Guide to Building a HD HTPC [Text View] - Page 35

Jaybird376

06-01-09, 09:42 PM

Hello everyone,

I'm preparing to build a new home theater setup and was hoping to get some advice as to setup / design and implementation.

I'm not exactly sure which forum this should fit in, since it crosses more than a few boundaries, so if this should be moved somewhere else, please let me know.

The entire setup revolves around 2x LN52B750 TVs that I'm setting up side-by-side in my living room, in effect trying to get the dual monitor affect on the Home Theater level.

I'd like to try and leverage both TVs as two large computer monitors for dual-screen display, and swap one into TV mode when I want to watch HD OTA or DirecTV (Apartment complex is upgrading to HD service for DirecTV soon but not in place yet).

I've built plenty of PCs but I'm a

I guess there are a variety of questions...

How potent a graphics card am I going to need to push out reliably to 2x 1080 TVs in a dual display mode?

Given the fact that DirecTV is SD only, I should be able to pull directly from the set-top box to the TV tuner (from what I can tell), along with OTA. How does that change when it switches to HD, particularly in the case of Audio?

Once DirecTV gets bumped to HD, my understanding is I then have to connect the settop box directly to the TV (over HDMI for 1080) and I can switch between dual monitors and TV / Monitor by changing the inputs on the TV.

What I don't get is how that affects the wiring for audio through a reciever. When everything's fed through the HTPC there's only one audio signal, but when it forks and I'm watching DirecTV on TV 1 and playing a game on TV 2, I don't know how that'll end up working. I'd switch my reciever over to DirecTV to play that audio. But is there a way to fork the audio from my PC so I can get both playing (maybe not on the same speaker set)?

How would a Hauppage HD PVR work in that setup as well?

Any help and/or thoughts would be tremendously appreciated.

Sincerely,

Jaybird376

mzanaty

06-01-09, 10:54 PM

some good info on the chip.

http://www.amd.com/us-en/assets/content_type/DownloadableAssets/47285A_E4690_Discreet_GPU.pdf
This is not an integrated GPU that will appear in PC mobos. It is a full discrete GPU in a small size for "embedded" applications, which means custom boards for specific uses not PCs. There is nothing stopping PC mobo makers from using it for PCs, but the cost would likely make it unattractive. iGPUs are much cheaper since they are actually integrated within another component (CPU or chipset), not a discrete socket. And in this case, it is a custom discrete socket which surely complicates board design.

renethx

06-02-09, 02:29 AM

renethx

06-02-09, 04:06 AM

ION desktop PCs (http://pc.watch.impress.co.jp/docs/news/event/20090602_212090.html):

MSI Wind Box D200
Pegatron IPP7A-CP
Foxconn JTX-N
AsRock Ion 330
etc.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=144189&stc=1&d=1243929933

sokkaNET

06-02-09, 06:47 AM

I see that the GIGABYTE -GA45-UD3P is recommended in INTEL/INTEL Mid-Range full ATX, however can anyone tell me the difference between this card and the GA-EP45C-DS3R. The EP45C-DS3R card is a cheaper MB, but the only spec I can see that's any worse than GA45-UD3P, is that it only has one NIC, and I'm sure I can live with a single NIC on my mobo.

Is there something I'm not seeing here, is there a reason why not to go with the EP45C-DS3R instead of GA45-UD3P

Paul E. Fox, II

06-02-09, 08:38 AM

Ok...

Thanks to the posts here, I was able to get the IR function of the LCD working but I still can't get either IMON or IMEDIAN to do what I think it's supposed to be doing.

Tonight, I'll RTFM, read here and try again...

Thanks for all your help so far gang!

toomz1

06-02-09, 10:54 AM

I finally decided on at motherboard - Gigabyte GA-EP45-DS3P. Now it turn out it is OUT OF STOCK :'(

Hardware i already bought:
# CPU Cooler: Xigmatek HDT-SD964.
# Graphics Card: SAPPHIRE Radeon HD 4670 GDDR4 512MB
# Case: Antec Fusion Remote Max

1. Could I go with the ASUS P5Q-E or are there any problems with this card and the hardware i already bought?

2. Asus uses a different sound-chip, any pros/cons?

3. Does the ASUS P5Q-E have room for the Xigmatek HDT-SD964?

renethx

06-02-09, 11:23 AM

toomz1

06-02-09, 11:40 AM

If you own ASUS P5Q-E, then you don't need another P45 mb, do you? GA-EP45-DS3P is an early model and discontinued. ADI audio chip is good. HDT-SD964 fits P5Q-E.

Sorry if i wasnt clean about it, but i dont own a P5Q-E now - then i would also know if the HDT-SD964 would fit ;)

I will go with the ASUS P5Q-E, thanks for your quick reply.

clobber

06-02-09, 12:17 PM

AMD and Intel are very close in performance. I am going to use Phenom II X2 550 in the AMD mid-range systems (expected in June 2, slightly cheaper than E7400). If you use a discrete video card, the chipset is less important. HD 4xxx with NVIDIA chipset works fine. But HD 4xxx with AMD chipset could be better in that you can use the discrete GPU and integrated one simultaneously (under Vista/Windows 7).

300W is good enough for the mid-range system. CMPSU-450VX is not so expensive and very quiet.300W to 450W: 20 Power Supplies on the Test Bench is a nice article.

I usually recommend a smaller, faster drive for OS (e.g. WD6400AAKS) and a bunch of larger drives for data (e.g. WD Caviar Green Power).

Rene,

1) Same Mobo with the Phenom II X2 550 for AMD mid-range systems (GIGABYTE GA-MA78GM-US2H or ASUS M3N78-EM)?

2) Just noticed, the AMD processor recommended (Phenom II X3 710 HDX710WFGIBOX) is AM3 but the motherboards are AM2+. Is that compatible? I have not kept up on my socket specs.

3) If I use the ASUS M3N78-EM and SAPPHIRE Radeon HD 4670 GDDR4 512MB will one PCI slot be blocked? (I do have one PCI card to put in so I can still make those analog recordings). Or will I lose the x1?

4) The Phenom II X2 550 is not available yet right?

5) Are the Coolermaster RR-CCH-PBJ1-GP and RR-CCH-PBU1-GP basically the same? I can't really find the one you recommend (PBJ) but newegg carries the PBU.

6) I was under the impression the 780G had problems sending audio over HDMI - or has that been solved? For whatever reason, I am under the impression that the 8200/8300 and 9300/9400 are superior to the 780G for HTPC?

7) I do have one audio requirement. I need to send audio over HDMI to my HDTV and analog out (RCA) to my stereo simultaneously. Are there any special settings to make that work?

8) I think I read you also use Mediaportal (which I love). How hard is it to get the built in remote and IR reciever on from the Antec Fusion Remote Black to work with MP?

thanks!

walterg74

06-02-09, 12:56 PM

HD 4xxx with AMD chipset could be better in that you can use the discrete GPU and integrated one simultaneously (under Vista/Windows 7).

Renethx: is this specific to the OS or what? I was told that the IGP could only be used in crossfire with a similar family discrete card (for example the 790GX chipset with a discrete 3450/3850 card). :confused:

On a separate note, no clue regarding the tv card/hdmi sound issue I mentioned before? :(

renethx

06-02-09, 12:58 PM

@clobber

1. Yes, until 785G is released in Q3.
2. AM3 processor supports both DDR2 (AM2+) and DDR3 (AM3). If you want to be sure, check the supported CPU list of each mb.
3. You will lose one PCI slot.
4. Available soon (June 5th?).
5. U1 and J1 are the same. Perhaps U1 comes with LGA1366 bracket?
6. I see no problem in sending stereo LPCM, DD and DTS. 780G and 9300/9400 are on a par in video quality. 8200/8300 is a bit inferior.
7. You can't use two sound playback devices simultaneously. You have to select only one at a time.
8. I haven't experimented MP+Fusion's remote. The latest status is here (http://forum.team-mediaportal.com/remotes-116/antec-fusion-v2-ir-how-use-w-mediaportal-28783/index11.html). It looks like IR receiver/remote/LCD work fine.

renethx

06-02-09, 01:05 PM

Renethx: is this specific to the OS or what? I was told that the IGP could only be used in crossfire with a similar family discrete card (for example the 790GX chipset with a discrete 3450/3850 card). :confused:

On a separate note, no clue regarding the tv card/hdmi sound issue I mentioned before? :(
XP: you can mix any two GPUs (AMD, NVIDIA or Intel or whatever) to support up to (usually) four displays.

