For example,

- A-DATA ADQVE1A16K DDR2-800 2 x 1GB Kit
- A-DATA ADQVE1B16K DDR2-800 2 x 2GB Kit
- G.SKILL F2-6400CL5D-2GBNQ DDR2-800 2 x 1GB Kit
- G.SKILL F2-6400CL5D-4GBPQ DDR2-800 2 x 2GB Kit

Thanks again renethx.
I have a chance to buy a CPU/MB combo
deal locally for $250. (Q9450 + ECS GF7050VT-M (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813135064))
There's also a local sale for Q6600 for $190.
I wasn't thinking about the Q9450 but after seeing
this $250 deal I'm thinking Q6600 or Q9450 ?
MB which comes with it is probably useless
and I'll still buy GA-EP45-DS3R($160) OR Asus P5Q-E($170).

This is probably a decision I have to make..
but given these prices and the 45nm MBs mentioned here,
do you see Q9450 adding more value/performance
to my system ?

Interesting reading. I think I see the way I want to go. OK, So does the HD 4850 support PAP or not? I can not find that information? Do I need to goto a product such as:
"- ASUS Xonar HDAV1.3
- Auzentech Auzen X-Fi HomeTheater 7.1
- Intel G45 (according to archibael"

I use HDMI to pass through all video and audio to my onkyo. I will go with the 4850 as it seems to have the best ability at HD playback. I guess I will keep it in the intel family after that. I do have the intel E8400, not a bad chip so far. Do I go with a board built in HDMI port, a HDMI port on the HD 4850 or another solution? Do I need the audio card, or will HD 4850 support PAP and pass through the audio? Sorry for the questions, It does make for interesting reading as fast as technology is turning. Thanks!
PAP is useless unless a software player supporting it exists. So you have to wait until a new version of PowerDVD or TMT is released and see if it supports HD 4850's PAP (if exists). The same applies to G45. Even if G45 supports PAP, we don't know yet what player supports it.

How does the HD 3870 compare the 4850 for HTPC use?
Thanks in advance
Please read this post (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=14229198#post14229198).

It being the new HTPC

Also if I keep having problems with the SAPPHIRE Radeon HD 3450 losing sink with the TV is there another resonable card you would recomend?
Thanks again for all your help!
Try GeForce 8500 GT/8600 GT.

Thanks again renethx.
I have a chance to buy a CPU/MB combo
deal locally for $250. (Q9450 + ECS GF7050VT-M (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813135064))
There's also a local sale for Q6600 for $190.
I wasn't thinking about the Q9450 but after seeing
this $250 deal I'm thinking Q6600 or Q9450 ?
MB which comes with it is probably useless
and I'll still buy GA-EP45-DS3R($160) OR Asus P5Q-E($170).

This is probably a decision I have to make..
but given these prices and the 45nm MBs mentioned here,
do you see Q9450 adding more value/performance
to my system ?
Q9450 is faster in encoding (up to +50% depending on applications) and consumes less power (by 25W at full load).

PAP is useless unless a software player supporting it exists. So you have to wait until a new version of PowerDVD or TMT is released and see if it supports HD 4850's PAP (if exists). The same applies to G45. Even if G45 supports PAP, we don't know yet what player supports it.

OK. So I guess the only real way I can do this is this. Purchase a 4850 which will give me better then the sound I have through my 2600HD. Then purchase the ASUS Xonar HDAV1.3 or Auzentech Auzen X-Fi HomeTheater 7.1 to bypass PAP (Sort of speak).

From what I read, PowerDvd will release version 9 sometime in the next few months. Which unlocks the true sound of HD. Or I can use the above mentioned sounds cards to bypass (sort of speak), the PAP issue. What truly sucks is, if you go with cyberlink you lose HD-DVD. If you go with TMT you lose the ability to play Blu-Ray from ISO. I tried WinDVD, and you also lost Blu-Ray play back from ISO. Choices seem to narrow as you sort out what you want to do. Thanks again Renethx

OK. So I guess the only real way I can do this is this. Purchase a 4850 which will give me better then the sound I have through my 2600HD. Then purchase the ASUS Xonar HDAV1.3 or Auzentech Auzen X-Fi HomeTheater 7.1 to bypass PAP (Sort of speak).

From what I read, PowerDvd will release version 9 sometime in the next few months. Which unlocks the true sound of HD. Or I can use the above mentioned sounds cards to bypass (sort of speak), the PAP issue. What truly sucks is, if you go with cyberlink you lose HD-DVD. If you go with TMT you lose the ability to play Blu-Ray from ISO. I tried WinDVD, and you also lost Blu-Ray play back from ISO. Choices seem to narrow as you sort out what you want to do. Thanks again Renethx

Huh? They all play BluRay from ISO. You just mount the ISO with DaemonTools.

ISO playback will always be possible since it looks identical to a real disc.

Huh? They all play BluRay from ISO. You just mount the ISO with DaemonTools.

ISO playback will always be possible since it looks identical to a real disc.

No they do not! WindDVD 9 does not do that, it stops immediately if AACS is not present. I confirmed that with their tech support before I was issued a refund. TMT, I just did not know, I had heard it did the same thing. So the catch is to get HD-DVD to play, which way do you go?

I am almost finished with my HTPC, but I am not sure what the best software is out there to rip blu-ray discs to my hard-drive. Any recommendations?

Case Silverstone LC17-B
Power Supply AeroCool Zerodba 620W
Video Card 512MB Zotac nVIDIA GeForce 8800GT Amp!
MotherBoard ASUS P5K3 DELUXE
CPU Intel Core 2 Quad Q9300
RAM CORSAIR 4GB(2X2G) DDR2
Hard Drive Barracuda 7200.11 SATA 3Gb/s 500-GB Hard Drive
Sound Card HT OMEGA CLARO 7.1 Channels 24-bit 192KHz PCI
Blu Ray LG GGC-H20L combo Blu-Ray/HD DVD player

No they do not! WindDVD 9 does not do that, it stops immediately if AACS is not present. I confirmed that with their tech support before I was issued a refund. TMT, I just did not know, I had heard it did the same thing. So the catch is to get HD-DVD to play, which way do you go?

TMT plays HDDVD just fine.

If WinDVD9 doesn't play non-AACS BD (which has nothing to do with ISO's), then that's a fault in their software. I can create non-AACS BD's from my camcorder, and all BD-playing software should play then fine. If they don't, the software is falt out wrong.

Any issues you have are not related to ISO's. ISO's are transparent to software and look like physical media.

I am almost finished with my HTPC, but I am not sure what the best software is out there to rip blu-ray discs to my hard-drive. Any recommendations?

Case Silverstone LC17-B
Power Supply AeroCool Zerodba 620W
Video Card 512MB Zotac nVIDIA GeForce 8800GT Amp!
MotherBoard ASUS P5K3 DELUXE
CPU Intel Core 2 Quad Q9300
RAM CORSAIR 4GB(2X2G) DDR2
Hard Drive Barracuda 7200.11 SATA 3Gb/s 500-GB Hard Drive
Sound Card HT OMEGA CLARO 7.1 Channels 24-bit 192KHz PCI
Blu Ray LG GGC-H20L combo Blu-Ray/HD DVD player

AnyDVDHD + ImgBurn + DaemonTools = ISO

-or-

eac3to + Haali + mkvtools = mkv/flac

How does the 780G chipset perform in the SD HQV tests when used with a 9550 phenom or tri-core? I was hoping post-processing might be improved enough to warrant going without the 4850 video card.

Once i burn a blu ray with AnyDVD can I extract the main movie only, then create an iso of that??? Otherwise its using to much space in my hard drives

If so, will my HTPC still read it like its an acutal blu ray?

Once i burn a blu ray with AnyDVD can I extract the main movie only, then create an iso of that??? Otherwise its using to much space in my hard drives

If so, will my HTPC still read it like its an acutal blu ray?

You don't burn with AnyDVDHD, you just remove the AACS. See my post above for the tools to burn, and better to do a search for more details.

Yes, TMT (for example) will play the extracted movie, but it will obviously be missing menus and extras. If you keep the entire ISO, it's just like popping the BD in a drive. In terms of size, you'll only save about 30% of the total space (e.g. 28GB vs 40GB).

Sorry, a few more questions:

1) If you want to do ffdshow post processing (upscaling and whatnot) then does having an HD4850 really matter? Would an IGP do just as well?

2) Or is the quality of the HD4850 hardware upscaling good enough? (I'd rather not have to fiddle with ffdshow if I can get the HD4850 to do just as good in hardware.)

3)Does better hardware deinterlacing matter if you're only watching blurays, mkvs, dvds, and avi's? Aren't those already deinterlaced? (or maybe I'm totally wrong here)

Thanks!

Sorry, a few more questions:

1) If you want to do ffdshow post processing (upscaling and whatnot) then does having an HD4850 really matter? Would an IGP do just as well?

2) Or is the quality of the HD4850 hardware upscaling good enough? (I'd rather not have to fiddle with ffdshow if I can get the HD4850 to do just as good in hardware.)

3)Does better hardware deinterlacing matter if you're only watching blurays, mkvs, dvds, and avi's? Aren't those already deinterlaced? (or maybe I'm totally wrong here)

Thanks!

DVDs and AVIs can benefit from good deinterlacing. Although if you have a good TV, you'll get pretty good deinterlacing from the TV, and might not see a big improvement with the video card.

Upscaling is about the same across all the current generation of gfx cards and IGP's.

DVDs and AVIs can benefit from good deinterlacing. Although if you have a good TV, you'll get pretty good deinterlacing from the TV, and might not see a big improvement with the video card.

Upscaling is about the same across all the current generation of gfx cards and IGP's.

Is the upscaling at least comparable to what we can get from ffdshow? If not, then should I be spending money on a better CPU and use an IGP?

(Sorry for the basic questions, just trying to get a handle on what a minimum build with the best upscaling would be -- why buy an HD4850 if you're not even going to use the hardware acceleration, right?)

Is the upscaling at least comparable to what we can get from ffdshow? If not, then should I be spending money on a better CPU and use an IGP?

(Sorry for the basic questions, just trying to get a handle on what a minimum build with the best upscaling would be -- why buy an HD4850 if you're not even going to use the hardware acceleration, right?)

Not sure what you're asking? Are you asking if the software deinterlacing/upscaling that ffdshow does is comparable to what a 4850 does in hardware?

If that's your question, then no, the 4850 does a lot better than any software-only solution, but the end result will depend a lot on what you watch and what TV you have.

Q9450 is faster in encoding (up to +50% depending on applications) and consumes less power (by 25W at full load).


Thanks to renethx I've picked the parts for
my system. Before I order, I hope you can look
over these parts and make any comments or
suggest any last minute changes..
(I hope I got the Memory picked right)

CPU = Intel Quad Q9450
MB = Asus P5Q-E
Memory = CORSAIR TWIN2X4096-6400C5 4GB(2x2) DDR2 PC6400 (http://shop1.frys.com/product/5611731?site=sr:SEARCH:MAIN_RSLT_PG)
Video = XFX PVT84JUSD4 Geforce 8600 GT (http://www.amazon.com/XFX-PVT84JUSD4-GeForce-Express-S-Video/dp/B000ZPJ79A)
Case = Antec Sonata 3 with 500W PS
DVD/Blyray = TBD (SATA)
HD = Seagate SATA 750.
Misc = 120mm Fan for cooling HDs in Sonata3.

As always I highly value this feedback.

Ren, I read a good portion of you guide and I think its great. I wish i knew of this thread when i built mine a while back. Thanks for your help...

For my question...

I want an above avg system to play back blu-ray/hd-dvd over hdmi. Is this overkill? My budget is about 1200 or so.... No games, no other major applications.

AMD Phenom 9600 Agena 2.3GHz
GIGABYTE GA-MA770-DS3
ASUS Radeon HD 3650
---------------------------------------
Currently, at 1400 bucks (tax/ship)
Silverstone LC20-B ATX
8 gigs pc6400 (2x2 x 4)
1TB HD
Vista Home Prem 64bit
LG Blu-ray/HD DVD-ROM & 16X DVD±R DVD Burner
SeaSonic S12 II SS-380GB ATX12V 380W Power Supply (do i need my power?)
Media card reader (TBD)

My other question is Fan for CPU...my goal is quiet, system. My previous expereience, i have always brought the wrong fan for cases. Can you recommend something for this case and processor?

4 gigs should be good but newegg has a combo which makes the first 4 gigs damn cheap so i figure i'll max out the system.

I struggled with AMD vs Intel. I have a Phenom 9300 and love it so I went back to it.

Again, thanks for your expert advice...

_____________________________________________
Recommended HTPC Systems – September 2009 Edition
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯
Last Update on September 25, 2009

For the latest recommended systems, go to: Recommended Systems - The Latest Edition
A small advertisement:

http://i696.photobucket.com/albums/vv328/renethx_yahoo/Supportyellow.png

Table of Contents

Peripheral Components and OS
Input Device
Optical Disc Drive
TV Tuner/Capture Card
Sound Card
OS
Brackets
Mini-ITX System
MicroATX System
Low-End
Mid-Range
High-End
Premium
ATX System
Low-End
Mid-Range
High-End
Premium
DAS (Direct Attached Storage)
Workstation
Media Storage Sever
Software – Links to Useful Threads
What's next?
Intel Processor
AMD Processor
Motherboard
Memory
Graphics Card
Sound Card

______________
Mini-ITX System
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=131137&d=1232878695

Case and PSU

Selecting a case and PSU is perhaps the most difficult part in building a Mini-ITX system. Apex MI-008 with 250W PSU selected here is favorably reviewed by Silent PC Review (http://www.silentpcreview.com/apex-mi008).

Intel/Intel

System

CPU: Pentium Dual-Core E5300 2.60GHz 2MB L2 LGA775, $64.
CPU Cooler: SilverStone NT07-775, $20.
Motherboard: Intel DG45FC (BOXDG45FC) LGA775 Intel G45 chipset Mini-ITX, $115.
Memory: A-DATA ADQVE1A16K DDR2-800 2 x 1GB Kit, $32.
Graphics Card: Intel GMA X4500HD (integrated in the chipset), $0.
HDD: WD Caviar Blue WD6400AAKS 640GB SATA 3.0Gbps, $70.
PSU: ATX12V 250W SFX PSU (included in the case): $0.
Case: Apex MI-008 Mini-ITX, $40. An alternative is Apex MI-100BK Mini-ITX, $48.
Total Cost: $341
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=134795&d=1235659332

Remarks

BD playback under Windows XP is not supported in this system due to the chipset driver limitation.
Intel/NVIDIA

System

CPU: Pentium Dual-Core E5300 2.60GHz 2MB L2 LGA775, $64.
CPU Cooler: SilverStone NT07-775, $20.
Motherboard: ZOTAC GeForce 9300-ITX WiFi GF9300-D-E LGA775 GeForce 9300 mGPU Mini-ITX, $140.
Memory: A-DATA ADQVE1A16K DDR2-800 2 x 1GB Kit, $32.
Graphics Card: GeForce 9300 (integrated in the chipset), $0.
HDD: Western Digital WD6400AAKS 640GB SATA 3.0Gbps, $70.
PSU: ATX12V 250W SFX PSU (included in the case): $0.
Case: Apex MI-008 Mini-ITX, $40. An alternative is Apex MI-100BK Mini-ITX, $48.
Total Cost: $366
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=134796&d=1235659332

AMD/AMD

System

CPU: Athlon II X2 240 ADX240OCGQBOX 2.8GHz AM3, $60.
CPU Cooler: SilverStone NT07-AM2, $20.
Motherboard: J&W MINIX 780G-SP128MB AM2+ AMD 780G chipset Mini-ITX, $155.
Memory: Crucial CT2KIT12864AC800 DDR2-800 SO-DIMM 2 x 1GB Kit, $29.
Graphics Card: Radeon HD 3200 (integrated in the chipset), $0.
HDD: Western Digital WD6400AAKS 640GB SATA 3.0Gbps, $70.
PSU: ATX12V 250W SFX PSU (included in the case): $0.
Case: Apex MI-008 Mini-ITX, $40. An alternative is Apex MI-100BK Mini-ITX, $48.
Total Cost: $374
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=151823&stc=1&d=1252163981

Remarks

You need to add a discrete graphics card such as SAPPHIRE Radeon HD 4550 DDR3 512MB HDMI, $45, for multichannel LPCM over HDMI.
AMD/NVIDIA

System

CPU: Athlon II X2 240 ADX240OCGQBOX 2.8GHz AM3, $60.
CPU Cooler: SilverStone NT07-AM2, $20.
Motherboard: ZOTAC GeForce 8200-ITX WiFi GF8200-C-E AM2+ GeForce 8200 mGPU Mini-ITX, $110.
Memory: G.SKILL F2-8500CL5D-2GBPK DDR2-1066 2 x 1GB Kit, $37.
Graphics Card: GeForce 8200 (integrated in the chipset), $0.
HDD: Western Digital WD6400AAKS 640GB SATA 3.0Gbps, $70.
PSU: ATX12V 250W SFX PSU (included in the case): $0.
Case: Apex MI-008 Mini-ITX, $40. An alternative is Apex MI-100BK Mini-ITX, $48.
Total Cost: $337
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=151849&d=1252169213

Gaming HTPC

System

CPU: Core 2 Quad Q9550 2.83GHz 12MB L2 LGA775, $266.
CPU Cooler: ARCTIC COOLING Freezer 7 LP, $20.
Motherboard: ZOTAC GeForce 9300-ITX WiFi GF9300-D-E LGA775 GeForce 9300 mGPU Mini-ITX, $140.
Memory: A-DATA ADQVE1B16K DDR2-800 2 x 2GB Kit, $55.
Graphics Card: HIS H485Q1GH Radeon HD 4850 GDDR3 1GB, $133. An alternative is XFX GS-250X-ZDFC GeForce GTS 250 DDR3 1GB, $144.
HDD: Western Digital WD6400AAKS 640GB SATA 3.0Gbps, $70. You will need a 12 inch Right Angle SATA to Straight SATA Cable, $2.
PSU: ATX12V 300W SFX PSU (included in the case), $0.
Case: SilverStone Sugo SG05 SST-SG05B Mini-ITX/Mini-DTX, $100.
Total Cost: $786 for ATI, $797 for NVIDIA
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=151825&stc=1&d=1252164102

Remarks

The case supports a slim type optical drive, e.g., SilverStone TOB02 SST-TOB02 Slim Type BD-ROM/DVD Rewriter, $148.
If you are interested in passive CPU cooling, check these two threads:
Hard|Forum – SG05, GeminII inside (April 28, 2009) (http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1414331)
OverclockingStation – "MINI-ME" - Mini-ITX für Sofa-Gamer... (April 28, 2009) (http://www.overclockingstation.de/showthread.php?p=78519)
______________
MicroATX System
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯

A microATX system is generally considered good for HTPC because of its small form factor. As the number of expansion slots is limited to four, almost every microATX motherboard integrates a graphics processing unit (GPU). There are already a couple of integrated graphics processing units (iGPU) that are good enough to play back HD contents and a microATX system with such an iGPU has several advantages over an ATX system with discrete graphics processing unit (dGPU):

Lower cost
Lower power consumption and heat output, hence lower noise
Space-saving
Disadvantages are:

The number of expansion slots is limited to four.
iGPU is still not perfect for post-processing.
iGPU is very weak in gaming (for a gaming HTPC).
Actually four expansion slots are plenty for normal use. Unfortunately most motherboard manufacturers still prefer to put two PCI slots despite the fact that PCI Express devices are quickly taking place of PCI devices.

I will give a low-end system, a mid-range system, a high-end system and a gaming system for each of the Intel platform/Intel chipset, the Intel platform/NVIDIA chipset, the AMD platform/AMD chipset and the AMD platform/NVIDIA chipset. Basic distinctions are:

Low-end system: offers reasonably good video playback performance at a low cost.
Mid-range system: offers the best video playback performance without compromise.
High-end system: should be able to handle other HTPC-related tasks such as video re-encoding and games with reasonably good performance.
Premium system: is intended to be the best (but not too expensive) overall system available today.
Here is a feature comparison chart (needs to be updated).

http://i696.photobucket.com/albums/vv328/renethx_yahoo/Support2yellow2.png

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=133613&stc=1&d=1234688600

So are my recommendations really enough for HD contents?

One of the most frequently asked questions is if these systems can play 1080p contents (including various mkv files as well as BD movies) fine. The answer is yes as you can see in the above chart. Here are screenshots taken in one of the recommended systems (the low-end Intel/NVIDIA system) when a 1080p mkv file is played back. Whether hardware acceleration of the GPU is on or off, the file can be played back fine.

Pentium Dual-Core E5200 2.5GHz 2MB L2 cache
GA-E7AUM-DS2H GeForce 9400 mGPU mATX
DDR2-800 2 x 1GB
Windows Vista SP1 32-bit
MPC HomeCinema with MPC Video Decoder (the first screenshot)/ffdshow Video Decoder (the second screenshot) and madFlac Decoder
1080p mkv file with FLAC audio track created from Blu-ray Spider-Man 3; the first 100 seconds of chapter 44 with max bitrate around 36Mbps
Hardware Acceleration ON (MPC Video Decoder)

If GPU hardware acceleration is used, max CPU usage is around 33%.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=130070&d=1232203181

Hardware Acceleration OFF (ffdshow Video Decoder)

ffdshow does not support GPU hardware acceleration (yet). Max CPU usage is around 70%.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=130071&d=1232203181

_______
Low-End
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯

All the low-end systems are basically equivalent in performance. There are differences in features however. The case I chose here is a inexpensive low-profile case. Alternative cases are

Antec NSK1480 microATX, low-profile, $95.
Antec Micro Fusion Remote 350 microATX, low-profile, with LCD/IR receiver/remote, $175.
Lian Li PC-C37B MUSE microATX, low-profile, $144.
Lian Li PC-C39 microATX, low-profile, with RF receiver/remote, $180.
Moneual MonCaso312 microATX, low-profile, with IR receiver/remote, $220.
Moneual MonCaso301 microATX, low-profile, with VFD/IR receiver/remote, $300.
Antec NSK2480 microATX, $94.
Antec Fusion Remote Black microATX, with LCD/IR receiver/remote, $140.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=153020&d=1253441623

Intel/Intel

System

CPU: Pentium Dual-Core E5300 2.60GHz 2MB L2 LGA775, $64.
CPU Cooler: Stock cooler, $0.
Motherboard: ASUS P5Q-EM LGA775 Intel G45 chipset microATX, $125. A cheaper alternative is Intel DG45ID (BOXDG45ID) LGA775 Intel G45 chipset microATX, $100.
Memory: A-DATA ADQVE1A16K DDR2-800 2 x 1GB Kit, $32.
Graphics Card: Intel GMA X4500HD (integrated in the chipset), $0.
HDD: Western Digital WD6400AAKS 640GB SATA 3.0Gbps, $70.
PSU: 80 PLUS 350W ATX PSU (included in the case), $0
Case: Antec NSK1480 microATX, $95.
Total Cost: $386
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=142141&stc=1&d=1241781886

Remarks

BD playback under Windows XP is not supported in this system due to the chipset driver limitation.
Intel/NVIDIA

System

CPU: Pentium Dual-Core E5300 2.60GHz 2MB L2 LGA775, $64.
CPU Cooler: Stock cooler, $0.
Motherboard: GIGABYTE GA-E7AUM-DS2H LGA775 GeForce 9400 mGPU microATX, $130. A cheaper alternative is MSI P7NGM-Digital LGA775 GeForce 9300 mGPU microATX, $105, which is of better value if you don't need an S/PDIF port and an eSATA port.
Memory: A-DATA ADQVE1A16K DDR2-800 2 x 1GB Kit, $32.
Graphics Card: GeForce 9400 (integrated in the chipset), $0.
HDD: Western Digital WD6400AAKS 640GB SATA 3.0Gbps, $70.
PSU: 80 PLUS 350W ATX PSU (included in the case), $0
Case: Antec NSK1480 microATX, $95.
Total Cost: $391
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=134799&d=1235661749

AMD/AMD

System

CPU: Athlon II X2 240 ADX240OCGQBOX 2.8GHz AM3, $60.
CPU Cooler: Stock cooler, $0.
Motherboard: GIGABYTE GA-MA785GM-US2H AM2+ AMD 785G chipset microATX, $80.
Memory: G.SKILL F2-8500CL5D-2GBPK DDR2-1066 2 x 1GB Kit, $37.
Graphics Card: SAPPHIRE Radeon HD 4550 DDR3 512MB HDMI, $45.
HDD: Western Digital WD6400AAKS 640GB SATA 3.0Gbps, $70.
PSU: 80 PLUS 350W ATX PSU (included in the case), $0
Case: Antec NSK1480 microATX, $95.
Total Cost: $387
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=151821&stc=1&d=1252163796

Remarks

You could use the onboard graphics (HD 4200) but HDMI audio is limted to stereo LPCM. If your receiver is pre-HDMI, this is a good choice.
If you prefer DDR3 SDRAM (+$10 with little performance increase, but DDR3 memory modules are reusable in future), choose
GIGABYTE GA-MA785GMT-UD2H AM2+ AMD 785G chipset microATX, $82.
G.SKILL F3-12800CL9D-2GBNQ DDR3-1600 2 x 1GB Kit, $45.
AMD/NVIDIA

System

CPU: Athlon II X2 240 ADX240OCGQBOX 2.8GHz AM3, $60.
CPU Cooler: Stock cooler, $0.
Motherboard: ASUS M3N78-EM AM2+ GeForce 8300 mGPU microATX, $83.
Memory: G.SKILL F2-8500CL5D-2GBPK DDR2-1066 2 x 1GB Kit, $37.
Graphics Card: GeForce 8200 (integrated in the chipset), $0.
HDD: Western Digital WD6400AAKS 640GB SATA 3.0Gbps, $70.
PSU: 80 PLUS 350W ATX PSU (included in the case), $0
Case: Antec NSK1480 microATX, $95.
Total Cost: $345
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=151822&d=1252163860

_________
Mid-Range
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯

Intel/Intel

System

CPU: Core 2 Duo E7500 2.93GHz 3MB L2 LGA775, $113.
CPU Cooler: Cooler Master 風神鍛 (Geminii S) RR-CCH-PBU1-GP, $32.
Motherboard: ASUS P5Q-EM LGA775 Intel G45 chipset microATX, $125. A cheaper alternative is Intel DG35EC (BOXDG35EC) LGA775 Intel G35 chipset microATX, $88 (there are no overclocking or memory voltage options in BIOS).
Memory: A-DATA ADQVE1B16K DDR2-800 2 x 2GB Kit, $57.
Graphics Card: SAPPHIRE Radeon HD 4670 DDR3 1GB, $70. An alternative is HIS H467QS1GH Radeon HD 4670 DDR3 1GB, $75.
HDD: Western Digital WD6400AAKS 640GB SATA 3.0Gbps, $70.
PSU: Corsair VX450W CMPSU-450VX 450W, $60.
Case: Antec Fusion Remote Black microATX, with LCD/IR receiver/remote, $140.
Total Cost: $667
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=152722&d=1253073843

Intel/NVIDIA

System

CPU: Core 2 Duo E7500 2.93GHz 3MB L2 LGA775, $113.
CPU Cooler: Cooler Master 風神鍛 (Geminii S) RR-CCH-PBU1-GP, $32.
Motherboard: GIGABYTE GA-E7AUM-DS2H LGA775 GeForce 9400 mGPU microATX, $130. A cheaper alternative is MSI P7NGM-Digital LGA775 GeForce 9300 mGPU microATX, $105, which is of better value if you don't need an S/PDIF port and an eSATA port.
Memory: A-DATA ADQVE1B16K DDR2-800 2 x 2GB Kit, $57.
Graphics Card: ASUS EN9600GT/DI/512MD3 GeForce 9600 GT DDR3 512MB, $77.
HDD: Western Digital WD6400AAKS 640GB SATA 3.0Gbps, $70.
PSU: Corsair VX450W CMPSU-450VX 450W, $60.
Case: Antec Fusion Remote Black microATX, with LCD/IR receiver/remote, $140.
Total Cost: $679
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=151799&d=1252141415

