Good news!

http://kotaku.com/gaming/gc07/gran-turismo-5-prologue-to-feature-car-damage-improved-ai-better-physics-293208.php

We just had a chance to sit down with Gran Turismo series creator Kazunori Yamauchi to not only watch the Polyphony Digital president play some expert-level Gran Turismo 5 Prologue, but catch up on how the teaser version of Gran Turismo 5 will play. The early taste of the first proper PLAYSTATION 3 release will feature a number of firsts, including online play, damage effects for cars, and fully modeled interiors.

We spent a good portion of our session going through Prologue's "My Page" features. Most of it is rather self explanatory—Options, Home integration, Garage—but Polyphony touched briefly on the TV functions. The developers plans to show videos of non-game content, including (potentially) real life races, television shows, and "how to" clips created by Polyphony themselves. The My Page Profile aspect was pitched as very straightforward, containing information about the user's personality, but we weren't shown what it actually looks like.

Kaz seemed pretty proud of his latest car museum disguised as a PlayStation game, giving us ample eyeball time with the lovingly crafted car models. He showed us details on a 2006 Ferrari F430, making sure we didn't miss the stitched leather details to our left. Yes, Kaz, very pretty. Players will be able to inspect Polyphony's hard work even during races, as the GT driving wheel will let drivers pan left and right, an option supposedly not available with the SIXAXIS controller.

We also got a bird's eye view of the Lotus Elise convertible from the same model year which he took out for a spin on the familiar Suzuka Circuit. This probably won't come as a surprise, but Kaz was pretty good at playing Gran Turismo 5 Prologue. The one curiosity I noticed was that he steered with the D-pad, not the analog stick. He told me to chalk it up to habit, having learned how to play his own game on the original PlayStation, before the controller became theanalog stick-equipped DualShock.

Hardcore racer will be pleased to learn that GT5 Prologue will also add a new level of mastery for expert drivers, with a Professional driving physics option. Apparently, fan requests for a more intense driving experience led to the change.

Also at the behest of fans is a working damage model, one of unspecified depth. We didn't see Kaz run into anything during our session, so it was hard to tell if the game features the system in place yet. When asked about the new built-from-the-ground-up AI code and the option for car damage, Yamauchi indicated that CPU controlled drivers are aware of the new penalties for playing "bumper cars." With up to sixteen cars on the track, they need to be aware of each and the danger of spinning out when one comes in contact with another.

Yamauchi says these changes will lead to fewer cars lining up as they had in previous Gran Turismo games.

Apparently, with GT5 Prologue being built on a car and component basis, virtual racers will be given a better perspective on how their changes in hardware will affect cars from a performance basis and how they'll look when decked out. After learning this, I asked Yamauchi if the new guys at PD are stuck building just components, like aftermarket wheels and bonnets. No, he said, but that is one of the tests when someone comes on at the developer. Get your tire models right, then you can move on to cars.

Yamauchi also confirmed, via his translator Tsubasa Inaba, that a new force feedback wheel is being developed specifically for the release of the game. The Polyphony Digital staff declined to give us additional details on what changes we could expect, but I think we can safely assume that they're not adding motion control.

The bad news? A North American release has not yet been confirmed. The Europeans and Japanese will get their driving gloves on the game this year, but Yamauchi asked us to solicit fan feedback. They said they'll be evaluating fan interest to see if a US and Canada version makes sense.

You know what to do. If you want it, say so

Awesome, this game is really looking good. Those guys at Digital Polyphony are really wizards with driving games.

Wow, I thought car damage was coming after GT5 released. nice job Digital Polyphony. They aren't screwing around.

Are PS3 games region locked?

considering that Prologue is never released stateside...:mad:

WTF, like he doesent know that the gran turismo series is HUGE iver here! It better come out this year

Oh...it will come out...but, that will be GT5...

this is Prologue, they have yet to release a GT "Prologue" stateside.

I am not expecting to see GT5 until at least late next year or into '09...

most gamers here tend to think Forza is on par with the GT franchise...I cringe at that thought...

I will figure out a way to buy it from the EU store if we don't get it at the same time.