Vista/Windows 7: The above is not true. The two GPUs must use the same driver. For example you can use HD 3200 with any AMD card that uses the same driver for multiple displays. But if you install a NVIDIA card in a 780G system, you can use only one GPU at a time (the GPU that is first initialized in BIOS).

Which issue? Perhaps I missed it.

walterg74

06-02-09, 01:20 PM

XP: you can mix any two GPUs (AMD, NVIDIA or Intel or whatever) to support up to (usually) four displays.

Vista/Windows 7: The above is not true. The two GPUs must use the same driver. For example you can use HD 3200 with any AMD card that uses the same driver for multiple displays. But if you install a NVIDIA card in a 780G system, you can use only one GPU at a time (the GPU that is first initialized in BIOS).

Which issue? Perhaps I missed it.

The issue is like this:

I have a recently installed TV tuner card (Sapphire Wonder TV PCI). After fiddling around with it, I managed to get the sound working. In order to do this, a cable must be connected from the card's "audio output" jack, to the onboard audio's "line in" jack.

The motherboard in question is a Gigabyte G31 chipset based board. But the thing is I am using in this htpc a discrete Sapphire HD4670 card.

With the former method that I got it working with, I'm forced to use the onboard audio, and attach some external speakers to the onboard sound card's line out jack, while I have been using my pc just fine with the hdmi output of the graphics card, and getting audio from there.

In the tv card's utility, in the setup, there is an option to select the output device and I CAN choose HDMI device (or even the Realtek High Definition audio device, besides the "normal" line out), but even though I select it, not only does sound NOT come out through the HDMI output, but additionally it still goes out the onboard sound card's line out to the external speakers.. :eek:

Any clue as to if there's a solution/workaround?

Thanks! :D

losangelesking

06-02-09, 04:33 PM

Great guide, very helpful. That being said, I still need a question answered. I want to build an HTPC with the primary function being a DVD jukebox with possible blu-ray playback. The only other uses would be old school emulators, streaming netflix, hulu.

I really like the idea of using the GIGABYTE GA-E7AUM-DS2H with the integrated 9400m. Not only do I want it to be able to playback DVD and Blu-ray but I want it to look good doing it. Using an 9400m, how does the PQ compare to a PS3 (my current dvd/bd player)?

I would be using a E6750 CPU and the Asus Xonar 1.3 for bitstreaming the HD audio formats.

renethx

06-02-09, 04:56 PM

losangelesking

06-02-09, 05:46 PM

Only PS3+GeForce 9300/9400 users can answer the question ...

I don't need exact, I just need to know if it can compete with a high quality DVD player (Oppo for example) and current generation blu-ray player, or if I need to go with something better.

tlguapo

06-03-09, 06:29 AM

I've spent several hours each day scouring over this thread and other articles this week and I think I'm finally ready to start making some decisions. Rene, you truly have gone above and beyond with your support in this thread. Thank you for your efforts.

I believe my goals should suffice with a low-end build, but I may need to mix in some mid-range items:
-Want a low wattage/low profile rig that's cost effective.
-Watch a BD on the player and d/l, stream and/or rip the BD in the background at the same time.
-Use Hulu Desktop and MCE/Boxee as well.

My first question is about the CPU. The system requirements for the Hulu Desktop application suggest running a Core 2. Will the e5200/5050e be able to support the requirements? If they will have some trouble, then what other low wattage CPU would you recommend? Is it better to have a dual core at a higher speed than a much slower quad?

Your chart shows Intel/Nvidia with the best video playback, but I've read the 9300/9400 chip sets are way too hot - is that an issue? I suppose I could use a dGPU, but I'm concerned about ATI's lower BD@24 performance and GF's audio issues. Am I splitting hairs here?

Finally the case has been probably the hardest thing for me to choose. I must have read about 100 cases. I like the Mini ITX - $50 for a case and psu is really nice. My concern is the availability of only one PCI slot. I'm assuming most people would add a GPU there. If you want a tuner I guess you could use a USB one, but what do you do about a sound card for TrueHD & DTS-HD?

Do the Micro cases give you an option for two usable PCI slots? Do you need 'low profile' cards to fit in the PCI slots?

Finally, do MCE remotes come with a IF receiver? Just curious if I need to get a case with a built-in IF.

I'll check back later - my eyes are bleeding from too much reading and I need sleep!! Thanks for the help.

~D

renethx

06-03-09, 07:25 AM

@tlguapo

Hulu at full screen is a bit demanding for E5200/5050e (80-90% CPU usage). A mid-range CPU may be better for this purpose. You shouldn't worry about 9300/9400 heat. Mini-ITX has only one expansion slot. TV tuner can be external (USB, network). No ASUS Slim PCI for Zotac 9300 mini-ITX. Most people are satisfied with 9300/9400 IGP. There are a couple of microATX/ATX cases with a built-in IR receiver. You can use Antec Multimedia Station if the case has a 3.5" external bay.

grantwolf

06-03-09, 12:19 PM

renethx,

I posted this in the sound card thread, but it'll fall off the first page soon:

How can you tell if the board has an internal S/PDIF connector? I don't see anything listed on this diagram ( http://www-307.ibm.com/pc/support/si...cid=MIGR-55746 ).

renethx

06-03-09, 12:22 PM

grantwolf

06-03-09, 03:58 PM

If you can't see it in the diagram, then perhaps the mb does not have it.

OK. Likely the case. I saw that you've written that it is often there on the MB, but not provided along the back panel of the CPU...and figured that most/all might have it.

This is a relatively old MB (probably 5-7 years old I think)...so it would certainly not surprise me if it didn't have it on the MB.

My current sound card isn't working with Windows7...so I was hoping this would be a solution.

McClusky

06-03-09, 03:59 PM

Hello - I'm sure this has been asked before but if I build one of these low to medium end systems can it replace my cable box that has a DVR built in it?

Thanks...

renethx

06-03-09, 04:08 PM

Hello - I'm sure this has been asked before but if I build one of these low to medium end systems can it replace my cable box that has a DVR built in it?

Thanks...
If you want to record premium (i.e. encrypted) contents in PC, you still need a cable box.

Cable box -> (via component video [analog]) Hauppauge HD PVR -> (via USB) PC.

NYSportz

06-03-09, 10:45 PM

If you want to record premium (i.e. encrypted) contents in PC, you still need a cable box.

Cable box -> (via component video [analog]) Hauppauge HD PVR -> (via USB) PC.

This is the alternative:
http://www.engadgethd.com/2009/05/12/how-to-install-a-cablecard-tuner-in-your-diy-media-center/

It's hardly cheap, though, and it's possible this will be deactivated by Microsoft somehow. At the least, the public PID posted on Engadget will likely be shut down.

Justin

NYSportz

06-03-09, 10:47 PM

My i7 build post is finally up. Sorry for the delay! Thanks to rene for the great thread and to everyone else who contributes. This is without a doubt the greatest HTPC resource on the web (and therefore in the world!), at least in my opinion.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=16582095#post16582095

Justin

zennui

06-04-09, 04:25 AM

Hi all.

It's time to retire the SD HTPC (having provided 6 years of uninterrupted service, I feel like I should give it a medal or something :) )

Here are my intended specs. Please feel free to comment.

