I think the tiers are 6/1 and 16/2, but if you find otherwise let me know.

With Tivo, you need the same level of service for Tivo + Cablecard as you do with Comcast DVR don't you? You'd only save the difference between DVR fee and Cablecard fee (if any). Meaning you still need Digital Silver or whatever you have in order to tune in those encrypted digital channels on the Tivo/CC, right?

As for DirecTV, I broke this down before but I'm basically saving over $600 in the first year alone, and that's after startup/equipment costs. Now if they charge me more for HSI that will cut into that (unless I find another ISP) but still, that's a big big difference (and ahhh the service is better). After the 1st year the price settles at about $75/mo for roughly the same service on Comcast that I'm currently spending well over $100 for.

I saw the 12/2 mentioned in a post related to DSLReports, not really sure what is actually offered here, does anybody really? :p

With the TiVo all you need is Limited Basic($18 here in SR), that's all I have.

With the Comcast DVR you need to have at least Standard Cable, and I believe the first digital tier to get their DVR. This was the main reason I went with the S3 originally, all I wanted was the local HD, but Comcast wanted to stick me with over $60 of programming to use their DVR. As soon as the S3 was available(mid-Sept '06), I had one 3 days later and got rid of the Moto box and the extra programming, and I've never looked back.

Limited basic will get you locals, but not all the other channels, that's what I mean. You need Standard cable AND a Digital package to get channels above about 82 (HD or SD).

Any word from anyone with ties to Comcast Bay Area as to whether we are getting DOCSIS 3.0 this month? Mike F? Thanks.

This month? :confused: I wouldn't expect it this decade.

So if one cancels Standard Cable (called "Expanded Basic" in the brochures) do you have to give back the DVR?

So if one cancels Standard Cable (called "Expanded Basic" in the brochures) do you have to give back the DVR?

yes

Limited basic will get you locals, but not all the other channels, that's what I mean. You need Standard cable AND a Digital package to get channels above about 82 (HD or SD).
Right, that was my point, all I wanted was the locals, which come with the 30 or so analog/SD channels in the Limited Basic package. To get the Comcast DVR you have to have all the rest of that stuff, that's why I've always said the Comcast DVR really costs around $45 a month rather than the $15.95 they say it does.

IOW, if all you want is local HD from Comcast, you can't have their DVR as well. If Comcast ever does a la carte, you can bet they'll be a minimum of $45 or so of programing in order to get the DVR.

Those Moto DVRs are paid for probably within the first 8-10 months of service, after that, I'll bet most of that $15.95 revenue is pure profit.

So if one cancels Standard Cable (called "Expanded Basic" in the brochures) do you have to give back the DVR?

Standard Cable is Limited Basic + Expanded Cable, at least it used to be. If you cancel the minimum digital tier, and Expanded Basic to be left with Limited Basic, you have to return the Comcast DVR.

When I first tried to do the above I thought I was good to go until she said "I see you have a DVR on the account, that will have to returned". As soon as the TiVo was available, I bought it.

Both my TiVos added the new channels, problem is none of them work. I should get all of them since I have the triple play premier, when I go into the diagnostics it looks like the channel doesn't exist.

I am in Redwood Shores, I *thought* we were on the same system as Foster City (that is the office I have gone to) which seems to have the new channels.

same here in San Carlos. Got Tivo message with all the new channels this AM, but not on Comcast box yet.

Right, that was my point, all I wanted was the locals, which come with the 30 or so analog/SD channels in the Limited Basic package. Yeah but you have satellite, right? He doesn't want that, he just wants to get rid of the Comcast Moto DVR and use a Tivo instead, if I understood correctly...

You can do that, you will save the $16 DVR fee, but of course pay whatever Tivo charges for the box and monthly fee.

If you get rid of any channels in Standard or Digital cable you can't tune them on a Tivo either.

This month? :confused: I wouldn't expect it this decade.

They are beta testing it in San Jose, and a few months ago Comcast said the top 10 markets would get it by the end of the year.

But since then, no word. I'm hoping Mike F or someone can provide actual news rather than the bashing because it took us a while to get Blast.

You can do that, you will save the $16 DVR fee, but of course pay whatever Tivo charges for the box and monthly fee.

$16/month for 3 years = $576 for Comcast DVR. Or, spend around $500 for TiVo HD with lifetime service. At the end of the 3 years, the TiVo should still be worth $200-$300.

The live search rebate varies between 0% and 30% and can change multiple times a day.
It does vary from time to time based on past history. In the short-term though, it's been stuck at 8% for a few weeks now.

Has anyone noticed the v11 TiVo software isn't doing a good job handling the double entry for 722 GolfHD in the channel guide? (I believe the double entry is from the CableCARD channel list)

If I open the channel guide, it won't scroll above or below 722. If I tune to 722, then ch+/- won't change to any other channel and the channel guide only has 722 and no other channel.

I say v11, but maybe it was this was on earlier OS versions too. I seem to recall double entry channels before and not having this problem.

I first noticed it when I happened to type 722 in the mobile slingbox client as a starting point then could no longer use ch+/- to change channels. I thought the IR blaster was messed up, but then when I looked on the actual TiVo, the channel guide only had 722. Once I changed to another channel, the full channel guide returned, but I still couldn't scroll past 722 in either direction.

Same situation in Belmont: Tivo lineup has the new channels (with the programming as well), but they are not coming in from Comcast (no signal).
My guess is that this is mistake by Tivo (or by Tribune Media) and Comcast will not show these new channels in Belmont/San Carlos until they upgrade our system.

same here in San Carlos. Got Tivo message with all the new channels this AM, but not on Comcast box yet.

It does vary from time to time based on past history. In the short-term though, it's been stuck at 8% for a few weeks now.

It was 20% just a couple of days ago, for less than ~24 hours.

Has anyone noticed the v11 TiVo software isn't doing a good job handling the double entry for 722 GolfHD in the channel guide? (I believe the double entry is from the CableCARD channel list)

If I open the channel guide, it won't scroll above or below 722. If I tune to 722, then ch+/- won't change to any other channel and the channel guide only has 722 and no other channel.

I say v11, but maybe it was this was on earlier OS versions too. I seem to recall double entry channels before and not having this problem.

I first noticed it when I happened to type 722 in the mobile slingbox client as a starting point then could no longer use ch+/- to change channels. I thought the IR blaster was messed up, but then when I looked on the actual TiVo, the channel guide only had 722. Once I changed to another channel, the full channel guide returned, but I still couldn't scroll past 722 in either direction.

SfHub,

I had the very same problem but you can fix it by redoing the initial Guide setup, it takes about 20 minutes to do but it fixed it for me. It also fixed the problem with the Fx-HD channel using the East Coast feed for the guide data and I finally get guide data for the Cartoon-HD channel.

On another note. I'm waiting for the official word from Comcast about the recent channel additions ( or the lack of addition in some areas ). I know it's the holidays and a lot of people are on vacation. I just got back and I'm going to be leaving again to visit my brothers in Davis and Stockton but I can get my email from there so when I get the word to post I will... I haven't forgotten ;)

Laters,
Mikef5

The MSNBC web page had a head line about power companies rushing to restore power in the North East. The only problem was the picture of the lineman was in a lift and you could see the "C" of the Comcast logo on it. He was trying to remove a branch from a cable line. IOW, "forget the power" just get us our cable TV back! :D

Has anyone noticed the v11 TiVo software isn't doing a good job handling the double entry for 722 GolfHD in the channel guide? (I believe the double entry is from the CableCARD channel list)

If I open the channel guide, it won't scroll above or below 722. If I tune to 722, then ch+/- won't change to any other channel and the channel guide only has 722 and no other channel.

I say v11, but maybe it was this was on earlier OS versions too. I seem to recall double entry channels before and not having this problem.

I first noticed it when I happened to type 722 in the mobile slingbox client as a starting point then could no longer use ch+/- to change channels. I thought the IR blaster was messed up, but then when I looked on the actual TiVo, the channel guide only had 722. Once I changed to another channel, the full channel guide returned, but I still couldn't scroll past 722 in either direction.


I noticed the same problem last night on my HD and S3 Tivos. I restarted them through the menu and after the reboot, the duplicate 722 channel was gone and scrolling through the guide works properly again. Very weird.

I noticed the same problem last night on my HD and S3 Tivos. I restarted them through the menu and after the reboot, the duplicate 722 channel was gone and scrolling through the guide works properly again. Very weird.
Thanks, I rebooted both S3s and the duplicate 722 was gone as well as the channel guide problem.

I have a gut feeling the bug in TiVo guide handling is still there, but the conditions to bring it about are no longer present.

That was weird. I rebooted my Tivo and it looks fine. I was thinking or restarting it to plug it through 'kill-a-watt' any way.

btw : Tivo HD sips 45-48 watts (less than I thought).
Comcast DCT 700 sips 7 watts (much less than I thought).

too bad : powered off Oppo DVD player takes as much as my boombox set to pretty high volume (2 watts).

They are beta testing it in San Jose, and a few months ago Comcast said the top 10 markets would get it by the end of the year.

But since then, no word. I'm hoping Mike F or someone can provide actual news rather than the bashing because it took us a while to get Blast.
Not bashing, I remember that statement but I haven't heard anything about it since then. Are they really testing in San Jose? That's news to me. Does anyone have it, or know anyone that has it?

I just wouldn't expect it until 2010 or later. Bay Area is always the last to get anything new (because we complain too much or something).

That was weird. I rebooted my Tivo and it looks fine. I was thinking or restarting it to plug it through 'kill-a-watt' any way.

btw : Tivo HD sips 45-48 watts (less than I thought).
Comcast DCT 700 sips 7 watts (much less than I thought).

too bad : powered off Oppo DVD player takes as much as my boombox set to pretty high volume (2 watts).Holy Moley! You mean that you HD TiVo guys are all sipping (sic) nearly 50 W 24/7??? Do they use vacuum tubes? A full-on HDD takes under 10 W, ferhevvinsake.

That tidbit just evaporated the last vestige of my interest in TiVo. I already had pretty much written TiVo off because of the exorbitant, IMO, subscription fees in comparison to my $15/year Schedules Direct one. That put a fork in it.

Regarding the DCT: I don't have one, but if I did I'd unplug it when not using the TV, just as I unplug my 6-watt-in-"standby" laser printer when it's not in use. ;)

The DVR needs to be "on" all the time to record programs obviously. 50 watts is about 37 KwH, at about 12 cents/Kwh that's $4.50 per month, big deal. It's not just the HDD obviously, the cpu and tuner(s) need to be active.

For non-DVR boxes you could use one of those "smart" power strips that monitors one of the outlets (say your TV) and turns off the other outlets when it detects that device is turned off.

Is anyone using Tivo with Comcast Limited Basic?

How much extra do they charge you for a cable card? I thought the first one was free but I'm hearing that Comcast tries to tack on some additional charges?

Or are you basically replacing the Comcast $15 DVR fee for the Tivo service fee?

My (HTPC) DVR is only "on" when actually recording programs (except for the ~5 minutes per day that it takes to download the Schedules Direct information and set up the day's recording schedule).

Multiply that $4.50/mo. by the number of TiVos in use and then try to tell me that the sum is not a "big deal", hmm? It's a colossal waste of energy!

Is anyone using Tivo with Comcast Limited Basic?

How much extra do they charge you for a cable card? I thought the first one was free but I'm hearing that Comcast tries to tack on some additional charges?

Or are you basically replacing the Comcast $15 DVR fee for the Tivo service fee?
I have Limited Basic with the S3 Tivo. The Comcast bill is $18 plus $1.79 for the CCs. The S3 uses 2 cards - with current model TiVo's, which can use 1 card, there shouldn't be any charge if it's the only outlet you have.

Not bashing, I remember that statement but I haven't heard anything about it since then. Are they really testing in San Jose? That's news to me. Does anyone have it, or know anyone that has it?

I just wouldn't expect it until 2010 or later. Bay Area is always the last to get anything new (because we complain too much or something).
Walk,

Anyone that is in the beta testing wouldn't be able to say anything due to NDA but if you follow what's happening in the Northwest, it's bound to get here faster than 2010. One way you will know that somethings going to happen is when Dave starts getting a lot of DTA's in the warehouse or I get permission to post ;)

Laters,
Mikef5

For non-DVR boxes you could use one of those "smart" power strips that monitors one of the outlets (say your TV) and turns off the other outlets when it detects that device is turned off.

How does your remote turn on the TV if it has no power to sense the remote signal? Seems we need completely redesigned electronics to do that though I do note my Sony Blu-Ray player does not have a standby light so it may have some energy reducing standby system. It is probably possible to charge something on a device so it can just check for remote signals and if it's charge is low turn on standby long enough to recharge. My Eee-PC AC adapter is stone cold on the outlet and only gets warm if you actually recharge the device or are using it. So there has been some work in this area.

I'm also wondering how long it will take a remote power switch maker to make $10-$20 infra-red light switch for home theater users being that Logitech charges an extra $100 for the Harmony that can control a $20 RF switch. There's a market for some astute manufacturer. You just have to put the sensor some place where it can see the remote.

I'm able to control my X-10 lighting with my Harmony 880 by using a X-10 PowerHouse IR Command Center, Model No. IR543. This unit works great with the Harmony and Logitech provides the data base online for this unit. The unit converts the IR commands to X-10 commands that it then injects into the house power. I currently have it controlling all of my lighting including the Cyron 180 LED multicolor backlight behind my 100" FireHawk screen.

I had looked into X-10 and it was not cost effective. I have no interest in controlling all my house lights with something like an X-10 system which I've been aware of since it was first introduced. I'm only turning off one lamp in the room that is over by the subwoofer and not next to me. That could be controlled by an inexpensive IR device if someone would make one.

I had looked into X-10 and it was not cost effective. I have no interest in controlling all my house lights with something like an X-10 system which I've been aware of since it was first introduced. I'm only turning off one lamp in the room that is over by the subwoofer and not next to me. That could be controlled by an inexpensive IR device if someone would make one.X10 IR543 IR controller (about $15 delivered)
X10 AM466 appliance module (about $10 delivered)
Check eBay, $25 total, a lot cheaper than most people would think. And you could expand to control 16 if you want with more modules.

For non-DVR boxes you could use one of those "smart" power strips that monitors one of the outlets (say your TV) and turns off the other outlets when it detects that device is turned off.

For DCT-700 it is 7 watts irrespective of whether TV is on or not. Cable boxes are always on mainly to receive data.

