O.K., I'm looking for honesty here. Not holding my breath, but I'm giving you a chance to be truly honest. I have made my opinion clear about this and I will not post my vote on this poll, nor will I attempt to sway anyone my way.

Which do you think sells and will continue to sell consoles MORE , New Releases or Catalog Classics (Movies, not games); genre for genre, blockbuster for blockbuster?

EDIT For dlhoppe...

New Releases = Pretty much anything that was brand new to theaters within the last 365 days, but more likely within the last 6 months or so and is now, or very soon to to be, released on HD optical.

EDIT: Some people are not reading this right so I am adding my responses to a couple of posts below to this opening post...

"Please remember people, you're not voting for what floats YOUR boat, but rather what you think will sell consoles. Give your opinion of what you think the general public views as important, not your personal preferences."


"Again I need to remind people, this is not about you and your personal preferences. This is about what you think sells consoles, in general, on average, to the average, potential console buyer.

And obviously some people are going to get both. Not the question. What kind of titles are people going to see in the store, or online, or wherever and go, "Gee if I had such and such a player, I could watch that!?"


And again, I will remind you that in the second paragraph above, the question asks which one sells consoles MORE. If you think it's almost 50/50, then take a guess and say which one you think just might be 51%. However, if you have no idea and would only be taking a shot in the dark, please do us all a favor and decline to vote.

Feel free to post your reasons, but please keep it civil.

Thanks

When you say consoles, do you mean game consoles?
J

O.K., I'm looking for honesty here. Not holding my breath, but I'm giving you a chance to be truly honest. I have made my opinion clear about this and I will not post my vote on this poll, nor will I attempt to sway anyone my way.

What do you think sells consoles more, New Releases or Catalog Classics; genre for genre, blockbuster for blockbuster?

Feel free to post your reasons, but please keep it civil.

Thanks

There is no doubt that New Releases sell more product. I personally buy more catalog releases, but on every sales chart available to us, the newer releases always sell much better then the catalog releases.

~Josh

When you say consoles, do you mean game consoles?
J

I ASSumed since we were in the HDTV software section vs. the game section that that was clear, but maybe I should have been more specific. I will try to edit.

Oh yeah, new releases sell more consoles. I believe this is not only due to demographics, but also because there are many people who just don't like buying movies a second time, even to upgrade to HD. Of course, newer titles look more impressive as well.

However, what I think may be more important is the popularity of the titles. I would think that Alien or the original Die Hard film, for example, would sell more consoles than something like Dodgeball or Behind Enemy Lines.

I buy a lot more catalog titles and appreciate a variety of genres with a mix of older films, but I do admit that newer titles sell more, especially day and date titles. Perhaps the starkest example of this (it's a DVD example but I think it still applies) was one night at Wal-Mart back in 2005 when I bought the SE DVD of Titanic: they only had maybe a dozen or so copies of it, yet they had hundreds of copies of new-release cinematic gems "House of Wax" (the remake with thespian Paris Hilton) and "Herbie: Fully Loaded."

I will take all the classics and new releases I can get my hands on, as long as they are in HD. ;)

I will take all the classics and new releases I can get my hands on, as long as they are in HD. ;)

That's great. The more important war is definitely HD vs. SD.

However, this is a poll and there are only 2 answers. Let's please keep the discussion on topic.

Thanks

Good question, but hard to answer.

HD right now has more in common with laserdiscs than it does with DVD. The machines cost a lot more than the ultra cheap DVDs, and so do the movies. You need to have some tech savvy to get the most out of your system. It an afficianado's format.

There seems to be two poles on the afficianado scale;

The "technofile" who is ever excited about the possibility of what advancements offer, & who tends to be more format-fickle, and much more interested in the "two birds in the bush, than the one in the hand".

Then theres the "film-buff" who loves cinema, and wants to see it in a way that closely replicates the theater going experience, no matter what the age is of the films in question. They digest as much technical info as is needed to get results, but have bigger collections, and are more skeptical about "flash-in-the-pan" technology.

I think some obviously fall between those extremes, but both are early adopters, and neither can be ignored by what is currently elitist new format. As I've said before I have over 3000, DVDs of films from 1900-Yesterday. I've upgraded at least a 100 within the DVD format itself. I buy about one or two movies a week, and I'm usually a second generation adopter.