CPU: Intel Pentium Dual Core E5200
MB: GIGABYTE GA-EP43-UD3L
Graphics Card: SAPPHIRE Radeon HD 4670 GDDR4 512MB
Optical Drive: LG Black LG Blu-ray/HD DVD-ROM & 16X DVD±R DVD Burner SATA Model GGC-H20L
Case: Antec Fusion Remote Max ATX
HDD: 3 x Western Digital Caviar Green WD10EADS 1TB SATA 3.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drive
Memory: PQI 2GB (2 x 1GB) Dual Channel PC2-3200 DDR-400 SDRAM (I already have this)
PSU: Antec TruePower 2.0 480 Watt (I already have this)
Tuner: HDHomeRun (I already have this)
Other: Firefly remote and wireless keyboard and mouse (I already have this)

Here are my requirements:

Watch Blu-Ray discs
Rip and download Blu-Ray discs to HD
Watch Blu-Ray rips
Watch standard DVD discs
Rip and download standard DVD discs to HD
Watch standard DVD rips
Record OTA HD TV (using Sage)
Store and play lossless (Flac) music files
Use services like Netflix and Hulu for online video streaming
No gaming
No CrossFire
No RAID

Here's what I have:

Brand new Panasonic 1080p Plasma
Old-ish Onkyo Receiver (DD 5.1 and DTS 5.1 via optical or coax) This is fine as it matches my 5.1 speakers. My plan would be to send audio to the TV using HDMI and to the receiver using S/PDIF.
Wired Gigabit network throughout the house (I just like to say that :) )

My main concern is that I get the best picture possible for the most reasonable price. I think I've got it, but please tell me where I may have gone wrong or overlooked another option.

Thanks in advance for your help.

renethx

06-04-09, 05:06 AM

@zennui

DDR2-400 is not officially supported by the chipset. Buy DDR2-800. Otherwise good.

tmavs

06-04-09, 07:49 AM

McClusky

06-04-09, 11:05 AM

Iteki

06-04-09, 11:26 AM

Thanks for replying renethx and NYSportz. Forgive my ignorance but what is premium (i.e. encrypted) content? I would like to record HD programs from ABC, FOX, TNT, ESPN and the like using a home built HD HTPC.

Premium and encrypted content are copy protected/scrambled channels. They can only be decoded with a digital cable box or a PC equipped with a cable card tuner.

ABC and FOX are free over the air channels, and are generally not encrypted. TNT and ESPN are 'premium' channels and you'll need the hardware listed above to view/record them.

renethx

06-04-09, 01:53 PM

according to this (http://www.anandtech.com/weblog/showpost.aspx?i=606). (I wrote contrary before.) But you shouldn't expect it anytime soon (August to October according to the same source).

foghorn2

06-04-09, 02:08 PM

Finally upgraded to BD last night :D
Using HIS 4670 (non turbo) and LG GGC H20L. Played Kung Fu Panda (BD) using PowerDVD 7.3 (updated OEM version), my CPU usage was around 25% (while recording) on a baby AMD socket 939 3500+ :cool:
No hiccups - totally smooth playback.

A really easy and cheap upgrade to HD.

Contrary to what renethx says here, my AMD 4850 45w processor plays blu-ray fine using a ASUS 8300 based motherboard, very low cpu utilization.

Its not all about high end CPU's, Gigabyte and 780g.

renethx

06-04-09, 02:14 PM

Contrary to what renethx says here, my AMD 4850 45w processor plays blu-ray fine using a ASUS 8300 based motherboard, very low cpu utilization.
Playing progressive contents (SD or HD) is relatively easy (PureVideo HD decoder does everything). You will see problems in playing interlaced contents that requires post-processing power (beyond PureVideo HD decoder). Quick tests are W6RZ (http://www.w6rz.net/):

- Alternating black-white 1, 2, 3 and 4 pixel strips with moving interlaced bar 1920x1080 (vertrezmotion.ts) to test 1080i MPEG-2 deinterlacing. (The 1 pixel alternating black and white stripes should not flicker, while the moving bar should be smooth without jaggies.)

- Film vertical and horizontal resolution test with motion and 32 pulldown 1920x1080 (filmrez.ts) to test 1080i MPEG-2 inverse telecine. (The 1 pixel alternating black and white stripes should not flicker, and there should not be black/white vertical edges.)

A good GPU should pass these tests.

Iteki

06-04-09, 02:35 PM

Contrary to what renethx says here, my AMD 4850 45w processor plays blu-ray fine using a ASUS 8300 based motherboard, very low cpu utilization.

Its not all about high end CPU's, Gigabyte and 780g.

I think Rene has been very vocal about keeping the CPU midrange (not high end) and a big advocate of the 4670 dedicated GPU (NOT 780g). They are a sweet spot for HTPC at the moment. Lower end CPUs can do HD very well, but don't handle SD or internet Flash video well at all (since Flash isn't hardware accelerated).

I think he'd be the last person to advocate more machine than one needs, especially if it's purely HTPC driven. Higher end CPU/GPUs get recommended when someone says they want to do some gaming or lots of encoding.

McClusky

06-04-09, 03:38 PM

Premium and encrypted content are copy protected/scrambled channels. They can only be decoded with a digital cable box or a PC equipped with a cable card tuner.

ABC and FOX are free over the air channels, and are generally not encrypted. TNT and ESPN are 'premium' channels and you'll need the hardware listed above to view/record them.

I'm so confused. I was hoping to build one of these aspenmediaproducts.com/AspenMediaStore/ConsumerLine/tabid/86/Default.aspx using the guide(s) in this forum (sorry I cannot post a url until my 3rd post). I am told these Aspen machines will record HD as they are cable lab certified.

Thanks again...

McClusky

06-04-09, 03:40 PM

Link for above http://www.aspenmediaproducts.com/AspenMediaStore/ConsumerLine/tabid/86/Default.aspx

doctorcilantro

06-04-09, 04:08 PM

As I noted, I found it would work using the ATI AHCI Compatible RAID driver with the BIOS left non-RAID quite by accident. The Sans Digital PCIe card and software are soooo poor and Vista working so well that I'm leaving it as is!

Anyway, since I found soooo many posts saying this wouldn't work, I thought it was valuable to let folks know it is in fact working on my rig!

I just noticed that Rod mentioned "BIOS in non-raid".

I have my JNC81 connected to an Addonics 5 port PM box and I want to use the ESata on the board which uses SB700 so I can use individual drives.

Upon post I notice the RAID prompt. How can I disable this? I have been in the BIOS and did not notice that RAID was enabled. I'm at work and will look again when I get home but any help from anyone is welcome.

One thought is that I installed the AMD AHCI driver during install. Maybe I should try it via .exe in Windows 7. I assume if I hadn't loaded the RAID driver I would still see the prompt on POST but it would be the default RAID driver. I have AHCI selected in BIOS.

thanks
Jon

renethx

06-04-09, 04:30 PM

if I build one of these low to medium end systems can it replace my cable box that has a DVR built in it?

I'm so confused. I was hoping to build one of these aspenmediaproducts.com/AspenMediaStore/ConsumerLine/tabid/86/Default.aspx using the guide(s) in this forum (sorry I cannot post a url until my 3rd post). I am told these Aspen machines will record HD as they are cable lab certified.

Are you going to buy components and build a system yourself or just buy a pre-built system?

Buying a pre-built PC equipped with Digital Cable Tuner and a CableCARD from your cable company is another method of recording encrypted contents in the PC. Read also this post (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=16582137#post16582137).

Iteki

06-04-09, 04:36 PM

Link for above http://www.aspenmediaproducts.com/AspenMediaStore/ConsumerLine/tabid/86/Default.aspx

Those allow you to add tuners, but don't appear to be cable card tuners to decrypt premium channels. I could be wrong.

There are some DIY cable card guides out there...normally cable cards are only licensed to 3rd party system builders (or Tivo). But there are some workarounds to get past that. It takes some work, plus you have to buy the tuner off ebay, and arrange for the cable cards from your cable company.

bmcent1

06-04-09, 04:56 PM

Hello! I am just starting the process to build an HTPC (well, leaning towards it, researching actually.) I've built many PCs, so I've got the basic ideas, but integrating with high quality audio and video components (Pioneer Elite VSX-01TXH and Epson HC 720 projector) is going to be the trick for me.

