San Francisco, CA - Comcast [Text View] - Page 8

sfhub

06-15-07, 06:32 PM

I'm not sure if it is even relevant whether CC2.0 is official or not for Motorola cable boxes and the July 1st deadline.

They control the head-end. They control the STB. They control the CableCARD. They have a mechanism to do software updates of the STB, the CableCARD, and the head-end. As long as they have VOD and PPV working and can at some future point add SDV support, the cable companies are happy, regardless of whether it is using official CC2.0 to achieve that.

The FCC deadline AFAICT just says they need to use externalized security for their own boxes. I don't think it says that it must take the form of CC1.0 or CC2.0. I recall some MSOs applying to have alternate external security satisfy the requirement.

For practical reasons all the boxes from Motorola will deploy with M-stream cards.

Now from the standpoint of a 3rd-party like TiVo, they do care about CC2.0 and M-stream cards working on UDCP hosts, because they don't control squat, except their own box, so they must implement to a spec to have reasonable expectations it will all work with someone else's equipment.

fender4645

06-15-07, 07:11 PM

I'm not sure if it is even relevant whether CC2.0 is official or not for Motorola cable boxes and the July 1st deadline.

They control the head-end. They control the STB. They control the CableCARD. They have a mechanism to do software updates of the STB, the CableCARD, and the head-end. As long as they have VOD and PPV working and can at some future point add SDV support, the cable companies are happy, regardless of whether it is using official CC2.0 to achieve that.

That's exactly what the post I linked to above says. The Moto boxes have a proprietary modem inside that allows them a secure tunnel back to the headend. CC 2.0 is completely irrelevant for the MSO's. But as you said, they'll want the M-card so they don't have to deploy multiple cards for a single device.

Speaking of M-cards, does anyone know how many streams it supports?

sfhub

06-15-07, 09:46 PM

Speaking of M-cards, does anyone know how many streams it supports?
According to OpenCable, M-Mode can support 200Mbps so that sounds like at least 5 x 38Mbps QAM256 channels, probably more because I think you only need to send the stream to decrypt, not the whole channel.
http://www.opencable.com/primer/cablecard_primer.html

ayewbf

06-15-07, 10:00 PM

What the heck are you talking about? STB is the property of Comcast and is supposed to be returned to Comcast. Who's throwing anything away?

OK, I did waste something: my time and gas for two trips to the Comcast office, and the fees I paid to Comcast for making account changes.
Oh, I'd have to drive the box back to comcast, and extra fee negotiation? That sounds like a real PITA. I didn't know, I've never taken them up on any equipment.

ayewbf

06-15-07, 10:07 PM

Not true. Comcast uses the reply back from your equipment as a way to determine if you're in an ADS-ready area.
What exactly isn't true? I *did* get ADS turned on just by asking, no extra equipment required. Are you suggesting my s3 should have sent a message to comcast but they fail to? Or comcast ignored the message?

fender4645

06-15-07, 10:41 PM

According to OpenCable, M-Mode can support 200Mbps so that sounds like at least 5 x 38Mbps QAM256 channels, probably more because I think you only need to send the stream to decrypt, not the whole channel.
http://www.opencable.com/primer/cablecard_primer.html

With SDV, recording 4+ could become the norm...or at least viable.

fender4645

06-15-07, 10:46 PM

What exactly isn't true? I *did* get ADS turned on just by asking, no extra equipment required. Are you suggesting my s3 should have sent a message to comcast but they fail to? Or comcast ignored the message?

You said:

If you can't get comcast to turn on ADS in an area that has it, you have a communication problem with comcast and acquiring more equipment doesn't solve that

And I'm saying acquiring equipment does solve that. Again, putting a digital-only STB in your house will flag your account and enable you to begin receiving ADS. Yes, you can call and hope you get a CSR that knows what you're talking about. What other people here are saying that sometimes it's easier to just drive to your local Comcast payment center and swap boxes.

sfhub

06-16-07, 12:27 AM

With SDV, recording 4+ could become the norm...or at least viable.
...assuming your recording device had 4 tuners. The decryption interface/processor has 200Mbps bandwidth, but it still needs tuners to provide the streams to decrypt.

I wouldn't mind at all seeing 3-4 tuner PVRs. It would make life easier and it would make the incremental lease cost of CableCARDs negligible.

fender4645

06-16-07, 12:54 AM

...assuming your recording device had 4 tuners. The decryption interface/processor has 200Mbps bandwidth, but it still needs tuners to provide the streams to decrypt.

I wouldn't mind at all seeing 3-4 tuner PVRs. It would make life easier and it would make the incremental lease cost of CableCARDs negligible.

Of course. Didn't Sony come out with some prototype a few years back that had something like 8 tuners and 3TB of space? Now that would be fun! :D

usc10

06-16-07, 01:48 AM

sfhub

06-16-07, 03:32 AM

Is this something that needs to be added to the first post? If so, could someone consolidate it so I can just plug it in? Thanks.

Also, if you post something that needs to be put in the first post make sure it gets my attention, like start the post with "FOR THE FIRST POST", or something like that. :p
I think wwu is saying you no longer need digital classic and standard cable to get an HD-DVR.

His experience is you can get an HD-DVR with just "digital starter package" (also known as "enhanced cable")

I think some here would prefer getting HD-DVR with just limited basic, but it is a slight improvement from requiring limited basic, expanded basic, and digital classic, just to received the HD-DVR.

I have one question for wwu though, it was my impression they put you on digital starter package if you were slated to get the DCT-700 or the Pace SD-DVRs. Are you pretty sure you can get an HD-DVR like Moto 6412/3412 with just "enhanced cable". I'm not contradicting what you are saying, just trying to clarify my own understanding, which may be outdated or wrong.

GeneWildersHair

06-16-07, 11:52 PM

hey mikef5 and keenan

i am happy i got more hd channels. heres the channel lineup

702 ktvu hd (fox)
703 kntv hd (nbc)
704 kron hd
705 kpix hd (cbs)
707 kgo hd (abc)
709 kqed hd (pbs
712 kbcw hd (cw)
715 ngc hd
718 a&e hd
719 mojo hd
720 fsnba hd
721 vs/golf hd
722 discover hd
723 espn hd
724 espn 2 hd / but this channel does not work. it go to back to basic
725 to be annouced
726 tnt hd
727 universal hd
728 mhd (mtv)
730 hbo hd
732 cinemax hd
734 starz hd
736 showtime hd

no food network hd yet or home & garden hd

i got on demand :D

usc10

hey usc10, you getting any type of NFL Network at all? I've called comcast on the matter, and they said we in Pittsburg should be getting it on channel 180, soon to be sent to the sports package on 417. Both channels do not work for me. What about you?

ianchan1970

06-17-07, 01:57 AM

usc10

06-17-07, 02:32 AM

genewildershair, no i dont have nfl network yet.

genewildershair, do you get espn2 hd i dont it go to baisc

usc10

keenan

06-17-07, 02:41 AM

GeneWildersHair

06-17-07, 04:39 PM

genewildershair, no i dont have nfl network yet.

genewildershair, do you get espn2 hd i dont it go to baisc

usc10

I have the channel on 724, yet it looks like it's not in HD. Maybe it's just the programming? But yeah I figured you probably didn't have nfl network... I really want that channel!

ianchan1970

06-17-07, 08:18 PM

That indicates a signal strength problem, usually too low, but sometimes too high a signal can cause problems as well.

The DVR reports good SNR (>33dB), so I'm guessing there is some sort of impulse noise on the cable.
Internet downloads also proceed haltingly.
It's gonna be a hard problem to track down. :(

sfhub

06-17-07, 09:21 PM

What's up with Comcast in Santa Clara?
I'm getting 30,000+ correctable errors every 5 seconds, and 100+ uncorrectable errors every 5 seconds!
Video and audio glitches occur in bursts every 1-2 seconds.
Their solution was to reboot the DVR, which of course didn't solve anything.
ARGH!
I had a problem like that 1.5yrs ago. It only affected certain channels. It took a long time to convince Comcast it was their problem. Everything was working fine for at least a year, then all of a sudden periodic bursts in errors every 5 seconds, only on certain HD channels. I told them exactly when it started happening +- 3hrs since I had recorded stuff off the STB and could tell when it started.

They kept insisting it was a wiring problem, signal strength, etc. etc.

Back then not too many people had HD and the problem for me only affected HD so they didn't really care much. They said they had no way of looking at work logs to see what changed. They said we need to schedule a truck roll. The guy came out and basically verified exactly what I told them and told me his truck didn't have the right testing equipment to isolate further and he would need to schedule another truck roll with one of the more serious trucks with the extendable basket.

Due to some mixup, the next truck roll was basically another guy w/o the proper equipment to isolate further.

Anyway I kept complaining and eventually they conferenced in the support folks with the head-end folks to figure out what changed. This only happened after they started hearing HSI customers complaining about unstable connections.

It turned out they had misconfigured some diagnostic tool that was supposed to send out signals on an unused channel. Instead they had left it on and had it configured on some used channel. Every 5 seconds it would send out a test signal and that was causing havoc.

Took them a week to resolve it (I'm going by memory, it felt like 2 weeks, but it was probably only 1)

I only tell you the long story in case it may help you navigate through support to get your problem fixed. Also I'm not saying you have the same problem, but there are similarities.

walk

06-18-07, 12:24 AM

Friend of mine had pretty bad breakup on his digital channels, but good signal levels when I checked the service menu. Turns out there was a bad transformer (or something) somewhere on his block (and other people had been complaining for a while). Still took a couple of weeks to get it fixed...

fender4645

06-18-07, 01:22 AM

I'm not sure how accurate this is but the rep at the Comcast office said the offer for a free DCT700 for one year ends at the end of June. So if you want to get those digital channels on your non-HD TV, you should probably go pick one up soon. I personally picked one up to connect to my HTPC. Sure, no HD (and I have to use the IR blaster) -- but it's a nice free way to have a backup DVR for SD content.

sfhub

06-18-07, 09:51 AM

I'm not sure how accurate this is but the rep at the Comcast office said the offer for a free DCT700 for one year ends at the end of June.
Unless Comcast gets an FCC waiver I think the DCT700 offer will definitely end around that time.

Now they could replace that with a different unit if they so chose, but that probably would not happen until they decide to start pruning analog channels or dropping analog extended basic as a whole.

GBruno

06-18-07, 12:04 PM

fender4645

06-18-07, 12:14 PM

Unless Comcast gets an FCC waiver I think the DCT700 offer will definitely end around that time.

Now they could replace that with a different unit if they so chose, but that probably would not happen until they decide to start pruning analog channels or dropping analog extended basic as a whole.

Right...because of the integrated security. Didn't think of that.

fender4645

06-18-07, 12:19 PM

At the risk of stating the obvious,

if you pick up the free STB(s) make sure you watch your bill. I picked up 3 of them on 4/23/07. On my most recent bill there were two ADDL outlet charges of 6.99 ea. for this month and pro-rated charges for last month plus tax. Why they did not charge for all three is a mystery???

Anyhow it took a 27 minute call to get the "promotional" rate added. I will say the CSR was very friendly if not fast.

Definitely. It's always a good idea to double-check your bill for a few months when you make a change.

On that same topic, after returning one of my DVR's, I'm saving $18.95/month. I honestly had no idea I was spending that much per DVR. We had 3 Moto's in house, one of which is being used as the "failover" DVR but now I'm thinking of just returning that too.

wwu123

06-18-07, 01:09 PM

I think wwu is saying you no longer need digital classic and standard cable to get an HD-DVR.

His experience is you can get an HD-DVR with just "digital starter package" (also known as "enhanced cable")

I think some here would prefer getting HD-DVR with just limited basic, but it is a slight improvement from requiring limited basic, expanded basic, and digital classic, just to received the HD-DVR.

I have one question for wwu though, it was my impression they put you on digital starter package if you were slated to get the DCT-700 or the Pace SD-DVRs. Are you pretty sure you can get an HD-DVR like Moto 6412/3412 with just "enhanced cable". I'm not contradicting what you are saying, just trying to clarify my own understanding, which may be outdated or wrong.

Right, these are exactly the sort of areas that are still ambiguous in Comcast's literature, and why the first post and these discussion threads are so helpful to folks trying to navigate Comcast's offerings.

Thus far these things are either officially worded or uncontested:
1) Digital SD box or SD-DVR requires "Digital Cable"
2) (Digital HD) box or HD-DVR requires "Digital Cable"
3) You can get a Digital SD box or SD-DVR with Enhanced Cable
4) Enhanced Cable is now called Digital Starter

So what is ambiguous is whether Enhanced Cable is considered "Digital Cable", and what you can get with it. Now that it is called Digital Starter, it seems hard for them to claim that it's not "Digital Cable". My own experience was that you could get the HD equipment, and it didn't feel like one of those YMMV situations like finagling a HD box with only a Limited Basic subscription.

If a few more people could corroborate similar experiences, then I think it could be taken as "official". The price jump from Digital Starter ($53.50) to Digital Classic ($64.45) just for HD is not insignificant, especially if you happen to be in an area like mine where more than half the non-local HD channels are still unencrypted, and therefore still accessible with the Digital Starter package.

ianchan1970

06-18-07, 03:09 PM

I had a problem like that 1.5yrs ago. It only affected certain channels. It took a long time to convince Comcast it was their problem. Everything was working fine for at least a year, then all of a sudden periodic bursts in errors every 5 seconds, only on certain HD channels. I told them exactly when it started happening +- 3hrs since I had recorded stuff off the STB and could tell when it started.

They kept insisting it was a wiring problem, signal strength, etc. etc.

Back then not too many people had HD and the problem for me only affected HD so they didn't really care much. They said they had no way of looking at work logs to see what changed. They said we need to schedule a truck roll. The guy came out and basically verified exactly what I told them and told me his truck didn't have the right testing equipment to isolate further and he would need to schedule another truck roll with one of the more serious trucks with the extendable basket.

Due to some mixup, the next truck roll was basically another guy w/o the proper equipment to isolate further.

Anyway I kept complaining and eventually they conferenced in the support folks with the head-end folks to figure out what changed. This only happened after they started hearing HSI customers complaining about unstable connections.

It turned out they had misconfigured some diagnostic tool that was supposed to send out signals on an unused channel. Instead they had left it on and had it configured on some used channel. Every 5 seconds it would send out a test signal and that was causing havoc.

Took them a week to resolve it (I'm going by memory, it felt like 2 weeks, but it was probably only 1)

I only tell you the long story in case it may help you navigate through support to get your problem fixed. Also I'm not saying you have the same problem, but there are similarities.

Thanks!
This is definitely useful information!

