hmm blea. my dad is gettin a kick ass projector and plasma for his living room, surround sound, whole shebang. while helping him look around its got me wanting to buy a new tv. i got about a 2 year old sammy hlr-5087, its 720p and i figure what the hell with prices down to what they are these days i can get a good 1080p dlp at around 60inches for a bit over 2k. i kinda wanted a plasma but a good 60" is over 4k so i think i'll stick with dlp tech or something

after looking at some stuff in store and looking around i think ive narrowed it down to a 60" sammy and sony

for the sony i guess its the KDS-60A300, for the sammy i think the HL-T6187s

have a few questions though and would love to hear you guys opinions

1) vid lag... mentinoed this briefly in a few other threads i was making but i need to know. do these models have it? has it been fixed in dlps these days? Processing time is the cause of this as far as i know im really hoping they use good enough processors these days wher ethats not an issue

2)i thnk this was answered in my componnt cable thread, but im assuming both these models take 1080p through component right?

3) sonys tech.. its some SXRD thing right? what exactly is that? for that matter whats up with the LED dlp, my understanding is the led one doens't use a color wheel anymore its just the mirrors and leds and stuff. also just want confirmation that the led one is supsoed to last the life of the set right? no bulbs to replace? I dont know anything bout the SXRD thing.. asuming its some kinda dlp tech, does it require regular bulb replacement if thats the case? lookin for some clarification on this

4)suposedly the sony has a 120hz refresh rate or something, but i couldn't find any info on the sammy regarding that. it is the standard 60hz? what exactly does a higher refresh rate do? does that have anything to do with vid lag? i dont think motion blurs an issue which is what i thought it handled

5) finally with the sammy. im a bit confused on the models actually. thers also a HLT-6189S but i cant really tell what the differnce is between that and the 87... spec wise they seem the same, except the 89 lists bluetooth (whoop de do) is that the only diff? also the 56" models seemed like some of them had pc inputs but i dont see that listed on the 87 =( is that a typo or does it just not have a vga input?

think thats about it. Would love to hear from gamers who own these sets since this set will ONLY be used for gaming, its not even being hooked up to cable. the vid lag is by far the biggest issue for me. Hardcore gamers only, most casual gamers probably wouldn't even notice the lag. Really dont know which of these 2 to get. ive been really happy with my old sammy other than the vid lag, its been very reliable, whereas my old sony 32" Vega had some problems with it... not sure what reliablity is on the sony

If you are a gamer get the Sony hands down. This is probably the single greatest set for gaming ever created.

reasons? does it have zero vid lag?

Zero lag for an A3000... or for that matter, XBR2. I have gamed extensively on both (360 and PS3).

I have the sammy your looking at the 61 inch, it does have a VGA input which will do 1080P via xbox 360 w/ HD DVD add on drive also 1080 via component and HDMI, zero lag. The set is incredible, the newer LED models has a longer life so to say but I have read reports of some pictures looking un-natural. For the recored you should be able to pick up this sammy model for mide teens...

The Sony has 1080p over component as well.

with this game mode stuff, doesn't turning that on lower the picture quality though?

2 people saying zero lag.. read your reply in my other thread hw, apreciate your input but if you didnt' notice the lag imediatly in halo 1/2 untill you started playing vs mode on it im a bit dubious as to your opinion on h3, because i noticed it imediatly in h2 wth my older sammy

ergo, have you tested it with rythym games or are you just basing it on regular gaming? Which one do you have, the 87 or 89? Hell Im still not even clear on what diff is between the 87 and 89. Do you notice any hotspots or anything? been browsing through the owners threads for these (so many posts! its taking a while) and am a bit conscrened about this. Oh and since you have it, is DNIE selectable to on and off? for a while there sammy took that option away which is stupid since i like turning it off for older ps2 games and stuff, it accetuats the hell outa jaggies

also, the hdmi on the sony is 1.3 right? im nto clear on what it is on the sammy, can you tell what yours is ergo? is it 1.3 or an older version, if its only 1.1 or 1.2 that might make my descision right there im only buying 1.3 the owner thread didn't clarify this either

Sony is very good for gaming, zero lag.. I tested the response time earlier today playing need for speed, using the rear view mirror button. Instant. I have experienced no difference in game mode, so it seems pointless to turn it on...

