apparently, I bumped my gain on my 3.3 with turbo when changing placements. If I have my speakers calibrated to 85 at MV 0, what db should the sub be set at? HOw hot is too hot to run a sub?

http://av123forum.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=3418 See Steps 4 and 6.

Ian

http://av123forum.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=3418 Repeat Step 4 and 6.

Ian


thanks, but I am more confused...

If I calibrate mains to 75, I should be at MV -10? The sub should be at 73, and at 75 it would be 2 hot?

thanks, but I am more confused...

If I calibrate mains to 75, I should be at MV -10? The sub should be at 73, and at 75 it would be 2 hot?85 @ 0 or 75 @ -10 are just reference points and are the same reference scale...just easier to listen to pink noise at 75dbs. Yes, if you calibrate to 72-73 you should be at a level match with your other speakers...75 would be 2-3db hot. I've had no problem running mine at 77-78 for some material, though with 2 subs I've changed to below my speakers with better results.

thanks, but I am more confused...

If I calibrate mains to 75, I should be at MV -10? The sub should be at 73, and at 75 it would be 2 hot?

No. Your reference level is at 75db for your mains and your sub should be close to that. Many people run their subs 3 to 5db hot, others rather keep it flat.


Ian

85 @ 0 or 75 @ -10 are just reference points and are the same reference scale...just easier to listen to pink noise at 75dbs. Yes, if you calibrate to 72-73 you should be at a level match with your other speakers...75 would be 2-3db hot. I've had no problem running mine at 77-78 for some material, though with 2 subs I've changed to below my speakers with better results.


thanks, I will give it a shot, still seems very quiet. HSU tech said I was running my sub too hot.

Ok, I set mv to 0, calibrated all speakers to 85, and the subwoofer to 82. It was extremely quiet. I even put the sub to 87-88 db and it was still much quiter than I had before. Now the gain is at 9:00, sub trim from -6 (82 db) to -2 )87-88 db). I can't belive the gain is so low, the trim is so low and the output is so low.

I previously had gain at 11:00, trim to -1 and it rocked. Only straining on a few scenes in certain movies. I kept it at -3 for the majority of the time. This is how Brad and I set it up, and it rocked. In nearfield or farfield.

What is going on?

Either your ears are trained to extremely hot LFE or there's something wrong. Personally, I want the bass to be there when it's called for, but balanced with the mains, not dominant, for everything else. It could be your ears or the sub. Since you've had problems with the turbo, maybe it's the sub.

It's easier to tell with music and very easy to go too hot for HT. If you get used to the kick, even if it's not as clean, your memory tells you it's not enough. Get used to clean bass and you'll start to turn your sub down.

If you get used to the kick, even if it's not as clean, your memory tells you it's not enough. Get used to clean bass and you'll start to turn your sub down. And it's also true if it is clean bass, where you keep digging for more because it's just so cool. I'm an unrepentant basshead, and am just recently discovering the truth to what Ron means by that.

Tim

It's easier to tell with music and very easy to go too hot for HT. If you get used to the kick, even if it's not as clean, your memory tells you it's not enough. Get used to clean bass and you'll start to turn your sub down.



And it's also true if it is clean bass, where you keep digging for more because it's just so cool. I'm an unrepentant basshead, and am just recently discovering the truth to what Ron means by that.

Tim


Good subs are very clean and linear. In other words they are accurate. If calibrated properly they will reproduce good healthy bass the way it was intended. They don't' manufacture the sound or in audio terms, color it.

Ian ;)

Guys, I am extremely lost in all this db crap.
Equipment:
Onkoyo 804
Sonance in wall .5 lcr 7.1 setup
HSU 3.3 with turbo

Sub is in nearfield now.

If master volume is set to zero:

mains and sub should be at 85? Is this right?
I hear someone tlaking about 82 or some stuff.

At this level, -10 is very loud

What about calibrating to 75 db, what am I losing? Where should the sub be set to in db?

Gain is at 9:00, and if all are 85 or 75, is that still considered running hot?


Please help.