I'm sure Comcast will do the same thing here too; that is they will verify that the problem actually exists before working on it. :/
It's just a royal PITA to follow shows when audio and video break up so often.
I might have to resort to watching shows my analog TV. >:D

sfhub

06-18-07, 07:07 PM

At the risk of stating the obvious,

if you pick up the free STB(s) make sure you watch your bill. I picked up 3 of them on 4/23/07. On my most recent bill there were two ADDL outlet charges of 6.99 ea. for this month and pro-rated charges for last month plus tax. Why they did not charge for all three is a mystery???

Anyhow it took a 27 minute call to get the "promotional" rate added. I will say the CSR was very friendly if not fast.
When it is properly configured, it should show up as

Digital Addl Outlet $6.99
DCT A/O Free -$6.99

Repeat for each outlet.

GBruno

06-18-07, 08:16 PM

When it is properly configured, it should show up as

Digital Addl Outlet $6.99
DCT A/O Free -$6.99

Repeat for each outlet.

I was told orignally in April and again today by comcast that both the Addl outlet fee and the STB fee are free for one year.

sfhub

06-18-07, 09:30 PM

I was told orignally in April and again today by comcast that both the Addl outlet fee and the STB fee are free for one year.
Yes, and that is why they charge you $6.99 for the DAO (which includes the DCT-700) then *subtract* $6.99 for the DCT Free. The net is $0.00. It should stay that way for a year.

bobby94928

06-18-07, 09:31 PM

And that's exactly what sfhub's post says:

Digital Addl Outlet $6.99
DCT A/O Free -$6.99

$6.99-6.99=$0.00

warrenlj

06-18-07, 10:29 PM

Got a flyer for free 1 year HD today....day after I set up my new hdtv, how cool is that?. Walnut Creek / Concord area. I need to go down to the local office tomorrow to pick up the receiver.

The irony here is that I picked up a dct 700 on Friday and couldn't get it to tune the channels from 2 to 76. On demand worked and some channels above 100 worked. Tech support told me to return the receiver for another.

fender4645

06-18-07, 11:38 PM

The irony here is that I picked up a dct 700 on Friday and couldn't get it to tune the channels from 2 to 76. On demand worked and some channels above 100 worked. Tech support told me to return the receiver for another.

The problem you're describing means the box is not mapping the analog-to-digital channels correctly (the 700 is a digital-only box). This problem occurred frequently when ADS was first rolled out, and 95% of the time it was a problem with tech/CS...not the box. The other thing to check is that you're truly in an ADS area (I know Walnut Creek was recently upgraded so it's possible they not ready yet).

fender4645

06-18-07, 11:38 PM

http://www.engadgethd.com/2007/06/12/hbo-to-go-hd-on-all-26-of-their-channels/

Wonder if there's room here for the additional channels...

warrenlj

06-19-07, 11:01 AM

Thanks fender, I suppose I will have this same problem with a hd receiver. Can a service call remedy this? I do live out in the sticks...Clayton.

fender4645

06-19-07, 11:15 AM

Thanks fender, I suppose I will have this same problem with a hd receiver. Can a service call remedy this? I do live out in the sticks...Clayton.

I would try calling Comcast a couple of times and see if you get a knowledgeable CSR
-- one that knows how to send the right "hit" to your box (and can also verify you're in an ADS area). If having digital 2-74 is not that important to you, you could always go the Comcast office and swap out for an analog-ready box (the 64xx series). There's a Comcast office in Concord right by the Brenden Theaters.

wwu123

06-19-07, 12:57 PM

Unless Comcast gets an FCC waiver I think the DCT700 offer will definitely end around that time.

Now they could replace that with a different unit if they so chose, but that probably would not happen until they decide to start pruning analog channels or dropping analog extended basic as a whole.

Since you mention it, I did notice the standard cable offering (limited basic + analog extended basic) is now gone from the website in my zip code, so limited basic is perhaps the only analog offering left in my ADS area.

garypen

06-19-07, 01:04 PM

Great. The fewer analog channels, the better.

That Don Guy

06-19-07, 02:54 PM

Do any HD stations in the area still broadcast that 15-minute-or-so set of screens so you can set up your HDTV properly? I think it used to be on what is now MOJO on Saturday mornings at 4:00, but it doesn't seem to be there any more.

(Yes, I can - and do - use Avia and Video Essentials, but I have to go through a non-HD DVD player, and I'd like something I could use to calibrate the signal coming in "directly" to the TV.)

-- Don

millerwill

06-19-07, 03:12 PM

Do any HD stations in the area still broadcast that 15-minute-or-so set of screens so you can set up your HDTV properly? I think it used to be on what is now MOJO on Saturday mornings at 4:00, but it doesn't seem to be there any more.

-- Don

Yes. I think it's the INHD channel, don't remember exactly, but I have it saved on my 3416 dvr. It comes on ~4 or 5 am Sunday mornings. Just go to the Guide and look at Sunday morning about this time, and I'm sure you will find it**. (And set to record it so you don't have to be up at this time!)

PS ** It's called 'Tune Up'.

aclayton

06-19-07, 03:27 PM

JasonQG

06-19-07, 07:26 PM

And still no news about Santa Rosa? Comcast has their head stuck so far up their butt it would take King Arthur to pull it out.

Barovelli

06-19-07, 08:03 PM

last of the free box offers . . .
Click for coupons. Hope this get's updated regularly . .

www.comcastsouthbay.com

fender4645

06-19-07, 08:17 PM

last of the free box offers . . .
Click for coupons. Hope this get's updated regularly . .

www.comcastsouthbay.com

Oooooo...I didn't know you could get the 5100 for free. Should I go with the smaller footprint, non-HD 700....or the larger, HD 5100??? Decisions, decisions.

keenan

06-19-07, 08:52 PM

And still no news about Santa Rosa? Comcast has their head stuck so far up their butt it would take King Arthur to pull it out.
No kidding...the below is the old list of 550 areas, I'm not sure which areas have been upgraded lately, pretty sure it's at least 3 of them...somehow I just have this feeling we'll be the last to be done...

Antioch
Hayward
Los Gatos
Milpitas
Pittsburg
San Leandro
San Lorenzo
Santa Rosa
Saratoga
Sunnyvale(parts)
Vallejo

sfhub

06-19-07, 09:56 PM

Oooooo...I didn't know you could get the 5100 for free. Should I go with the smaller footprint, non-HD 700....or the larger, HD 5100??? Decisions, decisions.
Not sure if people care about this stuff, but DCT-700 uses around 7watts power and DCT-5100 uses around 23watts power, regardless of whether they are On or Off.

mattack

06-19-07, 10:29 PM

Great. The fewer analog channels, the better.

Maybe for you. Not for all of us. The only digital tuner I have is a series 3 Tivo.. (and I don't have cablecards for it.. yet..)

Having to use a box with my S1 Tivos and my XS32 would be very bad. I know in the past I have actually asked about the digital simulcast (sorry I keep forgetting the correct name) of the broadcast channels, but I like the idea of having analog for my "cable ready" tuners for a long time to come. Especially as a backup for digital artifacts.

mattack

06-19-07, 10:35 PM

Not sure if people care about this stuff, but DCT-700 uses around 7watts power and DCT-5100 uses around 23watts power, regardless of whether they are On or Off.

By DCT-700, do you mean the "Pace DVR" they mention? I actually do care about that sort of thing, even though I currently have several DVRs running. (I am one of those people who argue that Tivos SHOULD have the option of turning off the hard drive after a period of time... Please, I'm not trying to start the electricity cost vs. cost of wear and tear argument again.)

But I am a sucker for "free" things.. Since I have a series 3, I have the HD part set (when I get an HD set).. so I probably will do the Pace DVR option and see how bad they really are compared to Tivos.. Plus, I can always unplug it if it's really awful. (On at least one of the few "digital cable" trials I've done in the last few years, I had the cable box not hooked up for almost all of it -- I did it because the special price was lower than I was already paying.)

swank6

06-20-07, 12:57 AM

Anyone heard any news about what 725 is going to be?

Any chance it might be... Food Network? :)

Barovelli

06-20-07, 12:59 AM

Oooooo...I didn't know you could get the 5100 for free. Should I go with the smaller footprint, non-HD 700....or the larger, HD 5100??? Decisions, decisions.

Still gots lots of them.

The larger HD box is not even a 5100, it's a 6200. Fast channel switching.

From what I heard, the web coupon site will be used for more local offers.

Barovelli

06-20-07, 01:06 AM

fender4645

06-20-07, 02:18 AM

Anyone heard any news about what 725 is going to be?

Any chance it might be... Food Network? :)

725 has been used as a spill-over channel and also used for the NFL "Game of the Week". It's been like that for a few years. My guess is that when/if Comcast gets FoodHD in the Bay Area, it will go on a different channel.

sfhub

06-20-07, 02:22 AM

By DCT-700, do you mean the "Pace DVR" they mention?
Sorry, I don't have the Pace DVR to test. The DCT-700 is a Motorola entry-level STB that has no channel indicator and only composite out. I would think the Pace DVR is at least 20watts because the hard drive itself will run around 13watts. Most likely it will be higher than 20watts though since DCT-700 is very bare-bones. If it is a model like the one Dave mentioned, then it will be more power friendly in spindown mode.

wwu123

06-20-07, 10:16 AM

By DCT-700, do you mean the "Pace DVR" they mention? I actually do care about that sort of thing, even though I currently have several DVRs running. (I am one of those people who argue that Tivos SHOULD have the option of turning off the hard drive after a period of time... Please, I'm not trying to start the electricity cost vs. cost of wear and tear argument again.)

But I am a sucker for "free" things.. Since I have a series 3, I have the HD part set (when I get an HD set).. so I probably will do the Pace DVR option and see how bad they really are compared to Tivos.. Plus, I can always unplug it if it's really awful. (On at least one of the few "digital cable" trials I've done in the last few years, I had the cable box not hooked up for almost all of it -- I did it because the special price was lower than I was already paying.)

The Pace DVR uses about 30 watts on or off, about the same as the Motorola 34xx HD DVR.

bobby94928

06-20-07, 10:18 AM

725 has been used as a spill-over channel and also used for the NFL "Game of the Week". It's been like that for a few years. My guess is that when/if Comcast gets FoodHD in the Bay Area, it will go on a different channel.

We've still got 710-714 and 719 open. It would certainly fit there somewhere. I'm guessing that FoodHD and HGTV-HD will go up together and that would be 713 and 714. Isn't guessing fun....

raghu1111

06-20-07, 10:50 AM

Does free DCT 5100 mean I don't need to pay $5 per month I currently pay for DCT 5200?

7 watts for 700 23 for 5100 sounds quite low, thats good. I think my CRT computer monitor takes 5 watts when it is 'power save' mode.

raghu1111

06-20-07, 10:55 AM

Does free DCT 5100 mean I don't need to pay $5 per month I currently pay for DCT 5200?

I have 6200.

Dbower

06-20-07, 11:34 AM

The hard drive thing is only a small part of the story. These hard drives consume perhaps 5 watts or so - which doesn't explain the ~40 watts the Mot STB sucks down ALL THE TIME. I was amazed that on or off made no difference when I did a power consumption test. 40 watts 24/7 adds up real fast, especially when I'm already into the ~$.33/kwh tier.

Even if they kept the drive running, surely there is some other circuitry (other than the display) that could be put in sleep mode. One more strike against a truly awful STB design.

-Dave

tgable

06-20-07, 11:51 AM

Anyone know which Comcast channels are un encrypted? I was thinking about ditching the Comcast box and going with a QAM tuner via Sage TV. Sorry if the question was addressed somewhere in here.

bobby94928

06-20-07, 11:53 AM

Anyone know which Comcast channels are un encrypted? I was thinking about ditching the Comcast box and going with a QAM tuner via Sage TV. Sorry if the question was addressed somewhere in here.

Plan on 702-712, ABC, CBS, Fox, NBC, PBS, CW...... Anything else is supposed to be encrypted.

tgable

06-20-07, 12:19 PM

Plan on 702-712, ABC, CBS, Fox, NBC, PBS, CW...... Anything else is supposed to be encrypted.

Great, I'm not sure I care for much else. If I can cut my cable bill in half I can pay for the extra hardware in less than six months.

Mikef5

06-20-07, 12:27 PM

An update from Milpitas..

About a month ago, I first saw a bus stop ad on Jacklin saying "Milpitas, On Demand is coming!", and I received a date-unspecific "we're upgrading your area soon" letter from Comcast a little before that.

Last week 715 NGC HD quietly appeared, and 721 Vs/Golf was added around a month ago. Still no 704, 712, 718 or 724-728 like I see on some other channel lists.

It seems strange that a single channel was added, instead I expected a flood of new ones once the upgrade was done in this area. Also it feels like the upgrade might be in progress, as my HSI has been going off and on a lot in the past couple of days, sometimes in 5-minute intervals. I haven't had a chance to call and complain about that yet, just curious if there's anyone else in Milpitas seeing the same thing?

Not complaining about the channel lineup, as I'm aware Milpitas is a bit less slummy as compared to the other slum areas. :) But here's my lineup at this point:

702 ktvu hd (fox)
703 kntv hd (nbc)
705 kpix hd (cbs)
707 kgo hd (abc)
709 kqed hd (pbs)
715 ngc hd
719 mojo hd
720 fsnba hd
721 vs/golf hd
722 discover hd
723 espn hd
730 hbo hd (don't subscribe, but I see it in the guide)

Haven't checked On Demand recently, but I doubt it's there.

-Andy
Andy,

Wow, someone other than myself actually lives in Milpitas :)

Just to let you know, Comcast is in fact upgrading our area. I received the same letter from Comcast about the upgrades but it said the upgrades would be happening in the next 2 to 3 months, that was in May when I got my letter. I pester Mr. J. on this weekly or when ever I can slip it in my emails to him. I want to see all the areas in the Bay Area to get the upgrades that they need and deserve.

Your line up is correct for our area and HBO-HD is the only movie channel that we get in HD.

I asked about the addition of 715 ( NGC-HD ) and it was done without the upgrade being complete. They had set aside a certain amount of bandwidth that they were going to use to use for ADS in our area but that was before they decided to upgrade our area and now that they are upgrading our system they can use that saved bandwidth to add a few more channels, 715 was the channel they decided to add to our area.

We do not have On Demand in our area. This is a real bone of contention that I have with Comcast. Video On Demand is their flag ship product and it's advertised constantly on tv but it is still not available in all areas. It galls me every time I see it advertised on tv but until they get this upgrade done we just have to wait, something that I'm not very good at..... ;)

Laters,
Mikef5

That Don Guy

06-20-07, 03:13 PM

Yes. I think it's the INHD channel, don't remember exactly, but I have it saved on my 3416 dvr. It comes on ~4 or 5 am Sunday mornings. Just go to the Guide and look at Sunday morning about this time, and I'm sure you will find it**. (And set to record it so you don't have to be up at this time!)
PS ** It's called 'Tune Up'.
Unfortunately, InHD is now Mojo, and now they show movies in the early morning weekend time slots. "Tune Up" is not listed anywhere on the listings on the Mojo website.