Also, the kuzu-ryu-sen looks great upscaled to 1080p on the SXRD.

well finally found them both at best buy, oddly enough neitehr andersons or circuit city ahd either of them. i wont buy from best buy because i hate them but i guess i can use them to test out the video lag. i messed witht he settings a bit and i must say that the sony picture looked a bit brighter, but the sammy looked a bit crisper. the sony also had some weird options like irus adjustment or something with auto, low mid high max, ect that i have no idea what they did, seemed to make things brighter maybe?

one thing i noticed on the sony, the picture seemed to almost kinda skip and stutter kind of.. not sure if thats the source or what. there were some optionf for stuff like motion smooth dunno if that was effecting it or what it did.

im kinda leaning twords the sammy but i still dont know if the sammy is 1.3

still lookin for answers to some of the questions.. is the sammy 1.3 hdmi?
what about sony, im almost positive the sony is

and im STILL not clear on the difference betwen the 87 and 89 on the sammy model.. is it just that the 89 has bluetooth? i dont see any other differnce

well finally found them both at best buy, oddly enough neitehr andersons or circuit city ahd either of them. i wont buy from best buy because i hate them but i guess i can use them to test out the video lag. i messed witht he settings a bit and i must say that the sony picture looked a bit brighter, but the sammy looked a bit crisper. the sony also had some weird options like irus adjustment or something with auto, low mid high max, ect that i have no idea what they did, seemed to make things brighter maybe?

one thing i noticed on the sony, the picture seemed to almost kinda skip and stutter kind of.. not sure if thats the source or what. there were some optionf for stuff like motion smooth dunno if that was effecting it or what it did.

im kinda leaning twords the sammy but i still dont know if the sammy is 1.3

still lookin for answers to some of the questions.. is the sammy 1.3 hdmi?
what about sony, im almost positive the sony is

and im STILL not clear on the difference betwen the 87 and 89 on the sammy model.. is it just that the 89 has bluetooth? i dont see any other differnceThe difference between the xx87S and the xx89S is that 89 series has 1.3 HDMI with CEC, USB 2.0, PIP, Bluetooth, and a all black frame.
The 87S has 1.2a HDMI, USB 1.1, almost all black frame except for bottom lip which is silver.

Yes the Sony uses 1.3 HDMI.

As far as motion response: the DLP is rated at 15 micro seconds response, where as the Sony LCOS is like 2.5 milli seconds.

One thing I noticed on the LED sets was the viewing angles were pretty bad. I could have probably dealt with the dimmer look to the picture but my family room has seating at multiple angles around the TV. While A3000 doesn't have the best viewing angles either they were much better then the LED sets.

Which one has a better picture is purely subjective you need to judge that for yourself and not what someone else tells you.

As far as gaming I had a Samsung 76 series and I gamed a lot on it before the Sony and it had no issues with my 360 or my Wii.

I know your not asking about the Mit sets, but they also are very nice sets, (734 and833) they both have 4 HDMI 1.3 inputs. the 833 also has 120Hz and does 1080p/24p, and has 3D gaming, The PQ on these sets also are great.
the 120Hz (higter refresh rate), minimizes motion blur in fast moving action scenes, so makes it great for gaming. Have a PS3 and 360 hook up to the 833 and they both look great.
The Mit come in 57",65" and 73" sets.

I know your not asking about the Mit sets, but they also are very nice sets, (734 and833) they both have 4 HDMI 1.3 inputs. the 833 also has 120Hz and does 1080p/24p, and has 3D gaming, The PQ on these sets also are great.
the 120Hz (higter refresh rate), minimizes motion blur in fast moving action scenes, so makes it great for gaming. Have a PS3 and 360 hook up to the 833 and they both look great.
The Mit come in 57",65" and 73" sets.


