I am looking to upgrade my Toshiba 65" rear projection T.V. to something a little more modern that doesn't need as much light control. I am looking to go with nothing larger, but not less than 55" or so.

The question I ask is, "Where do I start?" :eek: I have seen Plasma's and DLP's, so I have narrowed it down to one of these two. I notice the Plasma is a sharper image (and brighter) but have heard horror stories of burn ins and screen longevity. They cost quite a bit more, too.

The DLP's don't seem as crisp, but at half cost, they're a bigger bang for the buck, or so it seems. Any comments about the strengths and weaknesses of these types of monitors? Any suggestions on what to purchase?

As a background, I like to watch sports and movies, though it is the family T.V. which means it's everything from cartoons to Oprah. The system is matched to a very nice 7.1 surround, so that part is dialed. The light can be difficult to control, especially during daylight with kids running around. I watch almost exclusively HD channels since becoming spoiled. My DVD player is a progressive scan model, and I will eventually upgrade to DVDHD or Blu-Ray once a standardized format is announced (VHS vs. Beta all over again).

Please help,
Nick

Id reccomend the Samsung HL-S6187W. As far as Picture Quality, Brightness, and Crispness go for that set, its amazing.

DLP is certainly better bang for the buck than plasma, and does better in a bright room. Comparing PQ between plasma nad DLP is just a matter of personal preference.

If you aren't going to wall mount the plasma, then paying extra for a flat panel tv is kind of a waste of money IMO. Plus being the family tv, burn in/IR issues of the plasma would have me concerned as well as your room being fairly bright.

I was recently in a similar situation and decided to go dlp for now, save a few bucks - quite a few actually! ;) and will look into flat panels again in another year or two when the technology improves and the prices come down.

Plasma gives you a better picture, but it costs more money.

Plasma gives you a better picture, but it costs more money.

Thats complete ignorance right there.

Compare the Plasma model you want to the DLP model you want. My HL-S6187W beats out 99.9% of Plasma's out there in my opinion. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder applies here :)

Plasma gives you a better picture, but it costs more money.
No, it gives you a different PQ, which some prefer and others don't. I see SDE with plasma, and don't see RBE with DLP, so I prefer DLP. Others are the opposite and therefore prefer plasma. There is no single technology that all agree is the best.

Mitsubishi 65732 will give you the best of everything (except wall mounting capability) and can be had for 2400 if you look around carefully :)

No knock on Samsung or Sony but the Mits is the best imo...

No matter what advice anyone gives you here, nothing beats going to an overpriced brick and mortar store (*cough* Best Buy *cough*) and checking out the sets. I visited Sears, Best Buy, and Circuit City, and the Samsung HL-S6187W blew every single HD set out of the water. No contest, so I bought it and happy.

Buy the Mitsubishis WD-73831--it's big enough to where you can really see the difference with 1080 sources and big enough to make you feel you're at the movies.

There's no substitute for size!

It needn't be either/or...you should also investigate LCOS rear projection from manufactures such as JVC, Sony, and Syntax-Brillian (Olevia).

No matter what advice anyone gives you here, nothing beats going to an overpriced brick and mortar store (*cough* Best Buy *cough*) and checking out the sets. I visited Sears, Best Buy, and Circuit City, and the Samsung HL-S6187W blew every single HD set out of the water. No contest, so I bought it and happy.
Yeah it was fun going to Best Buy and getting the noob salesmen drooling when I told them I was making a large purchase then looked at everything I needed to see and went home to order my 5687W online. Muwaahahaha!

Alright, fellas, thanks for the feedback. I'm now throwing out the plasma option and looking exclusively for DLP. The main concern was burn in and wash out due to poor light control, but though I knew plasma's burned out, I thought they were better in brighter areas. It seems to be a concensus that I was wrong.

So now enters the question of which set to buy? I have taken into account the Samsung HL-S6187W, as well as the 65" Mitsubishi Diamond vs. Medallion series sets. Any suggestions?

