Well, that's good to know... But it doesn't mean I have to like it! :)

Oh no question.... I completely understand. Hell it's worse here for me as a sexagenarian with lifting limits imposed by health. Meaning I gotta get others to move the heavy stuff :(

I have to say other than that (and the rca input looking a little bashed in), I'm impressed with my LFM-1 Plus so far. I need to finish tuning it up tonight but first impressions were excellent. The finish looks great, and the plexiglass top is starting to grow on me. Sounds pretty nice too. :)

I've enjoyed my smaller LFM-1c the past two years and am really looking forward to marrying it up with the LFM-1EX en route to me now.

Are cables to connect to the receiver included in packaging?

Are cables to connect to the receiver included in packaging?


Nope.... you need to acquire one.... check out these
Monoprice subwoofer cables (http://www.monoprice.com/products/subdepartment.asp?c_id=102&cp_id=10236&cs_id=1023603)

Poop, ordered speaker wire a few days ago from monoprice and could have skipped some shipping costs if I thought about buying a subwoofer cable.

So this will work out? (I assume yes since it is on the page you linked me too, but I just want to verify): http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=102&cp_id=10236&cs_id=1023603&p_id=2683&seq=1&format=2

Well if it doesn't I'm screwed :D:D:D Seriously, it's a good choice. That same cable is en route to me currently :)

just set up my new lfm-1 plus and like it so far digs pretty deep so far. will do some more listening and post pics later!

If I were you I would make up my mind to get the dual LFM-1 EX by end of business today - but I'm someone who just pulled the trigger on one of these yesterday :) The current sale ends today and based on the research I've done, dual EX's for $1038 shipped will without a doubt produce the most high quality low frequency output at your price point.

You didn't mention it, but dual MFM-15s from av123 would be another option ($1099) but you'll pay more after shipping.

I don't see a reason to go with Hsu over Outlaw unless you need the Turbo option, or one of the wood finishes. Without the Turbo option, the Hsu subs will perform similarly to the Outlaw subs, but you aren't going to get two of them for $1000. I also prefer the downfiring driver/port design of the Outlaw.

The 12" SVS subs in this price range are likely good subs. I've not personally heard anything except for their water-heater type subs (which are awesome, but fugly). I have heard people say that the Outlaw/HSU designs sound better for music, which swayed my decision toward Outlaw from SVS.

I didn't really consider Epik. Even though they are also having a sale, in my opinion they didn't offer the bang/$ of the Outlaw subs. But they do get great reviews, they do have some nice features (love the balanced inputs) and they do win in terms of enclosure size if that is a factor for you.

Don't know anything about ED.

The thing that struck me about the Outlaw subs is that even after looking long and hard I have not found a single negative performance-related comment, really about *any* of the Outlaw subs. That's a pretty high standard! That, combined with the value represented by this sale made it an easy choice for me. The hardest choice for me was whether to go for an EX or a plus. Since I don't have space to place two subs in our family room, I decided to go with the bigger one.

Thanks for your inputs. Though my budget is roughly $1,000 I can stretch if needed. I don't want to compromise now and regret later.

I am clueless about subs, as you can see. I have evaluating different brands (HSU, ED, EPIK, OUTLAW, SVS, VELODYNE). What I looking to accomplish is perhaps salvage my existing sub (Velo CHT-12) and add another high-end sub. If not, then buy 2 subs (not top of the line) and use CHT-12 in my other setup.

One of the things I'd like to know when someone recommends a sub is why they are recommending that specific sub? What makes is better than the other brands listed above? I know price plays a role in decision making, but I looking for a good balance between price and performance (aka VALUE).

I have a heavily carpeted floor. Wouldn't that affect the sound/performance of a down-firing sub? Wouldn't side firing be better? Not sure, so just asking. :confused:

Thanks for your insights. :D

The downfiring subs come with spikes that raise them off the floor to compensate for this. That said, a Subdude or Auralex Gramma might need to be on your shopping list.

The downfiring subs come with spikes that raise them off the floor to compensate for this. That said, a Subdude or Auralex Gramma might need to be on your shopping list.

So, does that mean that down firing sub will be a problem on a carpeted floor, unless I use Subdude or Auralex? Seem like an unnecessary expense when I can get a side firing sub for the same price. Don't you think?

It comes with spikes designed for use on a carpeted floor. Being I have a wood floor, I had to use the included discs to put the spikes on top of. They do not recommend the additional isolators on carpet, just the spikes. I just keep picturing deep 1970's shag all up into the speaker when you say "heavily carpeted". ;)

As stated above the spikes will be all you need on normal carpet.

It comes with spikes designed for use on a carpeted floor. Being I have a wood floor, I had to use the included discs to put the spikes on top of. They do not recommend the additional isolators on carpet, just the spikes. I just keep picturing deep 1970's shag all up into the speaker when you say "heavily carpeted". ;)

Thanks for the clarification. :D

So you guys a pair of Outlaw LFM-1X would meet my needs. At current sale prices, they certainly fit my budget. Or should I go for a Hsu VTF3-MK3 for $700 and salvage my Velo CHT-12 for the 2nd sub?

Any advice?

Well, fellow members, I now have a legitimate reason to post here... I am the proud owner of a LFM-1c. Ordered late Monday night, and since I am in SoCal, it arrived on Wednesday (after taken on a tour by FedEx around the bldg... they were kind enough to bring it back downstairs on their hand truck so that I could take custody at the loading dock and throw it stragiht into the back of my vehicle). The Energy ESW-8 is going to go back to Costco as soon as I get the chance.

But that's the end of my gloating, as it seems I have caught whatever bug my son brought home from daycare. I am basically out of commission for the next few days (the sub is still sitting in my trunk... did not have the strength to take it out), which sucks because with the weekend here it would be the perfect time to take it out and fire it up. Oh, well... whatcha gonna do?

I do have to say that the shipping box was much smaller than I imagined it to be (based on NCDave's post I linked to earlier), which for me is a good thing, as I was looking for a small, powerful, good sounding sub that wasn't going to break the bank.

Anyway, I am probably not going to be around too much over the next few days, both to avoid the torture of reading all of your "I'm lovin' my new sub!" posts, and because I am currently typing this while sitting on the floor. Yes, every time I stand up I feel like I'm going to fall over, and my chair does not seem to want to be my friend today. I am going to go and plop myself on the couch when I get home (yes, I drug my sorry @$$ to work since I have a deadline to meet next week, though I didn't get much done) and let it work it's magic on my (it is a very comfortable couch, you must understand). I just hope I am feeling better by Saturday since I am supposed to be helping my Dad install his new Onkyo 707.

NyQuil, here I come!

So, adios fellow Outlaws, congratulations to all on your new subs. And thanks for convincing me to join the club.

Oh, one last thing, regarding the dimpled disks: when I was first looking for a sub, I was strongly considering the eD A3-250 due to it's long an low design, and I was really impressed with their spiked feet. Not only are they metal, but they screw apart and it you buy a second set, you can screw the two bases together to make what they call "hourglass" feet. I was really intrigued by this, as it would make it easier to slide across the floor (so I imagine). Thing is, I read on the Hsu Research site that Dr. Hsu recommends putting a rug between a downfiring sub and laminate/hardwood floor. I don't remember why at this time (to reduce vibration?), but since I have some leftoever carpet samples from years ago, I am going to try it out. Now, I don't have to worry about bothering with the dimpled disks or spending an extra $30 to get two sets of eD's spiked feet (if they would even fit). So, if you are having disk issues, check out a little rug, carpet sample, or go "pro" and get an Auralex Gramma or SubDude. Those seem to be the recommendations floating around.

VSP

I have caught whatever bug my son brought home from daycare. I am basically out of commission for the next few days (the sub is still sitting in my trunk...

What a bummer. Talk about adding insult to injury - not only sick but having your new toy sitting out in the car and not be able to play with it. Torture!!

I'm reading this entire thread to pass the time until mine arrives. I'm half way there and still three days to go according to tracking. What will I do to pass the time if it takes until Tuesday? :confused:

Yo, Vulcan....

If you could convince your dad to return his 707 and take my 875 instead for less $$$, I'll come up this afternoon and bring your sub in.

My EX is on vehicle for delivery...I ordered it Wednesday night. Unfortunately I won't be home to sign for it. Got my rear speakers Tuesday, speaker wire Wednesday, receiver Thursday, and sub today. Can't believe I'll be done soon.

Got mine tuned last night, at least the best I can without an EQ. After crawling around the room, I found that I had previously located the sub in probably the worst spot in the room. I currently have it in what seems to be the second best spot in the room, moving to the best spot is going to require some additional cabling, and there might be a WAF issue there. Once in place, I fired up REW and found a large peak at about 25hz. I replaced the port plug, switched to maximum extension, and BAM, almost a PERFECT plot other than a small, narrow dip at about 32hz. I did a full frequency scan and found I had a massive dip at 120hz. First I tried changing the phase, I thought I might have some cancellation near the crossover point. No luck. Then I tried messing with my crossover frequencies, but my old receiver doesn't offer anything other than switching the speakers from small to large. I could have probably solved this problem by lowering the main speakers crossovers to 80hz, but since there's no way for me to do this I had to switch the speakers to large. This DID work, and it works well. I'm not noticing any ill effects yet from doing this. I believe a new receiver would be all I need at this point to really dial my system in. I have my eyes on the Denon AVR-790.

So how does it sound? I fired up several movies and CDs. The first thing I noticed is how SMOOTH it is. There's no boominess and no peaky notes. The next thing I noticed is how effortless it plays low compared to my Sunfire. The Sunfire could move some air, but when it had to play low notes loud you could hear some noise from the driver working so hard. Not so with the new LX. On classical music, it was a whole new experience. I used Fantasia 2000 for these tests. It was amazing how much more realistic the music was compared to my older setup. The kettle drums and basses were never overpowering, they were right where they should be instead of sounding like an action film.

I'm impressed, this is a great sub! I may see if I can find an Auralex Gramma locally so I can try it out. Since I'm on hardwood floors with no underlay it is possible I could have some resonance (in fact, it's likely). On movies I enjoy feeling the floor shake though, so I am not positive that I will like the effect.

One of the things that shocks me is this is easily the least expensive audio system I've had in almost 30 years, yet it is also the best sounding.

My EX is on vehicle for delivery...I ordered it Wednesday night. Unfortunately I won't be home to sign for it. Got my rear speakers Tuesday, speaker wire Wednesday, receiver Thursday, and sub today. Can't believe I'll be done soon.

Hmm, now if I can get them to not bother wasting time stopping at your place and come directly to my office, I can take delivery on the SMS-1 and Gramma and not have to hang around a couple of hours after I'm done working.

:D

hey guys. I was looking at a EMP ES10i Sub, and was recommended a Outlaw LFM-1 Compact. Seems right for the price. Anyone have any opinions?

Glad you got your placement worked out TornadoTJ and are enjoying the new sub. You keep referring to it as the "LX", but I presume you got the "EX"? Anyway, I still love mine after a couple of years (and I paid a lot more than you lucky guys getting it for $520 shipped...).

Yea, darnit, I meant EX. LOL! Can't wait to play a good action movie on it. Watched "Hot Fuzz" last night, that doesn't count.

hey guys. I was looking at a EMP ES10i Sub, and was recommended a Outlaw LFM-1 Compact. Seems right for the price. Anyone have any opinions?


Based on specs the Compact should kill it.

125 more watts rms
10hz lower frequency responce (25 for Outlaw, 35 for EMP)

I haven't heard of either but I don't think it will be close.

----------------------
Oct 2, 2009 4:04 PM Arrived at FedEx location NASHVILLE, TN
----------------------

OMG, it is here in town now but I won't get it until Monday! Argh! :(

I guess I'll spend the weekend with REW, getting the hang of using it with my B&K notch filter and current sub.

Well my EX was delivered this morning but has suffered some minor cosmetic damage from the FedEx gang due to a puncture that went through both exterior and interior packing. I've contacted FedEx and sent pix to Outlaw as they requested. Haven't heard back yet......

The SMS-1 arrived today triple boxed. Also inside was another box that contained a microphone about 100x as expensive as the one that came with my Pio Elite SC-07 AVR. It came in it's own hard shell with foam rubber inside the 4th box. You could drop that thing off a cliff and the mic would probably survive.

The Plus is rattling everything in the living room at modest levels...

Sorry to hear that, Bob. I bet you are disappointed - I know I would be. It will be interesting to hear what Outlaw has to say.

You may get the opportunity to have part of your money refunded but still keep the sub if the damage it is something you can live with. This happened to me once with a piece of furniture (when I took the offered deal) and, on a separate occassion, a kitchen appliance (when I didn't take the deal and insisted on a new one).

Although maybe this is a different situation since FedEx is to blame and not the manufacturer themselves. Please keep us posted.

Sorry to hear that, Bob. I bet you are disappointed - I know I would be. It will be interesting to hear what Outlaw has to say.

Although maybe this is a different situation since FedEx is to blame and not the manufacturer themselves. Please keep us posted.

I talked to both Memphis as well as the local FedEx office. Bottom line from what I understand is that the procedure for damages is that Outlaw would issue the call tag for a pick up and then FedEx would do their own inspection / analysis of the damage. They'd talk and depending, the unit could be kept by FedEx with them paying Outlaw, or it could be sent back to Outlaw for them to rework / disposition with FedEx reimbursing an agreed amount. And yes another possible option is for Outlaw to issue a partial reimbursement to me with my keeping it "as is" and with I suppose FedEx reimbursing them.

The penetration damaged a lower edge of the sub. Properly placed it could be hidden against a wall or within a corner as it is cosmetic only. But unit value has been diminished by the damage regardless of functionality.

Yeah I was disappointed and quite upset. I sometimes wonder if baggage handlers at airports as well as material handlers at warehouses and transfer points for carriers and delivery services are fed bananas throughout the day :mad:

I was also disappointed that I didn't hear anything back from Outlaw today. Then again considering the time zone differences they only had the pictures of the damage for the afternoon so I'm probably expecting too much

I picked my EX up at the local FedEx warehouse after work. I saw a worker throw some boxes on the floor from about 2' off the ground while I was waiting for someone to come to the lobby area. I know there are many handlers that are very careful, but you never know who will be delivering your merchandise. Sorry for the position you are in.

I got my EX connected tonight, but won't be able to set it up with my other speakers and Audyssey until tomorrow.

I read the Audyssey setup thread, but still have some questions.

The crossover frequency can go from 0-180. I have it set at 180; is this correct?

The Port Mode can be 25hz max output or 20hz bass extension. Which do I use?

I just have a Denon 1610 and speakers, no fancy equipment.

seemed to me from reading this thread that most people were running theirs in bass extension with a port plugged. i have two lfm-1ex's with one port plugged on each - would i get any benefit from running one of them in bass extension and one in max output mode?

tfoltz -- you need to set the crossover frequency to somewhere around where your main speakers start to roll off in response. 180 seems quite high for virtually any type of speaker. Try something lower, like 80 to 120.

Ok, thanks. I'll try 80hz and bypass at 20hz with the port plug in (just like it came when shipped).

The Audyssey setup thread states the following:

"B. Disable the Low-Pass Filter (LPF) on the subwoofer, if allowed.

1. Disabling the LPF will result in more accurate subwoofer distance measurements.

2. If the LPF cannot be disabled, set it to the highest frequency allowed."

How is this addressed on this sub?

tfoltz,

Simply switch the sub crossover OFF and use only the AVR's crossover setting which should be 80Hz or THX 80Hz.

So I set "X-OVER" to Bypass instead of Active? Thanks for the help everyone.

tfoltz,

Simply switch the sub crossover OFF and use only the AVR's crossover setting which should be 80Hz or THX 80Hz.

So I set "X-OVER" to Bypass instead of Active? Thanks for the help everyone.

Exactly :)

While I'm waiting to hear about what will be done with the damage to the LFM-1EX, I set both the EX and my older LFM-1Compact up and experimented in my 30' x 16' room. Since these two (EX and Compact) aren't matches, the dual sub set up is much more difficult and potentially detrimental compared to just running the bigger sub. I set each up independently running Audyssey with only the EX on line. Then I started an analysis of each sub's position and BASH amp volume settings, as well as my AVR settings using a Stereophile Test CD and a Radio Shack analog SLM and reading correction tables.

