Very nice!!! I didn't realize that there were so many grey colored theaters out there!

Here is a couple of shots from my new room:

http://www.seriouspc.com/cliff/T3.jpg

http://www.seriouspc.com/cliff/T9.jpg

Looks like you have some pretty serious audio horsepower going on in there.

If you end up keeping the setup, are you going to ceiling mount the beasts?

Cliffy

Looking good guys, the screen is almost as wide as the room :eek:

I have a couple suggestions, if you haven't thought of this already. Since the SmX screen is audio transparent and you have it directly in front of the walls it will most likey reflect light off the grey walls back through the screen and blur/washout the projected image in those sections (especially on bright scenes).
You may even get doubling of projected text and bright objects on dark backgrounds.

Even flat black paint reflects light and flat grey paint will reflect even more. You guys are working hard to achieve the best projected image so I suggest the following. Go to a fabric store and pick up some black velvet, duvetyne or felt to cover the grey walls that are directly behind the SmX. You can either use 3m spray adhesive (the 90 series) to apply it to the walls or black tacks that get tacked behind the frame parts.

Also, cover that white box and wood above the screen with black velvet so it doesn't distract the audience.

It's amazing to see the amount of work you guys do to put on a kick ass show.

Ruben

Looking good guys, the screen is almost as wide as the room :eek:

I have a couple suggestions, if you haven't thought of this already. Since the SmX screen is audio transparent and you have it directly in front of the walls it will most likey reflect light off the grey walls back through the screen and blur/washout the projected image in those sections (especially on bright screens).

Even flat black paint reflects light and flat grey paint will reflect even more. You guys are working hard to achieve the best projected image so I suggest the following. Go to a fabric store and pick up some black velvet, duvetyne or felt to cover the grey walls that are directly behind the SmX. You can either use 3m spray adhesive (the 90 series) to apply it to the walls or black tacks that get tacked behind the frame parts.

Also, cover that white box and wood above the screen with black velvet so it doesn't distract the audience.

It's amazing to see the amount of work you guys do to put on a kick ass show.

Ruben

Lovin' that new frame of yours big dog. Any plans in the works for motorized masking?

Cliff

Lovin' that new frame of yours big dog. Any plans in the works for motorized masking?

Cliff

Thanks Cliff, we are working on it now, its gonna be slick and it seamlessly adapts to this new frame. William is the offical first owner of the SmX Pro-Line frame and he may be the official first owner of the SmX adaptable masking system as well. ;)

Ruben

Yesterday some serious progress was made. The SmX screen was completed. A custom "L" shaped wooden bracket was designed (by Bill Belcher and myself), constructed, and installed. Finally, the 12' wide 2.35:1 SmX screen was hung for the first time. Mike Parker proclaimed it the nicest screen he has ever seen. We all are particularly impressed with the "blacker than black" velvet material that covers the screen frame. This stuff actually absorbs incident light, making the projected image look like it is floating in the air. Major kudos to Ruben and the SmX gang. Mike can't wait to see how the SmX material performs in the blend. Bill took some before, during and after pictures, which he has already added to the thread, above.

In addition, Mike and John almost completely rebuilt both 9500LC Extremes. Both projectors would have been completed, except for the tiny fact that the new Red, Green and Blue CRTs I purchased in January ended up being 2 Green CRTs and 1 Blue CRT. All 3 new CRTs were in fact installed. Mike and John went home to get (among other things) a new Red CRT. The glycol in the one remaining Red CRT was replaced, and a new Red C Element was installed.

Today Mike and John will install the new Red CRT with another new Red C Element in the second 9500LC Extreme, and both projectors will be installed on the ceiling, after some preliminary on-the-floor assimilation.

Hehehe

In looking at the throw distance and aspect for each of two M9500s on a 2.35 dedicated screen here, with a ten percent overlap we find that the screen of 144" (twelve foot width) wants two "halves" projected, each half of 61" x 80" (80" being 55% of 144") so if that isn't Max Phosphor Usage, then tell me whut is.........! :D Many thanks to Mike Parker and his team of helpers for their tireless efforts in pulling this flagship event together!!!!!

Man I like that screen material... can't wait to finish this up..:)

Thanks Cliff, we are working on it now, its gonna be slick and it seamlessly adapts to this new frame. William is the offical first owner of the SmX Pro-Line frame and he may be the official first owner of the SmX adaptable masking system as well. ;)

Ruben

Ruben,

I have nothing but pure respect for your hard work and it shows every time I turn on the G90's.

Thank you for such a kick ass setup.

Stewart doesn't hold a candle to your material.

Cliff

Man I like that screen material... can't wait to finish this up..:)

Looking foward to having a couple of important conversations with you when I fly out this week Mike.

I have a couple of small things on my mind that I want to convey.

Looking foward to checking your mods fo sho. I have some flaws in my setup that are not projector related that I really would like to straighten out.

Cliffy

Yesterday some serious progress was made. The SmX screen was completed. A custom "L" shaped wooden bracket was designed (by Bill Belcher and myself), constructed, and installed. Finally, the 12' wide 2.35:1 SmX screen was hung for the first time. Mike Parker proclaimed it the nicest screen he has ever seen. We all are particularly impressed with the "blacker than black" velvet material that covers the screen frame. This stuff actually absorbs incident light, making the projected image look like it is floating in the air. Major kudos to Ruben and the SmX gang. Mike can't wait to see how the SmX material performs in the blend. Bill took some before, during and after pictures, which he has already added to the thread, above.

In addition, Mike and John almost completely rebuilt both 9500LC Extremes. Both projectors would have been completed, except for the tiny fact that the new Red, Green and Blue CRTs I purchased in January ended up being 2 Green CRTs and 1 Blue CRT. All 3 new CRTs were in fact installed. Mike and John went home to get (among other things) a new Red CRT. The glycol in the one remaining Red CRT was replaced, and a new Red C Element was installed.

Today Mike and John will install the new Red CRT with another new Red C Element in the second 9500LC Extreme, and both projectors will be installed on the ceiling, after some preliminary on-the-floor assimilation.

Big dog, did you get the black backing with the screen? Are you going to pull down your current screen to make sure the audio kicks arse? It looks like you have some serious horsepower on the amp side so I want to be impressed!!!!

MIKE, GET YOUR ASS TO WORK!!!!!! :D ;)

Cliffy

Wow ! Everything Looks excellent! That screen is HUGE!

Cant wait ! Still got to go through 5 days !

Ruben, others,
Has anyone thought about this?

Even if one does NOT plan to use speakers behind the screen, how about still using a AT screen and putting some serious acoustic tiles behind the screen ?

Think about it... A projection screen may be the single most reflective wall of a HT. Taming it may improve audio performance, right?



Looking good guys, the screen is almost as wide as the room :eek:

I have a couple suggestions, if you haven't thought of this already. Since the SmX screen is audio transparent and you have it directly in front of the walls it will most likey reflect light off the grey walls back through the screen and blur/washout the projected image in those sections (especially on bright scenes).
You may even get doubling of projected text and bright objects on dark backgrounds.

Even flat black paint reflects light and flat grey paint will reflect even more. You guys are working hard to achieve the best projected image so I suggest the following. Go to a fabric store and pick up some black velvet, duvetyne or felt to cover the grey walls that are directly behind the SmX. You can either use 3m spray adhesive (the 90 series) to apply it to the walls or black tacks that get tacked behind the frame parts.

Also, cover that white box and wood above the screen with black velvet so it doesn't distract the audience.

It's amazing to see the amount of work you guys do to put on a kick ass show.

Ruben

With a nonperfed fixed screen with motorized masking such as a Stewart, there is room behind the screen material to install absorptive material. The screen will reflect frequencies above 300 cycles but will pass htose below 300. However a few inches of absorptive material behind the screen will do little below 300 perhaps taming the 200 to 300 band. Making a screen transparent (5%) seems not worth it since most high frequencies would still bounce off it if coming from the front (not worth it given the cost in video gain). The fix is to prevent high frequencies from hitting the screen by treating the other walls in the room properly.

Ruben, others,
Has anyone thought about this?

Even if one does NOT plan to use speakers behind the screen, how about still using a AT screen and putting some serious acoustic tiles behind the screen ?

Think about it... A projection screen may be the single most reflective wall of a HT. Taming it may improve audio performance, right?

This is something that is brought up allot and is very true. A large solid screen is a large reflective wall for audio to bounce off. Most people that do an audio transparent screen usually treat the wall behind it for audio reflections.

The only way to do a dedicated theater IMO is by using an audio transparent screen. Movies are mixed with the dialogue intended to come from the screen, not above or below it.

People are mostly worried about degrading picure and audio quality when considering an audio transparent screen. Most audio transparent screens such as perforated/microperforated and negative gain weaved screens will degrade picture quality and that is what most people base their opinions on. This use to be my opinion as well, that's why I did the research I did to find a superior solution.

The SmX material also provides a perceived sharper image which helps out the softer projectors.

Ruben

The SmX material also provides a perceived sharper image which helps out the softer projectors.

Ruben

Yeah, and for that reason, I'll deal with a compromise in sound for a better image. Mainly since I'm not so concerned with higher frequencies in movies anyway.

I've seen similar screens before, but have never liked them. They always looked dull and flat. However, the screen surface of what I'm working with on this project, is something completely different. It's so different, the screen itself is good to look at.

Yeah, and for that reason, I'll deal with a compromise in sound for a better image. Mainly since I'm not so concerned with higher frequencies in movies anyway.

I've seen similar screens before, but have never liked them. They always looked dull and flat. However, the screen surface of what I'm working with on this project, is something completely different. It's so different, the screen itself is good to look at.

Hi Mike,

Your words hold a lot of weight, it is great to hear this from someone of your caliber that works on providing the best image anyone has ever seen. I'm just overwhelmed knowing that the top dogs in the CRT world are using this screen for such critical events.


Ruben

I also have to say I am very impressed with this screen. Working with Mike on this project we both went WOW when we walk into the room and saw the screen. It is the brightest white screen I've seen that does not have a reflective sheen to it!
It was easy to do, and see what we were focusing on the screen and it was sharp, no hazy or fuzzy edges on test patterns or images!

This screen deserves serious consideration if you are planning a HT or new screen!

Looks like Galen and I will be there.

Terry

Ruben. We love ya but your posts are sounding like advertising! End users OK, but not by the manufacturer.

That said. If one doesn't have the space for behind the screen speakers, would you recommend using a woven screen given the gain trade off? Do you believe, the screen should be mounted slightly off the wall, in such as case, so that sound absorptive material can be placed behind it to suck up whatever may make it through the unneeded weave?

Serious questions.

Mark,

I have to disagree with your perceptions of Ruben's posts. It appears he is making direct answers to questions posed to him. I hope he continues to be involved in this ongoing "conversation", especially as it relates to this meet. If you have questions as to the appropriateness of his posts please take them to a moderator off line.

The screen is about 6 to 8 inches from the speakers. William's other screen came down within a couple of inches. I think William plans to make sure the mounting boards are all painted to match the rest of his room.

William,
I was thinking that for the meet you may try some speaker/grill cloth that I have to "line" the back of the screen. Maybe thumb tack it to the back of the board the screen is mounted on. I think I probably have only enough to cover about half of that monster screen! I'll pull it out and see what I have.

Ruben. We love ya but your posts are sounding like advertising! End users OK, but not by the manufacturer.

That said. If one doesn't have the space for behind the screen speakers, would you recommend using a woven screen given the gain trade off? Do you believe, the screen should be mounted slightly off the wall, in such as case, so that sound absorptive material can be placed behind it to suck up whatever may make it through the unneeded weave?

Serious questions.

Yes you are right, I was starting to sound like a banner :eek:. I had to fix that last post.

To be honest, it depends on what soild screen I was using. If I needed a high gain screen then I would go for whatever solid screen makes sense for my situation. High frequency does pass through this material with a slight rolloff up high with inaudible combfiltering. So that tells us that more sound is passing through the screen than bouncing off of it.

So would treating the wall behind the AT screen benefit a person not using speakers behind it audiowise? Yes, it would be better than a solid screen wall as far as audio reflections go. Is it worth the trade off? That depends on the user and the amount of gain they need to achieve the FL they are looking for and what they want for audio in their room.

For the CRT guys, I imagine they are usually looking for high gain screens so any weaved AT screen is not going to compare to a high gain solid screen as far as brightness goes.

Everything has it's trade-offs, high gain screens hot spot, have sparklies, narrow viewing cones. Matte screens are not bright enough for everyone. Most weave screens have negative gains, and perforated/micro perforated screens moiré and combfilter. Everyone just needs to find a happy medium.

Ruben

I was thinking that for the meet you may try some speaker/grill cloth that I have to "line" the back of the screen. Maybe thumb tack it to the back of the board the screen is mounted on. I think I probably have only enough to cover about half of that monster screen! I'll pull it out and see what I have.I think I might have enough (black speaker grill fabric from PartsExpress.com) for the other half

Looking good there guys... Andres and I have just got the blend up... geez that spaniard swore a lot when he saw it... we are running 72Hz! and..... 15ft wide! :eek: This thing is enormous, and super bright too! Pics to come very soon.

Dear Ruben;

I have implemented both of your suggestions. I have painted the custom woodwork near the top of the new screen. The paint is the same flat grey used throughout the rest of the Home Theater. I have also purchased and attached some black velvet to the wall behind the new screen. You will be able to see the result of your "cover the new woodwork" suggestion the next time we take a picture of the SmX screen. The pros will have to attest as to the qualtiy of implementation of your black backing suggestion once we have blended images to view.

Please keep providing suggestions for improvement. They are highly valued.

William

Sounds like it's going to be a great crowd!

I already gave away my Ampro Light Valves at this event, but if anyone is bringing a truck and wants a free jumbo Barco retro (will trade for a 6-pack ;) ), LMK.

I also have a nice BG1208/2 with very nice tubes that I should list in the For Sale forum in case any one is driving this way... I'm too lazy to build a crate. And I should clear out my equipment closet, tubes, lenses, sources, switchers, speakers, Coke machine, Pepsi machine :eek:... maybe we should have a swap meet in the back yard.

This is EXACTLY what I have on my mind for my own situation.
I dont have space for speakers behind the screen, but I want a tilted screen to save on keystone adjustment.

Then I could put some acoustically absorbent material behind it.

With a AT screen I may kill two birds with one stone!



That said. If one doesn't have the space for behind the screen speakers, would you recommend using a woven screen given the gain trade off? Do you believe, the screen should be mounted slightly off the wall, in such as case, so that sound absorptive material can be placed behind it to suck up whatever may make it through the unneeded weave?

Serious questions.

Looking good there guys... Andres and I have just got the blend up... geez that spaniard swore a lot when he saw it... we are running 72Hz! and..... 15ft wide! :eek: This thing is enormous, and super bright too! Pics to come very soon.

Hehehe

What is the Spanish word for MOUAHAHAHAHA?

BTW, If anyone need a perfect new tube G90 up there and wants to save on shipping, I've got one I'll bring along......
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=841094

Terry

Tim. I think its typussirario :)

It’s almost time. Weather is supposed to be great; High Saturday and Sunday 70 (and sunny), Low Saturday and Sunday 46!!

Now, lets talk BEER and food!

First off - We will have a ½ keg of Michelob and some of the smoothest Margaritas this side of Mexico. And Clarence has a great idea; whoever is able; bring a six-pack of your favorite Mexican (in honor of Cinco de Mayo) or micro-brew beer.

Second – Food:

There will be BBQ beef brisket and pork provided and beef jerky for in-between beers.

William has some other items, I’m not sure what.

Emdawqz1 - (John) (with Beef Chili, hot wings, mild wings, etc.) YEA!!! (BTW- your chili; does it have beans?!?!)

Rajdude – (Rajiv) You said: “By the way, my wife is a good cook, anybody likes Indian food?” Heck yea! Bring whatever you can/like!

Audiophil - (with food (?)) Bring it on!

Anyone else cares to chip in on the eats, post back and let us know.

wallace

It’s almost time. Weather is supposed to be great; High Saturday and Sunday 70 (and sunny), Low Saturday and Sunday 46!!

Now, lets talk BEER and food!

First off - We will have a ½ keg of Michelob and some of the smoothest Margaritas this side of Mexico. And Clarence has a great idea; whoever is able; bring a six-pack of your favorite Mexican (in honor of Cinco de Mayo) or micro-brew beer.

