I am going to be running cable thru out my parents new house. Since I will be running homeruns I will need about 900 feet total. They will have digital cable from Cablevision/IO. They really don't care about upgradability.

I'm wondering if I should use RG6 Quad or Dual?

From what I've read, the opinion on this various greatly. Some people say it's only needed when you live close to an airport or military base or have any extreme amount of wireless gear/radio frequencies around you. Other people say it's a necessity in any house.

I don't know if my parents would notice the difference, they are currently happy with their old 27" TV's on regular cable.

So what is the real world difference between Quad and Dual?

FWIW, The longest run will be 80', all the rest will be quite a bit shorter. I will be terminating with PPC EX6 compression F connectors that work with both Dual and Quad shielded RG6.

Better shielding can't hurt. And, it's cost differential isn't too much, if you figure in something for the labor.

If you look out the window, almost anything you see can now be a transmitter. Even trees, billboards, light stanchions and power poles. It's all over the place. So, you don't necessarily have to be near any major installations.

The other problem is, the Digital Cable channels can be anywhere in the spectrum....actually, "most everywhere in the spectrum" is a better way to put it. So, your/their favorite channel might be sent in the same frequency band as a local TV station, an FM station, or a two-way radio or cell transmitter. Ingress (leakage of the signal in to the Cable) can be a problem.

Not to mention the usual array of inside-the-home sources of interference, like lights, refridgerators, microwave ovens, computers, digital musical instruments, etc.

Thanks for the response!

I'll have to check out the supplier to see what the cost difference is.

FWIW: Cablevision installers now use tri-shield here on L.I.
If it's close to the cost of standard RG6, then why not use it. Just remember to buy RG6 Quad ends too, as regular RG6 ends won't fit on quad cable.


The cable installer left 300' still in the 1000' box here last month because it was raining and he didn't feel like dragging the pullbox back to his van. My Digicon RG6 Snap & Seal (Blue) ends didn't fit on the tri-shield cable.
This was on the box: "Andrew Coaxial Cable A677TS-BVV "
http://www.andrew.com/catalog/product_details.aspx?id=1007


I've been very happy with CommScope cable, looks like the quad-shield is only $20 more/1000' roll than tri-shield. $129 for 1000' quad vs $109 for 1000' tri-shield.
http://www.yourbroadbandstore.com/products/coaxial-cable.php#indoor6

Really?

I thought that a 1K' roll was going to be over $300, I thought I read people talking those prices here.

If I could get 1K' of RG6 Quad for anything under $200 I will be very happy!

Buy two @ Home depot:
BICC
500 Ft. Black RG 6 Quad Shield Coaxial Cable

Model 92041-45-08

Price: $63.00/ea

I'd point you here - $95 - but they are out until early May:
http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=102&cp_id=10216&cs_id=1021604&p_id=2964&seq=1&format=2&style=

Skip the quad shield...

Belden's info tends to indicate their tri-shield with the Duobond Plus outer wrap is superior to quad shield. It has a shorting fold in the outer foil layer that effectively electrically "seals" the shield wrap.

Get Belden 7915A, it's RG-6 tri-shield with solid copper core and sweep tested to 3GHz. I've seen 1K' for around $110 at this place. (https://www.tselectronic.com/belden/7915a.html?tse_Session=118612dd9557c06ea16bb2fc0300bbfb) Maybe cheaper elsewhere...

This stuff has the DuoBond Plus outer shield configuration and with 3GHz rating, is more than enough for CATV, broadband, SAT, you name it. It's good stuff, Maynard....

Buy two @ Home depot:
BICC
500 Ft. Black RG 6 Quad Shield Coaxial Cable

Model 92041-45-08

Price: $63.00/ea
So Home Depot or Monoprice cable is just as good as the expensive brands?

This is some general information directly from the Belden website that describes their higher grade shielding configurations.

Duobond III (Tri-Shield)
Duobond III utilizes the Duobond II design (foil/braid) plus an additional surrounding layer of Duofoil. This extra layer of foil improves shield reliability and provides an additional interference barrier.

Duobond IV (Quad Shield)
Duobond IV adds a second layer of braid to the Tri-shield design (foil/braid/foil/braid). This extra layer of braid shield provides improved strength and durability.

Duobond Plus®
This shield features the same foil/braid/foil construction as Duobond III but with the additional of a shorting fold in the outermost foil. This fold prevents a slot opening from being created in the shield, thereby preventing signal egress or ingress. This unique feature creates the effect of a solid metal conduit, which improves the high-frequency performance of the cable.


To me, it's important to note that Belden basically says the outer braid of quad shield is for strength and durability, not increased shielding.

The Duobond Plus shielding (like on the 7915A cable) seems to claim the best ingress/egress protection due to the shorting fold on the outer foil shield.

Seems the better option in two ways - comparable in price or cheaper than Quad, and better ingress/egress protection.

']So Home Depot or Monoprice cable is just as good as the expensive brands?

Right up front, I'm not expert. But I used the Monoprice bulk quad shield when I finished my basement. I have runs up to 90 feet. And they all work fine for me.

Get Belden 7915A, it's RG-6 tri-shield with solid copper core and sweep tested to 3GHz. I've seen 1K' for around $110 at this place. (https://www.tselectronic.com/belden/7915a.html?tse_Session=118612dd9557c06ea16bb2fc0300bbfb) Maybe cheaper elsewhere...

The website listed above says to use standard RG6 Snap-N-Seal connectors on the Belden tri-shield.
FWIW, I couldn't get the Thomas and Betts standard (blue ring) RG6 Snap-N-Seal connectors, or Digicon (blue ring) standard RG6 connectors to fit on the Andrew tri-shield cable. Maybe Belden tri-shield is different, but I'd be certain it fits before I order 50-100 of the wrong ends.

I don't currently have any of the Belden, but I do have some Commscope tri-shield and am using Thomas & Betts Snap-n-Seal SNS1P6U connectors (red ring - if that matters) that fit just fine.

Hopefully this does not insult your intellegence, but I have to ask - you are removing the outermost foil shield before putting on the connector, yes?

I don't currently have any of the Belden, but I do have some Commscope tri-shield and am using Thomas & Betts Snap-n-Seal SNS1P6U connectors (red ring - if that matters) that fit just fine.
Funny, tri-state doesn't even list the Thomas and Betts SNS1P6U for use on the Belden tri-shield?



Hopefully this does not insult your intellegence, but I have to ask - you are removing the outermost foil shield before putting on the connector, yes?
Yes, I had to remove the outtermost foil shield to get the blue RG6 connectors to fit. The cable guy didn't do that with the black connectors he used.

Ok, I just went down to our equipment room (at my job) where our cable connections are. On the Andrew tri-shield coax cable- the technician from Cablevision used (black) PPC EX6XL connectors: http://dlsus10.chainreactionweb.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=629
So, it looks like with the tri-shield you really have to be specific w/the ends you use.

This is some general information directly from the Belden website that describes their higher grade shielding configurations.

Duobond III (Tri-Shield)
Duobond III utilizes the Duobond II design (foil/braid) plus an additional surrounding layer of Duofoil. This extra layer of foil improves shield reliability and provides an additional interference barrier.

Duobond IV (Quad Shield)
Duobond IV adds a second layer of braid to the Tri-shield design (foil/braid/foil/braid). This extra layer of braid shield provides improved strength and durability.

