I've noticed posts in the general Verizon FiOS thread and the PDX Comcast thread that Showtime is presenting a free view weekend. I can't get anything from our Frontier provider. So while the other TV providers (Comcast, Verizon) provide this for their subscribers, Frontier subscribers are left out? Is this another result of the "smallness" of Frontier which can't negotiate with the big boys?

BTW, for the past week, every time I want to compose a reply on AVS I need to log in. Never had to do this in the past. Anyone else?

BTW, for the past week, every time I want to compose a reply on AVS I need to log in. Never had to do this in the past. Anyone else?

No. I am OK with just posting..

I've noticed posts in the general Verizon FiOS thread and the PDX Comcast thread that Showtime is presenting a free view weekend. I can't get anything from our Frontier provider. So while the other TV providers (Comcast, Verizon) provide this for their subscribers, Frontier subscribers are left out? Is this another result of the "smallness" of Frontier which can't negotiate with the big boys?

BTW, for the past week, every time I want to compose a reply on AVS I need to log in. Never had to do this in the past. Anyone else?

Frontier is looking to migrate all of their video customers off their fiber network onto directv so don't look for them to offer previews made available to them by Showtime. It's also requires their conditional access manager to open up all channels then re encrypt them after preview which can take time and manpower.

Frontier is looking to migrate all of their video customers off their fiber network onto directv ....

Source? Is there a timetable for this transition? Are they expected to employ this strategy in all markets they acquired from Verizon or just Oregon? They're currently signing up subs for 2 year contracts so this is not going to be done quickly.

If true, this would seem to be a bit of an expensive, money-losing purchase by Frontier for just keeping (dying) land line business plus internet on the FiOS infrastructure.

I sometimes wish i didn't love the TV service as much as I do....I'd love to migrate to a supplier who is actually interested in innovation for the consumer instead of a service supplier. Frontier isn't doing jack while, Direct, Comcast, TWC, etc are looking at some pretty cool things in the near future.

Source? Is there a timetable for this transition? Are they expected to employ this strategy in all markets they acquired from Verizon or just Oregon? They're currently signing up subs for 2 year contracts so this is not going to be done quickly.

If true, this would seem to be a bit of an expensive, money-losing purchase by Frontier for just keeping (dying) land line business plus internet on the FiOS infrastructure.

http://www.oregonlive.com/business/index.ssf/2011/01/frontier_plans_massive_fios_ca.html

Frontier is looking to migrate all of their video customers off their fiber network onto directv ....

http://www.oregonlive.com/business/index.ssf/2011/01/frontier_plans_massive_fios_ca.html

I am familiar with the Oregonian report. It doesn't say Frontier is quitting the TV business and shuttling everyone to DirecTv, although you might infer that what with Ms. Beasly's comments about programming costs. The inference is that if Frontier can't recoup its costs for programming via increased subscription rates it might abandon its video services. Mt. Hood's Olson's "white flag surrender" statement is pure supposition on his part.

I'm not saying Frontier doesn't have a strategy to exit the video business in our area, it's just not been stated as fact by them ... yet.

I 'might' actually be willing to go to DirectTV if they make it as affordable as possible for me, somehow manage to get ComcastSportsNet AND implement RVU.

I 'might' actually be willing to go to DirectTV if they make it as affordable as possible for me, somehow manage to get ComcastSportsNet AND implement RVU.

Yeah, good luck with that.

It will be interesting to compare what Frontier will offer DirecTv packages for to DirecTv's own new customer packs. The article stated $63/mo. after a freebie period but that didn't specify the programming it might include.

Yeah, good luck with that.

It will be interesting to compare what Frontier will offer DirecTv packages for to DirecTv's own new customer packs. The article stated $63/mo. after a freebie period but that didn't specify the programming it might include.

Yeah, I know I'm in a dream world right now - this article has just got me really excited:

http://www.engadget.com/2011/01/09/could-this-be-the-year-we-get-to-ditch-the-cable-box/

Yeah, I know I'm in a dream world right now - this article has just got me really excited:

http://www.engadget.com/2011/01/09/could-this-be-the-year-we-get-to-ditch-the-cable-box/

But the euphoria dissolves when you wake up and realize you're a Frontier customer. :(

Thanks for the link.

But the euphoria dissolves when you wake up and realize you're a Frontier customer. :(

What's even worse is that it wasn't Verizon that dropped us, it was Frontier that wanted us! Frontier pushed for the transaction!

Verizon was probably happy to get rid of some relatively small, marginally profitable areas. But Verizon wasn't about to be proactive about it, they couldn't afford another black eye after the total disasters their previous spinoffs of their Yellow Pages (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Idearc) and their New England landlines. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fairpoint) Both of those went Chapter 11, just a few years after spinoff.

just happened to be parked outside of the Tanasbourne store tonight and they had a promo that didn't sound like they're looking to jump out of the industry any time soon.

If memory serves correct - it was a free 32" HDTV and Blu-Ray player along with some package of 255 channels free for a year with a 3 year commitment.

The fact that they'd lock someone in for 3 years along with those promo's seems kind of odd.

And there's a huge billboard/sign at the 99W overpass at Hwy217 that says something like "At Last - Free TV" with the Frontier logo. I was in motion westbound on 99W when I saw it but it didn't appear to contain any small-print details, just the lure. I also wonder why they are promoting these things if they are trying to exit the business. Perhaps it's as I theorized earlier - if they get enough subs paying their new prices they might be able to pay the freight for content.

And there's a huge billboard/sign at the 99W overpass at Hwy217 that says something like "At Last - Free TV" with the Frontier logo. I was in motion westbound on 99W when I saw it but it didn't appear to contain any small-print details, just the lure. I also wonder why they are promoting these things if they are trying to exit the business. Perhaps it's as I theorized earlier - if they get enough subs paying their new prices they might be able to pay the freight for content.

Only an idiot would pay those inflated prices though. It would be cheaper in the long run to pay the ETF and switch providers than to pay $94 or whatever dollars a month for what should cost $45-$50.

Free tv = DirecTV. Nothing more, nothing less.

Free tv = DirecTV. Nothing more, nothing less.

go figure....nice 3 year commitment they attach to it as well. Probably miserable programming package and outdated equipment.

More evidence (assuming it's fact) of the imminent (12/31/11) death of FiOS TV:

http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r25332780-Is-the-writting-on-the-wall-for-FiOS-TV-read-this.

More evidence (assuming it's fact) of the imminent (12/31/11) death of FiOS TV:

http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r25332780-Is-the-writting-on-the-wall-for-FiOS-TV-read-this.

I'm not sure I'd trust any "inside" information on a online forum right now. Without going through that person's post history to see if they have any real background within Frontier it's purely speculation or maybe even just a competitor trying to mess with Frontier customers.

Until I hear something from Frontier directly I'm not going to worry. Even then if I have to move again to someone else then that's all there is to do.

I'm not sure I'd trust any "inside" information on a online forum right now. Without going through that person's post history to see if they have any real background within Frontier it's purely speculation or maybe even just a competitor trying to mess with Frontier customers.

Until I hear something from Frontier directly I'm not going to worry. Even then if I have to move again to someone else then that's all there is to do.

AT&T and and Verizon have deals to resell directv but only promo it in areas where uverse and FiOS are not available. The fact that frontier is raising fios video rates and pushing FiOS video customers to satellite is obvious they don't want the burden or maintaining expensive headends, the people that run it and any possible fees to Verizon of maintaining any portion of it. Frontier will not come out publicly to state they are offloading customers.

Will Frontier eventually terminate FiOS?

I don't think so, but the "tea leaves" could lead some to think that.

The head-end is pretty much automated; Verizon still provides much of the programming and operational help under contract to Frontier. I would hope that Frontier entered into a long term agreement to offer phone, internet, and TV assistance. So, overall, I would expect Frontier to have access to these services for quite some time at some cost.

The fiber infrastructure is one cost that is shared by the 3 services. I don't think Frontier has the capital to expand the existing fiber network. They do however have the incentive to maximize that installed network. Without expanding the fiber network, they have little capability to increase the customers for fiber services. For phone and internet, they can market both fiber and copper delivered services. For TV, all they can hope for is increasing the number of subscribers near existing fiber, or market alternatives like DirecTV to their service area. It's not so much a question of DirecTV being less or more expensive, but rather how to capture that potential customer; the customer alternative is another cable company (eg Comcast), OTA, or internet delivered TV.

Frontier's near term challenge is to maximize utilization of its network - phone, internet, AND TV.

Frontier gets a temporary revenue boost if unserved fiber customers take the DirecTV alternative - DirecTV probably pays a bonus incentive to Frontier for each new subscriber added, and perhaps a percentage of the monthly subscription revenue. Out of this, Frontier funds its various incentives to lure new subscribers. It's probably cheaper for Frontier to do this than to invest in laying more fiber.

For internet and TV, Frontier simply delivers conventional POTS and DSL. They might even offer Frontier branded cellular and WiMAX internet as alternatives (as Comcast did here for a while).

Me, I'm not predicting doomsday. Sure, I'm not happy about the coming increase for FiOSTV subscription fees, nor would I welcome any decrease or ceasing of offered services. I am somewhat concerned that Frontier is stuck offering the current level of capabilities. I am hoping that as Verizon moves forward with FiOS services, Frontier eventually passes those improvements to its customers.

We'll just have to see what the future holds.

Mike

Mike,
Interesting thoughts...thoughts I hope come true...but I simply don't see it (I'm stuck reading those tea leaves).

First of all Verizon may provide the programming and operational help, but not only have we lost services (remote DVR scheduling) but there are fantastic new Verizon services coming to their customers (iPad app) that appear to be no where on the horizon for Froniter. This is creating a stagnant product offering that lost services upon the transaction completion and has done NOTHING to increase value over the past months. This tells me (again the tea leaves) that Frontier is trying to get away with the bare minimum offering for FiOS TV until their contract requirement of offering the service through 12/31/11 expires so they can kill it.

And while I agree that they are leveraging Verizon, there are just no enough FiOS customers to spread out any investment costs nor justify keeping a dedicated part of the company to service it. I've seen the number of 100,000 customers...who knows if that's true, but even if its in the ballpark there's just not enough there. Given these price increases and the push to Dtv that 100,000 will drop significantly and the situation will be worse. What happens as Verizon increases their fees to license their technology/services? Frontier is going to pay more to help those 100,000 customers rather than just killing the service? I don't see it.

The biggest tea leaf is the recent announcement. It's pretty unprecedented that a company increases rates way beyond its current competitors then turns around and offers their own consumers an alternative product for free for a year. You're telling customers to pay through the nose for FiOS or get this alternative service for free (then significantly cheaper). There is nothing in that strategy that grows the subscriber base. It may keep them in the Frontier family, but not on FiOS TV. Plus, what do they have to sell FiOS TV...one valid option is not having to use a dish...but what else? Pay more for less features? Or the picture quality argument but the vast majority of customers NOT on AVSForum have no clue about picture quality.

About 3 months ago I wrote a letter to the Frontier big-wigs expressing my concern about the future of FiOS TV. I, of course, didn't expect a detailed response about future strategy or anything but I thought I'd give it a try. I was hoping to maybe just receive a "we're committed to FiOS TV" response...the only response I got was a thank you and a "valued customer" discount on my bill.

In my mind if this rumor about not allowing bundled packages with FiOS TV as of next week comes true, it's over. Now they'd be offering a TV product with less features, is significantly more expensive, and you can't bundle with your other services.

I've been a happy FiOS customer for years but I see the writing on the wall. It will be interesting to revisit this in a year to see what happened but I'd make a fairly confident bet that I'd unfortunately be a Comcast customer again by then (my price protection expires 10/11).

Great insight......I am unsure how long my price protection lasts, I should probably figure that out.

Anyone know, if I am signed up for a package such as MLB Extra Innings with Frontier - if I end having to switch to Comcast mid-season. How big of a PIA would it be carrying the subscription package over with me?

Great insight......I am unsure how long my price protection lasts, I should probably figure that out.

Anyone know, if I am signed up for a package such as MLB Extra Innings with Frontier - if I end having to switch to Comcast mid-season. How big of a PIA would it be carrying the subscription package over with me?

I don't know this for a fact, but would guess you're buying the package from the provider not from MLB so there's nothing in place to transfer your purchase to a new provider.

I don't know this for a fact, but would guess you're buying the package from the provider not from MLB so there's nothing in place to transfer your purchase to a new provider.

This is going to certainly be a make or break for me in regards to staying a customer. I don't want to lock in my contract pricing as it's become clear that Frontier isn't going to be enhancing or developing for us.

I also refuse to shell out $180 for a product in which I may only enjoy for a month before the price hike hits - and be stuck holding the bag in multiple ways.

This is ridiculous.......I'm pissed, cause I've got a pretty sweet set-up the way things are.....

Yep, the Extra Innings or NBA League Pass or NHL Center Ice don't transfer from one provider to another. If you were moving to a new house and kept the same provider, it of course would transfer with you to the new address.

Yep, the Extra Innings or NBA League Pass or NHL Center Ice don't transfer from one provider to another. If you were moving to a new house and kept the same provider, it of course would transfer with you to the new address.

lovely......I figured as much however I was holding out hope. Looks like I'll be enjoying my Frontier picture quality, fast internet and 2 free DVR's for $109/month till the middle of March before hoping onto some Comcast deal.

Only cool thing that excites me.....iPad app!

Comcast is sure jumping on the announcement.

This weekend I had two friendly Comcast employees at my door making sure that I knew that Frontier was raising their rates.

They both looked crestfallen though when I told them I was already in a 2 year agreement at the current rate. :D

(Full disclosure: I have no love for Comcast.)

lovely......I figured as much however I was holding out hope. Looks like I'll be enjoying my Frontier picture quality, fast internet and 2 free DVR's for $109/month till the middle of March before hoping onto some Comcast deal.

Only cool thing that excites me.....iPad app!

The one thing you might be able to argue is that if Frontier were to go out the TV market you could get a pro-rated refund for the package.

Really though you could sign an extension right now and if the doomsayers are right you'd be free of your contract at the end of the year. If not you're still getting the same prices you have now and wouldn't pay an increase for 2 years.

If you like the service there's no risk to you, right?

The one thing you might be able to argue is that if Frontier were to go out the TV market you could get a pro-rated refund for the package.

Really though you could sign an extension right now and if the doomsayers are right you'd be free of your contract at the end of the year. If not you're still getting the same prices you have now and wouldn't pay an increase for 2 years.

If you like the service there's no risk to you, right?

True, I like the service and the price. What I don't like is the lack of innvoation - and the fact that we could see channels dropping like flies if they're "unable to negotiate a fair price to carry" them in the future as contracts expire.

So many unknowns - makes it very unsettling to commit to two years when I'm in the clear now.

We'll just have to see what the future holds.

Thanks for your insight as to what's happening. However, I'm not quite as optimistic as you are.

