Pioneer has released info stating that the new plasma technology is releasing sooner then you think. I am very hyped about the new screens and am thinking of getting one Below is more detailed info. Let me know what you think.



The key feature of the new displays are their ability to produce black levels 80% greater than Pioneer's previous models. The resulting 20,000:1 contrast ratio is a dramatic leap forwards for plasma technology that puts even the as yet unreleased 15,000:1 LED-backlit LCDs to shame. Code named Project Kuro (Japanese for black), the first of the new line of plasmas will premier in June and will be sporting 720p-ish XGA and WXGA resolutions. Specifically, the 42-inch Pioneer PDP-4280HD will rock 1024x768 for $2,700, and the 50-inch Pioneer PDP-5080HD will sport 1280x720 for $3,500.

In July, Elite branded models will launch, including the 42-inch PRO-950HD (1024x768) at $3,200, and the 50-inch PRO-1150HD (1280x720) at $4,500.

1080p aficionados will have to wait until September for the new 8th generation technology. Models will include two Pioneer displays at 50 and 60-inches (PDP-5010FD-$5,000, PDP-6010FD-$6,500) and two Elite models in the same size range (PRO-110FD-$6,000, PRO-150FD-$7,500).


What do you think?? Go for the 720p or wait for the 1080p model. Im planning on getting a 50".

Somebody rubbed an LED LCD fanboy the wrong way.... :rolleyes:

Pioneer has released info stating that the new plasma technology is releasing sooner then you think. I am very hyped about the new screens and am thinking of getting one Below is more detailed info. Let me know what you think.



The key feature of the new displays are their ability to produce black levels 80% greater than Pioneer's previous models. The resulting 20,000:1 contrast ratio is a dramatic leap forwards for plasma technology that puts even the as yet unreleased 15,000:1 LED-backlit LCDs to shame. Code named Project Kuro (Japanese for black), the first of the new line of plasmas will premier in June and will be sporting 720p-ish XGA and WXGA resolutions. Specifically, the 42-inch Pioneer PDP-4280HD will rock 1024x768 for $2,700, and the 50-inch Pioneer PDP-5080HD will sport 1280x720 for $3,500.

In July, Elite branded models will launch, including the 42-inch PRO-950HD (1024x768) at $3,200, and the 50-inch PRO-1150HD (1280x720) at $4,500.

1080p aficionados will have to wait until September for the new 8th generation technology. Models will include two Pioneer displays at 50 and 60-inches (PDP-5010FD-$5,000, PDP-6010FD-$6,500) and two Elite models in the same size range (PRO-110FD-$6,000, PRO-150FD-$7,500).


What do you think?? Go for the 720p or wait for the 1080p model. Im planning on getting a 50".

I think that I will test these units with my favorite dark movie DVD (like Fight Club) in a light-controlled showroom.

Until then, I won't believe one word I read here or (particularly) in Pioneer press releases.

Take a cold shower, adammb.

Im not sure what machinery they were using to measure1,000,000:1 ratio but I was told that there was no way for them to measure anywhere close to that and that it was pure speculation. Im talking about technology THIS year. Not something coming out in 2010.

Im not expecting 3D from this display wojtek but with those kinda numbers and early previews I am pretty excited to see what it will look like. Im told that when the 8th gen pioneer set is to be displayed it will have to be in a different aisle or area then the now current displays.

Pioneer has released info stating that the new plasma technology is releasing sooner then you think. I am very hyped about the new screens and am thinking of getting one Below is more detailed info. Let me know what you think.



the 50-inch Pioneer PDP-5080HD will sport 1280x720 for $3,500.

the 50-inch PRO-1150HD (1280x720) at $4,500.
Are you sure those won't be 1366x768, like they are now ?

All this and more is discussed in the plasma section in this thread:
8G Pioneer plasmas - 80% lower black levels! (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=782695)

I think I might actually give plasma a chance this time around.

My eyes are now set on the 1080p top-of-the-line model with "Direct Colour Filter III Plus" when it arrives in our country later this year.

I can't wait :)

Shouldn't this be posted in the plasma section?

