I need some help. I have a Westinghouse 4207 - 42" LCD with Direct TV HD box (H20). I am still receiving black bars on the left and right side of my pictures from certain HD shows like survivor, simpsons and some news. Other programs on the same HD network come in full screen. I am definately getting HD signals of 720 or 1080 for the shows mentioned. The inconsistancy is frustrating for someone new to the HD scene.

DirectTV has no explanation and either does Westinghouse??? I was under the impression 720P or 1080i signals would come in full screen automatically. The TV has very limited aspect ratio options (Full or Standard) and you cannot change Format options through the DirectTV remote on HD channels.

Are the black bars the norm for some HD signals and it just depends on how certain shows are broadcast? And, more importantly, can anyone comment on how NFL Ticket games come in on HD. If anyone has this TV/Sat set up I'd like to learn more. All feedback is appreciated!

OK, here we go....

Survivor, Simpsons and most news aren't in HD. They're upconverted to HD but they correctly retain the SD 4:3 aspect ratio.

I need some help. I have a Westinghouse 4207 - 42" LCD with Direct TV HD box (H20). I am still receiving black bars on the left and right side of my pictures from certain HD shows like survivor, simpsons and some news. Other programs on the same HD network come in full screen. I am definately getting HD signals of 720 or 1080 for the shows mentioned. The inconsistancy is frustrating for someone new to the HD scene.

DirectTV has no explanation and either does Westinghouse??? I was under the impression 720P or 1080i signals would come in full screen automatically. The TV has very limited aspect ratio options (Full or Standard) and you cannot change Format options through the DirectTV remote on HD channels.

Are the black bars the norm for some HD signals and it just depends on how certain shows are broadcast?

Everything you listed (simpsons, survivor, much news programs) are not produced or broadcast in HD.
They get passed thru (or "upconverted to") the 720p/1080i HD signal, so your box will report it as being HD (Everything on the HD channels will report as HD, even when much of it is upconverted)
They add the black bars to "fill" the screen.

Yep, most HD stations add black sidebars for non-HD programs like you listed, also for commercials and local/syndicated programming. Only true HD programming on the network's primetime schedule is full screen HD.

Yep, most HD stations add black sidebars for non-HD programs like you listed, also for commercials and local/syndicated programming. Only true HD programming on the network's primetime schedule is full screen HD.
NBC San Diego screwed up yesterday and aired that series... 60 something... as 4:3 letterboxed. Looked weird on an HD channel, considering that this show actually is HD.

Thanks to everyone who responded to this issue. I have accepted my black bar fate! I can't wait for the technology to catch up to my purchase.

I don't know if your tv is susceptible to image burn. Watching with black side bars over long periods of time can cause burning. You might want to consider resizing your picture to fill the screen using the satellite's remote function button.

I don't know if your tv is susceptible to image burn. Watching with black side bars over long periods of time can cause burning. You might want to consider resizing your picture to fill the screen using the satellite's remote function button.

You can't do that on the HD channels on most sets.

I don't know if your tv is susceptible to image burn. Watching with black side bars over long periods of time can cause burning. You might want to consider resizing your picture to fill the screen using the satellite's remote function button.
He has an LCD screen. Besides, even if he had a plasma, newer models are much less prone to burn-in (especially if you set them up correctly).

Thanks to everyone who responded to this issue. I have accepted my black bar fate! I can't wait for the technology to catch up to my purchase.There is lots of 4:3 programs and features in existence, so the total elimination pillars (those black bars on each side) won't happen for a long time if ever. We're still at the point where most 16:9 shows are framed for safe 4:3.

Untill the networks replace all of their 4:3 SD cameras with 16:9 HD cameras you will see black/gray side bars added to the actual SD video to make it 852x480 and then upscaled to 720p or 1080i prior to tranmission.

Untill the networks replace all of their 4:3 SD cameras with 16:9 HD cameras you will see black/gray side bars added to the actual SD video to make it 852x480 and then upscaled to 720p or 1080i prior to tranmission.

Hey guys,

I just got a sony kdl 40xbr2 with Time Warner in Los Angeles is a Scientific Atlanta Explorer 8300HD dvr. I've noticed that the side bars on non HD channels are gray, but the bars on HD channels with non HD programing like survivor, the simpsons...are black. Any of you guys know why this is? Is there a setting to make all bars black? I'm new to this HD stuff. So far I'm happy with my tv and the hd channels I get, but it bugs me to have the gray bars on the left and right and some time with the small black top and bottom. Thanks for the info.