X10 IR543 IR controller (about $15 delivered)
X10 AM466 appliance module (about $10 delivered)
Check eBay, $25 total, a lot cheaper than most people would think. And you could expand to control 16 if you want with more modules.

Thanks but the appliance module is not IR. I already have an RF remote switch with its own remote (around $20 or less). I found one wall switch with IR that would do the trick but only sold in the UK. But then it would have to be wired in. Just an IR version of what I already have would work though as I said before you may need to be able to have the IR sensor separate connected by wire so that it can be hit by the remote's IR.

Managing two remotes is okay (over 10 otherwise). All I'm saying is some company will realize the lack given that Logitech sells Harmony remotes priced as low as $99 MSRP which could also turn off lights if they were on an IR remote module.

Is anyone else having trouble with KTVU and KPIX over QAM? I was setting up a new TV and picked them both up in a channel scan early Saturday evening. Starting later Saturday they both had disappeared - and still haven't returned...

Thanks but the appliance module is not IR.
...But the IR543 is IR and it controls the appliance or lamp modules via RF when you use an IR remote. The result is exactly the same as the device you purpose. Only the X10 IR solution is 2 separate boxes and work together wireless for the same function that you want. I use this combo to turn on and off several of my electronic components like power amps and computer monitor. My universal remote is a URC MX-3000 which is IR. Most other universal remotes like, for example, the Harmony, have X10 codes available.

$4.50 per month does sound like a lot of waste. I think if Tivo spends more on hardware engineering, it could reduce the wattage much further for future Tivos (SD card for 30 minute buffer, for e.g.) Unlike analog TV, it does not even need to encode the stream. I don't think this much usage is unavoidable. I remember someone mentioned long back that Comcast non-DVR was about 40 watts.. DCT 700 is big improvement over that.

This only accounts for 12% of my electricity bill. Should check what other devices are contributing big. Only other always on devises are refrigerator and a Linux box.

My (HTPC) DVR is only "on" when actually recording programs (except for the ~5 minutes per day that it takes to download the Schedules Direct information and set up the day's recording schedule).

Multiply that $4.50/mo. by the number of TiVos in use and then try to tell me that the sum is not a "big deal", hmm? It's a colossal waste of energy!

$4.50 per month does sound like a lot of waste. I think if Tivo spends more on hardware engineering, it could reduce the wattage much further for future Tivos (SD card for 30 minute buffer, for e.g.) Unlike analog TV, it does not even need to encode the stream. I don't think this much usage is unavoidable. I remember someone mentioned long back that Comcast non-DVR was about 40 watts.. DCT 700 is big improvement over that.

This only accounts for 12% of my electricity bill. Should check what other devices are contributing big. Only other always on devises are refrigerator and a Linux box.

My Pioneer plasma and my Panasonic plasma, not current-year models, consume about 25W each on standby. Both have cable cards installed, although cable card is not the reason why it is using so much power. The new models are much better. It is really wasteful, especially considering that I am using a lot of power and therefore on the most expensive tier as far as my electric bill is concerned. If I unplug those from the wall, then it takes maybe a minute for the TV to wake up. Not a huge deal, but my kids often forget to do that.

I also had a Comcast HD tuner box (Moto 3200). If I unplugged that, I could not get On-Demand when I turned it back on, for a while (several minutes at least), and the guide data would be lost. Right now I have a Comcast DVR (Moto 34XX), because my tuner box is broken and they don't have any in stock, and they gave me that as a temporary substitute. That DVR consumes 30 W in standby (ouch!). Curiously, when it is turned on, it only runs a watt or so higher.

The real villain, of course, is the Sony PS3 which many people use as a Blu-Ray player. Even when idling, it consumes 100-200W, depending on the vintage of the player. A dedicated stand-alone player would only use 10W or so.

It's now time to look at my Comcast bill again, now that the promotions have run out :(. I have two cable cards and a Comcast HD tuner box. I am on the Digital Starter plan. How much should I be paying for the cable TV service?

I am asking because I seem to get different answers from different CSR's. Ideally I would want to only pay $1.79 each for those cable cards, plus the $60 or so for Digital Starter, but my bill is significantly higher.

It's $15.95 per month for the Moto DVR now, plus the unwanted required programming needed to quality for the DVR? Holy sheet! :eek::D

That's $191 a year. You can get a refurb TiVo HD for $179 right now, add in a 3 year sub and it comes to $17.22 per month total(including CC cost @ $3.95 - is it really that much now?), or $206 a year. That's $15 more per year for a vastly superior DVR, and that doesn't include the savings of nearly $900($300 per year @$25 per month) of unwanted programming costs needed to get the Moto DVR.
Keep in mind one thing: with the Comcast box, you can get PPVs and OnDemand. If you have just TiVo with CableCARDs, you can't.

-- Don

interesting discussion on power consumption. if i recall correctly, my Moto 6200 (?) HD box (no DVR) was an energy pig. i may have faulty memory, but it was in the tens of Watts the time i measured in a few years ago (40-ish?).

i've recently gotten rid of it with my new TV that has a QAM tuner. although the latter has higher power consumption i'm sure when it is on (46 vs 32 inch LCD), i'm sure i'm going to be saving power each month, not to mention the $8 they were charging me each month for their HD tuner box.

(but i know i'm unusual...all i want are the limited basic stations after realizing my TV watching was minimal recently and i was throwing away a lot per month to Comcast)

Keep in mind one thing: with the Comcast box, you can get PPVs and OnDemand. If you have just TiVo with CableCARDs, you can't.

-- Don

True, but I don't think I've ever purchased any PPV event, and I've read that OnDemand can be a bit sketchy in use and quality, plus, Neflix and Amazon should cover most of anything I might have missed, maybe not the best quality, but sufficient. That extra $900 or so of programming over 3 years is just way too much just to have access to those features, for me anyway. The Comcast/Moto DVR is really not comparable to the TiVo either. It's 2009 and you still can't add any additional storage to those boxes for just one glaring difference.

I'll I ever wanted from Comcast was the ability to record local HD channels, they lost me awhile back with regard to cablenet HD channels by not keeping pace with DirecTV - I get all of that I want from them - with the S3 I have what I wanted and save(ed) a bundle of money. For me, it's definitely the best option.

> My Pioneer plasma and my Panasonic plasma, not current-year models, consume about 25W each on standby.
I knew pioneer with cable card was bad.

My 2005 42 inch Panasonic takes 0.4 watts in standby (5 times better than my DVD player).. it does not have a cable card. I need to measure my 2007 50 inch Panasonic, but suspect it would in the same range.

I've got one of those Watts Up meters, think I check some of my equipment, some of it's probably higher than I would have expected, or wanted to know. :D

It's now time to look at my Comcast bill again, now that the promotions have run out :(. I have two cable cards and a Comcast HD tuner box. I am on the Digital Starter plan. How much should I be paying for the cable TV service?

I am asking because I seem to get different answers from different CSR's. Ideally I would want to only pay $1.79 each for those cable cards, plus the $60 or so for Digital Starter, but my bill is significantly higher.

You have to pay ~$7 for each additional outlet.

You have to pay ~$7 for each additional outlet.

But the digital starter package comes with one HD tuner, right? So it should be $59.95+2*($7+$1.79)=$77.53, correct?

That's pretty expensive. I may return the tuner or one of the cable cards to save the $9.

The real villain, of course, is the Sony PS3 which many people use as a Blu-Ray player. Even when idling, it consumes 100-200W, depending on the vintage of the player. A dedicated stand-alone player would only use 10W or so.When in standby mode PS3 uses 0 watts. During use it ranges from about 185W to 205W. What BD player uses only 10W? I'd think it would be higher, decoding MPEG4, AVC etc, requires a good amount of horsepower.

Anyway, the way the "smart" power strips work is they have 1 plug that is always on where you plug in a device that you are going to turn on and off yourself, and the strip detects the power draw and turns on 3-4 other outlets on the same strip. So you turn on say your TV, or a computer, and the strip turns on the other accessories, it's very useful for things that don't have power switches. Though honestly, it's not really worth it unless your device is using more than 10W or so when in standby mode.

Cutting power to your cable box really isn't a good idea though, it will lose all the guide data. For a DVR it's a definite no-no since it will obviously fail to record any shows you have scheduled.

The DVR needs to be "on" all the time to record programs obviously. 50 watts is about 37 KwH, at about 12 cents/Kwh that's $4.50 per month, big deal.

You're lucky to be paying 12 cents/KWH. Our marginal rate is 35 cents/KW. That DVR, at 30W, is costing us $7.50/month, even if it is in standby. That's if I have only one DVR.

When in standby mode PS3 uses 0 watts. During use it ranges from about 185W to 205W. What BD player uses only 10W? I'd think it would be higher, decoding MPEG4, AVC etc, requires a good amount of horsepower.



Well, my Panasonic BD player, DMP-BD35K, uses 14W playing a blu-ray. Not sure if other players do not consume less.

I was talking about the PS3 idling at 100-200W. Meaning not playing games or movies, just displaying a static logo. You would think that the graphics processor would have little to do.

I've read that OnDemand can be a bit sketchy in use and quality.

i haven't observed this. my wife is a heavy user and it has worked well for us so far. comcast has many faults but i wouldn't count this among them.

i haven't observed this. my wife is a heavy user and it has worked well for us so far. comcast has many faults but i wouldn't count this among them.

I was just commenting on what I've read from some others here, I've never used it myself, it probably does work well in most cases. The point for me though was that is wasn't worth the extra cost incurred just to have the feature. :)

The DVR needs to be "on" all the time to record programs obviously. 50 watts is about 37 KwH, at about 12 cents/Kwh that's $4.50 per month, big deal. It's not just the HDD obviously, the cpu and tuner(s) need to be active.
That is, until you go over your baseline limits, which it is quite easy to do with various tech gadgets people in the valley like to have. At 130% over baseline, the rate about doubles to 24 cents.

It doesn't have to be on all the time. TiVo just designed it that way. They could have designed a standby mode where they weren't buffering live TV on 2 tuners 24/7.

My Pioneer plasma and my Panasonic plasma, not current-year models, consume about 25W each on standby. Both have cable cards installed, although cable card is not the reason why it is using so much power.
Are you sure about the CableCARDs not being the reason? The cards themselves wouldn't be drawing the power, but they force many TVs into a mode where they have some modules running 24/7. On my Sharp, I think the standby power goes up by 25-30 watts when you use CableCARDs vs when you don't use them.

Cutting power to your cable box really isn't a good idea though, it will lose all the guide data. For a DVR it's a definite no-no since it will obviously fail to record any shows you have scheduled.
I think for the vast majority of people cutting power (or going into very low power mode) from 1am to 5am for a DVR would be fine if you could force that DVR to download guide data at a specific time.

If a DVR designer wanted to be more advanced, they could just map out the recordings for the day with the assumption that the DVR needs to be on 1hr in advance of any recordings to make sure channel maps get downloaded from the CableCARD. Any other open periods in the day, they can go into very low power standby mode with just a wake-up timer and front display clock driver. DVRs know in advance which hours it will be recording and most people don't actually care that much about 24/7 live TV buffering on 2 tuners. If they did care, they could just disable "green" mode for the DVR.

Suffice it to say there is a lot of low hanging fruit for someone who wanted to design a green DVR and market it as a significant cost saving feature. The power usage can pretty easily equal half the monthly service fees making the hidden+upfront costs about 150% of what you think you are paying.

I was talking about the PS3 idling at 100-200W. Meaning not playing games or movies, just displaying a static logo. You would think that the graphics processor would have little to do.
http://www.geeks.com/details.asp?invtid=9258T&cpc=SCH

I decided to use one of these for those power-hungry devices I'm often not using but end up leaving on because I'm too lazy to get up and turn them on or off. They are also good for devices that you can't have hang while you are travelling like Slingbox, where if it hangs, you have no way to reset it remotely, whereas remotely pulling the power cord gets you back up and running quickly.

When they are on sale it is around $50. The convenience of being able to click on a link on my phone or laptop to turn things on/off/power-cycle makes it worth it for me.

Are you sure about the CableCARDs not being the reason? The cards themselves wouldn't be drawing the power, but they force many TVs into a mode where they have some modules running 24/7. On my Sharp, I think the standby power goes up by 25-30 watts when you use CableCARDs vs when you don't use them.

Let me qualify that. Whether the CableCard is inserted or not does not change the standby consumption. The design of the CableCard tuner obviously contributed to the higher consumption. The Pioneer TV is always looking for program guides whether you are using the QAM tuner or the ATSC tuner, even when the unit is in standby.

Why would you leave your PS3 on all the time? There's no reason to do that at all. The last update even included a feature to turn it off after a few hours of inactivity.

As for DVRs, they could obviously be better designed with power in mind, say for example storing the guide/schedule info on hard disk so they don't LOSE IT ALL WHEN POWER IS LOST :mad: ... but they still need to be "on" at some level to be able start recordings.

Still, 30-40w just isn't enough to justify spending a ton of money on fancy power strips. If you had 3 devices using that much (or one using 90-100W or more) in standby it might make sense, but not if it's going to take 10 years to pay for itself, like when people suggest using them on cable modems and inkjet printers and such which only sip a few watts at most.

...
but they still need to be "on" at some level to be able start recordings.
...
Still, 30-40w just isn't enough to justify spending a ton of money on fancy power strips. If you had 3 devices using that much (or one using 90-100W or more) in standby it might make sense, but not if it's going to take 10 years to pay for itself, like when people suggest using them on cable modems and inkjet printers and such which only sip a few watts at most.
Sure they need to be on to record, but the point is take a 24hr day and see how many hours your device is recording. The hours you don't record is probably greater than the hours you do record which means you should be able to get close to 50% or more reduction in power usage with a smart green DVR design.

It's not necessarily just about the individual. If you start multiplying by the # of DVR users it starts adding up.

Personally I use the IP-controllable power strips primarily because of the ability to reset devices remotely which for me is worth it, but since I have them, I end up using them to shut-off devices that suck up too much power and/or don't have standby modes. They also have NTP clients and a power scheduler you can also use them as an advanced (mix of scheduled and not set schedule) vacation timer for lights.

A 40w device 24/7 is using around $82 a year if you are in the 130-200% baseline range so it is certainly in the range of paying for itself within a year. Of course if you really do use the device 24/7 or significantly close to it, no amount of shutting down will really save you that much money.

I don't know why you pay so much, I would call PG&E about that. On the last bill I checked it was 12-13 cents per KWH.