In looking at the specs, I have been removed from this so long, the terminology is fuzzy. What is necessary for good, quality HD viewing, including cable (with the option of going to dish if I desire), a good DVD player (upgrading to DVDHD or BluRay in the future), but won't play games on this set? The following are the options given for inputs on the Mitsubishi sets:


Medallion
Analog / Digital Combined: x2
Front A/V Inputs with S-Video: x1
Rear A/V Inputs with S-Video: x2
Component Video Inputs (480i/480p/720p/1080i): x3
HDMI™ with DVI Stereo Audio: x2
IEEE 1394 (MPEG2): x2
Digital Audio Output (Dolby® Digital / PCM): x1 (coaxial)
Multi-Format Memory Card Reader
Stereo Audio Output: x1 (fixed)
Record A/V Output: x1
VGA-XGA, 1280 x 720 Analog
VGA-SXGA, 1280 x 720, 1920 x 1080 Digital

Diamond
HDMI™ with DVI Stereo Audio: x2
Digital Audio Output (Dolby® Digital / PCM): x1 (coaxial)
IEEE 1394 (MPEG2): x3
S-Video: x3
Component Video Inputs (480i/480p/720p/1080i): x3
Stereo Audio Output: x1
Record A/V Output: x1
NetCommand® / G-Link™ IR Emitter: x1
PC DVI-I Input

What is needed and when are we talking money wasted on overkill?

Thanks for all the help in advance,
Nick

Alright, fellas, thanks for the feedback. I'm now throwing out the plasma option and looking exclusively for DLP. The main concern was burn in and wash out due to poor light control, but though I knew plasma's burned out, I thought they were better in brighter areas. It seems to be a concensus that I was wrong.

So now enters the question of which set to buy? I have taken into account the Samsung HL-S6187W, as well as the 65" Mitsubishi Diamond vs. Medallion series sets. Any suggestions?

In looking at the specs, I have been removed from this so long, the terminology is fuzzy. What is necessary for good, quality HD viewing, including cable (with the option of going to dish if I desire), a good DVD player (upgrading to DVDHD or BluRay in the future), but won't play games on this set? The following are the options given for inputs on the Mitsubishi sets:


Medallion
Analog / Digital Combined: x2
Front A/V Inputs with S-Video: x1
Rear A/V Inputs with S-Video: x2
Component Video Inputs (480i/480p/720p/1080i): x3
HDMI™ with DVI Stereo Audio: x2
IEEE 1394 (MPEG2): x2
Digital Audio Output (Dolby® Digital / PCM): x1 (coaxial)
Multi-Format Memory Card Reader
Stereo Audio Output: x1 (fixed)
Record A/V Output: x1
VGA-XGA, 1280 x 720 Analog
VGA-SXGA, 1280 x 720, 1920 x 1080 Digital

Diamond
HDMI™ with DVI Stereo Audio: x2
Digital Audio Output (Dolby® Digital / PCM): x1 (coaxial)
IEEE 1394 (MPEG2): x3
S-Video: x3
Component Video Inputs (480i/480p/720p/1080i): x3
Stereo Audio Output: x1
Record A/V Output: x1
NetCommand® / G-Link™ IR Emitter: x1
PC DVI-I Input

What is needed and when are we talking money wasted on overkill?

Thanks for all the help in advance,
Nick

The best combination of size and price with the best picture is the Mitsubishi 65732 which has the same PQ as the 65831 (which just won Cnet HD TV of the year) at $400-$500 less. If you are over 12 feet then I recommend the 73732 which is comprable to the 73831 in picture. Seriously, I just went through weeks of research and I can tell you the Mits does need adjusting but after that it yields the highest resolution possible - a full 1080 lines of resolution with an unbelievable picture.

Stay away from the XX731 and WXX and YXX models as they are not nearly as good as the XX831 and XX732 models. The diamond series is the same as the medallion in terms of features and picture quality are identical for all practical purposes. Do a search on Ebay for "65732" and use Watts Tv in Arizona. Talk to Ed they have the best price of anyone. You can get basic settings off of this forum once you get your tv. For a tv stand I recommend the following that will work perfectly for a cheap price:

http://www.target.com/gp/detail.html/sr=1-1/qid=1168775001/ref=sr_disc_1_1/601-9491987-0472943?ie=UTF8&asin=B000HWJR6E

DVD player use the Oppo 970 at Amazon.com for $150 (comes with a free HDMI cable) use 720p or 1080i inupt resolution

Get FIOS HD cable service (Verizon) if you can as it has the best HD feeds. If not you can get Direct TV HD too. You will be unbelievably happy with this setup, second to none for way under 3k$$

Cheers!

Chris

Thank you for the input, Chris. I was looking exactly at the Mitsubishi 65732 and 65831. They are priced at $2799 and $3299 right here at Costco. This means if there is any problems, return it, any time, and a full replacement or refuend comes, no questions asked.

