*Not sure if this belongs here or the screen section, mods move as you see fit.*

Ok, here's the whole story. I've been using a Barco G808 CRT projector with a 120" screen for years. Since we'd be moving soon I started investigating digital projectors again. I've seen the RS1 in action, and it's clearly better than what I have. We're about to move, and I'm about to get an RS1. And getting a screen and pj are mandatory, as we're selling the 808 and screen with the house.

Thing is, I've always wanted a larger screen, so 159" would be really cool. Also due to stretching the budget, I can't afford more expensive brands than Da-Lite. Problem is, there is no way I can see table mounting the RS1 in any desirable set up, so high power is out. Pearlescent sounds undesirable with the sparlies effect, and video spectra material doesn't get that large. So I'd be stuck with a plain white screen at 159". Would that be bright enough?

If not I could drop to a 133" screen worse case scenario, and probably get video spectra. Thing is I can't imagine there is much difference between 133" and 123", so if I was limited to a smaller size, I may save a bit and go with the Vutec Silverstar.

Since I've apparently been using too large a screen for a CRT pj, it's probably still brighter than what I have. After speaking with Richard at AVS over the phone, we came to the conclusion that I need to get the pj, get moved and throw the image on a white wall at 159" and see if it's bright enough. But since I'm very impatient, I want other opinions. :D So what would you do in my shoes?

I had an XG 135 NEC FP on an old 4:3 100 inch videomatte 100 screen. My RS-1 installed this past wednesday, is much brighter than what I had, and even the 2.35:1 movies have a nice bright image. I believe the throw distance I'm using is 15.5 to 16 feet. Low mode.

Getting the RS-1 and putting it on a wall at 160" will be a fake trial, since the thing seems to lose brightness fast after 100 hours. What looks great at 0-100 hours will not look as great past that, IMO.

You're worrying too much about the HiPower material. At worst you get (perceptually, regardless what the calculator tells you) a nice unity gain screen with some stray light rejection. Mount it over your heads, try for 1.5x then. At 160" (presuming diagonal meaure, 16:9 format) you want the HiPower and the gain. At least with the HiPower you have the option of more gain if you want, by repositioning the PJ.

Once you go bright you never will want to go back. Watching dim movies is like drinking flat soda... it tastes the same but it just isn't enjoyable. Finding or setting up a mount for the thing is painless, quick, and temporary, but the brightness enjoyed from doing it right is priceless. :)

"Problem is, there is no way I can see table mounting the RS1 in any desirable set up, so high power is out."

Many of us are doing exactly that with great success; read through some of the HP threads.

I have a 133" diagonal HP with the RS1 mounted just above and behind my viewing position. I've got about 275 hours on the bulb and the image is still quite bright. My experience matches that of the graphs I've seen of bulb light output with age in that the rate of dimming now seems slower.

I think 160" would be stretching it with a unity gain screen and concur that the HP is still worth considering with a suboptimal off viewing axis pj setup. Once you see the gain you get when you are nearly on-axis you won't want to go back.

Dan

Any guestimates as to how bright the image would be with HP on a 160" diag screen, if I found a way to table mount it? See if I went smaller than 160", the Vutec Silverstar is tempting, since it's only 10" smaller than the 133" obviously.

And are you guys saying you can still get the benefit of HP with ceiling mounted to some degree? BTW, light control is a non issue, I'll have perfect light control.

EDIT: Does the silverstar need to be table mounted as well?

"And are you guys saying you can still get the benefit of HP with ceiling mounted to some degree?"

Yes.

If not I could drop to a 133" screen worse case scenario, and probably get video spectra.I'm assuming you're referring to a 16:9 format screen here. I suggest you consider a High Power in a custom size of about 147" diagonal. Da-Lite will make a custom size for you for the cost of the next higher stock size, so you would pay whatever the price for a 159" diagonal screen is. The High Power material is seamless up to a maximum of 72" high, meaning if you go any larger than 72" high your screen will have a seam in it. 72" high in 16X9 format means 128" wide and about 147" diagonal. There's no reason to stop down to the 133" if you don't want to go as big as the 159" when Da-Lite will make you a custom size. I have seen a large (139" wide cinemascope High Power screen) with a Stewart screen right next to it, each one taking up half the projected image in an A/B comparison, and the difference is night and day.

