Anyone have any knowledge of when/if This Old House will make the move to HD?

Depends. I haven't heard anything. Do you know who produces it?

If it's PBS, you might get, if not HD, 16:9 SD, they do that with alot of their shows.

Right now, such a small demographic of the target audience has an HDTV, that it would be pointless to upgrade. Wait another three years, then come back and ask.

Depends. I haven't heard anything. Do you know who produces it?

If it's PBS, you might get, if not HD, 16:9 SD, they do that with alot of their shows.
The show is now produced by This Old House Ventures. In the past it was produced by WGBH.

This would be a great show for HD along with The New Yankee Workshop. These are my two favorite shows on PBS with Austin City Limits lagging behind.

This Old House has to be one of the highest rated shows on PBS. It's definitely my favorite and i'm looking forward to the day they go HD.

Funny, I started a thread about this sometime last year which had about the same results. I would love to see This Old House (and Ask This Old House plus The New Yankee Workshop) in HD, it's definitely one of my top five shows that I must watch every week. Imagine seeing all their fine craftsmanship in HD! It would have been nice if the Austin "green" house ushered in TOH in HD.

I've sent a few emails to contact@thisoldhouse.com asking about this and have gotten no reply, which is disappointing. They could at least tell me to bugger off and quit wasting their time. Maybe if people here sent a number of short emails asking about TOH in HD we could get some kind of response.

By the way, hope this isn't OT, but I read in today's paper that tonight's episode of TOH (WNED) will be their 50th project, and it's going to feature the complete renovation of a Texas craftsman-style house to new, "green" standards. Should be a good one..... :)

The season premiere of The This Old House Hour was shown Saturday on WNET (PBS 13 NYC) letter-boxed. I searched the guide for their HD station but it was not listed. Is anyone getting this on a digital PBS station in full wide-screen, or HD? Seems strange that they would shoot it wide-screen and not show it on the digital station.

When TOH is produced, they prolly sell PBS the 4:3 crop of the show, because it is too much work to edit it for both 16:9 and 4:3 at both TOH and at PBS, PBS should be asking for it in 16:9 and later on if not sooner in HD.... This show, ATOH, NYW, and Hometime would be so great in HD, and the recording/editing for HD is not that pricey anymore, they should do it, it would be so great, all the details:-)

Here in Boston, GBH offers a whole slew of channels. The flagship HD channel (2-2), does not present This Old House at all. It is available on the flagship SD channel (2-1), as well as on 44-1 and some of its side channels.

I suspect that, like Survivor, they simply aren't interested in spending the money on HD cameras, given how much the cameras they use are subject to risks from construction itself.

Here in Boston, GBH offers a whole slew of channels. The flagship HD channel (2-2), does not present This Old House at all. It is available on the flagship SD channel (2-1), as well as on 44-1 and some of its side channels.

I suspect that, like Survivor, they simply aren't interested in spending the money on HD cameras, given how much the cameras they use are subject to risks from construction itself.

I know nothing about the logistics that go into shooting a show like TOH. But I still wonder if they would need the really expensive HD cameras.

Couldn't they get away with a few pro-level HD cameras and then have a bunch of HDV camcorders? I've always thought that Survivor could do that as well. They can set up the expensive units and give the roving cameramen HDV units.

Or am I totally off base?

I know nothing about the logistics that go into shooting a show like TOH. But I still wonder if they would need the really expensive HD cameras.

Couldn't they get away with a few pro-level HD cameras and then have a bunch of HDV camcorders? I've always thought that Survivor could do that as well. They can set up the expensive units and give the roving cameramen HDV units.

Or am I totally off base?

I do believe that TOH is a single camera show.

I know nothing about the logistics that go into shooting a show like TOH. But I still wonder if they would need the really expensive HD cameras.The same arguments are regularly floated with regard to Survivor. The reality is that no matter how inexpensive HD cameras get, non-HD cameras are still much much less expensive. That may not always be true, but it is for now.

Couldn't they get away with a few pro-level HD cameras and then have a bunch of HDV camcorders?I can just imagine the complaints we'd read here on these forums if they cut corners like that. Better for them to acknowledge that the show simply is not HD and move on. That tactic has worked for Survivor IMHO. I see far fewer complaints on an ongoing basis about it not being HD than I see complaints about crappy HD on any number of programs.

This is quite possibly the best show on PBS. I just hope they go HD in the near future.

The season premiere of The This Old House Hour was shown Saturday on WNET (PBS 13 NYC) letter-boxed. I searched the guide for their HD station but it was not listed. Is anyone getting this on a digital PBS station in full wide-screen, or HD? Seems strange that they would shoot it wide-screen and not show it on the digital station.

Here Rochester, MN, KSMQ-DT (non HD) started showing the new season in 16x9!! I love that so much, It is really the way of future.... Hopefully they go HD too someday soon:-)
I will have a HD PBS feed in the next week, so I will post back when I see how it is handled on that.....

Still not being shown on WNET-DT. I have been zooming the letterboxed 4:3 from the analog WNET to fill my screen.

I do believe that TOH is a single camera show.

Yep - looks to me like a camcorder shot show - and I wouldn't be surprised if it was mainly shot by a single camera and crew. (It airs on a Discovery branded channel in the UK - I think "Discovery Home and Leisure". It is a good watch - though not really that relevant to a UK audience as our construction techniques can be very different, and we have different legislation governing building work etc.)

Cost of conversion to HD would be the cost of changing the camera (or cost of hiring the crew with an HD rather than SD camera) and increased post production costs.

If TOH is shot to reasonable Health and Safety standards as a production, then the camera should be at no greater risk of damage than the operator i.e. the camera shouldn't be at risk...

PBS shows operate with smaller budgets than some other broadcasters though - so the cost of changing to HD cannot be ignored. Equally, TOH is sold to other broadcasters around the world, some of who may want a 16:9 version - so it could be that they have switched to 16:9 SD production (which is almost zero cost these days - quite often only your titles need a tweak)

When they filmed last season around here (although they worked early, and I'm more of a late-night person) I recall them using a local broadcast rental company, and had about 3-4 cameras delivered.

I am assuming they rented them, namely as the van they came in was branded as such (sales, rentals etc)

Not sure if it was just for that season, of if they rent em all the time from that company etc, no idea!

Yep - looks to me like a camcorder shot show - and I wouldn't be surprised if it was mainly shot by a single camera and crew. (It airs on a Discovery branded channel in the UK - I think "Discovery Home and Leisure". It is a good watch - though not really that relevant to a UK audience as our construction techniques can be very different, and we have different legislation governing building work etc.)

There was one project they shot in London. An Amercian moved there and was renovating a flat in a historical district (which is common on this show). He was trying to anyway. The historical commision (or whatever they're called there) wouldn't give him any strict guidelines to follow and made him replace a ton of expensive steel work he just put in because of some vague complaints from them. By the time the Old House crew had to leave weeks and weeks later, he was out of money and still had little more than a shell of a living space. He could barely contain his anger to the people who were wasting his time and money when he said goodbye.

I'm glad that people in the U.K. are seeing how we build houses because when I was there, they wouldn't believe we build houses out of flammable wood products and our roofing materials are the same cheap asphalt junk they use on low pitched roofs.

I'm glad that people in the U.K. are seeing how we build houses because when I was there, they wouldn't believe we build houses out of flammable wood products and our roofing materials are the same cheap asphalt junk they use on low pitched roofs.
The thing I noticed about housing there was the windows. What cheap pieces of crap most of them were. You'd think in a climate that gets a considerable amount of rain and cold (and where utilities are very costly) they'd pay attention to how much heat was being lost through them. Most places I saw only had single or double pane windows that were more in line with what we use for suplimental storm windows. It also appears few people over their feel the need to have screens on their windows.

