to be following the totally BAD example Sony does... where every LCD they make is a Bravia.
The Bordeaux is primarily distributed in S. Korea, and India and soon in the UK. Not aware of plans to use Bordeaux in US and if so in limited specialty production most likely.

http://www.engadget.com/2007/03/24/samsungs-latest-bordeaux-lcd-trio-touts-15000-1-contrast-ratio/
http://www.blogsmithmedia.com/www.engadget.com/media/2007/03/3-24-07-bordeux.jpg

DLP, what a brilliant idea. The implementation, via the color wheel rather than 3 RGB chips, one of the worst in history. Screwing with the human visual system, rainbows, headaches, dithering, what a shame.

My head hurts just thinking of DLP! :)

You guys wanna start a pool on when these sets will hit the streets? My guess is August 15th.

The Bordeaux is primarily distributed in S. Korea, and India and soon in the UK. Not aware of plans to use Bordeaux in US and if so in limited specialty production most likely.


What I have belive is that Samsung LNxxM81BD PAVV Bordeaux series in Asia is "nothing" more than the 65/66 series in US and the 86/87 series in Europe. Its pretty much the same TV... So don't worry. It also says PAVV instead of Samsung, so it what Samsung LCD brand is called over there I'll guess - while waiting of the LED backlight - watch spectcular commercial at the CCFL BLU at
http://www.pavv.co.kr/

What I have belive is that Samsung LNxxM81BD PAVV Bordeaux series in Asia is "nothing" more than the 65/66 series in US and the 86/87 series in Europe. Its pretty much the same TV... So don't worry. It also says PAVV instead of Samsung, so it what Samsung LCD brand is called over there I'll guess - while waiting of the LED backlight - watch spectcular commercial at the CCFL BLU at
http://www.pavv.co.kr/

While pretty similar, the 81BD series in asia (even if you look at your link at the botton once the animation stops) has 5ms response time and what they call Wide Color Control. The 65 series has 8ms response times (according to the samsung website) and they don't mention this Wide Color Control. Actually, the 8ms response time is probably why I don't have 4665f sitting in my living room.

While pretty similar, the 81BD series in asia (even if you look at your link at the botton once the animation stops) has 5ms response time and what they call Wide Color Control. The 65 series has 8ms response times (according to the samsung website) and they don't mention this Wide Color Control. Actually, the 8ms response time is probably why I don't have 4665f sitting in my living room.

Exactly (on the 8ms response time). The only thing holding me back from making the plunge on the 5265 is knowing that "hopefully" the 71 will appear soon, or the 81 will be relatively problem free and no motion blur (and the damn price will drop quickly,,,,,,,if we ever see a price).

The Bordeaux is primarily distributed in S. Korea, and India and soon in the UK. Not aware of plans to use Bordeaux in US and if so in limited specialty production most likely.

http://www.engadget.com/2007/03/24/samsungs-latest-bordeaux-lcd-trio-touts-15000-1-contrast-ratio/
http://www.blogsmithmedia.com/www.engadget.com/media/2007/03/3-24-07-bordeux.jpg

And the girls are extra :D

samsung sucks

Has Samsung ever released a television on time? I have a feeling there's no information because it's going to be delayed till late fall or early 2008.

Did it ever occur to anyone that maybe Samsung is having a manufacturing problem utilizing LED technology in ther LCD's? This is brain surgery. The LED technology currently being used in last year's and this year's DLP sets pale in comparision to what goes into using LED's in a 52" LCD.

Did it ever occur to anyone that maybe Samsung is having a manufacturing problem utilizing LED technology in ther LCD's? This is brain surgery. The LED technology currently being used in last year's and this year's DLP sets pale in comparision to what goes into using LED's in a 52" LCD.

it may have occured to someone, but then again, it also may have occured to someone that once their previously set announced deadlines start to come and pass that some sort of announcement or update would be a healthy practice for them to excercise if they are indeed having unexpected trouble.

Maybe it's a case of, "we've hit a little snag, but think we can solve this by weeks end. There's no need to get with marketing to announce delays or change of scheduling", but then the week passes and now it's "oh, but were just about there.. just a few more day, really.. we'll have this thing figured out by Friday", then Friday rolls around and they do solve whatever issue, but a new one unexpectedly pops up as a result of it, but a solution for that one is anticipated by the following Wednesday.. etc., etc. :D Seemingly out of nowhere, you're significantly off planned schedule.




And the girls are extra :D

I call dibs for the one on the right! ;)

I call dibs for the one on the right! ;)


The one on the right definately is 'hotter' in my opinion ... I enjoy those hips. If Samsung would lend me her until the release of the 81 series I wouldnt be complaining about the wait :)

Zsolt

Maybe it's a case of, "we've hit a little snag, but think we can solve this by weeks end. There's no need to get with marketing to announce delays or change of scheduling", but then the week passes and now it's "oh, but were just about there.. just a few more day, really.. we'll have this thing figured out by Friday", then Friday rolls around and they do solve whatever issue, but a new one unexpectedly pops up as a result of it, but a solution for that one is anticipated by the following Wednesday.. etc., etc. :D Seemingly out of nowhere, you're significantly off planned schedule.






I call dibs for the one on the right! ;)

lol, the one on the left is fine by me :eek:

Did it ever occur to anyone that maybe Samsung is having a manufacturing problem utilizing LED technology in ther LCD's? This is brain surgery. The LED technology currently being used in last year's and this year's DLP sets pale in comparision to what goes into using LED's in a 52" LCD.

Well then bring on the damn 71's, lol.

Samsung said that they will only make 32" 100hz lcd for EU. So no 71 series EU-version. Now i am waiting for toshiba ,sony and jvc 1080p 100/120Hz lcds.(which have been confirmed) I hope you guys still get 71-series though.

Samsung said that they will only make 32" 100hz lcd for EU. So no 71 series EU-version. Now i am waiting for toshiba ,sony and jvc 1080p 100/120Hz lcds.(which have been confirmed) I hope you guys still get 71-series though.

Wow, Finland. My Anaheim Ducks just won the Stanley Cup thanx in part to Finland's own Teemu Selänne.

Did Sammy ever release these? It was a steal for $13K:
http://www.garrett-smarthome.com/samsung/lcd-televisions/lnr460d.htm

Wow, Finland. My Anaheim Ducks just won the Stanley Cup thanx in part to Finland's own Teemu Selänne.

My guess is that Teemu retires now. He is now one of all-time greats.

Did Sammy ever release these? It was a steal for $13K:
http://www.garrett-smarthome.com/samsung/lcd-televisions/lnr460d.htm

Look at msrps on this :) press release (http://www.samsung.com/PressCenter/PressRelease/PressRelease.asp?seq=20050106_0000090601)

Samsung is launching new model range in Europe this fall. Some models include local dimmed LED backlight.
Welcome to forums. What is your source?

I asked from Samsung reps about the new led lcds. :)

If i had to guess, i would say that you are from Samsung Electronics Nordic AB :D .

I have good hopes for localized dimming to eliminate motion blur. I have seen same kind of technology on lcd by philips. Philips set with alternating backlight (scaning backlight;clear lcd) focused entirely to reduce motion blur ,and it worked great.(contrast was ok but nothing spectacular) Philips dropped this because it was said to be too expensive .Now philips focuses on 100/120Hz technology to fight motion blur.

I have good hopes for localized dimming to eliminate motion blur.

Let's have an even bigger hopes that the LD does not introduce its own exclusive artefacts visible to the anticipating forumers.

Terveisia :D

Samsung to unveil 40-inch LED backlit LCD TV in September

Latest news
Max Wang and Emily Chuang, DigiTimes.com [Monday 7 August 2006]

Samsung Electronics plans to launch in September a 40-inch LCD TV that features an LED backlight, according to a recent report from research firm Displaybank. The 40-inch LED TV targets the European market with a price tag of US$3,000, noted the report, which added that the new TV will source panels from S-LCD, a joint venture between Samsung Electronics and Sony.

The release of the LCD TV with LED backlighting is mainly to strengthen Samsung's brand image, the report indicated.

Sony launched 40-and 46-inch LCD TVs with LED backlighting in November 2004. The company offered the 40-and 46-inch models for 1.1025 million yen (US$9,629) and 840,000 yen (US$7,334), respectively, according to Sony. However, sales of the two TVs did not meet expectations due to unfriendly pricing and the immature technology of LED backlighting, sources indicated.

According to DigiTimes Research, prices for a 40-inch LED backlight unit (BLU) are standing at about US$610 this year, compared to US$210 for a BLU featuring conventional cold-cathode fluorescent lamps (CCFLs). By 2009, the price for a 40-inch LED BLU is expected to fall to US$315, DigiTimes Research predicts.

Shipments for LED backlighting used in TVs will outpace that for CCFL technology in 2010, according to a forecast by Insight Media.

Samsung to unveil 40-inch LED backlit LCD TV in September

Disappointing on the screen size. I know this is a european press release, but I can't imagine there will be too much difference in products between north america and europe. Maybe we'll get a 46" but I have a feeling that will be the upper limit.

Disappointing on the screen size. I know this is a european press release, but I can't imagine there will be too much difference in products between north america and europe. Maybe we'll get a 46" but I have a feeling that will be the upper limit.

This is just old stale info from last year about a European-only model Samsung released last year that was not a local dimming LED backlight model. It has little connection with the forthcoming 81 series.

Samsung released three new LCD sets in Korea (40", 46", 52") with 17,000:1 constrast. They aren't LED backlight and it doesn't mention 120Hz.

http://www.i4u.com/article9491.html

Looks like they are the M92BD series.

This is just old stale info from last year about a European-only model Samsung released last year that was not a local dimming LED backlight model. It has little connection with the forthcoming 81 series.

Damn, didn't see the date on the press release. Maybe we can refrain from posting year old press releases from here on out.

Samsung released three new LCD sets in Korea (40", 46", 52") with 17,000:1 constrast. They aren't LED backlight and it doesn't mention 120Hz.

http://www.i4u.com/article9491.html

Looks like they are the M92BD series.

who knows what the hell is going on.

Samsung released three new LCD sets in Korea (40", 46", 52") with 17,000:1 constrast. They aren't LED backlight and it doesn't mention 120Hz.

http://www.i4u.com/article9491.html

Looks like they are the M92BD series.

It looks a lot like the LN-T4665F (panel)!

It looks a lot like the LN-T4665F (panel)!

Yes it does, but with a higher CR.

Yes it does, but with a higher CR.

Yeah - but even more importrant is a response time of 5 ms. Does it mean that their crystal black panel differs from super clear panel or?
both LNxxM81BD and LNxxM92BD features this response time, but what differs these 2? Se more at www.pavv.co.kr

Damn, didn't see the date on the press release. Maybe we can refrain from posting year old press releases from here on out.

I prefaced my post of the older LED Sammy by asking if they ever released these. I wasn't trying to confuse anyone, just thought i'd add that tidbit.

I prefaced my post of the older LED Sammy by asking if they ever released these. I wasn't trying to confuse anyone, just thought i'd add that tidbit.

No, you're cool - I think that person was referring to post #1032, not yours.

Yeah - but even more importrant is a response time of 5 ms. Does it mean that their crystal black panel differs from super clear panel or?
both LNxxM81BD and LNxxM92BD features this response time, but what differs these 2? Se more at www.pavv.co.kr

Those models seem to be "new and improved" versions of the '65/61 series.

WARNING..............IMO...................WARNING.......... ......IMO................WARNING
I'm beginning to wonder whether the US is getting trial versions or cheap imitations of the models Samsung releases. I've read that even the European models have higher quality parts.

Those models seem to be "new and improved" versions of the '65/61 series. I'm beginning to wonder whether the US is getting trial versions or cheap imitations of the models Samsung releases. I've read that even the European models have higher quality parts.

So we are all test dummies for Sammy? :(

Those models seem to be "new and improved" versions of the '65/61 series. I'm beginning to wonder whether the US is getting trial versions or cheap imitations of the models Samsung releases. I've read that even the European models have higher quality parts.
If your going to post such a statement and desire credibility please quote your source. Hearing it from "somebody" is hardly credible don't you agree?

Where in the world did you read this? Don't paint with such a wide brush that has no facts behind it please when no such panel is even in the marketplace yet as your damning the product without even being available and I've been viewing here and other forums for nearly 3 years and I've yet to read such a thing from ANY credible source - that's sounds more like my buddy says so and that is B.S. to post on the AVS forum without any facts or evidence to support such an event.

Please reference your credible sources or add IMO to the statements if you cannot support them. Rumor based upon a false assumption is not fact to be considered here IMO. Even speculation should have a foundation to support the statements shared and Samsung has no such history of providing "Cheaper" parts for N. America - most likely it's largest customer base - how idiotic would it be to even attempt such a thing with your most profitable customer? IMO that is an assinine statement absent product or proof to demonstrate and support it!

i think now the 81 series are bullshit .. lol we have not heard a ****ing peep about them anywhere which is really strange !!

i think now the 81 series are bullshit .. lol we have not heard a ****ing peep about them anywhere which is really strange !!

Maybe we could speculate that there has been some problems when they reached start of production (suppliers etc...)

