First, it's only $499. Second, for that you get a Blu-Ray player, a very good DVD upconverter, and the ability to stream from media servers. That's forgetting about games and forgetting about anything else they may be adding over the next few months. Its a great deal.

It's amazing that people spend so much on a good TV then worry about a couple of hundred dollars when it comes to buying things to take advantage of the TV.

I agree with your comments. The "Premier" Blu Ray player that happens to do several things that other Blu Ray stand alone players can't do is a bargain if you consider what you are buying into. Some people only assume that the PS3 is only THIS (games) or THAT (movies)....I dare to say that its simply the quintessential home theater system out of the box (no, I am not a sony fanboy, but the 360 does not have a hd-dvd player out of the box.....yet.....and yes I know you can download HD content.....ps3 can do that soon enough...)

Your last comment rings alot of truth. When buying a TV, you should consider what you will connect to it, not the other way around. IMO this permits a little extra future proofing (lack of a better phrase) and overall a better experience.

PS: You can pick up PS3's for under 450$ on craigslist. However, thats like playing russian roulette

According to Time Warner, 300 has quickly become the fastest selling high-def movie of all time, shifting more than a quarter million copies since its release a little over a week ago. The Spartan epic, easily outpaced The Departed and Casino Royale which both took a couple months to hit just 100,000 sold.

When broken down between format types, 65% of consumers picked up 300 on Blu-ray, while 300 on HD-DVD accounted for only 35% of the sales. According to the USA Today article, this mirrors sales for the year with Blu-ray handily trampling HD-DVD with solid 2:1 sales.

The HD-DVD cabal can pretend that PlayStation 3 sales don't impact the high-def format war (a point they try to make in every single press release they send out), but it's clear that they're wrong. The PS3 has made a huge impact on the ridiculous format war, and this latest piece of info just drives that home. The real question at this point isn't "Who will win?" but instead "How long until Universal and Toshiba just give up and go Blu?".



http://www.ps3fanboy.com/2007/08/08/300-on-blu-ray-sells-a-ton-300-on-hd-dvd-not-that-much/

I love how the Red Boys come over to the BD Forum to deflect attention away from the Blockbuster of the Year (Evan Almighty) by bringing up a Sony movie released SIX years ago (Final Fantasy).


Gingers...
If BD owners are smurfs, HDdvd ones are "gingers"

(or redheads...)

http://img119.imageshack.us/img119/9949/kylelq0.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

;)

They will announce neutrality when HD-DVD dies.

HD-DVD will die soon after Universal announces neutrality.

According to Time Warner, 300 has quickly become the fastest selling high-def movie of all time, shifting more than a quarter million copies since its release a little over a week ago. The Spartan epic, easily outpaced The Departed and Casino Royale which both took a couple months to hit just 100,000 sold.

When broken down between format types, 65% of consumers picked up 300 on Blu-ray, while 300 on HD-DVD accounted for only 35% of the sales. According to the USA Today article, this mirrors sales for the year with Blu-ray handily trampling HD-DVD with solid 2:1 sales.

The HD-DVD cabal can pretend that PlayStation 3 sales don't impact the high-def format war (a point they try to make in every single press release they send out), but it's clear that they're wrong. The PS3 has made a huge impact on the ridiculous format war, and this latest piece of info just drives that home. The real question at this point isn't "Who will win?" but instead "How long until Universal and Toshiba just give up and go Blu?".



http://www.ps3fanboy.com/2007/08/08/300-on-blu-ray-sells-a-ton-300-on-hd-dvd-not-that-much/


There have been numerous posts on the net about this article saying it is missing major counts of other places the movie was sold, like Amazon.com for one. Can anyone verify this?

According to Time Warner, 300 has quickly become the fastest selling high-def movie of all time, shifting more than a quarter million copies since its release a little over a week ago. The Spartan epic, easily outpaced The Departed and Casino Royale which both took a couple months to hit just 100,000 sold.

When broken down between format types, 65% of consumers picked up 300 on Blu-ray, while 300 on HD-DVD accounted for only 35% of the sales. According to the USA Today article, this mirrors sales for the year with Blu-ray handily trampling HD-DVD with solid 2:1 sales.

The HD-DVD cabal can pretend that PlayStation 3 sales don't impact the high-def format war (a point they try to make in every single press release they send out), but it's clear that they're wrong. The PS3 has made a huge impact on the ridiculous format war, and this latest piece of info just drives that home. The real question at this point isn't "Who will win?" but instead "How long until Universal and Toshiba just give up and go Blu?".



http://www.ps3fanboy.com/2007/08/08/300-on-blu-ray-sells-a-ton-300-on-hd-dvd-not-that-much/
Well for all intensive purposes, there has been from what i've read on this forum alot more copies of the BD version of 300 than the HD-Dvd version. So I don't think it really means a lot in going by percentages sold. A lot of stores have sold out of the HD 300, where as there are still copies of the BD in store. If they both had the same numbers in store in the first place then yes it would be a true representation of the figures.

ok, ok...as I remember it...when I was a kid both beta and VHS were both rentble at the video store...I had friends who's parents paid like a thousand dollars for a Beta max machine and we only paid 400 dollars for our VHS...yeah we, although not poor, couldn't afford the other...low and behold who won??? Dudes!!!! It's how much it cost you to get it! Do you think the average joe wants to fork out a paycheck for a player after he finally got his $3000 HDTV?? The bottom line is price...why do you think HD DVD is gaining momentum?? Because the average joe can afford it...plain and simple. I believe it is the sony big heads that refuse to listen...mind you, I also read that Sony is aready losing money on the cost of their players now. It is a great technology, but released too soon because of pressure from Toshiba's HD DVD. IMHO!

ok, ok...as I remember it...when I was a kid both beta and VHS were both rentble at the video store...I had friends who's parents paid like a thousand dollars for a Beta max machine and we only paid 400 dollars for our VHS...yeah we, although not poor, couldn't afford the other...low and behold who won??? Dudes!!!! It's how much it cost you to get it! Do you think the average joe wants to fork out a paycheck for a player after he finally got his $3000 HDTV?? The bottom line is price...why do you think HD DVD is gaining momentum?? Because the average joe can afford it...plain and simple. I believe it is the sony big heads that refuse to listen...mind you, I also read that Sony is aready losing money on the cost of their players now. It is a great technology, but released too soon because of pressure from Toshiba's HD DVD. IMHO!


Players for bluray haven't even been out an entire year. And your logic is flawed, Blurays are outselling HD-DVD. By this time next year expect Bluray players to be $200.

Far be it for me to inject something pertinent to the discussion of Universal, but here's some thoughts from a biased source on another biased source. :)

http://www.hollywoodinhidef.com/blog_detail.php?id=107

Note: HollywoodInHighDef.com is run by 20th Century Fox, so take the spin on the article with a hefty grain of salt.

There's no longer any question as to who's keeping the hi-def format war alive, or why.
It's Universal Studios and the top home entertainment exec, by his own admission.

I had been hearing over the last few days that various Blu-ray Disc manufacturers have been offering Universal plenty of incentives to join the parade but that Universal was walking away from the table every time without any reasonable objection.
Now we know why.

Universal president Craig Kornblau told me this week that the studio actually wants the format war to continue.
He also said Universal is getting financial incentives to create exclusive HD DVD features such as the Xbox Live component for the upcoming "Heroes" release.
"I’m not going to tell you that we don’t cut financial deals with people every day," he says.

But he has rationale for all of the above.
Kornblau says Universal does the same as every other studio in cutting deals to utilize another company's technologies and services.

But Kornblau says Universal's position is not driven by deals but by a long-term and consumer-focused strategy that is supported by Universal parent NBC and corporate owner GE. Universal never initially wanted a war, he says, which is why the studio made a decision years ago to back only one format.

Of course, that's the same position taken by Disney as well as Fox; the only difference being they individually chose the opposing format for a number of their own reasons, not the least of which is that each independently told me from the beginning that they believe that Blu-ray will ultimately offer the most consumer satisfaction and that the technology represents a full step forward in technology -- not a half-step -- to ensure the longest-term value for consumers. And, most importantly to Fox from the outset and now others as well, an extra layer of protection against piracy.

However, now that the market has evolved as it has, Kornblau says the hi-def format war has been "the very best thing that ever happened for consumers, retailers, and, frankly, studios" -- everyone except consumer electronics manufacturers -- because it has driven prices down further and far more quickly than would have been the case if there had been only one format in the market. (CE manufacturers are no small exception since they were among the primary groups driving the introduction of hi-def discs in order to restore the profit into their business that long ago evaporated with $49 DVD players from China. The format war has already forced some manufacturers to start subsidizing their hi-def players.)
Without the format war, Kornblau believes that even after more than a year in the market, the lowest-priced players would still be priced out of reach of most consumers at more than $1,000 and they would only drop to $800 or $900 over the next year or two.

Of course, that's impossible to know for sure and it's a bit of a faulty premise if you consider that PlayStation 3's, which play Blu-ray Discs and are by far the top-selling hi-def disc player of either format, were introduced last November at $600. As for the cause and rate of price declines in players, 10 years ago the cost of DVD players dropped about 20% in the first year and another 30% in the second year without any format war, according to "CE Historical" at the Consumer Electronics Assoc. web site www.ce.org.

With Universal the only holdout in sticking with HD DVD exclusively, Kornblau reluctantly concedes that HD DVD's position is just fragile enough that if Universal decided to release in Blu-ray now, it would have a serious, if not life-threatening impact on the future of HD DVD. So in addition to weighing how his decision will impact the studio, he now must also factor in the potential demise of the HD DVD format entirely if Universal would opt to release its movies in Blu-ray.

For now, that's not something Kornblau is willing to risk. He says Universal chose HD DVD initially because it offered the least expensive hardware and software manufacturing costs and immediate across-the-board interactivity and connectivity in all HD DVD players. "To this date, nothing's changed," he suggests.

Kornblau believes interactive and connected features are essential for the success of any hi-def disc platform, especially as more and more consumers realize that they can buy a DVD player for $129 that upconverts their DVDs to near-hi-def quality.

"DVD would not have grown to a $16 billion market if all we did was put movies on a disc," he said. Enhanced features are even more critical for the success of hi-def discs, which do not offer as many revolutionary distinctions from DVD as did DVD over VHS.

In fact, Kornblau says the lack of comparable interactivity and connectivity in Blu-ray as compared with HD DVD at this point is why Universal refuses to go the same route as Warner and Paramount in releasing in both formats but being forced to offer less interactive and connected features on the Blu-ray versions, such as Warner's new "300."

Hmmm, with the notable exception of the "U-Control" interactive feature that Universal introduced on several titles last year, the studio hasn't exactly been blazing many trails of innovation with content that couldn't be delivered on Blu-ray Discs and even DVDs in many cases. Warner has been leading that charge with web-enabled features introduced on "Blood Diamond" and continuing through last week's "300." After about a year-and-a-half in the market, Universal's first web-enabled feature will come courtesy of Microsoft on the Aug. 28 release of "Heroes."

And, not for nothing, but early results of "300," at a record 250,000 copies sold in the first week, show that at least 65% of those sales went to Blu-ray. Some expected the numbers to skew even further in favor of Blu-ray given it's appeal to the PlayStation 3 demographic.

Meanwhile Blu-ray promises even more dynamic connectivity features with its new "BD Live" component in Blu-ray players and titles coming as early as this fall, as well as further enhancements to its "BD-J" interactive technology.

Kornblau, who was kind enough to speak with me very frankly in the midst of a hectic time, also conceded that Universal could not have picked a worse time to be carrying the torch for HD DVD in terms of strong releases to help support its position and the platform.
Although Kornblau referred to his studio's weak movies over the past 9 months, Universal's release slate has been pretty dismal for the last several years. The studio had only two theatrical films in the top 30 at the domestic box-office in 2005 and it's lone top 20 title last year was 18th-ranked "The Break-Up," with $119 million, according to Boxofficemojo.com. After suffering through the first six months of this year with its biggest hits being the sleeper romantic comedy "Knocked Up" and the financial disaster "Evan Almighty," Universal is finally enjoying a solid franchise hit with last weekend's "The Bourne Ultimatum" opening with $69 million.
Kornblau sees all that as setting up a big fourth-quarter for his studio on the home entertainment and hi-def fronts, starting with "Heroes," followed by four $100 million-plus titles, "Knocked Up," "Evan Almighty," "I Now Pronounce You Chuck and Larry" ($92 million after 3 weeks), and "Bourne Ultimatum."

But that's pretty much the highlight for the rest of the year as far as programs available exclusively on HD DVD.
Almost everything else will be on Blu-ray, either exclusively or along with HD DVD, including everything from Steven Spielberg's first hi-def disc release, "Close Encounters of the Third Kind," exclusively on Blu-ray, to most of the top-grossing movies of the year, such as "Spider-Man 3," "Pirates of the Caribbean: At World's End" (both only on Blu-ray) "Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix" (not announced as yet); "300," "Ratatouille," "Wild Hogs," and "Blades of Glory" (the latter three only on Blu-ray). And as soon as Fox rejoins the BD party with its MGM distribution in tow -- which everyone hopes will be soon -- that studio could release its trio of summer hits exclusively on Blu-ray, "The Simpsons Movie," "Live Free or Die Hard," and "Fantastic Four: Rise of the Silver Surfer."

