Bungie admits to what most everyone has already said about Halo 2


When it comes to Halo 2, the developers of the game aren't content with how things turned. Sure the game went on to rack up $125 million USD in sales on its first day and has sold more than 6.5 million copies worldwide since its launch, but those successes seem to ring a bit hollow with Bungie.

Many Halo fans that plunked down their hard-earned money for Halo 2 were disappointed with the game’s storyline and ending -- Bungie's Frank O'Connor agrees. "We drove off Thelma & Louise style," said O'Connor. "The trick is to avoid designing or writing by committee. You have to take what's best from the input you're getting and not have it turn into that too many cooks situation."

Part of the reason for the discontent with the game stems from the fact that Bungie didn't have the four to six week "polishing period" that it had with the original Halo blockbuster. "We had about four to five weeks to polish Halo at the end. No more than that. And that last five per cent is responsible for 30 per cent of the success of the game, or more. That's the period in which we really had a perfect storm," said technical lead Chris Butcher. "One of the things that stuns me when I think about it, and I can't believe this is true - we had none of that for Halo 2 ... We miscalculated, we screwed up, we came down to the wire and we just lost all of that."

Even more harsh words were reserved for Halo 2's multiplayer. "Even the multiplayer experience for Halo 2 is a pale shadow of what it could and should have been if we had gotten the timing of our schedule right. It's astounding to me. I f***ing cannot play Halo 2 multiplayer. I cannot do it. And that's why I know Halo 3 is going to be so much better," adds Butcher.


Bungie has a chance to not only improve on the tremendous sales success of Halo 2, but also to improve on the many letdowns brought forth with that title. Bungie has already notified testers selected for the Halo 3 beta and the title is expected to hit store shelves in time for the Holiday 2007 season. Bungie has a little less than a year to truly wow Xbox 360 owners out there and hopefully they won't let them down. Gears of War is already shaping up to be the “next big thing” for the Xbox 360 platform, so the Halo franchise isn’t the only game in town anymore.

http://www.dailytech.com/Bungie+Admits+That+It+Screwed+Up+Halo+2/article5832.htm

I liked Halo 2


ending was forgettable though

Yeah, the story was - lacking.

The touted "per-pixel lighting engine" was producing pictures that ended up too many times just too dark.

And what was that with those frick*n weapons covering a big chunk from the bottom corner(s) of the screen? (To me, that was the most annoying - running around while "leaning forward" just to see where I am heading and what's coming at me...).

Halo 2 was clearly sailing on the waves created by the success of Halo 1. I preordered it blindly just like all the others. This time around I'll wait until the dust settles around Halo 3...

So I was right all along. Good to know.

It's still badass. Hard to argue with the numbers.

Yeah, Halo 2, what an abomination. Pure trash. Thank god no one fell for it and bought that game

Don't misunderstood me guys, to me it was an OK game. But I too believe it could have been so much better. Given the foundation it was built on...

I give it 5 "cheating online multiplayer b*st*rds" out of - 7...

:D

I played through it once and have not played it since.

Same here! :(

I didn't even get through it once. Making you play as a covenant elite...boring! Lost interest real quick after that happened. That was the worst decision since having the player play Raiden in MGS2 instead of Solid Snake. I tried to like Halo 2, but I just didn't. This gives me hope for Halo 3 though.

I also found Halo2 disappointing especially considering they repeatedly delayed it's release and I never finished it - whereas I played Halo at least a dozen times over at every difficulty level for a year and still find most FPS disappointing and friggin GOW I find graphically excellent but to me it's fluff period the Berserker simply stumped me and nothing ever stumped me in Halo. Simply did not find it fun even after finding a walkthrough I found trying to get past that part damn annoying and not worth the trouble - I game for fun not frustration or to have a game give me a cardiac along the way.

GOW while graphically an achievement has no replay value or worth even committing the time to bother with Berserker take away the graphics and it's SOSO BS. Just as they screwed up with Doom III and Quake 4 for 360 - horrible POS Games that have nothing in common with the originals that made them hits. I recall getting a shareware disk of the first doom on my PC loooong time ago and it blew me away - I played all night long yet the 360 version was a POS IMO.

Sorry guys but I've had it with a thousand ways to shoot up the undead and gorefest games or who can splash the most blood and smear there graphics with darkness. At least the Serious Sam series doesn't pretend to be anything but a frantic paced FPS and humorous to boot. Yes, Please take Halo back to what it was - the eye candy does not make up for the intense and challenging the original layed the groundwork for. Halo 2 was the biggest disappointment along with Doom 3 and Quake 4. Perhaps they should create a category of gorefest creepy FPS as that seems to be all they make now. :mad:

I liked Halo2, but the ending was "forgetable" as already mentioned. I ended up going through Halo and Halo 2 again just to refresh my memory in antisipation for Halo 3... Although the ending was a non-ending in Halo 2, I still thought the game was very good.

I liked Halo2, but the ending was "forgetable" as already mentioned. I ended up going through Halo and Halo 2 again just to refresh my memory in antisipation for Halo 3... Although the ending was a non-ending in Halo 2, I still thought the game was very good.


I am more into the story because of the books in addition to the game. I am currently reading the latest novel that was released last month and the timeline is prior to the Fall of Reach.

I am amazed at how jaded so many people are. I enjoyed Halo2 single player quite a bit - even playing as the covenant was an interesting twist. I am a little concerned however that they wrote themselves into a strange corner with the ending. I found the end far from forgettable - it was however very unclear where they are headed with the story. Where they left themselves is where they are stuck starting with H3...

I predict that either they will do something truly interesting and innovating with the game play and people will complain it isn't more like Halo or they will make it just like Halo and people will complain that they didn't do anything interesting.