Second – Food:

There will be BBQ beef brisket and pork provided and beef jerky for in-between beers.

William has some other items, I’m not sure what.

Emdawqz1 - (John) (with Beef Chili, hot wings, mild wings, etc.) YEA!!! (BTW- your chili; does it have beans?!?!)

Rajdude – (Rajiv) You said: “By the way, my wife is a good cook, anybody likes Indian food?” Heck yea! Bring whatever you can/like!

Audiophil - (with food (?)) Bring it on!

Anyone else cares to chip in on the eats, post back and let us know.

wallace

Wallace,

Really looking foward to the trip this weekend. This week is going to be an absolutely awesome week for me. Thursday, Gino and Jessica, Arli and his wife, my family and I hang out for some stackin' lovin and my place. Then Friday, I fly out to your neck of the woods to hang with Clarence. Saturday, I have the priviledge of meeting you, and hanging out with some of the elite from AVS!

Oh yeah, I get some ZILLA LOVIN' AS WELL! :D ;) :D ;)

Couldn't ask for more. :D

Cliff

Make sure you have some water/soda for me on Sunday...I'm not 21 yet :D. Don't worry though...I will be accompanied by my dad :p.

Make sure you have some water/soda for me on Sunday...I'm not 21 yet :D. Don't worry though...I will be accompanied by my dad :p.

You got it! Whatever flavor you want, just let me know.

We plan on having water, Gatoraid, basic soda and stuff.

wallace

A good idea of the rough rack from the last meet from the G90's:

Bomrat, one of my BEST friends hangin with me through this with a SMILE on his face:

http://crtforum.com/img/arli-ryan-cliff.jpg

Pretty little Pearl sitting in the middle wishing she could hang with the big boys. :)

One of my favorite pics thanks to Art:

http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p146/CarlosMeat/DSC01986.jpg

A nice close up thanks to Clarence of the SMX material:

http://crtforum.com/img/cliff08.jpg

I'd most definitely hit it multiple times:

http://crtforum.com/img/cliff03.jpg

Camera doesn't know what the hell to do with this kind of light output:

http://crtforum.com/img/cliff43.jpg

:eek: :eek: :eek: :eek:

Oh my God am I going to be in heaven this weekend. The master will lay his hands on the blended monsters and make once again forum history........

Cliffy


'

Worst case of the blend zone from the last meet:

http://crtforum.com/img/cliff22.jpg

Camera took so much detail, it didn't know what the hell to do with it:

http://crtforum.com/img/cliff33.jpg

Guys, this is going to be SO MUCH FUN!!!!! Can't wait for the weekend! :)

Mike,

Hope your hanging in big dog! Keep it all fresh for yourself as your much well deserved hard work has a HUGE reward. ;)

Cliffy

This week is going to be an absolutely awesome week for me.
Tell me about it mate, this past week i´ve been basking in the sun by the beach, beautiful latinas, awesome food. Setting up the biggest blend in history 15´!!!

Now off to yours tomorrow, then Art´s, then 2 days of more blending goodness :D :cool:

beautiful latinas. :cool:

For some reason, this is all I see when I read your post. :eek: ;)

Have a safe flight big dog!

We decided against going out for dinner because of time constraints, plus, my neighbor has been bitching about my subs so I told Arli to get you here ASAP after you get off of the plane. :p

Dinner for tomorrow night will consist of Beer, Makers Mark Whiskey, Wine, Mike's hard flavors, and PIZZA! Chicago Style!!! :D

Cliffy

We decided against going out for dinner because of time constraints, plus, my neighbor has been bitching about my subs so I told Arli to get you here ASAP after you get off of the plane. :p Cliffy


No joke man, you're blocking his driveway........

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/1/19/USS_Greeneville_%28SSN_772%29_in_Dry_Dock.jpg

Woodford Reserve, 20 year old Pappy Van, and if that is gone, 15 year old Pappy Van.

Time for a ststus update? Have the projectors been hung yet?

Time for a ststus update? Have the projectors been hung yet?

Easy killer. :)

This is the hardest part. I know from experience.

See you Saturday!

Cliffy

Dear Mark;

You need to bring some of that 20 year old stuff to the East Coast BlendZilla Meet so all of us can share in it.

William

You need to bring some of that 20 year old stuffIf he's really good, he'll scrounge up a bottle of the 23yo reserve

I know I have a full bottle of the 15 year old, its 107% proof., I purchased it in Lexington, KY three weeks ago. I'll look for a bottle of the 20 although its only 90.4% proof.. It sells for $100 a bottle. The 15 year is only $50. The 23 year old stuff is something like 95.6% proof. Pappy is on its 4th bottling of the stuff. The first three runs were sold out. A fourth run of 3000 bottles is planned for this Spring. I'll call them tomorrow but i doubt its available here so close to the Mason Dixon line. One HAS to add a splash to the 15 year old stuff. It's strong enough to hoist those two projectors to the ceiling.

Seriously. How's it going? My question was serious and not intended to be offensive. Hopefully you'll get them up tomorrow and Mike can finish it off Friday.

I'll be there Sunday. Can't come on Saturday unless around 8PM. Of course everyone will be so drunk by them I can come with a bottle of the cheap 10 year old and no one wil know the difference. Maybe I could even sneak in a bottle of their Rye. Will the party be a cigar free zone?

Will the party be a cigar free zone?If so, I plan on being one foot beyond that zone a couple of times ;)

I know I have a full bottle of the 15 year old, its 107% proof., I purchased it in Lexington, KY three weeks ago. I'll look for a bottle of the 20 although its only 90.4% proof.. It sells for $100 a bottle. The 15 year is only $50. The 23 year old stuff is something like 95.6% proof. Pappy is on its 4th bottling of the stuff. The first three runs were sold out. A fourth run of 3000 bottles is planned for this Spring. I'll call them tomorrow but i doubt its available here so close to the Mason Dixon line. One HAS to add a splash to the 15 year old stuff. It's strong enough to hoist those two projectors to the ceiling.

Seriously. How's it going? My question was serious and not intended to be offensive. Hopefully you'll get them up tomorrow and Mike can finish it off Friday.

I'll be there Sunday. Can't come on Saturday unless around 8PM. Of course everyone will be so drunk by them I can come with a bottle of the cheap 10 year old and no one wil know the difference. Maybe I could even sneak in a bottle of their Rye. Will the party be a cigar free zone?

Um, whilst I'll be drinking the "cheap" stuff throughout the weekend, I would absolutely love even the "10 year old" stuff. Could you bring some with big dog? :)

BTW, your question was not offensive at all. I just know at about this time the state I was in and it was not good, well, except for hanging with Clarence literally until the wee hours of the morning because that is the only time I had to "chill", hence, NO SLEEP. ;) :D

Kick it in High Gear MIKE!!!!!! Good luck and I cant wait!!!!!!! :cool:

Cliffy

No joke man, you're blocking his driveway........

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/1/19/USS_Greeneville_%28SSN_772%29_in_Dry_Dock.jpg

That damn thing needs to get circumcised. :cool:

I think maybe they could use the crane in the background. Digital guys usually get their wives to hang their projectors, rather simple, just some scotch tape or a little velcro. :)

We decided against going out for dinner because of time constraints, plus, my neighbor has been bitching about my subs so I told Arli to get you here ASAP after you get off of the plane. :p

Dinner for tomorrow night will consist of Beer, Makers Mark Whiskey, Wine, Mike's hard flavors, and PIZZA! Chicago Style!!! :D


Sounds good. You know we arrive at 2:20pm right? We´re currently in transit at madrid airport, waiting for our ten hour flight to o´hare. i´m on zero sleep, was up all night watching IMAX :p

Seriously. How's it going?

Fine!

Too much info. :)

Sounds good. You know we arrive at 2:20pm right? We´re currently in transit at madrid airport, waiting for our ten hour flight to o´hare. i´m on zero sleep, was up all night watching IMAX :p

We are looking foward to seeing you tomorrow. I probably won't be able to get the strippers we talked about ,they are working a boxing match in Kalamazoo on Friday sorry. :(

Art

We are looking foward to seeing you tomorrow. I probably won't be able to get the strippers we talked about ,they are working a boxing match in Kalamazoo on Friday sorry. :(

Art

SNAP!!!! I almost had to make a detour! :p

Cliffy

Kalamazoo strippers. Another example of a post with too much info! :) Close your eyes. Kalamazoo srippers. Ugh. Detroit strippers. Umm. Ann Arbor strippers.

William - Is it too late for me to come on Saturday? I just had a cancellation that allows me to follow my passion. I can pick up the trash, sweep the floor and wash your car!
Thanks,
Bob

William has posted elsewhere its an open invite. Room for whomever wants to come. So I think its quite OK to come.Just bring one of those 23 year old special Pappy Van Winkle's. Bring two and I'll buy one fro you.

Only a few more hours until Gino arrives!!!!!!

LET'S GET THIS PARTY STARTED!!!!!!!!

:D :D :D :D

Cliffy

oh man you're crazy cliff!

Anyone near D.C. with a Toshiba HD Player and some HD movies on disc please call Mike Parker, need Friday morning thru Sunday Thanks!I'll bring my Toshiba HD-A1 tomorrow morning.

In addition to a regular stack of HD-DVDs, I found a couple of demo HD-DVDs that should work nicely for this event...

I already gave the host one of these:
http://crtforum.com/img/hddvd235.jpg

And here are the menus from HD-DVD Demo #2:

http://crtforum.com/img/blendzilla-hddvd1.jpg

http://crtforum.com/img/blendzilla-hddvd2.jpg

Plus a few more secret jawdroppers. ;) :cool:

I'll swing by tomorrow and drop off my Toshiba before I pick up Cliff at the airport.

Nice...lord of the rings ;).

Nice...lord of the rings ;).http://crtforum.com/img/HDDVD-LOTR.jpg ;)

Another fun title I found...

http://crtforum.com/img/ts-hddvd.png

Ahh that's awesome. One day I'm going to watch all three in a row...one day.

I'll bring my Toshiba HD-A1 tomorrow morning.

In addition to a regular stack of HD-DVDs, I found a couple of demo HD-DVDs that should work nicely for this event...

I already gave the host one of these:
http://crtforum.com/img/hddvd235.jpg

And here are the menus from HD-DVD Demo #2:

http://crtforum.com/img/blendzilla-hddvd1.jpg

http://crtforum.com/img/blendzilla-hddvd2.jpg

Plus a few more secret jawdroppers. ;) :cool:

I'll swing by tomorrow and drop off my Toshiba before I pick up Cliff at the airport.


Thanks Clarence

Bring also any RCA-BNC cables for component you might have or any gigital-to-DVI-D cable is appreciated as the DVX has DVI-D in.


:-)

Yo Dogs what's up????

Mike, how is the setup coming? Did Terry try to kiss you yet???? :eek:

Gino and I have out lasted the ladies and are in screenshot mode at this point.

What a great young man he is and I am extremely glad that I met him!

His old lady is a HOTTIE too!!!!

Graturas screen shot:

http://www.seriouspc.com/cliff/Gino.jpg

Cliffy

:D ;)

http://www.seriouspc.com/cliff/Gino1.jpg

Here is a kick ass pic from Gino's 12 megapixel Canon 5D. Absolutely sick camera. I wish I had one!!!!! :D

http://www.seriouspc.com/cliff/Gino2.jpg

:eek: :eek: :eek: :eek:

Ladies,

Gino is off to some much needed rest al though he won't get much because it's off to Art's this morning but I just had to post about this young man that has incredible ability in regards to picture quality.

Not only did he put up with my BIG ASS MOUTH all night, but he stayed patient and pointed out to me things that I really DONT want to hear about when it comes to film.

Yes, I see them, yes, it doesn't bother me enough to take my system up to the kind of par that would be expected for a guy like him.

Yes, he rocks, yes, I'm buzzed, and yes fo sho it has been a blast.

Gino rocks......

Off to sleep for a "few" hours and off to Clarence's place in the morning.

This will be most awesome.

I see a Mike Parker mod in my future for the weekend that will correct the flaws of a stock CRT even like the G90. ;)

Cliffy

Did I mention that his lady is a hottie!!!???

You will all find out soon enough. What an absolute great evening!

Cliff

Wow!
I wish I could afford a digital SLR with a full-frame (35 mm sized) sensor! :mad:

That is a smoking hot camera! :D

Here is a kick ass pic from Gino's 12 megapixel Canon 5D. Absolutely sick camera. I wish I had one!!!!! :D



:eek: :eek: :eek: :eek:

William,
I am thinking I will bring along something to serve as "dessert" for the people with a sweet-tooth!

So do we show up on saturday at 11AM or it is at 2 PM?

Hey- those pics look really amazing!!! Congrats!!!

Yes, Gino is really off the charts when it comes to seek the perfect PQ!!! :-)

Cliff - those shots look really bright. How many ftL are you getting?

Hey- those pics look really amazing!!! Congrats!!!

Yes, Gino is really off the charts when it comes to seek the perfect PQ!!! :-)

Cliff - those shots look really bright. How many ftL are you getting?

Oh God, I'm learning first hand to direct result of sleep deprivation. :mad: :(

Oh well, you pay to live right? :p

Gino and Jessica just left in the Limo to fly out to Art's place and check out the KING of theaters. :) :cool:

I'm off to shower, pack up, and head to the airport. Looking foward to meeting EVERYONE and hanging with the AVS ELITE! ;)

BTW, big dog, 10.5 foot lamberts. :eek:

Cliffy

Guys!

We need another Toshiba HD player and some movies as spares, BluRay welcome also, anyone driving in please bring your players.

We need another Toshiba HD player and some movies as spares, NluRay welcome also, anyone driving in please bring your players.I've got special doorprizes for anyone who brings a player :cool:

Can anyone there right now tell me if Terry Ferrentinos is there? I'm supposed to meet him there w/ a BG1208 for a mutual client in Atlanta. I'm right by there waiting 4 his return call.

Also can someone PM me Mike Parker or anyone else's # so I can call.

thanx:)

Dave

Dave

Try 540 687 3802, they are there.

Yes, Terry is there.

Dave, Terry needs a HDMI-DVI cable or adapter if you happen to have one or pass a store that sells one, Terry said he will reimburse anyone who can bring one today.

Dang, that SMX screen frame is the prettiest screen I've ever seen. Incredible design and manufacturing quality. I want one.

Gotta go pick Cliff & Arli up at the airport...

I've got a couple. I'll take them up in a few minutes.

Anyone interested in a HTPC with a HD-DVD player with the latest nVidia 8600 GTS card + Purevideo?

I can bring one along.

BTW, what time? 11 or 2 PM

Hehe

Early telephone reports from the scene indicate "Moooahahaha" type image quality on the twelve foot wide SMX screen.

Send More Pix!!!!!!!!!

Anyone interested in a HTPC with a HD-DVD player with the latest nVidia 8600 GTS card + Purevideo?

I can bring one along.

BTW, what time? 11 or 2 PM

Rajdude,
Not sure about the htpc, and not sure if William will be on to read the forum tonight. But I think we is starting around 2:00 tomorrow and was thinking about 11:00 on Sunday. Hopefully, he will log on tonight and clarify if I'm wrong.

Maybe give him a call tomorrow morning and see what the scoop is.

The screen is outta-sight!! Blending is really cool!!

Bring something for desert? Great!

See you tomorrow.

wallace

Well ,Gino ,Jesse ,Angela and I had a nice evening but poor Gino had already been through the ringer at Cliff's. I think Cliffy had already had his way with him so he had needed AV viagra by the time he got here. :D

Art

First report.........LOOKS GOOD.........more to come

Terry

The lap dancers just arrived! They keep asking where's Art, Curt and Tim? Then somebody spoke the word Blendzilla and two of the girls lit up with big smiles and said the hell with Curt, Tim, and Art, and if I tell you what they did next to Cliffy, Tryg will have me banned. Mamma! Sad thing is Cliffy is sooo sloshed I'm not sure he will remember it.

Dave

Try 540 687 3802, they are there.

Thanks Tim:) I was able to get hold of the homeowner William and then drop the unit off with Terry.

I wish I could have stayed longer:( I was running VERY late for a later appt and had to leave after only a few minutes checking it out.

It was GREAT to meet everybody there and shoot the bull for a bit. It's been a few years since I've seen a few of them like Ken, Galen, Mike P., etc.

Thanks for running that BG1208/2 down to Atlanta for me Terry!!!