I ended up with the EX placed about 3' from a corner and the C at about 18' from the front corner along the wall. Placing it next or behind the listening couch located 16' in front of the screen didn't work as well as expected. Here is what I have ended up with:

Both subs with volume controls set around 10:30 o'clock or so. AVR set to cross subs at 80Hz, mains (which are 30-20k +/- 3dB) at 50Hz and all other speakers in the 7+2 system at 40 Hz. (As an aside Audyssey had given full for the mains and all others at 40Hz when run with just the EX on line.) Table corrected RS analog SLM readings given:

1000 Hz 70.5 dB
200 Hz 75 dB
160 Hz 76 dB
125 Hz 73.5 dB
100 Hz 70.75 dB
80 Hz 72.75 dB
63 Hz 71.75 dB
50 Hz 73.75 dB
40 Hz 75.5 dB
31.5 Hz 71 dB
25 Hz 72.5 dB
20 Hz 73 dB

Significant improvement over just the Compact in my large room which admittedly was pushing its envelope significantly.
And at 20-200Hz +/-2.625dB, these two dissimilar subs work quite well together for me. :D :D

Just purchased an Outlaw LFM-1 Plus for the discount price (although I bought it after the 30'th so I'm hoping the price will stick). I currently have a HSU STF-1 that doesn't seem to blend well with my speakers and is just too small. I guess I'm an inpulse buyer and bought the Energy ESW-V8 from wwstereo last Thursday with the hopes it would blend better with the mains. After watching a movie yesterday I realized that an 8" just ins't big enough. My HT area is 11'x15' and is open to the rest of the basement (a total of 11'x28'). It's a small room and I'm hoping the LFM-1 Plus won't be too much. Well just wanted to post and say I'm EXCITED to try this thing out when it comes. I'm scared it's going to be too big and I won't have many placement options. My parents think I'm done buying HT components so I'll try to sneak this one in and see their reaction when a movie explosion hits them in the chest :eek:

Just purchased an Outlaw LFM-1 Plus for the discount price (although I bought it after the 30'th so I'm hoping the price will stick). I currently have a HSU STF-1 that doesn't seem to blend well with my speakers and is just too small. I guess I'm an inpulse buyer and bought the Energy ESW-V8 from wwstereo last Thursday with the hopes it would blend better with the mains. After watching a movie yesterday I realized that an 8" just ins't big enough. My HT area is 11'x15' and is open to the rest of the basement (a total of 11'x28'). It's a small room and I'm hoping the LFM-1 Plus won't be too much. Well just wanted to post and say I'm EXCITED to try this thing out when it comes. I'm scared it's going to be too big and I won't have many placement options. My parents think I'm done buying HT components so I'll try to sneak this one in and see their reaction when a movie explosion hits them in the chest :eek:


Congrats--you should love the Plus. Don't worry about it being too much. You can always turn the gain (volume) down to tailor it to your needs, but you'll love having the extra headroom the Plus can provide compared to a smaller sub. Let us know what you think once it is set up.

itsfun

+1 to what Jeffrey said. Take the time to experiment with locations and settings (both the volume on the LFM-1+ and the various options within your AVR). That will ensure you get the best performance and therefore enjoyment from your new sub. You'll be very pleased as a result :)

My EX is on the truck and will be delivered today (Monday). I'm setup for room measurements using the Room Equalization Wizard (REW) software. If you are interested to follow along as I work through my setup, the thread is here (http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/rew-forum/21619-using-rew-setup-b-k-peq-notch-filter.html).

I am going to try using my existing sub (a Velodyne DLS-3500) and the new EX together. Earlier tonight I posted response graphs (http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/rew-forum/21619-using-rew-setup-b-k-peq-notch-filter.html) of the Velo installed in two different room locations. Unfortunately my current sub has a huge, huge dip at 38Hz in the location where the EX needs to go. I'm a bit concerned. I guess I'll learn more after the FedEx guy comes tomorrow.

My EX arrived this morning. I can see why Outlaw double-boxes these. The outer box was dinged up pretty badly in the corners and had several tears in it. Only one of the tears made it through to the inner box, though. The sub didn't suffer any visible damage.

However, there seems to be a rattle coming from inside the enclosure at certain frequencies, and when playing pink noise. I'm going to have to call them up - something isn't quite right.

I did an initial response measurement from the listining position. Maximum output mode gives me reference level bass at 20Hz in my room. That's what I was looking for! I haven't tried max extension mode yet.

I talked to Scott at Outlaw. I have a defective woofer :(

I guess they will send me a new woofer to install. More waiting...

I talked to Scott at Outlaw. I have a defective woofer :(

I guess they will send me a new woofer to install. More waiting...

Seems that the handling crews have been working overtime at screwing things up. I got an e-mail from Scott acknowledging the shipping damage mine suffered.... more to come.


Addendum: an accommodation has been reached with Outlaw. Painless thankfully and to their credit :)

What is the best method to check for rattles? Just turn things up? Mine seems fine, but I've had it playing quietly.

However, there seems to be a rattle coming from inside the enclosure at certain frequencies, and when playing pink noise. I'm going to have to call them up - something isn't quite right.

tfoltz,

Mine rattled (actually it was more of a buzzing noise) at any volume. Believe me if your sub had the same problem as mine you would not have any problem reproducing it! I noticed within 5 seconds of running the first level adjustment tone through it.

There have been others earlier in this thread who said they had a genuine rattle. IIRC in at least one case it turned out to be the speaker wire vibrating against one of the ports. When I removed my driver for inspection I noticed that the speaker wire was wrapped in polyester batting, I assume to remove that possibility.

tonight i'm going to try removing the plugs and testing max output mode and see if i can hear a difference.

Hi Everyone,

After some research and inputs of fellow forum members, I purchased a pair of Outlaw LFM-1X subwoofers. They are due to arrive on Friday. My HT area is 21'x16'x7.5' in a open basement of 21'x46'x7.5'. The setup is as follows:

Energy RC70s FR/FL x/o @ 60Hz
Energy RCLCR CC x/o @ 60Hz
Energy RC50s SR/SL x/o @ 80Hz
Energy RC10s SBR/SBL x/o 100Hz
Harmon Kardon AVR-630 (7.1, 75w/ch)
Panasonic L500U 720p HD Projector
110" DaLite Screen

This HT is 80% Movies, 15% Music, 5% Gaming. Since I don't know much about "fine tuning" the audio setup, here are some of my questions:

1. I don't think there's a whole lot of Bass Management options available in my HK AVR (atleast I can't figure it out). Are my speaker crossovers setup correctly to function in harmony with Outlaw subs? Should I change any settings?

2. Is there a better way to determine the placement for the 2 subs I bought, other than trial and error (aka sub crawling)?

3. What are recommended settings (phase, gain, crossover etc.) for the Outlaw subs (for my kind of setup)?

4. Besides this forum, are there any other resources that can help me fine tune my "subwoofer" setup?

Thanks everyone for your inputs.

1. Turn the EQ off on the sub if your receiver has a SUB OUT that's crossed over.
2. No. Not for initial placement. I found a few spots in my room then tried each. I ended up going with the 2nd best spot according to room crawling due to WAF and the fact I could locate the sub when it was behind me.
3. Use REW and your ears. You can't really get a list of standards from a forum.
4. REW.

After some research and inputs of fellow forum members, I purchased a pair of Outlaw LFM-1X subwoofers. They are due to arrive on Friday. My HT area is 21'x16'x7.5' in a open basement of 21'x46'x7.5'.

Congrats on your purchase. That should be a lot of bang for your $$.

1. I don't think there's a whole lot of Bass Management options available in my HK AVR (atleast I can't figure it out). Are my speaker crossovers setup correctly to function in harmony with Outlaw subs? Should I change any settings?

If your AVR doesn't have an adjustable crossover setting, then it is most likely set to 80 or 90Hz (THX reference is 80Hz). This should be fine for most applications, except for systems that have tiny, tiny satellite speakers, where you might want to have the sub crossover at a slightly higher frequency (100Hz or maybe even 120Hz) at the expense of being able to localize the bass more than you could with a lower crossover setting.

2. Is there a better way to determine the placement for the 2 subs I bought, other than trial and error (aka sub crawling)?

Yes, I recommend that you look into using the free Room Equalization Wizard (REW) software and an SPL meter to measure the frequency response at your listenting location. This will take a huge amount of the guesswork out of sub placement and setup.

3. What are recommended settings (phase, gain, crossover etc.) for the Outlaw subs (for my kind of setup)?

Most of this depends on exactly how the subwoofer interacts with your main speakers and your room. There is really no good way to know in advance, which is why I recommended that you look into the REW software.

4. Besides this forum, are there any other resources that can help me fine tune my "subwoofer" setup?

You will find a lot of valuable info in the subwoofer eq forums at home theater shack.

Thanks, everyone.

I'll do some Google-ing on this REW software. I am NOT an audiophile by any stretch of imagination, so I am hoping that this software would be EASY TO USE and wouldn't cause me to lose my (remaining) hair. :p

This is where you will find that information:
http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/rew-forum/

As far as it being easy, as long as you follow the step-by-step directions on the website, it is not difficult at all.

I would prefer my receiver allow a LOWER crossover point than 80hz. My mains are capable of playing cleanly much lower than 80hz. I tried the sub behind me, but unfortunately I was able to localize it. It sounded weird to have the audio smeared across the room. It sounded better behind me other than being able to localize it.

Hey all!

Well, I am still under the weather, tho getting better day-by-day. This flu that I've got really knocked me on my @$$... worst case I have had in years. So, if any of you were himming or hawing over getting a flu shot, stop and go get one. You don't want to be sick like this.

And if that isn't enough to get you moving, here is my latest symptom: my plugged ears are now distorting high frequency sounds, such that my cell phone and piano/guitar music sound like they are being played on something that is running out of batteries... very annoying! This has been going on for 2 days. It is quite awful. :mad:

OK, onto other things...
What a bummer. Talk about adding insult to injury - not only sick but having your new toy sitting out in the car and not be able to play with it. Torture!!
And the torture is continuing til today, as the sub is still in my trunk. I hate leaving it there, but at least it is better than the garage, since we have suddenly switched from Summer to Fall out here about a week and a half ago.
If you could convince your dad to return his 707 and take my 875 instead for less $$$, I'll come up this afternoon and bring your sub in.
Hey, thanks for the offer, but my Dad was very ecstatic about the 707, plus he got in on the Newegg coupon from a few weeks back (PM'd by J&R, so no tax), so you'd have to go pretty low to get him to bite on that. Additionally, I was able to make it over to his place on Saturday and set it up. Since everything is at floor level, I just sat there unplugging and plugging away, and then sat on the couch with the remote and programmed away. Too many noises to run Audyssey. Plus I wanted to leave that fun just for him, my mom, and their dog. :D

Glad to hear everyone is enjoying their new subs. Glad to hear Bob got his damage issue settled, and even more glad that he got the EX and the c synced.

OK, I'm outta here. Cross your fingers that I get over this bug soon so that I too can join in the fun. I am having a good feeling about this weekend. :D

VSP

I just got my Ex delivered today.:) Packaging job done by Outlaw was excellent, I think. Unfortunately, my EX suffered a same damage as Bob described. Puncture went through outer & inner boxes on the side causing small cosmetic damage to the left side of the sub. Job well done by FedEx.:mad: For my set up, right side faces the wall & left side is visible.:( I'll contact Outlaw tomorrow. I'll let you guys know how it goes.

EX's initial impression was great compare to my current (Not anymore:)) SVS 25-31 Pci. For initial listening, EX sits in same place as SVS was, receiver set up is unchanged and it's the same HT room as it was yesterday. To my ears, EX is far superior sub over SVS and I think I paid more for SVS. I bought SVS based on raves by so many people, but I could never liked it much. When I told people how I didn't like my SVS sub almost everyone was saying I must have set it up wrong ( calibration must be wrong, placement must be wrong or it's the fault of your room acoustic). It was like you have to love your sub no matter what because it's SVS. Of all my HT gears, (Receiver -> Sony DA5-ES; 5.1 Speakers -> Ascend CMT-340 for fronts & center, Ascend CBM-170for surround; SUB -> of course was SVS 25-31 Pci) SVS is the only thing I regret purchasing.

I just got my Ex delivered today.:) Packaging job done by Outlaw was excellent, I think. Unfortunately, my EX suffered a same damage as Bob described. Puncture went through outer & inner boxes on the side causing small cosmetic damage to the left side of the sub. Job well done by FedEx.:mad:

Well that certainly sucks! I'm curious as my damage also was on the left. Was yours on the lower edge or on the side itself? Was the penetration a "slit" about 2 to 2.5" long?

I contacted Outlaw and talked to Jennifer who gave me an e-mail address to send pictures to. I included the outside and inside boxes as well as the sub's damage itself. That was on a Friday afternoon and I heard back from Scott Monday. Tuesday we reached an accommodation. No doubt your problem will also be given expeditious attention as well. Kudos to Outlaw here :)



Glad to hear everyone is enjoying their new subs. Glad to hear Bob got his damage issue settled, and even more glad that he got the EX and the c synced.

Cross your fingers that I get over this bug soon so that I too can join in the fun. I am having a good feeling about this weekend.


VSP, glad to hear you're well on the road to recovery. Yeah this weekend you need to get your LFM-1c up and running. Here the dual sub set up continues to tickle me along with the new DefTech front end mains/center:D

Sorry to hear about your damaged sub kyekyk. This is troubling with all of this recent damage from fed ex. I recall from my EX how well it was packed, so Outlaw sure tries to prevent damage to the sub.

Glad you like the EX compared to your SVS. I similarly replaced an SVS with my EX, and I also much preferred the EX. My SVS was the PB1-ISD, which was in their first line of boxed subs. I had since upgraded the driver to their NSD driver, so my sub had the old enclosure and amp, with the new driver. The SVS was and is still excellent, and does just fine in our basement system, but the EX is a much more refined, powerful beast. No knock to SVS, but these Outlaw subs really are great.

Good grief, has anybody here received a fully functional/undamaged sub from Outlaw lately?

My replacement EX woofer is coming tomorrow (Friday) morning. I am not sure I'll be here to sign for it. Does anybody know if I can just leave the driver a signed note to avoid having to wait until Monday for a re-delivery attempt?

Good grief, has anybody here received a fully functional/undamaged sub from Outlaw lately?


I have, but it only had to travel 150 miles. That being said, there was a large slice in both the inner and outer packaging, but the unit remained unscathed.

My HSU Stf-1 was damaged by Fed-Ex. It had a puncture on the left side of the box that damaged the subwoofer housing. I was able to purchase my LFM-1 + (coming on Friday! :D) because the STF-1 is being sent back to California at Fed-Ex's expense (would have cost me $50 or more as I'm located in VA). I'm glad I got to "test" the STF-1 but Fed-Ex really should take care of their packages, no matter what they weigh.

Good grief, has anybody here received a fully functional/undamaged sub from Outlaw lately?

My replacement EX woofer is coming tomorrow (Friday) morning. I am not sure I'll be here to sign for it. Does anybody know if I can just leave the driver a signed note to avoid having to wait until Monday for a re-delivery attempt?

Fedex would not leave it, however after the first attempt I left my cell number on the slip and the driver called me and left a message. I called him back and was able to pick a place along his route and meet him to get the LFM-1 Plus. It was nice that he put it in my car - barely fit in the front seat of a 2 door vehicle - with the seat back!

The box was undamaged until ...well... I tried to move it with one handle on the side of the box. The handle and a hunk of cardboard went with me into the bushes. :( it is heavy.... and sounds fantastic!

I get the feeling that when Outlaw has a sale and moves a lot of subs, that some $@*&$ at FedEx in L.A. is overwhelmed and starts being careless. I had a box containing 2 DefTech Mythos Ones that came to my place through L.A that curiously had the same damage as the sub packaging did.

Received my LFM-1 PLUS in pristine condition. The box is really big and sure is heavy. But I agree they should be more responsible with other people's property.

Did a small comparison last night, klipsch sub-10 vs. PLUS. Played a scene on the klipsch, then plugged in PLUS and played same scene. WOW! Definitely shook room more and played notes that were absent with klipsch. Will try and do some more testing tonight, if not this weekend.
Not sure how to calibrate sub so any quick pointers or links of where i should go would be helpful.

Thanks

Good grief, has anybody here received a fully functional/undamaged sub from Outlaw lately?

I don't know if this qualifies as "lately" but my LFM-1 EX arrived last February (during the last big subwoofer sale) completely undamaged and unscathed. No rattles, no punctures, no upside-down components...in fact no problems of any kind! :)
Not trying to gloat; just want to set the record straight. I guess I was lucky!!!

Well that certainly sucks! I'm curious as my damage also was on the left. Was yours on the lower edge or on the side itself? Was the penetration a "slit" about 2 to 2.5" long?
My damage was more like a ding as if something pointy struck the packaging. I talked to Jennifer at Outlaw this morning. she asked me to email few photos of the damage so I did.

Glad you like the EX compared to your SVS. I similarly replaced an SVS with my EX, and I also much preferred the EX. My SVS was the PB1-ISD, which was in their first line of boxed subs. I had since upgraded the driver to their NSD driver, so my sub had the old enclosure and amp, with the new driver. The SVS was and is still excellent, and does just fine in our basement system, but the EX is a much more refined, powerful beast. No knock to SVS, but these Outlaw subs really are great.
Exactly, Jarrod. EX is definitely more powerful and blends in seamless in my system. EX is putting big smile on my face.:)

Man, go away for a couple of weeks and look out...:eek:

Outlaw finally runs another sub sale and the thread is active once again...