The one thing I don't understand from Frontier's perspective is the whole DirecTV thing. Yes it helps them in areas where they only have copper and not fiber. But, it makes their customers less sticky. Eventually a customer might ask "WTF do I need Frontier for, why don't I just deal with DirecTV on my own?" Similarly, will an Internet/TV bundle from Frontier be any cheaper than from Comcast (taking into account promotional pricing from both)?

Also, Frontier is in a really bad spot because voice is going away. So many people have cell phones, others do VOIP using services like Ooma or even Skype. It's hard to obtain value from the third leg of a triple play if it's so easy for individuals to do VOIP on their own. Those annoying magicJack commercials are undoubtedly taking their toll.

This won't end well for consumers, no matter what the details turn out to be.

Comcast is sure jumping on the announcement.

This weekend I had two friendly Comcast employees at my door making sure that I knew that Frontier was raising their rates.

They both looked crestfallen though when I told them I was already in a 2 year agreement at the current rate. :D

(Full disclosure: I have no love for Comcast.)


I'll go without tv before I switch to Comcast.

I'll go without tv before I switch to Comcast.

wow, no matter how much I may dislike a provider.....my love for quality programs far exeeds. :) Yes, I am a product of this modern American culture.:D

Wow, the Frontier "service politics" is an interesting read. I'm following along with great interest and much trepidation.

On a related note....Has anyone had problems with the HD DVR program listing not correctly flagging new television episodes as NEW? We've had to keep on top of it to keep from missing new programming for series' on our series list.

Anyone else having issues with it?

Wow, the Frontier "service politics" is an interesting read. I'm following along with great interest and much trepidation.

On a related note....Has anyone had problems with the HD DVR program listing not correctly flagging new television episodes as NEW? We've had to keep on top of it to keep from missing new programming for series' on our series list.

Anyone else having issues with it?

You might need to go back and re-schedule quite a few programs.
A few weeks back there was a refresh of the channel lineup and series recordings didn't update. Generally you can tell if they are set correctly if you see both a channel number and name in the series manager. If it's just the channel number (even the correct number) you're not going to get any scheduled recordings.

The 'New' flags aren't showing up in the guide for obviously new series programming though. It's inconsistent from show to show. This is what makes me think that there's a problem with the guide data. This is happening on lots of channels, most of which didn't change channel numbers.

Guide data is a-ok on the TiVo's.

The 'New' flags aren't showing up in the guide for obviously new series programming though. It's inconsistent from show to show. This is what makes me think that there's a problem with the guide data. This is happening on lots of channels, most of which didn't change channel numbers.

Maybe an example of a show that's not getting picked up might help? See if someone else has the same issue. If it's just a listing problem then there's not much that can likely be done since all guide info seems to come from one source.

Maybe an example of a show that's not getting picked up might help? See if someone else has the same issue. If it's just a listing problem then there's not much that can likely be done since all guide info seems to come from one source.

Merlin on SYFY is the one that's bugging me the most right now as they just started a new season and none are being flagged as new.

just went to pay my bill this morning and decided to check out my "services" - there is an option to 'renew your current bundle' - if you click on the link it tells you that you can not and have to visit there nearest office. I am assuming that their prepping to not offer new customers FiOS TV service or as a sales tactic to get you in and sell you on Directv....

I'm considering switching to Frontier (from Comcast). But I was looking at the lineup at the website and noticed that it is missing KUNP (Univision). That's a deal breaker since my wife needs her "telenovelas" fix. Is this channel really missing or is the lineup at the website outdated? If so, where can I get an updated lienup.

I'll go without tv before I switch to Comcast.


...and the Comcast ByteCounting.

One thing that keeps me on Frontier is my 3 1TB TiVo HD's. I wonder when the cable companies will get 157 HD hours of record time?!!!

Univision KUNP-TV is on channel 16 on FIOS

If I sign up now for TV service (new customer), do I automatically lock the current prices for 2 years? or what do I need to do?

...and the Comcast ByteCounting.

One thing that keeps me on Frontier is my 3 1TB TiVo HD's. I wonder when the cable companies will get 157 HD hours of record time?!!!


Well you can use the TiVo's with Comcast. And byte counting by Comcast is better than no service at all, but Frontier should be keeping us at least connected internet-wise for the foreseeable future.

Well you can use the TiVo's with Comcast. And byte counting by Comcast is better than no service at all, but Frontier should be keeping us at least connected internet-wise for the foreseeable future.

Yeah, i would plan on keeping my FiOS internet if I pull the plug on the TV service. I've had nothing but positive things to say about their internet. In fact, the TV service was flawless under Verizon - only had a few issues with it under the Frontier umbrella.

I've actually started to look into Directv and for what I watch, it really doesn't seem to be a bad deal. Anyone have any experiences with them? I'll probably hold off until I hear more about the RVU implementation though.

Well you can use the TiVo's with Comcast. And byte counting by Comcast is better than no service at all, but Frontier should be keeping us at least connected internet-wise for the foreseeable future.

Yes, I had done that before FIOS but there was sure more pixelization on Comcast!

Yeah, i would plan on keeping my FiOS internet if I pull the plug on the TV service. I've had nothing but positive things to say about their internet. In fact, the TV service was flawless under Verizon - only had a few issues with it under the Frontier umbrella.

I've actually started to look into Directv and for what I watch, it really doesn't seem to be a bad deal. Anyone have any experiences with them? I'll probably hold off until I hear more about the RVU implementation though.

DTV will not let me use my TIVO's. I could sell them but the DTV and DISH units do not have a lot of HD room!

DTV will not let me use my TIVO's. I could sell them but the DTV and DISH units do not have a lot of HD room!

this sounds like it will be changing soon.....

Yep, not only will the DirecTV Box with TiVo come online this year, but the expansion ports are or will be enabled for expansion for DirecTV.

Yep, not only will the DirecTV Box with TiVo come online this year, but the expansion ports are or will be enabled for expansion for DirecTV.

One thing I do not know is that if I decide to move to DirectTV, they have a number of boxes and equipment free of charge. If and when new boxes come available this year (directivo and the RVU enabled unit) how does one go about upgrading to new equipment with them?

That's a good question grassfeeder, haven't been with DirecTV since FiOS first came out. Still have an old HR10-250 which of course is now not-HD compatible besides OTA, we'll see if they want to upgrade us from that box to the new TiVo box...assuming that within a year Frontier TV goes bye bye or everyone pays $30 minimum more than they are now and I decide to move back to DirecTV.

That's a good question grassfeeder, haven't been with DirecTV since FiOS first came out. Still have an old HR10-250 which of course is now not-HD compatible besides OTA, we'll see if they want to upgrade us from that box to the new TiVo box...assuming that within a year Frontier TV goes bye bye or everyone pays $30 minimum more than they are now and I decide to move back to DirecTV.

any issues with DirecTV when you had them? Billing? Service? Quality?

No issues with billing, everything "Worked". Had the rain fade twice in our home (I think this was the big huge thunderstorms back in 2005-2007 that we had in January or March), but other than that everything came in like it was supposed to.

I do know that the non-HD channels didn't seem to come in as well as what we have on Frontier, but since we don't have a non-HDTV upstairs anymore, that shouldn't be a problem. Just no CSNW (Blazer channel) as of yet but everything else is pretty much the same.

I've been reluctant to switch to Comcast, but this new story on Netflix ISP performance has me leaning more in that direction. Comcast's performance is very high, Verizon's is pretty good, and Frontier's stinks.

I admit that I haven't *seen* any difference, but the drop from Verizon's levels has me wondering not only about their TV service, but what they might be planning for their internet service as well.

http://techblog.netflix.com/2011/01/netflix-performance-on-top-isp-networks.html

I've been reluctant to switch to Comcast, but this new story on Netflix ISP performance has me leaning more in that direction. Comcast's performance is very high, Verizon's is pretty good, and Frontier's stinks.

I admit that I haven't *seen* any difference, but the drop from Verizon's levels has me wondering not only about their TV service, but what they might be planning for their internet service as well.

http://techblog.netflix.com/2011/01/netflix-performance-on-top-isp-networks.html

Just a guess, but that probably averages in Frontier's primary customer base that uses a DSL-based connection for their internet access, not FIOS. If I remember correctly that's all that Frontier offered before recently getting the Verizon customers.

There are a number of commenters asking if there's a way to split the 2 customer bases but I'm guessing from Netflix's end they just see a common provider location and can't differentiate.

I don't personally see any difference from when we were getting service from Verizon and now, but do know that Comcast is going to hit you with data caps.

Just a guess, but that probably averages in Frontier's primary customer base that uses a DSL-based connection for their internet access, not FIOS. If I remember correctly that's all that Frontier offered before recently getting the Verizon customers.

There are a number of commenters asking if there's a way to split the 2 customer bases but I'm guessing from Netflix's end they just see a common provider location and can't differentiate.

I don't personally see any difference from when we were getting service from Verizon and now, but do know that Comcast is going to hit you with data caps.

I'd agree with this. I haven't seen any difference in service levels between the Verizon and Frontier rollover. For the most part (minus billing) the service levels have been pretty transparent.

Well, it looks like I found something good on dslreports about Frontier FIOS!

http://www.docstoc.com/docs/70213825/MACC-Letter-to-Frontier-FiOS

Other stuff there as well.

Well, it looks like I found something good on dslreports about Frontier FIOS!

http://www.docstoc.com/docs/70213825/MACC-Letter-to-Frontier-FiOS

Other stuff there as well.

interesting read for sure......I would love to see the direct response to this, not sure it's enough to retain me however. Too little, too late. I'm just waiting for other technologies to flesh themselves out at this point. I would a provider that's also interested in advancing it's product versus just providing it.

interesting read for sure......I would love to see the direct response to this, not sure it's enough to retain me however. Too little, too late. I'm just waiting for other technologies to flesh themselves out at this point. I would a provider that's also interested in advancing it's product versus just providing it.

I hear you but I am in for 24 more months and am paying LESS. My contract still had a year to go but they reduced the cost and resigned me for less per month. I think that they are careful now as I did this as soon as the increase was mentioned.

Great find mpsan.

Great find mpsan.

My concern is that Frontier basically says to MACC..."Yeah, you are correct. What are you going to do about it"? Nasty memo to follow! :D

My concern is that Frontier basically says to MACC..."Yeah, you are correct. What are you going to do about it"? Nasty memo to follow! :D

exactly.....Frontier has all the power in this one.......If people don't like it, make them change. By the time that actually happens they'll just pull the plug on 12/32/11 and you're out service....

exactly.....Frontier has all the power in this one.......If people don't like it, make them change. By the time that actually happens they'll just pull the plug on 12/32/11 and you're out service....

Yes, I dread 12/32/11! :D

I know it's inadviseable to keep my email with my ISP, but I do. Has anyone else who uses Frontier for email experienced hiccups like losing contact with the server or having to re-enter passwords frequently? It seems the SMTP server keeps dropping the connection and needs to be re-established more and more often. Never happened with Verizon in my experience. But since Frontier is now in the middle, it does. I doubt it's my Thunderbird email client as it happens with Mac Mail on my iMac as well as my PC.

I also wonder how long Frontier will be using Verizon's web facilities for billing and all other things where an internet interface is required? Maybe part of the overall strategy is to not have to develop this infrastructure for themselves for a short-lived purpose.

I know it's inadviseable to keep my email with my ISP, but I do. Has anyone else who uses Frontier for email experienced hiccups like losing contact with the server or having to re-enter passwords frequently? It seems the SMTP server keeps dropping the connection and needs to be re-established more and more often. Never happened with Verizon in my experience. But since Frontier is now in the middle, it does. I doubt it's my Thunderbird email client as it happens with Mac Mail on my iMac as well as my PC.

I also wonder how long Frontier will be using Verizon's web facilities for billing and all other things where an internet interface is required? Maybe part of the overall strategy is to not have to develop this infrastructure for themselves for a short-lived purpose.

I know this is a little OT, but I have always seen about 25/25 on several speed test sites. All of a sudden I sometimes get 25/10 or 15/8...still get 25/25 in the mornings. However, I never had this issue before.

I know this is a little OT, but I have always seen about 25/25 on several speed test sites. All of a sudden I sometimes get 25/10 or 15/8...still get 25/25 in the mornings. However, I never had this issue before.

When I first got FiOS I always saw close to 25/25. That's because Verizon knew what they were doing, and were committed to the long term. Frontier, in contrast, merely attempts to extract maximum cash flow from existing investment.

A few hours ago I was seeing 10/20 performance. Right now it's 23/23. So it's clearly quite variable.

Still, so far it's at least as good as Comcast. But at the end of the year, when TV goes away, I see no reason at all to keep Frontier for any service. Comcast triple play, here I come!

When I first got FiOS I always saw close to 25/25. That's because Verizon knew what they were doing, and were committed to the long term. Frontier, in contrast, merely attempts to extract maximum cash flow from existing investment.

A few hours ago I was seeing 10/20 performance. Right now it's 23/23. So it's clearly quite variable.

Still, so far it's at least as good as Comcast. But at the end of the year, when TV goes away, I see no reason at all to keep Frontier for any service. Comcast triple play, here I come!

I'm right there with you, if I decide against Directv, which is where I'm leaning now.

I'm right there with you, if I decide against Directv, which is where I'm leaning now.

Well, I never have seen this before. At least one person on the TiVo site also said that Netflix has been having streaming issues. What I do get seems fast enough, but it HAD ALWAYS been 25/25. Now I see less. Still, I remember the picture quality of Comcast and the Byte Counting and I would have to see a lot more problems before I switched! I wonder if we should start a thread on dslreports specific to the Portland area?

Just a quick question about the SuperBowl sound on 512...

I watched on a big screen and a large 5.1 surround system. All was good, however I noticed that when they switched to a local ad the sound was VERY soft and hard to hear. This went on even with the 10 PM news. All other stations except ch 513 that I tried were fine. Did our local Fox station do something or am I the only one who noticed this?

Just a quick question about the SuperBowl sound on 512...

I watched on a big screen and a large 5.1 surround system. All was good, however I noticed that when they switched to a local ad the sound was VERY soft and hard to hear. This went on even with the 10 PM news. All other stations except ch 513 that I tried were fine. Did our local Fox station do something or am I the only one who noticed this?

Noticed it on 512 during all the commercials as well, not just locals. Actually, I consider it a refreshing change from commercials being louder than the program materials!

It was quieter on the local commercials, wasn't at my house but a friend who lives nearby also has Frontier. Thought it was much better than the alternative!

My Network stuff was OK, but the local ones were almost so soft they could not be heard. That was the difference I saw. Does that sound like what everyone else heard? I just want to be sure my 5.1 Processor is OK. Everything else sounds fine! I wonder what they did. The DD 5.1 was on, but who knows what the heck the local commercials were?

Speaking of sound issue, did anyone notice regular cut-off of sound on OPB-HD for the past few days? I noticed it on Newshour, including the recording made at 4 PM today. It seemed every 10 minutes or so, the sound went away for about 3-4 seconds without any apparent video disruption. Strange!

