Thanks, I am going to call up D* tomorrow and see what they have to offer. I really don't have the money to purchase a new HD reciever, so I seem to be stuck.

Has anyone had problems with the audio on Charter Local HD channels. I'm not seeing any pixelating but the audio has an annoying cut that lasts about 1/2 a sec and occurs way to frequently. Just wondering if anyone else is experiencing it. I called and they said that they haven't had any other calls regarding it.

Josh,

I think if you have the flexibility to wait a bit longer that this "storm in a teacup" (as one of my European friends likes to say) will blow over.

Is it really realistic to see these Viacom channels going permanently dark on DISH? Personally, I don't think so. Some compromise will be reached and while it might take weeks or months more to get there, I think both parties have way too much to lose in permanently writing off their counterparts.

The bad thing about this is that we're all likely to get caught in this crossfire at some point in the future, regardless of which service we subscribe to. It seems like the local channel negotiations with Charter and other cableheads is just another manifestation of this same issue. And with Rupert Murdoch as Industry Enemy #1, DirecTV will surely have their bun fights with programmers, too.

While it's definitely frustrating, I think the process of jumping from one provider to another to avoid these distributor-programmer confrontations would prove in the long run not only to be pointless but extremely expensive in terms of switching costs.

Thanks for the level headed approach DTR. It's just frustrating as I have stated. I am dropping Charter b/c of their customer service, or lack there of, even though I like their content. Then not 3 days after I talk to E* this happens. However the more I look at it E* seems a better fit for me in terms of money and content. I think I will wait it out, maybe delay the install and see what happens.

Now I just have to explain the "storm in a teacup" notion to my 5 year old :)

SkyREPORT 03/10/2004: Viacom, DISH Keep Up Rhetoric After Nets Disappear

After EchoStar pulled the plug early Tuesday morning on a number of Viacom networks once delivered by DISH Network, Viacom went on the offensive, addressing the programming carriage skirmish with media. EchoStar went back to DISH Network customers to explain its side of the story.

Mark Rosenthal, president and COO of Viacom's MTV Networks, said during Tuesday's conference call the company was "disturbed and disappointed" the channels went dark on DISH Network. He also said it was reprehensible that EchoStar would "treat customers with such disregard."

Rosenthal also criticized EchoStar for playing the victim role in the skirmish. "EchoStar is not a small mom and pop operator," he said. "They are the fourth largest distributor."

As for previous talks, Viacom and CBS executives said they were "extremely flexible" with EchoStar during negotiations. "We couldn't work harder to work out a deal with EchoStar," Rosenthal said. He also pointed out that Viacom has reached carriage deals with virtually all other distributors - including agreements with cable giant Comcast and satellite's DirecTV.

Rosenthal described the offer given to EchoStar for carriage of Viacom nets and CBS channels as "modest and reasonable." The deal involved less than 6 cents per subscriber per month, but executives wouldn't go into further details on the offer.

Viacom executives said they are open to receiving calls from EchoStar, but had nothing to report on the stalled negotiations as of Tuesday afternoon. EchoStar CEO Charles Ergen said later in the day that Viacom officials have been in contact with EchoStar executives: "They want to do a deal, and we want to do a deal," Ergen said.

Meanwhile, EchoStar went back to its subscribers, addressing the missing Viacom and CBS channels during a special presentation on the satellite TV service Tuesday evening.

Ergen reiterated the company's stand on the skirmish, saying Viacom wanted carriage of additional channels that appeared to have little value to the DISH Network service. Apparently, Viacom told EchoStar during the negotiations that if DISH gets CBS, "you have to get all of this stuff (extra channels) and at a higher rate," Ergen said.

Ergen also said Viacom gave EchoStar a "take it or leave it" proposition on a carriage offer, and threatened to take away CBS channels before the network's coverage of the Super Bowl if EchoStar didn't ink their deal. In addition, Ergen said Viacom wanted EchoStar to tear up its contracts for other Viacom nets - CMT, Spike TV and TV Land - and extend those deals at higher rates. Those channels remain on DISH Network.

Viacom networks affected by the programming carriage skirmish include MTV, Nickelodeon, Noggin, BET and VH1, among others.

In addition, Ergen disputed the 6-cent offer per-subscriber/per month from Viacom. "If it was really 6 cents, I would sign that contract tomorrow," he said.

Has anyone else in St. Louis gotten a flyer from Charter about rate changes? It looks like my non-digital package will be going up about $2.00.

I was bummed not to see any new information in the flyer about the Motorola DVR that should be coming out soon. Since it looks like we've lost 4113's inside info we'll have to wait.

tcfilla,

I'm in the St. Peters area and I have a terrible time with Charter HD. In fact, they are meeting me for the 5th time in a month today to resolve their HD problems (I doubt it, but I can hope). They tell me every time I am the only one with tiling and audio dropout problems, but a neighbor of mine has them out also monthly as well and they tell him the same thing, just him. This time, I'm going early, getting my neighbor and both of us are telling charter it's more than ONE.

I am stuck in the Viacom/Dish battle and I am going to bail if it is not resolved within the next week. I checked with Charter about HD service in the city and they said yes, but when they sent me the price list it said $9.95/MO for the HD box. Is that right? I thought the HD box was only a couple of bucks a month more.

Thanks,

Steve

Originally posted by sconstan
I am stuck in the Viacom/Dish battle and I am going to bail if it is not resolved within the next week. I checked with Charter about HD service in the city and they said yes, but when they sent me the price list it said $9.95/MO for the HD box. Is that right? I thought the HD box was only a couple of bucks a month more.

Thanks,

Steve

Congrats Steve...

You have stumbled upon Charter's great secret...nobody pays the same for equipment. For my HD services, I pay $3.99 for HDNet and $3.00 for HD Interactive Service (don't know what that includes). My receiver or Set-top box is included in my Base Digital Package. Within the city limits, I think Charter may charge less for the packages, but more for the STB's.

Oh yeah....I WANT MY ESPN-HD NOW!!!! I am tired of waiting. Big week for NCAA Basketball, and Charter is holding me hostage!!!! It can't be that tough...turn on Channel 773 and let me watch some b-ball in glorious HD!!!

Originally posted by rbkb
For my HD services, I pay $3.99 for HDNet and $3.00 for HD Interactive Service (don't know what that includes). My receiver or Set-top box is included in my Base Digital Package.

Thats what I pay too - not sure where they get the $9.99 at, but Im not complaining.

I too am getting antsy waiting for ESPN-HD. It is almost to the point that I cannot watch ESPN right now and have to listen to the plugs of "watch tonights game in glorious high definition". Makes me wanna drive up to Bristol Connecticut and strangle the nearest guy with a smirk on his face.

Charter's pricing:

$6.95 for digital box and remote
$3.00 for HD Interactive Service (that is the HD digital box 'upgrade' and your local channels)

Total: $9.95. Sometime they bury the 6.95 in a package price, but if you look at your bill details, its there. The $3.00 is the HD surcharge. $3.99 for HDNet is optional. I'm sure ESPNHD will be $3.99, or they'll make a $9.99 or $6.99 package for HDNet/ESPNHD.

Chris

I suspect that ESPN-HD charges will be lumped in with the Sport Package that currently contains those extra Fox Sports Channels, NFL Network, ESPN Classic - and will also include the other new ESPN channel offerings: ESPN News and ESPN Deportes.

turn on Channel 773 and let me watch some b-ball in glorious HD!!!

How do you know its 773?

Tim

Here is what they quoted me:

Charter Cable TV®

FEBRUARY/MARCH SPECIAL (Promotion ends on April 3, 2004)
Receive Expanded Basic Service for $29.99 for 3 months.
Installation for up to and including 4 TVs is $19.99.

*Special only applicable for new customers. The definition of a New
Customer is a customer that has not subscribed to Cable Television and/or
High Speed Internet services for a period of 180 days (6 months).

* Installation charge quotes do not include custom charges. Custom
charges can be incurred if your basement is finished, if the outlet is
above the 1st floor, or if the cable must be fished through the walls.
Your technician will go over this with you. The rate for custom work is
$26.79/hr with 1-hour minimum. After this charges are divided into
15-minute intervals. No custom work will be done without your approval.

Analog Basic - $13.67/month

Expanded Basic - $45.85/month
Analog Basic
Expanded Basic

Charter Digitalâ„¢

FEBRUARY/MARCH SPECIAL (Promotion ends on April 3, 2004)
Receive the Biggest Value Package for $49.99 for 3 months.
1 digital outlet and up to 3 analog additional outlets included.
Installation for up to and including 4 TVs is $9.99.

*Special only applicable for new customers and customers who are
upgrading service. The definition of a New Customer is a customer that has
not subscribed to Cable Television and/or High Speed Internet services
for a period of 180 days (6 months).

* Installation charge quotes do not include custom charges. Custom
charges can be incurred if your basement is finished, if the outlet is
above the 1st floor, or if the cable must be fished through the walls.
Your technician will go over this with you. The rate for custom work is
$26.79/hr with 1-hour minimum. After this charges are divided into
15-minute intervals. No custom work will be done without your approval.

Big Value Package - $49.99/month
Analog Basic
Expanded Basic
Digital Receiver + Remote
Integrated Interactive Service
Choice of 1 Digital Tier
Big Movie Tier
Sports Tier
Family Tier

Bigger Value Package -$62.99/month
Analog Basic
Expanded Basic
Digital Receiver + Remote
Integrated Interactive Service
Choice of 1 Digital Tier
Big Movie Tier
Sports Tier
Family Tier
Choice 1 Premium
HBO and Cinemax
Starz/Encore

Biggest Value Package -$65.99/month
Analog Basic
Expanded Basic
Digital Receiver + Remote
Integrated Interactive Service
Choice of 1 Digital Tier
Big Movie Tier
Sports Tier
Family Tier
HBO/Cinemax
Starz/Encore

If you are interested in adding tiers, they will be $4 each. Additional
Digital Boxes are $6.95 per month per box. Please note that outlets
without digital receivers will receive only analog channels.


Charter HDTVâ„¢

FEBRUARY/MARCH SPECIAL (Promotion ends on April 3, 2004)
Free professional installation of HDTV services.
Free HD kit.

*Special only applicable for new customers and customers who are
upgrading service. The definition of a New Customer is a customer that has
not subscribed to Cable Television and/or High Speed Internet services
for a period of 180 days (6 months).

* Installation charge quotes do not include custom charges. Custom
charges can be incurred if your basement is finished, if the outlet is
above the 1st floor, or if the cable must be fished through the walls.
Your technician will go over this with you. The rate for custom work is
$26.79/hr with 1-hour minimum. After this charges are divided into
15-minute intervals. No custom work will be done without your approval.



HDTV Digital Cable Box - $9.95/month
Includes Local Broadcaster Channels
FOX 2 KTVI HD
NBC 5 KSDK HD
CBS 4 KMOV HD

HDNet and HDMovies - $3.99/month

A HD Kit - $14.99 (1 time charge)
A set of component and audio cables

St. Louis Area Channel Line Up
770 – HDNet
771 - HDNet Movies
777 - HDO HD
778 - Showtime HD
782 - Fox KTVI
784 - CBS KMOV
785 - NBC KSDK

Customers who subscribe to either HBO and/or Showtime will receive
HBOHD and/or ShowtimeHD at no additional cost

Originally posted by tcfila
How do you know its 773?

Tim

See this thread:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=377124

GlendaleHDTV:

Byt your previous posts and name, I hypothesize that you and I are in the same quaint little community between Kirkwood and Webster. Do you have any pixelation on your XCharter HD channels? What about audio drop-outs?

Originally posted by sconstan
I am stuck in the Viacom/Dish battle and I am going to bail if it is not resolved within the next week. I checked with Charter about HD service in the city and they said yes, but when they sent me the price list it said $9.95/MO for the HD box. Is that right? I thought the HD box was only a couple of bucks a month more.

Thanks,

Steve

It appears all the Viacom channels are back on Dish. Here's a message from Charlie:

Your CBS and MTV Networks Are Back! Message from Charlie Ergen, CEO of DISH Network

Dear Loyal DISH Network Customers,

I am very pleased to announce that we’ve successfully reached a long-term agreement with Viacom to provide you with CBS and MTV Network channels including MTV, Comedy Central, and Nickelodeon. I am happy to say that this agreement will allow us to continue to provide you the lowest all-digital price everyday.

I understand that it has been a difficult 36 hours to be without these popular channels. We appreciate your patience, your support for DISH Network and your continued business.

As promised, you will receive a $1 credit on your next billing statement. In addition, we would like to thank you for all of your support by sending you a free DISH On Demand Pay-Per-View coupon that will allow you to view upcoming hits like “Cat in the Hat” and “School of Rock.” The coupon will arrive in your April billing statement. Enjoy a movie on us.

Everyone at DISH Network will continue to fight to provide the best possible programming and services at the lowest possible price, every day.

Thank you for your loyalty and thank you for being a DISH Network customer.


Charlie Ergen
CEO
DISH Network

Originally posted by rbkb
GlendaleHDTV:

Byt your previous posts and name, I hypothesize that you and I are in the same quaint little community between Kirkwood and Webster. Do you have any pixelation on your XCharter HD channels? What about audio drop-outs?

Your hypothesis is correct. I've had some minor issues with both pixelization and drop-outs on CBS only (specifically on Two and a half men last Tuesday). But no problems on anything else (Sopranos, law and order, west wing, without a trace, ER, Leno, crossing jordan, etc).

Originally posted by sconstan
Here is what they quoted me:


Biggest Value Package -$65.99/month
Analog Basic
Expanded Basic
Digital Receiver + Remote
Integrated Interactive Service
Choice of 1 Digital Tier
Big Movie Tier
Sports Tier
Family Tier
HBO/Cinemax
Starz/Encore

If you are interested in adding tiers, they will be $4 each. Additional
Digital Boxes are $6.95 per month per box. Please note that outlets
without digital receivers will receive only analog channels.


You get HBO/Cinemax/Starz/Encore - all for $65.99? I think I am paying the $62.99 and get HBO/Cinemax/Showtime - wonder if this is worth me calling and talking price again with them....

I wish Charter would be like Dish and DirecTV and actually list their pricing on their website - it would be easier than having to contact CSRs every month or two to learn about the new pricing.

....chant with me..... ESPN-HD ESPN-HD ESPN-HD [that chant HAD to help us in getting that rogue channel]

Well, Charter worked on our HD problem for 3 hours last night and they said they found the problem, something about a line amp several blocks up stream. They first replaced my box, then took it out to the drop, then took it across the street and I guess kept going upstream until it worked :)

So far, so good. The tech Chris was outstanding to deal with and the line crews too. I have to say they really went all out to finally fix the problem. Well, we will see in a few days, but it appears I'm good to go.

Now, if I can only get ESPN-HD and Discovery HD I would consider this a perfect situation.

I sound greedy, don't I! :rolleyes:

you want greed? I want ESPN-HD, Disc-HD, Bravo HD, ABC-HD, Starz-HD, is there a weather channel HD? if there is I want that too! :D

Hey guys, it's been a while since I have posted. I just went through the entire March thread and didn't find anything about this...

Is KTVI (Fox) still having issues with their transmissions? I tried to watch the NASCAR race on Sunday and finally had to turn off the TV because the signal kept coming and going..Very frustrating.