If only there wasn't that pesky bulb to replace after so long.

Not like it matters to me though, I'm in love with the Mits 57" 734, and will probably end up getting it in a few months.

Do you think by that time there may be improvements in the lighting to something that lasts longer?
Also, I haven't been able to find any replacement bulbs on the internet for the 734 sets... I was checking around, so I could purchase a spare when I get my TV.

If only there wasn't that pesky bulb to replace after so long.

Not like it matters to me though, I'm in love with the Mits 57" 734, and will probably end up getting it in a few months.

Do you think by that time there may be improvements in the lighting to something that lasts longer?
Also, I haven't been able to find any replacement bulbs on the internet for the 734 sets... I was checking around, so I could purchase a spare when I get my TV.

yea, know what you mean about the pesky bulb,but on the good side ,can make your set look new again down the road. as far as improvements in the lighting, down the road, it's said the laser sets may be out 1st part of next year, but prices may be pretty high, as far as replacement bulbs , you can purchase one by calling mit at 800-553-7278 or go to website www. mitsuparts.com, this is in the owner's guide, have not check around myself.

If you are a gamer get the Sony hands down. This is probably the single greatest set for gaming ever created.

Akrias,

would you mind sharing your TV settings for 360 gaming?

If you are a gamer get the Sony hands down. This is probably the single greatest set for gaming ever created.

In my opinion, The Mit 833, is every bet as good as the Sony for gaming, and with 3d gaming said to become big in the next year or so , with the mit having 3D, may make it even better than the sony.

awww crap. are you sure the 87 has only hdmi 1.2.. if thats true then that makes my descision right there

blea every mits set i looked at looked like junk as far as pq went, i wrote them off a while ago

as far as the 120hz thing goes... it was my understanding that the 3000 and the sammy are both 120hz as well, arent they?

BD, how sure are you your not getting any lag. Casual gamers probably wouldn't notice it except maybe on guitar hero or something like that, but i certainly do notice it on fps and other stuff at least on my older sammy, even after several people told me they had no lag. I need a hardcore gamers opinion on this

since it looks like i may be stuck with the sony, (i guess ill call sammy to confirm hdmi input version) i need some clarification on the stutterying picture thing i saw in store with the sony. Basically the picture looked like it was kinda skipping, panning shots and just general footage did not look smooth. this wasn't motion blur, and i dont think it was flicker (maybe it was) but the picture looked like it was kinda just skipping, or jittery. Is this some kinda issue, or was it something screwy with the settings they had with their cinemotion and motion enhancer or whatever they have gonna take a 360 in to test it today probably so would love some answers on this before i do that

oh ya, and since bb was only place around here that had it (at least on display) does anyone know of any online stores that are pretty good? i may have to buy it there since i refuse to buy at best buy.. i just generally hate buying online for big purchases like this because if theres a problem exchanges are a bitch

hmm no sugestions on settings with the cinemotion, motion enchancer, ect to try to fix the skipping immage effect i saw? damn. gonna take off here soon probably, guess i'll just try to tweak with it myself and if i cant get it working im stickin with my old 720p set i guess

hmm no sugestions on settings with the cinemotion, motion enchancer, ect to try to fix the skipping immage effect i saw? damn. gonna take off here soon probably, guess i'll just try to tweak with it myself and if i cant get it working im stickin with my old 720p set i guess

Guy, your killing us just go pick one they all should look better than your 720P display.. I really think your over thinking this, go tweek, decide, and buy then report back as to what you went with..

awww crap. are you sure the 87 has only hdmi 1.2.. if thats true then that makes my descision right there

blea every mits set i looked at looked like junk as far as pq went, i wrote them off a while ago

as far as the 120hz thing goes... it was my understanding that the 3000 and the sammy are both 120hz as well, arent they?