I've read over the beginning of the thread and the updated baseline system on p85.

Can someone answer whether this info I received in another thread is still true? This is in reference to how well a BD player in a HTPC can hold it's own compared to a standalone player in the $200-300 price range...

"For starters, if you want to feed lossless audio codes to your receiver, you need to invest in an Asus Xonar HDAV1.3 and Arcsoft TMT 3, which will set you back about $300."

dbone1026

06-04-09, 05:05 PM

Iteki

06-04-09, 06:01 PM

"For starters, if you want to feed lossless audio codes to your receiver, you need to invest in an Asus Xonar HDAV1.3 and Arcsoft TMT 3, which will set you back about $300."

Commercial BD players (only kind thus far) won't pass full HD Audio unless they find a PAP (Protected Audio Path). Asus Xonar HDAV1.3 is the only hardware that supports this on the PC side.

However, you can rip the BD to a mkv container and FLAC audio, which will preserve the audio/video quality and won't be effected by PAP constraints (they can be played on any player that supports the codecs).

bmcent1

06-04-09, 11:23 PM

Iteki

06-04-09, 11:41 PM

Rene, Dbone, and Iteki -
Can any of you comment or clarify what seems to be (to a noob anyway) conflicting information from the previous two posts?

I have a Pioneer Elite VSX-01TXH receiver which is capable of decoding Dolby TrueHD and DTS-HD Master Audio. Will a discreet GPU like the Radeon 4670 be able to pass something useful from the DB-ROM reader over HDMI to my stereo which will then decode the audio?

I've ripped DVDs to HD with DVDFab in the past, and watched them using Media Portal. Is building a Blu-ray library on an HTPC a very similar process or is it more involved and are there more audio issues?

4670 is CAPABLE of it, but the player is what determines what quality of audio will be output. 4670 will pass multichannel but the player will downsample it since there is no protected audio path. So you will get all the channels, but the audio will be of a lower quality. Whether you'll notice will depend on your ears and your equipment.

Now if you rip your BluRay to an mkv file (as noted in other posts above), that bypasses the whole PAP issue and you will get BluRay quality video and HD sound.

If you rip to a disk image or a folder, the PAP issues will still apply, since the BD player will still need to be used.

Slysoft (makers of anydvdhd) are supposed to be making their own player that won't worry about PAP...it should be game changing when/if it comes out.

bmcent1

06-04-09, 11:54 PM

doctorcilantro

06-05-09, 12:51 AM

J. river has powerful DirectShow filter manager. I just install CCCP on the machines and tweak them to play MKV with either FFDshow (Haali) or another one that isn't free. Forget the name now...too tired.

On another note, Rod ha dposted about Port Muliplier support on SB700. Well I will be dipped in fudge, it works here. Forget Drobo, and I don't need RAID, now my HTPC is hooked up to a Addonics Storage tower with 5TB and each drive is separate; one bay is hot swap slide-in for easy access. I can't believe I got it working.

I popped the jumper off the raid header in the storage tower 5 PM card, and then I installed a newer AHCI driver from AMD, a year newer than the old one. Now all drives show up via Esata on SB700 board...

simply amazing given that I almost gave up 10 minutes ago. hats off to Rod for picking up on this....!

DC

bmcent1

06-05-09, 12:56 AM

Okay... after reading a bit on several Blu-Ray / HDMI HTPC threads, it's looking like more trouble than I'm up for at this point to reliably / easily watch Blu-Ray on the HTPC. I'll probably go with a standalone player for now and hope things get sorted in the future.

That said, if I build something like the MicroATX Low-End Intel/nVidia system here now (for things like Hulu, Pandora, DVD Library, etc) should that system be reasonably powerful to be a front and and play ripped or (somehow) streamed blu-ray content down the road from possibly a back end server?

renethx

06-05-09, 02:55 AM

@bmcent1

Perhaps the majority of people are watching BD without (major) troubles on HTPC. Nowadays playing BD is one of the easiest tasks for HTPC (any of my recommended systems can do that easily). HTPC is not just a replacement of a standalone BD player, it can do a lot of jobs that a SA BD player can't do (read here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=847560) and here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=15114423#post15114423)).

For HD audio downsampling, please read this post (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1029603#PAP) for details. If you use an AACS-compliant software player such as TMT or PowerDVD, HD audio is downsampled without a sound device supporting PAP (ASUS Xonar HDAV1.3 is the only such device right now). If you decrypt AACS-encryption of BD movies by AnyDVD HD (annual fee-based) in real-time or for archiving and use the upcoming SlySoft BD player (free), you will get full resolution HD audio with any GPU supporting HDMI audio. Creating MKV files with lossless audio track (in FLAC) and playing them with an appropriate media player/codecs is another method of getting full res. audio. (The reality is that it is very hard for the majority of folks to hear the difference between downsampled and non-downsampled HD audio.)

renethx

06-05-09, 03:02 AM

On another note, Rod ha dposted about Port Muliplier support on SB700. Well I will be dipped in fudge, it works here. Forget Drobo, and I don't need RAID, now my HTPC is hooked up to a Addonics Storage tower with 5TB and each drive is separate; one bay is hot swap slide-in for easy access. I can't believe I got it working.

I popped the jumper off the raid header in the storage tower 5 PM card, and then I installed a newer AHCI driver from AMD, a year newer than the old one. Now all drives show up via Esata on SB700 board...

simply amazing given that I almost gave up 10 minutes ago. hats off to Rod for picking up on this....!

DC
So you are talking about RodNewstrom's post (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=15518882#post15518882), right?

Iteki

06-05-09, 03:20 AM

Okay, so when you say "player" in this context, you mean the software that plays the blu-ray disk on the HTPC? What are some favorites?

Generic questions ... does VLC or Media Portal handle the playing of blu-ray disks and/or ripped mkv files?

Does FLAC support 7.1?

You mentioned posts above, any idea what pages they are on (I'm about to delve into the HD to mkv thread) ... I'm not being lazy, these threads with 200+ and 300+ pages are daunting :)

As usual, Rene has answered your question much better than I could have (see above). Playing BluRays and getting multichannel sound is easy. It's getting uncompressed HD Audio that can be complicated. And again, hopefully Slyplayer will remove that last bit of complexity for us.

The only players that can currently handle BluRay are commercial players such as Arcsoft TMT, PowerDVD, etc. VLC/Media Portal can't pay BluRay natively (but they CAN play Blurays that have been converted to mkv).

Yes, FLAC can handle 7.1

I'm right there with you...searching these threads can be a nightmare, as every question gets asked more than once, and depending on how much time has passed, the answers might change. Hang in there...

tlguapo

06-05-09, 04:39 AM

Not to beat a deadhorse...

So to follow up on bmcent1's topic about the audio - are the Rene recommended chipsets able to send uncompressed audio? Or do you need a card like the 4550 or the 4670 to be able to do this?

Man it would sure be nice if the Slyplayer was able to work this all out w/out needing to pick up a $200 sound card. Any ETA on the software's release?

renethx

06-05-09, 05:58 AM

are the Rene recommended chipsets able to send uncompressed audio? Or do you need a card like the 4550 or the 4670 to be able to do this?
Check the charts on page 85. LPCM is the standard uncompressed digital audio format used in PC and CE.

ClemsonKev

06-05-09, 08:56 AM

Everything was working fine, but for the past few days EVERY time I hit the SEARCH button to look for specific programs it crashes!

Here is the error message attached.

Any help would be appreciated folks.... :confused:

bmcent1

06-05-09, 01:32 PM

Thanks renethx and Iteki!

I've read over those HTTP/BD threads and have a lot better understanding of the issues now.

