"Tech specs boast 1080p video but, alas, no high-resolution audio on either the Blu-ray or HD DVD. Instead, fans will have to content themselves with DTS-ES Discrete 6.1 Surround and Dolby Digital 5.1 Surround EX mixes."

http://www.highdefdigest.com/news/show/New_Line/Disc_Announcements/New_Line_Issues_Rush_Hour_3_Blu-ray,_HD_DVD_Details/1006

"Tech specs boast 1080p video but, alas, no high-resolution audio on either the Blu-ray or HD DVD. Instead, fans will have to content themselves with DTS-ES Discrete 6.1 Surround and Dolby Digital 5.1 Surround EX mixes."

http://www.highdefdigest.com/news/show/New_Line/Disc_Announcements/New_Line_Issues_Rush_Hour_3_Blu-ray,_HD_DVD_Details/1006

OMG a Blu-Ray EXCLUSIVE STUDIO for this year comes out with no HD audio on Blu-Ray.. Noo...

I am just glad you went the high road and did not title the thread...

Rush Hour 3 = No Lossless. What will you buy instead? HD VMD? :eek:

omg boycott Blu-ray no lossless audio! omgz dis teh suxoorzz omgz omgz omgz *head explodes*























omgz!

I love 1 and 2 so I'll probably still do a blind buy but that is dissappointing. Hopefully they'll get at least half of it right and have top notch PQ.

No lossless No buy...
Lee shouldnt this be posted in the Blu-ray section(where it already has been posted), since its a Blu-ray exclusive????:confused:

I saw part of this at a drive-in, and even the audio coming through my clip-on speaker was too good for it.

Awful movie IMO.

OMG a Blu-Ray EXCLUSIVE STUDIO for this year comes out with no HD audio on Blu-Ray.. Noo... Blu-bots will start commiting mass suicides or they'll just start buying the SD version of the movie. ;)
And exactly what part of releasing on both formats, makes New Line a "Blu-Ray EXCLUSIVE STUDIO"? :rolleyes: It's been nothing but fanboy responses around here lately. If you *really* want to keep playing the fanboy game, someone would say since New Line is releasing on both formats, the Blu-ray version is being crippled to accommodate HD DVD's capacity deficiency.

No lossless No buy...
Lee shouldnt this be posted in the Blu-ray section(where it already has been posted), since its a Blu-ray exclusive????:confused:

"Exclusive to both high-def versions will be a picture-in-picture video commentary featuring Ratner and cast & crew, while the HD DVD version will also enjoy web-enabled content to be announced at a future date."

Might be nice if they could actually deliver on the promises of such an advanced format! :p

OMG a Blu-Ray EXCLUSIVE STUDIO for this year comes out with no HD audio on Blu-Ray.. Noo... Blu-bots will start commiting mass suicides or they'll just start buying the SD version of the movie. ;)

You still haven't sold your Blu-ray collection?

And exactly what part of releasing on both formats, makes New Line a "Blu-Ray EXCLUSIVE STUDIO"? :rolleyes: It's been nothing but fanboy responses around here lately. If you *really* want to keep playing the fanboy game, someone would say since New Line is releasing on both formats, the Blu-ray version is being crippled to accommodate HD DVD's capacity deficiency.

Just another reason why HD DVD needs to disappear as quickly as possible.

Whenever it does come out on HD DVD, it will have DD+ as the HD DVD spec mandates that codec. However, it will be 640k DD+.

Whenever it does come out on HD DVD, it will have DD+ as the HD DVD spec mandates that codec. However, it will be 640k DD+.
I think you have that wrong. *Bluray* is the format that is limited to 640K with DD+ at 5.1

However, DD+ on HD DVD goes much higher than that.

And DTS-ES 6.1 at 1.5 mbps is going to sound fantastic too.

omg boycott Blu-ray no lossless audio! omgz dis teh suxoorzz omgz omgz omgz *head explodes*

omgz!:D ! I wonder if BD folks will be buying only the DVD of this? :p

Highdefdigest throws around "no HD Audio" too casually. Most of the time they mean no lossless. I'm not sure if it is genuine ignorance or if they do it regardless to give their reviews more "punch".

No biggie, as it's easily the weakest of the trilogy. It does have some great moments, though.

I think you have that wrong. *Bluray* is the format that is limited to 640K with DD+ at 5.1

However, DD+ on HD DVD goes much higher than that.