Congrats to all who purchased at a great deal and I look forward to getting back in on the discussion.:)

Major revision #4 to the theater room and Outlaw Subs. I have always wanted to remove the built in 15' wide hutch and try a false wall along with my AT screen. This way I can try having all four subs located behind the screen with the rest of the front sound stage.

I decided to lay the subs on their sides and have the "business end" facing out to the room for something completely different!:p All I can say is WOW...along with a completely treated front "real" wall and two floor to ceiling bass traps, it has never sounded better...

Upgrade-itis has left the building! Long Live Outlaw Subs! :cool:

Here are five pictures from start to finish...:)

I decided to lay the subs on their sides and have the "business end" facing out to the room for something completely different!:p All I can say is WOW...along with a completely treated front "real" wall and two floor to ceiling bass traps, it has never sounded better...

Upgrade-itis has left the building! Long Live Outlaw Subs! :cool:


WOW! What are you running? 2 each EX plus 2 each +1 subs?

WOW! What are you running? 2 each EX plus 2 each +1 subs?

Hi Bob,

I have (2) EX subs & (2) PLUS subs and I located them in pairs. 1 EX with 1 PLUS basically underneath the screen width of 115". They sound great laying on their sides...go figure!

Larry

Larry,

You are the man!!! That is a sweet setup. Thanks for sharing :). Hope all is well with you my friend.

^^
Man nothing gets past you Stephen...:)

Thanks for the kudos!

^^
Man nothing gets past you Stephen...:)

Thanks for the kudos!

I just know to tune in when I see you post. There's always something worthwhile...and ALMOST always something to be jealous of ;)...like that SCREEN!!! Major props for that whole front wall - it looks incredible.

Very nice. I can't wait until I get into a house and can do something like that.

Hi Bob,

I have (2) EX subs & (2) PLUS subs and I located them in pairs. 1 EX with 1 PLUS basically underneath the screen width of 115". They sound great laying on their sides...go figure!

Larry

How does laying on their sides affect the frequency response and/or output levels? Just got my one little EX this past week and am happy with it but I always yearn for more thumpin and growlin! May just play with it this next week.

How does laying on their sides affect the frequency response and/or output levels? Just got my one little EX this past week and am happy with it but I always yearn for more thumpin and growlin! May just play with it this next week.

Hi paulbehnke,

I have not run REW after the change...I hope to do so in a few weeks.

Subjectively, it sounds amazing and I am pretty sure that has more to do with the new location and the acoustical treatments. Right now, SPL readings have increased on a couple of quick tests but IIRC, that was not the case when I had only my first two subs on their sides. Lifting the sub about 1.5" higher off my thick carpet did improve things while in the downward firing position.

Give it a try..I for one would be interested in your thoughts...:)

Very nice. I can't wait until I get into a house and can do something like that.

Thanks SupaKats...:)

I had to wait for my first "real" house to do this...

Apartment > Condo > Two Family was my road to this theater room.

Laugsbach, I am loving your 4 Outlaw subs. I thought I was going nuts getting 2 Ex myself. By the way, nice setup you got there.

Reye

^^

Thanks Reye!

BTW, you're not nuts...:cool:

When I think that I have too many subs I just stop over at fellow Cincinnati resident Erich H's theater room and go :eek::eek::eek::eek:

http://i195.photobucket.com/albums/z239/Scaper-S2k/completeHT.jpg

Here are five pictures from start to finish...:)

Looks like you have been busy. Awesome job on the new wall - it looks fantastic and I bet it sounds just as good as it looks.

^^
I appreciate the kind words Jarrod...everything has finally come together and indeed, it does sound as good as it looks!

Man, I wish I could try and lay my Outlaws like that. But with little rugrats with curious fingers, it would probably be a disaster. That's one of the main reasons I bought down firing subs lol

When I think that I have too many subs I just stop over at fellow Cincinnati resident Erich H's theater room and go :eek::eek::eek::eek:

http://i195.photobucket.com/albums/z239/Scaper-S2k/completeHT.jpg


You have a link to that thread, I want to know about his speaker holders.

^^

Here you go...

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1060966

Very generous accommodation has been reached for a shipping damaged for my EX.

Oct-07 ---> received EX with a minor cosmetic damage on the side due to FedEx's fault.
Oct-08 ---> Talk to Jennifer at Outlaw & emailed few pictures of the damage.
Oct-09 ---> In the morning, Scott at Outlaw was apologetic about the damage even though it wasn't fault of their own. He offered few options to ease my mental stress:D I suffered because of the damage. Offers were way more than I hoped for.

If every vendors and manufactures conducted their business like Outlaw consumers won't need BBB or reseller ratings.
Thank you very much Outlaw.

Very generous accommodation has been reached for a shipping damaged for my EX.

Oct-07 ---> received EX with a minor cosmetic damage on the side due to FedEx's fault.
Oct-08 ---> Talk to Jennifer at Outlaw & emailed few pictures of the damage.
Oct-09 ---> In the morning, Scott at Outlaw was apologetic about the damage even though it wasn't fault of their own. He offered few options to ease my mental stress:D I suffered because of the damage. Offers were way more than I hoped for.

If every vendors and manufactures conducted their business like Outlaw consumers won't need BBB or reseller ratings.
Thank you very much Outlaw.

Seems you've received the same great treatment I got. For those who are curious let me sketch out the basics. First the sub must have only suffered cosmetic damage and is fully functional in every way. 3 options were offered: (1) exchange for a new replacement unit with Outlaw issuing a pick up order to FedEx (2) a purchase price adjustment with the buyer retaining the damaged sub, or (3) an amount of "Outlaw dollars" good towards a future purchase with the buyer retaining the damaged sub. (As an aside those that have reported functional damage have received expeditious replacement parts inter alia possible solutions.) With those options I can't believe any customer who has experienced the trauma of this kind of shipping damage can come away with any negative feelings towards Outlaw at all. On the contrary, as kyekyk has already opined, this is top drawer customer service in the face of a situation not caused by either seller or buyer. As we old dawg swabbies are prone to say "BRAVO ZULU!"

My replacement woofer arrived this afternoon. I swapped it for the defective one in my EX in and fired up the sub. It's alive! From the brief listening I did earlier, it sounds fantastic. I am really impressed so far with the quality and quantity of bass that this box puts out - and max extension mode is incredible!

After 20 minutes of the initial tire-kicking, I spent the rest of the evening with REW, measuring the response of the different tunings and getting it integrated with my old sub (an 8" Velodyne DLS 3500). I was able to get a reasonably smooth response by setting the Outlaw sub to max extension mode and using the limited room EQ options on my pre/pro (B&K Ref50) to boost the low frequencies by 3dB with its low-pass shelf filter and apply its notch filter to tame a big peak at 60Hz. Full detail is in my REW thread (http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/rew-forum/21619-using-rew-setup-b-k-peq-notch-filter.html), but here is the result, measured from my listening position:

154886

Enough tweaking for now - I'm off to do some more listening.

(As an aside those that have reported functional damage have received expeditious replacement parts inter alia possible solutions.)

Just to echo what Bob said - my sub arrived with a malfunctioning/buzzing driver. I'm not sure if this was a manufacturing defect or shipping damage, but Outlaw gave me no hassle. I reported the issue to them this past Monday at noon, they shipped a replacement part out on Tuesday morning, and I had the woofer this afternoon (Friday of the same week). Great customer service - about the best I could have expected given the circumstance.

After dialing in my EX, I listened to a bunch of music last night, and watched Transformers twice today. WOW, this is one impressive subwoofer - full stop. If you factor in price, this definitely lives up to its reputation of one of the best price/performance subs on the market. At the sale price I think it is hands down the winner, but that's why I bought one so this a circular argument :p

The sub's musicality is really amazing considering its ported design. Definitely the most musical ported sub that I've heard at anywhere close to this price point. I mean, it doesn't sound as good as a servo design but it costs 1/2 to 1/4 the price and with considerably more extension and output to boot. It's a terrific compromise in my opinion.

And for movies, it is a brute. I just finished showing it off to the wife (the scene 1:55 into Transformers is incredible) and even she commented on how you can feel the bass, not just hear it. And she rarely comments even when I'm trying to pry it out of her! I am absolutely loving the max extension mode. No doubt in my mind that it will always stay in that mode for me. Love it, love it, love it!

Our room has short, berber carpet but I went ahead and put the metal disks underneath the spikes. I figured it would give the driver another 3/8" of clearance, and possibly help decouple it from the structure (we are on a wood subfloor with crawl space underneath and it can REALLY get to rocking). This seems to work well - it rattles the floor considerably less than I recall with my old Paradigm PS1000. And the Paradigm had probably 1/3 the output of this sub and could not generate energy below 25Hz. So between the spikes and the disks (the Paradigm had neither), I don't feel like it needs additional isolation even though I know a number of people in this thread swear by the Auralex platforms. I am still curious about them, though :)

Overall I feel like this is a really well-rounded piece of equipment and that Outlaw did an excellent job of spending money where it counts most, and not wasting it on frills. For example, they designed it in a way that requires no speaker grill, which I'm sure covers the cost of the premium spikes they include. And rather than spend on a variable phase adjustment in the electronics (which is difficult to use at best, for most people), they give us EQ for two tuning points which makes it a much more flexible piece than it would otherwise be. Decisions like these are what makes this subwoofer tops in bang/$$

So after getting off to a rocky start with the defective woofer, I am happy to say that this purchase has lived up to my expectations (which were admittedly very high after reading this thread). Now I can't wait to go back through my movie and music collection to re-experience it after this upgrade...

Now I can't wait to go back through my movie and music collection to re-experience it after this upgrade...

Jarrod,

I too have been extremely pleased at how well the LFM-1EX performs. Mine is on a carpet covered concrete slab so I've opted to go with the spikes sans discs. And as previously posted my EX is paired with Outlaw's smaller LFM-1c sub in my HT room.

One of the best demonstrations of just how well the EX does with the lowest frequencies is to play the scene (4th I believe) from War of the Worlds (Tom Cruise) where the alien machines emerge from under the streets. The earthquake like low frequency rumbling will stir your stomach :D Gotta love it!

After using my new LFM-1 Plus for a few days and enjoying it immensely I decided to experiment with it a bit... My pc is connected to the receiver with a digital optical cable, and I downloaded a tone generator and sent a variety of tones to the receiver...

I can hear down to about 23Hz apparently... At 20Hz I can't hear anything, but if I put a finger on the window in the living room I could feel it vibrating.

My disappointment came when i played an 18Hz tone. All I got from the sub was a terrible chuffing noise, which I can only assume is port noise? This is surprising since on the Outlaw website it lists the sub as going down to 18Hz. Anyone else experience this?

The other thing that's strange is that the "max extension" mode switch on the amp says "20Hz" and not 18Hz. I also got the manual for the old LFM subs in my box (LFM-1, LFM-2).

I'm liking the sub, but it seems like some of the specs and paperwork don't match up with reality...

My disappointment came when i played an 18Hz tone. All I got from the sub was a terrible chuffing noise, which I can only assume is port noise? This is surprising since on the Outlaw website it lists the sub as going down to 18Hz. Anyone else experience this?

The other thing that's strange is that the "max extension" mode switch on the amp says "20Hz" and not 18Hz. I also got the manual for the old LFM subs in my box (LFM-1, LFM-2).

I'm liking the sub, but it seems like some of the specs and paperwork don't match up with reality...

I am not a techie so I don't have much to say on the technical aspects of your test (I am assuming you had your sub set up properly, port plugged, switch set properly). My .02 cents, for whatever they are worth, is that it is certainly your right and prerogative to test your sub and to question this and even ask Outlaw to explain it. I would just say that if you were enjoying your sub before you ran this test, try to just go back to enjoying it again. 20 Hz is still pretty darn low and satisfying.

To be clear, I am not comparing you to a "pixel peeper", but in the camera world, there are pixel peepers who dissect every bit of a photo to find faults, and lose sight of whether the final photograph in the normal size looks good (which it usually does in their tests). I just focus on the final result with most of my toys, and with the Outlaw (I do have the EX to be clear), it performs.

Got a EX on 6 Oct and have the same low freq extension problem 'cept that I can hear the 20 Hz but nothing below that...figure it a placement prob or my almost 80yrs of age. My Manual was correct/

I too am very impressed with my PLUS. Did a small comparison between the PLUS and the klipsch sub-10. Played some parts of movie on sub-10, then played same parts on PLUS - - definitely an improvement. There was more output and extension with the PLUS, just a lot cleaner sound, even wife noticed how it shook the couch!!! It did awesome on movies, so now wanted to see how it did with music. It held its own there too, heard a lot of different notes, not just a lot of boomy bass. While the sub-10 was an improvement from a htib sub, it does sound pretty good - the PLUS just takes it further. Don't have any measurement - just using my ears as reference. =)
Will continue to put it thru its paces, also may look into some type of spacers to lift it off the floor (give the woofer a little bit more space between it and carpet).
Overall very happy with it.

MikeLo...why do u have to put more space between the sub and the carpet? I know that my old KSW 12 has fat 2inch legs but I cant find much info about any about any optimum space. Think it might affect volume more than freq response. U need a big room to hear a 16 Hz note. I know that people have put the LFM on the sides and were pleased with the results. See some of the earlier posts above.

paulbehnke,
Not trying to affect freq response or if there is an optimum space. I dont think my carpet is that thick but when i set my PLUS on the carpet with its spikes, it sinks in. The carpet goes all the way to the underside of sub, barely any clearance. Only thinking about raising an inch or so, so woofer doesnt hit carpet or moreso the port can move air freely. I know its designed that way and maybe they took that into consideration already. I know that sub moves a lot of air and I can't see where the air would go with that limited clearance. I can't lay it on its side, I have little ones and don't want to risk any toys being lodged into ports.
Anyone tried something like this without using a subdude or gramma?

I'd worry more about the rubber surround which if I recall does protrude above the surface of the bottom. Wonder what the folks at Outlaw think? Now u got me thinking...There really is not much space between the two

Only thinking about raising an inch or so, so woofer doesnt hit carpet or moreso the port can move air freely. I know its designed that way and maybe they took that into consideration already. I know that sub moves a lot of air and I can't see where the air would go with that limited clearance. I can't lay it on its side, I have little ones and don't want to risk any toys being lodged into ports.
Anyone tried something like this without using a subdude or gramma?

Hi MikeLo,

Here is a link to what I did:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=14231151#post14231151

I hope this helps!

Wow it really doe affect the SPL! Gonna have to play with it!

Hey paulbehnke,
That's exactly why i was looking into some type of spacers. The spikes with the dimpled disks works great for hardwood floors, gives the sub enough clearance to do its thing.

Hi laugsbach,
Thats a great idea, thanks.
I did notice on a picture you sent me a while back comparing size between PLUS and EX, that the feet were different ( not spikes) and now I know why. Gonna look around and see if i got something like that lying around. Since it affects SPL, then just gotta do it. Now that you mentioned that I remember having a movie playing, listening to sub, and was curious how much air it was moving. Put hand underneath as much as possible, then around and not being able to feel air coming out from any side - lifted front and air just rushed out and got increasingly louder at that spot of course. Just a confirmation to what you noticed as well.

Thanks for the tip, any others would be appreciated.

Since it affects SPL, then just gotta do it.

Absolutely...:)

Hi All,
Let me start of with. I received my second EX. I am not an audiophile and did not do any kind of calibration on two EXs with REW or what not. Have the EXs at the exact tuning. Meaning same volume setting and port extension and so forth.
The problem I hearing now is. Last night I was watching The Taking of Pelham 1 2 3. During the movie I hear alot of port noise. So I am not sure if I too got a defective driver on my second EX. To the people that got their with the defective driver. What are the signs I should be hearing to determine if I have a defective driver? I want say thanks to those people that is going to give me feedback on this.

Reye

Hi All,
Let me start of with. I received my second EX. I am not an audiophile and did not do any kind of calibration on two EXs with REW or what not. Have the EXs at the exact tuning. Meaning same volume setting and port extension and so forth.
The problem I hearing now is. Last night I was watching The Taking of Pelham 1 2 3. During the movie I hear alot of port noise. So I am not sure if I too got a defective driver on my second EX. To the people that got their with the defective driver. What are the signs I should be hearing to determine if I have a defective driver? I want say thanks to those people that is going to give me feedback on this.

Reye

Hi neighbor. Sorry I don't have any experience with defective Outlaw subs (or Outlaw subs in general), but I thought I'd say hi and it's good to see another local HT fan :).

As for troubleshooting, can you run the same scene with the new EX off and the settings the same? This can help you figure out if it's an issue with the new sub (if the first EX by itself doesn't make any weird noises, it probably IS an issue with the new sub).

Unfortunately, port noise is fairly common with many commercial ported subs. The fact of the matter is trying to reproduce sub-20hz frequencies at high output levels is simply too much for one small 3-4" port to handle without audible turbulence. Still, hopefully you'll find a way to get things sounding how you want them. Good luck.

