A few of my HD DVDs that I anticipate are “one-view only” types I have posted on Ebay to sell. However, I just got another message that the HD DVD I sold doesn’t work. When I inquired about the type of player they had, I found that they are REGULAR dvd players.

When I posted the item, I made it VERY clear that they will ONLY work in HD DVD players. In fact that is my first line. In the title it clearly states HD DVD. I don’t know how to make it any clearer. Yet, I have some angry buyers.

Just be aware that selling HD DVDs aftermarket is risky. I am now dealing with customers who are angry and want refunds and are threatening negative feedback. I’m not sure it’s worth it.

Here's another thread about selling used on ebay...though with a slightly different twist

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=848847

I wouldn't give them a damn cent back. It's happened to me with selling movies from other regions. I clearly mark that it's R2, R3, etc etc. If they can't read, it's not my fault.

^^^^ Exactly, if you have stated clearly in your offer that it only works in an HD DVD player then they have no case. It's their own fault for not reading carefully.

every other review on amazon for planet earth is they bought the hd thinking it'd work on their upconverting dvd player. People are stupid.

...Just be aware that selling HD DVDs aftermarket is risky. I am now dealing with customers who are angry and want refunds and are threatening negative feedback. I’m not sure it’s worth it.

Well, I sold roughly 100 HD DVD titles with only one problem and it was because the buyer needed a firmware update which I was happy to help him find. I made it abundantly clear in my listing that the discs "will only play in Toshiba HD DVD players and X-Box 360 HD DVD Add-On Players" and that all sales were final. I also have 100% positive feedback on over 1200 transactions.

I agree that people are quite stupid. I have conversations where people claim they DO have an HD DVD player and it turns out to be an up-converting regular DVD player. They argue that it DOES up-convert to HD and that the HD DVD should work. I argue that it won't because it HAS to be a specified HD DVD player. They disagree.

If people are this stupid with resale items, I wonder how the retail stores are doing with the new HD DVD software. Do they get a lot of returns from people thinking they would work in their regular dvd players?

Now, I may bet a little flack on this, but I think the name "HD DVD" is problematic since it too closely resembles regular DVD. Blu-ray appears to be immune from these type of misunderstandings. This is one case where the name is a disadvantage for HD DVD.

With Ebay items, the seller has dilemma. Even though you are in the right and described the product accurately, the buyer still has the power of the "feedback" system to ruin you as a seller. Most would advise to hold ground and refuse refund. But one negative feedback will probably cost the seller ten times more in lost business than the value of the HD DVD in question. So, eating the cost of buyer stupidity may be the best option.

No. Do not eat the costs. They cannot leave negative feedback in these cases, it is actually against Ebay policy. If they do, you can have it removed.

BTW, when I sell HD DVDs on Ebay, I begin and end each description with a statement to the effect of, please read entire description carefully, I am not responsible for hardware incompatibilities. Also, on items like these, always sell "as is" with NO return policy. Let your feedback and reputation do the talking.

I agree that people are quite stupid. I have conversations where people claim they DO have an HD DVD player and it turns out to be an up-converting regular DVD player. They argue that it DOES up-convert to HD and that the HD DVD should work. I argue that it won't because it HAS to be a specified HD DVD player. They disagree.



totally agree, i think the marketing guys that pushed people to rebuy dvd players for a 1080p hd upconverting players really confused lot of people.

I agree that people are quite stupid. I have conversations where people claim they DO have an HD DVD player and it turns out to be an up-converting regular DVD player. They argue that it DOES up-convert to HD and that the HD DVD should work. I argue that it won't because it HAS to be a specified HD DVD player. They disagree.

If people are this stupid with resale items, I wonder how the retail stores are doing with the new HD DVD software. Do they get a lot of returns from people thinking they would work in their regular dvd players?

Now, I may bet a little flack on this, but I think the name "HD DVD" is problematic since it too closely resembles regular DVD. Blu-ray appears to be immune from these type of misunderstandings. This is one case where the name is a disadvantage for HD DVD.