Remarks

The graphics card supports S/PDIF pass-through from the onboard audio codec through HDMI. If you want multichannel LPCM audio, you have to connect your AVR to the HDMI port of the motherboard and your display to the graphics card. Please read Any GeForce graphics card + GeForce 8200 HDMI audio work together perfectly! (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=13897618#post13897618).
AMD/AMD

System

CPU: Athlon II X4 630 ADX630WFGIBOX 2.8GHz AM3, $122.
CPU Cooler: Cooler Master 風神鍛 (Geminii S) RR-CCH-PBU1-GP, $32.
Motherboard: GIGABYTE GA-MA785GM-US2H AM2+ AMD 785G chipset microATX, $80.
Memory: G.SKILL F2-8500CL5D-4GBPK DDR2-1066 2 x 2GB Kit, $65.
Graphics Card: SAPPHIRE Radeon HD 4670 DDR3 1GB, $70. An alternative is HIS H467QS1GH Radeon HD 4670 DDR3 1GB, $75.
HDD: Western Digital WD6400AAKS 640GB SATA 3.0Gbps, $70.
PSU: Corsair VX450W CMPSU-450VX 450W, $60.
Case: Antec Fusion Remote Black microATX, with LCD/IR receiver/remote, $140.
Total Cost: $639
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=152878&d=1253250306

Remarks

If you prefer DDR3 SDRAM (+$17 with little performance increase, but DDR3 memory modules are reusable in future), choose
GIGABYTE GA-MA785GMT-UD2H AM2+ AMD 785G chipset microATX, $82.
G.SKILL F3-12800CL9D-4GBNQ DDR3-1600 2 x 2GB Kit, $75.
AMD/NVIDIA

System

CPU: Athlon II X4 630 ADX630WFGIBOX 2.8GHz AM3, $122.
CPU Cooler: Cooler Master 風神鍛 (Geminii S) RR-CCH-PBU1-GP, $32.
Motherboard: ASUS M3N78-EM AM2+ GeForce 8300 mGPU microATX, $83.
Memory: G.SKILL F2-8500CL5D-4GBPK DDR2-1066 2 x 2GB Kit, $65.
Graphics Card: ASUS EN9600GT/DI/512MD3 GeForce 9600 GT DDR3 512MB, $77.
HDD: Western Digital WD6400AAKS 640GB SATA 3.0Gbps, $70.
PSU: Corsair VX450W CMPSU-450VX 450W, $60.
Case: Antec Fusion Remote Black microATX, with LCD/IR receiver/remote, $140.
Total Cost: $649
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=153329&stc=1&d=1253704663

Remarks

The graphics card supports S/PDIF pass-through from the onboard audio codec through HDMI. If you want multichannel LPCM audio, you have to connect your AVR to the HDMI port of the motherboard and your display to the graphics card. Please read Any GeForce graphics card + GeForce 8200 HDMI audio work together perfectly! (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=13897618#post13897618).
________
High-End
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯

Intel/Intel

System

CPU: Core i5 750 2.66GHz LGA1156, $196.
CPU Cooler: Cooler Master 風神鍛 (Geminii S) RR-CCH-PBU1-GP, $32. Perhaps you have to buy a retention bracket set for LGA1156 which is not released yet. Meanwhile you can use the stock cooler.
Motherboard: ASRock P55M Pro LGA1156 Intel P55 chipset microATX, $100.
Memory: G.SKILL F3-12800CL9D-4GBNQ DDR3-1600 2 x 2GB Kit, $85.
Graphics Card: HIS H485Q1GH Radeon HD 4850 GDDR3 1GB, $133.
HDD: Western Digital WD6400AAKS 640GB SATA 3.0Gbps, $70.
PSU: Enermax PRO82+ 525W EPR525AWT, $96. A cheaper alternative is Corsair VX550W CMPSU-550VX 550W, $87.
Case: Antec Fusion Remote Black microATX, with LCD/IR receiver/remote, $140.
Total Cost: $852
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=152366&d=1252668618

Intel/NVIDIA

System

CPU: Core 2 Quad Q9400 2.66GHz 6MB L2 LGA775, $183.
CPU Cooler: Cooler Master 風神鍛 (Geminii S) RR-CCH-PBU1-GP, $32.
Motherboard: GIGABYTE GA-E7AUM-DS2H LGA775 GeForce 9400 mGPU microATX, $130. A cheaper alternative is MSI P7NGM-Digital LGA775 GeForce 9300 mGPU microATX, $105, which is of better value if you don't need an S/PDIF port and an eSATA port.
Memory: A-DATA ADQVE1B16K DDR2-800 2 x 2GB Kit, $57.
Graphics Card: XFX GS-250X-ZDFC GeForce GTS 250 DDR3 1GB, $144.
HDD: Western Digital WD6400AAKS 640GB SATA 3.0Gbps, $70.
PSU: Enermax PRO82+ 525W EPR525AWT, $96. A cheaper alternative is Corsair VX550W CMPSU-550VX 550W, $87.
Case: Antec Fusion Remote Black microATX, with LCD/IR receiver/remote, $140.
Total Cost: $852
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=151803&d=1252141738

Remarks

The graphics card supports S/PDIF pass-through from the onboard audio codec through HDMI. If you want multichannel LPCM audio, you have to connect your AVR to the HDMI port of the motherboard and your display to the graphics card. Please read Any GeForce graphics card + GeForce 8200 HDMI audio work together perfectly! (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=13897618#post13897618).
AMD/AMD

System

CPU: Phenom II X4 945 HDX945WFGIBOX 3.0GHz AM3, $170.
CPU Cooler: Cooler Master 風神鍛 (Geminii S) RR-CCH-PBU1-GP, $32.
Motherboard: GIGABYTE GA-MA785GMT-UD2H AM3 AMD 785G chipset microATX, $82.
Memory: G.SKILL F3-12800CL9D-4GBNQ DDR3-1600 2 x 2GB Kit, $85.
Graphics Card: HIS H485Q1GH Radeon HD 4850 GDDR3 1GB, $133.
HDD: Western Digital WD6400AAKS 640GB SATA 3.0Gbps, $70.
PSU: Enermax PRO82+ 525W EPR525AWT, $96. A cheaper alternative is Corsair VX550W CMPSU-550VX 550W, $87.
Case: Antec Fusion Remote Black microATX, with LCD/IR receiver/remote, $140.
Total Cost: $808
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=152571&d=1252915714

AMD/NVIDIA

System

CPU: Phenom II X4 945 HDX945WFGIBOX 3.0GHz AM3, $170.
CPU Cooler: Cooler Master 風神鍛 (Geminii S) RR-CCH-PBU1-GP, $32.
Motherboard: ASUS M3N78-EM AM2+ GeForce 8300 mGPU microATX, $83.
Memory: G.SKILL F2-8500CL5D-4GBPK DDR2-1066 2 x 2GB Kit, $65.
Graphics Card: XFX GS-250X-ZDFC GeForce GTS 250 DDR3 1GB, $144.
HDD: Western Digital WD6400AAKS 640GB SATA 3.0Gbps, $70.
PSU: Enermax PRO82+ 525W EPR525AWT, $96. A cheaper alternative is Corsair VX550W CMPSU-550VX 550W, $87.
Case: Antec Fusion Remote Black microATX, with LCD/IR receiver/remote, $140.
Total Cost: $800
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=151830&d=1252166440

Remarks

The graphics card supports S/PDIF pass-through from the onboard audio codec through HDMI. If you want multichannel LPCM audio, you have to connect your AVR to the HDMI port of the motherboard and your display to the graphics card. Please read Any GeForce graphics card + GeForce 8200 HDMI audio work together perfectly! (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=13897618#post13897618).
_______
Premium
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯

Intel/Intel

System

CPU: Core i7 860 2.80GHz LGA1156, $284. A cheaper alternative is Core i5 750 2.66GHz LGA1156, $196.
CPU Cooler: Xigmatek Dark Knight-S1283V, $45, with Xigmatek Crossbow ACK-I5361, $10 (necessary to attach the cooler to the LGA1156 socket).
Motherboard: GIGABYTE GA-P55M-UD4 LGA1156 Intel P55 chipset microATX, $150.
Memory: G.SKILL F3-12800CL9D-4GBNQ DDR3-1600 2 x 2GB Kit, $85.
Graphics Card (ATI): Radeon HD 5850 GDDR5 1GB, $259; two of this card for CrossFireX, $518. An alternative is Radeon HD 5870 GDDR5 1GB, $379.
Graphics Card (NVIDIA): GeForce GTX 275 DDR3 896MB, $210; two of this card for SLI, $420. An alternative is GeForce GTX 285, $320 or GeForce GTX 295, $525.
HDD: Intel X25-M SSDSA2MH080G2 80GB SATA 3.0Gbps SSD, $234.
PSU: Enermax MODU82+ 625W EMD625AWT, $128. An alternative is Enermax REVOLUTION85+ 850W ERV850EWT, $213.
Case: LUXA2 LM200 Touch microATX, with 7” touch screen/IR receiver/remote, $512. If you don't need or don't like a touch screen, choose LUXA2 LM200 microATX, with VFD/IR receiver/remote, $308.
Total Cost: $1707 for non-CrossFireX, $1966 for CrossFireX; $1658 for non-SLI, $1868 for SLI.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=153331&d=1253706866
AMD/AMD

System

CPU: Phenom II X4 965 Black Edition HDZ965FBGIBOX 3.4GHz AM3, $245.
CPU Cooler: Xigmatek Dark Knight-S1283V, $45, with Enzotech Type-X AM2 Retention Modules, $3, and four nuts (necessary to attach the cooler in the correct orientation).
Motherboard: DFI LANPARTY JR 790GX-M3H5 AM3 AMD 790GX chipset microATX, $140.
Memory: G.SKILL F3-12800CL9D-4GBNQ DDR3-1600 2 x 2GB Kit, $85.
Graphics Card: Radeon HD 5850 GDDR5 1GB, $259; two of this card for CrossFireX, $518. An alternative is Radeon HD 5870 GDDR5 1GB, $379.
HDD: Intel X25-M SSDSA2MH080G2 80GB SATA 3.0Gbps SSD, $234.
PSU: Enermax MODU82+ 625W EMD625AWT, $128. An alternative is Enermax REVOLUTION85+ 850W ERV850EWT, $213.
Case: LUXA2 LM200 Touch microATX, with 7” touch screen/IR receiver/remote, $512. If you don't need or don't like a touch screen, choose LUXA2 LM200 microATX, with VFD/IR receiver/remote, $308.
Total Cost: $1651 for non-CrossFireX, $1910 for CrossFireX.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=153332&d=1253706866

__________
ATX System
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯

The ATX form factor is differentiated from microATX by its larger size 12″ x 9.6″ vs. 9.6″ x 9.6″ of microATX, and hence the support for 7 expansion slots vs. 4 expansion slots in microATX. Another differentiating factor is that motherboard manufacturers tend to implement better CPU power circuitry and cooling solution for MOSFET and the chipset in ATX motherboards for better stability with a CPU of very high power consumption such as Phenom 125W/140W and better overclocking (although most HTPC users will not be interested in this aspect). I give a low-end system, a mid-range system, a high-end system and a premium system for each of the Intel platform with Intel chipsets, the Intel platform with NVIDIA chipsets, the AMD platform with AMD chipsets and the AMD platform with NVIDIA chipsets. As the expandability is the most important factor, I set the following criteria:: the motherboard should have

Low-end:
1 x PCIe 2.0 x16 for a 2-slot graphics card
3 x PCIe x1 for HBA, a sound card and a TV tuner
Mid-range and high-end:
1 x PCIe 2.0 x8 for a 2-slot graphics card
1 x PCIe x8 for HBA
2 x PCIe x1 for a sound card and a TV tuner
Premium system:
2 x PCIe 2.0 x16 (or x8) for dual 2-slot graphics
1 x PCIe x1 and 1 x PCIe x4 for a sound card/TV tuner/HBA
But a few systems do not meet this criteria (simply because there is no good motherboard). In addition, fully usable 6 SATA ports (I mean not blocked by a large graphics card) is a norm. I will give low-end, mid-range, high-end and premium systems for each of the Intel platform with Intel and NVIDIA chipsets and the AMD platform with AMD and NVIDIA chipsets. Basic distinctions are:

Low-end system: offers reasonably good video playback performance at a low cost.
Mid-range system: offers the best video playback performance without compromise.
High-end system: should be able to handle other HTPC-related tasks such as video re-encoding and games with reasonably good performance.
Premium system: is intended to be the best (but not too expensive) overall system available today.
Here is a feature comparison chart.

http://i696.photobucket.com/albums/vv328/renethx_yahoo/Support2yellow2.png

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=133082&stc=1&d=1234264565

_______
Low-End
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯

Intel/Intel

System

CPU: Pentium Dual-Core E5300 2.60GHz 2MB L2 LGA775, $64.
CPU Cooler: Stock cooler, $0.
Motherboard: GIGABYTE GA-EP43-UD3L LGA775 Intel P43 chipset ATX, $80.
Memory: A-DATA ADQVE1A16K DDR2-800 2 x 1GB Kit, $32.
Graphics Card: SAPPHIRE Radeon HD 4550 DDR3 512MB HDMI, $45.
HDD: Western Digital WD6400AAKS 640GB SATA 3.0Gbps, $70.
PSU: Corsair VX450W CMPSU-450VX 450W, $60.
Case: SilverStone Lascala LC17 SST-LC17B ATX, $119.
Total Cost: $470.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=151834&d=1252166768

Intel/NVIDIA

System

CPU: Pentium Dual-Core E5300 2.60GHz 2MB L2 LGA775, $64.
CPU Cooler: Stock cooler, $0.
Motherboard: EVGA 113-YW-E115-TR LGA775 GeForce 9300 mGPU ATX, $118.
Memory: A-DATA ADQVE1A16K DDR2-800 2 x 1GB Kit, $32.
Graphics Card: GeForce 9300 (integrated in the chipset), $0.
HDD: Western Digital WD6400AAKS 640GB SATA 3.0Gbps, $70.
PSU: Corsair VX450W CMPSU-450VX 450W, $60.
Case: SilverStone Lascala LC17 SST-LC17B ATX, $119.
Total Cost: $463.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=151835&d=1252166768

AMD/AMD

System

CPU: Athlon II X2 240 ADX240OCGQBOX 2.8GHz AM3, $60.
CPU Cooler: Stock cooler, $0.
Motherboard: GIGABYTE GA-MA785G-UD3H AM2+ AMD 785G chipset ATX, $90.
Memory: A-DATA ADQVE1A16K DDR2-800 2 x 1GB Kit, $32.
Graphics Card: SAPPHIRE Radeon HD 4550 DDR3 512MB HDMI, $45.
HDD: Western Digital WD6400AAKS 640GB SATA 3.0Gbps, $70.
PSU: Corsair VX450W CMPSU-450VX 450W, $60.
Case: SilverStone Lascala LC17 SST-LC17B ATX, $119.
Total Cost: $481
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=151836&d=1252166768

Remarks

You could use the onboard graphics (HD 4200) but HDMI audio is limted to stereo LPCM. If your receiver is pre-HDMI, this is a good choice.
If you prefer DDR3 SDRAM (+$8 with little performance increase, but DDR3 memory modules are reusable in future), choose
GIGABYTE GA-MA785GT-UD3H AM2+ AMD 785G chipset ATX, $90, or ASUS M4A785TD-V EVO AM3 AMD 785G chipset ATX, $100.
G.SKILL F3-12800CL9D-2GBNQ DDR3-1600 2 x 1GB Kit, $45.
AMD/NVIDIA

System

CPU: Athlon II X2 240 ADX240OCGQBOX 2.8GHz AM3, $60.
CPU Cooler: Stock cooler, $0.
Motherboard: ASUS M3N78 PRO AM2+ GeForce 8300 mGPU ATX, $94.
Memory: G.SKILL F2-8500CL5D-2GBPK DDR2-1066 2 x 1GB Kit, $37.
Graphics Card: GeForce 8300 (integrated in the chipset), $0.
HDD: Western Digital WD6400AAKS 640GB SATA 3.0Gbps, $70.
PSU: Corsair VX450W CMPSU-450VX 450W, $60.
Case: SilverStone Lascala LC17 SST-LC17B ATX, $119.
Total Cost: $440.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=151837&d=1252166783

_________
Mid-Range
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯

Intel/Intel

System

CPU: Core 2 Duo E7500 2.93GHz 3MB L2 LGA775, $113.
CPU Cooler: Xigmatek NEPARTAK S983, $30.
Motherboard: GIGABYTE GA-EP45-UD3P LGA775 Intel P45 chipset ATX, $115.
Memory: A-DATA ADQVE1B16K DDR2-800 2 x 2GB Kit, $57.
Graphics Card: SAPPHIRE Radeon HD 4670 DDR3 1GB, $70. An alternative is HIS H467QS1GH Radeon HD 4670 DDR3 1GB, $75.
HDD: Western Digital WD6400AAKS 640GB SATA 3.0Gbps, $70.
PSU: Enermax PRO82+ 525W EPR525AWT, $96. A cheaper alternative is Corsair VX550W CMPSU-550VX 550W, $87.
Case: Antec Fusion Remote Max ATX, with LCD/IR receiver/remote, $178.
Total Cost: $729.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=152724&d=1253073935

Intel/NVIDIA

There is no recommendation of a mid-range system for this platform. A system with the popular ASUS P5N-D nForce 750i SLI chipset motherboard is good for x16 SLI, but not particularly good for HTPC (not enough PCIe x1 slots; its SB is the three-year old MCP51 [used in GeForce 6150 motherboards!] supporting only 4 SATA ports).

AMD/AMD

System

CPU: Athlon II X4 630 ADX630WFGIBOX 2.8GHz AM3, $122.
CPU Cooler: Xigmatek NEPARTAK S983, $30.
Motherboard: GIGABYTE GA-MA790X-UD4P AM2+ AMD 790X chipset ATX, $104. An alternative is GIGABYTE GA-MA790GP-UD4H AM2+ AMD 790GX chipset ATX, $115 (with IGP; useful in case you use the motherboard for a server in future).
Memory: G.SKILL F2-8500CL5D-4GBPK DDR2-1066 2 x 2GB Kit, $65.
Graphics Card: SAPPHIRE Radeon HD 4670 DDR3 1GB, $70. An alternative is HIS H467QS1GH Radeon HD 4670 DDR3 1GB, $75.
HDD: Western Digital WD6400AAKS 640GB SATA 3.0Gbps, $70.
PSU: Enermax PRO82+ 525W EPR525AWT, $96. A cheaper alternative is Corsair VX550W CMPSU-550VX 550W, $87.
Case: Antec Fusion Remote Max ATX, with LCD/IR receiver/remote, $178.
Total Cost: $735
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=152879&d=1253250536

Remarks

If you prefer DDR3 SDRAM (+$20 with little performance increase, but DDR3 memory modules are reusable in future), choose
GIGABYTE GA-MA790XT-UD4P AM3 AMD 790X chipset ATX, $115 (without IGP) or GIGABYTE GA-MA790GPT-UD3H AM3 AMD 790GX chipset ATX, $115 (with IGP).
G.SKILL F3-12800CL9D-4GBNQ DDR3-1600 2 x 2GB Kit, $75.
AMD/NVIDIA

System

CPU: Athlon II X4 630 ADX630WFGIBOX 2.8GHz AM3, $122.
CPU Cooler: Xigmatek NEPARTAK S983, $30.
Motherboard: ASUS M3N72-D AM2+ nForce 750a SLI MCP ATX, $112.
Memory: G.SKILL F2-8500CL5D-4GBPK DDR2-1066 2 x 2GB Kit, $65.
Graphics Card: ASUS EN9600GT/DI/512MD3 GeForce 9600 GT DDR3 512MB, $77.
HDD: Western Digital WD6400AAKS 640GB SATA 3.0Gbps, $70.
PSU: Enermax PRO82+ 525W EPR525AWT, $96. A cheaper alternative is Corsair VX550W CMPSU-550VX 550W, $87.
Case: Antec Fusion Remote Max ATX, with LCD/IR receiver/remote, $178.
Total Cost: $750.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=153330&d=1253704877

Remarks

nForce 750a SLI is basically an SLI x8 version of GeForce 8200.
The graphics card supports S/PDIF pass-through from the onboard audio codec through HDMI. If you want multichannel LPCM audio, you have to connect your AVR to the HDMI port of the motherboard and your display to the graphics card. Please read Any GeForce graphics card + GeForce 8200 HDMI audio work together perfectly! (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=13897618#post13897618).
________
High-End
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯

Intel/Intel

System

CPU: Core i5 750 2.66GHz LGA1156, $196.
CPU Cooler: Xigmatek NEPARTAK S983, $30, with Xigmatek Crossbow ACK-I5361, $10 (necessary to attach the cooler to the LGA1156 socket).
Motherboard: ASUS P7P55D EVO LGA1156 Intel P55 chipset ATX, $185. An alternative is ASUS P7P55D PRO LGA1156 Intel P55 chipset ATX, $170 (single Gb LAN, no SLI bridge included) or ASRock P55 Deluxe LGA1156 Intel P55 chipset ATX, $175 (supporting DTS Connect, good for S/PDIF gamers; a 2-port SATA 6Gbps card included).
Memory: G.SKILL F3-12800CL9D-4GBNQ DDR3-1600 2 x 2GB Kit, $85.
Graphics Card: HIS H485Q1GH Radeon HD 4850 GDDR3 1GB, $133.
HDD: Western Digital WD6400AAKS 640GB SATA 3.0Gbps, $70.
PSU: Enermax PRO82+ 625W EPR625AWT, $108. A cheaper alternative is Corsair TX650W CMPSU-650TX 650W, $93.
Case: Zalman HD160 Plus ATX, with LCD/IR receiver/remote, $277.
Total Cost: $1094.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=152568&d=1252913988

Intel/NVIDIA

There is no recommendation of a high-end system for this platform. A system with the popular ASUS P5N-D nForce 750i SLI chipset motherboard is good for x16 SLI, but not particularly good for HTPC (not enough PCIe x1 slots; its SB is the three-year old MCP51 [used in GeForce 6150 motherboards!] supporting only 4 SATA ports).

AMD/AMD

System

CPU: Phenom II X4 945 HDX945WFGIBOX 3.0GHz AM3, $170.
CPU Cooler: Zalman CNPS9500A LED, $43.
Motherboard: GIGABYTE GA-MA790XT-UD4P AM3 AMD 790X chipset ATX, $115. An alternative is GIGABYTE GA-MA790GPT-UD3H AM3 AMD 790GX chipset ATX, $115 (with IGP; useful in case you use the motherboard for a server in future).
Memory: G.SKILL F3-12800CL9D-4GBNQ DDR3-1600 2 x 2GB Kit, $85.
Graphics Card: HIS H485Q1GH Radeon HD 4850 GDDR3 1GB, $133.
HDD: Western Digital WD6400AAKS 640GB SATA 3.0Gbps, $70.
PSU: Enermax PRO82+ 625W EPR625AWT, $108. A cheaper alternative is Corsair TX650W CMPSU-650TX 650W, $93.
Case: Zalman HD160 Plus ATX, with LCD/IR receiver/remote, $277.
Total Cost: $1001.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=152569&d=1252913988

AMD/NVIDIA

System

CPU: Phenom II X4 945 HDX945WFGIBOX 3.0GHz AM3, $170.
CPU Cooler: Zalman CNPS9500A LED, $43.
Motherboard: ASUS M3N72-D AM2+ nForce 750a SLI MCP ATX, $112.
Memory: G.SKILL F2-8500CL5D-4GBPK DDR2-1066 2 x 2GB Kit, $65.
Graphics Card: XFX GS-250X-ZDFC GeForce GTS 250 DDR3 1GB, $144.
HDD: Western Digital WD6400AAKS 640GB SATA 3.0Gbps, $70.
PSU: Enermax PRO82+ 625W EPR625AWT, $108. A cheaper alternative is Corsair TX650W CMPSU-650TX 650W, $93.
Case: Zalman HD160 Plus ATX, with LCD/IR receiver/remote, $277.
Total Cost: $989.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=152570&d=1252913988

Remarks

nForce 750a SLI is basically an SLI x8 version of GeForce 8200.
The graphics card supports S/PDIF pass-through from the onboard audio codec through HDMI. If you want multichannel LPCM audio, you have to connect your AVR to the HDMI port of the motherboard and your display to the graphics card. Please read Any GeForce graphics card + GeForce 8200 HDMI audio work together perfectly! (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=13897618#post13897618).
________
Premium
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯

Intel/Intel

System

CPU: Core i7 860 2.80GHz LGA1156, $284.
CPU Cooler: Xigmatek Dark Knight-S1283V, $45, with Xigmatek Crossbow ACK-I5361, $10 (necessary to attach the cooler to the LGA1156 socket).
Motherboard: ASUS P7P55D EVO LGA1156 Intel P55 chipset ATX, $185. An alternative is Intel DP55KG (BOXDP55KG) LGA1156 Intel P55 chipset ATX, $210 (supporting Dolby Home Theater, good for S/PDIF gamers; single Gb LAN).
Memory: G.SKILL F3-12800CL9D-4GBNQ DDR3-1600 2 x 2GB Kit, $85.
Graphics Card (ATI): Radeon HD 5850 GDDR5 1GB, $259; two of this card for CrossFireX, $518. An alternative is Radeon HD 5870 GDDR5 1GB, $379.
Graphics Card (NVIDIA): GeForce GTX 275 DDR3 896MB, $240; two of this card for SLI, $480. An alternative is GeForce GTX 285, $320 or GeForce GTX 295, $525.
HDD: Intel X25-M SSDSA2MH080G2 80GB SATA 3.0Gbps SSD, $234.
PSU: Enermax REVOLUTION85+ 850W ERV850EWT, $213.
Case: Thermaltake DH104 VH4001BNS ATX, with 7” touch screen/IR receiver/remote, $451. If you don't need or don't like a touch screen, choose Thermaltake DH103 VH3001BNS ATX, with LCD/IR receiver/remote, $244 or SilverStone Crown CW02 SST-CW02S-MXR ATX, with LCD/IR receiver/remote, $364.
Total Cost: $1766 for non-CrossFireX, $2025 for CrossFireX; $1717 for non-SLI, $1927 for SLI.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=153333&d=1253707119

Intel/NVIDIA

System

CPU: Core 2 Quad Q9550 2.83GHz 12MB L2 LGA775, $266.
CPU Cooler: Xigmatek Dark Knight-S1283V, $45.
Motherboard: XFX MB-N790-IUL9 LGA775 nForce 790i 3-Way SLI ATX, $170.
Memory: G.SKILL F3-12800CL9D-4GBNQ DDR3-1600 2 x 2GB Kit, $85.
Graphics Card: GeForce GTX 275 DDR3 896MB, $210; two of this card for SLI, $420. An alternative is GeForce GTX 285, $320 or GeForce GTX 295, $525.
HDD: Intel X25-M SSDSA2MH080G2 80GB SATA 3.0Gbps SSD, $234.
PSU: Enermax REVOLUTION85+ 850W ERV850EWT, $213.
Case: Thermaltake DH104 VH4001BNS ATX, with 7” touch screen/IR receiver/remote, $451. If you don't need or don't like a touch screen, choose Thermaltake DH103 VH3001BNS ATX, with LCD/IR receiver/remote, $244 or SilverStone Crown CW02 SST-CW02S-MXR ATX, with LCD/IR receiver/remote, $364.
Total Cost: $1674 for non-SLI, $1884 for SLI.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=151845&d=1252167147

AMD/AMD

System

CPU: Phenom II X4 965 Black Edition HDZ965FBGIBOX 3.4GHz AM3, $245.
CPU Cooler: Xigmatek Dark Knight-S1283V, $45, with Enzotech Type-X AM2 Retention Modules, $3, and four nuts (necessary to attach the cooler in the correct orientation).
Motherboard: MSI 790FX-GD70 AM3 AMD 790FX chipset ATX, $165.
Memory: G.SKILL F3-12800CL9D-4GBNQ DDR3-1600 2 x 2GB Kit, $85.
Graphics Card: Radeon HD 5850 GDDR5 1GB, $259; two of this card for CrossFireX, $518. An alternative is Radeon HD 5870 GDDR5 1GB, $379.
HDD: Intel X25-M SSDSA2MH080G2 80GB SATA 3.0Gbps SSD, $234.
PSU: Enermax REVOLUTION85+ 850W ERV850EWT, $213.
Case: Thermaltake DH104 VH4001BNS ATX, with 7” touch screen/IR receiver/remote, $451. If you don't need or don't like a touch screen, choose Thermaltake DH103 VH3001BNS ATX, with LCD/IR receiver/remote, $244 or SilverStone Crown CW02 SST-CW02S-MXR ATX, with LCD/IR receiver/remote, $364.
Total Cost: $1700 for non-CrossFireX, $1959 for CrossFireX.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=153334&d=1253707119

AMD/NVIDIA

System

CPU: Phenom II X4 965 Black Edition HDZ965FBGIBOX 3.4GHz AM3, $245.
CPU Cooler: Xigmatek Dark Knight-S1283V, $45, with Enzotech Type-X AM2 Retention Modules, $3, and four nuts (necessary to attach the cooler in the correct orientation).
Motherboard: MSI NF980-G65 AM3 nForce 980a SLI MCP ATX, $180.
Memory: G.SKILL F3-12800CL9D-4GBNQ DDR3-1600 2 x 2GB Kit, $85.
Graphics Card: GeForce GTX 275 DDR3 896MB, $210; two of this card for SLI, $420. An alternative is GeForce GTX 285, $320 or GeForce GTX 295, $525.
HDD: Intel X25-M SSDSA2MH080G2 80GB SATA 3.0Gbps SSD, $234.
PSU: Enermax REVOLUTION85+ 850W ERV850EWT, $213.
Case: Thermaltake DH104 VH4001BNS ATX, with 7” touch screen/IR receiver/remote, $451. If you don't need or don't like a touch screen, choose Thermaltake DH103 VH3001BNS ATX, with LCD/IR receiver/remote, $244 or SilverStone Crown CW02 SST-CW02S-MXR ATX, with LCD/IR receiver/remote, $364.
Total Cost: $1666 for non-SLI, $1876 for SLI.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=151882&d=1252196029

Remarks

nForce 980a SLI (rebadged nForce 780a SLI) is nForce 750a SLI + nForce 200 (a PCI Express switch for SLI x16).
The graphics card supports S/PDIF pass-through from the onboard audio codec through HDMI. If you want multichannel LPCM audio, you have to connect your AVR to the HDMI port of the motherboard and your display to the graphics card. Please read Any GeForce graphics card + GeForce 8200 HDMI audio work together perfectly! (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=13897618#post13897618).
_________________________
DAS (Direct Attached Storage)
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯

If you need more storage space than the one provided by the motherboard and the case, the quickest solution is attach an external HDD enclosure. Possible interfaces are USB 2.0 (60MB/s), IEEE 1394a (50MB/s), PCI (133MB/s), PCI Express x1 (250MB/s), all of which are good enough for home use. If you need lots of drives, you may want to consider a dedicated file server (see "Home Media Server"). If you need higher I/O throughput, e.g. for video editing, there are many SATA RAID controller cards with PCI Express x4 (1.0GB/s) or x8 (2.0GB/s) interface. Here are a couple of examples.