As for the adjusting, is this just going through and setting up the set, or is this a bigger adjustment than a layman could perform? Either way, is there literature on how to maximize and adjustment?

Thanks again,
Nick

Thats complete ignorance right there.

It's not ignorant if it's the truth. As far as pq a plasma can look as good or sometimes even better than a Tube Tv. Do you really feel your pq is on the level of a tube tv? Is it like having a gigantic tube tv?

It's not ignorant if it's the truth. As far as pq a plasma can look as good or sometimes even better than a Tube Tv. Do you really feel your pq is on the level of a tube tv? Is it like having a gigantic tube tv?
Zues, you obviously prefer plasma, and that's fine. But not everyone agrees with you. I see bad SDE with plasma and prefer DLP over plasma (and over LCD, which I believe you also like). That doesn't make me wrong anymore than it makes you wrong -- we just have different preferences. What IS wrong is assuming that what looks best to you or to me will look best to everyone.

It's not ignorant if it's the truth. As far as pq a plasma can look as good or sometimes even better than a Tube Tv. Do you really feel your pq is on the level of a tube tv? Is it like having a gigantic tube tv?

BillP is right, you do prefer plasma.

My HL-S6187W kicks a Tube TV out of the water. Into another continent halfway across the world. Its like having a gigantic tube tv that looks better. And I havent even had it calibrated yet. Also, Plasmas have trouble with black levels if im not mistaken.

BillP is right, you do prefer plasma.

My HL-S6187W kicks a Tube TV out of the water. Into another continent halfway across the world. Its like having a gigantic tube tv that looks better. And I havent even had it calibrated yet. Also, Plasmas have trouble with black levels if im not mistaken.

My father purchased a Sony Plasma set about 6 months ago and paid quite bit for it from a boutique shop. I'm not sure of the model but it's about 50 inches. After seeing the Sammy 5687w I ordered he's not very happy with his purchase at all. Main reason is the SDE (which he has no clue that's what it was called he just referred to it as "those **** squares". I took a look at his set for about an hour yesterday and the SDE was terrible. I would'nt own a set that performed that poorly. Now he wishes he had mine after watching it for an while. He wanted to trade on the premise that since his cost about twice as much it was bound to be somehow better. I asked him if I was born at night......

I have a DLP and am getting a plasma. DLP strengths are cost, lack of glare/reflection, great blacks and an excellent image/color for those who don't see rainbows. Plasma has equal color fidelity, no SSE, no SDE unless you sit relatively close to a 768p unit, no RBE, good blacks (Panny or Pio) and that realistic sense of depth than no projected image can quite equal. It is more $$ but there is zero upkeep - no bulbs to replace.

Both are great.

My HL-S6187W kicks a Tube TV out of the water. Into another continent halfway across the world.

Im sure that you and BillP would feel the same about your dlp if i could send you the new Samsung 6373 plasma for a in home trial. If you could keep it for free and give up your dlp for it thier is just no way the dlp would be staying :D

Im sure that you and BillP would feel the same about your dlp if i could send you the new Samsung 6373 plasma for a in home trial. If you could keep it for free and give up your dlp for it thier is just no way the dlp would be staying :D
Again, I disagree since the SDE would drive me nuts (and since the 63" display would not fit in my wall unit)..

Again, I disagree since the SDE would drive me nuts (and since the 63" display would not fit in my wall unit)..

You sure you have seen HD plasmas and not edtv? Unless your nose is to the screen you cant see sde from a normal viewing distance.. (unless you have superhuman abilitys) Which i doubt if you cant make out the rainbow effect. :rolleyes: :D Now SSE can be easily seen from a normal viewing distance.

Im sure that you and BillP would feel the same about your dlp if i could send you the new Samsung 6373 plasma for a in home trial. If you could keep it for free and give up your dlp for it thier is just no way the dlp would be staying :D

Keep it for free sure, but for one, it wont fit in my wall enclosure, and two, I dont like the way plasma screens look compared to tube tv screens. Though that Plasma is damn expensive, and I got my HL-S6187W for $1500. Theres a dropoff there :)

Oh, and i dont see SSE, SBE, SRE, SDE, RBC, RDE, or whatever those things are. I dont see rainbows eiether. Mabye im a bad viewer :P

Oh, and i dont see SSE, SBE, SRE, SDE, RBC, RDE, or whatever those things are. I dont see rainbows eiether. Mabye im a bad viewer :P
Me neither. I guess our eyes are bad. And thank goodness for that - it saves a lot of complaining! :D

You sure you have seen HD plasmas and not edtv? Unless your nose is to the screen you cant see sde from a normal viewing distance.. (unless you have superhuman abilitys) Which i doubt if you cant make out the rainbow effect. :rolleyes: :D Now SSE can be easily seen from a normal viewing distance.
Well, I see bad SDE on my brother-in-law's $8000 HD Panny plasma (he bought his plasma when I bought my DLP for less than half that, 3 1/2 years ago). I guess your eyesight just isn't that good if you can only see it with your nose against the screen.