I checked my signal strength and it fluctuated between about 20% and 60%. I am using a Zenith 520 STB and a Mits Decoder in my TV and it has the same problem.

Thanks for the info.. Bill

abcward,

I can't argue with you on that. :D I would like it all HD. Last night my wife said they better start making sure the actors and anchors on the news are HD ready. HD makes some of them look really, really bad :)

Does anyone have any thoughts on the whole HDTV DVD Player issue? When should we considering purchasing one...what brands will be the best deals...Any info/suggestions/rumors?

Originally posted by _Arklyte_
Last night my wife said they better start making sure the actors and anchors on the news are HD ready. HD makes some of them look really, really bad :)

Dick Ford in high definition is a very scary thought.:eek:

Fox Sports Net (Bay Area, Florida, New England) To Do All Home Games in HD "Soon"
Great news for Giants, A's, Warriors and Sharks fans (and same for teams covered by FSN New England and FSN Florida)!!!

Excerpted from tvweek.com (first posted in thread in Programming forum):



quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Comcast, Rainbow Ink Carriage Pact:

Rainbow Media today struck a deal with cable giant Comcast that includes long-term carriage of the AMC cable channel and extends the life of carriage agreements with Fox Sports Net Bay Area, Florida and New England. Financial terms of the pact were not released.

As part of the agreement, Rainbow's sports networks will soon broadcast all home games in the Fox Sports Net markets in high definition.

The high-def component bolsters the number of HD channels Comcast is offering subscribers. On Tuesday, the cable company inked a deal with NBA "TV in which some games will be broadcast in high definition.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



As far as the Bay Area, I would doubt we will see remaining (2003) Warriors and Sharks games in HD (maybe Sharks since they will make the playoffs and will be one of the top 3, 4 or 5 seeds in their conference). But surely this means Giants and A's games in HD beginning some time this season.

It says "all home games" without reference to specific pro teams or leagues, so conceivably it could also include MLS (Earthquakes), MLL (Lacrosse), AFL (Arena FL) and other less popularized professional teams, and maybe major college sports events (Cal, Stanford home football and/or BB games). But I doubt it-- the agreement probably only applies to MLB, NBA and NHL games.

Regardless, this is great news!"

I saw this on another forum. Come on, Fox Midwest...get on the bandwagon. Why do the people in FL and CA need HD sports? They have great weather...give it to the people stuck in their homes between November and March, please...

ferl:

Tonight, CBS HD on Charter really seems to be more pixelated than usual, and the audio cuts out alot. Has CBS gotten rid of 5.1??? I only get 2/0 now.

Also, I have noticed that alot more Charter cities have gotten ESPN-HD...still none here. WHAT GIVES, CHARTER??? You don't seem to be givin' the ol' hometown respect!!!:confused:

With my luck, we will get ESPN-HD on Sunday, the day after all the NCAA HD is completed. Once again, way to go CHARTER!:mad:

I've also had problems with CBS HD tonite, but I'm receiving it OTA.

Dean

I watched KMOV-DT over the air tonight and there were maybe a dozen video breakups, though they were pretty brief. The first one I remember happened probably halfway through CSI.

John Kotches posted here earlier in the week about an apparent change in how the sound is being flagged for non-DD broadcasts:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=3496623#post3496623

We Charter folks have been complaining about KMOV-DT since it became available around super bowl time. The over the air folks say they see some problems but don't complain too much. Maybe the Charter re-transmission of the HD signal with minor pixelation and sound drop offs is magnifying the defects. I am continually annoyed by the quality of KMOV-DT via Charter. It is the only channel with these problems.

It was so bad tonight on Letterman that I switched to the SD channel.

Doug,

For the shows I watch on CBS (CSI:Miami, CSI, Without a Trace) everything is coming across flagged as DD2.0 now as opposed to 5.1. Most processors / receivers can apply DPL, DPL-II or DPL-IIx to a DD2.0 signal. It's quite a different experience than being restricted to stereo. I suggested Walt come by some time to hear what his station sounds like in an e-mail last night :)

Redwine:

One thing I notice is that my processor clicks, which indicates audio lock is lost, whenever there's a switch between the national feed and the local feed or vice versa. It's quite annoying and I lose about 1/2 to 1 second of audio when it does this. I have an option to mark the input as a poor quality digital source that I haven't turned on yet. I'll experiment with that this weekend and see if it makes a difference next Monday night.

I get some drop outs and some pixelation, but it isn't too severe, ie no worse than any other OTA station in the area. I do wonder about what's going on with PSIP information with them and KDNL though. My 811 won't map either of them to their respective sub-channels. Thankfully the new software doesn't dump them out of the Guide altogether, just leaves them at their physical channel.

Regards,

Regarding the sound......I changed my digital audio from optical to coax and the sound problem is gone. I don't know how you guys are getting the sound to the receiver, but you may want to try this.

Tim

I was wanting to know if anyone was using a VOOM box for OTA. I'm getting VOOM intalled on 3/19/04. I have the Toshiba DST 3000 right know didn't know how the OTA reception would compare.

Mark

John,

I noticed that both CSI and Without a Trace sounded much fuller last night, especially in the surrounds. Definitely an improvement, though I wonder why CBS or the producers of this show aren't doing 5.1.

Do you know what the situation is with ABC shows? While I know KDNL isn't able to pass 5.1 yet, ABC has been 5.1 pretty much from day one. I had just assumed that all their shows are 5.1, but now I'm thinking that may be incorrect.

Is there anywhere online where one can find a reliable listing of the originating sound format for HD shows?

Doug,

I can't say with absolute certainty, but I suspect that the various companies providing the content haven't started submitting the results in 5.1.

DD2.0 is compatible with MTS Stereo, so it would allow them to utilize 1 soundtrack for both the SD and HD deliverable. This might be another reason for delivering in DD2.0.

Tim,

I don't have the option, as the Dish 811 is optical out only.

Regards,

Does anyone know if KMOV will be showing the HD game on the DT station, even if it is not the same game that is on the KMOV 4 SD station? In other cities that I have been in, I know that they sometimes put two different games on, always having an HD feed on the DT station. Any information is appreciated.

There is a thread on this topic under HDTV programming, but no one from STL has chimed in. Thanks.

Does anyone have any idea why Charter hasn't turned on ESPN-HD??? Only two more days of NCAA basketball on ESPN-HD, and it would be nice to see Mizzou in glorious hi-def tomorrow night (assuming they beat Kansas this evening;) )

I saw that other Charter cities are getting it turned on Monday, March 15. I will be really mad if they do that, just as NCAA Championship week end.:mad:

Originally posted by rbkb
Does anyone have any idea why Charter hasn't turned on ESPN-HD??? Only two more days of NCAA basketball on ESPN-HD, and it would be nice to see Mizzou in glorious hi-def tomorrow night (assuming they beat Kansas this evening;) )

I saw that other Charter cities are getting it turned on Monday, March 15. I will be really mad if they do that, just as NCAA Championship week end.:mad:

I've seen you're thread over in the main forum where you polled Charter customers in other cities whether they had ESPN-HD or not. Since it seems like many other do I wonder if the problem is Charter corporate, just the St. Louis division or both?

Originally posted by Dave Beebe
I've seen you're thread over in the main forum where you polled Charter customers in other cities whether they had ESPN-HD or not. Since it seems like many other do I wonder if the problem is Charter corporate, just the St. Louis division or both?

Yea I guess I am uninformed - I would think that getting a contract between ESPN and Charter would be a national thing. Charter wouldnt need to negotiate a contract for each individual city, would they? If not, you would think that most cities could go almost simultaneously, unless its a bandwidth issue. Color me guessing...

Originally posted by tcfila
Regarding the sound......I changed my digital audio from optical to coax and the sound problem is gone. I don't know how you guys are getting the sound to the receiver, but you may want to try this.

Tim

Tim,

I am using the optical but only have problems with KMOV-HD. Why would KMOV be the only channel with periodic but consistent audio dropouts (and micro video freezes)? I will experiment this weekend and see if it makes a difference. Thanks.

When I was living in Jefferson County a few years ago I had a big chimney mount antenna that I bought from Grandpa's (you old timers will remember Grandpa's). I installed it with TV antenna wire and a rotor. My house was on a high elevation so I could receive stations from far away. I enjoyed watching stations near Cape Girardeau and Columbia MO and some in Kentucky and others I can't remember that were fuzzy.

I still have that antenna. Will I have to install it again on my new house to receive the OTA HD channels? It sounds like fun. How much is a good OTA receiver and where is the best place to buy one? I can't wait for Charter and satellite won't offer local HD in my lifetime.

Hi

I have been having problems with CBS HD. Severe drop out due to signal fluctuations between 71 and 0. I live in Glen Carbon and all the towers are on nearly a straight line from my house (229 to 240 degrees). PBS is the furthest from my house at 30 miles and is a 233 degrees. I have not problems with this station. I has a solid signal at 74. ABC at 240 degrees and 23 miles, no problems. CBS at 231 degrees and 24 miles is a PITA. I am using a Hipix with an antenna in the attic. It doesn't seem to matter where I point the antenna, I have the same problem. I see the same problem with the charter feed but not to the extent as OTA. Do you think this is a network or a local problem. I am getting nervous with 13 golf tournaments about to be shown in Hi Def especially the Masters. It was AWESOME last year.

Walt

Red,

Most of the answers you're looking for about the antenna can be found in the post at the beginning of this monthly thread. The key issue is whether the antenna is a VHF/UHF combo, or just UHF. Considering the vintage, I suspect that it's a combo, which may result in inferior reception to a UHF-only. Cabling is also probably an issue on an antenna that old, so you'll need to find a sufficient run of quality coax. You might also try the path of least resistance and see if an indoor antenna will work in your new location.

You can find OTA-only receivers for around $400. Here's a link to a Zenith OTA-only STB that can be purchased at www.copperbox.com.

http://www.copperbox.com/lite/popinfo.php?lc_code=HDV420&uneek=90915781

It's also worth checking into eBay for a used set-top box. That may allow you spend even less, or close to the same amount and get a box that would also leave the door open to satellite in the future.

Doug

The antenna is new (one year), it is UHF only (yagi), and it has a rotor. The cable is RG6 and has had a amp installed recently in an attempt to solve the problem. When I adjust for signal, I can get into the mid 70's for signal strength but it doesn't stay there. It will rise and fall ever minute or so. I did not have this problem until about 1/2 way through the football season. Did CBS do something or do I have some degradation on my end.

Walt

Doug,

Your URL for copperbox is a bit off ;)

http://www.copperbox.com for those that are interested :D

Cheers,

Walt,

My previous answer was for redwine. I didn't respond to your question because I didn't really have anything particularly helpful to tell you.

I have a similar issue with KSDK-DT and I'm only around 20 miles from the tower and virtually due east. Oddly, my reception since late October has been very good and I would say that I have a problem less than 10% of the time, versus close to 50% of the time previously. I've seen others here note that such problems can be seasonal, with some posters here citing trees with leaves as a potential source of the problem.

I don't know if that's what's happened in my case, but I guess it's possible. If it gets worse this spring, I'll go up into the attic and try some repositioning to see if I can make it more reliable. To be honest, in view of the patchy record of NBC for delivering HD programming and for KSDK reliably switching to the HD feed, I'm not terribly motivated to do anything about it.

And once Letterman is in HD -- assuming that day ever comes -- there will be even less motivation.

Perhaps you're experiencing something similar that's causing you a problem. The fact that you can get a signal but that it drifts in and out sounds like the symptoms of digital multipath interference. Based on what I've read here and elsewhere, resolving that sort of problem can be tough.

As noted, I know that's not very helpful...sorry.

John, thanks for pointing that out -- the small finger on my right hand must be getting fatter.

Link now fixed...

aspec2,

I too have the same problem with ch 5's HD feed. I live in Ballwin, and I've made ten attempts to adjust the antenna to get a solid lock on 5, but the signal goes from 84& to 0 and back every 1-10 seconds. I added a 10 foot mast to my antenna, and my other channels got a 5-10% boost on my model 6000 OTA tuner, ch 5 is just as bad as before. Adding a preamp at the antenna didn't seem to change anything.


I'm hoping that if/when I decide to get a 921 from dish that the tuner will have less problems since I don't see what else I can change.

I read somewhere you might want to try a more directional antenna, which may reduce multi-path interference depending on the refection's source.


Can anyone in St.Louis that has an 921 give their opinion if it is a better tuner than a previous OTA tuner?

Thanks all,
-CoCoKola

Doug

No problem. I was my mistake as I had not read the previous post.

As far as trees are concerned, it began happening after the leaves fell off. Would digital multipath only affect one tower when all towers seem to be in a line and I get the furthest one from the house?

I'm sorry if I was miss-understood. My problem is with CBS channel 4. NBC is fine as are all the other channels. CBS is the one that is going to broadcast golf in HD and that is why I am trying to get it working.
So far today, I have pulled all the excess RG6 out of the attic. Probably 25 feet. I also pulled in the wire for the rotor. It was a PITA dragging it down to adjust. When I get the cable shortened and the rotor installed I will let you know what happens.

It is also funny that it never seems to drop out during a commercial.


Thanks for the input.

Walt

Walt,

No problem on the miscommunication. I just wanted to ensure that you knew that my previous note was addressing different questions and also that I wasn't purposely ignoring you.

In theory at least, it would seem that being further away (up to a point) would be advantageous where there's multiple towers, as you should be aiming at a narrower target. But then, the station that is causing me the most problem is in the middle of the tower cluster, just south of KDNL (ABC) and well north of WRBU (UPN) and that doesn't seem logical. Clearly there are other factors involved.

I assume that the issue with commercials coming in clearly is just coincidental (I sure hope so). I have noticed that there have been more periodic dropouts on KMOV lately and perhaps whatever is causing that is made worse for you by distance. But it sounds like you've had problems with KMOV for a while, so that too may be a non-factor.

I don't know that shortening the cable run will help, but it can't hurt. Maybe you'll get lucky and find that you were having some signal loss that gets eliminated in shortening the run.

What antenna are you using? My first experience with digital reception was in San Francisco (downtown) and at one point I upgraded my antenna in order to eliminate repeated dropouts I was getting on one station there (as it happened, also the CBS affiliate). An antenna upgrade might be something to consider if you find that the cable work and other ideas brings you no joy.

I'm definitely sorry to hear about the problems you're having and hope you find solution, here or elsewhere. If you do eliminate the problem, be sure to update us here.

WGN to present all Chicago home sports broadcasts in HDTV:

http://wgntv.trb.com/wgntv-sports-hdtv121803,0,7972094.story?coll=wgntv-home-4

Has anyone heard anything about the Blues possibly lifting the blackout for this Tuesday's game vs. LA Kings on HDNet? This game is big with 2 teams fighting for one of the final playoff spots - it sure would be nice to watch it on HDNet [especially for us Charter people who missed the one and only HD Blues game due to some sort of 'error'].

Someone get a hold of Jim Woodcock...

THe biggest week for HD sports on ESPN HD, and Charter, as usual, fails to come through by providing us ESPN-HD...

I've seen allot of complaints about the Big East tournament and how it looked in HD, but I still would have liked to see it.

Does anyone know if KMOV will show different games on analog and DT stations for the NCAA's? I hope they do like most other CBS affiliates and show the HD game as well as another game on Channel 4.