100 sq ft screen you are looking at like 4.5 fL..........IMO opinion since 12 is the goal I think you are going to be very disappointed.. just my opinion.

Art

I'm assuming you're referring to a 16:9 format screen here. I suggest you consider a High Power in a custom size of about 147" diagonal. Da-Lite will make a custom size for you for the cost of the next higher stock size, so you would pay whatever the price for a 159" diagonal screen is. The High Power material is seamless up to a maximum of 72" high, meaning if you go any larger than 72" high your screen will have a seam in it. 72" high in 16X9 format means 128" wide and about 147" diagonal. There's no reason to stop down to the 133" if you don't want to go as big as the 159" when Da-Lite will make you a custom size. I have seen a large (139" wide cinemascope High Power screen) with a Stewart screen right next to it, each one taking up half the projected image in an A/B comparison, and the difference is night and day.
Night and day in favor the HP? And was this with a ceiling or table mounted pj?

Also HP has a gain of 2.8 with a table mounted pj. Does anyone know what the effective gain is ceiling mounted? In any case sounds like 159" is out, it'll be 147" tops.

100 sq ft screen you are looking at like 4.5 fL..........IMO opinion since 12 is the goal I think you are going to be very disappointed.. just my opinion.

Art
Whats the largest size 16:9 screen, with what material(ceiling mounted), that could acheive 12 fl?

Night and day in favor the HP? And was this with a ceiling or table mounted pj?Table mounted at a really good spot. It was a shootout with four AVS members and three projectors. One member was impressed enough by the High Power he bought one soon after, a scope screen 132" wide. The other two members already have High Powers. Myself, I will buy one as well, but I would rather wait until I move so I can get one larger than what my projection room can currently handle.

Whats the largest size 16:9 screen, with what material(ceiling mounted), that could acheive 12 fl?

If you're referring to a 1.0 gain material, about 100" wide.You still could go larger and be acceptable with say 9 to 10fL but my point is a 160" screen at that gain with that projector is really unacceptably large IMO. I've seen an RS1 on a HP screen and on my screen and the quality is just night and day difference(probably 17 -18fL compared to 7.5).

Art

If you're referring to a 1.0 gain material, about 100" wide.You still could go larger and be acceptable with say 9 to 10fL but my point is a 160" screen at that gain with that projector is really unacceptably large IMO. I've seen an RS1 on a HP screen and on my screen and the quality is just night and day difference(probably 17 -18fL compared to 7.5).

Art
I'm thinking a 133" screen with HP material, even ceiling mounted should provide a very bright image yeah? Also I know HP has a narrower viewing cone, would it be normal looking for all seats within the edge of the screen? We have 3 Berkline HT seats, and they are not outside the lenght of the screen(I.e we're all in front of it).

Re. HP

This thread might be of some benefit.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=773065

ted

Thats interesting, so actually ideal mounting for the HP isn't necissarily table mounting, but shelf mounting as low as possible. Not diffucult in any room with the RS1 since it can be from 13-26ft from the screen to create a 133in image. I am concerned about the narrow viewing cone. I threw together a rough picture of where we sit. I'm in the middle, so no worries, but will those to my right and left get a respectable image without scowling at me knowing what I'm seeing? :)

http://img258.imageshack.us/img258/3502/pjviewzi4.png (http://imageshack.us)

We have curved seating as I tried to indicate.

The HP screen presents a uniform image to any viewer anywhere. Your side viewers may not see as bright an image but it will still look 'ok' to them; they won't see weird brightness gradients or hotspotting. I had seats at 40 degrees on my 133" HP (not with an RS-1 though) and it looked fine, though obviously not the same brightness enhancement as the center seats. At the end of the day, the picture looked good anywhere, so I didn't care that much about it. That's the nice thing about the HP, aside from cost... it doesn't damage the image, so at worst you have yourself a nice, flat, 1.0 gain screen that still rejects stray light, but most of the time you get at least some gain, and sometimes (with the right positioning) you get a ton of gain. You can't go wrong for most applications, imo.

