Anyone know how these subs compare?

I currently have a PB12-Plus/2. It's amazing, but just a tad large (physically).

The PB13-Ultra is a better size for me, but I'm wondering how it compares to the PB12-Plus/2.

Anyone compare the two? :)

My guess would be the ultra will sound better and the plus/2 will have the same or 1-3 db's more output at their native tuning. Just a guess though.

Any idea if an actual comparison has been done by anyone?

It's probably been done by Ed Mullen of SVS, but to my knowledge hasn't been released.

It's probably been done by Ed Mullen of SVS, but to my knowledge hasn't been released.

It would be nice if Ed chimed in and and let us know as I will be ordering one of their subs soon....

I'm thinking about selling my barely used PB12–Plus/2 and snagging the new Ultra... but the thought of shipping this monster scares the cr@p outta me! :eek:

I believe the new single driver PB / PC 13 will beat the dual 12" +2 just because the new driver is much more capable then the standard 12.3.

The old ultra/2 had only about 2-3 db's more output than the plus/2 and the new ultra is not quite as powerful as the old ultra/2 so That is why i think it will be close in output.

I'm guessing the Plus/2 will have slightly more output capability from 25hz and up, but below that, the 13-Ultra will rule.

I agree

Hmm... think it's worth selling the PB12–Plus/2 for the new Ultra? Or not?

That's a tough question. I would expect an improvement in both depth and sound quality, but not necessarily like night and day.

Ask SVS. What are you looking for? If it is better sound quality than yes, smaller footprint, again yes.

I'm guessing the Plus/2 will have slightly more output capability from 25hz and up, but below that, the 13-Ultra will rule.

Agreed...I have a pair of the Ultra/2's and I'm considering selling them and purchasing a pair of the U13’s. I realize output would be decreased but the increase in SQ and depth are attractive.

I shipped a PB12 Plus 2 and it was completely totaled by my friends at FEDEX ground. I did receive insurance on it but took an arm and a leg to prove that it was totaled. Many, many pictures had to be sent in but they did pay up.

I wonder if it is worthwhile to get a Velodyne SMS-1 to go with my new Ultra's when i get them of course....I like the fact that I would have a remote on it to change settings from my recliner.

I shipped a PB12 Plus 2 and it was completely totaled by my friends at FEDEX ground. I did receive insurance on it but took an arm and a leg to prove that it was totaled. Many, many pictures had to be sent in but they did pay up.
Wow. Bummer. Not good.

Doesn't make me feel too warm & fuzzy about selling mine.


EDIT: Just out of curiosity, how exactly did you ship it? In other words, was it in the original box, or ???

Did you take it to a FexEx location, or did they pick it up?

Also, how much did it cost to ship?

Thanks...

You can use a trucking service like AFC Worldwide which will get it there ok. FEDEX and UPS generally place boxes on conveyor belts and I have a feeling my sub was tumbled along the way....shipping is cheaper than a trucking service but you certainly have a better chance of it arriving unscathed. Good luck!

If you don't overpack the sh*t out of it and strap it to a pallet shipping a heavy sub is asking for disaster. Fedex Heavyweight or Ground is formerly Watkins, an LTL carrier. They do/did a good job of shipping pallets from dock to dock, but they are not the residencial arm of Fedex, just a wholely owned division now. They offer the services, but if not packed correctly, it's claim freight. Hopefully, they made you whole.

If you don't overpack the sh*t out of it and strap it to a pallet shipping a heavy sub is asking for disaster.
Are you saying that we should ship it on a pallet? (I don't exactly have any pallets layin' around).

Anything wrong with just shipping it in its original box?

Are you saying that we should ship it on a pallet? (I don't exactly have any pallets layin' around).

Anything wrong with just shipping it in its original box?The original box has a fibreboard pallet builtin. If that's gone, I'd go find a skid or buy one for $5.00 along with a heavy duty fibreboard box...think gaylord...bubble wrap and either shrinkwrap or banding to the pallet. You want to protect the corners, edges and top...most likely it will be stacked on top or underneath another piece of freight.