So, on Frontiers facebook page - I had posted a comment in regards to the price hike. An official rep had reported that frontier NEVER notified customers of this hike and it was all in the media (true as far as I can tell) and that no price hike was on the horizon. Interesting.

So, on Frontiers facebook page - I had posted a comment in regards to the price hike. An official rep had reported that frontier NEVER notified customers of this hike and it was all in the media (true as far as I can tell) and that no price hike was on the horizon. Interesting.

And yet The Oregonian had a memo direct from corporate Frontier about the price-increase. If we cover our tracks, no one will know we were here has to be Frontier's motto.

And yet The Oregonian had a memo direct from corporate Frontier about the price-increase. If we cover our tracks, no one will know we were here has to be Frontier's motto.

do you have a link to that? I'll fuel some fires!

Yep, right here.

http://media.oregonlive.com/business_impact/other/FrontierLetter.pdf

Yep, right here.

http://media.oregonlive.com/business_impact/other/FrontierLetter.pdf

Frontier is insane. Certifiably insane.

They think that people will pay them $25/mo for local channels? Given that Comcast charges $10/mo? Plus the fiber is a sunk cost. The fiber already runs past my house, the ONT is already hanging on the side of the house. I guess they aren't sending ordinary photons over that fiber, these must be US Prime, free-range organic photons.

I've got the triple play, presumably for the next 14 months. But we'll see what happens at the end of this year. Anyone want to take an even money bet that Frontier will drop TV entirely at the end of 2011?

Frontier is insane. Certifiably insane.

I've got the triple play, presumably for the next 14 months. But we'll see what happens at the end of this year. Anyone want to take an even money bet that Frontier will drop TV entirely at the end of 2011?

I'll take you up on it. I think Frontier would indeed be "insane" should they decide to drop Fios TV service. For one thing, aren't they simply rebranding Verizon's offering? More to their bottom line point, a good number of their current subscribers will simply jump ship without having to pay the ETF.

BTW, I re-upped for two years just a month ago, and hope Frontier keeps the Fios TV going. If not, it will be their loss, and another provider's gain. simple as that! Now, when are we gonna get the Fox Soccer channel in HD?

I now think they'll survive into 2012 with the tv, but if they hit us up for the $30 rate increase at some point in time this year...then 12 months from that date is when they decide to shut it down.

I find it hard to believe that Frontier is exiting the TV business when they're advertising like crazy right now.

Of course, I'm sure Ultimate Electronics was advertising right up until they pulled the plug...

Frontier isn't advertising FiOS TV, they're advertising DirecTV.

I find it hard to believe that Frontier is exiting the TV business when they're advertising like crazy right now.

Of course, I'm sure Ultimate Electronics was advertising right up until they pulled the plug...

did Ultimate Electronics already pull the plug here? Wow.

did Ultimate Electronics already pull the plug here? Wow.

nevermind - I take a couple weeks off of paying attention and I obviously miss out on a massive store closure.

Does anybody know if Frontier is going to show the NASA TV feed for today's space shuttle launch? (Hopefully in HD.)

Does anybody know if Frontier is going to show the NASA TV feed for today's space shuttle launch? (Hopefully in HD.)For those that care, it looks like HDNET (Channel 569) will be carrying the launch starting at 1:30. (About 15 minutes from now.)

Hello all:

For the past several days now, ch 508 NEWS has had a bright white rectabgle on the lower left. Sometimes it is off if there is news footage, but it is usually on. Several days ago I called them and the person said that she saw it too...this is NOT on SD, only HD. She knew who to contact and they said it was a decal they had to turn off. As I watched they turned it off and thanked me.

Then it came back on a day later. I called several more times and they thanked me again, but it is still there.

OK, someone else can have a turn at this!

I'll take you up on it. I think Frontier would indeed be "insane" should they decide to drop Fios TV service. For one thing, aren't they simply rebranding Verizon's offering? More to their bottom line point, a good number of their current subscribers will simply jump ship without having to pay the ETF.

Okay, let's have some fun with this, putting our money where our mouths are (or in this case where our keystrokes are).

I bet you $20 that, on or before December 31, 2011, Frontier says something like: "we can't make any money on FiOS TV. We will no longer offer it to new subscribers, and we will discontinue it for existing subscribers by (some date not too far later)."

You win the bet even if Frontier continues FiOS TV only as a forced part of a bundle. My prediction is they'll make an announcement discontinuing it entirely. Their longer term strategy will be to simply resell DirecTV.
BTW, I re-upped for two years just a month ago, and hope Frontier keeps the Fios TV going.

I hope you're right. I think it's a very good sign that they let you re-up just a month ago. If they're reselling DirecTV, maybe it's no big deal for them to also continue reselling FiOS TV (with all the heavy lifting being done by Verizon).

Perhaps Frontier's strategy will be to effectively force bundles on people by charging so much for just TV that people will realistically be forced to take a "double bundle" or "triple bundle". I will be willing to continue my service with them if they keep bundle prices reasonable, and as long it's FiOS TV, not DirecTV, and as long as the Internet doesn't degrade any further.

The linked document didn't say anything about bundle prices.

Hello all:

For the past several days now, ch 508 NEWS has had a bright white rectabgle on the lower left.

I usually watch the 11 PM news and hadn't noticed. So I went back and checked. The Friday show has it, the Thursday and Wednesday shows were OK, the Tuesday and Monday shows were bad.

The two shows that were OK were because there was a distinct "Tire Factory" sponsored crawl at the bottom of the screen for those days.

I interrupted my daughter's Disney Channel viewing to check. When I showed her what I was looking for, her reaction was "who cares?". I agree with her. I had previously watched at least two shows with the rectangle and didn't even notice it until you pointed it out.

It doesn't seem all that "bright" to me, but I'm viewing using component output and there's probably a slight overscan. If you're using HDMI perhaps the rectangle is larger and more annoying.

I usually watch the 11 PM news and hadn't noticed. So I went back and checked. The Friday show has it, the Thursday and Wednesday shows were OK, the Tuesday and Monday shows were bad.

The two shows that were OK were because there was a distinct "Tire Factory" sponsored crawl at the bottom of the screen for those days.

I interrupted my daughter's Disney Channel viewing to check. When I showed her what I was looking for, her reaction was "who cares?". I agree with her. I had previously watched at least two shows with the rectangle and didn't even notice it until you pointed it out.

It doesn't seem all that "bright" to me, but I'm viewing using component output and there's probably a slight overscan. If you're using HDMI perhaps the rectangle is larger and more annoying.

Yes, I am using HDMI and I just want to be sure there is no Burn in. It is not on that often...just the news in HD, but it is not right and they know how to fix it.

Also, when I re upped for 2 years on Frontier the rep said they did not want to kill FIOSTV as they make more mony on that than as a reseller of DIRECTV.

According to OregonLive (and dslreports) Frontier wants out of FIOS TV in Oregon!

http://www.oregonlive.com/business/index.ssf/2011/03/frontier_pulls_out_of_cable_tv.html

Not a surprise, take the outskirts out first and then move out of Beaverton and Gresham.

Not a surprise, take the outskirts out first and then move out of Beaverton and Gresham.

"Surprise, surprise, surprise" said Gomer Pyle. I wonder if Mrs. Mary Agnes Wilderotter is the issue of an unholy union between Gomer and the Unfrozen Caveman Lawyer? As in: "I'm a simple country bumpkin CEO. This strange box with flashing pictures and loud sounds confuses and frightens me".

Still, all hope is not lost. I notice you didn't make any predictions about Tualatin. Perhaps we'll be spared! :)

Whatever happened to due diligence? How could anyone believe that Frontier was unprepared for the complexities and costs of providing TV content? Isn't this a breach of public trust? I will ride out my new two year contract and see what happens.

"Surprise, surprise, surprise" said Gomer Pyle. I wonder if Mrs. Mary Agnes Wilderotter is the issue of an unholy union between Gomer and the Unfrozen Caveman Lawyer? As in: "I'm a simple country bumpkin CEO. This strange box with flashing pictures and loud sounds confuses and frightens me".

Still, all hope is not lost. I notice you didn't make any predictions about Tualatin. Perhaps we'll be spared! :)

Tualatin = outskirts. You're peanuts compared to Beaverton and Gresham.

Whatever happened to due diligence? How could anyone believe that Frontier was unprepared for the complexities and costs of providing TV content? Isn't this a breach of public trust? I will ride out my new two year contract and see what happens.


Don't expect them to be around in two years with tv service.

I think our "regulatory" agencies need to start paying attention, big time!

The article sort of stated that Verizon threw in the FiOS TV as a deal sweatener. This implies that Frontier was perhaps only interested in the telephone and internet services.

The way the Frontier folks are handling this from a PR perspective is a disaster. The executives or the PR people need to make a statement that isn't so wihy-washy. Everything seen so far looks like amateurs are running the operation.

If it is so hard, I don't understand why Frontier simply doesn't subcontract everything back to Verizon, who at least seem to now how to run the operation; and of course, Verizon FiOS is quite active in other parts of the country.

If the worst case happens, we are all at a loss.

I guess Frontier simply does not know how to negotiate with the programming suppliers.

If Frontier hopes to continue phone and internet service, they still have a lot of back room equipment to operate. Sounds like the reall issue is lack of negotiating heft on the programming side.

I guess we're just small time cable customers!

Mike

Don't expect them to be around in two years with tv service.

I am not deluding myself to think they will be around. What I will be watching closely is when they do step away is what will be their tactic to satisfy the remainder of my contract. I cannot receive satellite TV. Will there be a buy out? Maybe the terms of the contract would help - if I could ever find that.

If they drop tv, you're out of your contract and can move to someone else without penalty. You don't think they're contractually obligated to serve you for two years do you because that's not what the contract is for.

If they drop tv, you're out of your contract and can move to someone else without penalty. You don't think they're contractually obligated to serve you for two years do you because that's not what the contract is for.

No, no. Severability payment is what I expect. If I cancel or end the contract early, I have to pay them $xx for months remaining. They should have to pony up if they do not provide me with a suitable alternative to that which is being taken away ... or a monetary payment. Since I can't get satellite service and I don't consider Comcast as suitable, what's left (for example)?

No, no. Severability payment is what I expect. If I cancel or end the contract early, I have to pay them $xx for months remaining. They should have to pony up if they do not provide me with a suitable alternative to that which is being taken away ... or a monetary payment. Since I can't get satellite service and I don't consider Comcast as suitable, what's left (for example)?

That's what you'd like to see.
Unfortunately you don't have any rights with the contract you've signed, or with services like this in general.
If you go back and read your agreement you will find that Frontier (or Verizon) has reserved the right to terminate service at any time and without any notice.

That's what you'd like to see.
Unfortunately you don't have any rights with the contract you've signed, or with services like this in general.
If you go back and read your agreement you will find that Frontier (or Verizon) has reserved the right to terminate service at any time and without any notice.

Pretty sure they have to give 30 day notice (or 15), but yes they do have that right to terminate at anytime.



*edit* Looks like it's a 90 day notice actually...three months. Anyone want to bet we see something along these lines at the end of September?

I wish Verizon would do the smart thing and buy it all back from Frontier at half the price.

With all the trees around my place I'm sure I can't get satellite, and I don't want Comcast either.

Wow, I hadn't been following all this, beyond the January price increase that got pulled back, apparently replaced with a $500 installation that would discourage new business. Frontier wants only internet, funny. When FIOS came to town, Verizon would not sell me internet only. I have slow DSL, and pay $48 for phone and internet, it's too slow for Netflix. I suspect Verizon grew the business for the sale. Once Frontier signed the contract, Verizon cut my DSL speed in half. Frontier bought a bunch of unhappy customers.

If anybody has advice for best internet only service, ideally without phoneline required, I'm all ears.

Wow, I hadn't been following all this, beyond the January price increase that got pulled back, apparently replaced with a $500 installation that would discourage new business. Frontier wants only internet, funny. When FIOS came to town, Verizon would not sell me internet only. I have slow DSL, and pay $48 for phone and internet, it's too slow for Netflix. I suspect Verizon grew the business for the sale. Once Frontier signed the contract, Verizon cut my DSL speed in half. Frontier bought a bunch of unhappy customers.

If anybody has advice for best internet only service, ideally without phoneline required, I'm all ears.

I don't know why Verizon wouldn't sell you just Internet. I have a Sales Order Form from early last year, when I got their "Triple Bundle", and it was quite possible to order just Internet. Price was $50/mo for 15/5 and $65/mo for 25/25. One year contract required, $165 ETF.

Comcast has Internet. They used to charge $35 for their economy service, which was 1mb/384kb. That probably won't get you good streaming. As of about a year ago, their faster service started at about $55. But they probably offer deals for 6 or 12 month discounts. Why not call them?

Something else to think about is CLEAR. (http://www.clear.com/plans) If you are in their coverage area you can get 1.5mb/500kb for $35. But they are hurting, I don't think they will make it.

Thanks for the info on Clear, Phantom. $35 for rock bottom internet doesn't sound like a great deal to me, but it seems to be the price they all get away with. They still had triple play FIOS for $90, but for intenet only for both FIOS and DSL, Frontier quoted me over $55 last July. Plus installation. Frontier would allow internet only, but Verizon did not, at least no when FIOS was new. I know, I should call again, but I hate using the phone, and I never get a bottom line answer from anybody, not that it's any clearer online. I have hesitated losing my landline, so maybe I should shut up and live with what I've got, and forget about streaming.

I don't know why Verizon wouldn't sell you just Internet.

Possibly because Verizon sold that business in Oregon to Frontier, along with landline phone and TV? Verizon Wireless is the only remaining service you can buy from Verizon in OR.

I'm referring to FIOS when it first became available here, and Verizon owned it. Verizon told me they would not install FIOS internet unless I got FIOS TV too. Perhaps they needed a minimum number of FIOS TV subscribers for clout in negotiating channel programming. Or perhaps it wasn't worth it to install FIOS for two services. Or perhaps bundling was their strategy to lock out the competition.

Thanks for the info on Clear, Phantom. $35 for rock bottom internet doesn't sound like a great deal to me, but it seems to be the price they all get away with. The Clear service is most beneficial for mobile users. If you're buying the service for a stationary position (like at home or office) I don't think it makes as much sense as a hard-line solution. (DSL/Cable/Fiber/etc.)

I'm referring to FIOS when it first became available here, and Verizon owned it. Verizon told me they would not install FIOS internet unless I got FIOS TV too. Perhaps they needed a minimum number of FIOS TV subscribers for clout in negotiating channel programming. Or perhaps it wasn't worth it to install FIOS for two services. Or perhaps bundling was their strategy to lock out the competition.

Verizon FiOS internet was made available (at least to me) a year prior to the TV service even being rolled out. I had both services as soon as they hit market.