Tee hee, it is amazing the range of problems we find on this forum depending on the equipment and requirements.

We have the 777/333 which is admittedly brighter than the JVC. It is throwing an 11' wide image 16:9. The projector on a stand about mid screen in height.

So when we first got it we ordered a sample of the HP material since we had read so many great things about it.

So we got the sample and excitedly put it up on the wall and...

it was so bright the image was washed out and all we pretty much saw was white and faint hints at images!

Why not buy the pj and start putting some hours on it on any ole wall since it looks like you'll need 150 or so before the bulb is at a level that would equate to what it will be like through much of its use.

And also start ordering screen samples including the HP.

Just put 'em up at your anticipated throw distance and image size before you even move, and see if it looks reasonable.

Who shold I contact about ordering screen material from? Would be nice to get even a vague idea of various materials.

Just google DaLite, Carada, etc. and call them directly.

Tell them you are setting up a home theater and requesting samples from various companies and want to check out what they've got. They'll be glad to send you the samples gratis.

Put you probably don't want to waste their time and money asking for everything they've got. Check out their websites and cross out the ones you know you don't want -- like maybe acoustically transparent screens.

You also want to ignore materials that have a gain of one or less.

Look for options with a lot of gain -- but they may appear dark on the edges unless your seating position is way back (the gain, as you may or may not know, is directional).

When you get the samples you can first put them on the center of your wall, but really, I think the test will be do they look okay on the edges. You can also compare them in different places and see if they look much much brighter in the center. That may tell you it will have a hot spot in the center that may or may not be annoying.

For what it is worth, and I'm not trying to talk you in or out of anything -- I just want you to be sure you've thought of everything BEFORE you buy -- let me tell you what was important to us.

We wanted a big screen like you do. I think our image is 144" diagonal. My wife -- and this may be more important than you realize -- loves the "pop" of a plasma tv. Me, I like contrast more, but liked the pop too (I also like colour accuracy).

She wanted a big plasma. Me, I wanted a pj.

My research, which I did a lot of, told me I would need a lot of lumens to give her the pop and still light up a big screen.

When AVS had the InFocus/Kodak 777/333 special I was torn between that and the Sony Pearl. I finally found a Pearl lighting up a big screen. I sat there and thought "wow, how dull, and what a let down."

Now the 777/333 I got had the older DMD in it so contrast is definately nothing to write home about. Regardless, I am 100% sure I made the right choice.

It is a three chip DLP projector, the colours are pretty nuts-on (I think Kodak set, or had InFocus set, the colour on these modified 777s known as the 333s). No rainbow effect possible as there is no colour wheel.

We also got a video processor as I wanted to utilize as many pixels as possible when going from 1080i input to 720p output.

Yup, I still made the right decision getting a 720p projector instead of a 1080p projector. I know there are almost twice the pixels on the 1080 but I'm not sure I could see the difference from my seating position.

The image has incredible depth and the images just come out at you. With a big screen you really feel like you are there and a bright projector like that just lights it up.

On the so-called white side of the blackout cloth we have the blacks aren't fantastic, but they are good enough.

Oh, I should also have made clear that we don't have a dedicated screening room. We use this in our living room with light walls, a white ceiling and plenty of ambient light during the day.

A bright projector just overcomes a lot of those problems. If I had a room with black walls, ceilings, and opaque windows and a smaller screen, I certainly would have gotten a 1080 projector with greater contrast.

Now you certainly can get 1080p projectors with great contrast and tons of light. I know there a several three chip 1080p projectors now. I think they are $30,000 or more.

If you really want to light up a big screen and won't have a dedicated dark walled room, why don't you consider looking for a new InFocus 777. It is still only 720p, but does have a newer DMD with greater contrast. Importantly, you could probably afford it. Consider a processor like the Calibre Vantage HD or something different, to not lose any pixels scaling from 1080i. The built-in processors on many, most, or all, 720 pjs or tvs take one of the 540 frames and upscale it to 720.

This is probably why many folks see a huge improvement going from 720 imaging units to a 1080 unit when most of the content is 1080i.