What are the signs I should be hearing to determine if I have a defective driver?

Call Scott at Outlaw and he will walk through it and help fix the problem. It is your best and fastest solution.

I finally had the chance (read "finally felt well enough") to bring the 1c inside on Sunday. My son (2 y.o.) helped me out, though he felt that the still-wrapped carpet spikes belonged on top of the inverted sub. After almost having to fish one out of the port, I gave him the task of putting all the foam corners back in the box, which he happily did. I tipped it up onto a small carpet sample I had since I have laminate floor in my family room. I pulled the sock off and was actually quite taken by the appearance. The satin finish is much nice than I thought it would be (having previously wished to be able to afford a Hsu Rosenut sub to match my fronts and ent. center), and I am almost sad that I had to put it in a corner behind a recliner (to attain the much needed WAF). But it fit in nicely and looks sharp on the mini-carpet, or so I hope to anyone that happens to peer behind the recliner.

As far as performance, I was running very short on time and didn't have the chance to fire it up until Monday, and even then didn't have much time, so for now I can say that it is performing as expected for a room the size that it is in (18'W x 15'D x 9'H, with a 9'W opening to the kitchen and a 7'W opening to the dining room) and the main speakers that it is paired with (with double 9" woofers): good low-end extension and great bass support. I played some music (Dream Theater, SRV, Ed Motta) and a scene from "Robots" that I know has some nice low end rumbling (if you've seen the movie, you probably know the scene... it features "Aunt Fanny"). It seems to blend well with my mains and I don't hear any localization issues. I did bump up the Audyssey setting on my Onkyo 607 from -3dB to 0dB to give it a little more oomph. I set the crossover to 80Hz and the Double Bass to On. Since those last two aren't set by Audyssey, I am just guessing they are the best for my setup. Once I have more time, I plan on playing some BDs with explosions (Casino Royale, Live Free or Die Hard) and growling creatures (King Kong, Incredible Hulk).


MikeLo, did you try placing the Outlaw dimpled discs underneath the spikes to see if the greater surface area kept the sub more aloft on your carpet? Or is your carpet so soft that the sub would still sink in, and you would just have bigger holes in the carpet?

As I mentioned, I placed my sub on a carpet sample, both to help move it back into the corner, but also because it was recommended by Dr. Hsu over on the Hsu Research Forums (http://forum.hsuresearch.com/showthread.php?t=874). But I felt that the carpet was so thin, and was afraid of the 1c's (although rounded) spikes pushing through it and still causing damage to the floor below. So, I placed the dimpled discs between the spikes and the carpet. Now I feel much more secure that there won't be any damage to the floor, and I don't have to find someplace to store the discs (there are actually more substantial than I was anticipating based on some of the talk in this thread, so I was definitely going to be holding on to them). Plus, I figure I've gotten about 1/4" more clearance from the carpet, which should give me that much more air movement through the port, though I don't think not using the discs would have given me any clearance issues.

BTW, Bob linked to some aftermarket discs here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=17279191#post17279191), but I don't know how their size compares to the Outlaw ones, but it is another thought if you don't want to go laugsbach's practical and extremely economical route (if you happen to have a carpet roll on your hands, or can get one). Hey, maybe now that he's done with his, he can ship them to you! :D

VulcanSoulPatch,
Glad to see ur doing better and starting to enjoy your 1c. Funny that my 3 y.o. daughter did same thing, helped unwrap and put spikes on - then her job was done and ran off. I agree that the finish is a lot nicer in person and top helps smooth things over, wife said "its nice, I can use it as an endtable", so it got adopted with no problem. Let me know how your 1c does in your room? I have a similar size room and I think my PLUS might be too much sub. . . .nah!
I didnt use the discs on carpet, just spikes. It could give a tiny bit of clearance, but that sub is so heavy I think it would still sink them in. I could do that as a temporary fix until I get a better solution. Although I can say that the spikes give it a firm grip on the floor - which gives it a nice rumble you can feel. When I get free time, in between kids after school sports and weekend games, I will come up with a way to lift sub. Website is down on those aftermarket discs you linked, will try later.

Thanks

I watched "Almost Famous" last night, and as my EX is getting broken in it's also becoming more amazing. With it on my raised wood floors (they are about 4" off the slab) the sound and feel when they were at the concerts was JUST LIKE what it is like to be at a concert. The deep bass, the rumbling, the vibrations in the house. This sub is just getting better and better!

So, how goes the WAF? :rolleyes: Mrs. Coke=Pepsi (i.e., my wife can't discern between the two) stated, when I asked how she liked the sound, "Oh, is it running now? I can't tell the difference. That's why I don't understand what the big deal is about a subwoofer." Then she walked away. :eek: Well, at least she didn't say it was too much and I had to turn it down. I actually thought she would. Silly me. :p Oh, well... in another 40 hours when the sub is broken in maybe she will have different things to say. Then again...

Mike, I forgot about you needing a "way" to lift your sub. Since mine is only 38lbs, it is very easy to tilt one way, put the discs under, then tilt it back. I actually laid the discs out on the mini-carpet where I thought the spikes would land and picked the whole thing up and set it down. I actually hit all the discs, just not all the dimples. :p So, I had to tilt it to get it right. But the sub is squared off inside the mini-carpet, which I had to pat myself on the back for doing, since it looks pretty nice. I couldn't have asked for a more perfect sized rug (which I bought for $2 about 4 years ago) since the edges are about 2.75" from all sides. I didn't mention before, but after I picked the mini-carpet out of the stack of them in the garage (I chose the smallest one), I placed it on top of the 1c's outer box and was surprised to see that it had the exact same measurements. :cool:

With it on my raised wood floors (they are about 4" off the slab) the sound and feel when they were at the concerts was JUST LIKE what it is like to be at a concert. The deep bass, the rumbling, the vibrations in the house. This sub is just getting better and better!

:( You are making me miss my old house. While I love our 6 y.o. house, we moved from a house built in the 1950s with 12"+ crawlspace under the wood floor. I can only imagine what a downfiring sub would sound like on that floor! It probably would have http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/images/smilies/shakehousedown.gif. That crawlspace also allowed me to run surround wires underneath the floor, which was very nice. I would love to have wired surrounds now, but there was no way to acceptably hide them in the room without doing some construction. So, I got a Rocketfish WHTIB, which works nicely enough, but does add an unwanted delay to the surrounds that even Audyssey couldn't completely eliminate.

Speaking of Audyssey, I was playing around with some settings on my Onkyo 607 while my son was watching one of his shows that I recorded in SD off PBS. I turned off the Double Bass, and low-and-behold the sub stopped firing altogether. My guess is that since the SD station only carries 2ch audio, there is no sub signal so the sub won't fire. Same thing with one of the standard Dish music stations (I don't have Sirius)... sub didn't fire. I didn't have a chance this morning to check one of my recorded HD programs that is presented in surround sound, but my guess there is a sub signal associated with those and the sub will fire when watching those with Double Bass off. I am also guessing that while playing a CD the sub won't fire unless I have Double Bass on. So, there is a practical use for Double Bass, but too bad it takes so many button pushes to turn it on and off. I think I am going to turn it back on for now, and if I find that I don't like the way it sounds with .1 encoded content, then I may have to program a macro into my Harmony remote to make it easier to enable/disable. BTW, I am using the PLIIz listening mode for all content, which does matrix sound into the center, surrounds, and front heights from 2ch sources, just not the sub. Didn't try any other listening mode to see if it matrixes in the sub with Double Bass off. Anybody have any experience with this?

VSP

VSP,
All good over here. As far as appearance, the glossy black top won her over. My wife COULD tell a difference but I only got asked if the sub NEEDS to shake everything, with a BIG smile I said YES!!!!
The PLUS is a bit heavy, but I'll figure something out for raising it up (w' WAF in mind).
My brother-in-law has the 606, which I helped him set-up. If you manually go thru menus and find the setting onkyo set for your front speakers. Audyssey will set your fronts to "large" automatically if it produces anything under 80hz. Again brother-in-law has a bookshelf setup and it set his front bookshelf speakers to large (+/- 3db is 65 hz i believe). All you have to do is manually go thru menus and set front speakers to "small" and apply an appropriate crossover range of 60 or 80 hz - whichever sounds best to you.
Hope it helps...

My setup (upgrading from Onkyo HTIB HT-SR800),

Onkyo AV TX SR806
Infinity 362 front
Infinity PC350 center
Old onkyo speakers as surrounds
LFM-1EX and Old Onkyo sub (not connected right now, but plan to over weekend using Y-cable).
PS3/XBOX for Blu-Ray/DVD. All HDMI connections.

My problem is I am not able get good output from Outlaw 1EX. Could it be placement? or Setup? not sure. need your help in figuring it out.

I have set Front and Center to 80Hz on receiver (tried double bass too, nothing much changed).
Ran Audessy, it had set Sub to -8.5db, I have it at +2.0 now.
Sub volume is set to 5.
Sub Cross over is set to ByPass. Receiver LPF of LFE is set to 100Hz.
Tried both 0 and 180 phase.
One port plugged, sub set to "extended bass".

I have attached layout of speaker placement. 155194 Sub is near Left Front (between TV and Left front speaker).

I am not sure what the problem is? I can feel the sub working (I can feel vibration on floor, I can hear the bass. I do not feel the explosions, like in Dark Night when Gotham General is blown apart it doesnt shake the sofa, like most post in here), may be its an expectation issue:confused: I expected it to blow me away (upgrading from Onkyo Sub, that was part of HTIB). While playing music too, it doesnt really hit me in the chest.

What am I missing? How do I eleiminate speaker issues (if any)? How do I find right position, if thats the issue? any help..insight is much appreciated.

My problem is I am not able get good output from Outlaw 1EX. Could it be placement? or Setup? not sure. need your help in figuring it out.

I have set Front and Center to 80Hz on receiver (tried double bass too, nothing much changed).
Ran Audessy, it had set Sub to -8.5db, I have it at +2.0 now.
Sub volume is set to 5.
Sub Cross over is set to ByPass. Receiver LPF of LFE is set to 100Hz.
Tried both 0 and 180 phase.
One port plugged, sub set to "extended bass".

I have attached layout of speaker placement. 155194 Sub is near Left Front (between TV and Left front speaker).


Couple of quick things....
(1) Receiver crossover to the sub should be 80Hz and not anything higher
(2) Double Bass doesn't work without the mains set to full and THX off
(3) still sounds like a location issue anyhow.... try different corners and side walls close to a corner to get better bass coupling than setting the EX between your TV and a main speaker.

BTW I'm running both a LFM-1EX and a LFM-1c.

Definitely a location issue. I had the same problem when I bought my first LFM plus. I just could not get the type of slam that everybody was talking about. But that was due to the apartment I was in. When we moved into our house we have now, it just took a little fiddling and moving the sub around until I felt and heard the most bass possible. The more I stuffed it into a corner, the louder the bass was, but at the expense of it being too boomy. It could be your seating postion too. It looks to me like you have a central seating position, with a 24 foot long room, correct? Try moving the seat(s) back more towards the back wall. Sub in corner= more bass. Seats against back wall=more bass(usually). I wouldn't worry about hooking up your old Onkyo sub either. I can not picture that working well with the EX. I would just get another EX when you can. Every time I added a sub, it just keeps getting better. Now with four, I'm a very happy man. Hope this helps. You'll eventually find that bass, and when you do, you'll be blown away. Trust me.

You mentioned a xo of 80Hz., but make sure the mains are set to small also. Otherwise, it is a location problem. Walk around the room and listen for the bass to change.

:( You are making me miss my old house. While I love our 6 y.o. house, we moved from a house built in the 1950s with 12"+ crawlspace under the wood floor. I can only imagine what a downfiring sub would sound like on that floor! It probably would have http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/images/smilies/shakehousedown.gif.

I got to thinking about it and that space is somewhere between 8" and 12". I could use it to run wires, but I'd have to pull up solid wood flooring to get to it! Not going to happen!!

The house was built in 1955 by Fox and Jacobs. This design of lifting the floor up off the slab was a common feature of their homes here around Dallas from 1955 until about 1966. It is quite interesting. All the rooms in the house had solid oak floors already except for the back living room. I recently took out the wall dividing the two living rooms and had the flooring replaced in the back to match the rest of the house (it was plywood with carpet over it). I was extremely concerned that the acoustics were going to suffer, but to my surprise the room sounds better than it did before!

I'll try to get some pictures soon of my setup, and to stay on topic of course there'll be the EX in the photos. :)

I put a wife-approved rug over the wires running back to my surrounds.

I got to thinking about it and that space is somewhere between 8" and 12". I could use it to run wires, but I'd have to pull up solid wood flooring to get to it! Not going to happen!!
Fortunately for me, the crawlspace was a true crawlspace with an access door in one of the bedroom closets. I got the idea after the exterminator went down there to check the underside of the floor for termites. The house was not on a slab, just footers, so I got to army-crawl around in the dirt. The most fun part was getting past the gas line that went to the in-floor furnace, since it was just hanging there, midway between the ground and the floor, not flush up against the floor like you would expect. Had to turn my head sideways to get under it and push myself with my feet. But it was so worth it to have the surrounds in place. (I don't know if they had the wireless units at the time, but I wouldn't have bought one anyway since I could do it myself.)

I put a wife-approved rug over the wires running back to my surrounds.
I wish I could do that, but on the one side of the room is a fireplace (not a good idea for the rug or the wires), and the other side is open to the kitchen and would be considered a tripping hazard, or simply "out of place". If we were on carpet it would probably be more doable, but being on laminate it would just slide around unless something else was on top of it. I wish the previous owners of the house were into HT, then maybe they would have had the foresight to hide speaker wire behind the crown molding they installed in the room.

It took me a while to get my LFM Plus dialed in also. I am using an Onkyo 805 and setting the speakers to small made a big difference. I have a riser for all my audio equipment ( 12X2s with two layers of plywood insulated). The first times I set it up it sound lack luster/terrible. and I had a bunch of problems finding the right placement. Eventually, the sub wound up 12 feet from where I started. ( I also changed cables a number of times).
THe sub seemed to work best when I once had the audessy set up from one side of the stage but then moved it to another. I liked the sound better before I ran the audessy again. So I had to repeat the process from the previous location then move again and nor run audessy.
I am sure it is far from the optimal approach. But it worked it for me.

Thanks guys. I will experiement with placement. Any tips from your experience in finding right placement? (considering the layout provided). I do not want sub to sound boomy, so may avoid placing close to corner.

Bob, I did have front set to full band when I tried double bass (806, does not enable double bass until fronts are set to full band).

Honestly, I think the best way to find the best placement is to do the ol crawl test on your knees. Many think it's ridiculous, but it sure worked for me. Put your sub where you normally sit(move the couch/seat) then crawl around the room on your hands and knees and notice where the bass is the strongest. That's where you want to place your sub. Of course, this placement might not end up working due to WAF, but at least get it as close as you can.

Thanks guys. I will experiement with placement. Any tips from your experience in finding right placement? (considering the layout provided). I do not want sub to sound boomy, so may avoid placing close to corner.

From your layout, make sure your one seating position is not in the middle of the room. This is the worst spot.

anybody interested on a LFM-1ex pm me, I will be listing mine on E..y soon, just wanted to let you guys know first

Well, I have to say that my new 1c is really growing on me. I have read many people post that you have to let a new sub get broken in before you can pass any judgement on it, so this serves as a correction to my previous post where I stated that it just seemed to be supplying low-end support to my mains. It is actually standing all on its own, now, and the bass is much more noticable in the room than before. I believe I am only halfway to the 50-hour mark, so I am know really excited to hear how it fills out in the coming weeks.

I did turn Double Bass back on, since I want to complete the breaking in as quickly as possible, and we have been watching a lot of 2ch material lately. I didn't have a chance to play around with the other settings too much, except I did move the crossover up to 100Hz just to give it a little more of a workout. This weekend, we watched "Robots" on DVD (again... :rolleyes:, though my son has been picking Shrek more and more these days), and for the first time I had to turn Double Bass off as it is now becoming too boomy to couple the bass from the mains with the LFE signal.

I was also surprised that the Auto On seems to be getting more sensitive, or maybe it is just due to certain channels having more .1 volume in their 5.1 mix. I was watching the "Warehouse 13" season finale (from SyFy channel) last night "after hours" at low volume and noticed that the sub had switched on. I couldn't hear it very much since I had the volume so low, but could tell since I can see the light from where I sit. This was the first time the sub turned on during late night viewing, so I was surprised.

Prior to that, one of the other benefits that I have noticed about the sub is that it makes movies "scarier". We watched The Lion King with my son, and I remembered to mute and/or skim through the hyena scenes, but I didn't remember the stampede scene. Wow, talk about bass! There was so much more depth to that scene with the sub. It has given the scene a whole new meaning in the context of the movie, as now I, too, had the fear of getting trampled. :eek: Now I can't wait to watch The Dark Knight with the sub, as I had lent the BD to my Dad when we set up his 707 and Oppo 83 and I haven't gotten it back yet. I have been told that it is a very bass heavy movie.

