A while back I was searching through a collection of custom-art covers and I stumbled across one for The Abyss. Is it available somewhere in the world or is it one of those Star Wars type situations where they've recorded it off of HBO or something? I would love this movie on HD, even if the effects look like trash that way. ;)

The Abyss has been dying to be remastered for some time, the DVD is non anamorphic and has really bad picture quality.

The Abyss has been dying to be remastered for some time, the DVD is non anamorphic and has really bad picture quality.
I think the DVD I have is anamorphic. I'll have to check later.

20th Century Fox property.

I have the two-disc "Special Edition" of "The Abyss" and it is non-anamorphic. The extended director's cut is a prime candidate for the HD DVD treatment.

The extended director's cut is a prime candidate for the HD DVD treatment.
Not unless Fox goes neutral. :(

Not unless Fox goes neutral. :(


I thought Fox WAS neutral, as in not producing movies in either format. ;)

I thought Fox WAS neutral, as in not producing movies in either format. ;)
Lol, true enough. It'll make a great import though until they are truely neutral and releasing titles in both formats.

I'm just happy I'm not the only one who likes the movie! Seems like every time I try to get anyone to sit down and watch the directors cut they suddenly have things to do. Great flick.

The fullscreen version of the film actually shows more than the widescreen. I believe this is one of the only movie's I have seen where the widescreen doesn't show more of the film..

There are tons of movies filmed that way (mainly using Super 35 technique), but one rarely gets the opportunity to spot them, since the 4:3-full-negative-version mostly is stuck on a VHS-tape

The fullscreen version of the film actually shows more than the widescreen. I believe this is one of the only movie's I have seen where the widescreen doesn't show more of the film..

Read this, especially the section near the end:

http://www.highdefdigest.com/news/show/High-Def_FAQ/Joshua_Zyber/High-Def_FAQ:_Why_Dont_the_Black_Bars_Go_Away/764

I am all for this one in HD... Bring it!

The fullscreen version of the film actually shows more than the widescreen. I believe this is one of the only movie's I have seen where the widescreen doesn't show more of the film..

That is because it was shot with a "soft matte" which means a special plate is put into the theater projector which cuts off the top and bottom making the 1.85 AR - when shown full screen we see the whole frame. This also happens for all Super 35 shot films that are shown in full screen.

And though The Abyss is great eye candy and a technological marvel in the making - it really isn't that good of a movie as far as plot and sticking to physics

Not unless Fox goes neutral. :(
They pretty much are. They aren't releasing anything on BD either :rolleyes:

One thing to keep in mind about Super 35mm is that the negative area is larger than that used for image in standard spherical or anamorphic cinematography because no space is reserved for the optical tracks (yes, even now they still exist). This is similar to the Super 16mm format. There is no such thing as a Super 35mm release print. After the widescreen image is either optically or digitally extracted, a standard anamorphic print is eventually made.

So the full apetures of spherical open matte 1.85:1 and Super 35 actually have different aspect ratios.

EDIT: I should probably have pointed out that you can get away with using that extra bit of the negative in Super 35 because you don't have to worry about making contact prints.

Also, some relevant links:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Super_35_mm_film
http://www.widescreen.org/aspect_ratios.shtml#Super35
http://www.cameraguild.com/technology/formats.htm

Read this, especially the section near the end:

http://www.highdefdigest.com/news/show/High-Def_FAQ/Joshua_Zyber/High-Def_FAQ:_Why_Dont_the_Black_Bars_Go_Away/764


Great explanation - and some outstanding shot choices as examples!

As others have said, this is a Fox property, so no HD-DVD for you *soup nazi voice*

As others have said, this is a Fox property, so no HD-DVD for you *soup nazi voice*
Yup, kind of a moot thread unless someone knows of an HD DVD-friendly non-US distributor for this film.

Of course, without this thread I would have likely missed that article by Josh Z, so it's all good.

There is an HD version floating around out there ...at least from HD broadcasts.