Don't belive Samsung releases some info about prices and aviability before the sets are ready for shipping. I draw parallells to LG and Samsung who released info about news sets at the same time in Europe late March (LY95 and M86 respectively) Samsung appeared in stores right on time, while LG got delayed 1.5 months... Maybe that would be more frustrating, but at least you got the press release to study in the meantime!

If your going to post such a statement and desire credibility please quote your source. Hearing it from "somebody" is hardly credible don't you agree?

Where in the world did you read this? Don't paint with such a wide brush that has no facts behind it please when no such panel is even in the marketplace yet as your damning the product without even being available and I've been viewing here and other forums for nearly 3 years and I've yet to read such a thing from ANY credible source - that's sounds more like my buddy says so and that is B.S. to post on the AVS forum without any facts or evidence to support such an event.

Please reference your credible sources or add IMO to the statements if you cannot support them. Rumor based upon a false assumption is not fact to be considered here IMO. Even speculation should have a foundation to support the statements shared and Samsung has no such history of providing "Cheaper" parts for N. America - most likely it's largest customer base - how idiotic would it be to even attempt such a thing with your most profitable customer? IMO that is an assinine statement absent product or proof to demonstrate and support it!

Hey, give me a chance, OK? You must be hungry - seems you'd like to eat me alive, LOL.

My source was a discussion about the European version of the Samsung LN-T46xxF series. The question raised there was why the European versions were more expensive, and someone said European versions are often more expensive but they were also made better. Specific parts were referenced. I'm trying to find that post, but since it was a forum (and I don't even recall which one), it is going to take a while. I posted this because I can't be the only person in the world to have seen that discussion.

I have had bad experiences with two completely different models from Samsung's 2007 LCD line; surely it is understandable that my respect for this company is faltering? And then models with better specs are being offered only overseas...

In the meantime, I humbly accept your reprimand and will add IMO to my post.

However I don't think I'll delete it, because I recall clearly what I read, and I didn't say it was a fact, I just said it was what I read.

IMO there is something curious about how the US got the '65/61 versions which required mainboard replacements, and then 2 months later, Korea gets what appears to be the same thing but with improved specs.

Those [new Samsung] models [released in Korea] seem to be "new and improved" versions of the '65/61 series.

WARNING..............IMO...................WARNING.......... ......IMO................WARNING
I'm beginning to wonder whether the US is getting trial versions or cheap imitations of the models Samsung releases. I've read that even the European models have higher quality parts.

Hey, give me a chance, OK? You must be hungry - seems you'd like to eat me alive, LOL.

My source was a discussion about the European version of the Samsung LN-T46xxF series. The question raised there was why the European versions were more expensive, and someone said European versions are often more expensive but they were also made better. Specific parts were referenced. I'm trying to find that post, but since it was a forum (and I don't even recall which one), it is going to take a while. I posted this because I can't be the only person in the world to have seen that discussion.

I have had bad experiences with two completely different models from Samsung's 2007 LCD line; surely it is understandable that my respect for this company is faltering? And then models with better specs are being offered only overseas...

In the meantime, I humbly accept your reprimand and will add IMO to my post.

However I don't think I'll delete it, because I recall clearly what I read, and I didn't say it was a fact, I just said it was what I read.

IMO there is something curious about how the US got the '65/61 versions which required mainboard replacements, and then 2 months later, Korea gets what appears to be the same thing but with improved specs.

My fear is that Europe is the testing ground, and we will be getting the new higher contrast panels INSTEAD of the 71's and 81's.

Just Got back from a trade show/vendor training. . . . Talked to a direct employee of samsung, not a rep. He said the 81 and 71 are still in the making. . . he said it will probably be around the first or second week of August is when we'll see them. He also commented on the price, "ummm. . .the price is definately going to be up there for the first year or so...". . . dont know how promising our estimates were :/.

muzik360

Wonder how expensive these will be. I'm surprised that if Samsung is going to release these TVs in a few months that we'd hear more about them like we have from the Pioneer displays. For me, these will be in direct competition with the new Pioneers and they'll have to be very impressive for me and reasonable priced as I think it may be possible to pickup a 60" 1080P for close to $5k before shipping.

50,000:1 dynamic is probably on the same level with the Pioneers as they are 20,000:1 static. I also wonder if there is still going to be a 57" version, if not I'm out. I hate the thought of going down 1" in screen size! Maybe one of these years will get some 70"+ high quality screens that are actually affordable.

Just Got back from a trade show/vendor training. . . . Talked to a direct employee of samsung, not a rep. He said the 81 and 71 are still in the making. . . he said it will probably be around the first or second week of August is when we'll see them. He also commented on the price, "ummm. . .the price is definately going to be up there for the first year or so...". . . dont know how promising our estimates were :/.

muzik360

Looks like you are saying the 81's will be really expensive,,,,more than anticipated. What about the 71's?

Anyone know how much a round trip ticket to Korea costs?:
http://www.koreanewswire.co.kr/en_read.php?id=258178&no=0&nmode=&ca=&ca1=English-&ca2=&sf=&st=&of=&nwof=&conttype=&tm=1&type=&hotissue=&sdate=&eflag=&emonth=&spno=&exid=&rg1=&rg2=&rg3=&tt=

Anyone know how much a round trip ticket to Korea costs?:
http://www.koreanewswire.co.kr/en_read.php?id=258178&no=0&nmode=&ca=&ca1=English-&ca2=&sf=&st=&of=&nwof=&conttype=&tm=1&type=&hotissue=&sdate=&eflag=&emonth=&spno=&exid=&rg1=&rg2=&rg3=&tt=

500,000:1 contrast, wonder if its the 81 series

AND subsequently their price. ;)

:eek: 500 000:1 :eek: 70" Samsung will be available worldwide. All models will get at least 500 000:1 contrast.
Holy crap, I want one.

Looks like you are saying the 81's will be really expensive,,,,more than anticipated. What about the 71's?

These aren't going to be inexpensive displays, anyone that believes otherwise is not living in the same reality with the rest of us. I expect these to be the most expensive LCD's on the market at the same level with Sony's XBR's.

Anyone know how much a round trip ticket to Korea costs?:
http://www.koreanewswire.co.kr/en_read.php?id=258178&no=0&nmode=&ca=&ca1=English-&ca2=&sf=&st=&of=&nwof=&conttype=&tm=1&type=&hotissue=&sdate=&eflag=&emonth=&spno=&exid=&rg1=&rg2=&rg3=&tt=

I like the statement about using 50% of the power of conventional LCD's. For me power consumption is about the only problem I have with LCD and plasma displays.

With efficiency like that, it'd pay for itself in several years. :eek:

Local dimming should be more "effective" at 70 inches than at 40 inches. You can pack more LEDs in a bigger area and locally dimmed blocks of LEDs are smaller in relation to screen area, hence the higher overall contrast (40' set was advertised to have "only" 100K:1 CR).

More info and pics here:
http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/home-entertainment/samsung-70+inch-lcd-tv-has-local-led-backlighting-268735.php
http://www.akihabaranews.com/en/news_details.php?id=14104

Any guess as to cost of the 70"?

Any guess as to cost of the 70"?

According to Engadget it's only $63K US.

"Only ₩59,000,000 for the privilege which translates to about $63k or €48k"

http://www.engadget.com/2007/06/14/samsungs-70-inch-led-backlit-lcd-television-now-on-sale/

Anyone know how much a round trip ticket to Korea costs?:
http://www.koreanewswire.co.kr/en_read.php?id=258178&no=0&nmode=&ca=&ca1=English-&ca2=&sf=&st=&of=&nwof=&conttype=&tm=1&type=&hotissue=&sdate=&eflag=&emonth=&spno=&exid=&rg1=&rg2=&rg3=&tt=


My heart . . . <grasping chest>

Fred Sampson

Local dimming should be more "effective" at 70 inches than at 40 inches. You can pack more LEDs in a bigger area and locally dimmed blocks of LEDs are smaller in relation to screen area, hence the higher overall contrast (40' set was advertised to have "only" 100K:1 CR).

More info and pics here:
http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/home-entertainment/samsung-70+inch-lcd-tv-has-local-led-backlighting-268735.php
http://www.akihabaranews.com/en/news_details.php?id=14104

That's an interesting argument. I would not have thought it to make any difference... The way CR will be measured on these sets (and yes, we have seen the therm *intrinsic CR*) is that they will measure the ratio of light intensity from one point on the screen across to the other, and unless some standard emerges, I would guess manufacturers will take all the leisure in measuring these points as far from one another as they can. Though you may still be right because it all depends on HOW one measures CR and the area on which the CR is measured.

Contrast Ratio... Dynamic Contrast Ratio, Intrinsic Contrast Ratio... Fun isn't it?! I'm guessing they won't use the dynamic contrast ratio on LED BLU units because the advantage of dimming the CCFL in the time domain won't grab you much if you can locally dim in a single frame anyway. Its always the endless search for the highest numbers, that's what marketing demands!

Contrast Ratio... Dynamic Contrast Ratio, Intrinsic Contrast Ratio... Fun isn't it?! I'm guessing they won't use the dynamic contrast ratio on LED BLU units because the advantage of dimming the CCFL in the time domain won't grab you much if you can locally dim in a single frame anyway. Its always the endless search for the highest numbers, that's what marketing demands!
It's easy for locally dimmed sets to achieve infinite dynamic contrast. Just display black frame and measure light output (all LEDs off) and then display anything other than black frame and measure that. The ratio of any light output/no light output will be infinity. The only reason static contrast on these LD sets still isn't infinity is because the light from an LED block still leaks to other screen regions (even though the blocks behind those regions are turned off). Once this tech advances to the point when brightness of each LED can be individually modulated we should expect static contrasts approaching infinity.

That 500K:1 number probably represents neither dynamic nor static CR. They just probably took the infinite dynamic CR and ~20K:1 static CR and decided 500K:1 would be a nice compromise. :)

According to Engadget it's only $63K US.

No problem, thats about how much equity I have in my house. I am sure my wife would love to use it for a new tv. :rolleyes:

No problem, thats about how much equity I have in my house. I am sure my wife would love to use it for a new tv. :rolleyes:

For those who can not afford it there is much cheaper 70 incher from Sony coming in the summer for only $ 33K. It has LED BL and the glass should be identical in both sets. But sorry, no dimming for such a low price. :p

This is just old stale info from last year about a European-only model Samsung released last year that was not a local dimming LED backlight model. It has little connection with the forthcoming 81 series.

To get you back from fantasy land:

This non-LD LED BL 40 incher is available in Europe. It has been reviewed in various consumer magazines. For example German magazine Test in large test of displays gives it barely adequate note mainly because of bad color rendering - red and blue color blush. Many standard LCDs got good notes. Thus, LED is not a cure for everything.

It's easy for locally dimmed sets to achieve infinite dynamic contrast. Just display black frame and measure light output (all LEDs off) and then display anything other than black frame and measure that. The ratio of any light output/no light output will be infinity. The only reason static contrast on these LD sets still isn't infinity is because the light from an LED block still leaks to other screen regions (even though the blocks behind those regions are turned off). Once this tech advances to the point when brightness of each LED can be individually modulated we should expect static contrasts approaching infinity.

That 500K:1 number probably represents neither dynamic nor static CR. They just probably took the infinite dynamic CR and ~20K:1 static CR and decided 500K:1 would be a nice compromise. :)Yes, scattering to adjacent pixels even in a black room will result in some potential leakage. But this will effect the edges, the same with local dimming. Thus we may see large contrast, but the image pop may not be as great as we think since the edges (adjacent pixels) will not have that level of CR due to scattering and local dimming smearing.

To get you back from fantasy land:

This non-LD LED BL 40 incher is available in Europe. It has been reviewed in various consumer magazines. For example German magazine Test in large test of displays gives it barely adequate note mainly because of bad color rendering - red and blue color blush. Many standard LCDs got good notes. Thus, LED is not a cure for everything.

This is what has a lot of us thinking. There may be a lot of small things that could turn the 81 series into an unsuccessful product.

But this is the only news we've had from Samsung that is related in some form to the 81 series in months! It still is quite encouraging. With luck we'll get reviews of this set as a baseline, though I doubt it.

Where's KANO1977 when you need him to generate some hype?

This is what has a lot of us thinking. There may be a lot of small things that could turn the 81 series into an unsuccessful product.

But this is the only news we've had from Samsung that is related in some form to the 81 series in months! It still is quite encouraging. With luck we'll get reviews of this set as a baseline, though I doubt it.

Where's KANO1977 when you need him to generate some hype?


i toke my 81 money and went to vegas lol j/k the 70 inche looks awesome i cant wait till we can hear some info about the 81 series..if we ever do lol Aside from all the that samsung needs to pay my therapist bills cause i had to start seeing one cause of the stress waitng for the 81 series to come out lol

For those who can not afford it there is much cheaper 70 incher from Sony coming in the summer for only $ 33K. It has LED BL and the glass should be identical in both sets. But sorry, no dimming for such a low price. :p

Lmao, he almost sounds serious "such a low price" lmao

I wonder how this is going to translate into the mainstream market - i.e. the ~40-50" sizes which must make up a very large percentage of overall sales and revenues. The halo products that are at the top of the line are interesting but I know I'm happy enough with front projection that I don't really want a larger than 50" set since it will never compare size-wise to my front projection screen anyways (at least in any price range that I'm interested in.)

