I am slowly designing my home theater and am trying to make some basic decisions. One of them is whether to use inwall or freestanding speakers for the front. I already have Triad inwall Silver Surrounds for the right and left and Triad Inwall Gold Surrounds for the rear speakers, but have not yet decided whether to use the Inwall or Inroom Gold LCR's for the front. It seems that there are some benefits to going either way. Are there any opinions on which would sound best?

Thanks,
CJ

My personal opinion is never use in walls unless there is no other choice, but you seem to have some good ones and they are already in. As long as they match sonically I would use the free standing since you can move them about. Are you using an acoustically transparent screen and putting the speakers behind it?

Yes, I will be using an SmX screen and locating the speakers behind them.

It is my understanding that the largest benefits of freestanding speakers are the ability to toe-in the left and right speakers, while inwall speakers have the benefit of not having to worry as much about reflections from the rear wall.

Is there more to it?

Thanks,
CJ

To me the largest advantage of free standing speakers is that they will be entirely inside the room. In wall speakers basically defeat most sound isolation techniques.

Personally I think you get a better sound field from the free standing and as I say you can move them to get your very best result.
I also agree with Michael about them being within the room except in your case you have them in wall already.

Future upgrades or change of speakers is a lot easier if you don't have to hack apart your theater etc. Plus you get better bang for your buck in terms of sonic quality. If they are hidden, who cares if they are ugly and big? If they sound awesome go for it.

I've not heard about in-wall's causing less reflections. Any idea why?

To me the largest advantage of free standing speakers is that they will be entirely inside the room. In wall speakers basically defeat most sound isolation techniques.

For most inwall speakers I would agree with you. However, the Triad speakers are made with an integral back box, and are also made to work wih a separate subwoofer(s), so sound isolation isn't as much a factor.

CJ

So is the integral back box something like a green glue double drywall construction? I think Cathan is referring to the sound "proofing" of the room and cutting big holes in the wall isn't a good idea.

Future upgrades or change of speakers is a lot easier if you don't have to hack apart your theater etc. Plus you get better bang for your buck in terms of sonic quality. If they are hidden, who cares if they are ugly and big? If they sound awesome go for it.

I've not heard about in-wall's causing less reflections. Any idea why?

I hope not to have to upgrade my speakers for quite a while! The cost for the inwalls is pretty comparable to the price of their inroom speakers and are supposed to sound exactly the same.

The biggest problem with freestanding speakers for me is that it shortens the room. I didn't mention it before, but my room is about as small as I'd like it to be (22'x13'x9'). However, I would be willing to give up depth if it made a large difference in sound quality.

Since there is no wall behind the inwalls, you don't have to worry about the very quick reflections that would interfere with the direct sounds from the speakers. This is why many theaters mount the freestanding speakers in the wall. However, since the freestanding speakers were not made to be installed this way, a special baffle has to be designed to mount them in this way. I think that Denise Erksin designed Ash's theater in this manner.

However, all of this is just based on what I have read here and I have no real-word experience to back this up.

Thanks,
CJ

So is the integral back box something like a green glue double drywall construction? I think Cathan is referring to the sound "proofing" of the room and cutting big holes in the wall isn't a good idea.

It's made with MDF. From what I understand, holes in the wall are OK as long as they are properly sealed. Otherwise, there would be a lot of problems with electrical outlets and such. But I could be wrong!

CJ

Since there is no wall behind the inwalls, you don't have to worry about the very quick reflections that would interfere with the direct sounds from the speakers.


Isn't that why the front wall is usually treated? To stop just those reflections, as well as other reflections from around the room?

I think one of the big concerns with inwalls is that you've cut big holes in the (hopefully) soundproof box you've built for a theater. With those holes the sound will leak out to the rest of the structure, as well as allowing external sound into the theater.

-drin

Isn't that why the front wall is usually treated? To stop just those reflections, as well as other reflections from around the room?

I think one of the big concerns with inwalls is that you've cut big holes in the (hopefully) soundproof box you've built for a theater. With those holes the sound will leak out to the rest of the structure, as well as allowing external sound into the theater.

-drin

Good points. However, I was thinking that there must be more to it than just treating the front walls if someone like Dennis is going through the trouble of mounting freestanding speakers in a custom-designed baffle.

I didn't think that cutting holes was such a big deal as long as they were filled with something- in this case the speaker box made of MDF and the seams are sealed with an acoustic sealant. If I'm wrong, please let me know. I'm not too far along that I couldn't change all the speakers out if I needed to.

CJ

...
I didn't think that cutting holes was such a big deal as long as they were filled with something- in this case the speaker box made of MDF and the seams are sealed with an acoustic sealant. If I'm wrong, please let me know. I'm not too far along that I couldn't change all the speakers out if I needed to.

CJ

Sure an acoustically sealed mdf box is better then no box, but it probably isn't as good a solid, hole free double drywall/GG wall.

Anyway, you have the speakers. I would just work with what you have and do what you can to keep the speakers and the room isolated from the rest of the house if sound isolation is an issue for you. If starting from scratch, I would always go with free-standing speakers as in-walls just present a host of additional design difficulties. The exception is when you don't have the space to put free standing speakers behind a screen.

I appreciate all the comments.

Thanks!
CJ

I've heard studio builders mention that inwall speakers are better but I don't recall them quoting any good solid reasons.

I am building my main left and right speakers into the front wall, but I had this in mind from the start so they are entirely made of concrete. There will be no issues with sound leakage from the rest of the house and the speaker baffles are angled into the listener location. My room is 16x24 plus the speakers. The speaker boxes are about 3' deep. There are some details of my concrete speaker boxes on my blog but I can't post that until I have 5 posts. Google "GDS Amps blog"

Even with the rest of the room not being done and the speakers not being completely tuned up, the speakers sounded pretty amazing in the trial runs a couple weeks ago. We poured the exponential horns this week and will rebuild the permanent baffles next week. Then we can fire up the speakers again and see how well the horns work.

I'll start a thread for my HT once I get into that in earnest.

Sincerely,
Graydon Stuckey
Fenton, MI

This is the answer that I got from Dennis Erskine when I asked him the difference between inwall speakers, free-standing speakers with a baffle, and free-standing speakers placed away from the wall

InWall speakers are designed to be mounted into a wall and their response is based upon the designer's knowledge about the performance of the speaker once flush mounted.

Full range, free standing speakers need to be about 15' from any boundary to avoid a long list of problems including SBIR.

A properly treated and designed baffle will address the Allison Dip, SBIR from the front wall, smooth out response and reduce, or eliminate comb filtering (among other evils).

CJ