SVS packs their stuff extremely well...if you've got the original packaging and can re-pack tightly, you should be ok.

Gotcha... thanks.

Time to go see what these Plus/2s are sellin' for these days....

If I have a look at the new driver on their web and when reading the first impressions overhere on the PC13 I believe the PB13 will really pull away below 30HZ because of that huge and very capable driver.
From 30 / 40 HZ up I think the difference will not that big at all !

The Plus/2 will have more output over 30hz then the New Ultra, as stated by SVS...
But yes, you are correct that the Ultra13 will beat out the Plus/2 below that mark...

1) The Plus/2 in the native 25 Hz tune has similar or slightly stronger max output from 25-80 Hz as the PB13U in its native tune. Below 25 Hz, the PB13U dominates in both extension and output, of course.

2) The Plus/2 in the 20 Hz tune has similar deep extension as the PB13U in the native tune (they both extend to 19-20 Hz before roll-off).

The Plus/2 in the 20 Hz tune has similar max output as the PB13U in its native tune from 30-80 Hz. Below 30 Hz the PB13U starts to assert an advantage (the deeper the frequency, the larger the advantage the PB13U has).

Ask SVS. What are you looking for? If it is better sound quality than yes, smaller footprint, again yes.
A smaller overall size is what I'm really looking for... but the thought of selling & shipping my current Plus/2 makes me wonder if it's really worth it.

You will lose money by selling but the ultra is a better subwoofer, and smaller. I sold my Pb12/plus/2 with no problems. It did have the original shipping boxes(bottom pallet) and foam inside. I used Fedex freight.

Any idea what they're going for these days?

My Plus/2 is less than a year old and Rosewood.


EDIT: I also have the original box and stuff.... but I'm not sure about a bottom palette. I'll hafta look and see.

EDIT 2: Guess what? I do have the bottom palette thingy. Yeah! :)

What is the concensus of the PB12+/2 vs the PB13 Ultra for use in a large HT with a big 12' opening on the back wall into the kitchen? Would the down firing woofers be better? Any input is greatly appreciated!

I recently purchased a Plus/2 to go with my Ultra/2. After long talks with SVS, I decided this was the best way to go. I have been very happy with the results.

All I can add is that my Plus/2 will never leave my home unless I move and then it is coming with me. I sit next to it and the air velocity and vibrations it generates is amazing.

Anyone know how these subs compare?

I currently have a PB12-Plus/2. It's amazing, but just a tad large (physically).

The PB13-Ultra is a better size for me, but I'm wondering how it compares to the PB12-Plus/2.

Anyone compare the two? :)

You have to consider how much material is available under 25Hz. If you're trying to impress friends, probably go with the new PB13 and play a bunch of tracks of movies with that specific material. If you want a lot of great high output bass with movies and music and can deal with the large footprint, you'd be more than fine with the Plus/2. Before the PB13, there was no SVS sub that I preferred in the showroom that even compared to either the Ultra/2 or Plus/2. The large box and dual subs make for an uncompromising amount of tight, chest pounding bass.

If you want a lot of great high output bass with movies and music and can deal with the large footprint, you'd be more than fine with the Plus/2.
Yeah, I'm sure you're right. I think I'll play around with laying the sub on its side, since it's a tad tall as is.

Thanks.

Yeah, I'm sure you're right. I think I'll play around with laying the sub on its side, since it's a tad tall as is.

Thanks.People who have done this have commented that they felt it was a little more articulate. I will have to try that myself sometime.

If I hadn't just bought a house, I would be very, VERY tempted to replace my +/2 with a PB13. The Submersive would also be calling to me.

People who have done this have commented that they felt it was a little more articulate.
Any idea which way they faced the drivers?

If I hadn't just bought a house, I would be very, VERY tempted to replace my +/2 with a PB13.
Funny, we just bought a house as well (although it won't be ready for close to a year). However, I'm still tempted to replace my +/2 with a PB13! :)

I was thinking about getting the PB13-Ultra than started looking at the PB12-Plus/2.
Right now I have a PB12-NSD and its great just doesn't give me that punch in the gut that I was looking for. I listen to mostly music on my system so going low isn't as import as having high output in the mid bass area. So what do you guys think would be my best option?