Sharp has been so aggressive in their pricing of 37-42" models
(including their models that are one notch from top of the line ) that I wonder if this is Samsung / Sony's way of putting some clear air between them by saying our 40" models have 30X the contrast of the Sharp screens, therefore they are worth the price premium.

Pioneer 1080P has ~5000:1 measured static contrast. For LED LCDs "50000:1" dynamic means ~20000:1 measured static contrast depending on implementation. LED LCDs have infinite dynamic contrast. Forget anything you have learned about LCDs, these things are the first true replacement for CRT.

Wrong. That's last years Pioneers. The 768p models just came out with a static CR of 16k:1 and the 1080P models will be out in Septemper with a Static CR of 20k:1. Very good. Of course, the dynamic CR of 500k:1 of Sammys LED models sounds incredibly good. I know before it's even posted though that the 70" model is going to cost a fortune:(.

One last thought. And if they can put out a 70" model why didn't Sammy opt for a 62" model or something in between!

inappopriate post deleted by moderator: PM warning sent

Engadget has Manufacturer's list.



LN40M81BD $3518, LN46M81BD $4690, LN52M81BD $5863

Engadget has Manufacturer's list.



LN40M81BD $3518, LN46M81BD $4690, LN52M81BD $5863

Those are the Euro models, equivalent to the US LN-T 60 and 65 series tvs (i.e. LN-T4665F)

I've decided to forget the Samsung 81 Series. The new Pioneer 5080 is the hdtv I'm getting soon. It costs much less, has incredible blacks and contrast ratio, perfect motion, very good pure whites, etc. Oh and 1080p is not needed for how far I'm sitting. It's already available by the way. Done deal. No need to post here anymore. :D

I've decided to forget the Samsung 81 Series. The new Pioneer 5080 is the hdtv I'm getting soon. It costs much less, has incredible blacks and contrast ratio, perfect motion, very good pure whites, etc. Oh and 1080p is not needed for how far I'm sitting. It's already available by the way. Done deal. No need to post here anymore. :D
Make sure you audition it to make sure it has the shadow details you desire as blacks will be crushed otherwise and no wow factor. Report back if the shadow details match an SXRD in the sweet spot please. Enjoy your choice!:)

One last thought. And if they can put out a 70" model why didn't Sammy opt for a 62" model or something in between!
They've had a 57" for nearly a year now and there will be a follow-up to it soon.

I've decided to forget the Samsung 81 Series. The new Pioneer 5080 is the hdtv I'm getting soon. It costs much less, has incredible blacks and contrast ratio, perfect motion, very good pure whites, etc. Oh and 1080p is not needed for how far I'm sitting. It's already available by the way. Done deal. No need to post here anymore. :D

Ok, I respect your decision, but the first thing that comes to mind in burn-in. I watch a fair amount of SD, and hate it stretched, so you can bet that tv would burn in the black bars,,,,,,unless you have info otherwise. My other concern is washout during the day. Please let me know your thoughts on this.

Ok, I respect your decision, but the first thing that comes to mind in burn-in. I watch a fair amount of SD, and hate it stretched, so you can bet that tv would burn in the black bars,,,,,,unless you have info otherwise. My other concern is washout during the day. Please let me know your thoughts on this.

Your concerns are unwarranted. Try checking out the threads in the Plasma forums on just this topic. Why buy a HDTV to watch 4:3 content? 80% of network television is HD.

Your concerns are unwarranted. Try checking out the threads in the Plasma forums on just this topic. Why buy a HDTV to watch 4:3 content? 80% of network television is HD.

First of all, 80% is not HD. Even if you are only talking about ABC, NBC, CBS and Fox, they have programs in HD, usually primetime programs, but the majority is not HD, particularly during the day. I have Directv, and I am not going to say "no I can't watch that because it is SD", which is the majority of programming other than networks. Yes, Directv is promising 100+ HD channels by the end of the year, but I have heard those type of promises before.

I looked up the information on this TV, and it does look spectacular,,,,except for the part you read in the owners specs about not viewing in 4:3 mode or letting a channel banner sit for too long as this may cause permanent damage.

With all the problems with the various LCD tv's, I would consider plasma, if it weren't for the burn-in issue. But to each their own, and I hope you enjoy your set.

First of all, 80% is not HD. Even if you are only talking about ABC, NBC, CBS and Fox, they have programs in HD, usually primetime programs, but the majority is not HD, particularly during the day. I have Directv, and I am not going to say "no I can't watch that because it is SD", which is the majority of programming other than networks. Yes, Directv is promising 100+ HD channels by the end of the year, but I have heard those type of promises before.

I looked up the information on this TV, and it does look spectacular,,,,except for the part you read in the owners specs about not viewing in 4:3 mode or letting a channel banner sit for too long as this may cause permanent damage.

With all the problems with the various LCD tv's, I would consider plasma, if it weren't for the burn-in issue. But to each their own, and I hope you enjoy your set.

I was worried about burn in on a plasma too but took my chances. Especially because I game. I've had it for close to 8 months and I've yet to even see IR. I didn't believe it before but I think burn in is not as big of an issue as most people think. And by the way, if you are worried about reflections keep in mind that the 81 series Sammy may likely have a glossy screen like a plasmas. I wish Sammy would release the MSRPs and models on these sets.

Ok, I respect your decision, but the first thing that comes to mind in burn-in. I watch a fair amount of SD, and hate it stretched, so you can bet that tv would burn in the black bars,,,,,,unless you have info otherwise. My other concern is washout during the day. Please let me know your thoughts on this.

I have posted in the plasma forum many times stating that a Panny or Pioneer plasma renders the best PQ. However, one thing that has always swayed me away from plasma was not burn in per say, it will usually be temporary and then disappear. But the fact that the TV dictates what you can and cannot do to prevent IR, that's what bothers me. A TV is to be enjoyed, not worrying if a 3 hour movie with black bars will affect the screen.

Look closely at the pictures on both AVING and Gizmodo. Unless those screen images are simulated then I can't spot any perceivable glare in the blacks of the screen, in fact on the second image of AVING's site the flash from the camera seems to indicate a traditional LCD coating because of light scattering...

AVING (http://www.aving.net/usa/news/default.asp?mode=read&c_num=50002&C_Code=09)

Gizmodo (http://gizmodo.com/photogallery/samsung70LED/2021794)

So what's the deal here, you guys in the states and CAN are still waiting for M81?
Weird that OZ gets them first, but M81 has unreal PQ running HD demo.
Can't vouch for DVD PQ though.

Your concerns are unwarranted. Try checking out the threads in the Plasma forums on just this topic. Why buy a HDTV to watch 4:3 content? 80% of network television is HD.

gee, i wish ANY animated programs were in HD, except that NONE of them are, nothing on fox, and cartoon network will probably never even have an HD channel.

nice to see so many expert posting there views here. this really helped.

for this topic i would like to say that we do not have to purchase the newest technology, on now condition. LCD TV would be a perfect choice. we do not know when LED background light would be put into practical use. what we see is only prospect.

gee, i wish ANY animated programs were in HD, except that NONE of them are, nothing on fox, and cartoon network will probably never even have an HD channel.

Lots of Japanese Anime is in HD, and they are fantastic too! You should check them
out sometime. Lookie here for lots of details and even torrents:
http://www.anime-source.com/banzai/modules.php?name=Anime

Greetings everyone,

Thanks to everybody who has contributed info to this thread.

The use of LEDs in LCD tvs seems to have great potential in terms of picture quality.

I'm thinking of waiting for Samsung to bring these LCDs to the market to make my transition to HDTV. However I saw a demo video of the new 70" Samsung LED LCD that they just introduced. They were playing what looked like footage from Disney's movie "Cars". In the video you see a lot "blur" and other imperfections. What is causing that? I'm not really familar with LCD tvs so any answers would be greatly appreciated.

Its my first post so I can't post a direct link.
Link coming shortly.

post 2

post 3

post 4

post 5

Here is the link to the video:
http://aving.net/kr/tv/default.asp?mode=read&c_num=50007&mn_name=tv

In the video you see a lot "blur" and other imperfections. What is causing that? I'm not really familar with LCD tvs so any answers would be greatly appreciated.


Thanks for the link. In response to the set being blurry, I don't think we can use an interlaced, downscaled, low bitrate video to judge the quality of a 70" LCD screen. I would imagine you would have to see it in person to get the full benefit.

I'm thinking of waiting for Samsung to bring these LCDs to the market to make my transition to HDTV. However I saw a demo video of the new 70" Samsung LED LCD that they just introduced. They were playing what looked like footage from Disney's movie "Cars". In the video you see a lot "blur" and other imperfections. What is causing that? I'm not really familar with LCD tvs so any answers would be greatly appreciated.


All the imprefections originate from the limited quality of video recording. As far as it can be gaged from the pics there are signs that the original PQ should be fantastic.

However, without the inspection of video on the original glass in criticial viewing conditions the day of the final judgment is still off.

One note of correction: Samsung guy in the video states that the CR is 50 times better than current systems. Since they have CR of about 1000 the CR of this model should be 50 000:1 and not 500 000:1.

Why would they bring to market a 70" instead of gradually working their way up?

I am starting to get confused and frustrated. Is there going to be a 71/81 series or not?

$%^&$^# Samsung!!!!

Why would they bring to market a 70" instead of gradually working their way up?

I am starting to get confused and frustrated. Is there going to be a 71/81 series or not?

$%^&$^# Samsung!!!!

They probably will have smaller sizes, they just made a press conference about their biggest set.
Sony, Sharp & etc all had separate showings for their 70"-100" TV's at CES as well.

Why would they bring to market a 70" instead of gradually working their way up?

I am starting to get confused and frustrated. Is there going to be a 71/81 series or not?

$%^&$^# Samsung!!!!

I think they are just playing with us silly Americans

Reduces power consumption by 50%, with a 500,000:1 CR.

http://www.samsung.com/PressCenter/PressRelease/PressRelease.asp?seq=20070614_0000354151



Too bad this wasn't an LCD plant. 1.6 million square feet building = 9 football fields.

http://www.samsung.com/PressCenter/PressRelease/PressRelease.asp?seq=20070614_0000354604

Just wanted to inquire something I havent heard about for a while .... the Bluetooth capability of the 81 series ...

My understanding of this is that all you'll need is the power cord and everything else is wireless ... is this correct? Can anyone comment on this?

Zsolt

Can't believe that the bloggers have details on the other sizes but no details on the 57".

Has anyone seen anything?

Thanks!! I own a 46" 61-series and 52" 65-series but am wanting a 57" for our main TV (okay I "want" a 65" or 70" but $$ in the way).

Lots of Japanese Anime is in HD, and they are fantastic too! You should check them
out sometime. Lookie here for lots of details and even torrents:
http://www.anime-source.com/banzai/modules.php?name=Anime

yes but you're missing the point. First off alot of those so called "HD animes" are movie features, and not television shows (almost a bulk of regular moves as well can be aired in HD and often are on the premium channels, but anime movies are only seldom aired in HD, again we're talking about television programming not torrent downloads). But most importantly, the channel that airs the most anime/animated programs (Cartoon Network) on television does not even have an HD channel anyhow (again not like it would matter since all animated shows on non-premium cable programming on right now are not in HD regardless).

Can't believe that the bloggers have details on the other sizes but no details on the 57".

Has anyone seen anything?

Thanks!! I own a 46" 61-series and 52" 65-series but am wanting a 57" for our main TV (okay I "want" a 65" or 70" but $$ in the way).

I'm with you. I'm sure I'll probably get the up & coming Pioneer 60" plasma in Sept. But I'd like to see what the 81 series has to offer as the sound very exciting. 57" is the smallest I could possibly go and if they outdo the Pioneers and are within my price range then we'll see. That 70"er sounds sooo good until you look at the price tag :eek:.

yes but you're missing the point. First off alot of those so called "HD animes" are movie features, and not television shows (almost a bulk of regular moves as well can be aired in HD and often are on the premium channels, but anime movies are only seldom aired in HD, again we're talking about television programming not torrent downloads). But most importantly, the channel that airs the most anime/animated programs (Cartoon Network) on television does not even have an HD channel anyhow (again not like it would matter since all animated shows on non-premium cable programming on right now are not in HD regardless).

I'm just giving you an option for really good animated series worth watching. If you
want good quality animated/anime material, your best off building an HTPC (I use a
laptop).

And, for the record, those are not movies, they're SERIES! Many are 24 and up
episodes. The difference is that most anime series actual follow a plot that goes
from episode to episode and eventually complete in the end, while most North
American "cartoons" hardly have a plot for the whole series, and go on a per-episode
plot. Anime movies themselves hardly exist, and the ones that do tend to be too
short and hardly make any sense.

Anyhow, as I've said, I've give you an option for good quality animated material.
Yeah, it's subtitled, but they run fantastically well on LCD's. The Japanese dialog
really makes the story so it's best to watch subtitled stuff. The dubbed stuff, for
the most part, is just crap and doesn't do the story justice.

