Hey guys,

This song will give all of your Outlaws a nice workout.

"Deeper" by Pete Belasco

Play it in the car and you would never guess just how
the bass player is playing. Make sure all of your knick
knacks are not close to the edge of the table. This
one is a window rattler.

Have fun.

FORE !!!

^^

Thanks PannyMann...:)

Keep it in the short grass....:D:cool::D

^^

Thanks PannyMann...:)

Keep it in the short grass....:D:cool::D

What's that? :o

What's that? :o

That's all right, Stephen....golf is more "exciting" from the other areas of the golf course.:D

That's all right, Stephen....golf is more "exciting" from the other areas of the golf course.:D

I sure seem to get my money's worth ;)

Hi all,

I don't know if I should be concern of this issue I have with the Ex. That I recently purchased. It is the RCA jack where the subwoofer cable plug in.
The RCA jack only sticking half way out. So when I pluged in the subwoofer cable. It does not go all the way in and I can move it. In this case is kind of loose. So, is this something I should be worry about? I have read on many threads that make sure all cable plugs are snug tight. Thanks.

^^

Yep, the RCA jack does appear to be only sticking out about 1/2 way on the EX. I have two different cables and one does appear to fit better than the other but both cables do work.

It should at least come close to bottoming out, the jack should stick out roughly as far as any other RCA jack in your system.

^^

Thanks PannyMann...:)

Keep it in the short grass....:D:cool::D

Had an Ozik Matrix Xcon 5 installed over the winter. Working my way into finding the short stuff but is it ever LOOOOOONGG !!

My Outlaw LFM-2 Sub Woofer stopped working, contacted Outlaw, shipped the Amp. part back to them, they fixed it, now it works.
Nice job Outlaw.

My Outlaw LFM-2 Sub Woofer stopped working, contacted Outlaw, shipped the Amp. part back to them, they fixed it, now it works.
Nice job Outlaw.

Outlaw customer support is a 5 star. Scott took care me really good. I have experienced a rattle from my Plus, I called Scott and got a replacement within 1 week. I'm very happy with the sub now.

I agree their support for their products is first class. It's nice to see some companies actually give a damn. Plus Scott is a A+ guy to deal with.;)

So I took my kids to the Denver Aquarium yesterday. Outside, they have this Sponge Bob 3D ride; you know the ones with the seats that move and shake, kinda like a flight simulator. As I was exiting, I noticed that in the front corners, they had two LFM-1 EXs. I thought that was pretty cool.

Hi,
I recently purchased the LFM-1 EX and thinking of adding another sub.
But it is a different brand. "Polk Audio PSW505B 12" Can someone tell me if it is a good idea to add a second sub that is not the same brand? Thanks.

Hi,
I recently purchased the LFM-1 EX and thinking of adding another sub.
But it is a different brand. "Polk Audio PSW505B 12" Can someone tell me if it is a good idea to add a second sub that is not the same brand? Thanks.I tried 2 different subs...I believe it's best to use the same. I have 2 EX's which I'm very happy with. I did try my Paradigm PW2200 with one EX and it sounded weird. The Paradigm has a bloated sound whereas the EX is tight and punchy. ;)

I tried 2 different subs...I believe it's best to use the same. I have 2 EX's which I'm very happy with. I did try my Paradigm PW2200 with one EX and it sounded weird. The Paradigm has a bloated sound whereas the EX is tight and punchy. ;)

Thanks, well I guess I am not getting the Polk Audio PSW505B 12" for $219.
I was hopping that it will sound at least ok with a different brand sub. But if you say it sound weird. That dosn't sound good to me.

I did try my Paradigm PW2200 with one EX and it sounded weird. The Paradigm has a bloated sound whereas the EX is tight and punchy.
Thanks, well I guess I am not getting the Polk Audio PSW505B 12" for $219.
I was hopping that it will sound at least ok with a different brand sub. But if you say it sound weird. That dosn't sound good to me.
I also tried my old Paradigm sub (a PS-1000, not a PW2200) with my new LFM-1 EX and thought it sounded bad. If you really feel the need to run two subs, spring for a second EX! (If price is an issue, wait for the next good sale...if you can! ;))

The Outlaws have another special offer per an e-mail sent out this morning...

The package is a LFM sub + SMS-1 EQ (price reduced) with free shipping on both items.

http://www.outlawaudio.com/products/lfmEX.html

Hi,
I recently purchased the LFM-1 EX and thinking of adding another sub.
But it is a different brand. "Polk Audio PSW505B 12" Can someone tell me if it is a good idea to add a second sub that is not the same brand? Thanks.

With ported subs, i would not recommend using two different brands or models. With sealed it requires work, but it can be done more easily.

So...having heard some POLK subs....
Stay with Outlaw, and add a second later.

I'm only halfway through the thread as I just found it a few days ago. Outlaw has the SMS-1 special & I need feedback on whether to get the ex or the plus with the SMS.

I'm using one of my bedrooms as a theater & it measures 12' wide x 14' long x 9' tall ceiling. A 65" rptv is centered on the 12 foot wide wall at one end of the room. I have a pair of Magnepan MMGW on each side of tv for the center. Mains are MC1s and another pair of MMGW for surround.

I have the 990 and the Oppo BDP-83 as a source. Not too worried about music as I have a separate 2 channel for that in another room.

I'm in Oahu so shipping costs always kills my budget & I'm getting impatient waiting for a sale on just the sub & I know the SMS will help with the maggies so I'm thinking of buying the sub now. Question is which one. I may go dual subs someday, but not now.

Thanks for any input.

^^

I would go with the EX. Here is my full review:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=14745915#post14745915

Thanks, I am leaning towards the ex.

I have the Plus and am very pleased. I agree with laugsbach though, if I were doing it over again, I'd get the big boy EX and enjoy the added headroom. You can always adjust the gain if it's too loud (although I'm not sure how tight, punchy bass can possibly be too loud !) ;>)

I have the LFM 1x and have not looked back... Plus one on Outlaw CS! Scott is great!

I think, therefore I am single.

Too funny.:p

Too funny.:p

I ripped it off from somewhere, don't remember. Too good not to share though. Glad you likey !!

Placed my order for the EX & SMS-1 package.

^^

Good deal ngepoy...stop back with your thoughts.

I am surprised no one is talking about Outlaw's new little addition:

http://www.outlawaudio.com/products/ecs.html

The ECS-10

Driver Type: Front Firing, 10" Long-throw Woofer
Ports: None-Sealed Design
Amplifier Power Rating: 1000W RMS; 2000W peak
Frequency Response:
23Hz-120Hz +/-3dB
Crossover:
Lowpass : 40Hz to 120Hz and Bypass
Highpass: 80Hz
Phase: 0 or 180 Degrees
Dimensions: (HxWxD) 13.23" x 12.375" x 13.875 "
Shipping Weight: 46 lbs

:)

They just sent the announcement email this morning... give it a little time.

Looks like Outlaw wants to compete with the SVS SB12-Plus. Size is about the same, smaller diameter woofer than SVS but quite a bit more power.

I wonder if it is a collaboration with Hsu as well.

From a design perspective, anyone care to speculate as to how
a sub with a 10 inch high excursion woofer and a 1000W amp might
compare to the EX ??

Just wondering what kind of compromises are in order given the smaller
cabinet yet higher wattage.

From a design perspective, anyone care to speculate as to how
a sub with a 10 inch high excursion woofer and a 1000W amp might
compare to the EX ??

Just wondering what kind of compromises are in order given the smaller
cabinet yet higher wattage.

I would think it will not handle anything lower than the spec 24Hz. You need displacement and a very solid/heavy cabinet to handle low hz. As for anything above the spec, it would be interesting to see any dB difference. It may be worth an email to Scott to get his feedback on the question.

Recently started using a new (denon 3808ci) receiver; and although cables are tight and snug... there is a very loud buzz from my LFm1x... this buzz was not there with my previous receiver??? Any ideas/suggestions? Thxs

This new sub seems strangely similar to the CSW P-1000. They had 10" woofers (2 active), 1000w amps, and were good down to around 23hz. Coincidence...? I own two of them, very musical, but I have an LFM-1EX for the really low stuff!

This new sub seems strangely similar to the CSW P-1000. They had 10" woofers (2 active), 1000w amps, and were good down to around 23hz. Coincidence...? I own two of them, very musical, but I have an LFM-1EX for the really low stuff!

Hi floridaipoolboy !! Have you given up on your quest for dual MFWs ?

I would think it will not handle anything lower than the spec 24Hz. You need displacement and a very solid/heavy cabinet to handle low hz. As for anything above the spec, it would be interesting to see any dB difference. It may be worth an email to Scott to get his feedback on the question.

I like the objectvity I get here. I do have high regard for Outlaw CS though from what I read here. Haven't had a need to get my Plus serviced though and that's a good thing too.

Thanks for getting back. I'm sure there will be plenty of discussion when the new model gets into a few homes. I'm thinking of possibly placing one nearfield behind the couch.

I am on the fence debating between the Outlaw LFM-1 EX, the HSU 3.3 and the SVS PB-12. The sub will be placed against my leather sectional and a window, and my goal is for a slamming HT sub with sub 20Hz extension.

I hear that the SVS is the most reliable; however, looking at numbers it is the lightest and has a smaller amp.

The HSU sub (being a side firing sub) will fire directly into my sectional....which I hear may be a good thing. My concern is that I don't want to hear any distortion or leather vibrating noise.

The Outlaw seems to be the most attractive in stock form. The EX still comes with the plexi top...right?

Oh, BTW, thanks laugsbach for the great write up on the EX!!

^^

Thanks deepstang.:)

Man, all three are good picks...AFAIK, the EX still has the plexi top. :cool:
I love nearfield placement for movie impact and for my money, I would lean towards either the HSU or the EX.

Recently started using a new (denon 3808ci) receiver; and although cables are tight and snug... there is a very loud buzz from my LFm1x... this buzz was not there with my previous receiver??? Any ideas/suggestions? Thxs

I have seen a few other posts with this question. Your best bet is to google "subwoofer hum". You will get several hits with help.

Hi floridaipoolboy !! Have you given up on your quest for dual MFWs ?


Yes, I'm afraid so. I just can't take the chance, so now I'm leaning towards a second LFM-1EX. Since I already own one it would be the least expensive upgrade path for me.

Yes, I'm afraid so. I just can't take the chance, so now I'm leaning towards a second LFM-1EX. Since I already own one it would be the least expensive upgrade path for me.

I think it'll be the "smarter" choice. If you are enjoying your single EX, duals should REALLY be outstanding. Too bad there's no good sale on right now. The best ones see to be right after the christmas holidays.

I think it'll be the "smarter" choice. If you are enjoying your single EX, duals should REALLY be outstanding. Too bad there's no good sale on right now. The best ones see to be right after the christmas holidays.

I agree PannyMann.

FWIW, last year in early July the Outlaws ran a free shipping and 12 months same as cash promotion.

Yes, I'm afraid so. I just can't take the chance, so now I'm leaning towards a second LFM-1EX. Since I already own one it would be the least expensive upgrade path for me.Last Dec I was all set to purchase dual MFW's, I ended up purchasing dual EX's and haven't looked back. I am very happy with this dual setup. They look and sound excellent and they come from a company that cares about their customers. :)

Last Dec I was all set to purchase dual MFW's, I ended up purchasing dual EX's and haven't looked back. I am very happy with this dual setup. They look and sound excellent and they come from a company that cares about their customers. :)

Yeah, but do they give you *hugs*? :p:D

Yeah, but do they give you *hugs*? :p:D

LQTM...:)

What's up Stephen? How is the King & his Castle?

LQTM...:)

What's up Stephen? How is the King & his Castle?

Hey Larry,

Good to hear from you. Not sure how the King is doing (or even who he is) but the Castle's doing ok. Though to be honest that stupid upgrade bug keeps popping up. I think the next time I upgrade subs I'm going to go custom - either build it myself or have someone else build something to my specs.

What's new with you? Have you added four more EX's yet? ;) :D

^^

You're the King of your "Castle"!:)

Upgrade bug is killing me as well and I am also leaning towards a DIY project. Currently running with three subs as my Wife has turned into a "Bassette Head" and nicked one of the subs for her music area.:eek:

Hence the bug.:D

Upgrade bug is killing me as well and I am also leaning towards a DIY project.

DIY! DIY! DIY! DIY!

Come to the dark side Larry!

(Insert evil laugh)

:D

Will they be doing a 4th of July sale again this year?

^^

Stay tuned Orta...there should be an e-mail next week from the Outlaws.

DIY! DIY! DIY! DIY!

Come to the dark side Larry!

(Insert evil laugh)

:D

You're being a bad influence........again.:D

^^

Stay tuned Orta...there should be an e-mail next week from the Outlaws.

I'm ready to pull the trigger on a second LFM-1EX, if it goes on sale with free shipping!

^^

Well, I just rec'd my first(?) July 4th e-mail from the Outlaws and there are no sub specials...yet.

The Outlaws just sent a "Quick Draw" offer good for the weekend and unfortunately,....NO SUBWOOFERS!:eek:

I'm waiting for an LFM-1EX for $599 with free shipping. Come on Outlaw!

The Outlaws just sent a "Quick Draw" offer good for the weekend and unfortunately,....NO SUBWOOFERS!:eek:

Just wondering...what IS on sale over there? Is this something we can see on the website or is it an e-mail only promo?

BTW, I enjoyed the video you sent me. Sorry I haven't replied more promptly. I think you're about ready to do voiceovers! :D

I'm waiting for an LFM-1EX for $599 with free shipping. Come on Outlaw!

They have a B Stock EX for 574 bucks and I **think** free shipping...

Just wondering...what IS on sale over there? Is this something we can see on the website or is it an e-mail only promo?

BTW, I enjoyed the video you sent me. Sorry I haven't replied more promptly. I think you're about ready to do voiceovers! :D

It was so lame that I deleted it...:eek:

So, you think I have a chance for another career...should I move to LA?:D

It was so lame that I deleted it...:eek:

So, you think I have a chance for another career...should I move to LA?:D

Good thing I still have it on my computer :D. I can make millions selling it as my own work ;).

And yes, move to LA. I'd enjoy the company of a fellow HT fanatic. And you even golf too. I have a feeling we'd hang out a lot.

Been having lots of fun with the EX and SMS-1 since I got them about 3 weeks ago. Played around with diff placement and experimenting with dual subs using my old sub. In the end, I ended up using only the EX, placed where my old sub was & with the SMS-1 doing its job, I can't be happier with how it is integrating with my set up. Still have to do some tweaking but having too much fun rewatching some of my favorite movies.

They have a B Stock EX for 574 bucks and I **think** free shipping...

Yes, I saw that. I was a bit concerned about the condition of the B-stock items so I asked Outlaw C.S. if they could describe the subs' appearance. Scott replied that they do not differentiate between B-stock items, some are in great shape while some have "minor" cosmetic flaws. I'm still not sure what constitutes "minor", but I wish they would take maybe what, 5 minutes, during their inspectons/refurb/repack to note any cosmetic issues with the product. I wouldn't mind a scratch or smudge, but I would mind a gouge or crack! He then told me if cosmetics mattered I should just buy A-stock...well sorry, but even with a discount and free shipping I still have some WAF to deal with! Not the answer I was looking for, especially since I have already dropped over a grand with them for an A-stock LFM-1EX and an SMS-1. Maybe I'll just wait and see, I wasn't thrilled with the prospect of buying blind and facing a big shipping bill if the sub showed up with a serious issue.