If you really want to save money, replace all the light bulbs in your house with CFLs, that will save much much more than 40 watts (fact it will likely save over 40W PER bulb). You can get them for $1-2 each if you find them on special, I see them everywhere, the grocery store, Kmart, etc.. They will pay for themselves in the 1st month, maybe 2.

I don't know why you pay so much, I would call PG&E about that. On the last bill I checked it was 12-13 cents per KWH.
That is because you are within 130% of baseline usage. Clau and techie folks with lots of gadgets know what I'm talking about. Once you go over baseline usage there is a quick rampup on what they charge you. It is basically a framework for rationing electricity, but with rates that are not so high as to be real rationing.

Within baseline 11 cents. 100-130% of baseline 13 cents. 130-200% baseline 25 cents. After that I don't know how high it gets.

If you really want to save money, replace all the light bulbs in your house with CFLs, that will save much much more than 40 watts (fact it will likely save over 40W PER bulb). You can get them for $1-2 each if you find them on special, I see them everywhere, the grocery store, Kmart, etc.. They will pay for themselves in the 1st month, maybe 2.
They've already been replaced so no gain there, but for me, the light bulbs won't save as much on a normalized basis because the aren't on 24/7, actually much less, probably a couple of hours a day. Any light I have that is on 24/7 has been replaced with LED.

True, but I don't think I've ever purchased any PPV event, and I've read that OnDemand can be a bit sketchy in use and quality, plus, Neflix and Amazon should cover most of anything I might have missed, maybe not the best quality, but sufficient.
If there's nothing that's only on OnDemand (for example, pretty much the only reason I have it is for WWE Classics OnDemand) that you want, then stick with the S3.

But the digital starter package comes with one HD tuner, right? So it should be $59.95+2*($7+$1.79)=$77.53, correct?
You are on Digital Starter with one HD box and two sets of CableCards, right?

I have Digital Preferred with one HD box and one set of CableCards, and I get charged $1.79 for the cards, $6.99 for the "second digital outlet", and another $7 for the second HDTV access. The Terms and Conditions for Digital Starter say that "digital access is limited to a single outlet", so assuming all three of your connections are HDTV, I think it'll cost you $59.95+2*($7+$6.99+$1.79)=$91.51.

-- Don

What determines your baseline? Is it square footage or? You shouldn't be going over your baseline on a regular basis obviously, I'd call and get your baseline raised if that's the problem.

I have as many gadgets as anyone (TVs, computers, video games, etc) plus 2 outdoor lights that run all night, and a 240W attic fan that runs pretty much any time the sun shines (10-12 hrs/day) yet I stay well below the baseline.

If there's nothing that's only on OnDemand (for example, pretty much the only reason I have it is for WWE Classics OnDemand) that you want, then stick with the S3.


You are on Digital Starter with one HD box and two sets of CableCards, right?

I have Digital Preferred with one HD box and one set of CableCards, and I get charged $1.79 for the cards, $6.99 for the "second digital outlet", and another $7 for the second HDTV access. The Terms and Conditions for Digital Starter say that "digital access is limited to a single outlet", so assuming all three of your connections are HDTV, I think it'll cost you $59.95+2*($7+$6.99+$1.79)=$91.51.

Standard cable is $59.95, then you need a Digital package on top of that, I pay $16.95 for Digital "Preferred". Plus $15.95 for DVR and ($7 + $6.99 - $3.50 promo rate = $10.49) for the 2nd HD box.

Don't forget there's about $8 in taxes and franchise fees on CATV.

Comcast Cable Television $ 103.34
Comcast High Speed Internet $ 42.95
Taxes, Surcharges and Fees $ 8.31

Payment Due Date AUTOPAY $ 154.60 :eek:

What determines your baseline? Is it square footage or?Nope. It's based on where you live and whether it's summer or winter, as shown here (http://www.pge.com/myhome/customerservice/financialassistance/medicalbaseline/understand/#).You shouldn't be going over your baseline on a regular basis....I agree...and not using appliances that are needlessly running full-bore 24/7 is part of the solution. ;)

That is, until you go over your baseline limits, which it is quite easy to do with various tech gadgets people in the valley like to have. At 130% over baseline, the rate about doubles to 24 cents.

It doesn't have to be on all the time. TiVo just designed it that way. They could have designed a standby mode where they weren't buffering live TV on 2 tuners 24/7.
That is rather silly, I suppose it's so if you're late getting to the TV you can still rewind it to catch a show.

It would be nice if that feature could be turned off though.

You mentioned getting guide data, if one really wanted to save the energy they could leave the TiVo OFF until 30 mins before they were to use it, and with guide data, dialing in manually once every few days should cover it. That way it's not on 24/7. Plus, if you tune the TiVo to 2 channels with no signal it doesn't record/buffer anything as far as I know. I do know if you do that the throughput to/from the TiVo/PC is improved which seems to indicate less resources are being used.

So, power it off until it's time it's needed - viewing/recording, manually get guide data, and/or tune to no signal channels so it's not buffering while not in use.

Besides, I don't know what you guys are whining about, if I read the map TPeterson linked to correctly, you guys in the bay area have the cheapest electricity rates in the state. :D

So, power it off until it's time it's needed - viewing/recording, manually get guide data, and/or tune to no signal channels so it's not buffering while not in use.

Besides, I don't know what you guys are whining about, if I read the map TPeterson linked to correctly, you guys in the bay area have the cheapest electricity rates in the state. :D
If TiVo were to implement a low power mode that would make sense. Otherwise TiVo uses maybe at most 1 watt less when it is tuned to 2 channels with no signal vs 2 channels with signal. The buffering itself isn't the power sink. It is keeping all the components turned on so that it can buffer that uses the bulk of the power. The justification for keeping all the components on is the buffering feature. Power saving mode would also be much more effective if it was implemented at the design stage where they could implement a very simple interface to enable standby mode, something like pressing the power button.

The buffering is the only real excuse I can see someone using to justify why TiVo needs to be on full power 24/7. Take that away (because someone doesn't need it) and you start seeing that TiVo (and other DVRs) can really be in this proposed standby mode longer than they are on and in full-power recording/playback mode. In standby mode all they really need is a timer and front display driver.

You are reading the chart TPeterson linked to backwards. Those aren't rates for electricity. The #s are how many Kwh you are alloted per day at the cheap rationed rate of 11.5 cents.

According to that chart, during the winter, Santa Rosa has 28.5% more cheap rationed electricity than the peninsula (rate code TB is 12.6Kwh/day vs XB which is 9.8Kwh/day). During the summer Santa Rosa has 45.8% more cheap rationed electricity than the peninsula (rate code TB is 12.1Kwh/day vs XB which is 8.3Kwh/day)

This discussion of the rates is missing the point though. I don't think people mind paying the electricity amounts when they are actively using their devices. The complaint is always-on DVRs don't offer people an option to put them in low-power mode so people have the option to conserve when they aren't using them. It is akin to leaving your 40w light bulb turned on during the daytime when you have no need for it. Just pure waste.

Besides, I don't know what you guys are whining about, if I read the map TPeterson linked to correctly, you guys in the bay area have the cheapest electricity rates in the state. :D

I am not sure what you are talking about :). I am at a marginal rate of 35 cents/KWH, certainly not cheap. Other cities, like Palo Alto, are not supplied by PG&E and enjoy much lower rates.

But putting aside the money cost, that power consumption is still a big waste. Let's say the Tivo's and the DVR's average 40W in standby. If there are 1 million of those out there, that is 40 million watts being consumed. For what purpose?

I design and develop ultra-low power circuits and systems, so it is almost criminal for someone to not pay attention to power consumption, IMO.

Standard cable is $59.95, then you need a Digital package on top of that, I pay $16.95 for Digital "Preferred".
That might be some sort of legacy pricing. The website lists $59.95/month as the price for "Digital Starter".

My bill is pretty much the same as yours - $59.95 for "Standard Cable" plus $16.95 for "Digital Preferred". "Digital Preferred with Starz!" is an extra $35.94 above the Digital Starter price on the website. There doesn't seem to be a way to order Digital Preferred without Starz at the moment.

(I have Standard Cable (59.95) with Digital Preferred (16.95), Sports Entertainment Package (4.99), WWE 24/7 (7.99), Dual CableCards (1.79), Digital Additional Outlet (6.99), and HDTV (7.00 - I have two TVs with HDTV, but only one is charged); with fees, that's about $116/month (and that's without internet or phone) - and it's going to go up next month when I install another HDTV in my house.)

-- Don

I am not sure what you are talking about :). I am at a marginal rate of 35 cents/KWH, certainly not cheap.
...
But putting aside the money cost, that power consumption is still a big waste. Let's say the Tivo's and the DVR's average 40W in standby. If there are 1 million of those out there, that is 40 million watts being consumed. For what purpose?
The real way to look at it is you are subsidizing the electrical usage for folks in Santa Rosa so they can come back and tell you 40w 24/7 is no big deal :)

I completely agree the issue is more about waste and conservation than about the absolute dollar amounts. Though at some point in the future, you could always imagine if electricity did what gasoline did and went up 3-4x, what people be saying about wasted electricity. Certainly if you start multiplying the waste by the # of users the numbers do start getting large.

The real way to look at it is you are subsidizing the electrical usage for folks in Santa Rosa so they can come back and tell you 40w 24/7 is no big deal :)

I completely agree the issue is more about waste and conservation than about the absolute dollar amounts. Though at some point in the future, you could always imagine if electricity did what gasoline did and went up 3-4x, what people be saying about wasted electricity. Certainly if you start multiplying the waste by the # of users the numbers do start getting large.

That's us! We consume, consume, consume, and consume even more, all at your expense, and we thank you for it. :p:D

Agreed that the TiVo should have some sort of power management, especially in this day and age, it's just pure waste to have it running all the time.

I still think we should cut off SoCal and let them find their own water/energy instead of taking ours. :eek::D

P.S. I haven't really looked at my power bill in ages, but all this talk has prompted me to do so, but now I'm scared at what I might find. :)

I feel sad when I look at all-night-on lights in our complex. It is so surprising that none of them is a CFL bulb.. what a waste. If they change all those lights I think then can cut 10-15$ off of our monthly HOA (and may be increase the baseline usage limit for every one :)). I should bring it up in next association meeting.

All the outdoor lights in my HOA are fluorescent. The water bill (and landscaping maintenence) cost a lot more than the electric. Of course insurance is like 85% of the monthly bill.

The real way to look at it is you are subsidizing the electrical usage for folks in Santa Rosa so they can come back and tell you 40w 24/7 is no big deal :)Revenge for being banished to the 2% club for so long! :cool:

I feel sad when I look at all-night-on lights in our complex. It is so surprising that none of them is a CFL bulb.. what a waste. If they change all those lights I think then can cut 10-15$ off of our monthly HOA (and may be increase the baseline usage limit for every one :)). I should bring it up in next association meeting.
Suggest they put in solar powered lamps. Iraq got solar powered street lamps, why shouldn't we?

http://articles.latimes.com/2008/jul/14/world/fg-solar14

With CA going bankrupt and municipalities to follow, at least the street lamps can stay on even if we don't pay our bills :)

Sorry if this is a repost, but has anyone addressed all the new channels that were added today? My TiVo mentioned the 12 new HD channels added, though I don't seem to be able to tune to them quite yet. However, the TiVo has programming data for them. Guess a matter of time!!

Hi, I haven't posted here before although I've gathered information here, and I hope this information will be helpful. I have compiled all clear QAM channels that I get right now in Daly City. Signal type is 480i when unspecified. For the record, I subscribe to the cheapest "digital" package...when I used my cable box the only "digital" channels I got through it were KFTY and the assorted PBS subchannels. Now that I have a QAM tuner the silly box is gathering dust like it should be.

Hopefully this isn't terribly redundant, obviously paging through all 280 pages wasn't too practical. I'm sure if it's useless a mod can delete it.

They are listed in channel # order for simplicity but they kinda almost fall into sequential categories so I have grouped them.

==Channels==
2.1 KTVU-2 Fox (HD) 720p - Cable box ch.702
* KNTV (NBC) and KBCW (CW)'s HD feeds are up on 120.1-120.3
4.2 KRON-4 MyNetworkTV (HD) 720p - Cable box ch.704
5.1 KPIX-5 CBS (HD) 1080i - Cable box ch.705
7.1 KGO-7 ABC (HD) 720p - Cable box ch.707
7-2 KGO Plus 480i - Cable box ch.194
7.3 KGO AccuWeather - Cable box ch.195
9.1 KQED-9 PBS (HD) 1080i - Cable box ch.709
9.2 KQED PBS Life 480i - Cable box ch.189

86.1 HSN - Simulcast of Analog ch.31
86.5 QVC - Simulcast of Analog ch.34
86.8 TV One - Cable box ch.483
86.10 C-Span2 480i - Cable box ch.109
86.11 C-Span 480i - Simulcast of Analog ch.22
87.1 KBCW-44 CW 480i - Simulcast of Analog ch.12
87.2 KTNC-42 Azteca - Simulcast of Analog ch.19
87.3 KTSF-26 - Simulcast of Analog ch.8
87.5 KDTV-14 Univision - Simulcast of Analog ch.14
87.6 KQED-9 PBS 480i - Simulcast of Analog ch.9
87.7 KGO-7 ABC 480i - Simulcast of Analog ch.7
87.8 KPIX-5 CBS 480i - Simulcast of Analog ch.5
87.9 KTVU-2 Fox 480i - Simulcast of Analog ch.2
87.10 KRON-4 MyNetworkTV 480i - Simulcast of Analog ch.4
88.2 KCNS-38 480i - Simulcast of Analog ch.21
88.3 KCSM - Simulcast of Analog ch.17
88.4 KFSF-66 Telefutura - Simulcast of Analog ch.20
88.5 KTLN-68 480i - Simulcast of Analog ch.25
88.6 KQED PBS World - Cable box ch.190
88.7 KQED PBS/ V-Me - Cable box ch.191/621
88.8 KQED PBS Kids - Cable box ch.192
89.14, 100.10 JewelryTV 480i - Simulcast of Analog ch.24
92.3 The California Channel - Cable box ch.108
93.1 KICU-36 - Simulcast of Analog ch.6
93.2 Telemundo 48 - Simulcast of Analog ch.18
93.3 KTEH - Simulcast of Analog ch.10
93.4 KKPX-65 - Simulcast of Analog ch.16
93.5 KNTV-11 NBC 480i - Simulcast of Analog ch.3
94.1 Discovery 480i - Simulcast of Analog ch.16
96.1: KFTY-50 480i - Cable box ch.199

==Comcast stuff==
96.2 through .32: Music choice channels - Cable box channels 901-989
98.4 On Demand Barker - Cable box ch.1
100.2: Tv Guide - Cable box ch.111

==Public Access==
100.3: MCTV: Mid-Coast TV Channel 6
100.4: Daly City Public Access
100.5: Brisbane 27
100.6: Pacifica Community TV
100.7: PenTV

==VOD & Misc.==
100.9: Was airing paid programming all night. Couldn't identify.
101.1: VOD
101.2: VOD
102.1: VOD
103.1: VOD
104.1: VOD
104.3: VOD

120.1: KNTV Weather Plus - Cable box ch.186
120.2: KNTV-11 NBC (HD) 1080i - Cable box ch.703
120.3: KBCW-44 CW (HD) 1080i - Cable box ch.712

Hi, I haven't posted here before although I've gathered information here, and I hope this information will be helpful. I have compiled all clear QAM channels that I get right now in Daly City. Signal type is 480i when unspecified. For the record, I subscribe to the cheapest "digital" package...when I used my cable box the only "digital" channels I got through it were KFTY and the assorted PBS subchannels. Now that I have a QAM tuner the silly box is gathering dust like it should be.