I am another who like rear projection and do not like plasma's except the $8k Pio Pro 1080p
they all look grainy 'SDE' and less detailed. I spent many months viewing sets before I choose a Sony LCOS. To me it wasn't worth spending $1000 more to get a picture that looked worse to me, was a good bit smaller and didn't fully resolve 1080p. In the end use your eyes to find the best set for you be it plasma, dlp, LCOS, etc.
-Craig

I think plasmas are the best, especially under 50". over that they are too expensive right now, but with cost not an issue I would take a plasma every day. (and FYI I own an LCD RPTV)

over 50" (today) you can't go wrong with the LCoS or the high end DLPs. I prefer the LCoS. The JVC is a great deal.

It's tough being called ignorant, especially by someone who thinks plasmas have a problem with black levels. I have a 50 inch Panasonic Plasma in my bedroom, and I have been looking at every large rear projection tv available. I can honestly say that none of them can deliver a picture that has the "window" effect. That effect is that I feel like I am looking through a window at the picture. It is that realistic.

That being said, I am considering the 73 inch Mits or the JVC for the livingroom, because of the fact that glare is a consideration with a plasma, and the 65 inch Panny plasma is too expensive. In a bedroom, where you will not typically have glare issues, I believe Plasma is untouchable. In a room where you will have sunlight or other lighting affecting your picture, there is alot to be said for rear projection. However, I am convinced that the rear projection sets cannot deliver the same picture that a good plasma can deliver.

It's tough being called ignorant, especially by someone who thinks plasmas have a problem with black levels. I have a 50 inch Panasonic Plasma in my bedroom, and I have been looking at every large rear projection tv available. I can honestly say that none of them can deliver a picture that has the "window" effect. That effect is that I feel like I am looking through a window at the picture. It is that realistic.

That being said, I am considering the 73 inch Mits or the JVC for the livingroom, because of the fact that glare is a consideration with a plasma, and the 65 inch Panny plasma is too expensive. In a bedroom, where you will not typically have glare issues, I believe Plasma is untouchable. In a room where you will have sunlight or other lighting affecting your picture, there is alot to be said for rear projection. However, I am convinced that the rear projection sets cannot deliver the same picture that a good plasma can deliver.

I just spent 6 straight hours watching Discovery HD on my new 5687w and I can honestly say I haven't seen a plasma or LCD in the same size range that I feel has a better picture. There were some close ones, but if given a chance to change right now to a comparable size plasma of my choice for free, I don't think I could take the offer. It all boils down to personal experience and enviroment I suppose.

I never can understand why people try to convince others that plasma vs LCD vs DLP is better or worse. Picture quality is very subjective for most people, go and look at the picture and buy the one you like best it doesn't matter what others see it is what you see. For me I have owned two Sammy DLPs but I like the picture on the Plasma better. Do I like it enough to pay the premium, nope it is not that much better and I wanted a 61" 1080p set. So I stuck with DLP. As for buying lamps, give me a break you know how many $200 lamps I can buy for the difference in price between DLP and Plasma. lol

I think on a lot of good plasmas, the SDE isn't really THAT noticeable.

On the good DLP/Lcos sets the SSE really isn't notceable. The only time I ever notice it is when I watch someone skiing or figure skating (which I prefer to not watch). Even then, it can be barely noticeable on the good sets.

The vividness of the color on the plasmas is usually higher than on a RPTV, however usually the sharpness/image detail seems to be better on the RPTV than the plasma. Most people, however, just notice the pretty (more vivid) colors on the plasma and therefore think the picture is "better". However, from what I've seen after a year or two, even the expensive plasmas dont have the at sheer vivdness as when they were first bought.

This of course is a broad generalization. 80% of tv's in both category are utter crap IMO, and aren't guarenteed to be superior in anything.

It is of course, completely subjective as well. The only thing for sure is that Plasma probably gets you the worst bang for your buck.