Samsung 81 Series anticipation thread

[spincut]

My understanding from reading previous articles is that it's going to be semi-gloss... not totally flat like the 61's, but not as glossy as the 65's.

i would definetly like to see a gloss comparison between the 65 and the new 81's (and 71's), and the between plasmas and stuff (which no one even did for the 65's as far as i can see) to see the differences.

[necrolop]

interesting, I could live with a Semi Gloss, I just went and gazed at the 65 for a while, glaass wasnt as bad as I thought but i could still see it being quite intrusive, half way is totally fine. You can tell since it doesnt diffuse light that it does provide a deeper black while in a dimmly lit enviroment, although I think the difference in a dark room would be less, although the releftions would still be present.

[DSET]

perhaps you guys should stop complaining about CR numbers, and cluster let downs before you ever even laid eyes on the set. This set will most liekly be the best looking tv on the market and all I hear is complaints about how it can be better. Well screw you. Go live in a cave for 10 years and when you come out, maybe then the technology will be available to satisfy you.

In the mean time, I think i will remain interested in the 71/81 series of LCDs.
I knew some1 would say it eventually
:D
thus the reason I was laughing at gte747e earlier

[mike123abc]

The limited number of clusters is probably more of a processing limitation. There is probably a huge computation problem to get this to work correctly without introducing all sorts of artifacts like glowing edges on bright objects, or the opposite dark edges. The entire area of the bright object probably has to be considered with the nearby darker areas to come up with a compromise that makes the bright as bright as possible while making the dark as dark as possible without having noticably dark/bright edges.

A compromise would be to have the backlight up behind a bright object, but the LCD closed more to even out with edges with the LCD being open more and backlight down so the closed areas next to the bright object do not glow.

This is a technology that can really be improved over time. Once they get "white" working they can do each color. Can have red up bright and green/blue dim in an area. Can have multiple shades of RGB to brighten/darken behind areas to give more accurate color rendering. The possibilities are endless here, this TV will probably look as bad as a 10 year old plasma in a few years by comparison to sets produced then.

[LaserEdge]

100,000:1 CR for the 81s would no doubt be the maximum CR the panel is capable. Just guessing they would have had to have 1 half of the panel 100% white and the other half 100% black to get that. The source material that we would show on these panels is going to be nothing like that.

We should be able to figure the minimum CR for the 81s from the 71s as they no doubt use the same LCD panel. Anyone have a idea what the native contrast ratio is of the 71s?

I am still looking forward to the 81s very much. As it should still be a big step forward in PQ. Shadow detail alone should make a huge leap forward on the 81s.

[westa6969]

I have laid eyes on it.. Though they hid any possible flaws by having out on a brightly lit show floor.
I am not concerned about Contrast Ratios, it will with no doubt be higher than any other LCD. But the artifacts that could be added are hard to explain away, especially when Samsung has decided to half ass it.
Half ass it? Please link us to a FULL ASS version you can buy instead of these pipedream Tradeshow B.S. that no one can buy and most could not afford. Bitching about improvements when they have ZERO competition in the marketplace and you call it half ass? Seems to be a half brain statement! :cool:

Please do list our other choices? Brightside dreamware? SED Vaporware? Where is this sheeite to be bought and enjoyed?

[yanks1927]

the problem that i'm seeing with this is the potential for inconsistent blacks across a single screen. if you have a mixture of light and dark, depending on how it falls across one of those clusters you could have a very gray looking black sitting next to a very black looking black.

[spincut]

The limited number of clusters is probably more of a processing limitation. There is probably a huge computation problem to get this to work correctly without introducing all sorts of artifacts like glowing edges on bright objects, or the opposite dark edges. The entire area of the bright object probably has to be considered with the nearby darker areas to come up with a compromise that makes the bright as bright as possible while making the dark as dark as possible without having noticably dark/bright edges.

A compromise would be to have the backlight up behind a bright object, but the LCD closed more to even out with edges with the LCD being open more and backlight down so the closed areas next to the bright object do not glow.

This is a technology that can really be improved over time. Once they get "white" working they can do each color. Can have red up bright and green/blue dim in an area. Can have multiple shades of RGB to brighten/darken behind areas to give more accurate color rendering. The possibilities are endless here, this TV will probably look as bad as a 10 year old plasma in a few years by comparison to sets produced then.

soooo, does that mean it wont look better than anything else out there? or will it still?

also, i read this in one of the articles, and i'm not sure i understand it (since most of the 120khz processing stuff has been discussed as it relates to the sony sets, and i dont know if this is the same thing, better, worse, or what).

"Like the 71 series, the 81 series models include 1080p resolution and a 120Hz frame rate using Samsung’s Auto Motion PlusLED technology. The Auto Motion Plus system is implemented “a little bit differently” than in the 71 series models, employing the LED quadrant scanning system, said Ali Atash, Samsung LCD senior marketing manager."

[necrolop]

Half ass it? Please link us to a FULL ASS version you can buy instead of these pipedream Tradeshow B.S. that no one can buy and most could not afford. Bitching about improvements when they have ZERO competition in the marketplace and you call it half ass? Seems to be a half brain statement! :cool:

Please do list our other choices? Brightside dreamware? SED Vaporware? Where is this sheeite to be bought and enjoyed?


haha, you are right. But I do think they could have done better. I dont beleive the processing power limitation theory. Im sure motion interpolation while scaling a 720p image to 1080p at the same time requires more power the light modulation, or atleast similar.

I am still going to buy one, but i dont have the confidence to get it sight unseen, godspeed to those who are so brave.

Im sorta thinking best Display using todays Tech would be a 480p black and white plasma with a 1080P LCd panel mounted onto it sitting on top of it

[LaserEdge]

the problem that i'm seeing with this is the potential for inconsistent blacks across a single screen. if you have a mixture of light and dark, depending on how it falls across one of those clusters you could have a very gray looking black sitting next to a very black looking black.

We will have to see. Displaying something like a star filled night sky or fire works at night would be a good test. Anything where there is high contrast in the source with black being the predominate color will do.

[studdad]

100,000:1 CR for the 81s would no doubt be the maximum CR the panel is capable. Just guessing they would have had to have 1 half of the panel 100% white and the other half 100% black to get that. The source material that we would show on these panels is going to be nothing like that.

We should be able to figure the minimum CR for the 81s from the 71s as they no doubt use the same LCD panel. Anyone have a idea what the native contrast ratio is of the 71s?

I am still looking forward to the 81s very much. As it should still be a big step forward in PQ. Shadow detail alone should make a huge leap forward on the 81s.

Dynamic on the 71 is 25K:1, so I would assume the native is 5k:1

[wtfer]

Dynamic on the 71 is 25K:1, so I would assume the native is 5k:1


The best TV on the market right now can offer a 3,500:1 static contrast? So I'd say the upgrade is pretty damn good.

[DSET]

The best TV on the market right now can offer a 3,500:1 static contrast? So I'd say the upgrade is pretty damn good.
are you talking about the 65F?

it has 3k1

[houseofg]

Am I missing it somewhere in this thread or has no one caught the Samsung announcement?

Hmm...I haven't posted 5 times yet, so it won't let me post the link at engadgethd...let's see...

engadgethd[dot]com/2007/07/11/samsung-announces-71-81-series-1080p-lcd-hdtvs/

[LaserEdge]

Well if the native contrast of the 71 is around 4,000:1 the 81 should make for a very nice display indeed. Will have to wait and see if it has processing artifacts and bugs.

[terminatorbob]

Am I missing it somewhere in this thread or has no one caught the Samsung announcement?

Hmm...I haven't posted 5 times yet, so it won't let me post the link at engadgethd...let's see...

engadgethd[dot]com/2007/07/11/samsung-announces-71-81-series-1080p-lcd-hdtvs/


Here ya go, I'll make that easier for everyone. :)

http://www.engadgethd.com/2007/07/11/samsung-announces-71-81-series-1080p-lcd-hdtvs/

[Andrew67]

Am I missing it somewhere in this thread or has no one caught the Samsung announcement?

Seriously, did you even skim the last 2 pages of this thread?

[studdad]

Apparently C-net has given us an 'idea' of a release date on these. I can't wait to see one!

http://crave.cnet.com/8301-1_105-9743599-1.html

The 81s that is. Man it's good to have engadget and all this stuff being announced woohoo.

Yup, we were right. It is the same shiny screen as the 65's (on both the 71 and 81). Identical, according to the article. With my situation, it wont make too much of a difference, but for others, it will.

[studdad]

Seriously, did you even skim the last 2 pages of this thread?

LMAO

[houseofg]

Seriously, did you even skim the last 2 pages of this thread?

Yikes, thought I had gone far back enough, but obviously not. Would have been pretty shocked if I had broken something among this crew!

[spincut]

Yup, we were right. It is the same shiny screen as the 65's (on both the 71 and 81). Identical, according to the article. With my situation, it wont make too much of a difference, but for others, it will.

yeah but another confirmation article stated they were an in between, nothing has really been proven yet it seems, as even cnet hasnt even reviewed them yet as they had stated.

[Tibba]

Still no official product page for these units from Samsung, thus no word whether or not they have a 1:1 pixel mapping mode. One would expect it on a set at this price point, but I want to see it on an official spec sheet before I believe it.

[vtms]

So now that we know what Samsung is up to, let's see what LG/Phillips is going to respond with. Their "local area luminance control" set was scheduled for Q2. Maybe they were waiting for Samsung to blink first with their pricing strategy.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=9687005&&#post9687005
Meanwhile, Dolby is probably busy licensing Brightside technology to the rest of the players.

[Andrew67]

So now that we know what Samsung is up to, let's see what LG/Phillips is going to respond with.
That's the first time that I've seen that picture and specs on the LG. What's up with the 10,000K temperature? Why aren't they shooting for 6500K? Odd.

[Rennject X]

I'm interested to see if both the 71 and 81 series come out of the box working great or if it will be a huge card swapping snafu like the 65 series. Who wants to buy a tv that needs to be repaired right away?

[obfinance]

I'm interested to see if both the 71 and 81 series come out of the box working great or if it will be a huge card swapping snafu like the 65 series. Who wants to buy a tv that needs to be repaired right away?


haha! Good point. I am almost expecting there to be some initial bumps with the release of the 81 series. But... We'll just have to keep our fingers crossed, I guess.