The bad news? A North American release has not yet been confirmed. The Europeans and Japanese will get their driving gloves on the game this year, but Yamauchi asked us to solicit fan feedback. They said they'll be evaluating fan interest to see if a US and Canada version makes sense.

You know what to do. If you want it, say so

I just sent my email requesting GT5:P in the US to SCEA from http://www.us.playstation.com/ (just click contact us) & I suggest everyone else do the same!!

Hell lets just flood them with emails & calls!
Here's the number 1-800-345-SONY (7669)

They said they'll be evaluating fan interest to see if a US and Canada version makes sense.


Is that supposed to be a joke? Considering the sales of the previous GT games in the US and dearth of quality PS3 titles, a North American release should be a no-brainer.

Oh...it will come out...but, that will be GT5...

this is Prologue, they have yet to release a GT "Prologue" stateside.

I am not expecting to see GT5 until at least late next year or into '09...

most gamers here tend to think Forza is on par with the GT franchise...I cringe at that thought...


Right now it IS better than the GT franchise.
And I'm a H A R D C O R E Gran Tourismo fan.

Right now it IS better than the GT franchise.
And I'm a H A R D C O R E Gran Tourismo fan.
Errr.....false.

Of course opinion is all subjective, but GT is still tops as far as console-based driving sims go.

Errr.....false.

Of course opinion is all subjective, but GT is still tops as far as console-based driving sims go.

yes it's my opinion, so it's not false. Im not saying forza 2 will be better than GT5. but GT 1-4 cant touch forza ( IMO )
Do you own Forza 2?

I have no doubt that GT5 will be the ultimate drive.

Errr.....false.

Of course opinion is all subjective, but GT is still tops as far as console-based driving sims go.
Based on what? Forza is getting some love from hardcore race sim fans. GT (1-4 and GT:HD, anyway) is still considered a joke, as far as "sim" goes.

Of course when GT5 comes out, it'll all be put to rest, and it'll overtake GTR2 as the #1 race sim, and I can die happy.

yes it's my opinion, so it's not false. Im not saying forza 2 will be better than GT5. but GT 1-4 cant touch forza ( IMO )
Do you own Forza 2?

I have no doubt that GT5 will be the ultimate drive.
Yes, I rented Forza 2 and wasn't too impressed with it. Visually, it looks pretty on the surface but the oft-reported jaggies bothered the heck out of me. The damage modeling is fine for the typical rubbing-is-racing approach, but if I broadside into somebody at 175mph, I expect for something more than the hood to bend and the front air dam to crack :rolleyes:

I also prefer the driving style of the GT series; it seems much more realistic to me.

Based on what?
For starters:
http://vgchartz.com/games/game.php?id=793
http://vgchartz.com/games/game.php?id=887

GT (1-4 and GT:HD, anyway) is still considered a joke, as far as "sim" goes.
People may prefer one over the other, but anybody who considers GT:4 et al a joke is simply one themselves. The depth of customization and mechanical "tweaking" available in the GT series is dumbfounding.

The only complaint I've heard on a regular basis is a problem with incessant under-steering. However, if you set up the car properly (as well as turning off the electronic assists), this "problem" is nowhere to be found.

The bad news? A North American release has not yet been confirmed. The Europeans and Japanese will get their driving gloves on the game this year, but Yamauchi asked us to solicit fan feedback. They said they'll be evaluating fan interest to see if a US and Canada version makes sense.

:confused: To see if it makes sense? They say this as if the series dosen't do well in the US. Hey, I love the GT series, but I'm not wasting my time E-mailing them if they don't develope some common sense.....:mad:

For starters:
http://vgchartz.com/games/game.php?id=793
http://vgchartz.com/games/game.php?id=887


People may prefer one over the other, but anybody who considers GT:4 et al a joke is simply one themselves. The depth of customization and mechanical "tweaking" available in the GT series is dumbfounding.

The only complaint I've heard on a regular basis is a problem with incessant under-steering. However, if you set up the car properly (as well as turning off the electronic assists), this "problem" is nowhere to be found.
Ah, so amount sold=quality? You know that isn't true at all. Maybe I should point out on those very links you posted, that Forza has a higher average rating. I could also point out to you that Forza got overall better reviews than GT4, and has a higher gamerankings.com average. Have you even played (I mean really PLAYED) either Forza game?

