Got my original one in 12/05- died in 6/06 :(

Got the second one at the end of 6/06 died today - 5/07 :mad:

So my second Xbox360 has died again!! Looks like a one year lifespan. I love my 360 but damn if its not the most upsetting thing in the world to have such a fragile piece of equipment!

Whats up with you AVS'ers.... How many times has your 360 gone to "the big Malfuntioning Tech Prairie Field" in the sky?

I estimate the over/under time on this thread being locked at about 1 hour. I may still take the under.

Oh, I voted though, still on my launch unit...

0 since 12/06

I'm still working with my original launch 360.

I've had 2 die of the 3 I've purchased at launch (2 for me and 1 I gave to my brother) My brothers died at X-mas and one of mine went shortly after all 3 were from the Nov 22nd launch. The replacements are fine so far.

I'm still working with my original launch 360.

Same here (knocking on wood).

One died, one killed (I knocked it off a shelf onto a conrete floor) and two working 100%.

I estimate the over/under time on this thread being locked at about 1 hour. I may still take the under.


Why do you think it will be locked? Im not asking anything negative, am I? If it sounds that way to you, Im sorry.

Honestly just checking to see if others have had the same issue of repeating malfunctioning units. Microsoft states that theres a 3% fail rate on the console, so I figured a good way tocheck that would be an AVS poll.

I totally love my 360. So much that it sucks to lose it like this.

This really sux.. My 2nd 360 just bit the dust.. All I really play is Texas Holdem and once the 360 cuts on there's a bunch of artifacts when it freezes.. I guess I got another bad GPU.. If not for a warranty I'd probably stop gaming or go back to the better Xbox...

"0" but I've had more freezes lately, which has been kind of annoying. Don't know if that is Live related, software, combo or what though. I think about 1/3 or more of the people on my friends list have had 1 or more break. One has had 6 go bad on him, just picked up the Elite and hoping it doesn't turn red on him.

I've had my system since pretty much launch. I haven't had it break. My dvd drive is sticking about 50% of the time when I try to eject it, my wireless adapter bugs out every once in a while (just have to unplug it and resynch), and I've experienced one freeze while playing Saints Row. Still chugging along although the dvd drive is worrisome.

0 *crosses fingers*

my launch day unit lasted about 10 months and died. just a week ago my replacement unit died. call me stupid, but i bought an elite just before that.

i thought once that the amount of hardware failures was probably normal, until the second failure. now i have to believe all of those people who have had multiple units fail.

the most frustrating part is that i am excepionally carefull with my electronics. it shouldn't be happening to me. the original xbox was and still is solid as a tank. i have no faith that my elite or latest replacement will survive. i won't buy another, despite how hardcore i am.

my launch is starting to die.

i got 3 ROL, and all day yesterday it would just crash almost immediately. today it's working fine though.

who knows.

3 times.

1st, games constantly froze. I couldn't get through a game of Madden 06, and I couldn't progress after I beat a level on PD0. Constant freezing on everything.

2nd, disc drive died. It wouldn't even attempt to load a game. It'd be completely silent.

3rd, disc drive acting up again. Every game would load with the white "please insert a DVD" screen.

I'm now on my fourth.. with my fingers crossed.

It'll most likely get locked because we get these kinds of posts all the time and it gets old having to weed through them.

Funny though....it seems like everyone that starts a post like this seems to think they're in the majority with their issues. Most 360's are fine. Yeah, there's been some definite issues, but .......

It'll most likely get locked because we get these kinds of posts all the time and it gets old having to weed through them.

Funny though....it seems like everyone that starts a post like this seems to think they're in the majority with their issues. Most 360's are fine. Yeah, there's been some definite issues, but .......

I guess I havent been here long enough to notice other types of polls like this. If it gets locked, thats ok, at least now I know.

Its strictly for interest purposes since I have 3 friends at work who have a 360 and all of theirs have had to be replaced. I feel like 3 percent should mean that the amount of people that I know who have had the unit replaced would be very small... literally like 3 out of 100.

Guess me and my friends just happen to be unluckier than most ;)

Funny though....it seems like everyone that starts a post like this seems to think they're in the majority with their issues. Most 360's are fine. Yeah, there's been some definite issues, but .......

Yeah...Right now the failures are a minority by a whopping 2%.

Bought mine in early December 2005. No issues.

they have a big problem with these failure rates.

I have had 4 360s die and 1 damaged during shipping. I have since bought a second 360 so I have one working at all times. I am barely hanging in there!

Clearly the failure rate is horrid. I've been lucky so far and mine hasn't died since last summer. I got mine from Costco anyway, so replacing is easy.

My 1st xbox 360 (Ralph) was born on 10/05 and Died 03/07 R.I.P :(

Why isn't there a class action lawsuit??? Mine lasted one year. Got back 3 rings in one hour. They probally didn't fix it. Sent it in again. If it wasn't for xbox live I wouldn't even bother.

Had mine since launch day! No problems!!!

It's the results of a poll like this that stop me from taking mine apart to mod it or mod/paint
the case... I think I'll keep my 3 year warranty instead.

0 problems with my Premium launch console. BTW, it serves duty as a Media Center Extender on our main TV and has logged a ton of hours.

... there, I just jinxed myself. :eek:

It's the results of a poll like this that stop me from taking mine apart to mod it or mod/paint
the case... I think I'll keep my 3 year warranty instead.


When I get my new one tom. I'm taking it apart and going water cool or liquid nitrogen.. This will be my third one and I can't see how people can replace it more than 4 times without giving up (even more so without a warranty)...

Twice. Both times with the checkered screen.

I'm not voting because Murphey's Law will have a field day with my system.... :o

"0" but I've had more freezes lately, which has been kind of annoying. Don't know if that is Live related, software, combo or what though. I think about 1/3 or more of the people on my friends list have had 1 or more break. One has had 6 go bad on him, just picked up the Elite and hoping it doesn't turn red on him.


When it freezes does it seem like someone hit the pause button or is there artifacts or like a checkerboard?

Why isn't there a class action lawsuit??? Mine lasted one year. Got back 3 rings in one hour. They probally didn't fix it. Sent it in again. If it wasn't for xbox live I wouldn't even bother.