Actually it could be deleted...this has already been posted in the plasma section

It's easy. LCD panel contrast which you can measure * led light brightness control. Let's say 2000:1 native LCD panel * 500:1 led light control=1M:1 contrast. Check out Samsung 81 thread.



This may be a dead issue/thread but what in the heck are you describing here??? Contrast ratio is a very easy thing to measure. The numbers have been corrupted by TV marketing types trying to make the numbers look really big (like that is meaningful). Contrast is either WHITE/BLACK (intrinsic measurement, in a dark room) or WHITE + REFLECTION / BLACK + RELFECTION (extrinsic, what you see in your house). In real operation, extrinsic numbers are below 50:1.

As for new plasma panels, they are now putting on an reasonable expensive Anti-reflecting coating (see extrinsic numbers above). Plasma actual have poor numbers in lit areas because of reflection. This coating will increase a plasma's extrinsic number by a lot. If the 20,000:1 is a intrinsic number, then it was created by a marketing hack who is stupid.

DBLASS, so there are two contrast ratios to measure on a panel. What, if any, measure
is there or would make sense to compare to what your eyes see inside or outside, etc...?
In other words, it seems to me you'd want to approach a "contrast" that came as
close to "real" as possible. I guess I'm wondering what the "target" would be for
a manufacturer, if that makes any sense anyway.

Yes, exactly my point. The problem is "real world" CR is about 20:1 to 50:1. All 2500:1 to 20,000:1 numbers are essentially meaningless. Reflection from ambient light will corrupt the "darkness" of black, reducing the CR to some very low levels. These more realistic numbers, however, don't sell very well so TV mfg like to use the "inside the darkroom" numbers (which is meaningful when you source the LCD panel itself) because they are unimpressive.

The real story is YES--the upcoming Pioneer Plasmas will put every Flat Panel LCD ever produced or imagined in the toilet!

People here will pretend that fact isn't true!

The real story is YES--the upcoming Pioneer Plasmas will put every Flat Panel LCD ever produced or imagined in the toilet!

People here will pretend that fact isn't true!
I am interested in a 50" 1080p plasma, it looks like the Pioneer Elite PRO-110FD will be the best, but how about the Pioneer PDP-5010FD, how would you folks guess it will be compared to the Panny 750?

The real story is YES--the upcoming Pioneer Plasmas will put every Flat Panel LCD ever produced or imagined in the toilet!

People here will pretend that fact isn't true!
LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Interesting comments but since Pioneer Elite Plasmas have the best picture of any set these appear to only be better. I'm not counting front projection.

The real story is YES--the upcoming Pioneer Plasmas will put every Flat Panel LCD ever produced or imagined in the toilet!

People here will pretend that fact isn't true!

Alot of folks best buy the elongated toilets then! :)

I'm still in love with my Pioneer 6070 HD-DVD to my aging eyes it is amazing. If they made it even better I just can't agree more with you.

Glad I didn't buy LCD my toilet hardly flushes now.:p

Don't believe all the hype. Sure CR is important. Just don't believe all the numbers manufacturers print. We should all shop with our eyes and view sets in a normal viewing environment.

“Unfortunately, these extremely high contrast ratios have little to do with real world performance and are just marketing hype.

Ambient light kills contrast ratio on any and every display. If you can see the white carpet below your flat panel, your contrast ratio is being negatively impacted. If there is 1 lux of ambient light in the room (i.e. a small candle), the max perceivable contrast ratio is 500:1. A dimly lighted room with 30 lux of lighting would squash the maximum perceivable contrast ratio to 50:1” http://www.carltonbale.com/2007/01/the-truth-about-inflated-hdtv-contrast-ratios/

“there are a number of tricky ways to influence the outcome of a contrast ratio test—and none of them have anything to do with the real world contrast ratio that you will experience while sitting at home... http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/spec-wars/contrast-ratio-shoot+out-everyone-loses-259495.php

Contrast Ratio—Unreliable – “Also, these contrast ratios are only applicable if you are watching TV in complete darkness. If there is any ambient light or glare in the room, the numbers become meaningless”
http://www.digitaladvisor.com/lcd-tv-and-plasma-tv/do-tv-specs-really-matter_roundup.html

The Fraud of “Cooking Up” Contrast Ratios
http://www.avrev.com/news/1106/30.contrastratio.shtml

Contrast Ratio – The Useless Statistic
http://blog.hometheatermag.com/geoffreymorrison/111705contrast/

Don't allow any numbers confuse or mislead you. Shop and buy what meets your needs.

