I want a new TV, I dont need one, I have a 4 year old 46'' hitachi RP and it works fine but I want something bigger.

I have been looking at plasmas and found a nice panasonic 58'' for a pretty good price.

Before I make a purchase I want to makes sure I am doing the right thing so I ask, why would someone rather have a DLP type TV if the price is the same or very close to it?

Thanks for any insight

I hate to make generalizations. Can you post some exact model numbers?

But each display needs to be taken on it's own merrits. The technology used is not really enough alone to answer your questions, I think we all get the biggest and/or best displays we can for our money.

Panasonic TH-58PH10UK


I understand it doesnt have a high def tuner, who needs it with a cable tuner which I need for PPV.

I dont care about the fact it has no speakers either since I always use my surround sound.


I am however buying this off the internet and want to make sure I am making the right choice. While I cant post prices or links you can quickly see with a search and see how inexpensive this TV seems to be for what you get.


I do play video games though and I understand plasmas can burn in easier but I can just be carful with that.

Ok, in this case. You are looking at a x768 display here. These also are known to video lag as well so the game crowd is way not so high on these for game use.

You can get a 70" 1080p JVC IDLA (x1080) for around the same price as this. Lighter, way bigger, no lag, no burn in, ect..ect...


That is why people choose other displays over the one you are considering.

Thanks for the info, didnt know this stuff. I'll research this TV right now. Do I have to worry about bulb life? Are the colors bright ect?

70 Inch Might be to big, my living room is 16' wide.

This is also the first time I heard plasmas lag, I know LCD do but never heard Plasmas, are you sure about this?


Can you put this one you recommend on the wall? (this is not a deciding factor) I ask because you bring up the weight issue, why is this important?

hmmmm this TV is not looking good http://www.highdefforum.com/showthread.php?t=13396

It's the difficult scale to x768 with high res HD sources that can cause lag.

The lag on the panasonic you are looking at may be neglagabe. I am refering to more bargain Plasma names on that one for sure.

The Buy Dig deals on the JVC's, lots on here have bought em. Looks like they are out of 61", but the 56" is nearly 1/2 the Panasonic 58" plasma you are looking at here.

Really go for the 70", at 1080p you can even sit close to it without issue. :)

hmmmm this TV is not looking good http://www.highdefforum.com/showthread.php?t=13396

The thread is from 2005 you know. :)

LCOS (JVC-IDLA and Sony SXRD) is really about as good as it gets right now.

PS: Do some searches on this display: HD70FH97

Thanks again john, can you please give me the model number of the JVC you are recommending?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
JVC HD-70FH97 - HD-ILA 70" High-definition 1080p LCoS Rear Projection TV


http://www.buydig.com/shop/product.aspx?sku=JVCHD70FH97

I replied to a thread with a similar question...

Read this
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=11724867#post11724867

this

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=11728727#post11728727

and this
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=11733849#post11733849


On the second and third post, I've attached a picture (along with a proper explanation). While the Panasonic THPX75u that I briefly had isn't the same model that you are buying, the results should be similar.

Honestly, after seeing this I think the whole plasma is the best PQ hype is delegated to LCD vs Plasma talks..

Just a note though, RPTVs come with serious drawbacks as well. For one, you will see SSE. Secondly, you need to have a pretty tight viewing area (plasma has the BEST viewing angle, hands down). Thridly, you will have to change the bulbs, which is costly and a pain in the ass.

Still, I sometimes wonder how incorrect and objective observations could be propogated in such a viral manner. I've never seen how plasmas cant do white written anywhere, in any review. Yet, it is clearly visible. I never knew it would have such an effect on how the picture looks. Once again, its never mentioned. I always thought plasmas were brighter than RPTVs, as suggested by reviews. Not the case here. I thought plasmas had better contrast, which again was visibly not the case.

So, where is this information coming from? How is it getting spread so rapidly? Not a full week after I did this test, I had yet another person tell me how RPTVs cant compare to plasmas. I thought it was pretty funny to be quite honest.