While cruising the Newsgroups a year ago or so, I ran across an HD .ts file of the Abyss. Unfortunately, it had embedded Japanese subtitles over it, but the picture was down right amazing. And it was only 18gigs which included a 5.1 DD track (if you aren't familiar: a .ts is a Transfer Stream envelope used in HD broadcasts. It's basically a .mpeg2).

If it looked that good at 18gigs, I can only imagine how it would look as a 25-50gig AVC.

EDIT: Oh, so my point was, there is a remastered version at least. Fox just needs to put it to disc.

Yup, kind of a moot thread unless someone knows of an HD DVD-friendly non-US distributor for this film.

Of course, without this thread I would have likely missed that article by Josh Z, so it's all good.

My whole point of asking the question was to find out, I wasn't insinuating that it did exist. Merely commenting on seeing a cover made up for it and wishing it existed.

My whole point of asking the question was to find out, I wasn't insinuating that it did exist. Merely commenting on seeing a cover made up for it and wishing it existed.
Yeah, that did sound a little harsh, didn't it. :o

Also, I forgot: Fox Pathe, which distributes it in France, is a neutral studio. So maybe there's hope. Anyone know who distributed this on DVD in Spain?

Keep an eye on the imports thread.

James Cameron, like many bigtime directors, oversees his home video transfers personally. Because he shoots in Super35, he doesn't Pan'n Scan the final, Anamorphic versions, but instead returns to the original flat negative, which has head & foot room never seen on theater screens. For flat versions, he trims a bit off the sides and adds a great deal to the top and bottom; he likes this reformatting so much he says he prefers those transfers to the letterbox versions more accurately following the theatrical presentation of the film. His philosophy is that The Abyss in a movie theater and The Abyss at home are such different experiences that they need to be reformatted ... thinking that goes against the whole concept of Home Theater (we want to watch movies, not television). Luckily, Cameron's films always came out both in letterboxed and reformatted flat versions. The director is so powerful, that fans should be grateful he didn't nix letterboxing altogether.

http://www.dvdtalk.com/dvdsavant/s85transfer.html

He said all that way back when TV's were 4:3.

he likes this reformatting so much he says he prefers those transfers to the letterbox versions more accurately following the theatrical presentation of the film. His philosophy is that The Abyss in a movie theater and The Abyss at home are such different experiences that they need to be reformatted ...

No, that's not what he said. The article you link to misrepresents his words. This is what he actually said:

"In a move which will probably be considered more radical by purists, we are offering the film in both pan&scan and letterbox formats, despite the fact that it is a 'collector's edition'-type product. I am quite proud of the pan&scan transfer of the film, and believe it to be superior in many ways to the letterbox, due to the poor resolving power of NTSC video. The film was shot in the Super-35 process to allow for improved video transfer, and the result is that the pan&scan transfer does not suffer many of the horrible cropping losses normally associated with a widescreen film. I feel it is the most dramatically involving and effective version of the film in the current low-res video medium. However, for those interested in the original framing and composition as it appeared on the big screen, the letterbox version is offered as well."

Those words were written in 1993. Technological advances such as anamorphic enhancement and progressive scan on DVD (not to mention High Definition) have since convinced Cameron that home video is fully ready for widescreen. All of his movies are available on DVD only in widescreen.

Hi Josh, actually, there's a full screen version of The Abyss on DVD, check on amazon.com :)

Well hope they bring it out,it's a damn good film.Bit like close encounters underwater!

I am all for this one in HD... Bring it!

+1

Jorge

Love the Abyss. Hope it comes to HD-DVD some way or another. If not, then I will either import or find the HD version that is "floating around". :)

This film is ripe for a fresh transfer. Not only is the current transfer non-anamorphic, but the soundtrack is the original 4-channel master used for the Dolby Surround encode. As such, the DVD's 5.1 track contains the same mono surround information copied to both surround channels. I get a better surround experience by playing back the 2-channel PCM track on the laserdisc via Pro Logic IIx.