I am amazed at how jaded so many people are. I enjoyed Halo2 single player quite a bit - even playing as the covenant was an interesting twist. I am a little concerned however that they wrote themselves into a strange corner with the ending. I found the end far from forgettable - it was however very unclear where they are headed with the story. Where they left themselves is where they are stuck starting with H3...

I predict that either they will do something truly interesting and innovating with the game play and people will complain it isn't more like Halo or they will make it just like Halo and people will complain that they didn't do anything interesting.


Either way as a fan I am looking forward too it.

i was confused with the ending but the multiplayer wasnt that bad.... i mean how could they fix it?

Fans have always thought they were cheated by the abrupt ending of H2. It’s good to hear they have the extra time needed this time to polish H3.

I actually never finished the H2 campaign. Of course, I have chipped away at it over time and I will finish some day but as soon as I joined XBL and discovered how much fun multiplayer is I never looked back!

I thought Bungie did a decent job of tweaking the game during its life span to balance and improve the game.

A lot has been said about the modding and cheating. Of course, that detracted from the experience. However, when you belong to on-line gaming community you don’t have to worry about that crap. I was in a H2 league and it was, by far, the most fun I have ever had playing a video game. Getting together each week to practice and to talk strategy for the upcoming match that weekend was so much friggin’ fun

The diversity of game types, weapons, etc., and the lobby system in H2, I believe, remains unrivaled in gaming.

I am looking forward to H3. I am also looking forward to the next chapter for Bungie. They say H3 is the last in the series. We’ll see.

I agree with PB. I've never even bothered to try the single player, but the Halo2 multiplayer is among the best there is for a FPS. Even with the old gen graphics, my friends and I are always playing Halo2 on our X360's. Great multiplayer maps, very good game customisability, very smooth lag free online.

I enjoyed the game but it was too short. The MP made up for it but what if you aren't all into MP?

My BIGGEST complaint with Halo 2 was the whole lobby system. It was great how they devised a leveling up system but why make it so that you cannot create a random room where people can just join in? The only way to make a room is to invite people in which is unlike every other game out there.
You should be able to create a room and host and have people join in to your room. I realize the game auto picked the best host for speed purposes and then gave control to the next person if the host left, which was nice but I want FULL hosting control.
Just do like GOW and have regular rooms and ranked rooms and let people choose capture the flag, deathmatch, etc. and search for it.

The party system for Halo 2 was the best of any game before or since and it amazes me that no game even comes close to trying the same.

Selling 6.5 millions copies at approx. $50 a pop. Wow! And they still say they screwed up. I guess a $325 million dollar screw up is a good thing.

You know, this is really just marketing PR crap. They want to say that to get people even more excited about Halo 3 and that "Wow, if Halo 2 was that good/popular, Halo 3 is going to rock."

I'm more into the HALO universe, so the ending did what a good story does. Leave you wanting more. The books are great and fill in a lot of gaps in the game's storyline. I've put more hours into H2 than any other game.

The party system for Halo 2 was the best of any game before or since and it amazes me that no game even comes close to trying the same.

I agree. I hear the issue is that the party system is proprietary. Still, it doesn't make sense why MS would not share the technology or license it to 360 developers.

Selling 6.5 millions copies at approx. $50 a pop. Wow! And they still say they screwed up. I guess a $325 million dollar screw up is a good thing.

You know, this is really just marketing PR crap. They want to say that to get people even more excited about Halo 3 and that "Wow, if Halo 2 was that good/popular, Halo 3 is going to rock."

Actually I read it was 8 million + copies sold

I still play online multiplayer 3 or 4 times a week.I got hooked early on and to be honest never even finished the game. I am still looking foreword to Halo 3 for the multiplayer. I got my invite to Halo 3 Beta and I have high hopes for it.

I appreciate their mea culpa. Still, nothing beats an evening of MP with friends and family. It's still among the top gaming experiences to be had.

It's like admitting to a woman that you made her pregnant 50 years go and that you're sorry. ahem!

Halo 2 is still the only game that I have SERIOUSLY played many many hours. GOW doesnt even come close to how many times I spent online. I have lost countless hours of sleep because of MP. I'm actually a bit scared about Halo 3 because this addiction will manifest itself , again.......*sigh*........can't wait, lol.

Halo 2 wasn't perfect, but I sure did like the single player -- right up to the moment where the story slammed into a brick wall and came to a sudden, screeching, violent end. Actually, "end" would imply that Halo 2 actually had and ending. More accurate to say that it got terminated.


That said, I've had so much fun with the multiplayer that I really can't fault Bungie a whole lot. If Halo 2 was really screwed up, then I can only think of the awesomeness that will follow if they do Halo 3 "properly".

The lobby system in Halo 2 is the best ever lobby system. GoW Rs:V are just terrible lobby systems and give to much control the host.... can't play ranked games together.. oh just don't get me started on that BS

I completely agree, the storyline IMO was crap compared to HALO. Much better gameplay. The multiplayer is a crock too. Too much cheating, glitching and the maps are ok at best.

The different gametypes are cool, it just sucks you cant play GOW with capture the flag or territories. Playing execution and warzone all the time REALLY gets boring.

Where do I go to get my refund?

I loved both Halo:CE and Halo 2. Halo 2's storyline was lacking, however. I did not enjoy playing as the Arbiter. Master Cheif is such a cool character that I wanted to be him, not the enemy. And the ending of Halo 2 left much to be desired. Having a cliffhanger ending is one thing, but ending the game playing as the Arbiter left a bad taste in my mouth.