What is the difference??

When I calibrated my sets, I had to turn the contrast down anyhow. Who cares if it is 1,000,000,000:1 if you have to reduce it to 800:1 to watch it? HYPE!!!!

Black level is the key here I think. The DLP set I bought in 2003 has a fantastically black screen as long as it's off. It's obviously capable of absorbing a lot of ambient light. Same with the 2004 or 2005 LCD I had. But turn them on and you can forget about black. Grey is as low as they'll go. Of course, DLP, LCD, and now LCOS, are already presenting some greatly improved pictures since my TV purchases.

Nevertheless, these Pioneers look to be an exciting advance.

(Being able to see the individual pixels has always bothered me though with Plasma. I'll definitely being checking these models out though...)

Black level is the key here I think. Black level and accurate gray scale scale tracking are the real keys. It is gray scale tracking that demonstrates how accurate a set displays colors.

1280 X 720 is intriguing. Is Pioneer going to have less scaling errors with 1280 X 720 than Panasonic with 1366 X 768?

I can just hear it now--not only does Pioneer offer REAL 1080p--it also offers REAL 720p BROADCAST sportsfans!

1280 X 720 is intriguing. Is Pioneer going to have less scaling errors with 1280 X 720 than Panasonic with 1366 X 768?

I can just hear it now--not only does Pioneer offer REAL 1080p--it also offers REAL 720p BROADCAST sportsfans! Are you talking about different Pioneer sets, two 1080p the others 720p? I just read this and about two new Pio sets - are these different models? "And in what must be characterized as a state of complete denial, there will be two new 42-inch XGA (1024x768) plasma sets for 2007, selling for $27,00 and $3,200 (MSRPs) respectively." http://www.hdtvexpert.com/pages_b/Play_This_Game.html

No matter, unless there is zero overscan, even a 1280x720 display will scale a 720p input (2%-5% for overscan). How well a set scales this input is what matters.

Think it's actually still 1365 or what have you...

Previous model apparently had a dot to dot mode as well as an overscan mode...

Ambient light kills contrast ratio on any and every display. [/url]
.
Ambient light is controllable and every videophile knows that eliminating ambient light and room reflections is key to superior image depth and blacks provided the display has superior On-Off contrast and sufficient ANSI contrast. So these numbers are not meaningless at all if measured properly. You can't blame the numbers when people insist on suboptimal surroundings. Garbage in, garbage out. The others know what to expect from their device and how to put it to proper use.

Ambient light is controllable and every videophile knows that eliminating ambient light and room reflections is key to superior image depth and blacks provided the display has superior On-Off contrast and sufficient ANSI contrast. So these numbers are not meaningless at all if measured properly. You can't blame the numbers when people insist on suboptimal surroundings. Garbage in, garbage out. The others know what to expect from their device and how to put it to proper use.But they are not measured properly. This is the problem. This makes the reported numbers meaningless. There are no standards mandating the environment or how measurements are taken.

"Some manufacturers crank the display's contrast to the max, and measure one pixel in the center of the screen to get the white reading. Then they take the signal out of the display altogether to measure a perfect black in a perfectly black room. This results in huge contrast ratios, yet has little to do with any real world situation that you will have in your system – even in a light-controlled dedicated home theater." http://www.avrev.com/news/1106/30.contrastratio.shtml

Real world CRs, measurements taken in the average user's viewing area, are down in the range of 50 to 200:1.

Decent blacks and whites are important but with poor gray scale tracking these numbers and the CR obtained from these numbers is meaningless. This too is something every videophile should know.

The real story is YES--the upcoming Pioneer Plasmas will put every Flat Panel LCD ever produced or imagined in the toilet!


At twice the price for a 1080p? With a ton of reflection and burn in when used with a computer?

I laugh in your general direction.