IMO, after spending about 2 years building a dedicated theater, I am ready to plunk my butt down and watch some movies and fiddling with things has lost it's luster... just for the moment :)

I think I'm going to buy a stand alone BD player for ease of use and simplicity for the family. But I'm also going to build an HTPC for all the awesome things it can do when tied to a projector and good receiver. (I just played with Hulu, Pandora, Netflix streaming, and Media Portal using my laptop and I was blown away.)

So that said, I think I'll experiment with ripping BD later, and hopefully serve the media from somewhere on the home network and use the HTTP as a front end.

I followed the MicroATX low-end system on p85 of this thread as close as I could. Just have a couple questions.

NewEgg now has a Western Digital Caviar Black WD6401AALS 640GB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0G for just $5 more than the 6400AALS and it appears to have a 5 yr warantee vs 3 yrs and might possibly be better built. Is there any reason (other than saving $5) to stick with the 6400AALS?

They also have a HITACHI 0A38016 1TB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0G drive at the same price as the WD6401AALS. That's a lot more space, but does the Western Digital have a better reputation for low noise or better reliability?

Other than that, only changes were to the Antek2480 case because the recommended Antek case is no longer available.

And I went with CORSAIR 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 since it was just $15 more and doubled the RAM. Even though it's a "low end" system, it looks plenty powerful and the extra RAM might help it stave off an upgrade down the road.

I wanted to upgrade the processor too (I have an E8400 Core 2 Duo in the system I'm currently on and love it), but since the E8400 has a FSB speed of 1666 and this board is 1333 or 1000, it looked like they would be incompatible or the processor would get underclocked.

Am I on the right track?

I'd like to go for a regular ATX size medium-range HTPC (I hate working in small cases and I like to "future proof" a new computer by overbuilding it a bit) but I'm a big fan of the Intel/Nvidia combo so it looks like I'm out of luck until some new motherboards come out.

renethx

06-05-09, 02:05 PM

@bmcent1

WD6401AALS belongs to WD Caviar Black (maximum performance for power computing), while WD6400AAKS to WD Caviar Blue (for everyday use). WD6401AALS has a larger cache (hence a bit faster under certain circumstances) and have 5 year warranty. Both are very quiet.

E8400 is FSB 1333. All the current decent mbs support it.

NSK1480 is available at many retailers, for example, PROVANTAGE (http://www.provantage.com/antec-nsk1480~7ANTG04W.htm). But NSK2480 may be better in that it accepts full-height expansion cards.

bmcent1

06-05-09, 02:15 PM

^ Super! Thanks for the corrections/details.

ClemsonKev

06-05-09, 03:18 PM

juda

06-05-09, 03:34 PM

Great information here thank youu http://***************/9/z/i.jpg

wlo

06-05-09, 07:58 PM

Marc_G

06-05-09, 08:29 PM

Hi folks,

I'm thinking of taking my collection of BD .iso's [legitimately obtained] and making MKVs of them, because I really hate relying on PowerDVD software to play them. Also want to trim out the junk (extra audio tracks etc.) leaving me with pure movie files.

I imagine this is a processor-intensive task, so I'm thinking of using my desktop machine to do it instead of the HTPC. But, to make it practical, I would need to invest in a gigabit router, which I otherwise don't need (my network is all 100T). So, my question to his august assemblage of minds, is: For the task of MKVing the BDs, will there be a significant difference in speed based on these specs:

HTPC: AMD Athlon 64 X2 7750 Kuma 2.7 GHz (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103300)
4 GB RAM
Vista32 Home Premium SP1

Versus the Desktop PC:
AMD Phenom 9550 Quad-Core 2.2 GHz
6 GB RAM
Vista64 Home Premium SP1

Would the quad core and Vista64 deal make it remarkably faster? And if so, would anyone care to estimate how much?

Marc

epiekarc

06-05-09, 09:22 PM

Hello All,

Thanks for your expertise.

Goal:

The ability to centrally store, edit and view/play media including pictures, music and video.

Current Setup:

TV: Pioneer Elite PRO-111FD
Receiver: AVR-4308CI
Speakers: Vandersteen Quatro Wood Sig II (I love them!), VSM rears, VCC-2 center & V2w sub
DVR: TiVo HD XL DVR
Remote: URC MX-900 (controls everything including Lutron RF lighting and PS3 with PS3IR-1000)
Gaming: PS3

After reading the initial pages of this forum and page 85 it seems that I would likely be looking at a premium setup (for editing my home videos and pictures) along with quite a bit of storage. I believe everything could be done in one box, and I'd really like to setup the computer in another room where I could edit media through a typical display and keyboard interface. Hopefully I'll only need to run one HDMI cable and control everything through RF if not then a wire for IR. Either way, I don't see any systems with the Asus Xonar HDAV1.3 sound card, which I believe is the only way to play back lossless audio (without converting).

Question:

Could somebody please recommend a build that will send DTS-HD etc. to my receiver? I would really like to have a very user friendly GUI for my home theater user. Hopefully the build will include all software that will make this possible. I was planning on running the OS from one set of drives about 150GB in size and having a storage array of about 20TB (storage needs to be expandable in some way). Quality and performance is of utmost concern.

renethx

06-06-09, 01:16 AM

Hi all, I am new to this. I have seen someone has successfully get the ATI 4670 working with bitstreaming to a reciever for TrueHD and DTS-MA working. I need to upgrade my dated HTPC and wondering what my new hardware requirement should be and hope some of your experienced folks can shed should light for me.. My requirement: BD Rip and playback, DVD Rip and playback. No gaming. A dedicated HTPC. Connection to my Epson 6500UB Projector. Connection to my HDMI receiver. Quiet Operation is one of my goal. High qty HD Audio and video playback is my main goal.

Will the following system satisfy my requirements ?
AMD Athlon II 2x 7850 2.8ghz dual core CPU on Asus M4A78-E MB with the on board video (Radeon HD 3300) or I need triple or quad core CPU ?
4GB DDR2-8000 or 1066 RAM
What size of power supply do I need ? 450W or 650W or higher ?

Will the on board video Radeon HD3300 GPU good enough for BD or Mkv play back ? or do I need to invest a video card like Asus 9600GT Silent 512MB or Radeon 4770 or 4850? My concern is the noise level with these gaming video card ??
"someone has successfully get the ATI 4670 working with bitstreaming to a reciever for TrueHD and DTS-MA working"

If the TrueHD indicator lights up in his receiver, then he'd better get it repaired. ;)

Radeon HD 3200/3300 lacks multichannel HDMI audio. You will have to add a HD 4xxx for this purpose. Sapphire HD 4670 GDDR4 (Arctic Cooling fan) is very nice. You'd better choose Athlon II X2 250 3.0GHz 45 nm instead of Athlon X2 7850 65 nm. The former runs much cooler than the latter. Your mb is OK. Check also the ATX and microATX mid-range AMD/AMD systems on page 85 to get an idea what components you need to get the best video quality.

renethx

06-06-09, 01:25 AM

renethx

06-06-09, 01:35 AM

Question:

Could somebody please recommend a build that will send DTS-HD etc. to my receiver? I would really like to have a very user friendly GUI for my home theater user. Hopefully the build will include all software that will make this possible. I was planning on running the OS from one set of drives about 150GB in size and having a storage array of about 20TB (storage needs to be expandable in some way). Quality and performance is of utmost concern.
You can add ASUS Xonar HDAV1.3 (Slim) to any system on page 85 for bitstreaming HD audio to your receiver. The Core i7 premium system is very good for video editing. Check also the workstation recommendation. One HDD for OS (e.g. VelociRapter) and a couple of HDD in RAID 0 or 5 for video data. Perhaps you will want a separate media storage server (in Norco RPC-4220).

tstones

06-06-09, 09:01 AM

Hi there guys,

Can you help-me, I want to build an htpc and after read too many pages i'm a little bit confused and I need your opinion.

AMD or Intel?