5 Drive SATA Enclosure with PCI Express Controller

AMS DS-2350S VENUS T5 (http://prostores2.carrierzone.com/servlet/amselectronicscom/Detail?no=783), $220 (the picture below)
AMS DS-2340SES VENUS ES5 (http://prostores2.carrierzone.com/servlet/amselectronicscom/Detail?no=765), $175
SilverStone DS351 (http://www.silverstonetek.com/products/p_contents.php?pno=ds351&area=usa), $480
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=120521&d=1222204589

Each of them has Silicon Image SiI4726 (http://www.siliconimage.com/products/product.aspx?id=74) SATA to 5-Port SATA Device SteelVine Storage Processor and is bundled with a 2-port SATA PCIe x1 host bus adapter based on Silicon Image SiI3132 (http://www.siliconimage.com/products/product.aspx?id=32). You can attach up to two enclosures (10 drives) to one card by FIS-based Port Multiplier. Supports RAID 0, 1, 10, 5 and JBOD.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=120524&d=1222204694

8 Drive SATA Enclosure with PCI Express Controller

Rosewill RSV-S8 (http://www.rosewill.com/products/1189/productDetail.htm), $350
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=120522&d=1222204589

The case has two SiI3726 (http://www.siliconimage.com/products/product.aspx?id=26) port multipliers and is bundled with a 2-port SATA PCIe x1 host bus adapter based on Silicon Image SiI3132 (http://www.siliconimage.com/products/product.aspx?id=32) supporting port multiplier. The difference between SiI3726 and SiI4726 is that SiI4726 can be connected to a non-PM aware SATA port, while SiI3726 needs to be connected to a PM aware SATA port.

High-Performance 8 Drive SATA Enclosure with PCI Express Controller

External 8 drive Hotswap SATA Enclosure w/4X connectors (http://www.pc-pitstop.com/sata_enclosures/scsat84x.asp), $389
HighPoint RocketRAID 2322 2-port SFF-8088 (8-port SATA) RAID Controller PCIe x4 Card, $230
HighPoint Ext-MS-1MSB SFF-8088 to SFF-8470 1 m cable x 2, $56
Total Cost: $675
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=129564&d=1231846498

For better performance you can go with a RAID controller card with a hardware RAID processor engine such as

HighPoint RocketRAID 3522 with IOP341 processor, $480
Areca ARC-1221x with IOP341 processor, $595
Adaptec RAID 3085, $595
Adaptec RAID 5085, $760
LSI SAS3801E, $300
15 Drive SATA 4U Rack Mount Storage Chassis

Addonics is manufacturing a highly customizable 4U rack mount chassis supporting 15 HDDs.

SR460S Storage Rack base unit with 460W ATX power supply (http://www.addonics.com/products/raid_system/rack_overview.asp), $335
AE5RCS35NSA Disk Array 5SA (http://www.addonics.com/products/raid_system/ae4rcs35nsa.asp) x 3, $387
Total Cost: $722
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=127321&d=1229843353

You can use the chassis in various ways. For example use it with a RAID controller card such as:

HighPoint RocketRAID 2340 4-port SFF-8087 (16-port SATA) RAID Controller PCIe x8 Card, $430
or use it with three PMs and PM-aware SATA controllers such as:

AD5SARPM-E eSATA Port Multiplier for Rackmount Systems (http://www.addonics.com/products/host_controller/ad5sapm-e.asp) x 3, $240
MonoPrice PCI Express Serial ATA II (SATA II) Card (http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=104&cp_id=10407&cs_id=1040702&p_id=3581&seq=1&format=2) x 2, $30
Total Cost: $270
Other Solutions

Please check Newegg.com > Servers > Server RAID Systems (http://www.newegg.com/Store/SubCategory.aspx?SubCategory=509&name=Server-RAID-Systems).

__________
Worktsation
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯

Workstation here is a PC intended for various HTPC-related tasks other than video/audio playback. The CPU and the motherboard chosen here are good enough for the most demanding tasks and future upgrades (4 cores/8 threads, supporting PCI Express 2.0 x16, x16 / x16, x8, x8 / x8, x8, x8, x8 links). The selection of other components depends on the tasks you are going to do. The system below is a consumer-grade high-performance video editing machine.

System

CPU: Core i7 860 2.80GHz LGA1156, $284.
CPU Cooler: Xigmatek Dark Knight-S1283V, $45, with Xigmatek Crossbow ACK-I5361, $10 (necessary to attach the cooler to the LGA1156 socket).
Motherboard: ASUS P7P55 WS SuperComputer LGA1156 Intel P55 and nForce 200 chipsets ATX, $250.
Memory: G.SKILL F3-12800CL9D-4GBNQ DDR3-1600 2 x 2GB Kit, $85.
Graphics Card: GeForce GTX 275 DDR3 896MB, $210.
HBA: Adaptec RAID 51645 20-port SAS/SATA RAID Controller PCI Express x8 Card, $1,040.
HDD: Intel X25-M SSDSA2MH080G2 80GB SATA 3.0Gbps SSD, $234.
PSU: Enermax REVOLUTION85+ 850W ERV850EWT, $213.
Case: Chenbro SR109 EATX/ATX, $245.
HDD Cage (optional): Chenbro 84H210910-010 5-in-3 Hotswap HDD Cage, $102. The case supports up to 15 HDDs (besides the OS drive) with three cages.
Total Cost: $2616 (optional HDD cages and drives for data storage are not included)
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=152355&d=1252656633

Remarks

You can even use:
CPU: Core i7 920 2.66GHz LGA1366, $284.
Motherboard: ASUS P6T6 WS Revolution LGA1366 Intel X58 and nForce 200 chipsets ATX, $350 (supporting PCI Express 2.0 x16, x16, x16 / x16, x16, x8, x8 / x16, x8, x8, x8, x8 links), or ASUS P6T7 WS SuperComputer LGA1366 Intel X58 and dual nForce 200 chipsets ATX, $430 (supporting PCI Express 2.0 x16, x16, x16, x16 / x16, x16, x16, x8, x8 / x16, x16, x8, x8, x8, x8 / x16, x8, x8, x8, x8, x8, x8 links).
Memory: G.SKILL F3-12800CL9T-6GBNQ DDR3-1600 3 x 2GB Kit, $125.
if your applications can utilize that expandability.
_________________
Media Storage Sever
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯

Purpose of a Media Storage Sever

The main purposes of the media storage server described here are:

Storing/archiving media files (ripped/downloaded/recorded SD & HD contents, ripped/downloaded/recorded music, photographs etc.) in one centralized place.
Streaming media to HTPCs.
Possibly serving as a DVR with TV tuners added.
Here are some considerations in building such a system.

Component Selection

OS: The intended OS is one of
Windows Vista or Windows 7, x86 or x64 (Single Disk or JBOD or FlexRAID)
Windows Home Server (WHS)
unRAID (a Linux variant with RAID 4 capability)
You can also use Linux (software RAID), OpenFiler etc. as long as the SATA controller supports it.
Case: Currently NORCO RPC-4020 and NORCO RPC-4220 are the best cases for a media storage server. Both support 20 HDDs in hot-swap bays at a relatively cheap price ($290 and $350 respectively). The latter has a backplane with five SFF-8087 connectors instead of twenty SATA connectors in the former. If you need more storage space, build another server of the same type and store them in a rack such as iStarUSA WO22AB 22U WO Open Frame Rack (http://www.istarusa.com/server_cabinet/open_frame_rack/default.aspx), ~$300:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=120528&d=1222205426

PSU: Each hard disk drive consumes as low as 5W at idle, but as much as 30W at start-up (depending on each model). So we will need a powerful PSU to start up all the drives at a time. A typical power consumption of a server consisting of twenty HDDs is
~600W at start up
~200W at seek
~150W at idle
CPU: We chose a cheap dual-core processor because archiving/streaming/recording is not CPU-intensive.
Memory: 2GB is enough for a similar reason.
Motherboard: Basic requirements are
Onboard graphics
2 PCI slots or 2 PCI Express x4 slots for storage controllers for 16 storage HDDs
6 onboard SATA ports for additional storage HDDs and the OS HDD.
Gb LAN (that provides enough bandwidth for streaming HD contents to several HTPC simultaneously)
Proper support for power management, in particular WOL (Wake-On-LAN)
If you are going to use the server as a DVR, you may want more expansion slots. The motherboard chosen here (GIGABYTE GA-MA785G-UD3H) has enough expansion slots and is reasonably cheap. You can even use a RAID controller PCIe x8 card.
HBA (host bus adapter): As the number of onboard SATA ports is not enough, we use SATA controller cards. I chose cheap non-RAID SATA controller PCI-X (compatible with PCI) or PCI Express x4 cards, that are enough for our purpose.
OS drive: You can use any drive for OS (or a USB flash memory for unRAID).
Storage drives: There are several good cheap 1TB/1.5TB HDDs.
WD Caviar Green WD10EADS 1TB 5400 rpm SATA 3.0Gbps, $85.
Samsung HD103SI 1TB 5400 rpm SATA 3.0Gbps, $80.
WD Caviar Green WD15EADS 1.5TB 5400 rpm SATA 3.0Gbps, $120.
Samsung HD154UI 1.5TB 5400 rpm SATA 3.0Gbps, $120.
Backup

You will need to back up important, irreplaceable data (e.g. personal documents and family photos), perhaps off-site. Building a dedicated backup system is one method (you can use similar hardware components here). A caution to those who consider RAID5: RAID 5 is not a backup strategy, it's about uptime - if a drive fails, you can swap it for a new one to rebuild with no service interruption. You may lose the entire date in the array instantly however if multiple drives fail or if a hardware issue kills the array. FlexRAID and unRAID are better in this point: you can still get data from each non-failed drive.

http://i696.photobucket.com/albums/vv328/renethx_yahoo/Support2yellow2.png

20 HDD System I

The first system uses NORCO RPC-4020 case (20 SATA connectors in the backplane) and two 8-port SATA controller PCI-X cards.

System

Case: NORCO RPC-4020 4U EATX/ATX (20 x SATA/SAS drive bay), $290.
PSU: Corsair TX750W CMPSU-750TX 750W, $112.
CPU: Athlon II X2 240 ADX240OCGQBOX 2.8GHz AM3, $60.
CPU Cooler: Stock Cooler, $0.
Motherboard: GIGABYTE GA-MA785G-UD3H AM2+ AMD 785G chipset ATX, $90.
Memory: A-DATA ADQVE1A16K DDR2-800 2 x 1GB Kit, $32.
Graphics: Radeon HD 4200 (integrated in the chipset), $0.
HBA: Supermicro AOC-SAT2-MV8 8-port SATA Controller PCI-X Card, $95.
HBA: Supermicro AOC-SAT2-MV8 8-port SATA Controller PCI-X Card, $95.
OS HDD: Western Digital WD6400AAKS 640GB SATA 3.0Gbps, $70.
Total Cost: $844 (storage drives are not included)
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=151901&d=1252222290

Remarks

Supermicro AOC-SAT2-MV8 is a PCI-X card. However it works fine with a PCI slot and the performance is good enough for WHS or unRAID (this is natural considering the bandwidth of PCI is 133MB/s, higher than most single disks). If you want full bandwidth PCI-X slots (important for software RAID), then check one of the following motherboards:


Intel S3210SHLX LGA775 Intel 3210 chipset ATX, $280 (1 x VGA, 1 x PCIe x16@x8, 1 x PCIe x8, 2 x PCI-X, 1 x PCI) or
Supermicro MBD-X7SBA LGA775 Intel 3210 chipset ATX, $220 (1 x VGA, 1 x PCIe x16@x8, 2 x PCI-X, 4 x PCI) or
Supermicro MBD-X7SBE LGA775 Intel 3210 chipset ATX, $250 (1 x VGA, 1 x PCIe x8, 1 x PCIe x4, 4 x PCI-X) or
Tyan Toledo i3210W (S5211G2NR) LGA775 Intel 3210 chipset ATX, $235 (1 x VGA, 2 x PCIe x16@x8, 2 x PCI-X, 2 x PCI)

with an Intel Core 2 processor.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=129313&d=1231659444


You may need two Right (Left?)-Angle SATA cables so that one of the Supermicro cards does not interfere with the onboard SATA ports, such as:


StarTech SATA18LA1 18 inch Left Angle Serial ATA Cable (http://www.startech.com/Product/ItemDetail.aspx?productid=SATA18LA1&c=US)
20 HDD System II

The second system uses NORCO RPC-4220 case (5 SFF-8087 connectors in the backplane) and two 8-port SATA controller PCI Express x4 cards.

System

Case: NORCO RPC-4220 4U EATX/ATX (20 x SATA/SAS drive bay), $350.
PSU: Corsair TX750W CMPSU-750TX 750W, $112.
CPU: Athlon II X2 240 ADX240OCGQBOX 2.8GHz AM3, $60.
CPU Cooler: Stock Cooler, $0.
Motherboard: GIGABYTE GA-MA785G-UD3H AM2+ AMD 785G chipset ATX, $90.
Memory: A-DATA ADQVE1A16K DDR2-800 2 x 1GB Kit, $32.
Graphics: Radeon HD 4200 (integrated in the chipset), $0.
HBA: Supermicro AOC-SASLP-MV8 8-port SATA Controller PCI Express x4 Card, $100.
HBA: Supermicro AOC-SASLP-MV8 8-port SATA Controller PCI Express x4 Card, $100.
Cable: 0.5m SFF-8087 to Four SATA Cable, $11. (For example, 3ware CBL-SFF8087OCR-05M or Norco C-SFF8087-4S)
Cable: 0.5m SFF-8087 to SFF-8087 Cable, $11. (For example, 3ware CBL-SFF8087-05M or Norco C-SFF8087-D)
Cable: 0.5m SFF-8087 to SFF-8087 Cable, $11. (For example, 3ware CBL-SFF8087-05M or Norco C-SFF8087-D)
Cable: 0.5m SFF-8087 to SFF-8087 Cable, $11. (For example, 3ware CBL-SFF8087-05M or Norco C-SFF8087-D)
Cable: 0.5m SFF-8087 to SFF-8087 Cable, $11. (For example, 3ware CBL-SFF8087-05M or Norco C-SFF8087-D)
OS HDD: WD Scorpio Black WD3200BEKT 320GB SATA 3.0Gbps mobile 7200 RPM, $80.
Total Cost: $979 (storage drives are not included)
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=151902&d=1252222290
Remarks

Supermicro AOC-SASLP-MV8 is a PCI Express x4 card so that there should be enough bandwidth even if you go with software RAID. However currently the supported OS' are limited to:
Windows Home Server, 2003, 2008 and Vista
RedHat Enterprise Linux
Fedora Linux 9
SuSE Linux Enterprise
So you can't use it with, for example, unRAID or OpenFiler.
Tower Cases

In case you prefer or have to use a tower case, here are a couple of recommended ones.

15 HDD's in Hot Swap Bays, $551
Chenbro SR109 EATX/ATX, $245.
Chenbro 84H210910-010 5-in-3 Hotswap HDD Cage, $102.
Chenbro 84H210910-010 5-in-3 Hotswap HDD Cage, $102.
Chenbro 84H210910-010 5-in-3 Hotswap HDD Cage, $102.
15 HDD's in Hot Swap Bays, $380
Cooler Master Centurion 590 RC-590-KKN1-GP ATX (9 x 5.25” bay), $50.
Athena Power BP-SATA3051B 5-in-3 backplane, $110.
Athena Power BP-SATA3051B 5-in-3 backplane, $110.
Athena Power BP-SATA3051B 5-in-3 backplane, $110.
18 HDD's in Non-Hot Swap Bays, $284
Antec Twelve Hundred ATX (12 x 5.25” bay), $146.
Lian Li EX-23NB Internal HDD Kit, $23.
Lian Li EX-23NB Internal HDD Kit, $23.
Lian Li EX-23NB Internal HDD Kit, $23.
Lian Li EX-23NB Internal HDD Kit, $23.
Lian Li EX-23NB Internal HDD Kit, $23.
Lian Li EX-23NB Internal HDD Kit, $23.
20 HDD's in Hot Swap Bays, $586
Antec Twelve Hundred ATX (12 x 5.25” bay), $146.
Athena Power BP-SATA3051B 5-in-3 backplane, $110.
Athena Power BP-SATA3051B 5-in-3 backplane, $110.
Athena Power BP-SATA3051B 5-in-3 backplane, $110.
Athena Power BP-SATA3051B 5-in-3 backplane, $110.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=151896&d=1252221933

Remarks

For a 15 HDD system, you can replace one of the two Supermicro SATA controller cards with this cheaper card:
MonoPrice 2530 2-port SATA RAID Controller PCI Express x1 Card, $14.

____________________________
Software – Links to Useful Threads
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯
__________________
Windows Media Center
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯
Tutorial

Unleashing Microsoft Windows Vista Media Center (http://www.amazon.com/Unleashing-Microsoft-Windows-Vista-Center/dp/0789736713/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1228621950&sr=1-1)
Plug-ins

List your VMC best plugins here... (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1032611)
DVD

Built-in player with the build-in decoder (or change it with Vista Media Center Decoder utility (http://mediacenterexpert.blogspot.com/2006/07/vista-media-center-decoder-utility.html))
DVD Shrink or DVD Fab for ripping
Vote for your favorite RIPPER! (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1002316)
help ripping dvd collection for the first time (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1085903)
How to enable the DVD Library in Windows Media Center on a Windows Vista-based computer (http://support.microsoft.com/kb/930526)
How To Set Up a DVD Library in Windows Media Server (http://www.paraesthesia.com/archive/2008/09/12/how-to-set-up-a-dvd-library-in-windows-media.aspx)
BD

TMT or PDVD
AnyDVD HD (or DVDFab HD Decrypter) with or without ImgBurn for ripping
My Movies (http://www.mymovies.dk/)
MyMovies and WHS (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=14918868#post14918868)
MKV

HD to mkv .....the options are endless!!!! (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1033822) (creating your own mkv files)
Playing MKV files through VMC (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1023720)
Is Hardware Acceleration (HA) possible for MKV in Vista Media Center (VMC)? (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1035600)
Getting hardware accel working in VMC (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1070439)
How To Guide: Full DXVA (Hardware Accel) in Vista Media Center for 1080p MKV's (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1096447)
TV Tuners

Three ATSC tuners in MCE? (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=909663)
Media Center TV Pack! (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1050312)
Better way of recording live TV to WHS (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=935341)
Tutorial: How to move Media Center Recordings automatically (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1073086)
_____________
Other Front End
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯

MediaPortal

MediaPortal Install Guide (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1092168)
___________
What's Next?
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯
_____________
Intel Processor
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯

LGA 775 Processors

http://i442.photobucket.com/albums/qq146/renethx/IntelCPUPriceList.png

LGA 1366 Processors

The Core i7 processor (codenamed Bloomfield, Socket B or LGA1366), the successor to Core 2 Quad, was anounced on August 11, 2008 and will be available in Q4 2008, that features native quad-core, integrated memory controller, and QuickPath Interconnect. You can expect 20–50% performance gains over Yorkfield (Core 2 Quad 45 nm). The initial lineup is:

Core i7 Extreme 965 (3.20GHz, QPI 6.4GT/s, L3 8MB, 130W), $999
Core i7 940 (2.93GHz, QPI 6.4GT/s, L3 8MB, 130W), $562
Core i7 920 (2.66GHz, QPI 4.8GT/s, L3 8MB, 130W), $284
(Source: HKEPC Hardware – Intel Bloomfield處理器定價曝光2.66GHz 8MB L3型號僅售$284美元 (July 14, 2008) (http://www.hkepc.com/?id=1447).) Please read my post (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=14049839#post14049839) for details and the other two Core i7 processors, Lynnfield and Havendale (Socket H or LGA1156).

LGA 1156 Processors

List of LGA 1156 processors

Lynnfield processors (4-core, no IGP, 45 nm; to be released on September 8)

- Core i7 870 (8 Threads/2.93GHz/TB 3.60GHz/L3 8MB/dual channel DDR3/95W)　$562
- Core i7 860 (8 Threads/2.80GHz/TB 3.46GHz/L3 8MB/dual channel DDR3/95W)　$284 ✓
- Core i5 750 (4 Threads/2.66GHz/TB 3.20GHz/L3 8MB/dual channel DDR3/95W)　$196

Clarkdale processors (2-core, IGP, 32 nm; to be released in January 2010 at CES 2010)[/B]

- Core i5 670 (4 Threads/3.46GHz/TB 3.73GHz/GPU 733MHz/L3 4MB/dual channel DDR3/73W)　$284
- Core i5 661 (4 Threads/3.33GHz/TB 3.60GHz/GPU 900MHz/L3 4MB/dual channel DDR3/73W)　$?
- Core i5 660 (4 Threads/3.33GHz/TB 3.60GHz/GPU 733MHz/L3 4MB/dual channel DDR3/73W)　$196
- Core i5 650 (4 Threads/3.20GHz/TB 3.46GHz/GPU 733MHz/L3 4MB/dual channel DDR3/73W)　$176 ✓

- Core i3 540 (4 Threads/3.06GHz/TB -/GPU 733MHz/L3 4MB/dual channel DDR3/73W)　$143
- Core i3 530 (4 Threads/2.93GHz/TB -/GPU 733MHz/L3 4MB/dual channel DDR3/73W)　$123 ✓
- Pentium G6950 (2 Threads/2.80GHz/TB -/GPU 733MHz/L3 3MB/dual channel DDR3/73W) $87

References

HKEPC Hardware (http://global.hkepc.com/3673)
X-bit labs (http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/cpu/display/20090813091122_Intel_May_Unveil_Microprocessors_with_Integra ted_Graphics_Cores_at_Consumer_Electronics_Show.html)
Branding Scheme

The most important features that distinguish between i7, i5 and i3 are:

Number of threads (instead of the number of cores)
Turbo Boost Technology
Roughly speaking,

Core i7 = 8 threads, Turbo Boost (4 cores [Lynnfield])
Core i5 = 4 threads, Turbo Boost (4 cores [Lynnfield] or 2 cores [Clarksdale])
Core i3 = 4 threads, no Turbo Boost (2 cores [Clarksdale])
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=148275&stc=1&d=1248186508

Previews

AnandTech - The Lynnfield Preview: Rumblings of Revenge (http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=3570)
Expreview - Intel’s 32nm Clarkdale Processor Review Emerges (http://en.expreview.com/2009/07/29/intels-32nm-clarkdale-processor-review-emerges.html)

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=150164&stc=1&d=1250348076

(The performance improvement by Clarkdale depends largely on how well the application supports HyperThreading Technology.)

HARDSPELL – Intel mulls extended life-cycle for socket 775-based processors (November 17, 2008) (http://en.hardspell.com/doc/showcont.asp?news_id=4451)

Intel is considering extending the life-cycle of its socket 775-based processors to 2011 and is expected to let these CPUs cover the entry-level segment, according to sources at motherboard makers.

Currently, Core i7 processors use the new socket 1366, while in the third quarter of 2009, Intel will launch Nehalem-based mainstream desktop PC processors based on socket 1156.

If socket 775-based processors do get extended to 2011, 4-series chipsets will also need a longer life-cycle, therefore Intel is planning to make some modifications to its 4-series chipsets including boosting the G45s image processing performance, and adding Post Processing and Report Mode technologies to boost the chipsets image quality and add support of 24Hz monitors.

For the G43 chipset, Intel will improve memory slot support from two DIMMs originally to four and increase capacity from 8GB DDR2 and 4GB DDR3 to 16GB DDR2 and 8GB DDR3. G41 chipsets will see the addition of an HDMI port, as well as support of the ICH7 southbridge and RAID.

____________
AMD Processor
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯

AMD Processors Price List

http://i442.photobucket.com/albums/qq146/renethx/AMDProcessorPriceList1.png http://i442.photobucket.com/albums/qq146/renethx/AMDProcessorPriceList2.png

AMD Roadmaps

AMD CPU Roadmap

http://img527.imageshack.us/img527/6081/002fo2.jpg

Denob was postponed until Q2 9009.