I think a class action law suit would be futile. Microsoft has reacted to the problems by extending warranties and making exceptions on warranties. I imagine most judges would deem their efforts satisfactory. I'm no lawyer though, so maybe someone more knowledgable could chime in.

Unfortunately, if you want MS to provide more quality assurance w/ their products, you are going to have to hit em where it hurts. Stop buying their products and start going w/ the competitors. As it is, the 360 is doing pretty well (not great) and it seems like people are choosing to go w/ the cheaper piece of hardware that has more games and came out first over sonys apparently more reliable hardware w/ very little games.

For some time Apple has been making more reliable software, relative to MS. Nonetheless, people have chosen MS because it is cheaper and they have always been aggressive with business deals and advertising. Maybe MS is taking a similar stance here.

When it freezes does it seem like someone hit the pause button or is there artifacts or like a checkerboard?


i get artifacts and checkerboarding at startup. but if it freezes in game it usually just goes black.

0, and I have a launch box.

Had a launch 360 that lasted about 18 months before giving the flashing red lights. Replacement system would freeze up randomly. Second replacement has been working fine thus far. Hopefully that will be the case for the long haul.

This Elite console is my 10th 360. To be fair 360 #4 was ok(sold to friend) and #9 was flawless(again sold to friend).

Once. Bought it in 06/2006. Red lights of death in 02/2007. The replacement works well, but is much louder and has some scuff marks on it that I didn't put there.

Now I'm screwed... The last time I replied to a poll like this, my 360 died that same day.

Mine hasn't died, unfortunately. I got it in November, 2005. I want one of the new Elite models (for the HDMI connection and bigger hard disk) but this damn thing just keeps on playing games, playing movies, and not dying.

I think a class action law suit would be futile. Microsoft has reacted to the problems by extending warranties and making exceptions on warranties...

I agree with DPE... Although Ive had to replace mine 2 times already, both times MS Support has been very kind and accomadating... Obviously a nod to the fact that if they weren't they'd be in deep doo-doo.

Still it is very frustrating losing smoething you payed a lot of money for for 2-3 weeks due to poor workmanship.

And Im no mathematician, but so far out of 123 people as of my writing, I think the failure rate is looking like a bit more than 3 percent ;)

This Elite console is my 10th 360. To be fair 360 #4 was ok(sold to friend) and #9 was flawless(again sold to friend).

:eek:

Dude, Microsoft owes you lunch or a date with Bill Gates daughters or something... You "r0xx0rz M$ bank account" ;)

First one was problematic right out of the box. My 2nd one started stalling a while back but that was solved with an intercooler.

I'm still working with my original launch 360.

Yep.

3 times.

I still love my 360 though. No reason to give up. :)

-JR

Dam near a 50/50 split..

When it freezes does it seem like someone hit the pause button or is there artifacts or like a checkerboard?

Just freezes, like taking a snap shot of the game.. Can't log out of game or anything. My friends however did get the checkered graphics and other weird crap before his finally went.

Mine started freezing up regularly after 3 1/2 months. I sent it in and had it back in just under 2 weeks. They sent me a complimentary 1 month Live card. Frustrating but it seems fine again (only been a few days back though ;) ) and the repair process is fairly quick.

Oh, I'm sure I wouldn't be so satisfied if mine were out of warranty.

Just freezes, like taking a snap shot of the game.. Can't log out of game or anything. My friends however did get the checkered graphics and other weird crap before his finally went.

Brian,

My 360 finally died monday while playing oblivion, restarted a couple times got the same issue your friends had then the 3 red blinking lights of death with a blank screen. :mad:

Be making a call to microsoft today, if they can't fix it or replace it with a new one,i'll flip becaue no way am i accepting someones broken refurb.

I like the 360 but i think it's a flawed design console

Either they fix my console,send me a new one or i'm getting a PS3 and will never buy an xbox product again.I've always been a sony fan and this is my first time with the xbox brand, but the thing that sucks is even PS3 isn't ready for me yet since it can't do 1080i gaming which is important to me, it's a bit pricey, and the games i want don't come out for it for quite a while like RE5,Socom next gen, final Fantasy,MGS4.

Brian,

My 360 finally died monday while playing oblivion, restarted a couple times got the same issue your friends had then the 3 red blinking lights of death with a blank screen. :mad:

Be making a call to microsoft today, if they can't fix it or replace it with a new one,i'll flip becaue no way am i accepting someones broken refurb.

I like the 360 but i think it's a flawed design console

Either they fix my console,send me a new one or i'm getting a PS3 and will never buy an xbox product again.I've always been a sony fan and this is my first time with the xbox brand, but the thing that sucks is even PS3 isn't ready for me yet since it can't do 1080i gaming which is important to me, it's a bit pricey, and the games i want don't come out for it for quite a while like RE5,Socom next gen, final Fantasy,MGS4.

Dam, that sucks. Hopefully MS takes good care of you. If they don't just keep pushing them, seems like it works for others.

I thought I warned you that ES:IV was evil ;) I have sold it twice now, once on each platform :o

0 times, but I get disc read errors and I will trade it in soon.

Dam, that sucks. Hopefully MS takes good care of you. If they don't just keep pushing them, seems like it works for others.

I thought I warned you that ES:IV was evil ;) I have sold it twice now, once on each platform :o

good ridance man!lol :D

but yeah i'll give microsoft a piece of my mind and push them to get a new console otherwise it's a PS3 for me.

good ridance man!lol :D

but yeah i'll give microsoft a piece of my mind and push them to get a new console otherwise it's a PS3 for me.

I actually enjoyed it more the 2nd time as I kind of figured out what I was doing unlike the 1st time. I just realized that time goes by so quickly while playing. If I started later at night I ended up staying way past when I should go to bed, lol.

I actually enjoyed it more the 2nd time as I kind of figured out what I was doing unlike the 1st time. I just realized that time goes by so quickly while playing. If I started later at night I ended up staying way past when I should go to bed, lol.

Yeah it drains a lot of hours that's for sure, once played from 5:00pm-2:30am in the morning, once i really got into a quest.

With breaks for bathroom and food of coarse. :p

I have 2 launch premium 360s, another premium I bought in January and a two week old Elite and I've never had an issue other than one HD cable quit (replaced under warranty) and the very, very seldom GRAW lock up when I'm hosting online. They're all very well ventilated, I have big dollar surge protectors and Nyko Intercoolers on all of them also. According to the poll, there seems to be a lot of people that are able to keep there's alive as well.