Man....this Outlaw LFM-1 EX thread is so quiet.:eek:

Man....this Outlaw LFM-1 EX thread is so quiet.:eek:

We're all def from the sub. Mines 2 years old now and probably run 250 movies on it as well as a hundreds of hours of music, still kicking and I love it as much as I did the day I got it. I still gotta get the wife to let me buy another.

Man....this Outlaw LFM-1 EX thread is so quiet.:eek:

The thread really perked up during the last big sale and has dropped off quite a bit after everyone received them and made their initial impression posts. Excellent performance for the dollar and solid reliability might just be the reason there isn't a lot of talk about our subs.

The thread really perked up during the last big sale and has dropped off quite a bit after everyone received them and made their initial impression posts. Excellent performance for the dollar and solid reliability might just be the reason there isn't a lot of talk about our subs.

Indeed. My LFM-Plus is working like a charm. Just one question though. When I was playing around with the settings I pulled the plug out and the port 'tube' started coming out with it. I quickly tapped it back in and have not heard anything to indicate it was loose or vibrating. Just wondering if this is something I should be concerned about and what should I use to secure it if it becomes a problem? Some clear construction adhesive around where it meets the bottom perhaps?

Also - is there a correct way to remove the plugs to prevent this. Maybe I did not remove it correctly to begin with?

The sub sounds fantastic. I was watching Batman The Dark Knight and my son told me that my house was going to fall apart!!!! Unbelievable LFE!!!

Man....this Outlaw LFM-1 EX thread is so quiet.:eek:

I was one of the many who purchased during the last big sale. I just moved into a new house (previously was in a townhome) and have all my gear hooked up again. This thing (LFM-1 EX) is UNBELIEVABLE! The Dark Knight Bluray is incredible sound and I've been going through all of my regular DVDs looking for great bass. War of the Worlds where the machine emerges absolutely shakes the house, I love feeling the laser beams! Also, the cannons in Master & Commander are ridiculous with this sub. Oh, and I've got the gain set ~3.5 and Audyssey adjusted it down pretty far (-9.0 dB) during calibration, and it is still just crazy punchy bass.

Anyway, I've got more movies to watch! :D

The thread really perked up during the last big sale and has dropped off quite a bit after everyone received them and made their initial impression posts. Excellent performance for the dollar and solid reliability might just be the reason there isn't a lot of talk about our subs.
Spot on.

I'm running dual LFM-1EX's and couldn't be happier.

So glad I went with these instead of the MFW's.

Indeed. My LFM-Plus is working like a charm. Just one question though. When I was playing around with the settings I pulled the plug out and the port 'tube' started coming out with it. I quickly tapped it back in and have not heard anything to indicate it was loose or vibrating. Just wondering if this is something I should be concerned about and what should I use to secure it if it becomes a problem? Some clear construction adhesive around where it meets the bottom perhaps?

Also - is there a correct way to remove the plugs to prevent this. Maybe I did not remove it correctly to begin with?

The sub sounds fantastic. I was watching Batman The Dark Knight and my son told me that my house was going to fall apart!!!! Unbelievable LFE!!!

No doubt in my mind that Outlaw customer serrvice will guide you through how to address your loose tube issue. I was fooling around with the plugs for about the first month of ownership until I got it dialed in.

I ended up in MO mode. I listen to music via internet radio through my Onkyo 906. I also have the anti mode and have the 15 to 25hz "lift" engaged.
That combo gives me the best of both worlds for music and HT and no need to fool with the plugs since them.

I am EXTREMELY pleased with my Outlaw. Was looking at a comperable Hsu when I bought it but felt that I got a bit more bang for the buck with my Plus.

Man....this Outlaw LFM-1 EX thread is so quiet.:eek:

Well, I am glad I posted. It was nice to hear from some of you still enjoying the LFM-1 EX. I have one myself and really love it. Had mine about 6 months now and every time I hear it. I am still amazes what this EX can do. I am thinking of adding another. But will wait for the next big sale. If there will be any. But then again even if it is on sale. I still would need my wife approval.
She also enjoy the sound of the EX her self. Well we have a small house.
Adding one more EX will be tough for the wife approval.

Tell you what! I watched "Watchmen" last night and of 100+ Blurays, it made my sub do things Id never heard from it before (and sounded perfect).

Yes, I saw that. I was a bit concerned about the condition of the B-stock items so I asked Outlaw C.S. if they could describe the subs' appearance. Scott replied that they do not differentiate between B-stock items, some are in great shape while some have "minor" cosmetic flaws. I'm still not sure what constitutes "minor", but I wish they would take maybe what, 5 minutes, during their inspectons/refurb/repack to note any cosmetic issues with the product. I wouldn't mind a scratch or smudge, but I would mind a gouge or crack! He then told me if cosmetics mattered I should just buy A-stock...well sorry, but even with a discount and free shipping I still have some WAF to deal with! Not the answer I was looking for, especially since I have already dropped over a grand with them for an A-stock LFM-1EX and an SMS-1. Maybe I'll just wait and see, I wasn't thrilled with the prospect of buying blind and facing a big shipping bill if the sub showed up with a serious issue.

Even AV123 lets you know what to expect with "b" stocks. Give SVS a call, they'll take the five minutes to help you out.

Even AV123 lets you know what to expect with "b" stocks. Give SVS a call, they'll take the five minutes to help you out.

Funny, I was all set to pull the trigger on the B-stock LFM-1EX, all I wanted was a description of the appearance, or at least some assurance by an explanation of what constitutes "minor" damage. Now I'm still looking, I already own one Outlaw sub, adding a second would be the most cost effective upgrade. I'll have to think about it, dual 15" or 18" subs are mighty tempting!

Funny, I was all set to pull the trigger on the B-stock LFM-1EX, all I wanted was a description of the appearance, or at least some assurance by an explanation of what constitutes "minor" damage. Now I'm still looking, I already own one Outlaw sub, adding a second would be the most cost effective upgrade. I'll have to think about it, dual 15" or 18" subs are mighty tempting!Having dual EX's I can honestly say they kick some serious butt with movies and music in my HT room and they do look nice. I personally like punchy deep tight bass and they do this very well. BTW I was looking for a 15" or 18" sub until I seen these on sale and I have been very happy so far. Get another EX and give them a try...they do have a 30 day return if your not happy with the results. Good Luck!

I just received a B-Stock LFM-1 EX today and it looks brand new. Not a mark on it as far as I can tell. Still has the paper over the plastic top. I'm going to order another one most likely. I considered the PB-13 Ultra and the Submersive, but decided to give the LFM a try. I'm not disappointed, though when I build my real media room up stairs, I'll most likely step up to a better sub. I have four Energy RC-70's and a Energy RC-LCR - it sounds pretty darn awesome right now in my family room though. :)

I just received a B-Stock LFM-1 EX today and it looks brand new. Not a mark on it as far as I can tell. Still has the paper over the plastic top. I'm going to order another one most likely. I considered the PB-13 Ultra and the Submersive, but decided to give the LFM a try. I'm not disappointed, though when I build my real media room up stairs, I'll most likely step up to a better sub. I have four Energy RC-70's and a Energy RC-LCR - it sounds pretty darn awesome right now in my family room though. :)

All right, you talked me into it! I just placed an order for a B-stock LFM-1EX, hopefully mine will be as nice as yours. I was considering all the usual suspects, eD, Epik, MFW, etc. for a sub upgrade, but the least expensive path is to add a second Outlaw sub to match the one I already own. Now the waiting begins..........!

All right, you talked me into it! I just placed an order for a B-stock LFM-1EX, hopefully mine will be as nice as yours. I was considering all the usual suspects, eD, Epik, MFW, etc. for a sub upgrade, but the least expensive path is to add a second Outlaw sub to match the one I already own. Now the waiting begins..........!

I have to admit, I'm just a bit surprised. I thought you might wait to see how reliable the AV123 amp fix was turning out to be. I'm really hoping that this works out for you though. I do think the odds are in your favor given that there seem to be few complaints about Outlaw's B stock purchases.

So congrats on your "Outlaw re-initiation". Please let us know how the duals sound after you get it all set up. Do you run any type of ouboard bass eq ?

It is so hard picking subs in the class of LFM-1EX b/c the SVS PB-12 NSD and the HSU VTF3.3 are in a similar price point (SVS cheapest) with 12" drivers and 325-350 watt amps. HSU supposedly has great SQ. SVS supposedly has pretty high SPLs. It seems everyone loves the plexi-tops on the Outlaw. Are there any other convincing factors to go the Outlaw route?

I have to admit, I'm just a bit surprised. I thought you might wait to see how reliable the AV123 amp fix was turning out to be. I'm really hoping that this works out for you though. I do think the odds are in your favor given that there seem to be few complaints about Outlaw's B stock purchases.

So congrats on your "Outlaw re-initiation". Please let us know how the duals sound after you get it all set up. Do you run any type of ouboard bass eq ?

Yes, I'm using the SMS-1 to smooth things out. I couldn't wait on the MFWs, too much drama. This is the most cost effective upgrade for now. Presently I have a pair of CSW P-1000 subs up front acting like MBMs, and my Outlaw is behind the couch. I'm planning on moving the Outlaws up front once the second one arrives, and depending on the results, the other two subs will go into the family room. Of course, I may wind up using them in the HT as well, but I'm thinking two LFM-1EXs will be sufficient!

It is so hard picking subs in the class of LFM-1EX b/c the SVS PB-12 NSD and the HSU VTF3.3 are in a similar price point (SVS cheapest) with 12" drivers and 325-350 watt amps. HSU supposedly has great SQ. SVS supposedly has pretty high SPLs. It seems everyone loves the plexi-tops on the Outlaw. Are there any other convincing factors to go the Outlaw route?

I bought my first Outlaw based on price/performance, but the down-firing design and the plexi top sealed the deal. The Hsu didn't appeal to me visually, side firing subs just look strange. Variable tuning, good looks, and good price made me go Outlaw.

I just received a B-Stock LFM-1 EX today and it looks brand new. Not a mark on it as far as I can tell. Still has the paper over the plastic top. I'm going to order another one most likely. I considered the PB-13 Ultra and the Submersive, but decided to give the LFM a try. I'm not disappointed, though when I build my real media room up stairs, I'll most likely step up to a better sub. I have four Energy RC-70's and a Energy RC-LCR - it sounds pretty darn awesome right now in my family room though. :)

I have an LFM-1 EX and have a question... this sub absolutely ROCKS my theater room.

The room is approx 15ft x 10 ft rectangular and it shakes the damn walls.

My two questions are:

a) what do you consider a "better" sub

and

b) would I need to do anything different to my system if I wanted to add a second sub, and would you recommend it?

Thanks :)

My two questions are:

a) what do you consider a "better" sub

and

b) would I need to do anything different to my system if I wanted to add a second sub, and would you recommend it?

Thanks :)

a) Infinite baffle sub :D

b) Add another sub cable, y splitter, and recalibrate the two subs compared to the rest. Multiple subs help smooth out your frequency response, they can give you +3-6dB., and don't have to work as hard when driven at high volumes.

I have an LFM-1 EX and have a question... this sub absolutely ROCKS my theater room.

The room is approx 15ft x 10 ft rectangular and it shakes the damn walls.

My two questions are:

a) what do you consider a "better" sub

and

b) would I need to do anything different to my system if I wanted to add a second sub, and would you recommend it?

Thanks :)

a) There are many subs that are better. For me, this system is in my family room. I'd probably lean heavily towards a Seaton Submersive for the room upstairs. I think one would be enough, since it's a fully enclosed room roughly 14x18. I think the Outlaw sub looks quite nice and it sounds great for the price. It does NOT feel cheap and it does not sound cheap. Honestly it's probably perfectly fine for a majority of people. I just want to rattle the fillings out of my teeth, and to do that you really need more than a 12" single driver. With that said, one 12" single driver can pack a heck of a punch, and the EX does deliver.

b) This is difficult to answer because it's not cut and dry. As it was already stated, a Y Cable, and some adjustments can potentially yield positive results. Other times you may over power the area with bass, and not achieve the sound you are looking for. My family room for example has four openings into four different rooms, some of those having 20' ceilings. I also have large expansive windows and 9' ceilings in this room. I do lose gain and am on a slab, so if I did add a second sub it would probably help with the sound field in the room being more consistent. In my general seating area with the sub at the front left of my TV, I get very good effects. I did try locating my sub at the back of the room to the right of my seating area, and it was far less involving for the listener in the primary position. So sub placement and design is key. I can place my sub in several locations, others may not have that flexibility. For me, I'll flip a coin to see if I add another LFM-1 EX. If anything I wouldn't have to work the primary subwoofer as hard to get a similar effect. I also like the lows of the EX - movies I played previously where you almost thought nothing was going on in the scene generate a nice low rumble from the EX.

So far Watchmen is producing some nice lows and punch bass. I like it!

Yes, I'm using the SMS-1 to smooth things out. I couldn't wait on the MFWs, too much drama. This is the most cost effective upgrade for now. Presently I have a pair of CSW P-1000 subs up front acting like MBMs, and my Outlaw is behind the couch. I'm planning on moving the Outlaws up front once the second one arrives, and depending on the results, the other two subs will go into the family room. Of course, I may wind up using them in the HT as well, but I'm thinking two LFM-1EXs will be sufficient!

The SMS1 EQs all of your subs ?

The SMS1 EQs all of your subs ?

Yep, along with the semi-parametric feature on the P-1000 controller. I use the twin P-1000s running off a single controller as MBMs, and use the LFM-1EX to fill in the frequencies below 50 hz. The SMS-1 controls all three, giving me a nice house curve for movies, and a flatter curve for music.

Yep, along with the semi-parametric feature on the P-1000 controller. I use the twin P-1000s running off a single controller as MBMs, and use the LFM-1EX to fill in the frequencies below 50 hz. The SMS-1 controls all three, giving me a nice house curve for movies, and a flatter curve for music.

SMS-1 has multi LFE outs ? Just curious.

SMS-1 has multi LFE outs ? Just curious.

Yes, the SMS-1 has three LFE outputs, but they are all tied together, no adjusting one sub differently from the others.

Yes, the SMS-1 has three LFE outputs, but they are all tied together, no adjusting one sub differently from the others.

That was exactly what I was wondering. Sounds like you have the makings of a SUPER system once you get all of the pieces and in position and calibrated. I think multiple pics are in order !!

The Outlaw is scheduled to arrive on Tuesday. I'll take some pics once everything is up and running.

Add me to the list of happy LFM-1Plus owners....

Replaced a Def Tech PF1500 (which i still have..anyone need one??..lol)....LFM smokes it.