In contrast, a separate video processor will take both 540 frames and deinterlace them into 1080p, and then downscale the image to 720p. And thus not throwing away any of the image as happens when you are just upscaling 540.

Standard def is pretty much going to suck on any 1080 or 720 projector, though a processor is going to help a lot.

HD, however, is going to freaking rock and unless you are sitting closer than 15' to 18' or so to that big screen (don't see how you could enjoy being closer), you aren't really going to be able to see the pixels.

Anyway, just food for thought.

Many folks here are really fanatical about the contrast, and while I certainly agree it makes for a much better image -- especially for me as I love scifi movies that have many dark scenes -- I wouldn't make the trade off of having to have a much smaller screen and maybe a closer sitting position.

If you really want a big screen consider just getting a brighter projector.

Hehe, there is very little you could say to talk me out of the RS1, especially with a 720p projector. I thought my CRT at 1080i was sharp, and had a nice 3D effect with HD-DVD and Blu Ray(and it does really). After seeing the RS1 there is nothing else, it's truely the most stunning image I've seen from projector or plasma. Plus I do have a dedicated blacked out HT room all ready for it.

I'll definitly give Da-Lite a call today.

Hehe, there is very little you could say to talk me out of the RS1, especially with a 720p projector. I thought my CRT at 1080i was sharp, and had a nice 3D effect with HD-DVD and Blu Ray(and it does really). After seeing the RS1 there is nothing else, it's truely the most stunning image I've seen from projector or plasma. Plus I do have a dedicated blacked out HT room all ready for it.

I'll definitly give Da-Lite a call today.

Darn you, it's talk like that that will get me buying another sooner rather than later! :p

plissken99,

My situation was similar to yours. I went from a CRT to the RS1... and then realized I could go larger than my 110" screen. I was all set on a Carada. I kept dismissing HP because of the viewing cone aspects, wanting to celing mount etc. I happened to see a HP screen (I am the forum member hrd mentions) and was so impressed that I made it work in my room. A little creativity goies a long way. This past Saturday the CRT finally came down from the ceiling. It is done...

Once you go HP, there's no going back. I also went CIH (132" wide) and I've never been happier with my theater.

You really have to do some measurements of viewing angle. The HP set over ones shoulder is probably best in that it puts your head as close to the same angle from the screen as the lens.The HP is very uniform ,unlike gain angular reflective screens which all hot spot to some degree. The issue is the mounting position and the viewing cone. If you are seated and stand up and you are outside the viewing cone the gain goes from 2.5 or so to less than one ! Even one seat right in the middle the seat beside it won't be as bright.My theater has thirteen seats and with a High Power three seats would be in positive gain if at or near ceiling mount.

Check the viewing cone numbers get out a tape and find out. Probably with only three seats you should great though.

Art

I wouldn't bother getting screen samples. The brightest always looks best, and you have to get pretty far from optimal before it's down to 1 gain.

In your situation the only reason I can think of to rule out the HP is if there's uncontrolled ambient light coming from the same vicinity as the pj.

You really have to do some measurements of viewing angle. The HP set over ones shoulder is probably best in that it puts your head as close to the same angle from the screen as the lens.The HP is very uniform ,unlike gain angular reflective screens which all hot spot to some degree. The issue is the mounting position and the viewing cone. If you are seated and stand up and you are outside the viewing cone the gain goes from 2.5 or so to less than one ! Even one seat right in the middle the seat beside it won't be as bright.My theater has thirteen seats and with a High Power three seats would be in positive gain if at or near ceiling mount.

Check the viewing cone numbers get out a tape and find out. Probably with only three seats you should great though.

Art

In my setup there is zero difference in brightness when standing or sitting. I think this has to do with the fact that my projector is at max throw.

I have four seats in my front row. The outside two are slightly dimmer than the inside two, but not enough of a dif to bother anyone or reduce enjoyment of the film. I have to walk into a doorway (on the side of my theater) to see the image start to dim to the point that it may be an issue. My theater is 14.5 feet wide and 25 feet long.

I wouldn't bother with screen samples either - I'd spend more time planning your setup. I went from a celiing mount (CRT) to a shelf mount (in back of room) and it took a little creativity, but now I have an awesome setup.