Mark H. thanks for making some calls and hooking me up.

Have fun guys:D!!!

The lap dancers just arrived! They keep asking where's Art, Curt and Tim? Then somebody spoke the word Blendzilla and two of the girls lit up with big smiles and said the hell with Curt, Tim, and Art, and if I tell you what they did next to Cliffy, Tryg will have me banned. Mamma! Sad thing is Cliffy is sooo sloshed I'm not sure he will remember it.

Umm, I sent those girls in my absence. DIdn't they wave their Canadian flags and show their beavers?


If not, I want a refund!

One of them brought this shiny brass flag pole. From my boy scout nature merit badge, I thought Canadian beavers were covered in brown hairy fur. These beavers were bald. At least that is what it looked like when Cliffy and Clarence came up for a breadth of fresh air. Those boys reminded me of skin divers without scuba tanks they way they kept coming up for air and then going back down.

Guys!

Talked to William a moment ago, he sez the crowd is around 25 right now and the picture is freakin' amazing........many thanks to Clarence for supplying his HD clips discs for the demos and some door prizes!!!!! More soon and some pix I hope.

awesome....i hope its just as good tomorrow!

Pix...show us the pix!

Someone please take some people pictures!

Ruben

Someone please take some people pictures!

Ruben

Hehe

Would those would did not tell their wives "I'm going Bowling tonite" please post some pictures...... :D:D

So what time are you guys firing up the big three guns tommorow? :D 11-12?

Say Phil

Eleven am is a good bet.......

OK. I can't figure how to post pics, so here are some attached pics. BTW, I was in charge of beer, BBQ and maragritas. NOT pics. Someone else needs to post some decent ones.

More.

more.

my head hurts. more tomorrow.

wallace

William,

My God what a beautiful home you have. Not like you haven't heard this before from me. :D

Today was a blast but I must ask, why in the hell is my big ass in all of these pics? :D :D

Don absolutely AMAZED me with the pork, the beef brisket, and the jerky.

The jerky was by far THE BEST I have ever placed in my big ass mouth. Just simply incredible.

I FINALLY got to meet Terry. Bastard looks JUST LIKE MY DAD!!!! What a kick ass guy. Too kool. Loved the inside look of the AVS Elite!

AWESOME!

Mike,

Finally nice to meet you and looking foward to your visit!

Art,

Wish you were here to check the gig big dog! Sorry I kept Gino up all night! Miss you man. :)

Everyone else, it was most awesome to put faces to the names and I must say that there is some really cute AVS CRT members. I'm almost thinking at this point that I'm going to switch genders! ;) :p

Cliffy

Dam Dam Dam... missed out on the fun... looks like you guys had a great time..

I was the last to arrive getting there about 8:30PM. Mark Conner and I were the last to leave about 1:15 AM. JBJR and Gino and wife were staying the night. Mark and I had about 1 1/2 ride back home. Supposed to be back 11 AM tomorrow.

The food and drinks were superb! Beef brisket and jerky, great stuff. The margaritas--strong, strong, strong, the lime did not hide the taste of the liquor and the secret ingredient? A little whole milk added to the blender. Smooth, great tasting and potent.

The set up and picture quality--still a work very much in progress. Be very interesting to see this after a bit more dialing it in.

Status - Terry & Galen safely back in hotLanta.
Operational Status - multiple AmberBocks =/ Coffee consumption + driving.
William - Awesome host, great coffee and bacon cheese burgers! Thanks!
Mike and John - Best thrash since the Porsche racing days!
Relentless attention to details and video quality, incredible technical prowess!
Three days nonstop to 3AM & just like Christmas morning on Saturday......
Terry - Never ceases to amaze me - never stops until it's right on!
Don - Best BBQ ever!!! (serious praise from a southern boy....)
Ken - Great working with you on the Blend Zone (& 110% + feedback on the PJ)
Cliff & Clarence - great to meet you! So many posts and now some faces too!
Pete - Wish we had more time, please hook up next you're up this way!
Ashley - you are one sweet pup.....

Video Quality = Awesome
I have no idea what you saw after we left, but what I saw Saturday morning
when Mike and John and I did an A/B comparison of the MP Xbox vs. HTPC
was absolutely stunning. The combination of Mikes PJ mods, the setup up work
from Terry and Ken, the fact of using the full raster(= power) on the PJ's = the
most immersive picture I have ever seen or even imagined possible.
The detail in the low end and the effortless power in the bright scenes just
made the whole effort totally worthwhile. By far, the best sources that I
saw were the MP Xbox and Terry's HTPC, the toshiba/crystalio a credible 2nd,
toshiba to blender - not even close (color space wrong & very bad stuttering)

Screen impressions - A very pleasant suprise! Good job on the frame!
Some color shift due to the the higher gain coating used to compensate
for the fill ratio. The color shift makes the blend match a little difficult,
but the acoustic improvement will no doubt make the trade off worthwhile.

Blender impressions - challenging to sort out under time pressure, some
functionality issues (loading saved setups, etc) but hey, the fact is the darn
thing works, and it works well - according to Mike the next step up is about $50K.
Sure, you could spend hours tweaking - but the fact is - a very watchable blend
can be achieved in fairly short order.

Status - sleepy now.......

Thanks,
Galen

Guys, seriously.....
after all the talk about strippers.....words completely fail to describe
my disapointment when when Cliff showed up with the little black box!!!
Cheers,
G

What I watched in the evening was very limited. Terry left before i got there. We watched the Toshiba fed into the Crystalio fed into the Blendzilla, I didn't get to see the MP modded Xbox and Terry's HTPC. The Toshiba into the Crystalio into the Blendzilla was NOT the most awesome I have seen. Could also be limited by the HD DVD transfer we watched. Definitely limited by the room. Not a black pit and it showed. The room needs some black tuning!

Back out again today for more bbq and beer!

wallace

The host william and family were great. Very very enjoyable visit and I will be back. I need to see the better sources. The Toshiba first gen feed into the Crystalio is not the champ. No way. I am not shure the Crystalio was in there either. Someone said it was, someone said it wasn't.

Wallace! My wife (who was up when we rolled home at 2;15 AM or so) was impressed by the compliments my guest Mark and I were giving your barbeque (remember Mar Conner is the dairy ranching and cheese and yogurt production business in Dallas, wants you to cater the brisket and sauce for a large party we are having later this summer. Man was that stuff GOOD.

I need to see the better sources. The Toshiba first gen feed into the Crystalio is not the champ. No way. I am not dure the Crystalio was in there either. Someone said it was, someone said it wasn't.


The source issue was the last to iron out on this. And no one there on Saturday morning knew anything about the Crystalio, so it was a learning project. Though I would not rule it out for performance, as metioned, it has a color space problem. It's not handling HD colorspace, which makes the image look a bit dull, because the colors appear shifted. And a color space issue will rob an image of pop. Other than the color space issue, it seemed to be doing well with everything else. So hopefully, if a download can fix the color space issue, it may turn out to be a pretty good unit overall.

Both Marquees could use more setup and focus, but still at the resolution that we've been running them at (1400x1050 @ 72hz = 78H / 72V), they are doing very well. They are both cruising along at higher bandwidths. And they're still showing the very smallest text being readable from the rear of the room..:)

So today, we plan to work with more sources... more later, go to go!

Screen impressions - A very pleasant suprise! Good job on the frame!
Some color shift due to the the higher gain coating used to compensate
for the fill ratio. The color shift makes the blend match a little difficult,
but the acoustic improvement will no doubt make the trade off worthwhile.


Hi Galen,

Thanks for your feedback. Mike Parker posted above that the color shift was caused by the Crystalio having a color space issue.

The screen doesn't have a gain coating and it doesn't color shift. It is very neutral in color.

Ruben
.

Everybody is posting about how good the Barbeque was and how nice the people were, that is not a very good sign so far. I hope the next set of posts are not comparing tap water quality. :D

Ruben

Man I hope people are still there today :p

So is it at 11am today?

Actually, there are three water districts involved in the DC immediate area. DC, MD, and Northern Virginia. Of the three northern Virginia actually has the best tasting water. A small amount of it is delicious surrounded by a big slug of bourbon.

well, i don't know about the tap water, but the margaritas were fricken awsome... it was great to meet everybody, and it is my 3rd blending meet, it was great to see what the marquees can do in that setup... don w makes some wicked food... thanks much don.. as usually i love the smx screen its definitely what i am going with the next theater..

thanks much william for hosting this meet.

Sounds like a slam dunk. Keep those screen shots comming

Guys!

Well it is Mike Parker towards the back here, who are the others?

http://i15.tinypic.com/4z8x3df.jpg

What I watched in the evening was very limited. Terry left before i got there. We watched the Toshiba fed into the Crystalio fed into the Blendzilla, I didn't get to see the MP modded Xbox and Terry's HTPC. The Toshiba into the Crystalio into the Blendzilla was NOT the most awesome I have seen. Could also be limited by the HD DVD transfer we watched. Definitely limited by the room. Not a black pit and it showed. The room needs some black tuning!

Mark,

What I saw of the Toshiba and Crystalio were OK, but not close to what Mikes XBox or the HTPC provided at 1080P directly to the blender. That was the picture to look at. I'm surprised that they didn't hook Williams HTPC up which we had running HD DVD when I left (that's why mine came out of the system).
While I was there the small experiment we had done with the Toshiba and Crystalio on Friday evening showed it was not in the same league as the HTPC or modded XBox360 for HD DVD playback from a picture quality point.
And as I was leaving the A1 was hooked up directly to the blender and it just didn't have a good picture quality at all. Colors were way off and that was a setup that we hadn't tried.
Yes the 9500's needed some more dialing it (probibly a full days worth), but they were close enough for the demo. Same goes for the blender. But we were all time limited in trying to pull this off.
But then this was all a big experiment in the first place for William to see what could be accomplished with blending and his theater, and William did get to spend some quality time Friday seeing a HTPC and modded XBox running through his system.......so he knows what it can look like. In that regard this was a big success.

It must have been Margaretta time by then.

Had fun, nice meeting and working with ya'll, and a big thanks to William for his hospitality.

Terry

Wallace! My wife (who was up when we rolled home at 2;15 AM or so) was impressed by the compliments my guest Mark and I were giving your barbeque (remember Mar Conner is the dairy ranching and cheese and yogurt production business in Dallas, wants you to cater the brisket and sauce for a large party we are having later this summer. Man was that stuff GOOD.


I live in BBQ country, and that was the best BBQ I have ever had. That and Wallace's "special" BBQ sauce.

Terry

Hi Galen,

Thanks for your feedback. Mike Parker posted above that the color shift was caused by the Crystalio having a color space issue.

The screen doesn't have a gain coating and it doesn't color shift. It is very neutral in color.

Ruben
.

Ruben,

What Galen is referring to had nothing to do with the input or source. What we say was with all white patterns generated by the PJ's thenselves.
What color shift there was seen was very minor and could be easily dialed out. Don't be concerned about your screen. It was surprisingly good and performed way beyond what I would have expected considering it's accoustic transparancy.

What Mike is referring to has to do with the colors being produced in the picture played back from the Crystalio and HD DVD player which when I was there no focus was put on at all to set up at all.

My hat's off to you for a great innovative screen design.

Terry

Everybody is posting about how good the Barbeque was and how nice the people were, that is not a very good sign so far. I hope the next set of posts are not comparing tap water quality. :D

Ruben

Ruben,

Like I said in an earlier post, this was mainly an experiment for William to try blending and different sources.

For some reason after some of the early guests got there there was an immediate push by them to hook up the Toshiba A1 and Crystalio for HD DVD playback which they did. We had this set up briefly the night before and had dismissed it as inferior to the HTPC or Mikes modded XBox360 both for HD DVD playback. So to that end I didn't understand why there was this push to set the A1 up again.

But again, this was an experiment for William rather than a "structured" HT meet were the sources had all been dialed in carefully long before he meet and there weren't any other sources available.

What we had seen the day before and the yesterday morning while doing the install and setup were some of the best HD DVD playback I have ever seen using HTPC or Mikes modded XBox360 and Mikes modded 9500's. The black were great with fantastic sharp black detail. No gamma correction needed. The punch from the picture was very 3D looking. The screen was a good complement to the picture.

To be honest if the A1 stayed set up yesterday, the guests really didn't their monies worth at all.

Terry

Tim,

Left to right.....
Cliff, John, MP and Galen.

Terry

Do you know if the frame sample ever got there? I tried to get in contact with William to confirm but he must of been busy.

Ruben

Do you know if the frame sample ever got there? I tried to get in contact with William to confirm but he must of been busy.

Ruben

Yes the sample did get there Ruben.
We were particularly impressed w/ the frame, it construction and how well it masked any overscan.

Terry

Yes the sample did get there Ruben.
We were particularly impressed w/ the frame, it construction and how well it masked any overscan.

Terry

Awesome, thanks.

Ruben

Everybody is posting about how good the Barbeque was and how nice the people were, that is not a very good sign so far. I hope the next set of posts are not comparing tap water quality. :D

Ruben

:D :D :D

Hi Ruben,

The screen is great both in quality of construction and picture.
I would not hesitate to recommend it or spec it for an installation.

I meant no pejorative earlier, just some technical observations
after a very long day and 10 hour drive. Color shift is primarily
a crt pj effect due to the separate physical mounting of the
tubes/lenses. It was very minor, and not in any way a problem.

The frame design is very well thought out and implemented.
The mesh material and separate black mesh backing should give
incredible acoustic performance. I wish we had been able to stay
until the sound was going, hopefully we will have another chance.
I have a sample here though, and will at least be able to check it
out over a speaker in the near future.....

Regards,
Galen

Well it was nice meeting everyone and seeing Ken, Mike, and Gino in action, but somehow I have a headache even though I'm not even old enough to drink :p. Maybe Cliff's hangover somehow transferred to me?

I quote Nautikal:

Gino, Ken, Mike, and William were really busy today because the entire setup had to be redone for some reason...i think the memory got erased somehow? You all should really see Gino hold a remote though...he looks like he's holding a sword or baseball bat :p.

Anyways, the picture was great once everything was setup. We watched lots of King Kong as well as various clips from Clarence's HD DVD disk via the xbox. I left a little early cause I have school tomorrow and exams this week so I'm sure they had lots more fun afterwards.

Really great meeting everyone and talking amongst fellow enthusiasts.

They put me to work today that's for sure. I almost feel sorry for those that didn't get to see what we had achieved by this afternoon. From what I saw had been achieved yesterday, there was a real long ways to go. So William approached me this morning and asked for some help, and so I decided we really needed to start from the beginning. Due to obvious time constraints we couldn't really dial things in, so once things were satisfactory we moved on to the next step. I did a quick geometry setup with William, as this really needed work. I'd say in this area we went from 20% to 60%. Then Mike and I worked on focus/lens flapping. The thing I was most impressed here was the ability to focus with contrast at 100. This really made things sharp edge to edge. I'd say again another 10x improvement here. I then spent time tweaking geometry in the blendzone. William and I worked on convergence, then we played with the blend curve. Gallen did a very good job here and we only need slight changes. Then Ken worked his magic (I hope you'll come down under!) We had a great blend going here, but only 5-6 footlamberts. We pushed contrast to about 75ish and got to 7 ftL. We should be getting more output but we weren't able to maximise raster usage as the throw distance was too long. If we maxed this out, and shortened the throw, Ken thinks we should be able to get to 8+

The end result was special, and a massive and I mean massive improvement. However there is still room for more tweaking.

I'll post more on this soon, after I recover from this whirlwind trip, I'll start a thread later on my global CRT odyssey!

What a heck-of-a time! The last 3 days were some of the best I have had in my 51 years!

A HUGE thanks to William and his family for having this party! Beautiful house and great home theater. My many thanks to everyone that attended as I learned so much. Especially how grumpy people get when the margaritas need to be made :D .

Terry, Galen, Mike, John, Ken, Gino, Cliff, Clarence all in the same house at the same time? You talk about a lot of horsepower; WOW!!

Gino really got the blending in Sunday afternoon. I guess this was a working vacation for him. But it was worth it for the rest of us.

Hope I can make it to the next one.

wallace

pic. Dont blame me for the crumy quality. Beer and bbq are more my speed.

Here are a few screenshots that we took a little earlier this evening. I'll post back with comments later. must rest.