Even if, for the sake of argument, you go along with Universal's belief that the format war is driving prices down more quickly, Kornblau admits that there is only a limited window of time for which this situation can be interpreted as beneficial for consumers, retailers, and studios. He says that window will start to close when players drop to a price of $200 and consumers start making their choice, which is what will guide Universal's ultimate course.

So that’s the story. Universal did not want the format war and Kornblau believes the studio did not initiate the war, but he and the studio are now intentionally and strategically keeping the format war alive for what they believe is for the good of the consumer, retailers and studios while awaiting a clear consumer preference for Blu-ray or HD DVD once prices drop to $200. Universal chose HD DVD because costs were lower and it had about a year’s head-start on some interactive features and web connectivity.

Okay, Kornblau has always been straight with me so I have no reason to believe he doesn’t truly believe most, if not all of that.

But if consumers are already showing a 2-1 Blu-ray preference for every movie released in both formats months before Blu-ray introduces its more sophisticated web-connected and interactive features and even while HD DVD is riding a low-price advantage of about $150 - $200, it’s difficult to envision consumers becoming less interested in Blu-ray when all those features debut amid a flurry of the year’s biggest movies exclusively on Blu-ray.

When that point comes, on behalf of those of us who don’t believe that prolonging the format war is a good thing, I hope that Kornblau and Universal are quick to respond to the will of consumers and end this war.

In the meantime, I guess those customers who are already choosing Blu-ray will have to live without hi-def versions of "Knocked Up," "Evan Almighty" and "I Now Pronounce You Chuck and Larry" for awhile.

Well for all intensive purposes, there has been from what i've read on this forum alot more copies of the BD version of 300 than the HD-Dvd version. So I don't think it really means a lot in going by percentages sold. A lot of stores have sold out of the HD 300, where as there are still copies of the BD in store. If they both had the same numbers in store in the first place then yes it would be a true representation of the figures.

There have been plenty of stores, including Amazon, that have sold out of the BD versions as well. They got more in for a reason because BD as a whole sells better. This fact has been documented every week for this enitre year. BD didnt just "win" this one battle because stores didnt order enough of the HD version.

If you believe Universal was looking to drive prices down for the benefit of the consumer by it's continued exclusive support of HD-DVD, I'll make you a real good deal on some beachfront property in Siberia. Retaliation for prior litigation against Sony coupled with financial considerations from corporations behind HD-DVD hardware.

It would be fairly easy to ride Universal out if Fox would get back in the game.

Here's how I see it. When sales numbers are in for 4th Qtr 2007, Universal will have no choice but to go dual-format. I mean they will have so much pushing them that way, it will be impossible to ignore and for them to continue to put-up a war of words as to why they should remain HD-DVD exclusive will seem even more foolish then it alread does.

I will make a unique prediction now and that is that "Transformers" will end this format war once and for all. Following on the heals of "300's" dual-release success and how it appears Blu-ray is dominating the sales of "300", I feel this domination will be amplified for "Transformers" perhaps to the tune of 80/20 or 75/25 in favor of Blu-ray. Paramount will release a PR statement similar to WB's saying Transformers is the first movie to sell 500k in HD Optical in a week of which 375k+ were on Blu-ray. This will make the "decision-makers" at GE see the lost revenue of not releasing on the dominant format and thus pushing them to go dual-format in early 2008 when their rumored contract to release exclusively on HD-DVD through 2007 has expired.

Coupled with the Transformers numbers will be the overall sales numbers for the 4th Qtr 2007 and that too should show Blu-ray sales domination, especially with Fox back in the game, WB releasing Batman Begins, V for Vendetta and possibly The Matrix trilogy and the Exclusives such as the Spider-Man Boxset, POTC3, Ratatouille, The Simpsons Movie, Live Free or Die Hard, and "Fantastic Four: Rise of the Silver Surfer, Universal will have no logical choice but to go dual-format; Universal's management structure will demand it, their stockholders will demand it, GE will demand it and most importantly their customers (all of us) will demand it.

~Josh

Wow, I just can't believe how fanatical people on BOTH sides of this discussion can be. *Dominating* sales? You call <2:1 margin a "domination" (assuming the sales numbers are correct)? And over a combo disk no less?

Geez folks, neither format is doing great right now against DVD, and that's a fact. It is also a gross overstatement that BD 300 is "dominating" HD 300 in sales. 65-35? If this were a presidential election and we were measuring popular vote count, THAT would be a domination. This is not.

With that said, I bought the BD version. :D EFF COMBOS!

Wow, I just can't believe how fanatical people on BOTH sides of this discussion can be. *Dominating* sales? You call <2:1 margin a "domination" (assuming the sales numbers are correct)? And over a combo disk no less?

Geez folks, neither format is doing great right now against DVD, and that's a fact. It is also a gross overstatement that BD 300 is "dominating" HD 300 in sales. 65-35? If this were a presidential election and we were measuring popular vote count, THAT would be a domination. This is not.

With that said, I bought the BD version. :D EFF COMBOS!

Once HD-DVD goes completely away, then BD can concentrate on taking over DVD. I think when you own 66% of the market that is pretty good. That is just my opinion.

Once HD-DVD goes completely away, then BD can concentrate on taking over DVD. I think when you own 66% of the market that is pretty good. That is just my opinion.

Sure its a good thing for BD, but overall, when the market is 1% (I really dont know the percent), it makes no difference.

IMO, neither of these formats will ever overtake DVD.

Wow, I just can't believe how fanatical people on BOTH sides of this discussion can be. *Dominating* sales? You call <2:1 margin a "domination" (assuming the sales numbers are correct)? And over a combo disk no less?

Geez folks, neither format is doing great right now against DVD, and that's a fact. It is also a gross overstatement that BD 300 is "dominating" HD 300 in sales. 65-35? If this were a presidential election and we were measuring popular vote count, THAT would be a domination. This is not.

With that said, I bought the BD version. :D EFF COMBOS!

neither format is doing well? are you kidding - they just over took VHS sales!

i mean, its quite a feat to over take a format you never even see in stores anymore.

The bottom line is price...why do you think HD DVD is gaining momentum??

I must be pretty dense, because I just don't see where all this new momentum for HD DVD is coming from.

For the past 6 weeks, percentage of Hi-Def disk sales:

70% BD
65% BD
66% BD
61% BD
74% BD
66% BD

I wish the stock market were that consistent.

Once HD-DVD goes completely away, then BD can concentrate on taking over DVD. I think when you own 66% of the market that is pretty good. That is just my opinion.

I think Dell would have no problems with 35-40% of the PC market share. Or Verizon with 35-40% of the cell phone market share. Etc. etc.

Would any company like the best market share they can get? Yeah. But heck the Mac last I checked has single digit market share (8% I think) and is still alive and kicking.

35-40% is anywhere from 1 out of 3, or 2 out of 5 customers. That's a big big percentage.

So you think the red side will maintain 30ish percent market share through the end of the calendar year?

neither format is doing well? are you kidding - they just over took VHS sales!

i mean, its quite a feat to over take a format you never even see in stores anymore.

LOL

So you think the red side will maintain 30ish percent market share through the end of the calendar year?

I personally won't speculate about future market share specifics for either format. I will say this though. Logic dictates that more than just player prices need to be cheaper for mass adoption of either format. From the HD DVD folks, you keep hearing that their disks are so much easier and cheaper to mass produce than BD because of using the same production lines (with tweaks of course). Yet time and time again you see their disks priced evenly with BD or > BD in the case of combos.

And both formats are egregiously overpriced in a mass adopter's mind. It's going to take more than cheap, one-time HW purchases to convince Joe HDM Clueless to buy into HDM. The BDA is doing a much better job at marketing than Tosh and Co. But I wonder how much it really matters, considering BD and HD DVD are so much more expensive to buy into, unlike VHS and/or Beta were. Not only do you have fairly pricey players, but you also have hideously priced movies. AND you have to buy a "newfangled", expensive HDTV to appreciate the content.

Now tell me where my father's motivation to buy into these formats is going to come from. I'll answer my own question, it's not coming from anywhere unless he gets a free Sony player with his Marriott Rewards points next year.

Sure but you were the one saying about how the HD DVD market share is really good. You don't really think it will not erode even more in the next few months?

I think Dell would have no problems with 35-40% of the PC market share. Or Verizon with 35-40% of the cell phone market share. Etc. etc.

35-40% is anywhere from 1 out of 3, or 2 out of 5 customers. That's a big big percentage.

But: there are only two hi-def formats. There are probably a dozen PC makers, and I wouldn't begin to guess how many companies make cell phones. Ask Pepsi if they want to be outsold 2:1 by Coke.

The point about personal computing is flawed, flawed, flawed.

Apple Computing was in serious financial trouble up until the point when they introduced the iPod. Their single-digit market share almost killed the company, and would have if they hadn't diversified.

I'm not saying Toshiba will go out of business because of HD DVD if its market share drops to similar levels, but just like PC software, everything works with PC, hardly anything runs on a Mac, and that's the same situation we'll end up with in Blu-ray vs. HD DVD if Blu-ray ends up with 90%+ market penetration.

But: there are only two hi-def formats. There are probably a dozen PC makers, and I wouldn't begin to guess how many companies make cell phones. Ask Pepsi if they want to be outsold 2:1 by Coke.

Actually if I'm not mistaken, they are. KO has a worldwide penetration that PEP does not enjoy. However, KO is saturated virtually to the limit unless they diversify like PEP has been doing.

OK enough of OT.

Sure but you were the one saying about how the HD DVD market share is really good. You don't really think it will not erode even more in the next few months?

I'm not insinuating either format's market share is good. They suck, period. Compared to each other, it's <2:1. That is hardly a domination on any level.

The point about personal computing is flawed, flawed, flawed.

Apple Computing was in serious financial trouble up until the point when they introduced the iPod. Their single-digit market share almost killed the company, and would have if they hadn't diversified.

I'm not saying Toshiba will go out of business because of HD DVD if its market share drops to similar levels, but just like PC software, everything works with PC, hardly anything runs on a Mac, and that's the same situation we'll end up with in Blu-ray vs. HD DVD if Blu-ray ends up with 90%+ market penetration.

You can attack my point all you want and my intent was not to take this as OT as it's going. However, 35-40% is still 35-40%. It's not a death knell and noone can spin it as such, in and of itself. It would be pure and complete idiocy to do so, thereby ignoring 4 tenths of a market base.

Like I was alluding to above, none of this really matters. There's only one number that counts to consumers, and that is price. And the price of media for these formats is prohibitively expensive. Mass adoption will not come for either format anytime soon unless they do something fast about media prices.

But: there are only two hi-def formats. There are probably a dozen PC makers, and I wouldn't begin to guess how many companies make cell phones. Ask Pepsi if they want to be outsold 2:1 by Coke.

There are a DOZEN PC makers but there really only 2 or 3 operating systems available. (Windows, Mac, Linux) And since Mac is the only one who's OS is made strictly for their comps...8% IS 8%. No way around it.

But: there are only two hi-def formats. There are probably a dozen PC makers, and I wouldn't begin to guess how many companies make cell phones. Ask Pepsi if they want to be outsold 2:1 by Coke.
WHo said anyone from HD DVD Wants to be outsold by 2:1? That is just the reality and whether anyone wants it or not, they have to live with it.

Well for all intensive purposes, there has been from what i've read on this forum alot more copies of the BD version of 300 than the HD-Dvd version. So I don't think it really means a lot in going by percentages sold. A lot of stores have sold out of the HD 300, where as there are still copies of the BD in store. If they both had the same numbers in store in the first place then yes it would be a true representation of the figures.


Thats not really saying anything more than you said before as it still doesn't answer my question about whether that article was missing sales totals from other selling points the article did not include, again such as Amazon.com

Also I am not sure I follow your logic, if the article is suggesting there were more Bluray version of 300 sold, that how do you say it follows there are more copies left in the store of the Bluray version rather than the HD-dvd version unless the article had specific prestock starting points? and that would be unequal starting points obviously

I am trying to follow along here, maybe I missed something.

Thats not really saying anything more than you said before as it still doesn't answer my question about whether that article was missing sales totals from other selling points the article did not include, again such as Amazon.com

Also I am not sure I follow your logic, if the article is suggesting there were more Bluray version of 300 sold, that how do you say it follows there are more copies left in the store of the Bluray version rather than the HD-dvd version unless the article had specific prestock starting points? and that would be unequal starting points obviously

I am trying to follow along here, maybe I missed something.
Ok how's this. Stores have more stock of BD version of 300 right. So say for instance 70 BD's and 50 HD's. If they sell all of the 50 HD Dvd version and 60 of the BD version. There isn't enough HD Dvd to go around, so the numbers aren't a true representation of what it would be like if the shops had an equal amount of disks. I have read in the HD forum of a lot of members trying to find there version but it is all sold out because there wasn't enough HD sent out to shops in the first place.
By the way I have ordered the BD version, but it has been held up because of ratings. They say it is because of the extra content, but I thought the BD version was the movie only. Go figure.