[mark_1080p]

Apparently C-net has given us an 'idea' of a release date on these. I can't wait to see one!

http://crave.cnet.com/8301-1_105-9743599-1.html

The 81s that is. Man it's good to have engadget and all this stuff being announced woohoo.
http://i.i.com.com/cnwk.1d/i/bto/20070712/LN-T71F_series_270x202.jpg

Holy Crap!!!
Pitiful design, butt friggin' ugly boxy pedestal, boxy fat bezel, dumbo ears.
This is a design disaster!!!!

100,000:1, who cares, wouldn't have that butt ugly crap anywhere near the home.

[gamelover360]

Dissapointment that the 81 series is lacking HDMI 1.3 and 120hz. I had heard that before, but that sucks.

I really wanted 120hz, hdmi 1.3, and LED backlight. Ah well. Looks like I'll be going with the 71. How bad can it be? :D

[DSET]

Dissapointment that the 81 series is lacking HDMI 1.3 and 120hz. I had heard that before, but that sucks.

I really wanted 120hz, hdmi 1.3, and LED backlight. Ah well. Looks like I'll be going with the 71. How bad can it be? :D


I dont think we know for sure that the 81 doesnt have hdmi 1.3
they didnt include it in the description
but it still might include it

the 65F didnt include it in the description at first but after it was posted on the sammy website it did

I highly doubt this set will even gain much out of the 120hz feature.

Hopefully we get some 71 vs 81 reviews in early august :)

[midway]

Though the first few reports aren't completely specific it would be very odd for the 81 series to not have HDMI 1.3 as it is a step up from the 71 series, and its LEDs should allow for a color gamut which is greater than 100 percent of the NTSC colorspace into the xvYCC range. Also, it does have 120hz:

http://www.twice.com/article/CA6459449.html

[CadJoe]

Dissapointment that the 81 series is lacking HDMI 1.3 and 120hz. \

Where do you see that 81 doesn't have 120hz ??

crave page shows this 81 same specs as 71....

" Aside from the LED backlight, the LN-T81F series is pretty much identical to the 71F series in terms of specs and includes the same shiny screen "


CadJoe

[studdad]

Still no official product page for these units from Samsung, thus no word whether or not they have a 1:1 pixel mapping mode. One would expect it on a set at this price point, but I want to see it on an official spec sheet before I believe it.

The 65's have it, so I am sure this does too (the 71). It is called Just Scan.

[studdad]

Where do you see that 81 doesn't have 120hz ??

crave page shows this 81 same specs as 71....

" Aside from the LED backlight, the LN-T81F series is pretty much identical to the 71F series in terms of specs and includes the same shiny screen "


CadJoe

Well,,,,,much bigger contrast ratio of course.

[DSET]

http://www.twice.com/article/CA6459449.html


never read that article yet

Nice Find! :cool:

[studdad]

I'm interested to see if both the 71 and 81 series come out of the box working great or if it will be a huge card swapping snafu like the 65 series. Who wants to buy a tv that needs to be repaired right away?

Well, the HDMI 1.3 problems with the 65 series have pretty much been resolved, so I don't see that problem with the 71. If the 71 is pretty much the same set with higher CR and 120hz, then it should be pretty solid,,,,,unless they have problems with something related to the 120hz. The 81 is a whole other animal. I would not be surprised to see several problems that need to be ironed out with the new technology, but that is probably part of the reason for the limited release.

[DSET]

http://i.i.com.com/cnwk.1d/i/bto/20070712/LN-T71F_series_270x202.jpg

Holy Crap!!!
Pitiful design, butt friggin' ugly boxy pedestal, boxy fat bezel, dumbo ears.
This is a design disaster!!!!

100,000:1, who cares, wouldn't have that butt ugly crap anywhere near the home.


Man i left this forum for a couple ,months
fast forward to now
you have 1k posts more
and are twice as negative as you were before

I can understand you not wanting this set becuz of the reflective screen
not everyone can control the light situation in their rooms

but how can you not buy a set because its got an average deisgn
its pretty basic design not as good as it could be
but
its not like the frame is pink with happy faces on it
even if it did who the hell cares as long as it produces an amazing image

I cant understand people who spend 5k on a tv becuz its got a better design than the 4k model with not as good quality
for freak sakes its a frame

[Shinraven]

im glad the prices are within the 4k-5k range. now i wont have to rob a bank.

As for release, if within a month of 2, great !!! I am happy with my pioneer 5071, my house renovations wont be completed till winter, so no I wont be jumping on first batch of 81s.

im feeling the sammy 81 cuz its...straight, not curved. I cant wait to see this baby on my wall this winter, cuz by then the bugs will be ironed out or hell version 2 hehe.

I cant wait to see these sets in person.

[CadJoe]

Well,,,,,much bigger contrast ratio of course.
The 81 does have 120hz.

" Like the 71 series, the 81 series models include 1080p resolution and a 120Hz frame rate using Samsung’s Auto Motion PlusLED technology "

http://www.twice.com/article/CA6459449.html

Don't know about version 1.3 on the HDMI though.

[Roger Huston]

From the link dogmandoo posted:

"Other features include Samsung’s Super Clear Panel technology"

Arrgh! This is the glossy screen, just like the 5265! Is this a deal killer for anyone else but me? Even with dim room lighting, you'll see reflections in dark scenes, especially if you wear light colored clothing. For some people this may be OK, it's just like existing Plasma/CRT reflections, but I think one big advantage of non-glossy LCD's is the diffusion of reflections.

It looks like my only hope is the Sony XBR4/5, also a Samsung panel, and hopefully not glossy like the Samsung branded ones.

-Joe


Crap, I just came into some money and am finally looking into getting a good set. The 81 series seemed to be perfect, but with that glossy front, there is no way I can use that. I have 25' of glass on the left side of the room and an LCD TV seemed to be the answer as everything else reflects.

Now what? Are the new Sony's non glossy? What about the new LG models that I read about that also have similar technology?

- Roger

PS. I am also considering getting the Yamaha YSP-1100 (http://www.yamaha.com/yec/YSP1/idx_ysp1100.htm) does anyone have any experience with one of those? Can anyone point me to the proper thread?

[Cougar24]

Man i left this forum for a couple ,months
fast forward to now
you have 1k posts more
and are twice as negative as you were before

I can understand you not wanting this set becuz of the reflective screen
not everyone can control the light situation in their rooms

but how can you not buy a set because its got an average deisgn
its pretty basic design not as good as it could be
but
its not like the frame is pink with happy faces on it
even if it did who the hell cares as long as it produces an amazing image

I cant understand people who spend 5k on a tv becuz its got a better design than the 4k model with not as good quality
for freak sakes its a frame

Totally agree. Very stupid for a person to not buy a TV that boasts these kinds of spec.s because of a simple design. I'm not paying $4,000+ to have a nice sleek piece of plastic; I'm buying this for Picture Quality. For all I care, the frame could be in the shape of an ass, as long as it gives me the picture that this one promises.

If you aren't interested in this TV, then don't bother coming here posting your useless comments.

[Welshdog]

It was 40K because of the R&D, and the fact that it was not production model. Im sure samsung could impliment more than 60 clusters at not much more cost per unit.
Have you checked the price of a single RGB LED? Some cost several dollars each. So we can assume that Samsung gets them cheaper, but how much? Let's say they get them for fiddy cents each times 1400 = $700! That is just the raw cost of the LED. What about assembly, controller chips, R&D, licensing etc. There is no way a screen with 1400 or even 400 LEDs in it could be affordable. 60 to 70 seems about right for the price premium we are seeing here.

[Googlefan]

For local dimming display it is pretty much impossible to state an effective CR.
All dynamic sources will have an actual visible CR that is much lower than the possible maximum. The worst case scenario (all LED clusters are at their peak value) would have an effective CR of whatever LCD glass panel itself has. The visible CR is constantly moving in between the minimum and the maximum as the source changes. Simply put the CR on the 81s is a moving target that is based on the very source material that you input into the panel itself. If the source is high contrast the panel will likely be operating close to its maximum CR.

So you really need to state a minimum CR and a maximum CR as just 1 CR figure for a local dimming display is completely useless.


That reasoning seems to apply for all sets (also non- local dimming sets), not? If the source doesn't have pictures that go beyond the CR of the tv set then you can't measure CR ....

[Googlefan]

Still no official product page for these units from Samsung, thus no word whether or not they have a 1:1 pixel mapping mode. One would expect it on a set at this price point, but I want to see it on an official spec sheet before I believe it.


I would also like to know whether the 81 has 1/1 pixel mapping. Another question I have is about 1/1 mapping and 120HZ, can you have 1/1 mapping when 120HZ is activated? I guess when you activate 120HZ, you probably do some processing too but then you loose the 1/1 mapping capability ...

[Raitzi]

I would also like to know whether the 81 has 1/1 pixel mapping. Another question I have is about 1/1 mapping and 120HZ, can you have 1/1 mapping when 120HZ is activated? I guess when you activate 120HZ, you probably do some processing too but then you loose the 1/1 mapping capability ...

If you mean by 1:1 as show all and only pixels found on source material , as 120Hz creates half of frames by processing it's clearly not 1:1. But if source is 24Hz and panel makes it 120Hz by 5:5 , 1:1 can be enabled.

[Googlefan]

If you mean by 1:1 as show all and only pixels found on source material , as 120Hz creates half of frames by processing it's clearly not 1:1. But if source is 24Hz and panel makes it 120Hz by 5:5 , 1:1 can be enabled.


Is that a theoretical answer or the way Samsung has it implemented?

[JoeSony]

Crap, I just came into some money and am finally looking into getting a good set. The 81 series seemed to be perfect, but with that glossy front, there is no way I can use that. I have 25' of glass on the left side of the room and an LCD TV seemed to be the answer as everything else reflects.

Now what? Are the new Sony's non glossy? What about the new LG models that I read about that also have similar technology?

- Roger

PS. I am also considering getting the Yamaha YSP-1100 (http://www.yamaha.com/yec/YSP1/idx_ysp1100.htm) does anyone have any experience with one of those? Can anyone point me to the proper thread?

It looks to be a matte or semi-gloss finish not unlike the Sony XBRs 4 & 5.

[Cynn]

I thought the 81's were going to have LED pulse of some type to get rid of all motion blur. Now they are saying it just does the 120hz for that?

Can anyone explain if the 81 with LED will remove motion blur beyond what a standard LCD running at 120hz can?

[Raitzi]

Is that a theoretical answer or the way Samsung has it implemented?