The depth of tweaking in GT4 isn't special anymore. It's been surpassed by Forza, and in many tweaking areas it lags behind PC sims from years ago. Heck, the Tokyo Extreme Racer series has WAY better customization than the GT series. You can even do engine swaps in that game... You can't even change the way your car looks in GT4. Add to that lack of damage, wierd collision physics (there's a Gran Turismo joke at racesim central to the effect of, "who needs brakes- that's what my opponents are for!"), and other physics quirks: Do a donut in a RWD car, and the car will not just end up rotating on its own without you keeping steering lock on, or the fact that you can spin the tires in low gear in a high HP car in a straight line but the rear never comes undone, even with driving aids off... and you can see why some hardcore sim players would consider it a joke- it touts it's self as a "real driving simulator"... there are quite a few other games that have a better claim to that title, currently. GT just has the most cars and ther prettiest ones. It's realistic enough for most, and easily accessible to the masses- But it's not quite as sim as it's competitors.

GT4 is a GREAT game. I still play it and enjoy it. The GT series is not the king of sims anymore, though, and Forza has surpassed it, until GT5 comes out. It appears that PD is out to REALLY make it a sim, which is great, and it'll get my dollars for sure.

^^
Guess what, This thread isn't about forza!
Feel free to go somewhere else & make your own thread about it.

Yes, I rented Forza 2 and wasn't too impressed with it. Visually, it looks pretty on the surface but the oft-reported jaggies bothered the heck out of me. The damage modeling is fine for the typical rubbing-is-racing approach, but if I broadside into somebody at 175mph, I expect for something more than the hood to bend and the front air dam to crack :rolleyes:


That is just the visible damage. The physical damage to the car would leave the car crippled, however. In real life, of course, the car would be destroyed. In the end, it is a game, and they wanted it to be fun, so you might be able to get the car into the pits and fix the damage. I've been left with a car that can only drive in reverse at 3mph downhill at times, though. :)

Did you play Forza 2 with the damage set to simulation or just limited or cosmetic? I'm sure that GT5 will have similar options to please everyone.

They couldn't put in more visible damage than that in order to keep the car manufacturers happy. Ford doesn't want to see the Focus fold up like an accordion in a game. They don't want to see passenger compartments destroyed. They don't want to see drivers "die". It makes people think that the cars are unsafe. You won't see more than that in GT, either. Hell, Polyphony Digital has been saying that manufacturers won't allow damage at all.

Anyway, glad to see they are putting damage into the game. About time there was a penalty for hitting another car instead of a reward! :)

^^
Guess what, This thread isn't about forza!
Feel free to go somewhere else & make your own thread about it.
Ah, I love it when people who haven't read the entire thread make comments...

Anyway, glad to see they are putting damage into the game. About time there was a penalty for hitting another car instead of a reward! :)

I completely agree with that. When playing other people split screen, I couldn't stand the fact that the game rewarded people for overly aggressive driving and penalized me for racing realistically. Considering that many people expected a damage model and online play in GT4, these two features will be critical to GT5.

Ah, I love it when people who haven't read the entire thread make comments...

Oh I read the entire post, show me where in the OP it says anything about forza.

Just because someone may compare the GT series with forza is not an invitation to make the whole thread a GT vs forza thread.

Ah, so amount sold=quality? I said that GT was still tops in terms of console gaming, opinions aside, because it sold 8 times as many copies. "Tops" in this context means it is still far and away the most popular. Take from that whatever you wish.

Maybe I should point out on those very links you posted, that Forza has a higher average rating. I could also point out to you that Forza got overall better reviews than GT4, and has a higher gamerankings.com average. Have you even played (I mean really PLAYED) either Forza game?I rarely rely on others reviews/rankings just for that reason. The only opinion that matters when I choose a game is mine.

....and in many tweaking areas it lags behind PC sims from years ago. Heck, the Tokyo Extreme Racer series has WAY better customization than the GT series. You can even do engine swaps in that game"console-based driving sims" means I'm only talking about console-based driving sims :p Of course there are better alternatives on PC, there are more resources to work with.