Hopefully this isn't terribly redundant, obviously paging through all 280 pages wasn't too practical. I'm sure if it's useless a mod can delete it.
...

I actually was looking for this info for my parents in Daly City. Thanks...

BTW, where did you get the info? Is there a list for other cities like Fremont?

You can go here to see what channels are are what frequency, just add your area code:

http://www.silicondust.com/hdhomerun/channels

Travel channel hd (755) just showed in my lineup here in San Leandro. Getting "not auth" right now but that will probably change at some point over night since it is part of my package

That's us! We consume, consume, consume, and consume even more

Our electricity up here is clean, renewable geothermal from The Geysers. Not that that's any excuse to waste, but it's awesome. I had the opportunity to tour the Calpine facilities up there, and it's pretty amazing stuff. You don't hear about much about it compared to things like solar and wind, but it's an important piece of the puzzle.

Jason, I think that you'll find, if you dig into it, that the majority of Calpine's Geysers plant's output is being sold to SMUD rather than PG&E. ;)

But I agree with you about its value--it's an important resource and I heartily endorse the recent increase in geothermal development activities out here in California and other Western States.

Jason, I think that you'll find, if you dig into it, that the majority of Calpine's Geysers plant's output is being sold to SMUD rather than PG&E. ;)

Well, where the money goes is a different issue (crazy deregulation), but the actual electrons from the plant provide the majority of the power from the Oregon border to the Golden Gate bridge.

And it's being replenished primarily by Santa Rosa's waste water, which solves two problems.

"Actual electrons" don't count. ;) As in everything else, with power you must "follow the money". What you're buying from PG&E is not mainly geothermal electricity but a mixture of hydropower, natural gas generation, and a little bit of wind, nuke, and coal. SMUD beat you to the "good stuff" and their customers are the ones lining Calpine's pockets while your shekels go elsewhere. :)

I just got my first HDTV (Pioneer 5020) and I want to change my Comcast service from analog Standard to the Digital Starter service. Comcast currently has a promotional rate for Digital Starter for 29.99/month for 6 months. The offer ends at the ends in less than 2 weeks (on 12/31/08). Does anyone know if Comcast will offer a better (or worse) promotion after 12/31/08?

travel channel up and running here

^^^^
Yep, saw it listed on the Guide last night in San Jose (860MHz)

Well, still not working here in South San Jose (95123). But it will be a really good Christmas present. Travel Channel is one of the most watched at home, even if it's an SD channel.

Travel Channel HD is up on 755 in Foster City;
My HD Tivo lists the channel, and knows the channel name (as w/ other new ones);
but it and all the new HD channels are STILL "To be announced" empty channel guides. Annoying. I will file a program update report to try and fix (thought that was in progress since the channel names came up...)

Edit: hmm, can't find Tivo's report channel/lineup issue tool?
the old link no longer works ( http://www.tivo.com/setupandsupport/contactsupport/lineup_tool.html ),
and the new help page has no Report tool..? ( http://www.tivo.com/setupandsupport/technicalsupport/helpwithtivofeatures/Channels_Missing_or_Incorrect_in_Live_Guide.html )

eg,
733 BravoHD (3hr ahead vs 48 Bravo)
741 FX-West HD (same time as 36 FX)
749 Hallmark Movie Channel HD (didn't check analog)
753 E!HD (didn't check analog)
755 Travel HD (same as 71 Travel)
766 Cartoon HD (3hr ahead of 54 Cartoon Network)

All the HD news channels work too but I didn't bother testing as I assume they are not time-delayed, and I don't care about HD news anyway :) )

Do any of the guys who have contacts at Comcast have any information about what we can expect as Feb. 09 rolls around. I look at the continually expanding HD lineups in Chicago and, especially, Boston and am always irked at the fact that we pay the same rates but are so far behind them. I know that they are mostly digital but what will the digital cutover mean for the SF Bay Area?

(Still) no new channels in Petaluma.

DirecTV truck rolling to my location today :)

Well, still not working here in South San Jose (95123). But it will be a really good Christmas present. Travel Channel is one of the most watched at home, even if it's an SD channel.

Travel HD is fine in San Jose 95125 with Tivo guide data and all. Although the Tivo guide data has been there for a while now for me but it's only today that they channel is coming through (previously not-authorized).

The buffering is the only real excuse I can see someone using to justify why TiVo needs to be on full power 24/7. Take that away (because someone doesn't need it) and you start seeing that TiVo (and other DVRs) can really be in this proposed standby mode longer than they are on and in full-power recording/playback mode. In standby mode all they really need is a timer and front display driver.There is also the remote scheduling feature, where you can add an item to your TiVo ToDo list from the TiVo Web site (now including from cell phones), so the TiVo has to be "awake" enough to get these requests. True, there still could be a low-power mode where the hard drive and all of the video chips were off and the CPU was in low-power mode, but that might be harder than it seems.

I bet that it's no harder than is building all those extra power plants to keep myriad 50-W TiVos running night and day. ;)

But, but, I can order pizza from my TiVo! That's easily worth the extra power cost. :D

I'm surprised to have Travel Channel HD now available here.

I'm surprised to have Travel Channel HD now available here.

Why? Santa Rosa, having one of the 1 GHz systems, I would have expected we'd see it here.


OTOH, I expect that many bay area systems will be waiting even longer for more HD after seeing the below article about an "analog to digital freeze".

Cable Ops Agree To Short Digital Migration Freeze
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1096913

Now that Dexter's season is over I'm going to cancel Showtime. There's anything there that I would really watch now. I'll susbcribe again when Weeds comes back.
So instead of saving a few bucks, I don't remember the exact amount somewhere between $9 and $17, I'm thinking on switching to another package. My first thought was about getting the sports package to get NFL HD and some other SD sports channels I may be interested in. But now,I'm not sure about that. I mean, when I go to my gym, I always watch the NFL channel while I'm running in the threadmill, but I'm also listening to music in my mp3 player...
I'm not really interested in HBO or any other movie channel. Any other thing I may need to check?

DirecTV installed yesterday. Took the guy over 4.5 hours, the installer claimed that the cable modem was messing up one of the boxes so he had to run another line thru the crawlspace, but it's working great and I'm loving it so far. Picture quality is at least as good as Comcast, if not better post-3pack. I hooked the cable up to my TV QAM tuner directly and compared football on Fox and CBS back and forth between cable and satellite - if there's any difference at all it's very very small. PQ on all other channels is good to excellent. "HDNet" in particular looks like our old friend Discovery HD Theater did, before Comcast started 3-packing. I've been watching everything from HD locals, TBS/TNT, UHD, Palladia, HDNet, HBO, Showtime, etc. etc... have not seen anything untoward at all, no artifacts, macroblocking.. nothing. All of it looks fantastic.

The DVR is of course light-years better, the shuttle controls actually work... when you are FF or rewinding and hit play/pause it stops where you'd expect it to instead of shooting past where you wanted to stop by 5-10 seconds, etc... Plus the UI is so much better, I can't even describe how much better, it would take me pages here...

Another nice thing is I have already recorded 6-7 HD movies, about 13 hours worth, and the capacity is still at 90% (10% used). 13 hours on my old 120GB Comcast DVR would be about 60-70% used... I have no idea how big the HDD is in this (250GB maybe?) but of course I can add a few Terabytes any time I want on the E-SATA port. 8)

Anyway since I had the cable boxes removed I thought I'd plug them into the Kill-a-Watt. The DCT-6200 (HD, non DVR box, with analog tuner) uses about 28 watts, on or off. The DCT-3412 HD-DVR used about 24 watts when first plugged in, then jumped to about 31 watts when the hdd spun up. Both used the same amount of power whether "on" or "off". Keep in mind neither were hooked up to cable, or anything else, just power. Don't know if that would affect anything... I haven't had the chance to test the DirecTV receivers yet, frankly I'm scared to unplug them given what a bitch it was to get them up and running in the first place.. heh.

If you have the latest FW on the DVR they added a cool feature where if you hit the "Up" button on the remote it will give you a quick access menu to your favorite channels, you can put 9 of them in there and they're displayed by their logos, very handy. :)

walk,
I'm curious to know what model of the HR2x they gave you and did they install SWM (1 coax line to HR2x).

I was going through the TiVo setup (I, er, opened it early as I had made an appointment for 12/22 to have the CableCards installed), and when it got to channel lineups, it asked me what I was receiving on channel 26. For a long time, this is where C-SPAN 2 was located, and the guide on my older TiVo still included C-SPAN 2 as channel 26, but the signal has been blank for a while, so I selected "nothing on Channel 26". When the setup was completed, a considerable number of channels, including all of the non-local HD channels, were in the guide, but they all listed "To Be Announced", even 24 hours later.

I redid the channel selection setup and said that C-SPAN 2 was still on Channel 26, and the information appeared correctly.

"Why" is a question for the TiVo forums - I just thought I'd give you a heads up in case something like this happens to you.

-- Don

walk,
I'm curious to know what model of the HR2x they gave you and did they install SWM (1 coax line to HR2x).

It is HR22-100, apparently has 500GB but 100GB is reserved for VOD and stuff, which I just hooked up last night. Yes it is SWM, 1 coax line.

The HR22 is a little slow, the interface and stuff, compared to the H20 (HD, non-DVR) upstairs. The installer said it would be slow for a bit while it downloads program data, hopefully that will improve, though it's still better than the 3412 ever was.

Faster than the Direct Tivos I used to have too.

You should have asked DirecTV to install the right multiswitch and run two lines to that DVR.

Why do I want 2 lines?

Dual tuner DVR. You can record 2 programs at the same time.

Or record on one tuner and watch another channel.

Dual tuner DVR. You can record 2 programs at the same time.

Or record on one tuner and watch another channel.Only need 1 line now with new technology, SWM (Single Wire Multiswitch).

I can do that already, it uses "SWM". (what he said)

I only wish it had 3 or 4 tuners 8)

Why do I sometimes get free premium channels on my digital channels? Right now on channel 101-3 I'm seeing Encore in HD. I have the digital premium package right now, but no cable box for the TV I'm getting these channels for. They come and go.

Why do I sometimes get free premium channels on my digital channels? Right now on channel 101-3 I'm seeing Encore in HD.

On Demand?

On Demand?

I see a Cartoon Network On Demand on one of the channels. Don't know about the others.

Why do I sometimes get free premium channels on my digital channels? Right now on channel 101-3 I'm seeing Encore in HD. I have the digital premium package right now, but no cable box for the TV I'm getting these channels for. They come and go.
I think it's caused by somebody in another house watching that OnDemand channel - they have to put it somewhere. (Since you have a digital service, presumably the system has the channels set aside for OnDemand requests "authorized" for you.)

I just started an OnDemand show on my cable box, and my other TVs started airing it on 101-2. (Just to be sure, I paused it, and the show paused on the other TVs as well.)

-- Don

Ok, I know a lot of you will say this is an old topic, but on the new HD channels...

I am in San Mateo Digital area (Foster City, San Carlos, Woodside, Redwood City - very screwy delineation lines, not by city) and we got the TIVO new channels message on 12/9 listing all the new 730-740 type channels.

Well, its been almost 2 weeks and nothing. No new channels. A couple more messages about add Golf, delete Golf, but no channels are showing up. Tivo can tune to the channel but there is nothing there, and they are NOT showing up in Comcast guide.

Did anyone else have to wait 2 weeks b/w the TIVO msg and actually having the channels turned on?

Do you know if your area actually got those channels or not?

I think it's a matter of Tivo not having correct info as to what exact areas got the new channels. Comcast teased "new channels in Bay Area" but only rolled them out in a limited few areas, not the whole BA.

Do you know if your area actually got those channels or not?

Thats a great question. I did call COMCAST and they confirmed our area would be getting the channels, it was just a matter of time. We are an ADS area, so I would assume whatever Comcast can deliver we can receive.

It just seems really dorkie.

And Tivo keeps recording blank channels. It especially likes the new Travel HD channel, but I can only assume they filmed everything at NIGHT :D:D:D

Thats a great question. I did call COMCAST and they confirmed our area would be getting the channels, it was just a matter of time. We are an ADS area, so I would assume whatever Comcast can deliver we can receive.

It just seems really dorkie.

And Tivo keeps recording blank channels. It especially likes the new Travel HD channel, but I can only assume they filmed everything at NIGHT :D:D:D

Did you go through the channel setup sequence in the TiVo menu? It will ask you a series of questions about what stations and what channel numbers they are on and based on your responses it will select what it believes to be the proper guide. You can access it at the very bottom of the channel setup page, I think it says something like "enter if your listing is different", or something similar.

Comcast reps may be misinformed also....

We are ADS area here (750mhz) but did not get new channels.

I'm certainly not complaining about the addition of the new HD channels, but I do have a question about most of them, and some of the others.....
Why are we receiving the East Coast feed for so many of these channels? By midnight, nearly half of the channels in my guide are listed as "Paid Programming". I guess these are really only "daytime/prime time" HD channels for us?

I'm certainly not complaining about the addition of the new HD channels, but I do have a question about most of them, and some of the others.....
Why are we receiving the East Coast feed for so many of these channels? By midnight, nearly half of the channels in my guide are listed as "Paid Programming". I guess these are really only "daytime/prime time" HD channels for us?

Depends on what channels they are, very few cablenet channels have both a west and east coast feed. HBO and SHO do, and maybe a few others non-premium channels, but channels like TNT-HD, SciFi-HD only have the one feed, it's why you see the same show repeated 3 hrs later on these channels.

