There is a site made/maintained by an AVS poster at http://www.hdnowonline.com/.

This is a poll on AVS opinion wrt the informational content of this site. This is a public, multiple-choice poll.


Edit: I should add that only people who have read the site (choice 1) should vote on the info-content of the site (choices 4-10).

It's not objective at all, nor does it claim to be really. The sites stated purpose is to get more studios to release on HD DVD. What is the issue here requiring a poll?

Wow, a post before I even put the poll up :)

There is definitely bias, but with so little information about what's going on behind the scenes, I wouldn't fault for misinformation anymore than lots of stuff that gets thrown around this forum.

This are always changing with regards to "facts", so for opinion to dominate on the site is sort of expected.

The site is one-sideded, but doesn't pretend to be something is not.

Just to point this out but wouldn't it make more sense to just ask that only those that have read the website vote on the poll? I mention this since I notice that a few posters have already voted on the poll without noticing the first three options.

Looking at the respondents to the poll it looks like the BD fanbase is the only group that has even looked at the site so far.

Well, since there are so few of us can you specify the errors, and their severity?

Well since this seems to be a BD love fest, can anyone point out specifically the "lies" or misdirection of this site? None have answered so far.

I know the best way to generate traffic for a website is to critique it (positively or negatively). So, the owner of the site will be happy either way with this poll :)

Either way, it is good for AVSers to know whether the site is factual or not before they start spending money based on info read there.

I only read it because it was linked in this thread, but I have seen it linked to before as a goto HD-DVD site.

I don't think it even claims neutrality, and as such, the fact it has misinformation is a matter of course. Whats the point of this thread?

There was no poll item that accurately describes the site:

- It's an intentionally deceitful website whose purpose is to spread misinformation and propaganda.

There was no poll item that accurately describes the site:

- It's an intentionally deceitful website whose purpose is to spread misinformation and propaganda.Well said. The site is complete crap.

There was no poll item that accurately describes the site:

- It's an intentionally deceitful website whose purpose is to spread misinformation and propaganda.

No different that what Blu-crazed boys do here and all over the web with their relentless "Blu-Ray's victory is preordained" propaganda. Blu-Ray as a format is built around misdirection, misrepresentation and misinformation. They could use some competition in similar vein, however small it might be.

Blatant lies much?

I just looked at the site for the first time. The visitors count (2946) doesn't match the number of more than 5000 people who signed the petition. Strange.

rdjam, did you add the counter only later?

Well, since there are so few of us can you specify the errors, and their severity?

Well since this seems to be a BD love fest, can anyone point out specifically the "lies" or misdirection of this site? None have answered so far.

Still waiting for that extensive list. And I have posted questions regarding BD-J interactive features to the BD insiders with no responses so far. They seem to shy away for the questions. June or sometime in the Fall? When in the Fall? I will go BD when I can get all the goodies that HD DVD already provides. I don't care to pay premium for Fox or Disney with no extras.

http://www.hdnowonline.com/Comment_Who_Is_Muslix.html

This article is all anyone ever needs to read to know all they need to know about hdnowonline.

Conspiracy theories - with ridiculous supports - couldn't come any wilder than this even if it's Steven Colbert creating them. And this one is presented seriously!

I'll post my personal two favorite "assertions" from this article, numbers 2 and 11:

2) "Muslix", as he calls himself, is not even the correct spelling. We feel that this means he is attempting to indicate he is domiciled in Europe, when he is likely actually in the US. (It's "Mueslix", son...)

11) And finally, why did he choose to write the "tool" in Java? The obvious answer is that it is what he is most comfortable with. Given how close the Java camp and Sun are, as an integral part of the Bluray disc association, it seems to indicate, again, that "Muslix" is not actually an HD DVD supporter, but more likely in the Bluray camp. This is a more tenuous conclusion, but a reasonable one nonetheless. Of course, it is possible that using Java was just a "dig" at the HD DVD camp, an "insider joke", if you will. But then this would also indicate that this is an attack on the HD DVD format by desperate Bluray supporters.

Raaj, let's not visit the (alleged) sins of the companies/supporters upon the format :)

Also, saying BD's victory is pre-ordained is not wrong (in the sense of being immoral). People can discount such bravado but putting forth wrong info as facts is, IMO, wrong. I am not its saying immoral cos it may not be intentional. If it is intentionally misleading, then.. well, what can one say? =)

IMO, technology is quite cut and dried. So, the site is either factual or it is not. What his intentions are, I don't really care but I do care about the info presented.

http://www.hdnowonline.com/Comment_Who_Is_Muslix.html

This article is all anyone ever needs to read to know all they need to know about hdnowonline.

Conspiracy theories - with ridiculous supports - couldn't come any wilder than this even if it's Steven Colbert creating them. And this one is presented seriously!

I'll post my personal two favorite "assertions" from this article, numbers 2 and 11:

Educate me. And how does this make the site not worth considering?

Wow, a post before I even put the poll up :)

He must have been stalking you.