On the other hand, most places seemed to have their windows open (despite the fact that I visited in the fall and it was actually somewhat chilly), so I guess it really wouldn't matter.

I should say, this was in Ireland and Scotland. I'm not sure if things are different in England.

They have a fairly moderate climate and their living spaces are much smaller than ours on average so they just don't spend as much to heat them. We spend most of our money heating large rooms with nobody in them. Brits are often amazed at how many of our houses have huge living rooms with 20 foot cathedral ceilings. That's a lot of empty space to heat.

They tend to keep their windows open I think because they use radient heat. Forced air heat is unheard of. Fresh air is considered healthy and recirculated air (the stuff most of we Americans breathe in our homes) is unhealthy. I found that many of these beliefs were cultural and historical and their buildings reflected them.

Most houses I see in the moderate climate here only have single paned windows too. One lowly profession there is the "door to door double glazed saleman" who tries to convince people to spend a fortune replacing all their old windows.

Sony now offers an XDCAM HD camera (http://bssc.sel.sony.com/BroadcastandBusiness/DisplayModel?m=10014&p=20029&sp=20128&id=89719) for under $17K. Their XDCAM SD cameras cost a little more than this, but are supposedly more rugged. Considering "This Old House", et al, don't go too stressful on the cameras (I think), HD cameras should last for years while costing less...

I was thinking of making a new thread for this, but it seems this thread's last post was only a few weeks ago.

So, I noticed that the new season of This Old House is being shown in 16x9 format on the regular non-HD channel here. I'm about 99% certain that this is the first season that isn't using 4x3.

This made me think that maybe they were shooting in HD and the HD version would be airing on my local PBS station's HD channel, but so far that hasn't happened. I'm wondering if anyone in another part of the country has seen an HD version on their local HD channel.

Why would they go to 16x9 if they weren't putting out an HD version? It just makes it harder to watch in standard definition.

I was thinking of making a new thread for this, but it seems this thread's last post was only a few months ago.

So, I noticed that the new season of This Old House is being shown in 16x9 format on the regular non-HD channel here. I'm about 99% certain that this is the first season that isn't using 4x3.

This made me think that maybe they were shooting in HD and the HD version would be airing on my local PBS station's HD channel, but so far that hasn't happened. I'm wondering if anyone in another part of the country has seen an HD version on their local HD channel.

Why would they go to 16x9 if they weren't putting out an HD version? It just makes it harder to watch in standard definition.

This is the first season for 16x9 for TOH. It has not appeared on the PBS HD schedule yet. They could be shooting in HD and deciding to frame for 16x9 as an intermediate step on their transition to HD.

This is the first season for 16x9 for TOH. It has not appeared on the PBS HD schedule yet. They could be shooting in HD and deciding to frame for 16x9 as an intermediate step on their transition to HD.

Houston's PBS does air both TOH and Ask TOH on the HD channel, but they is "framed" with a Pillarbox/Letterbox of an SD 16x9. The interesting part is that the sponsors are all shown in 4x3.

Thank goodness my 42" Rear Projection TV has a Zoom function that works for HD channels too :D

I'm going to be in Boston next week, and will check there since that's where it's produced from, but preliminary checks look like they don't have it on their HD channel's schedule. (Thank goodness for an OTA HD tuner card for the laptop:) )

TOH is presented only on 2-1 and 44-1 here -- GBH's two SD channels. It is not broadcast on 2-2, the HD channel, at all, not even boxed.

Well I'm really glad to hear that at least one city is airing This Old House in HD. Now the question is why isn't it available in HD everywhere?

I think PBS stations kind of do their own thing which seems like they are overcomplicating things. I guess they have their reasons though.

But as far as This Old House goes it's too bad because they've taken away from the show by going to 16x9 in SD when people can't choose to tune into the HD version. The picture is so small now.

I'm in Columbus btw.

Well I'm really glad to hear that at least one city is airing This Old House in HD. Now the question is why isn't it available in HD everywhere?

I think PBS stations kind of do their own thing which seems like they are overcomplicating things. I guess they have their reasons though.

But as far as This Old House goes it's too bad because they've taken away from the show by going to 16x9 in SD when people can't choose to tune into the HD version. The picture is so small now.

I'm in Columbus btw.
No one has said it is airing in HD. All that has been said is it has been airing on the HD channel as upconverted material. It sounds like it is postage stamp, with bars on all sides.

True, I was reading through too fast I guess.

Well I'll try to email contact@thisoldhouse.com and ask about this but I've done that 2 or 3 times prior to this new season and they've never replied, which is frustrating. Anyone else should feel free to do the same, maybe they'll decide to answer one of us.

There was one project they shot in London. An Amercian moved there and was renovating a flat in a historical district (which is common on this show). He was trying to anyway. The historical commision (or whatever they're called there) wouldn't give him any strict guidelines to follow and made him replace a ton of expensive steel work he just put in because of some vague complaints from them.


Aah - chances are he either lived in a conservation area, or his house was Grade I or Grade II listed. Conservation areas are designated areas of historical value - and as such can't be massively modified as that would alter an area of historical character.

Grade I and Grade II listing is slightly different - and includes internal restrictions (meaning you can't just knock through walls because you want to), and can also involve restrictions on building methods used. If you are renovating a 16th Century building you may have to use traditional materials and techniques to comply. This can be vague - as each building is considered on an individual basis, and this depends on the level of listing and proposed works.

Any Brit who knows anything about property knows that buying any house that is Grade I/II listed or in a conservation zone is going to be a potentially very expensive project. (We have our own TV series like "Grand Designs" and "Property Ladder" to tell us!)


By the time the Old House crew had to leave weeks and weeks later, he was out of money and still had little more than a shell of a living space. He could barely contain his anger to the people who were wasting his time and money when he said goodbye.


Though he may have felt it was a waste - the UK has very strict planning laws - particularly for important properties or historical areas. We have to be careful to preserve our heritage


I'm glad that people in the U.K. are seeing how we build houses because when I was there, they wouldn't believe we build houses out of flammable wood products and our roofing materials are the same cheap asphalt junk they use on low pitched roofs.

I guess we live in different countries with different climates and heritage. My parents built a timberframe house in the 70s but that is still quite unusual. Most of our houses are essentially red brick - with some areas using stone. Most house roofing is slate or tile.

Modern buildings increasingly have environmental targets to meet - so insulated walls and ceilings, sealed unit double glazing etc. has been standard for a while. Though of course you can't put uPVC double-glazed units into a historic house!

The thing I noticed about housing there was the windows. What cheap pieces of crap most of them were. You'd think in a climate that gets a considerable amount of rain and cold (and where utilities are very costly) they'd pay attention to how much heat was being lost through them.


Yep - we had a lot of housing built post-war to replace the stuff that was destroyed. We didn't have a huge amount of spare money or resources - we had post-war rationing of resources until 1954...

A lot of post-war houses built until the 1980s will have been built quite simply. Brick construction, tiled roofs, single glazed metal or wood frame windows.

Once we hit the 1980s sealed unit double-glazing became the norm (though not universal)

Many post-war houses have had uPVC double-glazed panels retrofitted (my 70s house has)


Most places I saw only had single or double pane windows that were more in line with what we use for suplimental storm windows. It also appears few people over their feel the need to have screens on their windows.


