more on how both HD DVD and BD will fail. thoughts?

There’s a war going on in the technology industry. A war that doesn’t need to be fought. In the middle of the HD revolution our momentum has been stunted by 2 new disc formats; HD-DVD and Blu-Ray. I’m not here to talk about the technology itself, I’m here to talk about the foolishness of the industry to hopefully inform the masses of the idiocy of having 2 HD disc formats.

http://www.thebitbag.com/index.php/2007/10/22/why-hd-dvd-blu-ray-will-not-succeed/

CE makers better hurry up with $199 Dual Format players. I think both will fail unless this comes to fruition.

Yawn, welcome to a year plus ago bitbag.

Dude completely missed talking about dual format players, or dual format users.

With HD DVD dropping in price, under $249 with 7 free movies, even some PS3 owners may go dual format. A lot of first adopter Blu-ray set top owners will.

He is expressing a point of view that a lot of consumers have, a pox on the format war.

Nothing new here, just same old HD DVD talking points. Sony made Betamax, Blu-ray costs more to make, Blu-ray's 2:1 sales ratio doesn't matter for some reason, both formats are losing, DVD is good enough, downloading is the future, etc.

HD VMD is where it's at!!1 :D

interesting..

I think it reflects a frustration with studios soaking the consumers over and over again.

I don't agree that there are lots of fence sitters. I think there are a lot of people who simply don't care.
I do agree with this sentiment "why should a consumer have to decide between what movies they want to see and what movies that they’ll have to do without?"

Blu-Ray is beating HD-DVD in disc sales. I’d say it’s 2 to 1 but it could be more. I really don’t care though. My whole problem here is that with these two disc formats, the industry is now split. If you want Transformers in HD and you have a PS3, you’re out of luck. If you want Casino Royale in HD and you have an HD-DVD player, you’re out of luck. Tell me this, why should a consumer have to decide between what movies they want to see and what movies that they’ll have to do without?

I see this as the industry screwing us consumers over. We shouldn’t have to toil over whether to buy BD or HD-DVD. The studios were already screwing us with DVD moviess anyways. A perfect example is the numerous movies that are released several times with more features in ever new release. Terminator 2 had 3 versions. I thought the Ultimate version was the most complete DVD at the time it was released. In the wake of T3 they released an Extreme version with more special features. This is called ‘****ing the consumer’. If you aren’t a collector it’s no big deal, but some of us like to collect the best versions of the movies. When a DVD is released, I always opt for the special editions for all the features. I have sold and repurchased films several times to get the better versions. I’m tired of it. Now they want me to choose between two formats and buy the movies again?


So who really wins right now? DVD that’s who. No matter what happens, until the dust settles, the majority will still continue buying DVD movies. Plus if you are on the fence and MUST OWN THE DISC, DVD is the way to go. No one wants to upgrade 300+ DVD movies to HD format. No one wants to be stuck with a format that can’t play every film available in HD. Even if Blu-Ray wins this war, Paramount, Dreamworks & Universal will have no reason to switch to Blu-Ray. All the money that’s being made is being made on DVD and VOD services. The same can be said for Sony/MGM who are exclusive to BD. These studios will continue to stick to their guns until HD on disc matters and it may never matter at all.

All the studios seem to be doing is causing confusion. The market is now divided and the consumers are pissed. Sony and Toshiba couldn’t get along and their greed got the best of them. So now they are fighting for market share for what THEY believe is the future. They are force feeding us new disc technologies that we don’t need. If they think that we should purchase DVD movies in place of films that aren’t available in HD, why are they even bothering with HD discs? There’s money in technology. There are always geeks and early adopters that will buy into new technology on the first day it’s available. So there is extra money to be made at the cost of consumer confusion.

Let me shed some light on you readers out there. The studios don’t control the industry, the consumers do. A product isn’t successful until we buy it. I’m telling you right now there is absolutely no reason to invest money in any HD disc format.

I have to agree that we are in a fine mess. Imagine how awesome it would be if we had only one HD disc format.No fuss, everyone happy.