Just because rdjam acts like Mel Gibson in "Conspiricy Theory" sometimes doesn't mean there a lot of useful information in there as well as the off the wall stuff.

After all, Mel's character ended up as the own telling the greater truth.

Just because rdjam acts like Mel Gibson in "Conspiricy Theory" sometimes doesn't mean there a lot of useful information in there as well as the off the wall stuff.

After all, Mel's character ended up as the own telling the greater truth.
I was a little surprised to see that you checked both:

- The site is a worthy cause but wrongly implemented (as in errors etc.)

and

- The site is a worthy cause and well implemented

I haven't personally looked at the site much recently. But from looking at it before I view it kind of like one of those movies that is supposed to be serious, but ends up being funny. :)

--Darin

I don't mean to be a pain (too late :D) but if people are going to choose one of the choices from #4-10, do pick #1 too.

And if someone picks #2 or 3, please do not then pick #s 4-10.

Also, I dont get how #s 9 and 10 can both be chosen.. an accidental click? :)

Wow - this is interesting :p

A "brand new" member opens a poll as one of his first acts on the site, where almost every option is negative. Well I'm not going to get into whether anyone here is operating under two user names against forum rules, but I'll say my piece and move on.

I don't expect everyone to like my site. It's an advocacy site and expresses a lot of opinion - some of it quite strong. And in format wars (which fortunately don't happen very often) people get quite emotional when they see something they don't like.

In the last 3 or 4 days I have started talking about an issue that is VERY sensitive to the Bluray camp. And in the last day or two I can't help but notice a LOT of pressure being applied to undermine (nay, actually completely obliterate :p ) the "credibility" of myself and my opinions. Perhaps some folks recognized that with all the HD DVD fans contacting Warner on this issue, that maybe Warner would come looking to this site and that maybe it would be useful to "trash the movement"?

Oh well, all's fair in love and war, I guess. But everyone just remember there is that little tidbit in the forum rules about personal attacks. That said, I continue...

Now, WHAT was that little issue that seems to have inspired all of this "extra attention" I'm getting in the last couple of days? Oh yes, the "little" issue of BDJ development seeming to be a bit of a disaster and holding up the release of quite a few BD movies from studios such as Warner. Some say, "oh, it's not a BDJ problem, it's really just about player profiles".

Nuh-uh... If this BDJ thing was worth it's weight in paper as a standard, the players would have to conform to something, surely? You wouldn't have to worry that something you wrote (coded by HAND, I might add, since a Bluray insider said there are no dev tools) would run on one player but not another?

I got my first computer when I was 17. But I had been promised it when I was 16 and had to wait a few months for that great day to arrive. It was a Radio Shack color computer with 16 K, wowie! I was so excited I went out and bought a BASIC manual for it in preparation. I read that thing ear to ear, and you know, I could help myself - I started writing programs. Before even getting the computer, I had written something like 20 programs in pencil in a little dog-eared school notebook. Programs ranging from games, to music programs, even a "Date Interview" program (don't ask! :p ).

The day I got the computer I dutifully started tapping them in. And do you know what? They all ran perfectly - first time. Was that because I'm some kind of genius? Well I'd love to claim that was so, but let's face it - if that BASIC programming hadn't been standardized and set in stone, nothing I learnt in that book would have amounted to beans, and I would have gone mental trying to make it work. I would probably have chucked the lot in the bin and gone for something that worked better.

Anyone see what I'm saying here?

Look, no one's going to win anything by debating by "left hook". I'm acknowledging your statements that you don't like my site or my campaign, but I say that some of these complaints about me being an advocate of HD DVD are "like the pot calling the kettle black", since some of those who may swing the hardest are like my alter ego's on the other side of the fence.

That's not to say that there aren't some very objective people among us - we're all mostly very intelligent here, and it's unfortunate that so many of us are in the position of wanting a favoured format to succeed. Format wars suck.

I myself own both formats - I have the A1, the XA2, the Xbox Drive, the Samsung BDP1000 and a Philips Bluray burner (yes, I'm awaiting my HD DVD burner too). I'm having lots of fun with both formats, but for my own part have mixed feelings about one of them. I express my feelings, sometimes quite lucidly, sometimes like a drunken albatross. I think one format was ready when it launched, and that the other wasn't. I think the one that wasn't is hurting BOTH the formats. But hey - that's just one man's opinion. But at the end of the day, that's all it is. Do I go home and bow to Lucifern all trembling with excitement? Not unless she's wearing pink Victoria Secrets! :D

I'm straight up. I'm not going to "pretend" I don't say it how I see it with Bluray. I'm not going to apologise for being harsh on Bluray either - I think the format deserves it for all the problems that still haven't been fixed and for not being ready for prime time. And I'm not going lie and deny that I don't give it a good, hard Kick right up the tail now and then. Who knows how this "war" will all turn out. One day you may even thank me for helping keep Bluray honest and on its toes.