Theoretical. We don't know wheter it does 5:5 for 24Hz material. But as for screen area i don't think over/underscan will be any different with 120Hz.(it just doesn't make any sense)

[Shinraven]

Is that a theoretical answer or the way Samsung has it implemented?

im def interested in this too, cuz i plan on pluging my PC to it at 1920x1080 @ 60hz, so how will this work.any confirmation that this set can handle 1:1 mapping :p

[rwells2]

I thought the 81's were going to have LED pulse of some type to get rid of all motion blur. Now they are saying it just does the 120hz for that?

Can anyone explain if the 81 with LED will remove motion blur beyond what a standard LCD running at 120hz can?

thats what i want to know too...

[Shinraven]

Am I the only one who's fapin over the 81 series. OMG im fired up!!! :eek:

[phigment]

Have you checked the price of a single RGB LED? Some cost several dollars each. So we can assume that Samsung gets them cheaper, but how much? Let's say they get them for fiddy cents each times 1400 = $700! That is just the raw cost of the LED. What about assembly, controller chips, R&D, licensing etc. There is no way a screen with 1400 or even 400 LEDs in it could be affordable. 60 to 70 seems about right for the price premium we are seeing here.

The unit doesn't have 60 to 70 LEDs, it has 60-70 CLUSTERS. That means each cluser will be about 10cm square (or bigger) and contain multiple RGB LEDs. And I'm sure they get the LEDs much cheaper than $0.50 each. $0.05 would make more sense, but that is just pure speculation.

[Flash01]

Am I the only one who's fapin over the 81 series. OMG im fired up!!! :eek:

Heck we kept this thread alive when all we had to chew on was folks doubting this set was even going to exist! Not many folks predicted this set to be within buying range (hehe glad to say I was one of the lucky ones predicting it would be).

There's a bunch of us excited. Guess we easily fall into doubt because we don't want to set ourselves for disappointment. Kinda like how a movie is better if it exceeds your expectations you had walking in the theater...

Caution must be exercised but this was a samsung event, people (know Engadget folks were there) saw the TV running demos. Sure there will be downfalls but predicting we'll see reflections from the moon or football sized dimming regions popping out of the screen may be overreacting.

In the meantime, I still enjoy this technical discussion about what this TV may or may not do, just so you guys don't think I'm bashing y'all for speculating in this thread (which is what it is for!).

[Idjiit]

http://i.i.com.com/cnwk.1d/i/bto/20070712/LN-T71F_series_270x202.jpg

Holy Crap!!!
Pitiful design, butt friggin' ugly boxy pedestal, boxy fat bezel, dumbo ears.
This is a design disaster!!!!

100,000:1, who cares, wouldn't have that butt ugly crap anywhere near the home.

It could be pink with silver stars on it - I will still buy it if it lives up to the hype from an image quality standpoint.

[trendscape]

For all I care, the frame could be in the shape of an ass, as long as it gives me the picture that this one promises.
Well, I don't know if I would go that far! :D

[Flash01]

I cant understand people who spend 5k on a tv becuz its got a better design than the 4k model with not as good quality
for freak sakes its a frame

Maybe this wider frame is required by the LD electronics? I can only relate to the LED drivers I use but when you factor in the coils required they can chew some real estate. :) Plus they can get quite hot depending on the voltage applied/numbers of LED Driven.

I dunno... Heck I don't think it looks that bad. Its not a great design but its alright.

[taurus2007]

Heck we kept this thread alive when all we had to chew on was folks doubting this set was even going to exist!

I wonder where that dude is (we are not going to name names around here) since he went on for a while about how we wereso lame for believing there was such a thing called 71/81 panels... :rolleyes:

[z_toth]

I wonder where that dude is (we are not going to name names around here) since he went on for a while about how we wereso lame for believing there was such a thing called 71/81 panels... :rolleyes:

Ill name a name: that was Conan ... :) Im getting the feeling that Anticipation threads are a breeding ground for negativity as people like Conan were accusing everyone of perpetuating wild rumours of the 81 series "vapourware", now that we have the information we are bashing the cosmetics, the fact that "Samsung could do better", etc etc ... no offence to anyone here but I look forward to the set being released, hearing some positive reviews and than buying this set and getting away from all this negativity.

In the meantime here are some solutions for those with problems with the 81 series:

Too Wide:
- Use a saw and cut off the extra width, make sure to get an extended warranty and say a wood pecker flew in and did that.
- Go look at a Sony XBR2/3 and see how wide wide is
- OR you can get another HDTV

Styling is Ugly or too Boxy
- Again take out your chisel and sand paper and make some nice curves around it, or in the unfortunate circumstance it doesnt come in the shape of an ASS you can form it into the shape of an ASS
- Take out all the circuitry and install it into the frame of your choice; into a old gutted silver Panasonic Frame and see what happens.
- Get your kids to paint the frame and doodle over the frame to 'pretty' it up
- OR you can get another HDTV

Samsung could have improved the PQ / Number of LED
- Break into Samsung's R&D labs and steal next years model
- Call up Samsung and tell them to make a custom HDTV for you, money is not a limitation
-Make your own perfect HDTV in the basement of your home from parts fr your refrigerator, lawn mower, old computer CRT and a package of gum
- OR you can get another HDTV

Thats enough for now. Im sure you guys get the point that if your not happy with the set than there are many other manufacturs ready to take your money. I for one would be happy for you to have another TV as the 81 series will be in limited supply and I want my 46 or 52 inch set, my 5 grand is already saevd up and ready to be spent so just waiting for its release.

This is a time to celebrate not be a bunch a spoiled brats.

Zsolt

[Riverside_Guy]

From the link dogmandoo posted:

"Other features include Samsung’s Super Clear Panel technology"

Arrgh! This is the glossy screen, just like the 5265! Is this a deal killer for anyone else but me? Even with dim room lighting, you'll see reflections in dark scenes, especially if you wear light colored clothing. For some people this may be OK, it's just like existing Plasma/CRT reflections, but I think one big advantage of non-glossy LCD's is the diffusion of reflections.

It looks like my only hope is the Sony XBR4/5, also a Samsung panel, and hopefully not glossy like the Samsung branded ones.

-Joe

Glossy screen would also be a deal killer for me.

[Riverside_Guy]

Have you checked the price of a single RGB LED? Some cost several dollars each. So we can assume that Samsung gets them cheaper, but how much? Let's say they get them for fiddy cents each times 1400 = $700! That is just the raw cost of the LED. What about assembly, controller chips, R&D, licensing etc. There is no way a screen with 1400 or even 400 LEDs in it could be affordable. 60 to 70 seems about right for the price premium we are seeing here.

Most CCFL backlit LCDs have close to/over 50% of their cost in the backlighting system.

[007craft]

Totally agree. Very stupid for a person to not buy a TV that boasts these kinds of spec.s because of a simple design. I'm not paying $4,000+ to have a nice sleek piece of plastic; I'm buying this for Picture Quality. For all I care, the frame could be in the shape of an ass, as long as it gives me the picture that this one promises.

If you aren't interested in this TV, then don't bother coming here posting your useless comments.

Although I agree it should be about the picture, You guys dont know the average consumer. As some1 who sold big screen HDTVs for over a year (just last year), I know first hand that 90% of customers, care more about the physical appearance of a tv then the quality. To many people, they see these tvs and there are no scale of 1/10 for quality. There is only looks good and looks bad. Once they narrow it down to several looks good sets within their budget, they almost ALWAYS go for the tv that looks better for them. I try to explain to the customers that its the picture that matters most, but these people are stupid. They go for the TV that looks the best on the outside.

Why do you think the 71/81 series are still super glossy like the 65 series? You think samsung cares about the few thousand or so people posting on the net saying "not buying cause its glossy". Cause the majority of customers who purchase their sets, are those who know nothing about sites like this. They walk into a store and rely on a salesman to explain to them whats what. These customer will see the 65 gloss series over the 61 and love it.

I too wish that the television companies catered more towards us AVS type people, but ultimately it does not. In fact, the 81 series is talored heavily towards us, and look, its limited release. Samsung know that these sets will be nowhere near as popular as the 61/65/71 series. The average consumer doesnt know the difference between LED and CCFL and they are not going to pay a difference between the two.

[conan48]

........................still don't see any official announcement from Samsung? nor have they announced a date. Next month is a little over a couple of weeks.

BTW. I love the glossy screen. The screen is not glossy just to be glossy. It's a special film that they have been using on Laptop and some PC monitors (currently typing on a glossy LCD) for years. It dramatically improves black levels, and colours. Gives the image more pop like a good plasma can and more depth to the image.

All you crying about glossy screens are being little babies. If your so into Home Theater that you are willing to buy the best and latest, then why can't you get some freaking black out drapes or some decent curtains? I LOVE glossy! It gives an LCD an MUCH better picture. Id rather have a reflective screen then a dull matte screen anyday. So anyone you can't stand the gloss should leave this thread ASAP and never come back. Samsung realizes that they will lose some sales by doing this, but they also know that they will be gaining much more sales when people see how much better the glossy screens look.

[JoeSony]

Although I agree it should be about the picture, You guys dont know the average consumer. As some1 who sold big screen HDTVs for over a year (just last year), I know first hand that 90% of customers, care more about the physical appearance of a tv then the quality. To many people, they see these tvs and there are no scale of 1/10 for quality. There is only looks good and looks bad. Once they narrow it down to several looks good sets within their budget, they almost ALWAYS go for the tv that looks better for them. I try to explain to the customers that its the picture that matters most, but these people are stupid. They go for the TV that looks the best on the outside.

Why do you think the 71/81 series are still super glossy like the 65 series? You think samsung cares about the few thousand or so people posting on the net saying "not buying cause its glossy". Cause the majority of customers who purchase their sets, are those who know nothing about sites like this. They walk into a store and rely on a salesman to explain to them whats what. These customer will see the 65 gloss series over the 61 and love it.

I too wish that the television companies catered more towards us AVS type people, but ultimately it does not. In fact, the 81 series is talored heavily towards us, and look, its limited release. Samsung know that these sets will be nowhere near as popular as the 61/65/71 series. The average consumer doesnt know the difference between LED and CCFL and they are not going to pay a difference between the two.

I'm confused are you talking about the frame on the 81 series, because from the photos I've seen it doesn't look glossy but a matte black color shade.

