It seems to me that too many electrons are being wasted by people comparing SED and Pioneer's new plasma. Particularly since specs. seem to the subject of discussion in many cases. And yet, fool that I am, I feel compelled to read the huge threads on SEDs and the 8th. generation Pioneers.

Perhaps the people that have actually seen prototypes of both displays can help me confirm my feelings.

I saw the 60" Pioneer at CES this year and the 37" Toshiba SED demo at CES last year. Assuming the SED at 60" looks similar to the demo shown, and, relying on impressions that are more than a year old, my summarized thoughts are:

1)As of January 2006 I was going to wait for a 55" SED to be my next upgrade.

2)The SED knocked the socks off everything other flat panel in the show.

3)As of January 2007 I am going to wait for the Pioneer to be my next upgrade.

4)The Pioneer knocked the socks off everything other flat panel in the show.

5(Except, possibly, the Sony OLED display)

6)The wow factor of both displays was pretty much the same.

7)I would be willing to pay MSRRP of about $10,000 for either one.

8)There will be something to knock my socks off at CES 2008?

Can people that have seen both agree or disagree with these eight points?

OLED displays seem to be the best choice for Next-Gen displays, although it'll take a few years. Sony said that they focus on OLEDs, and might even introduce small OLED TVs in 2008.

Ron.

OLED displays seem to be the best choice for Next-Gen displays, although it'll take a few years. Sony said that they focus on OLEDs, and might even introduce small OLED TVs in 2008.

Ron.

I agree on OLED being the choice over SED.

Apparently, with the lawsuit forcing delays on the release of this product, there would be nothing for this year.

Other than that, Toshiba is a crappy CE company but why are they the primary company for SED. SED needs another manufacturer in order to take-off properly.

Otherwise, I won't even bother with SED anymore.

Other than that, Toshiba is a crappy CE company but why are they the primary company for SED. SED needs another manufacturer in order to take-off properly.

Otherwise, I won't even bother with SED anymore.

Toshiba no longer owns SED - they sold it all to Canon. But yeah - it's a one company show, and that's a problem.

Toshiba is not a crappy CE company. Look at the XA2 HD-DVD. It is a masterpiece. Toshiba is a great company.

I'm not so sure that the 8G Pioneer is really able to compete with SED image quality wise. Sure, the thing you notice most is the black level and there the 8G Pioneer has probably catched up to SED. But there are other factors to image quality. E.g. plasma pixels have to pulsate to create intermediate shades of color, which can lead to artifacts when there's any motion in the image. SED works similar to a CRT (the SED image is drawn line by line), so motion display should be very good. Furthermore fill factor is said to be nearly perfect with SED while we know that plasmas are not as good (the 1080p plasmas are better but not perfect). Also we'll have to wait for how good the shadow detail of the 8G Pioneer will be and how much noise there'll be in the dark image areas.

OLED is very promising, but it's a sample-and-hold type technology, just like LCD. That means tricks are needed to get rid of the sample-and-hold effect. We'll need 120Hz with either intermediate black frames (difficult for OLED, because for this to work the brightness must be quite high) or with added interpolated frames (which can add artifacts on its own).

IMHO great blacks with great shadow detail and proper motion display are the 2 things where we need the most improvement. SED should be very good in both. 8G Pioneer should be good in black level. Not sure yet with shadow detail. Also not sure about motion display. OLED should have perfect blacks and shadow detail, but again the motion problem needs to be solved as well. No, I'm not talking response time (OLEDs are ultra fast in response time) but about the sample-and-hold effect.

Also we'll have to wait for how good the shadow detail of the 8G Pioneer will be and how much noise there'll be in the dark image areas.
I agree with you on the motion thing, but I'm sure the shadow detail of the 8G will be very solid. As it stands, the 7G Pioneer is perhaps the only plasma I've used which does not seem to resort to a noisy, dithered pattern for areas of deep shadow. It's incredibly smooth as is and I can't imagine the 8G offering anything other than a boost in that area.

I'm sure SED is still the superior technology, but these 8G panels seem to be our only option for a large flat panel with CRT quality blacks in 2007. OLED displays appear to be superior to BOTH displays, but they are a long term technology that may not see the light of day as a large panel for years to come (if ever).

We don't have many options if we want a flat panel capable of producing CRT quality blacks right now. The only other panel we'll see this year are new LCDs that compete in this area...but they are still going to be just as slow as current LCDs.

SED works similar to a CRT (the SED image is drawn line by line), so motion display should be very good. SEDs are similar to CRTs in that phosphors are activated by electrons emitted from electrodes. That makes rapid switching times and excellent contrast possible. But SEDs have an x-y matrix like plasmas or LCD panels and AIUI images are written progressively as frames, all at once, not scanned line by line as with CRTs. -- John

SEDs are similar to CRTs in that phosphors are activated by electrons emitted from electrodes. That makes rapid switching times and excellent contrast possible. But SEDs have an x-y matrix like plasmas or LCD panels and AIUI images are written progressively as frames, all at once, not scanned line by line as with CRTs. -- John
No John, SEDs are written line by line. Believe it or not. They are passive matrix, not active matrix like LCD/Plasma. Proof: Look at all the photos, you'll see horizontal bars on them. These bars are caused by the "line by line" drawing.