Nevertheless, RPTVs are dying because they are the least flexible displays. The LCD is smaller, decent viewing angle, performs better in brightly lit rooms, doesn't suffer from glare, and uses a moderate amount of power. RPTVs, while low power, do worse in brightly lit rooms, have poor viewing angles, and are relatively bulky. Plasma is somewhere in the middle in regards to flexibility, as it uses a lot of power, suffers from bad glare... but its thin and has a great viewing angle.

In all honesty though, there are more important things than PQ. Hands down, my SXRD and probably one or two other RPTVs will produce a better picture than plasma.. IMO. Still, if you put your tv on the "long wall" in a rectangular room, your viewing space will only be a small portion of that room. You also have to be further back from the RPTV, as vertical viewing angle can also be a problem.

So, the first question to ask is "do I have any restrictions for my living room". If you have large open windows, plasma must be eliminated (and any glossy LCD). If you have a wide (or tall) viewing angle, RPTV is out. If you have both, then you are delegated to an LCD.

Hopefully, my input is of some use.

John, that looks pretty nice. Are these designed for stands only or can you wall mount them? You said they were light which makes me worried having it on a stand with 3 kids zooming around the house.

Nick that was some good info but left me a tad confused. I sit directly infront of my TV.

While I was at one of the stores, I glanced at rear projection and while I dont know if they were the ones you guys are talking about, JVC and sony, they were not near as bright as the plasmas.


Which brings me to why I want a new TV in the first place. I have a 46'' hitachi which is about 4 years old I guess. works fine, looks fine but I have a much bigger living room than I had when I bought it.


I went to my brother in laws house and he bought a samsung 32'' LCD and it was sooooooo much clearer and brighter than my TV I thought to my self I need a new TV.

So I research and find LCD either too small or two expensive for the size. So I went plasma but Now I will have to research these TVs.

I replied to a thread with a similar question...

Read this
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=11724867#post11724867

this

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=11728727#post11728727

and this
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=11733849#post11733849


On the second and third post, I've attached a picture (along with a proper explanation). While the Panasonic THPX75u that I briefly had isn't the same model that you are buying, the results should be similar.

Honestly, after seeing this I think the whole plasma is the best PQ hype is delegated to LCD vs Plasma talks..

Just a note though, RPTVs come with serious drawbacks as well. For one, you will see SSE. Secondly, you need to have a pretty tight viewing area (plasma has the BEST viewing angle, hands down). Thridly, you will have to change the bulbs, which is costly and a pain in the ass.

Still, I sometimes wonder how incorrect and objective observations could be propogated in such a viral manner. I've never seen how plasmas cant do white written anywhere, in any review. Yet, it is clearly visible. I never knew it would have such an effect on how the picture looks. Once again, its never mentioned. I always thought plasmas were brighter than RPTVs, as suggested by reviews. Not the case here. I thought plasmas had better contrast, which again was visibly not the case.

So, where is this information coming from? How is it getting spread so rapidly? Not a full week after I did this test, I had yet another person tell me how RPTVs cant compare to plasmas. I thought it was pretty funny to be quite honest.

Nevertheless, RPTVs are dying because they are the least flexible displays. The LCD is smaller, decent viewing angle, performs better in brightly lit rooms, doesn't suffer from glare, and uses a moderate amount of power. RPTVs, while low power, do worse in brightly lit rooms, have poor viewing angles, and are relatively bulky. Plasma is somewhere in the middle in regards to flexibility, as it uses a lot of power, suffers from bad glare... but its thin and has a great viewing angle.

In all honesty though, there are more important things than PQ. Hands down, my SXRD and probably one or two other RPTVs will produce a better picture than plasma.. IMO. Still, if you put your tv on the "long wall" in a rectangular room, your viewing space will only be a small portion of that room. You also have to be further back from the RPTV, as vertical viewing angle can also be a problem.

So, the first question to ask is "do I have any restrictions for my living room". If you have large open windows, plasma must be eliminated (and any glossy LCD). If you have a wide (or tall) viewing angle, RPTV is out. If you have both, then you are delegated to an LCD.