[phigment]

I'm confused are you talking about the frame on the 81 series, because from the photos I've seen it doesn't look glossy but a matte black color shade.
Which pictures are those? The computer generated ones on Engadget (http://www.engadget.com/2007/07/11/samsung-announces-71-81-series-1080p-lcd-hdtvs/) ? Or the ones on Gizmodo (http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/field-notes/hands-on-with-samsungs-newest-tv-tech-wi+fi-plasma-led+backlight-lcd-and-120hz-blur-reduction-277438.php) where you can see a shiny part being reflected in the top left?

[JoeSony]

Which pictures are those? The computer generated ones on Engadget (http://www.engadget.com/2007/07/11/samsung-announces-71-81-series-1080p-lcd-hdtvs/) ? Or the ones on Gizmodo (http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/field-notes/hands-on-with-samsungs-newest-tv-tech-wi+fi-plasma-led+backlight-lcd-and-120hz-blur-reduction-277438.php) where you can see a shiny part being reflected in the top left?


The shiny glare in Gizmodo photo could be the side speaker, the frame in that photo doesn't appear glossy to me.

[z_toth]

I'm confused are you talking about the frame on the 81 series, because from the photos I've seen it doesn't look glossy but a matte black color shade.

I believe people are speaking about the super clear panel glass, such that it becomes reflective in some instances ... the 61 series has a matte finish on the panel and prevent reflection but depresses the contratst ratio somewhat.

I personally like the glossy glass as I have a darker room.

Zsolt

[CadJoe]

BTW. I love the glossy screen. The screen is not glossy just to be glossy. It's a special film that they have been using on Laptop and some PC monitors (currently typing on a glossy LCD) for years.

Yeah, and it SUCKS on the laptop screens too. Acer is putting it on all their laptops now, and I won't ever buy another acer because of it.

Try using a laptop outside or in your vehicle with the GLOSSY screen. Its impossible to even see the screen. Not to mention all the glare from flourescent lights in the office.

CadJoe

[bpt8056]

I believe people are speaking about the super clear panel glass, such that it becomes reflective in some instances ... the 61 series has a matte finish on the panel and prevent reflection but depresses the contratst ratio somewhat.

I personally like the glossy glass as I have a darker room.

Zsolt

After comparing the 61 and the 65, I much prefer the glossy screen as well. I personally have a Dell Laptop with TrueLife display and I must say that it makes the display more vibrant, contrast, and life-like images over its matte counterpart. I saw the same result between the 61 and 65. To each his/her own, I guess.

[Andrew67]

I try to explain to the customers that its the picture that matters most, but these people are stupid. They go for the TV that looks the best on the outside.

So people are stupid because they value different features in a TV than the features you deem important?

[spincut]

i still want to know the difference between the Samsung 120khz and the Sony 120khz and its motionflow feature.

[WaldorfSalad]

Nitpick: Its 120Hz not 120khz. :)
Don't really know the differences. Sony claims black frame insertion in their MotionFlow. Not sure about Samsung.

[phigment]

So from this pic is the reflection from the lights look like it has a glossy screen?

Coopertwist, where did you get that shot of the TV with camera flare glaring off the screen? I couldn't find it on any of the linked sites.

[necrolop]

Nitpick: Its 120Hz not 120khz. :)
Don't really know the differences. Sony claims black frame insertion in their MotionFlow. Not sure about Samsung.

Blackframe insertion sounds like a surefire way to get flicker, not sure why this is a good idea. Also I want to know if they both can do 5:5 pullup, and especially from a 1080i telecine source.

[Free]

Guy's, I am planning on putting one of these in an RV, and it has to stand up to a fair amount of bumps, since the RV is a 4x4. Does anyone think that this particular technology would be more, or less likely to suffer from vibrations than conventional LCD?

[wtfer]

Glossy screen would also be a deal killer for me.


BAH
Go to any big box store & take a look at the Samsung 65 series on display, the reflection is NO WHERE NEAR THAT OF A PLASMA!

The only time you really see any reflections is when the screen is all black & even then you only see a blacked out outline & not a mirror like reflections.

Seriously, the new glossy screens are NOT bad. Even the plasma with the best anti-coating screen is 100 times more reflective than the glossy 65 series screen.

[seagrass]

As much as I am excited about this set, I have to agree that the frame, in my opinion, is way too wide. I'm disappointed as I have been holding off buying a set because I couldn't stand the wide bezel on my old 46XBR2. The 65 series is too wide with it's side speakers. I was hoping Samsung would stay in the styling vein of say the 4066F. Not a deal breaker, just a letdown.

[BigMacK1311]

I read the article at engadget,

[HDTV_ME]

YES! Kudos to everyone looking to jump on the 81 band wagon, I'm glad it's finally been announced for release and priced well. I'm a whimp and couldn't take the leap to such a new tech, bt its sounds super promising, I hope it works as well as it sounds. But the 71 series was also announced and that's been the only thing keeping me from jumping in...if it pans out well I'm sold. Otherwise I'll be satisfied with the 65 which will likely be lowered. Wouldn't be a bad thing. I think the design is a little confusing too, but hell it's not bad and it's the best TV to hit the market this year. Glad the wait is over!

[BigMacK1311]

and thought

[BigMacK1311]

that since Samsung "announced" the 71/81,

[BigMacK1311]

I could read the press release on their site.

[BigMacK1311]

Couldn't find it, but I did find

[BigMacK1311]

THIS (http://www.samsung.com/us/aboutsamsung/news/newsRead.do?newstype=productnews&newsctgry=&newssubctgry=&news_seq=3706&page=1&rdoPeriod=ALL&from_dt=&to_dt=&search_category=10102&search_keyword=) 500,000:1 contrast on a 70 inch screen! Might have to take out a Home-Equity loan for this baby.

(sorry, couldn't link until post #6...)

[dwilli57]

I agree. i want to see how it performs but i wish it looked more like the 65.

[spincut]

BAH
Go to any big box store & take a look at the Samsung 65 series on display, the reflection is NO WHERE NEAR THAT OF A PLASMA!

The only time you really see any reflections is when the screen is all black & even then you only see a blacked out outline & not a mirror like reflections.

Seriously, the new glossy screens are NOT bad. Even the plasma with the best anti-coating screen is 100 times more reflective than the glossy 65 series screen.

You know, i beleived that at first, but on the cnet review it said it was even WORSE than plasma i think, and thats a bold statement to make all things considered.

I think it was said actually that the upcoming ones would improve screen reflectivity to be somewehre between matte and the current ones out, so there's always hope they'll get it right this time.

[HDTV_ME]

I think it was said actually that the upcoming ones would improve screen reflectivity to be somewehre between matte and the current ones out, so there's always hope they'll get it right this time.

They didn't get it wrong, it was "glossy" because it lacked an anti-glare coating which enabled the higher contrast ratio, which is the difference between the 61 and 65. Whether they can find a work around that maintains that quality without having the screen suffer the effects of glare remains to be seen.

[mark_1080p]

BAH
Go to any big box store & take a look at the Samsung 65 series on display, the reflection is NO WHERE NEAR THAT OF A PLASMA!This is contrary to pictures posted in the original 65 series thread, if you followed it, is contrary to my personal experience viewing in stores, these sets are very reflective, not as much as some plasmas, more than some.

What's all this whining on this board about people posting negative comments? You guys want a bunch of girlyman yes-men to say nothing but good things about these sets just because of the hype? What is with all the defensiveness about a piece of electronics? You'd think people were hurling personal insults. I for one have learned most about discussions concerning the deficiencies of TV sets, since it is the discerning viewer that looks for them in all the detailed analysis that goes into viewing a TV screen.

There is alot to be negative about given current LCD offerings and given the potential for outstanding offerings with current improved panels. We have clouding, banding, no CableCARD, uninspired design (the 61 series is an exception, read the CNET review), gloss. Most people are not cave dwellers, matte finish please. Samsung just can't do it and match Sharp's numbers, so they resort to this glossy gimmick to please the "this is a sexy TV" crowd.

Yes picture quality is number 1, but I actually consider the picture of the 61 series superior to the 65 series. Ordinarily, one can live with styling deficiencies, but if those pictures are any indication, this a a major deficiency.

[Chris NYC]

I have the 4665 with a 10x8 foot window facing east 90 degrees and five feet from the TV and the glare is a non-issue for me. Thirty-something years of staring at a glass CRT, it's normal that televisions have glossy screens.

[JoeSony]

I guess everyone needs to wait until these sets are released or test reviews are posted to answer some of these questions.

[conan48]

Well.....We can all agree that the glossy screen has the better picture right? Ive never heard anyone say that he/she thought the 61 looked better then the 65. For us hardcore enthusiasts with light control, the news of a glossy screen is very positive indeed. I wouldn't be surprised at all to find out the sony xbr4 & 5 will also have a glossy screen as early reports suggest a contrast ratio of between 15 to 20 thousand. The only way to get a contrast that high is with a dynamic backlight and glossy screen. Ive been hoping for glossy LCD TVs for years now and Im happy that Samsung took the plunge. When I switched my LCD monitor 2 years ago for a glossy one, I couldn't believe how much better it looked then the matte. Always wondered why no TV did the same and now Samsung has answered the call of the gloss.

BTW, people should be used to gloss by now. What the hell were people watching for the last 100 years!! GLOSSY CRT. Never heard anyone complain back in the day about reflections. Get used to it, reflections are back people.

VIVA LA GLOSS!!!

[Jon Schindler]

........................still don't see any official announcement from Samsung? nor have they announced a date. Next month is a little over a couple of weeks.

BTW. I love the glossy screen. The screen is not glossy just to be glossy. It's a special film that they have been using on Laptop and some PC monitors (currently typing on a glossy LCD) for years. It dramatically improves black levels, and colours. Gives the image more pop like a good plasma can and more depth to the image.

All you crying about glossy screens are being little babies. If your so into Home Theater that you are willing to buy the best and latest, then why can't you get some freaking black out drapes or some decent curtains? I LOVE glossy! It gives an LCD an MUCH better picture. Id rather have a reflective screen then a dull matte screen anyday. So anyone you can't stand the gloss should leave this thread ASAP and never come back. Samsung realizes that they will lose some sales by doing this, but they also know that they will be gaining much more sales when people see how much better the glossy screens look.