In my setup there is zero difference in brightness when standing or sitting. I think this has to do with the fact that my projector is at max throw.

I have four seats in my front row. The outside two are slightly dimmer than the inside two, but not enough of a dif to bother anyone or reduce enjoyment of the film. I have to walk into a doorway (on the side of my theater) to see the image start to dim to the point that it may be an issue. My theater is 14.5 feet wide and 25 feet long.

I wouldn't bother with screen samples either - I'd spend more time planning your setup. I went from a celiing mount (CRT) to a shelf mount (in back of room) and it took a little creativity, but now I have an awesome setup.

This is not what I saw at Darin's 10' HP and RS1. One seat was at the center and had obviously better gain than the seat right next to it 18" from exact center or less !

Art

I didn't say there wasn't any gain difference horizontally. In my case I don't have one center seat but two (and they are identical because the angle is the same for both of them). The outer seats have less gain, but not substantially such that you wouldn't want to sit there.

I was mostly trying to say that while I expected the gain to drop as I sat down (my 2nd row is on a riser and the projector had to be mounted high enough to not interfere), it doesn't.

In your situation the only reason I can think of to rule out the HP is if there's uncontrolled ambient light coming from the same vicinity as the pj.

Another reason might be that you wish to have your speakers behind the screen.

It really sounds like HP will be the way of things, I'll just have to do some figuring. I went ahead and requested samples, took 2 minutes on the phone with Da-Lite, and it's free, so why not?

I spent hours with other local HT enthusiasts, looking at samples. It got very confusing very fast. We never were able to conclude much, if anything from the exercise. I'll add to the chorus. We have our PJ ceiling mounted and the HP screen. No issue. Gain difference between sitting and standing is imperceptable. As we move off center to the right or left, you can see the reduction in gain, but it's uniform accross the screen (magic?), so all seating positions look good. I have a sofa along the wall that is outside the edge of the screen and while it's not as bright as the center seating, it's very watchable. From your sketch, you will have no problems with the HP. To maximize the gain, pick your ceiling mount pipe length to get the PJ as low as you can w/out being a head knocker. I think you'll be happy with the results.
Gordon

As felxable as the pj is, unless we end up with a freakishly long room, I think shefl mounting on the back wall will be a no-brainer.

As flexable as the pj is, unless we end up with a freakishly long room, I think shelf mounting on the back wall will be a no-brainer.

Another reason might be that you wish to have your speakers behind the screen.

Or one has a wide room, multiple tiers of seating (30 degree from the projector).

Art

Also how close should the projector be? Should i make it as far back from the screen as possible, or as close as possible? Does closer yeild more brightness?

Oh, is this projector calculator on Projector Central fairly accurate(as far as ft lamberts)? http://www.projectorcentral.com/JVC-DLA-RS1U-projection-calculator-pro.htm

If thats accurate the image in the store(a 96in Firehawk), has 16 ft lamberts. A 147in HP would have 14ft lamberts, where a 133in HP would have 17...

Closer = brighter.
Further = more contrast.

The RS1 has plenty of contrast so you may want to exploit brightness by having it a bit closer (so as bulb dims you have plenty in reserve).

I went with max throw because it worked better for my room - from where I wanted to conveniently place the projector for my HP screen... with the added benefit that max throw works really well with certain anamorphic lenses.

Going by the pj central calculator. To achieve the same brightness as the one in the store, it needs to be about 21ft back with a 147in HP, and closer even brighter, and we don't know what sort of room we're gonna end up with yet. So I guess once that gets nailed down, we'll go from there.

Here is my take on it as I own a RS1. I've seen it on a 10 foot wide 1.0 gain screen with a new bulb it looked good. My screen is 120" diag it's rather bright on a 1.0 gain screen however it was much brighter on my 1.3 screen. IMHO I think 160 is way too big even with gain, but what it comes down to is will it look okay to you. I know people with rather large screens using a single G90 and they really like it.

Just remember it might look really good to you with a new bulb but as it ages it will loose light output.

You have a number of issues. First is the HP screen, if you can get the projector within the screen's height you will get the full benefit from the screen. It doesn't have to be mounted dead center of the screen's height to achieve this.