AMD Chipset Roadmap

http://img525.imageshack.us/img525/863/007kw2.jpg

AMD Platform Roadmap

http://img262.imageshack.us/img262/791/005hb6.jpg

AMD Roadmaps at 2008 Financial Analyst Day (November 14, 2008)

Deneb is slated for 2009 CES (January) with the Dragon platform.

http://img165.imageshack.us/img165/6601/45nmconsumerdesktopprocor6.jpg http://img81.imageshack.us/img81/6000/phenomiilaunchplansfv5.jpg

Source: IT168 – AMD最新Roadmap：45nm产品命名再次大改 (November 14, 2008) (http://publish.it168.com/2008/1114/20081114006901.shtml)

Bulldozer & Bobcat

The completely new microarchitecutures Bulldozer and Bobcat will be released in 2011 (unlike Barcelona they are not a revision of the K8 processor). Orochi, Llano and Ontario in the chart below are them.

http://img140.imageshack.us/img140/1985/amdclientprocessorroadmvi7.jpg

Source: PC Watch – AMDが新マイクロアーキテクチャCPU「Orochi」と「Ontario」を2011年に計画 (November 14, 2008) (http://pc.watch.impress.co.jp/docs/2008/1114/kaigai476.htm)

___________
Motherboard
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯

_______
Memory
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯

DRAMeXchange – Taiwanese DRAM packaging and testing industry analysis Part II (November 18, 2008) (http://www.dramexchange.com/WeeklyResearch/Post/2/620.aspx)

About the outlook of packaging and testing suppliers next year, we will mainly focus on the speed of migrating to DDR3. From the current status of the suppliers, except Powertech which mainly takes orders of Elpida is more aggressive, the others are still conservative about the schedule of DDR3 migration. This is because except Nanya and Inotera, other Taiwanese DRAM vendors so far still have no plan for the DDR3 production. Furthermore, the testing speed of the widely used Advantest T5593 can only top 1066 Mhz on DDR3, and the purchase of new equipments will be needed while dealing with higher clock-speed DDR3, such as 1333 Mhz or even 1600 Mhz. Unless the DDR3 chip output has reached the economy of scale or protected under the long term deals of stable amount and fix customers to secure the quantity, the packaging and testing suppliers will wait until the 2H09 DRAM industry recovery to invest in the DDR3 testing equipments.

___________
Graphics Card
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯

ATI

NVIDIA

Nvidia's GPU lineup for 2009 uncloaked (http://www.guru3d.com/news/nvidias-gpu-lineup-for-2009-uncloaked/)

The guys over at Vr Zone are showing off some new specifications about NVIDIA's plans for the desktop GPU market in 2009.

Obviouslt you already read our GeForce GTX 295 review and GeForce GTX 285 are slated for the first quarter of 2009, and the site says the first 40nm GPU will arrive in Q2 2009. The 40nm GT212 will serve both the enthusiast and performance segment, so the 55nm GT200b GPUs will have a very short lifespan.

The mainstream GT214 and GT216 along with the value GT218 40nm GPUs are expected in Q3 2009, these chips will replace the G94, G96 and G98, respectively. VR Zone claims NVIDIA is working on four desktop SKUs for the GT216 and six desktop SKUs for GT218 at least, so you can expect different clocks and memory configs/types.

For the integrated graphics market NVIDIA is working on the iGT209, this IGP chipset will replace the GeForce 9300/9400 series in Q3 2009. Last but not least, the site also lists the GT300 GPU. This will be NVIDIA's next-generation 40nm GPU, it will support DirectX 11 and is slated for Q4 2009.

Yet another rumor surfaced moments ago though, it seems, NVIDIA will rebrand the GeForce 9800 series graphics cards to GeForce GTS 240 and GeForce GTS 250.

According to sources this respin will commence in February 2009, and that NVIDIA will keep selling both 55nm and 65nm G92 GPUs.

http://i442.photobucket.com/albums/qq146/renethx/NVIDIAGPUroadmap2.png

__________
Sound Card
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯

For PAP-related arguments, please read my post (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=13872683#post13872683). Maybe a standard PAP will be implemented only in Windows 7?

Two sound cards finally supports PAP/multichannel LPCM/Dolby TrueHD & DTS-HD Master Audio bitstreams through HDMI (relased in July and September respectively):

ASUS Xonar HDAV1.3

http://img300.imageshack.us/img300/4431/xonarhdav131024uq3.png

Auzentech Auzen X-Fi HomeTheater 7.1

Auzentech Reveals HDMI 1.3-native PCI Express Audio Combo Card (http://auzentech.com/site/company/press.php)

http://img148.imageshack.us/img148/8844/xfihometheater71lj8.jpg

Compare it with

Auzentech Auzen X-Fi Prelude 7.1

http://img209.imageshack.us/img209/9427/xfiprelude666cg3.png

http://img181.imageshack.us/img181/934/xfihometheaterspec61706gc1.png

For my question...

I want an above avg system to play back blu-ray/hd-dvd over hdmi. Is this overkill? My budget is about 1200 or so.... No games, no other major applications.

AMD Phenom 9600 Agena 2.3GHz
GIGABYTE GA-MA770-DS3
ASUS Radeon HD 3650
---------------------------------------
Currently, at 1400 bucks (tax/ship)
Silverstone LC20-B ATX
8 gigs pc6400 (2x2 x 4)
1TB HD
Vista Home Prem 64bit
LG Blu-ray/HD DVD-ROM & 16X DVD±R DVD Burner
SeaSonic S12 II SS-380GB ATX12V 380W Power Supply (do i need my power?)
Media card reader (TBD)

My other question is Fan for CPU...my goal is quiet, system. My previous expereience, i have always brought the wrong fan for cases. Can you recommend something for this case and processor?

4 gigs should be good but newegg has a combo which makes the first 4 gigs damn cheap so i figure i'll max out the system.

I struggled with AMD vs Intel. I have a Phenom 9300 and love it so I went back to it.
GA-MA770-DS3 is a year-old model. The current replacement (?) is GA-MA78G-DS3H (the same price). This mb has IGP (HD 3200). IGP performs pretty well with Phenom processor so you don't need HD 3650. The southbridge SB700 is also better than SB600.

CPU cooler: ZEROtherm BTF90

Case fan: You can control the speed of the two case fans using this adpater (http://www.bestbyteinc.com/Cables_&_Misc._Accessories/Power_Cables,_Fan_Cables/3pin_Female_-_Dual_3wire__x__3pin_Male_Fan_Power_Adapter/Page_1/CBL-FAN-3D3.html) which should be connected to SYS_FAN1, and SpeedFan.

Q9450 is faster in encoding (up to +50% depending on applications) and consumes less power (by 25W at full load).

That was compared to a Q6600, correct?

How is a Q9300 compared to a Q6600?

Thanks!
Mike

That was compared to a Q6600, correct?

How is a Q9300 compared to a Q6600?
Yes.

Q9300 is faster and cooler.

I just built a HTPC. I like it so far. It's faster than my old HTPC obviously and the build didn't have too many issues. Unfortunately, I don't have a BluRay drive yet but I'll get one eventually. I do know that the system draws about 67w when idle. I have the primary monitor hooked up to a 19" LCD monitor via VGA and then the secondary display is my 50" Panasonic 1080p plasma via HDMI. I run Vista Media Center on the plasma display and it works fine. I stream most of my video files over the wired 100Mbps LAN and it doesn't have any hiccups.

If anyone wants to know anything more about this system, let me know.

Reply #2

Reply #3

OK, here is the component list for my new HTPC (http://secure.newegg.com/WishList/PublicWishDetail.aspx?WishListNumber=12028527).

Hello.
This is my first post on this forum. I've been reading post for about a month, but haven't been able to find the answer to my doubts.
Looking forward to building up a HTPC to be able to play BD. My budget is $1000-1500.
I'm trying to hook this up to my Sony 52" KDL-52W4100 LCD tv.
I was wondering if I could get a good recommendation as for list of parts (in a detailed way) that I should buy in order to build a good HTPC. A good set of 7.1 speakers and TV tuner would be nice as well. (TV tuner is not really a MUST at this point. I understand I can buy this later)
Thanks in advance, and sorry if I have posted at the wrong thread. I just didn't know where else I should do it.
stormeye@gmail.com

Hello.
This is my first post on this forum. I've been reading post for about a month, but haven't been able to find the answer to my doubts.
Looking forward to building up a HTPC to be able to play BD. My budget is $1000-1500.
I'm trying to hook this up to my Sony 52" KDL-52W4100 LCD tv.
I was wondering if I could get a good recommendation as for list of parts (in a detailed way) that I should buy in order to build a good HTPC. A good set of 7.1 speakers and TV tuner would be nice as well. (TV tuner is not really a MUST at this point. I understand I can buy this later)
Thanks in advance, and sorry if I have posted at the wrong thread. I just didn't know where else I should do it.
stormeye@gmail.com

Check out the first page. The low end II or mid range systems get my vote, with the addition of bluetooth keyboard/mouse, media center remote, vista premium 32, and blu-ray burner.

I just built the low end II, and coulnd't be happier.

E2220, Abit IN73HD, LG GGC-H20L, Crucial Ballistix DDR2-800 2GB RAM, Antec Fusion 430, XFX 8500 GT, WD 320 GB Hard Drive, Vista Premuim 32.

I use the stock cooler, and it NEVER gets over 40 degrees C in the Fusion 430 with dual 120mm fans @ the high setting, which is still very quiet.

The only reason why I didn't select the low end 1 is because I game and like having a video card.

OK, here is the component list for my new HTPC (http://secure.newegg.com/WishList/PublicWishDetail.aspx?WishListNumber=12028527).

Looks like a great inexpensive build.

Ok so after a few weeks of researching i decided on my gear. Now for some reason the more i research the specifics of what i bought i feel like i made wrong decisions (im incredibly indecisive) and want to return my graphics card and maybe my mb.

anyway looking for opinions.

1Gx2|CRUCIAL BL2KIT12864AA804
VGA ASUS EN8600GT MAGIC/HTP/512M RT
VID DEV AVERMEDIA AVERCOMBO
CPU INTEL|C2D E7200 2.53G 775 45N R
MB GIGABYTE GA-EP35-DS3R 775 P35 RT
CPU COOLER ZEROTHERM|BTF90 R

Thanks!

Ok so after a few weeks of researching i decided on my gear. Now for some reason the more i research the specifics of what i bought i feel like i made wrong decisions (im incredibly indecisive) and want to return my graphics card and maybe my mb.

anyway looking for opinions.

1Gx2|CRUCIAL BL2KIT12864AA804
VGA ASUS EN8600GT MAGIC/HTP/512M RT
VID DEV AVERMEDIA AVERCOMBO
CPU INTEL|C2D E7200 2.53G 775 45N R
MB GIGABYTE GA-EP35-DS3R 775 P35 RT
CPU COOLER ZEROTHERM|BTF90 R
Your system is nice and well-balanced. Did you find any problems with the graphics card and the mb? Which graphics card and mb do you look at? There are plenty of other good solutions and maybe I can help you.

Your system is nice and well-balanced. Did you find any problems with the graphics card and the mb? Which graphics card and mb do you look at? There are plenty of other good solutions and maybe I can help you.

Well the graphics card wont do hardware acceleration so thats heavy load on the cpu for playback. i dont think it would be a huge problem, but suplementing it with maybe an XFX8600gt for the same price might be better. plus this card only has 1 dvi instead of 2, dont know if thats a drawback.

Well the graphics card wont do hardware acceleration so thats heavy load on the cpu for playback. i dont think it would be a huge problem, but suplementing it with maybe an XFX8600gt for the same price might be better. plus this card only has 1 dvi instead of 2, dont know if thats a drawback.
Every GeForce 8600 GT card, including ASUS EN8600GT MAGIC/HTP/512M, supports HA for MPEG-2/VC-1 (partial)/H.264. One card (either ASUS or XFX) is enough unless you want quad display. VGA or DVI depends on your need.

I've got a pretty old HTPC that can't do HD content, so I'm thinking about upgrading. Taking stuff from this thread with other threads in this forum, this is what I've come up with:

Case: Cooler Master Cosmos S RC1100
CPU: Q9450
GPU: Gigabyte HD4850
MB: Asus P5Q-E
Mem: Corasair Twin2x4096 (4GB)
PS: Enermax MODU82+ 625W PS
CPU Cooler: Ultra-120 extreme
HD: WD 320GB SATA

This should be overkill for watching HD content, but I'll probably use it for some encoding, so I figure it's worth it. Anyway, I'm just wondering if it seems like a good build, or if I'm making some dumb mistake with any of the components.

Every GeForce 8600 GT card, including ASUS EN8600GT MAGIC/HTP/512M, supports HA for MPEG-2/VC-1 (partial)/H.264. One card (either ASUS or XFX) is enough unless you want quad display. VGA or DVI depends on your need.

ok great. so sticking with the Asus vs the XFX is probably safe. My last concern is output to my 42 Toshiba LCD TV with HDMI inputs. Will i be ok with this card?

what software raid 5 solution do you recommend for a 16 drive setup? Also if a sata controller dies for one reason or another, is it possible to recover the software raid?

I've got a pretty old HTPC that can't do HD content, so I'm thinking about upgrading. Taking stuff from this thread with other threads in this forum, this is what I've come up with:

Case: Cooler Master Cosmos S RC1100
CPU: Q9450
GPU: Gigabyte HD4850
MB: Asus P5Q-E
Mem: Corasair Twin2x4096 (4GB)
PS: Enermax MODU82+ 625W PS
CPU Cooler: Ultra-120 extreme
HD: WD 320GB SATA

This should be overkill for watching HD content, but I'll probably use it for some encoding, so I figure it's worth it. Anyway, I'm just wondering if it seems like a good build, or if I'm making some dumb mistake with any of the components.

That's a great selection! P5Q-E has a minor problem: one SATA port is blocked by HD 4850 (I am not sure why ASUS chose such a stupid design). But you still have seven internal SATA ports.

ok great. so sticking with the Asus vs the XFX is probably safe. My last concern is output to my 42 Toshiba LCD TV with HDMI inputs. Will i be ok with this card?

Usually OK although I can't guarantee it with your TV model.

what software raid 5 solution do you recommend for a 16 drive setup? Also if a sata controller dies for one reason or another, is it possible to recover the software raid?
Windows 2003/2008 Server or Linux. UnRAID and FlexRAID are not RAID 5, but popular.

Yes, software RAID is independent of hardware host controllers.

Hi,

This is a great thread, I learned quite a bit. I had a few questions:

1. Do most people keep the PC near their 40"+ screens? If so, how does the fan noise go (I have a Tivo & that fan is kind of annoying).

2. (a little longer):

I have a this media cabinet:

http://www.raymourflanigan.com/catalog/details.asp?ID=7374

I am planning on a 46" Samsung LCD that will be mounted two or so feet above the cabinet - the point being that all wires will be run from the back of the TV, through the wall, into the cabinet (I will put a new outlet near the TV on the wall).

I was thinking of adding two exhaust fans to the back of the cabinet (which will be very close to a wall).

I am concerned about heat in the cabinet. My 1.5 year old son would like the doors open but they need to stay shut so heat can be an issue.

3. I would love to run a cable through the floor & keep the PC in the garage but that wouldnt work with the wife & it would be annoying if we have a DVD to insert.

4. Was there any write up of XP Media center vs say Vista Ultimate?

Thanks for all the info!

Rich

Hello,

please help me decide..

I'm planning to buy HP Pavilion Elite m9300t series as my HTPC for playing and backup movies, NO games. From the manufacturers website the MB is ASUS: IPIBL-LB.

Not sure whether is MB is capable of future upgrades mainly HDD and video graphics card.

Please help..

Hello,

please help me decide..

I'm planning to buy HP Pavilion Elite m9300t series as my HTPC for playing and backup movies, NO games. From the manufacturers website the MB is ASUS: IPIBL-LB.

Not sure whether is MB is capable of future upgrades mainly HDD and video graphics card.

Please help..
I checked this page (http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/document?docname=c01324212&lc=en&cc=us&dlc=en&product=3658015). The mb seems to be relatively new. Feature-wise it's comparable with ASUS P5E-VM HDMI (but the chipset is G33 without HDMI port). Yes, you should be able to use it for the next couple of years. If you choose GeForce 9500 GS or higher, you don't have to even upgrade the video card in future. Sound is the weakest part as usual. But don't buy a X-Fi card. A better sound card comes later (supporting HDMI audio).

Hi,

This is a great thread, I learned quite a bit. I had a few questions:

1. Do most people keep the PC near their 40"+ screens? If so, how does the fan noise go (I have a Tivo & that fan is kind of annoying).

2. (a little longer):

I have a this media cabinet:

http://www.raymourflanigan.com/catalog/details.asp?ID=7374

I am planning on a 46" Samsung LCD that will be mounted two or so feet above the cabinet - the point being that all wires will be run from the back of the TV, through the wall, into the cabinet (I will put a new outlet near the TV on the wall).

I was thinking of adding two exhaust fans to the back of the cabinet (which will be very close to a wall).

I am concerned about heat in the cabinet. My 1.5 year old son would like the doors open but they need to stay shut so heat can be an issue.

3. I would love to run a cable through the floor & keep the PC in the garage but that wouldn't work with the wife & it would be annoying if we have a DVD to insert.

4. Was there any write up of XP Media center vs say Vista Ultimate?
1. Noise depends on the components you select. If you choose them carefully, noise is no issue.

2. Yup, the heat could be an issue as there is almost no ventilation in the cabinet. Both exhaust fans (rear) and intake holes (bottom?) may be necessary.

I checked this page (http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/document?docname=c01324212&lc=en&cc=us&dlc=en&product=3658015). The mb seems to be relatively new. Feature-wise it's comparable with ASUS P5E-VM HDMI (but the chipset is G33 without HDMI port). Yes, you should be able to use it for the next couple of years. If you choose GeForce 9500 GS or higher, you don't have to even upgrade the video card in future. Sound is the weakest part as usual. But don't buy a X-Fi card. A better sound card comes later (supporting HDMI audio).
Thank you Renethx..

The video card I plan now is Ge Force 512MB 9500 GS, hope this is a decent one.

Thanks again..

Ok, so Ive reconfigured my nonexistent HTPC yet again. Thoughts?

Intel E8400 Wolfdale Processor
GIGABYTE GA-EP35-DS3R Motherboard
Crucial Ballistix Tracer 2GB (2 x 1GB) DDR2 Memory (or something else on the comp list if I see it cheaper)
XFX GeForce 8600GT Video Card (Zalman fan)
LG Blu-ray/HD DVD-ROM GGC-H20L Optical Drive
Undetermined 450W power supply (possibly the Corsair mentioned above)
Undetermined Mid-tower case (Dont like any of the HTPC cases in my price range)
2 x Samsung Spinpoint 750GB HDD for media, a 3rd smaller drive for software.
Will probably add a Haupage PVR and Imon IR at some point later.

Only thing Im second guessing right now is I may want a video card with 512MB memory (Im not planning to game on it, but its very possible still...plus I am planning on having a second monitor output).

Renethx:

I was checking out your recommendation for the premium II rig. I like your mother board selection. I was looking for something with a few high powered pci-e slots. Future proofing. I was wondering if this board would be a good choice for the yet to be released Asus Xonar 1.3 hdav? Or would a scaled down board (less sound) in the same chip set be a better idea?

Ok, so Ive reconfigured my nonexistent HTPC yet again. Thoughts?

Intel E8400 Wolfdale Processor
GIGABYTE GA-EP35-DS3R Motherboard
Crucial Ballistix Tracer 2GB (2 x 1GB) DDR2 Memory (or something else on the comp list if I see it cheaper)
XFX GeForce 8600GT Video Card (Zalman fan)
LG Blu-ray/HD DVD-ROM GGC-H20L Optical Drive
Undetermined 450W power supply (possibly the Corsair mentioned above)
Undetermined Mid-tower case (Dont like any of the HTPC cases in my price range)
2 x Samsung Spinpoint 750GB HDD for media, a 3rd smaller drive for software.
Will probably add a Haupage PVR and Imon IR at some point later.

Only thing Im second guessing right now is I may want a video card with 512MB memory (Im not planning to game on it, but its very possible still...plus I am planning on having a second monitor output).
GeForce 9600 GT is perhaps the best choice for HTPC and casual gaming.

Renethx:

I was checking out your recommendation for the premium II rig. I like your mother board selection. I was looking for something with a few high powered pci-e slots. Future proofing. I was wondering if your if this board would be a good choice for the yet to be released Asus Xonar 1.3 hdav? Or would a scaled down board (less sound) in the same chip set be a better idea?
As for the number of PCI Express slots (x16, x8), P7N Diamond is the best choice for the Intel platform. Yup, if you go with the upcoming HDMI sound card, the bundled sound card is a waste of money. But the price of P7N Diamond is not particularly high compared with, for example, eVGA nForce 780i mb (without a separate sound card).

The midrange/high-end mb also supports dual PCIe 2.0 x8 (if you insert a second graphics card or a RAID controller card, the first slot will be automatically lowered to x8, that does not affect the performance of the first card in most cases).

Hiya,

Could you have a look at my suggested setup and give comments please. I'm wanting to upgrade my Xbox running XBMC with a dedicated HTPC but not with anything too expensive.

Although XBMC has its benefits, I think I might shift to running the HTPC on Vista OS with MediaPortal as I'm not skilled in Linux.

As I'm in the UK, the costs are in pounds using the cheapest I can find on the web:

Case: Silverstone LC20 Black: £74.35
Motherboard: Gigabyte P35-DS3P: £62.41
CPU: Core 2 Duo E7200 S775 2.53Ghz: £61.42
Memory: 2x1GB DDR2 PC2-4200: £25.84
Graphics Card: Gigabyte GeForce 8500 GT GV-NX85T2565
Hard Drive: Samsung Spinpoint T166 500GB HD501LJ: £37.37
Optical Drive: Logitech LGGC-H20L Blu-Ray and HD-DVD - £62.12

I'm still in need of advice on two things. It is likely that I'm also going to run my webserver on this PC so would like it to be on 24/7. I'm therefore looking for a quiet PSU and CPU cooler. Any ideas?

CPU Cooler (with fan):
PSU:

Finally, as I'm in the UK we don't yet have HD over freeview. I'm therefore likely to use the following TV tuner until we get to that stage:

TV Tuner: Hauppauge WinDVD PVR-500 - £66.33 – IT247.com

Many thanks

I'm still in need of advice on two things. It is likely that I'm also going to run my webserver on this PC so would like it to be on 24/7. I'm therefore looking for a quiet PSU and CPU cooler. Any ideas?

CPU Cooler (with fan):
PSU:

Finally, as I'm in the UK we don't yet have HD over freeview. I'm therefore likely to use the following TV tuner until we get to that stage:

TV Tuner: Hauppauge WinDVD PVR-500 - £66.33 – IT247.com
Cooler: stock cooler, Scythe Ninja Mini (fanless), ZEROtherm BTF90

PSU: Corsair VX450W, Seasonic M12II-430

Ok so after a few weeks of researching i decided on my gear. Now for some reason the more i research the specifics of what i bought i feel like i made wrong decisions (im incredibly indecisive) and want to return my graphics card and maybe my mb.

anyway looking for opinions.

1Gx2|CRUCIAL BL2KIT12864AA804
VGA ASUS EN8600GT MAGIC/HTP/512M RT
VID DEV AVERMEDIA AVERCOMBO
CPU INTEL|C2D E7200 2.53G 775 45N R
MB GIGABYTE GA-EP35-DS3R 775 P35 RT
CPU COOLER ZEROTHERM|BTF90 R

Thanks!

Your system is nice and well-balanced. Did you find any problems with the graphics card and the mb? Which graphics card and mb do you look at? There are plenty of other good solutions and maybe I can help you.

Ok complete newby question. So everything is up and looking good. i have the card connected to my tv with vga for now until i get a dvi-hdmi cable. so now whats the best way to get the sound working?...the mb has an spdif output but the graphics card doesnt have an input for it. the tv has 3 hdmi inputs.

any suggestions/guidance would be great. thanks!

Ok complete newby question. So everything is up and looking good. i have the card connected to my tv with vga for now until i get a dvi-hdmi cable. so now whats the best way to get the sound working?...the mb has an spdif output but the graphics card doesnt have an input for it. the tv has 3 hdmi inputs.

any suggestions/guidance would be great. thanks!
The ASUS EN8600GT MAGIC/HTP/512M card has an internal S/PDIF connector (circled in the picture below).

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=115221

Connect it to the mb's internal S/PDIF connector by a cable like this one (http://www.cablestogo.com/product.asp?cat%5Fid=909&sku=07090). A generic DVI-to-HDMI adpater will carry HDMI audio (S/PDIF pass-through in this case).

First off, this thread is an excellent guide. There's tons of valuable info here. Thanks!

So, I'd like to replace my large, loud, and heat generating PC with a smaller, quieter, more energy efficient HTPC. Media would be streamed via Cat5e Gigabit from a server in another room to this HTPC. Of course, it must playback all file types including HiDef. I already have Seagate 250GB SATA HD, Sony BDUX10S BD Rom, AverMedia PCI Combo, and Vista Premium 32 that I will recycle. Here are the new parts I'm considering:

Intel DG45ID (when it becomes available)
Intel e7200 Wolfdale
G.Skill 2x1GB DDR2 800
InWin MTJADE GLS300

I'll be using MediaPortal 1.0.rc1 and MPC-HC with all the necessary codecs for frontend.

Questions:

1. I've seen few uses of the Mt.Jade case. Can anyone provide any feedback as to the heat dissipation abilities and noise factor of this design?

2. Will this configuration allow for a single HDMI cable directly into my HDTV to provide video and audio? I'm currently only utilizing the stereo speakers on the TV, but would like to upgrade to 5.1 system down the road.

3. Cost is always a consideration. I can get all these new parts for around $400 US. I'd like to stick to that budget. I've looked at the 780G model for around the same price.

GIGABYTE GA-MA78GPM-DS2H
Phenom 8450 Toliman 2.1GHz
G.Skill 2 x 1GB DDR2 1066
InWin BT566T.300BL case (Mt.Jade case seems to be Intel specific)

I'm partial to Intel, but would consider AMD if it will perform better.

4. I'm trying to avoid the use of discrete graphics to keep cost/heat/power requirements at a minimum. Since I will be doing ZERO GAMING on this machine, is that reasonable?




Any thoughts or comments?

First off, this thread is an excellent guide. There's tons of valuable info here. Thanks!

So, I'd like to replace my large, loud, and heat generating PC with a smaller, quieter, more energy efficient HTPC. Media would be streamed via Cat5e Gigabit from a server in another room to this HTPC. Of course, it must playback all file types including HiDef. I already have Seagate 250GB SATA HD, Sony BDUX10S BD Rom, AverMedia PCI Combo, and Vista Premium 32 that I will recycle. Here are the new parts I'm considering:

Intel DG45ID (when it becomes available)
Intel e7200 Wolfdale
G.Skill 2x1GB DDR2 800
InWin MTJADE GLS300

I'll be using MediaPortal 1.0.rc1 and MPC-HC with all the necessary codecs for frontend.

Questions:

1. I've seen few uses of the Mt.Jade case. Can anyone provide any feedback as to the heat dissipation abilities and noise factor of this design?

2. Will this configuration allow for a single HDMI cable directly into my HDTV to provide video and audio? I'm currently only utilizing the stereo speakers on the TV, but would like to upgrade to 5.1 system down the road.

3. Cost is always a consideration. I can get all these new parts for around $400 US. I'd like to stick to that budget. I've looked at the 780G model for around the same price.

GIGABYTE GA-MA78GPM-DS2H
Phenom 8450 Toliman 2.1GHz
G.Skill 2 x 1GB DDR2 1066
InWin BT566T.300BL case (Mt.Jade case seems to be Intel specific)

I'm partial to Intel, but would consider AMD if it will perform better.

4. I'm trying to avoid the use of discrete graphics to keep cost/heat/power requirements at a minimum. Since I will be doing ZERO GAMING on this machine, is that reasonable?
The Intel system supports multichannel LPCM/DTS/DD over HDMI, while the AMD system supports only stereo LPCM/DTS/DD. If this is your concern, you'd better choose Intel. Pentium Dual-Core E5200 2.5GHz ($84) will be released on August 10. This should be enough for your purpose. E7200 will be $113 and E7300 (2.66GHz, $133) will be released on the same day.

His recommendations have gotten fairly old now, as he doesn't mention the P45 nor X48 chipsets. Also he doesn't seem to know about Silverstone, Origen, or Moneual cases. So I've had to start research over from scratch. Good effort though.

