Washington, DC / Baltimore, MD - HDTV [Text View] - Page 36

afiggatt

04-17-09, 05:35 PM

Is more time really helping? On the main delay thread, I noticed that DC is reported as being LESS prepared now at 3.7% completely unprepared vs. 3.3% on 3/1. Baltimore went in the opposite direction (0.99 vs. 2.77), which makes me wonder how reliable this data really is.

From what I've seen in the LA area, the educational efforts basically froze in early February after the vote and we still aren't back to where we were in December, at least as respects informational spots, website updates, etc.

Are any soft analog shut-off tests still being conducted? I can't get any info from the LA stations on this and I haven't seen any in a long time now.
I think there are a lot of questions about the reliability of the % not prepared for the analog shutdown numbers. Not an easy or simple number to measure. Still, those are the numbers that are being publicized and used. My guess is that % not prepared numbers will drop only marginally between now and June 12 as most of the remaining not prepared percentage are those who will do nothing until all the analog stations are off the air.

From what I have seen here, the on-air announcements for the shutdown went to almost zero in February. I have not heard about any soft analog shut-off tests, but I don't watch analog broadcast channels, so I wouldn't know unless it was in the news or posted here. The shutdown "tests" and scrolling announcement should start up again on the remaining analog stations as June 12 approaches, but I agree there was a major loss of momentum with the last minute 4 month postponement.

afiggatt

04-17-09, 05:38 PM

Anybody else notice WHUT transmitting a blank screen on their digital virtual channel 32-1 on OTA RF channel 33 for the last few days?
You are right, that what I noticed the past several days several times channel surfing pass WHUT-DT. But I never watch WHUT-DT 32 as if I am going to watch PBS programming, I'll get it from the HD channels on MPT or WETA, even if they are bit starved HD. Have to wonder if anyone from WHUT 32 is even monitoring their digital broadcast?

Potatoehead

04-17-09, 05:50 PM

A while ago I received a card from comcast saying that beginning Apr. 15 we could get 2 free cable digital conversion boxes (they call them digital transport adapters) for use on TVs without clear QAM tuners. I picked one up today. After a few attempts, I got them to work properly. They are Pace boxes and are about 1 inch tall and 5 inches wide. The only connections on the back are Coax in and Coax out. Of course they only work on the clear QAM Lo-Def channels, but they added clear QAM digital duplicates of all of the analog channels recently. I pick up a few additional channels like 7.3 (RTN) over pure analog.

It seems to be working well and my older TV the digital picture is much better than the analog. On my HD set the difference is not so large. The old TV's analog tuners probably were not very good.

Hope this is a sign that we are moving towards an all digital cable.:D

maestro73

04-17-09, 07:49 PM

Anyone else getting Breakups on MASN-HD?

Lots of breakups on Comcast of Alexandria, almost unwatchable.

Joe...has this been occurring since you posted this message? I'm now expierencing periodic tiling and breakups with audio and picture.

Anyone else in Alex/Arl seeing issues?

Of course, Comcast has to crap the bed when the Sox are in HD.

carltonrice

04-18-09, 08:44 AM

So, when June 12th rolls around, I wonder what stations in the Baltimore/Washington area will still be broadcasting SD news. And, how long will it be before the syndication and daytime network programs all become HD or at least widescreen SD.

DC_SnDvl

04-18-09, 07:44 PM

Wrc

so, when june 12th rolls around, i wonder what stations in the baltimore/washington area will still be broadcasting sd news. And, how long will it be before the syndication and daytime network programs all become hd or at least widescreen sd.

machpost

04-19-09, 07:16 PM

biker19

04-20-09, 06:17 AM

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5jJEkKK-Co2ERKwZM91FFAtn7FoBQD97LV98G0

Washington will be the first U.S. city to get free digital TV broadcasts for mobile devices like cell phones, laptop computers and in-car entertainment systems, broadcasters were set to announce Monday.

Broadcasts using new "mobile DTV" technology are expected to begin in late summer from five stations: local affiliates of CBS, NBC, PBS and Ion and one independent station owned by Fox.

If this is true, the stations must already be working on the equipment for this. Like the June 12 work is not enough. Yay, now you can get TV in your car while driving around the Beltway. :rolleyes:

JoeInNVa

04-20-09, 07:14 AM

Joe...has this been occurring since you posted this message? I'm now expierencing periodic tiling and breakups with audio and picture.

Anyone else in Alex/Arl seeing issues?

Of course, Comcast has to crap the bed when the Sox are in HD.

I am still getting it. It's been hell all weekend. Only got to see the Friday game in HD. The rest of the games my box was unable to pick up a signal for MASN-HD, both my TIVO and my SA Box. I think it's jammed in with Science Channel, Disney and Family Channel. All of those are either breaking up or don't get tuned...everything else is fine though.

maestro73

04-20-09, 07:22 AM

Ok thanks. With me, everything else is fine except MASN-HD. I went throught this last year, although the situation was much worse then (many channels). I hope it's not the beginning of the same issue. I sent some emails but as of last night it was still crapping out.

Trip in VA

04-20-09, 08:37 AM

If this is true, the stations must already be working on the equipment for this. Like the June 12 work is not enough. Yay, now you can get TV in your car while driving around the Beltway. :rolleyes:

The first city? You mean the launch in Raleigh last week wasn't the first? :rolleyes:

I wish these things would at least try to make sense...

- Trip

biker19

04-20-09, 09:26 AM

The first city? You mean the launch in Raleigh last week wasn't the first? :rolleyes:

Some folks consider the Raleigh roll out just a "test" case. Not sure what will be different in DC - the number of devices with which to recieve this stuff will still be very limited.

Just thought of something - what RF freq will this use?

CycloneGT

04-20-09, 11:10 AM

I keep staring at my G1 thinking about all of the Computer Technology that they somehow fit into this little device. I compare it to desktop PC and I come away thinking about how remarkable it is that they somehow have managed to fit so much into a little computer. Off the top of my head the following features come to mind.

1. Cellular Phone
2. 3G Radio
3. 2G Edge Radio
4. 802.11 WiFi
5. Linux Computing Platform (ie a embed PC)
6. MicroSD media storage
7. Keyboard
8. Trackball
9. 3.? Megapixel camera
10. Speaker Phone
11. Bluetooth.
12. USB connectivity
13. Rechargable battery
14. Color Video Screen
15. Touchscreen controls.
16. GPS
17. Compass / Accelerometer orientation.

I'm sure there are even a few more that I am missing. But one thing that stood out when I was watching a Youtube clip on the thing, or a Formula One race that I had transferred from my PC, was that it could not watch OTA TV. I mean why can't it? It already performs four kinds of a radio communications, is TV that much harder? It already has the Video and Audio capabilities built in. Add a big enough class 6 MicroSD card and heck, it could even theoretically act as a DVR.

But I dismissed those thoughts remembering articles before about how ATSC didn't work for mobile vehicles and that it had to do with modulation and 8VSB vs CODFM [sic]. So to see today's announcement is quite a surprise, but a welcomed one.

I would really like to be able to tune into the local channels with my phone. And with such a small screen size, I likely won't be complaining about PQ either.

Articles at:

http://www.afterdawn.com/news/archive/17674.cfm

and

http://www.dcrtv.com

More info at http://www.omvc.org/

DC Broadcasters To Offer Free Mobile DTV - 4/20 - Broadcasters are set to announce later today that Washington DC will be the first city in the US to receive free digital TV broadcasts for mobile phones, laptops, and in-car entertainment systems. The broadcasts using "mobile DTV" technology will hit the market in July or August and will come from the local affiliates of CBS (WUSA 9), NBC (WRC 4), PBS (WETA 26), Fox (WTTG 5), and Ion (WPXW 66). More from afterdawn.com.....

I guess my confusion lies with how this will be transmitted. Are the existing ATSC tranmissions going to somehow be modified to be "mobile friendly" or are there going to be an entire 2nd set of TV transmissions taking place? And to think, I thought that all of this digital TV new was about over.

Trip in VA

04-20-09, 11:13 AM

What confused me was the way it said "an independent station owned by Fox" which is to say NOT WTTG. (I'd e-mail DCRTV Dave but he usually ignores me.) I'm assuming they mean WDCA, which is not independent, but who knows.

- Trip

Trip in VA

04-20-09, 11:27 AM

Some folks consider the Raleigh roll out just a "test" case. Not sure what will be different in DC - the number of devices with which to recieve this stuff will still be very limited.

Just thought of something - what RF freq will this use?

The same ones they'll be using post-transition. It's not a separate service.

- Trip

Gerald C

04-20-09, 12:23 PM

I guess my confusion lies with how this will be transmitted. Are the existing ATSC tranmissions going to somehow be modified to be "mobile friendly" or are there going to be an entire 2nd set of TV transmissions taking place?
Mobile DTV will be transmitted within the ATSC datastream. This does require some additional equipment, and of course bandwidth. Depending on how many channels a broadcaster chooses to devote to M-DTV and the quality factor (the standard allows up to 480p), significant bandwidth can theoretically be used - e.g. 1-5 Mb - which gets subtracted from the 19.4 Mb total available.

Trip in VA

04-20-09, 12:25 PM

Each "section" of bandwidth used by Mobile DTV is a fixed 0.917 Mbps, so any bandwidth used is in multiples of that. WRAL in Raleigh is using 3 sections, I have a capture of KKPX in San Francisco while they were testing with 4 sections, and right now in Las Vegas they're demoing at the NAB show with 8 sections on KVMY. (I think 8 is the limit)

http://www.rabbitears.info/screencaps/nc-ral/8688-0_0.htm

This is a capture from WRAL-DT. TSReader doesn't know how to interpret the Mobile DTV part yet, but you can see its bandwidth usage if you scroll all the way to the bottom and note the 0x1eee feed.

- Trip

djp952

04-20-09, 04:35 PM

I was really hoping mobile DTV would fade away into obscurity, but it seems to be gaining speed?

I don't want to sound like a broken record, but aren't we already getting a bad enough picture from some of the locals? Pretty soon we'll be down to under 10Mb/s for a 1080i stream here.

Not that anyone here can do anything about it, I'm just upset that I've spent so much time and money and effort on DTV over the past few years and all that's happened is the picture has gotten worse and worse as time went on.

I personally think mobile DTV should be done as either LP transmissions on unused TV frequencies or even stick in the cell phone spectrums. The TV frequencies are so low it's going to be hard to have an effective antenna that fits in a PDA/cell phone/iPod as it is. Can you imagine the feat required to get a channel like WBAL, on VHF 11, broadcasting at whatever their new really low ERP is from a handheld device? Just doesn't make a lot of sense to me.

Sorry to be so off-topic.

Trip in VA

04-20-09, 06:42 PM

Mobile DTV hasn't had a chance to fail or succeed yet. I can't see cell phone companies allowing mobile DTV into their phones. That'll seriously harm its ability to go anywhere.

It's difficult to know exactly what the future is with regard to mobile DTV. There's no clear cut "this will fail" or "this will succeed" like there are with some other technologies.

- Trip

chrisherbert

04-20-09, 07:31 PM

Ugh, more junk to steal bandwidth from the HD subchannel.

Why can't local stations provide cable/sat/fiber providers with a separate, high quality version of their HD channel? Why do they have to use the same compressed version that goes out over the air?

systems2000

04-20-09, 08:19 PM

How do I find data on two cell towers I have close to me? I'd like to get the GPS on these towers, along with height and transmitting frequencies.

Trip in VA

04-20-09, 08:29 PM

How do I find data on two cell towers I have close to me? I'd like to get the GPS on these towers, along with height and transmitting frequencies.

I like www.cellreception.com though you're not going to learn anything about the transmitting frequencies. If the tower is owned by the company you might be able to tell, else you won't even be able to tell who's on it.

The FCC no longer requires cell phone operators to register new cell sites, so using the FCC site is limited at best, and for operators in the 1.9 GHz band, there aren't any cell site registrations as far as I can tell.

- Trip

Falcon_77

04-20-09, 08:44 PM

I can't see cell phone companies allowing mobile DTV into their phones. That'll seriously harm its ability to go anywhere.

Why would it harm the ability to go anywhere? Can't people just tune into the locals by market?

I don't think cell phone companies just want to charge a premium for the service, whether or not it comes OTA or through the cell network by way of their back-end deals.

Also, TV stations should choose between having Mobile DTV or fewer/no subs. Having multiple subs, mobile DTV and an HD main would place a serious strain on bandwidth.

Having all the locals share Mobile DTV facilities on a separate channel sounds too logical to ever get anywhere. :rolleyes:

...not that we can spare a full power channel in some markets, though perhaps a 15kW LP facility would be sufficient.

Trip in VA

04-20-09, 09:01 PM

Why would it harm the ability to go anywhere? Can't people just tune into the locals by market?

If their cell phone has that feature locked out/disabled, they really can't tune anything. And I doubt people will want to carry yet another device when their MP3 player will do video for them as well.

I don't think cell phone companies just want to charge a premium for the service, whether or not it comes OTA or through the cell network by way of their back-end deals.

I have US Cellular, so I wouldn't know anything about it, but I've had Verizon customers tell me things like Bluetooth are locked out for them. I would not be the least bit surprised to find the free OTA service locked out so as to force people to buy their own service.

- Trip

systems2000

04-20-09, 11:01 PM

biker19

04-21-09, 06:51 AM

Mobile DTV will be transmitted within the ATSC datastream. This does require some additional equipment, and of course bandwidth.
That's what I thought, but then was confused as to how a "regular" ATSC stream that can't be recieved in a mobile environment, then is somehow "modified" and then all of a sudden it can be recieved.:confused:

Some details of the spec can be found in http://www.atsc.org/standards/cs_documents/a153-2009-04-09/S4-130r14-A153-Part-1-ATSC-M-H.pdf - it is interesting to note that it uses MPEG4 for video and AAC for audio

I do foresee a potential problem - the info contained in the ATSC M/H stream may confuse some improperly programmed older DTV recievers (cause when they were desigend ATSC M/H did not exist) and cause issues. I'm thinking of cheap CECBs and such.

With the M/H stream being IP transport based all kinds of things could be piped in there, besides video. I could see lots of stuff being put in there and eventually stations could (years down the road) switch their main progamming to the M/H side of the ATSC stream and make the legacy ATSC stream a single SD ch.

markbulla

04-21-09, 10:23 AM

Thanks Trip,

It supplied some information, but the two towers close to my house were not in the database. :( I guess I'll be taking a short road trip to the towers and see if there is some posted information.

