I've recently found this website and have been enjoying reading through it. Talk about nostalgia...I'm only 23, but I was real into the A/V stuff from around 14 on and got a job helping install it all by the time I was 15 with a local dealer. These CRT's take me back...

So...

Right now I'm in the process of finishing my basement and the home theater is going to be moving down there and a front projector system will finally be a reality for me. I was planning on getting a budget level but descent 3-Chip LCD or a DLP projector. I had an epiphany though in the last couple of days. I have 1600 sq. feet of open space in my basement compared to the rather small (even DLP/LCD unfriendly) family room that's housed my home theater the last few years. Not only do I have plenty of room for a projector and a huge screen, I have plenty of room for a CRT projector. Furthermore, given the fact that they provide a much better picture than all the entry level LCD's/DLP's and they're affordable now, it almost makes more sense to go with the CRT especially considering I have total control over the lighting. I even have a bit of experience setting them up and servicing them from the install days.

My question to you though is this: where do I go from here? I'm not going to lie, once college started I fell out of the A/V world loop and I don't really remember who did what and how well. Furthermore, I'm very new on the modern CRT-aftermarket scene. I don't know what's cheap and what's expensive and again, what's worthwhile. I do know I've got as much room as I need for the biggest of projectors. I know that I want to be able to run HDTV sources. I would love to run 1080P Bluray (I'm content being one of "those guys...") however, it's not incredibly important to me. That said, where do I begin? Realistically I'm still on a budget but it seems like there are a lot of good buys out there even on Craigslist.

Let's put it like this...I will be pretty content spending a grand. I'd love it if I only had to spend $500-600. I'd get by spending $1500 if I was knocking one out of the park perse. That said, would you make any recommendations or offer any guidance on the matter? I'm not in a huge rush and am willing to wait it out for 2-3 months atleast to try and find something great at the right price, but if I know more of what I'm looking for, that'd help. Also, I've read a lot about 1080P on these old models. Some say they work fine, others disagree. What's the reality of the matter here?

Thanks for any help in advance.

Elliot

Tons of info:

http://www.curtpalme.com/TechTips.shtm

If you tell people where you are located you would be surprised at how many CRT's will be knocking on your door! ;)

My advice?

Make sure to get an EM (magetic) not ES (electrostatic) machine. Read about that at Curt's site.

Be prepared for a lot of work mechanically, optically and then electronically setting up the projector. Not plug and play.

the best advice is to get an electrohome Marquee 8500 or better and add a Moome HDMI input card to it. There is nothing out there in your price range that will touch this combo and you should be able to just do it (fully checked out and modded machine + $300. card) on your $1500. budget. 3 places to check where you will find nice machines, AVS marketplace, Curt's web-site, or Videogon.

the best advice is to get an electrohome Marquee 8500 or better and add a Moome HDMI input card to it. There is nothing out there in your price range that will touch this combo and you should be able to just do it (fully checked out and modded machine + $300. card) on your $1500. budget. 3 places to check where you will find nice machines, AVS marketplace, Curt's web-site, or Videogon.

I totaly agree with Draganm. I too was in your position last year around this time, by december i had gotten a marquee 8000 soon after i foubd better neck cards and a Input from a newer 8500 then i got the Moome hdmi input card. and now i have my PJ running 1080p @ 48hz and for me i love it i had a huge 12 foot screen from my digital days and kept it even though its a bit too big for an 8 inch crt, but every one who comes to watch movies is blown away at how clear it looks with no screen door effect of digtial. here is a link to some screen shots i took the other day first two are of my projector mount:


http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=11421569&postcount=13

Athanasios

Be prepared for a lot of work mechanically, optically and then electronically setting up the projector. Not plug and play.

Yeah...thankfully, I'm one of those weird DIY types that loves tinkering with all this stuff. I've gotten pretty bored with home theater audio, stereo, guitar, amp and pedal mods and tinkering. Might as well move on to the CRT world considering I need a projector anyways. There's a huge geek in me getting really excited to finally get my hands on one.


the best advice is to get an electrohome Marquee 8500 or better and add a Moome HDMI input card to it. There is nothing out there in your price range that will touch this combo and you should be able to just do it (fully checked out and modded machine + $300. card) on your $1500. budget. 3 places to check where you will find nice machines, AVS marketplace, Curt's web-site, or Videogon.