My B-stock LFM-1EX arrived today, and I must say, it looks very nice. It didn't have the paper on the plexiglass, but I can live with that! I now have to figure out where to put these two beasts, I'm leaning on using them as endtables flanking my reclining loveseat. With twin P-1000 MBM subs up front, twin LFM-1EXs next to the listening position, and dual Bass Shakers under the seats things should rumble quite nicely!

My B-stock LFM-1EX arrived today, and I must say, it looks very nice. It didn't have the paper on the plexiglass, but I can live with that! I now have to figure out where to put these two beasts, I'm leaning on using them as endtables flanking my reclining loveseat. With twin P-1000 MBM subs up front, twin LFM-1EXs next to the listening position, and dual Bass Shakers under the seats things should rumble quite nicely!

Sounds like you have some PRIMO rumbles in store. Glad to hear that the B-Stock looks to be in good condition. I hope the performance matches the aesthetics.

How does the EX compare the AV123s MFW. Since I live close to AV123, I could pick up and save on shipping, but would to pay for taxes. Pretty much puts me in the same ballpark as a B stock EX. Anyone heard both?

My B-stock LFM-1EX arrived today, and I must say, it looks very nice. It didn't have the paper on the plexiglass, but I can live with that! I now have to figure out where to put these two beasts, I'm leaning on using them as endtables flanking my reclining loveseat. With twin P-1000 MBM subs up front, twin LFM-1EXs next to the listening position, and dual Bass Shakers under the seats things should rumble quite nicely!Well...how did dual EX's work for you? Looking forward to your review. ;)

I need to do some rewiring to move the two subs into position, so the review will take a few days. I should have everything in place over the weekend, stay tuned!

I finally managed to move the subs into their new positions today, and then I noticed it. The B-stock LFM-1EX I just received has the amp mounted upside down! I can't believe I didn't notice this when I first unpacked it, crazy. The sub sounds normal so far, I ran the calibration tone and it sounded fine. I just can't believe Outlaw would repair a unit and not notice that the amp was going in the wrong way... they must have let the new guy work on this one!

I finally managed to move the subs into their new positions today, and then I noticed it. The B-stock LFM-1EX I just received has the amp mounted upside down! I can't believe I didn't notice this when I first unpacked it, crazy. The sub sounds normal so far, I ran the calibration tone and it sounded fine. I just can't believe Outlaw would repair a unit and not notice that the amp was going in the wrong way... they must have let the new guy work on this one!

Maybe the Outlaw experts would chime in here, however I have read other posts where - for rattles for instance - they would ask you to unplug the power and carefully remove the amp and look inside for any extra pieces. Perhaps just take off the amp and turn it around to take care of this. (Maybe call them first) I understand you should not have to do that, but if you like the sub it sure beats going through the effort of repacking it and sending it back.

I have the LFM-1 Plus and think it is awesome! For music and HT it rocks the house!

Maybe the Outlaw experts would chime in here, however I have read other posts where - for rattles for instance - they would ask you to unplug the power and carefully remove the amp and look inside for any extra pieces. Perhaps just take off the amp and turn it around to take care of this. (Maybe call them first) I understand you should not have to do that, but if you like the sub it sure beats going through the effort of repacking it and sending it back.

I have the LFM-1 Plus and think it is awesome! For music and HT it rocks the house!

I never thought about returning it for something like this, I just think it's a riot that they would let this slip by! They say the b-stock subs are returns or repaired units, obviously this one had an amp issue. It just makes me wonder when something as obvious as this manages to go unnoticed, that's all.

I never thought about returning it for something like this, I just think it's a riot that they would let this slip by! They say the b-stock subs are returns or repaired units, obviously this one had an amp issue. It just makes me wonder when something as obvious as this manages to go unnoticed, that's all.

It's all good! Who knows how it came to be..
Its very easy to correct, six screws and flip her over.
I would call Outlaw and let them know the situation to cover yourself for anything in the future.
I love my EX! I had a rattle in my driver and Scott took care of me pronto with a new driver at my door in three days!

It's all good! Who knows how it came to be..
Its very easy to correct, six screws and flip her over.

Hmm, reminds me of a girl I met in Dallas once...! ;-)

But seriously, I plan on contacting Outlaw to get the OK to flip the amp. I didn't care at first, but at night the two power leds are at different heights, visible when we walk by the HT, and it's starting to bug me!

i'm bumpin this thread up. id like to hear from everyone that are still enjoying their outlaw subs. i dont post here often but i am a longtime lurker. i own the LFM1-EX and have used it since last october. i also have an earthquake Kompressor i run along with it, but have it set barely on just to fill it out some. Panny 50" 85Z and panny BD-55 player. i own an Outlaw 950(retired) and 970 pre/pro along with a stack of Adcom GF-555"s running a pair of NHT 2.9's fronts(getting ready to bi-amp them with an active crossover and two of the 555's), Kef Q5 surrounds,Q3 srr's and an nht M6 for a center(outlaw m2200 for power)..so i am a long term Outlaw product owner. I think Outlaw is a great company with great product and a very good service dept. the rattle prob in my EX happened a few months after i got it..i was really bummed but Scott made it painless and fast. i really dont think in the price range you can do better for this sub. i may head into DYI-land in my next step if i dont buy another EX. i love my setup and love this particular hobby due to the never ending adjustments and tweaking.
ive watched this thread from the beginning and yes ..it has died off somewhat..
so how about it? lets hear from the guys the started the thread? how are your subs and systems going?how about some pics everyone? i will take some of mine and post soon!
best
randy

Can someone tell me which is correct in the blue highlighted section.
This is straight out from the owner's manual.

Port Switch
Depending on your bass preference, your Variable Tuning LFM Series subwoofer
has two separate "tuning" modes. In Its “Max Output” mode your LFM series
subwoofer will provide the greatest level of overall bass in regards to SPL (sound
pressure level). In Its "Bass Extension" mode your LFM series subwoofer will
provide the deepest bass (low frequency) levels. When using the Bass Extension
mode you will need to ensure that the provided “port plug” Is blocking one of
the ports located on the bottom of the subwoofer. In the Max Output mode, both ports should remain unplugged.

CAUTION: Do not leave both ports open when the Port Switch Is In
the “Bass Extension” position as your subwoofer's performance will be
comprised. If one of the ports is blocked using the supplied port plug, the
Port Switch must remain In the “Max Output” mode. Failure to adhere to
these requirements can lead to poor performance and damage to your subwoofer.

Can someone tell me which is correct in the blue highlighted section.
This is straight out from the owner's manual.

Port Switch
Depending on your bass preference, your Variable Tuning LFM Series subwoofer
has two separate "tuning" modes. In Its “Max Output” mode your LFM series
subwoofer will provide the greatest level of overall bass in regards to SPL (sound
pressure level). In Its "Bass Extension" mode your LFM series subwoofer will
provide the deepest bass (low frequency) levels. When using the Bass Extension
mode you will need to ensure that the provided “port plug” Is blocking one of
the ports located on the bottom of the subwoofer. In the Max Output mode, both ports should remain unplugged.

CAUTION: Do not leave both ports open when the Port Switch Is In
the “Bass Extension” position as your subwoofer's performance will be
comprised. If one of the ports is blocked using the supplied port plug, the
Port Switch must remain In the “Max Output” mode. Failure to adhere to
these requirements can lead to poor performance and damage to your subwoofer.

Your sub has 2 air ports (next to the woofer) that 1 by factory default (shipped) has a plug in it.

You have a switch on the back for Max output mode. You need to keep that port plug in one of the 2 ports to have that switch set to on. If you have the switch not set to max output, you can leave both air ports open (take the plug out).

Max Output is supposed to go deeper then the other which is supposed to be more punchy. Ive tried both and couldn't really tell the dif.

its a little confusing but as mentioned..there's a switch on the back amp plate. up is max output and down is max extension. its very important that you have the plug in when in max extension- switch down. i have a piece of tape labeled "plugged" on the bottom of the switch. the manual is very confusing.

Your sub has 2 air ports (next to the woofer) that 1 by factory default (shipped) has a plug in it.

You have a switch on the back for Max output mode. You need to keep that port plug in one of the 2 ports to have that switch set to on. If you have the switch not set to max output, you can leave both air ports open (take the plug out).

Max Output is supposed to go deeper then the other which is supposed to be more punchy. Ive tried both and couldn't really tell the dif.

Just to reiterate, in the Max Output setting, both ports must remain open. However, in Max Extension mode, one port must be plugged.

-Scott

Thank you everyone for the feedback. So all this time I had it all wrong.
I have been using my EX in according to the owner's manual indicated.
Which was bit confusing. And it turn to be the other way around. So now I am really concern of the EX unit. Wonder if its already shorten the life of the LFM-1 EX. What does everyone think about that?

Just to reiterate, in the Max Output setting, both ports must remain open. However, in Max Extension mode, one port must be plugged.

-Scott

Bla Im confused by their terminology, Ill have to look myself again. But that sounds perfectly right. The plug goes in for the deep base setting.

If one of the ports is blocked using the supplied port plug, the Port Switch must remain In the “Max Output” mode.

I believe this is a misprint in the manual that has gone uncorrected for quite some time. It should say, "If one of the ports is blocked using the supplied port plug, the Port Switch must remain In the “Max Extension” mode."

Scott is correct.

[QUOTE=woof*;16991680]i'm bumpin this thread up. id like to hear from everyone that are still enjoying their outlaw subs.

Hey there woofstar !! I'm not one of the original threaqd starters but I certainly meet yhour criteria for a happy Outlaw ! I am running the LFM1+ with Mirage OMD-28 fronts, C1 center, OMD-15 side surrounds and Omni 350 rears. Power is an Oknyo TX-NR906. I run the front mains full range and the side crossovers are set at 40hz. Rears are at 60hz as is the center. The The big Onkyo utilises Multeq XT and it all sounds nice and tight and plays with mucho authority when called upon.

My outlaw is set up in Max Output mode. To keep it clean, I have an anti mode 8033 and it is set for 15 to 25hz "Lift". It's VERY clean and punchy. I listen to more music, usually internet radio, than I do movies because I like to leave it on during the day when I'm home not pl;aying golf. I find the LFM1+ to handle any type of music I throw at it which for me is mostly jazz. I also like RnB and some hip hop and pop. If you ever want to hear what deep house shaking electronic bass, or an upright bass or a contra bass sounds like, you need a good sub to apprecaiate it. The LFM1+ delivers the goods.

I also enjoy movies with it and given that I love sci fi and action adventure stuff, the Outlaw gets a good workout whenever I watching, often with friends and their mates over. I just saw "Taken" and really enjoyed all the LFE which was not overwhelming but definately present throughout.

All in all, I find my Outlaw to be a wel rounded performer, providing deep powerful bass for HT while staying nicely tight and clean yet still punchy for music. All the wihile, it blends seamlessly with the rest of my rig, never reaalyy drawing attention directly to itself.

I've come to appreciate it more over time as opposed to taking it for granted. I never fail to get a few "wows" from my buds or their mates following a good action sequence. The best on by far is the first explosion in Iron Man. COmes from nowhere and it total intensity as it has sort of a ripping sound as it feels like the windows are going to blow out. It still makes me smile when I see them all jump a bit in their seats.

[QUOTE=woof*;16991680]i'm bumpin this thread up. id like to hear from everyone that are still enjoying their outlaw subs.

Hey there woofstar !! I'm not one of the original threaqd starters but I certainly meet yhour criteria for a happy Outlaw ! I am running the LFM1+ with Mirage OMD-28 fronts, C1 center, OMD-15 side surrounds and Omni 350 rears. Power is an Oknyo TX-NR906. I run the front mains full range and the side crossovers are set at 40hz. Rears are at 60hz as is the center. The The big Onkyo utilises Multeq XT and it all sounds nice and tight and plays with mucho authority when called upon.

My outlaw is set up in Max Output mode. To keep it clean, I have an anti mode 8033 and it is set for 15 to 25hz "Lift". It's VERY clean and punchy. I listen to more music, usually internet radio, than I do movies because I like to leave it on during the day when I'm home not pl;aying golf. I find the LFM1+ to handle any type of music I throw at it which for me is mostly jazz. I also like RnB and some hip hop and pop. If you ever want to hear what deep house shaking electronic bass, or an upright bass or a contra bass sounds like, you need a good sub to apprecaiate it. The LFM1+ delivers the goods.

I also enjoy movies with it and given that I love sci fi and action adventure stuff, the Outlaw gets a good workout whenever I watching, often with friends and their mates over. I just saw "Taken" and really enjoyed all the LFE which was not overwhelming but definately present throughout.

All in all, I find my Outlaw to be a wel rounded performer, providing deep powerful bass for HT while staying nicely tight and clean yet still punchy for music. All the wihile, it blends seamlessly with the rest of my rig, never reaalyy drawing attention directly to itself.

I've come to appreciate it more over time as opposed to taking it for granted. I never fail to get a few "wows" from my buds or their mates following a good action sequence. The best on by far is the first explosion in Iron Man. COmes from nowhere and it total intensity as it has sort of a ripping sound as it feels like the windows are going to blow out. It still makes me smile when I see them all jump a bit in their seats.
Hey PannyMann!
thanks for the update! as soon as i get my X2 crossover and begin Bi-amping my fronts.. i'm going to start experimenting with crossover/large/small settings. i've always set my speakers to small/80 hz, but after a yr or two this way i really wanna listen with different settings. also... did you buy your anti mode from a retailer or buy it direct? i've been interested in one of these.

[QUOTE=PannyMann;17008617]
Hey PannyMann!
thanks for the update! as soon as i get my X2 crossover and begin Bi-amping my fronts.. i'm going to start experimenting with crossover/large/small settings. i've always set my speakers to small/80 hz, but after a yr or two this way i really wanna listen with different settings. also... did you buy your anti mode from a retailer or buy it direct? i've been interested in one of these.

I think it's great to experiement instead of going with the standard 80hz Xover settings which I'm sure works for a lot of people. Since my fronts are full range, my thinking is ket's hear um. If I wanted to set 80hz Xovers, I would have bought bookshelves.

I bought my Anto Mode direct. Lightning fast delivery. EZ setup and great results. What's not to like ?

Got a lfm-plus during a SB sale earlier this year. Not a problem. Just saw Watchmen and was thinking that I might have to lower it a bit. May have to get a subdude even though it is on a stage. In short, this one of my favorite pieces of HT equipment.

Hey outlaw owners!
I have narrowed down my sub selection to a lfm1+ and would like to have some comments, opinions, or feedback. Currently have a klipsch sub-10 and am looking to upgrade it. Is there a significant improvement going to a lfm1+ ?

My room size is 14'W x 19'L x 9'H. tv is on 14' wall with opposite side opening into kitchen. Room is carpeted.
Receiver: marantz 5003.
Speakers: klipsch rf-52 fronts, rc52 center, and rb51 surrounds.
Listening habits: Mostly been movies/tv viewing as of lately. do enjoy music on setup but the sub has got me thinking. Could that area be improved? Not exactly looking to tear down walls, but prefer quality over quantity. Would the extra extension be noticed?
Not sure if i have left out any info.

Thanks in advance...

Mike

^^

Hi Mike,

I hope this helps...