Screens on windows are unheard of over here. Older properties might have wooden shutters on the exterior. Interior screens to allow you to open windows but keep things from flying in are not really needed as we don't have that many insects or bugs to keep out. We don't have hurricane-type conditions that often - so no major routine need to protect our windows. I've personally seen more windows damaged by bombs than weather (but I saw the result of at least three IRA or Real IRA attacks in London, one of which was where I worked...)

Of course double-glazing is a relatively recent development - and some of our houses date back hundreds of years - and not just the grand ones. It certainly isn't unusual to live in a house over 100 years old in the UK - and putting in double-glazing into some of these properties is difficult to do economically AND in a manner that doesn't ruin the character of the property. (Lots of Victorian and Edwardian properties have sash windows which are particularly tricky)


On the other hand, most places seemed to have their windows open (despite the fact that I visited in the fall and it was actually somewhat chilly), so I guess it really wouldn't matter.


When I've been to the US I've noticed that stores, hotel rooms and offices are often warmer than the norm in the UK. It is October and I would still open a window at home to get some fresh air.

Air conditioning is pretty unheard of in most houses in the UK.


I should say, this was in Ireland and Scotland. I'm not sure if things are different in England.

Not significantly - though construction does vary region by region - as naturally occurring local materials still influence building methods. (Cotswold stone vs London stock bricks etc.)

They have a fairly moderate climate and their living spaces are much smaller than ours on average so they just don't spend as much to heat them. We spend most of our money heating large rooms with nobody in them. Brits are often amazed at how many of our houses have huge living rooms with 20 foot cathedral ceilings. That's a lot of empty space to heat.


Yep - certainly suburban and city centre homes are probably smaller - we're a much smaller country after all!

High ceilings are common in older, grander houses, but in normal family homes, ceilings are nowhere near 20 feet high! (I am 6 foot tall and can change most domestic lightbulbs on tip-toe if I have to...)


They tend to keep their windows open I think because they use radient heat. Forced air heat is unheard of. Fresh air is considered healthy and recirculated air (the stuff most of we Americans breathe in our homes) is unhealthy. I found that many of these beliefs were cultural and historical and their buildings reflected them.


Yep - most heating was historically from central open wood or coal fires, gas or electric fires. Many homes now have central heating systems - but these are almost universally hot water based radiators - usually with heat generated from mains gas, or in more remote areas, fuel oil. Some houses have night-storage heaters (heated at night using cheaper electricity metered separately when consumption is lower) with large thermal inertia that are heated overnight and then release heat throughout the day.

Hot air heating does exist - my mother's house has it, as it was more popular in the 70s when her home was built - but it is not commonplace these days, and many of her neighbours have replaced their forced air systems with radiator based systems. These are also mostly gas-heated.

The UK has a pretty extensive mains-gas network, and converted from coal-generated gas to natural gas around the time of the exploitation of the North Sea gas and oil reserves in the early 70s.

I think because we have a relatively temperate climate and don't suffer very hot temperatures that often, we don't have air conditioning in most normal residences. Modern flats increasingly have it - but houses don't. There is certainly a cultural thing about fresh air being "good for you" is an accepted fact of life.

In the current era of environmental responsibility - normal air con would be very difficult to justify. Better to build houses that are naturally cooler (like those in the South of France that remain cool in the height of summer)


Most houses I see in the moderate climate here only have single paned windows too. One lowly profession there is the "door to door double glazed saleman" who tries to convince people to spend a fortune replacing all their old windows.

Yep - though that is kind of a dying trade and more of a comedy stereotype these days... Most people who want to replace their windows have by now!

The current stereotype of the door-to-door sales person is someone trying to persuade you to change your "virtual" electricity or gas supplier.

Any update on if/when TOH will go HD? I love this show and I think it would be great in HD to really show the details of what they're working on.

I certainly haven't heard anything on the subject. I'm still peeved that they went to 16:9 format in SD without offering the option of viewing it in HD. This is my favorite show on TV and I miss seeing it in fullscreen now.

And they've never answered any of the four or five emails I've sent them at contact@thisoldhouse.com asking about when the show might be available in HD. Maybe it's possible to contact WGBH Boston? They're the producers of the show.

.... I found the contact page at their website:
http://www.wgbh.org/contact/
I'm going to drop them a line asking about this subject. Maybe someone would care to call during the day (9am - 5pm) and try to ask a person directly.

I have a more general question - when a show is broadcast (and presumably filmed) in 16:9 does that always mean that they're using HD cameras? I don't know much about it, but why would they film it in HD and then not show it that way?

I don't know why people keep saying that not many homes have HDTVs:

http://www.engadgethd.com/2007/04/13/28-percent-of-americans-now-own-an-hdtv/

That was almost a year ago, and they sold like hotcakes again this Christmas and Superbowl. I'm sure it's over one third now. On top of that, I'd love to see what percentage of cable or satellite users have an HDTV set. My guess is it's over 50%, and this is the demographic they should care about.

I don't know why people keep saying that not many homes have HDTVs:

http://www.engadgethd.com/2007/04/13/28-percent-of-americans-now-own-an-hdtv/

That was almost a year ago, and they sold like hotcakes again this Christmas and Superbowl. I'm sure it's over one third now. On top of that, I'd love to see what percentage of cable or satellite users have an HDTV set. My guess is it's over 50%, and this is the demographic they should care about.

I tend to agree. Even my 76 year old grandmother bought at 42" HDTV this past Christmas.

whenever i see this title i think of the "in living color" skit "this old box" with damon wayans as antoine washington the homeless guy....theres a fight outside in the alley that you see thru the box door and he closes it and says "....oh wait thats pay-per-view"....classic !!

. Maybe it's possible to contact WGBH Boston? They're the producers of the show.

I have a more general question - when a show is broadcast (and presumably filmed) in 16:9 does that always mean that they're using HD cameras? I don't know much about it, but why would they film it in HD and then not show it that way?

WGBH are no longer the producers of the series. This Old House Ventures has taken over that role.

Yes it is possible to produce a show in 16x9 without doing HD. Being able to produce a show in HD and then get it delivered and broadcast in HD are all separate hurdles to clear. Starting to produce shows in HD now, futureproofs the show without incurring all of the costs to broadcast the show in HD now.

Ahh, well I sent a note to WGBH asking about it, maybe I'll get back something anyway...

Good points regarding the 16:9. I remember seeing on Late Night with Conan O'Brien that the cameras were HD long before the show went HD. But then they continued to broadcast in 4:3 until they started showing in HD, which seems like the right way to do it.

Even if This Old House is shot with HD cameras, why not frame shots for 4:3 while shooting, and crop the edges off in editing (same as Conan, presumably). Broadcasting the show in 16:9 standard definition provides zero benefit to, and only takes away from us, the end viewer. :confused:

Broadcasting the show in 16:9 standard definition provides zero benefit to, and only takes away from us, the end viewer. :confused:

Well there is a little benefit. You can zoom it to have it fill up the whole screen of your HDTV.

Even if This Old House is shot with HD cameras, why not frame shots for 4:3 while shooting, and crop the edges off in editing (same as Conan, presumably). Broadcasting the show in 16:9 standard definition provides zero benefit to, and only takes away from us, the end viewer. :confused:
Shooting 16x9 while protecting for 4x3 is a compromise, that most directors would rather not deal with. Also when doing something like this graphics have to be considered how they would look in this compromise.

Email response I got from WGBH:

"Dear Viewer,

Thank you for your interest in WGBH. We always appreciate hearing from our viewers, listeners, and Web site visitors.

While THIS OLD HOUSE is not currently available in HD, at some point in 2008, PBS will require all programs to air in HD. We are not yet aware of a date and are sorry we can not give you more specific information.

We hope you continue to enjoy the programs on WGBH - produced in Boston, shared with the world.