-- Don

JasonQG

06-20-07, 04:31 PM

No kidding...the below is the old list of 550 areas, I'm not sure which areas have been upgraded lately, pretty sure it's at least 3 of them...somehow I just have this feeling we'll be the last to be done...

Antioch
Hayward
Los Gatos
Milpitas
Pittsburg
San Leandro
San Lorenzo
Santa Rosa
Saratoga
Sunnyvale(parts)
Vallejo
Biggest city goes last, I guess.

keenan

06-20-07, 05:49 PM

Biggest city goes last, I guess.
Yep, no respect...I have this feeling that there's still some issues to be worked out between the city and Comcast, even though we were on the upgrade "list" way back when. I have no facts to support that, just past history.

Have you checked the Council schedule lately? I wonder if there's any meetings concerning Comcast coming up.

Another possible problem is that since the last election all the council members swapped seats...lol...and, I think we have a new City Manager.

fender4645

06-20-07, 09:41 PM

Just had my CableCARDs installed. I was expecting the worst but it actually went quite smoothly. Took about 30 minutes to install and get both cards activated. The tech even stuck around and made sure the premium channels were coming in (which they weren't, at first). Kudos to a good Comcast installer.

keenan

06-20-07, 10:42 PM

RE: Comcast HSI

If you have the cable modem/router, and you've already ran a line to the modem, connected up the switch, PC, loaded the software, etc....do you still need to have a service call, or can the service be activated over the phone(given that you already have Comcast cableTV)?

06-20-07, 10:54 PM

HSI is usually activated over the phone without a service call, but my parents' house had a trap that blocked the cable modem signal, so it didn't work until the technician removed the trap.

keenan

06-20-07, 11:01 PM

HSI is usually activated over the phone without a service call, but my parents' house had a trap that blocked the cable modem signal, so it didn't work until the technician removed the trap.
I probably have a trap for the Expanded basic channels, is that within the frequency area that HSI is transmitted?

sfhub

06-21-07, 09:21 AM

This was posted on TiVoCommunity

Still a ways to go, but maybe those free for a year deals will become free forever. Yeah, I know, wishful thinking, there is no such thing as free, they'll get it from you some other way.

http://broadcastingcable.com/article/CA6453329.html

Martin said the FCC was taking a number of steps regarding the broadcast and cable industries. He pointed out that commission has proposed requiring cable operators to deliver a “viewable” signal to customers, whether that means “explicitly requiring” them to deliver an analog signal to their analog cable customers, or that all-digital cable systems provide customers with the equipment to view broadcast signals, and that “cable subscribers will not be forced to rent a set-top box to view the broadcast signals.”

The FCC also proposes that cable to deliver a broadcasters’ HDTV signal in HD, rather than being able to convert it to standard DTV. Martin also put in another pitch for requiring cable to carry all of a broadcasters free digital channels, rather than just a digital version of their primary signals, as the commission has previously held. Martin tried to require multicast must-carry a year ago, but could not muster the votes. He said the proposal remains among his fellow commissioners.

Barovelli

06-21-07, 09:24 AM

I probably have a trap for the Expanded basic channels, is that within the frequency area that HSI is transmitted?

B1 traps should not affect HSI, but they can drift if dropped or boiled. Assurance that you have 2-way communication is vital. Some booster amps are not two-way, or have a specific port on them that is 2-way.

C3 may have had a return path trap, commonly used in the past, but not much any more.

Barovelli

06-21-07, 09:32 AM

sfhub

06-21-07, 12:27 PM

keenan

06-21-07, 12:40 PM

There will always be another low cost solution around the corner.

Isn't it DirecTV and Comcast telling us more channels is better. I don't remember them saying anything about quality of the channels :)

If we want to talk about quality, personally I already think we have way too many channels and I would argue for more quality over more quantity. If we could have quality and quantity even better, but it seems like in reality they end up being mutually exclusive.
Comcast has talked about quality in that study they released, in fact, it caused an uproar among the DirecTV crowd.

My personal opinion on quality? I've resigned myself to the fact that the quality is only going to get worse, at best it will stay constant, true HiDef can only be had with the new optical media and/or direct download to a capable playback device. Broadcast/cable TV is firmly in second place in the quality race, IMO.

On the subject of more channels though, Comcast needs to get to get their upgrade into high gear, Cablevision is adding the Voom suite and DirecTV is adding about 25 HBO/Cinemax HD channels that were just announced by Time Warner the other day. Also announced by HBO, they are going MPEG4 with all their channels come 2008, what that means to existing cable equipment, I have no idea.

keenan

06-21-07, 12:42 PM

B1 traps should not affect HSI, but they can drift if dropped or boiled. Assurance that you have 2-way communication is vital. Some booster amps are not two-way, or have a specific port on them that is 2-way.

C3 may have had a return path trap, commonly used in the past, but not much any more.
Thanks, I'm using a Moto booster amp but I don't recall if it's two-way or not, I'll have to check.

fender4645

06-21-07, 12:46 PM

...true HiDef can only be had with the new optical media and/or direct download to a capable playback device. Broadcast/cable TV is firmly in second place in the quality race, IMO.

Agree completely. When you watch a BR or HD-DVD movie for the first time, it's like you're watching HD for the first time. Almost the difference between DVD and HD, IMHO.

keenan

06-21-07, 12:48 PM

keenan

06-21-07, 12:56 PM

Agree completely. When you watch a BR or HD-DVD movie for the first time, it's like you're watching HD for the first time. Almost the difference between DVD and HD, IMHO.
Absolutely, and the larger the screen, the more the impact is. This stuff seems to go in cycles. When DVD came out I stopped watching TV for years, then HD came along and was better than DVD, now HD-DVD and BD are out and they're better than HD TV, and the more TV shows that are released on those formats, the less I will watch them from say a Comcast, sat or OTA.

FAZEMEGA

06-21-07, 01:08 PM

I just got an HDTV and ordered the Comcast Digital Starter Package for the $25 promotion and I had them add an HD Box. I was looking through the HD Channels and noticed I don't get A&E HD and TNT HD. I get ESPN and ESPN2 HD, and Discovery HD. I was just wondering if I would need to upgrade my service to get these channels (not that I really want them, just curious). I thought that if i had access to the standard definition version of the channel I would be able to get the HD version as well. I am new to this and kind of confused.

raghu1111

06-21-07, 01:35 PM

I don't think you can connect HSI and DSL both into a switch (assuming you have normal cosumer type wireless router/switch).

But you can connect both HSI and DSL connections to each your NICs. But to actually compare the speeds, you need to play with the "routing tables" on your computers to be sure which traffic is going on which NIC. To compare speeds, it would just be simpler to disconnect one and connect the other.

sfhub

06-21-07, 01:55 PM

Comcast has talked about quality in that study they released, in fact, it caused an uproar among the DirecTV crowd.
Sorry, I wasn't clear, I meant quality of the content, not quality of the picture. I want more channels I care about watching rather than a huge number of channels I don't really care about. Ironically it is also the premise of SDV that more and more channels need to be provided for marketing reasons but fewer people watch these channels, so why waste the bandwidth broadcasting it to everyone.

sfhub

06-21-07, 01:56 PM

Thanks, I'm using a Moto booster amp but I don't recall if it's two-way or not, I'll have to check.
Can't say for sure without the model #, but every Motorola amp I've encountered is 2-way.

sfhub

06-21-07, 02:01 PM

Probably not the right place to ask, but I know some of you guys are pretty computer savvy.

My MB has two 1 gig NICs, one of them I'm currently using as normal, connected to the home network/DSL internet, etc. Can I use the other one for HSI? Can the HSI modem/router be plugged into the same switch used for my DSL/home network?

Given that HSI is a month to month cost I was thinking of comparing the two services for at least a month.
Yes it can. There are a couple of ways you could do it.

The way I have mine setup is to have the DSL setup as x.x.x.1 and my other connection setup as x.x.x.2.

When I want to switch between the two I just change the default gateway for my network card between the .1 and .2 address.

There are other ways to set it up also, but this is a relatively simple setup if what you want to do is compare the two.

sfhub

06-21-07, 02:05 PM

I thought that if i had access to the standard definition version of the channel I would be able to get the HD version as well. I am new to this and kind of confused.
That used to be the case (and some people still have a grandfather account the implements it as of the time when the changed the policy)

Currently, you get HD locals with limited basic.

All the other HD channels (except pay/movie channels) are part of Digital Classic HD tier.

If your package has Digital Classic, you should be getting TNT-HD.

It's possible you are actually on a grandfather account and that is interfering with what you are supposed to get.

bobby94928

06-21-07, 02:13 PM

Thanks, I'm using a Moto booster amp but I don't recall if it's two-way or not, I'll have to check.

You and I have the same Motorola amp and it is two way. My DVR talks to the head end just fine.

keenan

06-21-07, 02:13 PM

keenan

06-21-07, 02:14 PM

You and I have the same Motorola amp and it is two way. My DVR talks to the head end just fine.
Excellent, I thought I did, just didn't want to have to dig around back there to look. :D

keenan

06-21-07, 02:21 PM

Yes it can. There are a couple of ways you could do it.

The way I have mine setup is to have the DSL setup as x.x.x.1 and my other connection setup as x.x.x.2.

When I want to switch between the two I just change the default gateway for my network card between the .1 and .2 address.

There are other ways to set it up also, but this is a relatively simple setup if what you want to do is compare the two.
Ok, so, I have a DSL modem/router plugged into a 8-port switch, that feeds everything I have and is connected to my MB through a Marvel NIC.

If I connect a cable modem/router to the same switch I can run another line to the Nvidia NIC, also on the MB and select that NIC for connection to HSI? I guess this is the Hookup for Dummies version.

I think what you're saying is you use the same cable from your switch/router and just change the address so it selects the HSI modem instead of the DSL modem? I'm unfamiliar how that's done, but I'm guessing it's not too difficult?

(what is the purpose of having two NICs on a MB anyways??)

fender4645

06-21-07, 02:32 PM

(what is the purpose of having two NICs on a MB anyways??)

If applications are smart enough (which most aren't) they can utilize both cards and disburse traffic appropriately. It's really only production servers that take advantage of this (for example, if you want your computer to reside on 2 or more subnets).

At my job, we have to test these types of things...but on a much larger scale (I have a machine in my lab with 8 Gb cards -- and everyone of them gets used pretty heavily).

FAZEMEGA

06-21-07, 02:32 PM

That used to be the case (and some people still have a grandfather account the implements it as of the time when the changed the policy)

Currently, you get HD locals with limited basic.

All the other HD channels (except pay/movie channels) are part of Digital Classic HD tier.

If your package has Digital Classic, you should be getting TNT-HD.

It's possible you are actually on a grandfather account and that is interfering with what you are supposed to get.

I did a little more research, and I think I'm on a Digital form of Standard Cable. So maybe I can't get certain HD channels. I just find it weird that I can get Discovery and both ESPN channels in HD and not the others.

keenan

06-21-07, 02:38 PM

If applications are smart enough (which most aren't) they can utilize both cards and disburse traffic appropriately. It's really only production servers that take advantage of this (for example, if you want your computer to reside on 2 or more subnets).

At my job, we have to test these types of things...but on a much larger scale (I have a machine in my lab with 8 Gb cards -- and everyone of them gets used pretty heavily).
Or, in my case, where my DSL modem is 75' away I could just tap into the cableTV feed right at my desk, install the cable modem right there and utilize the 2nd NIC - which is what I might do initially. Does that sound logical, or make sense? I'm guessing the Comcast HSI software knows which NIC to select? I haven't setup a new internet connection in a long time...

fender4645

06-21-07, 02:48 PM

beachkid

06-21-07, 02:51 PM

There is no Comcast HSI software. What DSL speed are you going to get? You should learn about MultiHomed networks.

walk

06-21-07, 02:53 PM

I'm not a network expert but I know that you shouldn't need any Comcast "HSI software". Windows XP and so should configure everything automatically. In fact if they give you software make sure to NOT install it, since it takes over your browser and can cause all sorts of probably (plus, just the fact that it's not needed...)

You do need to activate your account the first time though. When you first hook it up and open your browser it will redirect you to the Comcast activation page, though you may need info from Comcast on the phone to complete that.

raghu1111

06-21-07, 02:55 PM

Comcast software does not do anything. You should not install it (it messup up IE logos etc). Simplest might be to connect each to different NICs and "Disable"/"Enable" them through windows 'control panel/network connections'. This way you don't need to unplug anything.

Other option is to connect both to different NICs and change the 'default gateway' as sfhub suggested.

sfhub

06-21-07, 03:03 PM

> Ok, so, I have a DSL modem/router plugged into a 8-port switch, that feeds everything I have and is connected to my MB through a Marvel NIC.

> If I connect a cable modem/router to the same switch
When you say cable modem/router do you really mean cable modem/router or do you mean cable modem and just put in the router portion by habit?

> I can run another line to the Nvidia NIC, also on the MB and select that NIC for connection to HSI? I guess this is the Hookup for Dummies version.
Assuming you really meant cable modem/router, and assuming your dsl modem/router is configured as 192.168.1.1, just configure your cable modem/router as 192.168.1.2 and disable the DHCP server on the cable modem/router. Connect the cable modem/router to your 8-port switch.

When you want to use the dsl, you would use 192.168.1.1. When you want to use the cable modem, you would use 192.168.1.2

The place where you would make the change from one to the other is in the TCP/IP configuration of your network card (NIC) Configure the NIC to use static IP and for the "Default Gateway" enter either 192.168.1.1 or 192.168.1.2 depending on which WAN connection you would like to use.

You can change the "Default Gateway" by hand whenever you want to switch from one connection to the other and just use your existing ethernet cable (ie leaving the second ethernet disconnected as it currently is)

However if you'd like to simplify the switchover you could run a second ethernet cable from the 8-port switch to your currently unused 2nd ethernet port. Then you can configure one NIC to use DSL and the other NIC to use the cable modem (by using the appropriate Default Gateway)

To switch between the two, you can just enable the NIC that you want to use and also disable the one you don't want to use (right click on the NIC and there will be an option to enable/disable)

You could also use a small script to change the routing tables, thus allowing you to keep both NICs active.

> I think what you're saying is you use the same cable from your switch/router and just change the address so it selects the HSI modem instead of the DSL modem? I'm unfamiliar how that's done, but I'm guessing it's not too difficult?

Yup, that's pretty much what I was saying. There are different ways you can do the selection of DSL vs Cable, none of them are that difficult, but can sound difficult when written out as instructions.

> (what is the purpose of having two NICs on a MB anyways??)
Either for load balancing as mentioned above or for failover redundancy in case one NIC fails, or a combination of the two.

walk

06-21-07, 03:59 PM

fender4645

06-21-07, 04:20 PM

I think he has a DSL modem with router built-in yes?