These are from the door prize demo DVD's. Xbox 360
http://img329.imageshack.us/img329/1528/hpim1814ri4.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img329.imageshack.us/img329/2558/hpim1816hb5.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img504.imageshack.us/img504/220/hpim1817od3.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img179.imageshack.us/img179/2492/hpim1819ag5.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img407.imageshack.us/img407/5919/hpim1820vq1.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

MP's pics are much better...

more

more,

again, more.

Awesome pics Don!!!! It was really great meeting you and everyone else. What a family we have huh? :^)

Cliffy

Ruben,

Like I said in an earlier post, this was mainly an experiment for William to try blending and different sources.

For some reason after some of the early guests got there there was an immediate push by them to hook up the Toshiba A1 and Crystalio for HD DVD playback which they did. We had this set up briefly the night before and had dismissed it as inferior to the HTPC or Mikes modded XBox360 both for HD DVD playback. So to that end I didn't understand why there was this push to set the A1 up again.

But again, this was an experiment for William rather than a "structured" HT meet were the sources had all been dialed in carefully long before he meet and there weren't any other sources available.

What we had seen the day before and the yesterday morning while doing the install and setup were some of the best HD DVD playback I have ever seen using HTPC or Mikes modded XBox360 and Mikes modded 9500's. The black were great with fantastic sharp black detail. No gamma correction needed. The punch from the picture was very 3D looking. The screen was a good complement to the picture.

To be honest if the A1 stayed set up yesterday, the guests really didn't their monies worth at all.

Terry

Yeah, I should have kept my big ass mouth shut so I'm going to have to take the blame for that one. It actually would have worked out though if the damn color space of the Crystalio would have been out putting the proper greens for HD instead of outputting NTSC green for HD. :mad:

Somebody at that company needs a good spank on the tush for that fo sho. :confused:

Cliffy

Man. I am exhausted and all I did was eat, drink, watch, and drive about 400 miles this weekend. Great party. A lot of very talented people helped put things together. There is a tremendous learning curve here to get things right and with all that talent performance reached maybe 60% of potential. No one person had the skills or nowledge to do this right.

MVP? Gino. Witout him there and his tremendous knowledge of the blendzilla and the things you have to get spot on in setting the two projectors up, geometry both the same and perfect, convergence, identicle gray scales (the mighty Ken) before you can get the perfect blend. Now it really needs to be done again, move the projectors forward and do EVERY THING again, yet better. Doing this right is one massive feat and requires a lot of varied talent. And to maximize performance you really need a black room. Yada. Yada.

At the end, things looked much much better today. I slept one hour last night. And I only had one drink on saturday and one beer on Sundau. Cliffy has a hollow leg.

Awesome, thanks.

Ruben

Ruben,

That frame was bad ass big dog. Simply awesome.

You already know how I feel about the screen. :)

Cliffy

Man. I am exhausted and all I did was eat, drink, watch, and drive about 400 miles this weekend. great party. A lot of very talented people help put things together. There is a tremendous learning curve here to get things right and with all that talent performance reached maybe 50% of potential. No one person had the skills or nowledge to do this right.

MVP? Gino. Witout him there and his tremendous knowledge of th blendzilla and the things you have to get spot on in setting the two projectors up, gometry both the same and perfect, convergence, identicle gray scales (the mighty Ken) before you can get the perfect blend. Now it really needs to be done again, move the projectors forward and do EVERY THING again, yet better. Doing this right is one massive feat and requires a lot of varied talent. And to maximize performance you really need a black room. Yada. Yada.

At the end, things looked much much better today. I slept one hour last night. And I only had one drink on saturday and one beer on Sundau. Cliffy has a hollow leg.

I'm not quite sure what to make of the hollow leg thing as I am tired as hell and need to get my ass up to bed, but, I will have to say that I whole heartedly disagree about the "lack" of talent at the meet in regards to anyone's ability or lack of "skills" was by any means the reason why the setup was at 50% of it's potential.

I've done this before myself and it does take a STEEP learning curve in regards to a full setup. After looking at those screen shots, I see that everyone there today that came down after lunch and after I left got a hell of a show.

I'll leave it at that and it was nice meeting you Mark.

Cliff

Greetings,

I am going to have to disagree with the assertion that there
is that much room for improvement by increasing raster usage.

Due to the laws of optics as applied to crt projection, the light output
falls significantly as we move away from the optical centerline.
That is, the relationship of light output to raster size is not linear,
and it is definitely not 1:1, there is a point of diminishing returns.

There is maybe 5% more raster usage on those machines before
you will start to hit the tube corners - 5% more area might give
you 2 or 3% more output. To get from 7 to 8 ftL will require 14%
more output, which will require at least 25% more raster area,
and I know for a fact that is not available - not even close.

I am getting 6.9 ftL with the 9500LC Ultra on a Stewart Studiotek 130
screen, that seems plenty bright to me - and it is just 16:9.

Bear in mind this is a mesh screen, some appreciable percentage
of the light is not being reflected back to the viewer. If you stand
behind the screen it is possible to clearly see the room - I would
guess there's at least 15% of the light being transmitted rather
than reflected. This is an acceptable compromise in light (hoho!)
of the excellent acoustic properties, etc....

Good theater is a balance of sometimes conflicting parameters,
excessive focus on one parameter may move away from
the overall best possible experience. For example, what have you
gained when a totally maxed raster leads to dimmer corners and
a vertical luminance irregularity in the blend zone?

Cheers,
Galen

Hey Guys, just got home, man I'm wiped. It's been a long two weekends, but, I wouldn't trade em for anything! It's been loads of fun! Once again thanks William for allowing me to stay at you fantastic home, and meeting your wonderful family, and Ashley the dog and three cats.

All I can say right now is totally awesome! I want one of these soooo bad right now!
I'll post more later, off to bed!

John

Man. I am exhausted and all I did was eat, drink, watch, and drive about 400 miles this weekend. Great party. A lot of very talented people helped put things together. There is a tremendous learning curve here to get things right and with all that talent performance reached maybe 60% of potential. No one person had the skills or nowledge to do this right.

MVP? Gino. Witout him there and his tremendous knowledge of the blendzilla and the things you have to get spot on in setting the two projectors up, gometry both the same and perfect, convergence, identicle gray scales (the mighty Ken) before you can get the perfect blend. Now it really needs to be done again, move the projectors forward and do EVERY THING again, yet better. Doing this right is one massive feat and requires a lot of varied talent. And to maximize performance you really need a black room. Yada. Yada.

At the end, things looked much much better today. I slept one hour last night. And I only had one drink on saturday and one beer on Sundau. Cliffy has a hollow leg.

After much labor and being a part of a very powerful fellowship with some really great people, I happen to click on the forum and read something like this..:(

Hopefully, you guys who were present would overlook this, and not play into it. There were no MVP's at this meet. And this event was much more than what happened on the projectors. I could list 100 things that went wrong over the month, but if it took 100 wrong things to allow me to be part of the great people i got to hang out with this weekend, then those 100 things were worth it. And if it was even 1000 things that went wrong, the rights would still out weight the wrongs. And for me, it was a blast.

Pulling this thing off was a miracle, and it took a many people to make it a success.
Or maybe I'm out to lunch for seeing this event as being a success. I love to be around good people, and there were many good people present, involved and along the way. To me, that's worth more than anything that went wrong, or could have went wrong.

It was a real gas for me to work with both Terry and Galen. I've always admired Terry for being the person that he is, and that he was so willing to drive up from Georgia to help out. And for the first time, I got to meet Galen. And meeting Galen, was like meeting another Terry. And to be able to work with the two of them was a real treat. These two guys put up their best, and If anything did not happen, that should have happened, it's not important. It's not like we had time to really dot every 'I' and cross every "T" It was just more important to me that they were there, and that they were so willing to help out, and they did just that. And you'll never know how much that meant to me, to see so many people so willing to help out. So for whatever the goal was with this meet, there were things that happened that was way more valuable to me than the expectations. Or am I being a bit selfish here?

William and his wife were exceptional host. And they did an excellent job of opening their house up to even folk they did not know. These people are special.

Seeing and meeting folk from the forum that I've not met before was also special, and everyone of them was just great people.


There's a lot of people I can thank and post something about, but there's one i must mention, and that's my best pal JB. I would not know where to start in expressing my gratitude for his friendship. I can't think of a time when I've needed help, and he was not there, or did not offer to be of help...

I can go on, but i'm so full of joy, that I'll just go back to sleep and look forward to the rest of my life to include yet another grand and memorable moment to reflect back on.

You guys let Mark wobble in his negativity - and move on. You all were just fantastic. And if you're not feeling that, thank you for being so fantastic this past week in my life.

:)

Man. I am exhausted and all I did was eat, drink, watch, and drive about 400 miles this weekend. Great party. A lot of very talented people helped put things together. There is a tremendous learning curve here to get things right and with all that talent performance reached maybe 60% of potential. No one person had the skills or nowledge to do this right.

MVP? Gino. Witout him there and his tremendous knowledge of the blendzilla and the things you have to get spot on in setting the two projectors up, gometry both the same and perfect, convergence, identicle gray scales (the mighty Ken) before you can get the perfect blend. Now it really needs to be done again, move the projectors forward and do EVERY THING again, yet better. Doing this right is one massive feat and requires a lot of varied talent. And to maximize performance you really need a black room. Yada. Yada.

At the end, things looked much much better today. I slept one hour last night. And I only had one drink on saturday and one beer on Sundau. Cliffy has a hollow leg.

Mark - I agree that getting a Blendzilla rig up and running requires a monumental effort.

I also think that it IS possible for one single person to amass all required knowledge to do everything right (physical setup, magnetics, lens, geometry, convergence, geometry alignment in blend zone, D6500K in *ALL* areas, etc.)... and based on my interactions with Gino I think he is very close to that if not there yet (I really hope to get there too). I was amazed to see what he did to my setup in such a short time!!! :eek:

Blending is not for everyone, and neither is stacking. Stacking may be a bit (not much if you want to nail it) forgiving wrt to color matching but it is not with convergence; whether blending has its own quirks.

Is all this really worth it? For fun yes, for absolute sick people when it comes to seeking PQ (I must admit that I enjoy PQ more than actual movies) yes, and for the pleasure of getting it done, yes... but even the above than average person would be more impressed by a brighter (or bigger) image than by a better one.

Based on everything I am reading it looks like you all had a great time. All I can say is that I wish I was there!!! :-)

I am going to have to disagree with the assertion that there
is that much room for improvement by increasing raster usage.

There is maybe 5% more raster usage on those machines before
you will start to hit the tube corners - 5% more area might give
you 2 or 3% more output. To get from 7 to 8 ftL will require 14%
more output, which will require at least 25% more raster area,
and I know for a fact that is not available - not even close.

Good theater is a balance of sometimes conflicting parameters,
excessive focus on one parameter may move away from
the overall best possible experience. For example, what have you
gained when a totally maxed raster leads to dimmer corners and
a vertical luminance irregularity in the blend zone?


Hi Galen, it was a shame I wasn't able to chat with you as you left once I arrived.

But I'm afraid I disagree with you here. Yes, perhaps there was only 5% more available raster usage. Therein lies the problem. You are assuming that the blendzilla is outputting an image to entirely fill that raster. The timings are one of the issues that really annoys me about the DVX. If you look at the actual image used within that raster, you have a massive 20% atleast to gain! There is serious wastage of raster usage. And this is only in width, there is still more in height to be used when shortening the throw. So you see, this amount of increased raster, combined with a reasonably shorter throw, should get you this extra ftL.

Get William to post a picture of the tubes when a movie is playing in 2.35:1. Have a look for yourself. I just checked to make sure I'm correct, but I've packed my camera as I'm leaving soon.

Corners may be dimmer, I'm not sure though this is a real issue. I think contrast modulation helps here. As far as irregularity in the blendzone... well, if you turned off your blend it is actually lighter here... so it's really just a matter of redoing the blend curve.

Gino, I forgot I had my Moome DVI card in the car. Did you still want it?
Shoot me an email and I could mail it to you at your hotel in New York before you leave.

John
JBJR57@msn.com

I am shocked at the interpretation here!. My post was not intended as an insult to anyone. What the F is somebody reading my post as a comment that talent and skills were lacking? There was a wealth of talent and skills present. A team of super stars. And it took all of them to get where they got. 60% according to Gino. The man with blend experience.

My point was that doing this right is a tremendous effort. A lot of very talented people worked on this set up, long and hard and my guess is is that most learned quite a bit about doing a blend. There is no substitute for experience in CRT and HT set up land.

If this gathering involved a single CRT set up, hell it would have been a snap. The talent and skills present, hell those guys wouldn't even had to break a sweat.

An overlap stack. Not child's play,but several present have done it. A fair amount of experience

A blended stack? Whole nother story. Getting it to videophile PQ? The skills of many are required. And most don't have a lot of experience doing a blended stack.

Cliify. I never said or used the word "lack". Hollow leg means you can drink a lot and still function great. The only edit I made to my earlier post was to correct the mispelling of geometry.

This exercise was not a demonstration of the best. It turned out to be a demonstarion of how to set up what ultimately may be the best. It was like a demonstration of the best in the business doing a first time medical operation for them. A guy who has done the operation before came and helped make the operation a sucess. Experience in doing a heart transplnt operation by a very skilled team doing it for the first time. My hats off to the group. I stand by what I said, I wouldn't change a word. AND NOTHING I SAID WAS A NEGATIVE. You all know me a lot better than that. There's nothig I wouldn't do for anybody there to help them do anything in the future. I appreciate their herculen efforts. You couldn't put together a more knowledgeable or skilled group.

Awesome Meet guys ! :D
Wallace, thanks for hosting this event. You are a gracious host! :)
Don's BBQ and the jerky was one of the best I ever had !
It was nice to meet all the CRT whiz - kids all at one place.


Now for my technical nonsense:

1. I think that Toshiba A-1 left a lot to be desired in terms of judder. I hope the second generation is better. :(

2. I went back and checked my nVidia 8600 GTS (latest gen, not the older one) based HTPC,.... just to double check the no-judder claims I was making in the meet. And yes, absolutely no judder at 60Hz!! Just a extremely smooth image while panning! :D :D

Guys you just want to run the PJs to 72 Hz just to get rid of the judder, right? Why not get this card and be happy at 60Hz? At 60Hz the image will be much sharper too, since you wont be exceeding the bandwidth of these prehistoric beasts! ;)
And guess what? No mods required! :eek:

3. Now that I have seen both, I think I prefer a blend to a stack. The image is sharper since "no trying to converge 6 dots". And as of course, no matter what they tell you....size matters. ;)

4. This is the first time I saw 9500LC. Are they up to par with the G90? Ooops! Sorry, just had to ask :o

5. I dont get all this talk about getting more foor-lamberts on the screen? Whats up? That image I saw already was very bright. What do we achive by getting so bright an image? :confused:

I go to the local cinema....that image is no too bright either. But sit in there for 10 minutes and your eyes adjust to it and everything seems good.

So, all these efforts to get more brightess will simply be nullified with the human eye's iris narrowing, right?

Now if only someone showed up with a RS1!

If you look at the actual image used within that raster, you have a massive 20% at least to gain! There is serious wastage of raster usage. And this is only in width, there is still more in height to be used when shortening the throw. So you see, this amount of increased raster, combined with a reasonably shorter throw, should get you this extra ftL.

Gino,

I have been thinking about this since you posted last evening.

I am a bit confused here so let me explain why.

Normally when I hang a PJ for the first time, I take the highest frequency source and project it through the PJ w/ a 100% image size. The PJ is on a rolling cart and I project G only doing a very basic geometry then rolling the cart to a position that it fills the screen. OK now I have the starting throw distance.
We then translate that to the ceiling and mount the PJ there but with unistrut which allows us to move the PJ back and forth for final adjustments.

When we arrived at Williams there weren't really any any sources available yet as none of us knew how to operate the blendzilla. There were two of them there (one working and one not working) so we decided to use the internal test patterns of the PJ. We maxed and centered this cross hatch pattern to the tube face, projected it on the half of the screen +/- ~10% and slid the 9500 on a table back and forth until we determined the throw distance. At that point it was 114".

Once we got to the ceiling (at this 114"), we opened the PJ's size on these internal test patterns to the mid 90's and located that PJ by sliding back and forth on the mount. We did this with Mike as he wanted to be in the 95% size area projected over the screen half +/- ~10%. This moved the PJ forward ~2" to 112" to the front of the lens. We then took and made sure that the throw distance on the right PJ was exactly the same as the left and the throw distance was with 1/8".