Sincerely,
WGBH Member Development and Services"

Anyone ever heard this PBS requirement for all shows to air in HD in 2008?

Won't matter; just because a show airs in HD doesn't mean it will be produced in HD. So they'll just upconvert to comply.

Won't matter; just because a show airs in HD doesn't mean it will be produced in HD. So they'll just upconvert to comply.

That's happening now, the response seems to indicate a change will occur in 2008. I take it to mean PBS will require all new shows to be produced in HD.

That's happening now, the response seems to indicate a change will occur in 2008. I take it to mean PBS will require all new shows to be produced in HD.

I take it to mean someone most likely is misinforming the public, because they may not have all the information to answer such questions at WGBH. PBS is such a decentralized network of stations that such a directive does not make much sense.

It would not surprise me if PBS has asked producers to move to HD delivery of their shows, and some producers have taken some of the steps but are not yet ready to be able to deliver an HD product to PBS.

Well there is a little benefit. You can zoom it to have it fill up the whole screen of your HDTV.

But it looks like crap as is. Zooming it up just makes bigger crap.

I do the opposite, shrinking it down so there are black bars on all sides.

That's happening now, the response seems to indicate a change will occur in 2008. I take it to mean PBS will require all new shows to be produced in HD.Not here in the Boston area. This Old House only appears on 2-1 and 44-1 (the SD channels). It doesn't appear on 2-2 (the HD channel).

My email response is almost the same as the one Indiana627 shared:

Dear Viewer,
....

We do not have an exact timeline for when THIS OLD HOUSE will be made available in HD, but can tell you that by the end of 2008 PBS will be requiring all programs to be available in HD. We're sorry we do not have more specific information to report.

....

....
....

Nice to finally have some response on the subject! Notice the slight difference in wording between the two responses.

"at some point in 2008, PBS will require all programs to air in HD"
"by the end of 2008 PBS will be requiring all programs to be available in HD"

Also nice to know it isn't quite a stock reply they're giving people. But it does leave open the possibility that it could be up-converted. I can't picture any shows on my local PBS HD channel that have been up-converted though. I sent them another question asking if they could clarify whether or not it will be true HD.

I suspect WGBH is behind the PBS push for all programs to be HD. I'm sure they'd rather manage programming for five channels instead of the current six, and if they can rely on most PBS programming complying with the intent of that push for all-HD, then they can make 2-1 and 2-2 simulcasts of each other. How many other PBS channels have separate flagship SD and flagship HD channels, the programming for which is separated only by the fact that the HD channel shows only HD programming?

I spoke with the Program Mgr at the Houston PBS station and he allowed as how TOH is not yet being offered to them in either 16:9 WS or HD. Obviously, the new season is being shot 16:9, so it makes one wonder why it's not available in at least WS.

That's odd hdguru, you're saying TOH is still being shown in 4x3 standard defintion?

------------------

I sent WGBH this question to clarify what they meant exactly in their first response (three posts up)...

"By "available in HD," is it meant that This Old House (and other shows) will be produced and presented in true high definition? Or that standard definition shows will be up-converted and presented on PBS HD channels?"

To which they responded...

"THIS OLD HOUSE will be produced and presented in High Definition."

Seems that settles it - we'll be seeing This Old House in true HD by the end of 2008.
:) :cool:

when it becomes "This New House"

it's broadcast on the ota hd channel here in nashville in widescreen

it's broadcast on the ota hd channel here in nashville in widescreen
So out of curiosity and jealousy, I contacted the Nashville PBS station and had a few emails back and forth (I won't name the source as I didn't tell them I'd be posting this info).

What I was told is that they are getting TOH in 4x3 letterbox SD, then they upconvert it to fake HD and zoom in on the 16x9 frame within the letterboxing (I'm not sure which step they do first - or if it matters) and then send it out on their HD channel in widescreen.

I then asked if they knew if the fall 2008 season (probably being filmed already) was going to be in HD. They replied that it's "possible" this past season was filmed in HD, but that PBS didn't have enough satellite bandwidth to send it out to the affiliates in HD, hence the 4x3 letterbox. The good news is that they said PBS just allocated a second satellite for more HD bandwidth, so if TOH is indeed being filmed in HD now, hopefully PBS will be able to deliver it in HD to the affiliates this fall.

Well there is a little benefit. You can zoom it to have it fill up the whole screen of your HDTV.
You're confusing leterboxed SD with widescreen SD.

Widescreen SD does not require the viewer to zoom it to view it full screen 16x9. It doesn't contain any video black bars. It's usually shot anamorphically (even consumer camcorders can do the exact same thing), then mastered to preserve the proper 16x9 aspect ratio. Other than less detail, it appears much like regular HD video. This is how "Cops" and several other shows on Fox are produced.

Letterboxed SD is usually just 4x3 video that has been masked at the top and bottom with black bars, or 16x9 video that has been shrunken to fit a 4x3 frame. A lot of SD commecials are produced this way to get that "widescreen look" on an SD screen.

You're confusing leterboxed SD with widescreen SD.


I'm not confusing anything. WNET (thirteen) NY only shows it on their SD station letterboxed. So on my HDTV it has a black border all around it. In order to get it to fill my HD screen without cutting anything off I zoom it.

I'm not confusing anything. WNET (thirteen) NY only shows it on their SD station letterboxed. So on my HDTV it has a black border all around it. In order to get it to fill my HD screen without cutting anything off I zoom it.

KAET in Phoenix transmits TOH letterboxed on an SD subchannel too. So you're not alone.

I'm not confusing anything. WNET (thirteen) NY only shows it on their SD station letterboxed. So on my HDTV it has a black border all around it. In order to get it to fill my HD screen without cutting anything off I zoom it.
That's not what I was referring to. You said the benefit of shooting widescreen SD (aka: 16x9 SD) is you can zoom it to fill the screen. That's not true. If it were widescreen SD, it would already fill your screen.

What you're seeing is letterboxed SD. That's why it has black all the way around on a widescreen TV. It's a 4x3 image with letterboxing at the top and bottom, not a true 16x9 image.

Let's all save a lot of unnecessary posts: Indiana627's post (a few posts prior to this one) is the definitive information on this topic. Anyone who is getting something other than TOH 4:3 letterboxed means that your local station is doing what the Nashville station is doing: zooming the 16:9 letterboxed image to fill 16:9.

When someone gets confirmed info that TOH will be available in HD or WS by fall 2008, then let's pick up the thread.

Remember, however, that local stations that are not taking the entire PBS HD channel feed...in other words...they are purchasing individual programs in HD...may...or may not choose to downlink and record any PBS HD or WS program. Here in Houston, KUHT dropped the PBS HD channel on 7/1/07 and they have had all kinds of technical and administrative issues that have significantly reduced the number of HD programs we're getting right now.

KAET in Phoenix transmits TOH letterboxed on an SD subchannel too. So you're not alone.
Same here in Buffalo on WNED.

Remember, however, that local stations that are not taking the entire PBS HD channel feed...in other words...they are purchasing individual programs in HD...may...or may not choose to downlink and record any PBS HD or WS program. Here in Houston, KUHT dropped the PBS HD channel on 7/1/07 and they have had all kinds of technical and administrative issues that have significantly reduced the number of HD programs we're getting right now.
Luckily our PBS affiliate WNED does show HD PBS shows (like Nova, Inside, Soundstage, Antiques Roadshow), though they do not show the Jim Lehrer Newshour in HD even though it's available.

That's not what I was referring to. You said the benefit of shooting widescreen SD (aka: 16x9 SD) is you can zoom it to fill the screen. That's not true. If it were widescreen SD, it would already fill your screen.


