Hi,
Only last week I purchased a Sony 1272QM projector. Over the weekend I was setting it up and noticed that the projector appears to have only '9' zones for convergence. I thought the 1272s were supposed to have 21 zones!
Aside from the name on the plate on the top cover of the pj is there any other way to easily identify the projector?

After a hasty setup on Saturday, I'm already very happy with the picture I'm getting from the pj. I'm doing a proper (ala Guy Kuo Holy Focus) setup again tonight and am expecting even better things. So I'm not too fussed if it's not the projector it says it is. I got it for a very good price, and on inspection the tubes are in great condition. (The guy I bought it from didn't seem to use it a whole lot, he said he just wheeled it out to watch the occasional footy game. Apparently he bought it 2 years ago from a guy who had a number of pj's available for inspection. He said it had been retubed by the seller. Couldn't give me the name though.)

I'm driving the pj with a HTPC and tonight I'll be trying to establish the optimum resolution to run the pj at and I'm concerned about sending a higher scan rate to the pj than it can handle. -Sending it something that's within the specs of a 1272 but maybe not a 1252. On Saturday I was running it at 1280x720 (~45kHz, 60Hz)
Do these pj's have a safety cut off if the scan rate is too high? Can I send it different frequencies with impunity and not worry about damaging the pj?

Hi,
Only last week I purchased a Sony 1272QM projector. Over the weekend I was setting it up and noticed that the projector appears to have only '9' zones for convergence. I thought the 1272s were supposed to have 21 zones!
Aside from the name on the plate on the top cover of the pj is there any other way to easily identify the projector?

After a hasty setup on Saturday, I'm already very happy with the picture I'm getting from the pj. I'm doing a proper (ala Guy Kuo Holy Focus) setup again tonight and am expecting even better things. So I'm not too fussed if it's not the projector it says it is. I got it for a very good price, and on inspection the tubes are in great condition. (The guy I bought it from didn't seem to use it a whole lot, he said he just wheeled it out to watch the occasional footy game. Apparently he bought it 2 years ago from a guy who had a number of pj's available for inspection. He said it had been retubed by the seller. Couldn't give me the name though.)

I'm driving the pj with a HTPC and tonight I'll be trying to establish the optimum resolution to run the pj at and I'm concerned about sending a higher scan rate to the pj than it can handle. -Sending it something that's within the specs of a 1272 but maybe not a 1252. On Saturday I was running it at 1280x720 (~45kHz, 60Hz)
Do these pj's have a safety cut off if the scan rate is too high? Can I send it different frequencies with impunity and not worry about damaging the pj?

I'm also interested in your question since I'll soon be owning a 1272 too. I currently have 1271q but with a dead powersupply but with a 8/10 or 9/10 tube condition. :) I will also be driving it with a linux htpc at 1080i/60hz. Was wondering if those exploding tubes were myth or a reality. :D

I'm also interested in your question since I'll soon be owning a 1272 too. I currently have 1271q but with a dead powersupply but with a 8/10 or 9/10 tube condition. :) I will also be driving it with a linux htpc at 1080i/60hz. Was wondering if those exploding tubes were myth or a reality. :D

If you're going to go through the pains of using an HTPC, at least use 72Hz to avoid judder.

Exploding Tubes!!! I've never heard that before!
Hopefully a myth. :-)

Also I've been thinking about how best to establish the ideal resolution. People talk about finding the 'sweet spot' where the scan lines (or pixels) match the lines (or grains) of phosphor. Of course there's other factors such as; at what resolution at what frequency the pj can handle before it starts to lose focus from being driven too high.
Initially I was thinking I'd just have to run through various resolutions by eye till I find one that I percieve to be the best. Comparison can be harder as there's a certain downtime between displaying each resolution.
However Gary Kuo talks about defocusing the electr' focus to be able to observe the phosphor grain to aid optical focus. I'm wondering if the phosphor grain is still visible when the electr' focus is properly set. There's a Nokia test pattern that displays alternating lines pixel by pixel, either horizontally or vertically. It would be great to be able to simlpy look through the binoculars and compare the pixel width with the phosphor grain!

'regards
Sim

I was just reading another thread titled "Cleaning / Serivce a 1272Q" that shows there should be a sticker inside the cover on the side of the machine with model# and serial#. I'll have to check that when I get home.

If you're going to go through the pains of using an HTPC, at least use 72Hz to avoid judder.

Can someone confirm please if 1271/1272 can do 72Hz at 1080i? I'm praying now that it does, does it?