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=14745915#post14745915

Here is a pic for you:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=132462&d=1233835852

Hey Larry,

First of all, thanks for pics.
Thanks for your response, i actually read your summary before i posted and would love some extra info from you.
Room size is pretty close, believe you on a concrete floor while i am on a crawl space, not sure if affects it or not; but i forgot to put that earlier.

Still blown away with the fact that you are running 4 subs!

Unfortunately i cannot afford the EX, i'm stretching for the PLUS as it is. You mentioned the polk psw10, which i have heard, and thats what i am hoping you can elaborate on. What actually improved? (with running just single PLUS)
My klipsch sub-10 does fairly well for movies (never heard a high-end subwoofer before) and was thinking that the outlaw is bigger, more powerful, and i'm sure built better. With all that i'm not sure how a single PLUS would not be sufficient. Of course everyone's tastes and preferences are different.

Please keep comments and opinions coming in.

^^

Hi Mike,

My little "Bassette" wife flat out took one of my LFM-1PLUS subs for her music area!:eek: So, I'm down to three subs...:(

The LFM-1PLUS is a much, much better sub than the Polk PSW10. When my wife heard the Plus, she ditched the Polk and I have that in a spare bedroom at the moment in a 3.1 system. Music was "OK" on the Polk, but Movies is where it is at on the PLUS!!!

I think you will be fine with the PLUS for your room and listening requirements. You will have to experiment between Max Output and Max Extension (see my post #1004) and just know that your sub journey will continue at some point down the road.:)

Keep your movie/music demos with material above 20-25Hz...that should slow down the upgrade bug.:D

Larry

Hey Larry,

Think i'm getting closer to pulling the trigger on it. If the PLUS excels @ music and get the extra extension with movies - then double bonus!
For now the single PLUS will have to do, later on who knows.......
If i do then i will definately switch between max and extension mode to see which is better in my room.
Keeping my fingers crossed!
Thanks again...
Any other comments would still be much appreciated.

What are you guys running the xover at on the lfm-ex?

What are you guys running the xover at on the lfm-ex?

I set an 80Hz xover for the longest time. I have reconfigured my theater room due to the "theft" :) of one LFM-1PLUS subs and now I have a 90Hz xover due to the measurements from REW software...

What are you guys running the xover at on the lfm-ex?

There are lots of factors involved with this question (and I apologize if you are aware of any of this), but most of us disable the crossover on the sub itself, and set the crossovers in our AV Receivers. But this obviously depends on what kind of speakers you use in your system. In general though, I set my speakers to small in my AVR (even though I have floorstanders in front), and set an 80hz crossover for all of my speakers, front, center and surrounds.

^^

Hi Mike,

I hope this helps...

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=14745915#post14745915


This is a great post. With the no shipping on the B-stock for these I think this might have to be my first big sub purchase. Seeing the difference between the two from someone that has them in room at the same time is valuable information.

^^

Thanks SupaKats...

The EX or PLUS sub at a free shipping B stock is a good buy...

You're not very far away from Cincinnati...feel free to stop over for a demo.

Thanks for the invite. I'll actually be in Cincy towards the end of October for my cousins wedding but I plan to have something bought before then.

Here is a pic for you:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=132462&d=1233835852

Leave them out on your deck and send me your address, I'm gong to swing by and steel them!!!

^^

Just watch out for this little guy....:D

http://www.puppyparadise.com/puppyparadisetest/site/Breeds/rottweiler.jpg

On a serious note, I don't get how people can have 2 LFM1-EX's.

My room is 13' x 40' X 8's and 1 alone over powers it. After running Audyssey with the volume at 4/10 is sets my room to -15db. When I watch movies I shake my neighbors house along with my own siding (cement composite). Thats through a double wall, double insulation, double 5/8ths sheet rock and 5 4' x 2' x 4" acoustic panels on the wall. I can still hear it 2 floors (through soundproofing in floors) up on the other side of the house.

Hey guys, quick question.
I just ordered an LFM-1+ (bstock).
The description online says "Line and speaker level inputs". Does that mean 1 or 2 rca cables? I plan to run the connection to the back of the room and it will require about 40ft of cable.
So, do I need one like this:
RCA Single (http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=102&cp_id=10236&cs_id=1023602&p_id=4098&seq=1&format=2&style=)
Or one like this:
RCA Pair (http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=102&cp_id=10218&cs_id=1021803&p_id=2868&seq=1&format=2)
Also, for this type of connection, should I limit the number of breaks in the cable or the total cable length?
EX - a 50ft cable with 10ft of slack vs a 35ft and a 5ft cable coupled.
Thanks,
John

So, do I need one like this:
RCA Single (http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=102&cp_id=10236&cs_id=1023602&p_id=4098&seq=1&format=2&style=)

That is what you need...

EX - a 50ft cable with 10ft of slack vs a 35ft and a 5ft cable coupled.
Thanks,
John

I would go with the 50' cable...

^^

Just watch out for this little guy....:D

http://www.puppyparadise.com/puppyparadisetest/site/Breeds/rottweiler.jpg

Now that right there was funny !!

....and truly some SERIOUS woofage hee hee he

On a serious note, I don't get how people can have 2 LFM1-EX's.

My room is 13' x 40' X 8's and 1 alone over powers it. After running Audyssey with the volume at 4/10 is sets my room to -15db. When I watch movies I shake my neighbors house along with my own siding (cement composite). Thats through a double wall, double insulation, double 5/8ths sheet rock and 5 4' x 2' x 4" acoustic panels on the wall. I can still hear it 2 floors (through soundproofing in floors) up on the other side of the house.

Just try it sometime, then you'll know why we do it!

Exactly! I've recently gone the Larry route, and bought my fourth LFM-1+. Granted, they are not the EX's, but it is pretty extraordinary with four subs. I don't have a very big room(about 18x15 maybe) but it also opens up to the kitchen and dining room, which tends to steal some of the bass away from the listening area. I just put one in each corner, with the front two's volume at 4, and the back two at about 2 1/2 to 3. All four are run in ME. It is a bit much for music, unless it's something like Blue Man Group or Crystal Method, but I normally turn the subs off for music anyhow, and let my towers do the work. For movies though, it is insane. It feels like a Disney Land ride with the seats vibrating and all. I've never felt so much kick in my chest before. My next step is to get rid of all the rattling. The blinds will have to get replaced with curtains, and I need to get my wife to move all of her foo foo stuff that rattles lol. If you can find a way to get multiple subs, then by all means, do it.

Exactly! I've recently gone the Larry route, and bought my fourth LFM-1+. Granted, they are not the EX's, but it is pretty extraordinary with four subs. I don't have a very big room(about 18x15 maybe) but it also opens up to the kitchen and dining room, which tends to steal some of the bass away from the listening area. I just put one in each corner, with the front two's volume at 4, and the back two at about 2 1/2 to 3. All four are run in ME. It is a bit much for music, unless it's something like Blue Man Group or Crystal Method, but I normally turn the subs off for music anyhow, and let my towers do the work. For movies though, it is insane. It feels like a Disney Land ride with the seats vibrating and all. I've never felt so much kick in my chest before. My next step is to get rid of all the rattling. The blinds will have to get replaced with curtains, and I need to get my wife to move all of her foo foo stuff that rattles lol. If you can find a way to get multiple subs, then by all means, do it.

i recently put an auralex gramma under my EX...that fixed my rattles everywhere. i was worried about losing output by doing that, but was wrong. i did adjust a couple of db up for it but now no more rattles and the bass quality is much smoother.. i dont normally buy into these kind of claims but i am a big believer now.

Exactly! I've recently gone the Larry route, and bought my fourth LFM-1+.

Outstanding!:eek::cool:

Now you're earning your screen name...:D:D

I'm about to pull the trigger on a Plus, but I'm reconsidering and thinking I should get the EX.

My HT is in a large great room (20x20x9) that opens to a large breakfast room/kitchen (15x30x9) and an open foyer that's 15x15x18. Right now I have a small Energy ESW-8 sub that does nothing more than help out with the upper bass on my Bic Acoustec HT-75 towers, so the Plus is going to be a giant leap forward, but I'm afraid I'll look back some day and kick myself for not getting an EX. WAF is a huge factor here, and I talked my wife into getting the Plus. Now that I got her acceptance, I pushed the envelope a bit further and told her that I want the EX that's 2" wider and deeper. She's not too keen on this and I want her to be happy. Apparently the EX is an 1" or so taller too, which doesn't sound like much, but after looking at the pics that laugsbach posted, the difference in cabinet size is very noticeable.

Will the EX make that much of a difference in sound in my room? Will I really notice the 2-3 Hz of extension and the +3 SPL? Is the difference in cabinet size really that noticeable?

Since I'm on a budget, I plan on buying B stock. I've seen a few posts about B stocks and I'm mildly concerned about the quality vs. new. Anyone have any thoughts or opinions about buying B stock?

Thanks in advance on your replies. I'm looking forward to being an Outlaw owner! :)

Dude, order the EX and don't look back! The difference in size really isn't an issue, as long as you don't have the two subs sitting side by side! Trust me, the WAF factor will be very high with the EX, the plexi top panel wins them over every time. Go for it, you won't be sorry!

Thanks for the feedback floridapoolboy. The ESW-8 is going to another room once I get my LFM-1 (+ or EX). I do plan on taking side-by-side pictures and I'll post them just to show the difference. I just talked it over with the wife and she's giving in, so I got the green light. I'm still thinking it over because of the extra money and increased size of the EX. The extra extension with EX has me intrigued. I initially thought of buying a PA-120, then a Compact or STF-2, then the Plus or VTF-2 MK3, and now I'm onto the EX. I can't possibly go anywhere else because of size and budget constraints. After reading over laugsbach review some 30-40 pages earlier in this thread, I can't get it out of my head about his recommendation of an LFM-1 EX.

How's your B stock EX look other than the amp being inverted? Did you talk to Outlaw support to see if you could flip it over without voiding your warranty? Any blemishes on it? Did it still get shipped double boxed with the bag like your new one did?

laugsbach, any comments or suggestions?

Yeah, laugsbach can be a pretty bad influence on some.

Thanks for the feedback floridapoolboy. The ESW-8 is going to another room once I get my LFM-1 (+ or EX). I do plan on taking side-by-side pictures and I'll post them just to show the difference. I just talked it over with the wife and she's giving in, so I got the green light. I'm still thinking it over because of the extra money and increased size of the EX. The extra extension with EX has me intrigued. I initially thought of buying a PA-120, then a Compact or STF-2, then the Plus or VTF-2 MK3, and now I'm onto the EX. I can't possibly go anywhere else because of size and budget constraints. After reading over laugsbach review some 30-40 pages earlier in this thread, I can't get it out of my head about his recommendation of an LFM-1 EX.

How's your B stock EX look other than the amp being inverted? Did you talk to Outlaw support to see if you could flip it over without voiding your warranty? Any blemishes on it? Did it still get shipped double boxed with the bag like your new one did?

laugsbach, any comments or suggestions?

My B-stock LFM-1EX looks great, with the exception of the upside down amp! It arrived packed as new, and I thought it was identical to my A-stock sub, until I noticed the amp. I really haven't pursued the issue, once I get the urge I'll flip it over. Performance and condition of the B-stock is fine, no complaints, and two Outlaw subs are definitely better than one!

laugsbach, any comments or suggestions?

Nothing has changed for me...I would go with the EX.

Yeah, laugsbach can be a pretty bad influence on some.

When I joined this thread it was weverb that was (still is:p) the bad influence...I guess I have picked up the slack.:D

When I joined this thread it was weverb that was (still is:p) the bad influence...I guess I have picked up the slack.:D

I dunno, man...I knew you were trouble the moment I saw you here...:p

When I joined this thread it was weverb that was (still is:p) the bad influence...I guess I have picked up the slack.:D

The crown has been passed on to you my friend!

http://img185.imageshack.us/img185/4368/stedwardscrown.jpg (http://img185.imageshack.us/i/stedwardscrown.jpg/)

I guess you need to start interviewing who you are going to be passing it on to next year. ;) :D

Well I pulled the trigger on the EX. I think my wife is going to flip when she sees it :o I can't believe I talked her into it. I'm really excited and a bit worried about her reaction. I can't wait to hear (and feel) what I'm missing! :D

Nothing has changed for me...I would go with the EX.

How would you describe the difference between the Plus and the EX? It seems identical in every way except for the size of the cabinet. The specs and the reviews I"ve read state that it goes lower and is louder, but is there any other differences (SQ, tonal balance, etc)? I already bought an EX, so I guess I'm just looking for some justification and perhaps it would help others that are contemplating between the two subs. Thanks!

How would you describe the difference between the Plus and the EX? It seems identical in every way except for the size of the cabinet. The specs and the reviews I"ve read state that it goes lower and is louder, but is there any other differences (SQ, tonal balance, etc)? I already bought an EX, so I guess I'm just looking for some justification and perhaps it would help others that are contemplating between the two subs. Thanks!

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=14745915#post14745915

I am going with the EX, buying it at the end of the week, and will report back with what I find. As a side note I have a very similar set up to laugsbach as I have 4x RTI4 and 1x CSI3 with a PSW10.

How would you describe the difference between the Plus and the EX? It seems identical in every way except for the size of the cabinet. The specs and the reviews I"ve read state that it goes lower and is louder, but is there any other differences (SQ, tonal balance, etc)? I already bought an EX, so I guess I'm just looking for some justification and perhaps it would help others that are contemplating between the two subs. Thanks!

I own the EX and have never heard the Plus, but don't get hung up on the differences. The EX is fantastic--that's all you need to know, and you'll find out soon enough. Congrats on the purchase (and I think you did the right thing going with the EX--do it right the first time).

The crown has been passed on to you my friend!

http://img185.imageshack.us/img185/4368/stedwardscrown.jpg (http://img185.imageshack.us/i/stedwardscrown.jpg/)

I guess you need to start interviewing who you are going to be passing it on to next year. ;) :D

Uneasy lies the head that wears a crown....:o

Well I pulled the trigger on the EX. I think my wife is going to flip when she sees it :o I can't believe I talked her into it. I'm really excited and a bit worried about her reaction. I can't wait to hear (and feel) what I'm missing! :D

Good choice BleedGreen...:)

You could always show her some of the very large subs from other ID companies...:D


How would you describe the difference between the Plus and the EX? It seems identical in every way except for the size of the cabinet. The specs and the reviews I"ve read state that it goes lower and is louder, but is there any other differences (SQ, tonal balance, etc)? I already bought an EX, so I guess I'm just looking for some justification and perhaps it would help others that are contemplating between the two subs. Thanks!

A single EX handles large bass scenes in movies much better than a single Plus sub. I really didn't listen to much music when I had only one Plus sub...

I am going with the EX, buying it at the end of the week, and will report back with what I find. As a side note I have a very similar set up to laugsbach as I have 4x RTI4 and 1x CSI3 with a PSW10.

Awesome SupaKats...:cool:

Please stop back with your thoughts and comments...

Uneasy lies the head that wears a crown....:o

Deny it to a king? Then happy low, lie down!.... :o

Deny it to a king? Then happy low, lie down!.... :o

Shakespeare and subs...:confused::confused:

Well, I guess King Henry IV was considered an Outlaw in some circles.:p:D

I own the EX and have never heard the Plus, but don't get hung up on the differences. The EX is fantastic--that's all you need to know, and you'll find out soon enough. Congrats on the purchase (and I think you did the right thing going with the EX--do it right the first time).