The multiplayer, while not perfect, was incredible. I think you will get glitching, cheating, modding, etc. in any online multiplayer game...especially one as popular as Halo 2. The lobby, party, and matchmaking systems I thought were great. The only thing I really would like to see improved is the weapon balancing. Spawning with a SMG is pretty useless. I'm glad that in some of the updates, they changed the default spawn weapon to the Battle Rifle. But still, the power weapons were maybe a bit too powerful...

Selling 6.5 millions copies at approx. $50 a pop. Wow! And they still say they screwed up. I guess a $325 million dollar screw up is a good thing.

You know, this is really just marketing PR crap. They want to say that to get people even more excited about Halo 3 and that "Wow, if Halo 2 was that good/popular, Halo 3 is going to rock."
I agree. They're very shrewed with the marketing over there. Is there any way anyone could possibly reconcile what they are saying now with the stuff they were saying at the last E3 (or whatever) before Halo2 was released?

It's all just spin.

I also agree with others above that the party system in Halo2 was brilliant and is sorely missed in pretty much all other online games, especially games like Battefield2, and that the 'best host' system was brilliant as well. Both, I thought, would become standards for future Xbox games, and at the very least become more common than not in 360 games. I find it very disappointing that they are not.

Story? I don't care about no stinkin' story... I just wanna blow stuff up and smack sleeping grunts! :D

SOSO BS. Just as they screwed up with Doom III and Quake 4 for 360 - horrible POS Games that have nothing in common with the originals that made them hits. I recall getting a shareware disk of the first doom on my PC loooong time ago and it blew me away - I played all night long yet the 360 version was a POS IMO.


Of course it blew you away, becuase you'd never played anything like it before.
Now..think about it..Quake..4...Doom III....just another FPS. The only way to up the ante is to increase its graphical punch or radically alter the way the game is played. Doom III is a runa nd gun FPS with pretty graphics.

Lets face it..Doom I was great, but it was just random maze levels with monsters.
Doom II was a Doom I expansion pack. Once we started to get levels that actaully looked like someplace...a hospital looked like a hospital, a reactor looked like a reactor, etc, etc, then those Doom games just became like pac man or Donkey Kong....amusing for their time and fun to play fo ra little while today, but overtly simple with simple graphics.

I played the Doom leaked pirated pre-alpha copy with no sound for weeks and weeks.......it moved so fluidly.....it was like a revolution.

Sorry guys but I've had it with a thousand ways to shoot up the undead and gorefest games or who can splash the most blood and smear there graphics with darkness.


Not me :)


Yes, Please take Halo back to what it was - the eye candy does not make up for the intense and challenging the original layed the groundwork for. Halo 2 was the biggest disappointment along with Doom 3 and Quake 4. Perhaps they should create a category of gorefest creepy FPS as that seems to be all they make now. :mad:

Halo 2 was a reasonable followup to Halo 1, but Halo 1 had more of a story, I actually played through the repetitive levels to see how the story wound up (Halo 1). But man, its not a *great* fps....its a great console fps, but a mediocre fps if you compare it to games out for the PC.

Halo 2 was more of the same, and I enjoyed the playing as the Covenant Elite.....but like Halo 1, its a game I play through once and never touch again.

Quake 4 was just a mediocre game overall, same with Doom III......FEAR was the last FPS I actually liked, and wanted to keep playing...the gore helped, being able to dispatch enemies that did more than "keel over when they run out of hit box points" was quite visceral.

In a FPS, 3/4 of the fun is how you dispatch your enemies.....

The best thing for Halo 3 is the success of Gears of War. The more that games sales the less pressure Microsoft will feel to rush Halo 3's release date.

they didnt have enough time.....a game of halos caliber should take more than what year and half to make.....should of been 3 years i would have been fine waiting, but I bet they were pressured by MS to make it.....who knows im happy.

Story? I don't care about no stinkin' story... I just wanna blow stuff up and smack sleeping grunts! :D
thats what im talking about......i feel the same way.

If Halo 3's online is as simplistic and limiting as Halo 2's, I'll likely never play one game. So a solid storyline and single player campaign I can get into will matter far more to me than how many 4vs4 deathmatch maps there are.

Especially when it comes down to the fact that I'll essentially be playing another game with only about 8 weapons total, shooting the same "alien enemies" as the past 2 games.

I really hope they can bust out some real innovations for halo 3, like more open levels with more vehicles or angles of attack. Halo 2 was severely limiting (probably due to the limitations of the console) in that I always felt like I was completely on rails...

Also the levels were all so vertically challenged......you know, even in a city with buildings you couldn't go in any of them, there was mostly you shooting at aliens in the same corridor or street or room....that made it feel very old school to me.

I honestly could care less about the storyline. But when I first got H2 I wasn't even close to getting an internet connection. So single player was all I had. I felt that the graphics weren't that great and the enemy AI was the biggest let down. So after I beat it once or twice, it just collected major dust. When broadband internet became acquirable for me all that dust got blown away. Halo 2's MP was the best I've ever seen. There's so many games I tried MP on and it was just ridiculous. I was just getting into random matches and they usually sucked. So if H3's multiplayer is even the same as H2 with HD, I'm sold. I'm not really that interested in the Halo universe.

OK. First you can create any custom gametype and unless you make it a "closed Party" anyone who is on your friends list can join. Or anyone who is on your friends friend list can join and so on. I have acutally started a custom game by myself and after about 5 minutes it is full (16 players) with players who joined, none of which I invited. Usually this happens when I am trying to glitch. So to the poster on the 1st page who said this cannot be done I disagree.

