http://www.audioholics.com/news/editorials/10-more-reasons-hd-dvd-failed

This was front page news a few days ago on avsforum.

It looks like the Blu Ray and HD-DVD might fail, reading this article.

If Sony is reading this. All I can say is I hope you make the PC blu Ray affordable soon enough for dell to put it inside every pc they sell.

I know the blue diod problem is solved, and mass producing them lowers cost.
So why not follow my advice.

This forum is full of HD -DVD users so I thought posting this here would be a good idea.

or the fact that newer movies...umm...aren't that good.

what motivates me to upgrade my receiver and buy a DVI or HDMI input board for my plasma so i can watch alien resurrection in HD?

the answer is nothing.

out of the matrix, lotr, and star wars, how many are available? one of three, and the one not on both formats.

hollywood's downfall is they will freely admit that they don't strive to make classic films anymore. they think their talent is in marketing, to get people to pay for garbage. and they've used HD formats as just another marketing tool for the current crop of bad movies they produce.

i have an external raid enclosure with about 150 movies that i consider 'must own', which have all been recorded from HDTV broadcasts. last time i checked, if i were willing to go spend about 1500 bucks for an HDMI panel for my panasonic plasma, an HDMI capable receiver, and a toshiba HD-DVD player, i could get about 15-20 percent of those movies i've got broadcast recordings of on HD-DVD. if i bought blu ray for more money, i could get less of them than that.

the bigger problem for hollywood and DVDs is "how many movies have they produced in the past couple years that are better than Entourage, Deadwood, and The Sopranos".

or the fact that newer movies...umm...aren't that good. (...) hollywood's downfall is they will freely admit that they don't strive to make classic films anymore. they think their talent is in marketing, to get people to pay for garbage.Couldn't have said it better. The last two classic films Hollywood produced, IMHO, were Forrest Gump and Shawshank Redemption. I struggle to come up with classic films made in the last 20 years.

The facts are that many more movies are being made than, say, 30 years ago. Yet, what is the percentage of movies made in the last 20 or 30 years that people *want* to buy yet again in a new format? For me, not many. I'd rather get another version of The Godfather than ever see crap like The Gardian. Instead of striving to create something original or well done, it's flashy crap that's marketed to death again and again. The 1st weekend box-office & DVD sales are the only thing that matters.

But the industry will never examine itself and determine the problem being with the content, but rather the people who choose to ignore that content. Consequently, we hear retarded stuff like "Piracy is killing Hollywood." Oooooooooook, there. :rolleyes:

Congratulations OP you won the coveted Lamest thread of 2007 posted

First, this post is in the wrong forum.

Also, when DVD came out, within the first year, there wasn't a lot of good titles, matter of fact I think it took two years or so. Sony and Toshiba (BDA and DVD forum) will not let these formats die, they will take hold and one of them will be the winner. If there is no replacement product then either if these formats will win and that's that..

Not everybody owns an HDTV.. My cousin and my father, for example, are both avid TV fans and they have spent a ton of money on equipment, neither of them have stated they are going to upgrade for a while.

Just food for thought.

Give it time. When (if?) the format war is over, and the players come down to $199 or less at Walmart, you'll start seeing the trickle of HD releases turn into a flood. DVDs did start off slowly, and they didn't have a format issue to contend with. Once it all settles, it's golden days for the studios as they get to sell you every movie they already sold you previously on DVD! They won't drag it out, it'll go like gangbusters. Another factor, over the next two years HDTV will continue to make good progress replacing standard def TVs--that part is already turning from a trickle into a flood.

I agree, this is a pretty lame thread. Anyone dummy can post an editorial on the web. I support both formats; and, don't consider it a war anymore. I just bought a PC with a hybrid drive. It's inevitable that the prices will come down considerably this year. Prices have already started to drop.

Jeremy, give it up buddy.

Do what you do best, ffdshow tutorials etc. Many people appreciate your accomplishments there.

Not that I know much, but the one point made that might turn out to be true was competition from different on demand services. It is not in place yet but could be by the time the format war is over. If I was able to get a HD signal for $5-6 for a movie I want to see instead of having to spend $200 for a player and then $25 for the movie disk it would be an easy choice for me and probably a lot of other normal users.

Dead? Of course not. It's just slow growth because the prices are high, and most people (even HDTV owners) don't actually care enough about better quality.

With HDDVD boxes at $250 and falling (and PC drives at $130 with PDVD), it won't be long before they start replacing DVD players entirely. Bluray is a bit more expensive because it's more complex to make, but that gap will narrow. As they get cheaper more people will replace their DVD players, especially at Christmas. In a few months they'll be <$200, and that really is mass-market. It's also the pricepoint in that article for critical takeoff, yet we'lre almost there already - he's talking as if prices were still $400 per player.

Give it 3 years, with dualformat players at $100, and not only will the format war be over, but they'll kill sales of DVD players too. That endgame is pretty much inevitable to my mind - cost will dictate.

Why do you want to buy the same movie twice. I do not buy them on the thought that the movie was twice as good based on color fidelity. Or, that it's better because its on a HD format.

Properly scaled SD movies look great to me.

MAK

No need to buy the same movie twice, but there's tons of new movies, or ones I've never bought.

Even the best scaled SD can't compare to HD on a large 1080p screen though. It's a whole different ball game - DVD simply doesn't have enough source detail on the disc to be stretched that far.

Not that I know much, but the one point made that might turn out to be true was competition from different on demand services. It is not in place yet but could be by the time the format war is over. If I was able to get a HD signal for $5-6 for a movie I want to see instead of having to spend $200 for a player and then $25 for the movie disk it would be an easy choice for me and probably a lot of other normal users.

Well, I prefer to have the media in case I wanna watch it again.