And DTS-ES 6.1 at 1.5 mbps is going to sound fantastic too.I'm fully aware that DD+ goes upto 1.5mb. However, being that New Line is under the Warner umbrella, they most likely will follow their disc specs....which means DD+ @ 640k.

I am just glad you went the high road and did not title the thread...

Rush Hour 3 = No Lossless. What will you buy instead? HD VMD? :eek:

Yea that is a good thing because this thread would have been at least 5 pages by now if it was titled that!

I think you have that wrong. *Bluray* is the format that is limited to 640K with DD+ at 5.1

However, DD+ on HD DVD goes much higher than that.

And DTS-ES 6.1 at 1.5 mbps is going to sound fantastic too.

Are you sure about that? I could have sworn DD+ goes up to 1.7 Mbps on Blu-ray.

I just saw Alexander Final Cut's specs - looks like Dolby Digital 640 Kbps on both formats.

Whenever it does come out on HD DVD, it will have DD+ as the HD DVD spec mandates that codec. However, it will be 640k DD+.

Yes but might not it also have 1.5 Mbps DTS:ES 6.1?

And exactly what part of releasing on both formats, makes New Line a "Blu-Ray EXCLUSIVE STUDIO"? :rolleyes: It's been nothing but fanboy responses around here lately. If you *really* want to keep playing the fanboy game, someone would say since New Line is releasing on both formats, the Blu-ray version is being crippled to accommodate HD DVD's capacity deficiency.

How is the HD DVD's capacity crippling the BD version when it's the BD 1.0 spec that's crippling its own release? Both HD versions will have a PiP feature of some sort, meaning the BD version will contain two encodings of the movie in one 50GB disc. :rolleyes:

How is the HD DVD's capacity crippling the BD version when it's the BD 1.0 spec that's crippling its own release? Both HD versions will have a PiP feature of some sort, meaning the BD version will contain two encodings of the movie in one 50GB disc. :rolleyes:
Did you read the article title? Did you read the full comment I wrote? Did you understand the full comment I wrote?

I'll latch onto this movie when they:

(1) Redo it with lossless audio

2) redo it without Chris Tucker.

I'll latch onto this movie when they:

(1) Redo it with lossless audio

2) redo it without Chris Tucker.

Actually, I'll live without great sound, as long as they get rid of Chris Tucker.. :p

Why would anyone WANT to listen to Chris Tucker in lossless? The screeching...like nails on a blackboard....

Arg. :D

Are you sure about that? I could have sworn DD+ goes up to 1.7 Mbps on Blu-ray.

I just saw Alexander Final Cut's specs - looks like Dolby Digital 640 Kbps on both formats.For BD, DD+ is only used to deliver 6.1 to 7.1 tracks up to 1.7 Mbps. (A combination of 640 Kbps for the 5.1 core, and up to 1 Mbps for the DD+.) For normal 5.1 content, BD is restricted to Dolby Digital at 640Kbps.

I'm fully aware that DD+ goes upto 1.5mb. However, being that New Line is under the Warner umbrella, they most likely will follow their disc specs....which means DD+ @ 640k.

Actually

On HDDVD, DD+ itself can go up to 3Mbps regardless of how many channels used.

BluRay DD+ is 640kbps for the core (5.1) and 1.024 Mbps for the extension packets (another 5.1 Channels each packet) which it can have 4 (4.096 Mbps) for a total bandwidth of 4.7 Mbps.

ninajeedit: Grommet beat em to it.

For BD, DD+ is only used to deliver 6.1 to 7.1 tracks up to 1.7 Mbps. (A combination of 640 Kbps for the 5.1 core, and up to 1 Mbps for the DD+.) For normal 5.1 content, BD is restricted to Dolby Digital at 640Kbps.

Isn't DD+ decoding on Blu-Ray players optional like TrueHD? Isn't that the reason why Blu-Versions of Warner movies have DD compared to the HD DVD DD+ track?

boycotting this movie not b/c no lossless audio, b/c it just isnt good compared to the first 2. first 2 i will pick up with or without lossless audio. oddly enough they released remastered dvd's prior to the 3rd movie's theatrical launch yet no word on HDM versions.

Isn't DD+ decoding on Blu-Ray players optional like TrueHD? Isn't that the reason why Blu-Versions of Warner movies have DD compared to the HD DVD DD+ track?Well, yes... and, as I stated above, the BD standard doesn't support DD+ for 5.1 content at all. So, they couldn't do it even if they wanted to. There aren't a lot of discrete >5.1 mixes out there (especially from Warner)...