2 NICs, that can be handy, you can use one for the internet (100 base usually) and the other for your home network (1Gb). Or you can just network computers together without need of switches/routers etc..

The Comcast software does do something... it installs a plugin to IE that can mess things up. When my dad installed it, it prevented IE finishing loadingl (it would load, but sit at a blank screen forever...) Word to the wise... don't use it, you don't need it.

Does Comcast offer a hybrid modem/router now? I've had mine for a few years so I'm not sure. And yes, definitely do NOT install any Comcast software. It's 100% not needed. Plug in the router, activate it, and vooaallaa...you should have an IP address.

walk

06-21-07, 04:28 PM

keenan

06-21-07, 06:37 PM

I doubt if Comcast has a rental modem + router unit. You can always buy your own though. It's $3/mo to rent, so if you plan to stay with cable for more than about 18 months, it's better to buy, since they cost around $50-60. You can get them cheaper with bundled deals too probably..

For configuring it, I would plug in the modem directly to one of the computers first, get it all set up, and THEN hook it up to the rest of your network.
Yes, it's a 2Wire DSL modem/router.

As far as cable modem/router, I know you can probably get one as part of the "deal", but I was thinking of just buying one outright that had some "better" features like the latest wireless tech...bad idea??

I like the idea of just plugging it right into the PC initially, and later incorporating into the network.

keenan

06-21-07, 06:43 PM

So, essentially, all I need is the modem with the cable hooked to it and then just call Comcast?

walk

06-21-07, 06:46 PM

and hooked to a computer with a web browser that works... yes I think so. I don't think they need to send a tech out, but who knows.

fender4645

06-21-07, 06:54 PM

Unless you have a filter/blocker for the frequencies that HSI runs off of in which you'll probably need a tech. But my guess is those were all taken off when you had the Comcast DVR...a long...long....long time ago.

sfhub

06-21-07, 07:53 PM

Or, in my case, where my DSL modem is 75' away I could just tap into the cableTV feed right at my desk, install the cable modem right there and utilize the 2nd NIC - which is what I might do initially. Does that sound logical, or make sense? I'm guessing the Comcast HSI software knows which NIC to select? I haven't setup a new internet connection in a long time...
If your cable modem really is just a cable modem (ie no router) or you only ever intend to test the cable modem vs DSL on the one computer with 2 NICs, doing what you suggest makes sense.

Then you can select which connection is used by enabling the NIC you want to use and disabling the other NIC. This can be done either using windows UI or by physically unplugging and plugging in cables.

Alternately you could use the "metrics" parameter to make one NIC seem more costly, so the other will be used. The advantage of this method is you can leave both connections active so the switchover is quicker.

You can also automate both methods so you can click on one link to do all the work to switch to DSL and a second link to do all the work to switch to Cable.

Disadvantages of connecting the cable modem/router direct to your PC rather than making it a 2nd gateway on your 8-port switch is only one machine can use it and also when your PC selects that NIC, other machines on your network cannot access that PC. For example if your PC also serves as a network file server for DVDs or mpgs then the other machines can't talk to your PC when it is using the cable modem NIC. You can do even more configuration to fix that but it gets more complicated.

keenan

06-21-07, 08:20 PM

Cool, think I've got it all, thanks guys. :)

One last question, does Comcast charge a digital outlet fee for the HSI line/hookup?

keenan

06-21-07, 08:40 PM

I take it this is the modem that's to be used with Comcast?

http://broadband.motorola.com/consumers/products/sb5120/
SURFboard® Cable Modem SB5120

fender4645

06-21-07, 08:49 PM

Cool, think I've got it all, thanks guys. :)

One last question, does Comcast charge a digital outlet fee for the HSI line/hookup?

Nope (at least not on my bill)

fender4645

06-21-07, 08:49 PM

I take it this is the modem that's to be used with Comcast?

http://broadband.motorola.com/consumers/products/sb5120/
SURFboard® Cable Modem SB5120

That's what I have.

Tom Koegel

06-22-07, 11:31 AM

I need some help with an odd problem I may have caused for myself, or at least some thoughts as to whether I could've caused this problem or whether I am looking at some sort of local problem in my area (Mill Valley).

My son's school has ended for the year and he's home with a babysitter until his camp season starts up next week. Thinking that I would be able to enforce some limits on daytime TV watching, I wandered down to the basement yesterday morning and unplugged the RCA signal amp that I use at the distribution point for coax into the house. Sure enough, this resulted in no signal on the Cartoon Network, Nickelodeon, etc. (Turns out it didn't knock out KBCW-12, so he watched Judge Judy all day. *arg*)

The problems appeared when I came home and replugged the amp. All the sudden I am getting fairly substantial "correctable" errors on the signal to the Motorola 6412, and ESPN2HD 724 and TNTHD 726 (both operating at 489 MHZ) disappeared entirely. The service menu on the 6412 says something to the effect that those channels are ERROR or something like that. It's not showing a bad signal but more like it can't see a signal at all. The diagnostics available on my CableCard equipped second TV are more limited, but it would show 724 and 726 as "no signal."

After frustrating experiences with Comcast technical support (the telephone person wouldn't help me unless I had my account number, as if I keep copies of my bills around, and the internet person was limited to the usual lame "unplug the cable box and replug it" advice), I decided just to let it sit until this morning. 724 and 726 are now back on both sets, although they are suffering from frame dropouts. The service menu again reports that these two channels are suffering from pretty substantial "correctable errors" (on the order of 300). Other channels, operating at different frequencies, show more modest correctable errors (fluctuating between 5 and 30).

Is this likely related to my actions in unplugging the signal amp? Do the Cablecard and 6412 just need time to "synchronize" somehow with the local system in my area?

An unrelated problem but one I received a reminder on when I was checking the service menu. Before I entered the menu, the one you get by powering off and then hitting the central select button on the remote, I get an EP00 message on the cable box. The Wiki associates this with a bad fan, but I'm pretty sure the fan is turning in the 6412. Should I exchange the box anyways? I'm sure this isn't related to the current problem, as I had seen this before the new problem appeared . . . and because the problem manifests on the Cablecard TV as well.

Thanks,
Tom

fender4645

06-22-07, 12:53 PM

Seems like it would be awfully big coincidence if your issues weren't related to the amp. I know this is obvious but I got to ask: are you sure the amp is securely fastened on all entry/exit points? I guess it could be possible that somehow it was damaged when disconnecting it. You might want to run down to Radio Shack and pick up another bi-directional amp -- they're only like $30 and you can always return it.

As for your fan on the STB...completely up to you. You don't own it so whether it breaks down now or later, no skin off your back.

Tom Koegel

06-22-07, 03:58 PM

sfhub

06-22-07, 04:52 PM

Cool, think I've got it all, thanks guys. :)
I thought about it a little more and I think this will be the simplest setup for you.

Attach the cable modem to your 2nd NIC as earlier.

Configure the "interface metric" for your Cable NIC to be "1". The interface metric can be found under TCP/IP -> Advanced

Configure the "interface metric" for your DSL NIC to be "2".

Now you can use the "Standby" button on the Motorola cable modem to control which connection you use.

When the cable modem is powered up, your PC will automatically use the cable modem. When it is in standby, your PC will switch to using the DSL connection.

I'm assuming the cable modem powers down the ethernet port when in standby. If it doesn't, replace pressing standby button with removing the ethernet cable.

sfhub

06-22-07, 04:59 PM

All I did was disconnect (and then reconnect) the AC transformer to the amp. Notwithstanding, I did tighten up the cable connections after I noticed the problem, to no apparent affect. And I do seem to be getting a powerful enough signal, just with these errors focussed around 489 MHz.

I think your Radio Shack solution is probably the right one. One more task for the weekend . . . .
You could also bring the cable STB and a portable display to your cable amp and bypass the amp. As a first step, I often like to eliminate my whole house as a culprit by going straight to the demarc point. If the problem persists, it isn't anything on my side.

keenan

06-22-07, 07:25 PM

I thought about it a little more and I think this will be the simplest setup for you.

Attach the cable modem to your 2nd NIC as earlier.

Configure the "interface metric" for your Cable NIC to be "1". The interface metric can be found under TCP/IP -> Advanced

Configure the "interface metric" for your DSL NIC to be "2".

Now you can use the "Standby" button on the Motorola cable modem to control which connection you use.

When the cable modem is powered up, your PC will automatically use the cable modem. When it is in standby, your PC will switch to using the DSL connection.

I'm assuming the cable modem powers down the ethernet port when in standby. If it doesn't, replace pressing standby button with removing the ethernet cable.
Sounds simple enough, of course as fender noted, there wouldn't be any firewall/NAT - no router.

I'm probably going to go with Comcast anyways, but I didn't want to shut down the DSL connection before I had spent some time with the HSI connection(reliability, etc.).

If you have all the equipment hooked up, how long does it take for Comcast to activate it? I was at CC and the sales guy said it would take around 4-6 days, is that about right? I would think it would be just a matter of getting a CSR on the phone and having them "turn it on", given there are no other issues such as a trap or some other line issue.

brimorga

06-22-07, 10:39 PM

Sounds simple enough, of course as fender noted, there wouldn't be any firewall/NAT - no router.

Comcast gives you free anti virus software for your PC which includes a firewall. Not the same as a hardware box but it's something.

keenan

06-22-07, 10:56 PM

Comcast gives you free anti virus software for your PC which includes a firewall. Not the same as a hardware box but it's something.
Thanks.

I'm going to go ahead and invest in good wireless/wired router anyways, I can always use it if I go back to DSL...I think... :confused:

I'm using BitDefender right now and it works great, I'm really not keen on installing more, or different AV software.

Barovelli

06-22-07, 11:03 PM

I was at CC and the sales guy said it would take around 4-6 days, is that about right? I would think it would be just a matter of getting a CSR on the phone and having them "turn it on", given there are no other issues such as a trap or some other line issue.

Wot? I think if you get to the walled garden and follow the path, enter your account # and you should be good to go. May be off, but if you have an account and access to WG, no one needs to do anything.

keenan

06-23-07, 03:34 AM

Wot? I think if you get to the walled garden and follow the path, enter your account # and you should be good to go. May be off, but if you have an account and access to WG, no one needs to do anything.
What account number? The HSI account number, or my regular Comcast acct number? What's "walled garden"? Is that Comcast's gateway/portal or something?

Mikef5

06-23-07, 11:24 AM

What account number? The HSI account number, or my regular Comcast acct number? What's "walled garden"? Is that Comcast's gateway/portal or something?
I believe that Dave, "The President ;) ", is speaking in metaphors. I think he means you have access to Comcast's website and already have an account with Comcast so all you need to do is sign up on line for the HSI and they should be able to activate you that day, unless you want a separate line drop for your cable service, which would require a truck roll. IMHO a separate line for the cable would be better to avoid signal losses due to too many splitters and cables on a single line.

Laters,
Mikef5

Barovelli

06-23-07, 12:21 PM

Walled Garden (webopedia) (http://www.webopedia.com/TERM/W/walled_garden.html) Is a web environment generated by Comcast that comes up when your modem is not registered with an account. If you've ever used Wifi at a Starbucks or a hotel you get their walled garden where you need to agree to terms or enter a name & password to get to the Internet outside the walled garden.

Seeing the walled garden before anything is added to an account is a good thing - means the modem works and is communicating.

Account number is your Comcast account number, if you have it. One account number is all you need for all services.

A separate line for Internet? Well, I don't. I had a moto modem on a booster amp, 6 way splitter in the basement then a 2 way splitter at the PC, then into a wireless router. The wired PCs would get full speed. When I got Comcast digital voice I swapped the modem for the Arris EMTA/Modem and had the input taken off the booster (when pg@e fails, don't want phone going down) and had a directional coupler (fancy splitter. specifies the db loss) put inline for HSI/CDV.

You can see my name in the speed tests at DSL Reports (http://www.dslreports.com/archive?zip=93950&dnsdom=&start=Search)

keenan

06-23-07, 01:23 PM

keenan

06-23-07, 01:29 PM

I believe that Dave, "The President ;) ", is speaking in metaphors. I think he means you have access to Comcast's website and already have an account with Comcast so all you need to do is sign up on line for the HSI and they should be able to activate you that day, unless you want a separate line drop for your cable service, which would require a truck roll. IMHO a separate line for the cable would be better to avoid signal losses due to too many splitters and cables on a single line.

Laters,
Mikef5
My plan is to split the incoming line before the amp and go direct to the modem. With HSI how did you tell if there is a signal strength problem? It just won't connect?

BTW, for those of you that use wireless, what is the typical, reliable range for w-G? I want to be able to reach a detached garage 75-90' from the modem location, it would be going through about 3 walls including the open space between buildings.

Tom Koegel

06-23-07, 02:27 PM

Keenan. wireless transmission range is really an example of the old "ymmv" acronym. I can get both Wireless A (operating at a different (5GHz, IIRC, instead of the b/g 2.4 GHz) frequency that supposedly doesn't penetrate walls as well) and G from my house in my detached garage in circumstances very similar to yours. OTOH, I've set up an Apple system for my brother-in-law in a "shotgun style" house, and I couldn't get the signal from the main Airport to the receiving laptops to travel down the central corridor to the distant rooms to save my life. I had to set up a repeater station to relay the signal. The key factor for me seems to be the amount of metal between the transmitter and the receiver, and different wireless equipment seems to have greatly different sensitivities also. A wireless access point with directional antennas may help in configuring for your setup. Good luck.

06-23-07, 02:57 PM

keenan

06-23-07, 03:12 PM

Thanks Tom, there isn't much metal at all in the path I'm looking to use so I'm thinking I should be alright.

I just measured and it's about 90-100', 80% of that being open outdoor space, the rest being older, non-insulated wood walls, about 3 of them.

I'm guessing I'm probably right at the limit so I'll just have to see how it goes.

keenan

06-23-07, 03:18 PM

When I signed up at CC, my HSI service was activated the same day.

For extended wireless range, you may want to consider a pre-N router. I don't have personal experience with one, but I hear that the range is much better, even with G clients.
Yeah, I was looking at those, but IIRC they were about 2-3 times the cost of the G. If the G doesn't work I'll try adding a larger antenna and if that doesn't do it I go with N. I don't know, I probably will go with N, I like to do things once and be done with it.

Regarding service, did you call Comcast when you got home, or did it just become active later in the day?

06-23-07, 03:27 PM

Regarding service, did you call Comcast when you got home, or did it just become active later in the day?

I actually had to call Comcast because the CC's ordering system did not work completely for units within a complex. The CC's salesman told me that before I started the ordering process. So I think you should have no problem with activating the service quickly, even if it means having to call Comcast.

sfhub

06-23-07, 03:35 PM

but I hear that the range is much better, even with G clients.
It's slightly better with G clients, but there is only so much a pre-N router can do with G clients, because it only controls the power of one side of the wireless transmission. The G-client still has a low power transmitter and there is only so much an amp on the receiver can do.