Someone probably removed the 21 point convergence board(s). They are the small ones in between the red and blue CRT.

Well I got home and checked the sticker and the unit is 1252. The model# is 5000 something. I checked for the two boards between the green and red crts there's one in the DE slot, however the DF slot is empty.
I'm not that disapointed. Like I said I'm already very happy with the picture. And after scouring these forums, I've found that the only real difference aside from extra convergance zones is the larger bandwidth of the 1272. The crt's themselves in the 125x-127x Sony's are the same.
I would have liked to experiment with higher resoltutions and frequencies however the concensus seems to be that the crt's in the 12xx Sony's are pushing to sharply resolve 1280x720@60 regardless of bandwidth anyway.

After trying both 720p@60 and 1080i60 (30i) I found that I prefered 720p. It seemed sharper. Either way I couldn't get the small text from menus and under icons on the desktop to resolve clearly. I might try a few lower resolutions to see if I can bring the text into sharper relief - then look for which picture I prefer the best. (I'm here to watch movies, not to read giant emails :-)

Sim.

Where did you buy it from? Or more to the point where did your seller buy it from originally?

Yes, they have scan protection, and yes, a 1272/1252 will do 1080i 72hz, it's only a 42khz scanrate signal.

Unless you're watching US sourced DVDs/material, or HD-DVD/Bluray, you'll want to stick with 50hz or 75hz for Aussie based material. I'd use 1080i 75hz.

Where did you buy it from? Or more to the point where did your seller buy it from originally?

Yes, they have scan protection, and yes, a 1272/1252 will do 1080i 72hz, it's only a 42khz scanrate signal.

Unless you're watching US sourced DVDs/material, or HD-DVD/Bluray, you'll want to stick with 50hz or 75hz for Aussie based material. I'd use 1080i 75hz.

Are my eyes seeing it correctly that a 1272 can do 1080i at 72hz? What about 1271, can it?

The guy I bought it off couldn't remember the name of the person he bought the projector from. What he told me was that about two and a half years ago, he went to this person to buy a projector, a smaller one. But whilst there the person also showed him a larger pj that he'd just serviced and retubed and said would have a superior picture. They went with the larger one paying about AU$3000 for it.
The guy I bought it from didn't appear to be much into pj's. He just wanted something he could plug in and watch. He's replaced it with a plasma and I paid around $450 to take the pj off his hands. Needless to say I was quite happy with the price.

I don't quite get a multiple of three for interlaced material. Standard PAL is 25Hz or 50Hz per field. Each field gets shown 25 times a second. So if use 1080i at 75Hz that would mean each field gets shown 42.5 times. If my source material such as a PAL DVD is progressive then that would be okay. But if it was interlaced say from a broadcast wouldn't that screw up the whole 1:1relationship? I'd have thought I'd need to go to from 50Hz straight to 100Hz.

Anyway, I'll try it out.

Do I take it that DVD movies are usually 24p regardless of being PAL or NTSC? Mainly we watch PAL DVD movies and some US sourced material. I'm wondering if it's feasible (and worth it) to have different Powerstrip settings for each type of material. My last projector was a 1031QM running at 540p@60hz. I just left it at this for everything and rarely noticed any tearing or other issues. 'spose I'll have to watch and see.

'cheers
Sim.

Are my eyes seeing it correctly that a 1272 can do 1080i at 72hz? What about 1271, can it?

v1rtu0s1ty, the 1271 is certainly has a higher freq' and bandwidth than the 1252
check: http://curtpalme.com/PJSpecs_Sony.shtm

So yes you'll be fine. 1080i at 75Hz translates to a Hf of 48.3 kHz well within both mine and your specifications. Even though the pj can't resolve 1920 lines of horizontal resolution. It will do it's best and should give something quite good.
I found 1080i at 60Hz a bit soft, compared to the 720p@60Hz. But hopefully that's due more to the scan rate than attempting to resolve 1920 pixels. I look forward to trying Mark's suggestion tonight.

v1rtu0s1ty, the 1271 is certainly has a higher freq' and bandwidth than the 1252
check: http://curtpalme.com/PJSpecs_Sony.shtm

So yes you'll be fine. 1080i at 75Hz translates to a Hf of 48.3 kHz well within both mine and your specifications. Even though the pj can't resolve 1920 lines of horizontal resolution. It will do it's best and should give something quite good.
I found 1080i at 60Hz a bit soft, compared to the 720p@60Hz. But hopefully that's due more to the scan rate than attempting to resolve 1920 pixels. I look forward to trying Mark's suggestion tonight.