I've read about this one a bit and it seems nice. It's one of the ones that's on my list. Though I keep hoping to find that random person on Craigslist who has no idea that they have a G90...these stories I've read about people snagging them for 2g just makes my jaw drop...


http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=11421569&postcount=13

Athanasios

Very impressive just with the pictures. I'm shocked at this point that I was actually thinking about getting an entry level DLP projector with the wonderful color wheels and all their rainbow delight fun...just shocked.

If you tell people where you are located you would be surprised at how many CRT's will be knocking on your door! ;)

Detroit, Michigan...rockin' the suburbs...

I've read about this one a bit and it seems nice. It's one of the ones that's on my list. Though I keep hoping to find that random person on Craigslist who has no idea that they have a G90...these stories I've read about people snagging them for 2g just makes my jaw drop...


I would love to have one too but am afraid of the lack of parts. Electrohomes will most likely have parts available for a very very long time.

Athanasios

Nashou, I keep scouring Craigslist for just that reason. So far all I've found is a Barco Vision 600 for $30. :) I -am- going to be going to some artists workshop in Brooklyn this weekend that's giving away some big honker CRT projector, so here's hoping it's a G90... but I wouldn't bet on it. :D

(The real question is this - if I pick up the Barco Vision 600 in NY AND the place in brooklyn has a good PJ, how do I get both of them in my Mercury Mystique at once...)

I would love to have one too but am afraid of the lack of parts. Electrohomes will most likely have parts available for a very very long time.

Athanasios

Nashou, I keep scouring Craigslist for just that reason. So far all I've found is a Barco Vision 600 for $30. :) I -am- going to be going to some artists workshop in Brooklyn this weekend that's giving away some big honker CRT projector, so here's hoping it's a G90... but I wouldn't bet on it. :D

(The real question is this - if I pick up the Barco Vision 600 in NY AND the place in brooklyn has a good PJ, how do I get both of them in my Mercury Mystique at once...)

That is something about the G90 I haven't considered. Realistically, it's not likely to happen, but even so, probably better to go with something with more parts available like the Electrohomes. Good luck on loading up those projectors...I think it'd be a fairly nice problem to have though if the honker was something worthwhile.

On a random note, there's a guy around me with a couple Electrohome ECP3500's and an ECP3100. Seems like the 3500's go for next to nothing these days. Seen many being transferred for as little as $50. Would it even be worth picking these things up for free? I'm quite tempted to if he was willing just for the sake of having something to mess around with now to get into the swing of things in the CRT world again. I guess he's moving pretty quick and needs to dump these things. What do you think a reasonable offer would be for 1 or 2 3500's?

There 7 inch machines and wont do 1080p but i think can do 1080i nit sure so dont quote me. but i would pass unless you can waste some money for the sake of learning.

Atanasios

Your choice should depend on several things.
First: how important is ease of setup...if it's very important then the Marquee or Barco is the way to go. (Ampro is just as easy, and the 3600 is sharper than both, but very few in use, easy to mod for silent operation)
If ease of setup isn't important, and your up for the challenge, the NEC XG's produce a better focus from edge to edge, but have allot more adjustments to make.
Second: how important is color reproduction...if it's not to important, the Marquee, Barco, and Ampro all look the same, for those who need good color reproduction, their not very good. However they can be mod'ed
THe NEC's and Sony's are good right from the start as they are color corrected.
Third: How important is it to be able to get "new" parts in case of a breakdown. The only one you can get parts for will be the Marquee, however the rest can be repaired by people like Curt. OR you can do what a few of us have done, buy new parts and just stick them away.
Forth: Do you want Liquid Coupling, or will Air Coupling due. The effects (or non-effects) of LC'ing only shows up a few time per movie, unless it's something like Dark City, From Hell or the like, but for many of us who started with AC'ing then changed to a LC'ed machine there is no going back. It is a step forward in shadow detailing.
Fifth: Noise, they all need a hushbox, but the NEC's more than the rest, they have 10 fans (11 for the LC'ed ) if you use a remote 100cfm fan, you can cut that down to 3 fans. All can be quited with mod's, and with a remote fan, the Marquee can be used with NO FANS!!!
Having owned a Marquee 8500, Barco 808, and Ampro 3600...I've set-up a Sony G70, maintained Barco 1209, and I have always return to the XG's (5 different ones) for my eye nothing reproduces color like they do, I could also never get the others to create the depth of image my XG does (the Marquee was second best at that) however the XG is two or three times as hard to setup, but went it's right, it's hard to beat.
Someday I will move into a 9" pj, but since I just got into Blu-Ray, it's opened up a whole new world with my XG, and that keep me tweakin' and happy for another couple years.
As mentioned, you can get a 8500 for about $1,500, probably a Barco 1208 at that same price. You can also get an XG110LC for that price (just sold one with 700 hrs at $1,500) and with some TLC it's picture will be the best of all those mentioned...but there are trade offs.
In the end, any of the better 8" units will look very good, but for myself, the highend 8" are all LC'ed, the AC'ed units are the next 1/2 step down (but still great)