You can't even change the way your car looks in GT4.It's racing, not Pimp My Ride.

It's realistic enough for most, and easily accessible to the masses- But it's not quite as sim as it's competitorsI used to auto-x and, for my money, the physics & general feel of GT4 is much closer to my experiences in a car than Forza 1 or 2. I obviously wasn't driving Ferraris and the like, but the basic principle is the same.

In the end, all we have is our opinions. I just won't hear anybody make such a definitive statement as "Forza IS better than GT," without acknowledging their opinion.

Frankly, the thing I'm looking most forward to is the beautifully rendered interiors in GT5. This is the most realistic vantage point from which to drive a car. Bumper cams and 3rd person chase views are for the arcade; I want to sit in the driver's seat!!

Oh I read the entire post, show me where in the OP it says anything about forza.

Just because someone may compare the GT series with forza is not an invitation to make the whole thread a GT vs forza thread.
If you did indeed read the entire thread, you would have seen this chain if events:

Someone stated that he cringes at the thought of gamers putting Forza on par with GT. Someone else replied that Forza was indeed. Someone replied to him that GT was tops as far as console based driving sims go. I asked based on what. He replied. I replied my disagreement. I didn't turn it into a Forza vs. GT thread. It had already taken that direction.

It's clear that you only read the OP, my post, and didn't read the rest of the thread. Next time, try to keep up with what's going on in the thread before you single someone out.

They couldn't put in more visible damage than that in order to keep the car manufacturers happy....
Anyway, glad to see they are putting damage into the game. About time there was a penalty for hitting another car instead of a reward! :)

Yeah, I understand why an automobile manufacturer wouldn't want that in a game.

I know my opinion isn't a popular one, but I feel that if they can't (won't) do an equally simulative damage model, they should focus purely on the driving and institute a time penalty (or other such infraction) for hitting other vehicles.
Bumper cars was a big problem in GT4, but an easy fix was just to drive like you would in a real car and not rely on broad-siding another car just to stay on the track :p

I didn't turn it into a Forza vs. GT thread. It had already taken that direction.


Well congrats on taking the troll bait & running with it.
If you like forza fine, this is the PS forum, we are talking about GT.

I'm through feeding the troll here.


Now can we get back on topic?:rolleyes:

Well congrats on taking the troll bait & running with it.
If you like forza fine, this is the PS forum, we are talking about GT.

I'm through feeding the troll here.


Now can we get back on topic?:rolleyes:
You wouldn't even know what "we" are talking about, since you didn't even read the whole thread. Hell, my post is mostly about GT, but you probably didn't even realize that since you don't read things in their entirety.

Now as for on topic, It's great that a dev is actually listening to what gamers want and delivering. Now that there's damage, Clutch and shifter support, and cockpits, there's really nothing else I really want out of GT5, except for visual mods, especially if there is multiplayer. Although the physics in GT:HD weren't as good as say, the GTR series, they were decent, when coupled with the cars performance being close to the real-life performance. I'm glad they are tweaking the physics as well... Really, this could be THE sim...

I don't know if any of you guys played Ferrari 355 challenge in arcades, but apparently, it's so close to driving the real thing that Ferrari bought a setup from Sega for each of it's drivers to practice in the off-season... I wonder if next year they'll be buying the team PS3's?

I don't know if any of you guys played Ferrari 355 challenge in arcades, but apparently, it's so close to driving the real thing that Ferrari bought a setup from Sega for each of it's drivers to practice in the off-season...

My favorite arcade game of all-time!! :D

It wasn't much on graphics (by today's standards), but the driving was impeccable.

My favorite arcade game of all-time!! :D

It wasn't much on graphics (by today's standards), but the driving was impeccable.
I played it a lot on Dreamcast. I only played the Arcade version a few times... apparently, it was/is a pretty rare cabinet to find. That game was a blast, and it ran at 60 FPS! Ya know, I just might have to go down to the local gamestop and find the PS2 version...

