From TopGear.com (http://www.topgear.com/content/news/stories/2368/):


Top Gear on GT5

Our inbox will be relieved at least. Not a day goes by without somebody firing us a note saying either they - or their amazing old Capri - can lap the TG test track faster than Stig. Next year, on Playstation 3, you'll be able to find out.

Top Gear has hooked up with Sony to make our iconic test track part of Gran Turismo 5. And as an office with the permanent distraction of a Playstation 2, race seat, force-feedback wheel and a copy of the current GT4, it's the best news we've had since Alonso missed out on the F1 championship.

The latest iteration of the GT series will also be fully online - and, alongside lapping the TG circuit, players will be able to download classic episodes of Top Gear via a dedicated motoring channel called Gran Turismo TV on the Playstation network.

So, how long do we have to wait? As with previous versions of the game a scaled-down prologue will come first with around 10 tracks and 60 cars. This will feature the Top Gear TV content but not the TG track. There's no official word on when this is due, but we're expecting it to hit the UK around Spring next year.

The full version of the game is due to arrive around Christmas 2008 and, again, details are yet to be confirmed. We have been told to expect around 900 cars and, of course, our track.

We'll obviously keep you posted on the development of the game, but in the meantime check out our guide to the TG track to find out exactly what you'll be letting yourself in for.

X-mas 08??? in polyphony time thats X-mas 09. Feels like GT4 was delayed for a good 2 years, waiting and getting delayed multiple times.

1. Waiting that long is a mistake, IMO. I think they waited too long on GT4, and interest waned a bit. And while it was a good game, It really wasn't worth all the delay.

2. 900 cars= 250ish cars, with multiple variations of the same car.

900 cars is great. GT5 is the one of the few main reasons I bought a PS3 at launch. With no games to play though its going to be a loooong wait. :(

I hope the upgrading is actual upgrading of each car's engine bay, etc. I disliked the generic stage 1 stage 2 stage 3 mods.

Will the cars be invincible like previous GTs or can they be damaged just like in the real world ala Forza Motorsport. 900 cars means nothing if its not realistic.

They said they were working on a full damage model but it must be done right. If not ready at launch it will be a dload later on.

They said they were working on a full damage model but it must be done right. If not ready at launch it will be a dload later on.

That'll be cool.

2. 900 cars= 250ish cars, with multiple variations of the same car.

Will the cars be invincible like previous GTs or can they be damaged just like in the real world ala Forza Motorsport. 900 cars means nothing if its not realistic.

and it begins....

Will the cars be invincible like previous GTs or can they be damaged just like in the real world ala Forza Motorsport. 900 cars means nothing if its not realistic.
I still don't get what the big deal about damage is. If you race properly, you'll never see damage anyway.

I liked damage when I was 12 and had more fun intentionally wrecking than racing. Luckily back then there was no such thing as online play in a driving game. :D

Will the cars be invincible like previous GTs or can they be damaged just like in the real world ala Forza Motorsport. 900 cars means nothing if its not realistic.
Cars can be damaged in Forza, but I would feign from saying, "like in the real world."

GT5 demo up on JPN store.

I still don't get what the big deal about damage is. If you race properly, you'll never see damage anyway.

So, If I'm driving properly, and some overly agressive driver bumps me from behind to shake up the stability of my car so he can overtake me, It won't be damaged? Awesome!

So, If I'm driving properly, and some overly agressive driver bumps me from behind to shake up the stability of my car so he can overtake me, It won't be damaged? Awesome!

I leave the damage to cosmetic in forza. If you played forza online you'd know damage ruins the game. Slight tap and spinning out ruining the car. Damage is one of those things from reality I don't need in games to have fun.

Have to agree with the whole 15-20 versions of the same car issue. Why should anyone care if they can drive one of 20 Skylines or Vipers? 900 cars sounds nice, how about 500 different year, make, and model cars? Oh, and no need to create a bunch of 50hp microcars either.