Take care. {sorry for steering this thread off course... i'll stop here}

Can't believe that the bloggers have details on the other sizes but no details on the 57".

Has anyone seen anything?

Thanks!! I own a 46" 61-series and 52" 65-series but am wanting a 57" for our main TV (okay I "want" a 65" or 70" but $$ in the way).
If you were to go back to the very first page of this thread and press release it states:

At the head of the announcements is the company's 81 series. The company says the new LCDs, ranging between the 40-inch LN-T4081F and the 57-inch LN-T5781F, all mark the first LED-backlit TVs with local dimming. The new lighting technique dramatically improves the color gamut to 105% of the NTSC range, promising images that perfectly match the source material. Local dimming on the lights also boosts the contrast ratio to an exceptional 50,000:1 by selectively reducing light for pixels that display darker colors in a given scene. All the sets should be 1080p-capable and will include three HDMI ports when they go on sale in July for an unrevealed price.

Last Summer when the current 57" came on the scene there wasn't any big announcement over it. The first lucky owner happened to view it at a BB Mag Store in Rancho Mirage, CA and he bought it and posted pic's and that was at the end of June 2006 and within 30 days it became widely distributed throughout the country but at the time it's MSRP was $10K and now the MSRP has dropped a few K and can street a few K below that now. The 81 series will be the same tech and specs only on a larger size 57" and of course price to have a premium for it's top of class and unique features for awhile anyways. It is common for the CR measurement to become smaller on larger panels but if the 70" is an indicator it doesn't appear to apply if that baby is at 500K:1.

The past three years on this forum I've seen a pattern where Samsung has followed annual transitions regularly and on schedule and suspect the 57" should arrive in July which was the official debut of last years release. The only difference is the new Samsung/Sony plant that was finished a few months earlier than scheduled (to be honest I have no idea of what size panels will be built there though). Lets hope the 57" 81 series doesn't follow the pricing structure of the 70" or Sharp D93 won't have any competition at 65" since Sharp decided not to sell the 57" in N. America (though a 57" Sharp still will be sold in Asia and perhaps Europe). Makes you wonder where Toshiba is getting their 57" Glass as they do not build it's own mother glass they have only two sources being Samsung or Sharp.

Hopefully Samsung follows last years trend with the 57" which can now be acquired for 10% of the 70" and I've never seen a negative review posted on it. Hopefully Samsung does 81 series posting soon. :)

Lets hope the 57" 81 series doesn't follow the pricing structure of the 70" or Sharp D93 won't have any competition at 65"....

Hopefully Samsung follows last years trend with the 57" which can now be acquired for 10% of the 70" and I've never seen a negative review posted on it. Hopefully Samsung does 81 series posting soon. :)

It is absolutely unlikely for the 57" to have any exorbitant price. 52" is in the mainstream now, and Taiwanese will release several 65 inchers later this year. This prevents any significant premium.

The 70" can be marketed for some time as the world best & biggest LD LCD which will sell it to the folks who buy everything 10x standard price.

This market is limited to at most hundreds of pieces so one can expect the price bottoming to normal levels in a half a year or so.

It is absolutely unlikely for the 57" to have any exorbitant price. 52" is in the mainstream now, and Taiwanese will release several 65 inchers later this year. This prevents any significant premium.

The 70" can be marketed for some time as the world best & biggest LD LCD which will sell it to the folks who buy everything 10x standard price.

This market is limited to at most hundreds of pieces so one can expect the price bottoming to normal levels in a half a year or so.

I'm not sure if it would be a good thing for Samsung to produce a >10k 52 inch too. At some point, you have to figure out the sweet spot (through market studies) at which people are willing to pay premium and compute that into your potential market. Samsung would probably make more money selling a TV with a total BOM of say 2k at 6 grand than they would selling the same set at 11k. You'll end up with at least 10 times more buyers at 6 grand. And I'm pretty sure the total BOM isn't all that high on this set, what they have to recoup is the R&D and by selling more sets, you make that much easier. I may be dreaming, and I'm not promising a sub 4k set but I think samsung either can manufacture these sets without very special requirements (like manual calibration or operations) and sell them at a reasonable premium price, or they haven't figured their manufacturing process and we'll have sky-high prices of 30k+.

Samsung would probably make more money selling a TV with a total BOM of say 2k at 6 grand than they would selling the same set at 11k. You'll end up with at least 10 times more buyers at 6 grand. And I'm pretty sure the total BOM isn't all that high on this set, what they have to recoup is the R&D and by selling more sets, you make that much easier. I may be dreaming, and I'm not promising a sub 4k set but I think samsung either can manufacture these sets without very special requirements (like manual calibration or operations) and sell them at a reasonable premium price, or they haven't figured their manufacturing process and we'll have sky-high prices of 30k+.

The LD technology is new so there is learning curve to bring it down to mass price levels.

Sky high prices are very useful for the introduction and initial production of products which can be claimed unique. Often at the beginning such products are made manually.

Once the production gets automated and ramps up the price goes down. Thanks to the high initial price and existence of the folks who can afford to buy, innovation may reach everybody in the end.

What's going on here, 1000 posts speculating on the price of unreleased TVs. Pointless :D

The LD technology is new so there is learning curve to bring it down to mass price levels.

Sky high prices are very useful for the introduction and initial production of products which can be claimed unique. Often at the beginning such products are made manually.

Once the production gets automated and ramps up the price goes down. Thanks to the high initial price and existence of the folks who can afford to buy, innovation may reach everybody in the end.

Totally agree, that is IF they haven't figured out the mass production details yet. Samsung already has a few years experience (more so than any other manufacturer in my experience) in making LED LCD. Perhaps they feel confident they can roll in LD without too many hiccups.

I'm almost sure your estimate is correct and that this product won't hit the market with full production lines. Still, look at the iPhone. As much as I'm not an Apple Fanboy, Apple is introducing a LOT of stuff (granted lots is already on the market also in other forms) yet they're coming out with a *decent-albeit-very-high* price in large quantities.

What's going on here, 1000 posts speculating on the price of unreleased TVs. Pointless :D

Speculating is our life. Once the 81 series comes out we move on to another speculating thread. We are professional speculators. Speculating is our life.

Just wanted to inquire something I havent heard about for a while .... the Bluetooth capability of the 81 series ...

My understanding of this is that all you'll need is the power cord and everything else is wireless ... is this correct? Can anyone comment on this?

Zsolt

Isn't every TV wireless in that since? But in terms of a Bluetooth remote, I really hope not for the sake of using a universal remote.

Totally agree, that is IF they haven't figured out the mass production details yet. Samsung already has a few years experience (more so than any other manufacturer in my experience) in making LED LCD. Perhaps they feel confident they can roll in LD without too many hiccups.


There is colossal difference between LED and LED LD technology. LED is just replacement of CCFL with some control of light output. LD is based on tricky algorithms, Samsung will be first on the market with it.


I'm almost sure your estimate is correct and that this product won't hit the market with full production lines. Still, look at the iPhone. As much as I'm not an Apple Fanboy, Apple is introducing a LOT of stuff (granted lots is already on the market also in other forms) yet they're coming out with a *decent-albeit-very-high* price in large quantities.

Heh, this is funny example :D. Apple iPhone is a product which has no essential new tech, components are available by tons. Most probably its production is subcontracted to somebody in China.

Compare this to the 70" LED LD. The 70" glass is new and LED LD is new, only Samsung can do them.

What's going on here, 1000 posts speculating on the price of unreleased TVs. Pointless :D


lol you're new to avs, huh?

Originally posted by phigment
Thanks for the link. In response to the set being blurry, I don't think we can use an interlaced, downscaled, low bitrate video to judge the quality of a 70" LCD screen. I would imagine you would have to see it in person to get the full benefit.


Originally posted by irkuck
All the imprefections originate from the limited quality of video recording. As far as it can be gaged from the pics there are signs that the original PQ should be fantastic.

However, without the inspection of video on the original glass in criticial viewing conditions the day of the final judgment is still off.


Yeah I went back and watched the video a few more times, and I think that the blur just may be a result of the video and not the tv set itself. There looks to be some compression issues going on in the video.
Hopefully these new 81 series sets from samsung will come to the market sooner rather than later, then we can determine the picture quality with our own eyes. But regardless I'm still very excited about this LED LCD technology. :D

...may be a result of the video and not the tv set itself...
From viewing the video, I'm very disappointed with the bad color, only 72% color gamut. Oops, my PC's LCD is only 72%, never mind.

Speculating is our life. Once the 81 series comes out we move on to another speculating thread. We are professional speculators. Speculating is our life.
The problem is there are two types of speculators. The pro's that speculate on new technology and the wanta bees that speculate on price and release date.

There is colossal difference between LED and LED LD technology. LED is just replacement of CCFL with some control of light output. LD is based on tricky algorithms, Samsung will be first on the market with it.



Heh, this is funny example :D. Apple iPhone is a product which has no essential new tech, components are available by tons. Most probably its production is subcontracted to somebody in China.

Compare this to the 70" LED LD. The 70" glass is new and LED LD is new, only Samsung can do them.

Fast LED drivers, using 8, 16 and 32 ports technology is not really brand new. I've been using them personally for quite a while. I agree that there is lots of work on algorithms, for which samsung will have a lot of credit if they pull it off right. But on the hardware side, the problem is mostly figuring out ways to solve the problems associated with early LD tech, temperature issues.... I've seen quite a few documents on LD, some showed up in IEEE documents years ago, Samsung didn't pull this off by themselves and a lot of work has been done on this in the past. We're not discussing NASA stuff here. This is very exciting technology, quite new to the consumer market, but I don't think it fall into the Nitrogen-cooled computers category.

I'm not really thinking of the 70 incher either which seems to be a collector's item. For the 81 series, I think this represents fewer risks. To my knowledge the 70 inch isn't part of the same lineup.

That being said, I don't know if samsung is ready for mass market. I don't think they are, and according to reports from Samsung they won't be. So in the end run you'll probably be right and the price *will* be sky-high.

Heh, this is funny example :D. Apple iPhone is a product which has no essential new tech, components are available by tons. Most probably its production is subcontracted to somebody in China.



You know, its pretty hard to come up with something out of thin air these days. When you think of this 81 series, what really new? Maybe the dimming algorithms. Certainly not using LEDs in bunch or dimming them locally on a display. Heck I have a friend who worked on Subway signs 2 years ago that had 3-color LEDs. They dimmed local regions create accents on parts of the screen (like if the commercial wanted you to focus on a logo...). At some point, the novelty comes from little details. The iPhone, as much as I hate the idea of it, has a lot of interface novelties that could, or not, become deFacto in the next years. They are, to my knowledge, one of the first, if not the first to introduce a mass market multitouch device. Their predictive keyboard is supposed to be WAY ahead of anything out there.

Isn't every TV wireless in that since? But in terms of a Bluetooth remote, I really hope not for the sake of using a universal remote.


Sorry I got mixed up from a previous news piece way back in Jan 2007 ... found it and thought that this feature was on the 81 series as wel ..

http://reviews.cnet.com/8301-12760_7-9673322-5.html

Zsolt

I apologize if this has been posted before, but what is the smallest size LCD from samsung that will have the LED backlight w/ local dimming?

I apologize if this has been posted before, but what is the smallest size LCD from samsung that will have the LED backlight w/ local dimming?

I believe, but don't quote me, that it will be 40".

I'm hoping anyway and that they can get it into my 38.5" wide opening of my antiquated 4:3 entertainment center. Else, I will need to trash the entertainment center and buy a larger 81 series. :)

I believe, but don't quote me, that it will be 40".

I'm hoping anyway and that they can get it into my 38.5" wide opening of my antiquated 4:3 entertainment center. Else, I will need to trash the entertainment center and buy a larger 81 series. :)

Guess it's time to pull out the power tools. I had the same problem as your fitting my Sharp 46in into my old furniture. Now that I've returned it (the sharp(s) - Don't ask),the unit looks like hell with my old 32 inch CRT in the center. I definately need this set to come out soon :)

Fast LED drivers, using 8, 16 and 32 ports technology is not really brand new. I've been using them personally for quite a while. I agree that there is lots of work on algorithms, for which samsung will have a lot of credit if they pull it off right. But on the hardware side, the problem is mostly figuring out ways to solve the problems associated with early LD tech, temperature issues.... I'm not really thinking of the 70 incher either which seems to be a collector's item. For the 81 series, I think this represents fewer risks. To my knowledge the 70 inch isn't part of the same lineup.

LD LED LCD is not a quantum computer tech but still it is a quantum leap from the CCFL. On general level it is simple: connect LED's and switch on the current. But the devil is in the details and thi makes
it complicated: temperature and aging impact, dimming algorithms have to be extremely well tuned to avoid artefacts. And still there is ? if they managed to get rid of all the artefacts.

The 70 incher is of course a collector item now but once Samsung 8 Gen lines start rolling it will become mass product. This is just 6 months away.


That being said, I don't know if samsung is ready for mass market. I don't think they are, and according to reports from Samsung they won't be. So in the end run you'll probably be right and the price *will* be sky-high.