Yeah it drains a lot of hours that's for sure, once played from 5:00pm-2:30am in the morning, once i really got into a quest.

With breaks for bathroom and food of coarse. :p

exactly! :)

*sigh* - I guess I'm not destined to play much Guitar Hero... My guitar controller broke a few weeks ago, and not a week after I got it replaced, my 360 died. Now I'm waiting for my shipping box, thinking maybe I should get the extended warranty this time :-/

Launch primium and launch elite and 0 problems...

I had one from 12/05 and it died in January. Its been in for repairs twice and going again this week for a third time. Luckily it had an extended warranty so the repairs have been free so far. On the fourth I believe I get reimbursed the cost of the console. One more time and I'll have an Elite.

They will eventually die trust me... the freezing early on is a sign that it will eventually die.

I too kept my 360 taken care of in a well ventilated area on a glass shelf where it's nice and cool.

7 months later..Dead.

The 360 is just a flawed design and untill they do a hardware revision all of them will eventually die.

According to the poll, there seems to be a lot of people that are able to keep there's alive as well.

At the time of me writing this it is 80 people no problems to 69 people with problems. If you actually add up the instances of breaking it is actually 80 to 133+ (133+ due to the last option being 4 or more times). I am sure some folks are lying because of there love to other brands or hatred towards MS but I would assume most are not.

I really don't think, in the majority of cases, that it is a matter of peoples playing habits in keeping them alive.

Again. Owner of a 360 from the second batch of systems shipped out from launch(I believe I recieved mine early December). Nothing broken but dvd tray seems to be dying, wifi adapter bugs out occationally, only froze on me once.

Either way I know I was in a meeting recently because a production lot of ours had spiked to a .05% failure rate from our standard .01% We are doing a full fledged investigation into the probably causes. Even if it is at a 3% failure rate, that is pretty huge IMO.

still have my 360 launch box and working without any issues.

I'm amazed everytime I go into Gamestop/EBGames and that 360 still works in the small clear case with just an opening in the back...

I should get to vote twice as I have two 360s and both work just fine.

I should get to vote twice as I have two 360s and both work just fine.

Very valid point.

The 360 is just a flawed design and untill they do a hardware revision all of them will eventually die.

I have to wonder about this. No console previously had such a widespread problem with failure.

I'd like to change my vote from "1" to "2"... :mad:

I should get to vote twice as I have two 360s and both work just fine.

I want my 2nd, 3rd and 4th vote counted as well. :D 6 people with 4 bad boxes plus ? Is that for real ? Are you getting refurb boxes ?

Ive had my premium since day 1 (US release) and my elite since release. No problems with either machine. And the premium has had some heavy use.

I have to wonder about this. No console previously had such a widespread problem with failure.

I think other consoles had widespread problems, but in general weren't as "fatal" as the 360's. Or as you call it "failure".

If you look at the original nintendo, all of them had cartridge reading problems after a while. Ps2 had problems with the laser. Etc etc.

Also the checkerboard graphics & other symptoms strongly suggest something to do with the gpu or cpu. It's a sign of overheating, pushing too hard when overclocking, etc on PCs. I guess for the 360 it's failing solder points But I'm sure you guys already knew that.

This poll should have been public like the last one, so we can see who is voting.
The last poll had a lot of votes of multiple 360's dying by people that never even owned a 360.

Anyway.. launch 360 purchased 11-22-05, heavy use, zero problems.

This poll should have been public like the last one, so we can see who is voting.
The last poll had a lot of votes of multiple 360's dying by people that never even owned a 360.

Anyway.. launch 360 purchased 11-22-05, heavy use, zero problems.

Would be cool if you could change your vote as well as time goes on. In that other people lots of people voted "no problem" to have posted later in the thread that they had 1 or more broken 360's.

my launch unit just died today immediately after the spring update. it turned on just fine, I was greeted with the "update avail" message, I did the d/l, the system shut down and upon reboot, 3 red rings of death. :mad:

my launch unit just died today immediately after the spring update. it turned on just fine, I was greeted with the "update avail" message, I did the d/l, the system shut down and upon reboot, 3 red rings of death. :mad:

Sux, mine died to after one of the many updates they've had..

and it will only cost me 140.00 to get it fixed.

Sux, mine died to after one of the many updates they've had..

That's one thing that I don't get. I guess not being software sauve.. How do these updates and patches brick systems?

I've had one friend that said a Gears patch bricked his, a few for Guitar Hero, others for other patches..

and it will only cost me 140.00 to get it fixed.

OUCH! I hope you can push them hard enough on the phone to get this done for free.

and it will only cost me 140.00 to get it fixed.


I thought they were fixing those 360s for free? Lord knows they need to fix all 360s for free..

And Brian I have no idea.. All I know is my launch 360 was perfectly fine up until the patch.. Once I downloaded it not an hour later it froze with the checkerboard then I removed the HD and booted it up and got the 3 red rings of death.. It's weird to say the least..

Zero here ,Ive had my 360 since launch day (Oct 2005 build). Still going strong! <knocks on wood> ;)

I also have a launch day 360 and it has never given me an issues of any kind. (thus far)

Launch 360 as well,no problems so far.

First 360 had a december 05 build and bricked in december of 06. new one has had 0 problems

Whereas I agree that these polls can be slanted, these results are still telling. I mean seriously, when you see similar polls on the PS3 boards, the failure rates are usually less than 5%. There may be other factors at play here, but I think its really difficult to argue that the 360 is a well built machine.

Mine lasted about 6 months bought in Nov 06. The most suprising thing to me was I thought for sure the kinks would have been worked out after a year but I was wrong.

I voted no problems the last time this poll went on but mine went on latter to die, polls like this should have the option to change your vote after your 360 eventually dies.

if your system died after the update please give MS a call. according to them I was their only call about it. the nice I talked to suggested to me that if they got enough calls that they may do some type of discount repair and advised that if I could wait a week I should wait and see. I doubt it though.

My second died today. It was a year old. My first died about 5 months after launch. The worst part is my warranty expired. I will get the extended warranty. Loos like I will miss some if not most of the Halo 3 beta. :-(

I bought mine in August 06, died this pastThursday.