I played it a lot on Dreamcast. I only played the Arcade version a few times... apparently, it was/is a pretty rare cabinet to find. That game was a blast, and it ran at 60 FPS! Ya know, I just might have to go down to the local gamestop and find the PS2 version...

I didn't know they made a ps2 version...I played the DC version and really thought it was well done (coming from a PC sim guy), if the ps2 version is faithful and supports wheels, I may have to get it.

I didn't know they made a ps2 version...I played the DC version and really thought it was well done (coming from a PC sim guy), if the ps2 version is faithful and supports wheels, I may have to get it.
I know the PS2 version supports wheels, and from what I've read, is overall better than the DC version. Widescreen support, slightly better graphics, and extra modes. The only thing missing from the DC version is online play and the ability to upload lap times, which is no big deal now.

New GT5: Prologue screenshots on IGN:
http://media.ps3.ign.com/media/949/949777/imgs_1.html
http://ps3media.ign.com/ps3/image/article/816/816595/gran-turismo-5-prologue-screens-20070829031742379.jpg
http://ps3media.ign.com/ps3/image/article/816/816595/gran-turismo-5-prologue-screens-20070829031743458.jpg
http://ps3media.ign.com/ps3/image/article/816/816595/gran-turismo-5-prologue-screens-20070829031744598.jpg
http://ps3media.ign.com/ps3/image/article/816/816595/gran-turismo-5-prologue-screens-20070829031747208.jpg

They really need to fix the shadows and the animation of the driver. That's what has been
bugging me since I've watch the video. That blooming effect on the car in the last screen
is too artificial. I am not bashing I am just pointing out what needs to be done, either way
I am buying this game so I expect 100% quality from Polyphony. I can not count how many
times Yamauchi said that "....if it's not perfect, then don't do it at all".

I love pics... It adds a touch of realism to the discussion. More pics!

As for the driving realism, for me the closer of the sims that I've played GT series and Forza (note the previous!). You can break driving realism down into a couple of categories, likely including physics. As for driving experience, I've auto X'd and raced in a SCCA division. I've also tested some GT series Porsche's and once had the opportunity to drive an open wheel (skip barber) car. My vote lands with GT. There are pieces that it lacks for overall realism, but it's pretty good.

As for the Ferrari challenge, it's good, but let's be honest. You can use fellow racers to slow down there as well. The driving experience in the game is good. The braking is where this game falls short, in fairness most games fall short here. I've had the pleasure of driving a 355 multiple times as there's one in the family, and the stopping force is different. I'm sure the actual feet the car stops in during gameplay match spec, but the visceral experience being removed makes it seems unrealistic. To be fair, it's a game...

There are a couple of posters in this thread that should save up the cash to spend a day or two at a driving school. I'm not saying this to be critical of opinion, but I think they'd throughly enjoy the experience, and would likely come away with a different opinion on realism. Obviously, this is completely my .02, worth very little to anyone but me. :)

I've gone to a driving school, (BMW's car control skills course at the BMW performane center in Spartanburg) but neither GT or Forza comes close to a real driving experience. There's too many elements missing compared to full blown sims like the GTR series. So I tend to use physics and consequences of bad driving to determine "realism" in console racers, and GT is slightly behind Forza (currently), IMO. Forza punishes you a bit more for mistakes than GT does.

As for Ferrari challenge, I can't be too harsh on it, considering the game is nearly 10 years old on hardware barely more powerful than a PSP. Also, the arcade version is a different experience, as it has better hardware, superior physics, and a fully modeled clutch. At the time, it was superior to anything else.

IMO the game is looking great. They appear to have improved the incar animations that are missing from other titles:
Most of Yamauchi's hot lap in a Ferrari F430 was in the new cockpit view, and it looked freaking amazing. You could see the stitching in the leather upholstery, the driver's hands looked good moving on the wheel (Inaba said they were still tweaking that bit), it was magical, but then I am a nut for in-car cams.
http://www.1up.com/do/newsStory?cId=3162297
Also includes an improved physics engine & drift mode all in 1080p at 60fps, can't wait.

Also includes an improved physics engine & drift mode all in 1080p at 60fps, can't wait.

I want a drag strip in GT5!!