Secondly, H2 lobby system is the best ther is IMO. I cannot stand the lobby systems of the newer games and do not play them much as a result. I wish every xbox live game had a lobby system as good as H2's

Thirdly, H2 is a sequel. While I thought the ending sucked it was only b/c I wanted to continue playing. We all knew that H3 was on the way when we played H2 so while the ending wasn't really an ending I didn't expect too much. Better ending than COD2 or COD3 or RB6 though. If you think the game is too short or the AI was lacking I guess your not playing on Legendary.

Fourthly- I sold my Ps2 to buy an Xbox solely for Halo. Halo is the greatest game ever IMO and really has driven the console gaming industry to new standards. It is the most successful media franchise EVER!

Lastly- the cheating and modding was a real problem, but with the 360 you should be able to alleviate this in H3. Playing with a cheater? Simply select him from your players list and blackball him/her, you'll never be matched with that player again. The only bad thing about H2 is the long wait to H3. The only people left playing H2 online are hardcore Halofans, so the competition is usually fierce. No more noob fodder to teabag!

Lastly- the cheating and modding was a real problem, but with the 360 you should be able to alleviate this in H3. Playing with a cheater? Simply select him from your players list and blackball him/her, you'll never be matched with that player again.

I don't really have an issue with H2 one way or another, but I do take issue with this "solution" you propose. Blackballing cheaters will never solve the problem if cheating is rampant. I never played H2 multiplayer but at least from what I hear cheating was a major problem there. Even if there are 15 million players and of those, 1 million are cheaters, are you seriously going to sit and blackball 1 million players? of course not. The fact is, no matter how many players you blackball, there are always so many other cheaters out there that it would be impossible to consistently find a match where there are no cheaters.

Sorry if that was OT.

As it's time to start selling Halo 3, Bungie admits Halo 2 was disappointing.
I would believe they are sincere, if that were not a clever way to imply Halo 3 will be much better.

The party system for Halo 2 was the best of any game before or since and it amazes me that no game even comes close to trying the same.

THAT part was good. I only wish it featured a way to host a room and allow random people to find it. The only other option was to just join randomly with no host.
I'm looking for more of a rainbow six style approach where you see a list of available games and join in.
I don't know if they will use the party system this time though with the more advanced player features the 360 has with preferred player and so forth.

OK. First you can create any custom gametype and unless you make it a "closed Party" anyone who is on your friends list can join. Or anyone who is on your friends friend list can join and so on. I have acutally started a custom game by myself and after about 5 minutes it is full (16 players) with players who joined, none of which I invited. Usually this happens when I am trying to glitch. So to the poster on the 1st page who said this cannot be done I disagree.

No, what I said was you cannot host a room that random players can join. What do you do if no one on your friend's list enters or is online? Even with a full freind's list I had issues with that the first time around.
What I want to do is host games and be able to invite friends but also allow randoms to join. Basically like running a server much like Rainbow six.

I still don't get why some people want to bash Bungie/H2 for all of the modding/cheating done on H2. By the time Halo2 was released, the XBOX1 was already fully compromised to run unsigned code. And when H2 was in full swing, the modding scene made it too daym easy for anyone to mod their xbox to run cheats. It was not Bungie's fault but the xbox1 console as a platform and as a whole was at fault.

If Halo1 was released with xbl online play right before h2, you would have seen the exact same thing. If Gears of War was an xbox1 title right after Halo2, you would have seen the exact same cheats and mods there as well.

The point is that any popular multiplayer game will bring out cheaters. Unfortunately for H2, the cheating was amplified by modified xboxs. Looking at GOW now on the 360, the cheaters are there as well, but they're limited to in-game glitches as the 360 cannot and will not run unsigned code yet. Hopefully this stays true at least a while longer so that H3 will not be tainted by the same type of cheating that H2 encountered.

why are people crying over H2 rightnow gheez....its a fun game period....do people who post this stuff even play the game makes you wonder that they stay online complaining about a game than playing it.

why are people crying over H2 rightnow gheez....its a fun game period....do people who post this stuff even play the game makes you wonder that they stay online complaining about a game than playing it.
Dude, it's a discussion.
:rolleyes:

Dude, it's a discussion.
:rolleyes:
DK,
read others peoples posts not just yours next time thanks :rolleyes: ;) :)

DK,
read others peoples posts not just yours next time thanks :rolleyes: ;) :)
I did. take your smileys and pack 'em.

If you watched the development movie that was released over Christmas for Halo 3 the guys bascially said the the entire Brute character was sort of tacked on at the end. There were things in Halo 2 that bugged me but for the most part it was a fun game. I still have it and still play it occasionally.

I never made it through the story mode, I think that's because I was too busy playing 1000s uppon 1000's of multiplayer matches.

Best matchmaking ever

Never even played single player so can't comment on that.


Multiplayer however... garbage compared to H1. Most H2 n00bs never even played H1.. the same ones who are screaming H2 is awesome. H2 multi is awesome yes, but pales to H1 multi. No skill really needed to hold non-respawning snipes/rocks or tap into that oh so luxurious auto-aim and giant kill boxes. No scope in h2 = happens everygame. No scope in h1 = something to be proud of. That game just had a smoothness, and skill to it that is still unmatched. I would have laughed at you if you told me I would actually go to a tournmaent for a video game before I played H1.

Best thing they can do for 3 is to include an original H1 mutliplayer bonus disc or something.

The lobby system in Halo 2 is the best ever lobby system. GoW Rs:V are just terrible lobby systems and give to much control the host.... can't play ranked games together.. oh just don't get me started on that BS

I agree. The lobby system is about the only place I think H2 was successful, and I'm disappointed to not see it proliferated into other games.