Thanks for the vote of confidence. Now my only worry is what my wife is going to think when she sees it.

Good choice BleedGreen...:)

You could always show her some of the very large subs from other ID companies...:D

Coming from the diminutive ESW-8, there's going to be a dramatic difference in size (and sound).


A single EX handles large bass scenes in movies much better than a single Plus sub. I really didn't listen to much music when I had only one Plus sub...

That's exactly the reason I got the EX. I don't want to look back and think about what I could've been missing. I'm excited to hear how it sounds with movies and music.

Order placed now it just needs to show up. :)

^^

Congrats SupaKats...

IIRC, it took four days to Cincinnati from California...

I just watched Ironman with the aid of my new LFM-1+. It was pretty awesome! I had the sub amp set at 3/10. I think that was a little higher than the rest of my system can match. What level do you guys run? Maybe I need the LFM Compact??

I just watched Ironman with the aid of my new LFM-1+. It was pretty awesome! I had the sub amp set at 3/10. I think that was a little higher than the rest of my system can match. What level do you guys run? Maybe I need the LFM Compact??

Have you done anything to calibrate your system?

Have you done anything to calibrate your system?

I have just set it up manually. I don't have my surround speakers yet - I have been waiting for monoprice to get speaker wire in stock to order. They keep advancing their ETA date...

I suppose I could plug in my old towers as surrounds, but the 2 wires I have are about 10 ft, I need 20+...

I just noticed that the sub vibrated itself enough that it rotated from the 12 o'clock position to about 10:30. It is on a hardwood floor. Is that normal or is that set too high?

Order placed now it just needs to show up. :)

Just showed up about 35-40 minutes ago. Got it out of the box and ran audessy on my receiver. Played Skdooooosh and a few clips from Cloverfield and it is freaking awesome so far. Got some pics I will post later and I still need to fine tune it but out of the box performance is such an amazing leap forward from my Polk that I can't stop smiling.

:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

Putting on the spikes

http://i981.photobucket.com/albums/ae299/SupaKats44/IMGP1141.jpg

Back

http://i981.photobucket.com/albums/ae299/SupaKats44/IMGP1142.jpg

Front

http://i981.photobucket.com/albums/ae299/SupaKats44/IMGP1144.jpg

Top

http://i981.photobucket.com/albums/ae299/SupaKats44/IMGP1147.jpg

Next to old Polk #1

http://i981.photobucket.com/albums/ae299/SupaKats44/IMGP1148.jpg

Next to old Polk #2

http://i981.photobucket.com/albums/ae299/SupaKats44/IMGP1149.jpg

In final (for now) position

http://i981.photobucket.com/albums/ae299/SupaKats44/IMGP1152.jpg

Not sure what about this specific unit makes it B-stock but there is not a blemish on it anywhere so I guess it was something mechanical or else they shipped me a brand new one for B-stock price.

Not sure what about this specific unit makes it B-stock but there is not a blemish on it anywhere so I guess it was something mechanical or else they shipped me a brand new one for B-stock price.

Mine looked great as well, except of course, for the amp being mounted upside down! Seriously, my B-stock sub works great, but I don't know how they let such an obvious QC issue slip by...!

Yep. Three out of my four LFM-1 plus's are B-stock units. All three look identical to the new one. Pretty cool.

Well I just ordered the LFM-1 EX after debating for the past week. The current sale of $519 plus free shipping put me over the edge. I was trying to decide between comparable subs from SVS, HSU, and ED. For the money this sub seemed like the best bang for the buck. I'm coming from an Onkyo HTIB sub so anything I bought in this range was going to be tons better. Can't wait to get it. Besides WOTW, what other movies would be good to demo this sub with?

Elitimus

Well I just ordered the LFM-1 EX after debating for the past week. The current sale of $519 plus free shipping put me over the edge. I was trying to decide between comparable subs from SVS, HSU, and ED. For the money this sub seemed like the best bang for the buck. I'm coming from an Onkyo HTIB sub so anything I bought in this range was going to be tons better. Can't wait to get it. Besides WOTW, what other movies would be good to demo this sub with?

Elitimus

Thats a great deal. I paid more for my B-stock.

woot!
can't pass this one up..second EX for me too.. :)
this is silly bang for buck!!

What have I done!? Just ordered my second EX. Mind you, my home is only 800 square feet. The wife is not going to be happy about this.

What have I done!? Just ordered my second EX. Mind you, my home is only 800 square feet. The wife is not going to be happy about this.

Im in the process of begging my wife for the 2nd.

I just ordered my EX. I can't wait to get it. Last time they were on sale I could not get one... it was around Christmastime and funds were low. This sale is even better than the last one, last time I would have had to pay $68 shipping. What a great deal, I'm pumped! I finally get to replace my existing sub. I have an older Sunfire True Subwoofer MK2 that the amplifier died on about a year ago. I've been using a single channel of my Rotel RB-985 MK1 amp to drive the sub. Even when the amp worked, the Sunfire had developed a rattle when pushed hard, so this was a much-needed item! :)

I already have one LFM-1C in my 30'x16' HT room and am considering a second sub given the current 20% off plus free shipping promotion. The LFM-1c does a pretty good job already despite the room size. And yes, I understand that it is but -2dB @ 25Hz which isn't an uber low frequency response.

Layout is a seating position 16' from the 65" Mits RPTV screen. Mains separated by 9.5' and 13.5' from seating position. Sub next to left main and also 13.5' from seating position. Side surrounds slightly behind but angled toward listening position with the right 6.5' and left 7.5' distant. Rears are 3.5' apart and 8.5' behind and directly centered on the seating position.

The proposed second LFM-1c would go next to the right main. Or........

Now I guess I could get an LFM-1EX instead of a second LFM-1c, but I'm not sure just how having two different size subs would work. Anyone have any experience using two different sized subs in the same system?

Anyone have any experience using two different sized subs in the same system?

laugsbach is your man:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=14745915#post14745915

:)

laugsbach is your man
:)

Holy crap! A pair of both LFM-1 EX and LFM-1 Plus. Yikes! And he has them positioned such that they are in balance.

What I'm asking about though is a single LFM-1c and a single LFM-1EX. No apparent balance there :(

Hi, I am in the process of getting another EX. And my question is. How would I go about setting up Audyssey? Do I turn both sub on? Or can someone point out where I can lookup for info. Thanks

What I'm asking about though is a single LFM-1c and a single LFM-1EX.

Take a look at Hsu's MBM-12 MK2 Mid-bass Module (http://www.hsuresearch.com/products/mbm-12mk2.html) page... you'll see that they recommend putting the MBM in the nearfield, even behind the listening position. You could place the EX in the current C position, if the sweet spot ends up being the same for both, and then move your C next to or behind the seating. It's a thought... and a "selling point", if you needed it. :D

VulcanSoulPatch,

(That's quite a handle :) ) Your post was exactly what I was looking for. And yes that Hsu set up using the EX in a corner and the compact behind the couch is quite doable. Thanks!

Well, I am glad I stopped by this thread today, as I did not know about the sale going on. I am in the midst of a sub hunt, and the LFM-1C is on my short list, along with the Hsu STF-2 and eD A2 or A3-250 (still don't know if I need the extra power & better driver the A3 has). I had put the eD at the top of the list due to the lower profile (the sub needs to go in a corner behind a recliner, and I there can't be any recliner-usage interference), but I have been liking the placement of the down port on the Outlaw, since that is more kid & cat friendly (and I wouldn't have to worry about port orientation). Now with the sale, it has become even more competitive, practicallly pushing the Hsu off the table, since from what I understand they could essentially be considered the same sub. I am just in a conundrum about all of this. :confused:

Had I the time or the spousal patience, I would just audition them all and see what I like best/what works best.

Any input would be greatly appreciated. Bob A, what were your other considerations at the time of your LFM-1C purchase? What factors made you choose the LFM-1C?

Also, what is the smoked Plexiglas inset like? I read about it in the FAQ, but haven't seen any good pictures showing how it actually looks (I just stumbled across this thread and went straight to the last page, so I haven't had the chance to skim through the whole thread yet). Can you actually see inside the sub? Does it scratch more easily than the rest of the cabinet?

One last thing, the manual mentions feet and carpet spikes and dimpled disks. Are the feet and spikes the same, or are the feet what you see in the front pictures of the Plus and EX on the Outlaw site? This will be going on laminate, and frankly I did not want to have to mess around with the dimpled disks.

On the other hand, I read on the Hsu Research forum that Dr. Hsu recommends placing a rug underneath their down-firing subs when on laminate/hardwood... I am guessing that would be applicable to all downfiring subs. Is rug usage a general consensus, or have some had a negative experience to that? I have some carpet samples laying around that would go with the room decor (real samples with a sewn on edge, BTW, not just leftovers), so setting the spikes on a carpet sample would be very doable.

As you can see, lots of questions... too many, I guess. Aside from some Sony bookshelf speakers I recently bought on clearance from RS for front heights, this will be my first real speaker purchase... ever. All other speakers I've had in the past were hand-me-downs, mostly from family, all of which I gladly accepted. ;)

Can someone recommend a good Y splitter for the sub?
Good quality and cost effective. Possible?
Thanks.

Can someone recommend a good Y splitter for the sub? Good quality and cost effective. Possible?

I am new to this thread, but you will find I am a broken record when it comes to Monoprice. Too bad it is out of stock right now, but if you can wait, here is what you are looking for: RCA Female to 2-RCA Male Digital Coaxial Splitter Adapter - 6 inches (http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=102&cp_id=10236&cs_id=1023603&p_id=6261&seq=1&format=2). If under $3 (not incl. s/h) is cost effective, than this should do the trick. :D Give them a call, maybe they can tell you when they expect them, or at least when they last had them (or use their chat, they may still be open at this time as it is not quite 6pm PDT).

Hope this helps.

Well, I am glad I stopped by this thread today, as I did not know about the sale going on.

Any input would be greatly appreciated. Bob A, what were your other considerations at the time of your LFM-1C purchase? What factors made you choose the LFM-1C?

Also, what is the smoked Plexiglas inset like? I read about it in the FAQ, but haven't seen any good pictures showing how it actually looks (I just stumbled across this thread and went straight to the last page, so I haven't had the chance to skim through the whole thread yet). Can you actually see inside the sub? Does it scratch more easily than the rest of the cabinet?

One last thing, the manual mentions feet and carpet spikes and dimpled disks. Are the feet and spikes the same, or are the feet what you see in the front pictures of the Plus and EX on the Outlaw site? This will be going on laminate, and frankly I did not want to have to mess around with the dimpled disks.

On the other hand, I read on the Hsu Research forum that Dr. Hsu recommends placing a rug underneath their down-firing subs when on laminate/hardwood... I am guessing that would be applicable to all downfiring subs. Is rug usage a general consensus, or have some had a negative experience to that? I have some carpet samples laying around that would go with the room decor (real samples with a sewn on edge, BTW, not just leftovers), so setting the spikes on a carpet sample would be very doable.


Let me see if I can return the favor. I bought my LFM-1c in December '07 with a great deal of input and discussion here in this very forum. I had no short list going in and "bang for the buck" was a significant consideration. I wasn't going to be dropping 4 figures on a sub. Ultimately the feedback about the Compact, the fact that it is basically a Hsu STF-2 design in much nicer trim, and the Outlaw sale / free shipping at the time sealed the deal. I have not regretted the buy one iota. This coming from someone who has a separate stereo system running biamped modified Magneplanar MGIIIA's augmented with a custom 18" subwoofer that does move one heck of a lot of air way down there :)

Only reason I'm looking now is because of the e-mail I received from Outlaw about their sale. I've been upgrading all the rest of my 7+1 system speakers, so I'm looking at things. I'm a sexagenarian and my youngest son (31) has flat out said I'd be nuts adding another sub given how well the current one works in the HT room now.

The black plexiglass has not been an issue at all. Looks extremely classy and now matches up perfectly with the Definitive Technology bipolar towers (non powered sub version) with their glossy black piano end cap finish, I just upgraded my mains to. It employs long conical plastic feet to give it decent height above the floor. And yes back then the metal dimpled foot discs for the points of the feet to sit in were not always being shipped with the sub. I, along with several others, asked and promptly received the missing discs.

As for carpet, my HT room is downstairs with padded carpet over concrete. The LFM-1c has been on the conical feet in the metal dimpled disks on this carpet from day one.

That said I do have a lot of experience with that 18 incher* which also is a bottom firing unit. When on a wooden floor, the unit, which is no lightweight by any stretch, would elevate and move around the floor a few inches during loud very deep passages when the cone excursion would come close to its maximum rating of almost 4 inches. Placing a carpet square under the subwoofer commode solved that. Something I highly recommend with any downward firing subwoofer!

[* The driver in my custom has a history but you'd need to be familiar with the limited theaters outfitted with special subs that generated huge subsonics for the 1974 movie Earthquake's Sensurround effects]

Hope something here is of use :)

Also, what is the smoked Plexiglas inset like? I read about it in the FAQ, but haven't seen any good pictures showing how it actually looks (I just stumbled across this thread and went straight to the last page, so I haven't had the chance to skim through the whole thread yet). Can you actually see inside the sub? Does it scratch more easily than the rest of the cabinet?

Go HERE (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=14750747#post14750747) to see some nice pics from laugsbach on the Plus and EX. If you could up your budget slightly, I would highly recommend you get the Plus instead of the Compact. If size and budget are a constraint, then the Compact is an excellent value and you'll be plenty happy with it. The Plus will give you a little more headroom, has variable tuning, and is capable of hitting lower down to 18 Hz.

I have an EX and it looks really nice, except is huge. You'll notice that there's quite a difference between the plus and the EX in those pics.

The black plexiglass has not been an issue at all. Looks extremely classy and now matches up perfectly with the Definitive Technology bipolar towers (non powered sub version) with their glossy black piano end cap finish, I just upgraded my mains to. It employs long conical plastic feet to give it decent height above the floor. [...] That said I do have a lot of experience with that 18 incher* which also is a bottom firing unit. When on a wooden floor, the unit, which is no lightweight by any stretch, would elevate and move around the floor a few inches during loud very deep passages when the cone excursion would come close to its maximum rating of almost 4 inches. Placing a carpet square under the subwoofer commode solved that. Something I highly recommend with any downward firing subwoofer!
Good to know. Like I mentioned before, the sub is most likely going to be in a corner, so aesthetics aside from size are not that big of an issue for me. My fronts are cherry, as is my entertainment center (it was sooo weird how the color of the circa 2006 EC matches the circa 1989 speakers... they almost look made for each other!), so if I could get a cherry sub, then I would put it more prominently in the room (I was drooling over the VTF-1 in Rosenut as that appears to be very close to the color, but I would never be able to attain the WAF for a $550 +tax sub). Who knows, if I am able to get this one, maybe I will nudge the EC et al down a few inches and try to squeak the 1c next to the recliner where it could double as a low end table (as there is nothing near it at this time to set a drink on). If I could fudge a little more $ on this, I bet putting a Subdude HD would make it look and sound absolutely awesome! I will put that on the wish list. :p For now, I am going to check out the carpet samples I have, and if there is none that truly works, there is a little carpet shop near my office that sells their old samples for a few bucks apiece ($3, IIRC).