Pre-N AP/router with Pre-N client does get better range.

Tom Koegel

06-23-07, 05:14 PM

Here's the latest on my "no TNTHD or ESPN2HD" signal problem. I swapped out the signal amp with a much more powerful amp (a claimed +12dB as opposed to +4dB). No dice. I also tried just taking the amp out of the signal path, unplugging all splits and just plugging in the 6412. It's not as good a test as dragging the 6412 out to where the cable enters the house, but I don't have a TV out there. I also swapped out the 6412 box itself at the local service center.

In any event, none of this seems to have any effect. The other HD channels seem to be picking up a modest amount of "correctable errors" (from 5 to 500) that don't seem to interfere with reception, whereas the TNTHD and ESPN2HD bot pick up errors in the 50000 range with multiple uncorrectable errors. Sometimes I can get a jittery picture--but usually I get "no signal" on the cablecard TV and "this channel will be available shortly" on the 6412 connected TV.

Comcast, of course, is no help. They promised to send a signal to reset the cablecard and the 6412, but neither signal seems to have been received. They claim no problems in my local area, and just signed me up for a service call.

Here's one oddity, to me. I can't really see any difference in the readings on the quality of the signal between no amp, the +4 dB amp, and the +12 dB amp. What should I be looking for?

Also, anyone have any theories for why 489 MHz would be so affected, when higher and lower frequencies are not?

Barovelli

06-23-07, 07:17 PM

I guess what I asking is, the CC deal seems to be much better(modem rebated plus $75 CC gift card) than just ordering from the Comcast website and as such, will that slow down the activation process? You're saying as long as I get the WG all I need to do is call and have it "turned on"? I'm sure I'm making this more complicated than it is, I'm just looking for the smoothest, best deal, way to do it.

If I had a specific process to get rebates and cash back, I'd follow it. I don't know much about the various offers, but when it comes to cheapest deal - I'll take it any day, even if it means waiting a bit.

Back to the topic - I have a DCH3416. Works just like a DCT3416. That can be good and bad, eh?

Mikef5

06-24-07, 11:57 AM

Back to the topic - I have a DCH3416. Works just like a DCT3416. That can be good and bad, eh?
Dave,
Is your DCH3416 using the M-card or is that still in testing ??? How was it setting up, problems or no problems ?? Does it do everything, VOD, PPV etc..... and when will the rest of us get one ;)

Laters,
Mikef5

walk

06-24-07, 12:55 PM

Back to the topic - I have a DCH3416. Works just like a DCT3416. That can be good and bad, eh?
Does it have the same remote lag?

Keenan, you'll probably have to call Comcast to get the modem activated, but they should be able to do that instantly - once you've got it all hooked up and are at the Comcast web page (the only site you can get to until it's registered - the "walled garden"..) As for signal strength, depends on the modem but there should be a web address you can browse to and check the signals. Just guessing but low signal strength would probably lead to errors, which would lead to lots of retransmits, which would lead to lower transfer rates.

walk

06-24-07, 12:57 PM

On that note, the signal strength in my new house is amazing, I coudn't be more pleased.

This is after being split using a basic cheap 2-way splitter (one to the cable modem, one to the DVR)
http://home.comcast.net/~j.walkup/signal.gif

This page will give you an idea of what good signal levels should look like.
http://www.dslreports.com/faq/7124

Barovelli

06-24-07, 01:54 PM

Dave,
Is your DCH3416 using the M-card or is that still in testing ??? How was it setting up, problems or no problems ?? Does it do everything, VOD, PPV etc..... and when will the rest of us get one ;)

At the user level, it's much the same as a DCT. Looks purtier, IMHO. It's not been stricken with that remote lag everyone knows about (my DCT did that too).

I've had a couple of bugs that I had not seen in a DCT - a sudden jump from watching recorded TV to live TV. VOD felt ok, though some lag in remote commands were experienced that could not be the fault of the box.

On the provisioning side it's a whole new world. Five times the data to do, though a barcode reader system automates it. The boxes come pre-stuffed with MCards. Pairing is done in the provisioning stage. After it gets out the door it is treated just like any other set top box.

It remains up to the engineers to determine if its gold and release it in July, or seek out more testers, ;) .

sfhub

06-24-07, 03:29 PM

The other HD channels seem to be picking up a modest amount of "correctable errors" (from 5 to 500) that don't seem to interfere with reception, whereas the TNTHD and ESPN2HD bot pick up errors in the 50000 range with multiple uncorrectable errors. Sometimes I can get a jittery picture--but usually I get "no signal" on the cablecard TV and "this channel will be available shortly" on the 6412 connected TV.
When I had my 6412 and looked through all the HD channels they all had zero errors, correctable and uncorrectable. The installer said that is the way it should be and if you are getting correctable errors, then something is not quite right, but it hasn't reached the level of affecting your picture yet.

keenan

06-24-07, 03:52 PM

Does it have the same remote lag?

Keenan, you'll probably have to call Comcast to get the modem activated, but they should be able to do that instantly - once you've got it all hooked up and are at the Comcast web page (the only site you can get to until it's registered - the "walled garden"..) As for signal strength, depends on the modem but there should be a web address you can browse to and check the signals. Just guessing but low signal strength would probably lead to errors, which would lead to lots of retransmits, which would lead to lower transfer rates.
Thanks, I've decided to slow things down a bit and look around for the best deal on some "N" equipment, if I'm going to change things around may as well do it right.

bobby94928

06-24-07, 08:51 PM

Thanks, I've decided to slow things down a bit and look around for the best deal on some "N" equipment, if I'm going to change things around may as well do it right.

I like how you think. No bull in a china closet in your house. Knowing how many goodies you have it's nice to know that you think it out.

rsra13

06-24-07, 11:55 PM

At the user level, it's much the same as a DCT. Looks purtier, IMHO. It's not been stricken with that remote lag everyone knows about (my DCT did that too).

I've had a couple of bugs that I had not seen in a DCT - a sudden jump from watching recorded TV to live TV. VOD felt ok, though some lag in remote commands were experienced that could not be the fault of the box.

On the provisioning side it's a whole new world. Five times the data to do, though a barcode reader system automates it. The boxes come pre-stuffed with MCards. Pairing is done in the provisioning stage. After it gets out the door it is treated just like any other set top box.

It remains up to the engineers to determine if its gold and release it in July, or seek out more testers, ;) .

That sounds great. I'm ready to make the change just because of the remote lag. I have two 6412s, one for more than 3 years and the other for a little more than one year, both are second generation, the one with DVI, and they work fine for me, but the remote lag is sometimes unbearable.

blues96

06-25-07, 02:22 AM

I have the 30 second skip buttom programmed on my 3412, if I switch it out for the 3416 will I still be able to program the 30 second skip?

Thanks,

David
Mountain View, CA

keenan

06-25-07, 03:12 AM

I like how you think. No bull in a china closet in your house. Knowing how many goodies you have it's nice to know that you think it out.
Thanks, although that bull has roamed around here on occasion. :p

keenan

06-25-07, 03:12 AM

I have the 30 second skip buttom programmed on my 3412, if I switch it out for the 3416 will I still be able to program the 30 second skip?

Thanks,

David
Mountain View, CA
It should work just fine.

keenan

06-25-07, 11:08 AM

MikeSM

06-25-07, 12:37 PM

In an article on HBO-HD switching to MPEG-4 ....

For its part, Comcast Corp. (Nasdaq: CMCSA, CMCSK) has been cooking up a new series of Residential Network Gateway (RNG) set-tops that can decode both MPEG-4 and MPEG-2 signals. Comcast expects to test some of those products in the second half of this year, with commercial rollouts beginning in early 2008, said John Schanz, Comcast Cable's executive vice president of national engineering and technical operations.

http://www.lightreading.com/documen...127163&site=cdn

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=10874396#post10874396
Comcast New Technology Test - AVS Forum

The actual thing that HBO said they were doing is switching their distribution feeds to mpeg-4 over the satellite transponders that distribute their programming to comcast and other MSO's. The MSO's will transcode the signals at the headends to MPEG2 for transmission to users. It will be a decade until MPEG4 becomes mainstream in STB's.

HBO did this for an obvious reason: saving money. They are planning on going HD for ALL their channels soon, and to do that, they will need a LOT more transponder space. Going to MPEG4 for the new HD feeds cuts that bill by more than half.

Thanks
Mike

walk

06-25-07, 01:01 PM

sfhub

06-25-07, 02:15 PM

They also said 8Mbits for each channel....

DVD is 9Mbits ... of course it's MP2, but still. Lower than DVD bit rate for HD? Disgusting. Throw in another generation of lossy compression transcoding to MP2? Appalling. I'm glad I got rid of HBO.
I thought regular DVDs were around 3-5Mbps while superbit DVDs got up to 5-7Mbps?

http://www.hifi-writer.com/he/superbit/superbit.htm

However, we are talking apples and oranges comparing HD and DVD bitrates as the framesize is different.

I was also under the impression mp4 is about 1.5 to 2x smaller at equivalent PQ.

So today we are seeing around 13-17Mbps mpg2 for HBO-HD. What they are proposing sounds about in the ball bark of what you are seeing today, a little higher or lower depending on which numbers you are looking at.

walk

06-25-07, 02:41 PM

DVD is 9Mbits maximum, most titles *average* somewhere in the range you suggest, true.

MP4 is more efficient, but the frame size is also SIX times larger than DVD.

Most HD disc titles using MP4 average around 18-20 Mbits, with peaks as high as 40 (on Blu-ray, anyway). Microsoft claims that their VC-1 can acheive very good results at 10 Mbits, and it is true with certain program material, not so much with others... and it's always true that 18-20Mbits will look better. (MS is obviously trying to sell us on lower bitrates to boost sales of their downloadable HD programs).

Currently with MP2 on cable HBO is 19 Mbits (max, less on average), and most people agree the results aren't that great (macroblocking on fast-motion scenes, where the 19 Mbit cap is hit).

Maybe I'm being harsh and should reserve judgement. Having all channels in HD... I mean the picture on 25 out of those 26 channels WILL look better (being in HD vs SD) but man, I'm skeptical they can pull off good results at 8Mbits, especially if cablecos like Comcast will have to add another lossy compression to MP2 on top of that.. 8Mbits is "hd-lite" :rolleyes:

sfhub

06-25-07, 03:29 PM

MP4 is more efficient, but the frame size is also SIX times larger than DVD.
My point is that you should compare HBO-HD mpg2 vs HBO-HD mpg4, thereby eliminating the frame size difference. Comparing HBO-HD mpg4 to DVD mpg2 doesn't seem like a good comparison to me, there are too many variables.

sfhub

06-25-07, 04:43 PM

Currently with MP2 on cable HBO is 19 Mbits (max, less on average), and most people agree the results aren't that great (macroblocking on fast-motion scenes, where the 19 Mbit cap is hit).
I looked at King Kong recorded off of HBO-HD.

The movie is 188 minutes long. The recording was 195 minutes (7 minutes of preview stuff at the end). 17.00 GB was the file size according to TiVo.

To give the benefit of the doubt, I assumed all the 17.00GB was the movie and used 188 minutes as the length rather than 195 minutes.

I came out with 12.94Mbps. I think current HBO-HD is way below the max 19Mbps it could be using.

IMO what one should expect with HBO using mpg4 is "equivalent" PQ. I wouldn't expect this to be an event that leads to better PQ. I think with the 13-17Mbps mpg2 currently being used, they can pull off equivalent PQ at 8Mbps mpg4. That is just my opinion of course.

For reference, using the same calculation method:
King Kong 17.00GB/188min ... 12.94Mbps
Batman Begins 10.71GB/140min ... 10.95Mbps
Return of the Jedi 9.19GB/135min ... 9.75Mbps
War of the Worlds 11.03GB/117min ... 13.50Mbps

keenan

06-25-07, 05:13 PM

I came out with 12.94Mbps. I think current HBO-HD is way below the max 19Mbps it could be using.

They are, the last time I read about it they were running at about up to 14Mbps, never more than that. I also seem to recall that they are running at 1440x1080i as well.

BTW, if you have a Netflix account you can see some pretty cool VC1 technology in action. They have a "Watch Now" portion at the site where you can watch complete movies using the tech with it's associated app. I watched about 15 mins of a movie about credit yesterday and the quality was very impressive.

keenan

06-25-07, 05:16 PM

It will be a decade until MPEG4 becomes mainstream in STB's.

Thanks
Mike
You really think so? Per the article it seems they are planning on it a lot sooner than that, but of course you can't believe everything you read. It doesn't sound to me as if MPEG4 to MPEG2 conversion, at a cable plant, is going to be very good for PQ. I suppose they're going to have to initially, should be interesting.

MikeSM

06-25-07, 06:15 PM

sfhub

06-25-07, 09:13 PM

You really think so? Per the article it seems they are planning on it a lot sooner than that, but of course you can't believe everything you read. It doesn't sound to me as if MPEG4 to MPEG2 conversion, at a cable plant, is going to be very good for PQ. I suppose they're going to have to initially, should be interesting.
The article says they plan on testing mpg4 sooner than later. Deploying is a whole different story.

I think a complete upgrade from mpg2 to mpg4 is a long way off, but partial usage is probably closer.

I would guess VOD would see earliest mpg4 usage. Next possibly SDV areas with high mpg4-capable STB penetration.

Narrow-band applications like VOD can benefit earlier from mpg4. Boxes which are mpg2 will request mpg2 streams and mpg4 will request mpg4 streams if available. This could reduce VOD bandwidth needs with a smooth seamless transition.

Another example is coupling SDV with mpg4. Let's say an area like Santa Rosa had poor digital penetration due to crappy HD offerings. As Comcast transitioned to all digital, these areas would naturally get more of the newer mpg4-capable STBs as compared to an area which already had high penetration rates with older mpg2 equipment that people are slow to upgrade.

In an architecture using SDV and mpg4, they could for example notice that 80% of the people in Santa Rosa have mpg4 STBs while only 20% have mpg2 STB and they are wasting bandwidth sending both mpg4 and mpg2 versions of the same channel. They could then do some aggressive upgrade of the 20% remaining mpg2 STBs and then configure Santa Rosa for 100% mpg4, while leaving the rest of the areas mpg2.

I think there are lots of theories of how these transitions could work, but they will find out much more with real-life testing and that is likely to affect how things are rolled out.

KernelG

06-26-07, 03:12 AM

I have the 30 second skip buttom programmed on my 3412, if I switch it out for the 3416 will I still be able to program the 30 second skip?