There would be no reason for Warner to supply the stores with equal amounts. BD has almost two thirds of the market so the BD production should probably mirror that. Whatever the ratio produced it wouldn't make sense for it to be 50:50. It would need to be some amount in favor of BD sales since those sales are expected to be greater.

Thats not really saying anything more than you said before as it still doesn't answer my question about whether that article was missing sales totals from other selling points the article did not include, again such as Amazon.com




A quick check of amazon and the BD of 300 is #10 in DVD best sellers (was actually at #2 for awhile!) and the HDdvd is #15.
Everyday when I've checked, the HDdvd was NEVER higher than the BD.
So I'd wager that Amazon sold more BDs of 300 than HDdvds...

:)

There are a DOZEN PC makers but there really only 2 or 3 operating systems available. (Windows, Mac, Linux) And since Mac is the only one who's OS is made strictly for their comps...8% IS 8%. No way around it.

Yes, there's no question that the MacOS represents a niche market. But Apple has always made a profit on their Macs, even when they held only 2-3% of the total personal computing market. Why? Because they own 100% of their niche market. They have no competition for the MacOS within their niche.

Similarly, hi def DVD's are also a niche market (actually in worse shape, as many posters here have correctly pointed out, since the sum of BD and HD DVD is only 1% of SD DVD's). It will be hard for this niche market to make headway against SD DVD's under the best of conditions. Personally, I am not optimistic about the long-term survival of a format (HD DVD) that owns only 30% of this niche market. That is the core reason why I predicted that Universal will turn neutral within the year. And if I'm wrong I'll admit it.

Yes, there's no question that the MacOS represents a niche market. But Apple has always made a profit on their Macs, even when they held only 2-3% of the total personal computing market. Why? Because they own 100% of their niche market. They have no competition for the MacOS within their niche.

Similarly, hi def DVD's are also a niche market (actually in worse shape, as many posters here have correctly pointed out, since the sum of BD and HD DVD is only 1% of SD DVD's). It will be hard for this niche market to make headway against SD DVD's under the best of conditions. Personally, I am not optimistic about the long-term survival of a format (HD DVD) that owns only 30% of this niche market. That is the core reason why I predicted that Universal will turn neutral within the year. And if I'm wrong I'll admit it.

The thing that helps Universal and the other neutral studios in the long run, will be the combo disk. They wont need to supply a SD DVD version of every movie. Just the combo disk. That actually breaths more life into HD DVD. Prices of these combos will drop to DVD new release costs now. That will help Universal and other studios alot. Which could be why you see alot of studios go neutral. To save money by not producing a single SD DVD and producing for HD DVD at the same time, via the combo. HD DVD can survive with SD DVD for years this way. Something BD has yet to produce, is a good way to coexist with SD DVD. Which will be around for years. Costing BD studios huge money to produce, package and ship 2 disks of every movie. I think this alone keeps Universal confident in their position. Combos will save them money in the long run. Going neutral and supporting BD now will cost them more. Staying in their position for now is smart. They know the HD DVD combos can cut overall production costs in half. That is something that BD cant do at the moment.

Yes, there's no question that the MacOS represents a niche market. But Apple has always made a profit on their Macs, even when they held only 2-3% of the total personal computing market. Why? Because they own 100% of their niche market. They have no competition for the MacOS within their niche.

Similarly, hi def DVD's are also a niche market (actually in worse shape, as many posters here have correctly pointed out, since the sum of BD and HD DVD is only 1% of SD DVD's). It will be hard for this niche market to make headway against SD DVD's under the best of conditions. Personally, I am not optimistic about the long-term survival of a format (HD DVD) that owns only 30% of this niche market. That is the core reason why I predicted that Universal will turn neutral within the year. And if I'm wrong I'll admit it.

I'll be honest here. With each passing day, I think we get closer to a Uni neutral stance. Why? Not because of any lack of potential with the HD DVD format; au contraire, I think it's the "consumer" format and I love it. But I think Tosh has really, really effed the pooch in this war and it doesn't make any business sense for Uni to stay exclusive unless they receive HUGE incentives for 2008. And when I say huge, I'm talking serious bucks.

Not that any of this really matters to me...I'll continue to buy HD DVD exclusive movies.

I'll be honest here. With each passing day, I think we get closer to a Uni neutral stance. Why? Not because of any lack of potential with the HD DVD format; au contraire, I think it's the "consumer" format and I love it. But I think Tosh has really, really effed the pooch in this war and it doesn't make any business sense for Uni to stay exclusive unless they receive HUGE incentives for 2008. And when I say huge, I'm talking serious bucks.

Not that any of this really matters to me...I'll continue to buy HD DVD exclusive movies.


I'd agree with you wholeheartedly. I truly think the 4th Quarter is going to really move some hardware with that release schedule. The BDA is bringing out the guns and going right for the throat with the content.

I started pro HD DVD last year.. then started to have problems with my A1, at the end of 2006 a lot of my movie were chugging. I kept my movie and waited for the A2.... saw the thread and there's still a lot of problem with playback.

I then sold half my movies on Ebay, still keeping the must have title and bought a PS3 and have 40 bluray title , not even once i had any kind of trouble since Feb 2007. Still waited with my HD DVD... then checked what title where exclusive and figured out that the only title i wanted from Uni this year (so far) where Shaun of the Dead and Hot Fuzz.. than i sold my remaining HD DVD and i'am now BR Only.

I know that HD DVD still have Matrix , V and Batman that are HD DVD exclusive for now. Heroes interested me also since i didn't saw it and everyone i know say it was good.. but hey i made a choice. If Uni still exclusive and i can buy a player for 199$CAD (not the 360 add on, the real thing) i probably will

Ok how's this. Stores have more stock of BD version of 300 right. So say for instance 70 BD's and 50 HD's. If they sell all of the 50 HD Dvd version and 60 of the BD version. There isn't enough HD Dvd to go around, so the numbers aren't a true representation of what it would be like if the shops had an equal amount of disks. I have read in the HD forum of a lot of members trying to find there version but it is all sold out because there wasn't enough HD sent out to shops in the first place.
By the way I have ordered the BD version, but it has been held up because of ratings. They say it is because of the extra content, but I thought the BD version was the movie only. Go figure.

I haven't looked at the extras, but within the movie itself are some pretty "steamy" sex scenes. I don't know how New Zealand's ratings work, but that may have something to do with the holdup.

Universal could release their Spielberg titles tomorrow if they wanted, they do not need his permission at all. He did not MAKE Universal retract the announcement either. The only problem is Universal WANTS Speilberg's permission. To WANT and to NEED are a huge difference. They do not want to risk getting on the bad side of one of the biggest names in Hollywood.

With that said, I think Spielberg is just a little ticked at Universal for some previous experiences and wants to see them squirm a little bit. Universal will release his films in due time....with or without his permission.

From the digital bits :
''There's another issue here that's worth mentioning as well. Just a few minutes before the exchange above, Graffeo was asked by an audience member about the possibility of Steven Spielberg's films appearing on HD-DVD. I believe it happens at the end of video clip #4 on the HTF. Now... you may recall that earlier this year (on 1/29 to be exact), the HD-DVD Promotional Group had listed a number of Spielberg films on their website with the suggestion that they were "Coming Soon" to HD-DVD, including Jaws, E.T. and Jurassic Park. But shortly after they were posted, which caused an understandable stir, the Group removed the titles from the site and posted a retraction. To my knowledge, nothing more on the subject of Spielberg on high-def came to light until Graffeo was asked by an audience member (at the EMA panel two weeks ago) about the possibility of Spielberg films on HD-DVD. Here's his answer:

Graffeo: In regards to the Spielberg, um... it wasn't... Steven wanted to wait for DVD til there was a higher penetration for that. Um... right now, with 100... 200,000 players and 150,000... he wants to wait til there's more penetration. Because, um... you know when you do release... and Jaws was the first Steven Spielberg that we came out with, and at that time we released we sold a million units. More than we'd ever sold on VHS. But you have to have, sort of like... I don't want to say critical mass, because you had close to 3 or 4 million households that had players... but it's too early now. And I think we have to work very close with our filmmakers because they have a very big part in what we do.

Okay... I bought that argument and I think so did everyone else at the panel. And that would have been the last word on the subject... EXCEPT that just a week later, Sony announced at Comic-Con the first Steven Spielberg film to be released on high-definition, Close Encounters of the Third Kind, EXCLUSIVELY on the Blu-ray Disc format (on 10/2). Huh? Something doesn't jive here. Given his position within the industry, and Universal's close ties with Spielberg over the years, how did Graffeo not know this was coming just a week later? And for those of you who would say that Sony controls CE3K and not Spielberg, I was told directly by Sony reps at Comic-Con that Spielberg personally approved the high-def transfer of the film. Not only that, he's recorded a new interview just for the Blu-ray release. So he HAD to have approved this. How does Universal not know that was coming? In what light does that cast Graffeo's comments at EMA from just a week earlier? And, maybe even more to the point, what does it say about Spielberg's opinion of, and position on, this high-def format war, when his first high-def disc release is a Blu-ray Disc exclusive? Add to that Lucasfilm producer Rick McCallum's comments from a few weeks ago at the Star Wars Celebration convention in Europe, to the effect that if Hollywood doesn't get its you-know-what together and end this format war soon, Lucas might bypass high-def discs altogether and release the Star Wars films in high-def via download only. What does all that say about how good this format war REALLY is for consumers, regardless of Universal's belief that having helped to drive hardware prices down so quickly justifies their position? Who, at this point, does continuing this format war really benefit?''

The thing that helps Universal and the other neutral studios in the long run, will be the combo disk. They wont need to supply a SD DVD version of every movie. Just the combo disk. That actually breaths more life into HD DVD. Prices of these combos will drop to DVD new release costs now. That will help Universal and other studios alot. Which could be why you see alot of studios go neutral. To save money by not producing a single SD DVD and producing for HD DVD at the same time, via the combo. HD DVD can survive with SD DVD for years this way. Something BD has yet to produce, is a good way to coexist with SD DVD. Which will be around for years. Costing BD studios huge money to produce, package and ship 2 disks of every movie. I think this alone keeps Universal confident in their position. Combos will save them money in the long run. Going neutral and supporting BD now will cost them more. Staying in their position for now is smart. They know the HD DVD combos can cut overall production costs in half. That is something that BD cant do at the moment.

Sorry, but the combo disk is stupid. People with high-def don't need the standard def and don't want it wasting space that could be better used, never mind the extra cost. People with standard DVD don't want to pay extra for something they can't use. I'd also be willing to be that both formats take a picture quality hit when they try to shove both on disk. It's just a stupid idea.

Sorry, but the combo disk is stupid. People with high-def don't need the standard def and don't want it wasting space that could be better used, never mind the extra cost. People with standard DVD don't want to pay extra for something they can't use. I'd also be willing to be that both formats take a picture quality hit when they try to shove both on disk. It's just a stupid idea.

I'm not a fan of the combo disc idea, but the only "wasted space" would be for disc art. I don't think we're at a point where you'll see double sided discs with both sides in HD (WB's vapor TotalHD idea, notwithstanding).

combo disc on hd will do better as the price goes down.If its close to the same price as a dvd then many will buy it thinking they will go hd when the player hits 100 or lower.I have both 2 hd and 2 ps3 players and have about 20 disk of each.I still buy a dvd if its 14 and the hd or blueray is 34.

Jay_Davis, no... both formats don't take a picture hit. The combo HD DVD/DVD discs are two sided. Both sides can be full capacity dual layer. (The only thing you lose is disc art.) However, the "Twin" HD DVD/DVD format, which is extremely rare currently, is a single sided disc with 3 layers of HD DVD or Standard DVD content... so, that would have a space impact.

Personally, I think it's smart... especially if it didn't impact the end cost. DVD playback is universal, unlike HD. But I just don't see it happening as the norm... and, as such, it will have little impact on the success or failure of any format.

Sorry, but the combo disk is stupid. People with high-def don't need the standard def and don't want it wasting space that could be better used, never mind the extra cost. People with standard DVD don't want to pay extra for something they can't use. I'd also be willing to be that both formats take a picture quality hit when they try to shove both on disk. It's just a stupid idea.


Stupid to you, but a very viable answer to the HD media disk and SD disk problem. Right now all studios involved in HD media are taking a huge production hit by making 2 disks for each movie. Some even 3 disks. Combo disk eliminates the need for one of those disks. At the same time, saving the studios money in overall production. How is that stupid? When, and if, there is a single HD format winner. The real war will begin. HD vs. SD dvd. The combo disk makes this war a non issue. BD, if it is the last standing, has no such anwer to the SD dvd war. As I said before, when HD media infringes on shelf space, the combo disk will start to replace the SD only versions of movies. Right now, combined disks available dont amount to a whole lot of floor space. So its a non issue. By the time they start to faze out the SD versions and go with combos only. Combos prices will have dropped to DVD prices now. Maybe a little bit more, but not by much. Media prices will come down thats a given.