Yep, I was one of the first tv installs and was in the first month or two for internet for Verizon.

I just wonder if people in the Portland area have noticed that the Newspaper ads from Frontier have these new offers for FIOS Internet and Phone. Not a word about TV!

I just wonder if people in the Portland area have noticed that the Newspaper ads from Frontier have these new offers for FIOS Internet and Phone. Not a word about TV!

doesn't surprise me.....my patience with them are growing very tiresome. I am looking more and more into DirecTV.

doesn't surprise me.....my patience with them are growing very tiresome. I am looking more and more into DirecTV.

I renewed for 2 years and got a great rate with 6 Months free HBO/Cinemax. EVERY month I have to call them to find out what to pay as the bill has not been correct yet!

I just wonder if people in the Portland area have noticed that the Newspaper ads from Frontier have these new offers for FIOS Internet and Phone. Not a word about TV!

No they have TV in most of the ads I've seen....it's just missing a "Direc" in front of it! Why they think they can still try to make money off home telephone is beyond me. :confused:

No they have TV in most of the ads I've seen....it's just missing a "Direc" in front of it! Why they think they can still try to make money off home telephone is beyond me. :confused:

Well, the insert in today's paper has no mention of TV at all.

I just wonder if people in the Portland area have noticed that the Newspaper ads from Frontier have these new offers for FIOS Internet and Phone. Not a word about TV!

I was walking thru Washington Square this afternoon, and quizzed the sales critters at the FiOS kiosk about this. They said:

1) they're selling DirecTV to customers
2) they don't know if/when FiOS TV goes away
3) they think we will have at least 3 months notice before TV goes dark
4) they're also upset, because they are also customers
5) they don't make the decisions
6) they think that Frontier still has value, because their Internet service is better than Comcast's. I didn't really argue that point with them, other than to point out that
6a) when I had Comcast Internet it was just fine
6b) Comcast's bundling deals (triple play or whatever they're called) will make it harder for Frontier to compete

I've never shorted a stock in my life, and I'm not about to start now, but I certainly won't be buying FTR stock. I think it's being run simply to generate cash. No long term future for the company. The stock currently pays a very generous 9.3% yield. One way to interpret that is that Wall Street is betting that the company will have to cut its dividend. Note that they already cut once, from $1 to $0.75, when they bought the Verizon assets.

BTW, this whole business situation is being actively covered at a national level. It's not just local coverage like from the Oregonian. E.g. here is a Bloomberg (nee Businessweek) article (http://www.businessweek.com/magazine/content/11_13/b4221046109606.htm?campaign_id=yhoo) about it.

I sold off my FTR stock, received when VZ divested itself of us for about $9.44 and haven't been happier. The dividend will be cut again in the very near future and more people will dump the stock.

And Phantom is right, the double/triple play price will kill Frontier in the end against Comcast. Hopefully someone else (even a municipality) buys up the fiber portion from Frontier for pennies on the dollar and puts out a quality product like Verizon did.

My 2 issues about Comcast are...

1. Byte counting
2. TiVo's had more pixelization when I was on CC.

My 2 issues about Comcast are...

1. Byte counting
2. TiVo's had more pixelization when I was on CC.

3. Price per services
4. Customer Service, or lack thereof
5. Picture quality
6. Local monopoly attitude

3. Price per services
4. Customer Service, or lack thereof
5. Picture quality
6. Local monopoly attitude


Especially #6. It got better when Verizon FIOS came in but if Frontier goes away we will be back to this attitude worse than ever!

Does anyone know if Frontier is still offering free TV through 2011 for those willing to switch over from FiOS......I'm growing increasingly pissed.....

I asked that question last week and was told, no, I could not get DirecTV free for 2011 if I switched from FIOS.

I asked that question last week and was told, no, I could not get DirecTV free for 2011 if I switched from FIOS.

lovely considering they still have the "free tv" billboard up on Hwy 26 West....I'm not under contract so if they want to be an ass than maybe I'll drop them and "rejoin" them.....

The one is still up getting onto 217 north from I-5 north as well. These monkeys have no clue.

The one is still up getting onto 217 north from I-5 north as well. These monkeys have no clue.

Speaking of monkeys, any possibility of getting new channel additions to the Frontier FIOS lineup? Verizon is about to add Fox Soccer Channel HD, so ... does Frontier still get the VZ feed, or are they completely on their own now?

Speaking of monkeys, any possibility of getting new channel additions to the Frontier FIOS lineup? Verizon is about to add Fox Soccer Channel HD, so ... does Frontier still get the VZ feed, or are they completely on their own now?

Um, yeah, good luck with that......not happening!

Speaking of monkeys, any possibility of getting new channel additions to the Frontier FIOS lineup? Verizon is about to add Fox Soccer Channel HD, so ... does Frontier still get the VZ feed, or are they completely on their own now?

VZ still provides the feeds but Frontier isn't going to be paying anymore than they have to for channel content. It's not coming.

couldn't wait any longer.....I'm getting Directv starting next Saturday.....FiOS, I love you, and I'm keeping your internet, however you're TV service is like dating a hot chick - it's a great ride but you're pretty much assured she's going to dump you.

couldn't wait any longer.....I'm getting Directv starting next Saturday.....FiOS, I love you, and I'm keeping your internet, however you're TV service is like dating a hot chick - it's a great ride but you're pretty much assured she's going to dump you.

I'm confused. Was there something wrong with your FiOS TV? Why not hold on until the bitter end? I'm sure we'll get at least one month's notice before FiOS TV goes dark.

I'm confused. Was there something wrong with your FiOS TV? Why not hold on until the bitter end? I'm sure we'll get at least one month's notice before FiOS TV goes dark.

I really just didn't like the direction things were headed. $500 install costs for new customers? The started charging me $20 for my HD DVR after I was supposed to get it free for 12 months and the notes in the system "mysteriously" disappeared even though it states my regular $5 box is free for 12 months. Their tone and attitude in the retail store on 185th in Tanasbourne was piss poor at best.

I'm keeping their internet for sure. However I figured that if I was going to have to make a switch and sign a contract - sooner was better than later. Oh, and being on hold for 48 minutes 3 times in a row didn't soften my mood with them.

I'm a man that acts spontaneously, that I know - so now I know I have DirecTV being installed on Saturday! We'll see how my tone changes - if at all. Either way, it's cheaper and not going any where.

I'm a man that acts spontaneously, that I know - so now I know I have DirecTV being installed on Saturday! We'll see how my tone changes - if at all. Either way, it's cheaper and not going any where.

Can you report back on the DTV picture quality versus FiOS? I'm the same boat as you...I'm going to jump off the FiOS TV sinking ship. Just trying to figure out if I want to go back to Comcrap or DTV...

Can you report back on the DTV picture quality versus FiOS? I'm the same boat as you...I'm going to jump off the FiOS TV sinking ship. Just trying to figure out if I want to go back to Comcrap or DTV...

I absolutely will - once i get it all set-up to my liking. I've had comcast/xfinity - whatever they want to call themselves - I know how that song and dance goes. A friend of mine just switched from FiOS to direcTV a couple of weeks ago and loves it however I think I'm more of a critic than he is and he doesn't have the best set-up in the world but the picture looked solid from my limited viewing.

Comcast just has no equal competitor in the cable market any longer so I don't see them having any urgency to stay competitive, add services and evolve in the Portland area as much as I may like.

Reviews pending.

OK, so my DirecTV install went down yesterday and these are some pretty fresh observations. Obviously the most important thing, picture quality. In the limited viewing I've done thus far (mostly all sports) I can't say there is much if any diminished picture quality. The picture 'may' be a touch softer in some scenes however it's just as sharp as FiOS was. Great clarity, good skin tones. I haven't bothered check out many SD channels, just not that into it given it's 2011. SD isn't bad though, obviously it doesn't retain the same levels of sharpness but it's certainly watchable. As of right now, I have zero regrets switching, we'll see if that remains that way after a month or so but so far - so good.

Here's the other side of things though. I got the whole-home DVR which is awesome. Absolutely love being able to utilize this, it's seamless - no lag what-so-ever. It's going to be nice to be able to record kids shows for the little one and have them play in her her room versus on the big screen downstairs!

PPV has not been utilized, nor do I see us utilizing it at all given the netflix subscription and bluray at redbox.

hardware. I got the newest HR-24 dvr box. It's much faster than the standard silver motorola verizon box I had with FiOS which seemed to lag with commands. the HR-24 reacts immediately to all commands which is a major breath of fresh air. It's a good piece of hardware. The will be releasing the HR-25 soon a well.....not sure about the specs of that though.

GUI interface is certainly behind the times though, this is the one major disadvantage of DirecTV that I've found thus far. Rumor has it that the GUI will undergo an overhaul this year though and go HD, if not totally redesigned as well. It's certainly workable, just a dated. The FiOS GUI was more advanced and possibly a little more intuitive. I'm not one who reads directions, I feel that I'm tech savvy enough that I should be able to pick up the remote and get what I need done easily. If I can't, how can I expect the lady to figure it out :) In all seriousness, FiOS is much better in that regard. However, my tone may change as I put more time in.

That's basically it I think......Any questions specifically feel free to ask. I want to be respectful and keep this thread FiOS however I think we all know it's a sinking ship so hopefully we're all able to use this thread to help each other out with the other viable service options.....

Curious - who makes the DVR D* employs and what's your disk capacity?

Curious - who makes the DVR D* employs and what's your disk capacity?

Yeah...we would have a hard time going back to 20 HD hours after our 1TB 157 Hour TiVo's.

Has anyone else in our area also noticed the very slow net connections these past few days? This post even paused for 10 seconds loading it in when I selected preview post!

Curious - who makes the DVR D* employs and what's your disk capacity?

model is HR24-200....it's made by Samsung - 500gb hard drive in it.....

not all DVR's are manufactured by the same company. there is a HR24-100 as well as an HR24-500. The last three numbers identify the manufacturer.

Has anyone else in our area also noticed the very slow net connections these past few days? This post even paused for 10 seconds loading it in when I selected preview post!

Yes, very bad speed issues throughout Oregon and Washington. Seems to be connected to the switch over to the Frontier IP addresses. Supposedly someone got a hold of Frontier and they said they've had this "outage" for over 5 days and have no estimate for when it will be resolved. I literally can't watch a SD Youtube clip...forget about Netflix or anything like that. Even more entertaining is that location services thinks I'm in Kansas (I'm in Oregon). Lots of threads over here about it:
http://www.dslreports.com/forum/frontiernet

It's stuff like this that is going to force me back to Comcast. Even if DirecTV is a good option, having an "outage" for 5 days which reverts my 25/25 internet down to dial-up speeds is just unacceptable.

I really just didn't like the direction things were headed. $500 install costs for new customers?

Article on the Oregonian's oregonlive site, also contains link to the MACC report:

http://blog.oregonlive.com/siliconforest/2011/04/regulators_say_new_customers_s.html


... "For new customers, MACC is recommending against initiating a new relationship with Frontier," Christ wrote in his report to the commission (emphasis his).

"The $500 installation fee is simply ridiculous and unjustified, particularly when weighed against free or typical $30 installations by Comcast and similar offers from satellite providers. Whatever the benefits of Frontier's FiOS video, we do not believe the service is worth that initial investment."

Frontier is offering customers free DirecTV for the rest of this year, but Christ said that new subscribers should call Comcast instead.

"We urge new customers to contact Comcast first, since it provides a locally franchised service in many ways superior compared to satellite providers," he wrote. ...

Article on the Oregonian's oregonlive site, also contains link to the MACC report:

http://blog.oregonlive.com/siliconforest/2011/04/regulators_say_new_customers_s.html

good info, however, even with Comcast stated as being a preferred - I can't limb back into bed with them. I just couldn't. I did keep my FiOS internet however.

Yeah...we would have a hard time going back to 20 HD hours after our 1TB 157 Hour TiVo's.

Has anyone else in our area also noticed the very slow net connections these past few days? This post even paused for 10 seconds loading it in when I selected preview post!

Yep, getting the laggy internet service, some youtube videos just absolutely crawl in order to finish (I'm talking 1-7 minute videos at the most, nothing too big).

Yep, getting the laggy internet service, some youtube videos just absolutely crawl in order to finish (I'm talking 1-7 minute videos at the most, nothing too big).

wow, I haven't experienced that 'yet' - I may have to pay more attention to it because if that is the case than that is not going to work at all. I may have to start going some speed tests. So far I've been able to stream netflix videos without any issue......I'm in the Beaverton/Tanasbourne area - where are you all located??

SW Beaverton, the speed is better tonight.

My speedtest.net still defaults to me being in Kansas! I get very bad speeds. It is OK if I force it to Portland. Frontier said this will be fixed by Tuesday night. When I called he said "Welcome to the new Frontier, how can I help you?". I asked if I could be switched back to the old Verizon and he did not seem to think that was too funny.

My speedtest.net still defaults to me being in Kansas! I get very bad speeds. It is OK if I force it to Portland. Frontier said this will be fixed by Tuesday night. When I called he said "Welcome to the new Frontier, how can I help you?". I asked if I could be switched back to the old Verizon and he did not seem to think that was too funny.

classic.......you should have seen the stack of DVR's being turned in by people when I dropped mine off. They mad mentioned that it was becoming the norm and they didn't even flinch when just left them there. Kind of sad.

classic.......you should have seen the stack of DVR's being turned in by people when I dropped mine off. They mad mentioned that it was becoming the norm and they didn't even flinch when just left them there. Kind of sad.

Well, I have TIVO-HD units that I upgraded to 1 TB drives each. I get 157 hours of HD recording on them and had asked Frontier why I should ever consider their units. They told me I was wrong and that I must be getting 157 hours of SD. Yeah, sure, what does a customer know. Their job would be much easier if it wern't for all of those customers!

Well, I have TIVO-HD units that I upgraded to 1 TB drives each. I get 157 hours of HD recording on them and had asked Frontier why I should ever consider their units. They told me I was wrong and that I must be getting 157 hours of SD. Yeah, sure, what does a customer know. Their job would be much easier if it wern't for all of those customers!

LOL, I surprised the even admitted that 157 hours of recording was even possible or that any DVR could contain a TB hard drive. They're worthless. I know not everyone can be an expert - but at least admit to when you have no clue what you're talking about and seek correct answers from those who do.

LOL, I surprised the even admitted that 157 hours of recording was even possible or that any DVR could contain a TB hard drive. They're worthless. I know not everyone can be an expert - but at least admit to when you have no clue what you're talking about and seek correct answers from those who do.

Yeah, this started with the copy flag being set. I took care of it by getting 1 TB drives at about $55 each and putting them in my TIVO-HD's. Since MRV would not work on the stations they put the flag on, I just recorded the show on the TIVO's that I may want to see them on. Then I would delete the shows I already saw. Not a big deal as most shows I know we are going to watch on the biggest screen (Movies), and with 157 hours of HD I have a lot of room to spare. We watch when we want. We still have all of this seasons V for when we want to see it...it is taking up 10 hours of the 157!