Since DD+ was decided to not be mandatory in BD players, and Dolby representatives have stated that 5.1 audio quality gains between 640 Kbps and the maximum of 1.7 Mbps are far less obvious than the jump from ~384-480 Kbps DD to 640 Kbps DD on BD, I assume the BD group decided this was the "right thing to do."

Wow, way off topic... :confused:

I would rather sit and watch delta farse over and over again then have to spend $30 on this title, the first was ok, they have gone down hill since..

I would rather sit and watch delta farse over and over again then have to spend $30 on this title, the first was ok, they have gone down hill since..

2nd had zhang zi yi and roselyn sanchez tho, and it was funny for the most part and the action was good.

you are still trying to justify spending $28 on delta farce aint you? :D

another rental.

Actually

On HDDVD, DD+ itself can go up to 3Mbps regardless of how many channels used.

BluRay DD+ is 640kbps for the core (5.1) and 1.024 Mbps for the extension packets (another 5.1 Channels each packet) which it can have 4 (4.096 Mbps) for a total bandwidth of 4.7 Mbps.

ninajeedit: Grommet beat em to it.

Just trying to cut off some misinfo before it spreads. We seem to go through this every couple months.

There is no such thing as DD+ 5.1 on BB. It is not possible.
5.1 is DD at up to 640K. DD+ on BB is for 6.1+ channels ONLY.

BB does not support DD+ for 5.1 channel mixes. BD is limited to 640K DD for 5.1 channels (vs 3Mbps for HD DVD DD+)

Incorrect analogy removed. Busted by the obscure V-5 analogy police: geko29. Never knew they made V-5 engines. :)

Whenever it does come out on HD DVD, it will have DD+ as the HD DVD spec mandates that codec. However, it will be 640k DD+.

DD+ is limited to 640K on blu ray, not HD DVD. Warner usually puts DD+ as 640K because they are lazy to do two encodes.

DD+ is limited to 640K on blu ray, not HD DVD. Warner usually puts DD+ as 640K because they are lazy to do two encodes.
BD limits HD DVD again.

DD+ is limited to 640K on blu ray, not HD DVD. Warner usually puts DD+ as 640K because they are lazy to do two encodes.The reason why it will be 640k is irrelevant. My point is that the HD DVD version will have DD+.

Who cares about DD+ , DD or DTS. We CAN HAVE TrueHD, MA or PCM now... On new releases it's inexcusable. What's next LOTR in DD+ will 'good enought'?

Who cares about DD+ , DD or DTS. We CAN HAVE TrueHD, MA or PCM now... On new releases it's inexcusable. What's next LOTR in DD+ will 'good enought'?

3Mbs DD+ would certainly be "good enough".

BB does not support DD+ for 5.1 channel mixes. BD is limited to 640K DD for 5.1 channels (vs 3Mbps for HD DVD DD+)

Saying 5.1 DD+ on BB is like saying a car has a V-5 engine.
Wait, first you said it was impossible, now you're saying it's possible? So which is it? :p

In case you didn't get the basis for the sarcasm, here you go: (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VR6)
In 1997, VW removed a cylinder from the VR6, creating the VR5, the first block to use an uneven number of cylinders in a V design (other than the Honda V3 triples of MotoGP fame). This version, which had a 2.3 L capacity, was capable of 150 PS (110 kW/148 hp) and had a maximum torque of 210 N·m (154 ft·lbf). It was introduced in the Passat in 1997, and later in the Golf and Bora in 1999.

Congrats on the faulty analogy of the day! :D

DD+ is limited to 640K on blu ray, not HD DVD. Warner usually puts DD+ as 640K because they are lazy to do two encodes.

Once again DD+ 5.1 is NOT possible on BD (at 640K or any bitrate).
DD+ 5.1 does not exist PERIOD on BD.

BD uses plain jane DD at up to 640K for 6 channels (5.1).
For BD to add channels beyond 5.1 a DD+ extension packet is used for the additional channels.


BD
1.0 to 5.1 channels - up to 640K DD (normal DD not DD+)
6.1 channels - up to 1.67Mbps (normal DD 640K "core" + 1024K DD+ for extra channel)
7.1 channels - up to 1.67Mbps (normal DD 640K "core" + 1024K DD+ for extra 2 channels)

HD DVD
1 to 7.1 channels - up to 3.0Mbps DD+
(elegent, simple, and complete).