Mine died one day after the update just before the Forza demo went up. Bought in Jan, red rings from the first day which steadily got worse till it was taking me 50 plus boots.

My unit was built 02/06, bought in 05/06, died 03/07 from an "unplayable disc" message. Fired it up late 04/07 to play on live arcade started working again. played 4hrs of "just cause" and it said "unplayable disc" again right after I bought guitar hero. :mad:

Mine just died, and of course, 2 weeks outside of the 90 day return policy of Target. I should have just returned it last month and got an Elite. I got the extended warranty but I've been waiting a fews days already for the UPS box they're supposed to send me.

I did the spring update yesterday and turned my 360 off. Turned it on a while later and the froze up during a movie. Turned it on and off and now I get 3 red rings. Did all the diagnostic crap too still red lights flashing. Peace of ****. The thing was on it's own stand with nothing around it so cooling wasn't the issue.

I was playing Gears on Sunday turned off my tv and 360 a few hours later i get no picture or audio and my tv says component " no signal" .So if this is considered dead ? or do i just need a hdav component cable

This thread is amusing.
Xbox 360 appears to be a service that requires a yearly $400 subscription.

I honestly dont think anything makes Dralt happier.. than reading a fresh story of a dead 360.


While I hope MS improves the quality of the product.. in the 20 months I have owned one I have had to have had it replaced it once. The whole process took about two weeks.. and I've never had another problem. The even extended my warranty with no extra charge. Honestly the whole thing takes more time for me to write about than its even worth typing.

I think alot of people here spend so much time on this forum for the sake of winning some meaningless internet debate and proving their point (rather it be positive or negative) to a bunch of people who really could care less.. they forget the real reason why we are all came here (well in the gaming forum atleast).

Of the people that tend to complain the most on here.. I'd love to look at their actual gamerscore and games played history. I doubt if they even play many games or spend time gaming compared to how much complaining they do. It seems most would much rather spend their day arguing, defending and supporting their opinion than actually spending their time gaming.

It also seems that it doesnt matter which consoles these people own because its the same ole people on both sides of the fence and alot of the people making the most ridiculous points are the ones who own all 3 systems.

Nothing is perfect. Get over it. There isnt a winner or a loser.. Neither sucks or rocks. Its all about buying and enjoying your purchase.

If you dont enjoy it.. then dont buy it.. if you did buy it.. sell it.. how much simpler can it be beyond that.

In either scenario is it really worth complaining about it every chance possible? Can things be that boring in your daily activity that its that necessary.

I honestly dont think anything makes Dralt happier.. than reading a fresh story of a dead 360.


While I hope MS improves the quality of the product.. in the 20 months I have owned one I have had to have had it replaced it once. The whole process took about two weeks.. and I've never had another problem. The even extended my warranty with no extra charge. Honestly the whole thing takes more time for me to write about than its even worth typing.

I think alot of people here spend so much time on this forum for the sake of winning some meaningless internet debate and proving their point (rather it be positive or negative) to a bunch of people who really could care less.. they forget the real reason why we are all came here (well in the gaming forum atleast).

Of the people that tend to complain the most on here.. I'd love to look at their actual gamerscore and games played history. I doubt if they even play many games or spend time gaming compared to how much complaining they do. It seems most would much rather spend their day arguing, defending and supporting their opinion than actually spending their time gaming.

It also seems that it doesnt matter which consoles these people own because its the same ole people on both sides of the fence and alot of the people making the most ridiculous points are the ones who own all 3 systems.

Nothing is perfect. Get over it. There isnt a winner or a loser.. Neither sucks or rocks. Its all about buying and enjoying your purchase.

If you dont enjoy it.. then dont buy it.. if you did buy it.. sell it.. how much simpler can it be beyond that.

In either scenario is it really worth complaining about it every chance possible? Can things be that boring in your daily activity that its that necessary.

If we were talking about any of the million other things people complain about on the internet, I'd have to agree with you. In general, internet forums tend to attract negative complainers. Nevertheless, I think the 360 build issues are absolutely 100% legitimite. It seems like you are a real game lover and I can appreciate that, but your post comes across as a big time gaming apologist. Concerns about the 360 build are legitimite. Period. These things appear to be failing at an unacceptable rate. Most people, me included, adopt a console early with the intention of keeping it not just for 1 or 2 years, but for 7, 8, or 10. Its great that MS have given some good customer service with the faulty systems, but it shouldnt have been this screwed up in the first place.

Personally, I appreciate threads like this, because they can help you avoid products with a high fail rate, or at least encourage you to get a great warranty. I know similar threads on the TV forums seriously educated my TV purchase last year.

Daekwan, I'm with you.

My 360 has failed multiple times, but I still enjoy the console, the games, etc. I also found that having my 360 go down wasn't a huge thing that drove me insane. MS has always replaced my 360 with fairly short calls to their customer service number, and even with the amount of systems I've had go down, I've still barely missed a few days of gaming.

Still, it's a bummer to have a system, or any sort of hardware, go down, but hey, I'm still gaming and MS has been replacing my 360 and followed their warranty as it's outline.

Judging from this forum, and from friends, the 360 does have a high failure rate. I'm not condoning it, and like dpe says, it may help you avoid products or purchase a solid warranty. Either way, it's all about eduction and what you get out of the product. For me, as I've said before, the experience of having my 360 outweighs the hiccups of having to have MS replace it.

-JR

I am still using a launch system and knock on wood no issues here.

Popped my cherry last night. :( I have the dreaded 0102 error code. I'll be taking it back to Costco and keeping my fingers crossed that they'll take care of me.

This sucks. I've babied that thing since I picked it up in November. I was hoping that by avoiding the first batch I would miss out on some of the gremlins. I guess not.

My launch system is still running like a champ. I have had it lock up every once in a while, but its usually in a demo or something and I would bet its code related and not hardware.

Personally, I appreciate threads like this, because they can help you avoid products with a high fail rate, or at least encourage you to get a great warranty. I know similar threads on the TV forums seriously educated my TV purchase last year.

I agree with DPE on this one also. I think as people (myself included - 360 has died twice) who have had 360's die on them more than once, we look for solace in others who have had the same problem. And for some, that solace sometimes involves bitching and moaning endlessly and unnecessarily.

