anyone have any experience w/ StormLogic's Dragon v2.0?

I'm also interested. I want a turnkey solution that works without effort on my part, and I'm willing to pay extra for that. Maybe you can track down the best wiki or discussion board about that hardware.

I even have some basic questions about the hardware. Whenever there are choices, there are questions.

1) why would I choose a faster processor? Is there anything DVR related that the slower one won't do?

2) Why would I want anything but the stock heatsink? Will the processor overheat without a more expensive one?

3) Why would I want anything other than the standard video card? What do the more expensive ones do for me?

4) why would I want more RAM than the 1 GB standard? Is there anything DVR related that 1 GB isn't enough for?

Yes I could ask StormLogic these quesitons. But it seems to me that if they put up choices they should also put up some info to help people choose. If they can't figure that out by themselves, what's the point of my pointing it out to them?



Here's the dragon URL in case anyone is interested:

http://mythic.tv/product_info.php?products_id=44

1) The E4300 is plenty fast enough for about whatever you'd want to do, as any dual core cpu would be. It will do HD PIP (if you have 2 or more HDTV tuners) which most single core CPU's won't do.
2) The stock cpu cooler may be noisy. I don't know. Don't use the E4300.
3) if you want to play high end games on the machine also.
4) You won't need more than 1GB ram.

Just a note. I can't believe people will pay that much for a MythTV box. My whole system consisting of 3 boxes and 5 tuners cost less than the price of the Dragon2. One can build a dual tuner (OTA ATSC only) system for under $500 easy even with a dual core cpu.

Just a note. I can't believe people will pay that much for a MythTV box. My whole system consisting of 3 boxes and 5 tuners cost less than the price of the Dragon2. One can build a dual tuner (OTA ATSC only) system for under $500 easy even with a dual core cpu.
Thanks for the MythTV info. I'll tell you why I would at least hypothetically pay that much.

My day job involves ASIC design, sometimes at the bleeding edge. Every day there is another "challenge" or problem to solve, because of tools that produce cryptic error messages, or because of non-existent documentation, or because of poor specifications. Or because of 100 other reasons. I'm good at solving those puzzles. I get paid very well to do it.

When I get home I also have to do "tech support" for the computers and electronics around the house.

But enough is enough. I can't solve problems 24 hours a day! That's why TiVo is so nice. It just works (at least for simple things). The whole family (including young children) can use it. We have four DirecTiVos active.

There are two big reasons why I haven't already bought the Dragon:

1) Even though it's presumably much simpler than putting together a MythTV system from parts, the end result may still be too complicated for the rest of the family (compared to TiVo). Much less interesting if it must stay a toy for me in the den.

2) No component output. The big screen TV in the family room is about 5 years old and works great. But it doesn't accept DVI. I know that the web site sells two different VGA->component converters, but that raises two new questions:

2a) why two different converters? Is video quality the same? Is the difference just in physical size? There's a $220 difference in price.

2b) color space conversions can often have quite inferior results to "native" YPbPr output. Do I want to spend all the money and take a chance on inferior video quality?

1) Hardware wise, it doesn't take long to put a system together once you8 have all the parts. Software installation takes about 20 minutes using Knoppmyth.. Even buying a preconfigured system it still has to be configured once you get it and install it. So all you are really saving is the time it takes to order the parts, assemblr the computer, and load the software. I know I can put a single system together for well under $500 and a few hours or less. That's only half the battle. You still have to set up your guide data account and configure mythtv and do channels scans and what not. It's not like an S1/2 Tivo where you just plug it in do some minor (but still time consuming) configuration for OTA reception. As for picture quality, anything would be better than Tivo S1/2 picture quality. Even my RCA DVR had better picture quality than my Tivo.

2) buy a MB or video card with componet out if that what you want both or available.

2a/2b) Not sure where you are going with this. maybe you mean there's doesn't come standard with component out. After seeing the price, I really didn't investigate it much.:-)

As for picture quality, anything would be better than Tivo S1/2 picture quality. Even my RCA DVR had better picture quality than my Tivo.
I think the DirecTiVos are OK in quality and they have improved over time. They start out with digital picture and latest (R10) which I have definitely displayed much nicer pictures than SAT-T60. Because the received data is totally digital, it's easy to pause two boxes and switch TV sources to compare the video quality on exactly the same frame. The TiVo isn't the problem. DirecTV's high compression screws things up much more than the DVR.

2a/2b) Not sure where you are going with this. maybe you mean there's doesn't come standard with component out. After seeing the price, I really didn't investigate it much.:-)
Yes, that's right. Their video cards have DVI and VGA and either composite or S-Video depending on which is ordered. No component.

Why does the system cost so much?

1. Higher quality components to make the machine quiet. The Dragon is designed to be a low noise machine, so some of the components like the power supply and CPU fan cost extra.

2. Reliable/flexible components cost more. The Airstar 5000HD is more expensive than an AirStar 2.0, but it has a better ATSC tuner (for OTA) and also adds QAM support.