Duobond Plus®
This shield features the same foil/braid/foil construction as Duobond III but with the additional of a shorting fold in the outermost foil. This fold prevents a slot opening from being created in the shield, thereby preventing signal egress or ingress. This unique feature creates the effect of a solid metal conduit, which improves the high-frequency performance of the cable.


To me, it's important to note that Belden basically says the outer braid of quad shield is for strength and durability, not increased shielding.

The Duobond Plus shielding (like on the 7915A cable) seems to claim the best ingress/egress protection due to the shorting fold on the outer foil shield.

Seems the better option in two ways - comparable in price or cheaper than Quad, and better ingress/egress protection. Why does the triple shielded 7915A cost 3 times less than the dual shielded 1694A? What's the difference?

The website listed above says to use standard RG6 Snap-N-Seal connectors on the Belden tri-shield.
FWIW, I couldn't get the Thomas and Betts standard (blue ring) RG6 Snap-N-Seal connectors, or Digicon (blue ring) standard RG6 connectors to fit on the Andrew tri-shield cable. Maybe Belden tri-shield is different, but I'd be certain it fits before I order 50-100 of the wrong ends.
I was told that PPC EX6 XL was just about the best compression F-connector. A nice feature is that they work on both dual and quad shield so I bet they will surely work on your tri shield.

EDITED: I see by your next post that you already knew that, Oops :p

']So Home Depot or Monoprice cable is just as good as the expensive brands?

You bet.

']Why does the triple shielded 7915A cost 3 times less than the dual shielded 1694A? What's the difference?

1694A is billed as a precision video cable having very tight impedance tolerances and very low loss. It's not really intended for CATV/broadband use, but I'm not sure why it wouldn't work fine for that. I guess one would have to carefully study the tech docs in detail to know for sure. Belden makes it and is an acknowledged "expert" in the field so I trust their opinion/recommendation.

I would speculate the primary reasons for the increased cost are the tighter manufacturing tolerances and that 1694A has 95% copper braid shield vs. 80% aluminum braid shield.

Personally, even though 1694A looks better on paper in some specs, I would stick to the cable use recommendations of Belden and stay with the 7915A as a premium cable for CATV/broadband/SAT use.

Belden 1694a is a fine coax with a bare copper (versus copper clad steel) center conductor, a foil shield, and a 95% tinned copper braid. By all means a great coax, but overkill for CATV distribution in the home.

Elsewhere there is talk about tri-shield vs. quad shield. As with anything, it depends on the quality of the manufacturer. Assuming it is all Belden (very good quality), the tri-shield will get you almost the same shielding protection as the quad-shield, especially in the higher frequency range. Braid is generally best for low frequencies, foil for high. That having been said, quad is much, much more common.

Be careful where and from whom you purchase the quad-shield, however. Most of the no-name coax out there does not come close to true 60/40% braid coverage. Stick with reputable brands like Belden (mentioned here) Commscope, General Cable, Honeywell Genesis, and Coleman Cable (Signal Brand). You should be able to find General Cable at Home Depot, General or Coleman at Lowe's, and Coleman at Menard's.

Connectors are also important. Be sure to use a compression type that seals the end of the coax well, and pay attention to whether you are buying a dual or quad connector to match the coax you have installed.

Hope this helps.

Funny, tri-state doesn't even list the Thomas and Betts SNS1P6U for use on the Belden tri-shield?



Yes, I had to remove the outtermost foil shield to get the blue RG6 connectors to fit. The cable guy didn't do that with the black connectors he used.

Ok, I just went down to our equipment room (at my job) where our cable connections are. On the Andrew tri-shield coax cable- the technician from Cablevision used (black) PPC EX6XL connectors: http://dlsus10.chainreactionweb.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=629
So, it looks like with the tri-shield you really have to be specific w/the ends you use. Hello again, I had a question about what you said here:

Yes, I had to remove the outtermost foil shield to get the blue RG6 connectors to fit. The cable guy didn't do that with the black connectors he used. What did the cable guy do, just fold the foil back with the braid? I thought you were supposed to rip the foil off then fold the braid back (and of course leave the inner foil untouched around the dielectric)?



FWIW, I decided to go with the 7915A like whoaru99 recommends. I have 100 PPC EX6 connectors as well, it should all make for a good installation at my parents house.

']Hello again, I had a question about what you said here:

What did the cable guy do, just fold the foil back with the braid? I thought you were supposed to rip the foil off then fold the braid back (and of course leave the inner foil untouched around the dielectric)?
It looks like he just slipped the PPC EX6 connector over the foil, no other prep work? I couldn't really get a good look from my vantage point, but he didn't waste any time trimming or fooling with the braid/foil at all. It was- strip cable w/coax strip tool, seat end on coax, fix end on cable w/compression tool. About 10 seconds for the whole procedure.

Thanks for the response!

I have Cablevision too and a cable that was installed by them not too long ago is a tri-shield just like you explained. I found it easy to strip and clean the end, and my PPC-EX6 connectors went on without too much fuss, but held tight. It seems like the Tri-shield is the way to go for me, the 7915A seems perfect.

If anyone has any info on the proper way to strip tri-shield I would appreciate it. I assume you rip the outer layer of foil off, then fold the braid back.

ok, I guess I'm one of those that is having issues.

I just installed regular RG6 Dual from Home Depot.

Having all sorts of pixelation.


So I was told by the cable company TWC, that I just had bad wiring. I was planning on changing how I ran my wiring, so I got the Home Depot dual.

I also have a master antenna in my apartment building, and I had RG59 which of course would not work after we went digital.

So I ran the Home Depot Dual stuff and made direct runs from access points.

So for cable, it has a 3 way splitter, one direct to internet modem, one to living room tv and one to bedroom tv.

The master antenna, has a 2 way splitter, one going to living room TV and the other to the bedroom TV.

Both transmission types are still having issues.

The master antenna is not able to get NBC unless, I disconnect the splitter and just go to one tv. (I actually in the end, need to run into another bedroom so I will have to split to get to that bedroom when I solve this issue).

Cable TV which only had an issue on certain channels, such at E! entertainment (724 in NYC if I'm correct).

Now after putting in this new Home Depot stuff, E! is better, but I'm getting pixelation on almost every channel, not a lot, but it's annoying. Every few seconds or so.

So I was about to run out and get the Quad, and now am totally confused because of reading about this 'Tri' stuff.

I don't care about cost at this point.

So which is the better of the two if money is not an object, Quad or TRI, which does better at shielding.

And which connectors should I use, is there a special shielded type for each of these wiring types.

I don't want to call cable for a service call and having them blame me on my wiring, yet again. LOL!

And do amplifiers really help (yes, I know, don't use them on the internet modem run of the wiring).

Thanks!

Rob

PS I guess I will handle shopping around for the best price, just need to know which way to go.

The DuoPlus stuff, looks too stiff for me going around corners? And was it Quad or TRI anyway?

Thanks again!

Are you sure about the quality of your cables?
Is the cable modem also having issues?
Look at the modem diag screen and check the D/S and U/S levels.

I don't want to call cable for a service call and having them blame me on my wiring, yet again. LOL!

And do amplifiers really help (yes, I know, don't use them on the internet modem run of the wiring).

well you already replaced your rg59 and it still doesn't work so you wanna go out a replace the WIRE you just replaced ?!?!