I still don't get what the big deal about damage is. If you race properly, you'll never see damage anyway.

I liked damage when I was 12 and had more fun intentionally wrecking than racing. Luckily back then there was no such thing as online play in a driving game. :D

Are you really that naive? Damage is a HUGE part of racing, no matter what format. If you can just drive around slamming into things with no consequence, it's hard to get that white knuckle feeling of intense racing.

Have to agree with the whole 15-20 versions of the same car issue. Why should anyone care if they can drive one of 20 Skylines or Vipers? 900 cars sounds nice, how about 500 different year, make, and model cars? Oh, and no need to create a bunch of 50hp microcars either.
Exactly. There were so many great cars left out of GT4, because there were multiple versions of the same car taking up space. There were what, 4 different versions of the GTR?

As for damage, all I'm saying is that if you want to call your game a sim, you need to actually make it a sim. Car damage is a big part of making the game simulative of a real driving experience. Forza's isn't completely realistic, but it's better than no realism, IMO. I will say, however, that ther are a few other quirks that GT needs to focus on tweaking before damage (physics), but it's still very important.

it's hard to get that white knuckle feeling of intense racing.

Its impossible to get that feeling sitting at the comfort of your home, damage or not.

Its impossible to get that feeling sitting at the comfort of your home, damage or not.
I disagree. I'm competetive. I want to win. That's where the feeling of intense racing comes in. Having to keep your concentration and focus consistent to the point of winning. Knowing that I or some guy could just ram through cars with no consequences kills a bit of that.

I disagree. I'm competetive. I want to win. That's where the feeling of intense racing comes in. Having to keep your concentration and focus consistent to the point of winning. Knowing that I or some guy could just ram through cars with no consequences kills a bit of that.

yeh you could get that same feeling playing halo. Doesn't mean playing a racing game is going to make you a good driver.

yeh you could get that same feeling playing halo. Doesn't mean playing a racing game is going to make you a good driver.
No one is saying that.

No one is saying that.

read post #16

Ugh!!!

You guys are lame...


The PD team cannot be touched when it comes to racing sims. Thats why people go to them to engineer actual parts for cars.

Damage physics or not, they know how to make the game feel. Even not being able to flip a car all these years still hasn't lessened the driving experience in GT.

But, that will not stop you Forza fans from spewing your garbage here in the PS forums...

Also, some of the most challenging races are the microcar events. There is nothing more frustrating than losing 1st in a bad turn and not being able to remake the distance due to HP limitations. You can hit his fender, but, not enough room to pass...ugh!!! Good times there.

I can't wait for HD all night driving marathons..:D

Forza 2, basically redefined driving physics. Playing GT4 and Forza 2 back to back, GT feels really bad. All this talk about cars and graphics, I really hope they give GT all new physics engine.

Ugh!!!

You guys are lame...


The PD team cannot be touched when it comes to racing sims.
GTR 2 is pretty much considered the standard for sims nowadays. If you're talking strictly consoles, then maybe, but Forza is on par with the current versions of GT in every area but graphics, and has surpassed it in physics. Btw, I'm not a Forza fan.

read post #16
I don't see where he said that playing a racing game would make you a good driver. I took his statement to mean that damage enhances the immersion of the game, therefore making the experience more intense. But you're right- playing a racing game won't necesarrily make yo ua better driver- however, playing a racing sim could indeed make you a better driver. Sega's Ferrari F355 challenge was considered to be so realistic (the clutch modeling was insane) that Ferrari supposedly bought each of it's factory team drivers a cabinet so they could practice in the offseason.

Forza's nice, but I prefer Gran Turismo. Been playing the GT5 demo the last few days and having a blast.

Forza 2, basically redefined driving physics. Playing GT4 and Forza 2 back to back, GT feels really bad. All this talk about cars and graphics, I really hope they give GT all new physics engine.