Guys, I am extremely lost in all this db crap.
Equipment:
Onkoyo 804
Sonance in wall .5 lcr 7.1 setup
HSU 3.3 with turbo

Sub is in nearfield now.

If master volume is set to zero:

mains and sub should be at 85? Is this right?
I hear someone tlaking about 82 or some stuff.

At this level, -10 is very loud

What about calibrating to 75 db, what am I losing? Where should the sub be set to in db?

Gain is at 9:00, and if all are 85 or 75, is that still considered running hot?


Please help.
I'll give it a shot...

75db is considered reference level. 85db if your using Avia to set-up.

Run your receivers test tones for each individual speaker. Set your front left speaker at 0 (receivers gain for this channel). Now turn up the master volume until your SPL meter (weighting c, response slow)reads 75db. Once achieved, that is your reference level and you should no longer adjust the master volume.

Then go through each of your other speakers and adjust your receivers gain for that channel until you get 75db.

For the sub, due to correction factors, set the db's at 72-73. Some people like to run their subs "hot" a few db's. In which case you could adjust your sub to 76-77db which of course would mean your running 4db's hot.

Run your receivers test tones for each individual speaker. Set your front left speaker at 0 (receivers gain for this channel). Now turn up the master volume until your SPL meter (weighting c, response slow)reads 75db. Once achieved, that is your reference level and you should no longer adjust the master volume.

Exactly. The master volume setting necessary to achieve "reference level" can vary widely from room to room, situation to situation.

Don't try to force the receiver's master volume setting of "0" to be your reference volume, ccarzoo. Your master volume setting necessary to achieve "reference level" may be well below "0".

Do exactly what gvg45 says.

What about calibrating to 75 db, what am I losing?
It doesn't matter. The whole point is to make every speaker have identical output at any particular master volume setting.

Guys, I am extremely lost in all this db crap.
Equipment:
Onkoyo 804
Sonance in wall .5 lcr 7.1 setup
HSU 3.3 with turbo

Sub is in nearfield now.

If master volume is set to zero:

mains and sub should be at 85? Is this right?
I hear someone tlaking about 82 or some stuff.

At this level, -10 is very loud

What about calibrating to 75 db, what am I losing? Where should the sub be set to in db?

Gain is at 9:00, and if all are 85 or 75, is that still considered running hot?


Please help.



DVD have a maximum 0 dB fs (Full Scale) of signal recorded on them, and this will give you 105 dB spl output for each speaker to meet the Dolby calibration spec. So, 0 dB fs = 105 dB spl.

Some test disks use a -20 dB fs test signal (0 dB fs - 20 dB fs = -20 dB), and this will give you 85 dB spl output (105 dB spl - 20 dB = 85 dB spl).

Some test disks use a -30 dB fs test signal (0 dB fs - 30 dB fs = -30 dB), and this will give you 75 dB spl output (105 dB spl - 30 dB = 75 dB spl).

The receivers built in test tones use -30 dB fs tones, so 75 dB spl is the speaker number.


Now, some receivers allow you to calibrate the master volume control to 0 dB (neither fs not spl, just dB). Then you know that 0 dB = Dolby Reference Level for the master volume control for DVD playback.

Some receivers do not allow you to calibrate the master volume to 0 dB for Reference Level output, so you just have to note the number on the master volume. On my receiver, -22 dB = Reference Level on the master volume control.

Other receivers use full scale (say 0 to 60), and you have to note that number to determine the reference level output level setting on the master volume control.


So you calibrate the speakers to 75 or 85 dB, depending on the test tones. Then note the master volume setting or calibrate it to 0 dB. This master volume setting = Reference Level output levels (AKA maximum system PEAKS up to 120 dB spl).


Reference Level = loud, so use the volume control!

DVD have a maximum 0 dB fs (Full Scale) of signal recorded on them, and this will give you 105 dB spl output for each speaker to meet the Dolby calibration spec. So, 0 dB fs = 105 dB spl.

Some test disks use a -20 dB fs test signal (0 dB fs - 20 dB fs = -20 dB), and this will give you 85 dB spl output (105 dB spl - 20 dB = 85 dB spl).