On the other hand, my son seems to be getting more used to the sound of the sub and less scared of bass in general, which I believe has something to do with putting the Double Bass on during 2ch programs, which are mostly his kids' shows from PBS. Hopefully this will help gear him up for when we go to a movie theater, since there is tons of bass going on during every movie. If I had taken him to the cinema in the state he was a month ago, I am sure we would have had to walk out or I would have had his little fingers permanently imprinted on my arm, but now I think that by the time he is old enough to go he will be well accustomed to hearing, and feeling, bass. :cool:

VSP

VSP,

The auto on should function for a variety of broadcast content ranging from the CSI "thump" to that nagging Geico stack of bills with eyes jingle. :D With both of my Outlaw subs the green light is lit from the get go when watching DishNetwork and OTA content. Bets yours will too soon.

Great to hear that the LFM-1c and bass content is growing on both you and your son :) Next thing you know he'll be asking for a set of drums! hahahahahahaha

Hey Bob! I had read somewhere around here that sometimes a sub will not turn on automatically if the volume is too low, and that some noted if they used a Y-adapter to both sub pre-outs on the AVR that they were seeing their sub come on at lower volumes than with just one. That's why I was a little surprised that it came on so soon with Warehouse 13. I guess they must have a low note on the title card that triggered the sub that I just wasn't aware of.

When I started a DVD over the weekend (can't remember which one right now), I saw that the sub wasn't turning on. I even turned up the volume quite a bit to see if that would trigger it, but it didn't. I finally walked up to it and flicked the power switch to on, then back to auto (nice that they put the switch so high up on the back, I have seen some subs with the switch near the floor), which of course did the trick. As I was walking back to the sofa, there was a nice deep note that came from it, so if I had just been patient, I could have probably saved myself the trip. :p

Regarding drums, too late on that. My brother-in-law already gave my son a djembe and he loves that thing.
http://images.guitarcenter.com/products/thumbs/Toca/632866191016818106.jpg
Pounds on it all the time. Trying to teach him loud and soft, fast and slow, but he likes to hit it loud and fast all the time. Go figure. It sits on the carpet and recently I tilted it so it would make a deeper sound, and he loved it. Now, if I am sitting near the drum, he pushes it to me so that I can hold it tilted. Time to look for a stand! :D

Hey Bob! I had read somewhere around here that sometimes a sub will not turn on automatically if the volume is too low...

Ah the volume thing makes sense but I don't get a Y adapter having any impact.

Regarding drums, too late on that. My brother-in-law already gave my son a djembe and he loves that thing. Pounds on it all the time.

That's just TOO funny. Be glad that it isn't one of those gourds that also has beads.... not sure what that percussion instrument is called but you get both small hand drum type notes by striking as well as varying rhythms by shaking. I have some jazz LPS that use them.

i just bought a lfm ex and i'm looking for some advice.while watching a blu ray i increased the volume to -11db to see what it could do and i heard a pop.i immediately turned it down and it seems to be working fine.what was that pop?did i damage something?also i don't get a solid punch from the sub,i'm hoping some adjustments will fix that.as it is now it is very boomy.i'm using a denon 2808ci,polk monitor 40s,panasonic dbmp60 blu ray.i understand there are many factors involved in set-up,but what will give me max punch?

Question on Auto switch position. In what position does the speaker turn on and off automatically(based on Bass input)? I have set Auto to "ON" and green light is turned on all the time. When I set it to "OFF" position, sub never fires even when movie/music with heavy bass is played. There is also an intermediate position between ON and OFF, is this "Auto" mode? Never tried intermediate position, should I?

Stewey, I wouldn't worry about the pop. If it seems to be alright now, then you should be fine. It might of just been port noise. Also, it sounds like you might have it stuffed into a corner. If you can, try moving it out away from the corner a little. That should tighten it up a bit and get rid of some of the boom. Also, if you can, place the sub at your normal listening position, then crawl around the room while playing a bass heavy song. Wherever the bass sounds the best to you, that's where you should place the sub(if possible). It sounds silly to crawl around the room on your hands and knees, but it really does work.

Question on Auto switch position. In what position does the speaker turn on and off automatically(based on Bass input)? I have set Auto to "ON" and green light is turned on all the time. When I set it to "OFF" position, sub never fires even when movie/music with heavy bass is played. There is also an intermediate position between ON and OFF, is this "Auto" mode? Never tried intermediate position, should I?

Set it to auto mode. The sub will turn on by itself when ever there is signal send to the sub. Reaseon for set it to auto, that way you don't need to turn it on every time you use it. And when it is nor in use the sub will automatic turn itself off.

+1

Auto mode works like a charm. I like it since it lets me know when my 1c is receiving signal. I have found that some network stations even though braodcasting in HD, specifically The CW, don't seem to have a .1 signal. I wait and wait and wait for the sub to turn on, and it doesn't, even at higher volume levels. So far, the only fix that I have found thus far is to go into my speaker settings and turn Double Bass on, at which point the sub comes alive immediately (I am still looking for another solution to this). But since I have the sub in auto mode, at least I can tell and do something about it.

And it turns off pretty quickly, too. While I haven't actually timed it, I would surmise 5 minutes or less. After turning off my system, I will go do something and by the time I come back, the sub is off.

VSP

Regarding Auto Mode, I leave my sub in "ON" mode due to the fact that regardless of mode (on/off/auto), the draw is the same at 12 watts per my kill-a-watt meter.

Regarding Auto Mode, I leave my sub in "ON" mode due to the fact that regardless of mode (on/off/auto), the draw is the same at 12 watts per my kill-a-watt meter.

Based on this evidence, what do you suppose the purpose of this "feature" is?

Does anyone know if the drivers are problematic with the LFM-1 EX. I own 2 of these subs, purchased together in Feb 2009. One of my subs has not been right since day one. First it had a rattle sound coming from the driver...Scott sent me another driver in April, seem to work fine...Now the same sub (driver) rattles again. It been like this for a few months now. Braces seem nice and tight, no wires hitting anything inside. Port tubes nice and tight. I have both of my EX's volume set at 3. Elite receiver LFE set at -8.5. One works fine second one seems problematic. Could it be the Amp causing this problem with the drivers? I will be calling Scott tomorrow , I hope we can resolve this finally. I love these puppies when working correctly.

I received my LFM-1 Plus about three weeks ago and although it is a great performer I am looking to upgrade for my 2,000 ft3 room.

Therefore my LFM-1 Plus is for sale for $440 plus shipping from VA. If you are interested please PM me as I am looking to upgrade by December. Dunno if this is the right place to post this (or if it's even allowed) but I don't know where else to post :confused:

Based on this evidence, what do you suppose the purpose of this "feature" is?

Not much of a feature is it?:confused::confused:

When I had all four subs located nearfield, I turned on/off each sub with the Master Power Switch and left the Auto Power Switch to on.

Does anyone know if the drivers are problematic with the LFM-1 EX...

I have had my two EX subs since July of 2008 and have had no problems. IIRC, weverb had a driver issue in his EX...perhaps he will chime in.

I am sorry you are having a problem and I'm sure Scott will solve this problem. Please keep us posted.

I received my LFM-1 Plus about three weeks ago and although it is a great performer I am looking to upgrade for my 2,000 ft3 room.

Therefore my LFM-1 Plus is for sale for $440 plus shipping from VA. If you are interested please PM me as I am looking to upgrade by December. Dunno if this is the right place to post this (or if it's even allowed) but I don't know where else to post :confused:

WOW itsfun, that didn't take you very long for upgrade-itis to kick in.:eek:

FWIW, I think the mods would want you to take out an AVS classified ad...BTW, what are looking to upgrade to?

I have had my two EX subs since July of 2008 and have had no problems. IIRC, weverb had a driver issue in his EX...perhaps he will chime in.

I am sorry you are having a problem and I'm sure Scott will solve this problem. Please keep us posted.I'm sure Scott won't let me down, he is excellent to deal with. It's funny one sub works perfect and the other one starts to rattle after a few months of use, using 2 different drivers. Makes me think it could be the amp. Weird to say the least!

After my initial impressions of the apparent lackluster performance my new LFM-1c that I mentioned earlier (since I had forgotten about the whole "break-in period" thing :rolleyes:), coupled with my wife not really noticing the size difference between the 1c and the Energy ESW-8 that I had initially bought (since the 1c is out of sight behind a recliner), I was starting to get a tinge of buyer's remorse and was beginning to feel a little miffed that I didn't spring for the Plus and deal with the aftermath later. (After all, no noticing = no aftermath, right? :D) However, now that it is almost fully house-broken ;), and with some help from my latest BD purchase, that all melted away this morning.

Due to recommendations from the folks over at the Blu-ray.com forum, in addition to the killer price of $13, I blind bought Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen at Wal-Mart (Big Screen - aka, IMAX - Edition). I know, I know, everybody has trashed the storyline, but apparently people are touting this as the reference BD of the year, with perfect marks in both PQ and AQ. I watched a few scenes late at night the day I bought it, and was surprised that the sub Auto-on'd when my Onkyo 607 was only set to 8 (positive scale). I was additionally surprised by the amount of rumbling and grumbling at that volume compared to other material I have watched at the same level, e.g., Warehouse 13 that I mentioned a few posts back (I know that speaks more to the film than to the 1c).

This morning, I finally had the house to myself and was able to up the volume to ~40 and was blown away! While I am sure that the lower extension of the Plus/EX would have added a whole new dimension, I was really impressed with the way the 1c handled and made everything just that much more immersive and enjoyable. It blends very well with my other speakers, and even though I have not taken any SPL readings, I feel like the response is great (could just be my n00b ears :p). I truly don't know how I survived this long without a sub. (I chalk it up to not having heard a decent HT setup... or just living within 100 miles of laugsbach. :D)

And even with my 2,400+ ft2 room, I am very happy with the results. (I now know why Bob was able to go for 2+ years with only the 1c in his larger room.) Sure, the windows aren't rattling or anything (yet... I still haven't pushed the system to "reference" levels), so I guess maybe after a few years I will want to start having things falling off of shelves and hearing the neighbors complain :p, but for now I am a happy camper. I am extremely grateful for all the good advice, positive reviews, and gentle nudging that I received here and in other threads that made me go for the 1c and not just settle for the ESW-8.

So, even though I've not had the chance to hear many LFE intensive films (I won't be getting TDK back from my Dad until the weekend), I would recommend checking out TF2 if you haven't given your subs a good workout in a while.

Oh, and don't say I didn't warn you when the neighbors call the police. :D

VSP

This morning, I finally had the house to myself and was able to up the volume to ~40 and was blown away!

VSP, good choice...this title is like a roller coaster ride.:eek:


I truly don't know how I survived this long without a sub. (I chalk it up to not having heard a decent HT setup... or just living within 100 miles of laugsbach. :D)

I came from a Bose Set-up...:o:o:o
BTW, you are always welcome for a demo.

Sure, the windows aren't rattling or anything (yet... I still haven't pushed the system to "reference" levels), so I guess maybe after a few years I will want to start having things falling off of shelves and hearing the neighbors complain :p, VSP

After adding the second sub, I started to deal with rattling...:(
After the next two EX subs, a glass "jumped" off the shelf in the kitchen and shattered playing Cloverfield at "spirited levels"...:eek:
The Incredible Hulk produced the first phone call from my neighbor who is located 50' from my subs...:eek::D

VSP, I am glad you are enjoying your new purchase!:)

laugsbach, which version of TF2 did you buy, or did you rent it, or are you speaking from theater memory? I heard that the IMAX scenes are rather limited (only 2, I think, with at least 1 other from the theater version left out), but for the price I couldn't pass it up. I doubt I would be able to get that version, or any other, for any less anytime soon (of course, everytime I say that I end up eating my words :p... after all, Black Friday is around the corner, and I bought TF1 from Amazon for 10 bucks last year on BF). I bet the forest battle in IMAX would look awesome on your new screen. :eek:

Thanks for the invite. If I am ever in your neck of the woods, I would love to drop by and get my innards rearranged. ;)

Hmmm... I reckon my one neighbor is about 25' from my sub. And I do have The Incredible Hulk (Green-ray, I love it!)... do you remember what scene it was that you got the unceremonious phone call? :D I'm thinking the sonic cannons, maybe?

My neighbor is too nice to do that to, but even if I did, I don't think he'd complain. He goes out of town often enough, so I can wait until one of those days to test it out. Or I can always invite him over to check it out himself. Don't think he's much into HT, though, but you never know! Actually, I am interested in knowing how loud I could go before he could hear it (or feel it).

"Can you hear it now? Good." :cool:

WOW itsfun, that didn't take you very long for upgrade-itis to kick in.:eek:

FWIW, I think the mods would want you to take out an AVS classified ad...BTW, what are looking to upgrade to?

*cough..cough...Seaton.. cough*

:D

*cough..cough...Seaton.. cough*

:D

Just a slight upgrade...:rolleyes::p:p:p

laugsbach, which version of TF2 did you buy...

Not the Wally World Edition...just the standard on a pre-order from Columbia House B2G2 promotion.

I'm thinking the sonic cannons, maybe?

Correct...

My neighbor is too nice to do that to, but even if I did, I don't think he'd complain.

Same here...I have a very,very good neighbor and when he called he was wondering if I heard this strange sound in the neighborhood...:eek::o:D

Same here...I have a very,very good neighbor and when he called he was wondering if I heard this strange sound in the neighborhood...:eek::o:D

Ah, the laws of physics (the omni-directional attribute of low frequency sounds) finally working for us rather than against us....

"Hey, Larry, have you seen any earthmovers coming through here recently? It sure has been getting awfully noisy around here lately."

Has he seen your new setup yet?

BTW, how did you get your 4th back from your wife?

itsfun, I had seen his name around, but had never checked out his offerings before. :eek: Woah... dude... I think the word "upgrade" is a slight understatement. :p All I can say is, "Enjoy!" I am sure you will.

Oh, and "Red Cherry... Red Cherry... Red Cherry..." :D

^^

Simple VSP, I informed the wife that I was going to do what itsfun is planning to do....a little upgrade to Mr. Seaton.:D

Whoosh, back came the fourth sub!:)

BTW, I love the new sub arrangement and Mr Seaton or Mr Danley will have to wait...

This morning, I finally had the house to myself and was able to up the volume to ~40 and was blown away! While I am sure that the lower extension of the Plus/EX would have added a whole new dimension, I was really impressed with the way the 1c handled and made everything just that much more immersive and enjoyable. It blends very well with my other speakers, and even though I have not taken any SPL readings, I feel like the response is great (could just be my n00b ears :p). I truly don't know how I survived this long without a sub. (I chalk it up to not having heard a decent HT setup... or just living within 100 miles of laugsbach. :D)

And even with my 2,400+ ft2 room, I am very happy with the results. (I now know why Bob was able to go for 2+ years with only the 1c in his larger room.) Sure, the windows aren't rattling or anything (yet... I still haven't pushed the system to "reference" levels), so I guess maybe after a few years I will want to start having things falling off of shelves and hearing the neighbors complain :p, but for now I am a happy camper. I am extremely grateful for all the good advice, positive reviews, and gentle nudging that I received here and in other threads that made me go for the 1c and not just settle for the ESW-8.

VSP,

Finally! :D :D :D Seriously... glad you're enjoying the 1c.

Yeah my youngest brought over TF2 and the combo subs enjoyed the exercise :) I still find the 4th chapter of War of the Worlds (Tom Cruise) with the earthquake-like low rumbling as the alien devices emerge from under the streets to really do a great job showing what these puppies can do. The earlier scenes with the lightning strikes and of course the cannon volleys from Master and Commander are admirable as well.

Hey Bob! Finally is right! It has been a month since I ordered it, and those two weeks in the trunk were sheer torture. :( I am glad that there were no ill affects suffered from such maltreatment of this fine equipment. I would never have forgiven myself. :p

I'll have to see if my Dad has WotW, and I know he has M&C (I need to get that one on BD, great movie!... tho maybe I will wait for a rerelease to see if they will restore the extras... wouldn't that be nice? :p). Maybe I can borrow them both when he returns my BDs. I had seen WotW a few years back when a buddy rented it from Netflix.

I should also go over to that Bass thread and see what other films are recommended. Of course, I still need to find the time to re-view the BDs that I already own, so better do that before the list gets too long. :rolleyes:

I still find the 4th chapter of War of the Worlds (Tom Cruise) with the earthquake-like low rumbling as the alien devices emerge from under the streets to really do a great job showing what these puppies can do.

Bob A, I completely agree...IIRC, this scene goes on for 90 seconds.:eek:

I should also go over to that Bass thread and see what other films are recommended. Of course, I still need to find the time to re-view the BDs that I already own, so better do that before the list gets too long. :rolleyes:

Hi VSP, be very, very careful with that thread...it will cause a case of upgrade-itis!:eek::D

Off the top of my head for Bass Demos:

WOTW
Master & Commander
Cloverfield
Dark Knight
Incredible Hulk
Knowing
Iron Man
Kung Fu Panda
Hot Fuzz

That should keep you busy...:)

laugsbach, thanks for the nice, concise list. I haven't watched any of those movies since setting up the 1c, but I am soon to be over halfway there.