Yeah, this started with the copy flag being set. I took care of it by getting 1 TB drives at about $55 each and putting them in my TIVO-HD's. Since MRV would not work on the stations they put the flag on, I just recorded the show on the TIVO's that I may want to see them on. Then I would delete the shows I already saw. Not a big deal as most shows I know we are going to watch on the biggest screen (Movies), and with 157 hours of HD I have a lot of room to spare. We watch when we want. We still have all of this seasons V for when we want to see it...it is taking up 10 hours of the 157!

That's why I have a 2TB in my Premiere unit. :) Plenty of HD to watch, can't remember the last time I watched something in non-HD....maybe ESPN Classic for something?

That's why I have a 2TB in my Premiere unit. :) Plenty of HD to watch, can't remember the last time I watched something in non-HD....maybe ESPN Classic for something?

SD viewing hurts even my dogs eyes......

Yes, it is rare that I record anything in SD!

just read over at engadget about the new Verizon FiOS HD GUI finally being rolled out to customers. It's improvements like these that really make the experience for me, and yet something that Frontier will never invest in. Sad times.....

for the lazy, like me :)

http://www.engadget.com/2011/04/14/verizon-fios-tv-1-9-software-update-adds-an-hd-guide-dvr-enhanc/

man, this forum has just become dead!!

man, this forum has just become dead!!

I guess we're all trying to get used to the eventual demise of the Frontier offering of Fios TV! But seriously, given the fact there's no chance of any updates to Channel lineup, DVR, or guide software, not sure what else can be posted here besides "Frontier announces they are shutting down the Fios TV service in Oregon" whenever that happens.

Well there most likely won't be any new posters to this thread from the $500 installation charge now. No new news for now from Frontier.

So, what's option for us who have FiOS TV right now? Comcast or dish? Which way to go?
I think discussion related to this would be the only topic on this thread...

Not everyone can get satellite...but that's where I'll be going (without Frontier's referral) when FiOS finally closes up shop in Oregon.

Not everyone can get satellite...but that's where I'll be going (without Frontier's referral) when FiOS finally closes up shop in Oregon.

I'll probably do the same unless Frontier decides to shut down the fiber completely and send everyone back to DSL. In which case Comcast (sigh) might be a more attractive option, at least with the triple play package.

true......I'm nearing my one month with DirecTV and so far, so good. No issues to comment on, my ESPN-HD comes in just as sharp and clear as with FiOS. I did however keep Frontier for my internet though. $49 a month for 15/5 was still better than what Comcast could offer. So, even going with a bundle-less package and two different suppliers - my out of pocket is exactly the same as it was.....$100/month.

Not everyone can get satellite...but that's where I'll be going (without Frontier's referral) when FiOS finally closes up shop in Oregon.

At least our 157 HD Hour TiVo-HD's will still work with Comcast!

At least our 157 HD Hour TiVo-HD's will still work with Comcast!

True, I've never gone the Tivo route.....for many reasons, but having your existing technology that you enjoy work across multiple platforms is a must.

At least our 157 HD Hour TiVo-HD's will still work with Comcast!

Yep, but it's still with Comcast.

I was just checking and Comcast claims that MRV will work with our TIVOHD units. I did not think that they put as many flags on as Frontier, but they said they had none. I am not sure I believe them.

I have noticed that 502 is breaking up on ch 502 HD. I notice this on the Local news and on ABC news. Has anyone noticed this?

I posted this over at broadbandreports...thought I'd share here as well:

Ever since Frontier took over FiOS I dealt with reduced services (e.g. no remote DVR scheduling), poor Internet service (bad DNS servers, speed slowdowns), and a complete dearth of any future innovation. Thankfully I was within a 2 year price guarantee until October but was out of my one year contract. Easing the pain was the $40/month retention credit Frontier gave me.

I've been researching Comcast and DirecTV. I was leaning toward Comcast for a few reasons:
- Frontier was just giving me a bad vibe...didn't want to keep my phone/internet with them.
- I had FiOS from the first month of availability but previously had Comcast with no major complaints.
- Didn't want to install a Dish on my roof and didn't want to have to re-wire my FiOS to be Ethernet rather than coax.

Then the door hang came...the offer was fantastic. Preferred Plus Triple Play for $89.99 or Premier for $109.99. Considering that the Premier comes with an AnyRoom DVR for free, you're really only paying approx $5 for the Premier package. Free install because I'm a FiOS customer. Done deal. Premier it is.

Posting here to share the results after 10 days. As a general comment, I'm extremely happy.

Install: Easy. Except Comcast forgot to put in the port order for my phone number. I called and they quickly resolved it and I had my phone number back in one business day. I can forgive this as I did the entire order over email...the convenience of that outweighs the slight number porting hiccup!

TV Picture Quality: This was one of my major concerns coming from FiOS, but I'm extremely happy with it. Little, if any, perceptible difference between HD quality on most channels. SD quality is worse on Comcast but I never watch SD anymore. As a benchmark, my main screen is a 120" projector...so quality differences would be noticeable.

TV Equipment: New Motorola boxes...nice and small (not the silver monstrosities). Quick remote response. Love the 500GB AnyRoom DVR HD space. Lots of room. AnyRoom functionality performs flawlessly. HD and SD streaming works great to all 3 of my alternative TVs. With FiOS I actually had two DVRs due to the small HD sizes so I constantly found myself trying to manage what was recorded on the Home Media DVR so that I could stream from there. Nice to have one DVR.

TV Software: The biggest downside. Ugh...Comcast's UI from the early 2000s. Painful. Can't wait until the new UI gets rolled out. It works...barely.

TV Extras: The iPad app alone is worth the switch. Fantastic to sit and search listings and control my TV via the app. Very cool. I've got remote DVR scheduling back...woohoo! In fact, just realized I didn't set the DVR to record the NBA Finals tonight...better go do that from my iPhone...

Internet: Yes, the speed is slower than FiOS, but it FEELS faster. I didn't have to manually change my DNS servers. Sites load quickly. My PS3 logs into the PSN noticeably faster than Frontier FiOS. I sometimes use a Slingbox so I do miss the upload speeds but overall, totally happy.

Phone: Landline is landline. But I do like the caller ID popping up on my TV.

Just wanted to share my experiences as I read this board for awhile trying to make my decision. Good luck to all. It's a shame our beloved FiOS has fallen so far. My biggest relief is knowing that I am with a company that is actually investing in their future platforms and rolling out new features rather than one that is simply trying to stay solvent under a huge debt load and has no interest in running their own TV business.

EDIT: I should also note my bandwidth usage. I know many people are concerned about Comcast's 250gb cap/month. After 10 days I've used 10% of my 250gb. So at this rate I'm looking at 30% of the cap in a given month. Our usage was a bit light last week...but I can't imagine us coming anywhere close to 250gb anytime soon. Your mileage may vary.

Has anyone tried using the Ceton InfiniTV cards with Frontier?

I'm assuming it's going to be a major PITA, because I don't think Frontier is going to care too much about getting me up and running.

I already have M cable cards for my HDTivo, and I'm wondering if there's any settings I can port over from that setup that will keep me from having to involve Frontier's techs in the process.

Someone at the Frontier forum over at DSLreports mentioned that Fox Soccer Channel HD should be available today (June 1). Lo and behold, it is indeed now on Channel 584. This is very surprising given the purported/expected demise of FIOS TV service. I'm not complaining!

Previously in this thread, someone linked to an Oregonian article
http://www.oregonlive.com/business/index.ssf/2011/03/frontier_pulls_out_of_cable_tv.html
about Frontier abandoning FiOS.

Here's a link that Ken H posted on a different thread. It's to a different article
http://www.newsregister.com/article?articleTitle=frontier+to+pull+the+plug+on+fios--1299426460--223--news
from that same time frame.

This other article covers much of the same ground, but also provides some additional details. E.g. Frontier claims it costs them $800 to install FiOS.

I've used the Ceton since it first became available, no problems at all. My Frontier setup uses ethernet for the internet feed, so I don't have any MoCA interference, and no need for the filter mentioned here: http://www.cetoncorp.com/infinitv/support/

The signal usually needs to be padded down slightly, so a couple splitters may help reduce the levels before it enters the Ceton.

Has anyone tried using the Ceton InfiniTV cards with Frontier?

I'm assuming it's going to be a major PITA, because I don't think Frontier is going to care too much about getting me up and running.

I already have M cable cards for my HDTivo, and I'm wondering if there's any settings I can port over from that setup that will keep me from having to involve Frontier's techs in the process.

Pretty quiet around here. Am I the only one who still has service from Frontier? They just sent out some literature:
Happy Anniversary!

As July marks our first-year anniversary in Oregon, I wanted to let you know how much we appreciate your business and reassure you Frontier is not pulling the plug on anything --- we're here to stay.

The color and bold are in Frontier's original, not my embellishment.

Yeah, I saw that...pretty unbelievable. I'm still working on cutting the cord. Pretty close now.

Still here. Happy. Talked to Oregon mgmt team. Staying w/ FIOS.

Alternatives still don't compare.

Granted, tough for a new customer, but I have been a subscriber since Day 1.

Mike

I'm planning to stay the course at least until my current contract is up. I extended that in Jan. to get the better internet speeds. They say they aren't pulling the plug but on the other hand they aren't promoting any improvements to their TV service. They did add the Fox Soccer Channel but I don't think there are any changes to the guide or other services that Verizon is rolling out to its TV FiOS network. I think the TV part will languish until there are no more contracts to support then the plug will be pulled.

Early on (after Frontier took over) I was able to get a lot of concessions when I threatened to leave. One was the elimination of any contract. So although the various "deals" we have with them at the moment will expire, we aren't under any contract for service so we can leave anytime. If you deal with them later and want to stay I'd go that route so if something else goes south you'll have the option to leave without any penalties.

So far I have been getting a great deal to stay. I guess what still bothers me is that I need to call the rep I have every month to get my special price. If a rep says you get free HBO/Cinemax for x number of months why do you need to get it corrected EVERY Month. I also was promised $20 off the triple play, but get $10 off...fixed every month when I contact her. No problem for me now as I have her email and can ask her what to pay this month after I get the Bill. :-)

OH, Cinemax must have had a small issue a few days ago as a 1 hour 45 min movie recorded as 1 hour and 8 mins and 32 minutes...missing a few minutes. I scheduled it again and it was the whole movie in 1 segment as it should!

My only concern is that all of the "We are going nowhere" ads do not show FIOS TV. So they do show that they will still provide the 3 services I do not recall seeing anything about FIOS TV in a long time.

I think FiOS is really a four-letter word for Frontier. They don't like it, don't want to deal with it and I'm sure wish they'd never bought into it.

I think FiOS is really a four-letter word for Frontier. They don't like it, don't want to deal with it and I'm sure wish they'd never bought into it.

Yes, Verizon was good but Frontier even makes Comcast Customer Service not so bad.

I got that letter too...and by saying we're not pulling the plug on anything, that only means that they still have to provide FiOS TV to a pocket of us and dump the rest onto DirecTV (they hope).

I'm still good for this year (believe it's Feb or March in 2012) with my contract so we'll see what shakes out by then.

From a technology standpoint, realize that TV, Internet, and Phone are all FiOS services.

What is likely is that somehow the TV services are costing Frontier a lot more than they had planned, hence the high installation fee for new customers. The cost being either what Verizon is charging Frontier, or that Frontier is not equipped to negotiate with the various content providers.

Mike

From a technology standpoint, realize that TV, Internet, and Phone are all FiOS services.

What is likely is that somehow the TV services are costing Frontier a lot more than they had planned, hence the high installation fee for new customers. The cost being either what Verizon is charging Frontier, or that Frontier is not equipped to negotiate with the various content providers.

Mike

What I think it really comes down to is that it costs a ton to install new fiber to anyone's house that isn't already connected. It doesn't seem like Frontier wants to absorb that cost directly so they're passing it on to anyone who wants to add the service.
If all the infrastructure was in place I'm guessing the installation costs would be reduced.
It'd be interesting if someone moved to a house that was already set up for FIOS if they would still have the same installation fee or not.

What I think it really comes down to is that it costs a ton to install new fiber to anyone's house that isn't already connected. It doesn't seem like Frontier wants to absorb that cost directly so they're passing it on to anyone who wants to add the service.
If all the infrastructure was in place I'm guessing the installation costs would be reduced.
It'd be interesting if someone moved to a house that was already set up for FIOS if they would still have the same installation fee or not.

Not exactly what I meant with my comment.

Absolutely, if fiber isn't already running by the home, it costs big bucks to run fiber. It is clear that Frontier is not adding any new fiber capacity to their network.

What is surprising, however, is that Frontier is doing nothing to gain new subscribers, or to instill confidence in existing subscribers in neighborhoods that have fiber capability.

My comment was directed towards fiber neighborhoods.

Why Frontier is not marketing to these neighborhoods is the surprise.

Just to remind everyone, if fiber is in your neighborhood, an install is to run a smaller fiber cable to your home, install a network box, and you are all set. Same as what is required for internet or phone only service in fiber neighborhoods.

Adding TV capability is simply providing the coax to outlets in the home from the network box.

Therefore my comment was referring to the programming costs to Frontier from the various providers. Delegating to DirecTV allows Frontier to pass all this to DirecTV, and Frontier simply collects a finder fee for each new subscriber.

Mike

What I think it really comes down to is that it costs a ton to install new fiber to anyone's house that isn't already connected. It doesn't seem like Frontier wants to absorb that cost directly so they're passing it on to anyone who wants to add the service.
If all the infrastructure was in place I'm guessing the installation costs would be reduced.
It'd be interesting if someone moved to a house that was already set up for FIOS if they would still have the same installation fee or not.

It depends.

We've been FiOS internet and TV customers since pretty much day one. We're moving next month to a house that's already wired for FiOS but doesn't have TV service. They had to check if certain equipment was installed in that house (I'm not sure what equipment exactly), and if it wasn't they'd have to charge us $500 to move.

Fortunately, the house was properly equipped, so no fee was involved. They did have to jump through a few hoops to get the move scheduled, though. Apparently, to their system, a move is sort of like a new account. As they're not providing FiOS TV to new customers, the rep I got was having a hard time getting our triple play contract to transfer over. We did have to reup for a new two-year contract, though. (Which is fine by me unless the TV service really degrades. It only added a year to our current deal.)

Looks like we got everything sorted out. I'll know more in mid-Sept after we move.