BD, how sure are you your not getting any lag. Casual gamers probably wouldn't notice it except maybe on guitar hero or something like that, but i certainly do notice it on fps and other stuff at least on my older sammy, even after several people told me they had no lag. I need a hardcore gamers opinion on this

since it looks like i may be stuck with the sony, (i guess ill call sammy to confirm hdmi input version) i need some clarification on the stutterying picture thing i saw in store with the sony. Basically the picture looked like it was kinda skipping, panning shots and just general footage did not look smooth. this wasn't motion blur, and i dont think it was flicker (maybe it was) but the picture looked like it was kinda just skipping, or jittery. Is this some kinda issue, or was it something screwy with the settings they had with their cinemotion and motion enhancer or whatever they have gonna take a 360 in to test it today probably so would love some answers on this before i do that

oh ya, and since bb was only place around here that had it (at least on display) does anyone know of any online stores that are pretty good? i may have to buy it there since i refuse to buy at best buy.. i just generally hate buying online for big purchases like this because if theres a problem exchanges are a bitch
You should not be so concerned about HDMI 1.3. They are several posts on here explaining that it is really not something to worry about.

So just to clarify, what is the maximum resolution capable via VGA on the Sony A3000? No one has seen fit to answer this one for me yet, including SONY! Cool that it does 1080p through component, as do the other models.

well i just spent an hour and a half screwing with settings and playing my 360 on the a3000 at best buy. Wound up attracting the whole store it was funny, eery time i looked to my side there were new employees staring at the screen lol, one wanted to jump in and play halo but his manager gave him a dirty look

anyway, i was VERY impressed. The jittery picture i saw was not there at all with the 360, it musta been something in their crappy hd source thats split so much. I had it hooked up through component and set to 1080P, it looked fantastic. I was concerned there might be artifacting as id read that many tvs dont do component very well at that res if at all, but this looked great

the games i tested were halo 3, eternal sonata (both 1080p) and rainbow 6 vegas. Halo 3 because.. well its halo 3, heh, eternal sonata because it has very bright vivid colors and is 1080p as well, and vegas because on my old tv there was a lot of that crushing you kinda get in dark scenes on it (plus its 720p and i wanted tos ee a 720 upconverted) None of that crushing was present on this tv, the dark lvls were smooth as butter

For any gamers out there YES this tv DOES have video lag despite what some people have said on these forums. Turning game mode on almot totally eliminates it though. i think even with game mode on theres still a tiny tiny bit but if there is i dont really notice it in fp's. I would need to test it with a rythm game or soemthing to verify if there is actually zero lag with game mode but at the very least it severly reduces it to acceptable lvls to me. Although the picture quality does seem to take a small dip

a couple things i didn't like, number 1 the menu system just sucks. I mean its horrible. The sammys is layed out way better. Maybe part of the problem is all the options, but one thing that really bugs me is you have to go throughl ike 5 menu screens to get to the game mode option, its cumbersome and annoying there should be a hot button for stuff like that. Also.. theres just too many options and i ahve no idea what most of them do lol, im gonna spend forever screwing with it

what exactly does the irus adjustment do? anyone know, it seemd to be a brighter pic the higher it went.. whats the auto settings do? auto 1 seemd just as bright as max setting... also does putting it on auto effect processing lag? if so i'll just leave it on max (game mode defaults it to that i think)

very impressed with the tv, definatly the one im gonna get, now just a matter of finding where to buy it. does anyone know of any reliable online retailers? i refuse to get it from best buy so that leaves basically andersons and circiuit city around here, thats all

also, i was wondering whats the ideal viewing height for this? my 50" is 27 1/2" off the ground from bottom of set to floor, and thats PERFECT for where my chair is (about a bit over 8 feet back) im dead center on it. not sure wh at id have to set the 60" at, probably a bit lower because its bigger but some of the stuff ive seen sugests like 17" that seems WAY too low to me

very impressed with the tv, definatly the one im gonna get, now just a matter of finding where to buy it. does anyone know of any reliable online retailers? i refuse to get it from best buy so that leaves basically andersons and circiuit city around here, thats allDo you have a Frys where you live? They typically make BB or CC prices look bad.