Originally posted by DroptheRemote
WGN to present all Chicago home sports broadcasts in HDTV:

http://wgntv.trb.com/wgntv-sports-hdtv121803,0,7972094.story?coll=wgntv-home-4

Why the envy? Even if KPLR or Fox Midwest did the games in HD, I'm sure there is some way Charter would screw it up and show SD here!:mad:

Access to WGN-DT in St. Louis = unsolvable problem

Being held hostage by Charter in St. Louis = solvable problem

Hey guys, I'm putting my house on the market at the end of this week and will be moving to the Tampa area when it is sold (hopefully looking to close before the end of April). Just wanted to give the community a heads up in case someone might be looking for home theater cabinets. I'm not selling them until we have an accepted offer on the house and a closing date, since the HDTV and cabinets might end up as part of their offer. If the new owners don't make an offer on it, I'll be having a moving sale and my marble tables, Hooker cabinets/lighted bridge, and maybe my HDTV will be up for sale to interested parties (haven't deciced if I'm going to part with the HDTV itself yet, I guess it depends on the offers I get). I hate to part with them, but I'd rather not spend the cash to move it all down with me. Plus, we'll probably rent for the first year and build something, and I don't want have to move this stuff twice.

So, if you've been in the market for a nice bridge for your big screen (mine is 65" and it fits it just fine, looks great and I get more compliments on the furniture sometimes, over the TV) then drop me a PM or email and let me know of your interest and maybe an offer.

jondiehl@charter.net

Just for reference, everything was purchased in the Spring/Summer of 2001, new and the following were the retail prices on each:

Hooker cabinet set: $4500
HDTV: $4200 (I paid only $3700 though)
Marble cocktail table and end table ($500 each)

The HDTV obviously has taken a serious hit on value since it's technology and the same or similar 65" model (Plat Plus) can be had for much less now. The furniture though is all in like-new mint condition.

Here are some pics:

http://webpages.charter.net/jondiehl/ht

I'm pretty sure from previous threads I've read this is the local WGN and not the national WGN that everyone else in the country gets. WGN in Chicago is a WB affiliate and cannot retransmit this to the rest of the country.

CBS is going to be doing HD coverage of all the games played in Kansas City on Friday, March 19 and Sunday March 21. Here's the matchups set for KC this coming weekend:

Friday - March 19

10:30 a.m.:
(7) Memphis vs (10) South Carolina

30 minutes following the conclusion of the 10:30 a.m. game:
(2) Oklahoma State vs (15) Eastern Washington

5:25pm
(5) Providence vs (12) Pacific

30 Minutes following the conclusion of the 5:25 p.m. game:
(4) Kansas vs (13) Illinois at Chicago


Sunday - March 21

Times to be determined:
Providence-Pacific winner v Kansas-UIC winner
Memphis-South Carolina winner v Oklahoma St-E. Washington winner


The following weekend, CBS will broadcast all games played in the St. Louis regional in HD. If the seeded teams were to win through, those pairings would look like this:

(1) Kentucky v (4) Kansas
(2) Gonzaga v (3) Georgia Tech

Of course, upsets are almost inevitable, so you can take a look at the pairings to see about other possible match-ups.


Lastly, the Final Four games in San Antonio will be broadcast in HD.

No point in speculating on all the No. 1 seeds winning through, as that's never happened, or at least not in the tournament's current format.


I have no idea which games KMOV is planning to broadcast next weekend, but I think it's likely that the game between Illinois v Murray State will be one of the games they show on Friday. Assuming that's correct, I think that's also the game that would be shown on the digital channel.

CBS offers a complete package of all tournament out-of-local games via satellite and cable as a subscription purchase, and I think the HD games will be a fundamental part of that package.

As a result, I think the only way we'll see the HD games this coming weekend is if those are the games that KMOV elects to show locally.

If anyone knows differently, feel free to wade in and correct me.

Doug

Thanks for the responces.

You lived in THE City. I lived in THE City. I also lived in South City, San Mateo, Milpitas, and San Jose. It is still hard for the wife and I to distinguish between channels 4 and 5. Here its CBS, NBC. There its NBC, CBS.

Walt

Doug,

What do you think of the Channel Master 3010 that VOOM offers as part of their recent marketing campaign. I am considering retaining Charter basic for most of my TVs and installing the VOOM package for my HD set. I think VOOM will survive but might be bought out by a bigger fish.

Red,

I don't really know much about that particular antenna. It is one of those "incognito" antennas that was designed at least in part to keep complaints from neighbors to a minimum -- fittingly, it's called "the Stealth." In my limited experience with these sorts of antennas (primarily Terks), they are long on looks and short on performance.

But your mileage may vary.

I tracked down some threads where you can read actual user feedback and judge for yourself. There's not a lot of comment on this antenna here at AVS, at least based on the search I did for "stealth" focusing only on the "thread topic."

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=315441&highlight=stealth

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=247425&highlight=stealth

Worst case, VOOM installs the Stealth and you find you have problems getting all the channels, or your reception is hit-and-miss. At least, they've done the cabling and the mounting, and you'd only need to find a different, better antenna and remount it.

Or, if you're feeling pessimistic about the Stealth, you could check with VOOM beforehand to see if they'd install an antenna that you provide instead of their standard model. If they're bureacratic and say no, you could still try to "grease down" the installer, who may welcome the chance to pocket a few extra bucks.

You might even be able to turn around and auction off the Stealth.

Walt,

I lived in SOMA, just off of First Street and Folsom for about 3 years. In general I had a straight shot from my rooftop to Sutro Tower, though I did have occasional problems with multipath.

The building where I lived was very particular about how the cable was run from the rooftop antenna and satellite to my 2nd floor apartment, and in the end the installer had to rappel down the front of my building to get everything just right.

Amazingly, I found out afterward that this was the very first time the installer had rappelled.

I also lived in the South Bay for a while, working in Foster City and Burlingame.

Jon,

Sorry to hear that you're going to be moving. I remember you being one of the first guys to welcome me here. You will be missed.

If you need any ideas on how to pack up your RPTV, let me know as I did that a few years ago. In general, it worked out well, though I probably would have done a few things differently if I were to do it again, especially if I knew it was going to be in transit/storage for more than a month or so.

But in general, I'd recommend against a move unless you can't get a reasonable price for it. IMO, too many things can go wrong with moving that sort of thing, especially without the original packing.

Originally posted by DroptheRemote
But in general, I'd recommend against a move unless you can't get a reasonable price for it. IMO, too many things can go wrong with moving that sort of thing, especially without the original packing.

Yeah, that's what I'm thinking. Too much stuff can get jostled around, especially on a 1000+ mile move. If I can get a fair price for it from either the home buyer or an outside buyer, I'll probably let them take it off my hands and then get a new one when I get settled in Florida (maybe front projection or a DLP rear projection).

I'll still check in here, mostly for the in-laws though. I'm their only source of HDTV info :)

Originally posted by abcward
Has anyone heard anything about the Blues possibly lifting the blackout for this Tuesday's game vs. LA Kings on HDNet? This game is big with 2 teams fighting for one of the final playoff spots - it sure would be nice to watch it on HDNet [especially for us Charter people who missed the one and only HD Blues game due to some sort of 'error'].

Someone get a hold of Jim Woodcock... I'm guessing since he never responded to my previous email that it's not going to happen.

Doug

It IS a small world. I lived at the corner of 12th Street and Folsom. Took the 47 bus to school. That was back in the 50's. There was not Sutro Tower. Sutro's was an amusement area (quite an amazing place). The towers were built just before I left the Bay Area but at that time I was living in the South Bay.

Just an update on the HD. I shortened the cable and reconnected everything. Did not adjust the antenna. Watched 1 hour of CBS HD last night with NO drop out. This could be an anomaly but I am hopeful. CSI will be the test. You know, the WAF thing.

Walt

Just to follow up on the Charter issues I've been having in the St. Charles area. Since installation last December, HD services would work maybe two nights a week. The rest of the time it would tile so bad the pic would freeze....but only on HD channels. When they came out last week, the service tech worked for several hours, then brough line crews and they found a bad amp further up line. Since then, they have called me twice to make sure it was still working. It still works GREAT and I was shocked they called the first time much less the second time. Nice to see they just didn't bail on me like the previous 5 times.

Now, If I can just figure out how to get them to give me Discovery HD and ESPN HD, I would be a happy camper.

Has anyone seen if Charter turned on ESPN-HD today? For the majority of their cities, today was suppose to be the day. Thanks.

Since there is a lot of talk about Charter, I just thought I'd share my experience with their Broadband. I had my Charter high-speed internet installed over a month ago and they still haven't come back to bury the cable in the yard. Of course, the installers arrive 25 minutes after the 2 hour window I was given :rolleyes:

Anyway, I just thought I'd jump on the Charter bashing :D



Back on topic: I still haven't heard anything about the blackout being lifted for tonight's HDNet Blues broadcast.

Still no ESPN-HD on Charter...

Oh, what is a boy to do?

On other topics, do people that get CBS OTA or via D*/E* national CBS feed have the pixelation issues that I do with KMOV-DT over Charter?

Did anyone see the posts stating the Augusta National will allow CBS affiliates show the USA-HD Thursday/Friday feed of the Masters on the CBS HD/DT stations. Great news! Does anybody know if KMOV-DT will carry this feed?

I think this might be a sign of good news, but don't quote me: In the Charter HD channel guide, channel "773" is up and running, but there is no specific channel name there yet. However, when you go there, it is ESPN. So maybe that is ESPN HD. Also, another channel has appeared in the sports pack--but no name yet.

I saw this very early in the morning, so maybe I was still asleep and still dreaming. Thats my excuse if everything disappears.

Here's a story from SKYReport E-News that discusses some recent FCC reviews involving homeowner associations (HOAs) that attempt to prevent home owners from erecting satellite dishes. Although the only mention here is dishes, I believe that this would apply equally to disputes involving an OTA antenna.

Near the end of the article, there's a partial listing of potential HOA obstructions that are not allowed and which can be effectively ignored under current OTARD rules.

Note that there was no ruling or opinion provided by the FCC in this case, but presumably one will be forthcoming and if SKY reports it, I'll update it here.

_____________________________________________

SBCA Works on OTARD Issues

The Satellite Broadcasting and Communications Association recently went back to the Federal Communications Commission concerning regulations governing homeowner associations (HOAs) and their attempts to regulate the placement of DBS dishes.

Earlier this month, the association filed reply comments in response to a public notice from the FCC concerning whether attorney's fees could be assessed against a homeowner by an HOA. The case involved homeowners in Boulder, Colo., who face nearly $2,000 in attorney's fees tied to discussions with their homeowner association concerning the appropriate placement of a DBS antenna on their property.

In its FCC argument, the SBCA said the HOA cannot assess attorney's fees against the homeowners under the FCC Over-the-Air Reception Devices (OTARD) rule because they relocated the dish at the HOA's request. Further, several parts of the HOA's DBS antenna policy violate OTARD rules, SBCA said.

SBCA said additional violations of OTARD rules by the HOA include: A 30-day approval process; required descriptions and sketches of the dish installation; a requirement of painting and camouflaging the antenna; requirement of installation by a licensed contractor; the burden of proof on placement of the dish on the homeowners, not the HOA; a vague reference to compliance with local codes; written permission of a property owner for installation by a renter; and the restrictions on the number and types of antennas.

SBCA has online information detailing OTARD regulations and what homeowners can do if caught up in a dispute with an HOA. The information can be found at: http://www.sbca.com/government/zoning.htm.
_____________________________________________

HDNET TO DELIVER NASCAR’S FIRST LIVE HIGH DEFINITION TELEVISION PACKAGE

18 NASCAR Grand National Division Races on HDNet in 2004.

DALLAS and LOS ANGELES, March 15, 2004 ˆ NASCAR and HDNet announced today a three-year partnership for NASCAR’s first high definition television package. This landmark deal features 15 live high definition telecasts for a total of 18 races from the NASCAR Grand National Division, a tier of NASCAR regional racing series which includes the Busch North Series and West Series. HDNet will produce and broadcast the package in 1080i HDTV.

The package launches Sunday, April 25, with the Busch North Series race at Lee USA Speedway in New Hampshire. The first West Series race to be broadcast in high definition is the May 1 event from California Speedway near Los Angeles.

Full article: http://www.tvbarn.com/ticker/archives/019645.html

:D Well, I see chnl 773 now has "Channel available shortly" message on it.

Channel 773 is working for me - and it is ESPN-HD !!!!

[on the menu grid it is listed as "to be announced" but its the channel we've all been waiting for]

Has anyone heard back from the blues for tommorow nights game on HDNet?

Tim

game is tonight, not tomorrow - 9:30 pm I believe. And no, I have heard nothing back from Mr. Woodcock.

:(

Originally posted by abcward
Channel 773 is working for me - and it is ESPN-HD !!!!

[on the menu grid it is listed as "to be announced" but its the channel we've all been waiting for]

Charter 406 is now broadcasting a channel called "FUEL" although it is listed as "to be announced".

Posted Tuesday, April 8

Details Announced for Fox Digital Sports Net

Fox Cable Networks Group will "Fuel" its upcoming alternative sports network with unconventional advertising and sponsorship deals when the digital service rolls out in July.

The 24-hour network -- officially dubbed Fuel -- will focus on such pastimes as snowboarding, surfing, skateboarding, wakeboarding, BMX and motocross and likely will incorporate fewer, longer ad spots than traditionally air on cable.

"We've been looking at what is happening in the digital space, in the cable space, and the concerns from the advertisers' standpoint of 30 second spots in the age of Tivo and other similar recording systems -- and (advertisers') desire to get out of breaks and into shows," the net's programming-marketing VP CJ Olivares said during a conference call Tuesday. During the call, he and Fuel G.M. David Sternberg, who also serves as senior VP of Fox Cable's emerging networks group, officially announced the network's name.

Mr. Olivares added that the company is working with agencies and clients to develop what he called "a new paradigm for sponsorship." Fuel will look to reduce the number of ad breaks and is considering running ads as long as two minutes. The net also is considering mounting presentations with no commercial interruption.

The Fuel executives said they are targeting a young male audience, generally between the ages of 12 and 24, although some programming also will be geared toward young women.

"It is a big bet on a very strong future trend in sports participation and sports viewing in this country and our culture," Mr. Sternberg said, adding that he's confident the new service will "reach a viewer in the teenage demo that's not being served anywhere else in sports televison or television in general."

Fuel is in pursuit of appropriate sports rights, and will likely collaborate in some cases with sibling Fox Sports Network in purchasing certain games. For example, Fuel and Fox Sports Net are currently talking to Association of Surfing Professionals about the IMG-controlled rights to their World Tour.

Launch distribution stands at around 2 million homes, including deals with DirecTV, Time Warner Cable and Cable One.

Here is their link Fuel (http://www.fuel.tv/)

I haven't checked since very early this morning, but is the ESPN HD chnl 773 a subscribed service? When I left at 7am, it said chnl available shortly.

I have 770, 771 and the 3 local stations (showtime and HBO HD I don't subscribe to. I buy DVD's). Will I have to upgrade service for ONE additional station?

Then, my luck, when (and that is a big when) they add DiscoveryHD, I'll have to pay for that upgrade as well!

I just seen some other posts that said theirs is working.

no extra subscription pricing [yet] for ESPN-HD - seems like it is just another channel in Charter's HD channel package.

I'm watching a Spring Training baseball game right now...