Correct me if I am wrong that 1080i @75hz or 72hz will be sharper than 1080i @ 60hz?

I can't wait to get my new 1272 from Imprez. I'm going to his house this coming Sunday. :D

1080i 75/72hz will be blurrier than 1080i 60hz as it requires more bandwidth.

For PAL dvds and Aussie TV use 75z. 75hz works for 50i material just fine, don't understand why really - one day I tried it and it worked fine :)

1080i is more suited for HD material, for DVD 1280x720 at 75hz (or 50hz) would be fine.

You have to try for yourself.

I know some people like 720p on these projectors, but I guess I'd kind of challenge the notion that our goal should be to properly resolve pixels or scan lines. Why stop right at the point where the projector can't resolve any more res? Why not keep going? Like you said, we're not reading emails!

I can't overemphasize this: Quit testing with Windows menus and browser text and icons and start testing and comparing with real material - preferably from a source like HD-DVD or BD. If not HD-DVD or BD, then at least compare resolutions with really nice high-res still images.

Doing that and going back and forth with multiple film-based HD sources, I MUCH prefer 1080i to 720p on my 1271. You simply can't get around the additional spacial resolution that 1920x1080i source provides. The detail is just incredible in 1080i. 720p... not so much. My 1271 is pretty well setup and dialed in, but it's just soft enough that you can just barely see 1080i scan lines if you look for them in whites - even standing right at the 96x54 WilsonArt DW screen. From my ~1.2x screen-width seating position, the image looks nice and solid like a softer version of 35mm film. I LOVE it. I love that you can walk right up to it and see no pixels, scan lines, or other artifacts... just image. No need for an expensive scaler... it just looks silky-smooth. Even 1080i/60 (unprocessed) looks incredible from HD-DVD. Absolutely amazing what these projectors will do now with these great HD sources.

Could this projector look sharper at lower resolutions? Sure, but the resolution will be lower! Could another projector be sharper at higher resolutions? Absolutely. Do I feel like I need to upgrade? Not right now. Sure, if I can get a G70 working for cheap, I'll do it - but, I'm in no rush. It just looks that awesome, and everybody who's seen it has said so.

SC

Good writeup about setting up a 12xx. He said the resolution before scanlines overlapped on his 1270 was 666p.

http://www.curtpalme.com/docs/Sony_1270Q_CRT_Projector_Setup_Manual_April.pdf

The only time a 1272 is not a 1272 is when it's owned by Don Wallace.

Then it would become a 1272

Are you souping up wallace's 1272's? Or is he gonna stack a couple? That'd be cool. I think I'd try 1080i/72 (x2)... if you're off by half a line, then each projector would fill the other's scanlines and you could arguably end up with pseudo 1080p/72.

It'd be fun to try, just for giggles... it'd be interesting to see if the geometry would accomodate a side-by-side.

Has anyone stacked 1272's or ECPs? VPH-2544 :D

I tried the 1080i at 75Hz. It looks good. However not having a HD player, the highest resolution material I have are some 720p tv epsiodes. My partner and I sat down, compared the 720p@60Hz with 1080i@90Hz and unsurprisingly couldn't see a difference. However when I do eventually get a HD player, it's a single keyboard shortcut to switch between the two.

I thought I was done, but ecrabb thanks to your suggestion of trying out hi-rez pictures, I can spend another night playing with the pj :D

The coolest thing I noticed as I was tweaking the placement/convergence/registration for the third day in a row, is that every time I redo it - my adjustments are getting less extreme and my zones are much closer to 128,128. This gives me such a feeling of satisfaction ;)

One thing though, I'm running a 16:9 screen and in order to get the image to the right aspect I've had to really squeeze the raster, all the way from 128 down to about 25 in the vertical size. People talk about trying to not overdrive the electronics. Would this be included? Do people just put up with it as a necessary evil. Or is there an alternative such as a voltage pot on the board that I can adjust?
(This question ought to be in a new thread)

'cheers
Sim

The only time a 1272 is not a 1272 is when it's owned by Don Wallace.

Then it would become a 1272

Mike, jelousy will get you nowhere! You only wish that 8500 of yours was HALF the pj that my 1272 is. :eek:

When I get thru swapping parts with all the other 1272s, I'm going to put all the left over parts on a pallet and have it delivered to your house!! I am going to bow-tie the pallet with a Runco I have. :D:D:D:D

lol, lol....

Can't wait to see the blender in action.

wallace