The stats are remarkable in that I think they represent a fairly accurate portrayal of whats going on, despite Microsofts line.

Is it going to make a real difference to current owners in the long run? No, not at all. We'll still be stuck with our hardware and, like Daekwan pretty much summed it up, can either deal with it or talk until we're blue in the face to no avail...

BUT, stuff like this can also help someone who doesnt have the ability to spend 400-600 dollars recklessly on what can definitely be categorized as a "questionably built" product. If I hadnt already bought one, I would definitely be concerened seeing this...

Got my first on 1/1/06 and it died during the summer. Actually, it didn't die, but something happened to a fan or the DVD drive. It started making this REALLY loud whining noise.

My second truly died in January 2007 with 3 red lights.

I almost thought it was dying a third time. I had two copies of Guitar Hero that would get disc unreadable errors. I thought the DVD drive was going out. I brought the game to a friend's and it didn't work on his either. The third copy of GH2 has worked great.

I honestly dont think anything makes Dralt happier.. than reading a fresh story of a dead 360.

Particularly when it happens to mine.
Your statement is just silly.
This being said, I am amused when I see the efforts being made to deny the Xbox 360 is extremely unreliable.

While I hope MS improves the quality of the product.. in the 20 months I have owned one I have had to have had it replaced it once. The whole process took about two weeks.. and I've never had another problem. The even extended my warranty with no extra charge. Honestly the whole thing takes more time for me to write about than its even worth typing.

You sound like Peter Moore when he says: "Don't focus on how unreliable they are, focus on how fast we replace them."

Of the people that tend to complain the most on here.. I'd love to look at their actual gamerscore and games played history. I doubt if they even play many games or spend time gaming compared to how much complaining they do. It seems most would much rather spend their day arguing, defending and supporting their opinion than actually spending their time gaming.

It also seems that it doesnt matter which consoles these people own because its the same ole people on both sides of the fence and alot of the people making the most ridiculous points are the ones who own all 3 systems.

My tag is WeirdBanana. Have fun checking my history.

Nothing is perfect. Get over it. There isnt a winner or a loser.. Neither sucks or rocks. Its all about buying and enjoying your purchase.

If you dont enjoy it.. then dont buy it.. if you did buy it.. sell it.. how much simpler can it be beyond that.

In either scenario is it really worth complaining about it every chance possible? Can things be that boring in your daily activity that its that necessary.

Are you sure you're not Peter Moore? :p

Some people are on their third or fourh console, I think they've bought the right to complain.

As far as I am concerned, I think Xbox 360 is a great console with great games.

Yes, great console with great games. An amazing machine on paper and a lot of developer support.

I truly regret it's so unreliable. If my second one holds until the end of the cycle, I will consider myself a satisfied customer. If it doesn't, I'll be sorry to miss some good games, but I will not reward a manufacturer that indulges in selling faulty products.

If you are on your third or fourth system you honestly have to start looking for adverse environmental conditions. That kind kind of failure rate is simply too high to be realistic without an outside factor.

With that kind of rate MS would have revamped the hardware. They simply would not have had a choice. They have BILLIONS invested in the platform, they simply could not ship units with that kind of failure rate. Not to mention we would be reading in every business journal out there about the millions of lawsuits.

If you are on your third or fourth system you honestly have to start looking for adverse environmental conditions. That kind kind of failure rate is simply too high to be realistic without an outside factor.

With that kind of rate MS would have revamped the hardware. They simply would not have had a choice. They have BILLIONS invested in the platform, they simply could not ship units with that kind of failure rate. Not to mention we would be reading in every business journal out there about the millions of lawsuits.

You are still in denial.
And there can be no lawsuit as long as Microsoft willingly repairs or replaces them.

You are still in denial.
And there can be no lawsuit as long as Microsoft willingly repairs or replaces them.

Sorry Dralt its just bordering on impossible for rate of return to be that high. Do you live in the U.S.? Here we can litigate for virtually any reason, certainly for replacement of defective merchandise. There would be lawsuits for both refunds and replacement with non-reconditioned units. In addition there would be civil suits for compensation for multiple return periods.

I think Deakwan has you down cold Dralt.

If you are on your third or fourth system you honestly have to start looking for adverse environmental conditions. That kind kind of failure rate is simply too high to be realistic without an outside factor.

With that kind of rate MS would have revamped the hardware. They simply would not have had a choice. They have BILLIONS invested in the platform, they simply could not ship units with that kind of failure rate. Not to mention we would be reading in every business journal out there about the millions of lawsuits.

Sadly it is happening without outside factors, unless you consider poor QC from MS an outside factor.

Sadly it is happening without outside factors, unless you consider poor QC from MS an outside factor.

3-4 units without an outside factor brian? Then why are the vast majority no failure followed by only single failure?

3-4 units without an outside factor brian? Then why are the vast majority no failure followed by only single failure?

I've had a friend go through 6, another through 3 without outside factors. Quality control issues would be my guess.

I've had a friend go through 6, another through 3 without outside factors. Quality control issues would be my guess.


Statistically thats a near impossibility. When talking about hardware failure the number on cause is QC followed by enviromental conditions. When you have multiple failures the swing towards outside conditions.

Now I am about to argue the 360 is not far more succeptible to enviromental issues than your standard CE equipment, but when you have one location with multiple failures logic dictates you start looking for an outside factor.

Statistically thats a near impossibility. When talking about hardware failure the number on cause is QC followed by enviromental conditions. When you have multiple failures the swing towards outside conditions.

Now I am about to argue the 360 is not far more succeptible to enviromental issues than your standard CE equipment, but when you have one location with multiple failures logic dictates you start looking for an outside factor.

Actually it isn't, because it is happening to many others as well as. You can try to divert the blame to outside factors but that doesn't apply in this situation.

Actually it isn't, because it is happening to many others as well as. You can try to divert the blame to outside factors but that doesn't apply in this situation.

You are trying to ague against decades of logic (As long as there have been CE devices). You are trying to argue the math! Aside from the fact anything is trubly possible you have to look at this objectively. The vast majority have no issues, a small percentage have an issue. And yet you want to belive that 6-9 consoles can just fail on one poor bastard? How could any human being be that unlucky?