The color of the network generated side bars is determined by the network. Espn always seems to use Grey and the others normally use Black. And here in LA ABC sometimes uses blue.

Thanks walford,

Is it the same for the SD channels? What I'd noticed is that if I'm watching Mithbusters on Discovery SD (ch26 in L.A.), the screen has black top and bottom bars and the side bars are gray.

It appears that CH26 is displaying a 16:9 aspect ratio program in lettergox mode over its SD channel and that the 16:9 aspect ratio program was "filmes" with a SD camera..

You can't do that on the HD channels on most sets.On a lot of sets you can do that, if they have a zoom/crop option that works regardless of the format it's being fed. Personally, I prefer to watch the program in the original aspect ratio, regardless of whether it fills the screen or not, and seldom use the zoom button on my TV.

Shop carefully when buying a TV or you may be disappointed with your purchase.

Is there a setting to make all bars black? I'm new to this HD stuff. So far I'm happy with my tv and the hd channels I get, but it bugs me to have the gray bars on the left and right and some time with the small black top and bottom.

AFAIK there are 3 places the bar colors may be set: (1) on the TV, (2) on the cable box, and (3) by the broadcaster. This can make for some interesting combinations, such as the one you described for Mythbusters. Like you, I've had black bars on top/bottom (set by the broadcaster), and grey on the sides (set by my STB).

I don't know about your STB, but mine has an item in it's settings menu to set the bars to black. I assume yours has the same. Default is usually grey for STBs and HDTVs to alleviate IR/burn-in (brighter bars are more likely to age the phosphors at the same rate as those in the broadcast content). Combined with the black bars set by the broadcaster, this makes a nice rectangular all-black frame for the picture.

ROXGenghis,

What does STB stand for? Sorry to ask I'm new to this. What kind of TV do you have and who is you cable provider? Thanks.

Set Top Box, such as a digital cable box or a satellite TV box or a separate ATSC tuner box.

On the SA8300HD it outputs gray side bars (not changeable in color on cable systems that use Passport, like many Time Warner systems) for SD 4:3 channels if the aspect ratio setting of "normal" is used. You can change the DVR's format to stretch mode to fill the screen with the video for those channels and use your HDTV's own 4:3 with black side bars or non-linear stretch format if it has that. There is also a "zoom" mode available that will stretch and crop the top and bottom parts off - useful for letterboxed programs on 4:3 SD channels with top and bottom black bars.

On HD channels, they upconvert 4:3 SD programming on shows like "Survivor" at the station and typically add the black sidebars there - its still a full 16:9 image being displayed, the black bars are part of the image at that point. Thats why they are different - gray bars are added locally in the box on SD channels, black bars added at the station for HD channels with SD programming, including some commercials.

AFAIK there are 3 places the bar colors may be set: (1) on the TV, (2) on the cable box, and (3) by the broadcaster.

For local broadcast stations, you can subdivide: (3a) by the local station and (3b) by the network. Before NBC converted its Nightly News to HD, one nearby NBC station broadcast NBC's HD feed unaltered, in which NBC upconverted the SD to HD and added black bars on the sides; another station took NBC's SD feed, upconverted it locally to HD, and added its own blue bars with a station logo and and a swirl pattern.

I could tell the difference not only by the color of the bars, but also by the quality of the upconversion. The local station doesn't do quite as a good a job as NBC does.

Eventually there won't be black or gray sidebars on any 4:3 format programs broadcast on 16:9 channels. That is valuable screen real estate, and it will be crammed with annoying moving, swirling station logo crap and eventually, probably even ads.

Fortunately, some TVs have a zoom option to hide that distracting crap.

I just got my D* tv hooked up and I have a panny plasma and still have the black bars on the sides on alot of HD channels. From reading this thread it appears that there is really no way to change this. Is this true? I'm stuck with this on a lot of programing? I can stretch it to fill the screen via the TV but then when I change back to SD channel things are getting double stretch, 1 by the box and then again by the TV. So will I'm watching TV I constantly have to be messing with the aspect ratios. Please let me know if there is an easy way around the bars on upscaled HD signals.

Thanks

..... From reading this thread it appears that there is really no way to change this. Is this true? I'm stuck with this on a lot of programing? ....Yes & Yes. Much, if not most, of the upconverted SD on HD channels is network programming not produced in HD. Why not just view the SD version?