The sky-high price period will be very intermittent.
If consumers see benefits they will ramp up quickly and prices will bump down.

so does anyone know what the life of one of these panels is? conventional lcds range from 50,000 to 60,000 hours of use.

so does anyone know what the life of one of these panels is? conventional lcds range from 50,000 to 60,000 hours of use.

Well we just discussed it Irkuck and I. The temperature is THE (if the design is appropriate though, have to consider SOA and other design factors for sure) most important factor when considering lifetime for semiconductors. Still, LED traditionally have much better lifetime than almost any other light sources. I can't say for sure because the final implementation and manufacturing process is key, but my guess would be that it will surpass CCFL, Plasma, DLP...

I really, really hope that on the 40" model at least the price is somewhat within reason. I can appreciate a premium over non LD LED sets but if it's double the price or something along those lines, I'll have to wait it out.

so does anyone know what the life of one of these panels is? conventional lcds range from 50,000 to 60,000 hours of use.
do you fcn need more than 60000 hours?????? thats 6 1/2 hours a day for 25 years. if you watch tv that much get off your fat ass and go outside.... lol. if its not out yet, how do we know the life of these panel.

do you fcn need more than 60000 hours?????? thats 6 1/2 hours a day for 25 years. if you watch tv that much get off your fat ass and go outside.... lol. if its not out yet, how do we know the life of these panel.

I agree (not about the fat ass part - The lifetime part). I was mostly commenting earlier on the durability of the LED BLU section which should be similar to CCFL, or greater. But you make a good point that these panels are not yet out, ans I've had way too much experience designing power electronics to know that the reliability is not related to individual components MTBFs. In fact, if I remember my Dad back in the 'Ole days, he used to be repairing TV as a sideline and there was A LOT of them. I think TV manufacturer are doing a good job designing given that the amount of technology involved has gone up tenfold. Perhaps more support for firmware updates would be appreciated but some manufacturers are already doing a good job at that. (I've heard Olevia for one)

so does anyone know what the life of one of these panels is? conventional lcds range from 50,000 to 60,000 hours of use.

Don't worry about that. It is likely that the lifetime of the panel you buy will be longer than your lifetime. Unless of course in long future you throw it out to buy another panel made in some new XXX tech :D

I'm hoping anyway and that they can get it into my 38.5" wide opening of my antiquated 4:3 entertainment center. Else, I will need to trash the entertainment center and buy a larger 81 series.

Sounds like, to me, you win either way!

Damn it!! I became weak and dipped into my 81 series HDTV fund and bought some new speakers!! If they would just lay out a price than it would be easier to save for an exact amount rather than this hogwash "Its going to be expensive" garbage ... with so much money burning a hole in my pocket Im bound to buy something!!

Z

Damn it!! I became weak and dipped into my 81 series HDTV fund and bought some new speakers!! If they would just lay out a price than it would be easier to save for an exact amount rather than this hogwash "Its going to be expensive" garbage ... with so much money burning a hole in my pocket Im bound to buy something!!

Z

BAD BOY, now you may have to settle for the 71, lol

Damn it!! I became weak and dipped into my 81 series HDTV fund and bought some new speakers!! If they would just lay out a price than it would be easier to save for an exact amount rather than this hogwash "Its going to be expensive" garbage ... with so much money burning a hole in my pocket Im bound to buy something!!

Z

"It's going to be expensive".

BAD BOY, now you may have to settle for the 71, lol

Lol, thats exactly what went through my mind "Hmm Ill have to settle for the 46 inch 71 series, rather than the 52" 81 series" .... We'll see :)

lipcrkr: Im having deja vu ... I heard that somewhere? :D

Zsolt

sorry for not reading the whole thread but if someone can be nice enough to give a summery of whats the whole thread consist of and what if any updates are avaiable?
and pricing? what res 720p/1080p? and fianly what dates are these tvs hitting market?

We think they should be hitting the market in July, but there has been no announcement on the pricing yet. They should be a 1080p and MAY possibly do 120hz.

sorry for not reading the whole thread but if someone can be nice enough to give a summery of whats the whole thread consist of and what if any updates are avaiable?
and pricing? what res 720p/1080p? and fianly what dates are these tvs hitting market?


By the way "They will be very expensive"!! :D

Whats kind of creepy is that I have been reading this thread since it was only one page old.. and look at it now ... its all grown up and 37 pages old!!
;)

Zsolt

By the way "They will be very expensive"!! :D

Whats kind of creepy is that I have been reading this thread since it was only one page old.. and look at it now ... its all grown up and 37 pages old!!
;)

Zsolt

lol, yup, but it has slowed down quite a bit as Samsung continues to delay with info.

lol, yup, but it has slowed down quite a bit as Samsung continues to delay with info.

Yeah, it's even getting harder to speculate. I still can't figure out the 71 series. If it still exists i don't understand what the big secret is. It basically has 120hz which most TV's have now. It won't be that much different than the 65 series as far as features. I'm sure Samsung is looking at the MSRP of the Toshiba LX177 series.

$63K for Samsungs 70" in the US? Consumer price for Samsungs new 70" LCD in Sweden is going to be around $72,400. Price here is always much higher than in the US. :(

thanks for the reply guys ill just have to take the time to read the whole thread lol.....
i guess the pioneer 8th gen series wil be a better choice then

Sounds like, to me, you win either way!

:D

That's true though a tad more costly buying the new entertainment center along with the legwork of which center and TV.

C'mon 81s!!!!!!

do you fcn need more than 60000 hours?????? thats 6 1/2 hours a day for 25 years. if you watch tv that much get off your fat ass and go outside.... lol. if its not out yet, how do we know the life of these panel.


well before you guys continue to jump all over me, consider that the led lighting in dlp is rated for just 15,000 to 20,000 hours. at 8 hours a day (typical usage in the US, which, btw, does NOT take into consideration using the panel for pc or gaming use), that's just 5 years.

so yeah, it is relevant and it is worth discussing...

to your other assinine point, how do we know the mpg of the new cars that come out each fall? by using current data, referencing the tech used and making educated guesses. it's not hard. alternatively, wait for the specs from the mfr :mad:

well before you guys continue to jump all over me, consider that the led lighting in dlp is rated for just 15,000 to 20,000 hours. at 8 hours a day (typical usage in the US, which, btw, does NOT take into consideration using the panel for pc or gaming use), that's just 5 years.


The LEDs in DLP have to be much brighter for the projection, so they are probably overdriven to bump up the light output burning them out faster. White/blue LEDs are usually quoted with a 50,000 life (green, red with 100k). So, about 5 years of continuous use. Early burn out would be evil as you would most likely develop a red/green tint area.

It is pretty much the same as all electronics these days. If you are one of the unlucky your device will fail early, but out of warrantee and you will be stuck with a boat anchor. One just has to hope that new sets at that time will be so much better and cheaper that you will not feel so bad about being forced to upgrade.

One cannot view this set as an investment, one has to view it for what it is, possibly the best picture for the $$ at the time of its introduction. Soon to be outdated by newer models.

So there hasn't been any much new news on these sets? I'm assuming they won't show up in July then. :mad:

I'm probably suffering from some form of amnesia or something but I can't recall seeing this set, 52M92BD, although I do have a vague memory of that girl. (hehe)

http://www.samsung.co.kr/news/biz_view.jsp?contentid=116243

I searched briefly on the web and in AVS forums but haven't found much on this 92DB panel. I'm aware of the 81BD panels but can't recall this one. It seems it was announced on the 12th.

A french blog has some very bare info on it and it states LED backlight (though I doubt it. Kinda like the new phillips ambilight has LED backlight according to all these tech news websites)
http://www.journaldugeek.com/index.php?Ecrans (Scroll down past the 91BD 70 inch news, it is below that one)

Please someone refresh my memory! I'm still hoping for signs samsung will coem out with either a LED backlight or a 120 Hz panel sometime this summer.

$63K for Samsungs 70" in the US? Consumer price for Samsungs new 70" LCD in Sweden is going to be around $72,400. Price here is always much higher than in the US. :(

Heh, you complain but in Sweden there is sales tax of 25%, right? You like high taxes, you elect those who impose them, you suffer :D

But don't get into depression... the price will fall down very quickly due to the competition and production ramping up.

Just got off the phone ,Samsung rep. said both series 71 and 81 coming out ind mid August,countdown has begun :eek:

Just got off the phone ,Samsung rep. said both series 71 and 81 coming out ind mid August,countdown has begun :eek:

And we all know how accurate the folks are that answer the phones.

Just got off the phone ,Samsung rep. said both series 71 and 81 coming out ind mid August,countdown has begun :eek:

hm, considering this thread started off with information about a spring release i'm still staking stuff like this with an eek free grain of salt, even though it's hard to really dispute an august release at this point, and really more interesting info like pictures or prices are still annoyingly absent.

Samsung LN-T5281F This one looks intresting. And it would be nice to have an idea what the price range is? Wonder if there for regular consumers or just a niche market.

Samsung LN-T5281F This one looks intresting. And it would be nice to have an idea what the price range is? Wonder if there for regular consumers or just a niche market.

Um, is that the 81 series we have been talking about, or something else, or just a guess at the new 81 series number?

Um, is that the 81 series we have been talking about, or something else, or just a guess at the new 81 series number?

I made a statement a while back saying the 71/81 series is in the same series as the 61/65's. These are considered 2007 models. Gizmodo seems to agree with me:
http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/home-entertainment/samsungs-81+series-lcds-have-500001-contrast-ratio-226715.php

I'm probably suffering from some form of amnesia or something but I can't recall seeing this set, 52M92BD, although I do have a vague memory of that girl. (hehe)

http://www.samsung.co.kr/news/biz_view.jsp?contentid=116243

I searched briefly on the web and in AVS forums but haven't found much on this 92DB panel. I'm aware of the 81BD panels but can't recall this one. It seems it was announced on the 12th.

A french blog has some very bare info on it and it states LED backlight (though I doubt it. Kinda like the new phillips ambilight has LED backlight according to all these tech news websites)
http://www.journaldugeek.com/index.php?Ecrans (Scroll down past the 91BD 70 inch news, it is below that one)

Please someone refresh my memory! I'm still hoping for signs samsung will coem out with either a LED backlight or a 120 Hz panel sometime this summer.


Look at full specs on M81 and M92 (Asian versions) at http://www.pavv.co.kr
Their panels have 5 ms response time, but no mention about 100 / 120 Hz, and they definetley ordinary CCFL backlight - so basically they are improved versions of 65/55-series (US) or 86/87 series (Europe) The panel is called Crystal Black instead of Super Clear

No specs found on the Korean monster LN70F91BD yet?
Though I'm only intrested in its little brother 40" (maybe called LN40F91BD or something?)

Found a retailer for flat screen wall mounts
http://www.vuepointav.com/mounts/user/index.php?mfgsel=1&mfg=SAMSUNG
when choosing Samsung and lists all their models (61, 65 etc...) also the LN-Txx81F models is avaiable - though no matching mounts is found... How did they no about this models? No sign of 71-series here

Look at full specs on M81 and M92 (Asian versions) at http://www.pavv.co.kr
Their panels have 5 ms response time, but no mention about 100 / 120 Hz, and they definetley ordinary CCFL backlight - so basically they are improved versions of 65/55-series (US) or 86/87 series (Europe) The panel is called Crystal Black instead of Super Clear

No specs found on the Korean monster LN70F91BD yet?
Though I'm only intrested in its little brother 40" (maybe called LN40F91BD or something?)

Found a retailer for flat screen wall mounts
http://www.vuepointav.com/mounts/user/index.php?mfgsel=1&mfg=SAMSUNG
when choosing Samsung and lists all their models (61, 65 etc...) also the LN-Txx81F models is avaiable - though no matching mounts is found... How did they no about this models? No sign of 71-series here

Aye, this is a tad confusing with all these models. They released the M71 (7000:1 CR) what I think is the mix the 42 and 61 series here, although they are 6ms.

Then they have the M81, what looks like an improved 65 (Crystal Clear Panel, 15000:1, 5ms, *wide color control?*)

And what seems and another super improved M92 (Crystal black panel, Wide color control, 17000:1 CR, No mention of refresh rate). I guess the blue light comment is based on the LED light at the bottom of the panel.

Finally, the M61 series looks like the 42 series we have here.

So I'm still wondering why they have two products that look *VERY* similar, the M81 and the M92. But Samsung has some history doing this. Their cell phone division usually crank up models that are very similar but designed by two different teams, the U600 / U700 (think it was renamed) fall in that category.

Oh well, I need to pick up new languages if I want to stay on top of things it seems...

http://www.sec.co.kr/product/tv/index.jsp

Found a retailer for flat screen wall mounts
http://www.vuepointav.com/mounts/user/index.php?mfgsel=1&mfg=SAMSUNG
when choosing Samsung and lists all their models (61, 65 etc...) also the LN-Txx81F models is avaiable - though no matching mounts is found... How did they no about this models? No sign of 71-series here

Good digging! :)

We can't read too much into it, but these channels are often how information on release dates leak out...

Just called best buy and asked if they had ANY information on the 81's and they had me on hold for 5 minutes and the reply was, "I'm sorry we don't. We actually have no paperwork on this television." This thing is supposed to come out next month and no one knows anything! WTH!?