Asus M4A78-EM + Athlon 64 X2 7750 AM2+ Black Edition

or

Asus P5N7A-VM + Intel E 5200

One more doubt about the remote, i've see this CONCEPTRONIC USB Infra Red is good for an htpc or no? I want a remote with mouse function.

thanks in advance

renethx

06-06-09, 09:18 AM

@tstones

Audio requirement?

tstones

06-06-09, 10:00 AM

I have a creative 5.1 speaker sistem i'll think that the onboard sound card its enough

renethx

06-06-09, 10:30 AM

I have a creative 5.1 speaker sistem i'll think that the onboard sound card its enough
Then either one is good. Athlon II X2 250 is another choice (cooler and faster than 7750).

tstones

06-06-09, 10:48 AM

I've read your guide is fantastic congratulations;)

P5Q-EM or P5N7A-VM whats your personal choice?

And about power consumption Amd is better or the E5200 with asus EPU is the same thing??

i'll think i'll buy Intel system with nvdia card, and in the future buy a nvdia card to use hybrid sli, im not sure!

And about the remote any ideas, one that works with all systems and fully configurable to programs like foobar, media center classic, etc that works like a mouse

clobber

06-06-09, 11:22 AM

renethx

06-06-09, 11:28 AM

P5Q-EM or P5N7A-VM whats your personal choice?

And about power consumption Amd is better or the E5200 with asus EPU is the same thing??
P5Q-EM (obviously).

E5200.

renethx

06-06-09, 11:32 AM

What makes the Phenom II X2 550 ideal for midrange HTPC?
I changed my mind and will keep II X3 710 in the mid-range system. II X3 is better in overall performance. II X2 is a good choice if you want to save $20.

tstones

06-06-09, 11:34 AM

P5Q-EM (obviously).

E5200.

http://hothardware.com/Articles/NVIDIA-GeForce-9300-and-9400-Motherboard-GPUs/?page=10

http://www.extremetech.com/article2/0,2845,2333132,00.asp

Because??

Iteki

06-06-09, 01:54 PM

I changed my mind and will keep II X3 710 in the mid-range system. II X3 is better in overall performance. II X2 is a good choice if you want to save $20.

Ok, now I'm curious...

CPU/MOBO are my last two items to buy...I was looking at the X2 550 based on your original guestimation of it's speed. I was going to pair it with the GIGABYTE GA-MA790GP-UD4H.

The X3 is a triple core chip that lets you unlock the 4th core with the right BIOS, correct? And the X2 is a dual core that lets you unlock the other two, give the same BIOS?

With all cores unlocked, which is likely to be faster?

clobber

06-06-09, 02:01 PM

Ok, now I'm curious...

CPU/MOBO are my last two items to buy...I was looking at the X2 550 based on your original guestimation of it's speed. I was going to pair it with the GIGABYTE GA-MA790GP-UD4H.

The X3 is a triple core chip that lets you unlock the 4th core with the right BIOS, correct? And the X2 is a dual core that lets you unlock the other two, give the same BIOS?

With all cores unlocked, which is likely to be faster?

And regarding the unlocking of cores, can I do that on the recommended 780G GIGABYTE GA-MA78GM-US2H?

Actually, what makes that the recommended 780G board?

Marc_G

06-06-09, 02:58 PM

Creating MKV files is not so CPU-intensive unless you re-encode video (e.g. degrade compression or resolution). You will see no to little speed difference between Kuma (7750)+x86+4GB and Agena (9550)+x64+6GB.

Thanks Rene!

Little_Mike

06-06-09, 04:23 PM

Hi Rene,

I posted a while back about upgrading my card to an ATI 4670. Everything went well.

I'm trying to do play back via Windows 7 MC. I have all of the cover art xml files and everything looks great, but most of my collection is in different containers (some in mp4, MKV, AVI, etc). Alot of the audi is in either AC3 or AAC.

I'm having alot of stuttering problems when doing playback on the MKV h.264 files. I get so confused with all of the different codecs, etc. Also, MC won't even play a bunch of the files without tweaking registry files.

So my question is this: What should I do to my collection so that I can play everything in Windows 7 MC in 1080i? I have two TV's, one 1080p and one 1080i. I have two surround sound systems that support DTS and prologic II.

I'm thinking of remuxing my movies all into the same format. Do you know what the best container, Video format, and audio format will be for Windows 7 MC? I'm thinking MP4, h.264, and AAC. What are your thoughts? I have tried all different type of codec packages, like Shark007, CoreAVC, etc, and I can't get anything to give me smooth playback for all of my movies. I can't figure out what the hell I'm doing wrong. I want to get rid of external codecs all together, if this is possible.

Any help is once again greatly appreciated!
Mike

tstones

06-06-09, 05:27 PM

P5Q-EM (obviously).

E5200.

http://hothardware.com/Articles/NVIDIA-GeForce-9300-and-9400-Motherboard-GPUs/?page=10

http://www.extremetech.com/article2/0,2845,2333132,00.asp

Because??

Hi rene before any question i want to apreciatte your help, a big thanks, I just want to choose a mobo to mount my htpc, I've read about asus problems on 9300:(

I want a micro-atx board, can you give-me the best choice

I dont want to sound boring

9400 nvidia or G45 intel based and why you choose

GA-E7AUM-DS2H or P5Q-EM

Thanks in advance

Sorry for my bad english

renethx

06-07-09, 05:05 AM

P5Q-EM (obviously).
A correction (as I was confused with the model numbers). In general GeForce 9300/9400 is better than G45 in video playback (and 3D performance). So if you choose between the two, P5N7A-VM is better.

renethx

06-07-09, 05:12 AM

Ok, now I'm curious...

CPU/MOBO are my last two items to buy...I was looking at the X2 550 based on your original guestimation of it's speed. I was going to pair it with the GIGABYTE GA-MA790GP-UD4H.

The X3 is a triple core chip that lets you unlock the 4th core with the right BIOS, correct? And the X2 is a dual core that lets you unlock the other two, give the same BIOS?

With all cores unlocked, which is likely to be faster?
If you are going to unlock the blocked cores (there is no guarantee that you are successful), then 550 is obviously better as this is cheaper and BE.

renethx

06-07-09, 05:27 AM

And regarding the unlocking of cores, can I do that on the recommended 780G GIGABYTE GA-MA78GM-US2H?

Actually, what makes that the recommended 780G board?
Not every mb supports unlocking the blocked cores. The mb needs to support ACC (Advanced Clock Calibration; only SB750 and SB710 support it) and the BIOS code supports unblocking cores.

tstones

06-07-09, 07:02 AM

A correction (as I was confused with the model numbers). In general GeForce 9300/9400 is better than G45 in video playback (and 3D performance). So if you choose between the two, P5N7A-VM is better.

Thanks a lot Rene, after searching in the forum, the asus board P5N7A-VM has chipset over heat, many people have problems, so I think i'll go to the gigabyte solution with the 9400 chipset GA-E7AUM-DS2H is the best conbining stuff INTEL/NVIDIA

I've made my mind with your precious help

Motherard: Gigabyte - GA-E7AUM-DS2H
Processador: Intel E5200
Memória: Kingston DDR2 Hyper X 2GB 1066MHz CL5
Disco SAMSUNG 320GB SATA2 7.200 RPM 16MB
Disco 1TB WD Green retirado de um disco externo
Fonte Alim. CHIEFTEC 400W Big Fan PFC 20+ 4P ATX 2.0 BULK

This system beat amd 780G? What you think rene?

Thanks once again

btordini

06-07-09, 10:14 PM

Hello

First of all congratulations for this Forum, I believe it is awesome.

I am thinking of building an ATX High-End Intel/Intel system. I am very new, so I have a couple of questions.
1-The HIS H485QT512P Radeon HD 4850 GDDR3 512MB does not seem to have a HDMI output. Can you recomend a similar graphic card with this kind of output for this system?
2-If the Graphic Card has HDMI output, will the sound still come out of the regular audio output of the motherboard?
3-I have a set of Logitech Z5300e speakers that I have never used. Do you think I will get at least decent sound from the regular audio output of the motherboard?
4-The Zalman HD160 Plus ATX recomended for this system seems not to be sold by newegg anymore. Can I build this system with the Antec Fusion Remote Max ATX?
5-You do not recommend a wirless card in this site. Do you think that D-Link DWA-556 PCI Express Xtreme Desktop Adapter is good enough?