Now lets look at some throw distances and see where this is at for an 80" wide screen:

* EHome distance calculator says that with HD10GT17 lens 126.5"

* I believe that Tim uses 1.35 x screen width which works out to ~ 108" with Marquee lens's"

* Barco Lens program for the Barco 909 with HFQ900 lens's works out to ~110" to front of lens.

Considering that the lens's used on these 9500's were HFQ900's we felt that we were within a reasonable spec at out final distance of 112".

When we first arrived and until the second day of setting up Blendzilla, we were told that the width of each screen would be about 78.5" with blend. We actually ended up with a slightly smaller blend zone than anticiped by a few inches which equated to a slightly smaller screen size than the 78.5". There were also blendzilla changes in resoltion from the broken one to the operating one which could also have an effect on image size.

The point of all this is that yes there may be a few inches that the 9500's can be moved forward based on the blend zone size and different lens types, but I don't believe that will equate to 20% increase in picture size on the tubes. This few inches of travel cam be easily sone with the unistrut mounting system.

There are a few other points that Galen will address having to do with the trapezoidal pattern on the tube face, projection angle when ceiling mounted and Gaussian distribution of light in an optical system (which is very interesting when you consider color shift, loss of light output at the edges and how "pros" set up the pattern in a blended simulation system).

Terry

It was a real gas for me to work with both Terry and Galen.
:)

Mike,
It was a real pleasure to work with a pro like you as well. You and John work very well together and I found your on site repair abilities to be nothing short of amazing.

Terry

5. I dont get all this talk about getting more foot-lamberts on the screen? Whats up? That image I saw already was very bright. What do we achive by getting so bright an image? :confused:

I go to the local cinema....that image is no too bright either. But sit in there for 10 minutes and your eyes adjust to it and everything seems good.The typical theater measures somewhere between 12-14 fL. Whereas I agree that you can have a very enjoyable image with much less light, the eye craves contrast more than anything. Ask anyone who has seen a three-chip DLP installation with 20+ fL coming off the screen (or Art's and Cliff's with 10 fL)


Ken Whitcomb

Really enjoyed myself over the last week or so. As Mike said the people are what make this kind of thing special.

William, it was a treat and I admire how you kept your sanity! Really enjoyed talking with Cheryl and your sons.

Here's some of my pictures:

Friday

http://img441.imageshack.us/img441/1777/img0462hs4.jpg

Dueling convergence

http://img148.imageshack.us/img148/3117/img0468ji2.jpg

Big Desktop

http://img444.imageshack.us/img444/9917/img0476gq4.jpg

Saturday

http://img182.imageshack.us/img182/3131/img0505px7.jpg

http://img145.imageshack.us/img145/6062/img0503rp8.jpg

http://img264.imageshack.us/img264/8830/img0498fl7.jpg

My Blend Zone is bigger than your Blend Zone.

http://img295.imageshack.us/img295/8862/img0500uh7.jpg



More to come.

William working the corner

http://img517.imageshack.us/img517/1102/img0540ia9.jpg

Gino in his zone

http://img523.imageshack.us/img523/9171/img0537ra2.jpg

Color space issues from the Crystalio?

http://img168.imageshack.us/img168/9961/img0513hb6.jpg

Cliff checking the Forums. He must be either challenging HDTVFanatic to a duel or describing how he'd "hit that", Big Dog.

http://img266.imageshack.us/img266/469/img0543zi1.jpg

No, it's not a refergirator. It's Don's magic machine!

http://img113.imageshack.us/img113/907/img0545he6.jpg

Don, thanks for the BBQ.

http://img256.imageshack.us/img256/3337/img0550dm8.jpg

Ashley chillin'

http://img406.imageshack.us/img406/1159/img0547lc7.jpg


I'll post some screen shots a little later.

I think we all know and agree that CRT's put out less light than most if not all digital's. A comparison between the two is certainly not the focus of this thread.
My G90 on a torus with w/ 3.1 gain screen puts out a bit over 7fL and I find this to be a bright image. Williams put out about 6fL and found his to also be a bright CRT image.
That said, you aren't going to get this 12-14fL out of any CRT. The fact that stacked G90's produce 10fL proves this point.
6-7 fL is certainly a very enjoyable good contrast viewing image for CRT. The overall contrast and ability to transition from black to there contrast levels we achieve is what sets the CRT apart from any other technology out there.

Terry

I can't even fathom why you would even want over 7fL. I have a torus with a 3.1 gain screen and I have to turn the contrast down to 50% because if I go higher I have to wear sunglasses whenever there's a bright scene!

wow!
if you guys are getting 7 fL with a 3 gain screen I wonder what I get with my (lowly) Ampro 4200 on a UPW over drywall (read no gain) "screen" ???

2 fL ????????


I wonder why I never feel the need for more brightness :confused:

Hello

The Marquee/BlendZilla System on a nine or ten foot screen width is about all the light output you could stand with Contrast around 50, I do most viewing with Contrast 42 and it is grand. Those with batcaves and new tubes can push a bit more screen size with Contrast 55-60 if they understand that tube wear may be a bit faster.

Thanks to all who contributed their efforts in making the East Meet happen!

Mike,

So great to get up and read your notes on the weeks work.
I always learn a lot when we have talked via phone, and it was
an absolute blast to meet you and work together on such a challenging
time frame. I know you do much more complicated blend systems
for commercial applications on a regular basis, and was just amazed
by the depth of your knowledge. I learned more intricate, in-depth
details in a few days than I would in a year of just reading and working
on my own! I must say it was a pleasure working with John as well,
he has a lot of knowledge and a great ability to focus on a problem,
often quietly working while others are debating - and then bam - he's
figured it out and we were moving again. Like I said - best workfest in years!

Bill - great pics! Thanks for keeping up with that!

Wish we had more time to enjoy the party, and certainly appreciate
William's hospitality and the peaceful and beautiful setting of his home.
Also wish I had thought to nab some of Don's BBQ - lunch today is looking
very boring in comparison!

Gino - also wish we had met and had some time. Hope you had a great trip and
return safely. Certainly appreciate your enthusiasm for the blend system also.
However, I really don't understand though why you came in and hooked up the
worst possible combination of source/blender. The MPXbox 360 was setup and
ready to go, it would have only made sense if you had A/B compared the two.
But of course - people can debate technical details forever. If you can get a full
on-axis picture of the raster, I will be happy to do a graphical analysis and apply
the luminance curve transfer function, and calculate any theoretical possible
increase in light output.

Great fun meeting everyone!
Galen

Just for reference ,Ken measured just under 12 fL in my front row (most adventageous seating for an angular reflective screen) and 10 fL in the back row( poorest spot for my screen). I'm using a 1.7 gain screen.

I've been very very happy with that amount of light but no doubt more has a seductive quality. In a recent issue of WSR Joel Silver recommended 20fL as a starting point for screening rooms. I think we can argue about the merits but in my room there is not just a brighter image but the color saturation goes up rather dramatically when you have one projector muted then see both together.

Just my take...............

Art

Its sort of like the digital guys a year ago saying all a CRT does better is the blacks (On/off CR) and that isn't very important and them a bulb projector comes a long with much better blacks (the RS1) and they all have to have it.

We say high foot lamberts aren't that important (hell I (me) live with 5 or so and am quite happy, really enjoy it). BUT there isn't much you can do in CRT land to increase brightness, high gain screens (not an acceptable solution to me) or stacking machines. Yet, when one sees 10 ft lamberts, one goes wow. I want that too. I haven't seen 20 yet. Defend low ft lamberts too much and you sound as bad as a digital guy saying blacks aren't so important. We(CRT guys) know better and our arguments why low ft lamberts are OK for low foot lamberts make sense, BUT as Art says, see it and you want it. Just not practicable for most in CRT land.

I'll finish up from my previous post here.

Again, there's no MVP's from this event. And I'm not taking anything away from Gino, I've expressed both praise and appreciation directly to him. And I've also told him that he would be the most qualified person there to deal with the blend, mainly because he has one. And after seeing what he has learned about blending in such short time, he's one remarkable person.

Now, If an award or If there were one person that should get the single praise, it would be Ken. I must say, this guy is a professional in every way. And every time I get to see him at his work, I learn something new. But what really keeps him as one at the top with this. Is his ability to find issues within the video chain, or system itself. he just refuses to force a calibration, because he wants what the customer wants (the best).

I was amazed at how many times he went back over the adjustments, though it had nothing to do with what he had already done, he was more than willing to correct on the changes we were making along the way. He just wanted to be a part of the team, and he wanted to make this event the best it could be. And he surely proved that with both his efforts and the end results.

Again, thanks Ken. You are truly a first class person and if not the best calibrator on the planet, it's because you're not that well known globally. You've been a great and tremendous help, and I can't thank you enough. watching you and the other pro's at work inspired me to look beyond all obstacles. And that's why it was great to work with a great team.

I mentioned to Clarence that I was hoping to get a picture of the team that worked together that weekend. JB, Gino, Galen, Terry, Ken, and I guess I'm worthy to be named with you guys - great job!

Could we get some screen names connected to the pics to see who is who? Is Ashley's screen name emdawgz?:)

However, I really don't understand though why you came in and hooked up the worst possible combination of source/blender. The MPXbox 360 was setup and ready to go, it would have only made sense if you had A/B compared the two.


In NY safe and sound, and finally rested. Can't post long, gotta take Jess shopping now! Yes Cliffy... agree with you 110%.. she is a HOTTIE :D

I just want to ask what you're on about here Galen. Worst combination?? We tried the Xbox direct to the DVX.. in fact when we demoed the blend when we had it at its best it was this way. Why not the MPbox? Because of the limited time, Ken wanted to calibrate what William would most likely be using, and MP said that calibrating on his box may be an issue. We tried looking at the Crystallio just to show others what gamma bumps do, and we tried the A1 too, but just for kicks and only very quickly.

As for the questions on raster usage... just get William to post pics of what is actually being used. My screen is larger at home, and my throw is about the same, if not shorter!

In NY safe and sound, and finally rested. Can't post long, gotta take Jess shopping now! Yes Cliffy... agree with you 110%.. she is a HOTTIE :D



Glad you made it safe big dog. :)

You are truly a VERY VERY lucky man to have a beautiful and not only beautiful, but extremely intelligent, kind, and giving woman. There really arent that many left these days. Especially in the U.S.

Enjoy the rest of your trip big dog and we'll talk soon.

Cliff

Scowl on my face was immediately after being informed that the BBQ needed 20 more minutes.

Great event & lots of thanks to go around. The host family was outstanding!!

It was indeed good to put faces with names & in some cases voices.

Could we get some screen names connected to the pics to see who is who?
Top-left: Terry (chuchuf), Galen (zgman), Mike Parker (mp20748), John (JBJR)
http://img441.imageshack.us/img441/1777/img0462hs4.jpg

Terry and Galen...
http://img148.imageshack.us/img148/3117/img0468ji2.jpg

From left: Ken W (black shirt), Gino, Terry (sitting), Rajiv (rajdude with orange shirt), MP, Galen (at laptop)...
http://img182.imageshack.us/img182/3131/img0505px7.jpg

Cliff, Galen, Ken, Terry, Rajiv, Pete (zphoto), MP, and I'm sitting on the floor...
http://img145.imageshack.us/img145/6062/img0503rp8.jpg

Arli (bomrat) and John (JBJR)...
http://img264.imageshack.us/img264/8830/img0498fl7.jpg

Cliff...
http://img295.imageshack.us/img295/8862/img0500uh7.jpg

Cliff:
http://img266.imageshack.us/img266/469/img0543zi1.jpg

NautikaL and Don (BBQ Master)...
http://img256.imageshack.us/img256/3337/img0550dm8.jpg

I went back and checked my nVidia 8600 GTS (latest gen, not the older one) based HTPC,.... just to double check the no-judder claims I was making in the meet. And yes, absolutely no judder at 60Hz!! Just a extremely smooth image while panning! :D :D

Guys you just want to run the PJs to 72 Hz just to get rid of the judder, right? Why not get this card and be happy at 60Hz? At 60Hz the image will be much sharper too, since you wont be exceeding the bandwidth of these prehistoric beasts! ;) "absolutely no judder at 60Hz!!"

Hmm... now I definitely have to come visit your setup, because IMHO saying "no judder at 60Hz" is akin to saying "I found a rooster that lays eggs".

I'll have to show you 60 Hz judder vs silky-smooth (47.95 or 71.928).

Now I will admit that some media players and some video cards will play 60Hz smoother than others at 60Hz, and I've seen video cards and media players that "stutter" at 48/72, but when I show you judder-free 71.928 on your video card you'll say "OHHH! Now I definitely know what you mean by silky smooth".

The HD-A1 (and 99% of all other HDDVD and BD players) will always have judder... they only do 60Hz.

AFAIK, all video cards will judder on 60 Hz with film content. It's a mathematical artifact of turning 24 frames per second into 60, using 3:2 pull-down.

60Hz judder is a lot more subtle than dropped frames. It's easiest to notice on long, slow angular pans. You might only notice it once or twice during a movie. But once you make the mistake of learrning how to spot 60Hz judder, it's annoying. Like fade-to-black... once you see how a good video setup can handle it properly, you seek it, you appreciate it, and you strive for it.

Hello to all,

WOW! what a great meet. I would like to thank William and family for the hospitality they provided for ALL. I really enjoyed myself. What a fine family we are :) . I do wish I could have made it for day 2, as it sounds things were much different. I would like to know who threw out my margherita and beer when I went to the can.... I'll wait....Just kiddin. Thanks Don. I also found out that snickerdoodle road goes on forever when you go the wrong way :eek: Oh before I forget Clarence you also should get much credit for the fine demo dvds, very nice indeed.

Steve

Well I was so inspired by the meet :p...that I redid most of the color setup on the XG to the best of my ability. The main thing I did was to get rid of a slight red tint at low IRE so black levels are very good now. I'm sure it looks no where near as good as Ken could do, but even my mom noticed a difference and she doesn't even know what contrast means :D.

I also found out that snickerdoodle road goes on forever when you go the wrong way :eek:


Ouch...well at least its a pretty fun road to drive on as long as you're not scared by the fact that you can't see around the corners :).

Thanks, Clarence!

I feel sorry for Pete having to make another trip so soon!:)
http://img514.imageshack.us/img514/5931/peteeh1.jpg

Hello to all,

Oh before I forget Clarence you also should get much credit for the fine demo dvds, very nice indeed.

Steve

Hell ya. Clarence is the CRT forum HD DVD MASTER when it comes to making kick ass demo discs. He Rocks.

BTW, Clarence,

I owe you one now big dog. You and your wife's amazing ability to make me feel at home was nothing short of spectacular. Thank you so much.

Like you haven't heard it before. :)

Your a TRUE FRIEND! :D

Steve,

It was nice to meet you and YES, it's one hell of a family. Unlike anything I have EVER EXPERIENCED. :cool:

Cliffy

... and not only beautiful, but extremely intelligent, kind, and giving woman. There really arent that many left these days. Especially in the U.S.

Cliff

Or Canada. I see a road trip in my near future to down under. And according to the Aussie ladies, we Canadians have such cute accents..;)

The HD-A1 (and 99% of all other HDDVD and BD players) will always have judder... they only do 60Hz.

I'm pretty sure that there are three Blu-ray players that output 24p and current digital pj's will happily display it at 72hz or better still 96hz. Now that's judder free.

Ken

Did someone say Florida...

Did someone say Florida...

Dude, I'm in Daytona next week. Wanna do dinner you little fag? :D ;)

Cliffy

Thanks, Clarence!

I feel sorry for Pete having to make another trip so soon!:)
http://img514.imageshack.us/img514/5931/peteeh1.jpg

Great pic of Arli. What a most kick ass dude. Who is that HOMO in the middle?

Most excellent!

Cliffy

hmm 443 miles one way... let me see if I can get to jacksonville we have a site there that needs help. How long will you be in town mon-fri?