I also didn't like the abrupt ending, and don't care for the multiplayer balancing decisions that were made to the game, so I never really got into the MP as much as I did playing H:CE with my friend system linked LAN. I think I missed the pistol way too much. =P

Interesting discussion going on in this topic. I think this whole announcement by Bungie has a little bit of truth, a little marketing ploy, and some absurdity all in one. Halo2 was a terrific game, or it never would have sold as much as it did. However, the story definitely was not as good as the first, and it felt a bit too linear. Too many finicky fights too, especially on legendary. Getting stuck really is a huge issue. The legendary setting in Halo 1 was oh so perfect, it was a blast to play over and over again. I probably played legendary at least 15 times. Halo2 legendary was a test of your ability to not destroy your Xbox.

Anyways, Im glad to hear bungie is more confident with Halo3. I personally hate the idea of releasing this multiplayer beta, but thats just me. Keep it all under wraps until its done.

Never even played single player so can't comment on that.


Multiplayer however... garbage compared to H1. Most H2 n00bs never even played H1.. the same ones who are screaming H2 is awesome. H2 multi is awesome yes, but pales to H1 multi. No skill really needed to hold non-respawning snipes/rocks or tap into that oh so luxurious auto-aim and giant kill boxes. No scope in h2 = happens everygame. No scope in h1 = something to be proud of. That game just had a smoothness, and skill to it that is still unmatched. I would have laughed at you if you told me I would actually go to a tournmaent for a video game before I played H1.

Best thing they can do for 3 is to include an original H1 mutliplayer bonus disc or something.

H1 multiplayer sucked because you had have 2 or more XBOX's, along with 2 or more tv's in order to get bigger games with everybody having their own separate screens.

And before you bring up the tunneling software that gave you the option to play online, I was strongly considering buying a PC just for that reason but that was just too costly just to play MP. And I played H1 multiplayer every chance I got. I just had to get everybody together at the same place at the same time and have the equipment to make an enjoyable game that didn't involve everybody looking at everybody else' screen.

I'm a noob at H2 mp and my rank shows it. And I was extremely good at H1. I think it all balances out no matter what.

I personally hate the idea of releasing this multiplayer beta, but thats just me. Keep it all under wraps until its done.

I agree somewhat I have waited this long and I actually have a choice but it will be hard as hell to avoid the talks and this site alone on discussions about the beta so when I return(which by the way folks 2 more weeks and I will be back home) I was interested in Crackdown anyway and I didn't expect to find out every copy will have a beta code to it.

I loved the 1st Halo and I love Halo 2(both single player and multi) as far as cheaters go that is what a friends list is for and honestly as many friends that I have on 2 this was not an issue. It is no different then the cheaters with steroids for baseball it is going to happen and it is just a fact of life so when you see a cheater or a team you are playing with cheating then move on. Even with all the talk about cheaters online it obviously has not stop the momentum of H2 online play for the last couple of years.


I am suprised from a few responses on here that alot have never played or finished the single player campaign. That is new to me. Do any of you plan to play it or finish it?

H1 multiplayer sucked because you had have 2 or more XBOX's, along with 2 or more tv's in order to get bigger games with everybody having their own separate screens.


I was deployed for 8 months in Al udied, Qatar and I can't agree about it sucking simply because you had to hook up more displays to play multi. The whole base was playing H1 multi before online was available. Would you have rather they stuck with 4 players only on 1 screen?

I am suprised from a few responses on here that alot have never played or finished the single player campaign. That is new to me. Do any of you plan to play it or finish it?
I sold it with my XBox over a year ago. It had sat unplayed for so long and I had no intention of getting a 360. But now that I have one I'm not really interested in going back to it.

Has anyone here read the novels?

I have read the first novel and am about half - way through The Flood. My plan is to have all four read by the time H3 comes out. I have been enjoying the storyline quite a bit as well.

I've read them all. It's been a couple of years since I read Fall of Reach, The Flood, and First Strike, but I just read Ghosts of Onyx about 2 months ago.

I personally hate the idea of releasing this multiplayer beta, but thats just me. Keep it all under wraps until its done.

I agree. It seems like a pretty big Beta test as well.

The original article from which the "screwed up" quote came from is an interesting read into the workings of Bungie and its culture. For me, having some context behind the quote takes some of the sting out of it and makes me hopeful for Halo 3.

http://www.edge-online.co.uk/archives/2007/01/inside_bungie.php

I'm not sure if everyone at Microsoft will agree with Chris Butcher's quote below, but I think its sums up Bungie in a nutshell:

"Even through the Microsoft acquisition, Bungie’s purpose is not to make money for Microsoft and support the platform. Bungie’s purpose is to make great stuff."

Read between the lines. MS stepped in and ruined halo2 by telling them WE WANT IT DONE NOW. It was their cash cow. This announcement is also a great way of creating hype about their new game and making people think halo 3 will be awesome. I'm not falling for this again.

They promised so much more for halo2 and did not deliver. Everyone knew it was a time constraint, and MS was probably the cause, all this did was confirm it. The single player wasn't horrible, but seemed liked a rushed product. And all of you praising the MP have obviously never played many MP games over the years on other platforms....cough PC. I was shocked when playing the campaign and only the first few levels were on earth. after watching countless video's, and seeing screens showing more game action on earth, they obviously cut out a lot. And what did they fill it with?.....the FLOOD. They better not have the flood again, or at least stop using them as a filler to make levels longer.

The music was too loud and you couldn't do a thing about it, it also cut in at all the wrong times often drowning out others speaking so you couldn't hear things. The guns were WAY WAY WAY too large and blocked a large chunk of your viewable area. The AI was crap, the campaign was way too short for a game of this caliber. Yup, I'd say they botched it, not completely as there was still a decent game under it all, just not the game it could have been. As for what it has sold, it's called hype. Just like the iPod. Fact is there are more stun people in this world then smart, and they'll buy anything.