I can confirm that the 3416 does the 30 second skip. We have a couple of 3416's in the house here in Fremont, and it's pretty smooth sailing.

walk

06-26-07, 02:32 PM

King Kong 17.00GB/188min ... 12.94Mbps
Batman Begins 10.71GB/140min ... 10.95Mbps
Return of the Jedi 9.19GB/135min ... 9.75Mbps
War of the Worlds 11.03GB/117min ... 13.50MbpsThose are averages. If the 8Mbit figure they quoted was average, with peaks much higher (ideally 18-20, but hopefully at least 15) then it might work. But if 8Mb is the max.... I don't think so.

For example, see what people are saying about ATT's U-verse. They use 8.5Mbits for the HD channel.

keenan

06-26-07, 03:50 PM

The article says they plan on testing mpg4 sooner than later. Deploying is a whole different story.

I think a complete upgrade from mpg2 to mpg4 is a long way off, but partial usage is probably closer.

I would guess VOD would see earliest mpg4 usage. Next possibly SDV areas with high mpg4-capable STB penetration.

Narrow-band applications like VOD can benefit earlier from mpg4. Boxes which are mpg2 will request mpg2 streams and mpg4 will request mpg4 streams if available. This could reduce VOD bandwidth needs with a smooth seamless transition.

Another example is coupling SDV with mpg4. Let's say an area like Santa Rosa had poor digital penetration due to crappy HD offerings. As Comcast transitioned to all digital, these areas would naturally get more of the newer mpg4-capable STBs as compared to an area which already had high penetration rates with older mpg2 equipment that people are slow to upgrade.

In an architecture using SDV and mpg4, they could for example notice that 80% of the people in Santa Rosa have mpg4 STBs while only 20% have mpg2 STB and they are wasting bandwidth sending both mpg4 and mpg2 versions of the same channel. They could then do some aggressive upgrade of the 20% remaining mpg2 STBs and then configure Santa Rosa for 100% mpg4, while leaving the rest of the areas mpg2.

I think there are lots of theories of how these transitions could work, but they will find out much more with real-life testing and that is likely to affect how things are rolled out.
If the following is true it's definitely a plus for S3 owners,

From the FAQ's at the TiVo Forum, Series 3:

Does the S3 support new video formats?

The decoder used in the S3 supports MPEG-2, MPEG-4 AVC/H.264, and VC-1/WMV9. However, at this time there is not yet a way to load video on the S3, and both ATSC and digital cable are MPEG-2.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=10885519#post10885519
TiVo Series 3 - "Official" Thread - AVS Forum

sfhub

06-27-07, 10:20 AM

As mentioned earlier CC fees for "Dual C-card Dig Access" went up from $1.50 to $1.79 on the most recent bill so it looks like all areas are getting the new pricing and it just depends on your billing cycle when you see it.

06-27-07, 01:46 PM

sfhub

06-27-07, 08:02 PM

The funny thing is it is in a section titled "Demand more at Comcast" It should have said "Comcast demands more"

Demand more at Comcast
Effective July 1st the following monthly charges will be changed to
the following rates: HDTV Equipment fee without Digital Package
will cost $8.00. HDTV Equipment fee with Digital Package will cost
$7.00. The Dual Cable-Card Digital Access will now cost $1.79.

walk

06-28-07, 02:51 PM

Yeah I got hit with the $7 HDTV fee last month.

Luckily I'm getting the $6.99 A/O for free, at least for a year.

keenan

06-28-07, 02:54 PM

Re: HBO going MPEG4,

HBO Move to MPEG-4 Opens Door to Big Changes in Cable

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=10904081#post10904081
All HBO/Cinemax Channels to Go HD; DirecTV to Carry 11 in September - AVS Forum

wco81

06-28-07, 03:45 PM

Time to drop Comcast, basic cable plus the HD box rental.

sfhub

06-28-07, 06:09 PM

Man, that is crazy, $14/month for your 2nd HD STB.

hiker

06-28-07, 06:25 PM

Other than TiVo Series3, TVs with built-in QAM tuners, PC QAM tuners and Comcast STBs, are there stand-alone QAM tuner STBs (even non-DVR) that use cablecards and can be bought to own?

I have TiVo S3 with cablecards and Sharp TV built-in QAM without cablecard. What would it cost to add cablecard to Sharp TV, just the $6.99/mo AO fee and truck roll to install?

sfhub

06-29-07, 12:18 AM

There are a few scattered CableCARD devices. Sony had one that they discontinued.

I think for most manufacturers, if they go through the trouble of building a standalone CableCARD device will also include DVR functionality. If you just need a cable box most people will rent it from the cable company, especially if they are going to ding you with the digital additional outlet fee regardless.

keenan

06-30-07, 02:15 AM

Somewhat off-topic as this is a Comcast thread, but, after spending some time with the AT&T retention department today maybe Comcast might sweeten their offer for HSI. :p

My current DSL service - 6/768 - went to $34.99 per month last month so I was looking at Comcast HSI. Today AT&T offered me 12 mos for $34.99, with 2 mos free, plus a $50 cash rebate. Comes out to $24.99 per month. Plus, they gave me a $6 per month discount on my landline that brings it down to about $6 per month. So, for about $31 per month I get DSL and a POTS line.

Comcast comes to about $32 per month over the 12 month period and no phone.

Probably call them back tomorrow and take the deal, also going to see if I can squeeze a newer modem out of them. I've read the newer ones have some added capabilities like ADSL2/2+ which I guess can make things a little faster.

rsra13

06-30-07, 02:39 AM

You should be able to get Comcast HSI for 19.99 for 12 months. No phone. But the speeds should be a lot better than DSL.

keenan

06-30-07, 03:53 AM

You should be able to get Comcast HSI for 19.99 for 12 months. No phone. But the speeds should be a lot better than DSL.
The best I've found is $19.95 for 6 months and then it goes to the regular rate of $44 per month. I'm looking at their 6/mbps speed offering. If I could HSI for $19.99 per month, for 12 months, I would go that route for sure

rsra13

07-01-07, 02:40 PM

Well, the good thing about Comcast is that you can always call after your offer expires and ask them to extend it. I know people that have never paid the full price for more than 3 years.

keenan

07-01-07, 02:58 PM

Well, the good thing about Comcast is that you can always call after your offer expires and ask them to extend it. I know people that have never paid the full price for more than 3 years.
Yes, there's always that possibility, and if they won't, AT&T will probably have some offer to get me back if I don't stay with Comcast.

Going with Comcast does make sense I guess, I'd planned on getting a wireless N router anyways so the only expense with Comcast is the modem and that's rebated anyways. The email is a pain but I've already signed up for a Gmail account(free), unless anyone knows of a better solution?

Barovelli

07-01-07, 11:18 PM

The email is a pain but I've already signed up for a Gmail account(free), unless anyone knows of a better solution?

Full tilt nerdy way:

Get your own domain. Try and think of a domain name that is not taken and head for godaddy. Set up an email name at your domain that will forward all email to keenan@keenansmail.com to whatever ISP you have. Viola, you own email addy that never changes.

I may be off a bit on the email account - I know that godaddy offered a free email account back when I registered barovelli.com but I used a separate host service since I had web & ftp stuff.

walk

07-02-07, 12:32 AM

Yeah after Comcast took over and my email changed for the 3rd time in 3 years I got sick of it so I registered my own domain. I use Namecheap.com - it's about $8 a year, with URL and email forwarding. Then I have the email forwarding to Gmail (because it's great and has the best spam filtering). It's really easy to setup too.

The best part is probably that you get 1000 email addresses, so you can add a new one for junk mail any time you need it (and delete them later and let all the spam rot in hell).

fender4645

07-02-07, 12:54 AM

The best I've found is $19.95 for 6 months and then it goes to the regular rate of $44 per month. I'm looking at their 6/mbps speed offering. If I could HSI for $19.99 per month, for 12 months, I would go that route for sure

My $19.99x12 just expired. I called Comcast, told the rep I'd switch to DSL, and got it for another 12 months.

keenan

07-02-07, 02:36 AM

My $19.99x12 just expired. I called Comcast, told the rep I'd switch to DSL, and got it for another 12 months.
Yeah, it makes sense they would do that, based on my conversation with the AT&T retention department the competition is pretty fierce right now.

Now, are you getting the 6/mbps speed package with Comcast?

keenan

07-02-07, 02:37 AM

Full tilt nerdy way:

Get your own domain. Try and think of a domain name that is not taken and head for godaddy. Set up an email name at your domain that will forward all email to keenan@keenansmail.com to whatever ISP you have. Viola, you own email addy that never changes.

I may be off a bit on the email account - I know that godaddy offered a free email account back when I registered barovelli.com but I used a separate host service since I had web & ftp stuff.
I like that idea, I'll have to check it out, thanks. :)

fender4645

07-02-07, 02:43 AM

Yeah, it makes sense they would do that, based on my conversation with the AT&T retention department the competition is pretty fierce right now.

Now, are you getting the 6/mbps speed package with Comcast?

Yup.

FiloD

07-02-07, 11:26 AM

Just got my lastest bill: "Effective July 1st the following monthly charges will be changed to the following rates: HDTV Equipment fee without Digital Package will cost $8.00. HDTV Equipment fee with Digital Package will cost $7.00. The Dual Cable-Card Digital Access will now cost $1.79."

I read somewhere that the increase fees to both new and existing subscribers is to recover the higher costs of CableCARD-based set-top boxes, which most cable operators will be required to deploy starting July 1 under the Federal Communications Commission’s so-called integration ban.

Any news if Comcast is offering the Cable Card based STB this week? Thanks.

blues96

07-03-07, 01:16 AM

bobby94928

07-03-07, 09:51 AM

As long as the 64xx is a 6416 you could get that one. The only difference between the 34s and 64s is absence of analog tuners on the 34s.

walk

07-03-07, 11:27 AM

And the USB, inputs and smart card slot on the front.

I thought they couldn't give these boxes out any more since July 1st?

Or was that only for new customers?

bobby94928

07-03-07, 11:29 AM

As long as they have been deployed prior to July 1 they can redeploy any box.

Mikef5

07-03-07, 11:37 AM

And the USB, inputs and smart card slot on the front.

I thought they couldn't give these boxes out any more since July 1st?

Or was that only for new customers?
The new DCH boxes are suppose to go to new customers. If you turn in a box (ex: 6412) and it's broke, it can't be repaired and put back in the system, it must be removed from circulation but if they have another 6412 in stock they can give one to you or other previous customers until they run out.

Laters,
Mikef5

Mikef5

07-03-07, 11:42 AM

I went to the Mountain View office to trade in my 3412 for a 3416 and DENIED, they are out, said they don't have any idea of when and if they will get more. CSR said they are only giving out 64xx for new DVR customers. BUMMER. Question is where can I trade out since I live in Mountain View am I required to make swaps, etc at that office? Anyone know where I might score a 3416?

Thanks

David
Mountain View
If it were me and they told me they had no replacement box, I would have them give me a DCH box or make them do a truck roll and not charge me for it since I took the time to try and turn in a defective box and none was available. I would ask for the new DCH box at the Mountain View office since they are suppose to be available to new customers as of 1 July or to previous customers once the supply of old boxes runs out and from what you have said it seems the source of the old boxes has run out. I wouldn't sit there with no box and no service which you are paying for.

Edit...
I re-read your post ( you are trying to get a 3416 but nothing is wrong with the box you have now ), did they have another 3412 ?? If they have more 3412's then you're out of luck getting one of the new DCH boxes until they run out of the 3412's also. If not tell them your's is broke and you need a new box, they should have the DCH boxes in stock.

Laters,
Mikef5

blues96

07-03-07, 12:29 PM

I was just loking for more hard drive space (thus the reason to swap, there is nothing wrong with my 3412 other than the usual software poo). There has to be a plan within Comcast for HD and the need for more space. Is there a plan? Not everyone can afford the Tivo Unit. Maybe it's just me.... :D

Barovelli

07-03-07, 12:43 PM

The new DCH boxes are suppose to go to new customers. If you turn in a box (ex: 6412) and it's broke, it can't be repaired and put back in the system, it must be removed from circulation but if they have another 6412 in stock they can give one to you or other previous customers until they run out.

Where'd the "new customers" thing come from?

If a customer returns a defective DCT, it can still be repaired and re-issued.

The rule as interpreted by me is "Any box that has been on an account can be re-used".

A new customer (or anyone) requesting a HD DVR today will get a used 3412, 3416 or 6412 depending on availability.

When DCHs are released, anyone can get one. Should not be to far away, it works fine and stock is growing.

Best source for a 3416 would be a service center that is attached to an operations building.

Barovelli

07-03-07, 12:46 PM

There has to be a plan within Comcast for HD and the need for more space. Is there a plan? Not everyone can afford the Tivo Unit. Maybe it's just me.... :D

Switched Digital Video is one plan for more HD.

3rd party boxes that should be available may have more storage space, but like the S3 the cost could be a factor.

fender4645

07-03-07, 12:49 PM

Switched Digital Video is one plan for more HD.

3rd party boxes that should be available may have more storage space, but like the S3 the cost could be a factor.

I heard a while ago that Moto was going to have the DRM bug on the FireWire port fixed sometime this summer so external storage could be attached. Haven't heard anything in a while so I'm assuming it isn't happening any time soon.

Barovelli

07-03-07, 12:55 PM

I heard a while ago that Moto was going to have the DRM bug on the FireWire port fixed sometime this summer so external storage could be attached. Haven't heard anything in a while so I'm assuming it isn't happening any time soon.

And just when they figure that out they drop it in favor of activating the eSATA ports on the DCH. Which will take how long? :rolleyes:

keenan

07-03-07, 01:15 PM

And just when they figure that out they drop it in favor of activating the eSATA ports on the DCH. Which will take how long? :rolleyes:
I didn't think Comcast wanted to be bothered with the DRM issues and the customer service headaches associated with attached storage? They'd rather have you use VOD, at least that's the impression I get.

(BTW, thanks to you and walk for the tip about the domain thing, I'm gradually switching/forwarded my email through the new service already - I had no idea there was so many different domain suffixes available, I almost went with a .uk one. :p )

P.S. Newegg had a screaming good deal this weekend for the D-Link Xtreme N router and notebook card, $180 for both. The DIR-655 received WiFi Alliance draft 802.11n certification last Friday.

walk

07-03-07, 01:45 PM

How about giving us eSata and allowing the ethernet LAN so I can play back the files from a remote media player, like a PS3 ;)

Mikef5

07-03-07, 05:06 PM

Where'd the "new customers" thing come from?

If a customer returns a defective DCT, it can still be repaired and re-issued.

The rule as interpreted by me is "Any box that has been on an account can be re-used".

A new customer (or anyone) requesting a HD DVR today will get a used 3412, 3416 or 6412 depending on availability.

When DCHs are released, anyone can get one. Should not be to far away, it works fine and stock is growing.