I'm going to agree, people keep making a fuss about how great every car looks and it's all in 1080p. Wouldn't people prefer to see that processing power be put towards something other than 1080p? Like better physics or damage modeling? Ya know something that indeed enhances the gameplay experience, instead of a feature that will make the game slightly look better for the incredibly small population of people who will be playing this game who own 1080p TVs.

It amazes me the extent of complaining on games in general. Do you guys play games or play games to find something to complain about? :rolleyes:

So, If I'm driving properly, and some overly agressive driver bumps me from behind to shake up the stability of my car so he can overtake me, It won't be damaged? Awesome!
Choose the people you race with more carefully.

I don't have a problem getting a good race with absolutely no contact when I'm playing Live for Speed on the PC, but maybe that's because the LFS racers tend to actually try to race correctly. There is a very poor damage model in that game, but only to dissuade wreckers on the demo servers.

In most racing leagues intentional contact is grounds for DQ, regardless of the severity. In some, any contact at all, intentional or not, will get you DQed. As the person following, the onus is on you to avoid contact and find a good place to overtake without contact.

BTW, there are consequences if you (or someone else) decides to ram through a bunch of cars, or use the wall to keep your speed up artificially through a turn. I won't play with you any more. I only play with people who race properly.

Dead.Horse: Are you really so unimaginative that you need damage to tell you when you ****ed up and should by all rights quit because your car should be damaged beyond drivability?

It amazes me the extent of complaining on games in general. Do you guys play games or play games to find something to complain about? :rolleyes:

The latter. I'm sure half the people who complain about the issues never even played a GT game or is a troll.

It amazes me the extent of complaining on games in general. Do you guys play games or play games to find something to complain about? :rolleyes:

Haha, awesome.

That's why I look at uncalibrated TVs.

I'm going to agree, people keep making a fuss about how great every car looks and it's all in 1080p. Wouldn't people prefer to see that processing power be put towards something other than 1080p? Like better physics or damage modeling? Ya know something that indeed enhances the gameplay experience, instead of a feature that will make the game slightly look better for the incredibly small population of people who will be playing this game who own 1080p TVs.

The 1080p means the game will play in 1080i for those of us still using 1080i sets, and frankly GT's physics is already pretty good, the issue will be (for me) if the other cars are just blocking bumpercars like they are in GT3 and 4, pushing you out of the way on the last lap if you are in their line, etc, etc.

Nothing ruins a race like having the CPU push you out of the way without impunity..or even worse, when the CPU slams into YOU in a rally and you're the one who gets penalized.

Lets hope they fix that crap for GT5.

I think a simulation racer in 2007 should have a damage model. When I have a momentary lapse of judgment and put my car into a wall, I like my race being over. That's all.

^^

While I don't agree with the "into the wall, race over" part, I do feel there should be options for all. A "realistic" setting and an "arcade" setting.

I suppose:) Too many times in GT it was faster to use an AI opponent to make a quick corner...hit em at full speed, bounce off and go around the corner vs doing it correctly. I'm no self proclaimed videogame boyscout, I had no problem doing that(only in career mode though.) I think there should be an option in multiplayer to turn it off though, especially over live/psn.

Have to agree with the whole 15-20 versions of the same car issue. Why should anyone care if they can drive one of 20 Skylines or Vipers? 900 cars sounds nice, how about 500 different year, make, and model cars? Oh, and no need to create a bunch of 50hp microcars either.

I'm sure many a Skyline or Viper fan would disagree with you there, maybe those slight difference don't mean much to you, but they do to many aautomotive enthusiast. It's one of the reasons why Gran Turismo was so popular in the in first place, the ability to drive everyday affordable production cars. I know lots of people that brought earlier version not even to race the cars, but just to admire and test drive them. It was like car porn to them.

I don't quite get all the complaints about Gran Turismo's physics, do some you still play with the default racing mode and all the assists turned on or something?
Gran Turismo's real to life handling has been given thumbs up by many professional drivers, this time around adding in members of the drift community.