All towers have to have their ASR (antenna structure registration) number posted in plain sight. You can look up the owners info here: http://wireless2.fcc.gov/UlsApp/AsrSearch/asrRegistrationSearch.jsp
or here: http://www.fccinfo.com/cmdpro.php?sz=L&wd=1280

On the FCCinfo page, which, BTW, isn't associated with the FCC, you can also look up TV or radio station licenses within any distance of given coordinates. What I've done is to look up the ASR to get the coordinates, then use the coordinates to find out who's on the tower.

.
Sorry, I didn't realize that you were talking about cell phone towers. If they are over 200 feet, they will still have an ASR number, though.

systems2000

04-21-09, 10:34 AM

I've got the owners of both towers now. Cingular on the one at 7° (1.3 KM) and Shenendoah Personal Communications on the other at 171.5° (D.C. stations are at 173.5°).

I have 12 other ones within 10 KM of my house. :(

systems2000

04-21-09, 11:46 AM

I also have four AM stations and 10 FM stations within 15 KM. All my local television stations are beyond 20 KM.

Sometime over the weekend, I received severe electrical interference across all my VHF stations (I forgot to check channel 20). It lasted for at least five min. I just realized that at the base of the SPC tower is the local PennDOT yard and next to that is a multi-function auction house. I'll bet they do welding at those locations. There's also a backyard racer close by too.

dg28

04-21-09, 02:48 PM

systems2000

04-21-09, 03:56 PM

I talked to the Man-In-The-Know at SPC and the tower is 195' and operating A-Band. :confused:

Trip in VA

04-21-09, 05:56 PM

I talked to the Man-In-The-Know at SPC and the tower is 195' and operating A-Band. :confused:

If it means what I think it means, the A channel block is in the 850 MHz band.

- Trip

Marcus Carr

04-21-09, 07:19 PM

How long has King of Queens been in HD on WBFF?

mdviewer25

04-21-09, 07:30 PM

How long has King of Queens been in HD on WBFF?

at least a year

mdviewer25

04-21-09, 07:32 PM

Steve_AA_Co_MD

04-21-09, 08:33 PM

Is there anyone out there who can pick up TNT HD in the clear unencrypted? It is so annoying having video and no audio especially now during the NBA playoffs. It would be nice to see more than just the Sunday ABC game (which is usually Kobe's Lakers or LeBron's Cavs) in HD.

We had TNT-HD via clear-QAM here in AA County for a long while. It's been encrypted now for a few months. One thing I noticed is that the audio would sometimes be absent. Not sure why that happens on some clear QAM channels. WTTG-DT also had this audio issue (on non Comcast equipment only).

machpost

04-21-09, 08:47 PM

From Paul Farhi's online chat today at www.washingtonpost.com

Reston, Va.: The thing I hate about local news is when the station you like best is the only one whose news is not in HD. I'm looking at you, Channel 4.

Paul Farhi: Well, that's going to change in a few weeks...

I'll believe it when I see it. This would be huge for WRC. Despite every other local broadcasting their local news in HD, I still turn to channel 4 first.

Steve_AA_Co_MD

04-21-09, 09:45 PM

I did notice that the channel 4 newcast appeared to be from a corner of a room the other day and not from the usual studio.

Digital Rules

04-21-09, 11:30 PM

URFloorMatt

04-22-09, 02:19 AM

I'll believe it when I see it. This would be huge for WRC. Despite every other local broadcasting their local news in HD, I still turn to channel 4 first.

Word was that WRC would go through the same rebranding that the New York affiliate did. It took them three months to rebuild everything from the ground up there, and I think we're about three or four months since that job was completed. We haven't heard anything out of WRC on that front though.

aaronwt

04-22-09, 05:26 AM

systems2000

04-22-09, 08:22 AM

Is it just me, or does WNUV-DT 54 have serious audio sync issues? The motion is very jerky, but the PQ is excellent otherwise. I notice this on all our TV's.I had the same problem before I lost WJZ-DT & WNUV-DT, due to WJAL-DT (39) powering up. I found that if you detune your antenna, it helps to clean up the problem.

nottenst

04-22-09, 08:36 AM

What happened to WTTG 5-1 yesterday? They were not broadcasting in HD last night. I was going to watch Fringe, but since it wasn't in HD, I couldn't put myself through the pain of watching an SD show.I was quite surprised last night in watching Fringe. Seeing it both letter-boxed and pillor-boxed was not a pleasant surprise.

Later, WJLA swtiched from HD to SD for at least 10 minutes (probably more) during The Unusuals.

I am assuming that it is the stations and not Comcast doing this.

markbulla

04-22-09, 08:47 AM

Is it just me, or does WNUV-DT 54 have serious audio sync issues? The motion is very jerky, but the PQ is excellent otherwise. I notice this on all our TV's.

Just watched WBOC-DT 16 news for the first time in HD. Very impressive production quality for such a small market. The graphics are right up there with WBAL-DT 11. Can't understand why WRC is so far behind the ball?????

What kind of TVs do you have? I've heard of a couple of problems when people are viewing WNUV on Samsung and Sanyo TVs, but it's rare. I haven't been able to replicate the problem here, and it's odd that WBFF doesn't seem to have the same issue, since it's set up exactly the same way...

.

Digital Rules

04-22-09, 10:24 AM

I was quite surprised last night in watching Fringe. Seeing it both letter-boxed and pillor-boxed was not a pleasant surprise.

Later, WJLA swtiched from HD to SD for at least 10 minutes (probably more) during The Unusuals.

I am assuming that it is the stations and not Comcast doing this.Yes WTTG primetime was in SD last night, but WBFF was in HD.

Digital Rules

04-22-09, 10:41 AM

What kind of TVs do you have? I've heard of a couple of problems when people are viewing WNUV on Samsung and Sanyo TVs, but it's rare. I haven't been able to replicate the problem here, and it's odd that WBFF doesn't seem to have the same issue, since it's set up exactly the same way...

.Thanks Mark,

It is in fact a Samsung TV, but I've I have seen the same thing on the CM 7000 CECB. It seems to happen on HD only FWIW. I'll re-check my CECB's again next time I see it happen to make sure.

Thanks also to Systems 2000. I'll try adjusting the antenna next time also.:)

On a side note, what is the best way to contact the FCC regarding a PSIP issue from a station. The WMDO-DT 47 issue has not been resolved and it is quite annoying on my new TV.:(

Thanks again!!

raidbuck

04-22-09, 01:15 PM

systems2000

04-22-09, 01:18 PM

To remind everyone, I had the WNUV-DT "Freezing" problem on all the CECB's that I've tested and it would be at it's worst when "Primetime" programming was being shown.

Granted, it did happen at other times also, but not nearly as annoying. Since I didn't get WBFF-DT, I can't give a comparison between the two.

Digital Rules

04-22-09, 02:20 PM

I'm in Harford County. I was wondering why we don't have WETAHD like Baltimore has? Usually we are the same as the city.

I'm also wondering why we don't have MLBHD yet. I thought we would get it Apr 1st, then April 14th, still nothing.

Thanks,

Rich N.I believe it has something to do with the FCC's 50 mile must carry rule. If I'm correct, the cable company doesn't have to/can't carry any station outside the 50 mile radius if there is a closer affiliate available.

systems2000

04-22-09, 03:10 PM

Well, I've found that the SPC tower is 152°M at .69 KM distance. FCC TVQuery says WUSA-DT is at 152.63°.

I don't know how this information changes anything:
License, application, and construction permit (CP) coordinates shown in the TV Query are NAD 27 coordinates.
Antenna Structure Registration (ASR) coordinates are NAD 83.
Pretty good information tool at this link: http://boulter.com/gps/distance/

mdviewer25

04-22-09, 03:39 PM

Is it just me, or does WNUV-DT 54 have serious audio sync issues? The motion is very jerky, but the PQ is excellent otherwise. I notice this on all our TV's......

My USDTV box blinks every couple of seconds during HD programming. I noticed that last night during CW primetime programming and during House of Payne

aptt

04-22-09, 04:20 PM

From Paul Farhi's online chat today at www.washingtonpost.com

Reston, Va.: The thing I hate about local news is when the station you like best is the only one whose news is not in HD. I'm looking at you, Channel 4.

Paul Farhi: Well, that's going to change in a few weeks...

So there is a good chance News4HD might premiere in time for May sweeps.

jgantert

04-22-09, 06:01 PM

What happened to WTTG 5-1 yesterday? They were not broadcasting in HD last night. I was going to watch Fringe, but since it wasn't in HD, I couldn't put myself through the pain of watching an SD show.

I have used the contact us form on their website to request them to replay it in HD. I'm sure my request will be forwarded to /dev/null. :rolleyes:

BTW, I didn't watch the SD version either. Too painful. haha.

jgantert

04-22-09, 06:03 PM

aaronwt

04-22-09, 08:50 PM

I have used the contact us form on their website to request them to replay it in HD. I'm sure my request will be forwarded to /dev/null. :rolleyes:

BTW, I didn't watch the SD version either. Too painful. haha.

I guess I'll be renting it from Amazon in HD on my TiVo later this week. I don't really want to pay $3 to watch it, but I also have no desire to watch it in SD.

systems2000

04-22-09, 09:02 PM

Playing with my configuration lately, I was able to watch WJZ-DT tonight and was wondering why the 20:00-20:30 show looked washed out? WTTG-TV audio right now is almost non-existent.

I've been also noticing lately that WWPX-DT runs infomercials, while WWPX-TV runs the 700 Club most mornings. What's going on there?

I've been getting reception from 66 (WPXW-DT) & 67 (WMPB-DT) digital lately. I'll be putting up a M8 this weekend.

systems2000

04-23-09, 12:38 AM

While reviewing my DTV channel list information, I just realized why I'm not able to get some DTV stations:

WHP-DT (21 (CBS)) is blocked by WRC-TV (4 (NBC))
WHTM-DT (27 (ABC)) is blocked by WTAJ-TV (10 (CBS))
WLYH-DT (15 (CW)) is blocked by WATM-TV (23 (ABC))
WATM-DT (23 (ABC)) is blocked by WUTB-TV (24 (MyN))
WJLA-DT (7 (ABC)) is blocked by WJAL-DT (68)
WDCW-DT (50 (CW)) is blocked by W50DE (50 (WV PBS))

This continues to re-enforce my dislike for the Transition Delay. :( At least it's given me the chance to continue trying different designs and configurations. It would be more work with only digital and not having a Spectrum Analyzer.

I forgot to mention that I've also been picking up WFDC-DT lately.

systems2000

04-23-09, 09:08 AM

Does anyone know what a "Class A Study for 2nd Round" refers to?

I see WJAL (39) has an application for a DM (at 83 KW mounted at 168 Meters) on the same tower as WRC (NBC Telemundo), WMDO (Entravision), WFDC (Telefutura), and WWTD DC Broadcasting.

NOTE: WJAL is owned by Entravision.

Trip in VA

04-23-09, 09:16 AM

If I had to guess, it's probably a study to determine whether or not the station would interfere with an existing class A station.

Their petition to relocate to Silver Spring has been denied but they've appealed it. Entravision wants to put WJAL-DT in Washington for TeleFutura I believe.

(WMDO-LD and WFDC-DT are both owned by Entravision, by the way. WFDC-DT is Univision now.)

- Trip

nottenst

04-23-09, 09:28 AM

An article in today's Washington Post about the removal of MPT from Comcast's analog tier: MPT's Digital Move Angers Cable Viewers
By Paul Farhi
Washington Post Staff Writer
Thursday, April 23, 2009

Message to cable companies: Don't mess with public TV. If you do, you'll hear about it.

For the past week, confused and angry viewers have flooded Comcast cable systems and Maryland Public Television (MPT) with calls and e-mails, all of them essentially imploring, "I want my MPT!" The inquiries and outrage came after Comcast moved the public broadcasting station from its "basic" lineup of channels to the digital tier on cable systems throughout the Washington area.

The problem: A lot of Comcast's customers don't subscribe to digital cable, and thus can no longer receive MPT. The only way to do so now is to get a digital converter box from Comcast, or install a pair of rabbit-ear antennas and pull it in over the air.

Neither Comcast nor MPT will say how many people have protested the change or called with questions, but the change affected tens of thousands of cable homes in Montgomery, Prince George's, Frederick, Calvert and Charles counties in Maryland, as well as in the District, and Arlington, Alexandria, Loudoun and Prince William counties and Reston in Northern Virginia. "We've had quite a few calls," said MPT spokesman Michael Golden, declining to offer a specific count. "More than 'many.' "

Access to Washington area viewers is of critical importance to MPT, which is based in the Baltimore suburb of Owings Mills, because local viewers are some of its largest pledge-drive contributors. Losing a portion of these viewers, and their donations, could hurt at a time when public broadcasters are under financial pressure.

Comcast said it moved MPT with the station's consent and cooperation. Since the cable company already offers its Washington area basic subscribers two other public TV stations, Arlington-based WETA and District-based WHUT, the Philadelphia-based cable giant decided to move MPT off basic, said Jaye Linnen, a Comcast spokeswoman. WETA and WHUT carry some, but not all, of the same PBS programs as MPT.

MPT didn't come away empty-handed. In addition to MPT's main channel, Comcast also added two other MPT offerings to its Washington area digital lineup, MPT-2 and V-me, a Spanish-language channel. "We think it's good for consumers of public broadcasting that they have more choice, and more programming to choose from than they had before," Golden said.

Comcast said it will offer digital converter boxes to anyone who still wants to watch MPT, but there's a slight catch. The boxes are free for a year; after that, customers will pay an additional $3.65 per month to rent the boxes.

The move appears to have caught many viewers by surprise. MPT announced the change in a press release dated April 14 -- the same day the switch was made. According to Golden, Comcast alerted viewers to the change in their monthly bills for the last two months.

Nevertheless, the whole episode infuriates Karen Travis, a Bethesda resident who has complained about the change to Comcast, MPT and local officials.

MPT "is an important disseminator of information" about state and local politics, Travis said. "I woke up one morning and suddenly one of those sources of information was snatched away from me. It's particularly galling that I now have to pay a corporate behemoth like Comcast for it."

What's more, as a Maryland resident, her taxes directly support MPT through state subsidies, she said. She's also contributed directly to MPT, but that could change: Travis said she's asked MPT for a refund.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/04/22/AR2009042203608.html

aaronwt

04-23-09, 09:54 AM

I'll be glad when all analog is gone from OTA and cable.

voltore

04-23-09, 10:19 AM

So there is a good chance News4HD might premiere in time for May sweeps.