A few months ago I was at Best Buy, browsing the HD DVD selection and this guy saw what ever movie he was looking for sitting on the shelf and picked it up. He said to his girlfriend, "I'm going to get it on HD DVD, because it's going to look better than a regular DVD". I asked him if he owned an HD DVD player and he gave me a blank stare, blink his eyes for a second and said "I've got an HDTV so this should look great". I then explained to him that unless he owned an HD DVD player, the disc would not be playable in his regular DVD player.

He asked me how much it would cost to buy an HD DVD (at that time, they were still approximately $500). He thanked me and said for that price, he was "fine with just a regular DVD".

No. Do not eat the costs. They cannot leave negative feedback in these cases, it is actually against Ebay policy. If they do, you can have it removed.


Unfortunately, I have heard from several people that eBay won't touch feedback, regardless of how 'right' you are. :(

It really comes down to whether it's worth it. If you sold a disc for $10 and it could affect your perfect feedback (and prevent others from buying from you in the future) I'd probably just accept the return even though you're in the right.

One option I would take first: Email the studio and explain the situation as you bought the HDDVD version but you only have a DVD Player. Ask if they would be willing to let you exchange the disc by mail as the store won't let you anymore. The customer may find this resolution to be satisfactory (I just wouldn't mention the 6-8 week waiting period :p ).

You might also want to start including a list of all HDDVD players in your postings in the future. Saying "Plays on all HDDVD players" can cause some confusion (like somebody already mentioned, the upscaling players). Saying "This disc will only play on the Toshiba HD-A1, Toshiba HD-A2, XBOX 360 HDDVD Adapter", etc.. will at least let you avoid that.

I've noticed a lot of confusion with the HDDVD term. People assume that HDTV + DVD player = HDDVD player (or "HDTV DVD Player" as I've seen them call them ;) )

^ haha (two posts above)... I listened to a 5 minute back and forth faux argument in Fry's months ago between an employee and customer "looking for high definition DVDs." He argued with this poor women (who knew her stuff) that "all recent DVDs were high definition." I listened to the whole thing and it was freaking depressing. She walked him over to the BD/HD section and he just argued even more that standard DVDs were HD already and why would he want to buy a new player when he already had HD. This Fry's employee even mentioned that DVD was "standard definition 480" and high definition was "1080." And then there was this awkward pause because the guy who obviously was a know it all, had no clue what she was talking about. I would have jumped in, but she handled it very well.

You can blame this confusion on a number of things, upconverting DVD players, HDTVs versus HD signals, and even the printed word on the back of DVDs that say, "mastered in high definition."

Unfortunately, I have heard from several people that eBay won't touch feedback, regardless of how 'right' you are. :(

It really comes down to whether it's worth it. If you sold a disc for $10 and it could affect your perfect feedback (and prevent others from buying from you in the future) I'd probably just accept the return even though you're in the right.

One option I would take first: Email the studio and explain the situation as you bought the HDDVD version but you only have a DVD Player. Ask if they would be willing to let you exchange the disc by mail as the store won't let you anymore. The customer may find this resolution to be satisfactory (I just wouldn't mention the 6-8 week waiting period :p ).

You might also want to start including a list of all HDDVD players in your postings in the future. Saying "Plays on all HDDVD players" can cause some confusion (like somebody already mentioned, the upscaling players). Saying "This disc will only play on the Toshiba HD-A1, Toshiba HD-A2, XBOX 360 HDDVD Adapter", etc.. will at least let you avoid that.

I've noticed a lot of confusion with the HDDVD term. People assume that HDTV + DVD player = HDDVD player (or "HDTV DVD Player" as I've seen them call them ;) )

Time is money and you cannot allow people to push you around, even if that means getting negative feedback. Any reasonable person that is concerned with a negative feedback can read the sellers response. In this case, the OP would clearly state: buyer did not read description carefully, item was sold exactly as described.

I would never allow someone to return something if they were too lazy or stupid to read. Maybe I am in the minority, but after 7 years on Ebay, I have 1 negative feedback from a guy who never paid me, and is no longer a member b/c of his actions. I can live with that. It has never affected future transactions.

You give people an inch they take a mile...

A few of my HD DVDs that I anticipate are “one-view only” types I have posted on Ebay to sell. However, I just got another message that the HD DVD I sold doesn’t work. When I inquired about the type of player they had, I found that they are REGULAR dvd players.