Sanjay

James Cameron, like many bigtime directors, oversees his home video transfers personally. Because he shoots in Super35, he doesn't Pan'n Scan the final, Anamorphic versions, but instead returns to the original flat negative, which has head & foot room never seen on theater screens.Actually, I think Cameron uses a "common top" approach so he doesn't end up with extra head room. I saw a comparison chart of various extractions from the Super35 negative of 'Titanic': anamorphic 35mm release, 70mm release, hi-def cable TV transfer, SDTV/VHS version. Each had a different aspect ratio; the space above the heads remained roughly the same, they just kept dropping the matte as the aspect ratio got narrower. The fullscreen version of the film actually shows more than the widescreen. I believe this is one of the only movie's I have seen where the widescreen doesn't show more of the film.Look again at the special effects shots: they're 2.35 and have to be panned & scanned for the 4x3 transfer.

Sanjay

Actually, I think Cameron uses a "common top" approach so he doesn't end up with extra head room. I saw a comparison chart of various extractions from the Super35 negative of 'Titanic': anamorphic 35mm release, 70mm release, hi-def cable TV transfer, SDTV/VHS version. Each had a different aspect ratio; the space above the heads remained roughly the same, they just kept dropping the matte as the aspect ratio got narrower.

Indeed, here's a comparison from Terminator 2.

http://www.widescreen.org/images/super_35_example.gif

http://www.widescreen.org/widescreen_matted.shtml

Indeed, here's a comparison from Terminator 2.Something foreboding about them standing amongst barrels marked "DANGER". Too bad you can't see that in the widescreen version.

BTW, I'm sure you saw the P&S vs WS demo on the laserdisc extras. Apparently Cameron didn't just crop the image for the 4x3 version, he literally zoomed in and re-composed some shots. Wonder how many other film makers do that.

Same with the telecine demo on the DVD of 'SE7EN', where the colourist moved the 2.35 matte up and down on the Super35 image, until he got a pleasing composition (though not necessarily the same as was in the theatres).

Sometimes this stuff is so arbitrary that I wonder why purists quibble over small aspect ratio differences (e.g., 1.85 vs opening it up to 16x9).

Sanjay

And though The Abyss is great eye candy and a technological marvel in the making - it really isn't that good of a movie as far as plot and sticking to physics

Well, as far as underwater sci-fi movies go, this flick is LIGHT YEARS ahead of its competition. They have pressurization, depressurization, functional full face masks, liquid breathing, crush depth modeling, and an underwater station that looks like a real underwater station I don't know if you can really go "psycho" from pressurization but otherwise most of the film seems pretty practical.

Naturally you have to excuse all the alien stuff, but that is sci-fi for you. Compare this movie to Leviathan or Deep Star Six :)

I don't know if you can really go "psycho" from pressurization but otherwise most of the film seems pretty practical.

Depth-induced narcosis is real, and is taught in any decent scuba diving course. That said, you can manage the gas mixture to reduce the likelihood.

It's all real. Even the liquid breathing fluid is real and works on animals.

I think the movie is cut in the UK due to "cruelty to animals" (the rat breathing the fluid scene). Someone should probably inform the BBFC that the rat was never armed and never hurt in that scene (or maybe they think english childs are so stupid that they will drown rats to see if it works the same, but in normal water).

I think the movie is cut in the UK due to "cruelty to animals" (the rat breathing the fluid scene). Someone should probably inform the BBFC that the rat was never armed and never hurt in that scene (or maybe they think english childs are so stupid that they will drown rats to see if it works the same, but in normal water).

That is indeed what they think. They also have regulations against the depictions of head-butting in movies, because they think kids will imitate it.

Seriously.

Something foreboding about them standing amongst barrels marked "DANGER". Too bad you can't see that in the widescreen version.

Keep in mind that that's a single frame from a shot in motion, and one that's intercut with a number of different angles of the same scene.