Best source for a 3416 would be a service center that is attached to an operations building.
Dave,
The problem with that is, Comcast/Cable company's could repair/reuse these old boxes until hell freezes over and never have to issue the new DCH boxes. There has to be a way to get the old boxes out of the system so you can gradually issue the new boxes. It was my understanding that's why the FCC doesn't want the cable company repairing and reusing the boxes, that once they are turned in as defective they are to be removed from the system and the new boxes issued in their place. Any boxes that are now in use or in supply can be used/issued until they fail and then new boxes replace them. If they don't do that how are they ever going to get rid of the old boxes ??? I could be wrong but I believe that's the only way to do it without requiring the cable company's to replace them all now but to do it this way gradually.

Laters,
Mikef5

Barovelli

07-03-07, 05:52 PM

Dave,
The problem with that is, Comcast/Cable company's could repair/reuse these old boxes until hell freezes over and never have to issue the new DCH boxes. There has to be a way to get the old boxes out of the system so you can gradually issue the new boxes.

There is a way, it's called growth! If there was flat growth or loss, yes there would be no need to issue new boxes. But there are no minus' here. Yes, some fail and cannot be repaired, some walk off when a customer moves and never returns it, but mostly it's growth that require the purchase of new boxes every year. So if you want new boxes, order more! Get one in every room! Yah! make my day :D

I'm still baffled as to why we need a company owned cable card in every new company owned box. Don't get me wrong - I love cable cards, the competition cannot match it. But the marketplace has not produced many host items for them.

Mikef5

07-03-07, 06:15 PM

There is a way, it's called growth! If there was flat growth or loss, yes there would be no need to issue new boxes. But there are no minus' here. Yes, some fail and cannot be repaired, some walk off when a customer moves and never returns it, but mostly it's growth that require the purchase of new boxes every year. So if you want new boxes, order more! Get one in every room! Yah! make my day :D

I'm still baffled as to why we need a company owned cable card in every new company owned box. Don't get me wrong - I love cable cards, the competition cannot match it. But the marketplace has not produced many host items for them.
Dave,
You're missing my point, the FCC told cable company's to get rid of the old boxes and use boxes with cable cards ( separate security from the box ) and they gave them 2 ways to do it

1.) do them all now or
2.) Replace the old boxes through attrition, like I outlined.

What was the point of the 1 July dead line if the FCC wasn't serious about getting cable cards up and running and denying the cable company's request for an extension to that dead line date ??

The problem with the market place not making host devices is Cable Labs, There is no certification process in place for 3rd party's to get their devices certified for 2-way host devices. Tivo is a one way host and may or may not be able to be upgraded to a 2 way host, it's still unclear but Cable Labs is making the whole process slower than molasses and throwing up road blocks.

I can take care of the whole problem, give me a sledge hammer and access to the warehouse for about an hour and all will be taken care of..... :eek: :p

Laters,
Mikef5

Barovelli

07-03-07, 07:06 PM

Dave,
You're missing my point, the FCC told cable company's to get rid of the old boxes and use boxes with cable cards ( separate security from the box ) and they gave them 2 ways to do it

1.) do them all now or
2.) Replace the old boxes through attrition, like I outlined.

What'd I miss - # 2 is currently in place. Right now, I NEED more advanced boxes to make orders. I even have a good supply of DCHs. Don't worry about that.

But still, what good is a cable card in a rented box? If I could sell it to you, sure. If I could give it to you after you've rented it for 2 years, sure. But no one is selling the OEM units so why?

IMHO, this whole separate security thing was dreamed up by the analog pirate box sellers 11 years ago that were trying to legitimize their business. They are gone now thanks to digital, but even they did not jump on the cable card bandwagon when it launched - knowing that no one would buy a cable box if it didn't give them free channels . . .

Barovelli

07-03-07, 07:12 PM

How about giving us eSata and allowing the ethernet LAN so I can play back the files from a remote media player, like a PS3 ;)

How in the @$% do you get that to work? I have Vista with media center and a 750g hdd full of video - and a PS3. Whenever I try to knock on the PC's door with the PS3, it sees a Windows Media Center, but won't find the content.

This is not impressing the family. My geek-ness is at stake!

walk

07-03-07, 07:29 PM

Well, the content has to be "in" your "library" first of all, and then it must be in a format that Windows/Media Center recognizes. Otherwise... assuming you don't have a network issue.... I don't know, try the Playstation area here, there's a few threads about it.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=851441

walk

07-03-07, 07:34 PM

You also have to allow (on the PC) the PS3 to have access. It should ask you the first time you try to connect, or you can set it up in the WMP options (I'm using XP with WMP 11).

Mikef5

07-03-07, 07:47 PM

What'd I miss - # 2 is currently in place. Right now, I NEED more advanced boxes to make orders. I even have a good supply of DCHs. Don't worry about that.

But still, what good is a cable card in a rented box? If I could sell it to you, sure. If I could give it to you after you've rented it for 2 years, sure. But no one is selling the OEM units so why?

IMHO, this whole separate security thing was dreamed up by the analog pirate box sellers 11 years ago that were trying to legitimize their business. They are gone now thanks to digital, but even they did not jump on the cable card bandwagon when it launched - knowing that no one would buy a cable box if it didn't give them free channels . . .
The reason the FCC wants cable company's to use the cable cards is to level the playing field for 3rd party vendors. If cable company's have to use cable cards then they have to make them work and work right and right now they don't work right, way to many problems with them so by forcing the cable company's to use cable cards they are making the cable company's to make them work and work for everyone. That way other companys will have incentive to build boxes that work with cable but have their own features that they could include with their boxes. It will allow the customer to have his own box that can be used on any cable company's system be it Comcast, Cox, or any other cable company. Right now I have no choice but to rent a box from the cable company even though another company may have a better box ( maybe Tivo ) , it's competition that cable company's don't want.

So, enough of that. So you have lots of DCH's ??? Do you have any DCH 64XX's, I'm still not upgraded and still have all these analog channels that need to be gotten rid of, another bone of contention I have with Comcast ;)

Laters,
Mikef5

Barovelli

07-03-07, 10:53 PM

. . If cable company's have to use cable cards then they have to make them work and work right and right now they don't work right, way to many problems with them so by forcing the cable company's to use cable cards they are making the cable company's to make them work and work for everyone.

I am not convinced with that argument. Cable box is made by Motorola. Cable Card is made by Motorola. No doubt that combo works right. I could say that the trouble lies with the host devices not made as good as a Motorola DCH . . but those other devices are not provisioned at the same time like the DCHs are. The biggest bug I think is that there is no hands off provisioning system like there is for modems. When it's good enough to self install, it will be (near) perfect.

Upgrades looking good and on schedule so far. No 64xx, all ADS boxes :(

07-03-07, 11:02 PM

I could say that the trouble lies with the host devices not made as good as a Motorola DCH

Based on what I have heard, most of the CableCard installation problems are caused by bad cards (which may be put back into the pool for other installations) and poorly trained people at the headend who don't know how to program and activate the cards.

Barovelli

07-03-07, 11:14 PM

Based on what I have heard, most of the CableCard installation problems are caused by bad cards (which may be put back into the pool for oth. er installations) and poorly trained people at the headend who don't know how to program and activate the cards.

ummm I've heard that most "bad" cable cards are returned to the field and work fine. ;)

Agree about provisioning to a point - if every cable card install was the same it would not be a problem. But the host hardware is not consistent.

Ace of Space

07-04-07, 02:41 PM

Is there going to be a replacement model for the DCT6200 any time in the near future?

1982300sd

07-05-07, 12:19 PM

karlw2000

07-05-07, 12:25 PM

I am sick of paying comcast $5 for their box each month (just increased to $8). For $1.70 something I can rent a cable card to put into a cable box that I buy. Where can I buy these boxes? Does anyone carry 3rd party cable boxes yet?Me too. I rent only one box and use TV's with QAM tuners so I can watch clear stations. Only when I want to watch ESPN do I turn on the cable box.

walk

07-05-07, 12:58 PM

The only 3rd party Cablecard boxes right now are DVRs - i.e. Tivo S3.

Or, you can get a TV with Cablecard tuner, that's about it.

walk

07-05-07, 01:00 PM

You can't even get Tivo service for $7, let alone pay for hardware like the S3 ($800 MSRP ... that's 9.5 years at $7/mo...)

07-05-07, 01:23 PM

You can't even get Tivo service for $7, let alone pay for hardware like the S3 ($800 MSRP ... that's 9.5 years at $7/mo...)

Yes, you can. Who pays MSRP? The S3 could be bought for less than $400AR just a few weeks ago.

ryder1650

07-05-07, 01:26 PM

Are there any updates on when us Milpitas Comcast users will be getting On Demand?

walk

07-05-07, 02:59 PM

Yes, you can. Who pays MSRP? The S3 could be bought for less than $400AR just a few weeks ago.
The service is $14/mo or so isn't it?

07-05-07, 03:12 PM

The service is $14/mo or so isn't it?

For the first unit, you can pay $299 for 3 years, which is $8.31/month. For additional units, you can get it for $6.95/month (3-year rate).

1982300sd

07-05-07, 07:24 PM

I really wanted to just cancel Comcast on principle for hiking their digital set top box fee 60% more per month and expecting me to bend over, but decided that losing Discovery HD wasn't worth the sacrifice. I decided to return their set top box and go the cable card route which will let you rent for free. So if you have no need for On Demand and have a cable card slot in your TV, trade your set top box in and avoid the $8 a month fee.

walk

07-05-07, 07:26 PM

Sure if you have a Cablecard slot. Buying a S3 isn't going to save you any money, though it will get you ... well, a TIVO... instead of whatever abomination they call that on the Comcast boxes? Microsoft Abomination(tm)? I think that might actually be the name... :)

yunlin12

07-05-07, 09:25 PM

Just got the June bill, saying that starting June 1st they are charging $7 for HDTV Equipment ($* if not with a digital package), and $1.79 for dual cable cards. I use the S3.

I called to ask if I can just get the cable cards without the HDTV equipment fee, if I only need HDTV local stations from antenna, and don't want Comcast's HDTV channels, and I still want the cable cards to get digital TV, they said there is no way their system can handle that, if I get the dual cable card, they have to charge the $7 HDTV Equipment fee.

sfhub

07-05-07, 09:36 PM

I called to ask if I can just get the cable cards without the HDTV equipment fee, if I only need HDTV local stations from antenna, and don't want Comcast's HDTV channels, and I still want the cable cards to get digital TV, they said there is no way their system can handle that, if I get the dual cable card, they have to charge the $7 HDTV Equipment fee.
All I can say is there are people in the Bay Area paying the new $1.79 CC fee for their S3 who are not paying any HDTV fee, $5, $7, or $8. Either this S3 HDTV fee requirement is something specific to your area or they are not telling you correct info. I sympathize with your situation though. I know sometimes it can be very frustrating to resolve these tack on charges.

MKANET

07-05-07, 09:51 PM

It doesnt matter what kind of tuner/cable box I use, KTVU will once in a while have "micro-stutters". Best way I can describe it is every once in a while the audio and video will pause for < .5 seconds.

Is this a signal quality issue? I tried using a two-way amp placed near the front of my house where the cable comes in from the street. It still does the same thing. Maybe I'm not using a good enough amp? Maybe I have a bad cable run? Why would only KTVU/KPIX do this and not all the other channels? If I dont have a goood enough amp or the wrong amp, could you please recommend me a high grade amp? I have a radio shack all silver 2way digital amp. I also have a DC block before reaching my tuners.

07-05-07, 10:04 PM

Why would only KTVU/KPIX do this and not all the other channels?

Those two channels typically share the same RF channel, which is around 555 MHz in my area.

sfhub

07-05-07, 10:15 PM

dailowai

07-05-07, 11:08 PM

Any people in the Bay Area using Vista MCE with cable cards yet? How's it working? I'm thinking about getting a Cablecard ready machine and hopefully replace all of my comcast DVR's.

walk

07-05-07, 11:11 PM

Unfortunately you have to buy a new computer with OEM Cablecard license. Last time I checked, they were only offered with single-tuner cards, or EXTERNAL (ugly) single-tuner boxes. Yeech.

fender4645

07-06-07, 12:00 AM

Velocity Micro, I believe, just released a $1250 CC-capable computer (price is before adding the tuners). So you could add 2 tuners for $300/each and make it under $2,000. Not bad...but still a little too pricey. I imagine (or hope) the prices will come down once the manufacturers recoup of the cost of certification. Then again, these devices are in the same boat as the S3 in regards to SDV. So it may be dead already...

dailowai

07-06-07, 01:08 AM

Yeah I am thinking about getting a system from them as I really really want a Vista Media Center setup. I could get away with just HDHomeRun since everything I watch (including ESPN and Discovery) are currently not encrypted on this part of the bay, but I am moving to San Jose soon and reading through the thread it appears that in San Jose ESPN and DSC are encrypted so I'd need cablecard to watch those and other premium channels.

Do you guys think comcast will switch the Bay Area to SDV that soon? It'd suck to spend all that money on a system and have it be obsolete next year, but if I could get a few years out of it then I guess it would be worth it.

fender4645

07-06-07, 01:27 AM

Mikef5

07-06-07, 11:54 AM

There's been a couple recent articles (floated around the S3 forums) that say the "industry" is confident there will be something worked out to make current CC devices compatible with SDV. While there's no "in your face" legal reason why the FCC should/could step in, the fact that the current situation breaks the spirit of the law of CC could be enough for them to get involved. Basically, they don't want to look like a bunch of chumps since they spent so much effort in getting CC going.

As for Comcast switching to SDV, while some people say it's going to happen sooner rather than later, I just don't see that happening. Comcast, as we all know, is notorious for delaying new technologies that require infrastructure changes. This is just my personal opinion.
Fender,
While I agree with most of what you are saying. The part about Comcast not switching to SDV anytime soon might be a little wishful thinking. It's already in testing in a couple of markets back east.
If you listened to the last investors meeting that was just held, the main thrust of the meeting was VOD and Linear Programing ( think SDV ). These were stressed several times in the meeting and from other sources I've checked with these will be the main goals of Comcast in the near future. I do agree with you that Comcast is to slow to adapt to new technology especially when it requires a significant outlay of money. They remind me a lot of IBM, a juggernaut that had problems moving quickly with the changes and look where they are now. Not that I think that Comcast is headed that way but if they don't start moving faster with the adoption of new technology's and investing in the future and stop letting the bean counters dictate their investment strategies well......

Laters,
Mikef5

fender4645

07-06-07, 12:04 PM

Mikef5

07-06-07, 12:33 PM

Thanks, Mike. What makes me think it's not going to "take over" for a while is that Comcast already said they're not moving to all-digital until sometime after 2010 which means there still a fair number of analog customers out there. Does anyone know if MSOs can have SDV go to one household and regular QAM/analog go to another household on the same headend? If so, then I could see them possibly keeping things current the way they are and that all new services/channels would only be available via SDV.
I think people are getting a little bit to worked up about SDV. From what I've been able to hash out from different sources, the plan is to only put some channels on SDV and leave some on the cable like it is now, sort of a hybrid system and on systems that are now using SDV that's what they are doing. Now which channels will be put there or how they are going to determine which will be on SDV and which will not, only the Man upstairs knows for sure... ;)

As far as analog, my suggestion would be get off the analog wagon and get on the digital train. Analog wastes bandwidth that can be used more efficiently by going all digital. Just like when we went from radio to b/w tv then to color tv technologies evolve and you need to adapt to them. The price of digital equipment is dropping like a rock and you have 2 years to get ready for the change, don't wait.