I see these apparent BDJ development problems right now as yet another symptom that is so typical of a format that is all talk, but is not finished building yet. And isn't it just Sods Law that not only do these continuing development problems with Bluray get to screw up Warner's Bluray releases, but now they are screwing up HD DVD releases as well! And because certain BD folks were upset that Warner was churning out so many HD DVD releases, because HD DVD was easier to produce IME for.

It's a free country/Internet/Planet/etc and good debates on this site are encouraged, but they are better when they are less emotional. You're entitled to your view, and others are entitled to theirs. There are nearly 6,000 supporters of the Petition so far. You say you want them to come here and defend the site. Hello? Hellooo? I suspect most of them have better things to do than come here and get into online squabbles over their choice. Or they may just feel that I'm a big boy who can probably take care of myself.

We may not like some of the things that someone or another says about one format or the other, but let's try to keep some basic respect in place so that there can be discussion of views and not act like we all just came out of a video arcade looking for some aggro'.

Thank you for your time.

Peace.

What his intentions are, I don't really care but I do care about the info presented.
Methinks thou doth care a bit too much! :)

I am glad to see that you do think :) (joking)

But seriously, some of the conclusions in your long post are amazing. I say this without meaning any offense but I think there is a hint of 'jumping to conclusions' there.

I reply to your long post below and let me say as a teaser that I have no idea about or interest in the Warner issues you are talking about in it.

A "brand new" member opens a poll as one of his first acts on the site, where almost every option is negative.
Well, the thing is that your site is either fully correct or wrong to multiple degrees. Just having 2 options of 'Fully Correct' & 'Fully Crap' would not make for a good or accurate poll, so I created an array of choices with respect to how incorrect it may be/is. And btw, it is not a push poll.

Also, you might want to see how I voted :)

In the last 3 or 4 days I have started talking about an issue that is VERY sensitive to the Bluray camp. And in the last day or two I can't help but notice a LOT of pressure being applied to undermine (nay, actually completely obliterate :p ) the "credibility" of myself and my opinions. Perhaps some folks recognized that with all the HD DVD fans contacting Warner on this issue, that maybe Warner would come looking to this site and that maybe it would be useful to "trash the movement"?
I dont know what Warner issues you are talking about. My interest in your site was perked when I noticed your extremely anti-Sony postings and a regular agreed with me that you were rather strongly anti-Sony. So, I went through your site out of curiosity and I also noticed the heated "discussion" in the big thread. Thus, I created this poll.

Oh well, all's fair in love and war, I guess. But everyone just remember there is that little tidbit in the forum rules about personal attacks. That said, I continue...
No, all is not fair in love and war. If you state that you believe that, it could lead one to think that the wrong info on your site is intentional. I, personally, have not attacked you with my votes, just disagreeed with the info presented. None of the poll choices are a personal attack either. I didnt even mention your name in the thread title.

When you create a public site, expect public scrutiny, not a red carpet and child-like trust :)

Now, WHAT was that little issue that seems to have inspired all of this "extra attention" I'm getting in the last couple of days? Oh yes, the "little" issue of BDJ development seeming to be a bit of a disaster and holding up the release of quite a few BD movies from studios such as Warner. Some say, "oh, it's not a BDJ problem, it's really just about player profiles".

Nuh-uh... If this BDJ thing was worth it's weight in paper as a standard, the players would have to conform to something, surely? You wouldn't have to worry that something you wrote (coded by HAND, I might add, since a Bluray insider said there are no dev tools) would run on one player but not another?
I suppose all the above makes sense to someone who is into the BD-J issue or cares about it. I personally don't. So, I repeat that this poll is not about your Warner campaign or whatever you have going on.

To consider this poll a systematic response to undermine your Warner issue is wildly incorrect (and slightly funny) causation. You are free to believe that but frankly, I am no BD conspirer and you would be wasting your energy if you think that the two things, your campaign and my poll, are related. :)


We may not like some of the things that someone or another says about one format or the other, but let's try to keep some basic respect in place so that there can be discussion of views and not act like we all just came out of a video arcade looking for some aggro'.
There is no disrepect in this thread from me or anyone else yet (that I saw). If there is some, please report it. I do not have the power to police the forum. The only power I have is to start threads and post.

I am doing exactly that and I repeat I have not attacked you personally. And please expect and accept (polite) scrutiny when you create and publicize a website.

As you say, peace :)

rdjam, I think, given the multiple positive choices in this poll, the people who agree with your site's facts will make their voice heard. If you believe that AVS members who read your site can gauge the truth of it correctly, then the poll results will show that soon enough. Also, worst case scenario, this poll is at the very least going to send even more people to your site :)

You might want to note that, so far, no one except one person (out of 32 voters) has said that the site is completely correct. There are 3 more people (besides me) who think that the site is a worthy effort but even they vote that there are errors. Perhaps, and this is just a suggestion, you could PM those 3 people to get feedback on what errors they think you have made. They obviously support your site.

I have faith that if there are those who think that the site is fully correct and a worthy effort, they will vote as much. :)

time

you know the first thing we do when we get a report is check IP addresses and shared use

edit: it continues to amaze me that long time members would start to post under another identity:

this is against forum rules and will get you banned

Don't do it