Any idea which way they faced the drivers?


Funny, we just bought a house as well (although it won't be ready for close to a year). However, I'm still tempted to replace my +/2 with a PB13! :)
From the photos I've seen, they usually lay the sub on its side with the drivers side-by-side, facing into the room. I've even seen two stacked that way.

All I can add is that my Plus/2 will never leave my home unless I move and then it is coming with me. I sit next to it and the air velocity and vibrations it generates is amazing.

Is your HT similar to mine with an open wall into another room?

Is your HT similar to mine with an open wall into another room?
Mine is.

From the photos I've seen, they usually lay the sub on its side with the drivers side-by-side, facing into the room. I've even seen two stacked that way.
Yeah, I've seen that too. It won't work in my case, unless I leave the base-plate on. I can't leave those drivers exposed with a 4 year old in the house. ;)

Is your HT similar to mine with an open wall into another room?
I have this in a 20' X 30' family room and next to my wife's listening position and my recliner. She loves it as a coffee table and it is slab shaking.

I wish I could remember who did it, but another member posted pictures of his where he built nice looking grill covers.

Any idea what they're going for these days?

My Plus/2 is less than a year old and Rosewood.


EDIT: I also have the original box and stuff.... but I'm not sure about a bottom palette. I'll hafta look and see.

EDIT 2: Guess what? I do have the bottom palette thingy. Yeah! :)

They drop in value like a rock in a pond . It is worth $250 :eek:

where are you located you may be able to selll it locally

:D

They drop in value like a rock in a pond . It is worth $250 :eek:

No way it is only worth $250.

where are you located you may be able to selll it locally

:D

It might help if you tell us where you are, as many people would like to pick up a PB12/2

It might help if you tell us where you are, as many people would like to pick up a PB12/2
Well, I used to live in your neck of the woods in Orange County :)... but now I'm on the other end of country in S.E. Florida.

It is worth $250 :eek:
Fugget-about-it. It's not going anywhere for $250.

I wish I could remember who did it, but another member posted pictures of his where he built nice looking grill covers.
Hmmm... if you think of it, please let me know. Thanks!

Question: The new PB13 sits directly on the floor. The Plus/2 is raised off the floor by risers, since it fires down.

What kind of difference would this make to the sound or performance of the sub?

Just curious...

What is the concensus of the PB12+/2 vs the PB13 Ultra for use in a large HT with a big 12' opening on the back wall into the kitchen? Would the down firing woofers be better? Any input is greatly appreciated!

I can't comment on the PB 13 Ultra but my PB12+/2 is located in my living room (due to the size) which opens up to my family room which is open to the kitchen and it fills the entire first floor of my house and can shake the entire house when commanded. I prefer the down firing woofers because they are kid and pet friendly.

my PB12+/2 is located in my living room (due to the size) which opens up to my family room which is open to the kitchen and it fills the entire first floor of my house and can shake the entire house when commanded.
Yep, me too. The Plus/2 is a beast.

I prefer the down firing woofers because they are kid and pet friendly.
Hmmm, that's a good point. I too have a kid (small) and a dog (large). Maybe I am better off with the Plus/2.

I prefer the down firing woofers because they are kid and pet friendly.
I can see your point, but if you keep your screen/grill covering your driver (side/forward firing sub), would it not be kid/pet friendly as well?;)

I can see your point, but if you keep your screen/grill covering your driver (side/forward firing sub), would it not be kid/pet friendly as well?;)

depends on what the grill material consists of.. cloth, no. metal grill? sure. IMO, the downfiring is still the better option for kids,pets,etc.

Any more input.

SVS and Craig subs is telling me to go with the Plus/2, as it is fatter at the 20hz level, but the size of the new 13 is tempting, plus I would have two.

Michael

Any more input.

SVS and Craig subs is telling me to go with the Plus/2, as it is fatter at the 20hz level, but the size of the new 13 is tempting, plus I would have two.