Laters,
Mikef5

sfhub

07-06-07, 12:58 PM

Thanks, Mike. What makes me think it's not going to "take over" for a while is that Comcast already said they're not moving to all-digital until sometime after 2010 which means there still a fair number of analog customers out there. Does anyone know if MSOs can have SDV go to one household and regular QAM/analog go to another household on the same headend? If so, then I could see them possibly keeping things current the way they are and that all new services/channels would only be available via SDV.
Even if they don't move to all-digital until 2010 they could still move expanded basic to all digital before then, which would free up large amounts of bandwidth. They already did this in Chicago.

BTW moving to all digital *relieves* the pressure to go SDV, it doesn't indicate SDV is less likely.

Analog must be broadcast to everyone on your head-end. If we did see SDV it would either be SDV+fixed QAM+analog or in the doomsday case for S3 owners given current S3 functionality, only SDV+analog. The analog could in the meantime go from limited+expanded basic to limited basic.

Sporadic SDV usage/testing so far has ranged from a couple of channels + tier programming in test Comcast areas to major SDV usage at Time Warner Austin.

Mikef5

07-06-07, 04:43 PM

U-Verse tested in Milpitas

Well, it's finally happened. I'm the last of my family to be on cable. One brother is on
Dish the other brother is on Directv and my sister the other day went from Comcast to AT&T
U-Verse. What's the world coming to ?? :eek:

But it does give me the opportunity to actually have hands on experience with U-Verse. The
last time they tried to hook my sister's home up with U-Verse the installer never did get
it to work right and I was not overly impressed with it. But the installer that actually
did the hookup this time definitely knew what she was doing ( yes, female installer ).
The install took 6 hours to do, granted she did have to rewire everything the other
installer screwed up but after all was said and done it now works as advertised and if this
is any indication of AT&T's offering Comcast should worry. I sat there all day on the 4th
playing around with it and here's some of the things I've found so far.

Response time sucks, those of you that like to channel surf or even scan through the guide
quickly will be sorely disappointed, molasses comes to mind.

The guide is definitely different and will take time to get use to but then again I'm use
to the cable guide so I'm kind of bias on that. The guide does have a lot of info on it and
it will do PIP of the channel in the guide without having to loose the main channel that
you are watching nice feature. The new Comcast I-Guide is suppose to do this also but then
again we don't have the new guide.

There's a lot of search features in the guide, much more than the cable guide has, sort of
like what the Tivo has. Again the new I-Guide is suppose to have this feature also but the
new guide is missing in action.

I had the box output 1080i to watch for artifacts or breakups in the picture. I had no
breakups at all. I watched the A's game, I watched different movie channels HBO, HDNET, SHO,
etc and not one glitch. Now was that normal or did I just get there on a good day, I'll
have to do more testing, good thing my sister loves to see me. :p

Ok, now for the important stuff. How many HD channels ?? From what I was able to see and
count there are about 30 HD channels. Granted some are East/West feeds, like for HBO, SHO,
CineMax etc. but they do have a lot and for those of you that care they do have HDnet and
HDnet Movies. Keep in mind I'm in a 550 MHz area and I don't get squat for HD, not even
Video on Demand. Yes, AT&T does have VOD but it's free offerings are very limited and is
more like PPV than it is VOD, not appealing to me. Comcast's VOD ( or so I've heard ) is
much better with more free selections and in some areas have VOD-HD. U-verse does have
FSNBA but only the SD version not the HD channel, something I would find hard to live
without, I just love local sports to much.

So far I've had a good amount of time playing with the system and I'm much more impressed
with what I saw at my sisters house, much more impressed.

So in a nutshell here's my good and bad findings.

Good ---

Lots of HD channels
No breakups seen during my viewing but I need to do much more viewing to confirm that.
Good search features
Nice PIP feature
Price is cheaper than cable depending on the package you get. For me it would be close.

Bad ---

very slow response time, both switching channels and when navigating the guide, it will
frustrate most people.
Does not have FSNBA-HD
Only one HD channel at a time, big minus for me and a real deal killer.
Must have a box on all tv's that you want to view from. For most people not a big deal but
for you that like to plug your cable into your tv and get content you are SOL.
VOD very limited and not of much value to me.

So there you go, there's much more but this is the basics and I still need to play with the
system to really see if it's all it's cracked up to be but if the picture quality remains
the same and they ever get the ability to do more than one HD channel at a time and they
get FSNBA-HD then Comcast will have something to be concerned about. I'm pretty much a
cable guy but this system has potential if done right and if I was Comcast I'd expedite
getting all the Comcast's areas upgraded and start adding more content ASAP!!!

Laters,
Mikef5

garypen

07-06-07, 04:50 PM

Mikef5

07-06-07, 05:06 PM

The bad seriously outweighs the good, especially for me in a very good Comcast area. Actually, other than price, I don't see any reason to switch to DBS, either. (Dish costs almost the same as Comcast now, as well.)

I hear Verizon's FIOS is killer, though. But, ATT cheaped out on that last mile which limits their bandwidth. I'll bet a dollar that by the end of the year we will hear that ATT is planning on implementing FTTH, instead of the lame-ass FTTN they use now.
So Gary, if I might ask, how much do you pay for your cable ?? I pay $151 a month for everything with 2 dvr's and I get squat for HD, I'm in a 550 MHz area. The U-400 package is about $114, I think that's what my sister said she was paying, so for me it is something to think about. But like I said only one HD channel at a time is the real deal killer to me and only being able to do 2 at a time is not good enough either, with cable I can do as many HD channels as I have HD sets so AT&T is going to have to match that to be a real contender to me ;) but they are moving that way it's just a matter of time. The question is will they move fast enough or will Comcast move faster and match their offerings ???

Laters,
Mikef5

garypen

07-06-07, 06:26 PM

I don't have everything, as I don't need or want everything. I barely have time to keep up with the few series I record on a regular basis. Thank god the season's over.

I believe I was paying about $120 for Digital Silver (Digital Plus + HBO), TV Japan, HD-DVR, and tax. But, I complained about the price, said I was annoyed that new customers were paying $40 for the Digital Silver promo, and told them I thought about switching to DBS. So, they gave me the promo price for 6 mos. Now, I'm paying around $80. But, it will go back to $120 at some point.

When I priced Dish Network for the equivalent programming and HD-DVR, it was about the same price as Comcast. Plus, Dish has a commitment, their locals and most SD looks like crap compared to Comcast, and they are missing some local HD. And, Comcast has killer free VOD. I rely on VOD when there is nothing to watch on the other bazillion channels, which is often.

The single HD stream, lack of VOD, no FSN-HD, beta-like bugs and glitches, and problems with the ISP part of the service, as well, has made U-Verse a big No-verse for me. If they woulda just made the investment that Verizon did, they'd have a great system now. But, they cheaped out, will have to spend the additional buck anyway, and will have wasted all this time and effort trying to make the present system work.

sfhub

07-06-07, 09:21 PM

dt_dc pointed out in one of the TiVo threads
Once a cable plant has been determined to have "effective competition" ...
1) Prices can no longer be regulated by franchise authority
2) They no longer have to submit rate sheets to franchise authority
3) They can basically charge whatever they want / the market and competition will bearThis April 24, 2007 FCC Public Notice mentions that various Comcast franchises in the Bay Area and NorCal have requested "effective competition" status
http://www.fcc.gov/Daily_Releases/Daily_Business/2007/db0424/DOC-272521A1.pdf
CSR-7163-E Comcast Cable Communications, LLC Antioch, Brentwood, CA, et al
CSR-7164-E Comcast Cable Communications, LLC Fremont and Newark, CA
CSR-7165-E Comcast Cable Communications, LLC Coalinga and Huron, CA
CSR-7166-E Comcast Cable Communications, LLC Dublin, Livermore, CA et al
CSR-7167-E Comcast Cable Communications, LLC Sunnyvale, CA
CSR-7168-E Comcast Cable Communications, LLC Contra Costa County, Hercules, CA et al
CSR-7169-E Comcast Cable Communications, LLC Emeryville, CA
CSR-7170-E Comcast Cable Communications, LLC Campbell, San Jose and Santa Clara County, CA
CSR-7186-E Comcast Cable Communications, LLC Alameda County, Hayward, CA et al
CSR-7187-E Comcast Cable Communications, LLC Alameda County, CA
CSR-7188-E Comcast Cable Communications, LLC Atwater, Chowchilla, CA et al
CSR-7189-E Comcast Cable Communications, LLC Madera County, CA
CSR-7190-E Comcast Cable Communications, LLC Half Moon Bay, CA
CSR-7195-E Comcast Cable Communications, LLC Milpitas, CA
It will be interesting to see what happens to rates if these requests are granted. I'm wondering if it has anything to do with yunlin's experiences.

MKANET

07-06-07, 09:49 PM

walk

07-06-07, 10:05 PM

ATT is using 8.5mbits (max) for the HD channel now, but they plan to cut that back to 6Mb so they can fit 2 HD channels.

bobby94928

07-06-07, 10:34 PM

MKANET

07-06-07, 10:36 PM

That link doesnt work.

This is the one used by Comcast itself. I have my own and it is superb.

http://www.amazon.com/Motorola-484095-001-00-Signal-Booster/dp/B000066E6Y******pd_bbs_1/102-9386869-4071330?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1183775593&sr=8-1

bobby94928

07-06-07, 10:39 PM

That link doesnt work.

I notice that, was working on correcting it when you joined in. I can't get it to work, even through "*******."

The amp you want is:

Motorola 484095-001-00 Signal Booster

Look it up on Amazon......

MKANET

07-06-07, 10:43 PM

Thanks!! I cant find anywhere how many db+ it amplifies. Im not sure what "up to 32 times" means. Any ideas?

PS: I already have a 15db amp and its still a bit too weak.

I notice that, was working on correcting it when you joined in. I can't get it to work, even through "*******."

The amp you want is:

Motorola 484095-001-00 Signal Booster

Look it up on Amazon......

sfhub

07-06-07, 11:21 PM

Thanks!! I cant find anywhere how many db+ it amplifies. Im not sure what "up to 32 times" means. Any ideas?

PS: I already have a 15db amp and its still a bit too weak.
Most of these amps are +15db for a single port, then if it is multi-port, subtract the # of splits, -3.5db for 2-split, -7.4db for 4-split, etc.

If you have a +15db amp installed at the drop point (entry point) and your signal is still too weak, most likely you have a problem with the signal before it reaches your home or you have some inside wiring problem.

Tom Koegel

07-07-07, 01:29 PM

I know the readers of this thread have been on the edge of their seats waiting to hear of the resolution of my problem with errors on ESPN2HD (724) and TNTHD (726). It may have some bearing, too, for others hear fretting about signal strength as a problem related to only some channels.

In my area, both those channels seem to operate at 489 MHz. I was getting massive errors on those channels, resulting in either flawed PQ or no picture at all. Interestingly, sometimes the cablecard TV worked better with the problem, sometimes the Motorola 6412. Other channels, particularly HD channels, would show correctable errors, but not so much to affect normal viewing.

First step was to go through the telephone/online rigamorole, as I reported earlier. Second step was a truck roll, which ended up with the Comcast repair guy doing the same things I had done with the phone and online reps and concluding that I needed to schedule a second visit to install a "Comcast house amp". Why, when I had two functional amps? Probably because it is SOP, not an intelligent response. All the reps swore there was no problem in the local area.

Since you can't fight City Hall or Comcast, I scheduled the follow-up visit. The visit resulted in a no-show from Comcast and no explanation. But all of the sudden the problem, on all channels, but particularly on 724 and 726, complete disappeared. The error count on both sets completely disappeared. I can only assume that it was some local area problem on those two channels, and they finally figured it out.

Tom

tranle

07-07-07, 05:29 PM

Can someone please recommend the best (and most powerful amp) I can buy for digital cable? For some strange reason, my signal level by the time it reaches my STBs is -15db It just barely works, and my HDHomeRuns dont work too well. According the the hdhomerun tech support they said my signal is: (below -15dBmV)

I have been using the Channel Vision and ChannelPlus video amplifier and they seems to be working fine. If you are looking for a local shop that have them then http://www.hometech.com are in SunnyVale.

But I would advise first to double check if you do not have a bad splitter or cable somewhere on the path.

tyre

07-09-07, 06:54 PM

Milpitas Update

I just got the "We're going to be upgrading your neighborhood" letter from Comcast last week. Looking forward to finally trying out their Triple Play bundle when it becomes available.

FYI I live in the Parc Metropolitan community that is adjacent to the Great Mall.

russwong

07-09-07, 07:25 PM

Man, that is crazy, $14/month for your 2nd HD STB.

I'm surprised more people aren't complaining about this...

$42.80 for limited basic cable and 2 HD cable boxes....

6/19 - 7/18 High Definition TV 8.00
6/19 - 7/18 HDTV Additional Service 7.00
6/19 - 7/18 Limited Basic 17.99
6/19 - 7/18 Digital Addl Outlet 6.99
Includes: Digital Converter and Remote,
if applicable.
Cable Television
Franchise Fee 2.03
FCC Regulatory Fee 0.07
PEG Fee 0.52
State and Local Sales Tax 0.20
Total to be deducted - $42.80

keenan

07-09-07, 07:33 PM

That's ridiculous...

sfhub

07-09-07, 08:14 PM

I'm surprised more people aren't complaining about this...

$42.80 for limited basic cable and 2 HD cable boxes....

6/19 - 7/18 High Definition TV 8.00
6/19 - 7/18 HDTV Additional Service 7.00
6/19 - 7/18 Limited Basic 17.99
6/19 - 7/18 Digital Addl Outlet 6.99
Includes: Digital Converter and Remote,
if applicable.
Cable Television
Franchise Fee 2.03
FCC Regulatory Fee 0.07
PEG Fee 0.52
State and Local Sales Tax 0.20
Total to be deducted - $42.80
I'm going to mix and match posts a little here, but based on the billing you posted and based on how the HDTV charge was explained to Yunlin, even if you felt the fees were getting out of control and decided to purchase your own S3 equipment as a replacement, all those charges would would stay, and further you would likely be charged for CableCARDs beyond the first one. So it costs *more* to use your own equipment.

Actually you should be grateful (not!) you are receiving a $1 discount on the HDTV fee, which should be $8 + $8 instead of $8 + $7.

Something is rotten in Denmark.