Amazon.com is very good.

theres a frys but not that close its kinda a drive, maybe i'll give them a look

amazon eh? idealy id be able to get circuit city or something to pricematch an online price but i dunno if thats gonna happen most brick and mortar stores dont match online prices

I have a new hlt-6187s and a ps3. The Bluray picture is nothing short of breathtaking. The standard def is ok and HD cable is awesome.

Playing hd games on the PS3 is much better than i thought (seeing the ps3 displays in stores hooked up to dinky 19" lcds!!) Its very immersive and responsive.

I know there have been issues noted on this forum regarding samsungs support and halos, geometry, etc - but my set seems to be near perfect and everyone thats been over to check it out has been blown away.

I would recommend the hlt-6187s to anyone looking for a great price for i big, high quality picture. I would also send them over to AVS forums as well ;)

theres a frys but not that close its kinda a drive, maybe i'll give them a look

amazon eh? idealy id be able to get circuit city or something to pricematch an online price but i dunno if thats gonna happen most brick and mortar stores dont match online pricesSince you can get to Fry's you should be able to see all the displays you are interested in then. Sometimes they have unreal sale prices on various displays.

im not getting the sammy, it doesn't have 1.3 hdmi. I'll have to check frys and i gotta look around for a stand, thats gnna be kinda hard finding the right height

im not getting the sammy, it doesn't have 1.3 hdmi. I'll have to check frys and i gotta look around for a stand, thats gnna be kinda hard finding the right heightPlease check these links before you rule out anything.

Audioholics HDMI 1.3 Q&A (http://www.audioholics.com/education/display-formats-technology/audioholics-hdmi-1-3-q-a)

High-Definition Multimedia Interface (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HDMI)

Understanding HDMI Ver 1.3 (http://www.audioholics.com/education/display-formats-technology/understanding-hdmi-ver-1.3)

BTW Fry's has a lot of stands to pick from.

Kensin-

Is game mode available in 1080p? It's not on the XBR2 and thus a big reason why I have found input lag is less in 720p/1080i than in native 1080p due to processing going on.

wx, yes game mode was avalible in 1080p, i had it hooked up through component too. It seems to pretty much get rid of nearly all input lag with it on, but the picture takes a slight hit even after screwing with some settings

my main gripe is how to turn it on, basically you have to go through like 4 menu lvls and select the input and manually turn it on, then it locks it on to a custom setting, that you cant just change to vivid or standard or anything without going back another 4 menu lvls and turning it off manually... VERY VERY cumbersome and annoying. Maybe theres a faster way but i certainly couldn't find one in store without a manual

thx for the links john i'll take a look at them later tonight im gonna go look at stands right now and check a few stores to see if they have it in stock. i found it for 2199 at techdepot, but i dont know if circuit city will pricematch an online store... its a subsidiary of office depot so maybe i can lie and say its a regular brick n mortar store but there are none around here, heh. but really if im getting a whole new tv i want the latest hdmi standard since my curent tv is actually fine its just 720p and i wanna go bigger. Would be kinda dumb not getting the most current

anyone got an answer to my height question btw?

The Sony has 1080p over component as well.

I just found this nice little treat today when I plugged in my Xbox360 to my brand new Sony KDS-60A3000 via component! I changed my Xbox360 settings to 1080p (not expecting it to work...and bam it worked..and the dashboard looked AMAZING!)

but here is my question.....with it play HD-DVDs in 1080p via component? Or even VGA for that matter? I have an old Xbox360, and I am just not sure if it will work.

i remember a long time ago being told that the VGA 1080p did not work on this Sony...is this true? Thanks for your help!