Honestly it doesn't sound like it's a quality issue with the wire itself but maybe a quality issue of connectors or installation of connectors. Your best bet would be to call the cable company, take the hit of them blaming your work and get them to make it right with their connectors and troubleshooting tools. It may be more than just the connectors and I just can't imagine having your cable company fix it for you being any more expensive or more of an inconvenience than rebuying yet even more cable wire and connectors only to find out it still doesn't work.

Most DIY cable installations lead to numerous problems for the people that do them especially with the digital age upon us. It really isn't as Foolproof as it was 10 years ago. I would let the cable company handle it so you can stop second guessing everything and enjoy the tv your paying for.

I agree with weags I doubt it's your cable very likely the connectors and a junk splitter. What we can get locally especially the connectors and the method they are attached doesn't compare to what the cable installers use. I've been doing my own cabling for years and that's the two issues I run into, connectors and splitters.

Did they check the signal quality at the entrance? You shouldn't need amps with what little you have unless they're very long runs. Where is the splitter installed at the entrance?

As for the antenna is this an outdoor antenna? How do you know it's pointing correctly? An amp may help on the antenna. I have a $20 outdoor antenna I now use as a backup since I get those channels with my cable co. I never had any issues as long as it was pointing in the right direction.

I agree with weags I doubt it's your cable very likely the connectors and a junk splitter. What we can get locally especially the connectors and the method they are attached doesn't compare to what the cable installers use. I've been doing my own cabling for years and that's the two issues I run into, connectors and splitters.

Did they check the signal quality at the entrance? You shouldn't need amps with what little you have unless they're very long runs. Where is the splitter installed at the entrance?

As for the antenna is this an outdoor antenna? How do you know it's pointing correctly? An amp may help on the antenna. I have a $20 outdoor antenna I now use as a backup since I get those channels with my cable co. I never had any issues as long as it was pointing in the right direction.

I did replace all the splitters in the house, I'm using the ones that state they are for digital distribution. Not the 500-900 mhz stuff (not sure if I got that numbering correct, but you know what I mean).

I used at DigiMax (from the cable company) at the entrance, which is only inches inside my apartment, and the cable is boxed in the stairwell in building, and they have 4 ports per floor, one for each apartment on a floor.

The DigiMax is rated at 5mghz - 1ghz each side is -3.5db, it's tri-splitter as I mentioned in my original message.

On the cable box in diagnostic mode, there are errors.

They calm (cable) that I have too much power? Too high of a signal?

Doesn't make sense to me.

As far as the Master Antenna, because I'm in an apartment building, the antenna itself is on our roof (I live in a 15 story building, I live on the 4th floor). There is a amplifier in the basement (ground floor) that feeds up to each of the apartments with some kind of BNC wiring (it's really very thick), installed over 50 years ago when the building were built.

When we went digital, the replaced the antennas, repositioned them, and swapped out the old amplifiers.

I went to the office and they are going to try and find me an new wall plate, which is where I tap into the master antenna of the building.

When I mentioned I was having trouble with channel 4 (what it used to be) or I should say NBC, she said most residents were having trouble with NBC. Not sure if they are broadcasting from the same location as all the others.

When the World Trade buildings went down, not all of the broadcasters moved back to the Empire State Building (where it was before they built the original WTC). So it's kinda of hard to focus on multi-locations to receive reception.

I hope when the new WTC is rebuilt (seems it finally might be finished in 2 more years) they move the broadcasting back to one tower!

I'm wondering if it could just be the cable box itself, not able to handle the data compression that they are using.

Yes, I am willing to pull out the wiring that I just installed. It is all running through a molding, so all of these wires, are very close together. There are 2 cables in RG6, one for cable tv, the other for regular over the air tv, then there is a door bell that is located in my bedroom that I used old telephone wiring to hook it up with, which is a 12volt system. Probably doesn't do anything, since it only sends a signal when someone pushes the doorbell.

The other is 2 CAT 5 network wiring.

Lastly, there is about 3 wireless routers through out my house. And 2 6.0 cordless phone systems.

So when I read about outside interference, I figured upgrading to Quad wiring was the better way to go in the long run, to run out anything causing any inference in my reception on TV.


Thanks again.

Rob

Most DIY cable installations lead to numerous problems for the people that do them especially with the digital age upon us. It really isn't as Foolproof as it was 10 years ago. I would let the cable company handle it so you can stop second guessing everything and enjoy the tv your paying for.

They will not rewire my house!

Unless, I pay a month salary for them to do it!

And they won't string it into my molding, they go the route that is the easiest for them on the outside of the wall.

I have molding that it goes into and it's actually a shorter distance than they take.

I've already asked for them to rewire it, and they said since I was an existing customer, I would have to pay to have it done!

Rob

They will not rewire my house!

Unless, I pay a month salary for them to do it!

And they won't string it into my molding, they go the route that is the easiest for them on the outside of the wall.

I have molding that it goes into and it's actually a shorter distance than they take.

I've already asked for them to rewire it, and they said since I was an existing customer, I would have to pay to have it done!

Rob

Suit yourself but I guarantee you between all the trips to the hardware store not to mention the wires and connectors themselves you have already paid much more than most cable companies will charge you. The one I happen to work for is 30 bux an outlet. Not exactly monthly wage type of stuff.

If you don't like how they would run it ask them to run it your way and then you can take care of the molding. At least you can be assured everything including wire and connectors are put on right and are of good quality. They would also check your signal. You may just have a few bad connectors, or better yet it may not even be a wiring issue. You going out and replacing all the wires yet again will tell you none of this and probably won't fix your issue.

And yes high signal can cause the same issues as low signal. I don't believe that's your issue though. It could be the box too, but why not get it all checked out in one shot instead of all this back and forth and redoing this and that. When I'm in a house we check all services and make sure they are all in spec regardless of whether the customer requests us to do so. It helps to stop repeat service calls and fixes problems before the customer experiences any.

Im just giving you advice on what I would suggest you doing. Just like anything else, you can keep spending money multiple times over until you get it right or call the professionals and pay them to fix it for you.

I don't personally care what you do, i have no vested interest outside of offering help from my own experience ,but I have been in multiple hardware stores and see what they charge for cable hardware and wire and it makes no sense to me why, when you add it all up ,nevermind your time spent doing it, why people don't just have the cable company do it to start with. I can't imagine your cable company charging that much more than mine.

I see it all the time and that's why I'm usually there to rip out all the crap that people thought they were saving money by installing themselves. And they get charged just like any other service provider would charge.You wouldn't expect the electric company to rerun all your internal wires for free just because you pay a monthly service fee would you? Or if you do your own plumbing repairs and things don't go as planned would you expect the plumber to give you a break just because you tried to do it yourself?