From the digital bits :
''There's another issue here that's worth mentioning as well. Just a few minutes before the exchange above, Graffeo was asked by an audience member about the possibility of Steven Spielberg's films appearing on HD-DVD. I believe it happens at the end of video clip #4 on the HTF. Now... you may recall that earlier this year (on 1/29 to be exact), the HD-DVD Promotional Group had listed a number of Spielberg films on their website with the suggestion that they were "Coming Soon" to HD-DVD, including Jaws, E.T. and Jurassic Park. But shortly after they were posted, which caused an understandable stir, the Group removed the titles from the site and posted a retraction. To my knowledge, nothing more on the subject of Spielberg on high-def came to light until Graffeo was asked by an audience member (at the EMA panel two weeks ago) about the possibility of Spielberg films on HD-DVD. Here's his answer:

Graffeo: In regards to the Spielberg, um... it wasn't... Steven wanted to wait for DVD til there was a higher penetration for that. Um... right now, with 100... 200,000 players and 150,000... he wants to wait til there's more penetration. Because, um... you know when you do release... and Jaws was the first Steven Spielberg that we came out with, and at that time we released we sold a million units. More than we'd ever sold on VHS. But you have to have, sort of like... I don't want to say critical mass, because you had close to 3 or 4 million households that had players... but it's too early now. And I think we have to work very close with our filmmakers because they have a very big part in what we do.

Okay... I bought that argument and I think so did everyone else at the panel. And that would have been the last word on the subject... EXCEPT that just a week later, Sony announced at Comic-Con the first Steven Spielberg film to be released on high-definition, Close Encounters of the Third Kind, EXCLUSIVELY on the Blu-ray Disc format (on 10/2). Huh? Something doesn't jive here. Given his position within the industry, and Universal's close ties with Spielberg over the years, how did Graffeo not know this was coming just a week later? And for those of you who would say that Sony controls CE3K and not Spielberg, I was told directly by Sony reps at Comic-Con that Spielberg personally approved the high-def transfer of the film. Not only that, he's recorded a new interview just for the Blu-ray release. So he HAD to have approved this. How does Universal not know that was coming? In what light does that cast Graffeo's comments at EMA from just a week earlier? And, maybe even more to the point, what does it say about Spielberg's opinion of, and position on, this high-def format war, when his first high-def disc release is a Blu-ray Disc exclusive? Add to that Lucasfilm producer Rick McCallum's comments from a few weeks ago at the Star Wars Celebration convention in Europe, to the effect that if Hollywood doesn't get its you-know-what together and end this format war soon, Lucas might bypass high-def discs altogether and release the Star Wars films in high-def via download only. What does all that say about how good this format war REALLY is for consumers, regardless of Universal's belief that having helped to drive hardware prices down so quickly justifies their position? Who, at this point, does continuing this format war really benefit?''

Spielberg is pissed at Universal for lowballing Dreamworks during the buyout talks. His endorsement of CE3K on Blu-ray is a big middle finger to Universal, in my opinion. His refusal to release his movies on HD-DVD up to now is probably also an extension of that contempt.

Graffeo obviously can't tell the public that Spielberg is mad at Universal, so he comes up with a story that sounds plausible, and makes Spielberg sound like he's format-neutral, but completely loses credibility when it becomes obvious that Spielberg was indeed actively involved in the BD CE3K release.

I don't know how Graffeo would be able to spin it now-- it looks pretty bad for Universal.

Universal can most definitely release ANY spielberg title they want. Permission is NOT required.

anyone know in terms of total gross where Close encounters ranks with other Spielberg titles? Is this a top grosser with mass appeal say compared to Jurassic Park or ET?

I like how Bill spins this into a Spielberg backs BD issue....it's probably got nothing to do with a format. PoTC sold 50K or so titles between part 1 &2 combined - so I am assuming this title sells fewer than that. So tier 1 titles like ET or Jurasic Park for an HD release probably have much more extensive work done....Uni probably does not have a lot of minor Spielberg work, since that is where most of his best work was done. JMHO.

So Fox is not releasin on BD because they are pissed at the format? How does Mr. Bill spin that one? Did he even bring that up? Did he ever ask why so many BD titles were cancelled this year? He is a shameful propagandist....unethical and without integrity IMO.

Universal can most definitely release ANY spielberg title they want. Permission is NOT required.

anyone know in terms of total gross where Close encounters ranks with other Spielberg titles? Is this a top grosser with mass appeal say compared to Jurassic Park or ET?

I like how Bill spins this into a Spielberg backs BD issue....it's probably got nothing to do with a format. PoTC sold 50K or so titles between part 1 &2 combined - so I am assuming this title sells fewer than that. So tier 1 titles like ET or Jurasic Park for an HD release probably have much more extensive work done....Uni probably does not have a lot of minor Spielberg work, since that is where most of his best work was done. JMHO.

So Fox is not releasin on BD because they are pissed at the format? How does Mr. Bill spin that one? Did he even bring that up? Did he ever ask why so many BD titles were cancelled this year? He is a shameful propagandist....unethical and without integrity IMO.


So, you are saying Graffeo is lying when he says,"In regards to the Spielberg, um... it wasn't... Steven wanted to wait for DVD til there was a higher penetration for that. Um... right now, with 100... 200,000 players and 150,000... he wants to wait til there's more penetration. Because, um... you know when you do release... and Jaws was the first Steven Spielberg that we came out with, and at that time we released we sold a million units. More than we'd ever sold on VHS. But you have to have, sort of like... I don't want to say critical mass, because you had close to 3 or 4 million households that had players... but it's too early now. And I think we have to work very close with our filmmakers because they have a very big part in what we do."

If they don't need his permission, why the need for a retraction about the other movies? Why not just leave them out there without a release date for added buzz?

plazman, since the other thread was closed before I read your response.

Quote:
Originally Posted Plazman
Quote:
Originally Posted by briankmonkey
Thank god my math teacher wasn't an HD DVD fanatic, or maybe it would be better for my savings account if he was Absolutely hilarious

Krinkle, you dam well know the hd dvd fanatics hate facts, you must stop immediately

Are you in school or college? I am assuming school since college usually has profs. teaching classes. I was wondering what you do....you clarified it now since HD DVD has been around for only a year now. My math profs and teachers has no clue about HD DVD or BD.....not even DVD

So the theory that the most rapid BD supporters are high schoolers with PS3 game consoles is probably true then....

Basic math is something I was taught long before attending college, actually long before high school as well. So much for another theory of yours, maybe one day you'll get one right ;)

Did it really take you that long? Was this due to your studies focusing primarily on analogy's about ethics with Sony and apartheid in South Africa? Well as long as you picked up on the essentials eventually that's all that matters. I'm glad the professor was able to bring you up to speed. :)

lol plazman. give me a break.

you know why Universal wont release a hd-dvd title from spielberg yet. let me break it down for you.

if Universal should chose to release a title without Spielberg haven't it approved . it will backfire.

let me explain. Universal announce lets say Jaws. Steven will announce that he had nothing to do with the decision of it and did not approve the movie to be released. you know what that will do PR level wise in the minds of people?

it would totally destroy the dignity of Universal in the minds of people. and will have a backfire on HD-DVD as well on Universal.

if Universal would really be stupid to release a Steven spielberg movie without being aproved by steven spielberg. it is gameover HD-DVD. simple as that. and not only that. but i am sure Steven would tell Paramount not to release Transformers for HD-DVD.

and do you really think Paramount would say no to steven. they would say dont worry Steven we are not concerned with the nickels that hd-dvd makes. we will release Transformers only on dvd and bluray.

Bill is just smart. he saw a weak point in Graffeo defense and he attacked it. simple as that. so why is it then unethical for bill to mention? should we all just be blind and live up with the lies Universal feeds us?

Spielberg is a powerhouse. Universal cannot just willy nilly release his works or they would have already, so would Paramount and WB. I'll bet Sony would not have released CE3k on Blu-ray without his blessing.

Spielberg and Lucas say "jump!" and the studios reply with "how high, sir!?"

Jay_Davis, no... both formats don't take a picture hit. The combo HD DVD/DVD discs are two sided. Both sides can be full capacity dual layer. (The only thing you lose is disc art.) However, the "Twin" HD DVD/DVD format, which is extremely rare currently, is a single sided disc with 3 layers of HD DVD or Standard DVD content... so, that would have a space impact.

Personally, I think it's smart... especially if it didn't impact the end cost. DVD playback is universal, unlike HD. But I just don't see it happening as the norm... and, as such, it will have little impact on the success or failure of any format.

Yeah, the couple I saw in hand (as opposed to just the package) must have been the "twin" format. But every one I've seen costs more. If you have HD-DVD you want to spend extra for the standard def version why?

Besides, the studio likes selling you the same thing multiple times: original DVD, special edition DVD, anniversary DVD, high def (Blu-Ray or HD-DVD), high def special edition, etc... So its better for them to have the current standard def people buy the DVD than buy the high-def version later.

Sorry, the idea doesn't work for the consumer or the studios. This is just another weak argument by HD-DVD supports desperate to hang onto hope. The studios can save money by not bothering with HD-DVD.

Ok how's this. Stores have more stock of BD version of 300 right. So say for instance 70 BD's and 50 HD's. If they sell all of the 50 HD Dvd version and 60 of the BD version. There isn't enough HD Dvd to go around, so the numbers aren't a true representation of what it would be like if the shops had an equal amount of disks. I have read in the HD forum of a lot of members trying to find there version but it is all sold out because there wasn't enough HD sent out to shops in the first place.
By the way I have ordered the BD version, but it has been held up because of ratings. They say it is because of the extra content, but I thought the BD version was the movie only. Go figure.


Okay you seem to be wandering here a bit here. this was my original post which can be seen above on this page.

"
There have been numerous posts on the net about this article saying it is missing major counts of other places the movie was sold, like Amazon.com for one. Can anyone verify this?"

I think you may be trying to suggest not everyone had sufficient inventory, which is fine. That is not what I asked or posted about however, what I orignally posted is that the article saying so many more copies were sold on Bluray is said to be missing major sources of other places the movie 300 was sold, like Amazon.com, among others.

Spielberg is a powerhouse. Universal cannot just willy nilly release his works or they would have already, so would Paramount and WB. I'll bet Sony would not have released CE3k on Blu-ray without his blessing.

Spielberg and Lucas say "jump!" and the studios reply with "how high, sir!?"
"Today, Spielberg, arguably the most powerful man in Hollywood, is worth $3 billion."

from......................
http://www.forbes.com/2007/03/06/celebrity-billionaires-rich_07billionaires_cz_lk_0308celebrity.html

Any wise owls out there know who is arguably the most powerful wo-man (the strongest of the sexes, I'm convinced) in Hollywood..........well, I'm talking executives, not talent.

the strongest of the sexes, I'm convinced.

there are more than 2 sexes?

Spielberg fully endorsed the new release of CE3K. He even did a new interview for the Sd and BD releases and the BD has exclusive content.

:)

Any wise owls out there know who is arguably the most powerful wo-man (the strongest of the sexes, I'm convinced) in Hollywood..........well, I'm talking executives, not talent.
At one time it was Ms. S. Lansing...dunno about now....

"Today, Spielberg, arguably the most powerful man in Hollywood, is worth $3 billion."

from......................
http://www.forbes.com/2007/03/06/celebrity-billionaires-rich_07billionaires_cz_lk_0308celebrity.html

Any wise owls out there know who is arguably the most powerful wo-man (the strongest of the sexes, I'm convinced) in Hollywood..........well, I'm talking executives, not talent.

Don't know if she fulfills the 'executive' requirement, but Oprah certainly springs to mind. :rolleyes:

When she calls mr. Spielberg to invite him on the show to talk about his new film, he probably asks: 'When do you want me to come?'

Any wise owls out there know who is arguably the most powerful wo-man (the strongest of the sexes, I'm convinced) in Hollywood..........well, I'm talking executives, not talent.


Amy pascal?

Amy pascal?
YES !

And without a doubt (IMO), I might add. ;)

there are more than 2 sexes?
XXXY (mosaic) karyotype

When she calls mr. Spielberg to invite him on the show to talk about his new film, he probably asks: 'When do you want me to come?'
That’s an interesting way to verbalize it, if true.

I would expect Universal to go neutral about the same time as Sony...

Spielberg is a powerhouse. Universal cannot just willy nilly release his works or they would have already, so would Paramount and WB. I'll bet Sony would not have released CE3k on Blu-ray without his blessing.

Spielberg and Lucas say "jump!" and the studios reply with "how high, sir!?"To give this some perspective, Universal has been releasing a high percentage of the top stuff from 2003-2006 already, as I have pointed out before. And if we look at a list of Universal's top 20 box office draws in the US all time that I saw elsewhere with color codings as shown:

red = Spielberg title (not announced or released)
blue = released or announced
green = not announced and not a Spielberg title

1. E.T.: The Extra-Terrestrial (1982) - Spielberg (Director/Producer)
2. Jurassic Park (1993) - Spielberg (Director/Producer)
3. Meet the Fockers (2004)
4. How the Grinch Stole Christmas (2000)
5. Jaws (1975) - Spielberg (Director/Producer)
6. Bruce Almighty (2003)
7. The Lost World: Jurassic Park (1997) - Spielberg (Director/Producer)
8. King Kong (2005)
9. Back to the Future (1985) - Spielberg (Executive Producer)
10. The Mummy Returns (2001)
11. Liar Liar (1997)
12. Jurassic Park III (2001) - Spielberg (Executive Producer)
13. The Bourne Supremacy (2004)
14. Apollo 13 (1995)
15. A Beautiful Mind (2001)
16. Meet the Parents (2000)
17. The Sting (1973)
18. The Mummy (1999)
19. Knocked Up (2007)
20. American Pie 2 (2001)

As we can see, they have already released or are releasing everything except Spielberg titles and A Beautiful Mind and American Pie 2 from that list. Out of 20, 8 are unreleased and unannouced and 6 of those 8 had some involvement from Spielberg. It might be easier to release the 2 that he didn't direct than the 4 that he did. If we take the Spielberg titles out then 12 out of 14 have been released or announced. They've already used 11 of those just to get things were they are as far as sales.