Why do I sometimes get free premium channels on my digital channels? Right now on channel 101-3 I'm seeing Encore in HD. I have the digital premium package right now, but no cable box for the TV I'm getting these channels for. They come and go.

Yes these are the OnDemand channels that someone in your neighborhood is watching. There was an article earlier in the year I believe in the New York Times about how one can tune in OnDemand channels as they are in the clear. And yes even movies from Encore, Showtime, etc. are in the clear when ordered OnDemand. What the article talked about was watching your neighbor's VOD porn that way. ;)

The article included an interview with a Comcast executive who stated that they cannot scramble the signal with the current boxes and the way VOD works.

i would like:

1 VOD
2 a HD DVR that "passes through" the native broadcast format
(eg 720p is output as 720p *and* 1080i is output as 1080i with no end-user adjustment)

can i have this?

specifically if i buy a DVR that does 2 do i give up 1? (i'll assume comcast offers no DVR options that do 2.)

should i have an opinion on cablecard/tru2way/docsis3.0/SDV? or will it "just work" if i take the coax coming out of my wall and screw it into a new tivo?

i want to be a *little* future-proof but not *too much* future-proof. i don't want the "'perfect' to be the enemy of the 'good'".

Did you go through the channel setup sequence in the TiVo menu?

Good suggestion - I did go through the channel setup. I am 100% positive I have the correct user guide for our area. A couple of years ago a Comcast rep was outside the house and in chatting with me he showed me the maps of the areas and the upgrade plans. Literally 1 street over in 2 directions is 2 other distinct Comcast service areas. So when I call I ask if anything has changed. The answer is no.

I can only conclude that we in the San Mateo Digitial coverage area will be getting the channels, its just that Comcast is going about it in a very Comcast sort of way.

In the end its sort of one of those "can't wait to have it, but once I do what's the big deal?". I do look forward to Speed HD, which I pay for.

Maybe they will give it to us for Christmas???

i would like:

1 VOD
2 a HD DVR that "passes through" the native broadcast format
(eg 720p is output as 720p *and* 1080i is output as 1080i with no end-user adjustment)

can i have this?
No, not with a single box. Comcast does not have a DVR that does #2 and only their DVRs will work with their VOD. You can get a TivoHD for DVR and a HDTV box (DCT-6200) for VOD. OR you could get a Comcast DVR and just turn the box off and switch the output resolution - though you can't do that if the box is recording anything (you can't turn it off).

DirecTV DVRs will do both :cool: Though the VOD isn't quite "OD" since it takes a while to download the shows you want (via your internet).

yeah, i was afraid of that. well, thanks for summing it up at any rate.

maybe i'll "upgrade" from one kind of comcast STB to another kind of comcast STB that doesn't have the strange green-line-on-the-right/tearing-on-the-left issue. (i assume i can just walk the old STB into any comcast office and they will accomodate me...)

Literally 1 street over in 2 directions is 2 other distinct Comcast service areas. So when I call I ask if anything has changed. The answer is no.

I can only conclude that we in the San Mateo Digitial coverage area will be getting the channels, its just that Comcast is going about it in a very Comcast sort of way.

In the end its sort of one of those "can't wait to have it, but once I do what's the big deal?". I do look forward to Speed HD, which I pay for.

Maybe they will give it to us for Christmas???

Interesting about the service areas. I keep reading how folks in Foster City have the new channels, but in Redwood Shores, which I assumed was the same doesn't have them. Like you when I attempt to tune to them it is just blank, and when I go into the DVR Diagnostics screen, there is nothing there, the channel doesn't exist.

I am in a fun boat, since I have no idea what city anything comes out of. The closest via car is Belmont, as the crow flies Foster City, but technically we are Redwood City. :)

I thought I read somewhere Redwood Shores was on 860 mhz...

wanderace,

I live in Redwood Shores also. According to Comcast my headend is in Redwood City. I believe we are on a 860 system. I base this using the Diagnostics tool on my DCH3416. I have channels that are above 750: Channel 703 Freq = 771MHZ Channel 722 = 759MHZ Channel 756 = 789MHZ Channel 769 = 759MHZ and of all this Channel 58 765MHZ. Why we don't get the new channels is beyond me

John

i would like:

1 VOD
2 a HD DVR that "passes through" the native broadcast format
(eg 720p is output as 720p *and* 1080i is output as 1080i with no end-user adjustment)

can i have this?

No, not with a single box. Comcast does not have a DVR that does #2 and only their DVRs will work with their VOD. You can get a TivoHD for DVR and a HDTV box (DCT-6200) for VOD. OR you could get a Comcast DVR and just turn the box off and switch the output resolution - though you can't do that if the box is recording anything (you can't turn it off).I was under the impression you could change output formats on the fly with the Comcast DCH boxes. IOW, no powering off necessary. Is this not the case?

I was under the impression you could change output formats on the fly with the Comcast DCH boxes. IOW, no powering off necessary. Is this not the case?

True on the fly would mean the output changes automatically to what ever the channel is broadcast at. I'm not sure about the DCH boxes, but the earlier versions required the user to power it down and change the output manually. Even if powering down is not required on the DCH boxes I think some user interaction is required, it doesn't do it automatically like a TiVo does.

True on the fly would mean the output changes automatically to what ever the channel is broadcast at. I'm not sure about the DCH boxes, but the earlier versions required the user to power it down and change the output manually. Even if powering down is not required on the DCH boxes I think some user interaction is required, it doesn't do it automatically like a TiVo does.

Button on front of DCH labeled "Format". It displays the res in the VFD.

No Power/Menu as in DCTs

Button on front of DCH labeled "Format". It displays the res in the VFD.

No Power/Menu as in DCTs

Right, but it's not seamless, you still have to interact with the device, and it's basically not even practical to bother with.

The OP said "no end-user adjustment", so his wish clearly isn't met by the current boxes.

Right, but it's not seamless, you still have to interact with the device, and it's basically not even practical to bother with.

True, just pointing out the difference in accessing the choices. Honestly, I don't know what mine is set at, I have found some happy medium for most SD & HD TV viewing, video game playing and upconverted DVD watching so that I don't have to re-adjust for every source..

True on the fly would mean the output changes automatically to what ever the channel is broadcast at. No. "On the fly" means that the user can change it "on the fly". Changinging without intervention would be "native passthrough".

I realize the OP wants no user intervention. However, pushing a button from the remote (if you have one that's programmable), or reaching over and pushing one on the front panel, is a fairly easy compromise compared to having to power off and make the change in the setup menu. (I wish they'd add "on the fly" closed caption enable/disable, as well.)

No. "On the fly" means that the user can change it "on the fly". Changinging without intervention would be "native passthrough".

I realize the OP wants no user intervention. However, pushing a button from the remote (if you have one that's programmable), or reaching over and pushing one on the front panel, is a fairly easy compromise compared to having to power off and make the change in the setup menu. (I wish they'd add "on the fly" closed caption enable/disable, as well.)

Okay, so you're looking for an easy(button on remote) method of changing the res. As already noted by others, that's not an option with the current crop of cable boxes. With the TiVo boxes it is.

You're probably correct on the terminology, to me though, "on the fly" is synonymous with "native passthrough", I don't have to do anything for it to happen, I change the channel and the output is changed as well. I just wouldn't call having to hit a button every time I change the channel to be "on the fly", but what ever works. :D


BTW, Happy Holidays to every one here in the thread, went and saw the Nutcracker last night at the War Memorial Opera House, what a great way to spend Christmas Eve. :)

This reminds me of the good old HiPix PC product which had a feature that did exactly that... it would render video at the original broadcast resolution without scaling the picture. In fact, you could see the OSD showing 720p, 1080i, 480i, etc as you would flip through the channels. However, this was only for OTA ATSC, not cableTV.

True on the fly would mean the output changes automatically to what ever the channel is broadcast at. I'm not sure about the DCH boxes, but the earlier versions required the user to power it down and change the output manually. Even if powering down is not required on the DCH boxes I think some user interaction is required, it doesn't do it automatically like a TiVo does.

This reminds me of the good old HiPix PC product which had a feature that did exactly that... it would render video at the original broadcast resolution without scaling the picture. In fact, you could see the OSD showing 720p, 1080i, 480i, etc as you would flip through the channels. However, this was only for OTA ATSC, not cableTV.Yep, and MyHD also has such a feature--for both OTA and (clear QAM) cable TV. :)

The sad part is this is a feature common to just about everything but the Comcast Moto boxes. Is it really too much to ask to let the damn thing just pass the signal? Surely this is a firmware update away, given that we asking for 'less' from the box in the way of cpu/processing/memory etc.. right? =\

Okay, so you're looking for an easy(button on remote) method of changing the res. As already noted by others, that's not an option with the current crop of cable boxes. With the TiVo boxes it is.
I thought it was already established that the DCH boxes have that ability. No?

I thought it was already established that the DCH boxes have that ability. No?

I thought it was a button on the box, you had to operate it on the box, there is no remote button that will do it? IOW, you have to get up, go to the box and hit the button to change the resolution. Doesn't seem very practical. That's how I read it anyway, I could certainly be wrong though.

you know, i would actually be ok as long as i didn't have to power off the box: as noted before, that kills any recordings in progress / zeros out your buffer / has negative WAF / etc.

front panel button press would be marginally acceptable but of course it means walking across the room and yes, half the time that wouldn't be worth it.

so for now sounds like i could replace my DCT with a DCH box for starters.

the biggest remaining quesiton is: is there a way to configure a universal remote to cycle through the available resolutions?

thanks all!

It's possible with a DCH box, and at least with a Logitech remote. It should be possible with any programmable remote.

I've noticed that recent broadcasts of the News Hour with Jim Lehrer on KQEDDT Comcast 709 have not been in HD, despite the fact that the info display on my Tivo says the broadcast is 1080i. The picture is a 16:9 aspect ratio, but shrunk by about 10% (black bars on all sides) and is a dim, low-res picture, not the normal vivid hi-def broadcast. Is anyone else seeing this, and is it a Comcast problem or PBS? Other programs on KQEDDT 709 are still hi-def, so it doesn't appear to be my equipment. Just curious...

Supposedly you can program a remote button to toggle the resolution on the DCH boxes. I have a DCT, so haven't been able to test it. Here is the AVS post about it:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=13524611#post13524611

I've noticed that recent broadcasts of the News Hour with Jim Lehrer on KQEDDT Comcast 709 have not been in HD, despite the fact that the info display on my Tivo says the broadcast is 1080i. The picture is a 16:9 aspect ratio, but shrunk by about 10% (black bars on all sides) and is a dim, low-res picture, not the normal vivid hi-def broadcast. Is anyone else seeing this, and is it a Comcast problem or PBS? Other programs on KQEDDT 709 are still hi-def, so it doesn't appear to be my equipment. Just curious...

It's that way OTA too, so it's coming from KQED that way.

Larry
SF

Supposedly you can program a remote button to toggle the resolution on the DCH boxes. I have a DCT, so haven't been able to test it. Here is the AVS post about it:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=13524611#post13524611
ah- very helpful. thank you! can't wait to swap out my STB. not sure why i didn't ask these questions earlier...

Supposedly you can program a remote button to toggle the resolution on the DCH boxes. I have a DCT, so haven't been able to test it. Here is the AVS post about it:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=13524611#post13524611

Thanks SO MUCH for point this out!! It's something I've been wanting to have for a long time. (I didn't know of this thread, and have now subscribed to it.)

It works like a charm, really makes it convenient to cycle through the various output resolutions. This is where the Forum really shines!

Does anyone know where to find a listing of the resolution output of the various HD channels. I.e., which are 1080i and which are 720p.

Does anyone know where to find a listing of the resolution output of the various HD channels. I.e., which are 1080i and which are 720p.

For national channels, the below link is a good resource,

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=164671

Locally,

KTVU - 720p
KNTV - 1080i
KRON - 1080i
KPIX - 1080i
KGO - 720p
KQED - 1080i
KBCW - 1080i

May be a few left out...

For national channels, the below link is a good resource,

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=164671

Locally,

KTVU - 720p
KNTV - 1080i
KRON - 1080i
KPIX - 1080i
KGO - 720p
KQED - 1080i
KBCW - 1080i

May be a few left out...

Perfect! Thanks much.

IOW, all HD OTA stations are 1080i, except KGO, KTVU, and KICU (the one Keenan missed).

IOW, all HD OTA stations are 1080i, except KGO, KTVU, and KICU (the one Keenan missed).

KOFY is 720P too.

Larry
SF

Of course--how silly of me to forget KOFY/KBWB! :D

That makes it nearly 50:50 in HD format choice around here so that my "all but..." comment above isn't really warranted.

I think KRCB - Rohnert Park is also doing some 1080i broadcasts, but it's not available via Comcast that I'm aware of.

KOFY is 720P too.

Larry
SF

What sub channel is KOFY HD on in San Francisco?

KOFY is not on Comcast either. At least it isn't in my area and I haven't heard of it being on Comcast in any other BA city.

KOFY is not on Comcast either. At least it isn't in my area and I haven't heard of it being on Comcast in any other BA city.
Try channel 13 or channel 196, that's where it's at in my area but there's no HD channel.

Laters,
Mikef5

Does anyone know if the HDTV charge is supposed to be a one time charge on the account or is it per box? I have two $7 charges on my account one called "High Definition TV" and one called "HDTV Additional Service". I spoke with someone and they said it was per box, but that doesn't sound right as I didn't have this before.

I have cablecards and a box. My bill is at $250 a month and I need to figure out a way to lower it!

The HDTV charge is for the HD set top box rental only, not programming. That fee is per box.

Try channel 13 or channel 196, that's where it's at in my area but there's no HD channel.

Laters,
Mikef5

Yes the SD channel is there but not the HD channel. I thought we were talking about the HD channel. I suppose that will show up sooner or .... later. :D

Yes the SD channel is there but not the HD channel. I thought we were talking about the HD channel. I suppose that will show up sooner or .... later. :D

I surely wouldn't hold my breath on waiting for the KOFY HD channel being added anytime soon and as soon as I get permission to post I'll let you know why :(

Laters,
Mikef5

I surely wouldn't hold my breath on waiting for the KOFY HD channel being added anytime soon and as soon as I get permission to post I'll let you know why :(

Laters,
Mikef5

Do you happen to have permission to discuss the status of bringing DOCSIS 3.0 here? :D I ask because next week is the last week of the year and the rumors suggested we, as one of the top 10 markets, would have DOCSIS 3.0 by the end of the year.