When I posted the item, I made it VERY clear that they will ONLY work in HD DVD players. In fact that is my first line. In the title it clearly states HD DVD. I don’t know how to make it any clearer. Yet, I have some angry buyers.

Just be aware that selling HD DVDs aftermarket is risky. I am now dealing with customers who are angry and want refunds and are threatening negative feedback. I’m not sure it’s worth it.


Its not the sellers fault if the buyer is:

1) an idiot
2) unable to read your title and description

I'd email him back and tell him to learn to read. Not your fault at all...

Time is money and you cannot allow people to push you around, even if that means getting negative feedback. Any reasonable person that is concerned with a negative feedback can read the sellers response.

Unfortunately, most buyers don't actually READ the negative to find out why. They just look at the feedback percentage. Some have a "rule" they don't buy from anybody below 99% or so. So, it really doesn't matter how "right" you are as a seller if the positive percentage falls. One negative out of 100 is enough to have a financial impact on your profits.

I have to admit, that I have refunded money to buyers that I shouldn't have because they were in the wrong, not me. But I valued my feedback more than losing that small amount of money. It is very bothersome, however -- knowing you're right, but giving in.

I had a bad experience re-selling DREAMGIRLS.

I had no problem playing the disc but the guy who bought it off me via Ebay maintained that it "locked up" around the 20 minute mark, froze and would not play.

I looked through his feedback at Ebay and saw he had the same problem with SPY GAME (HD-DVD), noting "it didn't work the first few times but now it does". Since I assumed it wasn't a disc based problem, I offered to help him update his firmware (since that's what it sounded like) but he never told me what model he had.

At any rate, weeks went by, he files a Paypal claim against me and leaves negative feedback. Paypal sides with HIM but he doesn't get his refund because he never returned the disc to me and therefore the claim was canceled (guess it must've started to work?). But 2000+ positives and that's the first negative I get! :(

I just found it irritating that Paypal sided with him since it was not a problem with the disc, but more than likely was his player -- especially since it was clear he had problems with other discs!

Just a heads-up as far as WHERE you re-sell your discs. Amazon is a problem because you can confirm delivery with Delivery Confirmation, but the buyer can STILL claim they didn't receive it -- so you have to insure every item or face the consequences of them taking back your funds. And if you use Paypal via Ebay, be aware they're going to side with the buyer almost every time.

I have to admit, that I have refunded money to buyers that I shouldn't have because they were in the wrong, not me. But I valued my feedback more than losing that small amount of money. It is very bothersome, however -- knowing you're right, but giving in.

I've long gotten over that. No matter how "right" you are in what you do, you are going to run into someone who is going to give you trouble -- the kind of buyer who starts complaining after 48 hours that they don't have their item yet, even though you specify that Media Mail can take up to 30 days and it's not your fault than the post office takes that long to deliver...or that Ebay itself has a disclaimer that "sellers are NOT responsible for transit times." With some of these (increasingly impatient) buyers you just have to deal with it :rolleyes:

It's why, if you a buyer, you have to look at the feedback of whoever you are buying from and try to balance out one side's claims from the others. I'll buy from someone with 99% feedback often with no hesitation (depending on their feedback) because it's DEFINITELY not always the sellers who have the problems!

You might also want to start including a list of all HDDVD players in your postings in the future. Saying "Plays on all HDDVD players" can cause some confusion (like somebody already mentioned, the upscaling players). Saying "This disc will only play on the Toshiba HD-A1, Toshiba HD-A2, XBOX 360 HDDVD Adapter", etc.. will at least let you avoid that.



I've done just that. I revised my current HD DVD listings with an important message reiterating that the discs will only work in HD DVD players and then I listed all of the model numbers. I hope they read it. Some of the buyers having problems are NOT READING the descriptions for some reason.

Time is money and you cannot allow people to push you around, even if that means getting negative feedback. Any reasonable person that is concerned with a negative feedback can read the sellers response. In this case, the OP would clearly state: buyer did not read description carefully, item was sold exactly as described.