I talked with my Dad, and he is going to bring over WotW and M&C on DVD. Unfortunately, I won't be getting back my TDK BD yet, as he hasn't watched it (has it on DVD, but wants to see/hear the differences). Hopefully he will bring my IM BD back, since he did watch that one already. TIH is on my shelf, waiting patiently (I wanted to check TF2 out first, since I didn't want to miss WM's exchange window). KFP has been on my radar since I heard about the "skidoosh!" ("kadoosh!" ???) scene, but I missed picking up the BD from Amazon for $15 a while back (that's my preferred peak purchase price, tho I have bought a few over that in the past :p), so I have been patiently waiting for the price to dip back down. BTW, I just saw that The Bourne Trilogy on BD has dropped to $60. Not bad, but my PPPP is $45, so I will wait a little longer. :rolleyes:

I have "heard" good things about Cloverfield, but was unaware of Know1ng and Hot Fuzz being good bass movies, so I have added them to the "bug-my-buddy-to-rent-for-me" list (he has a Blockbuster account, so I just throw them in the mail when I am done, works out well for me :D). I'm not a total leech: I lent him TF2 today so that he can see the IMAX scenes since BB doesn't stock that version. I figure that makes us even for the 20 or so movies that I have borrowed from him. :p

Oh, and don't worry about upgrade-itis with me... it took 6 years to acquire the 1c, so it will probably take twice that for anything bigger. :rolleyes: Unless anyone around here is suddenly feeling extremely generous. :D

^^

My PPPP is also 15 bucks!

I'm guessing that is where the price usually falls on your B2G2 promo?

Man, I haven't used one of those services in ages. My Dad was a frequent flyer with Columbia House in the '80s (he had this thing for vinyl... weird... :rolleyes:). I did the BMG B1G5 and subsequent "we-want-you-back" B1G5 several times for CDs in the '90s. ;)

I should tell my Dad to check CH out again now that he has gone Blu, since after all he is a big time video hound, but my Mom would probably kill me. :p

After deciding to sell my LFM-1 Plus I noticed that I am still in the 30 day return window. I e-mailed outlaw and they quoted a $70 shipping fee on the sub (since I live in VA :mad:). Should I just return it to Outlaw or do you guys think I can take a smaller loss selling it locally (at the discount price)? I'd like to get this sale out of the way so I can save up for my Submersive but I've already lost $50 sending my HSU STF-1 back. Has anybody recently sold a sub and how do you guys see the used market for this kind of thing? I have 5 days to decide.. ughhh

VulcanSoulPatch, upgrade really is an understatement :D Although I really like the outlaw (and especially its price) I've already reached it's limits while demoing movies. I have to keep it on Max output mode to avoid port noise and the driver has bottomed out on a few occasions. I think it's my 2,000 ft3 room that makes me raise the sub volume to levels I can enjoy (although I never really thought I was pushing the thing, never putting the gain past 12 and keeping my receiver sub volume at "modest" levels). Watching movies with my family has really made me appreciate this sub but I crave the headroom. So to never ever have to upgrade again I'm going all out with Mr. Seaton :D:D:D Red Cherry looks gorgeous but Black Oak will be the one completing my ht room :)

I e-mailed outlaw and they quoted a $70 shipping fee on the sub (since I live in VA :mad:). Should I just return it to Outlaw or do you guys think I can take a smaller loss selling it locally (at the discount price)?

Tough one itsfun...I would want to be done with it at a $70 buck loss (I am assuming you had free shipping and/or Outlaw isn't going to back charge you for the incoming shipping).

Please stop back with your thoughts on the Submersive.:cool:

I'm guessing that is where the price usually falls on your B2G2 promo?

Hi VSP, yep...the only good thing about CH is when a deal comes along for pre-orders including free shipping. The best deal is a B1G1 w/free shipping but that has been a long, long time coming. BTW, CH is still a PITA to deal with.:mad::mad:

Lately, I have been able to get plenty of titles at 10 bucks through Amazon...:)

VSP,

I have another couple of very, very good Bass Demos:

The Haunting DTS-ES Version...
The THX intro called "Amazing Life" found on the Indiana Jones 4 DVD or Blu-ray...

itsfun, I can't even imagine what level of bass you are looking for. Oh wait, I know...

http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/images/smilies/shakehousedown.gif http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/images/smilies/shakehousedown.gif http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/images/smilies/shakehousedown.gif http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/images/smilies/shakehousedown.gif http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/images/smilies/shakehousedown.gif

Too many houses on your block, eh? :D

I decided to burn up some excess vac time today (and get some honey-do's done), and threw Incredible Hulk in during lunch. Woah. Impressive. Though I wonder if I was missing something in the sonic cannon scene. I am thinking that there may have been LFE below the 1c's capabilities. http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/images/smilies/dontknow.gif The Hulk vs Abomination scene, however, was simply awesome. Every step, every punch, everything thrown... very nice! For me, the volume level was fine, the only thing I think I would want more of would be extension. But will all factors considered, I am very happy where I am at. From nothing to a lot of something was a great move. And since my wife is not a bass aficionado, with the 1c's "limitations", I am to leave it on all the time. :cool:

My Dad stopped by and brought the BDs back. He watched TF1 last night, but decided to forego the TDK comparison for now. I'm guessing he will want to borrow it again after he finally runs Audyssey. :D Anyway, I put TDK in as I started typing this message. I didn't hear the low running bass line that someone was complaining about being "distracting" in another thread. Though I am now hearing a low thump thump thump running throughout the Joker Meets the Mobsters scene. I hadn't heard that before. Unless that guy had his scenes mixed up (unlikely), I'm guessing there must be super-low LFE in the bank scene that the 1c can not reproduce. No biggee, it still sounded fantastic, as is the rest of the movie. And every once in a while, in TDK and in other movies, there will be a scene that will surprise me on how much bass the 1c is putting out.

So, itsfun, congrats again on your soon to be purchase. Oh, and just so there is no confusion, if I could join you, I would in a heartbeat. http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/images/smilies/thumb.gif

VSP

laugsbach, I have bought more BDs from Ammy than anywhere else. Just load it in the cart and wait for it to drop. Nukeprice has become my best friend. :D

Cool, I have IJ4, too, just haven't watched it yet. Threw it in a few months ago to show my Dad the BD vs DVD difference (he has the DVD, and I put my Oppo on 480i for max difference... actually, we did it to sell my Mom on the upgrade, and it worked!), so I had skipped past the trailers and intro, etc. Won't do that the next time. ;)

You guys have lost me with all your acronyms :confused:

B2G2?
IJ4?
TDK? I thought they made audio tape?
CH? Not channel as used below....

There's more but this old man is tired :p

Sorry, Bob, this one's all me. Was being a bit lazy, what with my wordy posts and all... :p

B2G2 = Buy 2 Get 2
IJ4 = Indiana Jones (4) and the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull
TDK = The Dark Knight
CH = Columbia House

Most of the other acronyms are other movies, such as:
IM = Iron Man
TIH = The Incredible Hulk
KFP = Kung Fu Panda
TF1 = Transformers

I was thinking this might lead to confusion, so I tried to abbreviate only after the title was typed out at least once by either myself or laugsbach (most of the other movies I mentioned are in his post here (http://http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=17436692#post17436692)).

BTW, if it gets too annoying, let me know. There is a person at my work who insists on using everyone's initials in their e-mails, even for people with first names only 4 letters long! Very annoying! So I can sympathize.

VSP

VSP,

Usually they aren't a problem. Heck I'm a retired mustang naval officer so you know I've been around more than my share of acronyms. Folks used to complain all the time talking to anyone in government because of the expanded usage of alphabet soup.

But for whatever reason I got cross-eyed rather quickly on this page of the thread :D Like I said, I'm old and I was tired! LOL

You guys have lost me with all your acronyms :confused:

Sorry about that Bob...:o

I am a little typing challenged using only two digits to type!:D

Sorry about that Bob...:o

I am a little typing challenged using only two digits to type!:D

hahahaha I'm a two finger typist too! Hit 30 wpm during a test a few decades back but these days I just plod along :D

I was Mr. Hunt 'n Peck for the longest time, too, you guys. College started off as a drag since it took me forever to get reports typed up. Tried Mavis Beacon (spl?), but that didn't work. You know what fixed it? Diablo! No, I didn't sell my soul, I'm talking about the PC RPG. For faster gameplay, you could map certain actions to different keys. I started to memorize where the keys were so I wouldn't have to take my eyes off the screen. After a while, I noticed that my typing speed had improved. A few years later, I realized that I was looking at my wife (then girlfriend) as I was typing. Tripped her out. Me, too! There were other games that helped, too, but Big D is the one that is most memorable. It also helped that I was never satisfied with the WASD keyboard layout that is standard with most games, so I used to always remap the keys to my more preferrable ESDF layout, and always tried to keep the same actions in the same place (jumping, crawling, etc).

So, get to it! It's the most fun way I know of to learn how to type. And don't say anything about age, as it is never too late to get sucked into slaying demons and such. :D

And who says video games are bad for you? :p

I had a LFM-1 plus sitting at my desk at work for 2.5 weeks. It finally made it back home. I figured I'd better at least try it out to make sure there were no problems during the 30 day return window.

I have my receiver (HK AVR 235) handling the crossover (currently set at 60Hz), and I'm very pleased with the results. I probably should have bought the EX, but hey, I'm still pleased with the Plus considering I've been watching my movies using subtitles for the last 4 years because I never wanted to wake up the kids at night when I had time to watch TV.

I played a Boston Symphony Orchestra Jazz CD in 2.1 and IRON MAN in DTS 5.1.

Very nice....

I haven't fiddled with the crossover setting to see if the Plus blends in with my L/R channel speakers at a different X-over setting, and I haven't played with the phase toggle switch. The bass seems pretty tight and not boomy -- I have it sitting in the corner of the room next to the left channel speaker.

I've read that I'll be even more impressed once the Plus is broken in and I've found a more optimal X-over setting and db setting.

I'm very impressed! I'm going to go back home and pop in BLACK HAWK DOWN and THE INCREDIBLES tonight =D

--------------------------------
Harman Kardon AVR 235 receiver
Adcom GFA-555 power amp
Outlaw LFM-1 plus subwoofer
home-built tower speakers (2" tweeter/4" mid/2x10" woofers)
Polk Audio center channel
Polk Audio rear surrounds

And don't say anything about age, as it is never too late to get sucked into slaying demons and such. :D

And who says video games are bad for you? :p

LOL Guess you anticipated my retort. I know where most keys are too without looking. I had taken a typing course eons ago and in preparing for the speed test found I still was faster and more accurate with just two fingers so that's how I took the test. So no retraining for me.

yeungp,

I have Outlaw models that bracket your Plus (the 1c and 1EX) so I have a good feel for what yours delivers. No surprise about your reactions and yes they seem to benefit from a short break in period. Enjoy!

itsfun,

What have you decided to do?

I just got my lfm-1+ a few weeks ago. Sounds great and appears to be well built. Fedex did a great job too, not a scratch on the outside box.

I recently noticed, though, what appeared to be a 60hz type hum when the volume knob on the subwoofer was at max. I wouldn't play anything that loud, I was just checking white noise levels from my receiver. So then I plugged the subwoofer into the wall only and the hum is still there when the volume knob is between 3 o'clock and max. The hum itself is not too loud, but noticeable even about 3 feet away.

Outlaw says that a hum at max volume is normal when subwoofer is only plugged into the wall and that the subwoofer should not be used past 1 o'clock in normal operation anyway. I would expect to hear some white noise at max volume, but not what sounds like a 60hz hum. Do you guys hear a hum at max volume?

Another thing, there is a soft "thump" if the Off-Auto-On switch is left on On when the Master Power is switched on. Not really major, but just curious if anyone else noticed this?

EDIT: Just to add some more info, I did have a chance to test a different unit with same results. Still minor issues that might be common in subs of this power... I am very happy with the sub and would buy the same thing if I had to do it again.

^^

Hi calmcast, odds are that you have a "Ground Loop Hum"...I had it when I first started and it was my cable TV service.

On the soft "thump", I think that is because you are turning on the sub's master switch after powering up your amp/system...turn on your sub first or leave the sub's master switch "ON".

This thread has some info on ground loop problems...

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1004573

I hope this helps!

It also helped that I was never satisfied with the WASD keyboard layout that is standard with most games, so I used to always remap the keys to my more preferrable ESDF layout, and always tried to keep the same actions in the same place (jumping, crawling, etc).

Man, live by the acronym, die by the acronym...:p

ESDF?
WASD?

Off to Google I go!:D:D

Man, live by the acronym, die by the acronym...:p

ESDF?
WASD?

Off to Google I go!:D:D

LOL, those aren't really acronyms. They're used as key layouts for lots of games. For instance, playing a first person shooter game using the mouse to look around, WASD are typically used for movement:

W = move forward
A = strafe left
S = move backward
D = strafe right

It's laid out the same as the arrow keys, but there are more keys in the vicinity that you can more readily access for other functions.

LOL, those aren't really acronyms. They're used as key layouts for lots of games. For instance, playing a first person shooter game using the mouse to look around, WASD are typically used for movement:

W = move forward
A = strafe left
S = move backward
D = strafe right

It's laid out the same as the arrow keys, but there are more keys in the vicinity that you can more readily access for other functions.

Hi Stephen,

:o:o:o As you can tell, I'm not a game player!!!:eek::eek::D

Larry

:D I see I did it again! Thanks for the clarification, LLF.

I prefer to use ESDF, tho, since it puts my index finger on the key with the bump so that it is easier to find when not looking. Also, I like to use A for Alternate fire, and that gives my left pinky something else to do while waiting to Walk (holding Left Shift).

Anyway, I actually have some On Topic info to post, but I need some time to draft the essay that it will become. :p

VSP

I've had my LFM-1+ since spring and I have been very happy with it. But I think I may have played it to its limit. I watched Transformers 2 today....its absolute demo material for home theater systems. Lots of deep bass..and that may be the problem. On some of the very heavy bass scenes I heard the LFM rattle. These were scenes where you could feel the bass right into your gut. So..was I driving the sub to its limit or is there a probelm with it...??? The rattles aside..the sub sounded outstanding...

LOL, those aren't really acronyms. They're used as key layouts for lots of games. For instance, playing a first person shooter game using the mouse to look around, WASD are typically used for movement:

W = move forward
A = strafe left
S = move backward
D = strafe right

Strafe?! Strafe?

Better fly well clear of you'all!

http://i471.photobucket.com/albums/rr79/hanesian/Doofus_by_cycoze.jpg

So..was I driving the sub to its limit or is there a probelm with it...??? The rattles aside..the sub sounded outstanding...

Hi moodyman, TF2 has a wide dynamic range and listening at "spirited levels" could drive a single LFM-1+ where you don't want to go.:eek:

If it was port "Chuffing", there are really no problems with the sub.
If it was indeed a "rattle", then there might be an issue.:(

^^

Hi calmcast, odds are that you have a "Ground Loop Hum"...I had it when I first started and it was my cable TV service.

On the soft "thump", I think that is because you are turning on the sub's master switch after powering up your amp/system...turn on your sub first or leave the sub's master switch "ON".

This thread has some info on ground loop problems...

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1004573

I hope this helps!

Hi laugsbach,

It's not a ground loop problem as it happens with the sub plugged into the wall and nothing else plugged in. Yours might do it too, with your ear one foot or closer from the driver and the sub volume at max, do you hear any kind of hum with a silent input or no rca input?

The thump also happens most of the time with or without an input plugged... It doesn't happen if the Off-Auto-On switch is kept on Off and only switched to On after the Master Power switch is turned on.

The hum might be RF/EMI interference from something like the unused high level inputs acting as antennas. After making sure I've been properly grounded, touching one finger to one of the high level red connectors and another finger to a black connector, the hum is greatly reduced... These two issues are minor and might be normal, but I wanted check with other owners...

Yours might do it too, with your ear one foot or closer from the driver and the sub volume at max, do you hear any kind of hum with a silent input or no rca input?

I would be happy to try but I just finished my "false" wall theater room build and all the subs are behind it. Perhaps one of the other owners could try it...

The thump also happens most of the time with or without an input plugged... It doesn't happen if the Off-Auto-On switch is kept on Off and only switched to On after the Master Power switch is turned on.

I have never heard a thump on my subs...I leave the Master Power switch and the Auto setting switch to On at all times. When I had the subs nearfield, I would always turn the Master Power switch ON before the rest of the system and OFF after I powered off the rest of the system...IIRC, no thumps...

I guess I'm not much help...:o

<< crickets chirping >>

I guess Outlaw needs to run another sub sale to revive this thread...:)

I bought my Plus during a sale a coupla years back and this thread was one of the most active on the forum. Isn't their next big sale around the holidays ?