Thank you very much in advance.

Paul E. Fox, II

06-07-09, 10:29 PM

I was able to figure out (finally) my issues with the IMon stuff.

My oldest son and I pulled the case and moved the internal VFD connection from the 2nd USB slot on the MB to the 3rd and that did the trick. I have both IMon and IMedian working correctly now.

Once I get the HDMI/HDCP thing worked out I all good.

Everything else is doing fine and I'm happy. The HTPC is still silent...and I mean SILENT. Even sitting right next to it with the case open I can barely hear the fans. I haven't seen the internal temps hit anything about 30C and they seem to be averaging about 24C in fact. Is there such a thing as TOO cool?

Anyway, it was all thanks to this very thread and a little urging from a few people elsewhere on the tubes...I can finally begin the final migration from The Hoover and get that thing out of this room!

hahnyak

06-08-09, 12:01 AM

Hello Rene,

This is my first ever post. I feel like I know you as I have spent the past couple of weeks reading posts. I’m sure somewhere in this site most of these answers exist, sorry for any redundancy with my questions. I am a beginner (maybe intermediate, not sure?). My current knowledge is something like this (its okay to laugh): I can add and remove components like RAM, Hard Drives, Optical Drives, etc., and know enough to wipe and reinstall OS and programs. I love gadgets and like to tinker in various hobbies. Today I shoot and edit video for my son’s High School Lacrosse team (rendering takes forever on current system), and I thoroughly enjoy viewing HD movies currently in 1080i, (1080p coming soon). My current system plays in DTS 7.1 surround. I would like to save all my DVD’s and playback via hard drive. My overall goals are pretty much the same as most guys on this site, to download, save and playback the best possible video and listen to the best possible 7.1 audio. As you can see I am a beginner or so and very interested to build my first HTPC. My nature and desire is to build a premium system from the start, hoping I won’t have any regrets later “I wish I would have…” versus a low or medium budget system (not opposed to the later if that’s the right thing for this newbie). My fear is I won’t know what the heck I’m doing, get in over my head, and fail or quit with frustration? Do I need to be an IT, have a computer science engineering degree, or have years of electronic experience tackle this quest? This forum seems to offer many tools and folks like you to help along the way if needed. I’ve looked at Page 85 and examined your recommendations. Based on your experience and what I’ve just described, what do you think? Am I nuts, and should buy a finished retail product? Or have you seen guys like me succeed with their system builds? Any additional advice is appreciated. I do have a few specific questions below (not like I haven’t asked you a few already).

• Is it safer and easier building a low or medium budget system versus a premium system? Same amount of knowledge or more required for premium? I’m sure I would be ecstatically pleased with a medium budget system, but like the thoughts of premium.
• I see you are currently updating your recommended system builds. Are all the current systems on page 85 all up to date (or just some)? I wasn’t sure if these are the same combinations you recommended originally on your 07-07-08 post?
• Recently I read a press release regarding ASUS new uATX motherboard M4A78-HTPC/RC. Do you have an opinion yet on this motherboard? Would this be a better start and/or easier for me versus one of your recommended builds? Where would this motherboard rank on page 85, Low/Mid/High, or none of the above?
• You generously offer several Platform/Chipset combinations. I obviously have no preference or bias, can you give me your personal preferred combo. For me reliability, smoothness, quality, and the ability to run a variety of formats seem to be more important than a nano second. At the moment I have not found the urge to push and overclock (this might change soon; I don’t know where this will go?).
• Is HDMI the best way to playback video and audio from PC to system? Is optical a better source for audio?
• I might be jumping ahead, and this might be a useless question if you steer me a different direction. Your recommended ATX premium builds on pg 85, if using the GeForce GTX 275 card, can it be used as a non-SLI, or do you only recommend it for SLI use only in this application (two cards I believe)?
• Do you have an opinion of the Thermaltake DH-104 case versus SilverStone Crown CW02 SST-CW02S-MXR ATX? Which is better?

I genuinely appreciate your comments and direction.

dbone1026

06-08-09, 07:22 AM

bmcent1

06-08-09, 12:24 PM

The HTPC is still silent...and I mean SILENT. Even sitting right next to it with the case open I can barely hear the fans.

Hello Paul -
I tried to send you a PM, but it didn't show up in my sent mail, so not sure if you got it...

Can you comment on which case and power supply you used. Also if you used any non-stock fans or any other special noise reduction options.

Having a silent PC in the theater is one of my top considerations (next to video and sound quality) when I build my HTPC.

Thanks!

Paul E. Fox, II

06-08-09, 02:10 PM

WalkinPaul

06-08-09, 02:17 PM

I'm enjoying my new mini-ITX HTPC build recommendation from renethx that I built late last Friday night. THANKS RENETHX. Basically the mini-ITX gaming HTPC with out the video card. Just using the 9300 IGP, so far. I may add a gaming card since the Temps are good and the sound levels are great, but we'll see on that later. I can barely hear the thing in a silent room standing 2' from it. With the TV on and installed in a cabinet, it is completely silent. Except for the bright blue LEDs on the front of the Sugo 05 case, I don't even know it's there. I will probably put some electrical tape on that. The build was easy and the case has a lot of room. I didn't seem to have any of the cable problems that others have mentioned in the Zotac 9300 mini-itx MB thread, but I did take my time and laid everything out really nice and neat. Plenty of room for air flow in there.

Specs:
Intel Core 2 Duo E8400 Wolfdale 3.0GHz 6MB L2 Cache LGA 775 65W Dual-Core Processor - Retail $164.99
Stock Intel HeatSink - Included
ZOTAC GF9300-D-E LGA 775 NVIDIA GeForce 9300 HDMI WiFi Mini ITX Intel Motherboard - Retail $139.99
G.SKILL 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory - Retail $48.99
SILVERSTONE Sugo SG05-B Black SECC Steel Mini-ITX Tower Computer Case SFX 300W 80Plus Power Supply - Retail $99.99
Western Digital Caviar SE16 WD6400AAKS 640GB 7200 RPM 16MB Cache SATA 3.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drive - OEM $59.99
Windows bluetooth keyboard and mouse combo. (I already had these, ~$115)
Windows 7 RC 64 bit. Free (for now).

Waiting on LG Blu-Ray drive. $99.99 and external housing ~$40. (I plan to use this on other machines, so price is actually spread over different uses than just here).

Total: $613.94 + external housing.

Impressions:
The computer is small, powerful and very quiet. Could be smaller in a different chassis, but this one does have the ability to add a full size video card. WAF was very high. She really liked the size, how quiet it is, and the fact that the cables were limited to one network cable, one power cord and one HDMI cable. And the fact that it all fit (easily) inside the small cabinet of our new entertainment center. I'm using a wireless keyboard and mouse, so no other wires there either. It's attached to a 46" Samsung LCD display and the graphics are great. Hulu peaks out at about 30%, but only rarely, it's usually around 23%. Temperatures for the IGPU tops out about 130F and the 2 cores are around 123F each. The ambient temp in the room was 80F at the time. Looks like the heat will not be an issue, so far. Sound levels, what can I say, very quiet and way more than enough for me. With the doors open and sitting 8' away on the couch, I have to look at the light to see if it is on.

I look forward to using this in the future and feel free to ask any questions you may have on this build. All in all, a very nice build. :D

imatech

06-08-09, 02:58 PM

Renethx - great info on many threads and replies to questions (you make building a HTPC much easier.)

I am hoping you might be able to help me (or direct me to an thread where some information already exists) with connecting my HTPC to my HDTV. I have 2 type of Panasonic TVs and am not able to get satisfactory connections on either.