I agree, when I first read about the 65 series, I too was caught up in the hysterics over the glossy screen. Then I turned on my brain, looked at my 36 inch panasonic flatscreen CRT hdtv, and realized that it's screen is reflective too, as is any CRT. Then I looked at my laptop, and realized that it's screen is reflective too. And, to keep things in perspective, just about everyone agrees that CRT's produce the best picture quality. So I though to myself, if I've been watching a reflective CRT all these years, why should a reflective LCD bother me? I believe most of the whining about glossiness in this forum is caused more by the over-anxious, anal retentive nature of the average home theater nut than it is by any real issues with the set. It seems to be par for the course in just about every home theater site I've been to. I understand since I'm a bit obsessive myself, but at least I'm realizing that quite a bit of it is in my head. That's my 2 cents.

[obfinance]

I, for one, am quite happy with the possibilities of the glossy screen in order to gain on the greater depth it affords the overall picture. And yes, we have lived with glossy crt's in the past.

But, to the defense of those complaining about the glossy screens, I think that the issue is relevant as screen sizes have also increased. Prior to plasmas, lcd's and the such, the average consumer lived with a 32" or 36" crt on the larger end just fine. But now we're seeing screens in the 42, 50, 60 inch ranges and that tends to provide more surface area with a potential to reflect light. Just my 2 pesos.

[bilmar]

If a glossy screen adds 5000 to CR then I for one would be willing to suffer with a lesser CR of ONLY 90,000 -95,000 :1 on an 81 series if it meant fewer reflections!

Bill

[coopertwist]

phigment

on engadget...but they took the article down.....i cant find it...it was something like samsungs christmas in july party.

[007craft]

I just stopped by futureshop today and saw a 5265f for the first time. I have been waiting for the 71/81 so i never bothered to check it out. I wanted to see how bad this reflection was. Wow. Its not bad at all. It was placed right next to a sharp lcd and pioneer plasma. The sharp had less to no glare ont he screen, but the blacks on the sharp were crap compared to the 65f. The plasma had even blacker blacks then the samsung lcd, but not as big a difference as the samsung and the sharp (the sharp was terrible). The glare on the plasma was horrible. But the samsung was not bad at all. Especially for a room like mine, it wouldent be a problem.

These 71/81 series tvs are serious bussiness. If you have direct light hitting your tv, shame on you. What kind of crappy home theater is that? If your not going to do it properly, and use a dark space with little to no light, then go buy a 61f tv and leave the 71/81 to the professional HDTV viewers. I would be more concerend about buying curtains and making my home theater room decor look better and create a better atmosphere. So many times I visit friends houses who all have great tvs, but looks like crap in their living room or in some corner in some bright room. bah. Tvs like this deserve dedication.

[mark_1080p]

Well.....We can all agree that the glossy screen has the better picture right? Ive never heard anyone say that he/she thought the 61 looked better then the 65.

Absolutely wrong. In moderate or bright light the 61 is far superior IMO. Read the CNET review of the 4661, 61 has superior pic unless light controlled environment.

For us hardcore enthusiasts with light control, the news of a glossy screen is very positive indeed. I wouldn't be surprised at all to find out the sony xbr4 & 5 will also have a glossy screen as early reports suggest a contrast ratio of between 15 to 20 thousand. The only way to get a contrast that high is with a dynamic backlight and glossy screen.

Wrong again. Not the only way. Sharp does it without any gimmicks.
Yeah, you said it yourself, hardcore, your adjective, i.e. dark room.
Again, some of us do not like cave dwelling.

Ive been hoping for glossy LCD TVs for years now and Im happy that Samsung took the plunge. When I switched my LCD monitor 2 years ago for a glossy one, I couldn't believe how much better it looked then the matte. Always wondered why no TV did the same and now Samsung has answered the call of the gloss.

It's a plunge all right. Good for cave dwellers, yes. Good for those in denial that reflections even exist. Good for those that miss their old CRT crap tv. Not good for those who like some light and do not want to view themselves or their room on the screen.

BTW, people should be used to gloss by now. What the hell were people watching for the last 100 years!! GLOSSY CRT. Never heard anyone complain back in the day about reflections. Get used to it, reflections are back people.

Gloss is not back on any other brand, and may just be a passing Samsung gimmick. Anybody comparing CRT with these large screens is ignoring the differences. Old TV's were much smaller and sometimes curved. These panels are large and flat. Big difference in form factor. Big difference in reflection effect on viewing. Also, many LCD buyers have had LCD for a few years now and are used to matte, not CRT, and are not interested in plasma because of burn-in on 4:3 and gloss. Many people DO NOT WANT a plasma TV without the burn in problem (i.e. a glossy LCD).

[mark_1080p]

but the blacks on the sharp were crap compared to the 65f. ... The glare on the plasma was horrible. But the samsung was not bad at all.
The Sharp you saw was not properly set up. Blacks on the d92 are outstanding and no black crush.

If you have direct light hitting your tv, shame on you. What kind of crappy home theater is that? If your not going to do it properly, and use a dark space with little to no light, then go buy a 61f tv and leave the 71/81 to the professional HDTV viewers.
Ridiculous. The 65 series is a joke for home theater. For home theater, go to the projector section and 100" screens. This is not a home theater section by any stretch.

I would be more concerend about buying curtains and making my home theater room decor look better and create a better atmosphere. So many times I visit friends houses who all have great tvs, but looks like crap in their living room or in some corner in some bright room. bah. Tvs like this deserve dedication.
Sorry but the typical person is not going to modify their home to accomodate a TV, turn a room into a black hole. Sure if you have a home theater, get a projector and turn down the lights. Now perhaps with a 65" Sharp you could begin to call it a home theater, but who ever heard of a 52" home theater screen?

[obfinance]

If a glossy screen adds 5000 to CR then I for one would be willing to suffer with a lesser CR of ONLY 90,000 -95,000 :1 on an 81 series if it meant fewer reflections!

Bill

good point. ;)

[xb1032]

The Sharp you saw was not properly set up. Blacks on the d92 are outstanding and no black crush.

Ridiculous. The 65 series is a joke for home theater. For home theater, go to the projector section and 100" screens. This is not a home theater section by any stretch.

Sorry but the typical person is not going to modify their home to accomodate a TV, turn a room into a black hole. Sure if you have a home theater, get a projector and turn down the lights. Now perhaps with a 65" Sharp you could begin to call it a home theater, but who ever heard of a 52" home theater screen?

In my opinion, matte screens make the image flat. If you are not interested in the 81 series because of the matte screens then you are entitled to your opinion, however, how many times are you going to visit this thread and complain about the glossy screens? Posting the same frustration over and over isn't going to make Samsung redesign the 81 series. If you like the Sharp then just purchase it and forget about the Samsung 81 series.

[mark_1080p]

Posting a criticism and defending that point of view by responding to opposing points of view is a valid exercise so again why the complaint? I have a right to defend a point of view over and over again, just as you have that right.

[JoeSony]

Ridiculous. The 65 series is a joke for home theater. For home theater, go to the projector section and 100" screens. This is not a home theater section by any stretch.

I know many many home theater set-ups using a 52" LCD. To say you need projection and 100" screens is inaccurate.

[bpt8056]

The Sharp you saw was not properly set up. Blacks on the d92 are outstanding and no black crush.

Neither were the Samsung TVs nor the plasmas.


Ridiculous. The 65 series is a joke for home theater. For home theater, go to the projector section and 100" screens. This is not a home theater section by any stretch.

Sorry but the typical person is not going to modify their home to accomodate a TV, turn a room into a black hole. Sure if you have a home theater, get a projector and turn down the lights. Now perhaps with a 65" Sharp you could begin to call it a home theater, but who ever heard of a 52" home theater screen?

There are many different definitions for a home theater. For me, there are many different ways one can set up a home theater. For most common folks, a DVD player, surround system and a TV (not an HDTV) is enough for a basic home theater system.

The typical person is not going to buy a projector and have 100" screens. When I had my Sony HDTV CRT for two years, there were some reflections in the beginning. After making a few re-arrangements around the family room, I was able to minimize it. Lights coming from the window? Get some blinds or darker shades. Or you can try to use your brain and re-arrange the room. Good way to get some exercise. :)

[westa6969]

When I had my Sony HDTV CRT for two years, there were some reflections in the beginning. After making a few re-arrangements around the family room, I was able to minimize it. Lights coming from the window? Get some blinds or darker shades. Or you can try to use your brain and re-arrange the room. Good way to get some exercise. :)

OK - Magnify the puny CRT 400% in size and add a wall full of windows with southern exposure with a friggin view the home owner has paid to see and ceilings that are very tall as are the windows - we don't all live in trailer parks or apts or outdated homes with 8' ceilings and 3' tall windows. Even with blinds light seeps through and reflects in a reflective screen unless you put up a $5K wall unit that encloses the panel from reflections and sun washout. Blinds are for the former mentioned owners of such residences not those with larger homes/condo's with views to the real 3D world beyond the TV. Blinds only go so far for those with minimalist type homes and apts. :)

[gwynethh]

I second the motion on this request.

I am a little worried that the width of the 40 inch model will take it off my short list. (No room in the AV center). I hope we can get hard info soon. Love this place. G

[vtms]

I speculate that 57-inch model might contain more LEDs than 40-inch one so, consequently, the former should have more clusters than the latter perhaps resulting in slightly better CR on the 57''. This might explain "60 or 70" clusters comment on Gizmodo.

[tower101]

These 71/81 series tvs are serious bussiness. If you have direct light hitting your tv, shame on you. What kind of crappy home theater is that? If your not going to do it properly, and use a dark space with little to no light, then go buy a 61f tv and leave the 71/81 to the professional HDTV viewers.

What ??? Sorry we don't all live in a cave like you do, and don't take our home theater as serious as you. :rolleyes:

I like to read while watching TV I know the horror how dare I, I also have big windows with southern exposure OH THE HUMANATY. I have an active live style, I am not a troll that lives in a cave like some of you obviously are.

Yes CRTs have reflections and I have always hated them, why would anyone want to go back to that??? We are supposed to be moving FORWARD you know progress. Every time I hear someone say they don't build them like they used to I say THANK GOD.

[taurus2007]

Well, you don't have to get the latest Samsung panels if you have problems with reflections. You can always try other brands like Sony, Sharp, Toshiba, Mitsubishi, etc. It's not like Samsung is the only company that makes HDTV LCD.

[tower101]

taurus

I will upgrade to the TV that works best for me that my or my not be the 81 have to wait to see one.

Just upsets me when some troll claims that its only "professional HDTV viewers". Here is a hint troll very very few "professional HDTV viewer" use LCD and that fact that you don't know that speaks volumes of your knowledge.