Hopefully, my input is of some use.
Consider looking at the Samsung HL-T6187 if you are going to look at the LCoS systems. The Samsung is driven by LEDs...versus bulbs...where the bulbs need to be replaced every other year or so. LEDs have over 10 times the lightsource life/duration.

Also...the Sony has a slow startup time and lag when switching channels.

Do a search at this site for the Sansung HLT and you will see the differences for your comparison and consideration.

I am not attempting to convince you. I just gave you reasons why one would would choose RP over this simlarly priced plasma is all.

For many Plasma is it. This may be the case for you as well. Plasma is not so great for reflections either in all honesty.

I'm not so sure the plasma you linked to wouldn't be the best display for you. I recently was thinking about plasma and my wife decided on the 61" LCOS for about the same amount of money. That 1080p resolution you know. Vizio also has a 60" plasma that can be found for the same amount of money.

It is best to be informed, once informed you may come back to the Plasma as best for you. The 70" can't really be wall mounted. JVC has a new line of slim 1080p IDLA sets up to 65" which can be wall mounted, but they are more expensive.

Well, the picture I took was in a mostly white screen. The plasma will *ALWAYS* loose in this type of scenario.. in terms of brightness and in color..

In other scenarios, the plasma was a hair less bright.

I must admit though, in the store I thought the same thing... The projection seems to not look nearly as bright with too much ambient light (the ambient light is diffused off the screen - you lose contrast and thus perceived brightness). You also need to be relatively centered, a good distance away in order to have the best brightness uniformity (almost never the case in the store). Obviously, these are a bunch of conditions you don't have to worry about with plasmas. Direct view tvs will look equally bright under all circumstances (unless you have reflection problems - common with plasmas).

I suppose you could do what I did... buy two sets and keep the one you like :D

...So, the first question to ask is "do I have any restrictions for my living room". If you have large open windows, plasma must be eliminated (and any glossy LCD). If you have a wide (or tall) viewing angle, RPTV is out. If you have both, then you are delegated to an LCD.

Hopefully, my input is of some use.

While I agree with most of your post, I have to disagree with the part about RPTVs and viewing angles.

This is the single most important aspect of a display to my wife as she is constantly moving about the room while watching TV (kitchen, folding laundry, caring for baby, etc). Our HP set is fabulous at this, both horizontally and vertically.

I was recently in BB and although I will not judge a set's PQ by how it looks in the store, I feel that it was a decent environment to test viewing angle (especially since they have insanely bright lights from multiple sources around the sets). I walked to the sides of a Toshiba 65HM167 and a Mitsu 65" and got probably 70 degrees off of center of each before I noticed any problems with the picture (brightness, color, etc). That's pretty damn awesome.

Also, we live in sun country and have a lot of windows in our great room. The HP is rarely washed out and provides a great picture almost all of the time. I think a lot of it comes down to the screen finish, which is why plasmas are so unwatchable in high brightness situations. I think that the HP I have and the Mitsu 65" in the store have a very flat matte finish that just works so much better in high brightness. I think that the tradeoff may be screen brightness but these sets have such bright bulbs now that it's hardly a problem at all. The Toshiba had a seemingly brighter finish, while still matte. It seemed to me that it may have caused the excessive SSE the screen seems to exhibit. It was bright as hell though (torch mode of course)

I'm sticking with DLP RPTV for a while (plasmas are out for screen finish and LCDs have dismal picture quality and insane SDE to my eyes, even the new ones). The picture quality and price are just amazing. It's important to remember that any of these sets are amazing compared to what was available even 10 years ago...

-Evan

While I agree with most of your post, I have to disagree with the part about RPTVs and viewing angles.

This is the single most important aspect of a display to my wife as she is constantly moving about the room while watching TV (kitchen, folding laundry, caring for baby, etc). Our HP set is fabulous at this, both horizontally and vertically.

I was recently in BB and although I will not judge a set's PQ by how it looks in the store, I feel that it was a decent environment to test viewing angle (especially since they have insanely bright lights from multiple sources around the sets). I walked to the sides of a Toshiba 65HM167 and a Mitsu 65" and got probably 70 degrees off of center of each before I noticed any problems with the picture (brightness, color, etc). That's pretty damn awesome.