*Note that since DD+ decoding is not required in BD players studios might not/rarely use DD+ 6.1+ tracks on BD. Compare DD+ @ 1.67Mbps which work on some? BD players to DD+ @ 3.0Mbps that work on 100% of HD DVD players. From the studios point of view which is a better ROI?

DD+ is limited to 640K on blu ray, not HD DVD. Warner usually puts DD+ as 640K because they are lazy to do two encodes.

Actually DD+ is limited to 0K at 5.1 on BD. :)

This movie is gonna blow not because of the lack of HD audio, but because of the lack of quality. It is the definition of a mindless summer blockbuster.

Can we quit using the term HD audio?

Can we quit using the term HD audio?

No, we will not.

Lossless isn't HD audio, saying it is is like saying 480i non compression video is HD video. 48/24 96/24 is HD audio lossy or lossless.

Here is a chart from Dolby's site listing the specs for each format:

http://www.dolby.com/images/products/dmp/ComparisonTable_800px.jpg

Interesting. What is MLP Lossless?

It's TrueHD with a different header format, essentially. Dolby licensed it, messed with the packet layout, and branded it TrueHD.

I think you have that wrong. *Bluray* is the format that is limited to 640K with DD+ at 5.1

However, DD+ on HD DVD goes much higher than that.

And DTS-ES 6.1 at 1.5 mbps is going to sound fantastic too.

gotta love backwards thinking

BD has a minimum of 8Mbps dedicated exclusively for audio at all times
HD DVD has a minimum of about 0.5Mbps dedicated to audio

If a film doesn't have lossless it's because the studio is too freaking lazy to do it, the studio wants a reason to double dip, or the video peaks disallow the use of lossless on HD DVD and the studio doesn't want to do separate encodes. Those are the scientific facts.

BD limits HD DVD again.

FUD

How is 8Mbps of dedicated audio bandwidth limiting to 0.5Mpbs dedicated audio bandwidth?

Science not FUD please.

Basically BD allows for lossless on every release no matter how high the video peaks go. HD DVD cannot offer the same. If the video peaks are too high on HD DVD, there is insufficient bandwidth for lossless.

The RJB film perfectly supports these facts as well.

This movie isn't worth buying even if it had HD audio.
Never relly enjoyed the films. I can stand chris tucker. Can't they get somebody who can act.

It's a good thing it won't have any lossless aduio - really can live without Chris Tukers whinney high pitched voice captured and replayed in all its nasal high pitched squeaky glory

Can we quit using the term HD audio?

Lets just quit using HD video while we're at it as well:rolleyes:

There is no such thing as DD+ 5.1 on BB. It is not possible.
5.1 is DD at up to 640K. DD+ on BB is for 6.1+ channels ONLY.



umm BB - Bluray? Should it be BD and not BB? ;)

Anyway, you are correct.

The core audio of Dolby in Bluray is Dolby Digital not Dolby Digital PLus like I hastely typed. The extended packets are DD+.

gotta love backwards thinking

BD has a minimum of 8Mbps dedicated exclusively for audio at all times
HD DVD has a minimum of about 0.5Mbps dedicated to audio

If a film doesn't have lossless it's because the studio is too freaking lazy to do it, the studio wants a reason to double dip, or the video peaks disallow the use of lossless on HD DVD and the studio doesn't want to do separate encodes. Those are the scientific facts.

it could have 1 Pbps of bandwidth, DD still capped at 640k. The hindering of the technology is always the smallest choke point in which case the 640k is the smallest choke point. Bandwidth is IRRELEVANT.

This proves BD doesn't have the space needed for lossless audio!!!

And exactly what part of releasing on both formats, makes New Line a "Blu-Ray EXCLUSIVE STUDIO"? :rolleyes: It's been nothing but fanboy responses around here lately. If you *really* want to keep playing the fanboy game, someone would say since New Line is releasing on both formats, the Blu-ray version is being crippled to accommodate HD DVD's capacity deficiency.

Actually, since both versions have picture in picture, that means the blu-ray version had to go the two copies of the movie route, one with the second picture added and the other without.

If the hd dvd version used the same video encode of the feature and the much smaller PiP encode added, that leaves a lot of space that they could have used for TrueHD.

So if that's the case, wouldn't it be the inferior/incomplete hardware associated with blu-ray currently that is causing the problem? IE lack of second video decoder.

Oh dear......