That's not what the OP I replied to was talking about. He might have given the wrong terminology, but I knew what he meant in relation to this show since it wasn't available on the PBS HD stations in our areas. I clearly know the difference between letterboxed SD on an SD station and SD widescreen on the HD station.

They've been airing a spot in HD where Norm Abram and Kevin O'Connor are in the Ask This Old House barn studio. They talk about the 2009 move to digital and converter boxes / coupons. It's one of those in-between-shows spots that are often rerun.

Well WNET (Thirteen) in NY stopped sending the national PBS HD feed on 5/1 and started simulcasting their regular feed on the HD channel. Saturday I noticed that Ask TOH was completely filling my HD screen. Looked good, but not HD. When the closing ran I noticed the underwriter ads were cropped, so I think they were zooming the letter-boxed SD picture on the HD channel.

I'll bet you're dead on target there. A few other stations have done the same thing. Curious...as there are a number of letterboxed programs that "could" be expanded in a similar way...but are not.

TOH will be in HD by next fall...in fact, many PBS programs will be either HD or WS, as per their program/production specs to program producers/suppliers.

RemyM - That's happening in Columbus also, the normal PBS channel programing is being shown on the HD channel. But the SD picture isn't being expanded here like you described. A letterboxed program on the normal channel will have black on the top and bottom as well as the sides on the HD channel. The programing info on the HD channel is still for the HD shows that aren't being aired anymore.

Seems like it's been doing this for a few weeks so we might have changed on May 1st also. I want the HD programing back!

What's going on? :confused:

Anyone heard any updates about this upcoming season being in HD or not?

Supposed to be in HD

Anyone heard any updates about this upcoming season being in HD or not?

According to these sites the new season will be HD.
http://www.kued.org/?area=programs&action=viewSeriesDetails&id=112
http://www.iptv.org/series.cfm/12860/this_old_house_hour

According to these sites the new season will be HD.
http://www.kued.org/?area=programs&action=viewSeriesDetails&id=112
http://www.iptv.org/series.cfm/12860/this_old_house_hour

Sweet, I hope TPT2 out of the Minneapolis/St. Paul DMA carrys it, otherwise I will put an antenna up to get KYIN out of Southern MN/ North Iowa...

EDIT: Got this email back from TPT:

Dear Garrett,

Thanks for contacting member supported tpt. We appreciate hearing from you.

We will be airing this program [This Old House] on tpt HD beginning on October 2nd at 7 pm. Enjoy!

If you'd like to get the inside scoop of what's happening at tpt, and receive email updates about special programs, schedules, events, online features, and more sign- up for our bi-monthly e-newsletter tpt -e at:
http://tpt.blogs.com/newsletter/

Please let us know if you have any questions or concerns.

Sincerely,
Erica Nelson
Member Services

P.S. If you're not currently a member, please consider supporting. Membership is our single largest source of revenue. Without our members support we would not be able to bring you the quality programs you have come to expect on Twin Cities Public Television. As a Member, you will receive a full year of our program guide tpt Magazine, as well as discounts to Hotels, Car Rental Companies, and much more. Of course your membership is also tax deductible, and the best part is you will be supporting the programs you enjoy! You can join online at:
https://www.tpt.org/support/pledge/

Excellent! I've been disconnected for most of the summer - thanks for the update.

This Old House and ATOH in HD this week, will post screencaps if anyone wants!

Glad to hear that it will finally be in HD. This is the only TV show I regularly watch. I live in the Boston area- the 1st airtime is Thursday 8 pm & that is on the SD only WGBX (WGBH has a 2nd channel WGBX, but it isn't broadcasting any HD yet- or if they are, Comcast isn't passing HD along.) It is rebroadcasted the following Saturday afternoon on WGBH- which is HD.

So to catch it in HD, I'll have to watch on Saturday afternoon when it airs on WGBH- which is tough- I'm usually busy doing something... Hopefully either WGBX will begin broadcasting HD soon or they switch the Thursday broadcast to WGBH. The latter is doubtful though- during the fundraising periods they often completely skip entire episodes and I have to search for and watch missed episodes on the Rhode Island or New Hampshire PBS channels (which I also don't get HD passed along via Comcast- not sure if they're broadcasting in HD yet.) I've always been amazed that TOH gets this treatment from it's originating station! The other oddity is that during some parts of the season, the RI and NH PBS stations are several episodes ahead of WGBH- again, weird treatment from it's originating station.

Anyway, despite my complaining, glad to hear that it will finally be in HD. The last year or two where it was letterboxed SD seemed rather dumb.

Glad to hear that it will finally be in HD. I live in the Boston area- the 1st airtime Thursday 8 pm the shows will be played on the SD only WGBX (WGBH has a 2nd channel, but it isn't broadcasting any HD yet- or if they are, Comcast isn't passing HD along.)

One thought, DVR!!!!

So to catch it in HD, I'll have to watch on Saturday afternoon- which is tough- I'm usually busy doing something... Hopefully WGBX will begin broadcasting HD soon or they switch the Thursday broadcast to WGBH. The latter is doubtful though- during the fundraising periods they often skip entire episodes and I have to watch missed episodes on the Rhode Island or New Hampshire PBS channels (which I also don't get HD passed along via Comcast.)

PBS is its' own deal, compared with cable or the big broadcast networks.....

Anyway, despite my complaining, glad to hear that it will finally be in HD. The last year or two where it was letterboxed SD seemed rather dumb.

This sucked, I edit them with Videoredo and render them to 250MB each episode with AutoGK, the resolution gets pretty low with a 480i digital record being cropped to 480i widescreen.....

DVR won't help in Boston, if things are the same as they were over the summer: If WGBH-DT doesn't broadcast it Thursday 8PM, it will probably not be in HD when it is rebroadcast later.

This Old House and ATOH in HD this week, will post screencaps if anyone wants!

Please do...:cool:

Not shown on MPT's HD channel at all.

Not shown on MPT's HD channel at all.

Does WETA or WHUT carry This Old House, or is it exclusive to MPT? Of course we know that HD isn't even on the horizon for WHUT.

HD on PBS Digital via WTVS-DT Detroit Comcast.

HD on WNTV in Upstate SC.

Please do...:cool:

Will see if I can get good representative caps and post them in the morning....

Here they are. TOH is not as sharp as say CSI Miami, but it does not look to bad all things said and done...

This Old House in HD!!!!


http://i151.photobucket.com/albums/s129/gjvrieze/TOH1.jpg

http://i151.photobucket.com/albums/s129/gjvrieze/TOH2.jpg

http://i151.photobucket.com/albums/s129/gjvrieze/TOH3.jpg

http://i151.photobucket.com/albums/s129/gjvrieze/TOH4.jpg

http://i151.photobucket.com/albums/s129/gjvrieze/TOH5.jpg



Ask This Old House in HD
http://i151.photobucket.com/albums/s129/gjvrieze/ATOH1.jpg?t=1223040668

http://i151.photobucket.com/albums/s129/gjvrieze/ATOH2.jpg?t=1223040763

http://i151.photobucket.com/albums/s129/gjvrieze/ATOH3.jpg?t=1223040791

http://i151.photobucket.com/albums/s129/gjvrieze/ATOH4.jpg?t=1223040814

http://i151.photobucket.com/albums/s129/gjvrieze/ATOH5.jpg

Hope that on the Saturday afternoon showing on WGBH, it's shown in HD. I too have noticed that WGBH has been showing lots of HD material in letterboxed SD - on their HD channel! I don't know if they're cutting costs (if they pay PBS less $$ for the SD versions of shows.)