[mrjgkelly]

I think Samsung is getting close to putting them on their Web site... they are down to listing the 5265 as the only LCD they have that is over 50". Two day ago they had 3 models listed; yesterday they had 2 models listed.

[studdad]

I am a little worried that the width of the 40 inch model will take it off my short list. (No room in the AV center). I hope we can get hard info soon. Love this place. G

Yeah, I was looking for width specs. Does anyone know where they are?? I thought I saw them earlier, but went through the posts and links again, and can't seen to find them.

[rbarg]

I have not dissected all the postings on this thread of late, but on 7/11, Samsung made a major announcement re: the 71/81 series including pricing, all detailed on Engadget, Gizmodo, Twice.com - specifically this excellent article:

http://www.twice.com/article/CA6459449.html

Assuming this is old news here, what does "protected distribution" actually mean for the average or savvy consumer who buys at a large discount ie. from Amazon etc. Is the 5K MSRP figure for the 52" going to be the actual street price (and for how long)? The US Supreme Court recently ruled that "resale price maintenance" agreements are not per se violative of the anti-trust laws, an open invitation to companies like Samsung to effectively set price floors for boutique items like the 81. Their lawyers surely know this. Are the days of "Why we can't show this price" numbered?

Does anyone have an opinion of what the following means for pricing and availability?

"Stepping up is the 81 series, which will receive a protected distribution policy targeting A/V specialty dealers, installers and sales-driven regional accounts."

[rbarg]

Personally, I would like a choice between matte and glossy for the 81 series. I doubt if Samsung is going to do this. IMO this is a primarily an MBA driven decision, ie. what's going to sell more units. Laptops have largely gone this way, but the issues w/them are different.

I have a 24" matte near high definition PC screen which is matte. I would never consider working on a glossy computer screen like the old CRTS I had 10 years ago.

On the other hand, I still have a 32" Sony XBR tube in my living room that I have had for at least 10 years. My room has a lot of lighting and I have gotten used to just closing the curtains. If I had a large sunny room with a lot of people over, a glossy screen would not be my first choice. This is one reason I dont' like plasma screens. This, apparently for many, is a non-trivial issue.

I am sure there are sound technical and business rationales for Samsung to "go its own way" on LCDs w/these glossy screens. For me, I go back to the comparison w/the experience of going to a movie theatre. The screen there, whatever it is made of, appears as if it has a matte finish. People would be appallled if they went to a movie theatre and were met w/ a glossy anti-reflective screen to view the film thru.

If the superior PQ of the 81 series outweighs the annoyance of having reflections, I will go for it.

What are Sony's plans for having an 81-like (LED backlit) series beyond its 70" model? Why would Sony allow Samsung to get a jump on them?

[obfinance]

What are Sony's plans for having an 81-like (LED backlit) series beyond its 70" model? Why would Sony allow Samsung to get a jump on them?

Must I remind you that it was Sony that sought out Samsung's technological expertise and manufacturing abilities to help in the production of their lcd screens?

[bpt8056]

OK - Magnify the puny CRT 400% in size and add a wall full of windows with southern exposure with a friggin view the home owner has paid to see and ceilings that are very tall as are the windows - we don't all live in trailer parks or apts or outdated homes with 8' ceilings and 3' tall windows. Even with blinds light seeps through and reflects in a reflective screen unless you put up a $5K wall unit that encloses the panel from reflections and sun washout. Blinds are for the former mentioned owners of such residences not those with larger homes/condo's with views to the real 3D world beyond the TV. Blinds only go so far for those with minimalist type homes and apts. :)

I can't imagine a 136" (I currently have 34XBR960) TV but since you put it that way; I don't see where creativity should be put to a halt. If windows are a problem because of a reflective screen, then take the following steps:

1. Find a solution to minimize light to enhance your viewing pleasure. Blinds are the only option as you can use drapes, shades, shutters, etc. If that doesn't work, then you can try to rearrange the room.
2. If no. 1 doesn't solve the problem, then click "LCD Flat Panel Display" at the top of the page and look for other options. Hasta luego!

[SeeAlice]

Does anyone have an opinion of what the following means for pricing and availability?

"Stepping up is the 81 series, which will receive a protected distribution policy targeting A/V specialty dealers, installers and sales-driven regional accounts."[/QUOTE]

I would take the "protected distribution policy" statement to mean that Big Box stores, like Walmart and Target, will not carry the 81 series "high end" line in the same way that very high end AV equipment is distributed only by the AV specialty stores. Whether mainstream retail stores for the masses (such as Sears, BB, CC, and even Amazon) will be excluded from selling the 81 series remains to be seen.

[darkninja67]

I would think the 81 series will be carried in Magnolia stores if anything. They usually carry the higher end stuff anyway.

[dbr1]

These 71/81 series tvs are serious bussiness. If you have direct light hitting your tv, shame on you. What kind of crappy home theater is that? If your not going to do it properly, and use a dark space with little to no light, then go buy a 61f tv and leave the 71/81 to the professional HDTV viewers. I would be more concerend about buying curtains and making my home theater room decor look better and create a better atmosphere. So many times I visit friends houses who all have great tvs, but looks like crap in their living room or in some corner in some bright room. bah. Tvs like this deserve dedication.
Can you crawl back into your hole now? I'm sure you need to get back in training for the Pro TV Watchers Circuit.

[jksgvb]

As much as I'd like to believe that 'local dimming' technology is finally here and almost in the stores, this Samsung version is such a bastardized and cheapened version that I'll pass. Sixty to seventy clusters? Please...what kind of resolution is that? I don't see any way it can work without causing more problems than it solves.

The glossy screen is a cheap marketing gimmick that only seals the deal. No sale, Samsung.

[wtr_wkr]

Blackframe insertion sounds like a surefire way to get flicker, ...
LED BLUs are bright enough to do a duty cycle of something like 75% on/ 25% off at 120Hz. You should not see flicker from 2ms of blank at 120hz.

Now back to caveboy vs glitboy.

[snowstorm81]

so roughly how long does it take for a price drop? a 40" 81 series would be sweet, but with an estimabed $3000 price point how long do you think it would take for it to reach the high $1000's, low $2000's range?

Lets take the 65/66 series as an rough example for estimating of this
Please make similiar comparsions for US models like I do below:
I live in Europe (Sweden), so our prices is of course higher. Here the msrp for this 65-series 40" Sammy model was $3000 when released in March, and is now down to $2200 (in Germany it goes for around $2000).

Whats intresting is that Sony's new flagship in Europe for the moment - D3000, had when released in June, an msrp of $3000 (40"), but sells for $2500 in stores. Compare this to Sony's last years model V2500, it costs know $2000 and initial price was a bit over $3000 about a year ago. Sammy tends to drop somewhat more than Sony, but maybe that's a new era with the 71/81 series

[conan48]

Hey Mark 1080p. I got a Sony Pearl projecting onto a 110" screen and sit 14 feet away. 7.1 setup with lossless audio and some nice PSB speakers. Have both BD and HD hooked up. The 81 is for my second home theatre setup. :D Is that hardcore enough for you bra.

[axmode]

Yeah, I was looking for width specs. Does anyone know where they are?? I thought I saw them earlier, but went through the posts and links again, and can't seen to find them.

Hey Studdad,

I am back from my self-imposed posting rehab, but I will still remain less active, to kick this habit :D

I see that Mark_1080P is the voice of dissent on these glossy screens (anticipated 71/81 series and the current 65). One thing that I agree with Mark is on the subject of people referring to these TVs, as a "home theater" TV. I concur with Mark and would not go that far to call them HT. These are all very nice TVs, but to me, HT is 60" in a true HT setting. Otherwise, it just a nice family room TV.

As you know, I had the 65 before I sent it back (1016/1004 with HDMI issues) and settled on the matte 61. I am very glad that I no longer need to attenuate almost every light in the family room to enjoy the darn TV, although the 65 was not any worse than my old Sony Trinitron CRT. The 61 does look a bit washed out when viewed at 45+ degree angle and the 65 was better than the 61 in that respect. I do not regret going with the matte finish, since I have realized that Samsung is now going the way of these glossy screens (for the foreseeable future, to amp up their DCR figures). If glare is a major factor, those 61 series are very nice TVs for their features and can be had at around 1.5K to 2K from Amazon.

I am not too hard on the design and the ergonomics of those 71/81 and I do find them very acceptable and tolerable. Samsung does quite a nice job and packaging their TVs, without making them weighing a whole ton. However, my gripe with the 71/81 series (at least from what I see on the photos), is the fact that they seem to be wider (overall width) because of the bezel. As much as I liked the Sony XBR, it was the XBR's floating glass bezel that killed it for me. Some of us are restricted with respect to the space which we have and making a 46" TV to be almost 50" wide, render it useless.

In any case, I am going to kick back and relax till all the issues and the bantering is done with the 81 series, before I contemplate on jumping in (perhaps in a year when their price falls down to earth). Right now, I am quite content with my two 61s.

P.S. For those who are considering the 61 from Amazon, do not wait too long. I really think (pure speculation on my part) that their 61/65 inventory level is hitting the bottom and once the 71/81 come to the market, you will not be able to get a 61/65 from Amazon (from affiliated merchants perhaps, but they are not the same).

JM2C.

[studdad]

Hey Studdad,

I am back from my self-imposed posting rehab, but I will still remain less active, to kick this habit :D

I see that Mark_1080P is the voice of dissent on these glossy screens (anticipated 71/81 series and the current 65). One thing that I agree with Mark is on the subject of people referring to these TVs, as a "home theater" TV. I concur with Mark and would not go that far to call them HT. These are all very nice TVs, but to me, HT is 60" in a true HT setting. Otherwise, it just a nice family room TV.

As you know, I had the 65 before I sent it back (1016/1004 with HDMI issues) and settled on the matte 61. I am very glad that I no longer need to attenuate almost every light in the family room to enjoy the darn TV, although the 65 was not any worse than my old Sony Trinitron CRT. The 61 does look a bit washed out when viewed at 45+ degree angle and the 65 was better than the 61 in that respect. I do not regret going with the matte finish, since I have realized that Samsung is now going the way of these glossy screens (for the foreseeable future, to amp up their DCR figures). If glare is a major factor, those 61 series are very nice TVs for their features and can be had at around 1.5K to 2K from Amazon.