How did you ask about it? Maybe the model number isn't what we're anticipating (LNT-xx81?)

How did you ask about it? Maybe the model number isn't what we're anticipating (LNT-xx81?)

I just said, "Hi, do you have any information on the new Samsung 81 series LCD Televisions like a release date or pricing?" And then came the response I posted before. (I actually asked if he had any information on the XBR4's and he had the same reply except he said that they come out in august.)

I just said, "Hi, do you have any information on the new Samsung 81 series LCD Televisions like a release date or pricing?" And then came the response I posted before. (I actually asked if he had any information on the XBR4's and he had the same reply except he said that they come out in august.)
My hunch is these are going to be really pricey. Plus if you read some posts around here, it could be the knockout punch for plasma. Nobody knows much because I think there protecting the treasure. Like I told you in your thread you started, unless you got the money to buy this new tech you may be ahead to buy a XBR2 and wait a few years and buy LED. Nobody can give you any answers right now.

My hunch is these are going to be really pricey. Plus if you read some posts around here, it could be the knockout punch for plasma. Nobody knows much because I think there protecting the treasure. Like I told you in your thread you started, unless you got the money to buy this new tech you may be ahead to buy a XBR2 and wait a few years and buy LED. Nobody can give you any answers right now.

They're going to be pricey and probably buggy for the first few revs. I just got a 4665 and the plan is to use that for a couple of years then get a nice sized LED once the kinks are worked out.

I think plasma is on the outs . The 4665 and high end Sharps match the black levels of most plasmas, LED LCDs will actually surpass them.

I don't think these are going to be that expensive oldcband. This is new technology for TVs and all but looking at the XBR4 40 inch, (3000$ MSRP) which IMO has all the features of the 81 series (that we know of) besides LED backlighting, shouldn't cost that much more. And I'm willing to say that the most this new technology will cost (and by most I mean MOST) is a grand more, even though Sony's set is overpriced as usual because it has Sony written on it. I still think my dream 40 inch LED Series 81 Samsung will cost me less than 4000$ MSRP.

Its not far off now and you'll know for sure about them in a couple months at the most. I've followed this thread and theres alot of hype and speculation. Take your time. Patience is a virtue.

Take your time. Patience is a virtue.

Yes, but life is short; our days are numbered, and our eyes are aging.

:D

Yes, but life is short; our days are numbered, and our eyes are aging.

:D

And friggen football season is right around the damn corner

This is ridiculous. The thing is supposed to be the 2nd coming of LCD, and there's
nothing to show for it. Sure, there was that 70 or whatever inch beast they
recently showed, but c'mon, the thing is supposed to be huge is it not? I know
Samsung has LCD's, Plasma's, and DLP's so their marketing staff are probably
really busy... but this is ridiculous. I've already made up my mind on the Pioneer
8G plasma in the long wait. LED is starting to look like it took a seat next to SED... :eek:

as long as I have my hdtv ready for september 25th for halo 3 im fine. + hopefully the format war winner will be decided after holiday season and I can finally adaopt to the winning format. (go Hd-DVD woo)

This is ridiculous. The thing is supposed to be the 2nd coming of LCD, and there's
nothing to show for it. Sure, there was that 70 or whatever inch beast they
recently showed, but c'mon, the thing is supposed to be huge is it not? .... I've already made up my mind on the Pioneer 8G plasma in the long wait. LED is starting to look like it took a seat next to SED... :eek:

You seem to be a vicitm of this anticipation thread, hopefully there will be no real victims getting nervous breakdown :D. To cool down the moods let's explain this rationally:

Sammy's LED BL LCDs were announced for the H2 this year and as far as one see they are on track. Obviously, Samsung wants to release them with big splash proceeding in carefully orchestrated way according to standard marketing canons. The sets were announced early and with no further information coming the anticipation pressure was building up in the market, reaching already dangerous levels. Then came flaghship salvo of the 70" LCD cannon, setting the market close to explosion. This means the stage is now becoming ready for the whole fleet parade and people lining in the shops :cool:

You seem to be a vicitm of this anticipation thread, hopefully there will be no real victims getting nervous breakdown :D. To cool down the moods let's explain this rationally:

Sammy's LED BL LCDs were announced for the H2 this year and as far as one see they are on track. Obviously, Samsung wants to release them with big splash proceeding in carefully orchestrated way according to standard marketing canons. The sets were announced early and with no further information coming the anticipation pressure was building up in the market, reaching already dangerous levels. Then came flaghship salvo of the 70" LCD cannon, setting the market close to explosion. This means the stage is now becoming ready for the whole fleet parade and people lining in the shops :cool:

And the villagers cheered,,,,,lol

And friggen football season is right around the damn corner

...and the release of Halo 3 not far beyond that. No way am I going to play Halo 3 with split-screen Co-op on my 19" LCD :mad: That is the absolute deadline for me.

This whole thread is BS. Does the 81 series even exist anywhere other then AVS? Can someone post a link to an article talking about the upcoming 81 series or even it's annoucement. I could start a thread with the title "Samsung 91 series anticipation thread" and see how long it can go as a joke.

This whole thread is BS. Does the 81 series even exist anywhere other then AVS? Can someone post a link to an article talking about the upcoming 81 series or even it's annoucement. I could start a thread with the title "Samsung 91 series anticipation thread" and see how long it can go as a joke.


it exists. samsung announced it... :rolleyes:

This whole thread is BS. Does the 81 series even exist anywhere other then AVS? Can someone post a link to an article talking about the upcoming 81 series or even it's annoucement. I could start a thread with the title "Samsung 91 series anticipation thread" and see how long it can go as a joke.
Try looking at post #1 ... yea post #1174 is a bit lame :D .

Try looking at post #1 ... yea post #1174 is a bit lame :D .

+1

This whole thread is BS. Does the 81 series even exist anywhere other then AVS? Can someone post a link to an article talking about the upcoming 81 series or even it's annoucement. I could start a thread with the title "Samsung 91 series anticipation thread" and see how long it can go as a joke.

The '81' is just a shortcut for the LED LD technology.

Number being this or other, more important is that the LED DL is not a vaporware, it is real and coming
soon, at least in the 70" incarnation:

http://www.ledsmagazine.com/news/4/6/20


BTW, this Samsung LED LD BL has one additional important but overlooked aspect. It is a STROBING BACKLIGHT, meaning:

"The LEDs are rapidly switched turned on and off in sequence to correspond to the frame rate of the display, so that no image is produced between frames. With a constant brightness CCFL (or LED) backlight a greyscale image is produced during the transition from one frame to the next, which results in annoying motion artifacts."

Strobing LED BL is much better idea than 120Hz motion interpolated frame rate upconversion precisely because no interpolation is needed.

Thus the local dimming by Samsung should be better called LOCAL DIMMING & STROBING backlight, LDS in short.

The LDS brings LCD closer to plasma and CRT technologies with respect to the display refresh.

I just wish pricing would be announced so I can decide if this is worth a consideration by September or if this is something I may be more interested in making a purchase on down the road when prices come down. If the 70"er is going to sell in the $50k plus range, I'm sure expecting the 57"er to be $5k street is probably a stretch of the imagination but I'd still like to know.

The '81' is just a shortcut for the LED LD technology.

Number being this or other, more important is that the LED DL is not a vaporware, it is real and coming
soon, at least in the 70" incarnation:

http://www.ledsmagazine.com/news/4/6/20


BTW, this Samsung LED LD BL has one additional important but overlooked aspect. It is a STROBING BACKLIGHT, meaning:

"The LEDs are rapidly switched turned on and off in sequence to correspond to the frame rate of the display, so that no image is produced between frames. With a constant brightness CCFL (or LED) backlight a greyscale image is produced during the transition from one frame to the next, which results in annoying motion artifacts."

Strobing LED BL is much better idea than 120Hz motion interpolated frame rate upconversion precisely because no interpolation is needed.

Thus the local dimming by Samsung should be better called LOCAL DIMMING & STROBING backlight, LDS in short.

The LDS brings LCD closer to plasma and CRT technologies with respect to the display refresh.

Two things; first, are you saying that these new batch of 120Hz sets will have artifacting problems beyond a regular LCD? The 120Hz was supposed to help with motion blur,,,,are you saying this is not so?

Second, Um, if you call it LDS, you might have problems with the Mormons, lol.

I just wish pricing would be announced so I can decide if this is worth a consideration by September or if this is something I may be more interested in making a purchase on down the road when prices come down. If the 70"er is going to sell in the $50k plus range, I'm sure expecting the 57"er to be $5k street is probably a stretch of the imagination but I'd still like to know.

yup, if I don't hear something soon, I wont be waiting.

you guys are acting lame. Where is the official press release by Samsung. Where does SAMSUNG actually mention the 81 series? Where is the release date and pricing? for something thats coming in July it's funny that Samsung has never mentioned it. I don't care if Gizmondo states that their is an 81 series coming. Gizmondo probobly gets their information from AVS anyway. So please post a link where Samsung officially announced the 81 series. If not then STFU, if you can then I guess I haven't looked hard enough.

Strobing LED BL is much better idea than 120Hz motion interpolated frame rate upconversion precisely because no interpolation is needed...
FUD. That's like saying upconverting DVDs does not increase PQ. May as well get an EDTV for DVDs.

I do NOT like the jerky motion visible at a movie theater due to 24p. I do like the new, high speed cameras they are using for sports doing slow motion.

If you do not like "interpolation", I suggest you do some "connect the dot" pictures using a French curve. For contrast, you could restrict yourself to just horizontal or vertical lines (no diagonals) as you would get with no interplation.

you guys are acting lame. Where is the official press release by Samsung. Where does SAMSUNG actually mention the 81 series? Where is the release date and pricing? for something thats coming in July it's funny that Samsung has never mentioned it. I don't care if Gizmondo states that their is an 81 series coming. Gizmondo probobly gets their information from AVS anyway. So please post a link where Samsung officially announced the 81 series. If not then STFU, if you can then I guess I haven't looked hard enough.

Just because YOU cant find it doesnt mean it doesnt exist, many of us have been following this TV since its announcement at CES 2007 where it was announced. Many products are announced and than you dont hear about them until near launch.

The following links give more confirmation of its announcement at CES 2007.

http://www.electronista.com/articles/07/01/07/samsung.lcd.with.led.light/

http://blogs.consumerreports.org/electronics/2007/01/ces_2007_hdtv_g.html

http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/home-entertainment/samsungs-81+series-lcds-have-500001-contrast-ratio-226715.php

http://www.16nine.com/

You will need to search a bit through some of these.

Z

From the angry post here looks like somebody has buyers remorse. Technology moves foward not backwards. The day you buy its obsolete. Also this TV could cause alot of trouble to different technologies. But hype and reality are different. Wait and see is all I can say. We should know soon.

FUD. That's like saying upconverting DVDs does not increase PQ. May as well get an EDTV for DVDs.

I do NOT like the jerky motion visible at a movie theater due to 24p. I do like the new, high speed cameras they are using for sports doing slow motion.

If you do not like "interpolation", I suggest you do some "connect the dot" pictures using a French curve. For contrast, you could restrict yourself to just horizontal or vertical lines (no diagonals) as you would get with no interplation.

Ok, I am confused. I thought the 120hz was supposed to help with motion blur, and.....24p divides evenly into 120 so it was supposed to help with judder (to tell you the truth, I don't even know what judder is, and don't know if I have ever seen it. If someone could give me an example and tell me how to look for it, I would appreciate it).......so, I thought the "movie theater" was operating in the 24p, and thus we would get a more "movie theater" experience on the 120hz (since movies are shot in 24p).

Ok, I am confused. I thought the 120hz was supposed to help with motion blur, and.....24p divides evenly into 120 so it was supposed to help with judder (to tell you the truth, I don't even know what judder is, and don't know if I have ever seen it. If someone could give me an example and tell me how to look for it, I would appreciate it).......so, I thought the "movie theater" was operating in the 24p, and thus we would get a more "movie theater" experience on the 120hz (since movies are shot in 24p).

If you watch a lot of the big Panavision movies like "Lawrence of Arabia" and "Ben Hur" you will notice it during a slow pan scene like the famous one of "Lawrence" riding in from the distance on the camel. Watch a movie that slowly pans across the horizon, or if the camera is stationary yet action moves across the screen from the left or right.

you guys are acting lame. Where is the official press release by Samsung. Where does SAMSUNG actually mention the 81 series? Where is the release date and pricing? for something thats coming in July it's funny that Samsung has never mentioned it. I don't care if Gizmondo states that their is an 81 series coming. Gizmondo probobly gets their information from AVS anyway. So please post a link where Samsung officially announced the 81 series. If not then STFU, if you can then I guess I haven't looked hard enough.


what the hell is your problem man? do a little research before making a jackass out of yourself. the 81 series HAS BEEN OFFICIALLY ANNOUNCED BY SAMSUNG. if you can't find info on it, perhaps you need some basic computer courses.

If you watch a lot of the big Panavision movies like "Lawrence of Arabia" and "Ben Hur" you will notice it during a slow pan scene like the famous one of "Lawrence" riding in from the distance on the camel. Watch a movie that slowly pans across the horizon, or if the camera is stationary yet action moves across the screen from the left or right.