Glad to see that TOH isn't doing a drippingly wealthy couple's house this year- at least they don't appear to be. Although anyone who lives in Weston likely has quite a bit of dough- it's one of the most expensive towns in MA.

Some years they do houses where I'd be lucky to afford a house that's 1/3 as grandiose. I've had several people who have told me that they no longer watch the show because of this.

Okay, off my soapbox...

I don't know if they're cutting costs (if they pay PBS less $$ for the SD versions of shows.)That's not it. Rather, PBS broadcasts the HD version of shows at specific time(s). Any affiliate can, of course, broadcast it at that time, passing the PBS feed through. Affiliates can also record the PBS broadcast, and broadcast locally at later point(s) in time, but only if they have specialized (read: expensive) equipment to record HD and broadcast it (in HD) later. That's reportedly a bigger expense than WGBH can make from petty cash :) so they were evidently waiting for additional capital funds to become available to make the purchase and integrate it into their operations.

Glad to see that TOH isn't doing a drippingly wealthy couple's house this year- at least they don't appear to be. Although anyone who lives in Weston likely has quite a bit of dough- it's one of the most expensive towns in MA.

Some years they do houses where I'd be lucky to afford a house that's 1/3 as grandiose. I've had several people who have told me that they no longer watch the show because of this.

Okay, off my soapbox...

I am pretty happy with whatever project they do(that said, this year's project, looks very cool) I use the show as a great source of keeping up with what the latest home tech is, and I get a ton of good ideas, watching Tommy and Norm out pace unforeseen problems!

Thanks for the explanation bicker1. Hopefully the equipment will come over the next year or two. I'm sure the switch into HD isn't easy with the economic downturn. Too bad the switch wasn't fully in gear during the go-go years of the late 90s!

gjvrieze- I agree with you that the methods & materials that they go over are very useful to know. I completely renovated my current house over a period of five years and am hoping to have a house built next year (if it's possible to obtain financing!) There is a ton of stuff on the show that has been/will be great to know, even if I can't afford it to the scale on the show.

Well, it's on right now- 5 pm on WGBH DT and it's still letterboxed SD! I'm hoping that Comcast is passing on the wrong channel- otherwise that means that 'GBH really doesn't give a shite about one of the shows that they originate! Unbelievable!

Well, it's on right now- 5 pm on WGBH DT and it's still letterboxed SD! I'm hoping that Comcast is passing on the wrong channel- otherwise that means that 'GBH really doesn't give a shite about one of the shows that they originate! Unbelievable!

Did you watch it on WGBHDT2?

Yes! Is it full screen for you? If so, then perhaps the issue is that Comcast is passing along the wrong signal?!?!?

Wait, I see you're in SC...

Yes! Is it full screen for you? If so, then perhaps the issue is that Comcast is passing along the wrong signal?!?!?


What do you mean they are passing the wrong signal? Are you watching on 802? If so, then the issue is with WGBH.

What about Seattle? There was no This Old House episode on today. :confused: I d'on't see any TOH listings for the next two weeks! :( What is KCTS doing over there?

Well, it's on right now- 5 pm on WGBH DT and it's still letterboxed SD! I'm hoping that Comcast is passing on the wrong channel- otherwise that means that 'GBH really doesn't give a shite about one of the shows that they originate! Unbelievable!I got the same thing OTA, on channel WGBH-DT via my antenna. The problem is at GBH, not Comcast.

Did you watch it on WGBHDT2?What do you mean they are passing the wrong signal? Are you watching on 802? If so, then the issue is with WGBH.Friend, are you watching via Boston Comcast? If so, then they must have made special provisions just for you, because what WGBH broadcast was letterboxed SD, not HD.

What do you mean they are passing the wrong signal? Are you watching on 802? If so, then the issue is with WGBH.

Comcast's 802 is letterboxed SD (for TOH, but not all programs- some are true HD.) GBH broadcasts standard def digitally over-the-air on 2.1. They broadcast in HD on 2.2. 2.2 is a simulcast of 2.1, but 2.2 is supposed to be all the same content in HD. So there's a small chance that it's Comcast that is screwing up and putting 2.1 on 802 and not 2.2.

Here is the wiki page:


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WGBH-TV

Digital Television
The station's digital channel is multiplexed:

Digital channels

Channel Programming
2.1 Main WGBH programming
2.2 WGBH HD

Formerly WGBH HD showed a separate slate of programming from the analog channel to showcase PBS's high definition content; however, in 2008 it switched to a high-definition simulcast of the analog channel, with standard-definition programming presented in windowbox or letterbox format.

--

I also have a TV Tuner card in my PC that tunes Clear QAM. 2.1 was full screen but standard def. 2.2 is high def, but TOH was letterboxed- just like 802 via my Comcast box. So it's doubtful that Comcast is passing the wrong channel on 802.

--

I just saw bicker1 state that he watched o-t-a and it was also letterboxed SD, so that confirms the issue isn't with Comcast.

For those in the Boston area- please file a complaint here: http://wgbh.org/contact/ Thanks!

Friend, are you watching via Boston Comcast? If so, then they must have made special provisions just for you, because what WGBH broadcast was letterboxed SD, not HD.

I just wanted to verify you were watching via 2.2 and not 2.1.

Yup, I sure was. I knew that this was coming, and specifically tuned in OTA to check.

Good advice given earlier: Surf to http://wgbh.org/contact/ to complain.

It was in HD on KQED at 5pm Saturday.

WNET in NY will broadcast the first two episodes of the new season next Saturday at 7, hoping they are in HD, the guide does flag it as HD.

That's not it. Rather, PBS broadcasts the HD version of shows at specific time(s). Any affiliate can, of course, broadcast it at that time, passing the PBS feed through. Affiliates can also record the PBS broadcast, and broadcast locally at later point(s) in time, but only if they have specialized (read: expensive) equipment to record HD and broadcast it (in HD) later. That's reportedly a bigger expense than WGBH can make from petty cash :) so they were evidently waiting for additional capital funds to become available to make the purchase and integrate it into their operations.

Bicker1- you're spot on stating that 'GBH doesn't have the funding for equipment to capture the HD feed from PBS for later showings. Here's the response I got from 'GBH:

--
Dear Viewer,

Thank you for your interest in WGBH. We always appreciate hearing from our viewers, listeners, and Web site visitors.

At this time, programs produced in HD that do not originate from WGBH are broadcast in HD in their initial broadcasts only (i.e., those fed directly from PBS). This is because we do not currently have HD server storage capacity. THIS OLD HOUSE is fed from PBS and does not air on channel 2 at it's initial broadcast feed so we are unable to broadcast it in HD. Over the next year, as WGBH and PBS continue to expand HD production and distribution, you will be able to enjoy more and more of your favorite shows in a widescreen, high-definition format.

We hope you continue to enjoy the programs on WGBH - produced in Boston, shared with the world.

--

Seems lame to me- they DO originate TOH. I'm going to respond that they need to remove the HD flag in their 5 PM schedule listing.

You'll probably get the same reply. There are certain replies that are approved for distribution. They cannot craft and vet responses to every possible question that a viewer might submit, so I wouldn't expect to see something relevant come back from such a specific question.

What a pile of CR_P! WGBH is one of the most successful PBS stations in the country. Even our local station, KUHT (Univ of Houston) can record HD programming...if...if it's uplinked at a time when they can catch it...as there are some conflicts and most HD shows are not uplinked more than once or twice. Yesterday's TOH was 16:9 letterboxed. We'll see about next week. We do get Motorweek in WS, SoundStage, Austin City Limits, Antiques Roadshow...and many others in HD.