I am not too hard on the design and the ergonomics of those 71/81 and I do find them very acceptable and tolerable. Samsung does quite a nice job and packaging their TVs, without making them weighing a whole ton. However, my gripe with the 71/81 series (at least from what I see on the photos), is the fact that they seem to be wider (overall width) because of the bezel. As much as I liked the Sony XBR, it was the XBR's floating glass bezel that killed it for me. Some of us are restricted with respect to the space which we have and making a 46" TV to be almost 50" wide, render it useless.

In any case, I am going to kick back and relax till all the issues and the bantering is done with the 81 series, before I contemplate on jumping in (perhaps in a year when their price falls down to earth). Right now, I am quite content with my two 61s.

P.S. For those who are considering the 61 from Amazon, do not wait too long. I really think (pure speculation on my part) that their 61/65 inventory level is hitting the bottom and once the 71/81 come to the market, you will not be able to get a 61/65 from Amazon (from affiliated merchants perhaps, but they are not the same).

JM2C.

WB AX, lol. But keep up with your company,,,,gotta work to be able to afford all the cool new stuff. My decision will be made here pretty quickly, but still floating between the 65, 71, and Tosh lx177. I hope to have a decision by the end of August (Football Season and all). Personal reviews are just starting on the Tosh, and the 71 hasn't shipped yet, so still in the same position I was.

[FatesWarning]

P.S. For those who are considering the 61 from Amazon, do not wait too long. I really think (pure speculation on my part) that their 61/65 inventory level is hitting the bottom and once the 71/81 come to the market, you will not be able to get a 61/65 from Amazon (from affiliated merchants perhaps, but they are not the same).
JM2C.

I think you convinced me to get with the 61 (not wait for 71) since I have a very bright living room full of 6 foot high windows with a southern exposure. This CNET review mentions a denterlacing of video based 1080i content problem firmware update will be included with new 61's that arrive in stores in mid to late July. However, if I wait Amazon may run out? Do you think I should wait a few weeks in hopes of getting a completely updated set or buy it now to make sure I get one? I am currently using a 36 " Hitachi tube TV with no HD although I have a Comcast HD cable box. Hey, this was my first post :D


From the CNET review:

"For what it's worth, Samsung sent us a firmware update that worked with both sets to fix the deinterlacing of video-based, but not film-based, 1080i content and to show every line of a 1080-resolution test pattern. (This update is not reflected in our Geek Box results.) Update 06-20-07: We originally reported here that the firmware update would be available as a download from Samsung's web site. Now we hear from the company that the update may instead only be available to owners who call the Service Center and ask to have it sent. We'll update this section again when we're told more. New TVs equipped with the updated firmware will arrive on store shelves, according to Samsung, by mid- to late July 2007."

[xb1032]

Posting a criticism and defending that point of view by responding to opposing points of view is a valid exercise so again why the complaint? I have a right to defend a point of view over and over again, just as you have that right.

I do understand how glossy screens do not work in all environments and I have experienced problems in the past in my family room even with a non-gloss screen.

However, this is a thread to discuss the Samsung 81 series panel which will have a glossy screen like it or not.

If you want to debate or complain about a glossy screen then why not create a thread for this rather than continuously fill this thread with complaints about Samsung's choice to use a glossy screen. Even label it I hate the Samsung 81's glossy screens!!! :p

For those of us who prefer the glossy screen it gets tiring hearing the same complaints over and over from an individual. This is really nothing but a never ending debate that isn't adding any value to this thread.

[xb1032]

I have not dissected all the postings on this thread of late, but on 7/11, Samsung made a major announcement re: the 71/81 series including pricing, all detailed on Engadget, Gizmodo, Twice.com - specifically this excellent article:

http://www.twice.com/article/CA6459449.html

Assuming this is old news here, what does "protected distribution" actually mean for the average or savvy consumer who buys at a large discount ie. from Amazon etc. Is the 5K MSRP figure for the 52" going to be the actual street price (and for how long)? The US Supreme Court recently ruled that "resale price maintenance" agreements are not per se violative of the anti-trust laws, an open invitation to companies like Samsung to effectively set price floors for boutique items like the 81. Their lawyers surely know this. Are the days of "Why we can't show this price" numbered?

Does anyone have an opinion of what the following means for pricing and availability?

"Stepping up is the 81 series, which will receive a protected distribution policy targeting A/V specialty dealers, installers and sales-driven regional accounts."

I am wondering about this as well. If I were to make an educated guess that would mean there is limited supply on these panels and they will be distributed in high end stores. The bad thing is that stores like Magnolia and others won't deal much on prices (as far as I know anyway). Typically I've found that 25-30% off MSRP has been realistic on Samsung TVs which would put it within range for me to compare the 57" model to the Pioneer 6010. I like the brightness of LCDs over plasmas and after seeing the 65 series I bet the new Sammy's are really nice.

[axmode]

WB AX, lol. But keep up with your company,,,,gotta work to be able to afford all the cool new stuff. My decision will be made here pretty quickly, but still floating between the 65, 71, and Tosh lx177. I hope to have a decision by the end of August (Football Season and all). Personal reviews are just starting on the Tosh, and the 71 hasn't shipped yet, so still in the same position I was.

LOL. You've got to earn it first to be able to spend it later (well theoretically, unless you let your credit cards do the job for you and hope that the Chinese keep financing our consumer debt-well, I am now getting off the soap box ;) ).

Lemme make it simple for you: 65 + 71 +77 = 213.

213/3 = 71 :eek: :p :D

[axmode]

I think you convinced me to get with the 61 (not wait for 71) since I have a very bright living room full of 6 foot high windows with a southern exposure. This CNET review mentions a denterlacing of video based 1080i content problem firmware update will be included with new 61's that arrive in stores in mid to late July. However, if I wait Amazon may run out? Do you think I should wait a few weeks in hopes of getting a completely updated set or buy it now to make sure I get one? I am currently using a 36 " Hitachi tube TV with no HD although I have a Comcast HD cable box. Hey, this was my first post :D


From the CNET review:

"For what it's worth, Samsung sent us a firmware update that worked with both sets to fix the deinterlacing of video-based, but not film-based, 1080i content and to show every line of a 1080-resolution test pattern. (This update is not reflected in our Geek Box results.) Update 06-20-07: We originally reported here that the firmware update would be available as a download from Samsung's web site. Now we hear from the company that the update may instead only be available to owners who call the Service Center and ask to have it sent. We'll update this section again when we're told more. New TVs equipped with the updated firmware will arrive on store shelves, according to Samsung, by mid- to late July 2007."

Yes, I read that article too before I had made up my mind to switch from the 4665 to 4661 (plus I saved over $600 in the process: bough the 4665 at CC and paid sales tax-bought the 4661 from Amazon and got a few price adjustments since-I used the net savings to buy a Sammy BD player plus 8 BD movies at a Fry's special deal of 2 for $25 ;) ).

That 1080i deinterlacing technical jargon is all techie geek talk to me. I don't understand it in a tangible way. So I am not so concerned. Just for sh*ts and giggles, I had called Samsung tier 2 to ask them about a FW update and still no downloadable updates are available to the public for such bugs (none HDMI issues). I will remain patient and hope for a merry X-Mas from Samsung :rolleyes:

On the purchase from Amazon and the depletion of their inventory, you are asking me a "timing" question which i am terribly bad at :o . To me it seems that Amazon is going to be done with these models very soon. My hunch is based on the fact that you now will get the price right away, by going to their price page, without having to click onto the link to get the lower price. From my experience, this is when the manufacturer does not care about bucking the price at the discount sellers. If Amazon runs out, you will have to deal with their affiliated sellers, who will not offer you Amazon's very liberal return policies. I still think that Amazon has enough stocks through late August on these 61/65 series.

JM2Cs.

[studdad]

LOL. You've got to earn it first to be able to spend it later (well theoretically, unless you let your credit cards do the job for you and hope that the Chinese keep financing our consumer debt-well, I am now getting off the soap box ;) ).

Lemme make it simple for you: 65 + 71 +77 = 213.

213/3 = 71 :eek: :p :D

Lmao

[Cougar24]

I think that Amazon will def. have 61/65 series available for the next couple of months. The LNT4665F is the #1 best-selling TV on Amazon right now... actually the top 3 TVs are from the 61/65 series. I wonder if we have a price drop coming on these TVs anytime soon.

[glow11]

Anyone have "official" information about the 81's release date?
I went to the local Video Only shop and he had a release date in his book for the 71 series, but nothing on the 81...he had never heard of it, and when I explained what it was he got all snooty and said that LED backlit panels wont be out for at least a year cause they can't get them bright enough (or something along those lines)

[phigment]

So what is the 71 release date?

[taurus2007]

Both 71/81 series should be out next month but 81 panel would be limited prodution. So, I don't think every store will carry the 81 panel.

[glow11]

So what is the 71 release date?

I didn't see the day, but it was in a list of things that were being released, and they all began with 8's....so August is when that store is expecting them.

[mark_1080p]

Hey Mark 1080p. I got a Sony Pearl projecting onto a 110" screen and sit 14 feet away. 7.1 setup with lossless audio and some nice PSB speakers. Have both BD and HD hooked up. The 81 is for my second home theatre setup. :D Is that hardcore enough for you bra.Now you're talking theater, in the first case that is. :D :D

[Andrew67]

Anyone have "official" information about the 81's release date?
I went to the local Video Only shop and he had a release date in his book for the 71 series, but nothing on the 81...he had never heard of it, and when I explained what it was he got all snooty and said that LED backlit panels wont be out for at least a year cause they can't get them bright enough (or something along those lines)

He may be snooty, but in his case he's probably right as far as when he'll receive the product. Video Only won't be carrying the 81 series this year. It will only be available to high end shops, and custom installers. So that rules out Frys, Best Buy, Circuit City, Video Only, other general retailers.

[Gris]

I do understand how glossy screens do not work in all environments and I have experienced problems in the past in my family room even with a non-gloss screen.

However, this is a thread to discuss the Samsung 81 series panel which will have a glossy screen like it or not.

If you want to debate or complain about a glossy screen then why not create a thread for this rather than continuously fill this thread with complaints about Samsung's choice to use a glossy screen. Even label it I hate the Samsung 81's glossy screens!!! :p

For those of us who prefer the glossy screen it gets tiring hearing the same complaints over and over from an individual. This is really nothing but a never ending debate that isn't adding any value to this thread.