As a former Cable employee in Portland for 20+ years it looks like this to me. Frontier has a serious case of buyers remorse! They are going to pull the plug on all Fios customers they can once the December anniversary is behind them and force them to take DirecTv. To even keep small clusters of Fios here and there due to unavailability of DirecTV, their preferred provider, is very cost prohibitive. Forget the programming costs the benefits of keeping a few Fios customers happy is greatly outweighed by the monetary sucking sound. Fios here will be a memory in a year or less. It is unfortunate as it is a great delivery device. If I was a Frontier customer currently, used to be, I'd vote with my feet before they try and do the hokey pokey in January and force there new "bundles" on you. Comcast is not exactly a great alternative as they remind me of the Death Star with Darth at the controls of the download speed so users like me don't get too much bandwidth but at least they are consistent. Centurylink isn't making any bones about their TV bundle choice...DirecTv and only Direct, they're not even trying to widen their pipe for video.

I can tell you from my inside sources that Frontier is going to completely dump Fios after their December anniversary comes. It is too expensive and to even keep a token amount going is too cost prohibitive. They will bride any customer they can to switch from Fios to DirecTv that hesitates. Vote with your feet if you are a Frontier Fios customer and switch.

After March 2012, Frontier will deal with Dish only...so they'll try to make you switch to yet another provider after your DirecTV contract ends!

America's most reliable network is down for email services. I kept getting a rejection from the POP3 server this afternoon saying my log in was incorrect. I finally called Frontier, which was intercepted by the Verizon automated voice saying there was a nation-wide outage for email and their engineers are working on the problem. No resolution estimate was given. I still can't get my email.

I have found quite a few times over the past month or so that I have to continually log back in to retrieve new email - like the connection to the POP3 is dropped. Never had this problem before but it seems like a persistent problem.

As I wrote previously, FiOS fiber is essential for delivering all 3 services: TV, Phone, and Internet.

Pulling the plug on TV may stop the hemorrhaging for programming costs, but the fiber will still be there and expected to deliver phone and internet. If they intend to fall back onto good old copper for phone and internet, they will incur even more costs backfilling to keep their customers.

In another article discussing the Verizon strike, it was mentioned that FiOS is also not cost effective for Verizon.

Perhaps all that will happen is that Verizon/Frontier will simply raise rates to cover expenses, or renegotiate programming costs with the providers.

As for the email...long ago, I severed my email provided by ISPs. Much better to use independent email services that not tied to ISP domains that seem to change every few years as marketing or company identities change.

There was a message on the DVR saying Tennis channel will no longer be available as of September 3rd.:(

Any legally inclined forum members know if this can be ground for breaking the contract and getting rid of Frontier?

Wonder if it's getting dropped for the Pac-12 channel starting next summer?

I hadn't watched the Tennis Channel much but several months ago as I was paging through the upper-500 channels, I thought when I got to the Tennis Channel it said I wasn't subscribed to it. Not a big thing for my personal viewing but I did think it odd since I recall watching a few of those "masters" matches they had on. So I knew it was in my package at one time but thought it was removed quite a while ago, not recently.

I hadn't watched the Tennis Channel much but several months ago as I was paging through the upper-500 channels, I thought when I got to the Tennis Channel it said I wasn't subscribed to it. Not a big thing for my personal viewing but I did think it odd since I recall watching a few of those "masters" matches they had on. So I knew it was in my package at one time but thought it was removed quite a while ago, not recently.

It is channel 592 (HD), and was one of the reasons I re-upped with the ultimate package. I am just wondering how many channels can Frontier remove and still claim that we are under the contract obligation for the specific "package."

It is channel 592 (HD), and was one of the reasons I re-upped with the ultimate package. I am just wondering how many channels can Frontier remove and still claim that we are under the contract obligation for the specific "package."

I bet if I was able to find the contract verbiage and read the whole thing I'd find a passage that says roughly we agree to changes they may make from time to time. I'm not really looking for a way out of my current 2 year deal for the triple play Extreme. Trading tennis for soccer as the only substantive change over the past ~6 months is pretty good in my book. We'll just have to see what happens down the road to other programming (that they can't afford). :rolleyes:

Trading tennis for soccer as the only substantive change over the past ~6 months is pretty good in my book. We'll just have to see what happens down the road to other programming (that they can't afford). :rolleyes:

No argument on trading FSC-HD with Tennis-HD. I just wonder if this is the start of a trend. BTW, I did not see any discussion of Tennis channel being dropped on the Verizon FIOS TV forum. I guess the separation from the mothership has begun!

I know this thread is basically dead right now, but a heads up for everyone, Frontier refreshed their channel lineup again yesterday.
Much like earlier in the year the channel numbers of most stations didn't actually change but favorites and all DVR series recordings for certain stations will not work.
You'll have to go in a reprogram any series recording for these stations. Easiest way to see if a series is going to be effected is to look at the series manager.
If you only see a channel number and not a station name you'll need to reprogram the series.

Last time this was rolled out over a couple of days so you may have to do this multiple times.

From a technology standpoint, realize that TV, Internet, and Phone are all FiOS services.

What is likely is that somehow the TV services are costing Frontier a lot more than they had planned, hence the high installation fee for new customers. The cost being either what Verizon is charging Frontier, or that Frontier is not equipped to negotiate with the various content providers.

MikeI get that our bundled package is all FiOS but sorry Mike, I don't buy the cost angle at all. I don't know if you have Frontier or had the experiences we have had since day one but within weeks of purchasing the Verizon assets they made a deal with Dish Network to install satellite TV (in lieu of FiOS TV). This was at the exact same time they jacked the FiOS TV installation price (with or without phone and broadband) to $500.

Frontier had no interest in supporting TV to start with. They're an old school copper wire phone provider and got in way over their heads to secure Verizon's phone system. They had no experience with television or fiber optic delivery systems prior to this what-so-ever.

The $500 installation fee and attempted 50% rate hike were instituted within six months of the Verizon purchase. Costs did not skyrocket in that period of time.

As others have said, if their claim that the costs to operate FiOS TV were far greater than they expected they were either completely negligent in performing the due diligence that any company would be expected to do prior to acquisition or they are lying.

I do agree that Frontier is not equipped to negotiate with content providers or run a professional business for that matter.

I know this thread is basically dead right now, but a heads up for everyone, Frontier refreshed their channel lineup again yesterday.
Much like earlier in the year the channel numbers of most stations didn't actually change but favorites and all DVR series recordings for certain stations will not work.
You'll have to go in a reprogram any series recording for these stations. Easiest way to see if a series is going to be effected is to look at the series manager.
If you only see a channel number and not a station name you'll need to reprogram the series.

Last time this was rolled out over a couple of days so you may have to do this multiple times.

TIVO is looking better and better all the time.

TIVO is looking better and better all the time.It's a term thrown around way too much, but having used TiVo for about 10 years now...I can tell you that it is awesome.

It's a term thrown around way too much, but having used TiVo for about 10 years now...I can tell you that it is awesome.

After our latest round of DVR STB hassles with the Frontier folks, we're sick of the current DVR offerings and their lack of understanding of what people actually want.

We're going to switch to TIVO as soon as we're able even though the net cost is going to be a few dollars more each month.

I know this thread is basically dead right now, but a heads up for everyone, Frontier refreshed their channel lineup again yesterday.
Much like earlier in the year the channel numbers of most stations didn't actually change but favorites and all DVR series recordings for certain stations will not work.
You'll have to go in a reprogram any series recording for these stations. Easiest way to see if a series is going to be effected is to look at the series manager.
If you only see a channel number and not a station name you'll need to reprogram the series.

Last time this was rolled out over a couple of days so you may have to do this multiple times.

Thanks for the note. Now I know why I lost most of the Favorites last night. Of course shouldn't expect any mention of it from Frontier, including DVR message!:(

I get that our bundled package is all FiOS but sorry Mike, I don't buy the cost angle at all. ...

I do agree that Frontier is not equipped to negotiate with content providers or run a professional business for that matter.

No need to agree, as it is only my opinion.

I too have been with FiOS since the first day it was offered in my neighborhood. I am a happy customer, but am concerned about the future. Yes, I have seen the satellite promotions. You'll know things have gone downhill completely if/when they partner with Comcast for TV.

I did speak and correspond with the Oregon Frontier general manager. His assurances are perhaps only worth what replying to my email and answering my phone call cost. Definitely not a contract or guarantee that FiOS TV will continue forever.

Due diligence lacking? Perhaps.

In any case, if they were making money hand-over-fist, we wouldn't be speculating about the future, would we?

Again, I plan to continue with FiOS until the bits stop flowing. I monitor the Comcast threads, and all is not rosy there, either. And neither Dish nor DirecTV can deliver the same quality service as FiOS. Internet TV? Not yet.

Yes, I will miss FiOS TV if it ever shuts down in the area.

On a related note, I also am disappointed that Frontier has not enabled the Internet services with the premium channels -- e.g. unable to get access to HBO2GO, TNT, and other similar services. Yes, Verizon FiOS TV subscribers can get these, but not Frontier subscribers.

In the meantime, I'll continue to enjoy what they are able to deliver.

Mike

I know this thread is basically dead right now, but a heads up for everyone, Frontier refreshed their channel lineup again yesterday.
Much like earlier in the year the channel numbers of most stations didn't actually change but favorites and all DVR series recordings for certain stations will not work.
You'll have to go in a reprogram any series recording for these stations. Easiest way to see if a series is going to be effected is to look at the series manager.
If you only see a channel number and not a station name you'll need to reprogram the series.

Last time this was rolled out over a couple of days so you may have to do this multiple times.

Which channels? I just checked mine, and all seem to be OK, and recorded as expected.

Which channels? I just checked mine, and all seem to be OK, and recorded as expected.

USA, Spike, Food Network, History, Travel Channel, Bravo, all the ESPN networks. Probably quite a few more too. Basically it seemed to be most of the non-network stations.
It happened once before and people saw the changes roll out through the region over a few days. I think last time they also did 2 waves up updates to the channel information so you had to do the whole process at least twice.

It might just be worth keeping an eye on if you notice some shows not recording or your favorites list isn't looking right.

TIVO is looking better and better all the time.

I had a problem with one of my TiVos, where the CableCARD seemed to be defective. Frontier couldn't reinitialize it over the phone, but they showed up the next day with a new card. It worked! So, there are still some people at Frontier who are competent and are willing to support TV / TiVo, regardless of how bad things look overall.

If you buy a TiVo, you will be able to use it for Comcast, should FiOS ever go away. However, not for Dish or DirecTV.

I had a problem with one of my TiVos, where the CableCARD seemed to be defective. Frontier couldn't reinitialize it over the phone, but they showed up the next day with a new card. It worked! So, there are still some people at Frontier who are competent and are willing to support TV / TiVo, regardless of how bad things look overall.

If you buy a TiVo, you will be able to use it for Comcast, should FiOS ever go away. However, not for Dish or DirecTV.

Well, there is the new DirecTV TiVo coming out very soon but yes the regular TiVo's work with just about everyone besides satellite.

No need to agree, as it is only my opinion.

I too have been with FiOS since the first day it was offered in my neighborhood. I am a happy customer, but am concerned about the future. Yes, I have seen the satellite promotions. You'll know things have gone downhill completely if/when they partner with Comcast for TV.

I did speak and correspond with the Oregon Frontier general manager. His assurances are perhaps only worth what replying to my email and answering my phone call cost. Definitely not a contract or guarantee that FiOS TV will continue forever.

Due diligence lacking? Perhaps.

In any case, if they were making money hand-over-fist, we wouldn't be speculating about the future, would we?

Again, I plan to continue with FiOS until the bits stop flowing. I monitor the Comcast threads, and all is not rosy there, either. And neither Dish nor DirecTV can deliver the same quality service as FiOS. Internet TV? Not yet.

Yes, I will miss FiOS TV if it ever shuts down in the area.

On a related note, I also am disappointed that Frontier has not enabled the Internet services with the premium channels -- e.g. unable to get access to HBO2GO, TNT, and other similar services. Yes, Verizon FiOS TV subscribers can get these, but not Frontier subscribers.

In the meantime, I'll continue to enjoy what they are able to deliver.

MikeAgreed. It's just that after spending some time researching Frontier's CEO Maggie Wilderotter's work history as well as statements she made prior and subsequent to acquiring Verizon's business I hold out little hope for their long-term success. Nothing she or any of her executives have said or done since the acquisition have indicated that they understand the business much less know how to grow it.

The "front-line" folks are ex-Verizon and still understand and care about what they built so that's one saving grace. However in the long run nothing Frontier has done should give anyone any warm fuzzies about their future.

I need some help troubleshooting an audio problem I've been having. I get frequent audio drops of about 1 - 2 seconds occurring about every 8 - 10 minutes. The most recent episodes were on Mon. evening starting when we were watching news on KGW 508 from 5pm - 6pm and then on the Mon. Night Football on ESPN 570. It appeared again last evening on KGW during the 5 - 5:30pm news. It's very annoying.

I switched over to KGW on my OTA feed to determine if this was a source issue (should not be since I got the same issue on KGW and ESPN). As I suspected there were no dropouts during my OTA session. I switched back to my 7216 and got no drops for the rest of the newscasts. Since it doesn't always happen it's very hard to pinpoint the cause. I use the optical out for audio to my receiver so I guess it could lie in that chain. I only use the HDMI out for the video direct to my TV.

My own suspicion is that the problem is with bad sectors of the 7216's hard drive. But before I go through extensive cable swapping or go to Frontier, I thought I'd ask the community whether they had experienced any similar audio issues with the Frontier signal. If it lies in what they send down the FiOS pipe then they have a bigger issue and getting a new box won't solve mine. So am I alone with this problem?

TIA

I need some help troubleshooting an audio problem I've been having. I get frequent audio drops of about 1 - 2 seconds occurring about every 8 - 10 minutes. The most recent episodes were on Mon. evening starting when we were watching news on KGW 508 from 5pm - 6pm and then on the Mon. Night Football on ESPN 570. It appeared again last evening on KGW during the 5 - 5:30pm news. It's very annoying.

I switched over to KGW on my OTA feed to determine if this was a source issue (should not be since I got the same issue on KGW and ESPN). As I suspected there were no dropouts during my OTA session. I switched back to my 7216 and got no drops for the rest of the newscasts. Since it doesn't always happen it's very hard to pinpoint the cause. I use the optical out for audio to my receiver so I guess it could lie in that chain. I only use the HDMI out for the video direct to my TV.

My own suspicion is that the problem is with bad sectors of the 7216's hard drive. But before I go through extensive cable swapping or go to Frontier, I thought I'd ask the community whether they had experienced any similar audio issues with the Frontier signal. If it lies in what they send down the FiOS pipe then they have a bigger issue and getting a new box won't solve mine. So am I alone with this problem?

TIAFunny you should mention this...we experienced the same problem with audio drop-outs on KGW News the last couple of evenings. We have TiVo. So I don't think it's anything on your end...just a bug on Frontier's side.

I haven't experienced it since on any other channels, so I'd chalk it up to "one of those things".

Funny you should mention this...we experienced the same problem with audio drop-outs on KGW News the last couple of evenings. We have TiVo. So I don't think it's anything on your end...just a bug on Frontier's side.

I haven't experienced it since on any other channels, so I'd chalk it up to "one of those things".