So far I have it narrowed down to the Moncaso 932 case and one of these:
Mobos (P45) Mem PCIe USB Sound Power
Asus
+ P5Q3 Deluxe/WiFi-AP DDR3-dual-1600 16G 3(16),2(1),2(PCI) 10 ADI® AD2000B 8 Ch HiDef 16ph
P5Q-E DDR2-dual-1200 16G 3(16),2(1),2(PCI) 12 ADI® AD2000B 8 Ch HiDef 8ph
+ P5Q Premium DDR2-dual-1200 16G 4(16),1(1),2(PCI) 14 ADI® AD2000B 8 Ch HiDef 16ph
Maximus II Formula DDR2-dual-1200 16G 2(16),3(1),2(PCI) 12 SupremeFX X-Fi 8-Ch

MSI
P45 Diamond DDR3-dual-2000 8G 2(16),2(1),2(PCI) 12 X-fi Xtreme 268/388w
- X48 Platinum 4(16),2(1),1(PCI) 12 260/357w

No clear winners here. I want integrated graphics (for the case LCD) and lots of room for PCI cards (whether PCIe or otherwise). I don't know which PCI, cards are coming in these days, so it's a question whether more 16bit or 1bit is better.

I really like the idea of ASUS' EPU-6 Engine, assuming that it's not just marketing hype, much less whether it works in Linux.

Of course for PSU it will be a Silver or Gold-rated one on the 80Plus site.

... Will be running MythTV over Kubongo, and HD DVR will be this machine's main role. The PCIe video card will drive my projector, and must have BluRay hardware decode; haven't gotten that far yet tho. I hear R5000 HD support for MythTV is unreliable, but HD-PVR has lots o' problems too. What's a poor girl to do?

I would just like to say in regards to the Antec Fusion 430 listed in the Mid Range mATX build, this case is amazing, I did a LOW END II build except I included this case, and my CPU (E2220) doesn't ever go over 35 degrees C, and is usually 20-25C, on the Stock Cooler.

My friend has a similiar build except he is using a TOWER, and his runs 55-65 degrees C.

Will any of those low cost systems, run any .h264 .mkv 1080p videos without any problem whatsoever?

Will any of those low cost systems, run any .h264 .mkv 1080p videos without any problem whatsoever?

With my low end II build, I threw everything I could at it and have had 0 problems so far. I am incredibly impressed with its performance.

Thanks again to renethx.

How do you connect it to the TV? Hdmi>HDMi cable?

I connect my 8500GT to my Sammy hls6187w via VGA @1080p, however DVI-HDMI can also be used in my setup.

Reading in other foruns i saw some people mentioning that .mkv files doesnt support hardware aceleration, is that true?

If yes, what people do to run such videos?

From reading and advice from folks on this thread I built the system below.
Looks great and sound s good but noticed a problem today.
Streaming lossless wma I noticed audio dropouts about every 3 or 4 songs (no one logged on to the main machine.)
I suspected wireless problems.
Later my son was watching a Blue-Ray movie and noticed drop outs in the audio.
Where would be the best place to start looking?
Thanks

SILVERSTONE Black SST-LC17-B
ENERMAX MODU82+ EMD525AWT 525W
GIGABYTE GA-EP45-DS4P
Intel Core 2 Duo E8400 Wolfdale 3.0GHz
Crucial Ballistix 2GB
SAPPHIRE 100233L Radeon HD 3450 256MB
SAMSUNG SpinPoint T Series HD501LJ 500GB
LITE-ON Black 12X DVD-ROM

Linksys WRT160N Router
Linksys WMP300N PCI
Optical out to Denon 4802
HDMI out to Panny 1080p

Haven't seen this mentioned yet but surely it makes sense to wait for the Intel DG45FC Mini-ITX (http://www.intel.com/Products/Desktop/Motherboards/DG45FC/DG45FC-overview.htm)? Core-2-Duo ready, HDMI 1.3, a board that will fit with ease into those slim HTPC cases, and IGP graphics from the Intel GMA X4500 chip, so not shabby either.

For me, having built two HTPCs lately, one in a desktop form factor, yhe Thermaltake DH-101, so it's not ugly - just big. Too big for my next HTPC, which will have to sit on a living room glass shelf and really look the part. I'd love to use the Silverstome ML-02 for example, but wouldn't want to lose the power of a full HDTV ready HTPC by bailing out to a Via-Mini ITX solution.

What do you think?

EDIT: AVS already has a thread here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1004537). Expected August/September.

boydn1, the first place to start is to see whether the disk is busy. If so, you are disk-bound. Second, you see no problems with video stuttering? If so, I can't help as I'm a Linux type and Winduhs sux.

David O, I hadn't even looked at Intel mobos, but will now, thanks. I see that the X4500HD has hardware decode of mpeg2, AVC, & VCI, but I don't have time to look up whether one of those is BluRay format. I consider hardware decode of BluRay vital, as that's how I'll be storing all my Myth recordings.

I hear ya on the large case. I finally capitulated with the Moncaso 932 giant, but am not happy with the size at all. However sorting out all the mini and micro cases and figuring out all their respective gotchas and limitations has proven impossible for me with what little time I have. I must have at least audio (preferably X-Fi Elite Pro), a couple of PCIe 1bit slots, 10 USB2's, and a PCI slot.

His recommendations have gotten fairly old now, as he doesn't mention the P45 nor X48 chipsets. Also he doesn't seem to know about Silverstone, Origen, or Moneual cases. So I've had to start research over from scratch. Good effort though.

---- snip ----


Actually, if you looked on page 85, post 2523, renethx has posted updates to his 1st page recommendations, some of which include Silverstone cases. :)

As for OrigenAE, I've got a X11 from when they were Uneed, and while it looks good, the backpanel doesn't line up (need to use washers as spacers - what's up with that!!!) and the VFD/IR module is worthless unless your running MCE or use third-party software. Oh well...

A problem of Moncaso 932 is that a longer BD drive hits the motherboard.

- LG GGC-H20N (190mm): does not fit.
- LITE-ON DH-4O1S (170mm): fits.

EDIT: AVS already has a thread here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=14283705&posted=1#post14283705). Expected August/September.
Wrong link?

About the recommended "Low End II"

* CPU: Pentium Dual-Core E2220 2.4GHz Socket 775, $90.
* CPU Cooler: Scythe NINJA MINI, $33.
* Motherboard: abit I-N73HD NVIDIA GeForce 7100 and nForce 630i chipset microATX, $68.
* Memory: Crucial Ballistix BL2KIT12864AA804 DDR2-800 2 x 1GB Kit, $25 (after rebate at Newegg.com).
* Graphics Card: XFX GeForce 8500 GT PV-T86J-YAHG, $67.
* HDD: Western Digital WD3200AAKS 320GB SATA, $64.
* PSU: Antec EarthWatts EA 380 (included in the case), $0.
* Case: Antec NSK2480, $75.
* Total Cost: $422


Can i cut the off board video card and still be able to play 720p/1080p .mkv .h264 files?

Is there any new all-in-one motherboard which is better than this one?

Wrong link?
Link in my post above has been fixed

David O, I hadn't even looked at Intel mobos, but will now, thanks. I see that the X4500HD has hardware decode of mpeg2, AVC, & VCI, but I don't have time to look up whether one of those is BluRay format. I consider hardware decode of BluRay vital, as that's how I'll be storing all my Myth recordings.
It's full HD decoding for Blu-ray discs, as well as for well-encoded .mkv (but still need a top end processor for other mkv files). For sound, lossles LPCM 7.1.

Downside appears to be expense (though prices at about $150 is what is expected and that's not so bad, especially as it may save you a graphics card and a top-end sound card).

I hear ya on the large case. I finally capitulated with the Moncaso 932 giant, but am not happy with the size at all. However sorting out all the mini and micro cases and figuring out all their respective gotchas and limitations has proven impossible for me with what little time I have.
Me too. My only worry would be the heat of a 3GHz processor in a tiny case, though again the newest Dual Core processors seem to wind down nicely when they are not usefully employed. Even my Q6600 system never gets hot like my older Pentium 4 and AMD 64's do.

I believe the ML-02 would be difficult with just a 120W power supply, using a picoUPS could get it to 200W but the case would apparently need modding, not sure I'm really up to that. Also I am off VFD's in a big way as they are just a pain to program nicely, and impossible to read from any distance. So my search continues. If I have to mod, I would rather buy a nice cheap-as-Chinese slim DVD player and gouge the innards out than go with some of the cases out there.
I must have at least audio (preferably X-Fi Elite Pro), a couple of PCIe 1bit slots, 10 USB2's, and a PCI slot.
Well you wont get that with a Mini-ITX board. :)

About the recommended "Low End II"



Can i cut the off board video card and still be able to play 720p/1080p .mkv .h264 files?

Is there any new all-in-one motherboard which is better than this one?
Even with E8400, I saw occasional stuttering when playing back BD movies with PowerDVD. But PDVD is CPU cycle-hungry, and the single-channel memory controller has a bad effect. Results wit MPC is here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=13207153#post13207153).

If you don't use a discrete card, an AMD 780G chipset or GeForce 8200/8300 chipset motherboard is currently the best choice.

Thinking of buying this. Any problems or suggested upgrades?

Intel Core 2 Duo E7200 dual core system
MSI P35 Neo combo Intel P35 chipset mainboard
CoolerMaster Centurion 5 toolless ATX tower
Thermaltake 430w Silent ATX power supply
2Gb PC6400 dual channel DDR2-RAM
nVidia GeForce 8800GT PCI-e video w/512Mb
Seagate 320Gb SATA 7200RPM hard drive
Integrated 7.1 digital surround audio
LG dual layer DVD±RW drive w/NERO
Integrated 10/100/1000BT LAN adapter
12-in-1 media card reader

Thanks in advance

I created my build any ideas/suggestions? Any incompatibilities, necessities, or ways of making it cheaper?

http://secure.newegg.com/WishList/PublicWishDetail.aspx?WishListNumber=6427374

I'll be adding either the ASUS or Auzentech sound card to this build upon release. I'd like to add a HD tuner of some sort (hauppage?) to it also... any suggestions on that? Also the reason why I chose this LG HD/Blu-ray combo drive is because I read this Lite-On drive http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827106227 has problems reading Dual-Layer blu-rays... anyone know if thats been fixed?

Edit: Also I imagine I will be using Vista 32-bit edition.

Thanks

Thinking of buying this. Any problems or suggested upgrades?

Intel Core 2 Duo E7200 dual core system
MSI P35 Neo combo Intel P35 chipset mainboard
CoolerMaster Centurion 5 toolless ATX tower
Thermaltake 430w Silent ATX power supply
2Gb PC6400 dual channel DDR2-RAM
nVidia GeForce 8800GT PCI-e video w/512Mb
Seagate 320Gb SATA 7200RPM hard drive
Integrated 7.1 digital surround audio
LG dual layer DVD±RW drive w/NERO
Integrated 10/100/1000BT LAN adapter
12-in-1 media card reader
Good.

I created my build any ideas/suggestions? Any incompatibilities, necessities, or ways of making it cheaper?

http://secure.newegg.com/WishList/PublicWishDetail.aspx?WishListNumber=6427374

I'll be adding either the ASUS or Auzentech sound card to this build upon release. I'd like to add a HD tuner of some sort (hauppage?) to it also... any suggestions on that? Also the reason why I chose this LG HD/Blu-ray combo drive is because I read this Lite-On drive http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827106227 has problems reading Dual-Layer blu-rays... anyone know if thats been fixed?

Edit: Also I imagine I will be using Vista 32-bit edition.

Thanks
The case supports only two HDDs. Not sure about Lite-On drive's problem.

It's full HD decoding for Blu-ray discs, as well as for well-encoded .mkv (but still need a top end processor for other mkv files). For sound, lossles LPCM 7.1.
Excellent.


My only worry would be the heat of a 3GHz processor in a tiny case, though again the newest Dual Core processors seem to wind down nicely when they are not usefully employed.
Or, put a mobile processor in there. My goal is a green machine that screams. Why wouldn't a board like the DG45ID (http://www.intel.com/products/desktop/motherboards/DG45ID/DG45ID-overview.htm) take a mobile like the X9100 (http://www.intel.com/products/processor/core2xe/specifications.htm) (44w), for example?


Well you wont get that with a Mini-ITX board. :)
Gee, I've just discovered that a micro-ATX is much larger than a mini-ATX! Who would have guessed? Micro is fine with me, so I have more on-board.

I am seeing alot of questions being asked and answered about "How's MY build look?" "What do you suggest for ____" but I am not seeing any updates to the guide itself like which software people are using, Monitors (LCD, Projectors, Plasmas, rear projection. Which sound cards and how they are actually setting up their systems. Seeing all the hardware is great, seeing a general setting up and tuning the system would be a nice addition. What software is the most robust and what are people using?
I have been playing around with XP MCE, Vista MCE and Media Portal and woud like to see info on that,

I have been reading this thread since about a week after it was created (LAST YEAR) and am not seeing any useful updates because everyone is so busy answering questions instead of just finishing the guide. For some reason I am doubting this thread is going to become un-hijacked. :(

The case supports only two HDDs. Not sure about Lite-On drive's problem.

Yeah.. I was kind of worried about that, especially since I planned to use it to store blu-rays. Anyone know of any cases that hold more that 2 hard drives and also work with a microATX motherboard?

Yeah.. I was kind of worried about that, especially since I planned to use it to store blu-rays. Anyone know of any cases that hold more that 2 hard drives and also work with a microATX motherboard?

Is there any negatives to using external hard drives for BD storage?

Or, put a mobile processor in there. My goal is a green machine that screams. Why wouldn't a board like the DG45ID (http://www.intel.com/products/desktop/motherboards/DG45ID/DG45ID-overview.htm) take a mobile like the X9100 (http://www.intel.com/products/processor/core2xe/specifications.htm) (44w), for example?


There have been desktop-style DIY boards which support mobile processors-- the last I can recall are the 945G boards, but there may have been some designed around GM965 as well-- but most in the last couple of years have centered around desktop parts. Power is sipped nowadays, even on desktop parts, so the value of MOTD as a solution has been reduced compared to the "bad old days" where when your Pentium-D was rated at 130W... it actually drew 130W much of the time.

I'll let you know if I hear of any, though.

Is there any negatives to using external hard drives for BD storage?
I thought about that but I wasn't sure if external storage was fast enough to deal with big blu-ray files?

I thought about that but I wasn't sure if external storage was fast enough to deal with big blu-ray files?

Hopefully someone that has experience with BD/HD storage on externals can chime in, as I am hoping to use externals.

USB2.0, FireWire 800, FireWire 400??

I thought about that but I wasn't sure if external storage was fast enough to deal with big blu-ray files?
USB 2.0 is fast enough: 480 Mb/s, BD movies: 54 Mb/s. But if you store HD contents, maybe you'd better go with AMS DS-2350S eSATA 5 bay SATA Enclosure (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817332017) (equipped with SiI4726 (http://www.siliconimage.com/products/product.aspx?id=74) SATA to 5-Port SATA Device SteelVine Storage Processor). The box comes with a SiI3132-based 2-port eSATA PCIe x1 host controller. You can connect up to two boxes (10 HDDs) to one host controller card. Other solutions are here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=12730821#post12730821). Eventually you may want to build a dedicated media server.

thanks again renethx!

Hello all. I'm trying to find a way to get all of the goodness of the new HD Audio formats into my receiver, which is a Denon AVR-2308ci which doesn't decode any of the new formats. It does how ever accept multi chanel PCM over it's HDMI inputs. from reading many posts I've basicly figured that I need to get either a new intel G35 based MoBo or wait for one of the new fancy video cards that will output HMDI and have a PAP. I was happy to find this out thinking I finally had a sollution but then I read a post in this thread saying that Denon receivers won't accept multi chanel PCM from a computer via HDMI input. WHAT WHAT WHAT? Typically I AM the guy that everything happens to but has it happened again? Even if I do get the right software, MoBo, video card, cable, and calorie free cola, will i still be held back by my receiver???

Any insight would be appreciated. All i want is to know that with x MoBo, and or y video card, I can get multi chanel PCM into my Denon AVR-2308ci. Can someone fill in the X and Y for me?

Thanks, Craig

Any insight would be appreciated. All i want is to know that with x MoBo, and or y video card, I can get multi chanel PCM into my Denon AVR-2308ci. Can someone fill in the X and Y for me?
Currently the possible values of x and y are:

- x = G35, GeForce 8200/8300 (AMD 790GX soon)
- y = Radeon HD 4850

Each of them has its own thread and you can search or ask there :

- G35 (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=938473)
- GeForce 8200/8300 (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=990188)
- Radeon HD 4850 (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1041621)

While I'm waiting for my Asus P5Q-E MB and XFX 8600 GT Video Card (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814150258)
I'm wondering which slot I have to connect the video card to..
I'm coming from an older system where I used the AGP.
My first time with PCI-E stuff...so bear with me. :o

Gee, I've just discovered that a micro-ATX is much larger than a mini-ATX! Who would have guessed? Micro is fine with me, so I have more on-board.

Careful, its Micro-ATX and Mini-ITX, not ATX. While I'm not trying to be nit-picky I just want to avoid confusion in the future. :)

Hope that helps.

Power is sipped nowadays, even on desktop parts, so the value of MOTD as a solution has been reduced compared to the "bad old days" where when your Pentium-D was rated at 130W... it actually drew 130W much of the time.
I don't understand. Why (technically) wouldn't the X9100 work in the DG45ID? The X9100 is rated at 44w full-bore, whereas the comparable E8400 draws 65w. Lower structure dimensions and lower power means less waste heat.

And thanks Smitty. (Pfffff... why do they do that?)

Gee, I've just discovered that a micro-ATX is much larger than a mini-ATX! Who would have guessed? Micro is fine with me, so I have more on-board.
Mini-ITX is small 17cm square. Micro is OK but the cases you find (and there are not that many which look really good anyway) are generally not a lot smaller than full ATX - compare the depth of the Antec Fusion V2 case to a full ATX case for example. So I've rejected Micro-ATX as an option.

Mini-ITX is small 17cm square. Micro is OK but the cases you find (and there are not that many which look really good anyway) are generally not a lot smaller than full ATX - compare the depth of the Antec Fusion V2 case to a full ATX case for example. So I've rejected Micro-ATX as an option.

I very much enjoy the form and function of my Fusion V2 :)

I very much enjoy the form and function of my Fusion V2 :)

Antec Fusion, FTMFW!

Hi,

I am having a depth issue with my cabinet. I have a 17" standard mid tower ATX case that is a bit too deep (@ 17"). I think 15" would make it not so snug (in terms of depth).

Any idea how to search on Newegg for a case thats no more than 15" deep?

I am debating on spending $50 on a cheapie case (270 power supply uggg) & $50 on a cheapie Micro ATX mobo & moving my not used in 6 months Dual Core 3.2ghz processor, ram, hd, etc, into that case.

Or spending $400 or so on an newer build. I know the obvious answer is spend 100 but I would hate to spend 100 & then spend 400 on the newer hardware.

Any ideas on a small case?

While I'm waiting for my Asus P5Q-E MB and XFX 8600 GT Video Card (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814150258)
I'm wondering which slot I have to connect the video card to..
I'm coming from an older system where I used the AGP.
My first time with PCI-E stuff...so bear with me. :o
Blue slot. You may use two black slots, but they work at a slower speed (x8, 1.1 x4 respectively). 1.1 x4 is fast enough for HTPC tasks, though.

Hi,

I am having a depth issue with my cabinet. I have a 17" standard mid tower ATX case that is a bit too deep (@ 17"). I think 15" would make it not so snug (in terms of depth).

Any idea how to search on Newegg for a case thats no more than 15" deep?

I am debating on spending $50 on a cheapie case (270 power supply uggg) & $50 on a cheapie Micro ATX mobo & moving my not used in 6 months Dual Core 3.2ghz processor, ram, hd, etc, into that case.

Or spending $400 or so on an newer build. I know the obvious answer is spend 100 but I would hate to spend 100 & then spend 400 on the newer hardware.

Any ideas on a small case?
Check my guide first. Then search in Newegg (http://www.newegg.com/Product/PowerSearch.aspx?N=2010090690&SubCategory=690&GASearch=3). The manufacturers I did not mention in my guide are Athenatech, Compucase, In Win, Linkworld Electronics. They sell cheap mATX HTPC cases.

I don't understand. Why (technically) wouldn't the X9100 work in the DG45ID? The X9100 is rated at 44w full-bore, whereas the comparable E8400 draws 65w. Lower structure dimensions and lower power means less waste heat.

And thanks Smitty. (Pfffff... why do they do that?)

X9100 is a mobile socket (479 pins, no lid), whereas the E or Q series processors are a desktop socket (775 lands, lidded).

Physically incompatible.

Hm archibael, as they are both Socket775 I assumed they were built the same, but maybe not. Odd.

David, the MicroATX cases are smaller in the dimension that counts for me, depth. Compare ATX with microATX:
W H D Drives Slots Cardreader

Thermaltake Bach 17.0 6.7 17.7 5 7 - $100
DH102 17.1 6.0 16.8 3 7 - $430
Silverstone LC18 16.7 6.7 17.4 5vd 7 bay $270
CW03 16.9 7.2 17.2 6vd 7 bay $695
GD01B 16.9 6.7 16.9 6vd 7 5-1 $230
Origen X11 17.1 6.1 16.5 4 7 bay
X15 17.1 6.7 16.5 4vd 7
S16T 17.1 6.9 15.4 4 7 5-1 $700
MonCaso 932p 17.0 6.8 18.5 4 6 5-1 $460

W H D Drives PwrSupp Cardreader Fans
Micro-ATX cases
Origen S10V 17.1 4.5 15.4 2 ATX 5-1 4 x 60mm $369
Moneual 301B --- no info ---
Lian-Li PC-C37 17.1 3.7 14.9 2 ATX - 1 x 70mm $219
Silverstone GD02B 16.9 6.1 14.2 2vd ATX - 2 x 80mm $385
ML01B-R 13.0 3.9 16.7 1 300w PSU 26-1 1 x 80mm $129

... And Rich you can see I've done your work for you. Now I just have to figure out which one I like... leaning toward the S10V.

Any Antec Fusion Black 430 case owners out there? 17.5 deep or 16.3 deep.

Hi,

I was curious if you wouldnt mind measuring the Antec Fusion Black 430 case? The newegg specs vs the Antec specs say that the depth is either

Newegg:
Dimensions&Weight
Height 5.5"
Width 16.3"
Depth 17.5"

Antec:
Unit Dimensions:
- 5.75" (H) x 17.5" (W) x 16.3" (D)

http://www.antec.com/us/productDetails.php?ProdID=15739#

I am playing an inches game to get things to fit.

My current non-htpc case is 17", so I dont really want anything bigger.

Thanks,
Rich

I like that Lian-Li PC-C37 but of course its not out yet... The Antec Fusion Black 430 case is also nice too (ready today)

I still am not sure what makes more sense, should I:

1. Spend $100 bucks on an older system sitting around 3.2ghz Dual Core (100 being on the case & the mobo together)

2. Spend 650-800 on a new system (100 mobo, 100 video, 150 BR DVD, HD (have one already), 200 case, 40 ram, 200 cpu)

3. Spend nothing & use the 17" deep tower I have now.

The problem is the tower I have now is likely setup to have heat go up not sideways.

Any thoughts?

Blue slot. You may use two black slots, but they work at a slower speed (x8, 1.1 x4 respectively). 1.1 x4 is fast enough for HTPC tasks, though.

Ren, that Asus board is an ATX, I think I need to stick with a micro ATX. I plan to only use this HTPC setup with a 46" LCD TV. Does the Geforce 8600 output a signal even if it doesnt detect a source (say the PC boots before the TV is turned on)?

EDIT: No onboard video for me please :)

I just can not see why everyone likes the Fusion.

I think I like it for the size. However if its 17.5 deep & not 16.3 deep, its not for me.

I was curious if you wouldnt mind measuring the Antec Fusion Black 430 case?
W445 x D424 x H146 (inc. feet) mm = W17.5" x D16.7" x H5.75"

I like that Lian-Li PC-C37 but of course its not out yet... The Antec Fusion Black 430 case is also nice too (ready today)

I still am not sure what makes more sense, should I:

1. Spend $100 bucks on an older system sitting around 3.2ghz Dual Core (100 being on the case & the mobo together)

2. Spend 650-800 on a new system (100 mobo, 100 video, 150 BR DVD, HD (have one already), 200 case, 40 ram, 200 cpu)

3. Spend nothing & use the 17" deep tower I have now.

The problem is the tower I have now is likely setup to have heat go up not sideways.

Any thoughts?

Without telling us what components (model number, please) you already have, you won't get a right answer.

PC-C37 accepts only a low-profile graphics card, while you are asking no IGP but GeForce 8600 GT which is full-height ... a bit perplexing.

Hm archibael, as they are both Socket775 I assumed they were built the same, but maybe not. Odd.


Where are you getting that X9100 is Socket775?

http://www.intel.com/support/processors/mobile/core2extreme/sb/CS-028768.htm

Micro-FCPGA. PGA is "Pin Grid Array", and Socket775 is LGA ("Land Grid Array" aka no pins).

Hey guys, I ahve been reading this thread over the past month or so and am very grateful for the great information that is here. I am about to build my first computer and am creating a HTPC based on the information I found here.

My main queston is, if I use a high end video card, I was thinking one the the 4850s, can I skimp on the processor? I found a Athlon x2 dual core 5000+ Be for about 65 bucks the other day and was thinking I could save some money by using that with the higher end card since the card would be doing most of the work anyway, My other components are as follows

2gb ocz platinum ram
MB GIGABYTE GA-MA78GPM-DS2H 770 RT
CASE ANTEC|MINI P180 RT
HD 640G|WD 7K 16M WD6400AAKS
CPU COOLER SCYTHE USA|SCMNJ

Any input or advice would be appreciated. I will mostly be using this to play movies and play occasional games, I am not a big gamer but do enjoy them sometimes. Eventually I want to adda media server but it might be a little while. Right now I only have an older Onkyo reciever with 6.1 channel sound and no HDMI but hopefully that will change in the next few months as full HDMI compatible models drop in price.

I would like my machine to be somehwat future proof, will these parts fill my needs for a couple of years?

My main queston is, if I use a high end video card, I was thinking one the the 4850s, can I skimp on the processor?
Yes, you can skimp on both processor and motherboard, Athlon X2 2.5GHz and GA-MA78GM-S2H are enough. SidePort memory is a totally useless addition. A possible problem of mATX is that there is not enough PCIe x1 slots. If you use HD 4850, a PCIe TV tuner and want to add a PCIe x1 HDMI sound card in future (for HD audio bitstreaming), you are out of luck.

I guess I am too new to looking at home theater through a computer, does the sound card make that big of a differece? I thought htese new cards supported HDMI full HD sound from the BD and between that and a new receiver I would be covered.

The difference between HDMI audio from HD 4850 and that from a new HDMI sound card is:

- HD 4850: 16-bit/48kHz multichannel LPCM, DD 5.1, DTS
- HDMI sound card: full-resolution multichannel LPCM, Dolby TrueHD/DTS-HD Master Audio bitstream, DD 5.1, DTS

If you choose a HDMI sound card, you don't need HD 4850, IGP is enough.

- IGP + Athlon X2: perfect for 1080p
- IGP + Phenom X3/X4: perfect for 1080p/i (if you do deinterlacing with GPU)

I just can not see why everyone likes the Fusion.

It's definitely my favorite mATX design.

2 120mm fans, looks great, simple, built in IR, BLUE customizable VFD!, triple chamber design to separate heat and noise, decent price point.

The difference between HDMI audio from HD 4850 and that from a new HDMI sound card is:

- HD 4850: 16-bit/48kHz multichannel LPCM, DD 5.1, DTS
- HDMI sound card: full-resolution multichannel LPCM, Dolby TrueHD/DTS-HD Master Audio bitstream, DD 5.1, DTS

If you choose a HDMI sound card, you don't need HD 4850, IGP is enough.

- IGP + Athlon X2: perfect for 1080p
- IGP + Phenom X3/X4: perfect for 1080p/i

So if I want 5.1 sound through the S/PDIF for now, can use IGP (probably 8200), and then later, when I upgrade my receiver to an HDMI one, just add a HDMI sound card, right? I don't need a slot for a tuner as the server will have all the tuners.