They mentioned when they extended the September sale into October that they wouldn't have another sale til next calendar year. So, most likely no sale this holiday season.

I guess you will have to find something else for stocking stuffers this year. :D

My Transformers 2 rental should be in today's mail. I can't wait!

I guess Outlaw needs to run another sub sale to revive this thread...:)

We're all enjoying listening to our systems rather than cruising the net and posting stuff :)

Don't know how good the audio is but I am looking forward to getting Star Trek next week :)

^^

Hi Bob, I am looking forward to it too!

BTW, Ralph gave it a perfect 100 for audio...

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1195268

^^

Hi Bob, I am looking forward to it too!

BTW, Ralph gave it a perfect 100 for audio...

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1195268

Yeah well I'm not running Blu-Ray. Have an Oppo DV-980H that handles my needs quite well. Hopefully the DVD version will also have stellar audio.

I didn't even bother to put ST in the Netflix queue. I went on the Amazon preorder lits as soon as it was available. WIll do the same thing for District 9 when the time comes.

I didn't even bother to put ST in the Netflix queue. I went on the Amazon preorder lits as soon as it was available. WIll do the same thing for District 9 when the time comes.

Color me inpatient..... we go to Wally World Monday night and at Midnight buy the new release which is the game plan next week for Star Trek. Intend to do the same on Dec 28th for District 9. One of the perks of being retired is not having to worry about getting up in the morning for work :)

They (Blockbuster online) wound up sending me Disc 2 of extras instead of the movie. I guess the LFM Plus will be pretty silent during The Ugly Truth.

Yeah well I'm not running Blu-Ray. Have an Oppo DV-980H that handles my needs quite well. Hopefully the DVD version will also have stellar audio.

Hi Bob, the Oppo is a fine player for SD and you can add a Black Friday deal on a Blu-ray player to see/hear what the fuss is about. The improvement in sound was the biggest surprise after moving to High Definition Media...:)

One of the perks of being retired is not having to worry about getting up in the morning for work :)

Lucky Man...

Lucky Man...


LOL Not so sure luck is involved other than maybe making it to this age. There was a lot of sweat generated over those decades to get here I can tell you that :)

Hi Bob, the Oppo is a fine player for SD and you can add a Black Friday deal on a Blu-ray player to see/hear what the fuss is about. The improvement in sound was the biggest surprise after moving to High Definition Media...:)

Mmmm..... VSP has made a similar comment. Frankly I held off first because of the format wars and then because my 65" MITS does 1080i and not 1080p. Figured Blue-ray would be wasted on my RPTV. But if audio is that much better..... I really like what I see with the Oppo 83 especially the new special edition, but spending $500 or $900 for them doesn't pass my sanity check.

What model (s) do you suggest I keep my eyes open for on sale?

Mmmm..... VSP has made a similar comment. Frankly I held off first because of the format wars and then because my 65" MITS does 1080i and not 1080p. Figured Blue-ray would be wasted on my RPTV. But if audio is that much better..... I really like what I see with the Oppo 83 especially the new special edition, but spending $500 or $900 for them doesn't pass my sanity check.

What model (s) do you suggest I keep my eyes open for on sale?

My displays (a 40" TV and a 73" projector screen) are both 720p and Blu-ray looks MUCH better than DVD from my 7' viewing distance. With a large screen like yours, the PQ upgrade will be significant IMO. Though it's not always a night and day difference, I've noticed that BD's also have better audio clarity and dynamics than DVDs. It will vary from movie to movie, but let's just say I've never watched the same movie on DVD and BD and thought the DVD sounded better. The BD is almost always noticeably better.

What model (s) do you suggest I keep my eyes open for on sale?

I have the Oppo 83 and it is amazing for DVD/Blu-ray as well as SACD & DVD-Audio discs...a complete package for me.

I have had great success with my other Blu-ray player from Panasonic (BD35) that I purchased last year on a Black Friday sale for 150 bucks. You could look for this model used or see what BF brings for their latest model...

You want a Blu-ray player that Bitstreams & Decodes all of the latest audio formats:
DTS-Master Audio (DTS-MA)
Dolby TrueHD

The only Blu-ray player that has been a problem child for me was from Samsung...the player wasn't too bad but the support from Samsung was very inconsistent. I am almost embarrassed to say that I have had 5 Blu-ray players in my home since 2007 & 3 HD-DVD players!:eek::o:eek:

Definitely check out the "Help a guy find a Blu-ray Player" thread here:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=969206

So how did I do Bob? Not too many acronyms...:D:D

Larry

Larry,

I appreciate the sanity check here. The Oppo 83 is tempting but I'm in the middle of repairs/remodeling here at the house which is running 5 figures plus I just upgraded my HT system with an Outlaw sub, DefTech front/center, and an equipment rack. I've already lost my hair and now my pockets have just lint in 'em :)

Looks like the Panny BMP-BD60 is the current heir to your 35. The LG BD390 seems to garner acclaim too although again the BDP-83 is king of the hill. It's hard to justify a compromise unit here when doing it right would mean another Oppo. I've been VERY pleased with the Oppo I currently have. My use would just be HT as I already have a rock solid CD / outboard DAC in my stereo. Never went for SACD as I find a filterless DAC makes RedBook sound fantastic although still short of vinyl. Can you tell I'm an old sod? LOL

Argh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Can you tell I'm an old sod? LOL

Argh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

:):)

Not at all my friend...I have a couple of friends still with vinyl.:cool:

Yeah, the Oppo is the best way to go and there really is no reason to take an immediate step into Blu-ray. You could always sell the 980H and put that $$$$$ towards the BDP-83.

I have never really been a "music guy" but the 83 with all my room changes is bringing me back to listening to music again and some of the multi-channel SACD discs have been breathtaking.:cool:

Good luck with all of your repairs/improvements...Blu-ray can wait until next year.

The improvement in sound was the biggest surprise after moving to High Definition Media...:)
+1

I got my BD player in December 2008 and had my Oppo DV-970HD since May 2007 and Dish HD since September 2007, and my first take on the video quality of the BD35 was "Meh." It just wasn't that big of a difference from the HD I was already getting. Sure, I am only running a 1080i 34" display, but I was thinking it would be breathtaking. To me, most everything 720p and above is breathtaking, so Bob, I wouldn't look for huge improvements there (esp. since you are already upconverting SD through a 983HD), but you may since your display is so much larger than mine.

Once I got my Onkyo 607 this past May, however, the world suddenly became more Blu. Woah! I could tell the difference in sound quality between lossless and lossy immediately. That will be where the biggest improvement in your system will lie. And since we already answered the question about whether or not you need to upgrade your AVR ;), all that is left is the BD player.

Looks like the Panny BMP-BD60 is the current heir to your 35. [...] It's hard to justify a compromise unit here when doing it right would mean another Oppo.
While I haven't read through the BD60/80 thread, I am a resident lurker in the BD35/55 thread, and comments keep poppin' up about all of the problems with the latest Pannys. I would stear clear of them. As you mentioned, anything less than the Oppo would be a compromise at this time. Anything more would be foolish. So, I'd definitely set your sights there and wait for the fundage to materialize... or put it on your Wish List. :D In fact, I am waiting for my BD35 to suffer an untimely death so that I can upgrade. Loading is just tooo dang slow!!! Playing around with my Dad's new BDP-83 made me drool in less than 5 minutes.

So save yourself the heartburn of settling and wait... Oppo's not going anywhere. At least, I hope not! I am so glad there are still mfrs like them that insist on function as much as form.

Kind of like Outlaw. :D
http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/images/smilies/offtopic2.gif

VSP

Sure, I am only running a 1080i 34" display, but I was thinking it would be breathtaking..., but you may since your display is so much larger than mine.

Hi VSP,

Yep, you have to increase your display size to see what 1080p is all about on Blu-ray. I have a 61" RPTV in the living room and a 125" screen in the theater room...

I am a resident lurker in the BD35/55 thread, and comments keep poppin' up about all of the problems with the latest Pannys. I would stear clear of them.

I have been very pleased with my BD35 and for 150 bucks with two free Blu-ray movies, was the steal of the year last year and easily the best Blu-ray player I have ever owned until the "KING" arrived in July 2009...the Oppo BDP-83.:D

Loading is just tooo dang slow!!!

VSP, be very, very thankful that you never owned a Profile 1.0 player.:eek:

http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/images/smilies/offtopic2.gif

First off, this is a riot!:p:p

I think the Outlaw thread is going to be off topic until the next sub sale...

My first BD player was a Samsung and I returned it within BB's 30 day window.

I'm much happier with Pioneer, which can match the performance of Oppo, save for SACD capability for less dinero.

VSP:

I ran the Samsung with a 30" 1080i LG tube, and I didn't see much difference either. Then I bought a 50" Pioneer Kuro, and hello.................

Good luck with all of your repairs/improvements...Blu-ray can wait until next year.


So save yourself the heartburn of settling and wait... Oppo's not going anywhere.



Laugsbach & VSP,

Spot on. And frankly what I told myself a few years ago about Outlaw when I bought my LFM-1c although I really wanted a bigger one. Now having both a LFM-1EX and LFM-1c in my "7+2" HT system truly satisfies. Eventually my DV-980H will most likely be replaced with a BDP-83 :D

Do you have a source for the 20mm 1.6A slow blow fuse used in the LFM-2? I can't find one at Radio Shack.

I had music playing the other day and I went outside. My neighbor was outside and we had a brief convo by the fence on the lot line. Prob 20ft from the corner of my house and 50ft from where the stereo is. It sounded like a distant thunderstorm or something.
He didn't say anything, but I think the sub sounds good in either mode...
Which do you think travels the greatest distance? Max Output mode at 25hz or Extension mode at 18hz. (Lmf+1)

I guess Outlaw needs to run another sub sale to revive this thread...:)

Apparently, when Larry speaks, The Outlaws listen (got this e-mail today):

Although our "Pre-Cyber Black Friday (http://rs6.net/tn.jsp?et=1102847328637&s=38266&e=001TLAq8gpQl42Bg_7WEwyfxb2cP-YPTy2whQKX5-ShUNNfjs4BRlEt-C-3bJW1xWT3RF_jdCKUMAOQTXunB016Vsf_8-5VOaSX7Ix-jPa2o9CVwWGolCOocpkIBfUz8oE9kbXYl7eBFb5ROwlpOiwD_FMKbj-zlm14)" promotion ends tonight at midnight, we know that for many, Thanksgiving weekend without sales is like forgetting the pumpkin pie for desert. Therefore, to help you save money without facing madness at the mall, from now through 9 pm EST, December 1st we have some great pricing on the complete line of Outlaw LFM and ECS subwoofers (http://rs6.net/tn.jsp?et=1102847328637&s=38266&e=001TLAq8gpQl42DAtijjJR6VF3JF7d_cPdi1OZVftHUTw6sQIiKhiS5EgA M2ZERY3HKefYSRXDLEiBwxxAQGkxRYRk6mxSeWhH4Bxa9NJJk3UeAhi8JbQE IE0w7e8e3T7gDvtJrZm8mIJ5E5oG9kPME--5wwP8Q_2Gd) as well as the Velodyne SMS-1 (http://rs6.net/tn.jsp?et=1102847328637&s=38266&e=001TLAq8gpQl40_NyJ-wYiLwkcXRqr6bMyYiy9qIH7pmqHx76RLA6301R0ZLBWIdRcjAeL765zBE7xk Nte2ZoIB2vltS6m9qT4LIhWoxzRuui1LYWfOyPdTbsB3LerDg5QjnG8HoUZh Zzk4R_Hjki7hvw==):

15% Off Plus Free Freight On All Subwoofers!

While not quite as saucy as the September sale (20%), I'm guessing it may bring a few into the fold.

Happy Thanksgiving to all! And remember to be safe on the roads if you're traveling. Lot's of crazies out there... just giving you all fair warning, since I am one of 'em! :D

VSP

Apparently, when Larry speaks, The Outlaws listen (got this e-mail today):



While not quite as saucy as the September sale (20%), I'm guessing it may bring a few into the fold.

Happy Thanksgiving to all! And remember to be safe on the roads if you're traveling. Lot's of crazies out there... just giving you all fair warning, since I am one of 'em! :D

VSP can you give me some idea of what adding a second ex to my system will sound like,i found a sweet spot in my living room that has really tightened up the bass and i want to see if it can get even better if i put a second one next to it.i know having two side by side isn't usually the best idea but it seems to make sense if this is a good spot for one.i can't imagine how it could perform any better,it sounds awesome!but i've read that adding a second sub can be worthwhile.my question is it only a subtle improvement?i hope i can get some opinions on this so i can decide before the sale ends dec. 1st.my living room is 12x14x8.i only use my setup for movies. denon 2808ci,outlaw lfm ex,polk monitor 40 x4,panasonic thx 58" plasma,panasonic bdmp60.

can you give me some idea of what adding a second ex to my system will sound like,i found a sweet spot in my living room that has really tightened up the bass and i want to see if it can get even better if i put a second one next to it.i know having two side by side isn't usually the best idea but it seems to make sense if this is a good spot for one.i can't imagine how it could perform any better,it sounds awesome!but i've read that adding a second sub can be worthwhile.my question is it only a subtle improvement?i hope i can get some opinions on this so i can decide before the sale ends dec. 1st.my living room is 12x14x8.i only use my setup for movies. denon 2808ci,outlaw lfm ex,polk monitor 40 x4,panasonic thx 58" plasma,panasonic bdmp60.

Putting them side by side or stacked will probably gain you about 6dB. That means you can turn the gain down on both and have less distortion and more headroom. If you could place them in different spots, you will gain maybe 3dB and have less distortion but better response at more than one spot. There are trade offs to both.

:(Putting them side by side or stacked will probably gain you about 6dB. That means you can turn the gain down on both and have less distortion and more headroom. If you could place them in different spots, you will gain maybe 3dB and have less distortion but better response at more than one spot. There are trade offs to both.

thank you for responding the info helps.i think i'll go side by side because my listening position is small,just two chairs in the room.one other thing i don't understand completely is cancellation.will two subs cancel some of the bass or cause any other problems that don't occur with one sub?some say yes some no?by the way my one ex feels like my entire house is going to collapse!i just watched monster house and after the movie i had to go in the basement to see if any pipes were broken!

:(

thank you for responding the info helps.i think i'll go side by side because my listening position is small,just two chairs in the room.one other thing i don't understand completely is cancellation.will two subs cancel some of the bass or cause any other problems that don't occur with one sub?some say yes some no?by the way my one ex feels like my entire house is going to collapse!i just watched monster house and after the movie i had to go in the basement to see if any pipes were broken!

I guess I really cannot answer your question. Every room reacts differently. There are basically two large variables. The room and how the subs are set up. One can use the sub crawl method to find that initial placement and think things are good. I have always questioned weather you just found a peak in the response or a "good" smooth spot. Ultimately, you are going to need to measure the response in your room to get the answers you are looking for.

If you do go with a second EX, be sure to try it in another location. You may be surprised at the result. If one EX is giving you the "feel" you like, the second is going to balance things more and make the bass not sound like a one note wonder.

Disclaimer: I am not expert! Take the above comments as suggestions. Ask around with a more generalized sense versus just geared to the EX. There is a wealth of knowledge on here.

While I don't have twin EXs, I can emphatically endorse the notion of placement experimentation. I added an EX to my system that already had the smaller Compact. Ultimately I found a synergistic solution that combined placement and levels adjustments. True it took some time and effort including response testing, but the results were worth it. The two subs now "sing" together in my "7+2" system :D

Happy Holidays all of you Outlaw Sub Dudes (and dudettes) !!!!

Lovin my Plus all over again after Star Trek !!

^^
Right back at you PannyMann...:)

Star Trek 2009 is the movie of the year in our humble theater room.:cool:

Do you have a source for the 20mm 1.6A slow blow fuse used in the LFM-2? I can't find one at Radio Shack.


Did you call Outlaw to see if they would send you one ?

If you did and they can't, that's pretty sad.

http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Littelfuse/218016XP/?qs=sGAEpiMZZMseCiJT91fwImxU0EpJQZMXxvxeotQtt4Q%3d

^^
Right back at you PannyMann...:)

Star Trek 2009 is the movie of the year in our humble theater room.:cool:

Nothing was better than ST this year, hands down. I'm reading that Avatar effects are A+ but the story is a bit thin. Going to see it in the theater anyway.

I'm reading that Avatar effects are A+ but the story is a bit thin.

Agreed that Star Trek is among the best of 2009. As far as Avatar goes, my concerns are not so much that the plot line is "thin" but that the film basically is propaganda for a particular political point of view. I hate that :eek:
http://hollywood-elsewhere.com/2009/12/not_right-wing.php

I not only will not go to a theater (I think I've seen 2 films that way in the last decade so its no biggie), but I will not buy the DVD release either. If I see the drivel it will be on Sat or OTA TV.