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=814240&highlight=ht5000

Greetings,
I was just tickled to find that my tired old back was mistaken for Gino's
young slender physique! At least I am pretty sure I remember duelling
convergence with Terry, he always wins though...hohoho!!
Finally caught up on sleep and getting over the enormous hole my usually
placid oversized Lab chewed in our new carpet during a thunderstorm
Friday night! Watched a funny movie on my 2002 9500Ultra and didn't
adjust one darn thing! Very Glad William's setup came together in time
and pleased you guys could put in the extra day of setup. Really hope he had
a totally fun day enjoying all that he had planned for and anticipated for so long.
The screenshots looked very good also.
Looking forward to getting my new LUG's and red c-element installed, some
quiet fan mods, finishing the Barco twins down in the shop and oh yeah - back to
work on the house.
Best Regards,
Galen

hmm 443 miles one way... let me see if I can get to jacksonville we have a site there that needs help. How long will you be in town mon-fri?

Monday through thursday big dog. Don't push it if you don't have to.....

We'll be haning soon enough.

Cliff

NautiKal,

Must say that I am very much impressed at your level of interest & all that you have acheived at such a young age. Did not really realize the nature of your attendance at the Kosman meet until I talked briefly with your father.

Sorry that we did not get a chance to talk but good luck with all future CRT endeavors. I vividly remember being around your age & getting laughed out of some high-end audio stores in the 70's. Kudos to your father as well for aiding you in pursuing your interest.

Now I am hoping I have this right & "NautiKal" was the young man that came out with his father from Rockviille. His substantive post here differ wildly from his appearance.

Monday through thursday big dog. Don't push it if you don't have to.....

We'll be haning soon enough.

Cliff


Word Son Word...

Hope the beaches are as nice as they are in Pensacola, hmm of course thet are.

Could we get some screen names connected to the pics to see who is who?Some more...

Gino and William (the host)...
http://img150.imageshack.us/img150/2093/zilla1yq4.jpg

William (wkosmann), JBJR, MP, Gino (with remote), John (emdawgz), Mark Conner (damon), Pete (zphoto), Ken W (the jedi calibrator), Mark Haflich, and I'm not sure about the last guy in the black shirt...
http://img157.imageshack.us/img157/276/zilla2lw2.jpg

Hmm... now I definitely have to come visit your setup, because IMHO saying "no judder at 60Hz" is akin to saying "I found a rooster that lays eggs".


Well, I have been inviting you over for ages now! :D
Give me a heads up beforehand and I will bring the HTPC to my house. (The HTPC with the 8600 is not really mine, I built it for someone)

My own HTPC is older, with a FX550 card and no HD-DVD (yet).



I'll have to show you 60 Hz judder vs silky-smooth (47.95 or 71.928).

Now I will admit that some media players and some video cards will play 60Hz smoother than others at 60Hz, and I've seen video cards and media players that "stutter" at 48/72, but when I show you judder-free 71.928 on your video card you'll say "OHHH! Now I definitely know what you mean by silky smooth".


Ok, I am up for it, but I can’t imagine how much smoother this can be. It is already 100% jerk free.



The HD-A1 (and 99% of all other HDDVD and BD players) will always have judder... they only do 60Hz.

AFAIK, all video cards will judder on 60 Hz with film content. It's a mathematical artifact of turning 24 frames per second into 60, using 3:2 pull-down.


I'm not sure about if the content I watch is “film content” or not but none of the clips on your HD DVD demo disk and the 3 movies I have watched (King Kong, Babel and Deer Hunter) had any issues with jerky pans (AKA judder right?)



60Hz judder is a lot more subtle than dropped frames. It's easiest to notice on long, slow angular pans. You might only notice it once or twice during a movie. But once you make the mistake of learrning how to spot 60Hz judder, it's annoying. Like fade-to-black... once you see how a good video setup can handle it properly, you seek it, you appreciate it, and you strive for it.

I know I know…. I am very sensitive to it :) My plasma does it all day! But the same thing when I watch on the Ampro PJ, it is smoooooth. (talking about the Comcast DVR and DVDs)

Just for fun I have the judder poster child for all of you. If you can smooth it out you are there. Fight Club early in Ed Norton is describing the contents of his condo as the items and prices are overlayed as the camera pans across the room. Almost impossible to read at 60Hz. I have the Dtheater if anyone wants it for the test.

Art

Guys, did you run the blend at 60 Hz or 72 Hz?

We tried both 60 and 72 Hz on my setup and the difference was NOT subtle... HD-DVDs from HTPC looked super-smooth.... at 72 Hz and not so much at 60... That and the freaking rainbows was the final topping for me to go 72 Hz (I'd like to try 96 Hz but it is outside specs of single channel DVI-D I think).

BR - Andres

Guys, did you run the blend at 60 Hz or 72 Hz?

We tried both 60 and 72 Hz on my setup and the difference was NOT subtle... HD-DVDs from HTPC looked super-smoothEverything was coming out of the Blendzilla at 72 Hz.

We tried the Toshiba HD-A1 directly into the blendzilla and got slight judder. And we tried the HD-A1 into the Crystalio II and then into the Blendzilla.... IMHO this was even worse... we got ripping, judder, and colorspace issues.

We also tried to run HDMI out of the HD-A1, but the DVI HDCP box would not feed a signal. Of course the very next day after the meet, Toshiba released firmware update v2.2 to fix the HDMI-DVI issues...
http://209.167.114.38/support/ceg/downloads/ALL/D000004.asp

I was not in the room when they hooked up the xbox drive through HTPC... I'm assuming they were running 71.928 smoothly.

Guys, did you run the blend at 60 Hz or 72 Hz?

We tried both 60 and 72 Hz on my setup and the difference was NOT subtle... HD-DVDs from HTPC looked super-smooth.... at 72 Hz and not so much at 60... That and the freaking rainbows was the final topping for me to go 72 Hz (I'd like to try 96 Hz but it is outside specs of single channel DVI-D I think).

BR - Andres

We ran everything at 72hz. Both projectors were getting 1400x1050P @ 72hz (78khz / 72hz).

72hz should be the highest rate you'll want to do for film. Especially when doing progressive scan to the projectors.

72hz also gave us a very smooth image, but not with the Crystalio (broke). The Crystalio's only virtue was gamma adjustment. Other than that, it made a real mess of the image. It looked OK on "happy feet" but with true film source material, it was a joke.

The Xbox 360 into the Blend unit at 1080P /60hz produced the best image by far. And because we were trying different sources and variations, it was not used for most of the meet. And barely used on Saturday.

In speaking with William yesterday. I think we're going to do this again. Maybe somewhere like 3 to 4 months from now.

I have to go back out there in a day or so, to get a few things I left that I'll be needing asap. While there, I'll take a bunch of screen-shots with the Xbox in the setup. We'll post them from Williams sometime this week.

There were several things at this meet that sticks in my mind today. One was the ability of the Blend units to do what it does without softening the image. It did extremely well there - truly amazing!

the second was Gino. This guy has an eye. To not be someone who's either trained or has extensive experience with this stuff, he has this ability to see stuff with the image, that leaves you wondering, how did he acquire this skill in such short time.

Amazing guy!

And of course, those Marquee's..:D

Well I sure am glad we stayed up until 3am friday night watching
the xbox with mp mods, it was just awesome. The A/B tests
we did saturday before lunchtime with the htpc and mpxbox
running the same video material(KK) simultaneously and sync'd
was absolutely the technical highlight of the whole trip for me.
(well, besides fiddling about the the blend processor....)
I still can't understand why anyone would want to watch a
another source with that one available, there was such a big
difference. But I guess that's why they call it testing...hohoho!
Cheers,
G

The Xbox 360 into the Blend unit at 1080P /60hz produced the best image by far.Aside from the fact that the XBox wouldn't display the entire image at 1080P from the VGA connector... we were losing over a foot of the image on the left side.

To keep the aspect ratio correct, they also had to crop the top and bottom of the image when viewing 1080P from the XBox.

This was frustrating because the HDDVD menu is always in the very bottom of the frame, so you couldn't control chapter selection, etc.

Aside from the fact that the XBox wouldn't display the entire image at 1080P from the VGA connector... we were losing over a foot of the image on the left side.

To keep the aspect ratio correct, they also had to crop the top and bottom of the image when viewing 1080P from the XBox.

This was frustrating because the HDDVD menu is always in the very bottom of the frame, so you couldn't control chapter selection, etc.

Yeah, and that was the main reason for trying to make the other sources work. To include, we wanted to have an HDMI option, and see what that would look like.

So it was a combined effort to look at all available sources, and to be able to judge between them all what was best. It would have been great to be able to dial custom resolutions out of that Crystalio. However, things did not turn out the way we had hoped. And the only thing that bothered me was that Crystalio. I would have been fine, but when someone had the same problem posted on a computer, then I started to get a bit pissed about that Crystalio. It's obvious that the manufacturer KNEW that unit was broke, yet they sent it to use regardless..:mad:

But it's all good still.. we had a great time!

For me, seeing those Marquees step above that high scan rate, made it for me..:cool:

Just for fun I have the judder poster child for all of you. If you can smooth it out you are there. Fight Club early in Ed Norton is describing the contents of his condo as the items and prices are overlayed as the camera pans across the room. Almost impossible to read at 60Hz.Here's Art's "Fight Club" judder test snippet:
http://crtforum.com/img/fight-club-thumbnail.jpg (http://crtforum.com/img/Fight_Club_judder_test.ts)
http://crtforum.com/img/Fight_Club_judder_test.ts (27 Mb)

And here's the judder test scene from the opening title of "Sahara":
http://crtforum.com/img/sahara-5sec.jpg (http://crtforum.com/img/sahara-5sec.ts)
http://crtforum.com/img/sahara-5sec.ts (10Mb)
http://crtforum.com/img/sahara-45sec.ts (83Mb)

I am not sure when this occured, after Mike figured out the settings
to get the MP xbox input to sync with the blend unit (about 1:30 am friday night)
we spent some time with the H width and position controls, and had good
success getting the image centered and sized, there was a few inches
lost on the left, but nowhere close to a foot - based on the xbox menu screen.
However the H controls were both maxed at this point. I can imagine after
another setup and perhaps using the non-modded xbox, that the overall
configuration had changed. Certainly we found that the blend unit does
a lot of work in the porches as you increase the active blend area,
(very frustrating with the geometry setup iterations!), and of course the H
position/size is working in the porch settings. And of course my favorite
position for a quiet moment is out on the back porch...hohoho!!!
Cheers,
Galen

there was a few inches lost on the left, but nowhere close to a foot - based on the xbox menu screen.

I can imagine after another setup and perhaps using the non-modded xbox, that the overall configuration had changed.The mod doesn't affect the 1080P VGA cropping issue. We used both... modded and unmodded.

I'm talking about Sunday afternoon, particularly with the "Seabiscuit" HDDVD main menu.

And with the "Sahara" HDDVD menu. It says "Play" on the very bottom... but we couldn't see it because of the zoom crop necessitated by the XBox360's 1080P VGA cropping issue. But it won't play if you press "Play" on the front panel nor if you press "Play" on the remote. You must press "OK" on the remote. :mad: Who's the genius HDDVD menu author that allows that on most HDDVDs?

The Xbox still had 60Hz judder, even when processed to 72 by the Crystalio and/or directly to the Blendzilla. Gino and I tried the Toshiba and XBox through the Crystalio and directly into the Blendzilla... all combinations still had judder on the Sahara test scene.

IMHO, you have to use the external XBox360 HDDVD USB drive on a HTPC at 71.928 to get the full image (no cropping) without judder.

Clarence,

What about if you use component or DVI out from the Xbox and transcode it into VGA? Same results or is this a VGA specific issue?

That's what I'm doing now. But 1080i component or DVI through a transcoder or deinterlaced to 1080p in a video processor like the Lumagen pales in comparison to straight 1080P HDMI.

To keep this on topic for William's setup, I think he should seek HDMI 1080p @71.928

But I think we all found out the hard way that's easier said than done. There always seems to be a hiccup in the video path...

The XBox360 cropped the 1080p image from VGA :(

The Crystalio II had the wrong HD colorspace :(

The Toshiba HD-A1 HDMI is only 1080i. The Gen2 players should be better... they do 1080p and I've heard the HDXA2 can also give 24p.

The PS3's 1080P HDMI wouldn't output though the dtrovision DVI converter. The component 1080i deinterlaced by a video processor to 1080p is much softer than HDMI 1080p. :( 1080p HDMI straight into moome's card was stunning. But then it's still 60Hz... I'd like to get it to 47.95 or 71.928.

A good HTPC might be able to do X360 HDDVD at 1920x1080p@71.928, but that won't help with other HD sources like HDTV.

I'm interested in trying HDMI from Ben's X360 Elite... I'll have to check to see if 1080P is an option.

I also wish that the blendzilla would support 1080P instead of 1440x1050. I don't think you'd notice except on a one-on/one-off alternating single-pixel line pattern, but it'd still be nice to eliminate every possible pixel manipulation.

That's what I'm doing now. But 1080i component or DVI through a transcoder or deinterlaced to 1080p in a video processor like the Lumagen pales in comparison to straight 1080P HDMI.

To keep this on topic for William's setup, I think he should seek HDMI 1080p @71.928

But I think we all found out the hard way that's easier said than done. There always seems to be a hiccup in the video path...

The XBox360 cropped the 1080p image from VGA :(

The Crystalio II had the wrong HD colorspace :(

The Toshiba HD-A1 HDMI is only 1080i. The Gen2 players should be better... they do 1080p and I've heard the HDXA2 can also give 24p.

The PS3's 1080P HDMI wouldn't output though the dtrovision DVI converter. The component 1080i deinterlaced by a video processor to 1080p is much softer than HDMI 1080p. :( 1080p HDMI straight into moome's card was stunning. But then it's still 60Hz... I'd like to get it to 47.95 or 71.928.

A good HTPC might be able to do X360 HDDVD at 1920x1080p@71.928, but that won't help with other HD sources like HDTV.

I'm interested in trying HDMI from Ben's X360 Elite... I'll have to check to see if 1080P is an option.

I also wish that the blendzilla would support 1080P instead of 1440x1050. I don't think you'd notice except on a one-on/one-off alternating single-pixel line pattern, but it'd still be nice to eliminate every possible pixel manipulation.

Yeah, I'd love to see 1200P at the very least.

Cliff

"The Toshiba HD-A1 HDMI is only 1080i. The Gen2 players should be better... they do 1080p and I've heard the HDXA2 can also give 24p."

Sadly, it can't do 24p yet. Supposedly this summer it will get a firmware update.

Thanks. Then I'm not going to rush out and upgrade from my HD-A1 yet.

I'll get the PS3 and/or flip my X360 to upgrade to the new Elite360 w/HDMI.

NautiKal,

Must say that I am very much impressed at your level of interest & all that you have acheived at such a young age. Did not really realize the nature of your attendance at the Kosman meet until I talked briefly with your father.

Sorry that we did not get a chance to talk but good luck with all future CRT endeavors. I vividly remember being around your age & getting laughed out of some high-end audio stores in the 70's. Kudos to your father as well for aiding you in pursuing your interest.

Now I am hoping I have this right & "NautiKal" was the young man that came out with his father from Rockviille. His substantive post here differ wildly from his appearance.
Yep that's me... I got a CRT projector when I was 15. I started doing research for a "big screen tv" in 2004 and went from a RPTV, to a digital projector, and then to a CRT projector after somehow finding Curt's site. Unfortunately I'm limited in what I can get though...both in terms of money and the fact that this is my parents' house after all (I couldn't paint the walls black for example).

One day I hope to have something similar to Gino, Art, Cliff or whoever else has that caliber HT. Gino's sound system sounded ridiculous when he was describing it back at the meet! Until then, it's 400$ speakers along with an XG in quite a ghetto home theater room (my chairs are a couch and there's black fabric on the floor to cover the white carpet for example :)). But hey, it works and the picture quality is far better than I imagined back in 2004...and its twice the size.

Cliff,

When we returned from dropping you & Arli off at the airport on Sunday afternoon, Gino had finished the re-setup from scratch. Ken did another color balance calibration and then Gino and Galen tweaked the blend curve.

Bottom line, the final results were 4.72x better than they were when you'd left a few hours earlier.

IMHO, the results from 6-9pm on Sunday night were still a bit less than the results that you and Ken achieved on your G90's. But considering that the projectors weren't even ceiling-mounted and the blendzilla wasn't even connected until Thurs/Friday, I think that the final result on Sunday was very good.




As Gino hinted earlier, if you attended on Saturday or left before the BBQ on Sunday, then you missed seeing how it really came together.