So if I want 5.1 sound through the S/PDIF for now, can use IGP (probably 8200), and then later, when I upgrade my receiver to an HDMI one, just add a HDMI sound card, right? I don't need a slot for a tuner as the server will have all the tuners.
That's right. Basically any GPU with HDMI out can be used with a HDMI sound card.

so if I understand you correctly, with the configuration I posted earlier I am better off buying a high quality sound card rather than a high end video card?

Thanks again for your help, it is very much appreciated.

so if I understand you correctly, with the configuration I posted earlier I am better off buying a high quality sound card rather than a high end video card?

Thanks again for your help, it is very much appreciated.
Yes. And HD 4850 consumes +50W power compared with IGP at BD movie playback. Ultimately HD 4850 is for gamers (and PowerDirector users?)

Renethx, just wondering when you are going to post the update for mATX systems in post 2522.

I just can not see why everyone likes the Fusion.

I like the Fusion because it has large fans which equal low noise and lots of airflow. Many htpc cases have tiny little fans that would have to be turned way up to equal the airflow of the antec case, and that would cause them to be pretty loud. The fans are also right where the cpu heatsink sits so I can get away with no heatsink fan. The fusion is also a pretty decent price for what you get.

I'm in the same boat as swilde, built my BD enabled htpc with parts listed below, it's worked fine so far. Heck, I even grabbed an e8400 off of eBay back a month ago, haven't bothered to install it.

But I will be upgrading my AVR to to get latest hd sound codecs, so will need a hd sound card at that time. Do these cards pose any new/specific requirements on the mobo?

E2200 2.2GHz (could be upgraded to e8400)
GIGABYTE GA-P35-DS3L
SAPPHIRE 100218L Radeon HD 2600XT 512MB 128-bit GDDR3 PCI Express x16
2 gig Crucial RAM
LG dual purpose HD DVD

so if I understand you correctly, with the configuration I posted earlier I am better off buying a high quality sound card rather than a high end video card?

Thanks again for your help, it is very much appreciated.

If you use HD 4850, a PCIe TV tuner and want to add a PCIe x1 HDMI sound card in future (for HD audio bitstreaming), you are out of luck.
Unless you get the Intel DG45ID (
http://www.intel.com/products/desktop/motherboards/DG45ID/DG45ID-overview.htm), which has built-in BluRay hardware decode for video and audio, and HD sound built right onto the board. Also has a 16bit PCIe, 2ea 1bits, and a regular PCI slot in a microATX.


I like the Fusion because it has large fans which equal low noise and lots of airflow. Many htpc cases have tiny little fans that would have to be turned way up to equal the airflow of the antec case, and that would cause them to be pretty loud.
Reading the review on Origen's S10V, they say it's almost silent with 4ea 60mm fans. Does anyone own one? And there don't seem to be any complaints about 2ea 80mm fans, as are in the Silverstone GD02mt. I am just about to pull the trigger on one of them.

Originally Posted by RichTJ99
I like that Lian-Li PC-C37 but of course its not out yet... The Antec Fusion Black 430 case is also nice too (ready today)

I still am not sure what makes more sense, should I:

1. Spend $100 bucks on an older system sitting around 3.2ghz Dual Core (100 being on the case & the mobo together)

2. Spend 650-800 on a new system (100 mobo, 100 video, 150 BR DVD, HD (have one already), 200 case, 40 ram, 200 cpu)

3. Spend nothing & use the 17" deep tower I have now.

The problem is the tower I have now is likely setup to have heat go up not sideways.

Any thoughts?

Without telling us what components (model number, please) you already have, you won't get a right answer.

PC-C37 accepts only a low-profile graphics card, while you are asking no IGP but GeForce 8600 GT which is full-height ... a bit perplexing.



Hi,

The mobo is a Asus P4C-800E Deluxe, 2 gigs ram, 250 gig sata drive, I have a few different AGP graphics card (X800 I think is the newest).


Is there a low profile Geforce 8600? Or something comperable that wont have an issue if the TV is off when the computer boots?

Also, what are the low profile graphic options these days? Any recommendations?

Thanks,
Rich

I think I like (the Fusion) for the size.
It appears that he somehow does not understand my #2603.

Unless you get the Intel DG45ID (
http://www.intel.com/products/desktop/motherboards/DG45ID/DG45ID-overview.htm), which has built-in BluRay hardware decode for video and audio, and HD sound built right onto the board. Also has a 16bit PCIe, 2ea 1bits, and a regular PCI slot in a microATX.



Reading the review on Origen's S10V, they say it's almost silent with 4ea 60mm fans. Does anyone own one? And there don't seem to be any complaints about 2ea 80mm fans, as are in the Silverstone GD02mt. I am just about to pull the trigger on one of them.

That case is nice but I prefer the separate zones of the antec fusion and again the 120mm fans. On the antec the power supply is over on its own side so that it doesn't have to either suck up hot air from inside the case and so run hotter and/or run its fans louder or suck air in from outside and make the inside of the case warmer. I hate small fans and the noise they make. If you compare equal types of fans a larger fan can move more air at a slower, quieter speed. Just the way it is. I like to make sure my components are cooled well especially with the warm video card and processor I have in my case. So for me I don't think I'll be buying a case with anything less than 120 mm fans any time soon. My 900 case has a 200mm fan :D

That case you linked to is also pretty expensive compared to the fusion, especially when you figure in the nice power supply that the fusion comes with. I only payed 120 for my antec fusion v2 a while back. I don't believe I would get much use from a small 4.3 inch touch screen. I would want at least 8 inches I think.

Different people like different things but for me the fusion was a good value and one of the better designed cases, especially thermally.

So after reading just asmall portion of thread for about the last hour, I am suffering a severe case of information overload.

It really irks me that all of this technology is so hobbled by DRM that it is almost pointless to build a HTPC in the first place.

I mean what a batch of S&$t all of this HDCP crap is!

So if I understand the gist of it, in order to play h264 content my option is to buy this Asus sound card and a decent p45 MB with IGP and I'm set for stutter free 1080p operation?

Should I just wait another year for better hw options?

Would it make more sense to down convert 1080p material to 720p and be done with it?

I remember listening to a podcast from Leo Laporte's site (Security Now) that described the DRM madness that is Vista. Steve Gibson explained all of the DRM BS that was going to be shoved down our throats in order to display any HD content out of Vista. And It’s all come home to roost!

Are there any Linux options out there for HD audio/HTPC that are viable?

John DRM was exactly one of my motivations in converting fully to Debian ten years ago. I am a real estate developer, but I learned it anyway, and now I prefer Kubuntu over everything else including OS X.

After extensive research I am presently designing my first HTPC, which will be DRM-free and I will have complete control over all my content. I've just bought the Silverstone GD02B-mt (takes full-sized cards) and tried to buy the DG45ID but it is simply unavailable yet. I'll have a 750GB Barracuda 7200.11, 4GB RAM, and that's about it. Have yet to decide whether a HD-PVR or R5000-HD for capture.

This will be my media machine (Cygnus, the swan) on which I'll be running MythTV to capture and transcode movies and shows to BluRay format as a DVR, off a Dish ViP211 which I bought on eBay for $126. Will soon buy another ViP211 (second tuner) as soon as I get my system built and running.

I am enforcing my rights under the Fair Use Doctrine as found by the Supreme Court in the Sony Betamax case, which corrupt Republicans tried to take away from us with the Digital Millenium Copyright Act of 1999.

Hope this helps.

It appears that he somehow does not understand my #2603.

I saw that, I think most of those are out of my budget unfortunately. Let me rephrase that, if I get into HTPC, then its in my budget & at this point, i am planning to use it as a DVD player & a web browser (for the most part). I might start using it for more though.

Renethx, just wondering when you are going to post the update for mATX systems in post 2522.
In a couple of days, hopefully. :)

But I will be upgrading my AVR to to get latest hd sound codecs, so will need a hd sound card at that time. Do these cards pose any new/specific requirements on the mobo?
Absolutely no. You can use any mb with a vacant PCIe x1 (or x4, x8, x16) slot.

The mobo is a Asus P4C-800E Deluxe, 2 gigs ram, 250 gig sata drive, I have a few different AGP graphics card (X800 I think is the newest).

Is there a low profile Geforce 8600? Or something comperable that wont have an issue if the TV is off when the computer boots?

Also, what are the low profile graphic options these days? Any recommendations?
Your current system is too old to upgrade (Socket 478 mb & CPU, DDR SDRAM, AGP). You'd better build a new system.

If you don't mind an AMD system, there are two good systems with IGP:

- AMD 780G chipset system
- GeForce 8200/8300 chipset system

If you don't like IGP, you can always add a discrete card. If you stick to Intel, see my recommendation MicroATX Low-End II. Of course the graphics card can be GeForce 8400 GS (G98), 8500 GT, 8600 GT/GTS or higher. 8600 GT or higher is recommended for better deinterlacing. This (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814133222) is the only low-profile (ready) GeForce 8600 GT card. You have to find a low-profile bracket. Noise could be a problem with this small fan. You can find several low-profile fanless GeForce 8400 GS (G98)/8500 GT and Radeon HD 3450 cards.

I did a quick test if the TV is off when the computer boots with AMD 780G and GeForce 8600 GT. Both are OK. I can't guarantee it in your system though.

So if I understand the gist of it, in order to play h264 content my option is to buy this Asus sound card and a decent p45 MB with IGP and I'm set for stutter free 1080p operation?
Sorry, you misunderstand DRM. Nowadays, playing BD movies in PC is pretty easy. If your display supports HDCP, then you can use any of my recommended systems for perfect BD playback.

Sound is the weakest part in PC. Right now the best sound you get from PC is 16bit/48kHz multichannel LPCM. The upcoming ASUS Xonar HDAV1.3 and Auzentech X-Fi HomeTheater 7.1 (expected in late July and September respectively) supports full-resolution LPCM and Dolby TrueHD/DTS-HD Master Audio.

Sorry, you misunderstand DRM. Nowadays, playing BD movies in PC is pretty easy. If your display supports HDCP, then you can use any of my recommended systems for perfect BD playback.

Sound is the weakest part in PC. Right now the best sound you get from PC is 16bit/48kHz multichannel LPCM. The upcoming ASUS Xonar HDAV1.3 and Auzentech X-Fi HomeTheater 7.1 (expected in late July and September respectively) supports full-resolution LPCM and Dolby TrueHD/DTS-HD Master Audio.


Well that is what I was getting at, the HD sound. That's what I want, but I was also speaking to the H264 issues that have been raised here and elsewhere rather than BD playback per se. (I guess I would just use my PS3 for BD playback anyway). There seems to be much discussion about whether or not those sound cards will be able to deliver the goods depending on the implementation of PAP embedded in the proprietary software the cards will ship with.

I guess that's where my frustration begins to set in. I know there will be driver issues with these apps initially, and so it turns into another period where we will become beta testers for this new DRM implementation.

I know that I will definitely wait for those sound cards to show up in the channel and see what people willing to take the plunge have to say about them.

My point with DRM is that it adds an extra layer of complexity t that interferes with getting the full HD content that was supposed to “revolutionize” home theatre.
I mean they have already cracked BD playback for all intents and purposes so what is the point?

This is what killed DVD-A and SACD as well. A disc that I can't separate individual audio tracks out to a server to play back in any order I want in high resolution audio SUCKS. This is not the 60's where you bought albums and listened to one or 2 sides at time on a turntable (yes I know vinyl is making somewhat of a comeback but that’s a different topic) and I really liked having to run 5 patch cables in to my receiver from the player in order to listen to those formats (I know now that this has been fixed in 1.3 HDMI specs but that wasn't an option when I bought in).

Oh well, I guess I can wait some more for what I want to achieve, it just seems to never get there.

Well that is what I was getting at, the HD sound. That's what I want, but I was also speaking to the H264 issues that have been raised here and elsewhere rather than BD playback per se. (I guess I would just use my PS3 for BD playback anyway). There seems to be much discussion about whether or not those sound cards will be able to deliver the goods depending on the implementation of PAP embedded in the proprietary software the cards will ship with.

I guess that's where my frustration begins to set in. I know there will be driver issues with these apps initially, and so it turns into another period where we will become beta testers for this new DRM implementation.

I know that I will definitely wait for those sound cards to show up in the channel and see what people willing to take the plunge have to say about them.

My point with DRM is that it adds an extra layer of complexity t that interferes with getting the full HD content that was supposed to “revolutionize” home theatre.
I mean they have already cracked BD playback for all intents and purposes so what is the point?

This is what killed DVD-A and SACD as well. A disc that I can't separate individual audio tracks out to a server to play back in any order I want in high resolution audio SUCKS. This is not the 60's where you bought albums and listened to one or 2 sides at time on a turntable (yes I know vinyl is making somewhat of a comeback but that’s a different topic) and I really liked having to run 5 patch cables in to my receiver from the player in order to listen to those formats (I know now that this has been fixed in 1.3 HDMI specs but that wasn't an option when I bought in).

Oh well, I guess I can wait some more for what I want to achieve, it just seems to never get there.
What H.264 issue are you referring to?

Part of confusion in PAP is due to the fact that the audio part of AACS rules was obscure at the time of Vista development and hence MS left PAP in an unfinished form. Perhaps we have to wait for Winodws 7 for a complete PAP solution in Windows.

SACD is banned in PC from the beginnng. Not sure about CPPM with a commercial software player/HDMI sound card in future.

DRM mess is a kind of trade off for the open architecture of PC. HTPC can do an amazing number of things that other solutions can't do. Go for a closed system the content provider originally intends, or accept mess and enjoy HTPC ... it's up to each user. And rambling on DRM here is not a good idea, that won't help anybody to build a HTPC (that's the purpose of this thread).

What H.264 issue are you referring to?

Part of confusion in PAP is due to the fact that the audio part of AACS rules was obscure at the time of Vista development and hence MS left PAP in an unfinished form. Perhaps we have to wait for Winodws 7 for a complete PAP solution in Windows.

SACD is banned in PC from the beginning. Not sure about CPPM with a commercial software player/HDMI sound card in future.

DRM mess is a kind of trade off for the open architecture of PC. HTPC can do an amazing number of things that other solutions can't do. Go for a closed system the content provider originally intends, or accept mess and enjoy HTPC ... it's up to each user. And rambling on DRM here is not a good idea, that won't help anybody to build a HTPC (that's the purpose of this thread).

OK I see your point on the DRM, but Vista was supposed to have this PAP support from the get go (then again they were supposed to have 1394b support as well. I have yet to see it [nor do I care anymore as eSATA fills that void quite well]). But when I looked into this 2 years ago (building a HTPC), I kinda threw my arms up and walked away due to lots of the same kind of issues I still see mentioned now. I'd thought we would have been a lot farther along now then we are.

The h264 stuff I was referring to was the stuttery playback issues that some posters were struggling with 1080p material.

Clearly building and maintaining a HTPC is very much a "roll your own" proposition and I do get that, I only wish that there were some better solutions out there for the 1080p and HD audio stuff. I will just have to assess the trade offs involved and decide how much longer I want to wait before I commit to my project.

Your thread is nice info gathering point and I do appreciate your time and efforts in maintaining it, so with that I will end my rant against the evil empire that is DRM and return to the sidelines in my quest for HTPC nirvana :D

Absolutely no. You can use any mb with a vacant PCIe x1 (or x4, x8, x16) slot.

Great!

Guess I'll wait on the reviews for the ASUS Xonar HDAV1.3 later this month.

As always, thanks for the feedback.

John DRM was exactly one of my motivations in converting fully to Debian ten years ago. I am a real estate developer, but I learned it anyway, and now I prefer Kubuntu over everything else including OS X.

After extensive research I am presently designing my first HTPC, which will be DRM-free and I will have complete control over all my content. I've just bought the Silverstone GD02B-mt (takes full-sized cards) and tried to buy the DG45ID but it is simply unavailable yet. I'll have a 750GB Barracuda 7200.11, 4GB RAM, and that's about it. Have yet to decide whether a HD-PVR or R5000-HD for capture.

This will be my media machine (Cygnus, the swan) on which I'll be running MythTV to capture and transcode movies and shows to BluRay format as a DVR, off a Dish ViP211 which I bought on eBay for $126. Will soon buy another ViP211 (second tuner) as soon as I get my system built and running.

I am enforcing my rights under the Fair Use Doctrine as found by the Supreme Court in the Sony Betamax case, which corrupt Republicans tried to take away from us with the Digital Millenium Copyright Act of 1999.

Hope this helps.

Well keep us updated on your progress. I would be interested to see how that pans out for you. Have you considered HD audio in your plans for your system? If so what have you found WRT linux implementation of multi-channel bit streamed HD audio? Is it even an option?

Unless you get the Intel DG45ID (
http://www.intel.com/products/desktop/motherboards/DG45ID/DG45ID-overview.htm), which has built-in BluRay hardware decode for video and audio, and HD sound built right onto the board. Also has a 16bit PCIe, 2ea 1bits, and a regular PCI slot in a microATX.
Nowadays who uses IGP without hardware BD video decode? (Only Intel G35 users!) Hardware acceleration is a norm. Right now HA of G45 is crappy (http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/intel/showdoc.aspx?i=3356&p=5). We have to wait patiently for driver/software player development. Availability of the chipset is also in question (read my post (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=14283791#post14283791); G45 may not be available in large quantities in Q3). Considering them, perhaps October or later is a good time to build a G45 system. Audio decode is done not by hardware but by a software player.

How about hardware deinterlacing of G45? G35 is extremely poor. I don't expect much improvement in G45.

By "HD sound built right onto the board", perhaps you mean multichannel LPCM HDMI audio. This is not a novel feature either. Please read my post (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=13872683#post13872683) if you want to know what other solutions are available now. We don't know yet what software player supports G45's PAP. Without a player, PAP is useless (every BD audio is downsampled to 16bit/48kHz).

All in all, the only advantage of the G45 system over the other IGP systems is perhaps the processor, but processor plays little role in HTPC if HA works. Yep, my opinion could change once I get a G45 mb. :D

FYI the basic unit of PCIe is called a "lane". For example, a link consisting of 16 lanes is usually expressed as "x16". Yup, 16 lanes allows 16 bits to be sent in each direction simultaneously, but nobody (except you) uses an expression like "a 16bit PCIe". DG45ID has one PCIe 2.0 x16 slot, two PCIe 1.1 x1 slots and a PCI slot.

Thanks renethx for your invaluable guide.

The retailer I am going with does not carry the Radeon 3650 Silent, I've been looking at the Gainward 8600GT Bliss instead. How much of an improvement is the 9600GT, as it is 50-60% more expensive?

Any thoughts on the suitability on this? My budget is relatively small right now, but would I still like to be somewhat future proof. Or should I try to muster up patience and and wait for the 9500?

I run Meedio on my machine and mainly use it for TV/Movies and the occasional gaming but need to upgrade to allow for BD/HD.

I've been looking at the Gainward 8600GT Bliss instead. How much of an improvement is the 9600GT, as it is 50-60% more expensive?

Any thoughts on the suitability on this? My budget is relatively small right now, but would I still like to be somewhat future proof. Or should I try to muster up patience and and wait for the 9500?

I run Meedio on my machine and mainly use it for TV/Movies and the occasional gaming but need to upgrade to allow for BD/HD.
8600 GT and 9600 GT are basically identical in video playback. 9600 is slightly better in deinterlacing however. 3D performance of 9600 GT is much better, of course.

9500 GT is released on July 29. The main differences between 9500 GT and 8600 GT are 65 nm vs. 80 nm process, PCIe 2.0 vs. PCIe 1.0. Video playback is the same as 8600 GT (no VC-1 acceleration). 3D performance is about 10% better. If you don't need a new video card immediately, maybe you'd better wait (unless you go with 9600 GT).

Renethx, I am building my HTPC this weekend, or starting at least, since it is my first build I do not anticipate it actually working immediately but now I am looking into software.

I love what I have seen of mythTV but am not a computer person per se and linux is intimidating as are the requirements to use Myth. I am thinking I will probably have to use Vista media center.

I guess my primary question here is if using AnyDVD to remove restrictions from the movies I play will solve all this PAP audio stuff that I really cannot understand even though I have read your entire thread on it? To be honest this all seems well over the heads of the average user.

If I use AnyDVD do I still have to worry about all these protections messing up the audio on my movies?

Also any software advice would be great. This machine will primarily be used for web browsing and movies with occasional games.

Renethx, I am building my HTPC this weekend, or starting at least, since it is my first build I do not anticipate it actually working immediately but now I am looking into software.

I love what I have seen of mythTV but am not a computer person per se and linux is intimidating as are the requirements to use Myth. I am thinking I will probably have to use Vista media center.

I guess my primary question here is if using AnyDVD to remove restrictions from the movies I play will solve all this PAP audio stuff that I really cannot understand even though I have read your entire thread on it? To be honest this all seems well over the heads of the average user.

If I use AnyDVD do I still have to worry about all these protections messing up the audio on my movies?

Also any software advice would be great. This machine will primarily be used for web browsing and movies with occasional games.
Forget about Linux. Go with Vista Home Premium (32-bit).

Every current commercial software player automatically downsamples audio from every source (premium or not) to 16-bit/48kHz, so nobody can test if AnyDVD helps to avoid downsampling right now. And it is debatable if an ordinary listener can discern 16bit/48kHz and 24bit/96kHz.

If gaming is one of your purposes, HD 4850 could be the best choice right now. At least it supports multichannel LPCM HDMI audio and many can hear difference between (even downsampled) LPCM and DD/DTS. It all depends on how much 3D performance you want, of course.

Thanks for your quick responses, your input ahs been invaluable and I am sure I will continue to use it as I develop my home entertainment system over the next while.

Thanks again!

Every current software player automatically downsamples audio from every source (premium or not) to 16-bit/48kHz, so nobody can test if AnyDVD helps to avoid downsampling right now. And it is debatable if an ordinary listener can discern 16bit/48kHz and 24bit/96kHz.

If gaming is one of your purposes, HD 4850 could be the best choice right now. At least it supports multichannel LPCM HDMI audio and many can hear difference between (even downsampled) LPCM and DD/DTS. It all depends on how much 3D performance you want, of course.

Didn't I read somewhere that a hardcore audio/HTPC enthusiast could use AnyDVD, convert to FLAC audio in an mkv container and get 7.1 multichannel LPCM out at better than 16bit/48kHz? Or did I misunderstand?

Yep, that works.

I love what I have seen of mythTV but am not a computer person per se and linux is intimidating as are the requirements to use Myth. I am thinking I will probably have to use Vista media center.

I currently use XP with GBPVR. GBPVR is free and has lots of options and plugins. It's less intimidating than a linux build and more open than Media Center. You can even install over MC, so if you don't like it, switch back to MC.

Yep, that works.[AnyDVD, FLAC audio in mkv to get 7.1 multichannel LPCM out at better than 16bit/48kHz]

I'm not a hardcore audio guy, but to fill out the gray areas and as long as I'm on the subject: What does one need to get the FLAC audio 7.1 multichannel LPCM out at better than 16bit/48kHz once you've made the MKV container with it? I've got a Gigabyte P35-DS4 MB with integrated 7.1 multichannel analog outputs, will that work?

renethx says:
- HD 4850: 16-bit/48kHz multichannel LPCM, DD 5.1, DTS
- HDMI sound card: full-resolution multichannel LPCM, Dolby TrueHD/DTS-HD Master Audio bitstream, DD 5.1, DTS

Is there an underlying assumption in his comment about limitations imposed by protection/players when decoding/playing BD, or does it mean that the HDMI sound card is the only way to get full-resolution multichannel LPCM?

What does one need to get the FLAC audio 7.1 multichannel LPCM out at better than 16bit/48kHz once you've made the MKV container with it? I've got a Gigabyte P35-DS4 MB with integrated 7.1 multichannel analog outputs, will that work?
Analog audio always works. (But onboard analog will nullify the full-resolution FLAC audio.) For HDMI, you will need a HDMI solution supporting multichannel LPCM (Intel G35/G33/G965 [with HDMI out], GeForce 8200/8300, Radeon HD 4850, and the upcoming AMD 790GX, Intel G45, GeForce 9300/9400).

Is there an underlying assumption in his comment about limitations imposed by protection/players when decoding/playing BD, or does it mean that the HDMI sound card is the only way to get full-resolution multichannel LPCM?
Yup, the underlying assumption is that you play BD movies from a BD drive (or ISO) with a commercial software player such as PowerDVD and TotalMedia Theater. Creating your own mkv files with FLAC and playing them with a media player is not included.

Renethx, and all contributors, thanks for this great guide. After reading it for several months, I’ve taken the plunge and will be assembling an X2 AMD-based budget system this weekend. I’m going to be using the Abit A-N78HD mobo, relying on the integrated chipset for blu-ray playback. There are couple unresolved issues I am could use some advice on.

1) what discrete video card for occasional gaming? I’d love to take advantage of hybrid SLI with a Nvidia card, and hopefully the power savings, but maybe I should wait until there are more options, forget about hybrid SLI and go with a higher end Nvidia card, or should I just go with ATI? I just don’t know what to expect with games these days, and it doesn’t help that there are no official system requirements yet for the game I want to play (Fallout 3), which doesn’t come out for a few more months.

2) what software for disc playback is preferred right now? PowerDVD or Arcsoft Total Media? There doesn't seem to be a lot of recent talk about these programs.
Thanks in advance!

Oh, and can you direct me to your instructions on fabricating an optical adaptor bracket for the mobo? I read it a while ago, and now can’t seem to find the post.

Analog audio always works. (But onboard analog will nullify the full-resolution FLAC audio.) For HDMI, you will need a HDMI solution supporting multichannel LPCM (Intel G35/G33/G965 [with HDMI out], GeForce 8200/8300, Radeon HD 4850, and the upcoming AMD 790GX, Intel G45, GeForce 9300/9400).

Sometimes reading this thread is like swimming in molasses - sweet, but tough slogging forward and that permanent sinking feeling when you stop to catch a breath :D

Let's see if I can break this down into the parts that I understand ...

When you say "Analog audio always works" I take it you mean that 7.1 would appear at the audio outputs of my integrated audio motherboard or any other 7.1 audio card analog output. When you say "onboard analog will nullify the full-resolution FLAC audio" do I correctly understand you to mean that it would get downconverted to less than full resolution because Windows gets hold of it? Even the FLAC solution? or is it just a general comment about converting to analog before sending to your AVR?

When you say "For HDMI, you will need ...." let me break my ignorance down a bit further (it's really on display today). If I understand it correctly, when it comes to audio on HDMI from a HTPC, there are some solutions that have the audio on the same HDMI cable as the video, and others that have it on a separate parallel cable to the HDMI video cable. I'm not at all familiar with HDMI audio cards, but it would seem they all would require a separate parallel audio cable?

All of the solutions you mentioned would carry the FLAC solution as full resolution digital over HDMI - correct? Damn - sorry I started this post - I'm too unfamiliar with HDMI audio to even ask the right questions. Point me in the right direction and I'll do some reading to get the big picture. Thanks

I’m going to be using the Abit A-N78HD mobo, relying on the integrated chipset for blu-ray playback. There are couple unresolved issues I am could use some advice on.

1) what discrete video card for occasional gaming? I’d love to take advantage of hybrid SLI with a Nvidia card, and hopefully the power savings, but maybe I should wait until there are more options, forget about hybrid SLI and go with a higher end Nvidia card, or should I just go with ATI? I just don’t know what to expect with games these days, and it doesn’t help that there are no official system requirements yet for the game I want to play (Fallout 3), which doesn’t come out for a few more months.

2) what software for disc playback is preferred right now? PowerDVD or Arcsoft Total Media? There doesn't seem to be a lot of recent talk about these programs.
Thanks in advance!

Oh, and can you direct me to your instructions on fabricating an optical adaptor bracket for the mobo? I read it a while ago, and now can’t seem to find the post.
1) If you use a GeForce 8200 mb and in particular multichannel LPCM HDMI audio (in future in your case?), then you will need a discrete card supporting Hybrid Power. The cheapest one is

- GeForce 9800 GT, released on July 29

and this is the one I recommend. This is basically a 55 nm version of GeForce 8800 GT with the support for Hybrid Power.