Agreed that Star Trek is among the best of 2009. As far as Avatar goes, my concerns are not so much that the plot line is "thin" but that the film basically is propaganda for a particular political point of view. I hate that :eek:
http://hollywood-elsewhere.com/2009/12/not_right-wing.php

I not only will not go to a theater (I think I've seen 2 films that way in the last decade so its no biggie), but I will not buy the DVD release either. If I see the drivel it will be on Sat or OTA TV.

Do you hate that it's suposed propaganda or do you hate that is is not right wing enough (according to the author of the article in the link provided) ?

I don't think the author wrote this article because he is really concerned about the movie not being "right wing enough" for two reasons: first, he now hails from West Hollywood (just being observant, not intolerant); and second, this quote from the article (emphasis added)...
Cameron is an earth-hugging lefty from way back (the flagrant despise-the-arrogant-rich current in Titanic being but one example) so this should come as no surprise to anyone. I for one am cheered and heartened.
Sounds like he likes the fact that Cameron wears his politics on his sleeve in this movie.

And, in case you didn't read the comments to the article, this one (by the author):
The general truth of the matter is that conservatives are generally seen (accurately, I believe) as shills for corporate interests & supporters of whatever earth-ruination plans and schemes that will fatten their bank accounts and make their over-pampered wives and children feel more secure.

I, for one, am intrigued by media that polarizes ppl. The more bad press something gets, the more I want to know what exactly got to them. Was it truly "bad", or was it "too close for comfort". I wouldn't really characterize this article as being "bad press", though, just something to get his readers' juices flowing. Just look at the rest of the comments... they have strayed from discussing the movie into discussing politics in general and personal attacks. Quite entertaining, actually. :D

Well, it looks like the off-topic ninja struck again, so let me bring this back on track a bit. :D Got this e-mail this morning (in case anybody is out looking for a sub for Christmas):

The holiday season is in full swing, and we're approaching the goal line. With weather problematic across the country, malls crowded and everyone simply preoccupied with seasonal preparations, who has time to look for bargains?

In order to simplify your shopping the Outlaws are here to help with significant savings whether the gift is for a friend, relative, or even a treat for yourself. After all, we've been "good boys and girls" too, right?

Therefore, we're making our last pre-holiday promotion short and sweet: Starting today and running through 9PM Eastern Time on Sunday, December 27th, take 15% off the regular price of any Outlaw-branded product (http://rs6.net/tn.jsp?et=1102888611419&s=38266&e=001VrIgBRXFuXl_kTynB1Zr0ziLPYe7CN5YTYEbul_gZUD-LUv_ZhjihQhRU-NoE3kxwN7t1gW4gzdmUn1EeKMxADmB99enMdGTXCSMna3taoIxG9zn-CoaCA==).* Please note that the 15% discount will not be reflected in your shopping cart. Just put "promo" in the special instructions field of the shopping cart and this 15% discount will be deducted from your order total at time of processing.

So, get your "stocking stuffers" while you can! ;)

EDIT: Just clicked on the link, and it indeed looks like an unadvertised sale (except for the e-mail, or course :D).

I have an Outlaw LFM-1 sitting in my closet with a busted amp. I talked to Outlaw about it a year ago and they said to fix the amp (if it was fixable) might be ~$150 and to replace it would be ~$250.

My question is can I just buy any BASH amp in the proper dimensions, or do I need the Outlaw amp specifically?

Well, it looks like the off-topic ninja struck again, so let me bring this back on track a bit. :D

Thanks VSP!

My question is can I just buy any BASH amp in the proper dimensions, or do I need the Outlaw amp specifically?

This is a good question MoonieGT...

I would think any 350 watt RMS plate amp work work and I would think that the BASH amps would have the best chance to fit the opening on the LFM-1.

Maybe Outlaw has some used amps available???

Parts Express offers two different BASH amps (300W and 500W) that appear to have the right footprint and I'm tempted to give them a try...

^^

Maybe a call to BASH and/or Parts Express to see if they can recommend a replacement amp for the LFM-1...the amps at PE look good and seem to be missing only the Max Output/ Max Extension switch...

My LFM-1 amp does not have Max Output switch that I'm aware of... I have the original LFM-1 (sub is about 4 years old now).

You may also want to check and see if the Outlaw Bash amp had any type of boost built into it. I believe the Bash plate amps usually have a built in boost at a certain frequency.

http://www.parts-express.com/pdf/300-750.pdf

:confused:

I saw that PDF... When I have time, I'm going to take the Outlaw amp apart and see if it has the same or similar jumpers to set. Maybe I can copy the settings?

Does anyone know if Outlaw has their own amp specs?

Does anyone know if Outlaw has their own amp specs?

Not much technical information available from The Outlaws in reference to their subs...:(

Well, if I have time tonight I'll try to drag it out and look at the amp. When the outlaw died I got mad and ordered a PB10-NSD from SVS. It's a solid sub but does not have the grunt that the LFM-1 did... that's why I'm getting the itch to try and resurect the Outlaw...

MoonieGT,
Are you sure the amp is dead? does the power led come on? The reason I ask is because My LFM-1 stopped working the other day. I took amp out and pushed on all the connectors. I also noticed the slip on wire connectors to the speaker were kinda loose. Once I firmed them up I put it back together and it worked.

Checked out Avatar last night. The CG just BLEW ME AWAY !! The Pandora planet flora and fauna took quite an imagination to come up with.
The storyline was vaguely familiar (you knew who was going to get jacked up) but how it happens was pretty cool I thought.

Not as good as Star Trek but 2nd best of the year for me right behind Star Trek and now ahead of District 9.

Oh yea, 3D effects were just enough to enhance the experience.

^^
Thanks PannyMann...I'm really looking forward to the Blu-ray release in, I hope, 3D.

BTW, the movie "Coraline" in 3D is stunning on my 100" 1.78:1 screen...it also has a couple of good bass moments.

^^
Thanks PannyMann...I'm really looking forward to the Blu-ray release in, I hope, 3D.

BTW, the movie "Coraline" in 3D is stunning on my 100" 1.78:1 screen...it also has a couple of good bass moments.

Do you need to retrofit your projector or screen to enable 3D capability ?

3D on Blu Ray ? Where the heck have I been ?

Do you need to retrofit your projector or screen to enable 3D capability?

You just have to wear the goofy cardboard glasses.:D

I also adjust my projector to a brighter setting for all 3D titles.

^^
Thanks PannyMann...I'm really looking forward to the Blu-ray release in, I hope, 3D.

BTW, the movie "Coraline" in 3D is stunning on my 100" 1.78:1 screen...it also has a couple of good bass moments.

You just have to wear the goofy cardboard glasses.:D

I also adjust my projector to a brighter setting for all 3D titles.

Will it work on a plasma ? Is it just encoded into the disc ?

Will it work on a plasma ? Is it just encoded into the disc ?

Yes, the 3D aspect of the film is encoded on the disc. AFAIK, it should work fine with your plasma TV...the larger the screen the better the effect.

I also have a "man-cave" for a theater room and I'm guessing that might help me as well...I will try Coraline on my 61" RPTV in the living room and see how it relates to the theater room.

well, i'm joining up with the outlaw club. just sold my svs cylinder 25-31 pci to fund and just ordered an LFM-1 plus. i'm in LA so hopefully it'll be here before friday... as now i am subless.

was kind of torn between the EX and the plus but, space is a bit tight and the plus will do me fine and then some. i'm hoping it betters the svs in musical performance. i listen to a lot of vinyl as well as HT.

on paper it seems like it will perform as well as the 25-31 pci as it goes deeper, weighs more and has a bit more powerful amp. i really like the fact that you can plug a port too to experiment- which isn't an option on the cylinder.

i don't run my subs hot i just calibrate them to reference and sometimes a db or 2 below. but, maybe that'll change with the outlaw. with the svs i had to calibrate it a bit cooler because while it was awesome for HT, 2.1 audio seemed a bit boomy.

well, i'm joining up with the outlaw club.

Welcome adamanteus...:cool:

Let us all know what you think when you have the LFM-1+ set-up and running.

Yes, the 3D aspect of the film is encoded on the disc. AFAIK, it should work fine with your plasma TV...the larger the screen the better the effect.

I also have a "man-cave" for a theater room and I'm guessing that might help me as well...I will try Coraline on my 61" RPTV in the living room and see how it relates to the theater room.

Now that's good to know. I won't call it news because obviously I'm behind the curve on home 3D. Now I'll be waiting for the 3D blu ray like you.

Is Coraline on bluray ?

Is Coraline on bluray ?

Yep...

I am hoping to try this title during the Holidays on my RPTV for you.

Yep...

I am hoping to try this title during the Holidays on my RPTV for you.

Let me know your impressions.

Oh, do they send you those dork glasses with the disk ? And if I keep a pair from the theater, will they work at home ?

When the outlaw died I got mad and ordered a PB10-NSD from SVS. It's a solid sub but does not have the grunt that the LFM-1 did... that's why I'm getting the itch to try and resurect the Outlaw...Good to hear, since I am still using my original LFM-1.

I wish it had the extension option of the newer subs, since on a test tone it falls off after 25 Hz, and really disappears below 20. But Santa has a new receiver for me with Audyssey MultEQ XT, so maybe that will breathe some life into the deep end once the sub is equalized.

got my sub today (LFM-1 PLUS) and love it! it absolutely kicks the svs 25-31 pci cylinder in the a**. and i haven't even gotten it totally integrated yet. i figured it would smoke the svs with music which it did but, it smokes it in HT as well. max extension with the port plugged yields a really sweet and tight low end. no boomy bass on 2.1 music either which was my number one priority.

i need to play with it more i guess, i had recently ran audyssey on my marantz with the svs and it can take a while so when the LFM arrived i just put it in place, turned the volume on the sub up to where i had the svs's set and let it be. sounded incredible. not sure if i need to mess with it and audyssey multiEQ it all over again but, i will.

great deal too and it's big! looks really nice as well especially after having that giant cylinder in my corner for the last 2 years!!! the svs was a good sub but, the outlaw is much, much better.

Yep...

I am hoping to try this title during the Holidays on my RPTV for you.

got my sub today (LFM-1 PLUS) and love it! it absolutely kicks the svs 25-31 pci cylinder in the a**. and i haven't even gotten it totally integrated yet. i figured it would smoke the svs with music which it did but, it smokes it in HT as well. max extension with the port plugged yields a really sweet and tight low end. no boomy bass on 2.1 music either which was my number one priority.

i need to play with it more i guess, i had recently ran audyssey on my marantz with the svs and it can take a while so when the LFM arrived i just put it in place, turned the volume on the sub up to where i had the svs's set and let it be. sounded incredible. not sure if i need to mess with it and audyssey multiEQ it all over again but, i will.

great deal too and it's big! looks really nice as well especially after having that giant cylinder in my corner for the last 2 years!!! the svs was a good sub but, the outlaw is much, much better.

I'm glad you posted this as it is rare to have a direct comparison between two brands (and styles) of subs in the same room. I'm a bit surprised too because I had this "Cylinders are superior" myth in my head and you've sure debunked that one for me.

I'll have to apologise to my Plus for ever doubting it's capabilities

I'm glad you posted this as it is rare to have a direct comparison between two brands (and styles) of subs in the same room. I'm a bit surprised too because I had this "Cylinders are superior" myth in my head and you've sure debunked that one for me.

I'll have to apologise to my Plus for ever doubting it's capabilities

just to confirm after 3 days i'm still positive the LFM-plus beats the svs cylinder hands down. it's not even a contest really and i still haven't ran audyssey yet.

the biggest difference to me is how tight and clean the subwoofer is in comparison even down low in HT. this is in the bass extension mode with the port plugged. i'm not even going to bother with max ouput mode- no need for me.

don't get me wrong the svs cylinder is a good sub and svs has GREAT customer service. and i was actually afraid to replace it or rather, try a different brand. but, it was too boomy with music and a little "rumbley" in HT. i sold the svs the night before i ordered the LFM.

and remember this is all stated without me having even "correctly" integrating the sub into my system. i simply put it exactly where the cylinder was, set the volume dial on the sub to where my svs was set on it's dial and that was it. checking the volume with my SPL meter it was pretty much the same as the svs was but, the differences were in the accuracy and tightness and extension. FWIW i use(d) a great gramma with both subs.

the LFM eased my fears as soon as i plugged it in and fired up some vinyl in 2.1 mode. since then i've run it through it's paces with music and HT. i've watched district 9 and was amazed at how much more accurate the outlaw sub was over the cylinder. it didn't even break a sweat.

on paper i figured they would be close due to the driver and amp size. the outlaw however outweighs the cylinder by 20 lbs and also has the variable tuning which the svs did not. i think the added mass and tuning ability is what sets it apart. i'm very happy with it.

in the past chose svs over hsu and from what i understand the outlaw subs are designed by dr. hsu. in hindsight NOW if i could make that decision over i would have definitely went with hsu. but, i'm happier in the end i chose the outlaw. it looks much nicer to me with the plexi top instead of the hsu subs.

i think it's a great deal at the price it is and beyond. even though i paid about $100+ LESS than i originally paid for the svs 25-31 pci i honestly feel like i made a huge upgrade so i think these subs are priced very low for what you get!

PS- FWIW my box arrived in perfect condition and the auto on/off feature works perfectly. i think i had read some issues with these two things. after i turn the receiver on it takes about 30 seconds for the sub to get a signal and then it's good to go.

OMG, hearing about that LFM-Plus is making me drool!!!!

I was in the market trying to find the best sub with a max width of 15". I loved the price and looks of the LMF-plus, but was nervous b/c I feel that the Outlaw subs don't get enough press (and obviously they should). The HSU VTF2-mk3 has a smaller amp in comparsion (250 watt), and I decided against it. I finally decided on a pair of Epik Sentinels...which will be shipped in a few days. The Sentinels come with a $250 premium over the LFM-plus :(.

Thanks for sharing your results with the LFM-plus. I actually just returned a new SVS PC12+ cylinder. Although I think SVS is a great company, I am not a big fan of the cylinder subs.

I run my plus in MO mode with my anti mode 8033's “Lift 25” bass boost profile engaged. Tight and very punchy for both HT and music.

I listen to a lot of jazz on cd and "Lounge" music over inet radio. All channel stereo mode over my 7.1 system is pure ear candy with nicely recorded CD and still pretty dang good with inet radio.

I just got D9 on bluray and am wondering how those alien weapons firing is going to sound.

OMG, hearing about that LFM-Plus is making me drool!!!!

I was in the market trying to find the best sub with a max width of 15". I loved the price and looks of the LMF-plus, but was nervous b/c I feel that the Outlaw subs don't get enough press (and obviously they should). The HSU VTF2-mk3 has a smaller amp in comparsion (250 watt), and I decided against it. I finally decided on a pair of Epik Sentinels...which will be shipped in a few days. The Sentinels come with a $250 premium over the LFM-plus :(.

Thanks for sharing your results with the LFM-plus. I actually just returned a new SVS PC12+ cylinder. Although I think SVS is a great company, I am not a big fan of the cylinder subs.

i didn't mind the cylinder while i had it but, now it's gone... man i realize in hindsight that thing was fugly!

i hear you though i have been aware of outlaw audio for a long time but, last time i was in the market it seemed their subs seemed a bit more expensive in comparison to svs and hsu- if i remember correctly. for this purchase i looked at them all svs, hsu, name branders, etc and remembered outlaw and the hsu designed subs so checked em out. the LFM plus i guess has the power of the hsu 3.3 with the dimensions of the 2.3. so it was between the lfm and the 2.3 and 3.3. hsu is local to me and with tax i could go and pick a 2.3 up in person for just under $600. but, the extra power in the outlaw sub sold me and in the end i saved about $60 ordering online with them including shipping which took one day to arrive to me.

but, i didn't really base the decision on price i would've spent more/less whatever i was just looking for what would fit my needs and something about the outlaw sub called out to me. i'm glad i did it. i can say that if we ever get a bigger place i will definitely add another outlaw to the mix.

anyhow, good luck with the epik's. if you're not happy with them give the outlaw a try.

Hsu design, a little more power and the plexi top steered my decision and I haven't looked back since.

Whats nice these days is the fact that there are just so many good choices especially with the ID companies in the act. Hard to go REALLY wrong with whatever decision you make. You should at least get "decent" performance.

adamanteus thanks for this review. It really helps me alot because I am getting ready to upgrade my sub shortly. Been upgrading everything and just got a new tv now for the sub. I been looking at these outlaws for awhile now but I was iffy cause I have the exact same SVS tube. While the beast hasn't let me down I am just plain sick of looking at the big ugly tube in the room anymore. The girlfriend has been sick of it since 6 yrs ago lol. Im so glad to hear this kind of review man it puts me at peace now and I will definately be getting an outlaw...even better someone reviews it up against a svs. THANK YOU!

Looks like the outlaw sub family good a new addition. this one does not look like it's related to HSU:
http://www.outlawaudio.com/products/ecs.html