I'll be picking up an HD-DVD players next month, and my first purchases will be LAND OF THE DEAD, THE FOG (79), WILLY WONKA AND CHOCOLATE FACTORY, THE THING, ROBBIN HOOD (39) and THE ELEPHANT MAN.

Definitely new releases! Most people who are interested in BD or HD DVD already have the catalog titles they want on DVD, VHS, DVHS, or LD. New releases drive the hardware sales and the demand for these new formats more than catalog titles do.

Definitely new releases! Most people who are interested in BD or HD DVD already have the catalog titles they want on DVD, VHS, DVHS, or LD. New releases drive the hardware sales and the demand for these new formats more than catalog titles do.


If that's true, I can tell ya studios are hoping for a lot more. For this HD thing to ever pull out of limbo, they need double-dipping.

I have collected on every format in existence (even film), and figured out that I have in my 40 years spent $500 on Night of the Living Dead alone. Why stop at DVD if I can get the thrill of buying in HD, in one of those nifty pod-like cases? ;)

I think mostly it is hot new releases that people buy, so clearly it would be new releases that draw most people to a new format. I expect a lot of people to pick up a PS/3 because of Casino Royale, Pirates I/II, and Cars.

But, many may delay pulling the trigge until a particular favorite catalog "killer app" appears e.g. Lawrence of Arabia, Star Wars, Alien/Aliens, etc.

Gary

When thinking of titles a typical gamer will buy I come up with e.g.:
X-Men series
Spiderman series
Pirates of the Caribbean series
The Matrix series
Saw series

All of these are younger than 8 years, and they please the Playstation crowd more than anything.

In fact, I recently looked through the PS3Forums, and gamers' wishlists don't contain a lot of variety. The ones I mentioned plus Star Wars (of course) and The Lord of the Rings. That's pretty much it.

Definitely new releases! Most people who are interested in BD or HD DVD already have the catalog titles they want on DVD, VHS, DVHS, or LD. New releases drive the hardware sales and the demand for these new formats more than catalog titles do.

I understand new releases sell better, but do you really think most people don't want to re-purchase at least some of their titles in HD? If SD is good enough for their favorite movies, they might as well stick with DVD.

From my own personal experience, if it had a generally favourable review, I'm more willing to buy new releases I haven't seen yet (either in the theaters, rental, pay-per-view) - I can still justify the purchase as cheap for a first-time viewing.

Looking at some of the annual lists of top movies over the past 30 years, I can say I'd only buy 1-3 titles out of the yearly top 50 list. They'd have to be truly classics that can viewed over and over again. As I said, criteria changes for more current titles, as I've already bought Ice Age 2 & Mission Impossible 3 on Blu Ray, even though I doubt I would have if they came out 10 years later and already seen it somewhere else (dvd or cable broadcast).

I just checked my DVD Profiler list of movies - heavily skewed towards new releases from the last 7 years. Certainly a few "what was I thinking when I bought this?!?" titles that I've watched only once. In contrast, the few 35 or so "classics" in my collection have had multiple viewings each.

I've gotta say...I'm really confused?!?!? :confused:

We are TOLD by many that the console(s) are gonna infiltrate the market and sell more software/movies...(PS3 "trojan horse" strategy.) But NOW, we are trying to say that the software/movies are gonna drive the console(s)???

:confused: :confused: I'm so confused, I have nothing to say here. :confused: :confused:

I voted for catalog titles. I am increasingly disappointed with "new releases" over the years as they are mostly lame. But the prospect of seeing some of the older fils "like new" again is very enticing.

Please remember people, you're not voting for what floats YOUR boat, but rather what you think will sell consoles. Give your opinion of what you think the general public views as important, not your personal preferences.

I understand new releases sell better, but do you really think most people don't want to re-purchase at least some of their titles in HD? If SD is good enough for their favorite movies, they might as well stick with DVD.

IMO most people will buy mostly new releases simply because they haven't owned those movies on any video format previously. Then they'll check out their favorites in HD. It goes without saying that the high definition addicts will buy all of their movies in HD.

you should have a both option... i was a combination of both types of movies. theres definately some new ones i want and definately some older ones i want to see as well.

you should have a both option... i was a combination of both types of movies. theres definately some new ones i want and definately some older ones i want to see as well.

Again I need to remind people, this is not about you and your personal preferences. This is about what you think sells consoles, in general, on average, to the average, potential console buyer.