2) Either one will work fine. Each has a trial version (30-day, 15-day respectively).

I explained about S/PDIF bracket in this post (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=14239783#post14239783).

When you say "onboard analog will nullify the full-resolution FLAC audio" do I correctly understand you to mean that it would get downconverted to less than full resolution because Windows gets hold of it? Even the FLAC solution? or is it just a general comment about converting to analog before sending to your AVR?

I mean the inferior DAC/OPAMP of onboard audio codec spoils the quality of the full-resolution audio.

If I understand it correctly, when it comes to audio on HDMI from a HTPC, there are some solutions that have the audio on the same HDMI cable as the video, and others that have it on a separate parallel cable to the HDMI video cable.

AFAIK, audio must be always muxed with video.

All of the solutions you mentioned would carry the FLAC solution as full resolution digital over HDMI - correct?

Yes.

This post (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=13872683#post13872683)?

I mean the inferior DAC/OPAMP of onboard audio codec spoils the quality of the full-resolution audio.
Ok, got it.

AFAIK, audio must be always muxed with video.

So how do HDMI audio cards work? Do they accept video and mux it? If so, how do they get the video? I also could have sworn I saw something about using a DVI/HDMI video card (no muxed sound) and an integrated MB HDMI graphics with parallel HDMI cables.

This post (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=13872683#post13872683)?

Thanks. I do appreciate your efforts, and I have read that thread, it's just tough slogging

So how do HDMI audio cards work? Do they accept video and mux it? If so, how do they get the video? I also could have sworn I saw something about using a DVI/HDMI video card (no muxed sound) and an integrated MB HDMI graphics with parallel HDMI cables.
Look at this picture (http://img300.imageshack.us/img300/4431/xonarhdav131024uq3.png). There are two HDMI ports, one is for video in (from the video card) and the other for muxed video/audio out.

Have you considered HD audio in your plans for your system? If so what have you found WRT linux implementation of multi-channel bit streamed HD audio? Is it even an option?
The HD-PVR has an optical input, which flanges in nicely with the ViP211's optical out. So I should have at least Dolby 5.1, or whatever's sent over for the particular Dish show.

And thanks for your input Rene. If there is a better microATX option, please advise. (BTW, I am a real estate developer, not a bit-twiddler, so feel free to correct my terms, but it gets you nowhere unless you provide actual constructive advice)
Ehm, some of us are trying to advance the envelope, while others are just showing off. I don't have time for showboats. I am honestly saying what I think is best. fsck the BS.

Well, I think i am back to square 1. I did some research, I was planning on using the following items that have been sitting powered off for years:

Canterwood mobo - P4C800E
Processor - P4 3.2ghz (not dual core, regular P4).
2 gigs of ram

However, I looked at my invoice from newegg (10/2003) & I think that is just way to old.

I have another old piece of hardware - a Dell Dimension E510 with the following specs:

Intel® Pentium® 4 Processor 630
128MB PCI Express™ x16 (DVI/VGA/TV-out) ATI Radeon X300
& some Dell Mobo.

I think that is probably also too old.

I think I want to run Vista Ultimate & make this a decent PC. I just didnt realize how old my stuff is.

My primary goal was to run Windows Media Center, & use it for web browsing & DVD movies (Email too). I think these are all pretty old & maybe should be retired.

Since the TV will be here before my parts are figured out or ordered, I think I will use it for testing purposes only (see if I like it before spending 800 bucks).

Is the equipment above too old to use?

Thanks,
Rich

Well, I think i am back to square 1. I did some research, I was planning on using the following items that have been sitting powered off for years:

Canterwood mobo - P4C800E
Processor - P4 3.2ghz (not dual core, regular P4).
2 gigs of ram

However, I looked at my invoice from newegg (10/2003) & I think that is just way to old.

I have another old piece of hardware - a Dell Dimension E510 with the following specs:

Intel® Pentium® 4 Processor 630
128MB PCI Express™ x16 (DVI/VGA/TV-out) ATI Radeon X300
& some Dell Mobo.

I think that is probably also too old.

I think I want to run Vista Ultimate & make this a decent PC. I just didnt realize how old my stuff is.

My primary goal was to run Windows Media Center, & use it for web browsing & DVD movies (Email too). I think these are all pretty old & maybe should be retired.

Since the TV will be here before my parts are figured out or ordered, I think I will use it for testing purposes only (see if I like it before spending 800 bucks).

Is the equipment above too old to use?

Thanks,
Rich

Well I run XP Home Edition on a Socket 754 MB with a Athlon 64 3200+ , HD2600XT AGP Graphics Card and I play DVD's, Flacs & MP3's off my unRAID server without problem. In fact with MPC-HC I can play 720p & 1080p Mpeg4 trailers with less than 20% CPU usage (because of the HD2600XT and HWA in MPC-HC).

Your hardware should also do fine though I would guess Windows MCE 2005 would be a better choice over Vista considering the age of your equipment.

I have another old piece of hardware - a Dell Dimension E510 with the following specs:

Intel® Pentium® 4 Processor 630
128MB PCI Express™ x16 (DVI/VGA/TV-out) ATI Radeon X300
& some Dell Mobo.

I think that is probably also too old.

I think I want to run Vista Ultimate & make this a decent PC. I just didnt realize how old my stuff is.

My primary goal was to run Windows Media Center, & use it for web browsing & DVD movies (Email too). I think these are all pretty old & maybe should be retired.
Dell Dimension E510 is new enough for email, web browsing and DVD movies. :) You can buy a cheap, modern graphics card such as Radeon HD 3450/GeForce 8400 GS (G98) as low as $25/$30 for HD contents.

Audio? It depends on what you want.

I think I am going to get a new case, mobo & video card. I am having issues with the Dell (not booting & a flashing yellow power light) & I wouldnt mind using it but something is screwy.

In any event, I think that getting a Micro ATX mobo, that Antec case, & a 8600 card (will this work - http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductReview.aspx?Item=N82E16814145153). Might be the way to go for starters.

I can use the 630 processor & the ram. I can upgrade both if need be later.

On a side note, what are "Low Profile Brackets" for the video card? I saw some mention of it not being included in that 8600 card.

Is that much better than the 8500 card mentioned in the mid system 2?


EDIT: I am a little confused, this video card mentioned in the system 2, XFX GeForce 8600 GT PV-T84J-USD4 doesnt look like a low profile card. Does this fit in the Antec Fusion Black 430? Do we need low profile?


EDIT2: I see that the memory in the E510 is 1GB Dual Channel DDR2 SDRAM at 533MHz (2x512M) - I assume thats not going to work with the ASUS P5K-VM Intel G33 chipset microATX mobo? With the PC 6400 ram (2 gigs for a total of 3)?

I think I am going to get a new case, mobo & video card. I am having issues with the Dell (not booting & a flashing yellow power light) & I wouldnt mind using it but something is screwy.

In any event, I think that getting a Micro ATX mobo, that Antec case, & a 8600 card (will this work - http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductReview.aspx?Item=N82E16814145153). Might be the way to go for starters.

I can use the 630 processor & the ram. I can upgrade both if need be later.

On a side note, what are "Low Profile Brackets" for the video card? I saw some mention of it not being included in that 8600 card.

Is that much better than the 8500 card mentioned in the mid system 2?


EDIT: I am a little confused, this video card mentioned in the system 2, XFX GeForce 8600 GT PV-T84J-USD4 doesnt look like a low profile card. Does this fit in the Antec Fusion Black 430? Do we need low profile?


EDIT2: I see that the memory in the E510 is 1GB Dual Channel DDR2 SDRAM at 533MHz (2x512M) - I assume thats not going to work with the ASUS P5K-VM Intel G33 chipset microATX mobo? With the PC 6400 ram (2 gigs for a total of 3)?

"Low Profile Bracket" is necessary if and only if your case is low-profile. Antec Fusion 430 is a full-height case. So you don't need it. The main difference is

- 8500 GT: deinterlacing is not good
- 8600 GT: deinterlacing is good

besides 3D performance. Perhaps you'd better avoid the CHAINTECH card, I bet its fan is not quiet. XFX 8600 GT is quiet. Or you go with a fanless 8500 GT if you don't care about deinterlacing.

You can use DDR2 SDRAM at 533MHz (2x512M), and 1GB is enough for XP. If you use Vista, you will need 2GB.

HD 4800 series has several features not found in HD 2600/HD 3800 series:

-- Enhanced DVD upscaling (SD to HD)

I have a 4850 in my HTPC using with Vista Media Center. How do I enable the enhanced DVD upscaling? Is this in the drivers done automatically or part of some codec?

Can it upscale any thing else, i.e. divx videos?

Right now I have VMC using FFDSHOW as the default decoder, but when decoding DVD MPEG2 it uses the default Vista one (cause fast playback doesn't work with FFDSHOW).

Look at this picture (http://img300.imageshack.us/img300/4431/xonarhdav131024uq3.png). There are two HDMI ports, one is for video in (from the video card) and the other for muxed video/audio out.

I've been trying to figure this out too but i now understand from your photo link that the Asus card takes the Video from where ever, mixes it with it's PAP audio, and sends that whole lot out through the HDMI. This intrigues me as, in theory, i would not have to replace my MoBo or video card. I have a XFX 8600GT video card which has DVI output. Do you think it would work in this situation? I'm concerned that it's not a HDMI out but since DVI and HDMI are virtually the same I should think it would be fine. DVI has no audio on it which doesn't matter in this case.


Thanks

I've been trying to figure this out too but i now understand from your photo link that the Asus card takes the Video from where ever, mixes it with it's PAP audio, and sends that whole lot out through the HDMI. This intrigues me as, in theory, i would not have to replace my MoBo or video card. I have a XFX 8600GT video card which has DVI output. Do you think it would work in this situation? I'm concerned that it's not a HDMI out but since DVI and HDMI are virtually the same I should think it would be fine. DVI has no audio on it which doesn't matter in this case.

I know renethx will jump in, but I'm going to try to answer based on my current level of understanding, then he can correct anything I get wrong. I see no reason why it won't work. You should get the same video you get now with the audio muxed onto the HDMI with the video.

Going a bit further, if I understand what renethx has said, you still need to worry about finding a PAP player, or you end up with downsampled audio on the HDMI. It looks like all the current players are downsampling audio, even when there is no AACS protection present. I presume this is likely to change.

Just to confirm, with the Antec 430, you do need a Micro ATX mobo but a regular standard graphics card will work?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811129029

"Low Profile Bracket" is necessary if and only if your case is low-profile. Antec Fusion 430 is a full-height case. So you don't need it. The main difference is

- 8500 GT: deinterlacing is not good
- 8600 GT: deinterlacing is good

besides 3D performance. Perhaps you'd better avoid the CHAINTECH card, I bet its fan is not quiet. XFX 8600 GT is quiet. Or you go with a fanless 8500 GT if you don't care about deinterlacing.

You can use DDR2 SDRAM at 533MHz (2x512M), and 1GB is enough for XP. If you use Vista, you will need 2GB.

I was planning on building a HD HTPC out of more top of the line components, but the post BCDouglas got me thinking. If I can build one more or less out of hide so much the better. Will the following components have enough of what it takes:

Asus A8N SLI Deluxe NForce 4 SLI MCP mobo, socket 939, FX60 x2 2.6 Ghz CPU, 4 G RAM, 1 PCIe x16, 3 PCIe x1, running XP sp2.

Thinking seriously about adding the Asus Xonar 1.3 HDAV when released.

And your recommendation for the best video card, fan noise is not an issue for me.

This will only play movies (.mkv files), hopefully at 1080p with lossless 7.1 uncompress audio.

I've been trying to figure this out too but i now understand from your photo link that the Asus card takes the Video from where ever, mixes it with it's PAP audio, and sends that whole lot out through the HDMI. This intrigues me as, in theory, i would not have to replace my MoBo or video card. I have a XFX 8600GT video card which has DVI output. Do you think it would work in this situation? I'm concerned that it's not a HDMI out but since DVI and HDMI are virtually the same I should think it would be fine. DVI has no audio on it which doesn't matter in this case.
As MrFoxer said, you can use any video card with DVI out supporting HDCP. These HDMI sound cards may come with even a DVI-HDMI adapter.

The ASUS card is bundled with a version of TotalMedia Theater that supports PAP, while the Auzentech card is supported by PowerDVD. So we don't have to worry about PAP if we use a correct software player.

I have a 4850 in my HTPC using with Vista Media Center. How do I enable the enhanced DVD upscaling? Is this in the drivers done automatically or part of some codec?

Can it upscale any thing else, i.e. divx videos?

Right now I have VMC using FFDSHOW as the default decoder, but when decoding DVD MPEG2 it uses the default Vista one (cause fast playback doesn't work with FFDSHOW).
Enhanced DVD upscaling is supported by hardware/driver. CCC may have an item that control this function. Not sure about other video sources.

Just to confirm, with the Antec 430, you do need a Micro ATX mobo but a regular standard graphics card will work?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811129029
Yes. If you use Fusion 430, there is no reason why you go with a low-profile card with a smaller fan that tends to be loud.

I was planning on building a HD HTPC out of more top of the line components, but the post BCDouglas got me thinking. If I can build one more or less out of hide so much the better. Will the following components have enough of what it takes:

Asus A8N SLI Deluxe NForce 4 SLI MCP mobo, socket 939, FX60 x2 2.6 Ghz CPU, 4 G RAM, 1 PCIe x16, 3 PCIe x1, running XP sp2.

Thinking seriously about adding the Asus Xonar 1.3 HDAV when released.

And your recommendation for the best video card, fan noise is not an issue for me.

This will only play movies (.mkv files), hopefully at 1080p with lossless 7.1 uncompress audio.
Yes, your mb/CPU has enough power for your purpose.

If you don't need deinterlacing, GeForce 8400 GS (e.g. ASUS ASUS EN8400GS SILENT/HTP/512M) or ATI Radeon HD 3450 (e.g. ASUS EAH3450/HTP/256M) is enough.

For better deinterlacing, I recommend GeForce 8600 GT or higher (excluding 8800 GTS 320MB/640MB, 8800 GTX, 8800 Ultra as these older models lack proper H.264 HA), or Radeon HD 3650 or higher.

Thanks Renethx. You are, without a doubt, the man! I hope I got the gender right. How you manage to maintain your sanity answering all these questions is beyond me.

The ATI 4870 looks like it is right up my alley, so to speak. Are there any image quality issues to consider between ATI and Nvidia? Back a ways ATI had an edge image quality wise (I guess it was a long way back). Anything worth considering now? I have not been able to find any indication, one way or the other. I have a Panasonic 50pz85u if that makes a difference. And, would I be at a disadvantage without PCIe v2? Also, is there any differences between manufactures of the 4870? I was thinking about going with Asus because of my plans to incorporate a Xonar HDAV 1.3. At one time Visiontek was noted for better image quality. Would you have any advice along these lines?

Thanks Renethx. You are, without a doubt, the man! I hope I got the gender right. How you manage to maintain your sanity answering all these questions is beyond me.

The ATI 4870 looks like it is right up my alley, so to speak. Are there any image quality issues to consider between ATI and Nvidia? Back a ways ATI had an edge image quality wise (I guess it was a long way back). Anything worth considering now? I have not been able to find any indication, one way or the other. I have a Panasonic 50pz85u if that makes a difference. And, would I be at a disadvantage without PCIe v2? Also, is there any differences between manufactures of the 4870? I was thinking about going with Asus because of my plans to incorporate a Xonar HDAV 1.3. At one time Visiontek was noted for better image quality. Would you have any advice along these lines?

This thread (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1036539) may be helpful. Many HTPC users choose HD 4850 (and 4870) because of multichannel LPCM HDMI audio. PCIe 1.0/1.1 is enough for HTPC. There is no difference between manufacturers. All HD 4870 models are the identical reference design.

what is deinterlacing?

Deinterlacing is when you untie your shoes and remove the shoestrings.

what is deinterlacing?
Many HDTV programs are 1080i (i = interlaced; each frame is divided into even and odd field fields), that need to be "deinterlaced" somewhere (by the graphics card or HDTV) into 1080p (p = progressive).

Rene (or anyone),

Can you tell me if the analog 2-ch output of an Envy card (Maddog) is any better (or more accurate-bit perfect audio, i.e. non-resampled) than that coming out of a Gigabyte GA-EP35-DS3L? I'm trying to decide whether to pop this card into another machine or use it in the HTPC (for 2-channel analog only).

Operating system is WinXP Pro.

Thanks!

Brian

Enhanced DVD upscaling is supported by hardware/driver. CCC may have an item that control this function. Not sure about other video sources.

I don't see that option anywhere in CCC.

Do you see it?

So if I just make it playback a DVD it should just do it?

Do I need to use any special codec to playback? Does it need to do HW accelerated DVD playback in order do upscaling? (DXVA)

Slightly off-topic - anyone have a recommendation for a home, netoworked, color laser printer?

Slightly off-topic - anyone have a recommendation for a home, netoworked, color laser printer?

I use a OKI C3400n. Its relatively cheap and works great, google it.

Way off topic....

Can you add a fan to a fanless video card? I have the XFX 8500 GT, PV-T86J-YAFG.

I've read through much of this forum and I'm still confused. Is there a way to get video and audio from the pc to the avr with one hdmi cable? I'm sorry I'm thick, but each time I read about another card here and look it up, the specs never come right out and say this. HDMI compatible or adapter are phrases they use. I'm not to keen on spending a few hundred dollars to get almost there.

I'm not looking for the a graphics card to play games at all. I have one in my desktop and it works great for surfing the net:eek:, (I don't play games I get motion sickness, weird) I have many previous builds to borrow from. If there isn't a one card solution then should I scavenge these?

P4P800-Deluxe
P4 3.0Ghz 800
Radeon 9800 All-In-Wonder
Soundblaster Audigy 2 ZS

Intel Core 2 Duo E6600
Asus P5W DH Deluxe
Asus EAX1900XT/2DHTV/512M
Sound Blaster X-Fi Elite Pro

I just want to build a new system that I can put in my entertainment center, transfer movies/tv shows to and watch on my lcd tv. I will probably add a blu-ray recorder and some serious storage for future proofing my wants later.

I'm sorry for rehashing this, I just feel like I keep coming back to the same spot and still lost in the woods just on this one part of getting the movie or whatever onto the screen. I've read many times that the tvs have problems with aspect ratios from the video cards, I don't think that will be a problem. I can hook up my tv with s-video from my laptop with a pair of speakers plugged in to the laptop too and watch a movie, but this is such a pain.

which processor is better in HD video playback?
AMD PhenomX3 8450 2.1GHz or AthlonX2 6000 3GHz?

I've read through much of this forum and I'm still confused.

I know the feeling well:)
Is there a way to get video and audio from the pc to the avr with one hdmi cable?
Yes. I'm going to put myself half a step above you as I know the answer to this question is "yes", but we'll both have to wait for the experts to chime in and fill in details. There are three potential one HDMI cable solutions:

1) a motherboard integrated HDMI,
2) an HDMI sound card that muxes the audio with video from your graphics card, and
3) a graphics card that does both video and audio and sends it out via HDMI.

I'm pretty sure option 1 is available now, but haven't figured out details. I'm positive option 2 will do the job, but I'm not sure of availability yet, and I'm clueless on option 3.

I'm sorry I'm thick, but each time I read about another card here and look it up, the specs never come right out and say this. HDMI compatible or adapter are phrases they use. I'm not to keen on spending a few hundred dollars to get almost there.
I'm not totally sure what solution is good for you, but I'm running a single DVI-HDMI for video and a very inexpensive coaxial SPDIF cable from my DTS-Connect motherboard for sound.

I should probably point you to this (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=13872683#post13872683)post for more info. It has the three options discussed above and some details on pro/con.

1) is there on some Intel graphics G33 boards, on G35 HDMI boards, and the new G45 series. I think it's also there on the Nvidia 8200 or 8400...? I'm forgetting the details.

2) is on its way but not here yet

3) I believe the latest ATI 48xx series of cards can do this.

2) will run bitstream (aka undecoded TrueHD and DTS HD MA), the other solutions will only send decoded LPCM.

I know the feeling well:)

Yes. I'm going to put myself half a step above you as I know the answer to this question is "yes", but we'll both have to wait for the experts to chime in and fill in details. There are three potential one HDMI cable solutions. 1) a motherboard integrated HDMI, 2) an HDMI sound card that muxes the audio with video from your graphics card and 3) a graphics card that does both video and audio and sends it out via HDMI. I'm pretty sure option 1 is available now, but haven't figured out details. I'm positive option 2 will do the job, but I'm not sure of availability yet, and I'm clueless on option 3.


I'm not totally sure what solution is good for you, but I'm running a single DVI-HDMI for video and a very inexpensive coaxial SPDIF cable from my DTS-Connect motherboard for sound.

I should probably point you to this (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=13872683#post13872683)post for more info. It has the three options discussed above and some details on pro/con.

Thanks for responding and especially thank you for giving me some sort of redemption.:D

I've looked at the motherboard option, but whenever I read the specs I'm not totally convinced that the HDMI will output both audio and video. Part of my doubt rises from the reviews posted about the different motherboards by owners on the newegg website. It seems that no one has ever outright said that "Yes, hdmi on this mb outputs both audio and video." Until I read that somewhere I am hesitant to purchase something that may lead to future purchases just to get what I originally wanted. I'm pretty confident that I can eventually get any feature going after trial and error, but only if it is featured. I take it with a grain a salt whenever a review says it doesn't work. If someone does get it to work then I know its possible.

As far as option 2, the Asus Xonar HDAV1.3 seems to be a solution. I'm guessing that any MB with this Asus card and a video card will do the trick. I can't seem to find this card yet, but will keep an eye for it.

I guess I was asking for too much as far as option 3. That is what would be ideal and may be possible with some MB if not a card itself.

I know I can do what you have done and thanks for example, but I was thinking down the road and the possibility to playback some lossless audio over hdmi. Again, maybe I'm wanting too much so early in this shift in technology.

I should be thankful that it seems both of these hobbies of mine, computers and home theater, are merging. Somehow work brewing and drinking beer into this and I'll never have to leave the house!

1) is there on some Intel graphics G33 boards, on G35 HDMI boards, and the new G45 series. I think it's also there on the Nvidia 8200 or 8400...? I'm forgetting the details.

2) is on its way but not here yet

3) I believe the latest ATI 48xx series of cards can do this.

2) will run bitstream (aka undecoded TrueHD and DTS HD MA), the other solutions will only send decoded LPCM.

Thank-you. I have spent too much time looking through Asus MBs. I'm a creature of habit. The first Intel MB seems to fit the bill in their description. The DG45FC may be on my short list.

http://www.intel.com/products/desktop/motherboards/DG45FC/DG45FC-overview.htm

I'll have to research this, as I'm not familiar with the mini-itx form factor and will have to rethink some of the cases I've been eyeballing.

As far as the ATI 4800 series, the pictures on the website look like DVI connections. Are the adapters, DVI to HDMI, the same as if it were just HDMI?

One last thing, I'd prefer bitstreamed uncoded audio to let my avr handle the format.

Thanks again:)

Renethx,

I want to upgrade my video card to a 4850 but there are several ATI 4850 options. Do you know which is the quietest? My HTPC is currently quieter than my DirecTV HD DVR so I don't want too much noise from the fan on the card.

Will the 380 watt PS in my Antec 2480 run one? Are there any that won't fit the case?

Am I right that they will all pass audio through DVI/HDMI?


Thanks for the great info!

Thanks for responding and especially thank you for giving me some sort of redemption.:D

I jumped in here a few days ago to try to get up to speed on HDMI and sound. I made it a few steps forward with the help of renethx and others, but I should probably thank you, as thinking about your question helped me organize what I'd learned, and sent me back to fill in some gaps. I think archibael's short post was a really helpful summary of where things are now.

I've looked at the motherboard option, but whenever I read the specs I'm not totally convinced that the HDMI will output both audio and video. Part of my doubt rises from the reviews posted about the different motherboards by owners on the newegg website. It seems that no one has ever outright said that "Yes, hdmi on this mb outputs both audio and video." Until I read that somewhere I am hesitant to purchase something that may lead to future purchases just to get what I originally wanted.

Yes, a lot of posts focus on a detail, but when you're not up to speed, the underlying assumptions are not immediately apparent and you're left in the dark.

As far as option 2, the Asus Xonar HDAV1.3 seems to be a solution. I'm guessing that any MB with this Asus card and a video card will do the trick. I can't seem to find this card yet, but will keep an eye for it.

And that option seems to be the only one available for bitstreaming full res audio, and even that seems iffy due to the need for players to support PAP. I'm not sure why the MB solution won't do it. Presumably it's a driver issue and lack of PAP. Whether that might change over time, i.e., whether a future driver might later allow bitstreamed full res audio from a MB isn't clear either.

Finally, I'm still unclear about whether PowerDVD (which I understand currently downconverts audio even for unprotected content) might stop doing that in version 8.5. Then would all of the 3 options permit bitstreaming after AACS protection was removed with AnyDVD? (No wonder I'm still confused -it's like trying to climb a waterfall as the torrent of data, details and change tries to push me down to the bottom again:D

As far as the ATI 4800 series, the pictures on the website look like DVI connections. Are the adapters, DVI to HDMI, the same as if it were just HDMI?

One last thing, I'd prefer bitstreamed uncoded audio to let my avr handle the format.

Thanks again:)

The ATI cards have an included DVI-HDMI adapter (not a standard one) which has an internal circuit that tells the card to send sound because the output is HDMI.

I've read through much of this forum and I'm still confused. Is there a way to get video and audio from the pc to the avr with one hdmi cable?

Intel G35 mobo (now)
Intel G45 mobo (soon)
nVidia 8200/8300 AMD mobo (now)
Radeon 4850/4870 gfx card
nVidia 9200/9300 Intel mobo (soon)

All support full HD audio and HD video over one HDMI cable.

There are also a couple of pass-through HDMI audio cards coming out at some point that let you use any gfx card you want.

Hi,

I think I am revamping my goals.

I would like to:

Play light gaming (I have a Xbox 360 so probably no gaming)
Email
Web Browsing
DVD movies (probably regular DVDS with BlueRay in the future).
Run Vista Ultimate on the PC

E7200 Processor
2 gigs 800 ram
ASUS P5K-VM (anything better thats a G35)?
Fusion 430
XFX PVT84JUSD4 GeForce 8600 GT 256MB 128-bit GDDR3 PCI Express x16 HDCP Ready SLI Supported Video Card - Retail

In terms of noise, I will use the stock processor fan (I guess its quieter), no OC'ing for me. Does this look pretty good?

I might upgrade to a ATI 4850 at some later point (if I get into this).

Rene (or anyone),

Can you tell me if the analog 2-ch output of an Envy card (Maddog) is any better (or more accurate-bit perfect audio, i.e. non-resampled) than that coming out of a Gigabyte GA-EP35-DS3L?
The sound card is better.

I don't see that option anywhere in CCC.

Do you see it?

So if I just make it playback a DVD it should just do it?

Do I need to use any special codec to playback? Does it need to do HW accelerated DVD playback in order do upscaling? (DXVA)
Maybe there is no option in CCC. You don't need a special codec. It's automatic.

Can you add a fan to a fanless video card? I have the XFX 8500 GT, PV-T86J-YAFG.
Yes. Check the compatibilitiy list of the fan before you buy it.

Dell Canada has the Hauppage HD-PVR on sale for $199 with free shipping until tomorrow.

http://accessories.dell.com/sna/products/TV_Tuners_and_Video_Editing/productdetail.aspx?c=ca&l=en&s=dhs&cs=cadhs1&sku=A1753033

One last thing, I'd prefer bitstreamed uncoded audio to let my avr handle the format.Assuming "uncoded" means "undecoded", ASUS Xonar HDAV1.3/Auzentech Auzen H-Fi HomeTheater 7.1 sound cards may be the only solution for now.
Assuming "uncoded" means "undecoded", ASUS Xonar HDAV1.3/Auzentech Auzen H-Fi HomeTheater 7.1 sound cards may be the only solution.