I suppose:) Too many times in GT it was faster to use an AI opponent to make a quick corner...hit em at full speed, bounce off and go around the corner vs doing it correctly. I'm no self proclaimed videogame boyscout, I had no problem doing that(only in career mode though.) I think there should be an option in multiplayer to turn it off though, especially over live/psn.

That's a strategy I used to frequently use to get ahead. Probably because I'm not that good of a driver, and would probably end up middle of the pack without cheating.

Well I don't necessarily disagree with the different year completely. What they should do is pick they year when the car has different cosmetic changes.

Well I don't necessarily disagree with the different year completely. What they should do is pick they year when the car has different cosmetic changes.

All the different revisions of the cars in GT either have cosmetic and/or performance changes, that's why they're in there. Sometimes the differences are so small that they aren't recognisable by the non-enthusiast.

Try going to a vintage car show or car hobbist group to get a clearer picture.

I don't quite get all the complaints about Gran Turismo's physics, do some you still play with the default racing mode and all the assists turned on or something?
Gran Turismo's real to life handling has been given thumbs up by many professional drivers, this time around adding in members of the drift community.
I play with all assists off... The physics are good, but there are quirks that I'm sure even professional drivers notice.

For instance, traction loss does not affect the stability of the car in a straight line. Take a high torque FR car in game, throw it into first, and slam the pedal- the back of the car doesn't get loose at all. Also, fuel level doesn't appear to effect the physics of the car. And downshifting too far out of the proper RPM range with the G25 doesn't upset the stability of the car (in GT5:P). You can go from 5th directly to 2nd without slowing to the correct RPM range while turning through turn 15 of Suzuka and the car will make the turn. The car would suffer traction loss in real life.

I do think GT5:P fels more realistic than GT4, though.

I play with all assists off... The physics are good, but there are quirks that I'm sure even professional drivers notice.

For instance, traction loss does not affect the stability of the car in a straight line. Take a high torque FR car in game, throw it into first, and slam the pedal- the back of the car doesn't get loose at all. Also, fuel level doesn't appear to effect the physics of the car. And downshifting too far out of the proper RPM range with the G25 doesn't upset the stability of the car (in GT5:P). You can go from 5th directly to 2nd without slowing to the correct RPM range while turning through turn 15 of Suzuka and the car will make the turn. The car would suffer traction loss in real life.

I do think GT5:P fels more realistic than GT4, though.

That's a pretty fair evaluation, I'd love to be able to get torque steer at least with a forcefeedback steering wheel. Are there fuel levels in the GT:P demo?

I do have faith that Polyphony will improve the physics by the time GT:P goes gold, they are exceptional developers, and their love of the art of driving is plainly obvious.

You guys do know that they've completely reworked the physics engine for GT5, right? And that the physics engine probably isn't complete for the demo of GT5: Prologue?

That's a pretty fair evaluation, I'd love to be able to get torque steer at least with a forcefeedback steering wheel. Are there fuel levels in the GT:P demo?

I do have faith that Polyphony will improve the physics by the time GT:P goes gold, they are exceptional developers, and their love of the art of driving is plainly obvious.

Fuel guage, but I believe it just reads full.

Anyone know how to switch the gas/brake to the triggers? The default is the buttons 0%/100% throttle/brake.

All the different revisions of the cars in GT either have cosmetic and/or performance changes, that's why they're in there. Sometimes the differences are so small that they aren't recognisable by the non-enthusiast.

Try going to a vintage car show or car hobbist group to get a clearer picture.

I'm talking about major difference like the Corvette changes the front kind of change or the Evolution IX into Evolution X

You guys do know that they've completely reworked the physics engine for GT5, right? And that the physics engine probably isn't complete for the demo of GT5: Prologue?

But why would they change such a perfect system? :p

For anyone that thinks the Granturismo series is a "simulator" you need to play LFS then go back to Granturismo . If you still think its a "simulator" I'd be suprised.

Just because your car understeers doesn't make it a sim.

I've played GT. I prefer the Dirt demo.