I would never allow someone to return something if they were too lazy or stupid to read. Maybe I am in the minority, but after 7 years on Ebay, I have 1 negative feedback from a guy who never paid me, and is no longer a member b/c of his actions. I can live with that. It has never affected future transactions.

You give people an inch they take a mile...

Here is another reason that you might want to keep the negative feedback (if he gives you negative feedback)
What if the guy put fingerprints and/or scratches on this disc by mishandling it?
(Everyone doesn't treat their discs with care)
Meaning, it's no longer in prestine or mint condition after he has tested the disc in his player.

Throw in some huge blinking text around your disclaimer. (Does the blink tag even work anymore...?)

The thing I don't understand about all of this is how hard is it to understand. You have an upconverting DVD player that converts regular dvds to improved image quality and you have a completely new format called HDDVD that only plays on an HDDVD player. PLain and freaking simple. Man some people are dullards. Even my mom knows what the difference is for goodness sakes and I have to do everything electronics for her.

Because most Amazon customers can, by definition, read.

I've had very good luck selling CDs and DVDs through Amazon. Yes, they take a hefty cut, but the lack of aggravation makes it a better deal for me.

I don't know if you're allowed to use copyrighted logos and such, but maybe put an image of the HD DVD logo in your listing, stating that HD DVD's will only play in players with this logo somewhere on it. I know that listing the model numbers is better, but more often than not, they won't know the model numbers. This way, buyers can check for the logo and know that it will accept it.

Then you can also state "You may need a firmware update in order to play this disc." somewhere else in the listing.

http://img265.imageshack.us/img265/2093/hddvdlogotc1.jpg

A few of my HD DVDs that I anticipate are “one-view only” types I have posted on Ebay to sell. However, I just got another message that the HD DVD I sold doesn’t work. When I inquired about the type of player they had, I found that they are REGULAR dvd players.

When I posted the item, I made it VERY clear that they will ONLY work in HD DVD players. In fact that is my first line. In the title it clearly states HD DVD. I don’t know how to make it any clearer. Yet, I have some angry buyers.

Just be aware that selling HD DVDs aftermarket is risky. I am now dealing with customers who are angry and want refunds and are threatening negative feedback. I’m not sure it’s worth it.

Let them give you a negative and reply politely to the negative "bidder must first read, understand, then bid on the item. Sent as described.

Also, you may want to throw a link to the wikipedia HD DVD entry in there somewhere. Make it large type, and blinking.

Kind of odd. I've sold a ton of HD-DVDs and make absolutely no mention of them playing only in HD-DVD players and no one's ever tried to play it in a regular player (at least that I know of). Guess I've just gotten lucky thusfar.

I'd say it the upconverting players that are the biggest issue. I've seen a lot of upconverting players that say FULL HD 1080p upconversion. The upconversion part is very small and bellow the all gold 1080p part.

The worst part is many of the discount stores like walmart/target have signs above the normal DVD players that has a break down for HDTVs.
They say somthing like
SDTV 480I
EDTV 480p
HDTV 720p,1080i,1080P
So pepole assume the upconverting players oer even 480p commponet players are HD.

Like they say hook this proggesive scan ready player to your HDTV.but nowhere does is say SD 480p output max. Only plays DVDs or lower.

The guy who claimed all DVDs are HD must have seen DVDs with the mastered in High defintion. Or transfered in HD. Which dosent mean it HD it simply down converted to 480p. Or prehapps he thought 480p was HD. As their is only a few 480p only sets. Ot he has a HDTV and upconvert player.



Just clearly list everything I've found even if you list it. Some pepole miss it. I've seen negitive feedback related to lack of reading.prehapps a issue here. Not many read any more. They just watch the news that knows nothing about this format war or HD for that matter..


But I've always read the everything listed and know exactly what I'm buying. Although I can buy just about any format and play it. (HD-DVD,DVD(palor ntsc any region),LD, S-VHS and VHS). I plan in adding blu_ray and D-VHS at some point..

When eBay buyers can confuse Laserdiscs and DVDs, no wonder the distinction between HD DVD and DVD escapes them.

You sort of tend to lose all confidence in humanity if you trade on eBay for long.