Thanks.

Do you happen to have permission to discuss the status of bringing DOCSIS 3.0 here? :D I ask because next week is the last week of the year and the rumors suggested we, as one of the top 10 markets, would have DOCSIS 3.0 by the end of the year.

Thanks.

No, but it's all tied together. He did say they would be making an announcement after the holidays so until then..... :-X

Laters,
Mikef5

HD boxes (DCT-6200) are $7 each, per month.
Actually the 2nd+ one is $6.99 "additional outlet fee" plus the $7 = $13.99/mo.

Awhile ago they had a promotion for a free converter, so I got the CSR to give me a rebate on the $6.99 outlet fee for 1 year, then when it ran out I called back to complain and she gave me another 12 months rebate on half of it ($3.50).

Basically the thing is you have to call and complain and threaten to switch to satellite or something and they will transfer you to their "retention" department where you can get deals.

Sheesh, those charges are like Chinese torture, death by a thousand cuts. :p

$13.99 a month for the 2nd standard HD converter box? Yikes! Limited Basic programing is only around $15-$22 depending on area.

If it weren't for my need of cable cards because of my media center I'd switch over to DTV. So I'm paying 28 buxs for two extra boxes a month! Comcast is killing me with all the fees.

From KQED:

Thanks for your note. This is a temporary problem with the 3pm broadcast, which is the direct airing of a live satellite feed.

PBS moved the HD feed of the NewsHour to a different satellite transbonder effective 12/22/08. Apparently we're lacking some piece of equipment that will allow us to put that feed directly on air on the HD channel. So at 3pm, we can take only the SD feed and upconvert it for use on the HD channel, resulting in that broadcast being breadboxed. Then we're recording the 4pm HD feed, and as long as the NewsHour doesn't change their show between 4p & 6pm, airing the recorded version on the HD channel at 6pm. If they do update the show for the 6p feed, then you'll end up seeing the same breadbox during that broadcast as well.

The current assumption is we'll be getting whatever piece of equipment we need some time in January, but I don't have a more specific target date. But the 3pm problem should resolve itself within the next several weeks.


I've noticed that recent broadcasts of the News Hour with Jim Lehrer on KQEDDT Comcast 709 have not been in HD, despite the fact that the info display on my Tivo says the broadcast is 1080i. The picture is a 16:9 aspect ratio, but shrunk by about 10% (black bars on all sides) and is a dim, low-res picture, not the normal vivid hi-def broadcast. Is anyone else seeing this, and is it a Comcast problem or PBS? Other programs on KQEDDT 709 are still hi-def, so it doesn't appear to be my equipment. Just curious...

From KQED:

But the 3pm problem should resolve itself within the next several weeks.

Don't you just love that phrase? I suspect what they really mean is the situation will be resolved, I'm not aware of any problem of that nature that can "resolve itself". :p:D

If it weren't for my need of cable cards because of my media center I'd switch over to DTV. So I'm paying 28 buxs for two extra boxes a month! Comcast is killing me with all the fees.

It may be killing you, but you're Comcast's favorite customer (One who pays all the fees they throw at you and feel you're locked into them with no way out... and they didnt even have to try ;)

So I'm paying 28 buxs for two extra boxes a month! Comcast is killing me with all the fees.

$28 is a relatively small portion of your $250 bill. Do you want to replace two HD boxes with a dual-tuner DVR, for ~$5 less?

I just have to ask, what are you spending $250 a month on with Comcast, do you contribute to their 401K program or something? That's an insane amount of money.

I just have to ask, what are you spending $250 a month on with Comcast, do you contribute to their 401K program or something? That's an insane amount of money.

Agreed. My bill is about $200/month and that's with Preferred Plus, 2 DVR's, 2 CableCARDs, Blast Internet, and digital phone.

To be fair, DTV charges $5.99/mo for extra receivers beyond the 1st, and you have to purchase them upfront too. I paid $99 for the 2nd receiver (HD, non-DVR) and will pay $5.99/mo. for it. So in a 18mo. contract it works out to about $11.50/mo.

That said, the HD-DVR ($199) was free, along with the Slimline-5 dish, installation (over 4 hours including mucking around in the crawlspace), etc.. and HD and DVR are included in a ~$75 base package that has more HD channels than the Comcast equiv. for about $85-95 (plus the HD/DVR fees, franchise fees, taxes, etc..)

The down? side is you own the equipment, which only has a 90-day warranty unless you sign up for their service plan. If not, and it breaks, you are SOL. If you want to upgrade to the hot new model, you have to open your wallet. Naturally there are upsides to owning it too, such as if you want to replace the HDD, or if you just want to purchase a new box whenever you want, you can.

Nothing's perfect, cable still makes sense for some people, though with Comcast increasing their prices.. what 2 times a year lately? They are pricing themselves out of the market - at least they finally did for me....

Yet another price question. I have two cable cards now. If I were to exchange one card for a HD tuner box, do I have to pay more, and if so, how much? I'm on the Digital Starter plan. The online chat rep said that I do not have to pay more, but I have trouble believing that.

...
The down? side is you own the equipment, which only has a 90-day warranty unless you sign up for their service plan. If not, and it breaks, you are SOL.
...You don't own DirecTV equipment (receivers, DVRs) at that price, it is a lease and you are obligated to return if you terminate service. It was formerly owned before 2006. If it breaks and you don't pay for the Protection Plan, they will still replace for shipping charges (receivers, DVRs) or a service call (dish, dish alignment, LNB, mutiswitch, wiring).

Good suggestion - I did go through the channel setup. I am 100% positive I have the correct user guide for our area. A couple of years ago a Comcast rep was outside the house and in chatting with me he showed me the maps of the areas and the upgrade plans. Literally 1 street over in 2 directions is 2 other distinct Comcast service areas. So when I call I ask if anything has changed. The answer is no.

I can only conclude that we in the San Mateo Digitial coverage area will be getting the channels, its just that Comcast is going about it in a very Comcast sort of way.

In the end its sort of one of those "can't wait to have it, but once I do what's the big deal?". I do look forward to Speed HD, which I pay for.

Maybe they will give it to us for Christmas???
I had a similar problem when I installed a new TIVO HD with CableCards on 12/22 - the setup asked me what I get on channel 26, which is now blank (it used to be C-SPAN 2); when I told it that it was blank, the listings came up saying that I did not receive any non-local HD stations. When I redid the channel setup and said that C-SPAN 2 was still on channel 26, some of the non-local HD listings (e.g. CNN-HD) returned; however, some channels (e.g. Cartoon Network HD) are available if you enter the channel number, but the left-side guide listing is always "To Be Announced" and the right-side guide listing is blank, which has the added "feature" of automatically ignoring any attempts to record, or even schedule a manual recording on, those channels.

EDIT: I just did another channel scan (12/30), with channel 26 listed as blank, and all of the non-local HD channels still have no listings in the guide (for that matter, if I switch the guide to "Channels I Receive", the channels disappear from the left side of the guide as well).

-- Don

Yet another price question. I have two cable cards now. If I were to exchange one card for a HD tuner box, do I have to pay more, and if so, how much? I'm on the Digital Starter plan. The online chat rep said that I do not have to pay more, but I have trouble believing that.

That depends on how much you're paying/over-paying for the cards now.

For national channels, the below link is a good resource,

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=164671

Locally,

KTVU - 720p
KNTV - 1080i
KRON - 1080i
KPIX - 1080i
KGO - 720p
KQED - 1080i
KBCW - 1080i

May be a few left out...
and let's not forget my "discovery" that comcast sports HD in our area is 1080i. see
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=15098484&postcount=8208

clearly the national feeds are well known, and the local ones will almost certainly broadcast the same format as their OTA equivalent. but comcast sports net bay area doesn't really fall in either category and tends to get left off of all these lists.

You don't own DirecTV equipment (receivers, DVRs) at that price, it is a lease and you are obligated to return if you terminate service. It was formerly owned before 2006. If it breaks and you don't pay for the Protection Plan, they will still replace for shipping charges (receivers, DVRs) or a service call (dish, dish alignment, LNB, mutiswitch, wiring).

That's correct, and as far as I know, that PP basically saves you the shipping costs? I don't remember exactly what the PP is for.

That's correct, and as far as I know, that PP basically saves you the shipping costs? I don't remember exactly what the PP is for.
Basically, the PP saves the costs of shipping and service calls. The PP was much more an advantage when equipment was owned.

Basically, the PP saves the costs of shipping and service calls. The PP was much more an advantage when equipment was owned.

Thanks. :)

That depends on how much you're paying/over-paying for the cards now.

Currently paying $59.95 for the Digital Starter package, $1.79 for a cable card, and a questionable $6.99 for a Digital Additional Outlet. I said questionable because I was not charged that amount a few months ago when I had two cable cards. In October, I got a tuner box, and they started charging me the additional outlet fee. I have returned the box since then, but the additional outlet fee still stays :(.

I am asking because it seems like I should get a tuner box instead of one of the cable card if there is no difference in my payment. I chatted online with Comcast a couple of times, and did not get consistent answers.

Currently paying $59.95 for the Digital Starter package, $1.79 for a cable card, and a questionable $6.99 for a Digital Additional Outlet. I said questionable because I was not charged that amount a few months ago when I had two cable cards.
Two cards for one outlet = $1.79. Correct.

In October, I got a tuner box, and they started charging me the additional outlet fee.
Now you had two outlets. Correct.

I have returned the box since then, but the additional outlet fee still stays :(.
Wrong charge.

Earlier this month I returned two CableCards, but my bill stayed exactly the same as before. Had to contact Comcast to make the correction.

Getting a HD box will cost you $7 more.

Two cards for one outlet = $1.79. Correct.


Now you had two outlets. Correct.


Wrong charge.

Earlier this month I returned two CableCards, but my bill stayed exactly the same as before. Had to contact Comcast to make the correction.

Getting a HD box will cost you $7 more.

It's nice to know that if you're getting 2 CableCards, they don't necessarily add on the additional outlet fee. I thought they might just assume that the second cable card goes with an additional outlet.

If they charge $6.99 for the second card, then the $1.79 fee should not be there, since $6.99 includes one SD box OR one card.

It's nice to know that if you're getting 2 CableCards, they don't necessarily add on the additional outlet fee. I thought they might just assume that the second cable card goes with an additional outlet.
I just had a third HDTV "outlet" installed - two with Cable Cards, and one with a box - and I have two $6.99 "digital additional outlet" charges but only one $7 HDTV charge.

(The bad news is, that runs my monthly bill up to $122, and that's without phone or internet service.)

-- Don

I have 3 HD cableboxes running off a cable splitter through just one outlet on my wall in my bedroom. 2 of my cablebox, I own... I only lease one cable box. However, my bill says I'm paying for 3 outlets. Should I call Comcast and tell them I only use one outlet?

I just had a third HDTV "outlet" installed - two with Cable Cards, and one with a box - and I have two $6.99 "digital additional outlet" charges but only one $7 HDTV charge.

(The bad news is, that runs my monthly bill up to $122, and that's without phone or internet service.)

-- Don

I have 3 HD cableboxes running off a cable splitter through just one outlet on my wall in my bedroom. 2 of my cablebox, I own... I only lease one cable box. However, my bill says I'm paying for 3 outlets. Should I call Comcast and tell them I only use one outlet?

Are you really serious with this question?

Yes I am.

Are you really serious with this question?

An outlet is a device -- nothing to do with the physical connection on the wall. Since you have 3 boxes, you have to pay for 2 additional outlet charges.

MLB Network is on Comcast channel 412 (at least in the Alamo/Danville area) in SD (running pre-recorded loops until 3:00 PM PST on January 1, when it goes live).

Does anyone know if Comcast is planning to create an HD channel for it, and when? Thanks -- and happy New Year to everyone here for the information and entertainment over the past year!

ooh okay. I didnt realize Comcast referred to cableboxes as outlets. I thought an outlet mean an outlet on the wall the cablebox plugs into.

An outlet is a device -- nothing to do with the physical connection on the wall. Since you have 3 boxes, you have to pay for 2 additional outlet charges.

An outlet is a device -- nothing to do with the physical connection on the wall. Since you have 3 boxes, you have to pay for 2 additional outlet charges.

Not quite right. He has 2 customer owned boxes. I think it's outrageous for Comcast to be charging him the equivalent of a STB rental fee for boxes that HE purchased and HE maintains.

Completely ridiculous. If you charge for boxes, fine, if you charge for "outlets" fine, but charging everyone for both seems like a ripoff.

Not quite right. He has 2 customer owned boxes. I think it's outrageous for Comcast to be charging him the equivalent of a STB rental fee for boxes that HE purchased and HE maintains.

Completely ridiculous. If you charge for boxes, fine, if you charge for "outlets" fine, but charging everyone for both seems like a ripoff.

The outlet charge is very unfair and just extra profit for Comcast. He must have cable cards in his 2 owned boxes and that is why he is being charged.

The additional digital outlet is a programming fee. DirecTV does the same thing by charging for each additional STB active on your account. However, if you have two cable cards in one device like a Tivo, you should only have to pay one ADO. clau said he had digital starter and two cable cards plus a Comcast STB. This should have one ADO fee because Digital Starter includes the first "outlet". When he returned the STB, the ADO fee should have been removed if both cable cards were in a Tivo or other dual tuner device.

- Mike

The additional digital outlet is a programming fee. DirecTV does the same thing by charging for each additional STB active on your account. However, if you have two cable cards in one device like a Tivo, you should only have to pay one ADO. clau said he had digital starter and two cable cards plus a Comcast STB. This should have one ADO fee because Digital Starter includes the first "outlet". When he returned the STB, the ADO fee should have been removed if both cable cards were in a Tivo or other dual tuner device.

- Mike

Nonsense. It's supposed to be an STB leasing fee. Go look up the filings from the cable operaors on the breakdown of the fee. If it were a programming based fee, it would vary depending on what package you have. The fee is the same for someone who has basic cable or someone who has every single premium channel in existence. You are just plain wrong on this.

So if you have a normal SD STB, they charge you for a digital outlet fee (6.99/mon). If you lease a cablecard, it's 6.99/month. For MKAnet, like me, who has a couple DCP501's that were BOUGHT by us, they charge us 6.99/month! That is not for leasing anything! Everything is bought be the consumer - no cablecard, nothing. It's an outrage. They didn't use to charge for this in fact.