Howdy all,
Hope you don't mind if I chime in with a few things. Been doing cable since late 70's and am currently the Special Ops contractor for a major MSO who fixes both Residential, Commercial and System problems.
First it does not matter about the Tri,Quad, bla bla bla shielded cable for residential applications under most circumstances. To many exceptions to list and if you fell under one of them the Cable Co would have installed the different wire.
Just use an average RG-56 cable. NEVER go to Radio Shack for anything cable TV related.
I usually give the customer a few connectors, splitters and cable if they need them.
As most of the stuff the sub gets a hold of is junk and will cause system noise issues.
rOriginal Poster 900' of cable? How many home runs?
A common mistake by residential subs is to home run every room in the house and then try and find a large splitter to to connect them all. With the splitter loss on such a big splitter or worse yet multiple splitters you have run out of signal and everything runs poor.
Pixelation Post
You say you have pixelation which is most likely caused by low levels.
Get online using the cable modem or router at the location with the problem.
Go here Crap first post won't let me post Url. OK Google Thomson cable modem diagnostics ( Most everyone can check basic modem stats here) If site is down check some of the others just need info below.
I am hoping a data box will come up and you can get some numbers.
Upper left side of the page should say diagnostics, click that,
I am interested the the Return Path Power level and what it says.
Should be measured in dBmV.
I don't want to bore you with too much mumbo jumbo and will try to explain in layman's terms what we are doing.
By checking the dBmv of your cable modem AKA "Transmit level" I can get a rough estimate of the forward levels you have. This will be rough depending on the splitter configuration you have before the modem, but it will allow me to see if you do in fact have too low of levels. Most modems want to see below 56 dBmv transmit level. Most cable systems give you 10 dBmv from the tap which is called headroom and this makes up for the splitters you have feeding phone, cable modems & cable boxes. It's simple math really.
You start with 10 and subtract. A 2 way split = -3.5 loss. A unbalanced 3 way split can be- 7.5,-7.5 and -3.5 for the outputs and a balanced 3 way is -5.5. most of the time as there is a few brands that are- 6.5.Pretty much add anything in a residential application over a 4 split and you have screwed the pooch as they have too much loss.
One of my jillion jobs is to fix cable modems with poor performance that are transmitting to hot. Most of the time this can be resolved by reconfiguring the splitters to give the modem more signal. Your cable box can run fine at -4 or-5, however,the same level to the modem will be too hot of a transmit and will run slow,intermittent or not at all.
So if you can get on that site and post the number here we can go from there. As long as your getting numbers grab the SNR ( Signal to Noise Ratio) under the Forward section as well. It wants to be over 30 dBmv:cool:

By checking the dBmv of your cable modem AKA "Transmit level" I can get a rough estimate of the forward levels you have. This will be rough depending on the splitter configuration you have before the modem, but it will allow me to see if you do in fact have too low of levels. Most modems want to see below 56 dBmv transmit level. Most cable systems give you 10 dBmv from the tap which is called headroom and this makes up for the splitters you have feeding phone, cable modems & cable boxes. It's simple math really.
You start with 10 and subtract. A 2 way split = -3.5 loss. A unbalanced 3 way split can be- 7.5,-7.5 and -3.5 for the outputs and a balanced 3 way is -5.5. most of the time as there is a few brands that are- 6.5.Pretty much add anything in a residential application over a 4 split and you have screwed the pooch as they have too much loss.
One of my jillion jobs is to fix cable modems with poor performance that are transmitting to hot. Most of the time this can be resolved by reconfiguring the splitters to give the modem more signal. Your cable box can run fine at -4 or-5, however,the same level to the modem will be too hot of a transmit and will run slow,intermittent or not at all.
So if you can get on that site and post the number here we can go from there. As long as your getting numbers grab the SNR ( Signal to Noise Ratio) under the Forward section as well. It wants to be over 30 dBmv:cool:

Not sure I agree with you here. Knowing transmit levels will not help much in figuring out receive levels. Reason being is that someone fed off an end of the line tap with have much different levels specs forward and reverse than that of someone on the first tap off an amp. So on and so forth, the length of cable in the house and from the street will also decrease receive levels while leaving the transmit virtually untouched give or take a db or so. Not to mention that quality of connectors and/or workmanship installing them can also affect trasmit and receive levels independently right down to a certain frequency. Again all this guesswork is just that and not just simple math. Too many factors that you didn't consider.

Second most cable companies supply more than 10dBmv nowadays and again this depends on where your house is fed from on the network. No cable system can be designed to be 100 % exactly the same due to certain issues with long runs and cascades depending on geographical locations. Downtown new york will run much differently than say a little town in Montana where house are all widely spread out. Anything over a 4 way splitter is by no means a death sentence for you signal. It all depends on the many factors ive previously mentioned .Again thats just misinformation and more guesswork.

Lastly most cable modem manufacturers have spec of -15 to +15 to work fine with a transmit of up to 56. We use a spec of -10 to +10 with a transmit of 52 max Having a modem at -4 or -5 is perfectly fine as long as the transmit levels are within spec and while I haven't done a jillion jobs I've done enough to see that this is acceptable unless there is something else going on. Most issues of intermittent connection or slow speeds are due to SNR and transmit levels and often having nothing to do with receive levels as the they don't always go hand in hand. While an SNR of 30 will work it's not exactly acceptable, anything lower than 32 you will see issues in my experience.

The moral of the story is call the cable company. They have the test equipment and the right connectors and such to replace if need be. Going through and doing all the work yourself as suggested Is not only flawed and inaccurate but a waste of your time and money. Unfortunately you've already invested a lot of each so I am just trying to help you avoid any further.

Not sure I agree with you here. Knowing transmit levels will not help much in figuring out receive levels. Reason being is that someone fed off an end of the line tap with have much differet levels specs forward and reverse than that of someone on the first tap off an amp. So on and so forth, the length of cable in the house and from the street will also decrease receive levels while leaving the transmit virtually untouched give or take a db or so. Not to mention that quality of connectors and/or workmanship installing them can also affect trasmit and receive levels independently right down to a certain frequency. Again all this guesswork is just that and not just simple math. Too many factors that you didn't consider.
Again I tried to do this quick in laymen's terms without going into great detail here on a general site. I know the system I work on. The drop loss per 100' with our manufactures cable as well as all the other loss's of the other components we have.
Second most cable companies supply more than 10dBmv nowadays and again this depends on where your house is fed from on the network. No cable system can be designed to be 100 % exactly the same due to certain issues with long runs and cascades depending on geographical locations. Downtown new york will run much differently than say a little town in Montana where house are all widely spread out. Anything over a 4 way splitter is by no means a death sentence for you signal. It all depends on the many factors ive previously mentioned .Again thats just misinformation and more guesswork.Misinformation and guess work to the inexperienced
.It does not matter about system levels or any other numbers I have put out as EXAMPLES as the cable company will be putting levels to your home to run your equipment properly and hopefully within manufactures specifications. What I am trying to do is let the equipment tell me what they are doing and if they are doing it with in specifications.
FYI I am from Montana ( Missoula/Hamilton Area)As a contractor have upgraded their systems. From upgrading complete towns from cable,electronics and sweep.When it was TCI,then AT&T and now Bresnan.Some of these towns I have done multiple times. I have upgraded/rebuilt the old Charter systems that were bought as well.From strand,cable,splicing,activation and sweep since the late 90s. Before that it was, "We build the best and teach the rest". Anyone who has been in cable for a time will understand that last phrase.