Some test disks use a -30 dB fs test signal (0 dB fs - 30 dB fs = -30 dB), and this will give you 75 dB spl output (105 dB spl - 30 dB = 75 dB spl).

The receivers built in test tones use -30 dB fs tones, so 75 dB spl is the speaker number.


Now, some receivers allow you to calibrate the master volume control to 0 dB (neither fs not spl, just dB). Then you know that 0 dB = Dolby Reference Level for the master volume control for DVD playback.

Some receivers do not allow you to calibrate the master volume to 0 dB for Reference Level output, so you just have to note the number on the master volume. On my receiver, -22 dB = Reference Level on the master volume control.

Other receivers use full scale (say 0 to 60), and you have to note that number to determine the reference level output level setting on the master volume control.


So you calibrate the speakers to 75 or 85 dB, depending on the test tones. Then note the master volume setting or calibrate it to 0 dB. This master volume setting = Reference Level output levels (AKA maximum system PEAKS up to 120 dB spl).


Reference Level = loud, so use the volume control!
Come on, Cass. You're just going to confuse him with all that mumbo-jumbo. :rolleyes:

Don't try to force the receiver's master volume setting of "0" to be your reference volume, ccarzoo. Your master volume setting necessary to achieve "reference level" may be well below "0".




That totally depends on the receiver in question.

THX units are specified to have a calibrated master volume control (AKA 0 dB = Reference Level).

My receiver has the preamp type of output scale (AKA 0dB = all the way up). At the calibration level, -22 dB is the Reference Level master volume setting.

As usual, always read the instruction manual first!

Come on, Cass. You're just going to confuse him with all that mumbo-jumbo. :rolleyes:


He is already confused. Either he will understand, or he will have to think about it and then learn.

Anyhow, he should read the instruction manual.

He is already confused. Either he will understand, or he will have to think about it and then learn.

Anyhow, he should read the instruction manual.
So you never needed help with anything? :rolleyes:

I have read my Onkyo manual from front to back.
I have calibrated all my speakers to 75 db.
Left was -1
all others were at zero.
sub to 72
it sounds very clean, lean but clean.
some portions of dvds seem to spike the woofer into a bit of distortion, even after calibration.
sub trim is at -10, gain at 9:00 on 3.3 with turbo

i just don't get what my master volume is at for reference level

i just don't get what my master volume is at for reference level
Reference level is when each speaker is outputting 75db's with your receivers test tones. So when you calibrated all your speakers with gain of 0 and left front at -1, whatever your master volume was at is your reference level.

A further note, if someone tells you that they are playing a DVD at "reference level", that means they have the master volume control set at the number on the volume control that produces the 75 dB speaker calibration tones.


To put this in context, you have potential of a PEAK SPL reading of up to 120 dB if you playback a DVD with this master volume setting.


Most people listen to a DVD with the master volume control level set to around -10 dB from calibrated reference level. This varies DVD to DVD, but if I say that I am playing War of the Worlds back at -10 dB from reference level, you will have a good idea on how loud that is if you use the same calibrated setting on your system.

Everyone understands the equal speaker level calibration test. A lot of people don't calibrate the master volume number that will produce "reference level" volume. A lot of people also do not understand that the 0 dB number on their volume display is meaningless unless it is calibrated to reference level in some manner.

So you never needed help with anything? :rolleyes:


I am still learning the boring details. For example, I never though about the implications of coherent and incoherrent bass that was discussed in that other thread.

Heck, even you have helped me out in the past. Not by what you told me, but you forced me to figure out the more obscure details via the use of research and confirmation by testing!

I have read my Onkyo manual from front to back.
I have calibrated all my speakers to 75 db.
Left was -1
all others were at zero.
sub to 72
it sounds very clean, lean but clean.
some portions of dvds seem to spike the woofer into a bit of distortion, even after calibration.
sub trim is at -10, gain at 9:00 on 3.3 with turbo

i just don't get what my master volume is at for reference level
Where are you placing the SPL meter when you calibrate?