As far as the top 5 at the US box office for each of the years 2003 through 2006, they've already released 16 of those 20, have 2 more announced and have only 2 left (I think they are Along Came Polly and American Wedding), so it is pretty clear that they've been looking to release what they could that they thought would sell. And according to what Ken Graffeo said, it looks like they wanted to release at least some of those Spielberg titles.

--Darin

I would expect Universal to go neutral about the same time as Sony...

Thats just dumb. Sony will be the last studio on either side to ever go neutral. It doesnt matter what side you are on you should understand that.

if Universal would really be stupid to release a Steven spielberg movie without being aproved by steven spielberg. it is gameover HD-DVD. simple as that. and not only that. but i am sure Steven would tell Paramount not to release Transformers for HD-DVD.

and do you really think Paramount would say no to steven. they would say dont worry Steven we are not concerned with the nickels that hd-dvd makes. we will release Transformers only on dvd and bluray.



It's pretty much impossible that this would happen (The Transformers part), but IF that did happen, HD-DVD would be in some serious doo doo.

Thats just dumb. Sony will be the last studio on either side to ever go neutral. It doesnt matter what side you are on you should understand that.
Yeah. I think he was just taking the piss.

I laugh when people say "Universal will go neutral when Sony (or Disney or Fox) go neutral."

All indications are pointing that Universal will go neutral. If Weinstein goes neutral soon, this will signify the beginning of the end.

If people are that dense to believe that quantity is not imporant, than they are seriously lying themselves. The potential of the bluray catalogue dwarfs that of the red. I'm not going to make a list, but someone here could easily, and damnit, I wanna see 50 gb encodes of my movies ala Pirates.

if this is something you want to get behind, visit this link. also let your voice be heard with your own comments and read what others have to say:

link: www.petitionspot.com/petitions/BOYCOTTNBCUNIVERSAL (http://www.petitionspot.com/petitions/BOYCOTTNBCUNIVERSAL)

All indications are pointing that Universal will go neutral. If Weinstein goes neutral soon, this will signify the beginning of the end.

I don't think Weinstein will have any impact. They have only released a handful of under-performing films since leaving Disney. The house of mouse controls the vast majority of the Weinstein's finest output through Miramax. When you consider the exclusive titles already announced for Blu-ray, I am predicting that Fox and MGM are about to announce some big titles. The Blu-ray camp wants this thing over by the 4th quarter and I believe they will pretty much get their wish.

LoL,
I received some rather strange PM’s regarding what I meant by “wo-man” in the above posting.
It was a hint..........as in Co- Chairman, for astute readers.

Amy is a fine XX lady and should be applauded for being one of the select few that broke through the proverbial *glass ceiling*. :)

Now, if she can just get me a backstage pass to the next Victoria's Secret Fashion Show at the Kodak, I shall be forever in her debt.

Late January, just about the same time Toshiba pulls the plug on HD DVD. (once 30 days have passed since Christmas so nobody can return their shiny new HD DVD players)

Walt O

Microsoft to announce support for blu ray i heard. old news or new news ?

i guess obi is eating his hat :D

An interesting old article that I came across yesterday when googling for something else...

http://www.itwire.com/content/view/5647/53/

It's kind of an interesting read these days after what has happened.

An interesting old article that I came across yesterday when googling for something else...

http://www.itwire.com/content/view/5647/53/

It's kind of an interesting read these days after what has happened.

RLMAO :D
so wrong was he

He wasn't wrong on everything. Back then it did have better sound and picture and it still has better interactivity.

If Universal goes neutral soon then HD DVD is all but dead. If Universal holds out and HD DVD players hit a price for mass adoption then everyone who wants Universal titles in HD will buy an HD DVD player and buy the titles they want. At that point Universal can stay exclusive and probably will. If Universal is still exclusive at this time next year then we're into a two format HD disk scenario probably for years. Universal is being subsidized to stay exclusive (just like all the Bd studios) so if those subsidizes don't dry up, maybe MS would have to go banrkrupt or something for them to dry up, Universal will stay exclusive.

Cheers,

Grant

Now, if she can just get me a backstage pass to the next Victoria's Secret Fashion Show at the Kodak, I shall be forever in her debt.
You mean you didn't get YOURS yet?!?!? :p
I thought you were tight with Amy?? :eek:

Late January, just about the same time Toshiba pulls the plug on HD DVD. (once 30 days have passed since Christmas so nobody can return their shiny new HD DVD players)

Walt O
LOL!

An interesting old article.
And some say, this is how it all began……

http://www.businessweek.com/technology/content/oct2005/tc2005106_9074_tc024.htm

Editorial note……..
1. Sun Valley has GREAT mountain biking.
2. Don’t mess with a royal knight.

And some say, this is how it all began……

http://www.businessweek.com/technology/content/oct2005/tc2005106_9074_tc024.htmThanks. Fascinating article, especially if everything in there is true. Including:
Leaked to Microsoft, the news put the company in crisis mode. Execs began working the phones, lobbying retailers about the potential for mass consumer confusion if competing standards came to market.and yet now that HD DVD is behind it seems that Microsoft's stance has changed to preferring mass market consumer confusion and telling people over and over about how having 2 formats is good and much like videogames (or things to that effect). So, what does Microsoft really think is better if we take out the part about preferring one format over the other, one format or two formats?

And this part was interesting:
Meanwhile, Sony's camp received help winning over one influential studio from an unlikely source. Raider Carl C. Icahn, one of Time Warner's largest shareholders, began pressuring the studio to find ways to boost its stock price earlier this year. Despite Time Warner's long alliance with Toshiba, CEO Richard Parsons asked Jeff Bewkes, chairman of the company's entertainment unit, to reconsider the best way to recharge DVD sales. Bewkes decided that the studio should forget appearances and back Blu-ray if it was the format most likely to win consumers' hearts. "Blu-ray's potential for more capacity started looking better and better," said one Hollywood executive.

CRISIS MODE. Once warner started to waver, Paramount Pictures decided to move first in order to negotiate better terms, according to Hollywood insiders.Could this be a sign of things to come? Basically a repeat where somebody else sees Universal waver or looks at the market and decides it has to be wavering at least somewhat, then decides to look for the best deal for itself before Universal can move. I'm thinking along the lines of the Weinsteins as a smaller studio and Dreamworks Animation for a smaller studio with some big hits (like Shrek 3). If I was on the Blu-ray side I might be pointing out what Paramount did to Dreamworks Animation. Not sure if Paramount could decide to try to beat Universal to the punch like it seems they beat Warner to the punch because of antitrust issues with going from neutral to exclusive, but if this thing drags on long enough with sales of common titles and overall still favoring Blu-ray strongly and certain parties start feeling like Universal is trying to spoil things for everybody, I could see another power deciding to try to beat them to the punch and declaring that they are going to take and stand to try to end the war, since Universal won't. Or not declaring publicly that this is their reasoning, but just doing it. At this point maybe all Paramount would have to do it put out word that they are thinking of doing something like this if Universal tries to drag the war out longer than is reasonable. Of course, if HD DVD can turn things around this Christmas season that will be a different story, but if they can't I can see much of Hollywood turning on Universal if they decide just to be stubborn.

--Darin

Thanks. Fascinating article, especially if everything in there is true.

Yes, a nice history lesson.


Basically a repeat where somebody else sees Universal waver or looks at the market and decides it has to be wavering at least somewhat, then decides to look for the best deal for itself before Universal can move.


Penton-Man has already said (on another site) that Universal recently got the "best offer" it was going to get and they turned it down. The "blog" on HollywoodinHighDef also confirmed that Uni was offered "plenty of incentives", and the anti-Universal slant of the "blog" seems to me intended as retaliation for Universal not playing ball.

Seems to me there's a real hard push here to permanently push HD DVD out of the picture. Coincidentally timed with the introduction of BD+ and BD 1.1.
Considering the history of one of the main developers of BD+ - "Rootkit Sony" - I'd like to know a little more about exactly what this "executable code" on BD+ will do before we crown Blu-ray as the one & only.

Yes, a nice history lesson.





Penton-Man has already said (on another site) that Universal recently got the "best offer" it was going to get and they turned it down. The "blog" on HollywoodinHighDef also confirmed that Uni was offered "plenty of incentives", and the anti-Universal slant of the "blog" seems to me intended as retaliation for Universal not playing ball.

Seems to me there's a real hard push here to permanently push HD DVD out of the picture. Coincidentally timed with the introduction of BD+ and BD 1.1.
Considering the history of one of the main developers of BD+ - "Rootkit Sony" - I'd like to know a little more about exactly what this "executable code" on BD+ will do before we crown Blu-ray as the one & only.


You do know that the rootkits were BMG/Sony and has no connection with Blu-Ray whatsoever except in name only, right?

So, "Rootkit Sony" is not only misleading, it's completely inaccurate.

You do know that the rootkits were BMG/Sony and has no connection with Blu-Ray whatsoever except in name only, right?

So, "Rootkit Sony" is not only misleading, it's completely inaccurate.


Sony still put the product out, are you saying Sony chose to put the product out without knowing it had the rootkits?

There was horrible press and backlash against Sony about those rootkits. I think someone got sued over the damage the rootkits caused to pc's and also due to violation of some privacy issues as well.

You do know that the rootkits were BMG/Sony and has no connection with Blu-Ray whatsoever except in name only, right?

:confused: I do know that the rootkit was placed on a music CD, not a Blu-ray disc, and has no connection with Blu-Ray whatsoever.

So, "Rootkit Sony" is not only misleading, it's completely inaccurate.

Not at all, if I had said "Rootkit Blu-ray", that would be misleading, and completely inaccurate.

Look, not trying to piss in the pool here, or start a Format Debate. I'm just saying that the background of a company that put executable code on a CD that altered the customer's computer without their knowledge or permission makes me want to dig further into the details of any of their products before purchasing one - at a minimum.

There appears to have been a major push by BD backers recently to get Universal to go neutral quickly, effectively making HD DVD irrelevant. Perhaps the timing is coincidental, but the introduction of BD+ discs to the market is also expected shortly, and along with that the anticipated resumption of releases from Fox. No one but the developers know exactly what BD+ will do and is capable of doing.

As an example - one of the things that is known that BD+ will do is permit disc makers to place an executable code on a Blu-ray disc that the player must run. Will the BD+ discs be clearly labeled so the consumer knows this, and will the label detail what the executable code will do?

So, my personal desire is that Universal not go neutral, there continues to be competition for high def disc formats until at least all the details of a major aspect of the Blu-ray format - BD+ - is known. After that, I may be ready to ditch one of my players.

Is that accurate enough for you?

Yes, a nice history lesson.





Penton-Man has already said (on another site) that Universal recently got the "best offer" it was going to get and they turned it down. The "blog" on HollywoodinHighDef also confirmed that Uni was offered "plenty of incentives", and the anti-Universal slant of the "blog" seems to me intended as retaliation for Universal not playing ball.

Seems to me there's a real hard push here to permanently push HD DVD out of the picture. Coincidentally timed with the introduction of BD+ and BD 1.1.
Considering the history of one of the main developers of BD+ - "Rootkit Sony" - I'd like to know a little more about exactly what this "executable code" on BD+ will do before we crown Blu-ray as the one & only.

I am pushing for one of these formats to go away, absolutely. The next wave of adopters is waiting for an end to the format war. We are not going to see the titles we want, or get prices as low as we want, until adoption increases above the 2-3% that we are effectively at.

Despite the facts that I think Blu-ray has a technical edge and I have made a small investment in Blu-ray, I really don't care which one wins. But someone needs to actually win.

What I don't want to see is a very prolonged and drug out process that ends in an exhausted format crossing the finish line with customers having moved on to the next big thing.

While I want high-quality collectable media, I am however beginning to make my peace with the idea that we are heading for VOD/PPV/downloads/etc. I see people carrying around their iPods and iPhones and downloading stuff on their XBoxes and PC's, and they find it a lot more exciting than some disk that looks just like an old-fashioned DVD. This seems to be where all of the excitement and mindshare is today, so maybe I need to change my ideas.


But not quite yet. I am going to keep hoping that we can shut down the format war.

BTW I am very serious about this. I used to think that this was foolish alarmism.
It isn't. I think that this fall is the last real push that is going to be made for HDM. If we don't have a winner by early next year, attention is moving away, from the CE companies, studios, and customers.