The further back you place the PJ the more contrast you will get and although you may lose a few lumens it will make better angles for using with a HP screen. I wouldn't worry about this too much with the JVC it doesn't have that short of a throw. Place it where it is most appropriate and least obtrusive in your room.

160" is Ok for the JVC with HP but you might fall below 12ft/l as the bulb nears its useful life. I'd probably replace the bulb at 1000-1500 hours and keep the old ones for spares in case of a failure.

Lastly, I wouldn't sacrifice audio for a super size screen. If your speakers are going to get pushed in the corners and the center is going to be on the floor or ceiling I would reconsider your choice for a screen this size.

Hope this helps.

Bob

Well due to the limitations of HP, the largest the screen can be is 147in(don't want any seems). And since we don't yet have a house picked out, I'm gonna see what happes. It's either gonna be a 133in or 147in screen, depending on room size. As to how far back the JVC will be...

More than likely whatever size room we end up in, it will be mounted on a shelf on the back wall, so I'll either get uber brightness, uber contrast or the best of both(i.e halfway).

Sorry I may have missed this somewhere. What is the HP?

Larry

Sorry I may have missed this somewhere. What is the HP?

Da-Lite's High Power screen material

Okay I can actually speak with some authority on this. Not because I'm a videophile :) but because I have exactly the setup you're asking about, an RS1 and 159" diag Da-Lite HP screen.

There is absolutely no question about it, it's a perfect combination, the image is stunning on low bulb mode. I can even watch clearly with every light in the room on although it's not nearly as dramatic so I usually keep the lights off for the immersion effect.

You'll be thanking me for a long time if I help change your mind and stick with the 159", if your room fits it.

I went from a 120" 4:3 on my old PJ to this new combo and with the right movie it's awe inspiring, and I don't even have great content yet, just HD direcTV signal in 1080i. I'll take some still pics tonight since Fifth Element is on to give you some ideas.

There's no reason you can't ceiling mount it with extension bars. I have mine mounted just behind the seating area on a shorter part of the ceiling (7'9") and the bottom of the PJ sits at 5'7" from the floor, almost dead center of the screen. I'll put a little table below it with some flowers or something to prevent people trying to walk under it and whacking it. I'll just list off the specs of how I have things setup and state that it is amazing and you'll without question be extremely happy with it, if you have complete light control it's a no brainer.

PJ mounted with lens 16'6" from screen, seating head position is 14'6" from screen. Bottom of PJ is at 5'7" with ceiling mount. Screen is 159" diag Model C Da Lite HP. Ceiling where screen is mounted is 9'. When unrolled the viewing area of the screen starts at 8'2" and bottom at about 20.5". That puts the center point at 59". You could mount it lower with longer extension bars and get an even more gain but I see no reason to, with the PJ lens 2 feet above my eyes and 2 feet behind me I'm thrilled to death with the results.

All I can say is you'll never regret going big like this. It makes a movie really feel like a movie, not a really big TV. Also forget about any concerns with having a seam in the larger size screen, I was worried about that when ordering. Now that I've had it for a few weeks I can't find it and I've been looking with all the lights on in the room.

Kevin

Hrmmmmmm... yeah the seem is what I was concerned about primarily. According to the projector calculator here, I'd get 15 or 16FL with a 159in screen. Plus at AVS they say the custom 147in screen will be more expensive.

Yours is a pulldown? Any wrinkles at all? I was gonna go with the more exensive perm wall.

BTW, pics would be awesome!

Okay took a couple pics, had a little trouble with the auto focus on the camera trying to take over. I'll try to resize these. Sorry 159" is big (kidding) Please ignore the kids toys as well, the room is still being built...

http://www.winternet.com/~aspi/5th1.jpg

http://www.winternet.com/~aspi/5th2.jpg

I got screen samples from Dalite today, incluind a hi power screen sample. First off, the viewing cone is narrow, from the main seat it's very impressive, not so much for the others(solution, I'll drop the curved seating, bringing them closer together, so not very worried about that).

However, and this may be why HP and CRT projectors are a no-no, but it destroys the black level. When the screen goes totally black(i.e, the projector is outputting no light), everything is black. However when the HP is on a black part of a given frame where there are ligher parts around it, it's like a grey square on a black screen. Honestly, how good is your blacl level with HP and RS1?

