Short Version:

I liked my URC remotes in the past. Harmony's are total crap. How do I accomplish what I want with a URC or other remote that does not have variables (i.e. something under the MX-950)?

I have one TOAD (no discrete power) device. I can't do all on/all off macros because their are certain activities where the TOAD device must be off (and obviously others where it must be on).

Without state management, I can not come up with any series of macros that accomplishes this. Is there some trick I could do with a remote less than the MX-950 to accomplish this or some other brand of remote?

Note on the other brand: no touchscreens and no JP-1 remotes (I know a JP-1 remote could do it, but I'd need 3 pages of documentation so my wife knew what button to push for a given action).

Long Version:

Been using an MX-500 in the theater and an MX-600 in he family room for years. They are great remotes, but due to not having some hard buttons of the higher end/newer ones and their limited macro capabilities made them clunky for my wife to use and discouraged her from using the theater without me.

I have one TOAD device (no discretes) in both rooms that causes the problems. I can't leave it on all the time either because it will cause problems with other devices that are needed for other "activities". So, an MX-950 is the obvious solution to all my problems, but since I like to have the same remote in the family room and theater to make it easy for my wife, there is no way I can justify $1000 for remotes (and my wife would sh!t).

So I jumped at the chance to get a couple Harmony 880s cheap. Man are they crap!!!
- The programming interface is HORRIBLE. It must have been designed by retarded monkeys.
- There are many things the Harmony can do, but logitech won't let it do. And then there are the things they will let it do, but you can't do--you have to call tech support and be on hold for 45 minutes to get second level support person to do it for you (who's brain dead idea was this?)
- Activity entry and exit scripts are not enough macro capabilities for the sophisticated control many theaters need.
- The remote is an ergonomic nightmare. You cannot operate this thing by touch like the URC remotes.
- The buttons and remote feel incredibly cheap and poorly made.
- 1 of my 880s has already broken (about 30 days old)--it won't charge (yes, I got the new cradle from them, it is the remote itself).

So, since URC products have worked flawlessly for me for years, are built better, have better config software, and are easy to use, I'm looking to go back to one but need to figure out how to handle my TOAD device.

Thanks for any help.

What is the TOAD device?

Sorry, thought that common remote central slang had propagated out.

TOAD: Toggle Only Actuated Device. A term coined to represent a device that does not feature discrete codes.

In my case, the motorola QIP6416 and its power function.

Sorry, thought that common remote central slang had propagated out.

TOAD: Toggle Only Actuated Device. A term coined to represent a device that does not feature discrete codes.

In my case, the motorola QIP6416 and its power function.

I know what TOAD means... I was asking what was the device you had... as you answered in your second sentence.

If you know that you program the discretes for the Fios box with the JP1 remotes then the simple solution is to get one of those to program the command that you need and then teach that command to the URC remote of your choice. Your wife will never even know the OFA JP1 was in the house ;-)

If you know that you program the discretes for the Fios box with the JP1 remotes then the simple solution is to get one of those to program the command that you need and then teach that command to the URC remote of your choice. Your wife will never even know the OFA JP1 was in the house ;-)

OK, you lost me here. I didn't know there were discretes for the FiOS box. Everything I've found says there are not discretes for any motorola cable box. Is this wrong?If it does have discretes, problem solved--woo hoo! So, are you saying that there are JP-1 discretes available for the FiOS box?

Did you try the macro listed here?
http://www.remotecentral.com/cgi-bin/mboard/rc-prontong/thread.cgi?4999
(Post #10)
I haven't tried it, since I just leave the cable box on but logically those macros should work (although with a lot of switching on and off in some conditions).

Did you try the macro listed here?
http://www.remotecentral.com/cgi-bin/mboard/rc-prontong/thread.cgi?4999
(Post #10)
I haven't tried it, since I just leave the cable box on but logically those macros should work (although with a lot of switching on and off in some conditions).

No I have not. Thanks. Looking at it I don't see how it could work but I will try it tonight. I wonder if the use of the Menu makes it work for comcast boxes that use different software than the fios boxes.

If it had discretes, this is what my "Watch D-VHS" activity would look like:
- power off all source devices discretely (including QIP6416)
- send discrete on to PJ.
- send discrete on to Receiver
- Power on JVC 30K
- Delay
- Power on Mitsubishi 2K
- Select correct Receiver input

In this scenerio I don't see how that "off" macro would work here. It should turn it on if it is not on. Hmmm. But will try.

