I currently have a Paradigm PS1000. For home theatre use it has done fine, but I am beggining to appreciate its lacking for music... muddy and unclear at times.

I was considering 'upgrading' to the PW2200, but in other threads, some people have seem less satisfied w/ Paradigm's subs, compared to other choices in the same price range.

The upside if I go PW2200, is that the dealer will let me trade in my PS1000, which should save me 200-300 in the process.

I live in a smaller town in Canada, so my choices are probably more limited... ordering from a US online retailer would be cost prohibitive.

My local dealer carries Paradigm, Focal.
Online Canadian reatilers like Futureshop and Bestbuy would open the possibility for athena, polk, velodyne (http://www.futureshop.ca/catalog/subclass.asp?logon=&langid=EN&catid=10554) and infinity jbl klipsch (http://www.bestbuy.ca/catalog/subclass.asp?logon=&langid=EN&catid=20326)

Of course I am open to other choices as long as you can show me somewhere in Canada to get them.

Or maybe the Pradigm is good bang for the buck, no pun intended.

I'm not sure what we are talking about in terms of $$, so I'll just comment on the subs themselves.

The PW-2200 is a very capable sub. It does not play very loud @ 20Hz, but >30Hz has more than enough output, and I've never felt it was sloppy on music, but I've only heard it in the store.

Another alternative would be SVS. Here is a CAnadian distributor for SVS subs.
http://www.sonicboomaudio.com/

And here is a distributor for hSU subs, but I believe they have another alternative for their Canadian customers, so I would contact them directly before I do anything.
http://www.electronicsforless.ca/ProductMain.aspx?CatID=15

Another sub to look for locally would be the PSB Subseries 6i. It offers a combination of low end power, and midbass output, and retails for $749 U.S. MSRP. Being a CAnadian Manuf, I'm sure you can find it if you search for it.

You could always sell your PS1000, and that would get you some $$ to put towards your new sub.

Good luck.

Thanks Rockem

The retail on the PW2200 is $1099.00 CDN.
My dealer said I could have it for $550+tax if I trade in my PS1000. I imagine I could get it for around 750/800 with no trade in.

looks like the SVS PB12-NSD ($779) and PB12-Plus ($1199) are in the same price range. Actually the NSD (whats the diff anyways) is closer to the retail of my PS1000 (649).

As per another thread I have in the speaker forum, its tough because ideally I would want to hear them and compare to eachother.

A friend recently bought two of the SVS 12" cylinders to replace his PW2200. Even one of them (before he bought the second one) blew away the PW2200. The PW2200 is a fine performer, but SVS, HSU or Velodyne are better value. Ask if you can trade in your sub against the other speakers... if you get a similar trade in value, then you are free to choose any sub that you want in a similar price ranage. The SVS cylinder is likely more than you want to spend, but they have smaller models. Where are you located? You can save on shipping if you can drive to Markham, Ontario to pick one up.

So I would have to buy 2 of the SVS' to get equivalent performance?
Is one of the cylinders not enough?

20-39PCi Cylinder Subwoofer $759 CDN
20-39PC-Plus Cylinder Subwoofer $1049
PC-Ultra Cylinder Subwoofer $1379

so do I need one or two??

As far as retail subs go, the PW-2200 is a good performer. It's relatively compact, looks good, sounds good, and plays as loudly above 30 Hz as anyone could reasonably ask for. Yes, it's output is limited at 20 Hz as compared to the Hsu and SVS subs for the same price. So is every other retail sub. The Hsu and SVS are, in some cases, significantly larger and that plays a part in many homes.

For the price you are getting the PW-2200 for, I would be happy. My 2200 satisfied me for several years before the upgrade bug really set in. One thing's for sure, it will kick the crap out of the PS-1000 in sound quality and depth.

My friend has gone a little nuts lately... he bought two to smooth out the response in his room, and because his home theatre room opens to the rest of the basement and makes the volume big. He went from the PS1200 (which he was happy with until he heard my Ultracube 12) to the PW2200, and then to the SVS. In your room, one would be plenty for volume.

A friend recently bought two of the SVS 12" cylinders to replace his PW2200. Even one of them (before he bought the second one) blew away the PW2200. The PW2200 is a fine performer, but SVS, HSU or Velodyne are better value. Ask if you can trade in your sub against the other speakers... if you get a similar trade in value, then you are free to choose any sub that you want in a similar price ranage. The SVS cylinder is likely more than you want to spend, but they have smaller models. Where are you located? You can save on shipping if you can drive to Markham, Ontario to pick one up.



SVS and HSU subs will beat the PW2200 in the price /performance quest. Not the Velodyne,besides the SPL and HGS/DD series the rest has nothing great and the PW2200 bests the DLS series.

That SVS is pretty tall. I have understood the Paradigm might not do so well in a corner.

How finicky is the SVS Cylinder as far as placement is concerned?
Is there an 'optimal' placement?

Optimal placements are achieved by testing gobbluth... moving it around your room and using the spl meter and running LF sweeps... plotting a graph and see where you best results come from with different placements... every room is different, and its up to you or not to find the best placement... :)

Its not a never ending job... you can find the best place, with a bit of patients, and dedication.

Its worth it in the end, to know your getting the best from your equipment from the effort you put into setup... :)

yeah, but I have a wife, so placement will have very few limited options... so knowing it tends to do well in a corner would be a good thing :)

but yes, testing i know...
:)

When I first got my PB12-Plus/2 I set it up in the corner behind my plasma, (my room is layed out in the corner - see my pics below) and I thought it was pretty good, did sweeps, then I moved it out of the corner and ran sweeps again, a great improvement... I didn't move it very far..... Waiting on my Velodyne SMS-1 to optimize...

I think it sounds amazing now... can't wait to play with the velo... which I know will improve things greatly... Its not huge differences, just optimizing... when you get the sub of your budget, you just play with it a bit, and get to where your happy... you will be happy with any of these fantastic ID subs... the tweaking is part of the game, not a downfall... It seems right now a big mystery, but when you get your equipment, you will be thrilled with the performance.... no matter where you put it... minor adjustments just make it better.... :) I too was all worried before I got my stuff... then I just bought it and I $hit my pants the first time I heard it... :)

I just keeps getting better with time and playing around to tweak things...