Lastly most cable modem manufacturers have spec of -15 to +15 to work fine with a transmit of up to 56. We use a spec of -10 to +10 with a transmit of 52 max Having a modem at -4 or -5 is perfectly fine as long as the transmit levels are within spec and while I haven't done a jillion jobs I've done enough to see that this is acceptable unless there is something else going on. Most issues of intermittent connection or slow speeds are due to SNR and transmit levels and often having nothing to do with receive levels as the they don't always go hand in hand. While an SNR of 30 will work it's not exactly acceptable, anything lower than 32 you will see issues in my experience. I see you are using the word most a lot.Why is that? I'll tell you why. Every system is different and what applies here, may not apply there. What every cable system must have is signal. Picking apart my examples serves what purpose in trying to help this guy with his problem? Nothing in this business is set in stone and there is to many variables.With all of YOUR specs you have for YOUR system how is that going to help here. All I was trying to do was give an example. So sit back, read on, and you may learn something from my 33 + years in the business on how to trouble shoot an issue

The moral of the story is call the cable company. They have the test equipment and the right connectors and such to replace if need be. Going through and doing all the work yourself as suggested Is not only flawed and inaccurate but a waste of your time and money. Unfortunately you've already invested a lot of each so I am just trying to help you avoid any further.

Not meaning to bump heads on this site with my first post, If you read my original, this was for a ROUGH estimate. I am fully aware of SNR issues and the levels of go and no go. It has been my experience that if a modem is that low you replace it.If you are generating that amount of noise to cause the snr of your modem to dump in the 20's, your system node will also see it in overall modem performance and a noise crew would be sent as it would be system affecting bla bla bla.
So what is it I was trying to do here, just as if I was doing a Docsis test for the modem.If the TX level was was through the roof, I would suspect that there was low signal. Pixelation + High TX usually means low signal levels. So any loss numbers for gear or system levels at amp or end of the line tap don't mean much to me at this point in the diagnosis as I will let his devices talk to me.
I now know we have Pixelation and High TX. I can now move on with other tools I have to find his down and upstream Frequency of the modem and get their levels. AHH a light bulb should have clicked for you now to see what I am doing and where I am going to figure out the levels, which all I am concerned with is if they are low.
If this is a system issue with levels others would be having a problem as well and system would be dispatched. I am going with odds here as yes he could be the only drop on a terminating tap that someone ran over the ped and crushed his drop.
As far as contacting the cable company, I believe the Cable co was contacted and wanted to charge him a bundle to rewire his home? I could understand that, however they should have offered him some cable and connections at least at a discounted price.
I don't know about the rest of the country and it's cable systems. We would rather give the sub the proper equipment for free or a discounted price, than have them go to Radio Shack and install garbage that we may have to come out and troubleshoot in the future because it is causing so much noise it's killing the rest of the neighborhood or worse yet our commercial customers.

Again I tried to do this quick in laymen's terms without going into great detail here on a general site. I know the system I work on. The drop loss per 100' with our manufactures cable as well as all the other loss's of the other components we have.

Good luck with that.The worst way to troubleshoot a problem is to start at he equipment and "guess" what you SHOULD have there. This is exactly what you're doing.

Misinformation and guess work to the inexperienced
.It does not matter about system levels or any other numbers I have put out as EXAMPLES as the cable company will be putting levels to your home to run your equipment properly and hopefully within manufactures specifications. What I am trying to do is let the equipment tell me what they are doing and if they are doing it with in specifications.
FYI I am from Montana ( Missoula/Hamilton Area)As a contractor have upgraded their systems. From upgrading complete towns from cable,electronics and sweep.When it was TCI,then AT&T and now Bresnan.Some of these towns I have done multiple times. I have upgraded/rebuilt the old Charter systems that were bought as well.From strand,cable,splicing,activation and sweep since the late 90s. Before that it was, "We build the best and teach the rest". Anyone who has been in cable for a time will understand that last phrase.

While I haven't been in the business for 33 years, I will assure you I'm not inexperienced.I don't proclaim to know everything just because of my experience either. I have known many people in various trades who have been in them for ages who still don't know other parts of the business, they may act like they do but they don't. Age and time in a company mean little to nothing considering 20 plus years of your teachings probably don't apply anymore or have changed . I'm sorry but it is very rare to find a contracted splicer/plant tech who knows much about the inside of a home. It sounds like you are well versed on the plant side. Have you ever worked inside customers homes troubleshooting issues? For an extended time? It sounds like you have built and rebuilt systems but have you had to troubleshoot them. There is a big difference. I am also unaware of you catch phrase due to my "inexperience".


I see you are using the word most a lot.Why is that? I'll tell you why. Every system is different and what applies here, may not apply there. What every cable system must have is signal. Picking apart my examples serves what purpose in trying to help this guy with his problem? Nothing in this business is set in stone and there is to many variables.With all of YOUR specs you have for YOUR system how is that going to help here. All I was trying to do was give an example. So sit back, read on, and you may learn something from my 33 + years in the business on how to trouble shoot an issue

I see you saying 33 years a lot. I get it, and hopefully by now you see that I won't agree with your theories and troubleshooting processes even if you were the man who created cable TV himself. Me disagreeing with you serves the purpose of not having him waste more of his time and money trying to troubleshoot a problem using just a cable modem. It reads one frequency !!And all you are asking for is the TX !! In order to troubleshoot the RECEIVE levels !!! We have already determined he has signal issues. So now you give him your "rough(inaccurate)" signal on one frequency. How does that help ? How does that tell you what his signal is on the other frequencies, his actual problem frequencies? HOW IS THIS GONNA HELP HIM FIX THE PROBLEM !! Once again back at square one of running new cable , installing connectors without the right tools, etc etc, bla bla bla.

Here is you original quote :"One of my jillion jobs is to fix cable modems with poor performance that are transmitting to hot. Most of the time this can be resolved by reconfiguring the splitters to give the modem more signal. Your cable box can run fine at -4 or-5, however,the same level to the modem will be too hot of a transmit and will run slow,intermittent or not at all
So if you can get on that site and post the number here we can go from there. As long as your getting numbers grab the SNR ( Signal to Noise Ratio) under the Forward section as well. It wants to be over 30 dBmv"

Now this is wholly inaccurate and the reason why i gave you the specs I use. First off a modem with levels of -4 or -5 does not have anything to do with "transmitting too hot" . -4 or -5 is the receive and not the transmit and is perfectly acceptable. And if you are saying that a modem with a -4 or -5 receive is TRANSMITTING at a level that is "too hot" because of this, then you and your theory are again ,completely wrong. I can pull up a "jillion" modems that are operating at -4 or -5 and have a transmit level in the 40's. Also the SNR NEEDS to be over 32 not 30 to operate at a reliable level. Even at 32 something is off as I regularly see SNR levels in the 35-39 range.



I can tell you right now this customer HAS signal issues. It's pretty apparent to anyone who has read this post , regardless of time "in the business". So even if you somehow find a way to let him know his "rough(inaccurate)" signal level, we are still back at square one. Now what do you suggest, getting some cable and some fittings from the cable company? And who is going to put these on ? The customer, who MOST likely does not have the correct equipment needed to install these fittings. Again back at square one.

Aside from how to troubleshoot roughly(inaccurately) and inefficiently, I'm still waiting to "learn something from your 33 + years in the business on how to trouble shoot an issue".

Not meaning to bump heads on this site with my first post, If you read my original, this was for a ROUGH estimate. I am fully aware of SNR issues and the levels of go and no go. It has been my experience that if a modem is that low you replace it.If you are generating that amount of noise to cause the snr of your modem to dump in the 20's, your system node will also see it in overall modem performance and a noise crew would be sent as it would be system affecting bla bla bla.