Penton-Man has already said (on another site)
Correct, specifically the Insider's Thread on forum.blu-ray.com

Penton-Man has already said (on another site) that Universal recently got the "best offer" it was going to get and they turned it down.
Correct.
Alot of people are pissed. :mad:
There’s a limit to how much anyone is willing to bend over.

They’re not going to get a better offer for a long time, if ever and they just better make damn sure that when the music stops, they have a chair to sit on at the table !

Correct.
Alot of people are pissed. :mad:
There’s a limit to how much anyone is willing to bend over.

They’re not going to get a better offer for a long time, if ever and they just better make damn sure that when the music stops, they have a chair to sit on at the table !

Penton-man,

What does Universal really want? What are they waiting for and what do they want to accomplish?

They’re not going to get a better offer for a long time, if ever and they just better make damn sure that when the music stops, they have a chair to sit on at the table !
That's the way I read your previous posts. At this point, the BDA has basically told Universal that the bus is leaving, and asked them one last time to get on it.

Universal declined. What will be funny and interesting is to see when Uni changes its mind if they're able to catch up to that bus...

GE is pressuring Universal (it owns it )
MSFT is announcing(...) support for blu ray

manufacturers+studios+consumers' decision( 2 to 1, 3 to 1)= end of hd dvd.

re read Bill Hunt's paper from 8.9

the sooner one format wins the sooner will see finally a bit more titles being announced !!!!
the trend is changing already.

MSFT is announcing(...) support for blu ray


Have anything to back that up? That would be great news if it were to happen soon.

Have anything to back that up? That would be great news if it were to happen soon.
I was wondering the same thing.

they will go neutral just as soon as disney does... how about that?

Penton-man,

What does Universal really want? What are they waiting for and what do they want to accomplish?
I think you mean........"What does Universal Studios want" ?
No comment.

All I can say is that in the meantime, every conceivable path outside of Universal City is being reasonably explored, including at the level of NBC Universal-News Corp.

I think you mean........"What does Universal City want" ?
No comment.

All I can say is that in the meantime, every conceivable path outside of Universal City is being reasonably explored, including at the level of NBC Universal-News Corp.

Thanks.

Well, considering that personalities and policies can change in Hollywood can change as quickly as a bad jump-cut, I suspect that the future may bring some changes.

I actually found the Hettrick interview with Kornblau somewhat encouraging. He seemed to suggest that they were waiting for player prices to drop and then they would consider going neutral. Sounds like an escape clause. Any thoughts on this?

they will go neutral just as soon as disney does... how about that?
What does one have to do with the other? Why should Universal want more competition for the HD DVD dollar? It makes no sense unless they are being paid to stay exclusive by Toshiba.

Since HD DVD is not their format but rather a delivery channel for their content, why would they care to limit their options or support direct competitors (content providers) supporting HD DVD thereby reducing their potential sales? The only logical answer is that Toshiba is paying them a lot of money to say this sort of crap.

...While I want high-quality collectable media, I am however beginning to make my peace with the idea that we are heading for VOD/PPV/downloads/etc. I see people carrying around their iPods and iPhones and downloading stuff on their XBoxes and PC's, and they find it a lot more exciting than some disk that looks just like an old-fashioned DVD. This seems to be where all of the excitement and mindshare is today, so maybe I need to change my ideas.

...BTW I am very serious about this. I used to think that this was foolish alarmism.
It isn't. I think that this fall is the last real push that is going to be made for HDM. If we don't have a winner by early next year, attention is moving away, from the CE companies, studios, and customers.

I think it is alarmism. Have you seen the rising numbers for sales of the LP? Yes, that large etched platter that plays analog stereo? The kids love 'em. They love the art, the packaging and the sound. Digital downloads will certainly be part of the picture but while I love my ipod I will NEVER give up the 500 + CDs that are in my collection. Pre-packaged media will live side by side with digital downloading long after most of us are drooling at the rest home. People will long for the tangible in a world of intangibles.

I think it is alarmism. Have you seen the rising numbers for sales of the LP? Yes, that large etched platter that plays analog stereo? The kids love 'em. They love the art, the packaging and the sound. Digital downloads will certainly be part of the picture but while I love my ipod I will NEVER give up the 500 + CDs that are in my collection. Pre-packaged media will live side by side with digital downloading long after most of us are drooling at the rest home. People will long for the tangible in a world of intangibles.

I have an LP collection. They have a nice sound. The packaging is nice and they provide a different collectable experience.

The use cases of HD DVD and Blu-ray are however almost identical. They use the same codecs. Apart from the red and blue, you can't even tell them apart.

Like I say, I completely discounted this argument until recently. But there are just too many companies that are making moves in the VOD etc. area right now.

For example, DirecTV will be adding up to 100 (70 more realistically) HD channels this fall. That will be a huge amount of HD content. Already, I count more interesting (to me) movies on DirecTV in a week than is on both HDM formats combined.

People love to collect crap. That desire will not be fulfilled with intangible digital downloads on a box. I will certainly use it for viewing entertainment that I do not wish to own. But I will continue to purchase Blu-ray movies until the next format.

I sent Universal the following Canadian Feedback:

Craig Kornblau recently said that he wanted to prolong the format war by staying exclusive to HD DVD and even admitted the following:

1. without Universal exclusivity, HD DVD would colapse.
2. This format war is harming consumers and hindering consumer adoption of HD media.

Does this Mr. Kornblau seriously think other Consumer Electronics firms are going to be able to compete with an intrenched Toshiba in the 200 dollar range and make a profit?

I like getting a good deal like the next guy but Mr. Kornblau is trying to force a Toshiba monopoly by pushing competitors and competing formats out of the market through dumping.

Do consumers really want to have a monopoly where Toshiba could eventually raise the prices back up or change the format unilaterally to cause a forced upgrade?

BD has the support of numerous CE's that are not only giving lip service but actually coming out with their own BD players, recorders and camcorders.

Show me a non-Toshiba HD DVD standalone player on the market right now. There are none.

If Mr. Kornblau is really working in the best interests of Universal and consumers at large, he should have Universal Studios go neutral and let the best format win. Give consumers the choice they deserve and stop trying to make the decision for them.
I was referring to his belief that players would have to come down to the 199 dollar range before they would choose a winner but I question whether that is profitable or if Toshiba is just getting desperate and dumping below cost players onto the market in order to prop up HD DVD marketshare.

Kornblau was just blowing smoke up the interviewer's a$$.
Why would Universal give a shite what the competing format's hardware prices are?
If he was SOOO concerned about the prices consumers are paying, he would lower the price of his HD-DVDs.
The guy is a shmuck. :rolleyes:

People love to collect crap. That desire will not be fulfilled with intangible digital downloads on a box. I will certainly use it for viewing entertainment that I do not wish to own. But I will continue to purchase Blu-ray movies until the next format.
Absolutely right. :)

People love to collect crap. That desire will not be fulfilled with intangible digital downloads on a box. I will certainly use it for viewing entertainment that I do not wish to own. But I will continue to purchase Blu-ray movies until the next format.

Yep, I am a big collector too.

But I am beginning to think I have been exploited by the studios and now they are mistreating me about HD with their format war. [I blame the studios along with the CE companies BTW because I think they encouraged this mess by making side deals.]

Since I already have a huge collection on LD and DVD, perhaps I will move toward downloads for many routine titles. There are a lot of older titles that I keep trying to find but cannot get in any format. If these become available on some huge download server, that might be a benefit.

I may have no choice if the format war continues.

That's the way I read your previous posts. At this point, the BDA has basically told Universal that the bus is leaving, and asked them one last time to get on it.

Universal declined. What will be funny and interesting is to see when Uni changes its mind if they're able to catch up to that bus...

Universal has no desire to catch and share ride on the BD bus. After all, it's not necessary when you have your own bus HD DVD. ;)

I think you mean........"What does Universal Studios want" ?
No comment.

All I can say is that in the meantime, every conceivable path outside of Universal City is being reasonably explored, including at the level of NBC Universal-News Corp.


Don't you think similar avenues are being explored by HD DVD groups toward BD members with a eye on defection?

They actually want a bus that isn't going to break down and be obsolete. :D
They'll go blu after the holiday manslaughter.

They actually want a bus that isn't going to break down and be obsolete. :D
They'll go blu after the holiday manslaughter.
Ah I hate to point this out, but the current BD players will be obsolete when BD1.1 comes in. Where as the HD players are final specs. Or that is the case from what I understand.

that's so awesome, will your player play spider-man, potc, spielberg movies, pixar movies?
yeah.....thought so. so go and wish you had actual content real consumers care about and get back to me.

that's so awesome, will your player play spider-man, potc, spielberg movies, pixar movies?
yeah.....thought so. so go and wish you had actual content real consumers care about and get back to me.
If you are talking to me, then yes it will. I have the Panasonic BD10. I just don't go around spreading crap like some people around here do.

that's so awesome, will your player play spider-man, potc, spielberg movies, pixar movies?
yeah.....thought so. so go and wish you had actual content real consumers care about and get back to me.

Only Spielberg's movies interest me not Spidey or POTC in fact I don't like Close Encounters. However, I'll take Jurassic Park, and Jaws over those. And speaking of content get back to me when you can play The Matrix, Batman Begins, The Bourne series and the extra content on 300. Opps I forgots you can't sorry. ;)

BTW why aren't you guys asking when will FOX come out of its hole?

Only Spielberg's movies interest me not Spidey or POTC in fact I don't like Close Encounters. However, I'll take Jurassic Park, and Jaws over those. And speaking of content get back to me when you can play The Matrix, Batman Begins, The Bourne series and the extra content on 300. Opps I forgots you can't sorry. ;)

The Bourne Series at least should be coming out on Blu-ray next year :)

The Bourne Series at least should be coming out on Blu-ray next year :)

Yeah, I'm sure you'll see that before any new FOX BDs. ;)

Yeah, I'm sure you'll see that before any new FOX BDs. ;)

Nah I don't think it will be the beginning of the year or anything like that for Bourne. I think more likely the fall of 2008. There should be some Fox BD's before the end of 2007.

MSFT is announcing(...) support for blu ray

When did this happen. This is AMAZING news. Could you please elaborate and give some real information. HEY EVERYBODY, DIGITAL2004 KNOWS SOMETHING WE DON'T KNOW

Only Spielberg's movies interest me not Spidey or POTC in fact I don't like Close Encounters. However, I'll take Jurassic Park, and Jaws over those. And speaking of content get back to me when you can play The Matrix, Batman Begins, The Bourne series and the extra content on 300. Opps I forgots you can't sorry. ;)

BTW why aren't you guys asking when will FOX come out of its hole?


No kidding. I'm longing for some Alien and Aliens on my PS3.

BTW why aren't you guys asking when will FOX come out of its hole?

Because it's obvious -

the sooner one format wins the sooner will see finally a bit more titles being announced !!!!
the trend is changing already.


- the real reason why Fox hasn't released in HD since April with no announced releases on the horizon is because they've been politely & patiently waiting for HD DVD to call it quits before announcing more titles. :)

In the AP article entitled Holiday Sales Could Decide DVD Format War ( http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,292931,00.html), it mentions WB is trying to get more Blu-Ray studios to release on HD-DVD, and that Universal remains full-bore behind HD DVD:

Sony Pictures, News Corp.'s (NWS) Twentieth Century Fox, The Walt Disney Co. (DIS), and Metro-Goldwyn-Mayer are releasing only in Blu-ray. Universal, owned by General Electric Co. (GE), is the only major studio to back HD DVD exclusively.

Nonetheless, Warner Bros. believes both formats can coexist and has been urging Blu-ray backers to begin supporting HD DVD as well. The studio has developed a dual-format disc and has said it would license the technology to other studios willing to back both.

"The fourth quarter is critical for the formats to show growth and momentum," said Steve Nickerson, Warner Home Video's senior vice president of marketing. "It's more than about winning or losing. If you can continue to show growth (in both formats), that's a positive in a situation where standard DVD sales aren't growing."

To counter Blu-ray's recent gains, the HD DVD camp is planning an advertising campaign touting the interactive elements of the format, which allow users to connect to the Internet to download special features.

"This is not about a high-def movie on a disc," said Craig Kornblau, president of Universal Studios Home Entertainment. "It's about a fully immersive experience, connected interactivity. That's what is going to separate these high-def formats."

Kornblau said he isn't worried about Blu-ray's momentum and doesn't believe there's a need for one to knockout the other.

"To call this market nascent is to a degree to pay it a complement," he said. "The people who have bought so far aren't early adopters, they are early, early adopters."

Funny, I don't give a #$@! about Internet content and all I want is a high quality HD movie on a disc. My bad.

^I love WB.... :mad:
Until they stop this shite, NO more WB buys for me.

^I love WB.... :mad:
Until they stop this shite, NO more WB buys for me.
But if you take out the Warner content, both format would probably be dead and buried.

Thanks. Fascinating article.........
http://www.businessweek.com/technology/content/oct2005/tc2005106_9074_tc024.htm

You're welcome. :)

Darin, it is indeed a fascinating read and puts into prospective for the uninformed, the whos, whys and wherefores of all the major players from the early beginnings.

I reread it (I hadn’t read the piece since its original online appearance and this time I noted that Mike Dell is quoted in the article).