May Sweeps start today(23rd) so, if true...... (But I doubt it!)

markbulla

04-23-09, 10:36 AM

<edit>
On a side note, what is the best way to contact the FCC regarding a PSIP issue from a station. The WMDO-DT 47 issue has not been resolved and it is quite annoying on my new TV.:(

Thanks again!!

I don't know if it's the "best way", but there's FCC contact info on the fcc.gov page here: http://www.fcc.gov/contacts.html, and here: http://www.fcc.gov/cgb/consumerfacts/bis.html.
.

knnirs

04-23-09, 04:42 PM

An article in today's Washington Post about the removal of MPT from Comcast's analog tier:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/04/22/AR2009042203608.html

The information I receive about Comcast seldom matches my situation, because Comcast never gives any information about their QAM channels. I have been watching MPT on analog for many months, and my channel went dead a little over a week ago. I found MPT on a clear QAM digital channel 133-162 two days later, and it is now fine with a 1080i HD signal. I have the most basic Comcast connection at $15.00 per month.

jgantert

04-23-09, 06:13 PM

I guess I'll be renting it from Amazon in HD on my TiVo later this week. I don't really want to pay $3 to watch it, but I also have no desire to watch it in SD.
Well, actually got a reply back from WTTG Engineering... short and sweet...

"Sorry, we will not."

Not exactly what I was hoping for. For reference, here is what I asked:

"Are you going to be replaying Fringe in HD since it was only shown in SD last night (4/21)?

Please let me know when it will be shown again in HD so that I can set my DVR to record it."

Oh well. Nuts.

jgantert

04-23-09, 06:15 PM

I'll be glad when all analog is gone from OTA and cable.

So once analog is gone, are we still going to have the problem of the digital channels forgetting to flip the HD switch? Sometimes I notice on ABC 7 that they don't immediately flip the switch when they come back from commercial breaks. Will this be better after they don't have to support analog anymore? Heck, sometimes they wait a few minutes into the show after a commercial break before it switches back into HD. Very annoying. :(

systems2000

04-23-09, 07:36 PM

Why does it require a manual switch? The data stream can supply all the information the DTV sets need to set Aspect Ratios and quality format. Is it something to do with the Unions?

Deezul

04-23-09, 10:25 PM

Why does it require a manual switch? The data stream can supply all the information the DTV sets need to set Aspect Ratios and quality format. Is it something to do with the Unions?

Something I've also wondered as well. Why, on a DIGITAL channel, is the feed not always DIGITAL? If the reason is "the commercials" why not convert them to digital immediately when you receive them? I know I'm going out on a limb here, but usually isn't a commercial shown more than once?

nottenst

04-24-09, 09:17 AM

So once analog is gone, are we still going to have the problem of the digital channels forgetting to flip the HD switch? Sometimes I notice on ABC 7 that they don't immediately flip the switch when they come back from commercial breaks. Will this be better after they don't have to support analog anymore? Heck, sometimes they wait a few minutes into the show after a commercial break before it switches back into HD. Very annoying. :(The worst case I've seen was during The Unusuals on Tuesday night. Usually there is only a few seconds wait to get back into HD, but they must have switched into SD in order to put a wrap-around notice about the digital transition around the show and didn't switch back for what seemed like 10 minutes or so.

Digital Rules

04-24-09, 10:28 AM

I don't know if it's the "best way", but there's FCC contact info on the fcc.gov page here: http://www.fcc.gov/contacts.html, and here: http://www.fcc.gov/cgb/consumerfacts/bis.html.
.Thanks Mark,

I'll give it a shot. Too bad WMDO doesn't have a caring engineer like your station does.;)

raidbuck

04-24-09, 12:32 PM

I believe it has something to do with the FCC's 50 mile must carry rule. If I'm correct, the cable company doesn't have to/can't carry any station outside the 50 mile radius if there is a closer affiliate available.

Thanks for the information. Interestingly, we in Harford County still get WTTG-HD Fox from DC. It was added while Sinclair and Comcast couldn't reach an agreement and remains 2 years after the agreement was done.
I wanted WETA because it is a better station than MPT and shows more PBS digital/HD shows (IMHO). Oh well.....

Rich N.

systems2000

04-25-09, 12:14 AM

I've been seeing more transition ads from the stations lately. WJAL-DT is even running some. The most interesting one so far was the one WTTG-TV ran tonight. It showed a map of the surrounding Counties and they overlayed it with a reception circle. They then informed you that if you were on the edge, you'd need a high-gain antenna and anyone outside of the circles wouldn't be able to receive them at all. I'm way outside of their circle and get them great. :)

djp952

04-25-09, 10:33 AM

I'm way outside of their circle and get them great. :)

Yeah, but dude .. you have like a 40' tower - not exactly indicative of the common man's aerial :) lol. :D

I like that the stations are getting more serious about it and providing information like that, even if it's on the conservative side. That said, I don't see a need for any scrollers and/or more warnings on digital channels that aren't changing, like WTTG, since if you're seeing it already, you will continue to see it.

I liked what they did on WUSA last night, though. The message, while overly HUGE, was to warn that the channel is changing back to VHF and you might need a VHF antenna to continue to receive it after 6/12. I know more than a few people that didn't understand that part of the transisition, and am glad the broadcasters are making it known.

Dwight Shrute

04-25-09, 01:28 PM

mdviewer25

04-25-09, 06:55 PM

Is there anyway we can convince Comcast to unencrypt TNT HD for the NBA playoffs?

GregAnnapolis

04-25-09, 07:02 PM

Anyone with FIOS in MD, can you tell me if most of their HD channels are CCI blocked?

Comcast for me blocks nearly every HD channel I would ever want to record to my computer (ESPN, Discovery, TNT, Science, and Nat Geo).
No the channels are not blocked or locked down in Annapolis but I do have problems getting firewire working sometimes. It's weird; it'll start up just fine, but trails off to completely nonfunctional within 5 seconds. But most of the time it works just fine.

When I was on Comcast in Annapolis, they did not have channels blocked, so either that is a recent thing or you are misinterpreting something. You did not list a location, which may help us give you better information.

GregAnnapolis

04-25-09, 07:02 PM

Is there anyway we can convince Comcast to unencrypt TNT HD for the NBA playoffs?
Unfortunately, I doubt it VERY much.

davidjplatt

04-25-09, 08:43 PM

systems2000

04-25-09, 09:30 PM

What was with ABC (WMAR-DT) broadcasting the Nationwide race in 4:3? Was WJLA-DT also in 4:3? I also found it very annoying that the ABC crew seem to be in LOVE with Jr.

Jack D

04-26-09, 02:21 PM

Is there is mapping of channels into QAM frequencies available for CC in DC, Montgomery Co, MD area? If not, is there some way I check for myself? I'm interested because I want to know which channels CC is grouping into the same QAM thereby reducing the quality of the broadcast.

thanks for any help.

aaronwt

04-26-09, 04:42 PM

OK - WUSA (Channel 9) has now reached the heighth of stupidity - put a scrolling banner about their frequency change to VHF on June 12, 2009 at the top of the screen during the Barbra Streisand Concert special.

Thanks WUSA for making sure I had that on the recording on my DVR - what idiots. Thanks for ruining the recording.

Anytime they post this info during a show it would ruin the recording. But I guess that is the only way to make sure people see it. Otherwise, anyone with DVR would skip over it.
Of course most people who understand what this means are probably already prepared for it or are planning for it. The people that aren't prepared are probably teh same people that have no idea what moving to VHF means.

JoeInNVa

04-26-09, 06:53 PM

raidbuck

04-27-09, 12:21 PM

Is there anyway we can convince Comcast to unencrypt TNT HD for the NBA playoffs?

I'm going to ask a really dumb question. Why would you care about TNTHD being unencrypted. Isn't it in the standard digital package and HD included? So don't you get it if you get TNT SD? See, I told you it was dumb.

Thanks,

Rich N.

markbulla

04-27-09, 12:35 PM

Is there anyway we can convince Comcast to unencrypt TNT HD for the NBA playoffs?

Unfortunately, I doubt it VERY much.

You could give them money...

systems2000

04-27-09, 03:41 PM

carltonrice

04-27-09, 04:31 PM

Happened to be scanning channels this afternoon and noticed that WBAL-DT is showing The Oprah Winfrey Show in HD this afternoon. Is today the first time they've shown it this way or just the first time I've seen it?

mdviewer25

04-27-09, 05:07 PM

You could give them money...

I don't want to give them anything extra. With all the analog channels they have taken away the past year I figure they can add that one.

Digital Rules

04-27-09, 10:41 PM

What's going on with WWPX-DT? I'm receiving a 88% signal strength and 85% signal quality and the signal is continuously breaking up. I also don't understand why they keep running "Infomercials," during the "700 Club" hour.Did WWPX-DT improve for you today at all? It barely comes in here tonight. Maybe they are running at reduced power?????

Trip in VA

04-27-09, 10:43 PM

It barely comes in here tonight. Maybe they are running at reduced power?????

How's reception from Richmond or Philly tonight?

- Trip

Digital Rules

04-27-09, 10:47 PM

How's reception from Richmond or Philly tonight?

- TripRichmond WWBT-TV 12 barely comes in. There doesn't seem to be any tropo activity tonight.

Trip in VA

04-27-09, 10:51 PM

Richmond WWBT-TV 12 barely comes in. There doesn't seem to be any tropo activity tonight.

Ah well, there goes my theory. :D

- Trip

Digital Rules

04-27-09, 10:57 PM

I thought the same thing. The activity has been strong the past few days with this crazy weather.:eek:

I'm still hoping VPT will be receivable here post-transition. I'm hoping when analog DC 20 goes away, channel 21 will come in better from Washington, or Front Royal, VA.:confused:

systems2000

04-27-09, 11:00 PM

I just checked my numbers again and I'm getting 99% quality and 88% strength. I believe the problem is with their receiving equipment. The WPXW-DT link must have an issue.

Digital Rules

04-27-09, 11:03 PM

Maybe they're upgrading to HD on 60.1?

afiggatt

04-27-09, 11:49 PM

Did WWPX-DT improve for you today at all? It barely comes in here tonight. Maybe they are running at reduced power?????
Yes, there is something weird going on with WWPX-DT Ion 60.1. Earlier tonight, I could not get a stable picture. Now, the picture on 60.1 is off-center with color break-ups (and is some lame infomercial). The signal meter strength was a little off earlier, but I am getting the normal 7 bars (out of 10). 60-2, 60-3, 60-4 look normal. Probably something messed up with the equipment. But then again, maybe they are adding in new equipment to go HD.

mchief99

04-28-09, 04:26 PM

Any body bother to watch WASNHD Nationals game last night. In spanish - shifted to the SD channel and - english. Someone forgot to ...

Marcus Carr

04-28-09, 06:47 PM

Happened to be scanning channels this afternoon and noticed that WBAL-DT is showing The Oprah Winfrey Show in HD this afternoon.

Yep. Ellen and Regis are still SD.

systems2000

04-29-09, 12:08 AM

I just checked my ZAT-970A and it is showing the program material on 60.1 as 480i.

Trip in VA

04-29-09, 12:18 AM

systems2000

04-29-09, 09:27 AM

Am I the only one or is WHAG-TV bleeding over to 24 (WUTB-TV) and 26 (WETA-TV)? I've noticed this since Monday.

markbulla

04-29-09, 11:37 AM

Any body bother to watch WASNHD Nationals game last night. In spanish - shifted to the SD channel and - english. Someone forgot to ...

Sorry for the stupid question, but what is WASNHD? Is this a cable channel?
_

ACW112983

04-29-09, 12:10 PM

When's Comcast freaking getting Spike HD? :mad:

EDIT: And Comedy Central HD? :mad:
And the NFL Network :mad:

afiggatt

04-29-09, 12:22 PM

Hmm... from the FCC site this morning. WIAV-LP 58 wants to relocate the analog down to 4. They also had a approval for a digital companion channel on 44, but they've now simultaneously sought to displace it to 43.
So WIAV-LP Asiavision 58 wants to operate a 3 kW analog broadcast on VHF 4 and has filed for a 10 kW digital broadcast on UHF 43, both post-transition? The station filed for Silent STA last fall to go dark because of financial difficulties and I assume is off the air on UHF 58. Their UHF 58 broadcast has a small coverage area north of DC, so not many people on this forum could tell us whether it is dark or not.

UHF 43 is being freed up by the move of WPXW-DT Ion 60 (DT 43) to DT 34 when it takes over WUSA-DT's current digital broadcast. The DT 43 10 kW signal has a decent coverage area, better than the proposed analog VHF 4 coverage. If they have financial problems, why bother with the analog VHF 4 application? Unless it is a backup or they can get VHF 4 transmitter equipment dirt cheap - which OTOH is a possibility. DT 43 engineering attachment with coverage map is at http://fjallfoss.fcc.gov/prod/cdbs/forms/prod/getattachment_exh.cgi?exhibit_id=754198&formid=346&q_num=5100 for anyone curious. If they can't afford to maintain their curent analog broadcast, the odds have to be poor that they can operate at either of the new channels.

afiggatt

04-29-09, 12:24 PM

Sorry for the stupid question, but what is WASNHD? Is this a cable channel?
I think he meant MASN-HD. I saw part of that game - 7th inning I think - and the sound was in English. But with hollow sounding 2.0 audio so maybe they were having technical problems?

cpldc

04-29-09, 01:36 PM

So WIAV-LP Asiavision 58 wants to operate a 3 kW analog broadcast on VHF 4 and has filed for a 10 kW digital broadcast on UHF 43, both post-transition? The station filed for Silent STA last fall to go dark because of financial difficulties and I assume is off the air on UHF 58. Their UHF 58 broadcast has a small coverage area north of DC, so not many people on this forum could tell us whether it is dark or not.

I couldn't get a positive ID, but a few weeks ago I was getting a faint analog on 58 that I figured was WIAV. I think I'm just barely in the contour for them but hadn't checked the channel before (and it was too weak to show up on a scan). It appeared to be a movie of some sort. The only other 58 I can think of is W58DK way out in Virginia, and the program listed for VPT at that time was something I think I'd have recognized.

So, in other words, I think they are still running analog. I think their transmitter location would make digital viable for only a very small number of people.

dewster1977

04-29-09, 07:41 PM

Am I the only one or is WHAG-TV bleeding over to 24 (WUTB-TV) and 26 (WETA-TV)? I've noticed this since Monday.