Bruce

I'm curious what others are paying for their cable? I have Charter with all their channels and HDTV along with their fastest internet connection and pay roughly 130 a month. What do the rest of you pay?

I have all the 'normal' channels, HDTV, HBO/Cinemax/Showtime, and the fastest internet and we pay $113.



Bruce

abcward,
thanks for the info...I feel a little better that when I get home it will actually be working :)

Dyaus,

I have roughly the same, except a low tier pipeline and no subscritpion channels (showtime, hbo, etc) and roughly pay $90

Dyaus,

Here's the breakdown on my bill:

Monthly Charges
03/09 - 04/08 BIGGEST VALUE PACKAGE $0.00
03/09 - 04/08 BASIC $10.00
03/09 - 04/08 EXPANDED $29.00
03/09 - 04/08 HBO CINEMAX PACK $0.02
03/09 - 04/08 HD HBO $0.00
03/09 - 04/08 HD SHOWTIME $0.00
03/09 - 04/08 STARZ SUPERPAK $0.02
03/09 - 04/08 BIG MOVIE TIER $4.00
03/09 - 04/08 FREE CHARTER MOVIE TIER $0.00
03/09 - 04/08 DIGITAL RECEIVER SERVICE $3.85
03/09 - 04/08 REMOTE CONTROL - DIGITAL $0.11
03/09 - 04/08 INTERACTIVE INTEGRATED SERVICE $2.99
03/09 - 04/08 HD INTEGRATED INTERACTIVE SERVICE $3.00
03/09 - 04/08 384KDWN $29.99
03/09 - 04/08 EARTHLINK $0.00
03/09 - 04/08 MSN INTERACTIVE E - MAIL $0.00
03/09 - 04/08 CUSTOMER OWNED MODEM $0.00
Sub Total $82.98
02/28 Franchise Fee $3.60
03/09 FCC Admin Fee $0.04
Sub Total $3.64


So $86.62 for the lowest pipeline, plus the movie pack (HBO, Showtime, Starz, Cinemax) and the HD (no HDNET which is $3.99/month). This was some special deal (I think 4113 posted the details earlier in this thread) which goes up after two months if I keep all the movie channels.

I have been reading St. Louis threads for some time now and I decided to ask the question.

I just moved to University City/Clayton area and I need to make a decision on to either go Cable or Satellite for HDTV. I am hesitant going with Charter HD because of the bashing posts I have seen this month. It sounds like it will be a few months, if ever, till they work out the kinks. I know I am going to get the 2MB Charter pipeline, so it would be nice to have one bill. On the other hand, Satellite has their HD programming down and I am really interested in the DirecTV HD DVR 921.

If anyone has any opinions, that would be helpful.

Thanks

timw_stl:

As one of the main Charter-bashers (my wife considers it to be a hobby of mine), I can honestly say that the Pipeline service that they provide to me is outstanding. It is the lowest tier (pay $29.99), and I would not give it up.

My main problem with them is in regards to the cable television service. I feel that they are overpriced in comparison to satellite. In addition, their pricing changes quarterly. You never know what you are paying in comparison to your neighbor with the same service. You don't have this problem with D* or E*.

In regards to HD, I feel that they are really slow in comparison to satellite. For example, they have had the rights to ESPN-HD for over a month. They turned the station on in other markets, just not here. Why? Last week was probably the best week for ESPN-HD basketball, and they didn't allow us to have access to the channel. In addition, why no Discovery-HD? Other Charter markets have it. Also, they still haven't come to an agreement with KDNL-ABC 30 to carry their DT station. I understand that KDNL probably wants the moon, but Charter really needs them added to their line-up. In addition, I wish they had INHD also (unfortunately, it is owned by Comcast, a rival cable company.)

Originally posted by rbkb

You never know what you are paying in comparison to your neighbor with the same service. You don't have this problem with D* or E*.

I have read about Cable prices fluctuating...that sucks.

Originally posted by rbkb

Also, they still haven't come to an agreement with KDNL-ABC 30 to carry their DT station. I understand that KDNL probably wants the moon, but Charter really needs them added to their line-up. In addition, I wish they had INHD also (unfortunately, it is owned by Comcast, a rival cable company.)
I have just started to understand HDTV, so please bear with me when I ask:
Dose Satellite carry the HD signal for KDNL-ABC 30 and other local channels?

Originally posted by timw_stl
I have read about Cable prices fluctuating...that sucks.


I have just started to understand HDTV, so please bear with me when I ask:
Dose Satellite carry the HD signal for KDNL-ABC 30 and other local channels?

No. The only thing you'll find from the big four networks in HD is CBS from New York and LA for people who live in areas where they can't get HD. Local HD from satelite is probably many years away due to the tons of bandwidth needed.

Originally posted by timw_stl
[B
On the other hand, Satellite has their HD programming down and I am really interested in the DirecTV HD DVR 921.

[/B]

Tim, the DVR921 is Dish network's unit. DirecTV is coming out with the HD Tivo. Charter is reportedly coming out with an HD PVR as well, which had some discussion I believe in the Feb. thread.

I am moving to a new home in Dardenne Prairie in a few months and will be facing a similar situation regarding whether to stay with DirecTV and buy the HD Tivo, or see if Charter has 1) ABC HD, 2) the PVR, and 3) their act together by then.

Mike

One thing for sure about digital television and HD, it's creating opportunities for new players with new ideas to enter the market.

This is definitely one oddball approach...

______________________________

SALT LAKE CITY (AP) -- A Utah company launched what it called a digital cable-style subscription television service "for the rest of us" on Tuesday, an alternative that eliminates the coaxial cable and strips basic service to a few essential networks with a price to match.

For $19.95, USDTV, based in Draper, gives subscribers in Salt Lake City 26 channels, including local broadcast outlets. ESPN, ESPN2, Fox News Channel, Disney and Discovery Channel are five of the 10 cable networks included in the package.

The service is also available in Albuquerque and is expected to launch in Las Vegas in the next month, and the company hopes to offer service to 30 markets by year's end. About 1,000 customers have signed up in Salt Lake.

USDTV works by collecting feeds from the broadcast stations and cable networks at a single digital transmission tower, which then uses once-idle bandwidth -- bought from the stations -- to spray the signals to standard UHF/VHF antennas. Customers must buy a $99.95 set-top device to decode the channels. USDTV promises digital-quality picture and high-definition reception for HDTV programming.

Full story: http://tv.ksl.com/index.php?nid=5&sid=81371

______________________________

I get everything (except on demand) and pay around 130 a month and today I have charter HD-ESPN......

I also now have OTA CBS HD which on my system is better than Charter. The problem is me. I haven't quite figured out how to make this Holo3d II Aux do a good job of transcoding. Need to spend some more time on it.

Walt

Originally posted by rbkb
Does anyone know if KMOV will be showing the HD game on the DT station, even if it is not the same game that is on the KMOV 4 SD station? In other cities that I have been in, I know that they sometimes put two different games on, always having an HD feed on the DT station. Any information is appreciated.

There is a thread on this topic under HDTV programming, but no one from STL has chimed in. Thanks.

Not sure if this question has been answered yet, but it looks like the HD games will indeed be carried on KMOV's digital station. Great news in my book. Now if we could just get them to multicast all of the out of market games, as is being done in a few other cities, we'd be in basketball heaven!

From the web site, http://www.kmov.com/sports/topstories/stories/kmov_sports_040315_ncaaonkmov.8b6c5421.html

"Friday, March 19
11:25 a.m. Illinois vs Murray State
1:50 p.m. Oklahoma State vs Washington
6:10 p.m. Kentucky vs Lehigh/Florida A&M
8:45 p.m. Kansas vs Illinois Chicago

Friday March 19 (games in high definition)
11:30 a.m. Memphis vs South Carolina
1:50 p.m. Oklahoma State vs Washington (also on analog Channel 4)
6:25 p.m. Providence vs Pacific
8:45 p.m. Kansas vs Illinois Chicago (also on analog Channel 4)


All games from Kansas City on Friday March 19 and Sunday, March 21 will be broadcast in high definition (HD). KMOV-TV will carry all available games broadcast by CBS in HD on Channel 56. "

Originally posted by timw_stl
I have read about Cable prices fluctuating...that sucks.


I have just started to understand HDTV, so please bear with me when I ask:
Dose Satellite carry the HD signal for KDNL-ABC 30 and other local channels?

Too add on to Dave's comment, satellite does not "carry" local HD signals. However, the D* and E* set-top boxes/receivers do allow you to pick up local DT stations OTA with an antenna, and most will integrate the OTA DT channel into the channel guide. Charter's box doesn't have this capability.

Have tried to watch tonight's Mizzou game on the ESPN HD channel. I am getting a lot of video breakup and audio drop outs every few seconds. Almost unwatchable. Called Charter and was told that they have had no complaints. Is anyone else having problems with this channel? All the rest of the HD channels are OK. They set me up with 3-30-04 service call. The tried to resend the signal but it didn't help.

No problems here with ESPN-HD, except for the stretching everyone complains about...still though, finally, ESPN-HD!

I can't get 773 ESPN-HD on my box. Gives me the ordering info message.

I don't have the HDNet $3.99 package anymore, but still have the HD locals and HBO-HD and SHO-HD.

Anyone else in the same boat as me?

Does anyone here have Charter Pipeline without Charter Cable? If so, were you able to get it without having to pay for Basic service? If not, what's your total bill/speed?

I had thought about going to Charter once they came out with their HD DVR, but after seeing current prices, and assuming they will charge another 5-10 dollars for the DVR I' not sure I still want to.

To duplicate the service I have now (Dish Network top 150 + SuperStations/locals + 2 Dishplayer 7200 (40GB HD Upgrade) @ 45.00 & SBC DSL @ 29.95)) I would pay about $5 more, but less channels and no PVR/DVR.

My DSL contract is up soon and it will go to $39.00, so I'm going to move my internet access over to Charter, but since I'm keeping Dish, I'd rather not pay for Basic Cable.

Dave

Originally posted by jdiehl
I can't get 773 ESPN-HD on my box. Gives me the ordering info message.

I don't have the HDNet $3.99 package anymore, but still have the HD locals and HBO-HD and SHO-HD.

Anyone else in the same boat as me?

I was in the same boat, but as soon as I saw the ordering message, I went ahead and called Charter and ordered the "HD Tier" for $3.99/month which includes the two HDNet channels and now ESPN-HD. When I initally got Charter-HD, I didn't want to pay $48 per year for HDNet, but I'm willing to pay that for ESPN-HD.

Originally posted by StLouG
Have tried to watch tonight's Mizzou game on the ESPN HD channel. I am getting a lot of video breakup and audio drop outs every few seconds. Almost unwatchable. Called Charter and was told that they have had no complaints. Is anyone else having problems with this channel?

I had no problems at all (besides the annoying stretch mode)

whats up with the stretch mode? Will this be fixed at some point?


Also, a question on the upcoming DVR for Charter - this box has dual tuners, right? If so, can I configure this somehow to be able to use the Picture-in-Picture that my television has?

Nope, it will always be stretched unless there is actually HD content...Once their digital studio is done it will be probably be better. They are supposed to do Sports Center in HD once the studio is complete.

Originally posted by duihlein
Does anyone here have Charter Pipeline without Charter Cable? If so, were you able to get it without having to pay for Basic service? If not, what's your total bill/speed?

I had thought about going to Charter once they came out with their HD DVR, but after seeing current prices, and assuming they will charge another 5-10 dollars for the DVR I' not sure I still want to.

To duplicate the service I have now (Dish Network top 150 + SuperStations/locals + 2 Dishplayer 7200 (40GB HD Upgrade) @ 45.00 & SBC DSL @ 29.95)) I would pay about $5 more, but less channels and no PVR/DVR.

My DSL contract is up soon and it will go to $39.00, so I'm going to move my internet access over to Charter, but since I'm keeping Dish, I'd rather not pay for Basic Cable.

Dave

According to previous threads, the FCC made Charter split out their Pipeline and cable service. In the old days, you had to have basic cable in order to have Pipeline, but no more! I have a family member that has Pipeline only with NO BASIC CABLE. Of course, when you call customer service, you may get another answer.

In the old days, you had to have basic cable in order to have Pipeline, but no more!

A few years back, I heard that if you had a cable modem you could get the basic cable without paying for it. I am sure by now they have fixed that glitch.

A quick question for everyone. How is your HD-CBS quality on Charter? I have not been able to sit down at night and watch anything on HD-CBS without at least a few audio drop outs and an occational picture pixilation. I don't have this problem on HD-NBC. I am trying to determine if it is me, Charter or CBS. Last night I had to switch over to regular CBS (yuck!) just to watch TV.

Scroft,

There's been on-and-off discussion on KMOV picture quality, both Charter and OTA, throughout this month's thread.

Short story is that there are some periodic issues OTA, but it SEEMS (not confirmed in side-by-side tests) like there are other, bigger issues that are specific to Charter.

For the long story, scroll back and read the previous posts.

BTW, I thought the best part of the premiere of the new CBS show, Century City, was the PIXELLATION and DROPOUTS.

Talk about wasted photons...

Originally posted by rbkb
According to previous threads, the FCC made Charter split out their Pipeline and cable service. In the old days, you had to have basic cable in order to have Pipeline, but no more! I have a family member that has Pipeline only with NO BASIC CABLE. Of course, when you call customer service, you may get another answer.

I have it and pay only the 29.99 fee. They used to charge $8-$10/mo, but no more.

Chris

I subscribe to Charter HDTV. My HDTV channels, including, Channel 4, are clear/pristine, with no problems whatsoever. Much better than OTA.

oby,

It's highly unlikely that your KMOV feed is better than OTA, as the source for the Charter local digitals is the OTA signal.

Doug,

It depends on where Charter gets the feed. OTA (ok, then how far away) or via fiber feed to their plant.

I've only had occasional dropouts with KMOV. Maybe 2-3 per an hour of viewing. This is OTA with the Dish 811 and 6000.

More aggravating to me is the loss of audio synch when switching between local and network feeds.

Cheers,

John,

According the lastest info I've seen, Charter is getting the locals via OTA and no fiber feeds have been implemented. Agree that there could be localized issues with receipt via OTA and that this might account for different levels of dropouts, but overall picture quality, absent dropouts, should be virtually identical at the point of receipt.

Of course, it's possible that Charter's acquisition method has changed in recent months, but based on the slap-dash approach that Charter has taken in putting together its HDTV package, I'm more than somewhat doubtful that's occurred. If someone has more recent information about how Charter is acquiring digital locals, please correct me.

My own OTA receipt of KMOV-DT sounds very similar to your own. I haven't noticed the audio synch issue, but then I normally mute the commercials or surf away during breaks. And I very rarely watch the local SD programming, the only exceptions in recent months being the occasional college basketball game.

Doug,

I've sent an e-mail off to Walt about it. I also praised them for going back to the 2.0 flag on the audio stream :)

Edit

I changed over the 861 to indicate that the Sat was a poor quality digital source and I'll see if I have the lock being lost issue in the next couple of days.

Cheers,

Doug/John:

So, if I understand what the two of your are saying, Charter is just sending an OTA signal through the coax cable, and are not getting a satellite feed for the DT Channels. How do they do it for the analog stations, OTA or some sort of fiver feed?

rbkb,

I'm not sure how Charter acquires the analog stations, but it's most likely a leased line circuit.