And obviously some people are going to get both. Not the question. What kind of titles are people going to see in the store, or online, or wherever and go, "Gee if I had such and such a player, I could watch that!"

and you will never find that out without asking for personal opinions... thats what the consumer is.... ALL of us.

and you will never find that out without asking for personal opinions... thats what the consumer is.... ALL of us.

I'm asking you to speculate.

Assuming we're talking HD "consoles" (players).... I think people will look at the available titles as a BIG determining factor in whether they'll buy an HD player. Since the majority of HD titles are not what I would consider "new releases" (I never heard your definition of new releases btw), then that leaves catalog titles for prospective HD consumers to ponder.

(I never heard your definition of new releases btw)

I thought it was very clear due to context, but to be perfectly clear...

New Releases = Pretty much anything that was brand new to theaters within the last 365 days, but more likely within the last 6 months or so and is now, or very soon to to be, released on HD optical.

I've seen people use "day and date" but that could mean a lot of things...

ex. "Day and date" with a DVD, but the DVD in question is an old film that finally made it to DVD. That's not what I'm interested in.

Theres a lot more catalog titles than blockbusters.

Blockbusters will sell more per title but classics released in HD can sell more in accumulation.

Xbox 360 HD DVD add as a seperate purchase tends toward moovie watchers (more classics), embedded Blu-ray drive in PS3 tends to consumer blockbuster sales potential.

Catalog titles bring in early adopters - generally the technophiles and movie buffs with lots of disposable income for movies.

Newer, blockbuster titles sustain the formats - bringing in the inquisitive bunch with moderate disposable income. These people would rather buy an expensive HD disc if they can afford it, than be limited to the same old SD-DVD.

J6Ps take over and drive formats to their peak - but they don't and won't care until the choice of a HD disc and player is a no brainer due to the lack of other choices, or because it has become trivial to acquire such technology.

Since most people who even consider game consoles for movie playback are the people with enough disposable income to spend $$$ on a game console, but not enough $$$ to spend on a $$$$ dedicated player, newer blockbuster titles generally appeal more to them.

I made a lot of generalizations and assumptions, but I believe this applies to the majority of people from IMHO. There will always be oddballs.

Catalog titles bring in early adopters - generally the technophiles and movie buffs with lots of disposable income for movies.

Newer, blockbuster titles sustain the formats - bringing in the inquisitive bunch with moderate disposable income. These people would rather buy an expensive HD disc if they can afford it, than be limited to the same old SD-DVD.

J6Ps take over and drive formats to their peak - but they don't and won't care until the choice of a HD disc and player is a no brainer due to the lack of other choices, or because it has become trivial to acquire such technology.

Since most people who even consider game consoles for movie playback are the people with enough disposable income to spend $$$ on a game console, but not enough $$$ to spend on a $$$$ dedicated player, newer blockbuster titles generally appeal more to them.

I made a lot of generalizations and assumptions, but I believe this applies to the majority of people from IMHO. There will always be oddballs.

Well stated and logical. But a little non-committal. The question was in regards to the word "more."

Did you vote?

Well stated and logical. But a little non-committal. The question was in regards to the word "more."

Did you vote?

I voted "New releases". There is no definitive answer as the demographics for each category overlap a lot.

A new release will definitely outsell a catalog title (on average), but the sum total of catalog titles will outsell the sum total of new releases (due to there being a whole lot more of them). So it depends on whether you're talking a title-by-title basis or not. (Edit: I just noticed Kosty already said this.)

What exactly is the point of this though? I hope you're not trying to tell the studios that we don't want catalog titles.

What exactly is the point of this though? I hope you're not trying to tell the studios that we don't want catalog titles.

LORD No!

Though I'm flattered at your belief in the possibility, the market will tell the studios what to do, not this poll. IMO there is no reason not to produce catalog HD content if it sells and, of course the good ones will sell, plenty. Hopefully, when HD optical prevails over DVD, just about every title will be produced. The rental market is good enough reason to do that.

No, it has come up many times in discussions of the format war. I used what seemed obvious to defend my position and some defended theirs with the opposite stance.

I wanted to see roughly what percentage of AVS members had this opposite stance and why.

A new release will definitely outsell a catalog title (on average), but the sum total of catalog titles will outsell the sum total of new releases (due to there being a whole lot more of them). So it depends on whether you're talking a title-by-title basis or not. (Edit: I just noticed Kosty already said this.)