Turn the sub's gain up a bit so that you don't have to set its individual trim so low.

What do you mean you "don't get what my master volume is at for reference level"?



So, what's the problem? You're not happy with the sound? What?

Where are you placing the SPL meter when you calibrate?

Turn the sub's gain up a bit so that you don't have to set its individual trim so low.

What do you mean you "don't get what my master volume is at for reference level"?



So, what's the problem? You're not happy with the sound? What?

How low is too low on the trim? It is currently at -10 for 72 db

Before I calibrate to 75, where should the master volume be? Wherever it is, is that reference level?

How low is too low on the trim? It is currently at -10 for 72 db
Do you understand how both the sub's volume control and the level trim setting within the receiver can BOTH affect the subwoofer's output level? Turn the sub's gain up a slight bit with it's volume knob so that the level trim value within your receiver is not so low.


Before I calibrate to 75, where should the master volume be? Wherever it is, is that reference level?
Oy, veis meir! :eek: :D

Do EXACTLY what gvg45 says to do in Post#12. Print his response out. Read it and make sure you understand it. Then do EXACTLY what it says to do.

Their is nothing magic about "reference volume". If you calibrate as gvg45 suggests, your unique "reference volume" will be that master volume setting that produces the 75dB volume level from your front left speaker.

Do NOT adjust the front left speaker's individual level trim. Leave it at "0". Turn up the receiver's master volume knob until the test tone from that front left speaker is 75dB. Whatever that master volume setting IS when the tone from the front left speaker equals 75dB IS your unique "reference volume" level. It is the master volume setting that is necessary to produce the test at 75dB from your front left speaker. Once you know that particular master volume setting, LEAVE IT ALONE, and calibrate all your other speakers and subwoofer using the receiver's individual channel level trims.

I really don't understand what it is that you're hung up on. Do you understand that the whole point of calibrating your speakers is to make sure that the volume from all your speakers is identical when you're sitting in your listening spot?

You didn't answer me as to where you're placing the SPL meter, but it should be at your listening spot, at the same level your head would be if you were sitting there, facing forward, and tilted up at about a 45 degree angle. Place it on some books or something similar to get it up to the right level.

Oy, veis meir!

Is that Yiddish?

Ian :D

Do you understand how both the sub's volume control and the level trim setting within the receiver can BOTH affect the subwoofer's output level? Turn the sub's gain up a slight bit with it's volume knob so that the level trim value within your receiver is not so low.


Oy, veis meir! :eek: :D

Do EXACTLY what gvg45 says to do in Post#12. Print his response out. Read it and make sure you understand it. Then do EXACTLY what it says to do.

Their is nothing magic about "reference volume". If you calibrate as gvg45 suggests, your unique "reference volume" will be that master volume setting that produces the 75dB volume level from your front left speaker.

Do NOT adjust the front left speaker's individual level trim. Leave it at "0". Turn up the receiver's master volume knob until the test tone from that front left speaker is 75dB. Whatever that master volume setting IS when the tone from the front left speaker equals 75dB IS your unique "reference volume" level. It is the master volume setting that is necessary to produce the test at 75dB from your front left speaker. Once you know that particular master volume setting, LEAVE IT ALONE, and calibrate all your other speakers and subwoofer using the receiver's individual channel level trims.

I really don't understand what it is that you're hung up on. Do you understand that the whole point of calibrating your speakers is to make sure that the volume from all your speakers is identical when you're sitting in your listening spot?

You didn't answer me as to where you're placing the SPL meter, but it should be at your listening spot, at the same level your head would be if you were sitting there, facing forward, and tilted up at about a 45 degree angle. Place it on some books or something similar to get it up to the right level.