I think one of the primary issues that discourages Charter or other cable companies from picking up digital feeds via a leased line is that the bandwidth for the digital feeds is much higher, which translates to a significantly more expensive circuit.

As Charter attracts more paying digital/HD subscribers and as bandwidth costs drop over time, I'd expect that they'd eventually move to a dedicated line for each of the local digital feeds.

Originally posted by Scroft391
A quick question for everyone. How is your HD-CBS quality on Charter? I have not been able to sit down at night and watch anything on HD-CBS without at least a few audio drop outs and an occational picture pixilation. I don't have this problem on HD-NBC. I am trying to determine if it is me, Charter or CBS. Last night I had to switch over to regular CBS (yuck!) just to watch TV.

I'm having the same problem and don't think it's you. The problem is either KMOV or Charter. My guess is that it's charter. I had placed a service call and then canceled the call after finding this thread. I did try to make them aware of the problem and suggested they watch this forum.

The following is a press release from FOX Sports:

FOX Sports, an innovative leader in sports broadcasting, began its evolution to the digital age in January 2002 when the network televised Super Bowl XXXVI in enhanced-definition dubbed FOX WIDESCREEN™. Later this year, FOX’ sports division continues it’s on-screen evolution when it surges ahead to full-fledged high-definition.

Beginning in the third quarter of 2004, FOX Sports will present much of its exclusive live event programming in 720p high-definition, it was announced today by David Hill, Chairman, FOX Sports Television Group. A complete schedule of events which FOX Sports will televise in high definition will be announced shortly once all necessary equipment procurement is finalized.

“Given the high-profile events that FOX Sports broadcasts later this year and beyond, the timing is perfect for us to begin our transition to the gold standard of high-definition television,” said Hill. “We were very pleased with FOX WIDESCREEN™, but after extensive research and testing, it became clear that we wanted our viewers to have access to the sharpest sports images in the world, and without question, the 720p format produces those images.”

Between July 2004 and February 2005, FOX Sports televises many of America’s premier sports events, including NASCAR’s Pepsi 400 from Daytona International Speedway, MLB’s 75th Anniversary All-Star Game from Houston, playoffs and World Series; regular- and post-season NFL coverage including Super Bowl XXXIX from Jacksonville, and the Daytona 500.

The 720p (progressive) format takes 60 razor sharp, complete pictures per-second while 1080i (interlaced) takes 60 half pictures per-second. While 1080i has more lines of resolution when portraying still images, in FOX’ view, 720p provides greater picture quality for sports because it takes more pictures per second, and has more lines of resolution when portraying moving images.

“The common misperception in our industry is that 1080i is the better high definition system because it provides more lines or resolution,” added Hill. “However, I am truly convinced that 720p is the far superior format and our viewers are going to love all three of our sports and their signature events broadcast in this system.”

In just ten years of existence, FOX Sports has earned 57 Emmy Awards for excellence in the presentation of the biggest sporting events on television, more than any other network during the same stretch of time. FOX Sports is the exclusive network broadcast rights holder for Major League Baseball, the exclusive network broadcaster of NFC regular-season National Football League games and a rights holder of NASCAR NEXTEL Cup racing. David Hill and Ed Goren are the Executive Producers of FOX Sports.

I think the most interesting thing about the FOX announcement is their in-your-face endorsement of 720p.

Whether you care about the 720p v 1080i debate or not, it's good to see a broadcaster taking an assertive position on HDTV.

FOX Attitude, I suppose.

Tonight's KMOV feed on Charter channel 784 is terrible. I just watched the new show "The Stones", and after audio drop-outs every 30 seconds, and bad pixelation, I turned the channel. This was the worst that I ever saw. I still don't have any problems on KSDK or KTVI DT stations.

Originally posted by DroptheRemote
oby,

It's highly unlikely that your KMOV feed is better than OTA, as the source for the Charter local digitals is the OTA signal.

The charter HD quality is better than my OTA as well. If charter is getting their feed from the same signal as I am, then it could be the quality of the signal I am getting from my attic antenna to the mits OTA reciever that is built in.

Scott

marlowsa & oby,

It's quite possible that I am wrong and that Charter is now acquiring the signal from KMOV as a direct feed and that might explain the difference you're both citing. Maybe someone who knows for sure will jump in and clarify.

In the meantime, I'm curious about HOW the Charter signal is better -- is OTA softer, dimmer, out of focus, odd colors, tint in dark picture areas, etc? Be as specific as you can be.

Originally posted by MSloss

I am moving to a new home in Dardenne Prairie in a few months and will be facing a similar situation regarding whether to stay with DirecTV and buy the HD Tivo, or see if Charter has 1) ABC HD, 2) the PVR, and 3) their act together by then.

Mike

Mike,

Welcome to Dardenne Prairie. You will love the politics. Don't let Charter charge you the O'fallon taxes if you order their phone service.

My Panasonic HDTV lamp ballast went bad last night. I never knew how addicted I was to HD until today. I have to wait until Friday for parts. I have withdrawal symptoms.

Are any of the NCAA Tourney games today in HD?

And on that note...is there some internet source that I can check daily to see what is HD and what is SD?

Thanks

Originally posted by DroptheRemote
I think the most interesting thing about the FOX announcement is their in-your-face endorsement of 720p.

Whether you care about the 720p v 1080i debate or not, it's good to see a broadcaster taking an assertive position on HDTV.

FOX Attitude, I suppose.
I knew Fox would do something like that.

Hopefully since the Rams went 12-4 this last season we'll be back towards the top of the pile on Fox NFL games. CBS seemed to use HDTV for the "big" games that go almost national played at 3pm. Last season the St. Louis Rams played a lot of noon game but maybe we'll get more 3pm games this year. If that's true we''ll get more Rams games in HD other than night games on ESPN/ABC.

Slightly off-topic: supposedly the NFL and the networks are talking about moving start times in 2006 from noon/3pm central time to 1pm/4pm.

Who is doing all the out-of-market? Seems unlikely considering CBS probably makes a ton from selling the NCAA satellite package. I don't see how they would have enough bandwidth to carry all of them during HD coverage either.

BTW, this thread is nuts if you skip a week or two. And still no VOOM users?

Originally posted by esterman
Not sure if this question has been answered yet, but it looks like the HD games will indeed be carried on KMOV's digital station. Great news in my book. Now if we could just get them to multicast all of the out of market games, as is being done in a few other cities, we'd be in basketball heaven!

March Madness will be even more thrilling with the announcement that CBS Sports will be providing both the Midwest Regionals and the Final Four in High Definition television.

CBS will limit its regional HD coverage to the venue in St. Louis due to the logistics of sending HD equipment and crews—it’s easier to get from the middle of the country to the destination of the Final Four in San Antonio, TX.

HD coverage from St. Louis and San Antonio will be confined to the games themselves as the network’s pre-game coverage will be produced in standard definition.

This info taken from TitanTV: http://www.titantv.com/ttv/commandCenter/HDAlerts.aspx?HDAID=225

Fox 720p is good news for me. The best pictures I get for football is on Monday night.

I can't wait for it to start. Up to 5 NFL games a week in HD.

Walt

ESPN HD on Charter finally showed something in HD last night--the pro basketball game. It looked very good. I never watch pro basketball, but I watched this game as it was in HD.

I have to add to the frustration that others have posted about CBS-HD on Charter. I generally don't watch a lot of CBS, except sports, but I have noticed the freezes and hiccups.

For example, I am attempting to watch the NCAA game on CBS-HD right now. I realize the game is being shown in SD, but channel 784 will show the game a little more clearly than channel 04 will. I swear that there are glitches almost constantly. You can really put your finger on it when they scroll text across the page: that text is CONSTANTLY screwing up, hiccupping, etc.

I, like almost everyone else who has mentioned this issue ONLY have this problem with CBS-HD, not with any other HD channel. Honestly, we have had CBS in HD since Super Bowl Sunday. The limited amount of shows that I have watched on that channel, from the Super Bowl on, have all shown these issues. So much so, that generally [like today] I just change the channel.

Bottom line is that it is great that we have every HD channel that Charter offers, but if it is unwatchable its almost like not having the channel at all. I don't know who is to blame, but it needs to be fixed.

Just my 2 cents...



Bruce

Originally posted by abcward

Bottom line is that it is great that we have every HD channel that Charter offers, but if it is unwatchable its almost like not having the channel at all. I don't know who is to blame, but it needs to be fixed.


I'm having the same issues with Charter, so I just switched to my OTA antenna and the picture/sound are fine.

Originally posted by jdiehl
I'm having the same issues with Charter, so I just switched to my OTA antenna and the picture/sound are fine.

And you know if we call up and complain about it, a CSR will just send a tech out to replace our Motorola box....and we all realize that won't resolve the issue.

EDIT: I sent an email to WNichol@kmov.com - Maybe KMOV will get involved, but doubtful since the issue seems to be on Charter's end.

Is it time to do my daily anti-Charter ranting???;)

I was really looking forward to watching tomorrow's games in HD, as long as it isn't painful. As I mentioned last night, I had to finally agree with my wife, and turn off the KMOV-DT channel and watch KMOV 4. Nothing upsets me more than knowing there is good HD on, and I can't get it clearly, all because of my cable company!

I have some friends in Indianapolis that are getting all the games via Comcast cable through their multi-casting option. Apparently, the CBS affiliate has allowed Comcast to put their multi-signal on channels 801-803. My buddies apparently have the Motorola box just like us. I wonder if KMOV/Charter is doing this, and I just can't find it.

Could someone more technically proficient then me explain why Charter would be having problems with only one HD channel and not all of them? I know next to nothing about the process, but it seems to me that Charter's process should be the same for KSDK-DT and KMOV-DT, yet KSDK-DT works pretty much flawlessly and KMOV-DT has well documented issues on Charter. Does this make sense to anyone?

Cancel your Charter HD subscription.

I know there is a growing number of newcomers here each month. Lots of people are buying HDTVs and as a result there's more and more interest in HD programming. Charter would seem to be a logical choice for HD programming, but what seems logical sometimes turns out to be anything but the correct decision.

If you think things with Charter are going to get better, I'd suggest that you track down the St. Louis threads for February, January, December, etc. and read them and see for yourself that there's been little improvement. Charter clearly isn't serious about providing a complete and quality HD service.

The only conclusion I can draw from what I've seen so far is that Charter doesn't care about HD customers.

If you don't have the option of cancelling, at the very least you should take a proactive position with Charter and insist that they credit your HD service each month until you are satisfied. Make the call, be firm and polite and get your credit -- and make sure you're credited for both programming and hardware rental.

In the end, I really don't believe that Charter is going to change, absent a serious customer exodus or a growing tally of service credits. The precedent for Charter's indifference should be clear to anyone who has been observing the leadup and rollout of their HD service in St. Louis. If unhappy subscribers allow Charter get by on their past performance, there's little chance they are going to recognize a need for change.

Vote with your pocketbook. Vote with your feet. Make Charter feel your pain.

Or prepare yourself for more of the same.

playing devil's advocate:

I have been one of the Charter Bashers and still do bash whenever I see something wrong, however Charter does get a couple kudos too:

1) Getting the local channels in HD without messing with OTAs - I read a ton of messages here about people having issues locking in with this/that antenna. Not having to mess with that is a bonus.

2) I know pricing is very similar for Charter/Dish/DirecTV, but each time in the last year that i have thought about switching and did a price comparison, Dish was always more costly for what I currently have.

3) Cable internet is so nice....speeds are awfully fast. I wouldnt want to mess with that by changing and losing any 'pricing deals'.

4) Honestly if my wife wouldnt have resisted multiple times lately, I would already be back on Dish. But lets face it, switching is a hassle. We have an HD box on one tv, a normal digital box on another and two other TV's have standard cable. No extra $5 fees per tv/box like Dish.

5) to quote my wife: The Dreaded Rainouts - when it rains or gets icy, dish reception gets terrible [or at least it did when I had Dish before 2003]. Cable has no such issues.

I think you are right Doug, but I did want to be fair and point out the few advantages that Charter does offer.

abc,

1) There may be some hassle factor with OTA antennas, but in most cases you are going to get all the channels available and you're not paying anything beyond the antenna and hardware. I agree that the promise of locals via Charter is appealing, but to this point it's no more than an empty promise.

2) It isn't just a matter of price. If you don't get what you paid for, a low price is a mirage. It comes down to value, and I think the Charter value proposition is poor, though there is huge potential if they take the time and make the effort to get the service right.

3) I am also a Pipeline customer. Hard to disagree on this one, but I really do see a clear line of demarcation between Internet access and cable TV/HD service, especially now that Charter isn't allowed to insist on a monthly cable TV package as part of the Pipeline service. Apples and oranges here.

4) I appreciate the WAF -- in my calibration business my most lethal competition is the spouse, not the other calibrators in the area. I've lost business to bathroom renovations, new kitchens, cruises and overseas visits to the in-laws, so I know the reality of that potential obstacle. Still, there are a lot of ways to diminish the cost of switching, with the purchase of used equipment on eBay just one of the options.

5) How is rain fade different from what's happening with KMOV in recent days? At least satellite's problems are a result of "Mother Nature" not man-made incompetence. While I'll concede that rain fade is a more intractable problem, this point is no better than a "push" until Charter shows itself capable of managing the local feeds professionally.

Yes, I do appreciate that Charter is the only solution for many subscribers. That's why I think it's critical that you put their feet to the fire until they fully deliver what you're paying for.

Until then, you should demand your service and hardware credits.

I agree with Doug. Why am I paying Charter for something that is almost unwatchable. ESPN and CBS HD both have audio dropouts and the PQ is at times like watching a old time movie. Stuttering and shaky. I have already called charter once, on Monday, but will call again and again.

Originally posted by DroptheRemote
Cancel your Charter HD subscription.



I'm new to their service and to HDTV for 2 weeks now. I have issues with their service already. I've had Charter for several years now and got Pipeline as soon as it became available. In December I changed from Pipeline to DSL as it was less costly and once your above 1M it is a moot point as to speed for most users. I'm using Charter HD for the testing ground. I'm pleased with the HD broadcasts in general but KMOV through Charter sucks. ESPN looks strange but thats just ESPN, right? I'd like to avoid dishes or antennas on my house but if Charter can't maintain a decent quality of service, their history. I used to subscribe to their analog service with extended basic only. The digital/HD is only costing me $10 bucks a month more and includes Showtime and HDNET movies. The cost is reasonable and I can easily move on if I outgrow them, quality sucks or they keep raising rates. It's their call.
To me, sat dishes are too ugly and uncooperative. I like the local stations and I don't want to hang a second device on my roof to receive them. (I just walked through the living room and my daughter is watching the KMOV analog feed because the HD feed is bad) If this keeps up Charter wont be providing my service long.

dont get me wrong guys...i do agree that some of the subpar product that Charter is providing us is insulting....

I just wanted to [for once] be fair to Charter and point out a couple Pro's since I almost always provide Con's....

Thanks Doug!!

Originally posted by abcward
And you know if we call up and complain about it, a CSR will just send a tech out to replace our Motorola box....and we all realize that won't resolve the issue.

EDIT: I sent an email to WNichol@kmov.com - Maybe KMOV will get involved, but doubtful since the issue seems to be on Charter's end.

Who is WNichol@kmov

abc,

There's no mistaking that I'm a long-time Charter basher. But like you, I do try to see both sides of the picture.