I have always had bleed over on 24 and 26 from WHAG-TV 25 when pointed between south and west, Unlike WJAL-TV 68 which would bleed over on 65, 66, 67, 69, 70, 71

systems2000

04-29-09, 11:34 PM

I was getting channel 3 and 6 very clear, earlier this evening. I was also able to watch the Nationals/Phillies game on 17 (MyNetwork). Since my antenna was pointed to 133°, I'm assuming I was getting Philadelphia stations.

I was also getting:
19 - Very Faint - B&W - No Audio
23 - Edge (Color/B&W) - PBS
32 - Same as 19
42 - Very, Very Faint
61 - Good - iON

Makes me wonder what's going to happen with ATSC reception and tropo situations and even of more concern is going to be co-channel interference.

JoeInNVa

04-30-09, 07:29 AM

When's Comcast freaking getting Spike HD? :mad:

EDIT: And Comedy Central HD? :mad:
And the NFL Network :mad:

They have the NFL Network, SD and HD.

Marcus Carr

04-30-09, 07:39 AM

They have the NFL Network, SD and HD.

Not after today.

aaronwt

04-30-09, 09:13 AM

They have the NFL Network, SD and HD.

Isn't it an extra cost too?

ACW112983

04-30-09, 08:53 PM

Isn't it an extra cost too?My point exactly. My parents (who have Cox) get it all :mad::mad::mad:

systems2000

04-30-09, 10:50 PM

I just noticed tonight that WBAL-DT reruns their 5pm and 11pm News on 11-2. I LIKE IT! They even do a Sports show, on their 11-2 sub-channel. Much better than doing Weather all day. Nice to see someone there has a "Thinking Cap" on. Way to get outside the "BOX" WBAL.

CycloneGT

05-01-09, 01:13 AM

Yeah, I noticed that they had the sports show on 11-2 over the weekend. It was even my EPG. :D Looks like they even have a Raven's draft special on tomorrow during primetime.

systems2000

05-01-09, 08:00 PM

Just discovered that WBAL-DT -2 is fixed at 4:3 ratio. I realized it while they were doing the Weather, during the Newscast.

What's up with that?

Isn't their Newscast in 16:9?

Digital Rules

05-02-09, 12:03 AM

Isn't their Newscast in 16:9?Yes, and it is just awesome in HD.

I don't think I've ever seen any 16:9 subchannels now that you mention it. My guess is that it steals too much bandwidth from the main channel.

Trip in VA

05-02-09, 12:20 AM

Yes, and it is just awesome in HD.

I don't think I've ever seen any 16:9 subchannels now that you mention it. My guess is that it steals too much bandwidth from the main channel.

Uses the exact same amount of bandwidth as 4:3, but requires additional equipment, I think.

These stations all have widescreen SD.

http://www.rabbitears.info/oddsandends.php?request=widesd

- Trip

Digital Rules

05-02-09, 12:35 AM

Uses the exact same amount of bandwidth as 4:3, but requires additional equipment, I think.

These stations all have widescreen SD.

http://www.rabbitears.info/oddsandends.php?request=widesd

- TripThanks Trip,

The extra equipment issue makes good sense. I assumed it wasn't possible because I have never seen Delmarva's Fox 21.2 run in widescreen.

systems2000

05-02-09, 11:26 AM

I checked the EPG for 11-2 (I'm watching Saturday Morning News now) and they are really getting outside the box. They will be broadcasting L&O SVU tonight at 7:00pm on 11-2.

They also are running the film critics show after TVHill.

Marcus Carr

05-02-09, 12:00 PM

Comcast's Project Cavalry (analog reclamation) is coming to the Baltimore area.

Comcast Corp. (Nasdaq: CMCSA, CMCSK) expects to shell out $1 billion for an "all-digital" project that will enable the MSO to reclaim 40 to 50 channels of analog spectrum and free up room for Docsis 3.0, a broader video-on-demand (VoD) library, ethnic programming fare, and more than 100 linear hi-def channels.

...Comcast already has the project underway in areas such as Portland, Ore., Seattle, and the Bay Area, and is starting to tee it up in its Atlanta, Philadelphia, and Baltimore markets. By the end of the quarter, Comcast had completed the job in about 5 percent of its footprint.

http://www.lightreading.com/document.asp?doc_id=176164&site=cdn&

Dwight Shrute

05-02-09, 03:11 PM

No the channels are not blocked or locked down in Annapolis but I do have problems getting firewire working sometimes. It's weird; it'll start up just fine, but trails off to completely nonfunctional within 5 seconds. But most of the time it works just fine.

When I was on Comcast in Annapolis, they did not have channels blocked, so either that is a recent thing or you are misinterpreting something. You did not list a location, which may help us give you better information.
I'm in Baltimore City currently (I was in Baltimore County about a year ago and they blocked the exact same channels).

And as for the way I checked, I just turned off my cable box, pressed the enter button the remote which brought up that list of info. I went to Current Channel and under each of those channels I listed it said CCI: 0x02.

cjs2000

05-04-09, 05:30 PM

Just ordered FIOS today for Falls Church. They are running the home phone, 20/5 internet, and Extreme HD for 109.99/mo with $150 cash card.

carltonrice

05-04-09, 05:52 PM

Just ordered FIOS today for Falls Church. They are running the home phone, 20/5 internet, and Extreme HD for 109.99/mo with $150 cash card.

I took the same FiOS deal a couple of weeks ago. It was installed on Saturday. So far, only a couple of things I noticed as I am moving from DirecTV. I miss the caller ID display on the TV screen with DirecTV and haven't come across that feature in FiOS TV yet. Also, the guide information in DirecTV's guide seemed a bit more comprehensive. I also miss that the DirecTV box had an ATSC tuner to pick up OTA. I enjoyed watching the Baltimore stations, but all of the service providers consider me to be part of the DC service area. After having DirecTV for over 15 years, I'm sure it'll take a couple of days to get used to the new channel numbers and the remote control button placements. The picture on FiOS may actually be a little bit crisper than what I'm used to. I am beginning to wonder if the multiroom DVR is ready for primetime. The non-DVR STB remote doesn't seem to take instructions easily from the remote, but the installer alluded to an issue they were having and hope to correct.

aaronwt

05-04-09, 06:38 PM

Just ordered FIOS today for Falls Church. They are running the home phone, 20/5 internet, and Extreme HD for 109.99/mo with $150 cash card.

Wow! That's a great deal. I pay almost that much for Extreme HD and my lower end Verizon cell service. I only get a $13 discount by combining those two since i dropped my landine last year and my 50/20 internet tier doesn't qualify for a discount since they only charge $90.

And rumor is that 20/5 tier might increase to 25/25 at the end of June. The rumor is that they will only have three speed tiers instead of four. 10/10, 25/25, 75/25.

And if that happens that makes your $110 a month deal even sweeter.

cjs2000

05-04-09, 08:47 PM

I'm pretty excited about it, except they are charging me an additional $40/mo for 1 multi room DVR and 2 HD boxes, which will cover three tv's altogether. And another $16 for HBO. But it is still about $50 less than Cox cable...

VARTV

05-05-09, 07:19 AM

I took the same FiOS deal a couple of weeks ago. It was installed on Saturday. So far, only a couple of things I noticed as I am moving from DirecTV. I miss the caller ID display on the TV screen with DirecTV and haven't come across that feature in FiOS TV yet.Doesn't FiOS have widgets for TV which includes caller ID??

Tom Harms

05-05-09, 07:43 AM

Doesn't FiOS have widgets for TV which includes caller ID??

Yes, Verizon Call Assistant is free.

systems2000

05-05-09, 10:56 AM

Is WPXW being prevented from showing the 700 Club on WWPX-DT?

I decided to check WPXW-DT for the 700 Club this morning and found that it is being broadcasted during the 10:00am hour (at 720P). It's also on WPXW-TV and WWPX-TV, but not on WWPX-DT.

Why do they list the 700 Club in their EPG, but show the tape of some organization wanting support to save the Jews?

Marcus Carr

05-05-09, 01:01 PM

Cox Rolls DOCSIS 3.0 Into Northern Virginia

Ultimate Internet Package Offers Up 50 Mbps Downstream

Todd Spangler -- Multichannel News, 5/5/2009 8:32:35 AM MT

Cox Communications is expanding its top-speed broadband service - with up to 50 Mbps downstream - to residential and business customers in Northern Virginia.

The operator is offering the DOCSIS 3.0-based Ultimate Internet service, which provides 5 Mbps upstream, in Fairfax County and Fredericksburg, Va., markets. Standard price for the residential Ultimate Internet package will be $139.99 per month, with an introductory rate of $109 per month.

By offering a 50-Mbps tier, Cox will be able to compete head-to-head with Verizon's FiOS Internet service, which currently markets the same maximum download speeds.

Cox last month launched DOCSIS 3.0-based service in Lafayette Parish, La. The operator said it plans to offer Ultimate Internet to several additional markets by the end of 2009, and to more than two-thirds of its footprint in 2010.

"Our customers have said they want an online experience that allows them to do more, do it faster and on a network they trust. DOCSIS 3.0 lets them do that," Cox Northern Virginia general manager Janet Barnard said in a statement.

Customers can find more information about Cox's high-speed Internet services at www.cox.com/highspeedinternet.

http://www.multichannel.com/article/231391-Cox_Rolls_DOCSIS_3_0_Into_Northern_Virginia.php

carltonrice

05-05-09, 06:50 PM

Thanks for the heads up. I'll look into how to set the call assistant set up in the FiOS TV's widgets.

As another question maybe someone can answer, when you're using the multi-room DVR on the non-DVR STB, are the remote control signals for FF, rewind, etc. supposed to work. I find that there is an extremely long delay that makes using these type features difficult. Anybody else have experience with this?

afiggatt

05-05-09, 09:34 PM

Is WPXW being prevented from showing the 700 Club on WWPX-DT?

I decided to check WPXW-DT for the 700 Club this morning and found that it is being broadcasted during the 10:00am hour (at 720P). It's also on WPXW-TV and WWPX-TV, but not on WWPX-DT.
You have asked this question here before. Have you emailed Ion about it?

My guess is that it has to do with broadcast area rights. A quick search for WAZT shows that WAZT family of low power religious stations in the Shenandoah valley broadcasts the 700 Club at 9 AM weekdays. The AZTV "network" probably has exclusive broadcast rights for their market which preclude WWPX 60 in Martinsburg from carrying the 700 Club. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WAZT for the stations.

Most of their stations have gotten construction permits for low power digital broadcasts at 10 to 15 kW UHF or WAZT-LD for 300 watts on VHF 8 which will notably boost their coverage area over their current analog coverage -and add to possible interference issues. No idea on when they plan to go digital, but I expect there are would be WRC-DT 4 (DT 48) viewers north of Winchester who would like WAZW-CA 48 to move to DT 46.

PCW

05-06-09, 08:46 AM

aaronwt

05-06-09, 11:06 AM

Is anyone who has FiOS service in No. Virginia experiencing digital dropouts and glitches on channel 505 (Fox) that appear randomly? I have noticed it for a couple of weeks when the show breaks for a commercial or at other random times. On the non-HD channel (5) I checked and there's no problem.:(
Yes, I noticed this most recently with my Fringe recording last night from 505. And it was also there from my Dollhouse recording last week.
I haven't had a chance to check out my 5-1 OTA recordings to see if it was there too. I'll need to look at them tonight if I remember.

mark_e

05-06-09, 11:07 AM

Is anyone who has FiOS service in No. Virginia experiencing digital dropouts and glitches on channel 505 (Fox) that appear randomly? I have noticed it for a couple of weeks when the show breaks for a commercial or at other random times. On the non-HD channel (5) I checked and there's no problem.:(

I noticed it the other night during the 10 PM news here in Maryland. I only saw it during some commercials. I checked the diagnostics menu on my TiVo and it showed no uncorrected (or corrected) errors, so I attributed it to their feed, not FIOS.

PCW

05-06-09, 01:22 PM

I noticed it the other night during the 10 PM news here in Maryland. I only saw it during some commercials. I checked the diagnostics menu on my TiVo and it showed no uncorrected (or corrected) errors, so I attributed it to their feed, not FIOS.
Thanks for the confirmation. I was hoping it was not FiOS.

PCW

05-06-09, 01:23 PM

Yes, I noticed this most recently with my Fringe recording last night from 505. And it was also there from my Dollhouse recording last week.
I haven't had a chance to check out my 5-1 OTA recordings to see if it was there too. I'll need to look at them tonight if I remember.
Thanks, I'll look for your test results tomorrow.

aaronwt

05-06-09, 08:14 PM

Thanks, I'll look for your test results tomorrow.

I just checked for it. I thought I had a backup recording on 5-1, but it's also a recording from 505. I must have deleted the 5-1 season pass at some time.

markbulla

05-07-09, 10:49 AM

I noticed it the other night during the 10 PM news here in Maryland. I only saw it during some commercials. I checked the diagnostics menu on my TiVo and it showed no uncorrected (or corrected) errors, so I attributed it to their feed, not FIOS.

Are you watching WTTG Fox 5 from Washington or WBFF Fox 45 from Baltimore?
.

AbMagFab

05-07-09, 12:52 PM

Just watched House and AI from this week and last week, and I think there was only one minor hiccup during the program. If there was anything else, it wasn't noticable.

This is all OTA 5-1 on a Tivo Series 3.

mark_e

05-07-09, 01:07 PM

Are you watching WTTG Fox 5 from Washington or WBFF Fox 45 from Baltimore?
.

Mark,

Sorry I wasn't clear. It was WTTG as the OP said. I haven't noticed any problems on either of your channels.

compuwizz

05-07-09, 10:05 PM

WETA seems to be broadcasting in 720p now.

Digital Rules

05-07-09, 10:40 PM

WETA seems to be broadcasting in 720p now.With 3 subchannels, maybe this will help reduce the compression artifacts???? It looks pretty good right now, but not broadcasting any complex scenes at the moment.

markbulla

05-07-09, 10:47 PM

Mark,

Sorry I wasn't clear. It was WTTG as the OP said. I haven't noticed any problems on either of your channels.

I appreciate the info.

Just trying to head off problems!
.

CycloneGT

05-08-09, 10:24 AM

Dish network has added Speed, FX, Logo, MavTV, and Fashion HD Channels to their lineup today.

mark_e

05-08-09, 12:28 PM

I appreciate the info.

Just trying to head off problems!
.

Mark,

It is nice to know someone cares.:)

I usually watch Fox programming on WBFF, but since I watch the 6 PM news out of Baltimore, if I'm not watching primetime or TiVo, I'll watch the DC news on WTTG.