I'd forget the results you're getting from a little sample in trying to evaluate viewing angle etc. Please note the second picture above is being taken from outside the edge of the screen and beyond the outside edge of the outer seat in a curved three seat setup. The cone is not very narrow at all. When in a light controlled room you'll see just peachy from even a 4 or 5 wide curved seat set.

I wasn't aware CRT projectors and HP are a no no, where did you get that from? I'm certainly not an expert but I'd think that HP would actually be even more benefit to a CRT with limp light output. Blacks look great to me with the RS1, although contrast is a strong suit for the RS1 to begin with.

Something about the way the light from CRT hits the screen, it would cause lots of hotspotting. Anything with a higher gain than 1.3 with CRT is supposed to be bad.

Actually it's some color shift because of the different angles the 3 beams hit the screen, exacerbated by CRT's hortish throw of about 1.5:1 (IIRC).

But would there be wrinkles in a hi power pulldown screen? That would sure save money if not.

Wrinkles don't matter with the HP so much because the light is reflecting toward the direction it came, regardless of a contour change in the screen. The temporary 159" I have up right now has some wrinkles and you can't see anything but the image on the screen.

Wrinkles don't matter with the HP so much because the light is reflecting toward the direction it came, regardless of a contour change in the screen. The temporary 159" I have up right now has some wrinkles and you can't see anything but the image on the screen.
That screams perm wall to me, I can't believe wrinkles make no difference. When I had a pulldown in the beginning, panning shots in movies drove me up a wall. Think it'll have to be a perm wall.

"I can't believe wrinkles make no difference."

Yet another remarkable trait of the HP is its insensity to waves in the screen.

So no waves on panning shots?

Thats one huge screen you have there Tutmos, I've been dying to see some screenshots. Amazing and very well done. How big is your room? I decided to go with the Carada 16.9 126 diaganol to be on the safe side. Also pairing it with the HD1. Should have stuck to the 134 but didnt think I would have the space to make it work. Again well done.

That screams perm wall to me, I can't believe wrinkles make no difference. When I had a pulldown in the beginning, panning shots in movies drove me up a wall. Think it'll have to be a perm wall.
It doesn't show waves but I can tell you already that you will never be ok with it just because you subconsciously know they're there, even if you can't see them. You're already worrying about the screen in a huge (pun intended) way, so no, don't torture yourself with any waves at all.

But if you are handy with a staple gun and a power drill... buy the pulldown and cut the thing off the roller. It's not very difficult at all. The hard part is getting and finding a clear spot for the 10-12ft long case in the house in the first place.

I would have done a permanent wall mount if I'd had the option, not because I worried about waves or anything else, I just think they look better. Sadly I have a chair rail that runs around the room and I wasn't going to cut it up to stick a screen in the middle of it. I'm sure you can get some kind of a deal from Da-Lite if you're planning on just cutting it out of a roll up. I know they have a ton of dented case roll ups that get returned to them, I have two 159" screens here, the one on the wall and a black one on the floor that are both going back because of dents from the factory or shippers.

I have already ordered my Firehawk G3 165" 16:9, I am wondering that, in terms of brightness would that be possible to fit my 165" screen?

interesting thread
I own an HD1 on a scope flat non curved 400cm wide screen, 1.4gain microperf.
black room
but the gain and the microperf is a problem as the paint is revealed too much, and so the screen structure. also colors are affected (too flashy for instance).
the upgrade will be a CURVED 1.12 non painted microperf screen. tested samples and the result is very good no structure visible from 2.7m and beyond. accurate colors (no paint)
A screen must be invisible. The SR loses 20% brigthness and the fabric (seams) can be visible.(depends on viewing distance).
I wouldnt go to 4meters 16/9 with the RS1/HD1 (and definitely not with other machines like the sharp, marantz, etc)
but 4meters scope (315cm 16/9), pj at 6.7meters (so mid throw) is an excellent compromise, bright (and still in normal lamp but i raised offset by 10-15 on the RGB (while adjusting the color temp though). it gives a boost while staying in normal lamp.
One has to realise a giant screen implies compromises with our <1500ansi pjs.
It implies also changing the lamp more often (1000hrs?) but at $300 who complains?
the curve will give more brigthness towards the audience and fits well the ISCO pincushion.