How can you run a Marquee with no fans?

There is a secret handshake they will teach you, but first have to Sacrifice a digital projector. Then they will teach you the craft :p

I've already sacrificed several digitals...I also searched the archives for more KennyG quality info on the Marquee and fan mods...but not such luck!!

I guess an exhaust fan overtop of the projector with the top plate removed will allow the projector to run without the belly fans...but the power supply fans have to keep running, right?? Or wrong..

Kenny, where are you man?

I guess an exhaust fan overtop of the projector with the top plate removed will allow the projector to run without the belly fans...but the power supply fans have to keep running, right?? Or wrong..
Kenny, where are you man? right, with the 2 power supply fans in the LVPS off the unit will shut itself down after 15 minutes or less.

Judging by CZEddie's results (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=11430365&postcount=114), I suspect quiet-fan mods are a lot better idea than no-fan mods...

I've already sacrificed several digitals...I also searched the archives for more KennyG quality info on the Marquee and fan mods...but not such luck!!

I guess an exhaust fan overtop of the projector with the top plate removed will allow the projector to run without the belly fans...but the power supply fans have to keep running, right?? Or wrong..

Kenny, where are you man?

Sorry, Benareeno you are right, I wasn't thinking about that pesky ps.
With the unit mounted to the ceiling a plenum is built to seal the belly fan cavity to a fan up in your attic...also you could run a 1" flex line to the pressure plate mounted to the back Heatsink and cool that giant H-sink from "to hot to touch", to "cool to the touch". The components on the H-sink will thank you for it.

Thanks KennyG, I suppose a Marquee could be very close to silent and no need for a hushbox!

Gary, didn't you tell me that you had run a fan from another room?? If so, then you should just remove your belly fans, no?

I have ducting from the HT room into the furnace room with an 80 or 100cfm fan...I think if I get a Marquee, this would be enough to allow me to remove the belly fans altogether!

CZEddie's mod for the lvps seems like it would make a real nice difference too...

As much as I do agree that the NEC throws a better pic, perhaps a Marquee is the best overall choice...silence is golden!!!!

Ben

I agree, silence is golden.
Also realize my XG has gone from 11 fans down to 3, and has been running that way for a couple months now. As with all these remote fan mod's, all the heatsink temps are down 20-25 degrees, so a nice added benefit.
The H-def fan has been enlarged (I used one of the fan's from above the tubes) and then slowed down so it's close to silent...now it's a matter of working on the power supply fans. That's something I will attack later.
The XG is actually easier to cool as a total package than the Marquee, unless you don't worry about the Marquee's back h-sink. (which I had to do, it heats the theater room)

I'm not even sure -- which way do the belly fans blow? Would it work to remove the plate on the belly, hook it up to a plenum extractor, and get rid of the belly fans?

I'm pretty sure that's exactly what Kenny was saying...

So, are you going to keep the Marquee??

Having owned a Marquee 8500, Barco 808, and Ampro 3600...I've set-up a Sony G70, maintained Barco 1209, and I have always return to the XG's (5 different ones) for my eye nothing reproduces color like they do...Actually in past shootouts the G70 has beat the XG for color accuracy.

Straight out of the box, G70s are probably the best in terms of color, bar none. No mods required. And they're much easier to set up and work on than an XG. I can't see how you can wrong with a G70. If you're shooting for the best, it's definitely the way to go.

Color g70 and XG are in same league.
XG offers more set up options and have better focus.