Michael
I would definitely get the new Ultra 13. Based on user raports who have had the older Ultra or the Plus/2, all say it's much better. If you want fatter 20 Hz, you can always use EQ.

I am in a similiar situation...I currently have 2 of the Ultra/2's and I am considering selling for 2 of the U13's....Has anyone gone from 2 Ultra/2's to 13's? If so, anyone out there interested in a pair of Ultra/2's :)

Thx in advance!

Oringially, I had planned to wait on the new UFW-12, but I'm getting antsy for some bass in my HT. I'm also considering the PB13-Ultra and until this thread had not considered the PB12-Plus/2. In my configuration, the sub will be directly behind our sofa (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=866660). Do you think this pushes an advantage towards the downfiring sub for a more indirect sound? or would it be better to have the sub firing directly into the sofa and shaking everyone (no need for a butt kicker). Soundsgood, you selling your Rosewood PB12? =)

Soundsgood, you selling your Rosewood PB12? =)
Probably at some point (although it's a Plus/2, not a PB12).

It's just that I bought it new -- meaning I paid full price -- and it's not even a year old yet. Plus it matches my Rockets perfectly. Therefore, I'm a bit reluctant to sell it. But I really would like something smaller, so I'm torn.

Probably at some point (although it's a Plus/2, not a PB12).

It's just that I bought it new -- meaning I paid full price -- and it's not even a year old yet. Plus it matches my Rockets perfectly. Therefore, I'm a bit reluctant to sell it. But I really would like something smaller, so I'm torn.


Yea, that's what I meant. ;) I have Rockets too.

Probably at some point (although it's a Plus/2, not a PB12).But I really would like something smaller, so I'm torn.

If you want smaller, you will be disappointed. The PB13 is 4.5" shorter, is 1.5" wider and, with grill, will be just as deep as the +/2. And it is 15lbs heaver.

If you want smaller, you will be disappointed.
Hmmm. What about one of the little JL Fathom subs?

Hmmm. What about one of the little JL Fathom subs?Smaller footprint, bigger price tag. Somehow, they are going to get you.:)

Smaller footprint, bigger price tag.
I love the smaller footprint part.

Not so crazy about the bigger price tag part. ;)

They drop in value like a rock in a pond . It is worth $250 :eek:

where are you located you may be able to selll it locally

:D

Is that right $250 for a 1 yr old PB12-Plus/2? I have a change to pick up a lightly used textured black one for 800 today. It looks like it retails for 1300+100 for shippiing so that seems reasonable.

No, $250 is not right. try to get it $800 with shipping. Shipping should range $100-$150.

What do you guys think a one year old Rosewood Plus/2 should sell for?

No, $250 is not right. try to get it $800 with shipping. Shipping should range $100-$150.

Thank you so much. It local so I'm gettng it for 800 out the door.

The new ones go for $1100 right now so I would still think $750-800. I sold my textered black for $750 with shipping. That was 6 months ago. Guys remember they are worth as much as someone is willing to spend on them.

...I would still think $750-800.
That's half what I paid for mine just one year ago.

I understand that everything depreciates, but losing half its value in one year is just crazy.

Maybe $900. You think that is bad My M&K S-5000THX speakers were $1299 each new and now They sell for $300-$400. That is just wrong but the market dictates. If you think it it too low it will only get worse. The Problem is that SVS released a better product for similar money(ultra13). M&K never released anything better.

Another problem is that SVS dicounts shipping and when you sell shipping is much more. trust me, I have been thru it.

Used electronic normally go for ~half the new price. My dad told me this 20 years ago and it still is mostly true. The huge risk associated with buying used electronics and the care and treatment of it by the original owners is part of the problem.

That is why I try to buy quality when I by used.

Usually prices of used SVS subs hold up pretty well, but the 13Ultra being a considerable performance value at 1400-1600 has forced down the new selling price of the Plus/2. That of course hurts the resale value of that unit.

I recently purchased a Plus/2 to go with my Ultra/2. After long talks with SVS, I decided this was the best way to go. I have been very happy with the results.

I thought about doing the same with my Ultra/2.

Do you still have any e-mails you can forward to me?