Yes, I am listening. My receiver is complicated. When I set my left speaker to 0, I can't get out of the menu and adjust the master volume. THe receiver is an Onkyo 804. It allows me to trim the level and that raises the db level. The spl meter is at my main listening position. Just as everyone describes. If my master volume is 45 and I go to the trim of the left speaker and such, the 45 mv has nothign to do with the calbration. If i set it to ) MV it still has nothing to do with my trim. So is 0 MV my refernce level>

Yes, I am listening. My receiver is complicated. When I set my left speaker to 0, I can't get out of the menu and adjust the master volume. THe receiver is an Onkyo 804. It allows me to trim the level and that raises the db level. The spl meter is at my main listening position. Just as everyone describes. If my master volume is 45 and I go to the trim of the left speaker and such, the 45 mv has nothign to do with the calbration. If i set it to ) MV it still has nothing to do with my trim. So is 0 MV my refernce level> :confused:

When you have your receiver in the test mode it allows you to summon the channel you want to adjust, which should be at 0. Raise the master volume control until it reads 75db on your spl meter.

Fardrai zich dem kop! :D


Ian

THe receiver is an Onkyo 804.
A) Doesn't that receiver do automatic setup?

B) Check the manual. I'm not positive, but I'd bet that the test tones are put out at MV = 0 REGARDLESS of where the volume dial is set when you go into manual calibration mode. Try it. Set the MV at...I dunno...-30 and then go to the test tones and measure db level. Exit the test tone and turn up the MV to -10. Re-measure. See what you get. I wouldn't be shocked if you get the same reading...


Scott

Yes, I am listening. My receiver is complicated. When I set my left speaker to 0, I can't get out of the menu and adjust the master volume.
OK. Set it to "0". Then get out of that menu. The receiver will "remember" that the left speaker trim is set to "0". Now, if you're saying that you have to stay in that menu to play the test tones, have you tried adjusting the receiver's volume knob by hand?





THe receiver is an Onkyo 804. It allows me to trim the level and that raises the db level. The spl meter is at my main listening position. Just as everyone describes. If my master volume is 45 and I go to the trim of the left speaker and such, the 45 mv has nothign to do with the calbration. If i set it to ) MV it still has nothing to do with my trim. So is 0 MV my refernce level>
OK, so I think you're saying that the receiver's volume scale goes to "0" or is not applicable when you're calibrating. If that's the case, then simply use the individual speaker level trims to adjust each speaker to 75dB during the calibration proceedure.

Is there a problem getting each speaker to 75dB during the calibration?



Do you understand that it's all relative? The whole point of calibrating the speakers is so that what you hear at your listening position from each speaker is identically balanced. So that if you play an identical tone from each individual speaker, each speaker will have the same APPARENT volume at your listening position. Several factors affect the APPARENT volume of each speaker at your listening spot. The distance that each speaker is from your listening spot, the sensitivity of each speaker, the location of that speaker in the room, etc..

As long as you calibrate each speaker to the same level, it does not matter what you (or your receiver) call your "reference volume" or even that you know what that volume is, necessarily. What's important is that the speakers are calibrated to the same level. At what volume you listen to your movies is up to you.

It DOES sound like your receiver sets "0" on the MV scale to be the "reference" level.

A) Doesn't that receiver do automatic setup?

Yes, it does.

Why aren't you using the automatic setup, ccarzoo?

And if you're not using the automatic setup, you should follow the instructions on pages 70-75 in your manual, where it states that the tones are output at an "absolute" volume setting of "82" on your MV.

So, no matter whether you use the automatic setup or you calibrate to 75dB manually, "82" on your MV's scale is "reference level" for you.

How low is too low on the trim? It is currently at -10 for 72 db

Before I calibrate to 75, where should the master volume be? Wherever it is, is that reference level?


From a fundamental standpoint, what we know as "reference level" is a volume level that will play back your DVD at the same sound level that the engineers that produced your DVD intended. It does tend to be pretty darn loud. Some people love to listen at those levels. Others don't. You may, or may not aspire to listen to your DVDs at that sound, (or volume), level.

The key is not really to calibrate all your speakers exactly to 75db, (or 85dbs if you are using an AVIA disk), but to calibrate all your speakers, including your sub, to the SAME level on the SPL meter.

Example:

My first step in calibrating my system is to make sure that I am stricly in dolby mode, (non of the receivers sound environments), that all my speakers are set to "Small", and that the distance from each speaker to my listening position is set correctly on the receiver. Make sure your treble and bass are set to "0" or neutral.