If a film doesn't have lossless it's because the studio is too freaking lazy to do it, the studio wants a reason to double dip, or the video peaks disallow the use of lossless on HD DVD and the studio doesn't want to do separate encodes. Those are the scientific facts.

The first two reasons you give here are not 'scientific facts', just your speculation.

Pretty funny people are arguing over a craptastic movie's lack of HD audio......can't wait to see the flame war on the Plan 9 from Outer Space specs. :rolleyes:

It's a good thing it won't have any lossless aduio - really can live without Chris Tukers whinney high pitched voice captured and replayed in all its nasal high pitched squeaky glory

Amen. I've yet to see a Rush Hour movie because I can't stand that guy. He was bearable in "Friday", because it worked for that character and the movie was funny. But I couldn't believe he uses the exact SAME screechy voice in EVERY movie. Nails down a chalkboard.

The reason why it will be 640k is irrelevant. My point is that the HD DVD version will have DD+.You misunderstand what mandated means: the player must be able to decode it.

A HD DVD movie can have only a DD 448kbps soundtrack and will be perfectly in spec.

Diogen.

Actually

On HDDVD, DD+ itself can go up to 3Mbps regardless of how many channels used.

BluRay DD+ is 640kbps for the core (5.1) and 1.024 Mbps for the extension packets (another 5.1 Channels each packet) which it can have 4 (4.096 Mbps) for a total bandwidth of 4.7 Mbps.

ninajeedit: Grommet beat em to it.

Actually the blu-ray specs limit you to one extension packet, and to add insult the extension packet only purpose is to replace the 2 surround channels (from the 5.1 core) and replace them with 4 surround channels (for a total of 7.1).
The front channels are still limited by the plain old DD standard, and get no benefit from the extension.

Audio...meh...

HD-DVD, BACK OF THE BUS!!!

Or are you gonna Rosa Parks Blu-Rays ass?

Actually the blu-ray specs limit you to one extension packet, and to add insult the extension packet only purpose is to replace the 2 surround channels (from the 5.1 core) and replace them with 4 surround channels (for a total of 7.1).
The front channels are still limited by the plain old DD standard, and get no benefit from the extension.
That is correct.

And too few people understand that DD+ on Bluray is actually just DD. And all DD+ or DD 5.1 soundtracks on BD are limited to a maximum bitrate of 640k.

That is correct.

And too few people understand that DD+ on Bluray is actually just DD. And all DD+ or DD 5.1 soundtracks on BD are limited to a maximum bitrate of 640k.

It doesn't matter. It's coming on BD a couple months before HD DVD (not over a year and counting like SOME movies), so of course there isn't an 11 page+ discussion and outrage over how much DD+ sucks and how no one is going to buy the movie because it doesn't have lossless.

That would go against the "hypocritical oath" the Blu-ray fanboys take on this forum.

Heh, Tucker was great in the Fifth Element. Perfect guy for that character. :D Even moreso than Friday.

But yeah, as far as audio, if they're going to stay with a gimped lower bitrate HDDVD encode, the least they could do is put a PCM track.

The audio specs. may be a mistake. Hairspray, also from New Line, is getting 7.1 channel DTS Master Audio on Blu-ray. It could be that Rush Hour 3 is getting the same... even that one had better box office than Hairspray!

New Line has ususally been pretty good about audio on their releases.

We shall see.

I am currently imagining what Blade II DTS Master Audio would sound like.

Interesting. What is MLP Lossless?

MLP=Meridian Lossless Packet

This is the lossless format used for the DVD-Audio (hi rez music) format.

Yes this is the same Meridian company that is coming out with a HD DVD someday. ;)

Heh, Tucker was great in the Fifth Element. Perfect guy for that character. :D Even moreso than Friday.

But yeah, as far as audio, if they're going to stay with a gimped lower bitrate HDDVD encode, the least they could do is put a PCM track.

The Audio holdup here is with the BD audio specs and that they are doing the fake PIP with two separate encodes of the movie to achieve this fake PIP.

I do not have much interest in this movie so I do not know how long it is, but you should read the earlier posts to know HD DVD is getting short-cahnged AGAIN because BD is limiting the HD audio used. :p

Actually the blu-ray specs limit you to one extension packet, and to add insult the extension packet only purpose is to replace the 2 surround channels (from the 5.1 core) and replace them with 4 surround channels (for a total of 7.1).
The front channels are still limited by the plain old DD standard, and get no benefit from the extension.

You sure about that as the information I posted was basically from Dolby themselves re: the DD extension packets?