Co-op was still pretty good which is the only thing going for it for me. I tried MP but it was nothing more then yet another rehashed mutliplayer experience that I've seen done a million times over on other platforms. I don't get peoples obsession of wanting to play deathmatch over and over....hmmmm, run....shoot, die......run....shoot ....die...repeat. Sure, with a few buddies it's fun for a few hours, then you move on. but to play hundreds of hours or more doing it? Not me, sorry. So if h3 has no good single player, I'll rent it to experience it, then move on.

But, I'm a veteran gamer. Halo2 was great for those that haven't seen many MP games, or many FPS's. And this is something it did well, it introduced the genre in such a fashion that anyone could play so it grabbed a lot of new gamers.

Read between the lines. MS stepped in and ruined halo2 by telling them WE WANT IT DONE NOW. It was their cash cow. This announcement is also a great way of creating hype about their new game and making people think halo 3 will be awesome. I'm not falling for this again.
Halo 1: November 15, 2001
Halo 2: November 9, 2004

~3 year development time not enough?

I do agree with the 2nd part though. It's just to create more buzz, glad people are realizing that.

The weirdest thing to me is it seems none of you guys started complaining until Bungie complained it rushed the title. I guess people were complaining too when they bought 8 million copies.


I might as well hope on the bandwagon too since thats the latest fad..

I hate Halo2 more than Halo1 because colours on the box looked the same. I mean this is version two.. they could have put more colours in the photograph on the cover of the gamebox!

It's not that I didn't like the ending to Halo 2, it's that the ending occured my first day of owning it, I only got about 8 hours of gameplay from it. Multiplayer, on the other hand, was and is fun enough, who needs a storyline?

If I had been in charge, Halo 2 would've been a launch title for Xbox 360.

I guess I am one of the few who doesn't care about the single player mode... It was all multiplayer for 10+ month for 8hours a day (college....) I can't wait to get Halo 3, but for me it better be next gen! All the video I have seen so far, the graphics are just whatever and don't look next gen. I hope they prove me wrong... I just wish I was still in college and could play all day and all night with my roomates on 4 tvs, 4 360's and 2 highspeed lines coming into the house again.... ahh those were the days!

The ending wasn't that good, and the story wasn't that good but I still enjoyed it. As for the multiplayer---once I finished the campaign I played nothing but Halo 3 for about 5 months. Could they have done a better job? Sure, was it a bad game? Not by any stretch IMO. I think what they are trying to do is reach out to people who were disgruntled by Halo 2 and bring them back into the idea of purchasing Halo 3.

You guys have some pretty seriously low expectations of what an online gaming experience should be then. When I played online all I ever got was super-fast paced mindless "killed as soon as you spawn" deathmatch. The maps all felt like I was playing in a closet.

Are there bigger maps out for this game?

Just give me Halo:CE with 720p and live and I'll gladly shell out $60. Halo:CE on xbox-connect rocked back in the days.

Just give me Halo:CE with 720p and live and I'll gladly shell out $60. Halo:CE on xbox-connect rocked back in the days.

Now there's a man who knows great gamplay !! I agree, just make some new maps and leave everything else the same.

oh yeah, and new maps and maybe some live co-op or even better some 4 way live play through some missions. :)

Or even the ability to have a map editor/level creator (there were some pretty cool modded maps on Halo:CE)

let me just say

4 way co-op through the campaign via Live and splitscreen.

That would be something NEW.

new for the Halo series, but it has been done before (Bruteforce). It actually worked extremely well in BF, you could enter and exit the game at will without interupting anything.

You guys have some pretty seriously low expectations of what an online gaming experience should be then.Nope.

When I played online all I ever got was super-fast paced mindless "killed as soon as you spawn" deathmatch. The maps all felt like I was playing in a closet.You've owned an Xbox (and/or 360) for how long, now, and you don't know about Blood Gulch? :)

The people here that are comparing Halo against PC games isnt a fair comparison IMO. Both Halo games to me were GOOD CONSOLE GAMES.

I like medium to small rooms because the games move quickly unlike big boards where it takes forvever to end the darn game and is a snipers paradise. I like going face to face with my opponent and gunning them down.....what a RUSH!!

I say stick with what you like!

I hate all the big levels in Halo.... just can't stand them, but that is because my style of play does not match well. Lockout, Hangem High... Battle Creek... love the small levels :)

Halo 2 was such a horrible game. It was so bad that it burned in the HUD into my CRT HDTV.

Can't believe the game forced me to play hours on hours with my AVS/BetrayThis friends for months straight. :rolleyes:

The weirdest thing to me is it seems none of you guys started complaining until Bungie complained it rushed the title. I guess people were complaining too when they bought 8 million copies.


I might as well hope on the bandwagon too since thats the latest fad..

I hate Halo2 more than Halo1 because colours on the box looked the same. I mean this is version two.. they could have put more colours in the photograph on the cover of the gamebox!

That's not true these things were brought up early on by a lot of players.

The guns were WAY WAY WAY too large and blocked a large chunk of your viewable area.

Agreed.

Can't believe the game forced me to play hours on hours with my AVS/BetrayThis friends for months straight.
Certainly a waste of anyone's time.

I also hated all the text on screen when doing 4 way split.. There really needs to be options for these things in many games (like GRAW as well).

I was deployed for 8 months in Al udied, Qatar and I can't agree about it sucking simply because you had to hook up more displays to play multi. The whole base was playing H1 multi before online was available. Would you have rather they stuck with 4 players only on 1 screen?