As of prices, "almost" all HD-DVDs can be bought from Amazon for $19.95 shipped.
HP HD DVD drive is available from Frys for $129 after $50 rebate already.

And I agree with artsfer, even the best scaled SD DVD pales in comparison to HD DVD on 1080p large display. If you happened to own both, you'll never be watching SD again.

The whole 'all movies suck these days' argument is really not very accurate. There are as many good movies now as there ever have been, and the bulk of movies in the past were mediocre just as they are today. We just forget the crappy ones as time goes by and only remember the good ones and somehow start thinking that they were all that good back then. If you don't get off the couch and actively search out the good stuff, then of course you'll end up seeing the stuff intended for the biggest mass market.

As to the HD formats, there seem to be more political/self-interest positions involved int his argument than one can count, including a lot of people who just want to see them fail because they represent a step forward in copy protection. I don't see the companies behind these formats letting them fail. They probably knew that these formats were not going to catch on as quickly as DVD, because DVD was replacing a hugely inferior product, and it still took a while for it to catch on. I remember telling my relatives and friends about DVD years before most of them got on board. My parents only did because I bought them players.

The whole 'all movies suck these days' argument is really not very accurate. There are as many good movies now as there ever have been, and the bulk of movies in the past were mediocre just as they are today. We just forget the crappy ones as time goes by and only remember the good ones and somehow start thinking that they were all that good back then. If you don't get off the couch and actively search out the good stuff, then of course you'll end up seeing the stuff intended for the biggest mass market.



it does make sense when you consider there is more to watch than movies. we don't just have 3 OTA channels and the theater to choose from anymore.

like i said, the stuff HBO produces blows away most big studio movies, and in recent years, the stuff TNT produces has done the same (good example: TNT's frankenstein with Randy Quaid was better than the DeNiro/Branaugh frankenstein remake).

i even thought that the CBS take on Donnie Brasco was at times better than the Pacino movie.

unbeknownst to the major studios but obvious to everyone else, they aren't just competing with themselves anymore.

Well, I prefer to have the media in case I wanna watch it again.

As of prices, "almost" all HD-DVDs can be bought from Amazon for $19.95 shipped.
HP HD DVD drive is available from Frys for $129 after $50 rebate already.

And I agree with artsfer, even the best scaled SD DVD pales in comparison to HD DVD on 1080p large display. If you happened to own both, you'll never be watching SD again.

I can see why it would be nice to own the original but you would have to watch it 4 times to break even on the cost of the disk and that does not even count the cost of the HD DVD or Blueray player. I'm also talking about the normal user, that would not have a large DVD library and rents most of their DVDs and would not have a large 1080p display to watch. For HD DVD or Blueray to win, this is the segment that it has to convert since it would easily be over 90% of the people in the market. When on demand services get better and have HD content I think that would be a very nice option for most people, not all, but most.

I can see why it would be nice to own the original but you would have to watch it 4 times to break even on the cost of the disk and that does not even count the cost of the HD DVD or Blueray player. I'm also talking about the normal user, that would not have a large DVD library and rents most of their DVDs and would not have a large 1080p display to watch. For HD DVD or Blueray to win, this is the segment that it has to convert since it would easily be over 90% of the people in the market. When on demand services get better and have HD content I think that would be a very nice option for most people, not all, but most.

But I only buy HD DVDs I am sure I'll be watching again.

I watched "Phantom Of The Opera" no less than 15 times.

I wached "King Kong", "Dune" and "Waterworld" no less than 5 times.

I also extensively use my HD DVDs for testing.

I learned that "V for Vendetta" cannot be played with any PDVD older than 7.x.

I learned that original "Matrix" HD DVD uses the "old" processing key, but two other "Matrix" movies use the "new" processing key.

It is lot of fun btw :D

Congratulations OP you won the coveted Lamest thread of 2007 posted

+1

Posting an op ed piece from audioholics in a AVS forum is lame?

My guess would be those who say it is lame to post it simply do not agree with the op ed piece.

Shooting the messanger rather than countering the message is what is actually lame.

But I only buy HD DVDs I am sure I'll be watching again.

I watched "Phantom Of The Opera" no less than 15 times.

I wached "King Kong", "Dune" and "Waterworld" no less than 5 times.

I also extensively use my HD DVDs for testing.

I learned that "V for Vendetta" cannot be played with any PDVD older than 7.x.

I learned that original "Matrix" HD DVD uses the "old" processing key, but two other "Matrix" movies use the "new" processing key.

It is lot of fun btw :D

I agree with you and think it would be a lot of fun. My parents and the thousands of people like them though do not have the same idea of fun and these are the people that are going to have to be won over for either format to be a big sucsess. If the technology is in place in time, I can see it being a real threat to Blueray or HD DVD and prevent it from having the sucsess that DVD has had. One of them will still be around but more of a niche product than a mainstream one like DVD. This has a lot of ifs, but I can see the point made in the article and could see if happening.

I don't understand why this is on the HTPC forum when we already have perfectly good forums for "HDTV Software Media", "Blu-ray Players", "HD DVD Players", and "Dual Format Players." Surely the people who are interested in those topics will benefit from having this great discussion there. I feel really sorry for them that they don't know to come all the way over to the HTPC forum to talk about this.

*SADDENZ*

the title of the article is wrong. it should say HD discs formats, not HD-DVD formats which is the name of one of the 2 HD formats.

since they can't even get that right, i won't even bother with the rest of the article. judging from the fact that blockbuster's experimental period led to one of the two formats being implemented in 1500 stores nationwide, i don't see the hi-def disc failing. while the fact they chose blu-ray is bad news for hd-dvd supporters, it is a huge step for viability of the hi-def formats in general.