Ok, thanks

Ok, thanks

Actually, i meant to say "Omar Sherif" riding in on the camel. "Lawrence" (Peter O'Toole) is in the foreground. "Bridge on the River Kwai" and "Close Encounters of the Third Kind" have many pan shots that can expose a poor display.

Forget it. All the links you posted are from news sites that usually copy all their information from each other. Im looking for AN OFFICIAL statement from Samsung, or PRESS RELEASE or some kind of credible information. What you guys are posting is a joke. Anyway, Im looking forward to something new from Samsung. I'm also considering the new Pio 8g. Im just wondering where you guys are getting your info that this TV will even be out this year? All the link you posted are months old. WE have NO SPECS, NO PRICES, and the only recent article is from a monster 70" version with no news on the smaller sets. I don't want to be a party crasher but I wouldn't expect to see these TVs this year. Maybe I should reread 6 month old links telling me that the TV will be out in July. :D

:p [I]Think it like marriage you wait a few months pay top wack for all the trimmings,but you got best dam babe to look at and play with,but heck in few years gets worn scratched and breaks down does not look so good new models on street with that o so good looks dam just like marriage?

spoke with a samsung rep today.She checked in the system now 81 series 52" and 57" will be available in mid august now. pricing details are still not available

I agree, I need to see offical proof. I'd love to wait for these new sets, but at what price tag will it come with. Sony has some of the new XBR line information online now and I hope Samsung will release information as well. I'm getting my 4665 tomorrow actually and if the price tag is fairly decent, there might be a chance I'll hold off and wait for the new Samsungs.

do i win?

http://www.dtvcenter.com/product/lcdtvSpec.cfm?product_id=693

Samsung LN-T5281F 52" 1080p HD LCD TV
-VA, MD, DC- Call Order (703)433-5300
Samsung LNT5281F 52" 1080p HD LCD TV (LN-T5281F)
LNT5281F

Regular Price :$11110.00
Instant Saving

Sale Price : $9999.00
Availability : No

Display Type LCD TV
Screen Size 52 inch
Aspect Ratio 16:9
Contrast Ratio 100000:1
Resolution N/A pixel
Picture In Picture N/A
Built in DVR N/A
1080p Compatible Yes
1080i Compatible Yes
720p Compatible Yes
480p Compatible Yes
Cablecard Slot N/A
Width 54.0 inches
Height 12.6 inches
Depth 33.3 inches
Weight 92.6 lbs.
Coaxial Input N/A
Composite Input N/A
S-Video Input N/A
Component Video Input 2
Digital Media RS232C
DVI Inputs N/A
HDMI Inputs 3 (ver 1.3)
PC Input Yes

[/SIZE]

do i win?

http://www.dtvcenter.com/product/lcdtvSpec.cfm?product_id=693

Samsung LN-T5281F 52" 1080p HD LCD TV
-VA, MD, DC- Call Order (703)433-5300
Samsung LNT5281F 52" 1080p HD LCD TV (LN-T5281F)
LNT5281F

Regular Price :$11110.00
Instant Saving

Sale Price : $9999.00
Availability : No

Display Type LCD TV
Screen Size 52 inch
Aspect Ratio 16:9
Contrast Ratio 100000:1
Resolution N/A pixel
Picture In Picture N/A
Built in DVR N/A
1080p Compatible Yes
1080i Compatible Yes
720p Compatible Yes
480p Compatible Yes
Cablecard Slot N/A
Width 54.0 inches
Height 12.6 inches
Depth 33.3 inches
Weight 92.6 lbs.
Coaxial Input N/A
Composite Input N/A
S-Video Input N/A
Component Video Input 2
Digital Media RS232C
DVI Inputs N/A
HDMI Inputs 3 (ver 1.3)
PC Input Yes

[/SIZE]
Mother of god....

LOL. Look for the LNT4081 and the LNT4681.. they're both priced the same. I highly doubt this is representative of the the true price.

They aren't on reseller ratings, and the side column of the site is full of google ad words. Looks to me like a crook came across this board and decided to see if he/she could take someone desperate. There is nothing on this earth that anyone could say that would convince me that it is a legitimate site. Everyone reading this forum should stick to the places they KNOW are legit, it's simply not worth the risk, esp. for a tv set.

I would believe that price however the fact that this unknown TV seller website knows before anyone else including insiders at AV shops is quite suspicious.

Im about $6999 off on my HDTV savings account on that one :-( Not looking good .... The 46 inch versions always seem to be a thousand or $1500 off the 52 inch so that would still put it in a very inflated price range. Wowsers ...

$ 8500-8999 for the 46 inch version. Seems a bit inflated doesnt anyone think? Is this technology really that premium that it would sell for $6000 above the same size LCD on their 61/65 series .... wow ... Ill haveto wait until this gets down to quite a bit. If this is the case its definately the 71 series for me (if it exists) or the 65 series and than Ill wait 4-5 years for these prices to crash down on this technology.

I will keep hanging in there though.

Zsolt

Regular Price :$11110.00

:eek:

The Price Of The Led Model Is Also The Same As The 71 Model No's As Well. This Site Is All Wrong. Forget It.

Note that all the prices are 11110, including the 71 series. Doesn't make sense to me.

Well I just checked that site and all the 71 and 81 models they listed earlier have been pulled from the web site. I suspect that they were preparing an updated page listing the models that they expect to get in soon. (And just using placeholder data till they had real numbers). They probably inadvertently made the update live before they were ready. Or maybe they read conan48's posts and realized they were about to sell a TV that doesn't exist. ;)

you know i started to think about it, and i think Samsungs lack of an update is rather lame. At least in comparison, Sony has done a relatively good job of letting people know about their upcoming product (the top LCD of which seems equivalent to the 71's......at least as far as we know, no thanks to Samsung).

Yes, some have had MAJOR issues with Sonys problematic spec handling and innacuracies with some of the non XBR stuff, but at least they have pages, price info and specs, Samsung should really follow suit.

"Height 12.6 inches
Depth 33.3 inches"

Apparently the LED's must be encased in a set twice as deep as a RPTV and as high as a center channel speaker.

you know i started to think about it, and i think Samsungs lack of an update is rather lame. At least in comparison, Sony has done a relatively good job of letting people know about their upcoming product (the top LCD of which seems equivalent to the 71's......at least as far as we know, no thanks to Samsung).

Yes, some have had MAJOR issues with Sonys problematic spec handling and innacuracies with some of the non XBR stuff, but at least they have pages, price info and specs, Samsung should really follow suit.

What's interesting is at the SID show a couple of weeks ago there was nothing about the 71/81 series from Samsung.

"Height 12.6 inches
Depth 33.3 inches"

Apparently the LED's must be encased in a set twice as deep as a RPTV and as high as a center channel speaker.

These numbers should be reversed - depth 12.6" would account for the stands need to provide balance and safety of the panel though it's actually only less than 5" most likely they often include the stands depth which runs much deeper. The Height of 33.3" could make sense if the the speakers are on the side. My 57" is 37.5 high including it's speaker - the panel without speaker and stand is 32.5" high on the 57" so these numbers do make sense if one reverses the depth and height. the depth of my 57" Stand though is 18.5" but it weighs a helluva lot more than a 52" - 164 lbs with speaker and stand.:)

Note that all the prices are 11110, including the 71 series. Doesn't make sense to me.

"Conspiracy" lol, maybe it was a Samsung stealth attack to see how we would react :rolleyes:

Maybe everybody should just wait for the Laser TV's ;) ...

"Mitsubishi will show Laser TV at CES 2008"

http://www.i4u.com/article9749.html

Of course, they won't be available until sometime later since they are just being announced in Jan 2008 at CES (again).

It says they are cheaper to make than Plasmas!

No LCD or BackLight problems :p

Oh well, just stirring the pot here since half of us had chest pains after seeing those prices for the LED set :eek: They probably won't be that high, but ????

do i win?

http://www.dtvcenter.com/product/lcdtvSpec.cfm?product_id=693

Samsung LN-T5281F 52" 1080p HD LCD TV
-VA, MD, DC- Call Order (703)433-5300
Samsung LNT5281F 52" 1080p HD LCD TV (LN-T5281F)
LNT5281F

Regular Price :$11110.00
Instant Saving


It looks promising that something is about to happen. Even though the web site was later updated to remove the listing, it seems to indicate that at least something has gone out to distributors and now companies are readying their web pages. Perhaps more will be seen next month as originally predicted. MSRP was probably not released yet, just preliminary specs, so they just typed in a bogus number.

The price for a lot of online retailers is not even set by the retailer. Instead it is done automatically based on a formula the site uses. When the distributor makes inventory available for a certain wholesale price all the etailers supplied by that distributor have their web pages update to produce what they they will sell for.

It looks promising that something is about to happen. Even though the web site was later updated to remove the listing, it seems to indicate that at least something has gone out to distributors and now companies are readying their web pages. Perhaps more will be seen next month as originally predicted. MSRP was probably not released yet, just preliminary specs, so they just typed in a bogus number.

The price for a lot of online retailers is not even set by the retailer. Instead it is done automatically based on a formula the site uses. When the distributor makes inventory available for a certain wholesale price all the etailers supplied by that distributor have their web pages update to produce what they they will sell for.

GRrrrrrrrrr, I just want a damn price so I can decide to buy the 81, or 71, or fall back on the 65......PLEASE SAMSUNG, give us a damn price. Hey, one thing I did want to ask, do you think the 71 (seeing as that will be the one in my price range, maybe) will have a better video processor than the 65's? I am hoping Directv gets their "100" channels of HD up pretty soon, but if not, I would like a tv that has watchable SD.

do i win?

http://www.dtvcenter.com/product/lcdtvSpec.cfm?product_id=693

Samsung LN-T5281F 52" 1080p HD LCD TV
-VA, MD, DC- Call Order (703)433-5300
Samsung LNT5281F 52" 1080p HD LCD TV (LN-T5281F)
LNT5281F

Regular Price :$11110.00
Instant Saving

Sale Price : $9999.00
Availability : No

Display Type LCD TV
Screen Size 52 inch
Aspect Ratio 16:9
Contrast Ratio 100000:1
Resolution N/A pixel
Picture In Picture N/A
Built in DVR N/A
1080p Compatible Yes
1080i Compatible Yes
720p Compatible Yes
480p Compatible Yes
Cablecard Slot N/A
Width 54.0 inches
Height 12.6 inches
Depth 33.3 inches
Weight 92.6 lbs.
Coaxial Input N/A
Composite Input N/A
S-Video Input N/A
Component Video Input 2
Digital Media RS232C
DVI Inputs N/A
HDMI Inputs 3 (ver 1.3)
PC Input Yes

[/SIZE]

My guess is that Conan48 wanted to stick it to us for being obsessed with this TV and put that site together.

I joke, Conan48 :)

Maybe everybody should just wait for the Laser TV's ;) ...

"Mitsubishi will show Laser TV at CES 2008"

http://www.i4u.com/article9749.html

Of course, they won't be available until sometime later since they are just being announced in Jan 2008 at CES (again).

It says they are cheaper to make than Plasmas!

No LCD or BackLight problems :p

Oh well, just stirring the pot here since half of us had chest pains after seeing those prices for the LED set :eek: They probably won't be that high, but ????

I dont care what type of format they use to make a great TV ... as long as it isnt prone to burn in, motion blur, and has great black levels ... I dont care if it is Laser, LED Back lit, SED, Cow manure run, has millions of little lephracons with different colored suits that make up the pixels .... the kicker is that it needs to COME OUT SOON!

This upcoing tv the 81 series seems to be the best candidate for all that I ask .... Im sure CES 2008 will have some interesting innovations but I will not wait for the release of those tvs in august or sept 08 ... this wait since CES 2007 was painful enough. Im ready to make the plunge and start enjoying ... those future CES 2008 models will haveto be my year 2012/2015 upgrade model.

I certainly had chest pains when I saw the price... I also had that feeling similar to being a child during Chirstmas and opening a present expecting a certain something, only to find something else ... I can only describe it as a veil of deep disappintment coming across one self ... I sure hope that it comes much much less than $9999 ..... for the 46 inch model $3500-4200 would be tolerable.

Z



Z

The thing that is beginning to bug me is that it looks like Samsung has completely dropped cable card slots. Note those "specs" say "n/a" for a cable card slot... it should simply say NO.

http://english.etnews.co.kr/news/detail.html?id=200706260007

Interesting. I know we discussed it earlier but this seems *semi-official*... Nothing directly from Samsung though. Article says testing of the production line started on the 25th.

Edit: Interesting to point out that once again, Samsung reps come out intent on slashing LCD prices on large size panels (ok, maybe the 70" behemoth doesn't count...), we've already heard reports from CES and SID I believe with Samsung officials stating that 52" and above should become affordable soon. Much to the dismay of Sony might I say, whom they are *partenered* with, who have also come on record stating that current pricing scheme of LCD isn't profitable.

Thanks Flash, but this has nothing to do with the codename 81 series

Been watching this thread thinking about buying. But I keep thinking about waiting. Then I see this from Engadget

engadget quotes new plant for sony and samsung where they make 52in LCD opening in July. Also Samsung exec predicts a big price drop by end of next year.
I thought of buying but I think I am going to wait.

