Hi

There are ongoing discussions about the merits of DIY in a High End system on a different thread and that drove me to start this one, since the discussions were, as is often the case in this AVS section, OT.. I am quick to add that I am making the distinction between Do It Yourself (DIY) and custom as being made by someone else with the requisite skills to pull it off. In other words if you hire the Alon guys or the Kharma guy to design your speakers it does not qualify as DIY in my discussion.

I became interested in DIY specifically for subwoofer, I have come to see that in this area DIY could be a better solution, In particular IB, Infinite Baffle subwoofers which can with the minimum amount of expenditure produce results that NO commercial subwoofers can match .. Example you want to have infrasonics..? Stick a TRW in a wall and have the back side vent (pun intended) outside and you have a sub that can drive your house down, literally... Stick, for example, 8 Aura 18 inch drivers in the same wall and you have a sub that would do, with a little EQ, do essentially flat output from 10 to 80 Hz at SPL well above 120 dB in the most palatial of rooms, while providing the best bass known to man ears at levels that will destroy your hearing if that is what you really wish… 8 Auras plus the requisite amplification and EQ would not be above >10K… There less expensive and on paper equally good 18-ich drivers for less than $500 per..
Computer power is benefiting both the DIY persons and the manufacturers in ways unimaginable 10 years ago… a DIY person can conduct simulations that would have necessitated above $20 K of computer power, now I would not be too far to say that a sub $500.oo PC complete with a flat screen and a printer could do the same plus a Open Source Software… I am seeing Microphones of instrumentation quality at less than $500 and with frequency responses that go as low as 1 Hz… Spectrum Analyzers for PCs are common place…. Meanwhile this allows the manufacturers to come with interesting design such as the XBL2 in subwoofers and other long elongation schemes…

If we were to leave full range speakers to the Adults and take the subwoofers to the DIY… I believe one can produce subwoofers that commercial can not touch and with much less money even considering the time, effort and research put in the project.. Asking for the collective inputs? What is the place of DIY in a High End system?

Well, I have to disagree with your distinction somewhat, for reasons that may seem pedantic at first. I don't think the proper distinction is between DIY and off-the-shelf, but rather between custom-built subs and off-the-shelf subs. The reason for this adjustment is to allow for the possibility of hiring someone else to build your so-called DIY sub. There are many of us, after all, who haven't the time, inclination, and/or skill to really do it ourselves.

When you put it that way, the TRW does in fact fall into this "pseudo-DIY" category. After all, you can't just buy one of his fans and stick it in your room; it has to be built into the room architecturally, just as one generally does with an IB. Mark Seaton's work, in which he combines product selection with careful room placement to boost bass response, is another example.

So Mark and Bruce are carving out a sort of DIY-like "custom bass installation" market. I wonder how large that market could be, and what kinds of price points you could hit. That is, what's the minimum $$$ one has to be willing to spend on subs in order to make it worthwhile to go custom? If I have enough money for, say, a pair of Velodyne Digital Drive 1812s, should I just go with those, or hire someone to custom build a superior solution?

Michael

I agree...

Looking at the title of the thread. I would define DIY as building from scratch from ground up using "off the shelf" parts (resistors, caps, drivers etc) which may include the use of known designs and or schematics. This may include include kits where the manufacturer gives you all the raw parts and you just got to assemble it. With that said I believe DIY can only reasonably done for:

subs
speakers (assuming you have access to good woodworking tools and the skill)
passive preamps
tube amps
cables
screens

I consider myself quite handy around electronics and the only thing I would not tackle would be a "high end" speaker because of the woodworking aspect.

I wouldn't even consider DIY for

Displays / Projectors
sources (Turntable, CD player, DVD player etc)
Video Processors
Pre/Pro
Class A or A/B Solid State Power amps

I know I'm usually not welcome in these parts. :p

I do DIY because I am a full-time college student getting my Bachelors of Science in Construction Management in 2009... and frankly, I have no cash (school is a sacrifice and investment) But I know, for a fact, that DIY and interacting with loudspeaker gurus who have decades of loudspeaker design under their belt that can guide me through speaker design, I can achieve a relatively high level of audio quality with a little labor and little cost. Although the speaker itself may not be as beautifully crafted as a pair of $10k+ super-speakers, be as highly sensitive, or even sound better. If I can reach 80% of the sound quality but spending only $1k, regardless of how the speaker looks, I have already won with DIY in the respect of audio quality... and my smaller wallet.

Now subwoofers are a whole different story with DIY. Ultimate performance can be achieved for much less than the most popular subwoofer here. The only way you begin to win in commercial offerings is when the volume of the enclosure begins to be limited but low extension and high SPL's are required.When this occurs the computer engineers in commercial sub companies are already building the super high-powered amplifiers and pumping in massive equalization to correct the signal. With such low sensitivity and limits on size, how much displacement can you expect to get with one or maybe two drivers? Of course the TRW addresses these issues by creating very high displacement at very high cost.

Although whatever DIY subwoofer that is made can also be matched by a high-dollar subwoofer or array of high-dollar subwoofers, the DIY subs can really, really, really stretch out your dollar.

With respect to subs, Frantz, Nousaine is firmly in your camp. Or you in his.