BTW, there is a thread on this at BBR, http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r22342925-Picture-Freeze. It contains this post:

reply to stevee9
I DVR'ed 24 and watched in on Tuesday night. I didn't notice any pixelation or sound drop outs. However, I recorded the WBFF-45 HD feed which some of you probably do not have. I find that channel a bit more stable than Fox 5 in DC.

Thanks. Keep up the good work!

Mark

dneily

05-08-09, 04:14 PM

machpost

05-09-09, 09:46 AM

Is anyone else enjoying MASN-HD baseball as much as I am?

I set my DVR to record all of the live games or "encore" games in HD, then play them back if either the Nats or Orioles win.

Last night's Nats come-from-behind victory over the LA Dodgers was truly thrilling.

Except for a couple of games on Fox, the entire 162-game schedules for each team will be available on MASN-HD. If my math is correct, that's 324 HD baseball games this year!!

I'm in HD Sports heaven.

I'm definitely enjoying it. It's just too bad there isn't an HD overflow channel yet. Interestingly enough, the live HD feed of the game not being broadcast on MASN HD is available somewhere out there, because I've seen live look-ins of Nationals games on MLB Network that were in HD, while the Orioles were being broadcast live on MASN HD. Several cable companies do have the capacity and even a channel reserved for MASN2 HD, so hopefully it'll be live for next season.

dneily

05-09-09, 01:47 PM

I'm definitely enjoying it. It's just too bad there isn't an HD overflow channel yet. Interestingly enough, the live HD feed of the game not being broadcast on MASN HD is available somewhere out there, because I've seen live look-ins of Nationals games on MLB Network that were in HD, while the Orioles were being broadcast live on MASN HD. Several cable companies do have the capacity and even a channel reserved for MASN2 HD, so hopefully it'll be live for next season.

Unfortunately, there was no HD encore telecast of the Nats win last night. The game was shown in progress on MASN-HD starting with the 7th inning. All of the Nats scoring took place in innings 2 through 6!

tonyd79

05-10-09, 09:25 AM

I'm definitely enjoying it. It's just too bad there isn't an HD overflow channel yet. Interestingly enough, the live HD feed of the game not being broadcast on MASN HD is available somewhere out there, because I've seen live look-ins of Nationals games on MLB Network that were in HD, while the Orioles were being broadcast live on MASN HD. Several cable companies do have the capacity and even a channel reserved for MASN2 HD, so hopefully it'll be live for next season.

Probably getting the feed back to the MASN mothership. They don't store the HD game in the mobile facility. It is the lack of distribution to cable companies and satellite companies that MASN doesn't have. Trust me, if they did, they would be on DirecTV at a minimum.

Marcus Carr

05-10-09, 06:14 PM

Gaithersburg, Md., Awards Cable Franchise to Verizon

http://newscenter.verizon.com/press-releases/verizon/2009/gaithersburg-md-awards.html

dneily

05-10-09, 09:24 PM

Probably getting the feed back to the MASN mothership. They don't store the HD game in the mobile facility. It is the lack of distribution to cable companies and satellite companies that MASN doesn't have. Trust me, if they did, they would be on DirecTV at a minimum.

During last night's HD replay of the Nat's game, an announcer came on to say "Due to time constraints, we move further on in the game." The telecast then skipped about one inning.

tonyd79

05-10-09, 09:59 PM

During last night's HD replay of the Nat's game, an announcer came on to say "Due to time constraints, we move further on in the game." The telecast then skipped about one inning.

Yeah, that happens on NESN and others on replays.

djp952

05-10-09, 11:55 PM

Anyone else in Howard, MD having problems with WRC-DT 48 this weekend? I've never had an issue with this channel since setting up my D.C. stuff more than a year ago, but have had all kinds of issues this weekend.

The culprit seems to be signal strength (75-80 vs. 95-100 previously), not interference, but since I don't have a spectrum analyzer (yet) I can't really confirm that. I thought it might be the wind we had, but that's long gone and the problems persist.

This seems to happen to me from time to time with the D.C. channels, so I'm hoping that it's just a temporary issue at the source, but if you guys know of anything that's going on that will save me troubleshooting time, I'd really appreciate it !!

afiggatt

05-12-09, 09:45 AM

Verizon Fios added 4 of the 6 Entertainment Studios *.tv HD channels to the Washington Metro market this morning. They added these 4 channels to the Richmond market as well. The channels added were: 558 ES.tv, 633 Pets.tv, 674 MyDestination.tv, and 676 Recipe.tv. The other 2 channels: 599 Cars.tv and 695 Comedy.tv (not to be confused Comedy Central HD the real comedy channel) have reportedly been delayed but are to be added soon.

Contain your excitement.

Marcus Carr

05-12-09, 06:55 PM

Comcast's Project Cavalry (analog reclamation) is coming to the Baltimore area.

http://www.lightreading.com/document.asp?doc_id=176164&site=cdn&

And is underway in the DC/Beltway area.

http://www.comcastvoices.com/

bal1012

05-12-09, 07:51 PM

Don't be surprised if WJZ begins broadcasting their local news in HD very soon. While watching NCIS this evening an HD bug popped up.

http://img14.imageshack.us/img14/8513/wjzl.jpg

Full Screen 1 (http://img13.imageshack.us/img13/5718/wjz.jpg)
Full Screen 2 (http://img17.imageshack.us/img17/8093/wjz2.jpg)

aaronwt

05-12-09, 10:52 PM

systems2000

05-12-09, 11:17 PM

Has WJZ-TV reduced power?

I'm getting more "Snow" and other interference lately.

WHAG-TV (25) reduced their power over two weeks ago, when they started multiplexing their transmission and bleeding over WUTB-TV (24) and WETA-TV (26). Luckily, I get WUTB-DT fairly well. WETA-TV is now lost to me. :sad:

Digital Rules

05-12-09, 11:36 PM

The tropo activity has been high lately. Sometimes it can degrade or even wipe out normally reliable stations. That may explain your recent issues with WJZ.

WJZ-TV is very good here. I don't see much difference with WHAG. It was never that great in the first place. I'm surprised it comes in at all with another channel 25 only a few miles from here.

jeepmon

05-13-09, 11:33 AM

PCW

05-13-09, 01:58 PM

I did not see any problems this week with 24 last night and Fringe tonight.
I didn't notice it either with 24 or Fringe. Hopefully it's been fixed.

systems2000

05-13-09, 10:05 PM

There's a new CP filed on W51CY with the following change "WBDC BROADCASTING, INC." to "WDCW BROADCASTING, INC.. DEBTOR-IN-POSSESSION."
http://fjallfoss.fcc.gov/cgi-bin/ws.exe/prod/cdbs/pubacc/prod/app_det.pl?Application_id=1304013

What does this mean for WDCW?

systems2000

05-13-09, 10:09 PM

I forgot to mention that the WHAG engineer told me that they will not be transmitting any sub-channels and their primary will be 1080i.

Trip in VA

05-13-09, 10:10 PM

Tribune went into bankruptcy last year. It's very old news.

Bankrupt companies always show that way in FCC filings.

- Trip

systems2000

05-13-09, 10:17 PM

Can someone explain why I see multiple "Service Contour Map" values, when I'm browsing through the FCC TV Query Database (ie. 36, 41, & 51 dBu)?

Trip in VA

05-13-09, 10:34 PM

Can someone explain why I see multiple "Service Contour Map" values, when I'm browsing through the FCC TV Query Database (ie. 36, 41, & 51 dBu)?

UHF digitals have a noise limited contour at 41 dBu, whereas it's 36 dBu for upper VHF and 28 dBu for low-VHF.

Similar numbers exist for analogs but I don't know them off the top of my head.

- Trip

systems2000

05-13-09, 11:21 PM

The 51 dBu was from an UHF-LD. I see that the same UHF-TX has a 74 dBu.

I did a quick check of analog with the following result:
47 dBu = VHF-Lo
56 dBu = VHF-High
64 dBu = UHF

Are these the "Protected Zones?"

Trip in VA

05-13-09, 11:26 PM

afiggatt

05-13-09, 11:27 PM

Digital Transition Summary for DC, Baltimore, Hagerstown Stations – May 13, 2009

The following is an updated summary of the pre and post transition digital channels, power levels, and status of filings for the full power stations in the DC, Baltimore, and Hagerstown markets. I hope some find this list useful to prepare for the June 12 analog shutdown and DT channel shuffle. The list is sorted by the post-transition physical broadcast channel, which I think is more useful for highlighting the upper VHF stations and possible signal conflicts. The technical shorthand terms are ERP (Effective Radiated Power) in kW, HAAT (antenna Height Above Average Terrain) in meters, CP = Construction Permit granted by the FCC.

Some of the station comments show the post-transition maximization power applications submitted by the station last year, but the FCC has still not acted on many of them, so until then, people should use the officially allotted ERP as the basis for figuring out antenna needs. In the past several months, the FCC did grant increased post-transition ERPs for WVPY-DT PBS 42 and WWPB-DT MPT 31, but I don’t know if those stations are ready to increase power on June 13.

At the bottom is a separate list for the digital low power (LD) stations in DC and the stronger digital low power CPs in the western edge of the DC area. Some of the LD CPs may not be built; some of them are likely placeholders for future filings for better channel allotments. The analog low power stations and translators do not have to shut down on June 12. WZDC-DC Telemundo 25 was granted a digital flash cut on UHF 25 post-transition with an increased coverage area over their current analog one. When WHAG-TV 25 analog signal is turned off, that will eliminate interference problems which should help picking up the analog WZDC-CA 25 NW of DC.

The columns are: Station, Location, Pre-transition physical digital channel and pre-transition DT ERP in kW, Post-transition physical digital channel and current ERP allotment in kW, post-transition HAAT in meters, and Notes/Comments.

Station|Location|Pre-DT (ERP kw)|Post-DT (ERP kw)|Post HAAT(m)|Notes
WJLA-DT ABC 7|DC|39 (646 kW)|7 (30 kW)|235 m|Maximized app for 30 kW granted.
WUSA-DT CBS 9|DC|34 (1000)|9 (12.6)|235|
WBAL-DT NBC 11|Baltimore|59 (513)|11 (5)|299|Only 5 kW on VHF 11 post-transition! Some current OTA WBAL viewers will lose station!
WWPX-DT Ion 60|Martinsburg|12 (23)|12 (23)|314|Petition pending to move DTV operations to 51 in VA which conflicts with WETA’s 51 petition.
WJZ-DT CBS 13|Baltimore|38 (1000)|13 (28.8)|295|To operate on 9.8 kW STA on DT 13 for 1-2 months post-trans until new directional ant installed
WFDC-DT uni 14|DC|15 (325)|15 (1000)|227|Maximized app granted for 1000 kW post-transition
WVPY-DT PBS 42|Front Royal|21 (50)|21 (100)|400|Maximized app for 100 kW granted
WNVC-DT MHz 56|Fairfax|57 (7.3, dark)|24 (160)|221|App for 160 kW granted, off air until WUTB-TV 24 shuts down
WHAG-DT NBC 25|Hagerstown|55 (0.9)|26 (575)|376|Post DT 26 channel blocked until WETA-TV 26 shuts down
WETA-DT PBS 26|DC|27 (90)|27 (90)|254|Petition still pending to move to 51 for DTV operations at 674 kW
WFPT-DT PBS 62|Frederick|28 (30)|28 (41.2)|158|Increased ERP to 41.2 kW in February, Analog off the air.
WMPB-DT PBS 67|Baltimore|29 (14 )|29 (42.6)|309|Increased ERP to 42.6 kW in February
WNVT-DT MHz 30|Goldvein |30 (160)|30 (160)|229|
WHUT-DT PBS 32|DC|33 (100)|33 (100)|254|maximized app pending for 1000 kW
WPXW-DT Ion 66|Manassas->DC|43 (90)|34 (1000)|221|maximized app for 1000 kW granted, taking over WUSA-DT’s pre-trans DT 34 transmitter
WDCA-DT MyN 20|DC|35 (500)|35 (500)|227|maximized app pending for 950 kW
WTTG-DT Fox 5|DC|36 (1000)|36 (1000)|227|Will be an analog nightlight station after June 12
WMAR-DT ABC 2|Baltimore|52 (613)|38 (1000)|312|Taking over WJZ-DT’s pre-trans DT 38 transmitter
WJAL-DT ind 68|Hagerstown|16 (6)|39 (105)|372|Analog off the air, operating at STA 34 kW on UHF 39
WNUV-DT CW 54|Baltimore|40 (845)|40 (845)|373|Analog off the air.
WUTB-DT MyN 24|Catonsville|41 (200)|41 (200)|308|maximized app pending for 290 kW
WMPT-DT PBS 22|Annapolis|42 (150)|42 (150)|289|maximized app pending for 516 kW
WWPB-DT PBS 31|Hagerstown|44 (209)|44 (1000)|359|maximized app for 1000 kW granted
WBFF-DT Fox 45|Baltimore|46 (550)|46 (550)|373|Analog off the air.
WRC-DT NBC 4|DC|48 (813)|48 (813)|242|Will be an analog nightlight station after June 12
WDCW-DT CW 50|DC|51 (125)|50 (122)|253|maximized app pending for 1000 kW
Digital LDs|||Lic/CPs||
WMDO Telef 47|DC|8 (0.198)|8 (0.198)|150|on the air in late summer 08.
W08EE WV PBS|Martinsburg|8 (0.3)|8 (0.3)|281|on the air
WWTD ind 49|DC|-|14 (0.1)|179|CP granted Jan 08
WDDN Dayst 23|DC|-|21 (1)|213|CP granted Mar 07
WZDC Telem 25|DC|-|25 (4.6)|116|CP granted Oct 08 for digital flash cut post-transition
WIAV AsiaVis 58|DC|-|44 (0.1)|45|Applied for 10 kW ERP on UHF 43
WAZW rlg 48|Winchester|-|46 (12)|78|CP granted Jan 07
W51CY CW 51|Hagerstown|-|51 (15)|379|Satellite TX for WDCW, tower located east of Hagerstown, plans not known

afiggatt

05-13-09, 11:43 PM

I forgot to mention that the WHAG engineer told me that they will not be transmitting any sub-channels and their primary will be 1080i.
That probably won't last as the station owners (Nexstar broadcasting) will eventually want to add sub-channels for additional revenue streams. But until then, if WHAG-DT NBC 25 dedicates close to the full channel bandwidth available to the HD sub-channel, it could make WHAG-DT the go to station for watching Sunday night football and whatever worthwhile NBC programs are still left for those who can get WHAG-DT over the air.