Yeah, I hate when that happens.:rolleyes: Thx

Funny you should mention this...we experienced the same problem with audio drop-outs on KGW News the last couple of evenings. We have TiVo. So I don't think it's anything on your end...just a bug on Frontier's side.

I haven't experienced it since on any other channels, so I'd chalk it up to "one of those things".

We get this a lot on Bravo HD too.

and then on the Mon. Night Football on ESPN 570.TIA

I don't record the other shows you mentioned, but I do have MNF in my TiVo as a season pass. If you ever have problems with that program again, post the general time of occurrence and the exact context for the missing audio. I'll then check my copy.

In general I see very few problems with recorded shows. However, when I do see a problem, I check my other TiVo to see if it has the same problem. It usually does, meaning it's probably a FiOS problem and not the TiVo.

Also, in general, the FiOS problems I do see are with *video*, not *audio*. In my experience, when MPEG video freezes up or pixellates, the audio still sounds good. I'm not an MPEG expert, but my general conclusion is that audio is much more robust than video.

BTW I really do record lots of stuff on two TiVos. Frontier took away the ability we previously had to copy shows from TiVo to TiVo. So now I'm forced to record in two places, just in case I want to view in the Den vs the Family Room.

Phantom: I appreciate your input. Naturally, I haven't experienced the problem since I posted. But I will keep your invitation in mind if it does happen again.

As far as the video breaks, I know what you are referring to but I have not seen my audio issues accompany pixelation or other video hiccups. It's definitely audio only (I see lips move but no sound) which is why my suspicions centered on my DVR. I can't be sure but I don't recall the issue happening with my non-DVR STB in the den (I have a QIP6200-2 there). So logic is telling me the problem stems from writing to or a pickup from the hard drive on the 7216 in certain sectors. But now others have reported the same thing, so who knows?

I'll search for this but I was just wondering if there's a means to defrag the disk. Maybe Frontier can push that command if it's not a user thing. Perhaps that could help.

Hello? Is this thing on?

This thread is so inactive that I had to "check this box" in order for this post to even be allowed.

Surely us remaining FiOS diehards can come up with something to discuss at least once a month.

E.g. I at least 50% expected that Frontier would have pulled the plug on FiOS by the end of this year. Maybe I should be reading my junk mail more carefully, but I haven't yet seen an announcement from them to that effect. We'll see what happens in March when my 2 year contract is up. If they try to raise my price --- Comcast here I come!

Hello? Is this thing on?

This thread is so inactive that I had to "check this box" in order for this post to even be allowed.

Surely us remaining FiOS diehards can come up with something to discuss at least once a month.

E.g. I at least 50% expected that Frontier would have pulled the plug on FiOS by the end of this year. Maybe I should be reading my junk mail more carefully, but I haven't yet seen an announcement from them to that effect. We'll see what happens in March when my 2 year contract is up. If they try to raise my price --- Comcast here I come!

Frontier is going to "manage" the FIOS franchise right out of business and I don't think they care if it succeeds or not. They've been nothing but trouble for me since they took over from Verizon. It's a constant battle for me to fix all of their billing mistakes on my account.

I wish there was a better non-Comcast alternative in the market. I'd jump all over it when my contract is up.

Hello? Is this thing on?

This thread is so inactive that I had to "check this box" in order for this post to even be allowed.

Surely us remaining FiOS diehards can come up with something to discuss at least once a month.

...

OK Phantom, since you asked for it!

Still with FTR FIOS. Finally returned the outdated DVR and replaced it with Windows media center PC with external USB tuner. Cable card installer was a very nice guy, and the process took less than 20 minutes to complete! FYI, I finally settled on the Hauppage version (Dual tuner). Had some pixellation trouble with the Ceton (4-tuner) box. Everything's been working fine for the past 3 weeks. Love the WMC HD-interface guide.

"Going to ride this to the bitter end" as someone else said in a previous post!

Best holiday wishes to all you FIOS diehards.:D

Another FiOS and Moxi die hard here. Have 2 of the FiOS DVRs and a Moxi w/cable card.

Really like the Internet services and 2 phone lines.

Very happy with the service. No billing problems. No service problems. So reliable that I cut the Comcast backup internet service and basic cable.

Also have a media center PC with older SiliconDust basic QAM tuner and thinking about getting the Ceton or Hauppauge cable-card tuners.

Though quiet here, there is the occasional message over at the broadbandreports forums.

I hope 2012 be a continued good year for the Frontier subscribers. Kudos to the Frontier staff for keeping things running smoothly in my neighborhood.

Ditto with no service or billing complaints here. But I wonder occasionally if the local Frontier programming attendants are asleep at the switch. That is, when I see promos at the end of Nov. for NCAA football season ticket packages, it makes me scratch my head as to who's watching the store.

I'll need to evaluate the cable card route. I just don't know enough about the Haupauges, etc. My laptop has an ATSC tuner that I use occasionally with WMC to record OTA programs. At least that gives me one more tuner than the 7216 for recording or watching locals live. I hook that up to the TV via HDMI for great HD.

That'll be something to keep me busy when we get back from 3 weeks in Hawaii next month. Which reminds, me I need to get programming schedules for the new series that are starting in Jan. so they're recorded while we're away.

Happy Holidays everyone!

The local ads are served up by Viamedia who has no clue on what they're doing. You'll see their own ads pop up from time to time but they are truly inept at their jobs.

FiOS TV is supposedly being advertised for ordering again, problem is after all of the newspaper articles and web blogs decrying against the $500 install for the ONT for tv and shutting down some local agreements in Newberg and surrounding areas, how can they think that anyone will be interested in their product?

Truly the blind leading the blind with this outfit.

I have a TiVo Premiere unit as well as a Premiere Elite for six total tuners for my boxes. Speaking of that, anyone ever try to return any equipment ever since they closed their retail store in the Portland area...it truly is a long and tedious process!

I got FIOS installed the 1st month it was available in Portland. I'm about to move into a new house and would hate to loose my 35/35 Internet and my FIOS TV (that I have been very happy with). Does anyone know how Frontier is doing with new (I.e. transfer my service) installs? Comcast has poor Internet speeds and I don't want to pay Frontier for its stand-alone Internet service.

The post above says they are advertising FIOS TV again but I haven't seen that and their website pretty much disavowes all knowledge of FIOS TV.

Speaking of that, anyone ever try to return any equipment ever since they closed their retail store in the Portland area...it truly is a long and tedious process!

I just returned their HD-DVR (after opting for Cablecard and Media center PC combo). They send you a box and a shipping label to send the stuff back.

Fair warning 1: The box they ship has a tight fit for DVR, and not much room for the remote and AC cord!

Fair warning 2: Be sure to ask for receipt from the UPS store. According to the store clerk, Frontier has developed a notorious reputation for denying any knowledge of a box being returned. I witnessed it first hand a few months back when I exchanged a faulty DVR and was charged for two DVR's for two months!

I just returned their HD-DVR (after opting for Cablecard and Media center PC combo). They send you a box and a shipping label to send the stuff back.

Fair warning 1: The box they ship has a tight fit for DVR, and not much room for the remote and AC cord!

Fair warning 2: Be sure to ask for receipt from the UPS store. According to the store clerk, Frontier has developed a notorious reputation for denying any knowledge of a box being returned. I witnessed it first hand a few months back when I exchanged a faulty DVR and was charged for two DVR's for two months!

I bet they sent the box that you needed to me, and the box that I needed to you! Mine could hold at least 3-4 set top boxes/DVR's in it, I just had to send back two cable cards in it. Massive amount of tape to make sure those cards didn't go anywhere (thankfully I also had the little plastic containers that the cable cards cam in originally, otherwise it wouldn't surprise me to have them damaged upon receip)t.

At least for my box that I sent back, did you notice the addressee on the return label...it wasn't Frontier (it was VZ)!

I got FIOS installed the 1st month it was available in Portland. I'm about to move into a new house and would hate to loose my 35/35 Internet and my FIOS TV (that I have been very happy with). Does anyone know how Frontier is doing with new (I.e. transfer my service) installs? Comcast has poor Internet speeds and I don't want to pay Frontier for its stand-alone Internet service.

The post above says they are advertising FIOS TV again but I haven't seen that and their website pretty much disavowes all knowledge of FIOS TV.

Transferring service doesn't exist in Frontier's world. You literally start as a new customer (and many times you have to send back the boxes that you have, only to get new one's when you have the new installation). I'd call and confirm that you can keep everything and bring it over to the new house as that may have changed in the past year.

Call them up and see what they offer, I do know that the $500 install will be waived if you order a triple play package from them (that means you need a phone line). Some have reported that they've had the internet set up first which has no install fee, then have TV added on later which doesn't trigger the $500 fee either since you already have the ONT on site!

I bet they sent the box that you needed to me, and the box that I needed to you! ...
LOL, would not surprise me a bit! Perhaps I might end up with the box size you mentioned when the time comes to send the Cablecard back. ;)


At least for my box that I sent back, did you notice the addressee on the return label...it wasn't Frontier (it was VZ)!

Didn't pay attention, but I'm still seeing Verizon footprint all over their web site where you go to pay the bills on-line!

BTW, the tech that came over for the cable-card install floated the idea of IPTV, to which I responded, "how's that going to help Frontier with TV programming cost?" All I got in response was a hearty laugh!

I recently received the above-titled literature in the mail.

They proved me wrong. Back in February I offered to bet someone $20 (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=20068092&highlight=bet#post20068092) that Frontier would discontinue FiOS by now. Fortunately for me, he never agreed!

Not that the literature is very encouraging. In fact, quite the opposite. It's comical, if you read carefully enough. E.g. there are five street addresses in the brochure. You'd think they were locations for equipment pickup, etc. You'd be wrong. They in fact appear to be the addresses of "local franchise authorities". Presumably so you can complain to them about how badly Frontier is screwing up.

As to actual addresses for Frontier, good luck with that! The only thing I could find was a P.O. Box in Ohio.

The literature doesn't seem to mention anything like "triple play", so presumably they aren't offering that with FiOS at this time. I'll know more in March when my contract runs out. I'm sure that Comcast will make it very attractive to switch; it's beyond me how Frontier can expect to retain people without offering some sort of bundling. And them bundling DirecTV is an absurd proposition to those of us who previously struggled with LOS issues to the satellites and who now have fiber running to the sides of our houses.

It's the rare company that can make Comcast look good. Maggie Wilderotter has managed to achieve that remarkable feat. Unfortunately for her, Wall Street is wary of Frontier's ability to achieve long term financial success.

http://chart.finance.yahoo.com/z?s=FTR&t=1y&q=&l=&z=l&a=v&p=s&lang=en-US&region=US

I recently received the above-titled literature in the mail.


I assume you received the "FIOS Channel Lineup Portland, OR 2012" as well. I was pleasantly surprised and hope it is a sign that Frontier has decided to stay the course with Fios TV, at least for a bit longer than some of us anticipated!

I assume you received the "FIOS Channel Lineup Portland, OR 2012" as well. I was pleasantly surprised and hope it is a sign that Frontier has decided to stay the course with Fios TV, at least for a bit longer than some of us anticipated!

I think it's something they're legally obligated to provide every year.
I'm in the same boat though that I don't see myself leaving unless something in the service gets worse or I see some compelling option coming from Comcast. Right now there's nothing wrong with my service, but nothing great either. Comcast isn't doing much to make me want to jump ship either.

I will probably switch back to Comcast when my Verizon/Frontier contract ends in June, if only to get BBC America (and Top Gear) in HD again. Sadly, Frontier's channel lineup isn't that appealing to me.

Phantom Gremlin: I think you're going to end up being correct, only your timing was off. Once the two year contracts start expiring (which would be two years after Frontier started offering DirectTV service instead of FIOS) then I think you'll see them abandon TV. (But I'm not willing to bet $20 on it. :D )

I assume you received the "FIOS Channel Lineup Portland, OR 2012" as well.

Yes that came the next day.

The Extreme HD I have is a very comprehensive lineup. Still no change to my one complaint about the lineup (but it's really a nit) --- MGM HD 744 is in the Ultimate HD package. That appears to be the only standalone movie channel that's there. All the others are traditional premiums such as Showtime.

There is some extra sports stuff in Ultimate, but I don't want it. Plenty of sports in the other packages. And I wouldn't watch NFL Redzone even if you paid me. Way too may cuts between games.

I think some people who signed up earlier have a different lineup. Or at least they used to. I.e. I think MGM HD was previously part of a lesser package.

As for having stuff like Top Gear in HD, is that really necessary? It just takes up more disk space. Plus, you can watch the Reliant Robin segment (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QQh56geU0X8) in HD on Youtube.

I'd like to watch Top Gear in HD, so yeah, for me, it's as necessary as a TV show can be "necessary".


I heard Frontier advertising FIOS TV (Not Dish) yesterday, has anybody else heard those ads? I just about fell off my chair. Have they changed their tune again?

Yes, I heard it too.

Yes that came the next day.

The Extreme HD I have is a very comprehensive lineup. Still no change to my one complaint about the lineup (but it's really a nit) --- MGM HD 744 is in the Ultimate HD package. That appears to be the only standalone movie channel that's there. All the others are traditional premiums such as Showtime.



I suppose part of the problem was that Frontier had "inherited" Verizon lineup and there has been no change since the takeover. Let's hope they are indeed serious about remaining in the Fios TV business and can come up with different packages, say in about a year!

I heard Frontier advertising FIOS TV (Not Dish) yesterday, has anybody else heard those ads? I just about fell off my chair. Have they changed their tune again?
I heard the ad several times this week on KPAM and KXL-FM. Yes, FiOS TV is being promoted again with a $108.95 package identified.

Good news, indeed!

Perhaps they do have several packages; web site still shows DirecTV for the TV triple play packages. Looks like website still needs lots of work, so those curious or still on the fence would need to call to see what is actually offered.

But have they discontinued the $500 install price to encourage new subs? I'm sure (?) they are not about to lay new fiber so any installs would be along existing lines.

I heard the ad several times this week on KPAM and KXL-FM. Yes, FiOS TV is being promoted again with a $108.95 package identified.

They are also advertising this same triple play package on TV not just radio. Several times in the commercial it flashes something like:

Are you tired of Comcast raising your rates? Again?

Not that it costs them anything to advertise on TV. They've only come up with a handful of local advertisers, so they have lots of time to fill.

But have they discontinued the $500 install price to encourage new subs? I'm sure (?) they are not about to lay new fiber so any installs would be along existing lines.

I don't know if it's some sort of formality that they have to advertise to show some level of effort to generate business or if someone actually changed their mind and they might go after a real build-out.
It looks like the PNW owners have actually spun off their own website that lists FIOS TV as a real product. And has installation fee details:
http://www.frontierpacificnw.com

$500 Installation Fee Applies (fee may be waived with ONT present on-site or when purchased with a FiOS Triple Play package.)