so, voilà :D

Thanks for your comment, I chose RS1 because my throw distance is limited to 5.6 meters (18.6 feet) only RS1 can display my 165" screen in full screen. Is there any other projectors that you can recommend?

nope :D (as of today)

............
However, and this may be why HP and CRT projectors are a no-no, but it destroys the black level. When the screen goes totally black(i.e, the projector is outputting no light), everything is black. However when the HP is on a black part of a given frame where there are ligher parts around it, it's like a grey square on a black screen. Honestly, how good is your blacl level with HP and RS1?

That was the impression I got, that the higher gain screens raise the peak whites but with that the floor on the black level is equally raised. So if you watch a lot of movies with dark scenes, such as sci-fi and horror movies then the higher gain screens may not be best. If you're coming from a CRT, and used to or like the inky blacks you might really notice some compromise there.
Art Sonneborn had to go to a 3chip DLP light canon to fill his large screen and to get acceptable black levels compared to his stacked G90s, a high gain screen may have given him the brightness on a lesser projector on a large screen but black levels would have been unacceptalbly high.

I know I don't have to say this, but please correct me if I'm wrong since I'm still in the process of deciding which screen ,95x53 to scope with lens to 125x53 for the RS1 coming from a G70, and wanting to get the best level black possible in a total light control dark gray wall/floor room.
joe

good point on high gain indeed. i'm going to the alsmot neutral non painted screen myself.
but it's first for colorimetry and screen visibility (paint+holes= no!) reasons

as things evolve, there will be a family of RS.... for all kinds of screens

Art Sonneborn had to go to a 3chip DLP light canon to fill his large screen and to get acceptable black levels compared to his stacked G90s, a high gain screen may have given him the brightness on a lesser projector on a large screen but black levels would have been unacceptalbly high.

But contrast is linear, so while Art's light cannon may give adequate whites on a low gain screen the depth of the black level is still limited by the CR of the projector. That is, a high lumen projector does the same thing to black levels as a high gain screen. Again... contrast is linear. Try running some lumen/cr/gain/black level numbers.

But contrast is linear, so while Art's light cannon may give adequate whites on a low gain screen the depth of the black level is still limited by the CR of the projector. That is, a high lumen projector does the same thing to black levels as a high gain screen. Again... contrast is linear. Try running some lumen/cr/gain/black level numbers.

If I recall correctly, Art did comment that the SimHT5000's performance on low APL scenes was not quite as good as the RS1, but in every other category it was superior for his large micorperf screen. Of course he might have said that referring to his G90 stack, which would be stating the obvious!
joe

"If I recall correctly, Art did comment that the SimHT5000's performance on low APL scenes was not quite as good as the RS1, but in every other category it was superior for his large micorperf screen. Of course he might have said that referring to his G90 stack, which would be stating the obvious!"

This has nothing to do with your original statement, which is flawed as erkq pointed out.

I am using a RS-1 on a 140" wide approx 152" diagonal 2.35 screen. It seems to be plenty bright, but i am still under the 100 hr mark.

For comparison,

I have a Sony Pearl firing on a 133" diagonal 16:9 screen in the same room. the 16:9 screen is fixed and the 2:35 screen is motorized in front of it. The RS-1 on the large screen is just as bright as the Pearl on the smaller!

One last note... Im not using an anamorphic lens, I just never could get happy with the pencusion affect. So if you use a lens you would be even brighter.

Both of my screens are Draper Clarion M1300 Matte White!!!

i'd say the isco lens will make the image in scope look more cinematic, less digital. the RS1 is too sharp :D (of course one can defocus a tiny bit)
for movies i prefer sharp but not dead on sharp to the point of seeing either the source pixels or the pj mirrors (if it's a dlp).. the DILA structure is invisible.

i'm of the school of those who worship a nice clean panavision on a 8-10Meters wide screen theater, from a brand new fresh film print (before it's "used" after a few screenings)