Cliff learned that it takes more than 6 hours or 6 days to climb the Blendzilla's steep learning curve. Galen was doing a good job. Gino made it look easier after applying what he'd learned during his 6 months of ownership.

MP did a great job with the mods. Gino was impressed when he was able to crank contrast to 100 without blooming when he was doing EM focus.

And Ken did another perfect job with the color balance... extremely critical, especially when you have 2 separate projectors sitting next to each other... the slightest color shift jumps out at you.

I'd also like to thank Cliff and Ken for touching up my G90... my sources and video chain have changed significantly in the past year. Plus I changed the screen and the new frame was an inch closer than the original setup. I've been too lazy to do anything much more than basic convergence touchups.

And for the past several months, I'd been worried by a cyclical drifting or orbiting every 5 seconds or so, my blue grid would drift about a pixel to the right, then drop down about a pixel to the bottom, then drift back in and repeat every 5 seconds or so. I showed it to Cliff and he said he saw something very similar when he placed a fan in his hushbox. He asked if I had a fan or anything in my ceiling mount. I said no, and then looked up and said the only thing on top of my projector is a UPS. Doh! As soon as we removed the UPS, the orbiting disappeared.

Cliff, Ken, Arli, Pete, and I had a lot of fun (too much fun) staying up until sunrise watching movies and sipping beverages... followed by a few rounds of Wii golf and bowling on Sunday morning.

Hi Clarence,
Guess I don't know what you saw there after we left, just wish I had
more time to carefully take pics of the setup I saw so we could compare
results....I do think there's some confusion about scaling, etc. though.
All the sources are 16:9, 2:35 material shown on the 2.35 screen is
just a slice out of the middle, maybe 8xx by1920. The Blender is
frustrating in that there's no easy way to do constant height setups
for a single input, it didn't allow us to load saved setup parameters.
(I felt better when Cliff mentioned he had discovered the same issue.)
So, as I understand it, we were scaling a 8xx by 1920 image slice onto
a 1050 by 2600 total screen (the output per PJ was 1050P x 1400)
Total H rez = 2 times 1400 = 2800, minus 200 blend zone overlap = 2600.
We had the same cropping issue with the output of the HTPC, although
with that it was easy to just move the task bar over to the side.
I guess every solution has some issues, I found it was really engaging
to be able to watch 2:35 material at full height, and the 12' wide wasn't
too shabby either....hohoho!
And I am finally getting to snack on my last momento of the event, a bowl
of chili from Dank's Deli in Middleburg - highly recommended!!
Let's just look in the cupboard for something to blend it with...!
Cheers,
Galen

Ruben,

Mikes modded XBox360 both for HD DVD playback.
Terry

Do we know what Mike does to the Xbox? I wonder how a stock Xbox would perform on its own? Does Mike sell his XBox mod?

Does Mike sell his XBox mod?

No.


Cliff,

When we returned from dropping you & Arli off at the airport on Sunday afternoon, Gino had finished the re-setup from scratch

Actually, Gino re-did the geometry. And both him and I worked on lens flapping and tightening up the focus on both of the Marquees. The focus was only off on the bottom of the right Marquee. The left Marquee was nearly perfect.

Focus was never an issue on this setup, though the entire process took me only about two hours to do both once they were installed on the ceiling. And the only thing that I worked on was the focus.

The image never had any sharpness issues. Gino was highly impressed with the level of detail they both produced the night before. We both were looking at how well they both displayed the very fine text on the screen, and they did it at 87khz at 72hz. Which has always been a real task for any CRT to do - until now...

Gino had finished the re-setup from scratchActually, Gino re-did the geometry.I'm sorry. I didn't mean to imply that Gino had to completely redo everything on his own without help from anyone and without building upon the majority of the previous setup which was expertly done.

I'll refrain from making any further comments about what I saw, who did what, the frustrating constraints of the sources, or anything that I thought could be improved upon.

Everyone did a great job. It really was a fun weekend. And dang, Wallace's BBQ was great!

Cliff,

When we returned from dropping you & Arli off at the airport on Sunday afternoon, Gino had finished the re-setup from scratch. Ken did another color balance calibration and then Gino and Galen tweaked the blend curve.

Bottom line, the final results were 4.72x better than they were when you'd left a few hours earlier.

IMHO, the results from 6-9pm on Sunday night were still a bit less than the results that you and Ken achieved on your G90's. But considering that the projectors weren't even ceiling-mounted and the blendzilla wasn't even connected until Thurs/Friday, I think that the final result on Sunday was very good.




As Gino hinted earlier, if you attended on Saturday or left before the BBQ on Sunday, then you missed seeing how it really came together.

Cliff learned that it takes more than 6 hours or 6 days to climb the Blendzilla's steep learning curve. Galen was doing a good job. Gino made it look easier after applying what he'd learned during his 6 months of ownership.

MP did a great job with the mods. Gino was impressed when he was able to crank contrast to 100 without blooming when he was doing EM focus.

And Ken did another perfect job with the color balance... extremely critical, especially when you have 2 separate projectors sitting next to each other... the slightest color shift jumps out at you.

I'd also like to thank Cliff and Ken for touching up my G90... my sources and video chain have changed significantly in the past year. Plus I changed the screen and the new frame was an inch closer than the original setup. I've been too lazy to do anything much more than basic convergence touchups.

And for the past several months, I'd been worried by a cyclical drifting or orbiting every 5 seconds or so, my blue grid would drift about a pixel to the right, then drop down about a pixel to the bottom, then drift back in and repeat every 5 seconds or so. I showed it to Cliff and he said he saw something very similar when he placed a fan in his hushbox. He asked if I had a fan or anything in my ceiling mount. I said no, and then looked up and said the only thing on top of my projector is a UPS. Doh! As soon as we removed the UPS, the orbiting disappeared.

Cliff, Ken, Arli, Pete, and I had a lot of fun (too much fun) staying up until sunrise watching movies and sipping beverages... followed by a few rounds of Wii golf and bowling on Sunday morning.

Dude,

That was that absolute LEAST I COULD DO considering your hospitality and great friendship. Your top notch big dog. :cool:

Bummer that I missed it tweaked out. What really sucks is our flight got delayed so we didn't take off until after 8:30. :mad:

Cliffy

Clarence. Sipping or chugging? :)

As some might say, this gathering was a CLASSIC!

BTW thanks for putting up all those all stars at your house. CRTers are really a big brotherhood.

Sipping or chugging? :)

CRTers are really a big brotherhood.Cliffy, I think Mark is poking fun at our beer bellies again. :p

Beer bellies, BBQ bellies, buffalo wing bellies (thanks emdawgz)...
Plus, I whipped up a big breakfast buffet, so now we have big breakfast buffet bellies.

I'm sorry. I didn't mean to imply that Gino had to completely redo everything on his own without help from anyone and without building upon the majority of the previous setup which was expertly done.

I'll refrain from making any further comments about what I saw, who did what, the frustrating constraints of the sources, or anything that I thought could be improved upon.

Everyone did a great job. It really was a fun weekend. And dang, Wallace's BBQ was great!

Why, I love to read your commentary on things. And there's nothing wrong with discussing things that could have been done better. After all, there seems to be an East Coast Blendzilla 2 already in the plans. So maybe there's still somethings to learn about sources and anything else as it relates to this thread and event. I think it would be great for discussion. It would surely help out the next event, if we know ahead of time. The only source device I was familiar with before this event, was the Xbox 360. Everything else was new to me and I knew nothing about the blend unit.

MP did a great job with the mods. Gino was impressed when he was able to crank contrast to 100 without blooming when he was doing EM focus.


WOW. What was involved in getting that? MP mods? Magnetic mods? Frankenyokes? :eek: :eek: :eek:

Just MP's latest greatest mods!!!

But wasn't those Thonsom focus yokes responsible for blooming? I never thought the neck boards could cause blooming...

WOW. What was involved in getting that? MP mods? Magnetic mods? Frankenyokes? :eek: :eek: :eek:

It's a combination of two things. First, the magnetics and coils are stock.

On any of the mods i've been doing the past two years, you should notice that you'll be able to crank the contrast up a bit before blooming. This is an indication of a clean video chain. Or better put, tighter video chain, because increasing the contrast will also raise the noise floor in the video chain. So some parts of that bloom is noise.

On the set of boards (mods) that's in those two Marquees, they are special. They were done specifically for this event.

But that's not all, you'll have to align the magnetics a certain way to bring this out. I was showing this to Terry and Galen.

In a day or so, I'll be posting screenshots of the blend setup. Just as with You and Gino, the emphasis will be on detail.

But wasn't those Thonsom focus yokes responsible for blooming?

No.

Not the yokes. Its the MP mods to the VIM and neck boards. Mike could answer whether its both or one. Regardless, the mods do raise the E-homes to a whole nother level. Eliminates a lot of noise from the image too.

A lot of BIG EGOS in CRT land. The meet was great, lots of fun, lots of learning. Things to criticize? A lot but everyone is holding back because of the danger of bruising egos. A lot of cooks in the kitchen. The biggest problem I think was the meet was too close to installation. One might say it was simultaneous with installation. There were problems with one of the projectors drifting and different aged tubes. The projectors were not mounted at the right distance because the sources were not there at the time of mounting. Time forced compromises. Equipment showing up at the last minute with problems. One of the two blendzillas was bad. The Crystalio was not right. Old gen HD-DVD player. Not the latest blu ray players. Not a lot of set up experience with the blendzilla except by Gino. All sorts of source problems. By the next meet, things will be perfect. Things were pretty damn good by Sunday evening. Everyone contributed and really enjoyed themselves.. To hell with egos. They only keep you from getting better. Let suggestions and criticisms fly. We still all be friends. :) I'll just keep wallowing in my negativity.

Oh, I forgot to mention. The video chain would not only have to be clean, it has to have higher bandwidth than the signal applied.

I was showing Gino the difference between the internal grid and the external test pattern grid from the laptop. The external grid should be used for this. in comparison, the internal grid would bloom less. While the external would be more difficult to keep from blooming.

Also, the goal to maintain the bloom is necessary for high bandwidth sources. If the video chain cannot maintain blooming at high brightness, it will not handle finer detail in brighter scenes. So the ability to maintain blooming at higher contrast adjustments, is very necessary for high bandwidth performance.

The projector are not really bright, but they do extremely well in bringing out that finer detail. And if you're able to capture finer detail in a screen-shot, it's in your face.

The biggest problem I think was the meet was too close to installation. One might say it was simultaneous with installation.IMHO, this was actually always the intent. Speaking with the host before the event, it was clear that the emphasis was on him seeing what would work together and what wouldn't. He wanted to see as many source options as possible to help him get a feel for what he should acquire and what he should avoid.

He invited us to his house to collaborate and contribute... at the end of the week I think we all have a MUCH better understanding of what works, what is close to working, and what will never work.

We learned a lot more in this past weekend than we could learn from a year of rambling in a thread called "what HD sources and processors should be used to provide top-notch PQ on a 12' wide CRT setup?"

The host wasn't simply inviting us to see the finished product. Instead, we were graciously invited to watch over the shoulders as the whole cake started to bake. We got to lick the batter as it cooked. And yes, it took longer to bake than the recipe indicated.

The chefs took 2 separate sheet cakes and placed them side-by-side with nary a seam. They got the base layer of icing on the cake, but they never got to put the fancy flowers and flourishes on before everyone jumped in and grabbed several pieces.

Now we're hearing the taste tests... needed a pinch of salt... too much sugar. And suprisingly, maybe a squeeze of lemon.

OBTW, I never knew that Grand Marnier and milk/cream could make such a smooth margarita.

He means maintain NON blooming,

IMHO, this was actually always the intent. Speaking with the host before the event, it was clear that the emphasis was on him seeing what would work together and what wouldn't. He wanted to see as many source options as possible to help him get a feel for what he should acquire and what he should avoid.

He invited us to his house to collaborate and contribute... at the end of the week I think we all have a MUCH better understanding of what works, what is close to working, and what will never work.

We learned a lot more in this past weekend than we could learn from a year of rambling in a thread called "what HD sources and processors should be used to provide top-notch PQ on a 12' wide CRT setup?"

The host wasn't simply inviting us to see the finished product. Instead, we were graciously invited to watch over the shoulders as the whole cake started to bake. We got to lick the batter as it cooked. And yes, it took longer to bake than the recipe indicated.

The chefs took 2 separate sheet cakes and placed them side-by-side with nary a seam. They got the base layer of icing on the cake, but they never got to put the fancy flowers and flourishes on before everyone jumped in and grabbed several pieces.

Now we're hearing the taste tests... needed a pinch of salt... too much sugar. And suprisingly, maybe a squeeze of lemon.

OBTW, I never knew that Grand Marnier and milk/cream could make such a smooth margarita.

Damn dude, you need to start writing for a living!!! Too Cool!!!! :D ;)

Cliffy

I do not think we had the right sources. We did not have the latest gen HD-DVD and Blu Ray. We had a sick Cystalio. I am sure one of the intents was indeed to compare sources. But IMNSHO the intent was to have the projectors up, aligned, geometricized, blended, calibrated yad yada YADA before the meet started on Sauturday. That was the intent. That didn't happen. Now everything was combined, trying differentr sources while doing everything else. Not the way to do it. Once again, time got too compressed as I and others knew it would. **** happens. No one's fault and yet at the same time the fault of many. But the faults were eseentially harmless given the great time had by all.

Squeeze of lime, not lemon. Grand Marnier adds refinement and a slight orange taste to the mix. The cold milk, that was an ingredient I have never seen used in the drink. It indeed added smoothness and a touch or a creamy texture. I learned and it will go into my chain of ingredients not to mention marinating brisket in Dr. Pepper.

Everyone was invited to bring sources. I brought the HD-A1... if I had a gen2, I would've brought it. Cliff brought the PS3 from Chicago... if he had a better BD player, he would've brought it.

I think we were lacking in the HDCP arena. My internal G90 devices weren't usable in a Marquee. And due to a Toshiba bug that wasn't fixed until yesterday (in firmware v2.2), the HD-A1's HDMI didn't work with the dtrovision DVI stripper. We'd hoped to have moome's latest external box, but that didn't materialize.

The Crystalio wasn't sick, it's flawed with the wrong colorspace for HD.

I think the whole weekend is fairly representative of buying a bunh of stuff only to find out that half of it doesn't work like you hope, or only works 80% with everything else you have.

Everyone was invited to bring sources. I brought the HD-A1... if I had a gen2, I would've brought it. Cliff brought the PS3 from Chicago... if he had a better BD player, he would've brought it.

I think we were lacking in the HDCP arena. My internal G90 devices weren't usable in a Marquee. And due to a Toshiba bug that wasn't fixed until yesterday (in firmware v2.2), the HD-A1's HDMI didn't work with the dtrovision DVI stripper. We'd hoped to have moome's latest external box, but that didn't materialize.

The Crystalio wasn't sick, it's flawed with the wrong colorspace for HD.

I think the whole weekend is fairly representative of buying a bunh of stuff only to find out that half of it doesn't work like you hope, or only works 80% with everything else you have.

Yep. I would have loved to bring my ISS switcher with the latest moome input card like you have in your G90 that I use to power the stack and all of those problems would have dissapeared.

Unfortunately, my baggage would only hold the PS3. It's bad enough that security ravaged through my luggage because I brought that!

By no means is the Toshiba A1 flawed in any way and they rank the PS3 blue ray playback among the Elite of BD players.

Yes, the A1 is only 1080i, but with the right scaler, it's absolutely stunning.

I'm not going to even think about getting started on the whole 72hz vs. 60hz thing.

ANYBODY WHO PUSHES THE ISSUE WITH ME, I'LL JUST PUT MY FINGERS IN MY EARS AND SCREAM BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH!!!!!! :p ;) :D

Cliffy

I live in BBQ country, and that was the best BBQ I have ever had. That and Wallace's "special" BBQ sauce.

Terry

Terry,
Thanks for the compliment! I'll pm you the bbq sauce recipe this weekend.

wallace

Cliffy sticking his fingers in some orifices in his body and screaming is something I do not want to see or hear. So please let's make it 48 or 60. :)

What a family we have huh? :^)
Cliffy

Cliff,
Outstanding family!!! Just let me know if anyone needs any cooking or drink making done.. :D

Really cool time, and really cool to meet you guys. Hope some of the jerky made it back home...

wallace

Cliff,
Outstanding family!!! Just let me know if anyone needs any cooking or drink making done.. :D

Really cool time, and really cool to meet you guys. Hope some of the jerky made it back home...

wallace

Wallace,

My family destroyed it. It's almost all gone already. :(

Thanks so much big dog!! Absolute best jerky I have ever put in my mouth!