Yes, glossy screens are no good in my family room environment either. It would just be nice if Samsung gave us the choice of screen type with the new ld led technologhy. I'm sure it will happen eventually but how hard would it have been for them to do it concurrently with the 81 series and please both groups, like the 61 and 65 series?

[KLee]

If those MSRP prices are correct, the 81-series could turn out to be a good alternative to the Pioneer 1080p Kuros.....I am really looking forward to a head to head-to-head shootout between the Pioneer PDP 5010FD and the Sammy LN-T5281F...both of which have $5000 MSRPs!!!!

[Raitzi]

Previous Samsung LED 100Hz(euro) LCD was not great .(just ok reviews ; not great)
But of course 81-series(or what ever it will called in europe) can change all this. Just little reminder for you guys. We have seen hype and reality with sharp, sony etc. for delivering perfect LCD.

[Cougar24]

Heres a link with some pictures from gizmodo. I don't think its been posted yet.

http://www.gizmodo.com.au/2007/07/hands_on_with_samsungs_newest.html

[wtr_wkr]

Previous Samsung LED 100Hz(euro) LCD was not great ...
1st gen of most new technology is usually marginal. Based to technical specs for some 2nd gen solution, 2nd gen should be much better. But, that will only apply to the manufactures that put in a beefy processor.

Same with this 1st gen LED BLU TVs. Actually, it ~12th gen LED BLU. The prior 11 revs did not make the grade - a weak color, uniformity, power efficiency, cost,...

[moreHD]

Lets take the 65/66 series as an rough example for estimating of this
Please make similiar comparsions for US models like I do below:
I live in Europe (Sweden), so our prices is of course higher. Here the msrp for this 65-series 40" Sammy model was $3000 when released in March, and is now down to $2200 (in Germany it goes for around $2000).

Whats intresting is that Sony's new flagship in Europe for the moment - D3000, had when released in June, an msrp of $3000 (40"), but sells for $2500 in stores. Compare this to Sony's last years model V2500, it costs know $2000 and initial price was a bit over $3000 about a year ago. Sammy tends to drop somewhat more than Sony, but maybe that's a new era with the 71/81 series

What is US' 81-series called in Europe? Is it known? Any educated guesses?

[mark_1080p]

However, this is a thread to discuss the Samsung 81 series panel which will have a glossy screen like it or not.

... continuously fill this thread with complaints about Samsung's choice to use a glossy screen.Well it was only very recently confirmed that the screen on the butt-ugly fat boxy bezel 71 and 81 series will be glossy so a flurry of comments is not unreasonable. Do you not believe that the phrase "continuously fill this thread" is a bit over the top? :D :D

Let's get real: This plastic box is not going to win any design awards anytime soon :p .

Now on the number of clusters of RGB LED's, we really should give this thing a chance. It may perform very well, we shall see. The increased CR of the 71 is a good sign as well, and perhaps the degree of gloss will be diminished relative to the 65 series.

Let's face it: The 65 series is a line of 1080 plasma TV's without burn-in. Yea, they are brighter.

Guess what: The reason why many people are in this section is they do not want plasma TV. Any wonder why the gloss is an issue for many?

[Raitzi]

What is US' 81-series called in Europe? Is it known? Any educated guesses?

M96 or M97 or something else.

[go81]

Let's get real: This plastic box is not going to win any design awards anytime soon :p .

Go away Mr. Interior Decorator. This plastic box is going to win awards for PQ.

http://www.blogsmithmedia.com/www.engadget.com/media/2007/07/img_1473.jpg

[NormanB]

Got excited when I heard about the 120hz & thought I may have found my dream set. If it has a glossy screen, I will be forced to bow out since that is my #1 concern before I part with my hard earned $. I can't imagine anyone with atleast 1 window in their room would be interested. I put up with a RPT Tosh for too long that was pretty bad. It is SO annoying & distracting I ended up selling it to a buddy for cheap (sucker). The 37" Vizio I have now has no reflection & I LOVE it (except the stupid shiny black border, I actually bought some black 2" felt border tape off EBAY & covered it). If there is another 120hz out there with a matt screen, please let me know. I may have to wait until next year when Vizio catches up.

[mark_1080p]

Go away Mr. Interior Decorator. This plastic box is going to win awards for PQ.
Yea, with the lights out. Then you can't see the ugly design anyway, so I guess that's good for cave dwellers.

[studdad]

Got excited when I heard about the 120hz & thought I may have found my dream set. If it has a glossy screen, I will be forced to bow out since that is my #1 concern before I part with my hard earned $. I can't imagine anyone with atleast 1 window in their room would be interested. I put up with a RPT Tosh for too long that was pretty bad. It is SO annoying & distracting I ended up selling it to a buddy for cheap (sucker). The 37" Vizio I have now has no reflection & I LOVE it (except the stupid shiny black border, I actually bought some black 2" felt border tape off EBAY & covered it). If there is another 120hz out there with a matt screen, please let me know. I may have to wait until next year when Vizio catches up.

Take a look at the new Toshiba LX177 line, just started shipping this last week or so.

[yanks1927]

i think the sonys are matte screen as well

[go81]

Yea, with the lights out. Then you can't see the ugly design anyway, so I guess that's good for cave dwellers.

Then why are you even posting on this thread if you don't watch display with lights out/dimmed environment? You don't need this super contrast, you aren't worthy of 81 series. 81 series doesn't want you. 81 series is made for PQ freaks. PQ heaven is finally here.

[lipcrkr]

Then why are you even posting on this thread if you don't watch display with lights out/dimmed environment? You don't need this super contrast, you aren't worthy of 81 series. 81 series doesn't want you. 81 series is made for PQ freaks. PQ heaven is finally here.


And you've seen the 81 series where?

[cwave]

Has anyone checked to see if the 71 or 81 is available to preorder at Best Buy/Magnolia?

[studdad]

Has anyone checked to see if the 71 or 81 is available to preorder at Best Buy/Magnolia?

Nope, but you could go on their website and see.

[Alex the Great]

Can anybody comment why Sammy Gen#6 comes in 3 incarnations 61, 65, 66, and Gen #7 and #8 have only one version x1? IMO we suppose to expect that each family will be broken down onto number of subversion - xx71, xx75, xx76, xx81, xx85, xx86.
Any ideas?

[007craft]

I stand by my original comments. If your looking into the 71/81 series tv, then you should indeed be looking into a nice home theater setup. If your not building a home theater, and you just want a tv for your family room, go buy a 61 series.

Live in a cave? none of you have ever been to a movie theater have you? It suppose to be dark. Rather then complain about a glosyy finish to improve blacks, I mentioned the fact that many people here are buying these for their fair lit living rooms. If I was selling you a tv today and that was your situation, I would not recommend buying a 71/81. Everyone here seems like they want the lattest and greatest technology for their family tv. Im confused by this.

I myself have turned my room into a home theater of sorts and I will be happy to show pictures of it once I get my new 81 tv in place (my current 27" crt does not do the arrangement of the room justice). Theres a window in the room, but lighting can easily be controlled because theres freaking blinds on the window. My room looks better then any of my friends set-ups, and Im doing it all on the smallest budget ever imaginable. When I watch movies, I always get that feeling like im at a theater, which is how I believe movie watching should be. When the family is watching a dvd downstairs, I come down and Its not enjoyable at all. Big open room, light coming from everywhere. Even at night there is no atmosphere. This room is fine for a family/living room, but for watching movies (not tv) I cant be bothered. My parents however dont care about a dedicated HT setup like most of use here on the forum do.

[studdad]

I stand by my original comments. If your looking into the 71/81 series tv, then you should indeed be looking into a nice home theater setup. If your not building a home theater, and you just want a tv for your family room, go buy a 61 series.

Live in a cave? none of you have ever been to a movie theater have you? It suppose to be dark. Rather then complain about a glosyy finish to improve blacks, I mentioned the fact that many people here are buying these for their fair lit living rooms. If I was selling you a tv today and that was your situation, I would not recommend buying a 71/81. Everyone here seems like they want the lattest and greatest technology for their family tv. Im confused by this.

I myself have turned my room into a home theater of sorts and I will be happy to show pictures of it once I get my new 81 tv in place (my current 27" crt does not do the arrangement of the room justice). Theres a window in the room, but lighting can easily be controlled because theres freaking blinds on the window. My room looks better then any of my friends set-ups, and Im doing it all on the smallest budget ever imaginable. When I watch movies, I always get that feeling like im at a theater, which is how I believe movie watching should be. When the family is watching a dvd downstairs, I come down and Its not enjoyable at all. Big open room, light coming from everywhere. Even at night there is no atmosphere. This room is fine for a family/living room, but for watching movies (not tv) I cant be bothered. My parents however dont care about a dedicated HT setup like most of use here on the forum do.

To each their own, but I do have to say, the glare issue is not that big of a deal unless you have a window directly behind the viewing area. I have large windows on either side of our living room, and they are adjacent to the tv, and glossy screens have never really been that bad. Take a look at the 61/65 thread, plenty of people were worried about it, but then chose the 65 anyway, and nearly every one of them as has commented on it not being the big deal that everyone made it out to be.

So, again, I don't want to get into an arguement here, but I think for many people, a small amount of glare is really a non-issue, and there is really no reason to have total light control (just not behind the viewing area) in order to enjoy this TV.

[Raptor007]

To each their own, but I do have to say, the glare issue is not that big of a deal unless you have a window directly behind the viewing area. I have large windows on either side of our living room, and they are adjacent to the tv, and glossy screens have never really been that bad. Take a look at the 61/65 thread, plenty of people were worried about it, but then chose the 65 anyway, and nearly every one of them as has commented on it not being the big deal that everyone made it out to be.

So, again, I don't want to get into an arguement here, but I think for many people, a small amount of glare is really a non-issue, and there is really no reason to have total light control (just not behind the viewing area) in order to enjoy this TV.

That's a relief; the only windows in my viewing room will be behind the TV, and direct sunlight can't really get through the trees and blinds. I think I should be alright with the 81 series. :D

[pawn45]

Can anybody comment why Sammy Gen#6 comes in 3 incarnations 61, 65, 66, and Gen #7 and #8 have only one version x1? IMO we suppose to expect that each family will be broken down onto number of subversion - xx71, xx75, xx76, xx81, xx85, xx86.
Any ideas?

The 66 was a Best Buy Model. I would imagine only having the xx71 would leave room for future improvements to be marketed under the xx75/xx85 numbers.