I'm actually trying to keep exterior sound and some occasional bass from getting into one of my rooms (stucco exterior, 3/8 drywall, blow-in insulation, Milgard classic dual pane w/3/16/ and 1/8 glass). I also get airplane and train noise too :rolleyes: .

The window helped, but it seems the simplest/ cheapest wall solution seems to be green glue and an extra layer of 5/8 sheetrock, but being a cheap sob I'm wondering if folks who've used it can comment on its effectiveness (and consistency). To those that have used it, do you think that using a high quality 50 year caulk might have yielded the same results? I'd be very curious to see the stc result using DAP dynaflex or similar.

I've contacted DAP (the maker of many common lines of caulking products) and none were ever rated/tested/qualified/intended for acoustical purposes, though that doesn't imply anything about their acoustical purpose suitability.

By the way, where is the cheapest place to just get 8 tubes or so of the green glue?

You can get Green Glue from the manufacturer.
There is only one other product like this on the market from Quiet Solutions.
I suggest you visit www.greengluecompany.com and look at the various acoustic tests and alternatives

Hey, my walls are textured. Does that mean I need to buy more GG?

Anybody have 1 tube of the stuff they want to sell me?

50 year caulk is great for caulking. it is for seams in wallboard etc. it is NOT a substitute for Green glue they are two different animals. No more than putting heating oil in your cars gas tank is an alternative.

50 year caulk is great for caulking. it is for seams in wallboard etc. it is NOT a substitute for Green glue they are two different animals. No more than putting heating oil in your cars gas tank is an alternative.

Yeah but you must admit with so many caulks and adhesives out there, it's reasonable to assume that a few of them would have similar stc benefits.

So has anyone used the Quiet Solutions brand of caulk? and if so would you recomend it as a substitute for green glue?

Just imagine getting a case of caulk for 12 bucks in-stead of 200 and having the same results. Somebody with a sound lab... help!!!!

Edit. Ok, did some more digging. I've derived that you at least get 3 or so STC advantage from using a non-rigid type adhesive or silicone. I'm going to use one of the higher end latex caulks that stays flexible and also has good adhesive capabilities and try it out. I know I'll get at least some improvement from adding the 5/8 sheetrock anyway.

Look everyone this is the second post ive ever made,and still nobody replied to my first.....i might just have to cry :(

Look everyone this is the second post ive ever made,and still nobody replied to my first.....i might just have to cry :(

Green glue is the product most choose for this type of application........you might want to start a new thread asking about Quiet Solutions as it probably get more visibility.

peanut butter! Read some of the other threads on this forum. :)

It doesn't make much sense to me to take all the time to apply something if you have no idea if it is going to make a difference, even if it is cheap to purchase. Especially since you can't easily undo and redo it with something else later on.

If you find GG to be too expensive then just go the double layer of drywall and be done. Otherwise, go the GG route and know you've made an improvement. I don't recall seeing anything about GG when I did my room about 4 years ago. But I would have probably gone that route if it was available, at least for the ceiling.

peanut butter! Read some of the other threads on this forum. :)


YES! I concur. :D :D :D

YES! I concur. :D :D :D


I can't recall if it was Xtra Crunchy or the Smooth...hmm :confused:

:D

A couple tests to look at:

http://www.greengluecompany.com/greenGlue-vs-engineeredDampedGlue.php

http://www.greengluecompany.com/greenGlue-vs-ConstructionAdhesive.php

If you find GG to be too expensive then just go the double layer of drywall and be done. Otherwise, go the GG route and know you've made an improvement. I don't recall seeing anything about GG when I did my room about 4 years ago. But I would have probably gone that route if it was available, at least for the ceiling.


Spot on. Nothing is cheaper than free. You do a good benefit, measured and verified, from doubling the drywall w/o green glue - if that's all your budget can handle, do that. If you can do more, but can't afford the optimal 3 GG tubes/sheet then there are quantified reports on the GG website showing benefits at 1 or 2 tubes per sheet - or look at QG, as viable alternatives.

Just because it comes in a caulk gun tube doesn't mean you can substitute any thing that comes in a tube and expect results.

Yeah but you must admit with so many caulks and adhesives out there, it's reasonable to assume that a few of them would have similar stc benefits.
No, it is a false assumption. The physical characteristics of a CLD material and a caulk are entirely different and must be so.

OK, well it looks like I'm going to put my $$ behind my own hybrid solution.
Note, I may run GG on a small wall just to try it out, but DANG it's expensive!

I've done even more digging and it looks like I'll be going with my own hybrid solution. Tests by Greenglue show that non flexible adhesive detract from performance, while damped glue that remains flexible yields 3+ stc damping improvement. While this is not as effective as GG, you can get a permanently flexible caulk for $3 per tube in-stead of $20. I'm going to go with Dap Dynaflex 50 year caulk.