Nonsense. It's supposed to be an STB leasing fee. Go look up the filings from the cable operaors on the breakdown of the fee. If it were a programming based fee, it would vary depending on what package you have. The fee is the same for someone who has basic cable or someone who has every single premium channel in existence. You are just plain wrong on this.

So if you have a normal SD STB, they charge you for a digital outlet fee (6.99/mon). If you lease a cablecard, it's 6.99/month. For MKAnet, like me, who has a couple DCP501's that were BOUGHT by us, they charge us 6.99/month! That is not for leasing anything! Everything is bought be the consumer - no cablecard, nothing. It's an outrage. They didn't use to charge for this in fact.

I agree, it's the nickel and dime you to death scenario and I believe this is a response to the analog days when you could hookup as many TV as the incoming signal strength would support yet you only paid for the one inbound connection to the premise. Cable looked upon that as "theft". IMO, ADO charges are a pile of steaming BS and just a way for the cableco to extract every last dollar they can from you. If you pay for an incoming connection(the subscription), it shouldn't matter how many devices it's hooked up to. If you rent their equipment, fine, charge for that equipment, but if it's customer owned equipment there should be, at worst, an activation fee only with no ADO monthly charges.

Nonsense. It's supposed to be an STB leasing fee. Go look up the filings from the cable operaors on the breakdown of the fee. If it were a programming based fee, it would vary depending on what package you have. The fee is the same for someone who has basic cable or someone who has every single premium channel in existence. You are just plain wrong on this.
I agree the additional outlet fee is non-sense.

The way Comcast has structured their play on words is that the additional outlet fee is a "digital mirroring" fee which is a programming fee that doesn't depend on which programming you get. They then go on to claim the additional outlet fee includes a "free" device, whether that be STB or CableCARD. This is utterly non-sense, as we all know this fee goes towards leasing the equipment and we didn't get anything for free.

Comcast in our area is especially bad with the "free" equipment word play. Other areas actually have separate fees for "mirroring" and for "leasing". It might still add up to around $6.99 per outlet if you use their equipment, but if you provide your own equipment, then you only pay the "mirroring" fee and the "leasing" fee drops off. Comcast in our area just bundles up everything into the additional outlet fee and says the equipment is free, so there is no way you can separate them.

BTW in reality the fee isn't the same for everyone whether they have basic cable or every premium. Basic cable (just analog cable) doesn't have the fee because your equipment just works. When you move to digital they need to enter your box #s into their system and that is where they start dinging you.

BTW in reality the fee isn't the same for everyone whether they have basic cable or every premium. Basic cable (just cable) doesn't have the fee because your equipment just works. When you move to digital they need to enter your box #s into their system and that is where they start dinging you.

The activation, which should be a one-time expense, not a monthly raping of your wallet.

The activation, which should be a one-time expense, not a monthly raping of your wallet.
Agree it should be a one-time *event*. However, those fees whether recurring or one-time, we can leave in the round-file :)

happy new years everyone. MLB network showed up on 412 today, i believe it is the launch date for that channel. anyone know if we're gonna have the HD channel too? not showing up in my tivo guide yet.

I'm sure as the economy gets worse people are going to start looking at their cable bills and how much money they are throwing away monthly. Then Comcast and other cable and even DBS companies will be in trouble. If they haven't thought out how to adjust to this they'll probably be flying in on their corporate jets to beg in front of Congress.

For the amount of money I put out I get very little back but I am a very selective viewer. I don't watch drivel just because it is in HD. And as the novelty of having some shows in HD wears off otherse become more selective. Besides these companies are competing with some new technologies that can knock them off their mountain such as Blu-Ray and Internet driven services.

the cable industry has a business model and it still works. they offer choice. i like being able to choose ESPN (or being able to catch the giants on comcast sports net). can't do that with OTA. my wife likes being able to watch VOD. can't do that with limited basic. yes, if we both lost our jobs, we would revisit our decision to spend over $1500/yr on having that much *choice* with respect to TV media consumption. but overall the "what-i-want-when-i-want" price proposition still does work for a lot of people.

happy new years everyone. MLB network showed up on 412 today, i believe it is the launch date for that channel. anyone know if we're gonna have the HD channel too? not showing up in my tivo guide yet.

Yes, Happy New Years to all. Let's hope this year is a better one...

MLB Network showed up on my Tivo as well...412. No sign of the HD channel yet.

For the $6.99/mo. you DO get a cable box, that's what the fee is for.

It's a non-HD box though. If you want a HD box that's another $7/mo. :(

For the $6.99/mo. you DO get a cable box, that's what the fee is for.
According to Comcast in our area, that isn't what the fee is for.

Again, according to them, the fee is for your outlet (ie some database entry that has the relevant # for your box so your activation and decryption works). One cable box (or cablecard) is included Free with your outlet.

That is the reason they use (which a few people earlier, including myself, don't agree with) to justify having people pay the full outlet fee when you provide your own equipment.

Of course we all know in reality, the outlet fee is going (at least partially) towards leasing the cable box.

Yes, that explains why when someone has 2 cable cards using cable connections split off from one outlet, they get charged for 1 outlet.

I'm not sure how/where it came to be that an outlet means a cable box thats customer owned or leased; however, additional cablecards dont apply.

According to Comcast in our area, that isn't what the fee is for.

Again, according to them, the fee is for your outlet (ie some database entry that has the relevant # for your box so your activation and decryption works). One cable box (or cablecard) is included Free with your outlet.

That is the reason they use (which a few people earlier, including myself, don't agree with) to justify having people pay the full outlet fee when you provide your own equipment.

Of course we all know in reality, the outlet fee is going (at least partially) towards leasing the cable box.

To further confuse the outlet/cable box fee...
If you have a customer owned cableCARD device (TV, TiVo, etc.) on your primary outlet, then Comcast should give you an SD cable box (HD box adds $7/mo.) to use on the same primary outlet for VOD and PPV. See the 2nd to last answer in this FAQ at Comcast here (http://www.comcast.com/customers/faq/FaqDetails.ashx?ID=2540). It worked for me but I had to take a copy of the FAQ to my local office and make my case.

I don't know what they call it "for", and they probably have conflicting answers depending on who you ask, what phase the moon is in, etc... but they gave me a small digital box for the "extra outlet" at first. It was small, looked like a radar detector, and only had composite video and L/R analog audio. I returned it and upgraded to the HD box for $5/month then - which has since gone up to $7.

On the Comcast side of things it's listed as "free money!!", on our side of it, it's listed as what ever they want to confuse the customer. :p:D

Anyone suddenly stop getting the KRON digital channel? It used to be on 4-2 for me, but not it's gone.

Anyone suddenly stop getting the KRON digital channel? It used to be on 4-2 for me, but not it's gone.

they mentioned something the other day about upgrading their equipment, but I thought it only effected people who are recieving their digital signal through an antenna.

Anyone suddenly stop getting the KRON digital channel? It used to be on 4-2 for me, but not it's gone.

KRON migrated from 4-2 to 111-8 on our set. Not sure when exactly, though, since before yesterday afternoon I hadn't tried tuning it in for at least a few days.


EDIT: It figures...I just turned on my TV again and it's back to 4-2.

Yes, that explains why when someone has 2 cable cards using cable connections split off from one outlet, they get charged for 1 outlet.

I'm not sure how/where it came to be that an outlet means a cable box thats customer owned or leased; however, additional cablecards dont apply.
You are mixing up the outlet and the included (free) device. The outlet is still associated with a single STB, PVR, or TV regardless of which included device you choose.

According to Comcast in our area, your additional outlet fee gets you 1 included device. You can choose a STB or a CableCARD.

In the case of the STB, that is what is considered your outlet. In the case of something like TiVo, the PVR is what is considered your outlet, with the first CableCARD included in the outlet fee. If that same TiVo needs a second CableCARD it is $1.79.

However if you have a 2nd physical TiVo unit split off the same physical outlet (plug in the wall), that is considered a 2nd digital outlet and requires another additional outlet fee. In the digital world, there is no association between a physical outlet (ie plug in the wall) and the outlet they are charging you for.

So basically STB = outlet. CableCARD does not necessarily = outlet. CableCARD is placed in a device that = outlet. That device may need more than one CableCARD. Only one CableCARD is included in the outlet fee. Additional CableCARDs for that particular device are $1.79.

I don't agree with how they charge, but their story is consistent.

KRON migrated from 4-2 to 111-8 on our set. Not sure when exactly, though, since before yesterday afternoon I hadn't tried tuning it in for at least a few days.


EDIT: It figures...I just turned on my TV again and it's back to 4-2.
4.2 is a virtual channel mapping for ease of use. The physical channel is likely still somewhere in the 100s, possibly 111.8 or 111.N. Many TVs will let you tune the virtually mapped channel with both the virtual and physical channels so 4.2 and 111.8 would probably both get you KRON (depending on your TV) When you don't see 4.2 that means you lost the PSIP virtual channel mapping. That is independent from whether the physical channel moved.

On the Comcast side of things it's listed as "free money!!", on our side of it, it's listed as what ever they want to confuse the customer. :p:D
I guess that is what they mean by double-entry bookkeeping :) I think Madoff used the same system but marketed it differently to his customers :)

^lol

4.2 is a virtual channel mapping for ease of use. The physical channel is likely still somewhere in the 100s, possibly 111.8 or 111.N. Many TVs will let you tune the virtually mapped channel with both the virtual and physical channels so 4.2 and 111.8 would probably both get you KRON (depending on your TV) When you don't see 4.2 that means you lost the PSIP virtual channel mapping. That is independent from whether the physical channel moved.

That sounds awesome. Wish the lna450 can do that.

On the Comcast side of things it's listed as "free money!!", on our side of it, it's listed as what ever they want to confuse the customer. :p:D
Comcast is charging $1.79 monthly for a dual-card for my Tivo. There is also a charge of $0.20 monthly for a remote, even though I don't rent a set top box from Comcast.

I am too lazy to dispute the charge.

I'm considering getting a Tivo DVR for use with Comcast. On the Tivo website it discusses single-stream CableCARDs (S-card) and multi-stream CableCARDs (M-card): to tune 2 channels at once I need 1 M-card or 2 S-cards.

How do I find out whether the Comcast head-end supports M-cards? Is there an advantage to the M-card, or are 2 S-cards exactly equivalent? Will Comcast charge differently?

Thanks for the help,
Mark Z.

I have no idea if there's any way to know what kind of card you'll get. My cousin in Sunnyvale just got a Tivo HD for Christmas. He returned the old Moto digi-cable box and they gave him an M-card over the counter. He had a hell of a time getting the Tivo and CableCard to work. Many calls to Comcast, exchange on the Tivo box and a Comcast technician visit to get it all paired correctly and it finally did work correctly. This is the first time I've heard of Comcast giving any CableCards over the counter in the south bay, much less an M-card.

BTW, M-card will only work in TivoHD. Series 3 must use two S-cards.

- Mike

Mark Z, most likely you will get a M-card unless you get a S3 Tivo. I have 3 other friends that picked up the M-card so they can get the guide data mapping for their HD local channels with the limited basic service. We are around Sunnyvale, west San Jose, Mountain View & Fremont area. We just picked up the cable card at a local Comcast office.

I think only one person was successful pairing the cable card the first time.
I got mine working on the 2nd card, the same with one friend. Another friend ended up having the truck roll since they were getting the VOIP service installed as well.

I have since upgraded mine to a digital service. It works quite well, but I can't use the Comcast on-demand service through Tivo.

How do I find out whether the Comcast head-end supports M-cards? Is there an advantage to the M-card, or are 2 S-cards exactly equivalent? Will Comcast charge differently?

Most cards are M-cards now. 1 card is free, unless you have other devices on your account. 2 cards would have an additional $1.79/month charge.

This is the first time I've heard of Comcast giving any CableCards over the counter in the south bay, much less an M-card.
That has been available in the Bay Area for about a year now, IIRC.

BTW, M-card will only work in TivoHD. Series 3 must use two S-cards.
M-card works fine in S3, but you still need two of them. BTW, "Series 3" is really the family/generation name, not the model, since TiVoHD is also part of Series3.

I just installed a TiVoHD for a relative in Concord tonight. The first call to Comcast paired the card correctly, but the encrypted channels did not work. Another call fixed that issue.

Before you call Comcast to activate the card, I would highly recommend scanning the channels and check the signal levels first. If the signal is poor, you're likely to have many issues, including activation.

After the card is inserted into the TiVo, check the Network Setup screen to make sure you are getting the OOB messages. If not, nothing will work. Let the card sit for 15-30 minutes while it upgrades the firmware. You can check the status on the CableCard Status screen. After that is done, then call Comcast for activation.

I'm considering getting a Tivo DVR for use with Comcast. On the Tivo website it discusses single-stream CableCARDs (S-card) and multi-stream CableCARDs (M-card): to tune 2 channels at once I need 1 M-card or 2 S-cards.

How do I find out whether the Comcast head-end supports M-cards?
Well, you can do it the way I did it recently; plug an M-card into the CableCard 1 slot, have it authorized/paired, then see if you can tune into different digital channels on the two tuners. (I actually recorded about a minute on each one simultaneously, just to be sure that the one card was working with both tuners, as opposed to just one tuner changing channels.)

By the way - mine worked the first time.
(Well, sort of - Comcast detected the card, but then I had to remove it as I had not written down its serial number, and when I put it back in, it didn't automatically bring up the pairing information data after a minute or so like it did the first time; I had to switch screens manually to see it.)

-- Don

You are mixing up the outlet and the included (free) device. The outlet is still associated with a single STB, PVR, or TV regardless of which included device you choose.

According to Comcast in our area, your additional outlet fee gets you 1 included device. You can choose a STB or a CableCARD.

In the case of the STB, that is what is considered your outlet. In the case of something like TiVo, the PVR is what is considered your outlet, with the first CableCARD included in the outlet fee. If that same TiVo needs a second CableCARD it is $1.79.

However if you have a 2nd physical TiVo unit split off the same physical outlet (plug in the wall), that is considered a 2nd digital outlet and requires another additional outlet fee. In the digital world, there is no association between a physical outlet (ie plug in the wall) and the outlet they are charging you for.

So basically STB = outlet. CableCARD does not necessarily = outlet. CableCARD is placed in a device that = outlet. That device may need more than one CableCARD. Only one CableCARD is included in the outlet fee. Additional CableCARDs for that particular device are $1.79.

I don't agree with how they charge, but their story is consistent.

Actually I don't think they have a consistent story. Every time I called/chatted, I had a 50% chance of getting one of two answers to the CableCard outlet question :).