WGBH evidently considers other things more important. After all (projecting what they're thinking) people can still watch TOH -- it isn't like they're not broadcasting the show.

WGBH evidently considers other things more important. After all (projecting what they're thinking) people can still watch TOH -- it isn't like they're not broadcasting the show.

God, I feel lucky; with TPT (Twin Cities Public Television), they record and rerun their HD feed on non PBS feed (it is ONLY HD material, no SD period) and they have a simulcast which carries the SD analog channel contents on a digital sub... This Old House has actually been "rerun" a couple of times thus it is easy to catch it, if the dvr misses it the first time...(IIRC)

WGBH also just moved into an enormous flashy new building earlier this year- and so I'm sure a lot of their money (for the next 50 years probably!) will go to pay for that... New building, HD transition, bad economy - all at once!

http://www.wgbh.org/support/studiotours

Not shown on MPT's HD channel at all.

This Old House was in HD on MPT today, although resolution was a bit low.

Ask This Old House was on before it with an HD screen that said Presented in HD. But the show was in SD because of some kind of technical problem.

They were window-boxed SD.:mad:
I got full screen HD from WNET , no window box, on Fios (ch 513) .
The "regular" SD channel (13) was windowboxed SD ....

I got full screen HD from WNET , no window box, on Fios (ch 513) .
The "regular" SD channel (13) was windowboxed SD ....

:o Stupid me. Since this has been set up in my DVR for a couple of years to only record first run episodes it's set to record the SD channel. WNET-DT switched in May from the national PBS HD feed on the HD channel to a simulcast. TOH was not shown on the national PBS HD feed. Thanks for the heads up.

KUHT, Houston has broadcast the first 2 new episodes in SD/letterboxed. I've asked if they plan to go HD; however, I understand that they experienced significant damage from the hurricane and I suspect that this is the least of their issues.

KUHT, Houston has broadcast the first 2 new episodes in SD/letterboxed. I've asked if they plan to go HD; however, I understand that they experienced significant damage from the hurricane and I suspect that this is the least of their issues.

Not sure what feed you're watching, but the 12:30 airing Saturdays on KUHT-DT (Comcast 308) has been full screen HD the last two weeks. The program guide does not list it as "This Old House Hour", but the two shows are shown back to back.

Looks like WGBH in Boston _finally_ has their HD capture system in place (for timeshifting HD material.) There's an Ask This Old House rerun on right now (I'm assuming it's not coming from PBS' live feed- which is always in HD) that is in HD.

Finally...

Incredible. So I go to check the schedule for the next episode of This Old House, the first episode of the Brooklyn project -- the January 23rd episode -- isn't even being broadcast on on WGBH-HD... we'll have to wait until the second episode of the Brooklyn project -- January 30, 4AM -- to see if our wait is over.

I see here:

http://www.thisoldhouse.com/toh/tv/house-project/overview/0,,20277827,00.html

that the Roxbury house they're working on currently won't begin airing episodes until January 2010...! Have they reduced the number of episodes TOH is doing "next" season- or is there another project that's not covered on the website that will begin airing in September/October 2009?

If anyone knows.... thanks!

I see here:

http://www.thisoldhouse.com/toh/tv/house-project/overview/0,,20277827,00.html

that the Roxbury house they're working on currently won't begin airing episodes until January 2010...! Are the number of episodes TOH is doing "next" season- or is another project that's not covered on the website airing in September/October 2009?

If anyone knows.... thanks!

Interesting. I know TOH usually has about 6 months of "lead" time from time of the project, to time it airs. Maybe another part of the season is already in the can. If I have to wait until January of 2010 for new episodes, I think that I am going to die!

If I have to wait until January of 2010 for new episodes, I think that I am going to die!

Yeah, it's the ONLY tv show that I try to catch every episode.

If this is the "2nd" half season project ... Then both will apparently be in the Mass area .. Usually the longer 1st "main" Project is in the Boston/Mass areas, & the 2nd is in another state.
Being that this listed project is in Boston & their "30th" anniversary project .. It would seem to be the 1st half of the season ...
Perhaps the date is wrong ...

Yeah, it's the ONLY tv show that I try to catch every episode.

I don't think I've missed more the two or three episodes in the last 30 years. TOH and Antiques Roadshow are my PBS mainstays.

If they've already begun the Roxbury house -- and they have; the web cams are on -- but it won't air until 2010, maybe it's a whole-season build, like the Carlisle farm and the Manchester shingle house?

Doesn't explain why it's being held back 3 months, but it also doesn't sound like there would be time to air their typical winter project.

Looks like WGBH in Boston _finally_ has their HD capture system in place (for timeshifting HD material.) There's an Ask This Old House rerun on right now (I'm assuming it's not coming from PBS' live feed- which is always in HD) that is in HD.

Finally...

Is That When WGBH Changed Their On Air Bugs A Little Bit As Well? And What Date in January 2009 Did WGBH Finally Have Their HD Capture System As Well? Or Was It Between December 25, 2008 and January 26, 2009 Did WGBH Do That?

The title of this thread from '07 needs a change ...
Tricked me into thinking the new season of TOH is 10/2/09

BTW ... What is the premier date?

The title of this thread from '07 needs a change ...
Tricked me into thinking the new season of TOH is 10/2/09

BTW ... What is the premier date?

October, check your local listings as it varies by PBS station.

Here are summary's of this season's projects.
http://www.thisoldhouse.com/toh/tv/house-project/overview/0,,20287370,00.html

http://www.thisoldhouse.com/toh/tv/house-project/overview/0,,20277827,00.html

Good- they _are_ going to have a full season this year! The Roxbury house was featured on the website a few months ago stating that episodes begin in January- made me wonder if there were going to be any new episodes this fall! I'll have to look on the TOH website to see if they ever put webcams up in the Newton home. So they're doing two houses in MA this year...

Yeah, that'll probably save money over relocating (or sub-contracting) a crew in another state).

New season premieres tonight on many PBS stations. My PBS station, WNET Thirteen NYC, runs them at 7:00 on Saturday's.

As far as I can tell, WGBH doesn't plan on offering This Old House in HD in prime time this year. They're offering it Saturdays 5PM.

Wow, this thread went dead!

I like this year's project, but am not crazy about the new graphics. Also, they messed with the opening of the show and it is not that great, if they want/wanted to go into the 30 year history, I would have loved that though!

Yeah, the thread is dead: I have to wonder how much the fact that they're not presenting the show in HD in prime time anymore has adversely affected interest in the show, overall.

Yeah, the thread is dead: I have to wonder how much the fact that they're not presenting the show in HD in prime time anymore has adversely affected interest in the show, overall.

I get in HD Saturdays at 7:00 on WNET, New York.

Yeah, the thread is dead: I have to wonder how much the fact that they're not presenting the show in HD in prime time anymore has adversely affected interest in the show, overall.

There is a lot of variation in PBS program run dates, unlike the big 4 networks. This must hurt viewership, when the local affiliates move the times/dates around. I had to make a favorite in Sage TV just to keep track of when it is on, as I have access to 4 PBS stations (3 with HD, one in SD only) and they are all over the place, often one station is one week behind. Nice if one misses an ep, but confusing to move people)

I get in HD Saturdays at 7:00 on WNET, New York.Prime time runs from 8PM - 11PM on Saturdays in New York, so that's another major market with they're no longer running This Old House in HD in prime time. I'm even more surprised about that, because here in Boston, at least, it is broadcast in SD in prime time (on WGBX). Is there anything like that in New York.... does WNET have a second broadcast channel or sub-channel on which they broadcast This Old House in SD in prime time?