I set the initial point of reference with my left main speaker as follows. I set the dial on my RS SPL meter to the 90db scale, (easier than trying to calibrate to 85db using the AVIA disk on the meter). Then, I adjust my receiver's Master Volume so that with the speaker set to "0" trim at the receiver, the left main speaker reads 90db, ("0" on the SPL meter set to the 90db scale). On my receiver, in my room, this happens when the receiver's master volume is set to -15. This is my reference point to calibrate all other speakers. From this moment on, I leave the master volume alone for the remainder of the calibration. Using the trim on the receiver for each speaker, I calibrate the rest of my speakers to read 90 db on the SPL meter.

The sub will require a few more steps. You will need to set the phase so that you don't have cancellation issues with your mains. You will know you do if your sub sounds "thin" regardless of how much gain you have on the sub. Cancellation happens when the sound from your mains and your sub cancel each other. Your sub sound will be "lacking". On my system, I have the sub trim at the receiver set to -3, and the gain at the sub set to around the 10:30 position, (this is for a 3100^3 room). I "calibrate for music", which usually means that, rather than running my sub "hot" 2-3db, my bass output is calibrated to complement my mains exactly. I do make some very minute fine adjustment to the sub for personal taste, but I need to emphasize that they are very minute changes from the calibrated settings. If I want to run my sub hot a couple of dbs for a DVD, I usually turn the sub trim on the receiver up a notch to -2.5. But word of caution... as some have already indicated, a quality sub should strictly convey the LFR and LFE content in the source material, and only when the content is present. It should never add something that shouldn't be there or color your low frequencies. This is specially true when listening to music. The sub is supposed to complement the main speakers, not overpower them or color the sound. What the sub adds will be subtle... important and noticeable, yes, but subtle, when compared to full range large speakers.

For your sub, I would recommend that you check phase and position in the room.

Then, I adjust my receiver's Master Volume so that with the speaker set to "0" trim at the receiver, the left main speaker reads 90db.
First of all, I'm not sure he's using AVIA. Secondly, I'm not certain he can adjust the level trims "on-the-fly". It seems that when he goes into his receiver's manual speaker calibration, it plays the test tones automatically when he's at the level trim adjustment screens. It also "zeros" his MV reference level to an "absolute" value of "82" during the calibration, so he can't simply set his left speaker to a "0dB" trim level.

It's still unclear to me why he isn't using the receiver's automatic calibration proceedure; at least initially.

HERE (http://63.148.251.135/redirect_service.cfm?type=own_manuals&file=web_TX-SR804,804EA_En.pdf) is a link to his receiver's manual.

Yes, it does.

Why aren't you using the automatic setup, ccarzoo?

And if you're not using the automatic setup, you should follow the instructions on pages 70-75 in your manual, where it states that the tones are output at an "absolute" volume setting of "82" on your MV.

So, no matter whether you use the automatic setup or you calibrate to 75dB manually, "82" on your MV's scale is "reference level" for you.
Okay, that's what I suspected.

To the OP...just sit in the primary LP with trusty SPL meter in hand and set all speakers to 75db (or 85...whatever...pick your favorite number). Don't worry about the MV. The MV is irrelevant (as pointed out) as it will effectively be set to 0.

Just my 2c, but if I were you, I'd be HEAVILY inclined to just use the auto cal. No offense, but if setting the speaker levels is causing you headaches, manually setting other paramaters (e.g., distance, crossover, room eq, etc.) is going to make you want to rip your hair out.


Scott

FWIW, I have tried auto-cal with a few different receivers (HK, Onkyo, & Pioneer) and I have almost always had to tweak the gain on some channels. They are good for a starting point, but, IMO, still need/should be fine tuned with a meter.

First of all, I'm not sure he's using AVIA. Secondly, I'm not certain he can adjust the level trims "on-the-fly". It seems that when he goes into his receiver's manual speaker calibration, it plays the test tones automatically when he's at the level trim adjustment screens. It also "zeros" his MV reference level to an "absolute" value of "82" during the calibration, so he can't simply set his left speaker to a "0dB" trim level.