Sounds like a pretty cushy place if the whole base was able to reliably play MP H1. The first time I went to Iraq, bringing an XBOX with you meant a certain horrible death for that XBOX.

But I was comparing H1's MP to H2's MP. If you compare H1's MP to an H2 MP that didn't exist of course H1 will be better. We could simply end the debate to see how many current people play H1 MP to H2 MP but you can't know that because most can't play H1 online so they don't ever get to really play H1 MP.

Certainly a waste of anyone's time.

Good old grudges.. :rolleyes:




Bungie's response to the recent internet wildfire caused by the Edge article. Pretty decent read:
http://www.1up.com/do/newsStory?cId=3156739

"It's funny to read our team's own criticisms of Halo 2," O'Connor said. "I wonder what folks would have thought if we'd come out and said 'Halo 2 was a shimmering work of perfection that could not possibly improved in any way, shape or form.'"

Halo 1 was not perfect. Halo 2 was not it either. But that doesn't mean I and millions of other people cannot enjoy the game as is.

Good old grudges.. :rolleyes:


Not so much of a grudge as still being hurt by it.

Understood Doc...

Sounds like a pretty cushy place if the whole base was able to reliably play MP H1. The first time I went to Iraq, bringing an XBOX with you meant a certain horrible death for that XBOX.

But I was comparing H1's MP to H2's MP. If you compare H1's MP to an H2 MP that didn't exist of course H1 will be better. We could simply end the debate to see how many current people play H1 MP to H2 MP but you can't know that because most can't play H1 online so they don't ever get to really play H1 MP.


As you can see I am currently deployed in Iraq. My statement was at a time I was deployed in Al udied in 2001 before the start of the war. To have that many people interested in Halo at the time in the desert with people deployed all over the world must say a lot about the popularity of a game. I can agree about the Xbox in the desert as many of us went through alot of Xbox's because of mainly plugging them into 220 :D. The BX always had them out of stock when new shipments came. It isn't that the base was cushy it just happen to be everyons interest when they were off work on there own free time. Xbox live started in November of 2002 and of course Halo was never a live game. Actually living on a base is no different then living off base it is just more secure is all. Having multi system matches was no different then being at some ones house off base. I worked at Best Buy and every friday there was a Halo party after work lasting until 10 am the next morning. I am not going to take away the amount of popularity that had people hauling televisions from others homes and from down stairs and running a bunch of Cat 5 cable all over the house. Those were fun times

P.S. I have had my launch 360 here with me in Iraq and know how the stories are about these crashing mine plays just fine still.

You're in Iraq right now ? Wow. Thanks for your service.
That's nice you have a game system of yours there to blow off steam.

H1's MP was very popular because it had no competition. Try that now with the option to play H2 online in the comfort of your own home versus hauling your tv and XBOX with you to play H1 MP and there's a pretty good chance that most will opt for H2. I currently have a 360 and a XBOX each with their own HD set in different rooms and even contemplated having a separate live account just in case somebody wanted to play some MP. Too many variables involved in timing and getting people together just to make it work.

P.S. I was at LSA Anaconda/Balad 18 months ago and it's fairly built up. Hard buildings, air conditioning, most major pockets of dust covered in rocks so I imagine that as long as you could transport the 360 there without damaging it, it would play just fine.

Halo 1 was made in one year. Halo 2 was made in three. Real rushed.
Can't believe the game forced me to play hours on hours with my AVS/BetrayThis friends for months straight. :rolleyes:
Think about it. It was more like, literally, years.

Halo 1 was made in one year.Was not. (http://www.bungie.net/News/TopStory.aspx?story=prexboxhistory040904)

H1's MP was very popular because it had no competition.


Ok you obviously didn't play much.

XBC?
National Tournaments all the time?
No competition? Riiight.

Ok you obviously didn't play much.

XBC?
National Tournaments all the time?
No competition? Riiight.
I don't think that's what he meant.

Ok you obviously didn't play much.

XBC?
National Tournaments all the time?
No competition? Riiight.

Umm, I think he meant that Halo wasn't competing with many other similar games.

Thanks for helping clarify JD23 and assasyn.

Was not. (http://www.bungie.net/News/TopStory.aspx?story=prexboxhistory040904)
I'm sure he isn't talking about the entire time from conception to software. More like conversion to Xbox.

I don't buy into this "rushed game" theory either. The Xbox was a well know platform for Bungie already, and they had all the assets of Halo CE. Though I can see the employees complaining for experiencing stress due to uneven workload, lack of direction and mad rush toward the end of the 3rd year.

And this brings me to my point: I think that the Halo 2 project was simply poorly managed.
(I am talking about the single payer/co-op campaign here. Some of us still want a captivating story AND great gameplay along with it...)

They wanted a BIG CINEMATIC EXPERIENCE of a big budget movie, but they didn't include some basic elements that make videogames (and Halo CE) work. MS forced itself more into the picture causing (or letting) certain Bungie people to leave. As the franchise became big business, probably people with the biggest ambitions made the strategic decisions, not the ones with the greatest talent.

And that is why I think Halo 3 will be just a good game, not a great one. It will smell like a lotsa money, but it will be just as soulless as Halo 2.

Will we fall for it still? Yes, the vast majority of us will - again. Good games still deserve to be played...

At this point, I'd settle for H1 in non-upconverted HD or even H2. Just hopefully not something worse.

Was not. (http://www.bungie.net/News/TopStory.aspx?story=prexboxhistory040904)
I'm sure he isn't talking about the entire time from conception to software. More like conversion to Xbox.
It was, sorry if you didn't know that. When Microsoft bought Bungie, they scrapped all the PC versions and built the Xbox version from the ground up in just about one year. They didn't even reuse any assets from the earlier versions except for maybe some textures. All the coding for Halo: Combat Evolved was done in 12 months.