If you could up your budget slightly, I would highly recommend you get the Plus instead of the Compact. If size and budget are a constraint, then the Compact is an excellent value and you'll be plenty happy with it.
I am stretching the budget with this as it is. This whole sub hunt started when I spotted an Energy ESW-8 at Costco for $100. But then I found out that my fronts have 2x9" woofers, not 7" like I thought. I realized that the 8" sub was just not going to do much for me, so I did a little research and found that my room was going to make the 8" sub do even less. Since this is most likely the only sub I will be buying for many a year (I could only *wish* to be as fortunate as laugsbach!), I want to do it right. But my wiggle room is very, very limited.

The size issue is another big factor. We have the space, but some of us don't agree with that. :p To put it in perspective: I have a passive custom sub that my father-in-law bought in 1995 (I believe it to be custom since there are no markings on the enclosure). My in-laws moved in 2003 and were not going to take the sub with them (it is a MONSTER!). I gladly took it off their hands, and upon getting it home placed it where I thought it should go. The rest is almost too sad to mention. I did not even get the chance to hook it up. It's sheer size failed the WAF and there was nothing I could do to overcome that. It was relegated to an unused corner in the office room where it sat until we moved, when I attempted to place it in my current family room. Failure again, w/o a chance to even unspool the speaker wire. So into the new office room it went, where it has remained to this day. The only reason it is still with us was for leverage: I was not about to give it up unless I could replace it with something that I could actually use. So, here we are.

I have not measured the driver of the custom (15" ?), but the enclosure is a cube close to 18" on a side, plus ~1" for the grill. The 1c is pushing it with regards to its depth (19"), but the width (13") is going to go a long way to shrinking the footprint. I just hope that the spikes don't make it appear overly tall (does the 16.75" include the spikes, or not?). The custom is a front-firing sub, so it sits on the ground which may make it falsely appear shorter. I don't think I want the two to be sat next to each other for comparison... that would just be asking for trouble.

If you know anyone who may be interested, I am going to be posting a giveaway on the custom here very soon, replete with pictures and measurements and all. Yes, I will be giving the monster away, to anyone who can meet me to take custody, or is willing to pay true shipping costs. I don't know enough about it to sell it, but I am sure some industrious individual could make use of it, or its parts.

I know that was more than you asked for, but now you know why there is just no possibility for a 12" in the near, or even distant, future. Any 12" small enough is going to be insanely priced (I'm thinking about those little sealed deals).

OK, two quick little things before I close up shop for the night. boarder1995 mentioned here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=15760559#post15760559) that he needed to "add the threaded on feet" to the sub as shown it picture 3, though pic 3 shows the carpet spikes already installed. :confused: Are there some other feet that are shipped, or available for these subs? That was what I was asking about earlier. I went back to Outlaw's site and noticed that the Plus sits on a white sheet in the photo, which obscures the fact that it is on the spikes and not any other kind of foot. Further confusing me was laugsbach's pictures of the Plus and EX side by side, but continued reading revealed that the "feet" in those pictures are actually the carpet tube that he reappropriated as cheap... er... inexpensive spacers. :D That was one thing I liked about the eD's... they have those metal spikes that screw apart and you can get a second set when you order which you can combine to make "hourglass" feet... those look way cool!

Next I wanted to thank NCDave for his post here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=15765830#post15765830) with some nice shots of the 1c, including its size relative to the shipping boxes (my wife would have a $#!+ fit if she came home and saw the outer box thinking the sub was the same size... thanks for the heads up!), and his comp shots to similarly sized subs. Though, I have to say, the 1c looks bigger than I imagined when looking at his shots... I guess it is all perspective. I don't know how wide his fronts are, but mine are 10", so that should shrink the appearance of the 1c.

Thanks again for all the info. Looking forward to getting this decision made. And if you made it to the bottom of this post (w/o falling asleep), congratulations! You are ready to read some of my longer ones in the Onkyo 607 thread. :D Wait, just did a preview... this is the longest. :o

VSP

Hey guys,

Well I went ahead and pulled the trigger on a lfm-1+.
As I am waiting, i have been second guessing my decision. Let me explain.........
I have been looking for a subwoofer to handle movies as well as music. Past couple of nights I have been just relaxing and listening to music, and i seem to prefer music without a subwoofer, by no means the fault of my current sub, but more to do with my receiver sounding A LOT better in pure direct mode (marantz 5003), strictly two-channel.
So with that being said, the question is, how does the PLUS handle movies?
Is the PLUS better at music than movies or vice versa?
Is the PLUS still better than the klipsch sub-10 (punch and depth)?
I know lots of questions, but hoping some of u can chime and help me out.

Thanks.....

To those who has two EX setup. Can you please share what Y splitter you are using. Thanks

reye, Mr. 4-sub (aka laugsbach) is your best bet to ask.

Aside from the one I linked above, everything else I come across is crap. I did find anIxos splitter on the Bay.uk for £13 (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/IXOS-Subwoofer-Y-Splitter-Lead-1-Female--2--Male-RCA_W0QQitemZ380154051339QQcmdZViewItemQQimsxZ20090831?IMSfp =TL090831166001r5493) which looks nice and beefy, but I didn't find anything this side o' the pond.

BTW, I had to call Monoprice re: a optical cable for my Dad and I asked about the one I linked to above... since it doesn't list an ETA, it could take 4 to 6 weeks to get back in stock. It could be sooner, so they recommended doing the "notify me" and they will send you an e-mail when it arrives. I did that before and snagged a Wii component cable for my nephew while it was still on sale before they ran out again. Not to pour salt, but they said they ran out of stock on 9/23.

You could always get something from RS for the meantime.

Edit: wait, wait, wait... here you go. I did a search on the IXOS part number, XHA215-Y1F, and lookee here: XHA215-Y1F Twisted-Pair Y Adapter at YBetInc.com (http://www.ybetinc.com/patchCable.php?x=11&imgName=ixos&showItems=showAll&offset=18&subNav=PatchCable)... they're in Las Vegas! They don't list a price, you have to contact them for more info. Don't know anything about them, but worth a shot!

To those who has two EX setup. Can you please share what Y splitter you are using. ThanksMonoprice was out of their y splitters so I purchased Outlaws Y splitter, which is really nice but not necessary , I didn't want to wait. If you can get a monoprice Y then go that route...cheaper price. ;)

VSP,

You mentioned your plan to place your sub in a corner. Here's mine nested in the left rear. Speakers (mains + center) are Definitive Technology. Not the best picture... just a quickie I just took with the American Le Mans Series racing in the rain on Speed channel on screen :)

http://rap.midco.net/bald1/HT_DefTech_Outlaw.jpg

I am about to pull the trigger on the LFM-1Compact. I have a HK 254 and was wondering how I should hook it up to the receiver. I want to order the cable so I can hook it up when it comes in.

Here is a link that shows the back of the receiver. Thanks
http://www.amazon.com/Harman-Kardon-7-1-Channel-Receiver-Repeater/dp/B0016BGRX6

I am about to pull the trigger on the LFM-1Compact. I have a HK 254 and was wondering how I should hook it up to the receiver. I want to order the cable so I can hook it up when it comes in.

Here is a link that shows the back of the receiver. Thanks
http://www.amazon.com/Harman-Kardon-7-1-Channel-Receiver-Repeater/dp/B0016BGRX6

Your AVR's pre-out subwoofer jack (bottom left rear of the unit) should be connected to the LFM-1c's sub in jack just below the crossover adjustment dial. Basically you're taking a pre-amplifier "out" signal to feed the BASH amplifier in the subwoofer. You'll use your receiver's setup functions to tailor the low frequency feed provided through that connection. Use a suitable quality RCA connection cable. This is how my LFM-1c is connected to my Onkyo TX-SR705:)

http://www.outlawaudio.com/images/compactbackmain.gif

Thanks Bob

You mentioned your plan to place your sub in a corner. Here's mine nested in the left rear.
Bob, my friend. Thank you for the picture, my friend. I love your decor, my friend. Remind me not to get on your bad side, my friend.

:D

Well, in your photo, the sub looks very inconspicuous... like, "Don't mind me, I'll be over here, just doin' my job." Of course, since it's counterpart on the right side of your set is just slightly larger, it may be relativity kicking in again. I can see how the plexi top of the 1c helps it blends with your fronts. Very nice!

One other thing, are the spikes metal or plastic? The manual states metal, but I thought I read someplace else in this thread they are plastic. :confused:

BTW, are you going to get the EX? Placing it in the corner where the 1c is will not look out of place at all (from the photo).

Now I guess I could get an LFM-1EX instead of a second LFM-1c, but I'm not sure just how having two different size subs would work. Anyone have any experience using two different sized subs in the same system?

Get the EX and don't even hesitate. At $519, it's a steal! I have a huge room similar to yours. My great room is 20x20x10, but it's actually open to a lot more space. A little less than half of the room is open to a foyer (that opens to the 2nd story), a surrounding walkway, and kitchen/breakfast area (30x15x10) and the EX can shake the entire first floor plus the balcony overlooking the foyer. It pressurizes the great room. You can feel it in your chest when it hits low and that's at -5 dB SW level and only -20 on AVR. I haven't heard the Compact, but the EX just seems really powerful.

Worst case scenario, the Compact doesn't mate with the EX. I don't think you'll really need it, because the EX will give you plenty of output on its own. You could always move the Compact to another room, give it to your son, or sell it. Looking at your picture, the EX will look fine in the corner. Keep in mind though, it's rather large. Much larger than I expected, but it's a nice looking sub nevertheless.

VSP,

Have no fears.... I'm an old sexagenarian retired warhorse ("mustang" naval officer and "zoomie" federal manager). That said I continue to enjoy handloading and shooting; been doing that for over 40 years :)

As for the LFM-1c spiked feet, they are plastic although the dimpled disks they sit in are metal.

Honestly I still haven't decided about a second sub. The prices are great with the sale but this past month I also upgraded my main and center speakers. Its more a question of whether I really need it as opposed to budget. Ran the 3rd scene from War of the Worlds (2005) tonight as a sanity check with the DVD set to 5+1 DTS and my AVR to 7+1 PLIIx Movie.... again my youngest son said I'm nuts thinking I need more bass than what I'm getting. :D We'll see.....

BleedGreen,

I hear ya! And that thinking is exactly what I'm playing with. Mmmmm......

As for size... no biggie. That custom (non-powered; I employ a Parasound power amp to drive it) 18" sub I run with my stereo is in a wood commode measuring 25"^3. (It's heavy weighing over 100 pounds. The woofer itself has a 3" voice coil driver with a 26 lb. magnet assembly! Maximum SPL at full input is over 128db @ 1 meter ) That's something I've been comparing the LFM-1c to as well. The big 18 incher only goes into the "thunder in your gut mode" IF there is low frequency content. The LFM-1c seems to slightly exaggerate things a bit possibly compensating for the limits of a 10" driver...dunno. Were I not comparing I would find absolutely nothing wrong with the Compact. And less there be any misunderstanding, I really like it and it works wonderfully in my HT system. It certainly shakes things up although the visceral punch in the gut is anemic (no doubt due to the large room size) and not even close to what the big 18 incher delivers.

Well, the thing that I have read about having two subs in the rooms is not just more volume, it's fullness. And with two different sized subs, I would think you'd be getting a better response across the entire bass range. Remember, you don't have to turn it all the way up so you can blow out your windows.

And, according to the Outlaws:
"In most circumstances two subwoofers will perform better than one. While you might assume this is for added SPL, the greatest benefit will actually be smoother bass response."

That was from p 8 of the 1c manual, but I think they push... er... state that in all manuals.

And this way, I can live vicariously through you. If I could attain the WAF, I'd do it! Actually, I would put an eD A3-250 between the back of the couch and the wall (because it would fit perfectly there: recliner sofa, big ol' gap) and then get a Hsu VTF-2 in Rosewood for the front... mebbe a VTF-3 Turbo! Hey, if I'm gonna dream, dream BIG! :D

Edit: Oh, and if you said you were going to go for two double-stacked MFW-15s, then I would tell you you've lost your flippin' mind!

Here it is in a nutshell :)


Does a 62 year old ____ (you fill in the blank) need to be kicked in the gut by a subwoofer when watching movies or is just being shaken good enough? Especially when if a gut punch fix is needed, there's a big bad woofer in a stereo system to do the deed. LOL

Bob A (SD), you don't need it. It's more of a want than a need. How much do you want that kick in the gut while watching movies? ;)

If you're happy with what you have, then there's no need to upgrade. Granted, it is hard to pass up such a good deal, especially considering you won't see this kind of sale all too often, but either way, you can feel good knowing that you got good quality bass in your sound system.

BleedGreen,

You've certainly nailed it.

We just turned the sub sideways so the back panel now faces the equipment rack. Seems to slightly improve the corner coupling. As an aside I have the sub now set to -6dB within the Onkyo TX-SR705 speaker setting group, Main speakers at full range, AVR crossover at 80Hz, LFM-1c crossover off, and have the LFM-1c volume set to around 9:30.

When the sub was positioned out further in the room just to the left of the left main speaker, the settings were higher which is no surprise as it now is coupled with the room corner adding efficiency.

Anything more in the way of volume setting in either the AVR or sub results in booming, distortion, or if pressed even more, doubling. This again I believe is a product of using this small 10 incher in a large 30' x 16' room. Regardless, where it is currently positioned and with the levels set gives deep powerful seamless bass integrated with the rest of the 7+1 system.

The major gains were I to add a LFM-1EX would be in lower reach plus significantly more room pressurization / gut punch. I continue to wrestle with whether that's something I really want to add at this stage in my life.

Mmmmm.... I just received a DVD "Kodo: One Earth Tour Special." It was recorded in 2003, released in 2004, and has no special soundtrack other than being marked by the double D Dolby by Sony Music Japan. The ACR does a decent job expanding things into 7+1 but having heard these huge drums before a bigger sub would definitely do a better job of gut kickin' than what I'm running now. Ouch this old swabbie is listing towards the EX :) LOL

Two days to decide!

How often are these sales? I just bought a relatively basic/entry level setup (Denon 1610, Polk CS2 center, Polk Monitor 60 fronts, Polk Monitor 30 rears), and I'm looking for a sub to replace an 8" Sony sub I've had for a while. I was looking into the Polk PSW10/PSW110/PSW125 for around $150+, then see that a person might as well spend an extra hundred for a PA-120 for $258 which would be way better than the Polk, then see that a person might as well spend an extra hundred on top of the PA-120 to get an Outlaw LFM-1c since it is significantly better, and then reading this thread it seems that a person should jump to a LFM-1+ for $100 over the LFM-1c, and of course that a person might as well spend an extra $100 over the LFM-1+ for a LFM-1EX. Obviously, it makes a person's head swim since I am now looking at $520 compared to the initial $150-ish. I'm not really in the market to buy a $500 sub, but I like value in my purchases, and it would be a lot easier to pass on the sale right now and save up if I knew that a similar sale would occur in the near future. My TV room isn't too big, maybe 14'x14', but it's a split level room that is connected to the main entry area which is pretty large and sometime in the distance future I may move things into that room. I have neighbors on the sides of our house (one about 10' away, the other about 20') who I don't really want to affect with my viewing/listening habits. I know I won't need much to make me happy, but I like to get good value out of my purchases.