What exactly is the point of this though? I hope you're not trying to tell the studios that we don't want catalog titles.

Also, you, like many others, for some reason, have missed the important point. I did not ask how many titles will sell, but rather which type of title will sell more consoles. Will most people get fired up and buy a console because of a classic, or a new release? When they walk out of the store, will they likely have a handful of classics to take home and watch, or will their hands be more full of new releases?

For the record, the poll has been pretty consistent at about 2 to 1 in favor of New Releases.

At this time the tally is

New Releases 49 (69%)

Catalog Classics 22 (31%)

Also, you, like many others, for some reason, have missed the important point. I did not ask how many titles will sell, but rather which type of title will sell more consoles. Will most people get fired up and buy a console because of a classic, or a new release? When they walk out of the store, will they likely have a handful of classics to take home and watch, or will their hands be more full of new releases? Well for most console buyers, it won't make a difference in their buying decision. The vast majority of PS3s or Xbox 360s will be bought without movie playback or depth of titles even being considered.

The people that title selection mostly will affect are people buying one (Xbox add on or PS3)solely as a movie player. Those people may be more sensitive to catalog selections than the typical console owner.

So if it doesn't affect one large group at all but it affects a smaller group a lot, then it may still affect the sales a little bit.

Universal and HD DVD seem to be placing more faith in releasing a diverse catalog as opposed to the more young adult genre Blu-ray has been earlier releasing.

^

A look back...

now that we have data that seems to show a verifiable result.

Definitely new releases. Very few titles that I'll double dip on but all future purchases/rentals will be blu-ray when possible.. I think the sales trends have been showing new releases doing much better as well, correct me if I'm wrong.

I don't think it's so much an issue of New vs. Catalog, per se. It's more an issue of what's popular.

By definition, newer releases are more popular as a whole since fewer people have seen them and/or own them in other formats. For catalog titles to have "star power", they have to be truly exceptional titles in some way, either being huge blockbusters from the past (The Matrix, Jurassic Park, Star Wars, Citizen Kane, etc.), enamored as a cult classic amongst a statistically significant niche (Rocky Horror Picture Show, Galaxy Quest, Dawn of the Dead, etc.) or have some sort of other attraction that will make a sizable number of non-owners take the plunge and buy the associated hardware.

If you don't believe this is true, go look at the buying trends for gaming consoles; you'll see exactly this pattern of behavior. People buy entertainment hardware for the software it provides.

I don't think it's so much an issue of New vs. Catalog, per se. It's more an issue of what's popular.

By definition, newer releases are more popular as a whole since fewer people have seen them and/or own them in other formats. For catalog titles to have "star power", they have to be truly exceptional titles in some way, either being huge blockbusters from the past (The Matrix, Jurassic Park, Star Wars, Citizen Kane, etc.), enamored as a cult classic amongst a statistically significant niche (Rocky Horror Picture Show, Galaxy Quest, Dawn of the Dead, etc.) or have some sort of other attraction that will make a sizable number of non-owners take the plunge and buy the associated hardware.

If you don't believe this is true, go look at the buying trends for gaming consoles; you'll see exactly this pattern of behavior. People buy entertainment hardware for the software it provides.
No doubt about it.

At the time I posted this, there were many who disagreed with this. I couldn't understand why it was even an argument, but it was. Fortunately it sparked a bit of debate and the vote was clear. As I said above, now, at our present time the data seems to have spoken.

I never did vote, BTW. Wish I would have made it public.

I wasn't paying attention to HD media when this poll originally appeared, but I can't vote for one of these options anyway.

If we're speculating on the general public, I believe the expectation would be that ANY movie they might want to rent/purchase would be available, and that will drive the decision to dive in. Some fans of current blockbusters (POTC) or popular TV shows (Heroes) may buy in to a format to see their favorites in HD, but IMO, the general public's decision to buy and HD media player will not be driven by segments of software.

Movies are not like games. People choose consoles for games because a single game can deliver hours of pleasure. Very few non-fanatics will pay $200-$500 to watch a few movies that they can get on DVD without the hassle of upgrading.

The DVD market is saturated, and customers expectations are for all releases to be available at reasonable prices and that all of these releases will play anywhere on inexpensive hardware. Once the non-enthusiasts see these options in HD media, they will buy in.