Looking at it I don't see how it could work
On would be:
Menu
delay
Toggle Power
delay
Toggle Power

Off would be:
Menu
delay
Toggle Power
On the Motorola boxes, pressing MENU when powered off brings up a setup menu (setting output resolutions, and other things I can't remember right now), and pressing power from there turns the box off. So for OFF Macro, if the box is on, menu will just go to the menu and then turn off. If it is off, it will go to the setup menu, and then turn off.

ON macro would be an extension of that where MENU,POWER gets you to a known OFF state, and then additional POWER turns it on.

As I said, this will cause the box to turn off and on if it is on and the ON macro is sent; it will go to menu, turn off and then on again. This may or may not be acceptable to you (if it works at all).

On the Motorola boxes, pressing MENU when powered off brings up a setup menu (setting output resolutions, and other things I can't remember right now), and pressing power from there turns the box off. So for OFF Macro, if the box is on, menu will just go to the menu and then turn off. If it is off, it will go to the setup menu, and then turn off.

Oh, I thought that menu when powered off to get to that menu had to be just from the front panel. I didn't know you could do it from the remote. Will try it.

And yes, it is acceptable if it works! Thanks. Will try in a few hours!

Did you try the macro listed here?
http://www.remotecentral.com/cgi-bin/mboard/rc-prontong/thread.cgi?4999
(Post #10)
I haven't tried it, since I just leave the cable box on but logically those macros should work (although with a lot of switching on and off in some conditions).

Well it works mostly with the QIP6416. Two caveates:
1) For the "on" macro. If the box is off, the push of the menu on the remote causes that setup menu to flash but not stay up. So the power command has to come with no delay --unlike his instructions (basically since it is processing the set up menu and dismissing it, the first power does not get handled [which is good]--any delay between the menu and power and the power gets handled [which is bad].
2) If the box is recording, the power on macro will not work because the "menu" is ignored. So basically the box stays in its current state when the "on" runs (i.e. both powers get handled).

But, I'm going to think about this a bit and see if I can come up with something clever. Thanks for pointing me at this, it may ultimately free me from the Harmony nightmare. :)

OK, you lost me here. I didn't know there were discretes for the FiOS box. Everything I've found says there are not discretes for any motorola cable box. Is this wrong?If it does have discretes, problem solved--woo hoo! So, are you saying that there are JP-1 discretes available for the FiOS box?

I don't know if there are discretes for the box. I didn't research it because I got the impression that you already did from this line in your first post

Note on the other brand: no touchscreens and no JP-1 remotes (I know a JP-1 remote could do it, but I'd need 3 pages of documentation so my wife knew what button to push for a given action).

Sorry if I misunderstood. Glad to see you have a few suggestions from others familiar with the box. I had to do a similar work around with the Cable SA8300

Ooops, miscommunication. I meant I know a JP-1 could control the system because they have variables so I could remember the state of the TOAD. Not that the JP-1 had discretes. No discretes and the work around does not work perfectly unfortunately.

You know I have seen a dozen reasons to never turn those off.

Why do you need to cut the cable box on and off?

You know I have seen a dozen reasons to never turn those off.

Any good ones? Basically, all turning it off does is stop the tuner from recording live TV to the hard drive. Why is this bad?

Why do you need to cut the cable box on and off?

Firewire handshake issues.

Basically, in my theater, the firewire bus looks like this:
QIP6416 -> Mitsu 2K -> JVC 30K

Mitsu is used for all HD archiving and playback. The JVC is used as the MPEG2 decoder for the Mitsu and to play the occasional DTheater movie.

Even though the Mitsu stays "tuned" to the QIP6416 and the JVC to the Mitsu, firewire in the A/V world is buggy. So, for the "Watch D-VHS" activity this must happen:
QIP6416 off
Mitsu 2K off
JVC 30K off
JVC 30K on
delay 2 seconds
Mitsu 2K on

(As an aside: getting the Harmony to turn on the JVC and the Mitsu in the right order with a dealy took 3 support calls--and they never figured it out and about 4 total hours of my time playing with it until I came up with a serious cludge--just one of the many reasons I hate Harmony remotes. I had my MX-500 doing this in 5 minutes!).

If the QIP6416 is on when the JVC comes up, then the JVC will "see" that device and not tune to the Mitsu when it comes up--instead, it will throw the famous (an incorrect) "too many i.Link devices" and there is no way out of that state but power off and back on in the state specified above. (The JVC needs to tune to the Mitsu to act as its MPEG2 decoder.)

Other options I considered:
- All on/all off: Not a fan of this as there are 5 sources in the theater and some have fans. I've never ever need all 5 sources in any single "session".

- Leave QIP6416 on all the time and turn off at needed time: Another option was leave it on all the time and have the "Watch D-VHS" "activity" turn it off as the first step. The problem is, I can figure out no way to restore it back to being "on" when done with that activity.