And for the sake of argument lets say your friend indeed has all those failures with ZERO (And you would need an electrician at the very least to verify) outside factors that could increase the likelihood of a failure...

He is certainly not an indication of overall results for consumers.

You are trying to ague against decades of logic (As long as there have been CE devices). You are trying to argue the math! Aside from the fact anything is trubly possible you have to look at this objectively. The vast majority have no issues, a small percentage have an issue. And yet you want to belive that 6-9 consoles can just fail on one poor bastard? How could any human being be that unlucky?

And for the sake of argument lets say your friend indeed has all those failures with ZERO (And you would need an electrician at the very least to verify) outside factors that could increase the likelihood of a failure...

He is certainly not an indication of overall results for consumers.

I'm not trying to argue anything I am merely stating facts. It's not a matter of wanting to believe it is the reality of the situation for him and others.

I'm not trying to argue anything I am merely stating facts. It's not a matter of wanting to believe it is the reality of the situation for him and others.

Is your friends name Roy Sullivan by chance? Again anything CAN happen, but it doe snot happen to many people.

Is your friends name Roy Sullivan by chance? Again anything CAN happen, but it doe snot happen to many people.

Not Roy Sullivan, whoever that is.

Based on everything I've read it is happening more with the 360 than any other console I've owned and by far. Seems to be happening to a lot of people. Over a 1/3 of my friends have had issues, I personally don't define that as not many people.

I think brianmonkey's friends list may be a tad small (its limited to 100) to use as a statistical sampling.

Roy Sullivan is a man thats been hit by lightening 7X even though the odds of being struck once is small.

I think brianmonkey's friends list may be a tad small (its limited to 100) to use as a statistical sampling.

Roy Sullivan is a man thats been hit by lightening 7X even though the odds of being struck once is small.

There is no explanation for your point of view besides pure blind fanboyism. Spend 10 minutes searching the net for forums discussing 360 problems and you will be overwhelmed. And for the most part, these discussions are led by people, like me, who love the system.

On last weeks Xbox magazine podcast, they were even discussing the high rate of failure. On the IGN podcast 2 weeks ago, they said the failure rate at IGN has been over 75%.

There is simply no way to rationally argue that there is not a problem w/ the 360 hardware.

Sorry Dralt its just bordering on impossible for rate of return to be that high. Do you live in the U.S.? Here we can litigate for virtually any reason, certainly for replacement of defective merchandise. There would be lawsuits for both refunds and replacement with non-reconditioned units. In addition there would be civil suits for compensation for multiple return periods.

I think Deakwan has you down cold Dralt.

Probabilities, something useful to learn.

If the actual defect rate is 10%,
- the probability of going throug 2 consoles is 1 in 100.
- the probability of going throug 3 consoles is 1 in 1000.
- the probability of going throug 4 consoles is 1 in 10000.

That is true whether you treat it like a baby or an ordinary piece of consumer electronics.

If the actual defect rate is 20%,
- the probability of going throug 2 consoles is 1 in 50.
- the probability of going throug 3 consoles is 1 in 500.
- the probability of going throug 4 consoles is 1 in 5000.

Etc.

But we don't know the actual defect rate.
Online polls continue to show 40+% had to replace their console at least once, but these polls prove nothing, beyond the fact Microsoft has a lot of proving to do in the reliability deparment.

There is simply no way to rationally argue that there is not a problem w/ the 360 hardware.

I fear you may have missed some posts. I've had a unit fail, therefore I cannot even argue there is not problem with defects. (Given that the unit has never failed again in the same enviroment its reasonably safe to assume this is a QA failure and not one due to how it is treated/kept etc) There is as I have argued no conclusive proof there is a failure rate consistent with the average consumer with a failure having 3-4 (or more units) failed units.

I can also go on the wbe (I just did) and find consumers posting about failed iPods. Does this mean there is a largewr than normal numer of iPod failing for users? Does this mean that peopel will ahve 3,4 or more iPods ail?

Internet MSG boards are hardly a reliable reference. I can argue that whaever site I go to the VAST majority have no problem.

Can never be said enough: Vocal minority

Those without problems are less liley to comment than those with.

CE failure rates are between 3-5%, lets say the 360's are twice that. The math is against brian's frind (or anyone) having 6. Are you trying to dispute that dralt? Multiple failures are more lilley to be due to outside forces when we look at your cut and paste chart Dralt.

Yes there are failures (Every CE device has failures)
Yes it appears there are more failures than "normal"
No there is no data to suggest there is a significantly higher rates of failure (These result in recalls)
Yes there are plenty of MSG board posts and game site mentions. The 360 has the highest installed base of this gen console. It gets the most internet coverage of any system right now.
Three to six hardware failures for any device is highly suspect to beinga QA issue when so many millions do not even have ONE.


We can all go round and round but until there is a goverment investigation (Every state in the U.S. has a BBB whos job it is to investage things like a higher than expected failure rate that effects consumers) or MS releases the % or number of failures Dralt is just speculating. The burden of a claim like his is on the accuser not on the company or product. if it was otherwise I could just say "The Nintendo Wii ate my cat" all over the internet until people believed it.

Come on guys. There was obviously some design flaw that contributed to a higher than normal/acceptable failure rate. That is obvious if you follow the news and own one yourself.

It is still a great box, and MS has been awesome with their support resloving these issues. It really sucks though if you got really unlucky and had 2-3 fail on you. I feel sorry for those people.

I think that the xbox 720 will have a lower failure rate.

There will always be a negative response bias on message boards, I agree with you there Frank. However, it is clear that the 360 problems go far beyond a negative response bias. You will find plenty of people complaining about any product, sure, but when you look at the 360, the complaints are simply overwhelming.

I just dont think the environmental factors argument is strong. THe more reliable and well built the product is, the less likely environmental factors will affect it. I think it is perfectly reasonable to state that the 360 is manufacture poorly, with ABSOLUTELY NO CAVEATS whatsoever.

MS has responded to complaints in a satisfactory way, but it should be 100% expected that they should do so.

CE failure rates are between 3-5%, lets say the 360's are twice that. The math is against brian's frind (or anyone) having 6. Are you trying to dispute that dralt? Multiple failures are more lilley to be due to outside forces when we look at your cut and paste chart Dralt.