I also looked at results with quietrock, and the schematics clearly show that their high-end product is a sandwich of sheetrock, two layers of damped glue, and center layer of closed cell foam.

Most of my sound is coming from one 8'x16' wall.
Closed cell foam that's sold for pergo type floor installs ($50), 8 tubes of dynaflex ($30), and 4 sheets of 5/8 sheetrock ($50), Drywall screws ($10). Not bad, when you consider that one case of GG costs 200 bucks!

Nuff said!

http://www.cartoonstock.com/newscartoons/cartoonists/mba/lowres/mban1789l.jpg

OK, well it looks like I'm going to put my $$ behind my own hybrid solution.
Note, I may run GG on a small wall just to try it out, but DANG it's expensive!

I've done even more digging and it looks like I'll be going with my own hybrid solution. Tests by Greenglue show that non flexible adhesive detract from performance, while damped glue that remains flexible yields 3+ stc damping improvement. While this is not as effective as GG, you can get a permanently flexible caulk for $3 per tube in-stead of $20. I'm going to go with Dap Dynaflex 50 year caulk.

I also looked at results with quietrock, and the schematics clearly show that their high-end product is a sandwich of sheetrock, two layers of damped glue, and center layer of closed cell foam.

Most of my sound is coming from one 8'x16' wall.
Closed cell foam that's sold for pergo type floor installs ($50), 8 tubes of dynaflex ($30), and 4 sheets of 5/8 sheetrock ($50), Drywall screws ($10). Not bad, when you consider that one case of GG costs 200 bucks!

I'll just offer some constructive criticism...

A) I think you forgot something in your analysis... You must be comparing 10oz. tubes of the Dynaflex to 29oz. tubes of Green Glue. You'll need three tunes to cover a sheet of drywall and to equal the amount in one tube of GG.

Update your numbers and now you're talking about $9 per (3) tubes of Dynaflex vs. $14.48/tube of Green Glue (including AVS discount shipping to my zip code... To put it another way, Dynaflex offers you a savings of 62% over Green Glue.

B) Where do you see that the DAP product will perform anything like the "Engineered Damping Glue" referred to in the Green Glue testing? From what I can tell, it's not necessarily damped at all - it's probably mostly elastic.

C) How do you know the DAP product will improve the isolation characteristics of your wall assembly... or accomplish anything at all? Since you're using a completely unknown material (no test data), that you're willing to spend 62% of what it costs to get a proven product doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

I was like you once - it seems so expensive on the surface (excuse the pun). But, in the grand scheme, it's really not. I say, use the Green Glue or use nothing at all.

SC

You guys all know that i copyrighted the use of peanut butter in sound control and i get a quarter every time someone does it, right?

I've made $1.75 so far, but i'm facing a 4 million dollar lawsuit over this apartment complex that's rotting now... :P

The best substitute for Green Glue on a lower budget is less Green Glue. In independent lab tests Green Glue applied at 1 tube per 4x8 sheet and even 1/2 tube per 4x8 sheet considerably outperform Quiet Glue, the details are online if anybody wants to see them.

Also, it needs to be said that you don't need any Green Glue to make a good wall, there are alot of ways to go about that. Staggered studs or double studs or sound clips like RSIC, ISOMAX, and future products are good choices too. If you opt for clips, remove existing drywall from the side of the wall that the clips will go onto and make 1 big air cavity instead of 2 little ones. Use double drywall on the clips as weight is a HUGE help with clips and stopping low-freq noise.

There are alot of ways to stop sound, GG is one, but only one, and very often its the best choice and sometimes it isn't.

But there is a tangible risk in a shot-gun approach to adhesives and layers in between drywall on walls. And that is that the results of adding an adhesive to walls can range from making things quite a bit worse, to a whole lot better.

On one end of that scale is boring old normal adhesives like liquid nails or epoxy or something - in a ind lab test, a 2x4 wall with double 5/8" drywall on both sides and fiberglass insulation got STC=45. With conventional drywall adhesive, it was <40, with a competitive damping glue it was 44, 45, and 46 in 3 tests with 1/2, 5/8, and 5/8 drywall (double drywall both sides), and with GG it was 56.

The trick to constrained layer damping applications is that they are very particular. As an example, GG is good in its intended applications, but would not be the damping material of choice for various other applications, and the odds of finding something that would meet all of the relevant properties are zero - as by nature having these properties makes a mateiral not well suited for really any other use. For example, GG would probably be a pretty poor choice of caulk, but typical acoustical sealants like USGs would perform closer to liquid nails (worse) than GG if used like GG. So GG = crappy caulk but great soundproofing material, caulk = great caulk but crappy soundproofing material.