Don't overlook the fact that some low lifes will want to watch movies without paying for them. Kinda of like a Netflix without the monthly membership fees.

question: I've never used ebay, but can the buyer give you a negative rating even if you bend over backwards to satisfy them?

If so, giving people a refund doesn't guarantee they won't try to hurt your business...I'd tell the customer to put it up on ebay themselves to re-sell it or something, and be done with it.

ricwhite,

I'm anxious to know what are you going to do?

question: I've never used ebay, but can the buyer give you a negative rating even if you bend over backwards to satisfy them?

Yes.

If so, giving people a refund doesn't guarantee they won't try to hurt your business...I'd tell the customer to put it up on ebay themselves to re-sell it or something, and be done with it.

Exactly, especially if they didn't know what they were buying. If they claim it's defective, though -- and they use Paypal -- you basically HAVE to accept the return or they will take your funds from the transaction, provided they prove they shipped it back to you. I just found that out on one of my auctions -- Paypal sided with the buyer, but thankfully for me, the guy never bothered to ship it back in the 10 day time frame, so they didn't give him a refund.

Unfortunately this is the one and only advantage of the 'Blu-ray Disc' name!

Seriously though - the dodgy hardware manufacturers have been deliberately misleading consumers into thinking HD upscaling = HD for a few years now.

Some advertisemenst even go as far as labelling them 'HD DVD' players when they are obviously not (to anyone with a clue).

Unfortunately this is the one and only advantage of the 'Blu-ray Disc' name!


Nope, I've had one of the Blu-ray discs I sold on eBay try to come back saying it wouldn't play on their DVD player! (That God-awful Talladega Nights that came with my PS3). I've had two similar complaints on HD DVD's. But I think the guy with Talladega Nights was just trying to get out of it because he complained it wasn't a "legit copy" because it was marked "Not For Resale". I explained that it came included with PS3 and was marked that way so it couldn't be sold as New in a store, and I had sold it as Used (I made it 15 minutes into the movie before giving up) I guess I drove the point home when I told home that the way I looked at it, I paid $500 for that Blu-ray disk and Sony included a free PS3. :p He replied "OK".

I now put it at least 3 times in the description that the item is an HD DVD or Blu-ray disk and will only play on those players. And then in my 3 day return policy I state "Satisfaction Guaranteed" - but don't try to tell me because the disc won't play in your standard DVD player as I've made it really clear that this is a HD DVD / Blu-ray version.

No returns or negative Feedback yet. :rolleyes:

ricwhite,

I'm anxious to know what are you going to do?

The latest one, I replied that they needed an HD DVD player to play it as described in the listing. She replied back that she realizes she has the wrong player and she apologized for bothering me in a rather terse way. I think she was hoping I'd offer to refund her, but I didn't. I'm just waiting now to see if she is going to challenge the purchase via paypal or not. Maybe claim I sold a product that didn't work. She would probably WIN a judgment from paypal if she did -- although, I have in writing her admitting SHE had the wrong player. So, I'm waiting to see if she'll go that route.

The best I can hope for from this one is . . . nothing. I know she won't post positive feedback. I'll he happy if she doesn't post negative feedback and doesn't challenge the purchase. We'll see.

...I'm just waiting now to see if she is going to challenge the purchase via paypal or not...
Anytime an eBayer pays you via Paypal, immediately withdraw that money into a unconfirmed bank account such as Netbank. My original Paypal-confirmed checking account (Bank of America) was closed long ago, but Paypal has no way of knowing this. If some stupid seller tries to contest the charges a few days after the sale, I'll have $0 in my Paypal account that Paypal could withdraw/freeze, and I don't believe they can go after my existing non-confirmed checking account. Of course, who knows what they might try to do that's legal or not... :eek:

Paypal is unfortunately a necessary evil, so I do what I can to protect myself. I only pay with a credit card via Paypal, and will dispute any charges directly w/ my credit card issuer and not thru Paypal. A lesson learned a few years ago that has stuck with me...

BTW, I understand the importance of making your item description perfectly clear in the write-up!!

Signed, a 100% feedback rating via 302 members via 372 transactions, including many HD DVD players during the G1 frenzy (thanks, UK buyers!) and assorted HD DVDs... :)