As an interesting aside, Mike D. is a big home theater enthusiast and apparently, he’s not totally happy with the audio (and perhaps wonders if the video could be better too) in his home theater.
So, a calibrator who occasionally posts on this forum has been asked to come in for consultation and perform a redo in the Lone Star State.

Ah I hate to point this out, but the current BD players will be obsolete when BD1.1 comes in. Where as the HD players are final specs. Or that is the case from what I understand.

Sorry, but no, not all will be obsolete. The PS3 will be fine and I suspect most 2nd gen players can be upgraded to 1.1. The later 2.0 spec may be tougher for all but the PS3 to do, but that's further down the road.

As far as HD-DVD goes, it's "final specs" alright. There's "final specs" for laserdisc too!

I have both formats, (Tosh and Samsung) so don't really care who wins, but I wish that they would do it soon because my collection keeps growing and about half of them are going to be about as useful as an 8 track tape in the not to distant future.

You don't have to own both players as I do to realize that the HD DVD is a better designed system, just honest. One of my biggest problems with BD, other than then fact it's an inferior system, is that Sony is behind it, and I just don't trust Sony to do the right thing when it comes to the consumer. It will be business as usual. Which means Sony will continue to use their 57 Billion dollars of annal sales to muscle anyone who stands in their way.

The only thing that really upsets me, is that the people were suppose to decide the outcome of the format war. Unfortunately it looks like the big retailers (Wally World, Bad Buy, and Crockbuster) have taken it upon themselves to decide for us, for a small kickback of course. And yes, If these big stores were pushing HD DVD that would be just as wrong!!

If all companies involved, from the start, had at least pretended to be mature responsible adults, instead of acting like a bunch of greedy five year olds we would not be going through all this crap. There is room for both formats, unfortunately someone might loose a nickle. It's much better just to screw over the consumer. Hopefully when the winner is finally declared, we don't all find ourselves being the biggest looser. I don't have a problem with any company that's just trying to make an honest buck, unfortunately it's becoming increasingly difficult to find one.

I have both formats, (Tosh and Samsung) so don't really care who wins, but I wish that they would do it soon because my collection keeps growing and about half of them are going to be about as useful as an 8 track tape in the not to distant future.

You don't have to own both players as I do to realize that the HD DVD is a better designed system, just honest. One of my biggest problems with BD, other than then fact it's an inferior system, is that Sony is behind it, and I just don't trust Sony to do the right thing when it comes to the consumer. It will be business as usual. Which means Sony will continue to use their 57 Billion dollars of annal sales to muscle anyone who stands in their way.

The only thing that really upsets me, is that the people were suppose to decide the outcome of the format war. Unfortunately it looks like the big retailers (Wally World, Bad Buy, and Crockbuster) have taken it upon themselves to decide for us, for a small kickback of course. And yes, If these big stores were pushing HD DVD that would be just as wrong!!

If all companies involved, from the start, had at least pretended to be mature responsible adults, instead of acting like a bunch of greedy five year olds we would not be going through all this crap. There is room for both formats, unfortunately someone might loose a nickle. It's much better just to screw over the consumer. Hopefully when the winner is finally declared, we don't all find ourselves being the biggest looser. I don't have a problem with any company that's just trying to make an honest buck, unfortunately it's becoming increasingly difficult to find one.

I don't know who wrote the rules that said "the people were supposed to decide". If there were rules, there would be a rule against silly format wars.

But in any case the people don't want to decide.

Everyone I know was unwilling to buy either machine until the format war was perceived to be over. I bought Blu-ray last fall (because I like Sony and because IMO Blu-ray has slightly better specs but let's not argue about that). If HD DVD can figure out how to win, that's fine with me, but I don't see how they will do it. But they should do it soon. I am definitely opposed to dragging this out much longer.

I now finally have two friends who have decided that Blu-ray will win and have bought it. Everyone else I know is still waiting. For many, the fact that they perceive the end is near is just another reason to wait: "why buy now when it will be over in a few months" is what I am hearing now.

People sense that these formats are very similar, only one will win, and they don't want "another Betamax" (oh how many times have I heard that).

I almost never encounter someone who says "which is better". They don't care about bitrates, codecs, interactivity, or any of the other details. They all say "which is going to win and when will it be over." [And I am talking about technically sophisticated people.]

I think it is unreasonable to expect that a large number of people are going to spend their hard-earned money to help "decide" when they figure they will just wait it out.

You don't have to own both players as I do to realize that the HD DVD is a better designed system, just honest. One of my biggest problems with BD, other than then fact it's an inferior system...

Would you care to elaborate on these statements please?

Funny, I don't give a #$@! about Internet content and all I want is a high quality HD movie on a disc. My bad.

I agree with you, but I do like the ability to download from the Internet whenever I want to. But here's the real kicker (LOL): my Tosh XA2 is the only CE device I have had in YEARS that has difficulties connecting to the Internet! My PS3 is wireless enabled and had no hiccups. Laptops, the same. My desktops, of course the same. XBox 360 (when I had it), the same.

The Tosh XA2? Holy crap, what a bloody mess! Not only would it not detect my network, I had to run a frigging longass cable to it to even *try* to get it to work. Eff that mess. So THEN I had to wait for the stinking FW update for a month+, until someone on this site found the alternative ISO through some backwoods Tosh Canadian site. Yeah, sounds like Tosh REALLY knows how to web-enable HD DVD. (MSFT, can you please just take over the PR war now for our beloved HD DVD???)

I would SO love to explain to these clueless marketers that their Bravo Sierra will only sell to equally clueless customers.

When do you think Universal will announce Format neutrality?
http://www.littlepigs.biz/images/pigs_flying.jpg

<here there be hd dvd fanboy stuff>

Do you enjoy creating new accounts over and over?

Would you care to elaborate on these statements please?
Does any of the HD DVD defense group ever care to elaborate? Of course not, you cant elaborate on half made up/half spin all with no real facts.

http://www.littlepigs.biz/images/pigs_flying.jpg
Ahh. Always great to find another Pink Floyd fan. ;)

When Universal finally goes neutral, I'd love to see the excuses and pandeomonium than.

Wow so angry take a pill.

Not angry, just opinionated. A good debate gives me a rush of blood that not even Viagra could produce. Oh, and I never take mind-altering drugs. I enjoy life's roller coaster ride.

You never know, osho. Hi ! :D

Most people never envisioned that one would see so soon, an increase in volume of Blu-ray software sales in those markets where piracy has previously ravaged the DVD business. :)

http://www.blu-ray.com/news/?id=396

Would you care to elaborate on these statements please?

Yeah, I'd like to hear that too.

One of my biggest problems with BD, other than then fact it's an inferior system

How is it inferior?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blu-ray_disc#Blu-ray_Disc_.2F_HD_DVD_comparison

While you guys are waiting and hoping for Universal to go exclusive to BD, Wild Hogs just came out.

Craig Kornblau seems to be unaware of the fact that most people do not have internet access and of those that do, few have broadband access either because they do not feel the need for it or it is unavailable in their area.

Even with the small niche of consumer that actually have broadband, few will want to go through the hassle of running Cat5 cables into the living room if they are not already there.

How is it inferior?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blu-ray_disc#Blu-ray_Disc_.2F_HD_DVD_comparison

Do you see all the "optional.. optional.."

While you guys are waiting and hoping for Universal to go exclusive to BD, Wild Hogs just came out.

We didn't all miss it, I should be watching it tonight.

Thanks Netflix!

BTW, I have it set in my mind that the movie is going to completely suck, low expectations really help me enjoy movies of questionable quality.

You never know, osho. Hi ! :D

Most people never envisioned that one would see so soon, an increase in volume of Blu-ray software sales in those markets where piracy has previously ravaged the DVD business. :)

http://www.blu-ray.com/news/?id=396
At least I am not employed by the BDA, as you are, and posing as a regular member in AVS instead of the "BR Insider" that you really are. ;) ;) ;)

I wish you’d tell them that…………………

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=11265837&&#post11265837

Do any biologists out there know if trolls have the same number of lives as cats ?
More…..less ?

Craig Kornblau seems to be unaware of the fact that most people do not have internet access and of those that do, few have broadband access either because they do not feel the need for it or it is unavailable in their area.

But he is aware ;) of news items like this :) …………………………
http://www.videobusiness.com/article/CA6467868.html

I wish you’d tell them that…………………

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=11265837&&#post11265837

Do any biologists out there know if trolls have the same number of lives as cats ?
More…..less ?
What about BDA members posing as regular AVS members??? ;)
Aren't 'BDA Insiders' supposed to declare themselves as such? Apparently the rules do not apply to some. ;)

"Does any of the..." Bluray "...defense group ever care to elaborate? Of course not, you cant elaborate on half made up/half spin all with no real facts."

:D

Will any of the HD DVD fanboys ever stop posting in the BLU-RAY forum?

they're posting here because soon they will all be members. their pathetic format is soon toast and they want practice posting here. why else do they hang around here like flies over $$hit.

How is it inferior?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blu-ray_disc#Blu-ray_Disc_.2F_HD_DVD_comparison

First let me say that I do like both players, and I use them both all the time depending on what movie I want to watch of course. What I was talking about was that when I went to purchase the Matrix trilogy I had to buy it on HD DVD because I was told that Warner did not release it on BD because it could not play it until a firmware update was released which should be in October.

When I first hooked up my A2 I noticed that my front display did not work, so I just plugged it into my router and down loaded the latest firmware and it has been rock solid every sense. I also read that the production cost of the HD DVD format was about half that of BD. Which that is better, if the savings is passed along to the consumer. I have noticed that sometimes it is and sometimes it's not. As I said before, I like both formats. The PQ is so close I can't tell which format I am looking at, unless you look to see which player is turned on. This being the case I guess you could say both formats are about equal except in price. I picked up my HD A2 for $300 delivered while my BD-P 1200 set me back $700 at the time.

What about BDA members posing as regular AVS members??? ;)
Aren't 'BDA Insiders' supposed to declare themselves as such? Apparently the rules do not apply to some. ;)
So....you are the only guy posting on this forum that DOESN'T know Penton-Man is a BD Insider?!
Everyone here knows he posts on the Insider Forum.
Sheesh... :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

I want my damn Back to the Future Box Set on blu-ray..... damnit Universal! You are the only major studio holding out on Blu-Ray!!!!


Blu-ray support
Paramount
Warner Bros.
Disney (Buena Vista)
Fox
Lionsgate
MGM
Sony Pictures

HD-DVD support
Paramount
Warner Bros.
Universal Studio

I don't know who wrote the rules that said "the people were supposed to decide". If there were rules, there would be a rule against silly format wars.

But in any case the people don't want to decide.

Everyone I know was unwilling to buy either machine until the format war was perceived to be over.

I guess you don't believe that the consumer had anything to do with the VHS vs Beta format war either. I know of a few people who purchased one format or another before the war was presumed over. Which format war am I talking about?? Both.

If everyone went out tomorrow and purchased format X over format Z, then format Z would be finished and it would not matter how many studios they had behind them because the studios will always follow the money and would jump ship in the middle of the night. Right now the money is on Sony and Samsung. I seriously doubt that It would happen, but the consumer could change that. The BD supporters are aware of this and will do whatever it takes to prevent it from happening, as well they should, it's only smart business. As expected, from the start, the sale have been slow. But there still have been sales and the format backers have paid very close attention to this. They understand that the uninformed and misinformed consumer will most likely purchase what ever is recommended to them by their friendly neighborhood sales person at their local BB or CC. I have a friend that is the sales manager for Magnolia inside a local BB. He told me a few months ago that they were instructed to push BD because it was higher profits for the store. Like you, I also think the war is over, actually it looks like it may have been over well before it started. I think that for HD DVD to have any chance to survive it will have to have very strong sales this Christmas, if not, it is finished. If that happens, so be it. At least then I can start working on my BD collection. :)

Till Universal announces neutrality, and Toshiba stops making players, the war is going to continue, simply because HD DVD has changed the rules of engagement. Co-existence with DVD is the catch phrase now, with the maintaining of software sales ratio. This is probably not sustainable but appears to be the current tact, and talking points. Universal neutrality based on the current reporting appears possible only after significant changes in upper management, which would probably be directed by GE, and probably only after shareholder unrest. So IMHO I dont expect anything in the short to medium term. To me even the CES is a long shot. There will be spin from both sides based on the numbers but nothing definitive for consumers will be evident.

But he is aware ;) of news items like this :) …………………………
http://www.videobusiness.com/article/CA6467868.html


I guess once all the HD DVD players sold out they had no choice but to go with BD. If I am the average consumer which I am, am I going to pay $200+ more for a machine that gives me the same quality of picture???

Wonder what will happen when the market is flooded with cheap Chinese made HD DVD players sold a Wal-Mart...That will be interesting...BD better have something up their sleeves. Me thinks a tidal wave is coming.

Wonder what will happen when the market is flooded with cheap Chinese made HD DVD players sold a Wal-Mart...That will be interesting...BD better have something up their sleeves. Me thinks a tidal wave is coming.