Not meaning to bump heads either but when someone is providing what I deem false hope or information,not to mention unreliable methods of troubleshooting I have to put in my two cents and disagree.

So are you talking about upstream SNR or Downstream SNR? If it is either replacing the modem rarely fixes it.

Many factors can cause poor dowstream SNR, signal tilt(THE BIGGEST FACTOR), poor fittings,water damage, EQUIPMENT, etc. This type of SNR will affect the TV signal and cause pixelation. However I find "in my inexperience" the equipment to be very low on this list. I find techs who look at the equipment as the culprit in a majority of instances to be poor techs. The guy who brings back 40 pieces of "bad" equipment every week , probably has a signal meter that hasn't been powered on during that week. These type of tech are also the ones who waste tons of time REPLACING everything up to and including perfectly good wires, when the issue could have simply been solved with the right test equipment and solid troubleshooting methods. Again this is in my limited experience, but if you are talking about replacing a modem for poor downstream SNR a majority of times, I couldn't disagree with you more if I tried, which is the same way I feel about him re-replacing all the wire in his house.

If it is upstream SNR, again it is very rarely the equipment itself causing this. It is usually ingress from the home(bad wires, bad connectors, etc) or a system node issue. Just because his home is generating a lot of ingress and affecting HIS service does not mean its enough to cause a node issue so the two don't necessarily go together. In my limited experience upstream SNR issues do not cause picture quality issues.


So what is it I was trying to do here, just as if I was doing a Docsis test for the modem.If the TX level was was through the roof, I would suspect that there was low signal. Pixelation + High TX usually means low signal levels. So any loss numbers for gear or system levels at amp or end of the line tap don't mean much to me at this point in the diagnosis as I will let his devices talk to me.
I now know we have Pixelation and High TX. I can now move on with other tools I have to find his down and upstream Frequency of the modem and get their levels. AHH a light bulb should have clicked for you now to see what I am doing and where I am going to figure out the levels, which all I am concerned with is if they are low.

No light bulb here, I'm still trying to figure out what you are doing. So with your "other tools" you find his ONE frequency of the modem and that tells you what? That he has poor signal ? I thought we concluded that he has poor signal 10 posts ago. I thought I made it clear and you somewhat agreed that there are too many factors and variables that anything you give him is pretty inaccurate. So for ha ha's lets say he has -10 on that single frequency and a tx of 54 , where do we go from here ? Let me guess new connectors or new wire(This also brought up quite a few posts ago) All installed without the know how and tools to do it properly. Maybe a light bulb will click now as to why I see this as a complete waste of time.

If this is a system issue with levels others would be having a problem as well and system would be dispatched. I am going with odds here as yes he could be the only drop on a terminating tap that someone ran over the ped and crushed his drop.

Or just a plain old bad drop due to many factors such as water , age,electrical damage, poor fittings , etc etc. Yes if we eliminated all these other factors , I too would agree that the odds against someone running over a ped and crushing his drop are pretty good.

As far as contacting the cable company, I believe the Cable co was contacted and wanted to charge him a bundle to rewire his home? I could understand that, however they should have offered him some cable and connections at least at a discounted price.
I don't know about the rest of the country and it's cable systems. We would rather give the sub the proper equipment for free or a discounted price, than have them go to Radio Shack and install garbage that we may have to come out and troubleshoot in the future because it is causing so much noise it's killing the rest of the neighborhood or worse yet our commercial customers.



I do believe the cable co was contacted(via phone I believe, but not in person,I could be mistaken but that's what it sounds like), however I heard nothing about a price other than the ASSUMED, monthly salary level , which is far from average for what a cable company would charge to run 3 wires not including a wallfish. He just stated they would not run them through his molding, which I believe he was able to do himself. Why not pay to have them run the wire, in the direction he wants to and then he can tuck it in his molding, which he already did with his own wiring.

As far as giving them wire to avoid RS stuff, I agree and disagree , because while the equipment is better , without proper tool and know how, good equipment is useless. I can give you the best plumbing supplies money can by but if you don't know what the heck your doing or have the tools to install it, what good is it gonna do for you or me?

To conclude, all this goes back to rlanza1054's problem. If you read the previous posts you would have seen that he has problems OTA AND cable. This is why he believes it's the wire. This is also why I believe and stated multiple times that it is the connectors and/or installation procedure that is causing his problems and having him redoing everything with the same methods and procedures with better equipment ,would be a waste of time and money. And why him and you knowing the rough(inaccurate) signal levels for a frequency he is not experiencing a problem with is just as impractical.

My advice, skip this mickey mouse troubleshooting, and at least have a tech come to your house in person to check out your issue and give you some ideas. Most of them and some contractors, have the know how and tools to PROPERLY evaluate your situation. Call and schedule an appointment for installation of outlets I would ask for an in-house tech and avoid contractors if possible),they will quote you a fee, if you think its too much, I'd be curious to see how much it was. When they come out explain to the tech whats going on, I'd be hopeful that the tech would work with you to find the best solution and go from there. Most of us technicians who deal with customers everyday are there to help and want our customers to be happy with their service. It costs more to roll a truck to a house multiple times and do nothing or worst case lose a customer ,than it does to do whatever it takes to make that customer happy on the first visit.

This of course is just my "inexperienced" opinion, blended with some cable 101 basics , but I think this is your best course of action, to help you save money and time.

Looks like you put a lot of time into your response trying to find fault in my troubleshooting methods.
I am sorry I don't have the time or will to conduct a Cable TV 101 class here, however I will be posting some how to videos in the coming weeks on a RFoG cable system which will include, the initial acceptance testing of the fiber, the detailed use of the OTDR, understanding and using a fiber loss budget, fusion splicing, a mid sheath entry,some enclosure work as well as aerial cable placement.
This main reason for my visit to this site was for info in working with the Adobe family of products, Blender and Maya for custom graphics in the tutorials.
Back to the poster with the cable problems.
If your cable company is not going to help you out or charge you an arm and a leg, then your best bet for cheap quality parts is Ebay. I see a lot of system guys selling their company stock here.
Depending on your cable type ( which can be had for nothing in the cable co dumpster if your lucky enough to find a few large partials) get the proper drop fittings which are usually labeled to accept the different braid configurations. (duel and quad shield for instance) I would go with a compression type such as a "Snap N Seal". A good compression tool can be had for under $10 and well as a cable prep tool.
Again for figuring if your input levels are low to your modem check the site suggested.
Now with those numbers we get an rough idea of levels where your modem sits as far as levels. With this info in hand we move the cable modem to the first spot where the cable enters the home. Outside should be a lock box which needs to be checked to see if you have any splitters. Ideally you want to hook up your modem before the splitters and again check the levels. If this is a problem with your inside wiring, fittings, splitter configuration, the numbers will talk.
Before I was interrupted by another poster, I would have gone through this step by step. What we have done is to use your modem as a make shift signal level meter.
With the info from the modem in it's first location and now on the input to the house we look at our levels as well as SNR and maybe see what is going on inside.
Depending on what this looks like we may them want to Check both the forward and return Frequencies at both locations.
I am sure your scratching your head and it's seems the other poster with his limited cable experience was doing the same.
All I needed from you was just the numbers and did not want to try and explain what I was doing which would only be confusing.
To anyone else reading this thread, This is not an EXACT science and there are many variables to consider,this is were the 33 years comes into play, however this can be done this way, But baffles others without the knowledge
Normally I would say just contact the cable company which I guess you had done and had no success.
These companies shoot themselves in the foot on a daily basis on the customer service end as well as the technical,The amount of work I have to fix and clean up after their techs is staggering. The cable company pays about as much as an opening position at McDonalds for their starting people for one,and you have to really screw up before they will fire you, most just don't care.
Anyway I am done here with this thread and am going back to what I came to this site for. If you want to do it yourself and what to continue shoot me a PM and we will get you fixed up.
Oh Yeah, look for my upcoming tutorials as you are paying for it. Mr Obama is paying us 100% to install an RFoG(RF Over Glass) Fiber to the home, system. In a village of 600 with 30% living under the poverty level.It is creating ZERO new jobs and these people can't pay for any services this will bring. So might as well check out where your tax $$ are going.