Although it might be difficult to detect, I want Charter's HD service to succeed, because cable is an important element in getting more HD programming and creating more competition for satellite. If cable overall doesn't provide more competition for satellite, DISH and DirecTV will take their time in expanding their HD packages. Likewise, if cable systems aren't carrying the majority of the channels already available (see Discovery, INHD, etc), why should other programmers develop HD services if they aren't going to be seen by anyone?

That's right, I'm greedy.

In addition, a quality Charter HD cable product would benefit my business directly, because there would be more HDTV owners and more potential customers looking to get the best from their sets by having them calibrated.

Yep, greedy again.

I think that a lot of you might laugh out loud when you read this, but if Charter provided a truly quality, reliable HD service, I'd happily recant my negative statements in the past and even recommend it to my own customers who ask for advice on HD programming options.

But Charter needs to earn that business, not get it because they have a cable franchise monopoly and can get away with a half-baked effort.

That might have worked 10 years ago, but no more...

Originally posted by ferl
Who is WNichol@kmov

On the first page of every month's thread, Doug lists contacts for every station - that was the email for KMOV.

ferl,

Just wanted to welcome you here and say that you're correct about ESPN-HD. They stretch their 4x3 standard-definition programming whenever there's no native HD programming available. It's ugly, but could be worse (14x9 zoom and crop).

ESPN is currently building a new HD-ready production facility that is scheduled to be ready in early April. Once that's up and running, portions of SportsCenter will be in HD and then there will be more and more HD highlights as time passes. Likewise, there will be a transition to some of the other ESPN studio shows being produced in HD. None of this will happen overnight, but once the new facility is up and running, that process will begin and there will be more and more live and studio stuff from ESPN in HD.

There's more info about this over at the HD Programming forum here at AVS:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=370506

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=380335

Didn't mean to "officially" start a Charter-bashing run...

Unfortunately, the only reason I haven't switched to D* is because I'm lazy...and I have 7 televisions that my wife would want hooked-up. I guess I could go with just basic cable on 3 of the ones I don't watch often...

Doug, what kind of calibrations do you do?

I started a thread on the HDTV PROGRAMMING section, and now I am more upset with Charter. It seems as if Comcast is multicasting the games in their cities...are we getting screwed again, or am just a moron and can't find the multicast on my cable box???

Or another scenario, is KMOV behind the curve with not being able to multicast??? I have a sixth sense that automatically makes me blame Charter....

rbkb,

FWIW, apart from the need for seven satellite receivers, it is now possible to run more than four receivers off a single dish. That didn't used to be the case, with four receivers being the upper limit in the past. I'm set up for five DirecTV receivers, though I'm only making use of four at the moment. I could expand up to eight.

On the multicasting, I've never seen KMOV do any multicasting, so I don't know if they have that capability or not. In any event, cable companies in general have so far been resisting carrying anything other than the primary OTA digital channel. It's been suggested, but not confirmed, that the negotiations between Charter and KDNL are hung up over that very issue, and I have read that ABC is looking to exploit multi-casting potential as part of their digital strategy.

From what you're saying about Comcast, it sounds like they are open to carrying multiple program streams from local stations.

As for calibrations, I do video calibrations on all types of displays including CRTs, LCDs, plasmas, DLPs for direct-view, as well as rear- and front-projection systems. I'm ISF trained and have also taken specialist courses in CRT front-projection setup. I also do system setup and basic audio setups, but video calibrations is my primary focus.

Send me a private message if you'd like to know more.

Originally posted by GlendaleHDTV
Could someone more technically proficient then me explain why Charter would be having problems with only one HD channel and not all of them? I know next to nothing about the process, but it seems to me that Charter's process should be the same for KSDK-DT and KMOV-DT, yet KSDK-DT works pretty much flawlessly and KMOV-DT has well documented issues on Charter. Does this make sense to anyone?

Maybe Charter needs to adjust the OTA antenna they're using to rebroadcast the KMOV-DT signal :D

Well I just ordered Charter Pipeline to replace my DSL and contemplated dumping Dish to go to Charter once they come out with their HD PVR (or any PVR for that matter), but after comparing prices/service I'm going ot stick with Dish.

Now I'm trying to decide between a PVR721 and a DVR522 to go with my future DVR921 (word is there will be price drops soon)

I use a HiPix to record OTA HD and have no problems with any station except WRBU (no loss) and I don't need ESPN HD till the NFL starts up again.

As for Doug, I can vouch for the quality of his work. He calibrated the Component Inputs on my Hitachi 53UWX10B and I am very pleased with the results. Even my wife notcied a considerable improvement.

And now that I've got my Yamaha RXV-2400 my SVHS signals going through the component input look fantastic without any color tweaking!!!

Dave

The following news short is from SkyREPORT.

I'm posting this because it's likely that some HD owners may expect that KMOV will show all of the HD games available Friday on KMOV-DT, regardless of what they show to analog viewers.

I think the only way we'll get the HD games (all those played today and Sunday in Kansas City) is if the HD games are also selected by KMOV for local analog broadcast. I might be wrong (and I'd be happy if that were the case), but I'd be surprised as this would effectively discourage any local HD viewers from buying the DirecTV March Madness package.

Based on the NCAA game listings for KMOV in my morning paper, the only HD we'll be seeing today will be the late game (tentatively scheduled for 8:55 p.m.) with Kansas playing Illinois-Chicago Circle.

I think next weekend will be better as all the regional games played in St. Louis will all be produced in HD, but again it will probably depend on KMOV showing those games to analog viewers.

_____________________________________

PROGRAMMING: DirecTV Has HD March Madness

DirecTV said it will offer select NCAA Division I Men's Basketball Championship games in high-def through its exclusive Mega March Madness subscription package. The coverage begins today. DirecTV said it will broadcast up to eight CBS-produced and regionally shown tournament broadcasts in HD, originating from Kansas City, Mo., (March 19 and March 21) and St. Louis (March 26).
_____________________________________

Dave,

I just wanted to say thanks for the online endorsement of my calibration work.

And nothing makes me happier than knowing that my work gets the spouse seal of approval (or even acceptance). :D

Thanks again.

Originally posted by DroptheRemote
I'm posting this because it's likely that some HD owners may expect that KMOV will show all of the HD games available Friday on KMOV-DT, regardless of what they show to analog viewers.

I'm expecting that today, as I've seen them do this in the past (show something different on the digital channel vs analog).

Jon,

I hope you're right...

Is everyone else watching 784 having audio sync issues? It's been doing that for me for a day now.

I turned on the audio from my OTA receiver and it matched up with the video from 784, but the audio from 784 is behind. Almost as if the audio from 784 is the analog feed or something.

Going to try and reboot my Motorola box, otherwise I'll watch today OTA.

Has something changed today on CBS-HD on Charter? I turned it on to watch the NCAA games and the first thing I noticed is that the advertisements are not stretched anymore....appears to be 14 x 9 now.

Also, picture looks better and [so far] there has been no hiccups or issues....

EDIT - strike that, hiccups and pauses are back as normal...almost one per second. However the game is not stretched for some reason.

EDIT #2 - CBS has switched to the Memphis/S.Carolina game in Kansas City. This game is in true HDTV... looks nice too.

Jon was right.

Great stuff...

I didn't take the day off, but maybe because even the SD stuff is originating from the HD feed? So they don't get a chance to stretch it.

Originally posted by abcward
Has something changed today on CBS-HD on Charter? I turned it on to watch the NCAA games and the first thing I noticed is that the advertisements are not stretched anymore....appears to be 14 x 9 now.

Also, picture looks better and [so far] there has been no hiccups or issues....

EDIT - strike that, hiccups and pauses are back as normal...almost one per second. However the game is not stretched for some reason.

EDIT #2 - CBS has switched to the Memphis/S.Carolina game in Kansas City. This game is in true HDTV... looks nice too.

Well, fellow Charter subscribers who are lucky enough to be at home...

How does the KMOV-DT signal look/sound? Are there the standard audio breakups/pixelation issues with this signal? Am I going to be upset when I get home with CBS HD basketball?

I got another response from Charter claiming that my audio/pixelation issues with Channel 784 have to be related to my television and set-up/connections, and there definitely wasn't a problem on their end. I told them I had a tough time believing this considering KSDK, HBO, and HDNet were fine....only KMOV-DT was bad!!!

Originally posted by rbkb
I got another response from Charter claiming that my audio/pixelation issues with Channel 784 have to be related to my television and set-up/connections, and there definitely wasn't a problem on their end. I told them I had a tough time believing this considering KSDK, HBO, and HDNet were fine....only KMOV-DT was bad!!!

And maybe the fact that EVERYONE on this thread who has Charter complains about the same issue....

Today I sent the following email to KMOV:

"Why is CBS HD having audio drop outs and a shaky jerky picture? Your SD channel does not have this problem. I have looked forwarded all year to watching the basketball tournament in HD and now this. Maybe your company needs to get with Charter and see who is to blame for this situation. The AVS forum that I belong to all say the same thing about Charter and your CBS HD channel. A lot of unhappy people out here."


A few minutes later I got the following response:

"I am sorry you are having problems with our HD feed. I called Charter, they are having reception problems. I am working with their engineers to clear up the problems."

Then I got this:

"Charter says they may have found the problem. Could you let me know if our picture has stabilized? I unfortunately can't see KMOV's HD feed from Charter."

I have been watching for about 15 minutes now and everything is great. Is it just wishful thinking or has anyone else notice an improvement?

No trouble here, but I wait to pass judgement when the CBS basketball feed comes on. If it is fixed, I'm glad to see that KMOV gets better results out of Charter that I, or should I say, we do!!!

Well, if the e-mail generated the fix, that is at least two things KMOV-HD has fixed (one way or the other) at least partially because of feedback from this group. Pretty cool.

Originally posted by rbkb

I got another response from Charter claiming that my audio/pixelation issues with Channel 784 have to be related to my television and set-up/connections, and there definitely wasn't a problem on their end. I told them I had a tough time believing this considering KSDK, HBO, and HDNet were fine....only KMOV-DT was bad!!!

Which is exactly why I won't touch cable with a ten foot pole! I once had to file a complaint against TCI with the City of St. Louis due to their incompetence and refusal to provide any reasonable level of service. They always took the route of blaiming my equipment. The city made them rewire the building and solve other problems, like replacing water logged equipment, and I ended up getting money refunded.

It's the same crap I heard from cable companies over and over until I switched to D* 6 years ago. I've had no problems with satellite service.

I knew this was coming when everyone started getting excited about Charter HD. My response was "yeah, right, we'll see." I wasn't about to change from D* for that.

Dean

You guys fixed KMOV HD on Charter? It has been bad since the Super Bowl. I wish I could check it out but my Panasonic TV has been dead since Tuesday and I have been going through hell trying to get them to properly service it still under warranty.

Do rear projection LCD sets need calibration?

All sets purchased, except from a very few high end manufacturers, need some adjustments.
Dug

AAAHHHHH!!!!

The beauty of hi-def. Kudos to KMOV and whoever made the call to get Charter to fix the DT signal. NCAA basketball looked beautiful tonight, even though the games stunk!!! Once again, KUDOS!

HUGE kudos to StLouG for following through with KMOV/Charter. The Hi-Def hoops last night was outstanding!!!

Kudos to this ENTIRE St. Louis avsforum group - together we hold more power than each of us do individually.

I know for a fact that many of us have contacted KMOV lately under the guise of 'we at avsforum are seeing this issue'. I do believe that because KMOV was presented this issue by a large group of people they had no chance to ignore this issue.

Also, we need to give KMOV credit too. They could have easily just stated: "this is Charters problem" and went on about their day, but they did not. They were proactive in resolving this issue. I only wish that Charter had resolved this issue on their own and not waited until KMOV was on the phone. Like others have stated, this issue has been there since day 1 of the CBS-HD/Charter marriage.

Any other problems in the world that this St. Louis avsforum thread should look into? Why there is so much road construction in St. Louis? Why I cant get really good irish food in St. Louis? World Hunger??



Bruce

Kudos to KMOV.

Something else to Charter. How many of you contacted Charter and got the brush off, whereas KMOV was responsive?

Chris

Originally posted by abcward
Kudos to this ENTIRE St. Louis avsforum group - together we hold more power than each of us do individually.

Although I would love to take all the credit it really goes to the whole group. I am sure I am not the only one who sent a email to KMOV. So let's celebrate with glorious HD today and hope it lasts.

:)

A huge kudos should go Joe Miller Assistant Director of Engineering of KMOV. He is the person who responded to my email. You can reach him at jcmiller@kmov.com

red,

As Mr_Bester says, all television displays -- regardless of the underlying technology -- need to be calibrated if you want to see accurate images. As a general rule, calibrations address four areas of image quality.

* Focus -- This is a major element for rear- and front-projection CRTs, where fine focus of the electronic beam, lens focus and proper convergence of the three CRT images all contribute to image clarity and presentation of fine detail. Of course, optical focus is also an important element in LCD, LCOS and DLP projection sets.

* Light Levels -- A key issue in an accurate picture is setting up minimum and maximum light levels correctly. Getting black level (brightness) correct is critical in order to see all of the detail in dark picture areas and a key element in providing picture depth -- if black level is set too high, the picture will appear "flat" and washed out. Setting white level (contrast) correctly is important in ensuring the display is not "crushing" bright image areas or overdriving the electronics and risking premature failure of key components.

In effect, this element of calibration sets the floor and ceiling levels for light output. Another way to think about it is optimizing the dynamic range of the picture.

* Color -- There's really two areas here -- grayscale and chromatics.

Grayscale is important because black and white makes up the majority of detail in a color picture, and the only way an RGB device can present grayscale information is through the proper mix of red, green and blue light. CRT televisions have traditionally been set up at the factory to skew heavily toward blue, as this creates the illusion of a brighter picture, and this practice has carried over without change to newer technologies. This is done because most consumers place an inordinate value on brightness when deciding which television to purchase. If your grayscale is skewed toward blue (or red or green), the overall picture will carry evidence of that tint regardless of whether you're watching "Casablanca" or "Moulin Rouge." The goal in setting grayscale is that the foundation for your images is as neutral as possible from near black to peak white.

Setting the other element of color, chromatics, is a primarily a matter of ensuring the right balance between saturation (color control) and hue (tint). That's actually pretty straightforward and most home theater setup discs include a tutorial and filters that help the user to alter this balance. However, there's an added color issue arising from the skewed grayscales -- the color decoders in most televisions are tilted toward red to compensate for the bluish tint in the grayscale.

This is sometimes called "red push" and that's why flesh tones often appear "sunburned." The usual consumer fix for "red push" is to turn down the color control until actors look natural, but doing this also directly impacts blue and green levels, resulting in undersaturation of those colors. A calibration will routinely involve evaluating and usually reprogramming of the color decoder to restore proper color processing.

* Picture Detail -- At its simplest, this involves determining the correct level of the sharpness control, but can go much deeper depending on viewer preferences. In the early development of television, picture sharpness was much more difficult to achieve than through today's more advanced electronics and production systems. As a consequence, an entire range of other sharpness and detail processing tricks were developed by TV manufacturers to trick the eye into seeing a sharper picture. While these can sometimes still prove useful in dealing with the limitations of the overcompressed standard-definition channels from cable and satellite, they introduce distracting artifacts into DVD or HD images.