OK, back to the primary question. How unique of a sale is this so I can decide my next course of action?

I don't know that they have a set time they go on sale but this is I think the third time I remember something like this in the past 12-18 months.

Scouring this thread after I first posted here, I noticed that the last time this sale occured (20% off all three LFMs) was back in February of this year. Don't know how long it lasted. This one is lasting one week.

It seems that other sub companies in the past have had sales from November thru December.

On another note, eD is debuting their "real wood finishes" on October 1st. If it wasn't for the LFM-1c meeting my needs, I would love to be able to wait 1 day to see exactly what they are going to offer and how much it will cost. After all, this will be my *only* sub purchase for at least 10 years.

BTW, Bob, what's that I hear?

"EX... EX... EX..."

Does anybody else hear that?

:D

And to reply to your earlier statement, your trying to decide if you should get the EX rather that if you could get it gives me hope that I too may have the same opportunity in my future.

Hence the leetle horns on my head. :rolleyes:

Edit: BTW, your not the only one I am have been prodding with my pitchfork... my Dad has only recently begun going HD, so I persuaded him to get an Onkyo TX-SR707 and am nudging him towards the Oppo BDP-83. I enjoy my Onkyo 607 and Panasonic BD35, but would have loved to have waited to get my hands on the 707 and Oppo's offering. Since I couldn't, I am doing what I can to get them in the family. :D

BTW, Bob, what's that I hear?

"EX... EX... EX..."

Does anybody else hear that?

:D

And to reply to your earlier statement, your trying to decide if you should get the EX rather that if you could get it gives me hope that I too may have the same opportunity in my future.

Hence the leetle horns on my head. :rolleyes:

Blast these seas are stormy. Just ran Chapters 3 & 4 from Master & Commander. The broadside canon fire was extremely satisfying with the room shaking and my feeling it :) The list to EX is gone yet again :D

Anyone see that Bret Favre commercial where he can't make up his mind about the big screen TV? Deja Vu! LOL



Edit: BTW, your not the only one I am have been prodding with my pitchfork... my Dad has only recently begun going HD, so I persuaded him to get an Onkyo TX-SR707 and am nudging him towards the Oppo BDP-83. I enjoy my Onkyo 607 and Panasonic BD35, but would have loved to have waited to get my hands on the 707 and Oppo's offering. Since I couldn't, I am doing what I can to get them in the family. :D

He can't go wrong here. I'm running the earlier Onkyo TX-SR705 and Oppo DV-680H and both have been extraordinary and reliable.

Yeah, the 707 was not a hard sell, as he is already an Onkyo fan (he is replacing a working Onkyo Integra TX-DS838), but just wanted the latest HD codecs and something to upscale his LD player.

As for the Oppo, I have the DV-970HD and use it more than the BD35 since a) I have many more DVDs than BDs, b) it loads DVDs waaay faster, & c) it can play ANY file I throw at it (e.g., downloaded TV shows), whereas the BD35 just sits there going "Huh?" I hear the BDP-83 loads BDs very quickly, which is one of my chief complaints with my BD35 (along with very delayed disc ejecting). Esp. on movies where they still force you to skip... er... sit through trailers. I thought we were past that stage. C'mon, studios, get with it!

As for the Oppo, I have the DV-970HD and use it more than the BD35 since a) I have many more DVDs than BDs, b) it loads DVDs waaay faster, & c) it can play ANY file I throw at it (e.g., downloaded TV shows), whereas the BD35 just sits there going "Huh?" I hear the BDP-83 loads BDs very quickly, which is one of my chief complaints with my BD35 (along with very delayed disc ejecting). Esp. on movies where they still force you to skip... er... sit through trailers. I thought we were past that stage. C'mon, studios, get with it!

My DV-680H allows me to hit Top Menu and skip all those trailers I'm not interested in. Doesn't the 970 do that too?

As for the Oppo 83, it sounds fantastic but I have no interest in Blu-Ray at this point. My 2004 Mitsubishi WS-65315 65" RPTV does 1080i and not 1080p which has been plenty good enough for me. HD from OTA and DishNetwork has been great too on this TV.

Still, the issue at hand is EX or not EX...... argh :(

reye, Mr. 4-sub (aka laugsbach) is your best bet to ask.

Aside from the one I linked above, everything else I come across is crap. I did find anIxos splitter on the Bay.uk for £13 (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/IXOS-Subwoofer-Y-Splitter-Lead-1-Female--2--Male-RCA_W0QQitemZ380154051339QQcmdZViewItemQQimsxZ20090831?IMSfp =TL090831166001r5493) which looks nice and beefy, but I didn't find anything this side o' the pond.

BTW, I had to call Monoprice re: a optical cable for my Dad and I asked about the one I linked to above... since it doesn't list an ETA, it could take 4 to 6 weeks to get back in stock. It could be sooner, so they recommended doing the "notify me" and they will send you an e-mail when it arrives. I did that before and snagged a Wii component cable for my nephew while it was still on sale before they ran out again. Not to pour salt, but they said they ran out of stock on 9/23.

You could always get something from RS for the meantime.

Edit: wait, wait, wait... here you go. I did a search on the IXOS part number, XHA215-Y1F, and lookee here: XHA215-Y1F Twisted-Pair Y Adapter at YBetInc.com (http://www.ybetinc.com/patchCable.php?x=11&imgName=ixos&showItems=showAll&offset=18&subNav=PatchCable)... they're in Las Vegas! They don't list a price, you have to contact them for more info. Don't know anything about them, but worth a shot!

Thanks for the trouble.

This weekend, I ordered the Plus, SMS-1 and Gramma, after having spent a considerable time listening to subwoofers and reading the threads in this forum.

I gotta laugh at those people that spend thousands on their HT equipment, only to stop short on cabling and try to get the absolute best bang for their buck. Over a year ago, I too drank the Kool-aid and mail ordered HDMI cables from Monoprice instead of buying the instantly available ones from a local retailer for more dinero.

It was no laughing matter when they arrived and revealed themselves to be as stiff as a wire coat hanger. I was told by a local service shop that didn't even have to look at my receiver that the torque produced by those cables probably overflexed the HDMI input board on my brand new Onkyo receiver. Unfortunately, I had to drive 100 miles each way to the closest authorized warranty repair to get the board replaced, at a time when gas was over $4 a gallon.

When I finally brought the receiver back home 400 miles later, I stopped at Best Buy to get their high buck cables -- you know which ones I'm talking about -- then put on Pink Floyd's One of These Days (I'm gonna cut you into little pieces) and attacked those cheap cables with my M1 metal snips.

The 28awg HDMI cables that I've gotten from monoprice have always been very flexible. Definitely moreso than the thick DVIgear "premium" $60 cable that I got for free in a raffle. Now if you bought the heavy gauge ones, I can see how they might be stiff to bend.

Don't know if this applies to the bigger models currently on sale, but the LFM-1c @ $319 shipped is actual $20 less than I paid in December 2007 for mine when it also was on sale.



I did it! Pulled the trigger on a LFM-1 EX :)
I'll corner load the EX and place the Compact in a nearfield position :) Woooo Whoooo

I don't know that they have a set time they go on sale but this is I think the third time I remember something like this in the past 12-18 months.

That's about what I remember.

I was told by a local service shop that didn't even have to look at my receiver that the torque produced by those cables probably overflexed the HDMI input board on my brand new Onkyo receiver. Unfortunately, I had to drive 100 miles each way to the closest authorized warranty repair to get the board replaced, at a time when gas was over $4 a gallon.

Ever stop to think that either your Onkyo receiver is cheaply made or that you didn't think about the stress applied by your cables when you wired them up? I have not had a bit of trouble from my cables. BTW, they don't apply torque, look up the definition.

To stay on subject, my LX is halfway here according to FedEx

Don't know if this applies to the bigger models currently on sale, but the LFM-1c @ $319 shipped is actual $20 less than I paid in December 2007 for mine when it also was on sale.



I did it! Pulled the trigger on a LFM-1 EX :)
I'll corner load the EX and place the Compact in a nearfield position :) Woooo Whoooo

I think you're in for a good time, Bob. Congrats. Keep us posted.

I've been limping along with a little 8" Velodyne sub that I bought from Costco when my Paradigm PS1000 died a few years ago. The subwoofer is by far the weak link in my existing setup (B&K Ref 50 pre/pro, Lexicon CX7 amp, B&W CDM NT mains/rear surrounds, B&W DS7 dipole side surrounds), and has been for some time.

After the PS1000 died, I got geared up to build a 12" DIY sub - I have the driver (an old Adire Shiva) and a 250W PartsExpress plate amp. But life got in the way and I haven't done the build. Now I'm ready to get back into it, but after reading up on the capabilities of the newer generation of value-priced high-performance subwoofers, I realize that things have come a really long way in a short time!

Well, after agonizing about this situation for several days, I just ordered an LFM-1 EX! I'm a little nervous about how this is going to sound in my room (13' W x 19' L with the rear wall open to a large eat-in kitchen) given that I've never heard any of these subs before. I'm hopeful that it is going to knock my socks off given the many positive reviews I've read from both amateurs and professionals but I'll hold off until mine is delivered and installed.

Anyway, I'm looking forward to joining the club of Outlaw sub owners here!

(and now what to do with this woofer and amp I've got sitting around???...)

My DV-680H allows me to hit Top Menu and skip all those trailers I'm not interested in. Doesn't the 970 do that too? It sure does. Well, for the most part. I have found that some DVDs still don't allow the player to go directly to the menu, but most do. The BD35, though... more likely than not, if there is a trailer, you have to skip through it. No bypass allowed. The worst part is not not having to skip through them, but waiting for them to load. Sometimes it takes as long if not longer than the menu! Fortunately, some BDs don't have any trailers on them, and load the menu quickly to boot ("King Kong" PJ ver, OTTOMH).

As for the Oppo 83, it sounds fantastic but I have no interest in Blu-Ray at this point. [...] HD from OTA and DishNetwork has been great too on this TV. I had Dish HD for about 15 months before getting the BD35, and OTA for 2 years prior. I only bought the BD35 since a) it had great reviews, b) it was on sale for $200 at Costco, c) Panasonic was offering 2 free BDs by mail, and most importantly d) my buddy gave me his extra 5 free from when he bought his Sony 300 the year before because he got doubled up by mistake. :cool: When I first ran a BD on my 34" 1080i Sony, I was pretty underwhelmed. I had already experienced greatness with Dish HD, and the long load got on me from the start.

BUT, at 11pm the night I set up my 607, I put my "V for Vendetta" BD in, listened to just the intro in DD, and then replayed it in TrueHD at a volume of 10 (I know, positive scale, can't tell you the -reference dB), and it became clear why I needed to go Blu for all future purchases. The sound was night and day.

So, Bob, here comes the pitchfork again!!! :rolleyes:

I did it! Pulled the trigger on a LFM-1 EX :) I'll corner load the EX and place the Compact in a nearfield position :) Woooo Whoooo <brushes hands> My work here is done.

:D

Congratulations. I am sure you will be filling us all in on your nearfield effect. Looking forward to the review.

I have not had a bit of trouble from my cables.
+1 (Aside from the stab at Onkyo AVRs... :mad: <grrrr>... ;))

I bought five 5' 24AWG 1.3a Cat 2 CL2 HDMIs for less than HALF what I would have paid on a comparable Mwah-ha-ha-onster cable. (Oh, in case you didn't know, that was them laughing to the bank.) And no stress here, either.

Not to say that I didn't have any of them cables in my old setup. I bought a few open box from BB, but that was years ago before the fog lifted. They have now all been relegated to the BR setup. (What?? I wasn't going to just throw them away!)

No Kool-Aid for me... I'm sippin' top shelf with what I saved. :D

I don't care that he took a stab at Onkyo. I've done so all over this forum. I now use a Pioneer SC-07.

My Plus hasn't shipped yet. Looks like I'll be getting the Gramma and SMS-1 before the subwoofer comes in. I guess I'll get to practice on the Paradigm it's replacing.

BUT, at 11pm the night I set up my 607, I put my "V for Vendetta" BD in, listened to just the intro in DD, and then replayed it in TrueHD at a volume of 10 (I know, positive scale, can't tell you the -reference dB), and it became clear why I needed to go Blu for all future purchases. The sound was night and day.

So, Bob, here comes the pitchfork again!!! :rolleyes:

Congratulations. I am sure you will be filling us all in on your nearfield effect. Looking forward to the review.

VSP,

I've heard TrueHD at our local brick n mortar pro sound shop. Nice but I'm still not sold on Blu-Ray. If the Oppo 63 comes down under $200 I'll pop. But until then.... :D
And absolutely I'll be reporting back once the twin subs are dialed in.



Jarrod,

I'm confident you'll be quite pleased.




lalakersfan34,

Thanks :D No doubts here!

Bob, if you need convincing on the video side to move to Blu-ray, rent yourself a copy of Visions of Italy. Even my mother was blown away.

Bob, if you need convincing on the video side to move to Blu-ray, rent yourself a copy of Visions of Italy. Even my mother was blown away.

I guess I'm simply a late adopter. You wouldn't believe how long it took me to get a CD deck for my stereo back when. And still, despite using a fantastic outboard Kusunoki style filterless DAC and great CD deck, I much prefer vinyl played with one of my Denon MC carts.

And if you looked closely at my systems in the pictures I posted a couple days ago, you'll see vintage equipment as well as formats many feel have long been eclipsed (obviously I don't.... e.g. vinyl and reel to reel high speed tape). Heck my HT theater equipment rack sports a VCR as well although admittedly the DVD player is used almost exclusively these days.

I teased about the Oppo 63 coming down in price, but the real issue for me is that my current TV is 1080i. To fully maximize the use of Blu-Ray DVDs and their 1080p/24 video data and TrueHD 7+1 Dolby audio, I'd need to upgrade both my TV (and AVR for that matter) to obtain the latest capabilities and codecs. Fat chance of that. Plus I'm convinced the dust isn't even close to settling with further refinements in the offing. I can wait :D

In the interim, new mains/center and a second sub work just fine !!!!

And if you looked closely at my systems in the pictures I posted a couple days ago, you'll see vintage equipment as well as formats many feel have long been eclipsed (obviously I don't.... e.g. vinyl and reel to reel high speed tape). Heck my HT theater equipment rack sports a VCR as well although admittedly the DVD player is used almost exclusively these days.

Oh, yeah... I see them now. I guess I was a little "distracted" before to notice. :o

As for late adopters, I know all about that. My Dad wouldn't get an answering machine until the mid '90s. :eek: "Sure, give me a ring. And if I'm not there... tough noogies, call back later." :p

It is very true that waiting will most always produce better offerings. I am sure Oppo's 2nd gen BD player will smash the 83, and will most likely be lower in price. After all, I bought the "budget" version of their DVD-up lineup (970HD) for $150 back in 2007, which was $100 less than it's predecessor, IIRC. Don't know if their BD players will hit $200, but it sure would be nice!