But if you're on a budget, one of the nice things about GG is that using less is more cost effective (but not as good in absolute terms). We have just one test with 25% coverage (1/2 tube per sheet) and it did pretty well. at reduced coverage, GG is a small fraction of the overall cost of building the wall and a nice bargain.

But again, you don't need to use GG at all if you simply don't want to... but its risky to take a shotgun approach to putting things in walls.

As an alternative suggestion, remove existing drywall, add 2x2's in front of the plates you have now, and make a staggered stud wall. Then add 2 layers of drywlal if budget allows.

To compare apples to apples...
(I modified the amount of Dynaflex per sheet to nearly match the amount of 1 tube of GG per sheet)

Most of my sound is coming from one 8'x16' wall.
Closed cell foam that's sold for pergo type floor installs ($50), 12 tubes of dynaflex ($36), and 4 sheets of 5/8 sheetrock ($50), Drywall screws ($10). Not bad, when you consider that one case of GG costs 200 bucks!
Total...$146

1 case (12 tubes) of GreenGlue ($180 shipped), 4 sheets of 5/8" ($50), Drywall screws ($10), sale of 8 tubes of GG to another AVS member (-$100)... Total $140.

The DAP/floating floor foam doesn't look like that great of a deal, does it?

SC

Anyone else think a lot of confusion could be eliminated if Green Glue didn't have the word "glue" in its name?

(raises hand)

I'll just offer some constructive criticism...

A) I think you forgot something in your analysis... You must be comparing 10oz. tubes of the Dynaflex to 29oz. tubes of Green Glue. You'll need three tunes to cover a sheet of drywall and to equal the amount in one tube of GG.


WHoa... the GG tubes are 29 oz? I didn't realize that! That really throws a wrench in my value conclusion (incorrect!).

OK OK OK I'll take the 8 tubes of GG! :) But of course, now I'm wondering if I'm losing some potential energy cost savings (thermal) if I skip the foam!??? :eek:

I would think the R-value in a 1/8" thick piece of foam would be negligible - probably less than R-1 ... and not much better than whatever the Green Glue-imposed gap (and the Green Glue itself) offers. Neither would probably do much of anything.

The Green Glue guys need to put something in the pictures of the tubes for scale or add some big red type or something so people realize how big those tubes are! You're not the first to be surprised that they're not the typical 10oz tubes.

SC

50 year caulk is great for caulking. it is for seams in wallboard etc. it is NOT a substitute for Green glue they are two different animals. No more than putting heating oil in your cars gas tank is an alternative.

If your car runs on diesel then putting in home heating oil not only works but it is cheaper. They are essentially the same product with the exception of a colorant added as home heating oil isn't taxed as much as diesel fuel. Usually the boys in blue check for this at weigh stations so truckers on rare occasions can get away with it but cars are never checked.

If you do some homework even many municipalities break federal laws in this regard...

Hey, my walls are textured. Does that mean I need to buy more GG?

No, it means you should remove the texture with a texture remover or put a skim coat of light plaster over the texture to smooth out the wall.

If your car runs on diesel then putting in home heating oil not only works but it is cheaper. They are essentially the same product with the exception of a colorant added as home heating oil isn't taxed as much as diesel fuel. Usually the boys in blue check for this at weigh stations so truckers on rare occasions can get away with it but cars are never checked.

If you do some homework even many municipalities break federal laws in this regard...

WTF. Are you going to get that technical. Obviously McCall was referring to a gasoline powered vehicle not diesel.

50 year caulk is great for caulking. it is for seams in wallboard etc. it is NOT a substitute for Green glue they are two different animals. No more than putting heating oil in your cars gas tank is an alternative.

Heating oil is diesel fuel. I put that in my car every month.

jondotcom,

If you can afford a home in the Bay area, buck up for the GG. If not, sell your home, move to the midwest, and GG the entire mansion you get with the money you save. :)

Scott

jondotcom,

If you can afford a home in the Bay area, buck up for the GG. If not, sell your home, move to the midwest, and GG the entire mansion you get with the money you save. :)

Scott

Hahaha just saw this :p . My house is only 1100 sq feet (smaller than many of your home theatres!), over 50 years old, in a so-so neighborhood, and it would still get over $500k in the current market. You think I can afford GG with my $3500/mo house payment? :eek:

BTW, I ended up getting a case of quiet glue and plan to pick up some GG for the next room.

Hahaha just saw this :p . My house is only 1100 sq feet (smaller than many of your home theatres!), over 50 years old, in a so-so neighborhood, and it would still get over $500k in the current market. You think I can afford GG with my $3500/mo house payment? :eek:


Ouch....Move to Texas ;)

BTW, I ended up getting a case of quiet glue and plan to pick up some GG for the next room.

think it was worth the money ?