Prime time runs from 8PM - 11PM on Saturdays in New York, so that's another major market with they're no longer running This Old House in HD in prime time. I'm even more surprised about that, because here in Boston, at least, it is broadcast in SD in prime time (on WGBX). Is there anything like that in New York.... does WNET have a second broadcast channel or sub-channel on which they broadcast This Old House in SD in prime time?

WLIW from Long Island (a sister station of WNET) broadcasts it at 8:00 PM on Thursdays but they don't broadcast anything in HD. WNET has always shown TOH at 7:00 on Saturdays as long as I can remember.

Yeah, the thread is dead: I have to wonder how much the fact that they're not presenting the show in HD in prime time anymore has adversely affected interest in the show, overall.

For me it's more about the content. It's turned into a show about multi-million dollar renovations that are performed entirely by contractors (no sweat equity from the homeowner).

IMHO, the vast majority of people that are willing to drop the sum of money that is typical of recent TOH projects would rather just buy a new house instead (Although I will admit that this applies more to those of us not living in urban NE area where new homes are much easier to get).

Mac The Knife - I have to disagree with your assessment of the show, the list (http://www.thisoldhouse.com/toh/tv/house-project/0,,,00.html) of homes in years past shows that most have been "normal" homes owned by "normal" people, also a few very small homes, with a few affordable housing projects as well. I'm just guessing here, but I think the only renovation that might have cost over a million dollars would be The Carlisle Project, and that was bought, renovated, and sold by TOH, which was an interesting change for the show imo.

I think homeowners help out more than you state, but then I personally don't really care to see the homeowners very often. I enjoy watching the This Old House crew, and the homeowner segments aren't quite as interesting in my opinion. It seems like you want this old house to be more like Hometime. Plus, Ask This Old House is pretty much all about involvement with homeowners, and their direct involvement in lending a hand.

I agree about the new graphics. One of things I love about This Old House is the fact that it's a refuge away from the quick cuts and overuse of computer generated graphics in most of today's TV shows. They aren't using quick cuts thankfully, but imo the new intro is annoying with the clips floating around. How does that enhance the viewer experience?

In Columbus the show runs in HD at 8:00pm on Thursday nights.

Prime time runs from 8PM - 11PM on Saturdays in New York, so that's another major market with they're no longer running This Old House in HD in prime time.

Do we really 'This Old House' in HD?

I think the producers do have to look for homeowner of means, though: Just think about what happened this past episode: They had to replace the structure of the entire first level under the new kitchen. That kind of unforeseen expense could put a project like this off for a few months while us normal people try to find new financing. Now TOH might be able to get some of the materials and labor to be donated, keeping them on the production schedule, but with a larger problem, the homeowner (and we've heard this complaint coming from some of the less affluent homeowners in the past) may be forced to spend money that they didn't intend on spending, much more quickly than they would have wished, solely because the show must go on and TOH has a production schedule. I wouldn't be surprised if homeowners have to put down a bond as part of the agreement, to be used in case necessary, in consideration of the promise of the routine donations.

Mac The Knife - I have to disagree with your assessment of the show, the list (http://www.thisoldhouse.com/toh/tv/house-project/0,,,00.html) of homes in years past shows that most have been "normal" homes owned by "normal" people, also a few very small homes, with a few affordable housing projects as well. I'm just guessing here, but I think the only renovation that might have cost over a million dollars would be The Carlisle Project, and that was bought, renovated, and sold by TOH, which was an interesting change for the show imo.
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Let's see, I remember that comtemporary unit in Boston where the brass ballaster and handrail for the staircase cost $60k all by itself. And the risers were a custom steel fab that must have easily been five figures. And each of the stair treads were 4 inch thick Teak planks (which is now banned for importing so it had to be reclaimed) they would be an easy mid three digits for each tread. So that's pushing close to 6 digits just for the staircase. Then the guy easily added six digits worth of AV equipment. So there's a fifth of a mil without even talking about most of the work.

Then there's that NY Brownstone that they completely gutted the place and had hundreds of hours of time refinishing all the wood, replacing all the windows, repointing all the bricks, replacing all the HVAC stuff, landscaping all the back yard. If all that wasn't over a seven digits (esp. considering the higher costs of everything in NYC), I'd be stunned.

And then there was the "pre-fabbed" woodframe which basically meant tearing the entire house down and reframing it from the ground up. Where they had a ginourmous crane on sight for several weeks (I wonder what the cost of the crane alone was? I'd guess low five digits maybe mid five digits due to the length of time it was on site). And there must have been at least $200k worth of landscaping due to all the extra work they had to do to comply with wetland regulations.

I'm guessing the Boston duplex and the NO shotgun were a little cheaper. Maybe in the $500-750K range.

I will admit I slightly exaggerated on the "multi" part. Most of them probably where right around $1M-$1.5M and didn't quite break $2M.

But still at a price point where I'd just be buying a new house rather than dumping into some old clunker out here (Obvious this doesn't apply to New England where it's much more difficult to get a new home built).


I think homeowners help out more than you state, but then I personally don't really care to see the homeowners very often. I enjoy watching the This Old House crew, and the homeowner segments aren't quite as interesting in my opinion. It seems like you want this old house to be more like Hometime. Plus, Ask This Old House is pretty much all about involvement with homeowners, and their direct involvement in lending a hand.

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Yeah, I'd be more interested if it was more like it used to be, which is more like what Hometime is now (although ToH always had a little more of a professional air to it than Hometime has ever had). And yeah, since I know I'm never going to drop a $100K on just a staircase, it's starting to loose some relevancy to me. YMMV.

No offense intended, but that's a lot of guessing. The truth is we don't know just how much they're spending, except I think when they work with nonprofit organizations. I have wondered whether TOH contributes some of their own money to pay for some interesting things that the homeowner wouldn't have paid for otherwise, in order that they can be talked about on the show. Maybe someone knows if this is or isn't true? Certainly there are many expensive features that have been in the show, but that's not the whole story of This Old House.

The point of This Old House is to show a full season's worth of episodes that depicts old houses being renovated, added onto and so forth, so naturally the cost is usually high. Those homeowners who choose to buy a new house instead of working on their old home are never going to be seen on This Old House, so I don't understand your reasoning there. I like that homeowners restore (and improve) their old homes. The only other option is letting them deteriorate to the point where they'd eventually be torn down.

Both homes this season are reasonably inexpensive projects. The Newton Centre house is getting a small addition, and the Roxbury House is a foreclosed and boarded up house that is being worked on by a nonprofit organization. You mentioned The New Orleans house, which was a small home in the Lower Ninth Ward, and alongside that they also showed the building of a small home going to a young musician. Also mentioned was The East Boston House, a reasonable renovation paid for by two different people living on separate floors. The Washington, D.C. Rowhouse was worked on by another nonprofit organization with a very limited budget. And you also mentioned the New York City House, which did have some expensive features, but the homeowners renovated two of the four floors in order for them to be rented out.

Again, I agree that there are sometimes exorbitant features added to some of these homes (which I'm interested in seeing). The project page (http://www.thisoldhouse.com/toh/tv/house-project/0,,,00.html) shows some expensive projects, I don't mean to ignore that. (I personally like all of their projects.) But there are also homes where the budget is small and can't be exceeded. I don't think pegging This Old House one way or the other is accurate, it's all these things. And in all honesty, most people will never be getting a full renovation or an addition to their home anyway, so if an viewer wants to see what they could be doing to their own home, shows like Ask This Old House, Hometime or those on the Home & Garden network would be the ones to watch.

I hope I don't sound argumentative. I for one love This Old House and the work that they do, across all their homes.