Keep in mind that that's a single frame from a shot in motion, and one that's intercut with a number of different angles of the same scene.True, I wasn't considering that. Guess I like the composition of that entire frame (personal preference vs OAR).

Sanjay

Glad there is already a thread on this. It's on ScFi right now and I thought that would be a great HD-DVD get...too bad it's still on the wish list.

20th Century Fox property.

Every hd-dvd owner can import it! Nice try!

Every hd-dvd owner can import it! Nice try!

If it gets released by a HD DVD company overseas. Just because a movie CAN be released on HD DVD overseas doesn't mean it WILL be released.

http://www.widescreen.org/images/super_35_example.gif

Josh, that overlay looks like 16x9 to me. :D

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

On a side note... All this talk of 'The Abyss' got me hankering...
I saw that Fry's has it on sale for $5...
It has both the Theatrical and the Extended Cuts on 1 disc.

Which means that one side is 140 minutes long
and the other side is 171 minutes long.

Seeing as this is not a dual disc but a double disc,
one single side (4.7 Gig) will be 141 minutes long,
the other single side (4.7 Gig) will be 171 minutes long.

That EC must look absolutely horrible; probably'll look worse than a VHS-tape-to-DVD you'd record at home.

Indeed, here's a comparison from Terminator 2.

http://www.widescreen.org/images/super_35_example.gif

http://www.widescreen.org/widescreen_matted.shtml
I really think all James Cameron's super 35 movies should be released in HD as widescreen, P&S and full-frame for completeness, similar to Blade Runner's complete version approach. Personally I would like to see the extra information in the full frame, as an option: something that has never been made available before AFAIK.

Depth-induced narcosis is real, and is taught in any decent scuba diving course. That said, you can manage the gas mixture to reduce the likelihood.

Sure, narcosis, but that was taught to me as feeling intoxicated, confused, and delerious. The SEAL guy became aggressive, paranoid, and psychotic and started cutting himself, while remaining techincally skilled and coordinated enough to handle complex underwater recovery tasks and lead his team for several days. He did start to breakdown a bit towards the end, but I bet his condition was altered siginificantly to fit the story.

They also didn't have a guy explode from surfacing without decompressing, a MUST in every deep diving movie :P

Sure, narcosis, but that was taught to me as feeling intoxicated, confused, and delerious. The SEAL guy became aggressive, paranoid, and psychotic and started cutting himself, while remaining techincally skilled and coordinated enough to handle complex underwater recovery tasks and lead his team for several days. He did start to breakdown a bit towards the end, but I bet his condition was altered siginificantly to fit the story.

They also didn't have a guy explode from surfacing without decompressing, a MUST in every deep diving movie :P

What the Biehn's character suffered from was not narcosis, but HPNS, high pressure nervous syndrome. HPNS does not occur in normal air scuba diving, but is related to breathing helium-air mixtures at extreme depths, like over 500 ft. One of the premier US cave divers, Sheck Exley, was known to have suffered HPNS on several ultra-deep cave dives and met his death pursuing a 1000 ft dive in Mexico breathing multiple helium mixes. The supposition was that he was overcome by HPNS and couldn't function. The tremors shown in The Abyss are a symptom of HPNS. Under higher pressures at depth, nitrogen in air becomes narcotic; helium eliminates the narcosis, but can interfere with the nervous system. This was even mentioned in the dialog as the SEAL's entered the rig from the mini-sub.

Sorry for getting talking diving in a home theater forum, but wanted to set the story straight.:)

id also very much like to see 'the abyss' on hdm and/or an anamorphic w/s sd version. the current s.e. has 'anamorphic w/s' on back of case insert but the actual w/s movie is letterboxed w/s. bummer!

i'd go buy a bd machine just for this movie. i'll get one soon anyway, the way prices seem to be slowly coming down.

That is indeed what they think. They also have regulations against the depictions of head-butting in movies, because they think kids will imitate it.

Seriously.

Yet, they have no reservations about showing off their (often) nasty teeth.