$10 HD Monthly Equipment Fee Applies

rewdpost, You beat me to the punch. I was quite pleased to see frontier spinoff this site too (www.frontierpacificnw.com). I was not aware that they were actually spending money to advertise FiOS on local radio and TV.

Unfortunately, the $500 fee does not appear to be going away but at least new subscribers can get it waved if they buy the triple play. In fact, I was searching for news about frontier and one of the news sites even had a banner ad for the $108.50 triple play package (with FREE INSTALLATION! to boot). I was quite floored and then found the "pacificnw.com" web site listed the same package offer. It is interesting that the main site does not show anything about FiOS TV (like it has for about a year now) and does not even forward you to the "pacificnw.com" site.

Phantom Gremlin, what makes you think advertising on TV does not cost them anything? If Frontier hopes to get new business, they have to advertise on channels that will be seen by those NOT on frontier FiOS TV (local ads on cable channels on FiOS TV will not work). This means running ads on channels like KATU, KGW, KRCW, KOIN, etc.(including their subchannels) so viewers on all providers (Comcast, DirecTV, Dish Network and OTA) will see the ads. That will cost them $$$ (or $ if they stay away from primetime).

I too was expecting to see some announcement that they were canceling their franchise at the end of 2011 (after the fourth anniversary of their service date) and pull the plug soon after that. Perhaps something happened since then that made Frontier take a U-turn and actually keep FiOS TV going and expand its subscriber base.

I read that part of their deal with Verizon was they couldn't expand FiOS outside of their service areas. I am not sure that is actually true. Even if they can't expand into areas still controlled by Verizon, they could go elsewhere like Portland (and compete against CenturyLink). But you guys are probably right, its not likely Frontier will lay more fiber to add more households, even in a large city like Portland.

Anyway, I am looking forward to seeing Frontier's next quarterly report in late February and see where FiOS stands. I am suspecting there will be still more losses, probably on par with the last one (approx. 10,000 or more).

At least, I can safely say that FiOS will be around for quite awhile.

I'm actually a customer in the Seattle are but thought I'd weigh in.

I just got off the phone earlier tonight with a customer rep and she indicated big changes to FIOS were coming in March.
1. New website. They've still been using and relying on the Verizon system (read renting it from Verizon).

2 would continue to offer the 15/5 Internet I have now even though it's not advertised online. (note on a speed test I can often get 20/30 up/down).

3. We're going to start parter nearing with Dish Network.

4. Comp'ed me the DVR fee and the usual 3 months of HBO to stay with what I've got at least until the new stuff rolls out.

She said employee meetings were going to be held in the next few weeks and all the customer service reps would be learning more soon.

Phantom Gremlin, what makes you think advertising on TV does not cost them anything?

I could be all wrong, but here's how I think the finances work.

When local channels squabble with Comcast or Dish or DirecTV or Frontier, they're arguing over how much the cable company will pay for "cable carriage". A local can force a cable company to carry them for free, or they can negotiate a fee. All the "big" local channels try to extract a fee.

So Frontier has agreed to pay KGW, KATU, etc for their programming. DirecTV used to pay $0.10 per subscriber per month, but I'd bet the fees are a lot higher by now.

But cable companies don't want to pay "real money" for carriage, so instead they agree to buy advertising from the local channels. They're obligated to buy a certain amount of that advertising. Which is the air time they use to advertise "triple play", etc. I don't know if they can resell that particular airtime or if they can only run their ads on it.

That's what I meant. I believe Frontier has a lot of advertising time they have bought. Especially if they're not allowed to resell it, then it's "free" since they have already paid for it.

OTOH, Frontier doesn't have that many subscribers, which means they might not have bought a lot of time. So maybe it's the opposite of free. Maybe it would cost quite a bit for Frontier to advertise triple play. Plus, a company like DirecTV is happy to advertise across the entire Portland metro area, since their signal goes everywhere. Frontier only goes to a few suburbs, and yet the ads on KGW and KATU go everywhere, including Vancouver etc. Not very well targeted. In general, cable can target much more precisely, but I can't imagine that Comcast would be too eager to run FiOS ads in the neighborhoods that Frontier serves.

At least, I can safely say that FiOS will be around for quite awhile.

You're a lot more confident about that than I am. I don't understand Frontier's change of heart. The same morons are still running the place, I don't trust them. See the chart below. I wouldn't say they're in a "death spiral" quite yet, but Wall Street doesn't think they have much of a future. Remember, there's a lot of precedent for problems with Verizon's discards. Two other companies, FairPoint (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FairPoint_Communications) and Hawaiian Telecom, (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hawaiian_Telcom) that Verizon dumped a bunch of land lines to didn't do very well. Neither did Verizon's old Yellow Pages (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SuperMedia) division. A rant for another day would be how Verizon has managed to f*** over all the people who used to work for them. People who bought into working for the telco in exchange for e.g. a good pension, but who then got foisted off elsewhere. Still, Kenny Boy managed to f*** over lots of Portland General Electric employees in much the same manner. So I guess it's The American Way.

would continue to offer the 15/5 Internet I have now even though it's not advertised online. (note on a speed test I can often get 20/30 up/down).
Do you mean not advertised in display ads on other sites? The 15/5 package can be found on the new Pacific NW Frontier website. (http://www.frontierpacificnw.com/fios/) Much cheaper than Internet from Comcast.

Unlike TV, Frontier seems to be serious about Internet. Their network is a joke compared to a real ISP like Comcast, but for the most part I've also been quite happy with upload/download speeds.

What Phantom said.

Phantom, you might have a point there. Did not think that Frontier (or others like DirecTV and Comcast) might make deals with the local stations to buy airtime versus simply paying them subscriber fees. I don't watch the local channels too often (with the exception of subchannels like Antenna TV and This TV) so I have not actually seen any Frontier ads on them.

I do agree with you there. I am not all that confident about the future of FiOS TV either but I wouldn't think they would spend all that money just to scuttle it later this year. All this time I was contemplating when "Judgement Day" was going to happen (Judgement Day = when I would need to find a new TV provider).

einsteinium, that is interesting news. Will be looking forward to seeing what happens in March. Just hope its not something bad like "FiOS TV will no longer be offered after XXXX XX, 2012." But with all that is going on lately, I seriously doubt it. I do hope it will be news like "we are bringing Remote DVR back", "we have a new DVR app for Android and iOS (Iphone)" (both licensed from Verizon), and online deals with channels like ESPN (and allow us to use apps like ESPN Watch), and most of all, get new DVR's (or at least allow us to use external HDD's with them).

Which brings up a question ridgefamus, You are using the 7216? I was not aware Frontier had this model available. I thought the only DVR model we had was the QIP6416 (which is the unit we use). Is the HDD in the 7216 larger then 160 GB? I sure would like to upgrade to a unit with a larger HDD. If so, hopefully we can have both for a transitional period so we can empty out the HDD on the old DVR while the new one takes over recording our shows.

Lets hope for some really great news in March.

Which brings up a question ridgefamus, You are using the 7216? I was not aware Frontier had this model available. I thought the only DVR model we had was the QIP6416 (which is the unit we use). Is the HDD in the 7216 larger then 160 GB? I sure would like to upgrade to a unit with a larger HDD. If so, hopefully we can have both for a transitional period so we can empty out the HDD on the old DVR while the new one takes over recording our shows.

Lets hope for some really great news in March.

Hmmm, pretty sure that's what my DVR is. I'll check it when we return tomorrow after 18 days on the Big Island :D and report back. Regardless, I know the capacity is 160 GB.

I was doing some thinking about this whole situation and got a theory as to why the future of FiOS TV is looking much better.

1. I read an article back in early 2011 that the MACC stated that they would not let Frontier out of their franchise agreement if they tried to invoke the termination clause due to the service having a good market share at present.

2. Frontier has ongoing expenses to bring FiOS TV programming to Oregon and Washington from Verizon's Super Headend, regardless of how many or how few subscribers they have. Only pulling the plug on TV would end those expenses.

3. Frontier may have finally made deals with the programming services to get better rates. However, I have no idea if they had or not.

4. They want to get away from the bad publicity that trying to kill the service has put on Frontier's image (including Comcast ads that use that bad publicity).

5. Without FiOS TV, they cannot effectively compete with Comcast for triple play customers and with Verizon signing a bundling deal with Comcast, they lose out even more with Comcast offering Quad play packages with Verizon Wireless.

So it seems to me, that with a franchise agreement they cannot get out of, paying expenses to bring FiOS TV to the Pacific Northwest that they have to pay, like it or not, possibly better programming rates, and the prospect of losing more customers to Comcast and Wireless options.

They decided that FiOS TV is worth keeping after all. In fact, if they have to keep it, then they should try to make the best of it. Who knows, they may even rescind their decision of ending their franchise agreements with those four Oregon cities.

Would make better sense to offer FiOS TV in all Oregon and Washington areas if they have to keep it in some of those areas.

Don't know yet if all of this may save FiOS TV in Indiana too, will have to wait and see.

As I was recycling the various coupon flyers, I noticed single sheet ads for the Frontier triple play packages amongst the DirecTV and Dish ads.

Three different coupon flyers, each with the same Frontier triple play offer for $108.95

Originally Posted by greatonepdx
Which brings up a question ridgefamus, You are using the 7216? I was not aware Frontier had this model available. I thought the only DVR model we had was the QIP6416 (which is the unit we use). Is the HDD in the 7216 larger then 160 GB? I sure would like to upgrade to a unit with a larger HDD. If so, hopefully we can have both for a transitional period so we can empty out the HDD on the old DVR while the new one takes over recording our shows.

Lets hope for some really great news in March.


Hmmm, pretty sure that's what my DVR is. I'll check it when we return tomorrow after 18 days on the Big Island :D and report back. Regardless, I know the capacity is 160 GB.

Yup, my DVR is the QIP 7216-1. I traded it in for my 6416 which was giving me trouble over a year ago. I got the new one from the storefront shop Frontier had at Tanasbourne. What I would like to see from Frontier is some of the new equipment (with 500GB drive) and Guide improvements that Verizon has introduced in their markets. Since Frontier and Verizon don't compete head-to-head I don't see why (OK, $$) Frontier can't provide similar advances for us.

Thanks ridgefamus, We will have to look into replacing our 6416 as well. Its got all sorts of software glitches that I gather the 7216 does not. Glitches include having the sound out of sync until I hit the jump back button (or pause the playback), the screen goes blank every so often when I play a recording requiring me to unplug the unit to reset it, it will at random times jump forward or back at time amounts other then what I programmed it to do (10 sec back, 30 secs forward). I had hoped that they would fix these glitches with a simple software upgrade, but I guess not. Actually the sound problem did not exist when we got the unit. I don't know if the HDD running in the 90% full and over makes a difference.

Did you do a straight trade of the two units when you upgraded? I would have trouble doing that since we would need to empty the HDD on the 6416 first while not recording any new content. Would be cool to trade in one DVR and have them move the HDD to the new one but I suspect they don't do that.

mmihalik, I found that ad too. Frontier does have one typo in that ad, they included their "frontier.com" web site address but there is no mention of the FiOS triple play offer on that site, they should have had the "frontierpacificnw.com" site listed instead. The price is a bit higher then the same deal from Verizon (in verizon areas like Washington DC), but at least they are not charging the $30 rate hike. And your a little off, the price is $108.50 (Verizon charges $99.99 for the same bundle, plus those new subs can get $10 more off when they order online).

But $108.50 is still a good deal and I hope a lot people jump on it. Not sure how long they have been doing this new advertising campaign but I suspect they will still report a net loss of FiOS TV subscribers in Feb. One piece of bad news about the offer, the 2 year agreement applies only to Internet and Phone service, so if they still wanted to kill TV, they could and keep customers on Internet/Phone for the whole 2 years (at least, I think that would be the case). Just hope that isn't what they are trying to do.

I wish Frontier good luck on this new offer.

.

Did you do a straight trade of the two units when you upgraded? I would have trouble doing that since we would need to empty the HDD on the 6416 first while not recording any new content. Would be cool to trade in one DVR and have them move the HDD to the new one but I suspect they don't do that.


I don't recall the exact issues I was experiencing with my 6416 but it was problematic enough that when I dealt with Cust Svc on the phone I was given an authorization number that greased the skids for when I showed up at the store. I do recall that the store part was one of the most pleasurable CS experiences. The lady in the shop was really tech-savy and could carry on an intelligent conversation about all their products. BTW, I have never heard of any trade for boxes that included an ability to save or transfer previously-recorded material, so catch up before you make your move.

I was doing some thinking about this whole situation and got a theory as to why the future of FiOS TV is looking much better.

1. I read an article back in early 2011 that the MACC stated that they would not let Frontier out of their franchise agreement if they tried to invoke the termination clause due to the service having a good market share at present.

2. Frontier has ongoing expenses to bring FiOS TV programming to Oregon and Washington from Verizon's Super Headend, regardless of how many or how few subscribers they have. Only pulling the plug on TV would end those expenses.

3. Frontier may have finally made deals with the programming services to get better rates. However, I have no idea if they had or not.

4. They want to get away from the bad publicity that trying to kill the service has put on Frontier's image (including Comcast ads that use that bad publicity).

5. Without FiOS TV, they cannot effectively compete with Comcast for triple play customers and with Verizon signing a bundling deal with Comcast, they lose out even more with Comcast offering Quad play packages with Verizon Wireless.

So it seems to me, that with a franchise agreement they cannot get out of, paying expenses to bring FiOS TV to the Pacific Northwest that they have to pay, like it or not, possibly better programming rates, and the prospect of losing more customers to Comcast and Wireless options.

They decided that FiOS TV is worth keeping after all. In fact, if they have to keep it, then they should try to make the best of it. Who knows, they may even rescind their decision of ending their franchise agreements with those four Oregon cities.

Would make better sense to offer FiOS TV in all Oregon and Washington areas if they have to keep it in some of those areas.

Don't know yet if all of this may save FiOS TV in Indiana too, will have to wait and see.

Most likely #1 and maybe a little bit of #4 which influences them to keep it going. I don't think they will rescind their decision with the four communities (Newberg and surrounding areas I do believe?)

Do you guys know if Frontier offers cablecard self install? The operator said that they don't have that option and the only way is to send a technician for a $79 fee. I thought its an FCC mandate for them to offer this option... Btw.. Im located here in Beaverton area.

Do you guys know if Frontier offers cablecard self install? The operator said that they don't have that option and the only way is to send a technician for a $79 fee. I thought its an FCC mandate for them to offer this option... Btw.. Im located here in Beaverton area.

Offhand, I don't know. But why don't you call or write to the MACC and get their take on the process. http://www.maccor.org/contact-us/contact-information.html (http://http://www.maccor.org/contact-us/contact-information.html)

bdlive, that $79 charge never appears on your bill unless they've changed something in the past three months.


Also, anyone who wants the Pac-12 Network (and sub channels) please write to Frontier to express your desire for Frontier to carry them.