The goal to this aspect of a calibration is to remove undesirable edge enhancement processing and get back to a more natural, unprocessed "film-like" image.


To recap, displays of all types will benefit from calibration in each of these four areas. Some will matter more than others for the different technologies, but the underlying image quality issues are all the same.

One final thing to bear in mind when thinking about these new display technologies: Every single television standard in effect today was conceived with a CRT display in mind. As a result, all of these new types of displays need to be set up in a way that allows them to come as close as possible to a properly calibrated CRT image.

Doug, after reading your comments I'm guessing that my Toshiba 51 inch HDTV is in dire need of calibration. How much do you charge for this service?

FYI --

Though I'm not a Charter HD subscriber, I called yesterday and spoke first with a front-line CSR and then a supervisor. Interestingly, the CSR had a vague recollection of seeing something in writing about KMOV-DT problems and then spent 5 minutes unsuccesfully trying to locate it.

When I spoke with the supervisor (she called back an hour later -- it was around 3 p.m.), she had obviously researched the issue and let me know that they were working with KMOV on the problem.

I spent some time explaining to her that there many people online upset about the KMOV problem and that the CSRs were compounding the problem by saying everything was fine, or that the problem existed at the customer end and was only an isolated issue.

I also explained to her this forum and suggested that someone at Charter make a point of monitoring it for information about how they're doing in serving their highest-spending customers. She seemed interested but I'm skeptical that she'll actually followthrough. I got a strong sense that she was looking to get me off the line so that she could deal with the next fire raging on her desktop.

abc,

I don't want to hijack this thread completely, as I've probably overstepped a bit already. But I definitely want to answer your questions about calibration of your Toshiba HDTV.

Give me a call on either of the numbers below, or send me a private message with a number where you can be contacted and I'll call you.

Thanks for your interest.

Just found this thread, so I thought I would ask a few questions. I have been using an RCA DTC100 for 3 years for DirecTV and OTH. I also have a Charter Pipeline and basic cable, although not used for TV. Thought I would move to Charter HD, so I had the box installed - possibly to save a buck. I am not impressed. Forgetting the present fact that it has been showing "almost ready" for about 1 week (I know I should call), I find the Motorola box very inconvenient to use, especially in the guide area - when it did work. My OTH reception for local provides me more channels and a perceived better picture quality. I was also looking forward to a Firewire port, but my settop has only an unpopulated option plate. Anyone know if a different box is available in St. Louis?. Looks like mine has died, since the Pipeline works OK, so no time like the present to upgrade. I try to keep an open mind, especially now that Direct wants an additional 11 bucks for the "non-premium" HD. I sure wish Charter had their act together.

Ed Horton

ed,

It seems the place to start is the fact that you're paying for basic cable but not using it. According to other posts I've seen here this month, Charter is no longer allowed to require a basic cable TV package in order to get Pipeline. I haven't independently confirmed that, but no one here has suggested that's not currently the case.

Assuming that is true, you can cancel basic cable and take those savings and apply it to the DirecTV HD package -- you should be right around break even.

Of course, that doesn't address your desire for Firewire, and though I think it's been suggested here that a new Motorola box with Firewire might be in the works, I'm not sure if that's really the case or when it might be a reality. Charter isn't very forthcoming on future plans.

The more interesting option, I think, is the Charter HD DVR box, which is going to be based on MOXI (www.moxi.com). But again, there's no firm or even rumored date from Charter on when that might happen.

If you decide to cancel basic cable and do the short-term switch to HD on DirecTV, it might be worth calling DTV and asking for the customer retention desk. Tell them you're thinking of jumping to Charter cable but would stick with DTV at least a bit longer if they waive any extended commitment for you to upgrade to the HD package (and if you'd like to hedge your bets, additional receivers). You might also be able to talk them into a month or two of free HD service. The retention reps appear to be well-incentivized, so see what they can come up with.

This approach leaves you the option to jump to Charter without any DirecTV commitment penalty. In the meantime, if Charter rolls out the new DVR and develops a better idea about how to treat high-end customers, you'll be in a good position to revisit a switch to cable.

Thanks doug. I will check into the Pipeline only solution and report. It works very well and DSL is not available in my location. I'll keep my eyes open for the new box.

Regards,
Ed Horton

everyone has noticed that the CBS-HD issues have been fixed on Charter. Are we also seeing the same issues resolved on ESPN-HD too?

ESPN-HD has seemed glitchy too, but since we heard yesterday that CBS is fixed, it appears that ESPN-HD seems ok too. [not that i've watched it for more than 30 minutes or so].

Can anyone else confirm?

I guess with all this action and no comments from 4113 that our Charter insider has left the building.

I thought the cable co's had agreed to a 4/1/04 firewire launch date with the FCC... that was a big deal a year ago, but you don't hear much anymore.

Is anyone else getting a very high pitch tone on the HD KMOV feed from charter, it makes it unwatchable. It is the only HD channel doing this.......unfortuantly I can't drop Charter though as E* and D* can't get line of sights to their satalites and my landlord won't let me mount the dish on the roof !!!!

Josh,

The ringing tone is on KMOV-DT OTA, too. Charter's clean on this one.

Sorry to hear about your obstacles to satellite. Does anyone in your building have roof rights? If so, it might be worth seeing if you can work out a sharing arrangement with them, though that's easier to do on an antenna than it is for the dish. Still, it might be worth a try.

Ok, I'll cut charter some slack I guess on this one....lol. No, unfortunatly no one has roof rights so I am stuck paying more for less. I just hope that they get their DVR online soon... even if it only has a 4GB. What's with that anyway.

What's up with KMOV-DT? Where's the hd from Kansas City for the NCAA's today?

rbkb,

I've been wrong on so much of the NCAAs in HD, that I probably should just keep quiet, but I think that they showed the Illinois game on both SD and HD, because it was effectively a local game (or at least, a game of some local interest in the KMOV viewing area).

I think the Kansas-Pacific game will be shown in HD at 3:50 p.m. or thereabout.

The Kansas-Pacific game is on right now and IS in HD.

Assuming that is the case, nobody knows, its nothing I haven't seen a dozen times before--you go on a forum representing a company officially or unofficially, you better have a thick skin. Usually they disappear right after they get defensive.

Originally posted by Dave Beebe
I guess with all this action and no comments from 4113 that our Charter insider has left the building.

I agree it's unfortunate that 4113 exited.

In a short period of time, 4113 was able to answer a lot of questions for Charter customers and I think that he/she helped to bring some balance to the dialog here. I also believe that 4113's active presence here would have helped eliminate the KMOV-DT issue more quickly.

Maybe that still happened while in lurker mode.

Personally I hope that 4113 didn't get terminated in the last round of Charter layoffs. That event happened right around the time of the last 4113 post and I hope the timing was coincidental.

so.....time to start nagging Charter on the next HD Channel on our wishlist....

ABC-HD? WB HD? Cinemax HD? Starz HD? DISC-HD? [what others am I missing?]

Discovery HD would work for me. Right now, they are promoting the broadcasting of a 5 hour documentary in HD "so vivid you will think you're there".

Also, TLC keeps stating some of their new content is HD.

Originally posted by _Arklyte_
Also, TLC keeps stating some of their new content is HD.

Trading Spaces in HD? My wife will never let me have the remote again. :(

I happened to catch an interview with Mark Cuban the other day on HD Net. They were disuccsing HD PVR's, Cuban mentioned that Charter should be online by the end of the yar. Has anyone else heard anything lately?

I know this is going to come off like a wise-ass comment, so let me say up front that that's not my intention -- but what year was Cuban talking about?

Was this included in the CES show (January 2004) or the CEDIA show (September 2003) on HDNet?

Also, I noticed that DirecTV had the recent CES show on HDNet mislabeled as "What's Kewl at CEDIA" and while I only stumbled on this in surfing around, it seemed clear the show was about CES.

Which is another reason for trying to get clarification. I was under the impression that the Charter DVR rollout was supposed to happen sooner.

Originally posted by abcward
Trading Spaces in HD? My wife will never let me have the remote again. :(
Unfortunately, those of us with D* and DiscoveryHD have had the opportunity to see that bubble headed annoyance(Paige) in glorious HD.
It actually make some of the colors look more true to life, not that I am admitting watching that show. ;)
Dug

My set is fixed. It was a bad ballast. It only took a week and tons of nagging the CSRs at the Panasonic service desk.

I want the premium movies channels next in HD on Charter: Starz and Cinemax. If they do that soon I won't go get ZOOM.

Originally posted by Mr_Bester
Unfortunately, those of us with D* and DiscoveryHD have had the opportunity to see that bubble headed annoyance(Paige) in glorious HD.
It actually make some of the colors look more true to life, not that I am admitting watching that show. ;)
Dug

On another note - if any of you ever watch BBC AMERICA you realize that almost every Home Improvement hit show that we are airing in America, like Trading Spaces, is a DIRECT ripoff of shows from England. Trading Spaces is an exact copy of BBC's Changing Rooms show, down to the theme song.

Its pretty sad that we Americans cant think of anything original.

Drop - I don't think they ever said honestly ? All they said was it was a show that only featured HD products, which is why Cuban was there promoting it. Sorry, that's all I can remember but I will keep an eye out for a repeat.

I too thought the DVR was coming out soon ( before summer ) which is why his statement caught my attention.

Originally posted by Mr_Bester
Unfortunately, those of us with D* and DiscoveryHD have had the opportunity to see that bubble headed annoyance(Paige) in glorious HD.
It actually make some of the colors look more true to life, not that I am admitting watching that show. ;)
Dug

Bubbleheaded annoyance??? Don't get me started on a completely HD unrelated rant. Don't be dissin my Paige!!! :)

Chris

Originally posted by BudShark
Bubbleheaded annoyance??? Don't get me started on a completely HD unrelated rant. Don't be dissin my Paige!!! :)

Chris
Sorry, should I have added "hot" to that?

As far as the BBC stuff goes, My wife and I got hooked on Changing Rooms on our 5th anniv trip to the UK. We saw it in London and then found it on BBC America. I would much rather see Carol and Linda in all their HD glory and my wife fancies Lawrence.

Sorry, back on topic, I hate charter(just to make this seem somewhat HD related)(see previous posts for why) ;)
Dug

Originally posted by DroptheRemote
I agree it's unfortunate that 4113 exited.

In a short period of time, 4113 was able to answer a lot of questions for Charter customers and I think that he/she helped to bring some balance to the dialog here. I also believe that 4113's active presence here would have helped eliminate the KMOV-DT issue more quickly.

Maybe that still happened while in lurker mode.

Personally I hope that 4113 didn't get terminated in the last round of Charter layoffs. That event happened right around the time of the last 4113 post and I hope the timing was coincidental.

I keep thinking 4113 got canned in the last round.

Then again if you go to Charters HR website they're hiring a bunch of people in I.S.. I'm out of work and two of the jobs listed are up my alley, but I'm afraid to apply since in sounds like the place is such a mess.

I feel your pain Dave - sounds like we're sharing a similar boat....

Has the KMOV problem reared its ugly head again? I wasn't home last night but my wife said CSI on KMOV had issues.

ferl,

I had a couple of dropouts last night, and a couple of pixelations, neither of which were in the "serious" category....


FYI, I made the change to my processor the other day which defines SAT as a "Poor Quality Digital Source". This makes the processor more forgiving of occasional dropouts. Since then, I have had no issues with losing Audio lock when KMOV switches from network to local feeds or from local to network feeds. This was quite noticable every time there was a local commercial or promo inserted.

Cheers,

I've been away from the forum for awhile now due to change in job and new baby at home.

I browsed a few pages of the current thread to try to nail down the current HD lineup on Charter.

Can you guys verify if this is correct?

KSDK, KMOV, HBO, and HDNet

Originally posted by cmf76
I've been away from the forum for awhile now due to change in job and new baby at home.

I browsed a few pages of the current thread to try to nail down the current HD lineup on Charter.

Can you guys verify if this is correct?

KSDK, KMOV, HBO, and HDNet

770 - HDNet
771 - HDNet Movies
773 - ESPN-HD
777 - HBO-HD
778 - SHO-HD
782 - FOX [widescreen but not HD as of yet]
784 - CBS-HD
785 - NBC-HD

One of the guys in my car club works for charter so I pm'd him about the PVR.

me :Hi,

If I remember right you work for Charter correct? Have you heard any release dates for the MOXI PVR in STL?

Thanks,
Josh



him :Last I heard was june/july


Take it for what it's worth :shrugs:

Originally posted by __Josh125__
One of the guys in my car club works for charter so I pm'd him about the PVR.

me :Hi,

If I remember right you work for Charter correct? Have you heard any release dates for the MOXI PVR in STL?

Thanks,
Josh



him :Last I heard was june/july


Take it for what it's worth :shrugs:

June/July of what year?:rolleyes:

Charter guy came by today, I am having problems with VOD. He said South County has problems with VOD. Getting a 207 error which is a "Switch" problem. Anyone else having problems. Moto510 box. DVI and COMP conections

I wanted to bring this topic up again:

Charter's upcoming Motorola DVRs - they are dual tuners. Is there any way to use the dual tuners to be able to use the Picture-in-Picture that my Toshiba HDTV has? I really hate not being able to use that feature.

Thanks


Bruce

I don't believe the Motorolla has two outputs. However, I believe the unit itself has PinP. So... you will get PinP, but not through the Toshiba.

Chris

Originally posted by abcward
I wanted to bring this topic up again:

Charter's upcoming Motorola DVRs - they are dual tuners. Is there any way to use the dual tuners to be able to use the Picture-in-Picture that my Toshiba HDTV has? I really hate not being able to use that feature.

Thanks

Bruce

According to this (http://broadband.motorola.com/noflash/bmc.html) there is only one RF output. Is your Toshiba one of those TVs that needs to use an external tuner (input via RF from a VCR) for P-I-P?

The data states that this Toshiba HDTV uses PIP via its two tuners.

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?id=1051826206626&skuId=5341793&type=product&productCategoryId=cat03005

Product Features

16:9 widescreen display with 1080i native display capability (when combined with an HD source)

CableClear digital noise reduction significantly improves the quality of broadcast signals

Split-screen 2-tuner picture-in-picture

Built-in high-contrast TheaterShield protective screen

3D Y/C digital comb filter and advanced velocity scan modulation for clarity

PowerFocus HD II lens system and multilinear digital TouchFocus auto convergence system for incredibly sharp presentation of high-definition signals

Ambient Light Sensor (ALS) automatically adjusts brightness for optimal viewing in varying lighting conditions

30-watt MTS/SAP stereo audio system with dbx noise reduction, Sub Bass System and SRS 3D simulated surround sound

DVI input for an all-digital A/V connection to compatible devices; 2 sets of ColorStream HD component video inputs, 3 S-video inputs (1 front, 2 rear), 3 A/V inputs (1 front, 2 rear), 2 RF inputs; A/V and fixed/variable audio outputs

Center-channel audio input for home theater use

Originally posted by abcward
The data states that this Toshiba HDTV uses PIP via its two tuners.