Also, we live in sun country and have a lot of windows in our great room. The HP is rarely washed out and provides a great picture almost all of the time. I think a lot of it comes down to the screen finish, which is why plasmas are so unwatchable in high brightness situations. I think that the HP I have and the Mitsu 65" in the store have a very flat matte finish that just works so much better in high brightness. I think that the tradeoff may be screen brightness but these sets have such bright bulbs now that it's hardly a problem at all. The Toshiba had a seemingly brighter finish, while still matte. It seemed to me that it may have caused the excessive SSE the screen seems to exhibit. It was bright as hell though (torch mode of course)

I'm sticking with DLP RPTV for a while (plasmas are out for screen finish and LCDs have dismal picture quality and insane SDE to my eyes, even the new ones). The picture quality and price are just amazing. It's important to remember that any of these sets are amazing compared to what was available even 10 years ago...

-Evan
What HP tv do you have?

What HP tv do you have?

MD5880n. Love it.

-Evan

While Id agree its very manageable (in some sets more than others), you have to admit that in most cases, RPTVs are inherently weaker in this area. LCDs arent perfect at it either, but plasmas have a clear advantage. I think most RPTVs are pretty good for 120 out of 180 degrees (although in most sets 90 deg is preferred)... which is quite a lot.


However, you have to realize that in some configurations, that extra 40 degrees is very important... flat panels do have an edge in that regard.

You also have to remember that we aren't always talking about one axis. Being off center in both the x and y axis can further cause issue. If you get up and walk around, things can vary greatly.

Of course, I was making a broad generalization, which simply will not be correct for all models... Your set could be one of the better ones, I don't know. I think though, what I said generally holds true.

I did have to bring my 61" JVC up quite a bit to satisfy walking around and still getting decent PQ. So nicknomo's comments should be given a lot of thought indeed. :)

I just went through this myself parks. If you game you really should look at rptvs. From what I gathered plasmas have possible burn in. I also didn't like the screen door effect on some of the models I saw including the highly praised Panasonics. Lcds have blurring issues. However if what I've read is true the newer models have fixed these problems with gaming. I never confirmed it but I couldn't afford the newer models anyway, so I went with a Sony rptv KDS-60A2020. Im pretty happy with it so far. I've only used it for 2 days so Im still in testing phase. Skate on the PS3 looks fantastic ;).

Yeah, I suppose my set could be in the minority. I forgot to mention in my post that I did not see excessive vertical axis problems with the sets in BB either. Perhaps they've gotten better, I don't know. The sets were slightly lower than optimal and I bent down and got on tip-toes to test. Just my opinion, of course.

-Evan

I had the liberty of putting the panasonic plasma side by side with my A3000 RPTV... In the "sweet spot", the picture was untouchable. Going a little off axis did little to change thing...

When I view the A3000 by itself, and move a good deal off axis, my eyes don't perceive that much of a change. It gets dimmer, but it doesn't really bother me THAT much.

When I had the plasma next to it, the effect of moving off axis was exacerbated by the constant brightness of the plasma.

This seemed to be the basic result of all major differences. By themselves, both seemed to have a pretty good picture. If I watched the plasma by itself, I didn't really notice just how horrible the whites were. Together, side by side, even in instances of sparse white... the plasma just looked deficient. Same thing happened with the decreased viewing angles of the RPTV, lower brightness of the plasma, flicker from the plasma, no motion smoothing from the plasma, darker/deeper colors on the plasma...

You don't really notice how much of a "problem" something is until you have a reference of comparison. It really seems to be one of those great tricks of the mind. Your brain seems to "fix" the issues mentally, unless you happen to either 1) look for them; 2) can't avoid noticing them.

In all honesty, thats why most people are perfectly happy with the sets they buy. I think if everyone had one of each type of set right next to each other, they'd be unhappy with all of them.

Is there a way to tell (or a list somewhere?) which displays have a matte/non-glossy finish?

I'm looking to put a big 50-70" display in a huge room with more windows than I know what to do with, but it seems everything has gloss, which would ruin everything.

I find great reviews of sets and deals online, but people almost never mention whether it's matte or not :(