WHAG will be switching from a 1350 kW analog UHF 25 broadcast to a 575 kW digital UHF 26 broadcast, which is, in terms of analog to digital power levels, a respectable power increase with a larger reception area. Some to the northwest of DC and west of Baltimore who find analog WHAG-TV very noisy may find that WHAG-DT comes in fine once WHAG-DT goes full power after June 12.

aaronwt

05-14-09, 05:54 AM

So what time are the stations switching things on June 12th? I have over twelve devices with ATSC tuners and I only what to do a rescan once for each device

markbulla

05-14-09, 08:22 AM

So what time are the stations switching things on June 12th? I have over twelve devices with ATSC tuners and I only what to do a rescan once for each device

Apparently, different stations are transitioning at different times. There's a list someplace...

systems2000

05-14-09, 08:40 AM

So what time are the stations switching things on June 12th? I have over twelve devices with ATSC tuners and I only what to do a rescan once for each device
If you only want to do it once, you'll probably have to wait until after 23:00 hours (11:00 p.m. for those civi's :) ).

systems2000

05-14-09, 09:21 AM

Is it me or is WMAR-DT News not supplying CC? It also appears WUTB-DT doesn't have CC either.

How much lag time is everyone seeing on WBAL-DT and iON?

afiggatt

05-14-09, 09:41 AM

So what time are the stations switching things on June 12th? I have over twelve devices with ATSC tuners and I only what to do a rescan once for each device
Some of the local stations are shutting down the analog in the morning, some in the afternoon, and some will do the big switch at midnight. If you want to avoid a lot of rescans, wait until June 13. But even then, there may be some stations that run into technical problems and won't be at full power on their new channel for several days. I should go through the FCC filings and list the 6 hour shut down window checked off for each station.

systems2000

05-14-09, 10:10 AM

I've found that the "Auto/ON" setting of the APEX DT502 took awhile before the CC information began showing on WMAR-DT and WUTB-DT. Is it the CECB's or the system that creates such a long delay on some situations?

Marcus Carr

05-14-09, 06:22 PM

Univision says its 148 owned and affilated TV stations will conduct a network-wide analog shut-off test on May 16 between 9:30 and 10 p.m., during Univision's popular Sabado Gigante program.

It will be the first of a series of prime time shut-off tests for Univision. Hispanics and other minorities are among the FCC's DTV at-risk populations because of relatively high percentages of analog-only viewership.

Other network primetime shut-off tests will follow on May 18, June 2, and June 4.

Univision is also participating in the FCC'backed national shut-off tests May 21.

http://www.multichannel.com/article/232536-Univision_To_Conduct_Analog_Shut_Off_Test_On_Sabado_Gigante. php

systems2000

05-14-09, 10:15 PM

Reception was so good tonight, that I was able to catch the last five minutes of Smallville and watch the Season Finale of Supernatural. Too bad I didn't know I was getting rock solid reception of WJZ-DT and WNUV-DT earlier, so that I could watch all of Smallville.

WJZ-DT is at 100%/85% and WNUV-DT is at 43-63%/79% (Quality/Strength).

AbMagFab

05-15-09, 10:39 AM

Some of the local stations are shutting down the analog in the morning, some in the afternoon, and some will do the big switch at midnight. If you want to avoid a lot of rescans, wait until June 13. But even then, there may be some stations that run into technical problems and won't be at full power on their new channel for several days. I should go through the FCC filings and list the 6 hour shut down window checked off for each station.

So for DC, is WUSA the only one changing their digital frequency? (And what's the over/under on when Tivo will have this updated?)

Gerald C

05-15-09, 11:17 AM

So for DC, is WUSA the only one changing their digital frequency?

No, also WJLA and WPXW. WETA has applied to change theirs also (from 27 to 51).

AbMagFab

05-15-09, 11:38 AM

No, also WJLA and WPXW. WETA has applied to change theirs also (from 27 to 51).

Great. So assuming Tivo screws this up like they have every other time, I won't be able to record CBS or ABC for like 2 weeks.

Yippee.

systems2000

05-15-09, 12:18 PM

Baltimore will also be changing several channels WMAR (52 to 38), WBAL (59 to 11), & WJZ (38 to 13).

WDCW will be changing from 51 to 50 and WHAG will be changing 55 to 26.

afiggatt

05-15-09, 12:55 PM

So for DC, is WUSA the only one changing their digital frequency? (And what's the over/under on when Tivo will have this updated?)
Go and look at the table I posted Wednesday in message #8931.

In the DC market, five stations will be on new physical RF channels come June 13. WJLA ABC 7, WUSA CBS 9, and WDCW 50 will switch back to their analog channels, WPXW-DT Ion 66 will move from 90 kW UHF 43 in Manassas to 1000 kW UHF 34 in DC, and WNVC-DT MHz 56 will finally return to air on UHF 24.

In Baltimore, three stations will move their RF channels: WBAL NBC 11, WJZ CBS 13 will switch back to their analog channels and WMAR-DT ABC 2 will move from out-of-core UHF 52 to UHF 38 (taking over WJZ's current digital broadcast).

In Hagerstown, which is a subset of the DC market, as noted, WHAG-DT NBC 25 will move from a low power 900 Watt broadcast on UHF 55 to a 575 kW broadcast on UHF 26. WJAL-DT 68 will presumably increase to 105 kW on UHF 39 with the interference problem with WJLA-DT out of the way.

As for Tivo, they should be ready for this switch. They have had PLENTY of advance warning about it. But would a move of the physical RF channel pose an issue for Tivo? The station ID code in the PSIP data stays the same, the mapped channel stays the same, only the physical broadcast channel changes. A rescan may be all that the Tivo needs.

AbMagFab

05-15-09, 01:02 PM

As for Tivo, they should be ready for this switch. They have had PLENTY of advance warning about it. But would a move of the physical RF channel pose an issue for Tivo? The station ID code in the PSIP data stays the same, the mapped channel stays the same, only the physical broadcast channel changes. A rescan may be all that the Tivo needs.

You'd think it would be easy, but when JLA or WB50 was adding sub-channels a while ago, Tivo had to push out channel updates to even allow it to tune to the channel, independent of the guide information.

And at one point they screwed it up so that the channel wasn't visible at all (unless you tuned to the underlying RF channel). Eventually Tivo pushed out an update to fix that as well.

So I don't think the Tivo acts like a regular ATSC tuner in that regard, and they have the channel mapping matrix in some configuration somewhere that they need to update when things change.

jgantert

05-16-09, 09:48 AM

So I don't think the Tivo acts like a regular ATSC tuner in that regard, and they have the channel mapping matrix in some configuration somewhere that they need to update when things change.
Actually with Tivo, you can still do a manual scan and pick up the new channels just like a standard ATSC tuner, you just wont get any guide data on the new channels. This is why back in Feb when they decided to change WJLA to RF7, we lost that channel, but if you did a manual scan, you could tune in that channel. In the guide there was two WJLA channels. One on RF7 with guide data and one on RF38(?) without guide data that you could actually tune to.

I suspect something similar will happen June 12th. All the channels that change RF frequency will go black. You will need to rescan. The guide will have duplicate channels with no info that you can tune to.

-John

Knicks_Fan

05-16-09, 10:24 AM

Anyone else having issues with WJLA's pic on D*? Since last night, a series of lines is showing up. moving from bottom to top. It actually looks more like analog interferance than anything else.

AbMagFab

05-16-09, 11:03 AM

Actually with Tivo, you can still do a manual scan and pick up the new channels just like a standard ATSC tuner, you just wont get any guide data on the new channels. This is why back in Feb when they decided to change WJLA to RF7, we lost that channel, but if you did a manual scan, you could tune in that channel. In the guide there was two WJLA channels. One on RF7 with guide data and one on RF38(?) without guide data that you could actually tune to.

I suspect something similar will happen June 12th. All the channels that change RF frequency will go black. You will need to rescan. The guide will have duplicate channels with no info that you can tune to.

-John

But the net result is my Tivo basically won't work for those channels until Tivo fixes them, right? I don't watch live TV.

I sure hope Tivo has their act together this time. They really blew it with the last RF change (as you mention), it took them many days to get it straightened out, and they totally screwed up the Verizon remapping. Both were widely publicized and widely available information.

I have a sinking feeling I'll be missing all my June/July recordings from ABC and CBS and WB...

jgantert

05-16-09, 12:36 PM

But the net result is my Tivo basically won't work for those channels until Tivo fixes them, right? I don't watch live TV.
True, but you could still watch them live if you absolutely had to. Luckily all of the current shows seasons are ending, and it shouldn't be too much of an inconvenience.

AbMagFab

05-16-09, 03:16 PM

True, but you could still watch them live if you absolutely had to. Luckily all of the current shows seasons are ending, and it shouldn't be too much of an inconvenience.

Sadly for me, I get sucked into the summer reality shows... Big Brother on CBS will likely be going on at that time. Not sure if there's anything I care about on ABC, but I thought I heard of some timeshifting summer series coming in, but maybe that was the fall?

Anyway, I wish Tivo could get their act together on this. Yes, I'm condemning them before anything happens, but the past is the best predictor of the future...

afiggatt

05-16-09, 04:35 PM

Listed Analog shutdown times for DC, Baltimore, Hagerstown Stations

The following is a summary of the analog shutdown times filed by the full power stations in the DC, Baltimore, and Hagerstown markets. The stations that are shutting down on June 12 filed the time of day they plan to shut down with the FCC. The FCC form had a checklist for the 6 hour window: Morning (6 AM to Noon), Afternoon (Noon to 6 PM), and Evening (6 PM to midnight). However, this is only the time they plan to turn off the analog broadcast. The stations that are flash cutting to their current analog channel or moving to a different digital channel might take part of the day to do so. Some may even have digital broadcasts on 2 different physical channels for a while – which could be interesting to see what the ATSC tuners do with that.

Note that many of the stations will be shutting down in the morning or afternoon, not at midnight. WHAG 25 checked off that they will keep their analog broadcast on the air until the evening of June 12, but in their 387 transition stats form they stated they will start construction on the tower on June 10 and use a helicopter to install a new digital antenna in the place of their current analog antenna. That can’t be done instantly, so WHAG is likely to only have their low power DT 55 broadcast for a time.

This table is based on the digital transition table I posted a few days ago, so it still has the stations listed in order of their post-transition physical RF broadcast channel. The columns are: Station, Location, Pre-transition physical digital channel and pre-transition DT ERP in kW, Post-transition physical digital channel and current ERP allotment in kW, post-transition HAAT in meters, and Analog shutdown comment. The technical shorthand terms are ERP (Effective Radiated Power) in kW, HAAT (antenna Height Above Average Terrain) in meters.

Station|Location|Pre-DT (ERP kw)|Post-DT (ERP kw)|Post HAAT(m)|Analog Shutdown
WJLA-DT ABC 7|DC|39 (646 kW)|7 (30 kW)|235 m|Morning, 6/12
WUSA-DT CBS 9|DC|34 (1000)|9 (12.6)|235|Morning, 6/12
WBAL-DT NBC 11|Baltimore|59 (513)|11 (5)|299|Afternoon, 6/12
WWPX-DT Ion 60|Martinsburg|12 (23)|12 (23)|314|Evening, 6/12
WJZ-DT CBS 13|Baltimore|38 (1000)|13 (28.8)|295|Afternoon, 6/12
WFDC-DT uni 14|DC|15 (325)|15 (1000)|227|Evening, 6/12
WVPY-DT PBS 42|Front Royal|21 (50)|21 (100)|400|Evening, 6/12
WNVC-DT MHz 56|Fairfax|57 (7.3, dark)|24 (160)|221|Off since September
WHAG-DT NBC 25|Hagerstown|55 (0.9)|26 (575)|376|Evening, 6/12
WETA-DT PBS 26|DC|27 (90)|27 (90)|254|Morning, 6/12
WFPT-DT PBS 62|Frederick|28 (30)|28 (41.2)|158|Off on April 16
WMPB-DT PBS 67|Baltimore|29 (14 )|29 (42.6)|309|Morning, 6/12
WNVT-DT MHz 30|Goldvein |30 (160)|30 (160)|229|Analog shut down in 2003
WHUT-DT PBS 32|DC|33 (100)|33 (100)|254|Afternoon, 6/12
WPXW-DT Ion 66|Manassas->DC|43 (90)|34 (1000)|221|Evening, 6/12
WDCA-DT MyN 20|DC|35 (500)|35 (500)|227|Afternoon, 6/12
WTTG-DT Fox 5|DC|36 (1000)|36 (1000)|227|Nightlight until July 12
WMAR-DT ABC 2|Baltimore|52 (613)|38 (1000)|312|Afternoon, 6/12
WJAL-DT ind 68|Hagerstown|16 (6)|39 (105)|372|Off in January due to fire
WNUV-DT CW 54|Baltimore|40 (845)|40 (845)|373|Off on March 2, 2009
WUTB-DT MyN 24|Catonsville|41 (200)|41 (200)|308|Morning, 6/12
WMPT-DT PBS 22|Annapolis|42 (150)|42 (150)|289|Morning, 6/12
WWPB-DT PBS 31|Hagerstown|44 (209)|44 (1000)|359|Morning, 6/12
WBFF-DT Fox 45|Baltimore|46 (550)|46 (550)|373|Off on March 2, 2009
WRC-DT NBC 4|DC|48 (813)|48 (813)|242|Nightlight until June 26
WDCW-DT CW 50|DC|51 (125)|50 (122)|253|Morning, 6/12

systems2000

05-16-09, 10:54 PM

afiggatt

05-17-09, 12:34 AM

What about the midnight to 6 a.m. time period?

Back in February, WHAG was announcing that they would be turning off their analog transmitter a week before. This was so they could do the tower work. Maybe their looking to do the same.
None of the stations in the DC or Baltimore market checked off the 6/12 midnight to 6 AM option. The most recent 387 transition report filed by WHAG in April states they will keep their analog broadcast on the air until June 12 (http://fjallfoss.fcc.gov/cgi-bin/ws.exe/prod/cdbs/forms/prod/cdbsmenu.hts?context=25&appn=101308187&formid=387&fac_num=25045). Maybe they meant to check off to shut down early morning on June 12 on the analog termination form. Then spend June 12 swapping out the main antenna. Somewhat risky to wait until June 12 if there is bad weather that day. But since WETA-TV 26 has stated that it plans to stay on the air until the morning of June 12, WHAG may have decided to keep their analog on the air until the last day (Friday) and if they are off the air over most of that weekend, so be it.