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?id=1051826206626&skuId=5341793&type=product&productCategoryId=cat03005

I installed a coax splitter before the Charter STB and ran one to the STB and the other to the TV. I connected the STB with component cables. The pic-in-pic is not all that it could be but at least you get 70 or so cable channels on one pic and everything on the other pic.

abcward:

I agree, dual tuners in the Motorola box would be nice. In the mean time have you tried placing a splitter ahead of your digital cable box so you can have one cable going to your box and the other going to the antenna input of your TV? This allows you to use the picture-in-picture function, but unfortunately one of the two sources has to be analog TV. Not the perfect solution, but it's better than nothing.


If you do this make sure you get a splitter that has a frequency range that supports digital TV. 900MHz (or higher) on the upper end will work.

Well, if 4113 got laid off he or she was using their corporate PC to comment on this forum. If I got laid off and was using my home PC I would surely be commenting on this forum. I think someone snitched on 4113 and management told him or her to stop immediately. Typically corporate communications are strictly regimented to a certain department and violation of this is a punishable offense.

Keep the faith 4113, we appreciated you.

Originally posted by abcward
Is there any way to use the dual tuners to be able to use the Picture-in-Picture that my Toshiba HDTV has?

It may be like my Samsung. Unable to use PIP when using the component cables. I can't even watch a dvd while using PIP. Do you guys know any way around it?

For the past month or so, I've been working to pull together a "State of HDTV" article that I'm looking to sell locally. I'd like to get some local comment into the article, and it seems logical to survey the group that frequents and lurks here.

If you'd like to participate, please take a look at the questions below, and send me your responses by private message here at AVS. As a courtesy to everyone else, PLEASE don't respond here in this thread. If you're not set up for private messages, you can eMail me at doug@clearlyresolved.com.

In order to use your contribution in the article, I need your full name and your city/state (I can't use quotes with an AVS screen name). Having a phone number for possible follow-up questions would be welcome, but it's not required to respond.

I don't want to mislead anyone, but I'm probably only going to incorporate five to 10 quotes into the article. Also, I need your replies by end of the day on Sunday, March 28, as I'll be finalizing the article next Monday and then pitching it early next week.


The following are the questions I'd like you to consider. I'd appreciate if you could answer as many as are relevant to you, but feel free to pick and choose.

1. How would you describe the difference in picture quality between standard-definition and HD television to someone who has never had the opportunity to see HDTV for themselves?

2. How important to you is the digital surround sound aspect of HDTV? Do you use it? If so, how does it add to the viewing experience? If not, why not?

3. When did you take the plunge into HDTV and what was the primary factor that made you decide to spend the money on an HDTV and associated hardware?

4. As an HDTV owner, what's been your biggest frustration as an "early adopter?"

5. Do you have any regrets about being an HDTV owner? Anything that you'd do differently if you were in the market for an HDTV again?

6. How would you summarize current HD programming availability to someone who's looking for an idea of how much HDTV is being shown at the moment?

7. If you didn't buy some type of HDTV receiver (OTA or Satellite/OTA) when you originally purchased your HDTV, why not? If you've subsequently purchased an HD STB, what caused you to change your mind?

8. If you installed an antenna to receive OTA HD programming, was it worth the effort and cost, and would you recommend for or against to a friend or family member who was considering doing the same?

9. What's your primary method for receiving HD programming (OTA, satellite, cable), and are you satisfied with that source? Please be specific about pros and cons.

10. If you don't currently own an HDTV, what is discouraging you from buying one? Please be specific about about the reason and what would need to change for you to purchase an HDTV (for example, "prices for a 55-inch set would need to fall to $X dollars," "Sponge Bob would need to be available in HDTV," etc.)

11. Feel free to make any other comment you'd like to put forward about your experience with HDTV.

Thanks in advance to everyone who takes the time to reply.

KMOV won't lock in tonight ?

flody,

I lost KMOV on my 6000 last night, but didn't check my 811.

Cheers,

From SkyREPORT E-News
_____________________________________________

Tax Group: Allow Digital Nets Via Satellite

A tax watchdog group is suggesting that satellite TV services should be given the opportunity to retransmit the digital signals of broadcasters nationally, including areas where the digital TV transition is slow to start.

Since 1988, satellite TV providers have offered distant broadcast programming if it isn't available locally to subscribers, yet the federal law allowing for the transmission of distant network signals applies only to analog broadcasts. In a statement released Thursday, Americans for Tax Reform said an amendment extending those rights to digital broadcasts would make DTV programming available nationwide, including areas unserved by digital broadcast TV.

The organization said making the digital distant network change in the Satellite Home Viewer Improvement Act (SHVIA), which is up for renewal this year, would help reduce the federal budget deficit by more than $120 billion. The Balanced Budget Act of 1997 requires broadcasters to relinquish their analog spectrum – a commodity that's worth more than that $120 billion if and when the spectrum is auctioned off to the private sector for other uses, Americans for Tax Reform said.

The relinquishing of analog spectrum is subject to at least 85 percent of households in their markets being capable of receiving digital broadcasts.

"The DBS companies have the technology to jumpstart the digital television transition tomorrow morning if Congress will allow them to," said taxpayer advocate Grover Norquist. "Perhaps more importantly, a simple change in the law will make extremely valuable spectrum available for companies willing pay literally hundreds of billions of dollars for it at auction – enough to eliminate a sizable chunk of the deficit. This is a win-win proposal for taxpayers."
_____________________________________________

From today's Wall Street Journal:

Should Cable
Be a la Carte,
Not Flat Rate?

By ANNE MARIE SQUEO and JOE FLINT
Staff Reporters of THE WALL STREET JOURNAL
March 26, 2004; Page B1

When Sen. John McCain goes shopping, the grocery store doesn't make him buy broccoli if he's buying milk. Why then, the powerful head of the Senate Commerce Committee wonders, do cable and satellite-TV companies make people pay for channels they don't watch, say for example, ESPN?

Instead of forcing consumers to buy a prix-fixe menu of channels, the Arizona Republican is pushing for a la carte service, or individual channels in lieu of traditional packages. And the idea is gaining popularity.

Full story (fee-based subscription required):

http://online.wsj.com/article/0,,SB108024393026565550,00.html?mod=todays_us_marketplace

Originally posted by DroptheRemote
From today's Wall Street Journal:

Instead of forcing consumers to buy a prix-fixe menu of channels, the Arizona Republican is pushing for a la carte service, or individual channels in lieu of traditional packages. And the idea is gaining popularity.

http://online.wsj.com/article/0,,SB108024393026565550,00.html?mod=todays_us_marketplace

Think how much bandwidth could be made available for HDTV by dropping the "dog" channels. Where do I sign up to vote?

Bill

Still can't get KMOV on my Samsung sir 150, have been receiving it fine for a long time. All others o.k.

I could not lock onto KMOV either last night or this morning with my Dish 811. I called DISH and complained figuring it must be their receiver, looks like maybe it was KMOVs fault. I really want to see the BBall games tonight in HD, so I hope they get it fixed ASAP. Be sure to post a message when you are able to receive KMOV again...
Thanks

Yeah. I lost KMOV during the bball game last night OTA with a Hipix. I had a signal strenght of 85 and no picture or sound.

Walt

Same here when I try to get 56 , signal strength good , no video or audio. My wife said it went off about 4pm yesterday evening during a soap opera, ouch !!.... : )

For anyone concerned about KMOV and the HD basketball later tonight --

I just checked KMOV-DT here and it's coming in fine, as of 1 p.m. Assuming that the earlier problem reports weren't related to something specific to a certain STB (and it doesn't look that way), everything should be fine for the NCAA coverage.

FYI -- My STB is the DTC-100...

Channel 4-1 comes in fine on my Samsung t160 @ 3:50 pm Friday
Dug

KMOV's PSIP data must have been messed up - yesterday I too lost the signal (on 4.1), but when I manually tuned in 56.1, It came in fine.

KMOV , 4-1 , or 56 is on here now. Just got home, so I don't know when the problem went away.

The NCAA tourney on KMOV / Charter comes in with the DD5.1 flag on. I do hear the fans on the surround speakers. Is this real 5.1 John?

I tried from 6:00 on and for every 15 minutes to no avail. I saw the game last Friday and know that I can get KMOV-DT when they are on. Then finally at the end of the first game, they were on, but then it was off again. Anyone have ideas? I had a group over to watch the game and we had to settle for SD over sat. My father has HDTV and he was unable to catch it OTA as well.

Skippy,

It sounds like whatever your problem is, it's at your end, because I was able to watch both games in HD without any interruption. From other posts here since the games last night the same appears to be true for others.

Do you have the PSIP option turned on? If so, switching it off and trying to view KMOV-DT as 56-1 might resolve your issue. Personally, I've never had anything BUT trouble with PSIP functionality on two different STBs.

My own view is that PSIP is a worthless feature if doesn't work 100% of the time and if the broadcasters don't bother to send full program listings as part of the PSIP process.

Skippy

No problems here with KMOV OTA on a Hipix. I watched both the HD games and the SD on a direct view next to the screen. SD switched games when the score got out of hand.

Walt

I appreciate the replies. I did try to manually go to 56.1 but the TV would automatically reassign to 04.01. I checked the user menus and can't find a way to bypass the PSIP. I have a Mits WS55711.

Skippy,

I can't recall how that function works on Mits sets, but sometimes it's referred to as Channel Guides or Off-Air Guides. Look for something along those lines and see if you can't defeat the remapping functionality...

I sure would like to get an explanation from KTVI why I seem to never be able to pick up their signal. Here it is Sunday again and I am trying to watch the NASCAR race and the damn signal won't come through. It is getting old. Either fix the damn signal or let me get FOX on DirecTV. This sucks.

Hey Doug, add this to your list of stuff for the article. The General Managers of the stations refusing to upgrade or maintain their equipment when it breaks.

Uugghhh!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I don't think the FOX digital signal has been added to DirecTV yet, though apparently agreements for that are in place. Not sure what the hold up is, but it might be that DirecTV is waiting until FOX actually has some HD content before committing to the bandwidth.

However, based on what's happened in owned/operated markets for CBS, I think it will be virtually automatic that we'll have access to the East Coast FOX feed whenever it is included on DTV. Not sure about the West Coast feed -- it would be nice, but I'm a little doubtful that we'll qualify for both.

Has anyone else in the Ferguson area lost their HD lineup with Charter? We're in an area that hasn't quite completed the upgrade, --- none of the interactive stuff is available but HD had been working since the end of January.

I came home Saturday to find all of the HD channels as well as HBO Signature East (506) displaying "This channel will be available shortly". (Interesting to note that the recently added ESPN channel is fine).

Shortly turned into hours so I placed a call to Charter Customer Service. After about an hour of try this, push that, set this, we gave up and have a service call placed for Wednesday, between 3-5 pm!

All analog channels are there, all digital channels are there, except for 506. Perhaps coincidental to all of this is the appearance of the VOD channel. 999 now is recognized on the Motorola 6200 box (as of Friday night, attempting to select 999, resulted in rolling down to channel 99).

I'm guessing that a software download for the VOD stuff came down somewhere after Friday evening and hosed the HD stuff, but can't seem to convince anyone at Charter that waiting 4 days for a tech to show up is unacceptable.

Anyone have an idea what may be going on?

Thanks

Steve

I don't think the agreement with Fox is signed, sealed, and delivered yet. This was one (and far as I know, only) case where DirecTV made an announcement before the contracts were signed.

But since DirecTV and Fox are both owned pretty much by the same guy (Rupert), and the guy wants the deal done, it's a safe bet it will happen some time soon.

Boy it was hard to watch the first game today [Kansas/GTech] in HD and then be forced to scale it back for the 2nd game in SD....

HD game looked great - no problems that I could see.

I know the FOX deal isn't done yet, but I can dream can't I? I have just had it with KTVI. I sent an email to the Engineering group but that got kicked back due to space constraints on their email.

I sent an email to YOU PAID FOR IT, saying how I paid for an HDTV but KTVI is ripping me off.

I called the Engineering group and left a message. All I know is that this is an ongoing problem and I have just about had it.

I start my new job tomorrow or else I would be on the phone calling and trying to get a hold of the Engineers and the GM. Bunch of BS..

On another note, I am aware that TV's do the 5% overscan but has anyone else noticed that the CBS "HD" feed for the second game seem off center or is it just my TV? It is like 2 inches too far to the right.

Hey Doug, any news on DirecTV launching any new HD Channels?

wmschultz,

I LOVE the idea of sending an eMail to YOU PAID FOR IT. IMO, you can't do better than to hit them with their own empty PR rhetoric... :p

I didn't actually watch the second game this afternoon (for the very reasons you've highlighted) but I had the TV on and in passing I didn't notice it being significantly shifted from center. I believe that KMOV's 14x9 local stretch is slightly off center, but on the earlier game when they broke to commercials with the 4x3 adverts pillar-boxed, it looked even on both sides to me.

Next week during the HD coverage check to see if you're seeing the same off-center display during the commercial breaks. If it's uneven then, it sounds like there's a minor problem with your HD geometry.

On DirecTV I haven't heard or read anything, and to be honest the HDTV Programming forum here is probably the best bet for breaking news of that type. I do recall reading somewhere that DirecTV told its resellers early in the year that they would be expanding the HD line-up, but as is typical for DirecTV there were no details or hints of what that might include.

Another good source for HD news of this type is www.tvpredictions.com

wmschultz , I watched the Nascar race Sunday on KTVI without problems with my Samsung T150

I saw this is today's Post Dispatch:

Get Out Monday
Compiled by Jim Hanselman
Of the Post-Dispatch
03/28/2004

Prince performs at the19th annual Rock and Roll Hall of Fame induction ceremony this month.

PRINCE ALMOST LIVE: No doubt Prince's most ardent (and well-heeled) fans are in LA tonight, but if you couldn't make it to Staples Center there, you can enjoy the next best thing: a live satellite simulcast. It starts at 10 p.m. at the Regal St. Louis Mills Stadium 18, 5555 St. Louis Mills Boulevard. Tickets include a copy of the star's new CD, "Musicology." Tickets are $17.50; for more info, visit www.regalcm.com or call 314-227-5503.

I then went to the St. Louis Mills Cinema website for movie times this link (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/editpost.php?s=&action=editpost&postid=3592861) and saw that they have some other "live" broadcast events planned. I next went to the Texas Instruments DLP website and they didn't list any DLP cinemas in the area.

This is the first I've heard of something like this in the St. Louis area. The big AMC 25 in the Chicago suburb of Naperville was the closest digital projection theater to the St. Louis area.

When did the cinema at St. Louis Mills start doing digital presentations?
Are they going to start doing movies in digital projection?
What technology are they using? They're not using TI's DLP.


While I know this isn't truly home theater and HDTV I figured that many St. Louis HT/HDTV enthusiasts would be fans of digital projection technology at the theater. (The rare times that we now go since we have our HDTVs)

Just a quick update from my post on the 15th RE: my house sale/move/home theater stuff for sale.

The HDTV is sold, as is the HT cabinets. Marble cocktail table and end table are still available though, if anyone is interested....

I just noticed that TitanTV shows the Blues at Predators game this Saturday (4/3) as being in High Definition on KPLR-11. I hope this is acurate.

Originally posted by jbabb
I just noticed that TitanTV shows the Blues at Predators game this Saturday (4/3) as being in High Definition on KPLR-11. I hope this is acurate. That would be great, especially since we were all denied the HDNet game on 3/16 and most likely the game tomorrow (3/30) due to Fow Sports blackout restrictions :mad:

Unfortunately, I'm not holding my breath for another HD Blues game this season....maybe if they make it past the 1st round.