Yes there are failures (Every CE device has failures)
Yes it appears there are more failures than "normal"
No there is no data to suggest there is a significantly higher rates of failure (These result in recalls)
Yes there are plenty of MSG board posts and game site mentions. The 360 has the highest installed base of this gen console. It gets the most internet coverage of any system right now.
Three to six hardware failures for any device is highly suspect to beinga QA issue when so many millions do not even have ONE.


We can all go round and round but until there is a goverment investigation (Every state in the U.S. has a BBB whos job it is to investage things like a higher than expected failure rate that effects consumers) or MS releases the % or number of failures Dralt is just speculating. The burden of a claim like his is on the accuser not on the company or product. if it was otherwise I could just say "The Nintendo Wii ate my cat" all over the internet until people believed it.

After this reply, it's all yours...I know you are set in your way of thinking.

- "your cut and paste chart Dralt"

There was nothing cut-and-paste here.
1 in a 100 or even 1 in a 1000 is nothing like Roy Sullivan.

- "There would be lawsuits"

Keep on dreaming. Even the Department of Justice had to work for 10 years to cause legal problems to Microsoft.
Now, just figure how likely Joe Blow is to cause them legal worries.
Based on the fact they are repairing or replacing failed units, you would not find an attorney to take on the case.

- "until there is a goverment investigation (Every state in the U.S. has a BBB whos job it is to investage things like a higher than expected failure rate that effects consumers) or MS releases the % or number of failures"

Like we could trust MS to admit the truth.

- "Yes there are plenty of MSG board posts and game site mentions. The 360 has the highest installed base of this gen console. It gets the most internet coverage of any system right now. Three to six hardware failures for any device is highly suspect to beinga QA issue when so many millions do not even have ONE."

It goes well beyond message boards. You just need to run a quick survey to realize that. In fact, it is so ridiculous that both leading apologists on AVS (you and Daekwan) have first-hand experience with those failures.

Like we could trust MS to admit the truth.



This pretty much shows a distinct negative bias towards the producer of the console. We certainly cannot expect you to be objective with blanket staments like that.

This pretty much shows a distinct negative bias towards the producer of the console. We certainly cannot expect you to be objective with blanket staments like that.

Versus your extreme positive bias towards MS...

MS has earned this distrust from their loyal customers.

Can you please take a minute to prove that brian?

Am I biased because MS took care of my hardware failure in an efficient and timely manner? Perhaps I am biased due to my 2 perfectly working units?

I see it as I have experienced great customer service (Check my posts it took me 15 min on the phone to get my repair call completed) and the majority of my units have worked flawlessly through hundreds if not thousands of hours of use. Again search will show you we use the 360's as MCE extrenders for every hour of television in our home, they are probably on many times what your average "gaming only" 360 is.


I will certainly be surprsed if you can find a blanket statement from me saying everything is perfect from MS. (In fact you can look in this thread to see me stating units fail)

Can you please take a minute to prove that brian?

Am I biased because MS took care of my hardware failure in an efficient and timely manner? Perhaps I am biased due to my 2 perfectly working units?

I see it as I have experienced great customer service (Check my posts it took me 15 min on the phone to get my repair call completed) and the majority of my units have worked flawlessly through hundreds if not thousands of hours of use. Again search will show you we use the 360's as MCE extrenders for every hour of television in our home, they are probably on many times what your average "gaming only" 360 is.


I will certainly be surprsed if you can find a blaket statement from me saying everything is perfect from MS. (In fact you can look in this thread to see me stating units fail)

Everything perfect, I didn't say that. :cool: Anybody can click on you posting history if they want, there really isn't anything for me to prove. I'm far from the only one to realize this. Its not a knock, we all have biases. Just playing devil's advocate, if you are discrediting a person for not trusting MS (for good reasons based on MS's history) you need to take yourself out of the equation as well for being on the other end. Pretty simple, you can't have it both ways.

Dralt discredited himself, nobody else. I did not type that for him.

Yes brian look at my posting history. Look at the games on 360 I have made negative comments about. I do not need to disprove your your claim, you need to prove it. Theories need to be proven to be accepted. Now I theorized Dralt had a personal bias against Microsoft but I had no proof until Dralt typed it himself.

There is a difference between being a satisfied customer and a personally biased person. If I was personally biased I would not be typing Halo does not look so good or that I think Forza should have been held back for more graphics work. These are two of Microsoft's biggest IP's and here I am criticizing them!

Do not make the absurd mistake some do on the PS3 forum. My PS3 criticisms have nothing pro or con to do with the 360. I am critical of both when I feel it appropriate.

It just turns out I am a damned satisfied Microsoft customer. That offends some folks but thats not making me out to be any more than that.

I think you can take MS out of the equation entirely. THe 360 was built with poor QC. You can like MS and think that or you can dislike MS and think that. However, I dont know how you could think it was a well built machine regardless of what you think of MS..

However, I dont know how you could think it was a well built machine regardless of what you think of MS..

Most people never experience a failure. Why on earth would they not be satisfied with the build quality of their machine?

This pretty much shows a distinct negative bias towards the producer of the console. We certainly cannot expect you to be objective with blanket staments like that.

Please find a better way to discredit me and my statements.

I have been working with Microsoft's products and technologies for the past 15 years, it's a fact they would never admit they ever did anything wrong.

And, certainly, they'd better not or they would become liable.

No offense on my end, it is just silly to go out an attack Dralt in the fashion you have. You are no more or less, that is the simple truth. Yes, I've seen you opinions of motorstorm online, I actually checked your history (as you are on my buddy list on motorstorm), it indicated you raced 1 race, lol Pretty experienced for how vocal you've been about the game :cool:

Nobody could do it better than you Dralt. I am not saying you do not have a reason to be so biased.

I have been an MCSE for 9 years and worked with MS products for 13. I take from that Microsoft is a company who provides products and solutions. Sometimes good, sometiomes great and sometimes awfull. I am however able to be open minded and do not assume MS cannot be trusted. Or else I would be forced to stop trusting every company out there!

While no company will admit wrongdoing if possible (It opens them up to further lawsuits) MS has a long history of being brough to court and spending BILLIONS making the situation right.

I really like the 360, but it does seem to break more than your average CE product. I've only had to send mine in once, fortunately - And they did send it back promptly and at their expense fixed it.