It's still unclear to me why he isn't using the receiver's automatic calibration proceedure; at least initially.

HERE (http://63.148.251.135/redirect_service.cfm?type=own_manuals&file=web_TX-SR804,804EA_Fr,Es.pdf) is a link to his receiver's manual.



Too bad I can not understand much French or Spanish!

Anyhow, that is a THX unit per the parts that I can read. You can select either the Absolute scale or Relative scale (AKA dB's) on the master volume control. Those units reset the master volume to 0 dB (with use of Relative scale) after calibration is done. THX units use 0 dB as "reference level".

I still don't understand why people don't read the instruction manual first, and just follow the directions!

Too bad I can not understand much French or Spanish!

Oops, sorry! My bad. :o

I fixed the link.

It was Greek to me. :D

I've never thought of calibrating reference to the left speaker. I just set my receiver to 0 and calibrate to 75 db using receiver test tones or 85 db using avia. That seems much easier to me. For the op, another option is to crank your receiver to 82 since that is your reference level, and adjust the trim on each channel till it reads 75 db on your RS meter. Since you like your sub hot, adjust the trim till it reads 75 to 78 db (run it 3 to 6 db hot. The RS meter is off about 3 db on the subwoofer pink noise). After this is all done, reference level is 82 on your master volume. If you play a movie at 72, you are 10 db below reference aka -10. If you play the movie at 75 on the MV, you are 7 db below reference level. If you and whoever else calibrates their receiver where reference level is calibrated to 75 db on the receiver test tone, then whenever we all play the same movie at 10 db below reference, it will sound the same volume for everyone no matter what room/setup they have. Make sense?

-Thomas

I've never thought of calibrating reference to the left speaker. I just set my receiver to 0 and calibrate to 75 db using receiver test tones or 85 db using avia. That seems much easier to me. For the op, another option is to crank your receiver to 82 since that is your reference level, and adjust the trim on each channel till it reads 75 db on your RS meter. Since you like your sub hot, adjust the trim till it reads 75 to 78 db (run it 3 to 6 db hot. The RS meter is off about 3 db on the subwoofer pink noise). After this is all done, reference level is 82 on your master volume. If you play a movie at 72, you are 10 db below reference aka -10. If you play the movie at 75 on the MV, you are 7 db below reference level. If you and whoever else calibrates their receiver where reference level is calibrated to 75 db on the receiver test tone, then whenever we all play the same movie at 10 db below reference, it will sound the same volume for everyone no matter what room/setup they have. Make sense?

-Thomas

yes, they all make sense, jsut yours helped clarify it. A few things. Auto calibration didn't work that well. I had to do it by hand. This I figured out. Two, my seal on my turbo has gone bad and I am caulking it as we speak. The woofer seems to be reaching it's excursion limits, if it hasn't been blown by the bad seal on the turbo. Sub gain is 9:00 on the button, sub trim set to -10, and it is very well balanced. I get what you said about not adding stuff that wasn't there. It blends perfectly into the room. However, max output mode yielded no significant gains in spl. I actually prefer the sound that the turbo produces. It hits just as hard in my huge room. I think the driver is bad, because, with the gain to 11:00 and the trim to -1, the thing really pumped out pressure, bass and spl. It never distorted til the turbo seal began to erode. Now even running 1-2 db hot, I can hear distortion in movies, and a helicopter type glapping in the sub when playing the lowest test warble on Dr. Hsu's disk. Can you still help???

Thanks in advance,

Christopher

It never distorted til the turbo seal began to erode. Now even running 1-2 db hot, I can hear distortion in movies, and a helicopter type glapping in the sub when playing the lowest test warble on Dr. Hsu's disk.

The sound you describe is exactly what I heard once from my VTF-3.3 when I did not have my Turbo in tight enough because I had forgotten to use the supplied rubber pad underneath it. If the seals on your Turbo are defective, you should contact HSU via phone, email, or their forum (all on their website) and they will best be able to assist you.