3. Some reasonable profit for the guys building the machines. I priced the Dragon 1.1 parts at newegg several months ago and the total was about $950. To buy from StormLogic was $1100. I think $150 is more than reasonable for them to assemble and ship the unit.


That said, I built a quasi Dragon 1.1 for myself since I had a case and wasn't worried about noise. I was able to build a 2 tuner BE/FE for about $800.

I have since built a FE only box using a Shuttle PC case for about $450. Very nice form-factor with reasonable noise level (it sits in the kitchen and is quiter than the refridgerator)...

Chris

i built the dragon, but used a few of my own upgrades.. you can do so cheaper... thats for sure, and end up with a bit nicer hardware... i like whats in mine...

for a turn key solution it sure is handy...

just a fyi the chaintech card they recomend is cheap and easy to set up, using the files off of the install cd... on any box...

One can build a dual tuner (OTA ATSC only) system for under $500 easy even with a dual core cpu.I'm currently looking to do this, and I'd like to know what hardware you used to keep it under $500.

I'm currently looking to do this, and I'd like to know what hardware you used to keep it under $500.
Case and 500W PSU $25
AMD X2 3800+ MB $156 Take your pick from pricewatch combos
512M ram $35
320GB HDD $85
2 ATSC Tuner cards $50
16x DL DVD burner $30
Nvidia 6200 Video card $35
Cordless KB/mouse $20

That's $435. Want a remote, add $5 for an IR receiver with remote. If you aren't in a hurry, wait for Fry's to put the AMD X2 cpu/mb combo on sale again and save a little more. Anyway, it's not hard to build one for well under $500 if you want to. Skimp a little adn you can get under $350 easy.

Thanks for the details. I'm really trying to do the same, but for the AMD 3800+ I'm looking for (the 35W EE chip - ADD3800CUBox) that's about $350 for the CPU alone, when/where you can find it!

I'm looking at the ASUS M2NPV-VM mobo that has the component video output, and a NICE case to put it in. I'm really interested in the Zalman 160XT, and that's about $550. :( I already have 2 320GB HD's....so that's not in the total.

So far, I have about $900 in the CPU and case alone!

I've tried an Air2PC r02 card for DTV, but it's not too stable for the weak reception where I'm located, so I'm looking at the 5000 card, or something else.

I have an old Hauppauge 401 card....I can't believe that I bought it in 1999, and finally got to fire it up with KnoppMyth this week....but it does the analog just fine! That will stay, so that I can attempt to do FM through it when Analog TV shuts down.

Then why bother me. FYI, the 35w part won't really save you anything. Most of the time both would be idling at their lowest speeds with cpufreqd and the difference in current draw will be miniaml. The 65W model is also an F3 stepping while the 35W is F2. At 15 cents per KWH, I don't know how many years you'll have to use it for payback, but my guess would be it will be obsolete before that time comes.

Again, you're wanting to pay $550 for a case and then waste my time asking how to build one for under $500. Give me a break. What was your point? Personally, I think anyone that would spend $500 for a case is an idiot with more money than brains, but it's your money. Spend it the way you like. Just don't bother with your stupid questions any more.

Then why bother me. FYI, the 35w part won't really save you anything. Most of the time both would be idling at their lowest speeds with cpufreqd and the difference in current draw will be miniaml. The 65W model is also an F3 stepping while the 35W is F2. At 15 cents per KWH, I don't know how many years you'll have to use it for payback, but my guess would be it will be obsolete before that time comes.

Again, you're wanting to pay $550 for a case and then waste my time asking how to build one for under $500. Give me a break. What was your point? Personally, I think anyone that would spend $500 for a case is an idiot with more money than brains, but it's your money. Spend it the way you like. Just don't bother with your stupid questions any more.Mmmmm.....

I asked for a reason. To see what components you were using.

I then stated what components I would like to use, along with some pricing. This puts everything out on the table for the forum to see what others are doing. I agree, that I'm shooting for some high end gear. That's probably why some folks drive BMW's instead of Honda's.

I'm stupid and an idiot? Re-read your intelligent reply, and think about it. If you don't wish to be 'bothered,' per se, stay off the forum. Who know's who'll you'll find here. :(

Where is this $50 ATSC tuner card? The cheapest I've seen is the KWorld ATSC 110 for about $80. Also, 512MB RAM is not really enough for HD MythTV.

I think the Dragon has a bit of padding, though. I build my own MythBox for something like $650. Uses an Athlon 3200+ (probably a bit weak), ASUS A8N VM CSM motherboard (with digital audio out and onboard 6150 video), PCHDTV 5500 tuner (as I said, the KWorld would be cheaper), and Silverstone LC-11M case.

With the Core 2 Duo behind it, there's no reason they shouldn't be able to get away with onboard video and certainly onboard digital audio.

Where is this $50 ATSC tuner card?

I don't know about $50 ATSC cards, but I've got 6 (5 in system and 1 spare) of which I paid under $20 each for the last 2 I bought. With shipping price was under $25 each. They are ATSC only, which is all I care about. Search ebay fro air2pc.