I will use LCD mostly to watch Channels and movies

Thanks Flash, but this has nothing to do with the codename 81 series

It doesn't? I mean if Samsung follows Sharp's lead, they want to come out with 46-52 (and 57) before they come out with 40/42inch models. They would probably want to roll the 81 series out of this new plant would be my guess because it is much more profitable for large size panels.

8th gen? i thought we were into the 9th generation now?

8th gen? i thought we were into the 9th generation now?

There has to be a damn tv in order to have a "gen" lol

Maybe everybody should just wait for the Laser TV's ;) ...

"Mitsubishi will show Laser TV at CES 2008"

Of course, they won't be available until sometime later since they are just being announced in Jan 2008 at CES (again).

It says they are cheaper to make than Plasmas!

No LCD or BackLight problems :p

Oh well, just stirring the pot here since half of us had chest pains after seeing those prices for the LED set :eek: They probably won't be that high, but ????


I can't see getting a laser tv. During certain action movies, I'd be sure that one of the lasers was going to misfire and vaporize my whole family. And I'm just not ready to take that kinda risk with the loved ones in the name of entertainment. ;)

Thanks Flash, but this has nothing to do with the codename 81 series
May I post your own Quoted POST from May 1st 2007 on this Forum.

"Trust me. You made the right decision. The Sammy 65 series is the first LCD that actually made me think of giving up my Panny Plasma I think I'll wait for the 81 series first."

For being such a doubting Thomas your own quote acknowledges it. I guess Samsung just finished that new plant a few months early to produce what? The same panels they already have? No! Personally I think your jerking our chains with your proposition there is no 81 series to get attention or vent the frustration of the wait and lack of anything to simply discuss on this forum but speculated fluff and old panels - there's been a real void of new product recently and all we seem to have is fluff speculation.

I supposed there was a grand conspiracy at CES 2007 and the half dozen tech sites that announced the 81 series as they had nothing else to do with the convention center filled with thousands of product and they made up this story out of the ethers. That's nuts! The Samsung LED has existed in Europe under a different code and was announced last fall so why is it so hard to believe the 81 exists? After all your quote above acknowledged it didn't it.

Common sense and history of Samsung releases should tell you new panels are on the horizon as it's the same timeline of last years debut with July - August and especially the 57" model which is now one year old and ready for it's replacement and if a new panel wasn't on the horizon why wouldn't they have just updated the 57" as a 65 series at this new plant? Who cares what the hell the code moniker is - the new panels are on the horizon after all there is a reason they built the new plant. :)

While not an AV wiz like most of you folks, I do know a little about new technology development and roll out. Release of the 81 series could be delayed for any number of valid reasons: technical, legal, or strategic marketing. Should the latter issue be the primary reason for delay (whether a real or imagined delay), it may be an indicator that competing technologies and/or competing brands are not in a position to steal Samsung's thunder by releasing a competitive product before Samsung (believe me, all major AV competitors are very well aware of their competition's R&D and manufacturing timetables). The frustration evident on this thread (after all, this is an anticipation thread) is music to the ears of Samsung's LCD TV marketing team. The loss of a few sales to those technology hounds too frustrated to wait out the actual release date of a hot new product, are worth the extra hype, marketing buildup, and eventual sales gained by a relatively small delay.

Vent all you like, threaten, or actually go out and buy something else, it won't expedite the product release date of the 81 series (if it actually exists, Conan) by a single day. Personally, although I would eventually like to buy a 57" 81 series, I am content to watch and wait for now. If I grow too impatient with either release date, price issues, or the still-as-yet undertermined reliability of the 81 series, I will consider all alternatives. Meanwhile, calm down if you can; throw a hissy fit if you can't. It's almost like a movie or Reality program (actually, I despise all Reality programs!). So just sit back, grab some popcorn and enjoy the show. Come on, Samsung! Hit me baby one more time!

There has to be a damn tv in order to have a "gen" lol

well yeah but you know what i mean, the "upcoming" "yet to be released" televisions should be 9th gen panels shouldnt they?

That post was months ago, and I just took everyones word that the 81 series was coming and that it even existed. Recently Ive been looking for some actual confirmation or prof that the 81 series is actually coming out and I could find nothing but reports from CES from sites that are not always very credible. There has been nothing for months concerning the 81 series. Also, Im not doubting the fact that Samsung is developing Local Dimming LED LCD TV technology, but when it comes out it will probobly not even be using the 81 series name. So unless someone has a link from something official from Samsung then many people on this forum who have attacked me have no reason to and should ask themselves why they are so sure that these TV's will be even out this year? I hope they come out ASAP because Im looking forward to them as much as anyone else. Ive given up on plasma due to phosphor lag (green trails) and Im hoping LED will finally give me the picture quality Ive been waiting for all these years.

well, with improved contrast and 120mhz perhaps this will be the time.

And yeah the 71 is matching to sonys top XBR coming out in the next few months.

But i'm looking forward to this generation having the contrast, black detail and motion ability with the 120mhz to really go the distance finally.

...Ive given up on plasma due to phosphor lag (green trails)...So have I. :(

There's no need to panic. 81 series has been scheduled to come out in July and the last time I checked July is still ahead of us. Let's wait until the end of July before accusing Samsung of delaying these sets.

My guess is they will release an official press release about 81s on the day these tvs reach actual stores.

What's actually delayed is LG's LD LED LCD that had been announced for Q2. Now, what's up with that? To be fair, though, LG still has few days left to make the announcement. :)

i just sold my laptop and xbox. Ive got money pouring out of me now. If I dont buy a TV soon, Im gonna blow all my money on cheap booze and hookers. But seriously, I want my tv. Waiting to buy the elite 360 with the tv. Im so bored I want to play some games arg.

There's no need to panic. 81 series has been scheduled to come out in July and the last time I checked July is still ahead of us. Let's wait until the end of July before accusing Samsung of delaying these sets.

My guess is they will release an official press release about 81s on the day these tvs reach actual stores.

What's actually delayed is LG's LD LED LCD that had been announced for Q2. Now, what's up with that? To be fair, though, LG still has few days left to make the announcement. :)

True, a Best Buy employee claimed July 29 is the date in their computers.
I'm hoping they weren't lying.

True, a Best Buy employee claimed July 29 is the date in their computers.
I'm hoping they weren't lying.

that person lied. I've searched all over best buys RSS inventory system and there is no 81 sku to be found.

i just sold my laptop and xbox. Ive got money pouring out of me now. If I dont buy a TV soon, Im gonna blow all my money on cheap booze and hookers. But seriously, I want my tv. Waiting to buy the elite 360 with the tv. Im so bored I want to play some games arg.
Leave your money in the bank instead of your pocket. Then, you won't waste it on something cheap and sleazy... ;)

True, a Best Buy employee claimed July 29 is the date in their computers.
I'm hoping they weren't lying.

I love this thread. Now we have a date praytell.

Waiting outside the local BB to open on Sunday the 29th with a cup of Starbucks decaf, single-pump raspberry, white chocolate mocha is what this is all about.

Anyone else have any other purported dates?
:p

Leave your money in the bank instead of your pocket. Then, you won't waste it on something cheap and sleazy... ;)

". . . cheap and sleazy.." you must be talking about the elite 360.

I gave up and ordered the new Pioneer Pdp4280hd plasma... Its the best in its class and MUCH better than ANY Lcd out now... and the price is the same as a 40 inch XBR2

I just hope that this is the right choice and that the 81s... or whatever they will be called conan.... willl be too expensive or something. LOL

...otherwise ill be pretty dissapointed

I gave up and ordered the new Pioneer Pdp4280hd plasma... Its the best in its class and MUCH better than ANY Lcd out now... and the price is the same as a 40 inch XBR2

I just hope that this is the right choice and that the 81s... or whatever they will be called conan.... willl be too expensive or something. LOL

...otherwise ill be pretty dissapointed

Wrong choice. I made the same mistake but at least I was allowed to return the plasma. My Sony 34" HD XBR CRT is light years ahead the 4280 in black level department. LED LCD seems to be the only hope for crt like black levels. I hope that my CRT doesn't die before Samsung 81 release :(

^^^
I don't know if he made the wrong choice? Having owned CRT before plasma and before LCD, my experience is LCD is like scotch its an acquired taste. I prefer LCD over all techs out there now. I would never buy a plasma or CRT now. I like the look of LCD it looks real to me. When I look at TV's all LCD's look better to me.

Also I believe that these new LCD's will drop fast in price. In another thread I read where Samsung said there new plant should have 52" LCD's at 1000.00 buy the end of the year. If so it should drop the price of these also. How much?

Well... I will compare it to my 27 inch Sony Trinitron... But personally, I think as of RIGHT NOW it is the BEST choice (for anyone I think) and the Colors are Lightyears away from the XBR or the sharp even in some light.

But I did get it from Best Buy so I have 30 days No Questions Asked to Return the unit if I don't like it...

I gave up and ordered the new Pioneer Pdp4280hd plasma... Its the best in its class and MUCH better than ANY Lcd out now... and the price is the same as a 40 inch XBR2

I just hope that this is the right choice and that the 81s... or whatever they will be called conan.... willl be too expensive or something. LOL

...otherwise ill be pretty dissapointed

I'm considering this model too. 4 hdmi inputs! Samsung plays this same game every year, its getting goddamn ridiculous. last year its was the xx95 and then the xx96.

Wrong choice. I made the same mistake but at least I was allowed to return the plasma. My Sony 34" HD XBR CRT is light years ahead the 4280 in black level department. LED LCD seems to be the only hope for crt like black levels. I hope that my CRT doesn't die before Samsung 81 release :(

I am waiting for these same models to check out too. I am just waiting for a release date as well as a price. :)

I had the same impressions as you w/ the Pioneer Kuro models... if you're just talking about an all blank screen. I thought in really dark scenes the 5080 held up nicely against a Sony XBR.

I can't say that about many flat screen TVs... if ANY at all.

I am waiting for these same models to check out too. I am just waiting for a release date as well as a price. :)

I had the same impressions as you w/ the Pioneer Kuro models... if you're just talking about an all blank screen. I thought in really dark scenes the 5080 held up nicely against a Sony XBR.

I can't say that about many flat screen TVs... if ANY at all.

Well, the Pioneer definately has the BEST Black Levels of any Flat Panel out now, with less black crush than other sets that have black levels that come close.

I dont know about the 81 series, but at least I can say that at this time its true.

How's the Samsung LN-T4x6x panels hold up against today's top plasmas? Compared to plasmas a year or so back they definitely seem to hold their own as far as blacks go. Are the current crop of plasma's encroaching on CRT black levels?

Can I get an LED TV for a grand

^^^
I don't know if he made the wrong choice? Having owned CRT before plasma and before LCD, my experience is LCD is like scotch its an acquired taste. I prefer LCD over all techs out there now. I would never buy a plasma or CRT now. I like the look of LCD it looks real to me. When I look at TV's all LCD's look better to me.

Also I believe that these new LCD's will drop fast in price. In another thread I read where Samsung said there new plant should have 52" LCD's at 1000.00 buy the end of the year. If so it should drop the price of these also. How much?

The link (http://english.etnews.co.kr/news/detail.html?id=200706260007) in post #1215 says $1000 52" panels by the end of next year (2008, presumably).

I wonder if this is the price of the component, or the actual TV?

Regards,
Sejin Oh

I love this thread. Now we have a date praytell.

Waiting outside the local BB to open on Sunday the 29th with a cup of Starbucks decaf, single-pump raspberry, white chocolate mocha is what this is all about.

Anyone else have any other purported dates?
:p

That is a not a drink order i would be fast and loose about.

anyway, you might also not look so cool if you're camping out of best buy for a product that hasnt arrived yet (either because best buy doesnt always get things when they say they will, or the release date story is bogus and yet to be confirmed).

and btw, isnt the pioneer kuro stuff all just a pr page at the moment? someone has seen one?

uh.....Spincut you might want to get out more. The 8g Kuro Plasma are in stores right now.

uh.....Spincut you might want to get out more. The 8g Kuro Plasma are in stores right now.

http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/projectkuro/index.html

then why is there still a countdown going on on the kuro main page as if they are upcoming? And i figured since the current pioneer plasmas seem like they had been out for a while and i hadnt seen any kuro branding on them (which i figured was replacing their regular line), that pioneer kuro plasma televisions were still upcoming.

http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/projectkuro/index.html

then why is there still a countdown going on on the kuro main page as if they are upcoming? And i figured since the current pioneer plasmas seem like they had been out for a while and i hadnt seen any kuro branding on them (which i figured was replacing their regular line), that pioneer kuro plasma televisions were still upcoming.
The true countdown is to the 1080P versions though the 5080 is already out and owned by several members - the 1080P panels and the Elite versions will have the whole package. :)

Can I get an LED TV for a grand

In 2016

The true countdown is to the 1080P versions though the 5080 is already out and owned by several members - the 1080P panels and the Elite versions will have the whole package. :)

yeah so basically aside from the 5080 cominout early, it's a countdown for the kuro sets right? unless they started naming them kuro during the previous generation, or released lower performing kuros?