Looks like you put a lot of time into your response trying to find fault in my troubleshooting methods.
I am sorry I don't have the time or will to conduct a Cable TV 101 class here, however I will be posting some how to videos in the coming weeks on a RFoG cable system which will include, the initial acceptance testing of the fiber, the detailed use of the OTDR, understanding and using a fiber loss budget, fusion splicing, a mid sheath entry,some enclosure work as well as aerial cable placement.
This main reason for my visit to this site was for info in working with the Adobe family of products, Blender and Maya for custom graphics in the tutorials.
Back to the poster with the cable problems.
If your cable company is not going to help you out or charge you an arm and a leg, then your best bet for cheap quality parts is Ebay. I see a lot of system guys selling their company stock here.
Depending on your cable type ( which can be had for nothing in the cable co dumpster if your lucky enough to find a few large partials) get the proper drop fittings which are usually labeled to accept the different braid configurations. (duel and quad shield for instance) I would go with a compression type such as a "Snap N Seal". A good compression tool can be had for under $10 and well as a cable prep tool.
Again for figuring if your input levels are low to your modem check the site suggested.
Now with those numbers we get an rough idea of levels where your modem sits as far as levels. With this info in hand we move the cable modem to the first spot where the cable enters the home. Outside should be a lock box which needs to be checked to see if you have any splitters. Ideally you want to hook up your modem before the splitters and again check the levels. If this is a problem with your inside wiring, fittings, splitter configuration, the numbers will talk.
Before I was interrupted by another poster, I would have gone through this step by step. What we have done is to use your modem as a make shift signal level meter.
With the info from the modem in it's first location and now on the input to the house we look at our levels as well as SNR and maybe see what is going on inside.
Depending on what this looks like we may them want to Check both the forward and return Frequencies at both locations.
I am sure your scratching your head and it's seems the other poster with his limited cable experience was doing the same.
All I needed from you was just the numbers and did not want to try and explain what I was doing which would only be confusing.
To anyone else reading this thread, This is not an EXACT science and there are many variables to consider,this is were the 33 years comes into play, however this can be done this way, But baffles others without the knowledge
Normally I would say just contact the cable company which I guess you had done and had no success.
These companies shoot themselves in the foot on a daily basis on the customer service end as well as the technical,The amount of work I have to fix and clean up after their techs is staggering. The cable company pays about as much as an opening position at McDonalds for their starting people for one,and you have to really screw up before they will fire you, most just don't care.
Anyway I am done here with this thread and am going back to what I came to thise site for. If you want to do it yourself and what to continue shoot me a PM and we will get you fixed up.
Oh Yeah, look for my upcoming tutorials as you are paying for it. Mr Obama is paying us 100% to install an RFoG(RF Over Glass) Fiber to the home, system. In a village of 600 with 30% living under the poverty level.It is creating ZERO new jobs and these people can't pay for any services this will bring. So might as well check out where your tax $$ are going.

Good luck buddy. I will continue to work for my mcdonalds wages while you brag about how important you feel you are and how great you are at everything you do. After 33 years you'd think humility would have been something you would have learned. Us inexperienced pions will never know your level of perfection when it comes to cable tv. I know enough people like you and they rarely,if ever live up to their self induced hype.

Once again. I take pride in the service I provide to my customers as do a majority of my coworkers and you insinuating otherwise is quite an insult. I wonder why type of quality work you will do for that village of 600 poverty cases. I could sit here and rant on about the amount of contractor or plant maintenance screw ups we've had over the years but I'm not here for that. It does nothing to help , kind of like running around the house with a cable modem or diving in dumpsters looking for cable wire. That is theft too by the way,even if it is trash. Good advice from your 33 years once again. Can't wait for your tutorials.

Weags, don't waste your effort with someone who is trying to beat you down to stupid, sounds like nwdigicom picked his name off a compression tool and read an SCTE book and now he is giving advice where he is missing the mark..:rolleyes:

I think you do a fine job of giving advice and if the brainiac wants to throw his 2-cents my on a PM go for it. Or haul his butt to Charlotte and we find the BS level. Can't lie in this industry you know that...:)

Rob

Weags, don't waste your effort with someone who is trying to beat you down to stupid, sounds like nwdigicom picked his name off a compression tool and read an SCTE book and now he is giving advice where he is missing the mark..:rolleyes:

I think you do a fine job of giving advice and if the brainiac wants to throw his 2-cents my on a PM go for it. Or haul his butt to Charlotte and we find the BS level. Can't lie in this industry you know that...:)

Rob

Thanks man I appreciate it. :))

Has no one mentioned to the OP that there is a proper bend radius for each type of 75ohm cable? He was running it through moulding, which I would assume means very tight bends. Center conductor can break or migrate through the soft dielectric. I had cable that was installed years ago with nice tight pretty 90degree bends and regular staples that crushed the shielding. I always thought cable was meant to be grainy on analog. My new digital boxes kept crapping out, so I rewired the house with Steren quad RG6. I used nice curving bends and contoured staples. Out of curiosity I hooked the cable straight up to a television (back then we had over 70 analogs) and said, "Damn, we could have been watching this picture for years now!"
Just want to say for short runs a more flexible cable will work and don't pinch it.

Weags, don't waste your effort with someone who is trying to beat you down to stupid, sounds like nwdigicom picked his name off a compression tool and read an SCTE book and now he is giving advice where he is missing the mark..:rolleyes:

I think you do a fine job of giving advice and if the brainiac wants to throw his 2-cents my on a PM go for it. Or haul his butt to Charlotte and we find the BS level. Can't lie in this industry you know that...:)

Rob

I was trying to give advice when this guy stepped in with his 2 cents of in house advice stepping on my foot if you look back.
You what to talk Cable? Bring it on. I am not hiding here in a little AV forum playing king of the mountain to mostly Noobs.
Let's head over to the Cable Bar where I have been a member since it's conception many years ago. This is where the Pro's hang.
Oh and the name, is the name of my company which I have had since the early 90's.I am the original. You may be able to baffle these people with BS, I not buying it and am calling you out!

I was trying to give advice when this guy stepped in with his 2 cents of in house advice stepping on my foot if you look back.
You what to talk Cable? Bring it on. I am not hiding here in a little AV forum playing king of the mountain to mostly Noobs.
Let's head over to the Cable Bar where I have been a member since it's conception many years ago. This is where the Pro's hang.
Oh and the name, is the name of my company which I have had since the early 90's.I am the original. You may be able to baffle these people with BS, I not buying it and am calling you out!