FWIW, after calling and complaining, here is what they seem to agree on my bill:

I have two cable cards plugging into two TV's. The first card is free with the Digital Starter package. The second card they agree to charge me $1.79 without the DAO or HDTV fee. I am happier now, assuming the change will actually show up in my bill next time. I don't miss VOD at all, even though on paper there are a lot of stuff I should want to watch.

I think "c3" had them figured out. If I were to exchange one of my cablecards for a STB, then I would have to pay the DAO and possibly the HDTV fee. However, the HDTV fee may be waived if you are persistent enough and have time to complain :).

Also when you call/chat, ask them for any promotion they might have. You never know. One time someone offered me the Digital Preferred package for $43/month for 6 months. At the time, I didn't know what that package had over Digital Starter, so I did not take it. I probably should have, even though I don't need the Digital Preferred package.

I had to remove it as I had not written down its serial number

BTW, the serial number is on the pairing screen.

I had time over the holidays so I had Comcast over to my house 3 times with nearly 8 hours of service. I am in San Carlos, and have Triple Play (or whatever its called). Here is what I discovered, though it might not be relevant to many other areas or even to HD.

1) After 8 hours on the pole and under the house we maxed out the signal strength to the TVs and phone/cable modem. You can check your modem signal strength at 192.168.100.1. I started at around -8dB on downstream and ended up around +11dB. All fixes were very small changes, but added up to a lot.

2) I discovered I am in a 705Mhz area (probably 680???). But then why HD and On Demand, I though 680MHz areas didnt get that?

3) There was NO ANSWER as to why TIVO got the new channels but they are still not showing up through COMCAST box. They did confirm that channels are not out in our area yet.

4) I pay for blast but wasn't getting blast speeds. Two issues - Low signal strength will impede the rate, as will OLD routers. My Linksys BESFR41 limited to 10Mb WAN (6Mb down and 3M up were actuals). Upgraded and saw speeds of 21Mb and 3M).

Just some observations I thought I might pass on that might help others.

1) After 8 hours on the pole and under the house we maxed out the signal strength to the TVs and phone/cable modem. You can check your modem signal strength at 192.168.100.1. I started at around -8dB on downstream and ended up around +11dB. All fixes were very small changes, but added up to a lot.



Actually, if I'm not mistaken, that +11dB is right near the upper limit of "acceptable", a reading of around 0dB would be optimum. I believe anything between -12dB to +12dB is "okay", but the closer to 0dB the better.

New Comcast throttling system

http://www.dslreports.com/shownews/New-Comcast-Throttling-System-100-Online-100015

To any of you that have contacts/connections with Comcast insiders:
Do we have any reliable information that suggests what we can expect in the way of additional linear HD channels after the mid-february digital conversion? Will that even be a factor that will allow Comcast to increase the number of HDs or will the Bay Area continue to plod along with infrequent additions of questionable value?

To any of you that have contacts/connections with Comcast insiders:
Do we have any reliable information that suggests what we can expect in the way of additional linear HD channels after the mid-february digital conversion? Will that even be a factor that will allow Comcast to increase the number of HDs or will the Bay Area continue to plod along with infrequent additions of questionable value?

The DTV conversion has no short term impact on Comcast. Comcast does not receive the signals from OTA anyway, and the analog SD signal you see today is being downconverted from the HD source. So no impact.

The DTV conversion has no short term impact on Comcast. Comcast does not receive the signals from OTA anyway, and the analog SD signal you see today is being downconverted from the HD source. So no impact.

So we will continue to lag badly behind Chicago and Boston?

The DTV conversion has no short term impact on Comcast. Comcast does not receive the signals from OTA anyway, and the analog SD signal you see today is being downconverted from the HD source. So no impact.I thought the article "Cable Ops Agree To Short Digital Migration Freeze
MSOs Won't Move Channels From Analog To Digital Tiers Through February" applied to Comcast. http://www.multichannel.com/article/CA6623219.html?desc=topstory

Most bay area cities did not get the new HD channel additions that were announced for last November, I assumed that we can expect no progress on this until after the freeze is over.

4) I pay for blast but wasn't getting blast speeds. Two issues - Low signal strength will impede the rate, as will OLD routers. My Linksys BESFR41 limited to 10Mb WAN (6Mb down and 3M up were actuals). Upgraded and saw speeds of 21Mb and 3M).Wow, wish I could get that rate with Blast! I upgraded my cable modem to a linksys cm100 & my firewall is a befsx41 and I only get 6-12Mb down/3Mb up. That's with 38dB SNR.

Hello. I am having an audio problem which Comcast does not know how to answer. I have a DCT3416 and my audio goes to a Denon AVR via optical. Every channel is received in Dolby Digital 5.1 or if programming is not DD, it automatically switches to 2.0 stereo. No problems there. However, one channel, 703 (NBC), will not automatically switch it's audio. Many programs, like Leno, will be totally silent until I manually switch the Denon from DD5.1 to Stereo. Some shows are DD5.1 but go into a silent mode for a few seconds or minutes when the audio being broadcast changes within the show (i.e. Winter Classic Hockey.) Am I the only one who is experiencing the 703 optical blackouts? Any ideas other than the workaround of manually switching the audio mode for this channel (very low WAF.) Should I switch to a DCH3416? Thanks!

I thought the article "Cable Ops Agree To Short Digital Migration Freeze
MSOs Won't Move Channels From Analog To Digital Tiers Through February" applied to Comcast. http://www.multichannel.com/article/CA6623219.html?desc=topstory

Most bay area cities did not get the new HD channel additions that were announced for last November, I assumed that we can expect no progress on this until after the freeze is over.

This has to do with the game playing going on with the FCC re: how channels are charged for differently when they move them from the analog tier to the digital tier. They tied it to the DTV conversion as a "pro-consumer" action, but it's really trying to delay things until a more friendly FCC chairman can take over.

So I guess then it is tied to the DTV conversion, but only because of how cable is positioning it, not because it has any relationship to the cutover. The channels being discussed here are expanded basic channels, not locals.

my firewall is a befsx41 and I only get 6-12Mb down/3Mb up. That's with 38dB SNR.Hmm, I was able to get my download speed to 22Mbps by temporarily turning off the firewall in the befsx41. Damn, the befsx41 was supposed to be high performance by linksys standards, but looks like it can't firewall faster than 13Mbps. Guess I'm shopping for a firewall upgrade...

FYI, for the couple people out there who might actually care about the NHL Network:

I finally contacted Comcast again about losing the NHL Network this season. After various delays and confusion about the Center Ice package, the CSR finally decided it's only available with the $4.99 sports package. I thought maybe NHLN was grandfathered in with the Digital Silver package (i was still getting channels like CBS College Sports and TVG Horseracing, which are supposed to be in the sports package, according to comcast.com ... but there were always some i didn't get, so it's not as if i was getting the whole sports package for free). His only explanation for the loss of the channel was "it may have recently been updated, I apologize that you were not informed before hand." I agreed to take the sports package, and minutes later, it was active.

NHL Network is carrying the Hockey Night in Canada broadcast of Saturday's Sharks game in Vancouver (Sundin should be on the ice by then). CSN isn't airing the game, but NHLN may still be blacked out here so they can push Center Ice. Maybe we'll at least get to see NHLN's Sunday morning rebroadcast. (And no, i didn't get NHLN just for Saturday's game. :) )

Now when is Comcast gonna give us NHLN in HD? Sunnyvale was a Comcast ghetto for so long; now that we've got all this bandwidth, it's a shame we can't take full advantage of it.

--dave

Any ideas why The NewsHour on KQED Comcast 709 has reverted to SD? Other 709 HD programming doesn't seem affected.

Today there was a message on my cable box that MLB net is part of Digital Preferred. I found it odd that it it not part of a sports tier like NFL net.

Today there was a message on my cable box that MLB net is part of Digital Preferred. I found it odd that it it not part of a sports tier like NFL net.

It's probably the result of MLB negotiating a better deal than the NFL. Many cable/DBS operators are actually partners in the network, whereas the NFL wants to keep everything in their own pocket.

The channels being discussed here are expanded basic channels, not locals.
But the two are being tied together. If the excuse for delayed HD rollout is lack of bandwidth, and that lack of bandwidth can be adressed by shedding more analog cable channels, then comcast agreeing to do nothing on the later 'till after the Feb. OTA milestone impacts cable HD channel additions.

I'm sure it was a tough sell to get comcast to agree to sit on their hands until after Feb. 17 :)

I'm having a problem when coming off of pause on an HD feed, or after rewinding. It's always when watching a live feed; not a recording. It's happened twice in the last 3 days. Is the box getting ready to die? Was there a firmware upgrade? Other reasons?

Thanks,
jeff

FYI, for the couple people out there who might actually care about the NHL Network:

I finally contacted Comcast again about losing the NHL Network this season. After various delays and confusion about the Center Ice package, the CSR finally decided it's only available with the $4.99 sports package. I thought maybe NHLN was grandfathered in with the Digital Silver package (i was still getting channels like CBS College Sports and TVG Horseracing, which are supposed to be in the sports package, according to comcast.com ... but there were always some i didn't get, so it's not as if i was getting the whole sports package for free). His only explanation for the loss of the channel was "it may have recently been updated, I apologize that you were not informed before hand." I agreed to take the sports package, and minutes later, it was active.

NHL Network is carrying the Hockey Night in Canada broadcast of Saturday's Sharks game in Vancouver (Sundin should be on the ice by then). CSN isn't airing the game, but NHLN may still be blacked out here so they can push Center Ice. Maybe we'll at least get to see NHLN's Sunday morning rebroadcast. (And no, i didn't get NHLN just for Saturday's game. :) )

Now when is Comcast gonna give us NHLN in HD? Sunnyvale was a Comcast ghetto for so long; now that we've got all this bandwidth, it's a shame we can't take full advantage of it.

--dave

This Saturday's Sharks/Canucks game has been added to CSN +. Not HD, but at least it's locally broadcast. They announced it during the Sharks/Flames stinker err game on Tues. night.

What I don't get is why everyone gets the MLB Network, but you need the $4.99 sports package for the NHL network. That's ridiculous.

No HD on Letterman tonight on KPIX-DT (705) here on Comcast San Jose.

Anyone else noticing this?

This Saturday's Sharks/Canucks game has been added to CSN +. Not HD, but at least it's locally broadcast. They announced it during the Sharks/Flames stinker err game on Tues. night.

Thanks for the follow-up. I was gonna post an update when i heard that the other night, but i promptly forgot.

What I don't get is why everyone gets the MLB Network, but you need the $4.99 sports package for the NHL network. That's ridiculous.

Probably trying to give it wide exposure since it just launched. I'll bet they eventually move it into the sports package, too.

--dave

No HD on Letterman tonight on KPIX-DT (705) here on Comcast San Jose.

Anyone else noticing this?

Yes, no HD for much of the show, but the last part was HD, so the problem was fixed. I only flipped into it to watch certain parts though.

Thanks for the follow-up. I was gonna post an update when i heard that the other night, but i promptly forgot.



Probably trying to give it wide exposure since it just launched. I'll bet they eventually move it into the sports package, too.

--dave

No they won't. See post 8739 above. Comcast, along with DirecTV, Time Warner and Cox, all have a share of ownership of the network. MLB retains about 67% and the rest is divided between the above. As a revenue sharing partner, it's to their best interest to have the channel available to as many eyeballs as possible - more eyeballs, more ad revenue, more money in their pockets.

The NFL Network, on the other hand, is solely owned by the NFL, and as such, hasn't a lot value for an MSO like Comcast, especially given that the channel's only real content is about 8 games per year(there's around 250 NFL games played per year, not including playoffs). So, put the channel on the "Siberia" tier as in Comcast's view, that's where it belongs, and frankly, I personally don't disagree.

The NFL, being the wealthiest, most lucrative professional sports organization in the world must have decided they just didn't have enough money so they retained full ownership of the channel. Had they done what MLB has done, you can bet that the NFL channel would be right there next to the MLB channel, or close to it.

By the way, regarding CSNBA, I'm not sure if this is old news, but Oakland A's and San Jose Sharks games will no longer be on CSNBA but on Comcast Sports Net California, home of the Sacramento Kings. I guess as far as pro sports go, only Giants and Warriors games will be in HD in the bay area as I don't believe there is an HD channel for CSNC available in the bay area.

As an example of how two-faced the principles can be with regards to these sports net, and even of "regular" cable channels in general, Comcast, while removing the A's and the Sharks from CSNBA, is currently asking for a 40% increase in carriage rates from DirecTV. This is a channel that now has 30% less pro sports content, along with a team, the Giants, that haven't had a winning season in 4 years. But, this is pretty much SOP for Comcast, stick your nameplate on the ownership office door and then proceed to jack up the rates for the same product, and in the case of CSNBA, product of less value. Great business plan if you can get away with it. :D

That may be the case for the NFL Network, but my concern was the NHL Network, which as far as i know is an NHL/Comcast joint venture. Comcast should want to boost viewership (and thus ad revenue) there, too, yet it apparently got bumped up to the sports tier last fall after its first season on the air. I don't know what their revenue-sharing agreement looks like, though.

I just found this prediction in a recent Sports Business Journal column by John Ourand (http://www.sportsbusinessjournal.com/article/61083), FWIW: "By the time the 2009-10 regular season starts, NHL Network and NBA TV will be seen in many more homes by persuading cable operators, including Comcast and Time Warner, to move them off sports tiers onto better penetrated digital tiers."

Keenan, thanks for the news about the Sharks (and A's) moving to CSN California. I hadn't heard that before. But if they don't come up with a way to air games in HD, especially after airing half of all Sharks games (more than half of the CSN-carried games) on CSN-BA-HD this season, they'll have some unhappy fans. Any chance they'll add a CSN-CA-HD channel?

--dave

By the way, regarding CSNBA, I'm not sure if this is old news, but Oakland A's and San Jose Sharks games will no longer be on CSNBA but on Comcast Sports Net California, home of the Sacramento Kings. I guess as far as pro sports go, only Giants and Warriors games will be in HD in the bay area as I don't believe there is an HD channel for CSNC available in the bay area.When is this happening?

By the way, regarding CSNBA, I'm not sure if this is old news, but Oakland A's and San Jose Sharks games will no longer be on CSNBA but on Comcast Sports Net California, home of the Sacramento Kings.

It's definitely not old news; it's not really news at all yet. They're just in the talking stage. Nothing official yet.

Is there any chance that CSNBA will significantly increase the number of Giants games it shows in HD? For the last couple of years, it seems that only about half were in HD.