Guess what I've been doing to the wife after eating it??? Ever done the pull the covers over the head gig? :eek: :D ;)

Cliffy

I would like to know who threw out my margherita and beer when I went to the can.... I'll wait....Just kiddin. Thanks Don. Steve

You know it wasn't ME who threw out any drink! But I do recall some "whining" when the margaritas were out... :eek:

Hey, I'm ready to go for it again! I have a bunch of other drink recipes as well as (ok, here I go blasting my big ass mouth as Cliff would say) the best beef fajitas you ever had! :cool:

wallace

Ever done the pull the covers over the head gig? :eek: :D ;)

Cliffy

You dog!!! I just fell out of the effing chair when I read that. Damn right! No good marriage is complete without the "cover over the head" trick. Really good when it's an SPD (silent but deadly).

Dude, you crack me up!!!

wallace

Thanks for the effort, nicely done! and for the most excellent demo disc!
There are and will be a ton of technical details about this to learn and
discuss - and different people have different ways of expressing themselves
and some of us can get pretty wrapped up in whether exact numbers
thrown out as descriptions make good engineering sense ( ...who me....?)
I like the story about the UPS on the PJ, I had that squirelly picture thing
on my nice Viewsonic years ago and chased that problem forever....!
Cheers,
Galen

Turns out I had one good picture, must have been Thursday night, before
the lack of sleep and caffeine OD kicked in, Terry is actually smiling....
Although I still don't get how to get around the pixel limit of avs?

William (wkosmann), JBJR, MP, Gino (with remote), John (emdawgz), Mark Conner (damon), Pete (zphoto), Ken W (the jedi calibrator), Mark Haflich, and I'm not sure about the last guy in the black shirt...
http://img157.imageshack.us/img157/276/zilla2lw2.jpg

That was one of William's sons.

Everything was coming out of the Blendzilla at 72 Hz.

We tried the Toshiba HD-A1 directly into the blendzilla and got slight judder.

Guys, 72Hz doesn't judder. I bet if you got 72Hz out of that sahara scene from the source, you wouldn't have a problem. When Andres had his htpc setup to output this correctly, it was the most fluid film I had ever seen, almost like watching video material.

Despite the DVX outputting 1400x1050@72, the problem was that it was being fed at 60Hz. I've said it before that I'm not impressed with the DVX's deinterlacing ability, and I don't think it even does 3:2, and this is why it wasn't displayed smoothly. For best results with the DVX, it should not be set to an internal rate of 72Hz, but rather set to sync with or follow the input source rate, so if you can feed it 72Hz, it will lock with it and you'll get judder free playback.

Hope this clears up this issue.

Turns out I had one good picture, must have been Thursday night, before the lack of sleep and caffeine OD kicked in, Terry is actually smiling....
http://img183.imageshack.us/img183/9826/terryandmikesmbw9.jpg
:)

Squeeze of lime, not lemon. Grand Marnier adds refinement and a slight orange taste to the mix. The cold milk, that was an ingredient I have never seen used in the drink. It indeed added smoothness and a touch or a creamy texture. I learned and it will go into my chain of ingredients not to mention marinating brisket in Dr. Pepper.

Grand Marnier gives it the "top shelf" drink. Dr Pepper for the marinade, I can't take credit for that. Just using a recipe that someone gave me when we lived in Texass.

Glad you enjoyed it; my pleasure for sure!

wallace

the second was Gino. This guy has an eye. To not be someone who's either trained or has extensive experience with this stuff, he has this ability to see stuff with the image, that leaves you wondering, how did he acquire this skill in such short time.

Amazing guy!

And of course, those Marquee's..:D
Geez, thanks for the kudos guys, especially from you MP. I did keep hearing that I had an eye for this, I think it is my drive/passion for top PQ, and the fact that I'm a dentist means that I'm always looking at things under a microscope and going for best aesthetics possible.

As I told others at the meet, because I am so remote and I couldn't get anyone to help me out, I had to learn this all myself, and this pushed me to learn it as well as I can, but I'm still pushing and learning. This trip was the first time I had seen another CRT projector besides my own, so it was always something in the back of my mind whether I was doing CRT's justice.

I don't have time to chat, Jess has been really supportive and wonderful this trip that I'm taking her around NY shopping and wining and dining as deep as my wallet can go. But I'll start a thread of my own when I return home as there are many people I need to thank.

That was one of William's sons.That makes sense. I met the wreck from Ga Tech. That must be the Hokie brethren from Va Tech.

I did keep hearing that I had an eye for this, I think it is my drive/passion for top PQ, and the fact that I'm a dentist means that I'm always looking at things under a microscope and going for best aesthetics possible.That's exactly what Art told me when I talked to him on the phone... he said being a dentist means you're anal-retentive about details. And that's a perfect trait for AV.

From my standpoint, this whole weekend was like watching the Discovery channel when a bunch of the BEST surgeons get together. There were so many times when someone would finish doing their part and just say, "Ok, your next". Then, that person would step in and do their part.

If something was wrong before, or changed because of new settings of other adjustments, it was "just fixed"! GIT-R-DONE! Thats what it amounted to.

Truly amazing to watch a bunch of people dedicated to something 110% and strive for the best outcome.

Damn I wish this stuff would happen more often.

Top shelf!

wallace

Well Ladies and Gentlemen;

So many people to thank. Mike, without whom this isn't possible, and who has been unbelievably generous with his time and expertise. John, for driving down many times, always being there, modden the Xbox, fixen a 1000 other problems, and maken the Belden 1694 RGBHV cables. Terry and Galen, who drove up from Atlanta to rescue us when everything was falling apart, and who, with Mike, mounted two 9" CRTs in one day. Ruben, who busted his ass to get me the brand new first in the world SmX screen frame in time for the Meet. Wallace, who smoked up the best pork and beef barbeque, beef jerky, and margaritas in the frikken universe. Ken, who calibrated again, and again, and again, and again, and never complained, not once. Gino, who flew all around the world, then worked like hell on Sunday to give the system one more college try, and ended up contributing in a major way to creating the best image we got. Jess, for putting up with theater after theater after theater, with grace and style, and a smile on her face all the time. Clarence for bringing the Toshiba, the HD DVD clips, the cables, and the stripper (sorry Cliffy, she came on Friday). Cliffy for bringing the PS3, our only Bluray player. And for everyone who flew, drove or walked to the Meet, who enjoyed themselves, and who hopefully got something out of the gathering. If I have forgotten anyone, it is not intentional.

I have not been posting since the end of the meet, as I have been in tear down mode, alone. Boxed up and shipped are the bad BlendZilla (to Analog Way), a red and a blue CRT (to Tim), a box of cables (to Galen and Terry), the bad Crystalio II (to Pixel Magic), and the SmX Pro Frame sample (to Ruben). A pile of stuff for Mike sits on the bumper pool table, awaiting his next arrival. Still have to pull John's cables through the ceiling conduit, so that only enough is left to hook up to the projectors. Then, Tim's BlendZilla, the new HTPC, and the new modded Xbox 360 have to be set up in the equipment rack, cables connected, and everything tested.

The Home Theater is not operational at this point. As soon as it is, I will take an image of each CRT raster, while something at 2.35:1 is being projected. I have followed with great interest the debate as to whether moving the projectors forward 5 or so inches closer to the screen will increase light output noticably. This is not an academic discussion, as the first thing Mike and I were going to do is remove the projectors from the ceiling and remount them closer to the screen. Would hate to do that and not see any benefit.

Mike has already spilled the beans, so I will amplify a little. I feel badly that we were not completely done with installation and setup before the Meet started. That had been the original intent. I would like to make it up to everyone who came, by offering to host another East Coast BlendZilla Meet, in like October, say the 20th/21st. Picture in your mind's eye driving down the driveway with the 20 Norweigen maples in full bloom, a dazzling display of every hue imaginable from red to orange to yellow, on the way to a fully optimized twin Electrohome Extreme BlendZilla setup, projecting (from source to screen) only 1080P/72 native, via either HD DVD or Bluray. Mike standing on the side, beaming at his babies. Ken already having finished his work, able to sit there and simply enjoy the result. Clarence challenging the rig with the nastiest, most difficult to correctly process clips he can find, and the rig properly responding with ease. Mark challenging everything. Cliffy challenging everyone (and playing his favorite scene from Crank). Don's cooking hanging in the cool crisp autumn air.

The Mars orbiter aeronomy mission proposal I have been working on for almost 2 years is due to NASA on October 19. The 20th seems like a good day to start a party................

William

Guys, 72Hz doesn't judder. I bet if you got 72Hz out of that sahara scene from the source, you wouldn't have a problem. When Andres had his htpc setup to output this correctly, it was the most fluid film I had ever seen, almost like watching video material.

Despite the DVX outputting 1400x1050@72, the problem was that it was being fed at 60Hz. I've said it before that I'm not impressed with the DVX's deinterlacing ability, and I don't think it even does 3:2, and this is why it wasn't displayed smoothly. For best results with the DVX, it should not be set to an internal rate of 72Hz, but rather set to sync with or follow the input source rate, so if you can feed it 72Hz, it will lock with it and you'll get judder free playback.

Hope this clears up this issue.

BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH on the 72hz thing! :D

Anywho, my buddy at work that I was telling you about says you look just like Bruce Lee.

I have to agree.

Your kind of cute. I'd HIT IT!!!! (JUST KIDDING DAMNIT!)

Here is to that flight to Aussie that I hope to take one day soon and BTW, here is the link to that band I bragged about so much:

http://www.aussiefloyd.com/

You must see them if you get the chance. Unreal they are! :)

Cliffy

Well Ladies and Gentlemen;

So many people to thank. Mike, without whom this isn't possible, and who has been unbelievably generous with his time and expertise. John, for driving down many times, always being there, modden the Xbox, fixen a 1000 other problems, and maken the Belden 1694 RGBHV cables. Terry and Galen, who drove up from Atlanta to rescue us when everything was falling apart, and who, with Mike, mounted two 9" CRTs in one day. Ruben, who busted his ass to get me the brand new first in the world SmX screen frame in time for the Meet. Wallace, who smoked up the best pork and beef barbeque, beef jerky, and margaritas in the frikken universe. Ken, who calibrated again, and again, and again, and again, and never complained, not once. Gino, who flew all around the world, then worked like hell on Sunday to give the system one more college try, and ended up contributing in a major way to creating the best image we got. Jess, for putting up with theater after theater after theater, with grace and style, and a smile on her face all the time. Clarence for bringing the Toshiba, the HD DVD clips, the cables, and the stripper (sorry Cliffy, she came on Friday). Cliffy for bringing the PS3, our only Bluray player. And for everyone who flew, drove or walked to the Meet, who enjoyed themselves, and who hopefully got something out of the gathering. If I have forgotten anyone, it is not intentional.

I have not been posting since the end of the meet, as I have been in tear down mode, alone. Boxed up and shipped are the bad BlendZilla (to Analog Way), a red and a blue CRT (to Tim), a box of cables (to Galen and Terry), the bad Crystalio II (to Pixel Magic), and the SmX Pro Frame sample (to Ruben). A pile of stuff for Mike sits on the bumper pool table, awaiting his next arrival. Still have to pull John's cables through the ceiling conduit, so that only enough is left to hook up to the projectors. Then, Tim's BlendZilla, the new HTPC, and the new modded Xbox 360 have to be set up in the equipment rack, cables connected, and everything tested.

The Home Theater is not operational at this point. As soon as it is, I will take an image of each CRT raster, while something at 2.35:1 is being projected. I have followed with great interest the debate as to whether moving the projectors forward 5 or so inches closer to the screen will increase light output noticably. This is not an academic discussion, as the first thing Mike and I were going to do is remove the projectors from the ceiling and remount them closer to the screen. Would hate to do that and not see any benefit.

Mike has already spilled the beans, so I will amplify a little. I feel badly that we were not completely done with installation and setup before the Meet started. That had been the original intent. I would like to make it up to everyone who came, by offering to host another East Coast BlendZilla Meet, in like October, say the 20th/21st. Imagine driving down the driveway with the 20 Norweigen maples in full bloom, a dazzling display of every hue imaginable from red to orange to yellow, on the way to a fully optimized twin Electrohome Extreme BlendZilla setup, projecting (from source to screen) only 1080P/72 native, via either HD DVD or Bluray. Mike standing on the side, beaming at his babies. Ken already having finished his work, able to sit there and simply enjoy the result. Clarence challenging the rig with the nastiest, most difficult to correctly process clips he can find, and the rig properly responding with ease. Mark challenging everything. Cliffy challenging everyone (and playing his favorite scene from Crank). Don's cooking hanging in the cool crisp autumn air.

The Mars orbiter aeronomy mission proposal I have been working on for almost 2 years is due to NASA on October 19. The 20th seems like a good day to start a party................

William

William, your amazing. I couldn't have put it better myself. What an extremely kick ass guy you are and I am so glad from top to bottom that I met you.

Words couldn't describe you. :cool:

Your that damn cool! ;)

Cliffy

Great to hear from you William, really enjoyed our visit!
I could go for 2 or 3 days just asking about all the very cool
space projects in your office! What an outstanding fellow....
Just one raster pic will be fine, red or blue is best since
they will have a little bit of horizontal keystone
It will be interesting to follow up on that aspect. It would
also be fun to follow up on Gino's suggestion to run the
HTPC at 72Hz (71.928), I had wanted to try that while
we were there but never got around to it. I have tried it
here and it definitely helps with film material, but of course
the projector is squealing at that point. Which is a problem
you will clearly not have to worry about - thanks to Mike!
Fall sounds great, and as we say in the south - ya'll come see us....
Regards,
Galen

Last night I took a bit of time and converted a VIM to what we had at the meet. This VIM is new to my 8500. And we're using the same camera and everything. With only the camera being a bit further back this time.

This version of the mods I had planned to announce at the meet. That did not happen for one reason or the other. It was being called "extreme." It's should from now on be called SV2, which is short for Super version2.


Marquee 8500 / Xbox 360 HD-DVD / 1920x1080P /60hz
http://img508.imageshack.us/img508/9982/hpim1830oh0.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img504.imageshack.us/img504/7299/hpim1831qr6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img227.imageshack.us/img227/9004/hpim1832td0.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img100.imageshack.us/img100/5308/hpim1833xe2.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img149.imageshack.us/img149/2893/hpim1836pk6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img501.imageshack.us/img501/4628/hpim1838co6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img501.imageshack.us/img501/2016/hpim1842ta9.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img144.imageshack.us/img144/8994/hpim1845ch2.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img144.imageshack.us/img144/2595/hpim1846gl1.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

I cannot escape the feeling I have left my black levels and details
up in ol' Virginny....hohoho!!! Its going to be very difficult to be
satisfied with a stock 9500Ultra - and who woulda thunk it....
G

Heh, I hear ya. I've got my mods on order and am eagerly awaiting seeing everything that the mods have to offer :)

Don's cooking hanging in the cool crisp autumn air.
William

In that crisp autumn air, I can smell some "Deep Fried Turkey, Hot Buttered Rum drinks" (with another secret ingredient), and some other good stuff!

Can't wait.

wallace

You are the man!
I recall getting up early Sat AM, and glancing out the
bedroom window to see you carrying in a tray of meat the
size of a poweramp!, and then a few minutes later, another
one....way to go!
G

I cannot escape the feeling I have left my black levels and details
up in ol' Virginny....hohoho!!! Its going to be very difficult to be
satisfied with a stock 9500Ultra - and who woulda thunk it....
G


And a pair of your sneakers??? :eek: :D


John

Here's a few screen shots from Saturday. Sorry for the delay. Work has been hell and we're getting ready for the American Cancer Society Relay for Life this weekend (see my signature).

These are from Happy Feet. I'm prettu sure it was the Toshiba to the Blendzilla, but someone correct me if I'm wrong.
Ben, tell me if your shots were worse than mine. ;)

http://img144.imageshack.us/img144/5646/img0518tb4.jpg

http://img511.imageshack.us/img511/5263/img0519ud4.jpg

http://img355.imageshack.us/img355/8635/img0522ed5.jpg

http://img175.imageshack.us/img175/6769/img0526lf1.jpg