I'd agree there's a tidal wave coming, but like real tidal waves...it's going to be blue. As for the question what does BD need to do to combat millions of cheap HD-DVD players at Wal-Mart...honestly, nothing, since I don't see any reason to believe that's happening.

So....you are the only guy posting on this forum that DOESN'T know Penton-Man is a BD Insider?!
Everyone here knows he posts on the Insider Forum.
Sheesh... :rolleyes: :rolleyes:
Then why is he not relegated to the Insiders forum as members like Amir? :rolleyes:
It is not about where he posts, it is who he posts as; if he is a BR insider, he should remain in the Insider thread, and also identify himself as such: These are AVS rules.

Sigh here we go again. If Walmart has a flood of HD-DVD players, you can bet Sony will counter-act with something of their own. They won't sit back idle for that. Whenever one side makes the move, the other will be just as quick.

Then why is he not relegated to the Insiders forum as members like Amir? :rolleyes:
It is not about where he posts, it is who he posts as; if he is a BR insider, he should remain in the Insider thread, and also identify himself as such: These are AVS rules.AVS rules don't prohibit insiders from posting in threads other than the insiders thread, do they? AFAIK Amir started that on his own, for his own reasons.

Then why is he not relegated to the Insiders forum as members like Amir? :rolleyes:
It is not about where he posts, it is who he posts as; if he is a BR insider, he should remain in the Insider thread, and also identify himself as such: These are AVS rules.
I believe the rules state that to post in the insiders thread you have to declare yourself as a insider. Nowhere does it claim that insider or not that you cant post in the general forums. Amirm chooses not to post outside the insiders thread as that would expose him to question which challenge some of his earlier posts. He I believe is the only insider who posts on a regular basis but only in that thread most other regular insider poster do post in the general forums as well. Declaring your affiliation is only a requirement if you are posting for the benefit of that orginization or to clarify a position that orginization has.

gez.give it up univeral made it very clear the war goes on.
plus toshbias 3rd gen players coming soon.,and onkyo hd dvd player.
i would think if univeral was going neutral,other ce companys would not make hd dvd players.may opition get a hd dvd player if you dont have one,and dont worry about univeral.

may opition get a hd dvd player if you dont have one,and dont worry about univeral.

It's a lot cheaper for me to just wait for Q4 to play out, and enjoy the eventual beating HD-DVD will get in that period. Uni ain't going neutral now...but I'm hoping the absolute whooping they're about to get will change that in early 2008.

If not...patience is a virtue. Spending money on redundant hardware for a handful of movies...is not.

I just think if I was a HD-DVD owner I'd be frustrated. I mean Disney is a HUGE HUGE HUGE Deal. Sony as well. And Fox too. HD-DVD elitists know that the only reason HD-DVD is still around is because of one studio.
yeh a big deal if disney and fox start releashing titles,i mean some good titles,not the new crap that you watch once and wish you didnt buy it. i like to see the abyss in hd

yeh a big deal if disney and fox start releashing titles,i mean some good titles,not the new crap that you watch once and wish you didnt buy it. i like to see the abyss in hd

There are some Killer library titles dying to be let out
I agree 100% on the Abyss but you can add ID4, and Shrek, Digital to digital has to look amazing, considering on Shrek they had cartoon some characters as they looked too lifelike. On the whole It is loss for everyone when these don't get released. The cost of admittance is a one time fee for a long term benefit.

Sigh here we go again. If Walmart has a flood of HD-DVD players, you can bet Sony will counter-act with something of their own. They won't sit back idle for that. Whenever one side makes the move, the other will be just as quick.

Irregardless of HD-DVD competition, Blu needs a good budjet player to stave off the looming titan, DeeVeeDee, ultimately. $448 for a Samsung 1000 at Wally-Mundo ain't selling. ....not at the one I've been going by for discs. They have it demo'ed on a 12" monitor..... ;) It's some little micro set that's 16 x 10. No end caps 2-nite....

Irregardless of HD-DVD competition, Blu needs a good budjet player to stave off the looming titan, DeeVeeDee, ultimately.

I agree that they WILL need that...I don't agree that that is needed in 2007. I mean, do people really think Blu-Ray has to trump DVD THIS year to succeed? If so, why? I doubt anyone behind either format believes that's even remotely possible...reason enough you're not going to see super budget BD players this year. It's just not necessary yet.

It's a lot cheaper for me to just wait for Q4 to play out, and enjoy the eventual beating HD-DVD will get in that period. Uni ain't going neutral now...but I'm hoping the absolute whooping they're about to get will change that in early 2008.

If not...patience is a virtue. Spending money on redundant hardware for a handful of movies...is not.

I have no idea why you're so confident....well, maybe some.... ;) As long as HD-DVD has a big price advantage I am worried. The cheaper format might have a better chance of breaking out and selling to joe as the upconverting player that also plays HD....I've seen such an ad already.

I see some Blu ads too. They're both warming up it would appear. I hope this Christmas forces a format adjustment of Blu dominance or uni players. Either way I'll be happy. I'll not count any chickens till they're in the barn. There's more than one way to win this war. I'm not discounting any of the possibilities yet even though my horse loks good. Never underestimate the power of network TV advertising and the best team doesn't always win....that's why they call it war.

I agree that they WILL need that...I don't agree that that is needed in 2007. I mean, do people really think Blu-Ray has to trump DVD THIS year to succeed? If so, why? I doubt anyone behind either format believes that's even remotely possible...reason enough you're not going to see super budget BD players this year. It's just not necessary yet.

If either side can break out and really seell to the Joes, they could win. The sooner Blu has a budjet player the better IMO.

I have no idea why you're so confident....well, maybe some.... ;)

This is what I thought would happen 9 months ago...and everything keeps going as I thought. So, it bolsters my confidence. I told myself I wouldn't buy a format until I was comfortable that said format would win...so, I've had confidence for some time. Just my read on the market factors that exist.

If either side can break out and really seell to the Joes, they could win. The sooner Blu has a budjet player the better IMO.

But even with uber cheap players, I still don't think it'd happen. I KNOW the studios aren't going to switch to DVD pricing on discs. I know they're not expecting this to sell to average joe this year. I know HDM is heavily dependent on HD saturation, which is going to grow by leaps and bounds over the next couple years. Simply put, I know the companies behind this don't want HDM to become uber cheap over night, and I know it's unrealistic to think if it was that cheap...it'd necessarily blow up overnight to begin with. Which is why I have little faith in HD-DVD's strategy...and fully believe it will die in short order. It'd be nice if all prices went that low right away, don't get me wrong...I buy the movies, and cheap is nice. But I'm just trying to be realistic about what motivates the companies involved to actually push these formats, and what the tolerances of the mainstream are to a format of this kind will be. I just don't think it's just about price, and I don't think HDM is, or needs to be, about average joe right now. If I had any concern that not selling to average joe in 2007 was going to be a problem with HDM...I might be encouraging it more. But I simply don't think it is.

Declaring your affiliation is only a requirement if you are posting for the benefit of that orginization or to clarify a position that orginization has.
Exactly!

I guess once all the HD DVD players sold out they had no choice but to go with BD. If I am the average consumer which I am, am I going to pay $200+ more for a machine that gives me the same quality of picture???

Wonder what will happen when the market is flooded with cheap Chinese made HD DVD players sold a Wal-Mart...That will be interesting...BD better have something up their sleeves. Me thinks a tidal wave is coming.

Be more like what is going to happen when those cheap HD DVD Chinese players break in a week or recalled.

Exactly!
Osho,
Just like oink said above, you seem clueless to this situation.

Let me spell it out to you.
I am not hiding anything.

I am a Hollywood studio insider. The little thingee beneath my name on forum.blu-ray.com says “Hollywood Insider” for short. That translates to accessibility to all majors in “the town” (if you even know what that means) as well as some indies, regardless if they are BR supporting, neutral or only HD DVD supporting. But I love Blu. :)

I am not employed by the BDA. My studio involvement is so far upstream from consumer electronics that if Blu-ray is a teenager then I’m near the level of where the egg is fertilized.
I don’t post on the Insider’s Thread here because one mod felt it prudent for the betterment of this forum to keep Amir and me apart. That’s fine with me. The Insider’s Thread on forum.blu-ray.com ...................
http://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread.php?t=4988

keeps me plenty busy. :)

Be more like what is going to happen when those cheap HD DVD Chinese players break in a week or recalled.

Heck, I think that much of our electronic components are already coming out of China.
Next time you walk through your local WM,BB,CC check out the boxes and note how many state "Made In China".

Exactly!

Nope not Exactly, His comments are similar to Amillians .sp?. Till he adds Insider to his signature his information carries the same weight as mine does "ZERO" yes he might have more credibility based on some of his posts but to claim he is posting illegally or for some groups benefit are not defend able. As other than the pip info the material he has consistently posted you or I searching the internet can find. Amillian posts a lot of details that you or I would never have access is he an insider probably not, just with good connection in the biz.
Anyway why is someones affiliation an issue when the post is supposed to be pro the forum they are posting in? Affiliation is only an issue in neutral forums, forums of opposite affiliation, and forums where open discourse is not possible, As then there is a hint bias. Forums that you are pro for automatically are biased for your information.
Anyway just my 5 cents.

Edit: Whoops a couple of minutes late.

Really though...right now a 42" plasma is very affordable and will continue to drop in price. I didn't get into this whole HD thing until I could get what I wanted for the price I could afford.

IMO, if cheap HD DVD players start hitting the market, I just might get one, as will most of you movie lovers out there that think to themselves...."hey I can buy or rent all those Uni movies now that I have wanted for so long and it isn't going to cost me much to do it". I think it will be a win-win for everyone. If HD DVD dies a slow death...is it going to cost you an arm and leg to enjoy those Uni movies???? No! The $150 bucks you spent on a player will be long forgotten about.

...But I'm just trying to be realistic about what motivates the companies involved to actually push these formats...
I believe what motivates these companies are flat and declining DVD sales. In the end they will choose growth because the shareholders demand it. Right now both formats are insignificant to the their income & stock price, the last thing they need is a niche product.

Really though...right now a 42" plasma is very affordable and will continue to drop in price. I didn't get into this whole HD thing until I could get what I wanted for the price I could afford.

IMO, if cheap HD DVD players start hitting the market, I just might get one, as will most of you movie lovers out there that think to themselves...."hey I can buy or rent all those Uni movies now that I have wanted for so long and it isn't going to cost me much to do it". I think it will be a win-win for everyone. If HD DVD dies a slow death...is it going to cost you an arm and leg to enjoy those Uni movies???? No! The $150 bucks you spent on a player will be long forgotten about.

I do NOT want two players, what is hard to understand about that? I don't want to buy movies for a dying format, what is so hard to understand about that? How do people continue to miss that most of us want one damn format?

The term "keep it simple, stupid" exists for a reason.

I guess once all the HD DVD players sold out they had no choice but to go with BD. If I am the average consumer which I am, am I going to pay $200+ more for a machine that gives me the same quality of picture???

Wonder what will happen when the market is flooded with cheap Chinese made HD DVD players sold a Wal-Mart...That will be interesting...BD better have something up their sleeves. Me thinks a tidal wave is coming.
Your 22 posts are showing...come back when you are old enough to shave.

Then why is he not relegated to the Insiders forum as members like Amir? :rolleyes:
Amir can't post in the HD-DVD Forums?

If he is restricted to the Insiders Forum, then that is great move by AVS.
Why?
Because he had made a point of spreading FUD about BD from the very beginning of these HDM Forums.
And particularly ON THE BD FORUM!!!

Has Penton-Man done this?

AVS rules don't prohibit insiders from posting in threads other than the insiders thread, do they? AFAIK Amir started that on his own, for his own reasons.
Good.
Looks like my efforts paid off.

If he is restricted to the Insiders Forum, then that is great move by AVS.Amir is not restricted to there. He chose to restrict himself to there and not debate in the open areas with a level playing field for each side to make their point(s), like he used to.

--Darin

Osho,
Just like oink said above, you seem clueless to this situation.

Let me spell it out to you.
I am not hiding anything.

I am a Hollywood studio insider. The little thingee beneath my name on forum.blu-ray.com says “Hollywood Insider” for short. That translates to accessibility to all majors in “the town” (if you even know what that means) as well as some indies, regardless if they are BR supporting, neutral or only HD DVD supporting. But I love Blu. :)

I am not employed by the BDA. My studio involvement is so far upstream from consumer electronics that if Blu-ray is a teenager then I’m near the level of where the egg is fertilized.
I don’t post on the Insider’s Thread here because one mod felt it prudent for the betterment of this forum to keep Amir and me apart. That’s fine with me. The Insider’s Thread on forum.blu-ray.com ...................
http://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread.php?t=4988

keeps me plenty busy. :)
Then add the 'Insider' signature to your posts, and case closed.

Then add the 'Insider' signature to your posts, and case closed.I think it would be fair to you to add something to your signature saying that you used to post as Oshodi, if you want him to add something to his signature about the insider thing. That way when people see you claim that you haven't done something just because you didn't do it with this login, they can keep that and your history in mind. Or is there a reason you don't want people to know that you used to post as Oshodi and have used multiple logins since then?

--Darin

don't forget lagosian or django....!

;)

Looks like my efforts paid off.Looks like mine didn't.