StevenJB

05-17-09, 01:41 AM

None of the stations in the DC or Baltimore market checked off the 6/12 midnight to 6 AM option. The most recent 387 transition report filed by WHAG in April states they will keep their analog broadcast on the air until June 12 (http://fjallfoss.fcc.gov/cgi-bin/ws.exe/prod/cdbs/forms/prod/cdbsmenu.hts?context=25&appn=101308187&formid=387&fac_num=25045). Maybe they meant to check off to shut down early morning on June 12 on the analog termination form. Then spend June 12 swapping out the main antenna. Somewhat risky to wait until June 12 if there is bad weather that day. But since WETA-TV 26 has stated that it plans to stay on the air until the morning of June 12, WHAG may have decided to keep their analog on the air until the last day (Friday) and if they are off the air over most of that weekend, so be it.

Really excellent effort on your part to follow the transition through June 12th. Your lists make the process of transition so much easier to follow.

Since you are well versed with the DTV transition, there is something that I would like your comment on as well as any other like-minded individual. It's been bothering me and I am quite concerned for the sake of many many thousands in the area who will be affected.

It concerns the post digital transition statuses of NBC WBAL-DT 11 and CBS WJZ-DT 13 in Baltimore. As you know, both Baltimore stations in order to protect post digital transition ion WWPX-DT 12 in Martinsburg, will have to either vastly curtail their power or employ a highly restrictive directional antenna. WBAL on DTV 11 will only be allowed a 5KW non-directional DTV transmitter. WJZ on DTV 13 will only be allowed a 28.8KW highly restrictive directional DTV transmitter. Viewers in far distances will have reception issues with WBAL and distant viewers outside of Baltimore in the direction of Martinsburg will also have problems with WJZ. Both of these channels are major network outlets as well.

Now as you also know WWPX-DT 12 wants to relocate to DTV 51 post transition. But, so does WETA-DT 27 in Washington. I hate to pick on WETA, but isn't it in everybody's interest (except WETA's) for WWPX to be moved from DTV 12 to 51? This way both WBAL and WJZ could run full power non-directional transmitters which I believe would be 30KW each. Again, I have nothing against WETA but the FCC should do that which benefits the greater good. What do you think? Would you care to speculate whether the FCC is aware of what I am proposing?

systems2000

05-17-09, 09:34 AM

I believe the FCC is going on the perceived notion that, with DTV, there is not an issue with "Adjacent Channel" interference, like you have with analog. You can see examples of this all through the frequency allocation list:

WJLA (7), WGAL (8), & WUSA (9)
WBAL (11), WWPX (12), & WJZ (13)
WHAG (26), WETA (27), WFPT (28), WMPB (29), & WGCB (30)
WHUT (33), WPXW (34), WDCA (35), & WTTG (36)
WMAR (38), WJAL (39), WNUV (40), & WUTB (41)
WBFF (46), WPMT (47), & WRC (48)

Not to mention all the "Co-Channel" interference from analog and digital Class "A", LPA, & Translator stations.

Go here ( http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/audio/tvq.html ) and use 115KM (71.5 Miles) distance. You'll be surprised what you see.

That being said, RF 20, 31, & 45 (from my location) appear to be open frequencies. RF 49 has WWTP-LD and RF 22 has W22DA as the sole transmitter for those frequencies.

Afterthought: I don't see Philadelphia, Eastern Shore, or Fredericksburg on my 115KM search. Those in Baltimore and D.C. will catch even more stations then I do.

mikepinkerton

05-17-09, 11:05 AM

WJLA (7), WGAL (8), & WUSA (9)
WBAL (11), WWPX (12), & WJZ (13)
WHAG (26), WETA (27), WFPT (28), WMPB (29), & WGCB (30)
WHUT (33), WPXW (34), WDCA (35), & WTTG (36)
WMAR (38), WJAL (39), WNUV (40), & WUTB (41)
WBFF (46), WPMT (47), & WRC (48)

I guess this is a silly question, but what happens to the "branding" of the stations that are changing channel numbers to something totally new (such as WETA, WRC, or WTTG)?

Will WTTG no longer be "Fox 5" and now call themselves "Fox 36"? I can't imagine a day when WETA isn't 26. Having first moved here in 1981, it's gonna take a little getting used to :-) I know in the day of 500-channel scrolling guides it's not so important, but I still associate the local channels with their analog number. Guess I'm getting old :-)

-Mike

AbMagFab

05-17-09, 11:19 AM

I guess this is a silly question, but what happens to the "branding" of the stations that are changing channel numbers to something totally new (such as WETA, WRC, or WTTG)?

Will WTTG no longer be "Fox 5" and now call themselves "Fox 36"? I can't imagine a day when WETA isn't 26. Having first moved here in 1981, it's gonna take a little getting used to :-) I know in the day of 500-channel scrolling guides it's not so important, but I still associate the local channels with their analog number. Guess I'm getting old :-)

-Mike

RF <> PSIP channel.

Fox 5 DT is *currently* on UHF 36. ATSC/PSIP allows remapping of channels, so you can "tune" to channel 5-1, but actually be tuning to UHF 36.

Totally for branding. Already resolved.

afiggatt

05-17-09, 12:12 PM

Now as you also know WWPX-DT 12 wants to relocate to DTV 51 post transition. But, so does WETA-DT 27 in Washington. I hate to pick on WETA, but isn't it in everybody's interest (except WETA's) for WWPX to be moved from DTV 12 to 51? This way both WBAL and WJZ could run full power non-directional transmitters which I believe would be 30KW each. Again, I have nothing against WETA but the FCC should do that which benefits the greater good. What do you think? Would you care to speculate whether the FCC is aware of what I am proposing?
Actually, what WWPX Ion 60 proposed was to move to UHF 51 AND to a new antenna location some miles south of their current location. Ion has WWPX up for sale and likely filed the petition so if it was approved, the station would have the broadcast rights for a location with a larger population. However, if WWPX-DT moved to UHF 51, it would interfere with WDCW-DT 50 reception in the western edge of the DC area. And there is no alternate station for CW programming to the west. The complication of the conflicting WWPX-DT and WETA-DT's petition to move to UHF 51 may be the reason why WDCW-DT's maximization application to increase to 1000 kW has not been granted.

Keep in mind that WETA-DT is running at only 90 kW on UHF 27 and can't increase power much at UHF 27 because of interference issues with WFPT-DT 62 on UHF 28. There are likely a lot of WETA-DT analog OTA viewers who probably can't get WETA-DT's current digital broadcast. As Systems2000 posted, with digital broadcast, it is more efficient to have co-located stations on adjacent channels to pack the frequency space. In DC, we have WRC-DT on UHF 48, currently have analog WWTD-LP on UHF 49, will have WDCW-DT on UHF 50. By putting WETA-DT on UHF 51, the station could likely increase to the 674 kW they asked for. There probably would be space for a 15 kW digital low power station on UHF 49 if WWTD-LP does a flash cut or folds up & another LD station takes the channel space.

WWPX-DT Ion 60 on VHF 12 does create problems for WBAL-DT and WJZ-DT. CBS owned WJZ-DT is spending the money to put up a new directional antenna that will allow them to get good coverage to the north, east, and south. But Hearst-Argyle owned WBAL opted not to spend money on a new directional antenna and went for only 5 kW total power. However, WHAG-DT 25 should be able to provide NBC HD programming for those who lose WBAL-DT in the western fringe. But OTA viewers to the east and north of Baltimore may not have alternate stations for NBC.

For CBS programming, people way west of Baltimore may have to rely on getting WUSA-DT. The better solution would be for WWPX-DT to find another UHF channel to broadcast on if there is one available. Or, heck, move to VHF 4 at 30 kW for kicks. Or for WWPX-DT to reduce power, because once WPXW-DT Ion 66 is at 1000 kW in NW DC, it will reach the majority of the WWPX-DT 60 OTA viewers population wise. However, if Ion can't find a buyer for WWPX, don't know what they will do with the station.

By taking away 18 UHF channels from TV broadcasting, UHF 52 to 69, the spectrum in the mid-Atlantic region is a lot more crowded with stations jostling each other for the remaining frequency and coverage space. Some stations get improved coverage, some don't. See how complicated this gets? :eek:

StevenJB

05-17-09, 02:15 PM

Trip in VA

05-17-09, 02:29 PM

If that is correct then WJZ and WBAL do not have to protect WWPX-12.

It's not correct. They do have to protect WWPX-DT.

- Trip

StevenJB

05-17-09, 03:21 PM

It's not correct. They do have to protect WWPX-DT.- Trip

Alright, agreed, WBAL-DT and WJZ-DT must protect WWPX-DT. Doesn't WWPX-DT, in turn, have to protect WBAL-DT and WJZ-DT? Why is WWPX-DT going to be allowed to output as much as 23KW post transition using a 314m tower when WBAL-DT is being restricted to only 5KW using only 299m tower, post transition and they are adjacent channels to each other? If WJZ-DT must protect WWPX-DT by using a directional antenna how is WWPX-DT protecting WJZ-DT? What am I missing?

Trip, let me ask you the same question. If WWPX-DT is allowed to move from DTV 12 to DTV 51 wouldn't that allow WBAL-DT and WJZ-DT to maximize their power allowable on high VHF (7-13) and run a non directional antenna?

afiggatt

05-17-09, 03:23 PM

afiggatt, maybe I am missing something but I still cannot understand from your explanation why WBAL-11 and WJZ-13 are restricting their power and coverage patterns. systems 2000 says that adjacent channel interference is not an issue with DTV if I understand him correctly. If that is correct then WJZ and WBAL do not have to protect WWPX-12. Am I wrong?

If that is true then why are WBAL and WJZ restricting their patterns? Do they have other alternatives which they are rejecting? Are you saying that WBAL is voluntarily restricting their power to a meager 5KW and could use more if they wanted to? Could WJZ run a more non directional pattern at 28.8KW?
Adjacent channel interference with digital (ATSC) broadcasting is an issue for stations that are not located within so many kilometers of each other or not far enough apart (Trip can provide the km separation numbers).The reason is that if one station's signal is so many dB stronger than the adjacent channel, as can occur for someone located close to the broadcast tower of 1 station but far enough away from the station on the adjacent channel, then the stronger station will interfere with the weaker signal. If the broadcast towers are close together, then they can pack 3-4 stations on adjacent channels. Which is what we have in DC with WHUT-DT on 33, WUSA-DT on 34 (soon to be WPXW-DT), WDCA-DT on 35, WTTG-DT on 36.

WBAL-DT 11 was originally allocated 6.91 kW by the FCC in the earlier post-transition allotment assignments, but that may have been for a directional antenna. WBAL-DT probably could have asked for a little more power than 5 kW, but a little more power is not going to make much difference. I would think the FCC staff is fully aware of the situation, but they have to follow the rules and have to nominally treat each station as more or less equal in their rights to spectrum space. If WBAL and WJZ really want to maintain OTA coverage in the western edge of their coverage area, they could negotiate with Ion to accept more interference for WWPX-DT, ask for reduced power for WWPX, or buy WWPX outright and move it to a different channel, but the latter raises all sorts of legal questions and is a rather expensive solution.

The solution for some to getting WBAL-DT 11 and WJZ-DT 13 after June 12 from further away is to get a good upper VHF antenna with a rooftop or attic setup. I get WWPX-DT at 23 kW on VHF 12 just fine at 48 miles from the backside of a upper VHF antenna. I think the bigger problem is going to be with the OTA viewers with indoor rabbit ear antennas who are used to getting a noisy, but watchable (to them anyway) picture for WBAL and WJZ who are 10, 15, 20 more miles away. Many of them are going to have trouble getting solid reception for WBAL-DT 11 with the converter box come June 13.

Trip in VA

05-17-09, 03:31 PM

Alright, agreed, WBAL-DT and WJZ-DT must protect WWPX-DT. Doesn't WWPX-DT, in turn, have to protect WBAL-DT and WJZ-DT? Why is WWPX-DT going to be allowed to output as much as 23KW post transition using a 314m tower when WBAL-DT is being restricted to only 5KW using only 299m tower, post transition and they are adjacent channels to each other? If WJZ-DT must protect WWPX-DT by using a directional antenna how is WWPX-DT protecting WJZ-DT? What am I missing?

Trip, let me ask you the same question. If WWPX-DT is allowed to move from DTV 12 to DTV 51 wouldn't that allow WBAL-DT and WJZ-DT to maximize their power allowable on high VHF (7-13) and run a non directional antenna?

WWPX-DT was there before WJZ-DT or WBAL-DT, or so is the logic of the FCC. Because of that, 11 and 13 have to protect 12 but not the other way around.

Now the reason for the power difference is that I have been told (you'll want to ask someone who's more knowledgeable before you take my word) that the station below an adjacent station causes more interference. That is, 11 interferes with 12 more than 13 does.

If WWPX-DT gets their move, then absolutely they could go omni-directional. However, then WWPX-DT starts interfering with WDCW-DT across northern Virginia in an interference problem worse than the existing WETA-DT/WFPT-DT problem.

I've actually typed up a document that I plan to submit to the FCC proposing a solution to hopefully make everyone happy. I've actually had it typed out for several months and just haven't gotten around to finishing it up. I plan to mail it to the FCC and to the stations involved. Here's a copy of it if anyone here is interested: http://data.quelorant.com/08-99-COMM-MOD.pdf

EDIT: Updated version posted.

- Trip

StevenJB

05-17-09, 04:28 PM

I've actually typed up a document that I plan to submit to the FCC proposing a solution to hopefully make everyone happy. I've actually had it typed out for several months and just haven't gotten around to finishing it up. I plan to mail it to the FCC and to the stations involved. Here's a copy of it if anyone here is interested: http://data.quelorant.com/08-99-COMM-MOD.pdf EDIT: Updated version posted.- Trip

My compliments to you on a very well written proposal. Of course, I am not a trained engineer so my comments lack a technical background. Your proposal does appear to satisfy the issues that you discussed.

My advice is get this document formalized as quickly as possible. The more people that you can get involved the sooner the better. June 12th is coming up fast.

Just my two cents worth.

systems2000

05-17-09, 07:06 PM

Northern Baltimore will be covered by WGAL-DT.