Renethx,

I want to upgrade my video card to a 4850 but there are several ATI 4850 options. Do you know which is the quietest? My HTPC is currently quieter than my DirecTV HD DVR so I don't want too much noise from the fan on the card.

Will the 380 watt PS in my Antec 2480 run one? Are there any that won't fit the case?

Am I right that they will all pass audio through DVI/HDMI?


Thanks for the great info!
So far every HD 4850 card (512MB) uses the same reference card/cooler design. That means basically every card is equally quiet.

380W is enough. Every 512MB card fits NSK2480.

Yes, HD 4850 passes audio through DVI with the bundled DVI-HDMI dongle.

Hi,

I think I am revamping my goals.

I would like to:

Play light gaming (I have a Xbox 360 so probably no gaming)
Email
Web Browsing
DVD movies (probably regular DVDS with BlueRay in the future).
Run Vista Ultimate on the PC

E7200 Processor
2 gigs 800 ram
ASUS P5K-VM (anything better thats a G35)?
Fusion 430
XFX PVT84JUSD4 GeForce 8600 GT 256MB 128-bit GDDR3 PCI Express x16 HDCP Ready SLI Supported Video Card - Retail

In terms of noise, I will use the stock processor fan (I guess its quieter), no OC'ing for me. Does this look pretty good?

I might upgrade to a ATI 4850 at some later point (if I get into this).
Looks good. If you don't use onboard video, G33 and G35 are basically identical. The difference between ASUS P5K-VM and P5E-VM HDMI is the southbridge ICH9 (4 SATA ports) vs. ICH9R (6 SATA ports, RAID).

I'm still deciding (and saving money) for my HTPC, now that my Samsung LCD screen has finally arrived. In my search I have stumbled upon a few more things I can't really seem to figure out or decide on:

1. I want to use the HTPC for HD material as well as games. I'll probably go for an ATI 4850 (Saphire I think), but I was wondering if it will fit in the Antec Fusion V2 case, as it seems to be slightly lower than other cases.

2. renethx recommended a E8400 as the processor earlier in this thread (when compared with a quad core), but I noticed the price of the E8500 is only about 15 euro's more than the E8400. Worth the extra bucks, or just overclock or leave the 0.16 GHz?

3. As I will be going for an Intel Core 2 Duo CPU, I will need a socket 775 mobo, which has to have a mATX form factor. This somewhat limits the available motherboards. I'm wondering which one would be best, the G33, G35 or G45 chipset? And which manufacturer or model would be best for my situation (HD video and gaming)?

If anyone can help me answer any of these questions, I would be very much obliged... :)

1. C'mon over to this thread (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=14351931), where we are eagerly anticipating the newest Intel mobo. It eliminates the need for a video card.

2. I would spring for the E8500 if I were you.

Even when gaming?

For gaming, please find another forum, you violence addict. This is the AV forum.

Guys, I have a question about using an RF remote to control an HTPC.

I have an URC brand RF remote and this basestation:
http://www.universalremote.com/produ...l.php?model=42 (http://www.universalremote.com/product_detail.php?model=42)

The whole thing will be hidden in a cabinet.

What is the best way to get this to control an HTPC?

The basestation has mono-mini-jack serial outputs for emitters. Is there any way to connect the output to an HTPC without converting back to IR? Is there something out there that would allow the RF basestation output to be connected to a USB port or to the motherboard IR header?

I'm still deciding (and saving money) for my HTPC, now that my Samsung LCD screen has finally arrived. In my search I have stumbled upon a few more things I can't really seem to figure out or decide on:

1. I want to use the HTPC for HD material as well as games. I'll probably go for an ATI 4850 (Saphire I think), but I was wondering if it will fit in the Antec Fusion V2 case, as it seems to be slightly lower than other cases.

2. renethx recommended a E8400 as the processor earlier in this thread (when compared with a quad core), but I noticed the price of the E8500 is only about 15 euro's more than the E8400. Worth the extra bucks, or just overclock or leave the 0.16 GHz?

3. As I will be going for an Intel Core 2 Duo CPU, I will need a socket 775 mobo, which has to have a mATX form factor. This somewhat limits the available motherboards. I'm wondering which one would be best, the G33, G35 or G45 chipset? And which manufacturer or model would be best for my situation (HD video and gaming)?

If anyone can help me answer any of these questions, I would be very much obliged... :)

1. HD 4850 fits in Fusion 430.

2. Either one is OK.

3. As you don't use onboard video, either of G33, G35, G45 is fine. It looks like most G45 mATX mbs are not available in Q3 and there is no particular reason to wait for G45. Go for ASUS P5K-VM (G33; 1 x PCIe x1 slot, 4 SATA ports) or P5E-VM HDMI (G35; 2 x PCIe x2 slot, 6 SATA ports, RAID) and you won't regret.

I don't recommend an Intel brand motherboard because it lacks advanced BIOS settings such as adjustment for FSB frequency, CPU multiplier, CPU/NB/FSB voltage and even DRAM voltage, all of which are basic IMO.

For gaming, please find another forum, you violence addict. This is the AV forum.

I'm not sure if you are joking or not but his question is very legit. This is the HTPC forum and gaming is one aspect of HTPC.

1. C'mon over to this thread (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=14351931), where we are eagerly anticipating the newest Intel mobo. It eliminates the need for a video card.

2. I would spring for the E8500 if I were you.

The G35 already does this, just no PAP (and a couple other issues).

The G45 should be nicer when it comes out, whenever that eventually is.

haha, gaming isn't just violence you know..

I very much enjoy racing games or adventure games to be honest :)

And thanks for the info renethx, I guess I'll go for the G35 one then..

I just imagined what a disaster my HTPC would have been if I hadn't found this thread... usefulness+++ :cool:

I'm not sure if you are joking or not but his question is very legit. This is the HTPC forum and gaming is one aspect of HTPC.
No it does not encompass HTPC. And I am not joking

This "gaming" is social conditioning which dulls normal aversion to adverse events. It teaches violence as a legitimate response, and is now creating a massive underclass, which normal people must then oppose and oppress.

See it as you like kid, LOL!

I guess "home theater" imposes false realities whereby participant's normal rationale thought processes are compromised.....

When comparing that Nvidia 8600 GT, is it comparable to the ATI 3870? I am a little more partal to ATI boards (for no reason other than I own more ATI cards) but they are both in the same price range.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814125086&CMP=AFC-C8Junction

There is a difference with htpc and "htpc" gaming. I see it in my own household. Too much focus/attention/time spent NOT paying attention to daily life, will be detrimental. But that's a political thread.

How quiet is the CPU Cooler: Scythe NINJA MINI? I ask because I just plugged my old Socket 478 stock intel 3.2ghz setup in & that sucker is loud!

To loud to leave on 24/7 like I would like to. Is the Scythe so quiet you wouldnt notice it?

When comparing that Nvidia 8600 GT, is it comparable to the ATI 3870? I am a little more partal to ATI boards (for no reason other than I own more ATI cards) but they are both in the same price range.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814125086&CMP=AFC-C8Junction
The competing product of GeForce 8600 GT is Radeon HD 3650 (in both price and performance).

- Radeon HD 3870: $100 (after rebate)
- Radeon HD 3650: $63 (ASUS SILENT; after rebate)
- GeForce 8600 GT: $63 (XFX; after rebate)

You will see difference between 3870 and 3650/8600 in post-processing and 3D performance.

How quiet is the CPU Cooler: Scythe NINJA MINI? I ask because I just plugged my old Socket 478 stock intel 3.2ghz setup in & that sucker is loud!

To loud to leave on 24/7 like I would like to. Is the Scythe so quiet you wouldnt notice it?
The fan bundled with NINJA MINI is very quiet. You even don't need the fan if you use NINJA MINI in Fusion 430/NSK2480.

The fan bundled with NINJA MINI is very quiet. You even don't need the fan if you use NINJA MINI in Fusion 430/NSK2480.

I noticed it is socket 478 compatible, so I just ordered it to see how it will sound with my current setup - which seems to run XP MCE pretty smoothly.

Thanks!

OK, so here is another question. I just turned on my current system (P4C-800 Asus Canterwood board, midtower case on its side, P3.2ghz P4) on without a CPU fan turned on (AKA Mini Ninja with no fan on) and its still way to loud.

It could be the case & other items (not exactly soundproofed).

I am going to order the Antec Fusion 430 you mentioned as my HTPC case.

This might be a huge waste of money but... I think i want to try This DDR400 Mobo (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813138262). Its 70 bucks shipped & probably a waste but considering I wanted that CPU fan & that case, it was either 70 for the mobo to work for the parts I have or a new Video, Mobo, Ram, processor running $375 (with a few rebates). I figured gambling 70 vs a definate 375 wasnt too bad.

No it does not encompass HTPC. And I am not joking

This "gaming" is social conditioning which dulls normal aversion to adverse events. It teaches violence as a legitimate response, and is now creating a massive underclass, which normal people must then oppose and oppress.

See it as you like kid, LOL!

I think your are wrong, on both points. 1) several people use their HTPC as MAME boxes, in addition to other things (music, pictures, etc), and who wouldn't want to game on a big screen with 5.1 or 7.1 sound? and 2) your stating your opinion, which is fine, but don't present it as fact. It's like saying playing D&D teaches you how to cast spells.

OK, so here is another question. I just turned on my current system (P4C-800 Asus Canterwood board, midtower case on its side, P3.2ghz P4) on without a CPU fan turned on (AKA Mini Ninja with no fan on) and its still way to loud.

It could be the case & other items (not exactly soundproofed).

I am going to order the Antec Fusion 430 you mentioned as my HTPC case.

This might be a huge waste of money but... I think i want to try This DDR400 Mobo (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813138262). Its 70 bucks shipped & probably a waste but considering I wanted that CPU fan & that case, it was either 70 for the mobo to work for the parts I have or a new Video, Mobo, Ram, processor running $375 (with a few rebates). I figured gambling 70 vs a definate 375 wasnt too bad.

Buying an AGP mb is not a good idea (then you will need a modern AGP card). You can use CPU (Pentium 4 630 LGA775) and RAM (DDR2-533 2 x 512MB) from Dell Dimension E510. So what you need are only

- mb (P5K-VM, $97)
- graphics card (XFX 8600 GT, $67)

If you want to save money, go with

- GIGABYTE GA-G31M-S2L (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128078), $60
- ASUS EN8600GT OC GEAR/HTDP/256M (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814121095), $45 after rebate

Basically there is no performance difference between G31 and G33.

Is the only difference between the ATI 3870 and 4870 the sound capability of the 4870? Or does the 4870 perform better on the video as well?


Edit - NVM - I looked them up and the 4870 is way better. Tnx anyway.

Is the only difference between the ATI 3870 and 4870 the sound capability of the 4870? Or does the 4870 perform better on the video as well?
See this post (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=14229198#post14229198).

I think your are wrong, on both points. 1) several people use their HTPC as MAME boxes, in addition to other things (music, pictures, etc), and who wouldn't want to game on a big screen with 5.1 or 7.1 sound? and 2) your stating your opinion, which is fine, but don't present it as fact. It's like saying playing D&D teaches you how to cast spells.

I LOVE MAME!

I have backup's of all my games saved to my HTPC, so I use emulation/roms for Atari 2600, Atari Jaguar, Game Boy Advance, MAME, MESS (classic systems like IntelliVision and ColecoVision), Neo Geo, NES, N64, Nintendo DS, Nintendo Game Cube, Panasonic 3DO, Sega Dreamcast, Sega Genesis, Sega Saturn, Sony PlayStation, Sony PlayStation 2, Sony PSP, Super Nintendo, Turbo Grafx 16, Virtual Boy, and XBox.

Oh, and of course FRETS ON FIRE!

One System to Rule them All. The HTPC.

The downside is, for emulation to be legal, you have to actually own the games/systems...

Luckily for me, I have probably the largest game collection on AVS.

...and my photobucket link shows it... All Mint in Box condition as well :)

For gaming, please find another forum, you violence addict. This is the AV forum.


No it does not encompass HTPC. And I am not joking

This "gaming" is social conditioning which dulls normal aversion to adverse events. It teaches violence as a legitimate response, and is now creating a massive underclass, which normal people must then oppose and oppress.

See it as you like kid, LOL!

Gaming is most definitely on the top 5 list of what users do with their HTPC besides browse the web, play their media, and watch and record TV. If you think gaming is not a part of the HTPC then you are very misinformed. Also you should do some more research, videogames are not centered around, nor do they promote violence. If there is violence in a videogame you should be happy, people can get their kicks killing people in a virtual world as opposed to the real world. I grew up with videogames and I turned out alright, I paid for and graduated from a Big 10 college with an engineering degree and I have no criminal record.

Second of all, you seem to have a very negative opinion of videogames. Videogames are just like any other form of entertainment such as reading, watching movies, or watching TV. If you don't think there is violence in books, television, movies, or even music you are very wrong. This underclass you talk about, please expand on what you mean. Am I to believe that people who play videogames are inferior to those who do not? That is such a biased statement it blows my mind.

Who are you to come in here and tell someone that they are not allowed to discuss videogames in relation to their PC? Who are you to take a higher ground because you do not play videogames? Who are you to call a stranger a violence addict because they play videogames?

I might be a "kid" by your standards, and I might not write as well as you do, but man, you have got some serious personal issues you should deal with before posting on online forums.

Please get out of this thread and this part of AVS if you have nothing positive to contribute.

Hello everyone,
Can someone point me to the latest guide?
Thanks

Another point I'd like to make, without getting further off track from this great thread, is Flight Simulation falls under the category of gaming, as I'm sure many here use their HTPC's for Simulation...

I certainly wouldn't want to spend thousands of dollars crashing airplanes when I could practice on my Flight Simulator via my HTPC.

While many games do have violence (as well as TV, Movies, Books, and, oh... the Iraq War I fought in back in 03 when the ground war started), it is merely a form of entertainment that people are entitled to, without criticism.

I guess I don't understand being against one form of entertainment that is simply a story that allows interaction (Video Game), opposed to a story that doesn't (Movie).

...But everyone is entitled to their own opinions and views, but there is no need to critisize.

I'm not sure where you got these statistics of creating a massive underclass... And also, people who play video games aren't normal? The social norm in this day in age is that video games are socially accepted.

So technically, "we" are the norm.

Hello everyone,
Can someone point me to the latest guide?
Thanks

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=940972&page=85

Gaming is most definitely on the top 5 list of what users do with their HTPC
...
Also you should do some more research, videogames are not centered around, nor do they promote violence.
What a ridiculous assertion, to claim that Grand Theft Auto, Crysis, Call of Duty, etc are not centered around nor promote violence. Most of us can not understand how you could possibly believe that. I notice that only two of you trogs are supporting this view, albeit quite noisily, as expected.


This underclass you talk about, please expand on what you mean. Am I to believe that people who play videogames are inferior to those who do not? That is such a biased statement it blows my mind.

Not going to explain it, as we obviously come from different cultures, and this isn't the place anyway. I am saying that you are voluntarily making yourself a new underclass, which the rest of us will then happily marginalize.

What a ridiculous assertion, to claim that ALL video games and video gamers are centered around and promote violence. Most of US can not understand how YOU could possibly believe that.

You called me a violence addict because of a video game inquiry?

I am glad we come from "different cultures".

I would NEVER want to be so closeminded, judgemental, and ignorant.

You should realize there are thousands of video games which do not have or promote violence, and that this is not some "new underclass of gamers". Video Games have been around since the 70's.

You will find alot more violence on the evening news than you will in a game of PONG.

It is the parents responsibility to decide what games their kids play. I'm not saying to let 10 year olds play Call of Duty or Grand Theft Auto. But the same responsibility that falls under the rating system for movies applies to games.

Don't boycott movies because of Natural Born Killers or Pulp Fiction. So don't boycott Video Games because of Call of Duty and Grand Theft Auto.

Others aren't being rude by disrupting this thread like I have, but I can assure you the majority agree's with me. So I am sure I am not the only "trog" supporting this view.

renethx, I apologize for disrupting your thread, and I will end my comments on this subject now.

I couldn't have responded better gunbunnysoulja. Thank you. That is all.

Maybe there is no option in CCC. You don't need a special codec. It's automatic.

So does that mean it will upscale all content or only things that are hardware accelerated playback? ie only MPEG2, VC1, H264?

Or will DIVX videos also benefit?

It may be a decade before the data is really in on some of the new violent gaming and it's psychological effects, so it's not really worth arguing about now. Since many people do use htpc's for gaming on their home theaters, it is certainly on topic whether or not it is a bad thing for society.

So, is an 8300 mb with IGP and phenom 9550 good enough for quality deinterlacing?

So does that mean it will upscale all content or only things that are hardware accelerated playback? ie only MPEG2, VC1, H264?

Or will DIVX videos also benefit?
I have been away from HD 4850. HA and post-processing are done in different places (UVD, stream processors). So perhaps upscaling has nothing to do with HA. Need to test.

So, is an 8300 mb with IGP and phenom 9550 good enough for quality deinterlacing?
No. It looks like the formula "IGP+Phenom=good deinterlacing" applies only to the AMD chipsets. I know some other review sites got different results from mine ...

Back in December I put together my HTPC based on the Mid-range ATX configuration in this wonderful guide. At that time, the Samsung Spinpoint hard drives seemed to be preferred, and almost every configuration suggested EITHER an ATI Radeon OR a GeForce graphics card. I've been very happy with two Samsung drives and the ATI 2600XT graphics.

Now a relative wants me to build a system for her use, and I see that Western Digital drives are now listed in almost every configuration, and only Geforce graphics cards are recommended. Is there a reason for these changes that I've missed over the last few months? I've continued to read the thread, but could have missed something. Searching the thread didn't bring up any answer to my question either.

Thanks again, Renethx, for this invaluable guide!

renethx
Thanks. What is the minimum requirement for high quality deinterlacing with amd mb with on board graphics and cpu at this point, or do we still have to go with a separate gpu?
If I have to go with one of the upcoming sound cards for the audio benefits the overall cost is now too high. May as well get another ps3 or wait 6 months?

Back in December I put together my HTPC based on the Mid-range ATX configuration in this wonderful guide. At that time, the Samsung Spinpoint hard drives seemed to be preferred, and almost every configuration suggested EITHER an ATI Radeon OR a GeForce graphics card. I've been very happy with two Samsung drives and the ATI 2600XT graphics.

Now a relative wants me to build a system for her use, and I see that Western Digital drives are now listed in almost every configuration, and only Geforce graphics cards are recommended. Is there a reason for these changes that I've missed over the last few months? I've continued to read the thread, but could have missed something. Searching the thread didn't bring up any answer to my question either.

Thanks again, Renethx, for this invaluable guide!
Lately I saw lots (actually a dozen or so) of negative user reviews on Samsung HD501LJ (very high failure rate). It's far from reliable statistical one, but I chose WD for safety.

The latest recommendations are page 85 (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=940972&page=85). GeForce vs. Radeon HD partly depends on each user's environment. I am using several cards of both brands and they are equally good (with several minor glitches).

renethx
Thanks. What is the minimum requirement for high quality deinterlacing with amd mb with on board graphics and cpu at this point, or do we still have to go with a separate gpu?
If I have to go with one of the upcoming sound cards for the audio benefits the overall cost is now too high. May as well get another ps3 or wait 6 months?
If you go with IGP, then 780G+Phenom X3/X4 is right now the best for deinterlacing.

If you also consider audio (multichannel LPCM), then Intel G45 could be the best choice. We have to see the actual chipset yet, however (a rumor is that G45 is not available in large quantities during Q3).

AMD 790GX chipset is released soon (July 31?). It is rumored that it supports multichannel LPCM. If this is true, then 790GX+Phenom may be your solution.

Lately I saw lots (actually a dozen or so) of negative user reviews on Samsung HD501LJ (very high failure rate). It's far from reliable statistical one, but I chose WD for safety.

Ah, that explains it! Good to know.

The latest recommendations are page 85 (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=940972&page=85). GeForce vs. Radeon HD partly depends on each user's environment. I am using several cards of both brands and they are equally good (with several minor glitches).

And that must be one of the posts I missed! Good to have the latest, thanks again so much.

If you go with IGP, then 780G+Phenom X3/X4 is right now the best for deinterlacing.

If you also consider audio (multichannel LPCM), then Intel G45 could be the best choice. We have to see the actual chipset yet, however (a rumor is that G45 is not available in large quantities during Q3).

AMD 790GX chipset is released soon (July 31?). It is rumored that it supports multichannel LPCM. If this is true, then 790GX+Phenom may be your solution.

Where does the 8200 fit into this?

What a ridiculous assertion, to claim that Grand Theft Auto, Crysis, Call of Duty, etc are not centered around nor promote violence. Most of us can not understand how you could possibly believe that. I notice that only two of you trogs are supporting this view, albeit quite noisily, as expected.




Not going to explain it, as we obviously come from different cultures, and this isn't the place anyway. I am saying that you are voluntarily making yourself a new underclass, which the rest of us will then happily marginalize.

Haven't laughed this hard in years. Thanks.

Where does the 8200 fit into this?
8200/8300 is weak in deinterlacing.

Hi there, I have been following this amazing thread for months now and finally decided that I need a HTPC now. I will only need it to watch DVDs, 720p, 1080p mkv files and later maybe BluRay so internal graphics is enough. I also don't need the new audio formats. I am not sure about post-processing for DVDs but from what I have read even the integrated graphics do quite a good job. Is that correct?
Although I belive the Antec Fusion is a great case I don't like its design. The Lian-Li PC-C36 looks great and hopefully it is available soon. Or would you have any objections to that?
My build so far:

Gigabyte GA-MA78GM-S2H 780G
Phenom 8450
2 x 1 GB DDR2RAM A-DATA Vitesta Extreme Edition PC800 CL4
1 TB WD Caviar Green WD10EACS SATA2 7200rpm 16MB
Lian-Li PC-C36 (includes 300 W PSU)

The system should be really quiet and cool. What kind of CPU cooler would you suggest for this case?
Thanks for this thread and your suggestions.

Jonas

Renethx, I had two questions for you:

1. Is there a 8600 Nvidia (or ATI comparable) that has no active fan? I think I would like to have the CPU passive (thanks to the mini Ninja) as well as the video be passive cooled (no fan). Or is there one of them thats quieter than all the others?

Right now I am listening to my older 478 fan spinning around (its way to loud) & I dont want to repeat this for the other parts I am ordering.


2. My 24/7 PC thats on needs to handle the line out to the reciever (for DVD's). EDIT: It needs to be on 24/7 for the home automation vocal annoucements.

LCD TV has the Audio Output, going into the Line In of the PC. The PC has a Y splitter on the Line Out, one Line Out goes to the Sony Reciever Input (TV Input), the other Line out from the PC goes into the HDMI 2 (DVI + DVI Audio Input).

The problem is, if I am watching TV, the audio needs to be on very loud (on the reciever) just to hear it. If something happens on the PC (Home Automation annoucement), its blasting as the PC volume is at 100% & the line in (on the XP machine) is at 20% (any louder it makes a screetching noise).

If i lower the volume on the PC, I can turn the line in up, but the reciever still cant play it loud enough (as the signal is too low).

In the end, the PC handling the splitting of the inputs isnt working out as well as I would hope.

Any suggestions?

Is the only difference between the ATI 3870 and 4870 the sound capability of the 4870? Or does the 4870 perform better on the video as well?


Edit - NVM - I looked them up and the 4870 is way better. Tnx anyway.

Could you provide some review links (in addition to the details renethx provided).

From what renethx posted it definitely looked better, but my 3870 (and even my old 2600XT) provid the ability to use and adjust fleshtone correction, color vibrance, denoise, as well as edge enhancement. Personally I don't use fleshtone nor color vibrance, but denoise and edge enhancement work quite well if conservative settings are used. Note I am running Vista so I don't know if these features are Vista only with the 3870.

I'm interested in knowing especially if deinterlacing has been improved with the 4800 series of cards vs the 3870.

BTW, as far as gaming on an HTPC we should all keep an open mind to this. HTPCs are after all entertainment devices and many individuals, myself included, do game on our HTPC (my preference is to play simulation racing games on our 51" HDTV and high end surround system; combined with the Logitech MOMO steering wheel - lots of fun (IMO anyway)). Vista Media Center can even launch games directly from Media Center with only the remote control. We simply plug in our XBox 360 USB game controller or steering wheel (these came with very long USB cables) and play away. No keyboard or mouse required and this really provides a seamless HTPC gaming experience.

Mod's edit: Off-topic posts removed. Please stay on topic.

Will any of these fit in that Antec 430 case?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=Property&Subcategory=48&Description=&Type=&N=2010380048&srchInDesc=&MinPrice=&MaxPrice=&OEMMark=0&PropertyCodeValue=679%3A36592&PropertyCodeValue=679%3A28607&PropertyCodeValue=679%3A29475&PropertyCodeValue=684%3A9614&PropertyCodeValue=2953%3A18921

They are fanless (silent).

Hi there, I have been following this amazing thread for months now and finally decided that I need a HTPC now. I will only need it to watch DVDs, 720p, 1080p mkv files and later maybe BluRay so internal graphics is enough. I also don't need the new audio formats. I am not sure about post-processing for DVDs but from what I have read even the integrated graphics do quite a good job. Is that correct?
Although I belive the Antec Fusion is a great case I don't like its design. The Lian-Li PC-C36 looks great and hopefully it is available soon. Or would you have any objections to that?
My build so far:

Gigabyte GA-MA78GM-S2H 780G
Phenom 8450
2 x 1 GB DDR2RAM A-DATA Vitesta Extreme Edition PC800 CL4
1 TB WD Caviar Green WD10EACS SATA2 7200rpm 16MB
Lian-Li PC-C36 (includes 300 W PSU)

The system should be really quiet and cool. What kind of CPU cooler would you suggest for this case?
Post-processing is very good with Phenom and your choice is right. :) Find a good CPU cooler is the hardest part. The case height is only 94 mm.

- Zalman CNPS8700 LED (H67 mm) is perhaps barely OK.
- SilverStone NT07-AM2 (H36.5 mm) is designed for 65W, but perhaps OK for 8450.
- Dynatron A48G: too loud unless you change the fan.

Renethx, I had two questions for you:

1. Is there a 8600 Nvidia (or ATI comparable) that has no active fan? I think I would like to have the CPU passive (thanks to the mini Ninja) as well as the video be passive cooled (no fan). Or is there one of them thats quieter than all the others?

ASUS EN8600GT SILENT/HTDP/512M (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814121098)

is a good choice.

Will any of these fit in that Antec 430 case?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=Property&Subcategory=48&Description=&Type=&N=2010380048&srchInDesc=&MinPrice=&MaxPrice=&OEMMark=0&PropertyCodeValue=679%3A36592&PropertyCodeValue=679%3A28607&PropertyCodeValue=679%3A29475&PropertyCodeValue=684%3A9614&PropertyCodeValue=2953%3A18921

They are fanless (silent).
All cards will fit in Fusion 430. The heatsink of the GIGABYTE card barely touches the case cover (but no problem).

Post-processing is very good with Phenom and your choice is right. :) Find a good CPU cooler is the hardest part. The case height is only 94 mm.

- Zalman CNPS8700 LED (H67 mm) is perhaps barely OK.
- SilverStone NT07-AM2 (H36.5 mm) is designed for 65W, but perhaps OK for 8450.
- Dynatron A48G: too loud unless you change the fan.

Thanks for that reply, renethx! I found the Scythe Shuriken to be only 64 mm high and quiet. Would you agree?
I don't necessarily need post processing so would you have a suggestion for a processor/mb combination that has very low power consumption/heat development and is still good enough for BluRay, 1080p mkv (I just picked the 780G because I felt it was favoured over G35 and 8200)?
I s there a reason why to go for the Gigabyte board instead of Asrock A780, Asus M3A78-EMH, MSI K9A2GM-FIH?
How much does the 780G/Phenom 8450 combination consume?
Would you say such a small case is too tricky?
Is it possible to boot the system via a remote control or what would I need for that?

I know, lots of questions. Sorry for that but I want to do it right with my first HTPC. So please bear with me.

Thanks,
Jonas