Their customer support has been good, except everytime I've called their help line I always got the message that they were experiencing higher than normal call volume and so it may take longer than normal for them to get to me. Every time it's higher than normal volume, even in the middle of the night.

No offense on my end, it is just silly to go out an attack Dralt in the fashion you have. You are no more or less, that is the simple truth. Yes, I've seen you opinions of motorstorm online, I actually checked your history (as you are on my buddy list on motorstorm), it indicated you raced 1 race, lol Pretty experienced for how vocal you've been about the game :cool:

Attack Dralt? Where? I posted an opinion that differed from his. Nobody attacked anyone here. Perhaps calling him on his comment about MS "Like we could trust MS to admit the truth"? Take a look at that and explain how anyone should consider his comments in good faith? he further admist his 15 years working with MS left him with that opinion. He made the comment and then clarified why he has that opinion. Makes it pretty clear when its from him, so how am I attacking him? Dralt accused me of being in denial brian, I did not attack his views I argued against his logic. Then he turned around and stated he does not trust the company. If I were to go to the Sony forum and state I do not trust Sony to tell the truth to consumers would I not discredit anything I might have to say there?

Oh MS LOL please do go and fine a post about Motorstorm online from me!

Nobody could do it better than you Dralt. I am not saying you do not have a reason to be so biased.

I have been an MCSE for 9 years and worked with MS products for 13. I take from that Microsoft is a company who provides products and solutions. Sometimes good, sometiomes great and sometimes awfull. I am however able to be open minded and not assume MS cannot be trusted. Or else I would be forced to stop trusting every company out there!

While no company will admit wrongdoing if possible (It opens them up to further lawsuits) MS has a long history of being brough to court and spending BILLIONS making the situation right.

Some would use the fact you are a Microsoft Certified System Administrator and a Microsoft Certified Systems Engineer to sweep your opinion under the rug of "don't bite the hand that feeds you".

I don't.

Yet, do you really believe Microsoft would ever admit a 30% defect rate, if such were their defect rate?

What you and others fail to understand is this:

The defect rate out of the factory may well be 3-5%.
Yet, the defect rate after 6-12 months of use is considerably higher.

This can be due to 4 factors:
- Hardware design flaws
- Poor quality of components
- Poor quality of assembly
- All of the above

Now, as a customer, I don't care if the defect rate is 3-5% at the end of the assembly line. That doesn't do anything good to me.

Finally, my experience with Microsoft is a roller coaster ride. They disappoint me or impress me once or twice per year.

Attack Dralt? Where? I posted an opinion that differed from his. Nobody attacked anyone here. Perhaps calling him on his comment about MS "Like we could trust MS to admit the truth"? Take a look at that and explain how anyone should consider his comments in good faith? he further admist his 15 years working with MS left him with that opinion. He made the comment and then clarified why he has that opinion. Makes it pretty clear when its from him, so how am I attacking him? Dralt accused me of being in denial brian, I did not attack his views I argued against his logic. Then he turned around and stated he does not trust the company. If I were to go to the Sony forum and state I do not trust Sony to tell the truth to consumers would I not discredit anything I might have to say there?

Oh MS LOL please do go and fine a post about Motorstorm online from me!

I am just as able to keep an open mind about Microsoft as you are.
Hence, I have a 360 and I bought more than 20 360 games.
If I had judged them based on their history, I would have never considered buying any game console made by them.

I do not trust Sony to admit to any bothering truth either. They are in the same market as Microsoft and are bound to operate similarly.
This is such a trivial and self-evident fact, I fail to see how it can discredit anyone or anything.

I do not believe they would admit a 30% failure rate. I also believe they have no way to "hide" a rate that high. Or one even close.
The 360 I imagine is built by the lowest bidder. This I would wager increases the failure rate to a level above that of a product with in house manufacturing. (Usually higher QC)

I again (Third time this thread) am not claiming there are not failed 360's nor that the 360's fail more often than the average CE device. My only argument here is that they are not failing as high as some here claim. The logic for that is that companies are subject to oversight both govermental and third party as well of course as internal oversight.

Microsoft is in this to make money and having a truly high failure rate would cause them to halt production to reengineer as we are at the beginning of a long (This makes me sad but thats another thread) cycle and they simply cannot afford the bad press not to mention the costs of bringing the units in for repair.

I certainly see why people with one failure or more overreact, especially with when they read the vocal minority on the web. But the facts are not available to anyone to claim the situation is anything close to what is being speculated.

I do not believe they would admit a 30% failure rate. I also believe they have no way to "hide" a rate that high. Or one even close.
The 360 I imagine is built by the lowest bidder. This I would wager increases the failure rate to a level above that of a product with in house manufacturing. (Usually higher QC)

I again (Third time this thread) am not claiming there are not failed 360's nor that the 360's fail more often than the average CE device. My only argument here is that they are not failing as high as some here claim. The logic for that is that companies are subject to oversight both govermental and third party as well of course as internal oversight.

Microsoft is in this to make money and having a truly high failure rate would cause them to halt production to reengineer as we are at the beginning of a long (This makes me sad but thats another thread) cycle and they simply cannot afford the bad press not to mention the costs of bringing the units in for repair.

I certainly see why people with one failure or more overreact, especially with when they read the vocal minority on the web. But the facts are not available to anyone to claim the situation is anything close to what is being speculated.

That's your most reasonable post today.

Thanks.

Well I've had enough of this particular failure thread. My apolgies for anyone who feels attacked (Like I do about my Motorstorm Opinions!). I have said all I can and want to avoid further beating of this dead horse.

It seems today was my time to join red 3 light crew. Wanted to download that new shooter. First power on, xbox screen with garble green slashes frozen, second attemp 3 rings of death. Off to Fry's I will go, I'll see if they let me upgrade to the Elite as MS said they'd have better QC on it.

Frank, You know I'm just playing around with you buddy. I came off too strong today though, my apologies.

*Knock on Wood* Still using my launch system with no problems yet. I can only hope it never dies on me. I love my 360 but I dunno how some of you guys do it with the whole repairing/replacing your xbox every 6-10 months.... crazy

This thread has run its course.

Don't forget, most people who have problems are very quick to complain (understandably). People who don't are busy playing their 360 at home.

That is why polls like these will always be flawed.

Kyser