There will be no real winner between the two. Dual-Format players will be the norm in a couple years I think.

Unless there is a huge increase in HDM sales this Christmas, I believe both formats will die like SACD/DVDA. I just don't see the demand from the average user for hidef, due to cost and complexity.

Even a smash 'hit' like Transformers which sold 190k units of HDDVD vs 8.5 million units of SD DVD. And were already approaching the third generation of HDDVD hardware. Pretty good indication that HDM is really a niche product.

SACD/DVD-A died because there was no software support.

All the big films of the year are out, or coming out soon on HD DVD, BD, or both.

How many Top 10 albums were ever released on SACD/DVD-A?

Steve W

HDM will not fail. There is and will be a market for it for some years to come.

Perhaps we should have an MTV death math between the two formats.:D

In some ways the competition is good since it is pushing the manufacturers to cut costs and add useful features. I don't thing HD51 would be arriving so early if not for the format war. Also I think the improvements in the Blu-ray specs would have taken a lot longer. That being said this war is very destructive causing public confusion and the inability for either group to build up a mass market which will be enough to sustain profitability. Some say this is playing into Microsoft's hands since Microsoft really wants to push HD content over the internet so it can have total control. So Microsoft may be the only winner in this war. :eek:

Both formats will be around for a while, if nothing else, as niche products.
BTW, smaller classical labels still make SACDs.
J

SACD/DVD-A died because there was no software support.

All the big films of the year are out, or coming out soon on HD DVD, BD, or both.

How many Top 10 albums were ever released on SACD/DVD-A?

Steve W

Every time I read comments like this, I get pi$$ed off all over again. Regardless of the dual formats, the music industry had a great opportunity to showcase hi-rez sound .... and basically did NOTHING! Other than Dark Side of the Moon, there were no top albums released in either DVDA or SACD.

Interestingly, there is still a trickle of interesting releases - but could have been so much more.

Dude completely missed talking about dual format players, or dual format users.

With HD DVD dropping in price, under $249 with 7 free movies, even some PS3 owners may go dual format. A lot of first adopter Blu-ray set top owners will.

He is expressing a point of view that a lot of consumers have, a pox on the format war.

And with the 399 PS3 around the corner a lot HD-DVD users will go blu-ray. In the end we have reached a stalemate. The only question is will studios continue to push the HDM disc formats.

I don't know if the $399 PS3 is the answer. Prehapps a $299-399 standalone would be sweet. I d jump on a $299 BD player. Prehapps some of the gen one players will drop down enough to justify the missing spec. I figure if I can watch the movie in HD I'm good. Extas are nice but if I can get a player now for 1/2 off I can wait till UG time. Then build up the BD collection

Not saying the 399 player is the answer but it will encourage some like myself to become format neutral. I was looking to get a 360 for Christmas since I like games like GOW and Halo3 but I also like movies (much more so) and the PS3 does have Oblivion Orange box and Resistance so why not. So instead of spending 349 for an Xbox I'll spend 399 and the extra 50 gets me a bluray player. I ll add the 360 next Christmas when prices are even better.

Downloading content is the future. Hopefully it reaches mainstream sooner than we all expect.

I would not jump on any DB player until the specs are finalized and the players are capable of all the same things HD DVD currently has.

Perhaps we should have an MTV death math between the two formats.:D

In some ways the competition is good since it is pushing the manufacturers to cut costs and add useful features. I don't thing HD51 would be arriving so early if not for the format war. Also I think the improvements in the Blu-ray specs would have taken a lot longer. That being said this war is very destructive causing public confusion and the inability for either group to build up a mass market which will be enough to sustain profitability. Some say this is playing into Microsoft's hands since Microsoft really wants to push HD content over the internet so it can have total control. So Microsoft may be the only winner in this war. :eek:

You know, I keep hearing that MS wants to control downloads and all, yet I recently heard how Sony has secured rights to allow (Nokia?) cellphones to download digital content to be played back. Not that MS isn't interested in downloadable content, but to pretend as though they're the only party with a vested interest isn't accurate.