Look dude, I wasn't stepping on your foot, I was simply disagreeing with your troubleshooting methods as they pertain to the specific issue at hand.Maybe you are not used to anyone doing this at your other site but I don't know of you or about you, just that I didn't agree with you. I took the time to back all of this up with multiple reasons as to why.All those numbers you threw out , I explained why they were off. I knew what you were getting at by asking for his levels and I explained why this wasn't the best solution. The only thing you could come back with were compliments for yourself and insults for anyone who disagrees with you.

You may be the big dog at whatever site you frequent and that is good for you, I never doubted your time in the business or knowledge of the business but I did and still do disagree with your advice on this issue. Most people that come here looking for help are looking for practical help. Running around the house with a cable modem and jumping in dumpsters for cable wire doesn't sound all that practical to me.

This last post you wrote sums it all up, a know it all who is extremely defensive and never feels as though he is wrong. Quick to put everyone else down but slow to offer any REAL reasons why, other than because you are better. Did I mention an ego maniac. These are not exactly traits of a good troubleshooter nor a good person and I feel bad for any poor person who has to work with you and listen to your visions of self importance all day.

EDIT: Just stopped by the CABL Bar, and first posting I click into I already see someone bashing someone else out for not knowing something , when he himself cannot answer the question. Amusing to say the least but just what I had figured. And it was a post about the aspect ratios changing on ESPN and other networks on analog tv's. And as I speak even with all with all those "pros" over there no one has yet to answer and let the OP know that these networks have begun broadcasting that way, which even us inexperienced people know. They seem to all be too busy boasting about how much they all know about everything else but the questions raised. Sound familiar ?

I was trying to give advice when this guy stepped in with his 2 cents of in house advice stepping on my foot if you look back.
You what to talk Cable? Bring it on. I am not hiding here in a little AV forum playing king of the mountain to mostly Noobs.
Let's head over to the Cable Bar where I have been a member since it's conception many years ago. This is where the Pro's hang.
Oh and the name, is the name of my company which I have had since the early 90's.I am the original. You may be able to baffle these people with BS, I not buying it and am calling you out!

Yeah big shot it's called the Cabl Bar..get it right and it's where old Linemen look for job's and bitch what Prime did not pay them, mostly these days it's composed of Satellite people...

Pick one from re-building lasher's, Sweeping, fusion splicing, Head-end work. I got more gear in my garage than you ever touched.

Rob

Pick one from re-building lasher's, Sweeping, fusion splicing, Head-end work. I got more gear in my garage than you ever touched.
Rob
I doubt it.
The Cable bar (Oh Cabl bar) is sadly not what it used to be and is a bunch of whiners on the outside.
However, Myself like many others are still members and can be contacted through he site.
Channel, Rocky Mtn, Can-am, CCI ,Burnup & Simms, and even bent over for a week with Mastec, just to name a few are all company's I have worked for in the past from coast to coast since 78. I can still find old Dawgs going back to when I started on that site. Myself like them are the true linemen and started from the ground up on hooks using a Brace & Bit building systems when none existed before.
Why do I say this, because after working 32 states, I have met a lot of good people across the country who are members there and we keep in touch through the bar.

I have worked with just about every piece of Cable Tv electronic from the old Blonder Tongue tubed amps to the 1+ gig stuff that is out there today and fixing a guys install through a forum is a piece of cake, so much so I can do it blind folded which is exactly what I was doing.

So I come to this site looking for some 3d Animation software help to do some tutorials.
I run across a guy who has wired his or I believe his parents and he now has problems. He has already contacted the cable company and they want to charge him an arm and a leg to wire the place.
I figured I would help the guy out. Using the cable modem as a meter checking the levels where it enters the premise and then getting eols through out the house I could pin point where his problem is. More than likely braid around the center conductor.

I was not going to jump down his throat telling him he shouldn't have done this unless he knew what he was doing. No sense in insulting the guy, just give him a hand, trying to let him know I had the experience to do so

So along comes "weags" starting to question me and my methods along with what I should and should not do.
We all know he should have called the cable co and paid the price to have it done right in the first place.
I don't recommend people wire their place themselves unless they know what they are doing, as just like this case problems are created and you may get a noise guy at your door wanting to know why +15 worth of noise is coming from your house and killing the neighborhood.

This was my first post on this site and unlike Ol weags didn't want to give the guy a ration of crap, rather help him fix his problem.

Sorry guys, had to put off the wiring issue for other stuff, and just getting back to reading all the posts.

I want to specifically thank, nwdigicom and weags for trying to explain everything as best you can.

I'm sorry you two got into a tech war over it.

It's funny, because both of you were trying so hard to help me and the other users. You both have taken the time to give very long explanations and descriptions of what can be wrong and what to do. Please don't fight, we want you here to help. And the more help the better.

Remember, reading text can be misinterpreted because we don't have the visual clues of a face to face conversation. Just try and take that into account.

I appreciate anyone and everyone that provides help and feedback.

I personally still want to invest in doing my own wiring. I like doing the work. I'm on disability and so my career was over years ago. But I tend to keep my hands and head up to date. I personally was a trained network technician (not hardware). But as I've said I've been out of it for years now. Just want I can do at home help me stay abreast of things.

Ok, from what I've read, the Tri-Shielding is the best to go, the Quad's outer layer is just for stiffens and durability. So because it's indoors and not subjected to outside weathering, it seem logical to invest in the Tri-shielding.

Also, I have to be sure to order the correct tri-shielding connectors because they are totally different from regular rg6 and quad wiring.

Then, don't make to many home runs to a multiple splitter, right now, I am using what the cable company gave me, a 3 way splitter. One for the living room run, one for the bedroom run, and one for internet modem. I also purchased my own internet modem. I wanted the latest (because of issues) so I got a Motorola Surfboard extreme DOCSIS v3.0 (model SB-6120), which can handle the latest wideband stuff.

So that is my plan, and when I get that done, I will check in to let you all know what happened. If I still have issue, I will then get your opinions and of course, get the cable tech's in here. (Honestly, the last time they were here, they were checking all the levels and I was actually over and they didn't really complain about the wiring itself, just about the connectors.)

I'll end this lastly, by asking, since some of you seem to be sort of local (NY area), would any of you consider doing a personal job? Do you do some of this on the side?

I'd rather have you guys here then the regular cable tech's that keep coming!

Rob

PS

OK, I was about to order the cable when I double checked with a place I usually get my stuff at (cablewholesale).

So for $84 I can get a 500 foot roll of Belden Tri Duo Plus stuff:

http://www.tselectronic.com/shop/product/Belden-7915A-RG6-U-Duobond-Plus-3GHz-RG6-U-Tri-Shield-Broadband-Coax/215

For $74 I can get a 1000 foot roll of Quad cable (they don't sell 500 foot rolls).

https://www.cablewholesale.com/specs/rg6-coax-spool/10x4-091nh.htm

And you can download the spec sheet of this particular quad wiring from that link or here:

https://www.cablewholesale.com/pdfspecs/10x4-122th.pdf

Doesn't make sense to get tri for twice the cost of the quad, or is this quad not very good quality and does it matter?