A review of the Videoscan numbers shows CONVINCINGLY AND WITHOUT EXCEPTION that new releases do very well on Blu-ray/HD DVD while "classic" titles do very poorly.

Titles like Spartacus, Forbidden Planet, Grand Prix do not sell enough titles to pay for their preparation, not nearly. New titles even of poor quality and low box office do well.

This is not my preference but this is the way things are.

I broke down and bought a PS3 so that I could get PoTC Trilogy, Cars and Ratatoulie.

Will pick up some catalog titles also of course..but they did not drive me to get the console(Fifth Element, Rambos, Terminators, etc)

EDIT: Since this is not supposed to be a "what floats your boat" answer I am not sure if I did it correctly...but since I actually DID spend the money, I think it is valid..for me and others in my demographic. I enjoy Pixar Films, my wife is a HUGE Disney fan, and we have a 3.5 y.o. son who loves Cars(and other Disney movies on DVD).

Too hard to vote on this one.

Stars Wars Six Pack would sell BD players, and it is not a new release.
Indy Trilogy would sell HD DVD players, and it is not a new release.

Transformers sold HD-DVD players
Spiderman and Disney releases sold BD players.

I think good movies will push sales. New releases or catalog titles.

Therefore no vote for me.

Over all the newer movies will sell better.

My opionion why is FX. FX keep getting better and that is what the console market wants. Sure there are some older movies with great special effects (Star Wars), but people want the latest and greatest.

My bet is that beowulf (despite poor showing in theaters) will do well, and any movie that can do what 300 did and take it up a notch will be huge on HDM.

I think it doesn't matter all that much since for HDM to survive, it's gotta sell both, and it's gotta appeal to both demographics. Pre-80's catalog accounts for such a tiny % of the what has been released IMO opinion they aren't sticking their necks out too far to snag a more diverse audience, even if it means taking a hit on them for another year.

Studio's aren't going to get nearly as much money out of me, because I've bought a lot of day-and-date stuff just to feed the player, however the novelty of buying so-so films I'm mildly curious about just because they're HD is wearing thin for me.

The cost of remastering catalog movies could very well go down once the art has been "perfected" and can be done efficiently. This could drive catalog HDM manufacturing cost down and hopefully bring the price down with it.

Video game companies are reaping great rewards by re-releasing old games via downloadable content to the 3 major gaming consoles.

Just a matter of time before Hollywood can catch up and release their older films in higher resolution and better AQ for a cheaper price.

I believe new releases sell more consoles but I'd rather have catalog classics in my hd library.

I find it hard to believe this is even as close as it is. Catalog releases are catalog releases for a reason - mainly that we have already seen them. Whether in the theater, purchased on another format, or rented on another format. Stories don't change format to format. Some people love re-watching catalog titles, more people do not.

Too hard to vote on this one.

Stars Wars Six Pack would sell BD players, and it is not a new release.
Indy Trilogy would sell HD DVD players, and it is not a new release.
Agreed.

I should have qualified these and the few other exceptions in my O.P.

The debate at the time I posted this poll was Classics like Lawrence and Gone With the Wind vs. the new stuff. I posted this out of frustration as I was floored that there was even a debate. Yes, there are certainly some classics that I enjoy, the aforementioned being two that I own, but I never thought films of this type would do much to sell consoles. Of course back then, as a blu-boy, it was Fox against Universal, but I strongly believed I had a case.

Of course the facts of today have clearly spoken.

I believe new releases sell more consoles but I'd rather have catalog classics in my hd library.
This is the kind of honest answer I was looking for.

I find it hard to believe this is even as close as it is. Catalog releases are catalog releases for a reason - mainly that we have already seen them. Whether in the theater, purchased on another format, or rented on another format. Stories don't change format to format. Some people love re-watching catalog titles, more people do not.
This is an old poll filled with votes from people with an agenda. Today's facts speak clearly. I'm sure if it were retaken today, the spread would be wider.

I believe new releases sell more consoles but I'd rather have catalog classics in my hd library.

Exactly.

"Which do you believe sells more consoles?"

...who cares?? Movies sell movie players..

"Which do you believe sells more consoles?"

...who cares?? Movies sell movie players..
That's brilliant, rdjam. Thanks for your astute contribution to the discussion.

FWIW, it was not my intention to revive this thread. The question is settled. And no, the answer is not that of rdjam's above.