BTW, you have a 705 (http://www.onkyousa.com/model.cfm?m=TX-SR705&class=Receiver), right? I thought it does TrueHD/DTS-HD... :confused:


Edit:
In the interim, new mains/center and a second sub work just fine !!!!
Your right about that... as I saw in someone's sig a few months back:
"By a receiver for the features, buy the speakers for the sound."

The 705 does do DTS and quite well. Ah... just looked up TrueHD in the owners manual and surprise you're correct it's there as a processing feature. Ah well....

Hmmmm... another something new on Bob's horizon?
http://www.clicksmilies.com/s1106/teufel/devil-smiley-029.gif

Lighting fires wherever I go.

:D

Hmmmm... another something new on Bob's horizon?
http://www.clicksmilies.com/s1106/teufel/devil-smiley-029.gif

Lighting fires wherever I go.

:D

You're BAD! :D:D:D PM sent!

My LFM-1 EX is on a truck somewhere, scheduled to be delivered by the 5th. I spent yesterday night dusting off my test equipment and getting REW setup on my computer. All ready to go and as a bonus I was able to successfully improve the room response of my home office setup while learning how to use REW. I think my wife and kids are ready to evict me, though. The test sweeps are already getting on their nerves and they haven't even heard the big boy, yet :)

My LFM-1 EX is on a truck somewhere, scheduled to be delivered by the 5th.

Mine is en route as well although with an October 2nd scheduled delivery date. I still haven't gotten used to FedEx's new residential delivery schedule of Tuesdays through Saturdays :)

My LFM-1 EX is on a truck somewhere, scheduled to be delivered by the 5th. I spent yesterday night dusting off my test equipment and getting REW setup on my computer. All ready to go and as a bonus I was able to successfully improve the room response of my home office setup while learning how to use REW. I think my wife and kids are ready to evict me, though. The test sweeps are already getting on their nerves and they haven't even heard the big boy, yet :)


My purchase experience with Outlaw was a bit more complicated than other purchases I've made recently in which I needed delivery to my office instead of my home. After several missteps, most of them the fault of the credit card company, Jennifer finally completed the order yesterday.

Because I live in Southern California, my LFM-1 Plus will be delivered today. Unfortunately, the Gramma and the SMS-1 aren't due to be in until Friday at the earliest.

I have a webcam on the front of my house. I watched the FedEx guy walk up to the house then walk away. :( I just called FedEx and I get to pick it up at the depot at 6:30 PM. :) That was some SPEEDY service by Outlaw!

My co-worker who sits next to me here in the office has been giving me sh*t because he got his AV123 MFW-15 cheaper than I got the LX (he paid $485 shipped, I paid 519)

My co-worker who sits next to me here in the office has been giving me sh*t because he got his AV123 MFW-15 cheaper than I got the LX (he paid $485 shipped, I paid 519)

What's the big deal? He think his 15 inches trumps your 12? Both will do quite nicely in an appropriate room and dialed in correctly. The black glass top is classy on the Outlaw too :)


On another note Outlaw terms the use of two subs as "scattered." Given I'll be corner loading my EX and using my older Compact in a near field location I'm curious. Is there any other term besides "scattered" for this type of alignment? Scattered sounds so much like hair brained..... LOL

Hey Guys,

I am in the process of completing my HT setup, which is approx. 21x16x7.5 in an open (fully finished & carpeted) basement of roughly 21x46x7.5 (7000 cubic feet). I recently purchased Energy RC70s (front), RCLCR (center), RC50s (side surround), RC10s (back surround). My Receiver is HK AVR-630.

I guess for room that size I would need a pair of 12" or 15" subs. I am considering brands like ED, Hsu, SVS, Outlaw, Epik to name a few. I don't know much of this stuff so I am seeking your inputs. Can anyone make a recommendation given my setup.

My budget is approx. $1000 for the pair. Thanks!

Hey Guys,

I am in the process of completing my HT setup, which is approx. 21x16x7.5 in an open (fully finished & carpeted) basement of roughly 21x46x7.5 (7000 cubic feet). I recently purchased Energy RC70s (front), RCLCR (center), RC50s (side surround), RC10s (back surround). My Receiver is HK AVR-630.

I guess for room that size I would need a pair of 12" or 15" subs. I am considering brands like ED, Hsu, SVS, Outlaw, Epik to name a few. I don't know much of this stuff so I am seeking your inputs. Can anyone make a recommendation given my setup.

My budget is approx. $1000 for the pair. Thanks!

If you want to buy today you can get two of the LFM-1EX from Outlaw for 1038

If you want to buy today you can get two of the LFM-1EX from Outlaw for 1038

Yeah.. I know. Just wanna make sure if it would fit the bill though and how it compares to the rest of the brands listed in my post. :confused:

Mine is en route as well although with an October 2nd scheduled delivery date. I still haven't gotten used to FedEx's new residential delivery schedule of Tuesdays through Saturdays :)

Oh I forgot about that - and the 5th is a Monday darn it. It says estimated delivery by Oct 5. So I am REALLY hoping it comes on Saturday and not Tuesday....

Waiting is going to be tough. In the meantime I will read all 75 pages of this thread!

Does anybody know why the word R-E-W got highlighted in red in my previous post? I didn't do that. *Edit* now it is back to normal again - bugs in the new board software??

Yeah.. I know. Just wanna make sure if it would fit the bill though and how it compares to the rest of the brands listed in my post. :confused:

If I were you I would make up my mind to get the dual LFM-1 EX by end of business today - but I'm someone who just pulled the trigger on one of these yesterday :) The current sale ends today and based on the research I've done, dual EX's for $1038 shipped will without a doubt produce the most high quality low frequency output at your price point.

You didn't mention it, but dual MFM-15s from av123 would be another option ($1099) but you'll pay more after shipping.

I don't see a reason to go with Hsu over Outlaw unless you need the Turbo option, or one of the wood finishes. Without the Turbo option, the Hsu subs will perform similarly to the Outlaw subs, but you aren't going to get two of them for $1000. I also prefer the downfiring driver/port design of the Outlaw.

The 12" SVS subs in this price range are likely good subs. I've not personally heard anything except for their water-heater type subs (which are awesome, but fugly). I have heard people say that the Outlaw/HSU designs sound better for music, which swayed my decision toward Outlaw from SVS.

I didn't really consider Epik. Even though they are also having a sale, in my opinion they didn't offer the bang/$ of the Outlaw subs. But they do get great reviews, they do have some nice features (love the balanced inputs) and they do win in terms of enclosure size if that is a factor for you.

Don't know anything about ED.

The thing that struck me about the Outlaw subs is that even after looking long and hard I have not found a single negative performance-related comment, really about *any* of the Outlaw subs. That's a pretty high standard! That, combined with the value represented by this sale made it an easy choice for me. The hardest choice for me was whether to go for an EX or a plus. Since I don't have space to place two subs in our family room, I decided to go with the bigger one.

teligent

+1 on what Jarrod suggests. Best bang for the buck when you factor what they deliver sonically, the sales price, and free shipping. Keep in mind that Dr. Hsu designed the Outlaw subs which is a huge plus in my view. And as far as looks go, I personally find the semi-gloss black with plexiglass top elegant. No, they don't have exotic wood finish options, but their standard finish I just described is outstanding.

What to you guys think about which mode to set the EX in my proposed twin sub set up (EX corner loaded with Compact in near field next to listening position couch)?

I'm thinking bass extension with one port blocked vice max output with both ports open.

I just ordered the EX, and I feel dirty. Quite a jump from looking at a Polk PSW10 ($150ish) to a LFM-1 EX ($519). So dirty.

Well, I got my EX yesterday and I am loving it. A huge improvement over my previous HTIB sub. The sub was packaged very well, props to outlaw on that. I plugged it up as soon as I unboxed it and ran it using the Audyssey settings from my previous sub. Max extension mode at 3 on the volume would rattle my basement door. I then re-ran Audyssey and it trimmed the sub by -11. I decreased the volume to 2.5 and the trim was at -5. That was good with some room to play. I'm very pleased with my purchase. I will admit that although I love what Audyssey does with my speakers, it really seems to nerf a sub. Reference vs preference I guess. Any who bought this during the sale is getting a killer deal on a great sub.

Elitimus

Bob,

My instinct would be to put the EX in extension mode, locate it in a corner, and set the crossover to its lowest setting. Then put the compact closer to your listening location and set its crossover to its highest setting. Then I might even try setting the crossover point in your receiver/processor to something like 90-100Hz, assuming your electronics have this feature.

Have you got an SPL meter? Do you enjoy tinkering with setup? With two subs I would recommend trying to do some kind of analysis of how the subs interact with each other and the room to give you some idea about placement. Of course you can always just do what sounds good, too but I like to tinker :)

Congrats tfoltz, you dirty SOB! :D

Elitimus, you need to stop. I can't take the suspense of waiting for mine to be delivered! J/K - please keep coming back to share your impressions after you get more time with it.

Yup, I have the original RatShack analog SPL meter.

What you suggest is what I described my game plan as being. Was just curious if anyone thought I should be going for max SPL vice max depth in a 30' x 16' room with these two subs.

I'm also looking at a surge protector for the near field LFM-1c. I've got a power center I use for my HT equipment that's in a rack plus the TV and the sub that's co-located, so that stuff is covered/protected. Candidates currently are the Panamax Max 2 SUB and Monster SW-200.


Hey! Congrats to those for whom the FedEx team has visited with their Outlaw packages already. Pant...pant....

sad i just noticed the sale on the EX's tonight but i was wondering if it's on par with the Epik Sentinel or say the ED A5-350. i have the Sentinel which is a great sub but tinkering around with the idea of another sibling. 520 for the EX is nice but being that it's a 12", does it match up with the ED sub at all? i read the the Outlaw can go down to 15 or 16hz which is nice but can it do that without stuttering and keep it's power up? i'm thinking of the A5-350 but not sure how low that can go or if i should stick with something like the EX. the mfw i'm reading some mixed opinions on that recently.

My EX was dropped off today around 6PM.....the box is huge! Unpacked it, but not had a chance to hook it up yet, but I can tell everyone it is one sweet (and very large) looking subwoofer!

Not sure the wife is going to be thrilled with our new "table" when she gets back from her trip :rolleyes:

My PLUS was delivered yesterday.
Very nice packing job by outlaw and the finish is actually quite nice. Only got to play with new toy for a little bit. My situation is a bit unique; my father is also looking for a sub, so i figured i could test it out there and see how it does in his size room. Room is very large and open, which definiately needs a pair of subs. Gonna hold off on final impression till I test it out in my smaller room. In max output mode it held it own in the larger room, but when switching over to max extension mode it got kinda lost.
I know that placement and acoustics play a big role, but my question is:
Is there supposed to be that big of a drop in output between the two modes?

For those still on the fence or late arrivers, good news. Just got this e-mail from Outlaws:

"Due to the overwhelming response to our current promotion of 20% off and free shipping* on our
LFM series subwoofers and $100 off (plus free shipping) on the ECS-10 subwoofer, we are extending the offer for a few days. Our incredible prices on these remarkable products will be available until midnight Eastern time on Friday, October 2nd. Once this promo expires on Friday, these prices will absolutely not be available again this year."

Can anyone suggest an alternative to Outlaw's completely useless and stupid foot disks? I appreciate that they included the disks to protect wood or tile floors, but the design is just ridiculous. I tried moving the sub with the disks in place and the spikes either came out of the divot, or the foam rubber on the bottom just rolled up and peeled off. Awesome.

Anyone have a suggestion on an alternative?

I received my Plus yesterday, with a big slice in both the outer and inner packaging, despite having only traveled about 150 miles. Fortunately, the unit appears to be unscathed.

Is it possible to hear no audible difference between 0 and 180 phase, corroborated by the RS SPL meter? I wonder if the switch doesn't actually work.

Fortunately, the SMS-1 I ordered should be here before the weekend, where I will make a real attempt to tune the sub.

Can anyone suggest an alternative to Outlaw's completely useless and stupid foot disks? I appreciate that they included the disks to protect wood or tile floors, but the design is just ridiculous. I tried moving the sub with the disks in place and the spikes either came out of the divot, or the foam rubber on the bottom just rolled up and peeled off. Awesome.

Anyone have a suggestion on an alternative?

The design really isn't ridiculous when you realize they are NOT designed to slide. You are supposed to move the sub (big units take two people to pick up, re-position, and set down), then lift the corners and place the discs underneath the spiked feet.

But regarding replacements, here are some:

Audio Selections support discs (http://www.musicdirect.com/product/72951) @ $6.99 each

Audio Points brass support discs (http://www.musicdirect.com/product/72729) @ $9.99 each

Nope not cheap, but that's about the going rate for such items. You might simply want to contact Outlaws, admit you screwed yours up, and ask for replacements. You never know.... you might just get a set free.

The design really isn't ridiculous when you realize they are NOT designed to slide. You are supposed to move the sub (big units take two people), then lift the corners and place the discs underneath the spiked feet.

I wouldn't have a problem with it if the disks attached to the spikes somehow. I don't want to slide the sharp spikes on the tile floor, so that means having to have two people lift up the sub every time you want to move it 6 inches, then put all the disks back under there... It's a little silly. I realize it's not a problem once you get it all set up, and that it's a small problem, but it still annoyed me.

Maybe I'll peel off what's left of the foam rubber and re-sole them with cork...

jaball77,

It may seem "silly" to you, but that's how all spiked feet / support discs are designed. This is not exclusive to Outlaws. Sorry :(

I got mine fired up last night after a NIGHTMARE at FedEx (I HATE dealing with FedEx, but that's another story).

First impression, as everyone else has stated, the way they pack these up is remarkable. Wife immediately says "dang, it's big" (too bad I don't hear that more often LOL). Well, she's used to our Sunfire True Subwoofer, so yea compared to that the LX is big.

I agree with the spikes and discs comment. For me they are a pain as protecting the wood floor while placing this big heavy thing is not a lot of fun.

Right now it's a bit of a boomy mess. I am hoping to get the placement correct tonight, and then get busy with REW to smooth it out. Initial impression was that it isn't a marked improvement over the old Sunfire, but again I know it's not placed correctly at the moment.

I essentially have a 30x30 open room with some minor breaks in the kitchen area. I have all wood floors (1955 house) lifted off the concrete slab, so it reacts like a pier and beam floor.

Will moving it back to maximum extension smooth the boom out if it's still there after proper placement? I'm considering going back to that setting anyway because currently it's easily filling the room without effort.

jaball77,

It may seem "silly" to you, but that's how all spiked feet / support discs are designed. This is not exclusive to Outlaws. Sorry :(

Well, that's good to know... But it doesn't mean I have to like it! :)

I have to say other than that (and the rca input looking a little bashed in), I'm impressed with my LFM-1 Plus so far. I need to finish tuning it up tonight but first impressions were excellent. The finish looks great, and the plexiglass top is starting to grow on me. Sounds pretty nice too. :)