I guess most people should go to a movie. If your looking for an epic story maybe rent Ben Hur. I want blow them up, talk smack to the guy as you kill him and teabag him. That what Halo 2 is great for. The cheating sucks, but anytime cheating can be done it will be done. I live with it. I think the blacklisting will be great. No more playing with guys who de-level. I cannot wait to play the beta Halo 3. If it has better graphics and no cheating with new maps I will be happy. I for one game on a game console. My computer is for the internet. Maybe some of these guys should get back to W.O.W and quit playing Halo. Anybody who want to just play hit me up
Gamertag : tedmales

You're in Iraq right now ? Wow. Thanks for your service.
That's nice you have a game system of yours there to blow off steam.


I have been here since October I am going to be home in the middle of February. Thanks for the support.

H1's MP was very popular because it had no competition. Try that now with the option to play H2 online in the comfort of your own home versus hauling your tv and XBOX with you to play H1 MP and there's a pretty good chance that most will opt for H2. I currently have a 360 and a XBOX each with their own HD set in different rooms and even contemplated having a separate live account just in case somebody wanted to play some MP. Too many variables involved in timing and getting people together just to make it work.

P.S. I was at LSA Anaconda/Balad 18 months ago and it's fairly built up. Hard buildings, air conditioning, most major pockets of dust covered in rocks so I imagine that as long as you could transport the 360 there without damaging it, it would play just fine.


We are in pods righ now. Army they are in pods and Tents. I am Airforce so only E-5 and up can live in the pods and Airman live in the dorms basically E-4 and below. The gyms are nice here but the worst part of it all is the rain and mud.

I guess most people should go to a movie. If your looking for an epic story maybe rent Ben Hur. I want blow them up, talk smack to the guy as you kill him and teabag him. That what Halo 2 is great for. The cheating sucks, but anytime cheating can be done it will be done. I live with it. I think the blacklisting will be great. No more playing with guys who de-level. I cannot wait to play the beta Halo 3. If it has better graphics and no cheating with new maps I will be happy. I for one game on a game console. My computer is for the internet. Maybe some of these guys should get back to W.O.W and quit playing Halo. Anybody who want to just play hit me up
Gamertag : tedmales


But that is the good part about the Beta version. I believe the other reason is to avoid as little bugs, cheats as possible this being the whole point of it being a beta. They are giving us an opportunity to play the game and hope we do find bugs and cheats that they can fix before it is released. So hopefully people will see this as a chance to fix problems that don't have to exist later for the retail version.

It was, sorry if you didn't know that. When Microsoft bought Bungie, they scrapped all the PC versions and built the Xbox version from the ground up in just about one year. They didn't even reuse any assets from the earlier versions except for maybe some textures. All the coding for Halo: Combat Evolved was done in 12 months.Dude, designing a game is far more than just making the models and doing the coding. Concept art, design, gameplay, story, and so on are key, and much of that was in place well before Halo was a glimmer in MS' eye.

The evolution of the game is right there on the link I provided. Regardless of whether they whipped Halo: CE to the Xbox in 12 months, they only did so after getting a lot of the leg work out of the way.

I guess most people should go to a movie. If your looking for an epic story maybe rent Ben Hur. I want blow them up, talk smack to the guy as you kill him and teabag him. That what Halo 2 is great for. The cheating sucks, but anytime cheating can be done it will be done. I live with it. I think the blacklisting will be great. No more playing with guys who de-level. I cannot wait to play the beta Halo 3. If it has better graphics and no cheating with new maps I will be happy. I for one game on a game console. My computer is for the internet. Maybe some of these guys should get back to W.O.W and quit playing Halo. Anybody who want to just play hit me up
Gamertag : tedmales


If you honestly think they can make a game as complex as H3 MP without the ability to cheat, you're probably going to be disappointed. There are people out there who will spen day and night trying to exploit any hole they can find in the game. I mean, look at the superbouncing. How could anybody have figured that one out?

We are in pods righ now. Army they are in pods and Tents. I am Airforce so only E-5 and up can live in the pods and Airman live in the dorms basically E-4 and below. The gyms are nice here but the worst part of it all is the rain and mud.

The unit we keep out there are electrical/mechanical engineers. So we were able to commandeer a building and wire it up completly like a normal building. Our own showers, laundry, internet and all that other stuff. The pool is even nicer in the summer time. The movie theatre isn't too bad. Just have to deal with hearing incoming mortar attacks sometimes.

I hate all the big levels in Halo.... just can't stand them, but that is because my style of play does not match well. Lockout, Hangem High... Battle Creek... love the small levels :)
I didn't like the larger levels because of the RIDCULOUS sniping. In fact I hate sniping in most games where you are half way across the map and ZING, someone takes your head off & you have no idea where it came from.
I guess I am more into teh close quarters play style. In rainbow six there is sniping but it doesn't happen nearly as often as in H2.

The weirdest thing to me is it seems none of you guys started complaining until Bungie complained it rushed the title. I guess people were complaining too when they bought 8 million copies.

a whole website was created to its sucking days after it was released.

Well, I'm playing Halo 2 again today in hopes of winning access to the Halo 3 beta, and I must say... I am not having the least bit of fun.

The action is chaotic and feels pointless (as opposed to the tightly focused tension of Gears), the lag is horrible, there are failures to load the maps on a regular basis, and the players seem to be scraping the bottom of the barrel in terms of maturity.

Playing Halo 2 again makes me seriously question whether I'll enjoy Halo 3 at all, and finishing the required 3 hours of playing to get into the beta is going to be an unexpected chore.