WDCW has a satellite transmitter (W51CY), just East of Hagerstown, that operates on RF 51 and will come on-line June 12th. It has been there for years as an analog transmitter, but was turned OFF (Dec, 2007), when WDCW-DT started broadcasting on RF 51 pre-transition. I've been waiting to get CW back since then.

systems2000

05-17-09, 07:18 PM

Trip,

Your proposal doesn't acknowledge the existence of W51CY 15KW transmitter on RF 51 and owned by WDCW.

dewster1977

05-17-09, 08:23 PM

It would also put WMAR (moving to 38) in the same boat as WBAL and WJZ are now. 18 or 19 may be and option for Martinsburg

systems2000

05-17-09, 08:35 PM

17, 18, & 19 are not used in the Baltimore/D.C. area.

aaronwt

05-17-09, 09:07 PM

RF <> PSIP channel.

Fox 5 DT is *currently* on UHF 36. ATSC/PSIP allows remapping of channels, so you can "tune" to channel 5-1, but actually be tuning to UHF 36.

Totally for branding. Already resolved.

But will it stay that way? They currently have channel 5 on analog which will go away soon. At which time they will be channel 36.
Will channels 4 and 5 be available for someone to use in the future? If so then Fox 5 would have to stop calling themselves that at some point if someone else took over channel 5 digitally.
Or are those lower VHF channels not used for any digital stations?

Trip in VA

05-17-09, 10:13 PM

My compliments to you on a very well written proposal. Of course, I am not a trained engineer so my comments lack a technical background. Your proposal does appear to satisfy the issues that you discussed.

My advice is get this document formalized as quickly as possible. The more people that you can get involved the sooner the better. June 12th is coming up fast.

Just my two cents worth.

Thanks. I've actually had most of that typed up since October. I just really am dreading figuring out who to mail them to. I mean, I've sent formal comments to the FCC before, but this one will also be sent to the stations in question.

Trip,

Your proposal doesn't acknowledge the existence of W51CY 15KW transmitter on RF 51 and owned by WDCW.

It doesn't need to. W51CY is a translator, and as such will have to move when/if WETA-DT/WWPX-DT moves to 51. For purposes of allocations, it might as well not exist.

It would also put WMAR (moving to 38) in the same boat as WBAL and WJZ are now. 18 or 19 may be and option for Martinsburg

1) 18 and 19 are out due to Land Mobile concerns in DC.

2) The proposed tower site by WWPX-DT is further south and would have to protect WMAR (since the 39 allotment would be newer than WMAR-DT's approved 38). Also, WJLA would be the ABC affiliate for that area, rather than WMAR.

But will it stay that way?

Yes. A station signing on DT-05 would map to 36-1.

- Trip

afiggatt

05-17-09, 10:25 PM

But will it stay that way? They currently have channel 5 on analog which will go away soon. At which time they will be channel 36.
Will channels 4 and 5 be available for someone to use in the future? If so then Fox 5 would have to stop calling themselves that at some point if someone else took over channel 5 digitally.
Or are those lower VHF channels not used for any digital stations? Low VHF 2-6 will be available for digital broadcast. The post-transition channels are 2-51 except for UHF 37 which is reserved for radio astronomy. However, because low VHF (54 to 88 MHz) is prone to RF interference, only 40 full power stations in the US selected low VHF in their post-transition allotments, most of those in rural areas. The big exception to that is WPVI-DT ABC 6 in Philadelphia which will flash cut to VHF 6 on June 12.

What we will likely see for Low VHF is a number of low power stations moving there because it is cheaper to operate at low VHF. Religious and educational stations mostly, more interested in getting cable carriage than OTA reception. If another station starts up on VHF 4 or VHF 5 in the coverage area of WRC-DT or WTTG-DT, that station will have to choose a unused virtual channel channel to map to. The FCC has laid out very specific rules on this.

I expect in a few years, once the analog transition is done and over with, that the FCC will relax the rules a bit for virtual channels and allow stations to map to their physical broadcast channel if that station wants to, provided that no other station in that or adjacent markets is using that mapped channel number. If you were running WPXW-DT Ion 66, which does not have that strong an identity IMO, wouldn't you rather have it known as WPXW Ion 34? But if you are WRC, which has called itself WRC 4 or NBC 4 for decades, you will stick with WRC 4, not WRC 48. But this is getting off topic for the DC thread as these topics are national issues which have been discussed a number of times in the final DTV table of allotments sticky thread.

afiggatt

05-17-09, 10:37 PM

Thanks. I've actually had most of that typed up since October. I just really am dreading figuring out who to mail them to. I mean, I've sent formal comments to the FCC before, but this one will also be sent to the stations in question.
Go ahead and send to them. Good ideas in your proposal, although it would require 3 stations to get new digital broadcast equipment. However, all 3 have asked for new channel assignments so they are prepared to do so. I assume the reason that WETA-DT has not been granted it's petition to move to 51 is because of the conflicting petition from WWPX. Too bad, because the FCC could have granted that petition last fall, which might have given WETA enough time to be ready to switch to UHF 51 on June 12.

If WETA-DT were to move to 51, what would that do for opening up UHF 27 in adjacent markets far enough away from WFPT on 28?
2) The proposed tower site by WWPX-DT is further south and would have to protect WMAR (since the 39 allotment would be newer than WMAR-DT's approved 38). Also, WJAL would be the ABC affiliate for that area, rather than WMAR.
Did you mean WJLA ABC 7, not independent WJAL 68? (There should be a rule about dyslexic call signs in overlapping markets :D).

Trip in VA

05-17-09, 10:42 PM

If WETA-DT were to move to 51, what would that do for opening up UHF 27 in adjacent markets far enough away from WFPT on 28?

It doesn't do much, really. 27 is taken in Philly which does a lot to limit availability. Between that, WHAG-DT 26 in Hagerstown, and WRLH-DT 26 in Richmond, there aren't many places a 27 could be implemented successfully as a full-service station. Maybe in the Shenandoah Valley or something it would work, but I haven't looked at it too closely.

Did you mean WJLA ABC 7, not independent WJAL 68? (There should be a rule about dyslexic call signs in overlapping markets :D).

Yes I did. D'oh! I've fixed it.

- Trip

aaronwt

05-17-09, 11:21 PM

Thanks!

Low VHF 2-6 will be available for digital broadcast. The post-transition channels are 2-51 except for UHF 37 which is reserved for radio astronomy. However, because low VHF (54 to 88 MHz) is prone to RF interference, only 40 full power stations in the US selected low VHF in their post-transition allotments, most of those in rural areas. The big exception to that is WPVI-DT ABC 6 in Philadelphia which will flash cut to VHF 6 on June 12.

What we will likely see for Low VHF is a number of low power stations moving there because it is cheaper to operate at low VHF. Religious and educational stations mostly, more interested in getting cable carriage than OTA reception. If another station starts up on VHF 4 or VHF 5 in the coverage area of WRC-DT or WTTG-DT, that station will have to choose a unused virtual channel channel to map to. The FCC has laid out very specific rules on this.

I expect in a few years, once the analog transition is done and over with, that the FCC will relax the rules a bit for virtual channels and allow stations to map to their physical broadcast channel if that station wants to, provided that no other station in that or adjacent markets is using that mapped channel number. If you were running WPXW-DT Ion 66, which does not have that strong an identity IMO, wouldn't you rather have it known as WPXW Ion 34? But if you are WRC, which has called itself WRC 4 or NBC 4 for decades, you will stick with WRC 4, not WRC 48. But this is getting off topic for the DC thread as these topics are national issues which have been discussed a number of times in the final DTV table of allotments sticky thread.

systems2000

05-18-09, 09:09 AM

Channels 2 through 6 are still available, but not likely to be desirable by any high power station. These frequencies are prime for a lot of interference (especially lightning) and prevents the FM band from expanding.

OrleansDawg

05-18-09, 07:45 PM

AbMagFab

05-18-09, 08:29 PM

OrleansDawg

05-18-09, 08:34 PM

Sports fan or something?

Saints fan :o

I am just moving from another city where I had Comcast and it was miserable not being able to watch my Saints without going to a bar so I told myself I would find a DirecTV place.

I figured I would find 1-2 DirecTV apartments but alas, I have come up empty after a few days

Just curious if anyone knew of any good ones towards Cap Hill that maybe they stay at or stayed at :)

AbMagFab

05-18-09, 08:49 PM

Saints fan :o

I am just moving from another city where I had Comcast and it was miserable not being able to watch my Saints without going to a bar so I told myself I would find a DirecTV place.

I figured I would find 1-2 DirecTV apartments but alas, I have come up empty after a few days

Just curious if anyone knew of any good ones towards Cap Hill that maybe they stay at or stayed at :)

Another possibility - some apartment buildings have centralized the DirecTV service. So even if it's not south facing, it's what's available in the building. (That might be what you're saying, if so, sorry!)

OrleansDawg

05-18-09, 09:02 PM

Another possibility - some apartment buildings have centralized the DirecTV service. So even if it's not south facing, it's what's available in the building. (That might be what you're saying, if so, sorry!)

Good thought. I will ask about that.

systems2000

05-18-09, 09:05 PM

I believe that is what he has had a problem finding and would like references, from those in the know, to where he can find one.

DRal

05-19-09, 10:11 AM

Good day to all. I am in Vienna VA using COX. I have a HD DVR box and I want to transfer shows from my DVR to my computer. It would be great if I can transfer shows/video from my computer to my DVR. Is this possible if so what do I need to do this.

Thanks for all the help.

gmucklow

05-19-09, 12:29 PM

I have a question for locals in downtown DC (Around Capital Hill)

I am moving to DC and have been apartment rental shopping for several days now....and am ABSOLUTELY floored at the lack of DirecTV apartments I have found in the city. Now, a few places allow me to get DirecTV if I want but the apartments they have available are either closed off to the Southern Sky or some other problem that would interfere with the service

So, does anyone have a recommendations for someone looking for a DirecTV place near Capital Hill?

Well, the Hyde Park condo near the Ballston Metro on the Orange Line in Arlington has DirecTV satellite dishes on the roof, as well as Comcast and FIOS and a digital HDTV master antenna system for local channels. Some rental units are available with DirectTV included. At least one is available now.

cpldc

05-19-09, 02:02 PM

Good thought. I will ask about that.

That seems like a better idea. I can't think of any apartments on the Hill that have balconies or other areas you could use to mount a dish of your own. I only know of one building that has/had DirecTV but it's far up in NW, and uses a central system.

Some other parts of DC have RCN instead of Comcast, if that's preferable. I'm not familiar with sports programming.

URFloorMatt

05-19-09, 05:20 PM

NBC Charlotte has switched to HD local news. That makes WRC the only NBC affiliate in the top 25 markets without an HD news broadcast. In fact, there are only 15 NBC affiliates in the top 50 markets without an HD news broadcast.

Among the four major networks, there are only two affiliates in the top 10 markets without an HD news broadcast. Fox Boston is the other.

OrleansDawg

05-19-09, 06:30 PM

Well, the Hyde Park condo near the Ballston Metro on the Orange Line in Arlington has DirecTV satellite dishes on the roof, as well as Comcast and FIOS and a digital HDTV master antenna system for local channels. Some rental units are available with DirectTV included. At least one is available now.

Thanks for the suggestion. I called them today and was told they didn't have any for rent and were just selling....which makes sense but damn

Spent all of today and kept finding places with Comcast/RSN only. Ugh.

Maybe I will just have to give up on DirecTV. :(

CHIA

05-19-09, 08:13 PM

Cap Hill has a lot of rental houses that you could probably put an antenna on. Check craigslist or yarmouth management. Otherwise, there are a bunch of new large apt buildings near the baseball park that might have service in the building. I think one is called capitol yards.

Separate question - I lost WETA digital reception the last couple of days. I'm in the city, have a rooftop antenna, and have usually had good reception with WETA and other stations (CBS 9 and PBS 22 are sometimes spotty). Any ideas why problems with WETA digital , when the analog reception is still good? And, with the Jun 12 transition, will reception improve? I saw the transition list posted here and it looked like a number of stations will dramatically reduce power, am I reading wrong?

OrleansDawg

05-19-09, 09:32 PM

Thanks for the Cap Yards place. I will give them a call tomorrow

I have tried Craigslist and the other site but it seems like a lot are in Arlington or those that DO have Sat capabilities are in sketchy locations, etc....

Beggers can't be choosers I guess :)

afiggatt

05-19-09, 09:44 PM

Separate question - I lost WETA digital reception the last couple of days. I'm in the city, have a rooftop antenna, and have usually had good reception with WETA and other stations (CBS 9 and PBS 22 are sometimes spotty). Any ideas why problems with WETA digital , when the analog reception is still good? And, with the Jun 12 transition, will reception improve? I saw the transition list posted here and it looked like a number of stations will dramatically reduce power, am I reading wrong?
I have not observed any problems with WETA-DT reception recently.

If you are looking at the current UHF power for the stations moving to upper VHF, it takes less power for VHF to provide the same coverage area. The question for upper VHF (7-13) is whether 12.6 kW omni-directional (WUSA-DT), or 28.8 kW directional (WJZ-DT) will be adequate to match the analog and current digital broadcast coverage. WBAL-DT 11 at 5 kW will not match their current analog coverage, period.

gmucklow

05-20-09, 12:42 AM

Thanks for the suggestion. I called them today and was told they didn't have any for rent and were just selling....which makes sense but damn

Spent all of today and kept finding places with Comcast/RSN only. Ugh.

Maybe I will just have to give up on DirecTV. :(

That is incorrect. I know the owner of a Hyde Park condo unit -- I think it is 603 -- it is a very large one bedroom unit with Direct TV and it is for rent now. Maybe you need to talk to a broker or something. There is a lock box on the door. The metro will take you to Capital South station without a transfer.

Marcus Carr

05-20-09, 09:47 AM

Comcast will move NFL Network from the Sports Entertainment Package to Digital Classic by August 1.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=16488884#post16488884

AntAltMike

05-20-09, 10:26 AM

...I figured I would find 1-2 DirecTV apartments but alas, I have come up empty after a few days

Just curious if anyone knew of any good ones towards Cap Hill that maybe they stay at or stayed at :)

I don't have any comprehensive, timely way of keeping track of this, but most of the DC apartment complexes I do business with that have DirecTV have not yet upgraded to 3-Ku satellite, let alone 5-satellite KuKa. The nine most popular HDTV channels are on the 3 satellite system, whereas the rest are only on the five satellite system. But if you only want, say, the NFL Sunday Ticket, or if your desires are more modest than that, you should be able to find a building that has DirecTV "Sat A" (101 deg) availability.

You might call MDU Communications and see if they will tell you of any client buildings of theirs in that locality. They are by far the largest DirecTv system operator in your market.

A few years ago, I remember speaking to one Arlington resident who would not move into Washington DC until Comedy Central became available.