Color g70 and XG are in same league.This is your opinion vs the shootout results, which were conducted with colorimeter. The hard, cold facts don't lie.
XG offers more set up options and have better focus.Again this is a matter of opinion. My opinion is it's needlessly complicated. Some people mistake this complication for preciseness. After suffering thru all the work required to setup an XG, XG owners can't help but feel like they've done something special. I'm afraid that's not the case.

You just can't beat a G70 for top performance, logical setup and ease of maintenance.

I'm sure the XG could be tweaked for equal color...Guy's XG was found to have incorrect blanking/pedestal adjustment at the time (just one of the many XG qwirks):)

WHy do we argue and defend our projectors like they're our children?? I mean, if you have a XG and you like it, great! You don't have to make it your mission in life to defend the honour of projectors....if you're happy with what you have, that should be good enough.

Ben

You just can't beat a G70 for top performance, logical setup and ease of maintenance.Wish it worked out that way for me. :(

This is your opinion vs the shootout results, which were conducted with colorimeter. The hard, cold facts don't lie.
Again this is a matter of opinion. My opinion is it's needlessly complicated. Some people mistake this complication for preciseness. After suffering thru all the work required to setup an XG, XG owners can't help but feel like they've done something special. I'm afraid that's not the case.

You just can't beat a G70 for top performance, logical setup and ease of maintenance.

I can't recall the shootout result well but thought he said they were in ball park. Color performance is determined by c-elements and both pj's have identical elements. If not then we can argue unless you are talking about the blue crt w/o the c.

XG1352 is arguably has higher bandwidth. Some say they are the same but my XG actually beats my own digital 720 pj in overall sharpness, detail and clearity. Perhaps it is due to its HD-134 don't know.
If it wasn't the case I wouldn't have said so and don't really care it is mine or not. It is only a pj and I can find more stuff to brag about than a PJ.:confused:

I'm sure the XG could be tweaked for equal color...Guy's XG was found to have incorrect blanking/pedestal adjustment at the time (just one of the many XG qwirks):)

WHy do we argue and defend our projectors like they're our children?? I mean, if you have a XG and you like it, great! You don't have to make it your mission in life to defend the honour of projectors....if you're happy with what you have, that should be good enough.

Ben
I hope you did not mean this to be a serious post.:confused:
They were talking about differences and I replied as one owner with 7 years of experience with the XG. If you don't like it then there is nothing I can do about. I did not consider my purpose as to defend the pj as you put it just chatting.

How much would you guys pay for a G90 site unseen?

Probably not more than a couple hundred, since 'sight unseen' could mean, 'was recently immersed in flood waters for fifteen weeks and then power washed'.

If I could somehow be assured it didn't have major damage and was complete, I'd probably pay $1000, but I haven't got a whole lot of money to throw around! :D

Is it really worth it? I didn't want to spend that much but I may be able to get one cheaper and I could sell off one of the many premium guitars I have that don't get played to make up some of the price. Is it worth it????? That's what I'm really struggling with now. I would love to own one of these and make it the center of my theater for years to come, so if the price is right, maybe it's worth the money. Realistically though, if you were insured it was in good shape, got pictures of the phosphors and a hopefully a screenshot of usage hours, what's a reasonable price on the low end?

This is your opinion vs the shootout results, which were conducted with colorimeter. The hard, cold facts don't lie.
Again this is a matter of opinion. My opinion is it's needlessly complicated. Some people mistake this complication for preciseness. After suffering thru all the work required to setup an XG, XG owners can't help but feel like they've done something special. I'm afraid that's not the case.

You just can't beat a G70 for top performance, logical setup and ease of maintenance.

Fact is both of these pj reproduce color better than any other 8", and to the eye, the G70 is no better. I in fact know someone who started with a XG, a couple years later moved to a G90, and still says the colors of the XG are better. So to say one is better than the other in terms of color is to mislead.
In my case I could not get the Sony to produce as sharp an image as the XG, and I'm not the only one who's of this opinion.
Fact is the XG IS more complicated...and because of that fact, I feel, and see that it is more precise in certain areas.
THey are both very good pj's, and if you like to tweak, both will make a great, color accurate picture.
However the Sony is definitely not a better pj, just like the XG is not a better pj than the Sony, or a LC'ed (and color corrected) Marquee. With color correction of any of the top 8" LC'ed units they are all outstanding, and not any one is "better" than the other...it all depends on what you want out of your image.