Not saying the 399 player is the answer but it will encourage some like myself to become format neutral. I was looking to get a 360 for Christmas since I like games like GOW and Halo3 but I also like movies (much more so) and the PS3 does have Oblivion Orange box and Resistance so why not. So instead of spending 349 for an Xbox I'll spend 399 and the extra 50 gets me a bluray player. I ll add the 360 next Christmas when prices are even better.

Oblivion and The Orange Box are multi-platform releases.

I think HD adoption will be slowed by the fact that people have many different types of DVD players (home theater, computer, portable player, and even in cars). This is different than VHS, in which case almost all players were just in the living room/theater room.

So what do they do? Buy an HD disk that doesn't play in all of the other devices, or just buy a DVD that works in everything they own? Replacing all of those various players is not currently an option.

I would not jump on any DB player until the specs are finalized and the players are capable of all the same things HD DVD currently has.


Ditto. Even at $299, I'd just know I was throwing away $300 and would have to buy another player. I might pick up a PS3 if it's ever 1.1 capable. I'm still not even sure I'd spend $399 for that though, as that's about $100 out of my magic pricepoint.

Shouldn't the title be renamed to 3 HD disc formats?
We have HD VMD now as well.

I'm all about embracing both HD DVD and BD. Don't restrict yourself from titles on the other HD format that can basically do the same thing you favor.

Hopefully, we'll eventually see a DVD-R/DVD+R resolution to this format war. Consumers buy dual format players at a reasonable price and studios produce their titles on their format of choice and (almost) everybody is happy.

HD VMD can be DVD-RAM :P

...All the studios seem to be doing is causing confusion... They are force feeding us new disc technologies that we don’t need...
Seems to me that this guy is the one that is confused. "Force feeding us...(HDM)!!!

How about we simple accept that HDM is not ready yet. The price is not there. BD is still on vers 1.0. You will know when HDM is ready. Normal ppl will be buying DF players.

I have to agree that we are in a fine mess. Imagine how awesome it would be if we had only one HD disc format.No fuss, everyone happy.

Not everyone. >90% would walk away because the prices are way out of line. This war is great for competition in many respects (product features, costs: royalties, reproduction, player & HDM prices, studios, "deals", BOGOs, "free dics",...

I have to agree that we are in a fine mess.

Seems to me that this guy is the one that is confused. "Force feeding us...(HDM)!!!

How about we simple accept that HDM is not ready yet. The price is not there. BD is still on vers 1.0. You will know when HDM is ready. Normal ppl will be buying DF players.



Not everyone. >90% would walk away because the prices are way out of line. This war is great for competition in many respects (product features, costs: royalties, reproduction, player & HDM prices, studios, "deals", BOGOs, "free dics",...

Yeah, but I'd rather have initial high prices than this crap we are in now. In the long run it is much better for the market and adoption. Prices would still come down.

There would be no format bickering, no confusion, and a brighter future.

.



Oblivion and The Orange Box are multi-platform releases.

Well aware of that fact. These just happen to be titles I am interested in.

Well aware of that fact. These just happen to be titles I am interested in.

Ah. It read to me as though you thought they were PS3 exclusives. Apologies then.

Unless there is a huge increase in HDM sales this Christmas, I believe both formats will die like SACD/DVDA. I just don't see the demand from the average user for hidef, due to cost and complexity.

Even a smash 'hit' like Transformers which sold 190k units of HDDVD vs 8.5 million units of SD DVD. And were already approaching the third generation of HDDVD hardware. Pretty good indication that HDM is really a niche product.

You say that like it's a bad thing. Selling 190,000 copies at a premium price, it's hard to see how it's not *already* a profitable format for major new releases. If the studios release all the major (new) movies in HD formats, and make money doing so, how can the formats possibly "die"?

How about the idiocy of idiotic articles that are passe, conventional and without an iota of originality to them.