My HTPC is as follows:

CPU: Phenom II X3 710 HDX710WFGIBOX 2.6GHz AM3.
Motherboard: GIGABYTE GA-MA78GM-US2H
Memory: DDR2-1066 2 x 2GB Kit
Graphic card: On board GPU
Case: Antec Fusion Remote Black microATX

HDTV's:
Panasonic PT-50DL54 (DLP with 1 HDMI input)
Panasonic TH-C54FD18 (3 HDMI inputs)

O/S: Windows 7RC 64Bit

I have attempted to connect to both TV through the HDMI output. Both have very severe image flicker. I have set the graphics output (via ATI Catalyst control) to each sets native resolution (720P for the DLP and 1080p for the plasma) with no success in achieving a stable image. No adjustments tried have yielded a stable image.

I connected using the RGB inputs of both TV`s with more success. However, the DLP will only shows 4:3 ratio image when connected by a RGB cable (limitation of the TV, best display is XGA60 -1024x768) and the plasma`s image does not appear to have the correct ratios.

My questions are:

i) Is connecting from HDMI a known issue with Panasonic TV`s (haven`t got much help from Panasonic)?
ii) Any suggestion on what I could try to problem solve my connection issues?
iii) Would a separate graphics card offer more adjustment than the on-board Radeon 3200?
iv) Is it possible W7RC is an issue?

Let me know if you need more information to help? If information exist that I could go to I would appreciate your direction (I have tried searching multiple threads and haven't been able to find anything that helps.

Little_Mike

06-08-09, 04:08 PM

I assume you cleared out any installed codecs before installing new ones to avoid conflicts ? I installed Shark007's codec pack (I am running W7 x64) and have smooth playback of all my 1080p h.264 mkvs. Also, check out www.Hack7MC.com for some great info on codecs (http://www.hack7mc.com/2009/02/mkvs-for-minimalists-on-windows-7.html)

That's a great read, thanks. I have uninstalled all Win7 Codecs and retried, i'm still having problems.

I have actually had some success with removing the ATI Driver and using the Win7 Driver instead. I'm not sure if this is a good idea or not.

Thanks

dbone1026

06-08-09, 04:12 PM

That's a great read, thanks. I have uninstalled all Win7 Codecs and retried, i'm still having problems.

I have actually had some success with removing the ATI Driver and using the Win7 Driver instead. I'm not sure if this is a good idea or not.

Thanks

Hmmm, not sure what it could be. Here are the steps I did for my W7 x64 install:

http://dbone1026.blogspot.com/2009/06/windows-7-rc-install.html

You have had success playing back these files prior to W7 I assume (just wanted to make sure it is not a network or file prob)?

tlguapo

06-08-09, 04:39 PM

ccd

06-08-09, 05:05 PM

Wondering why the Guide recommends the SilverStone CW02 case instead of the less expensive GDOMX case. What does the CW02 offer for the extra money that the GDOMX lacks?

renethx

06-08-09, 05:28 PM

Wondering why the Guide recommends the SilverStone CW02 case instead of the less expensive GDOMX case. What does the CW02 offer for the extra money that the GDOMX lacks?
GD01MX?

CW02 supports longer gaming graphics cards.

ccd

06-08-09, 06:04 PM

Renethx:

You are correct, I meant the GDO1MX.

Thanks for the quick response. I looked at user reviews at Newegg and people seem to really like the construction quality of the CW02. The common complaint about the GDO1MX had to do with the limited range of the remote. My only hesitation with the CW02 apart from price, is that I prefer a panel to cover the drives so I don't have to deal with sticking a panel on the end of the optical drive. From a prior build (not the CW02, the panel you stick on the end of the optical drive to match the case always seemed kind of flimsy and probably prone to come off at some point.

Again thanks!

WalkinPaul

06-08-09, 06:58 PM

Nice job. How about some pics? Do you run the PC inside a closed cabinet? Sounds like it would get kind of hot in there, no?

Yes, The pc is in a cabinet. I have some pics. Probably more than one way to get computer to screen, but this is the way I chose to do it. I usually crack the doors open a bit. Hasn't got too hot yet. I'm planning on cutting some vent holes across the back of the cabinet soon. Cabinet is 43"W x 15"H x 17.5"D. Cabinet also contains an XBOX and power brick, a Directv hd box, and a Denon Receiver (not in pics). I'm moving the XBox power brick outside the cabinet. It gets pretty hot with the xbox running and the doors closed. I don't run all the equipment at the same time. I'm getting new speakers, so the Denon may/will be running real soon w/ the 1 other equipment running too. PC has been running pretty cool so far. I'm using the nVidia system tools to monitor it.

I got my multimeter & temp probe out. I'll take some readings a little later and post them here if anyone is interested.

kampswas

06-08-09, 07:57 PM

Paul E. Fox, II

06-08-09, 08:00 PM

Hello Paul -
I tried to send you a PM, but it didn't show up in my sent mail, so not sure if you got it...

Can you comment on which case and power supply you used. Also if you used any non-stock fans or any other special noise reduction options.

Having a silent PC in the theater is one of my top considerations (next to video and sound quality) when I build my HTPC.

Thanks!

I tried to do this at work since I ended up with a few extra minutes at the end of the day but a nasty thunderstorm rolled through before I could get everything posted and BING! went the power...

I'll start over here:)

Fans (purchased 2 to replace the fans that come with the case):
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835185004

PSU:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139004

Case:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811129053

RAM (probably didn't need 4GB but that's what I wanted):
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820211188

As I said, I decided to go with the Intel 9550 Quad Core CPU as this PC will also be used for some other tasks and I don't want to have to upgrade for a little while.

I was kinda worried about the CPU temperature since I was going off spec but according to the Gigabyte ET6 utility, I'm currently running at 22/23C for the CPU and 34/35C for the system.

I'm really happy with that. Rene mentioned that it was a bit cool but so far, it seems to be working well. I've never experienced the problem of having a PC run too cool before:)!

Hope this helps!

WalkinPaul

06-08-09, 08:18 PM

Yes, The pc is in a cabinet...
I got my multimeter & temp probe out. I'll take some readings a little later and post them here if anyone is interested.

Temps: With doors closed and pc at idle and 81F ambient in living room. The Temp is 88F in cabinet after about 20 minutes. Didn't read pc specs. With doors open about 2 inches and playing Hulu at full screen resolution, for about 35-45 minutes. Cabinet is 92, cpu1 = 111.2F, cpu2 = 114.8F, GPU 118.4f, motherboard 118.4F. I wouldn't recommend this setup, but all things considered, this is not too bad a reading.

My A/C is not working the greatest, but this is about as hot as it gets in my house when no one is here and is usually about 77 or cooler normally, so temps should be lower than these reading. Though, computer could be under more of a load at other times too. I'm planning on using my router and cutting some 1" x 1' slots across the top of the back of the cabinet. The doors probably leak enough around the edges for a pretty good flow of air. I'll try to remember to post back some temps after I do that. YMMV.

duff99

06-08-09, 08:56 PM

supapowa

06-08-09, 11:34 PM

renethx

06-09-09, 04:43 AM

Hi Rene

Based on this Motherboard could you give me a recommendation to include

Already Purchased -
GIGABYTE GA-EP45-UD3R LGA 775 Intel P45 ATX Intel Motherboard -

CASE I would like HTCP Profile versus tower but would go with tower if price dictates
VIDEO CARD
CPU
Cable Card for watching HD Dual Tuner
AUDIO CARD
Memory
Power Supply
Hard Drive 1TB
Blue Ray Player
FAN

I am looking to play games basics nothing super intensive as far as Gaming, Play Hulu, stream netflix and have it 7.1 surround sound play BLue Ray DIVX burned files. My audio set up is through an ONKYO HT-S6100 with an Epson Home Cinema 6100 1080p

Budget around 1000. Mind you I already have the Motherboard.
Basically I recommend the ATX mid-range Intel/Intel system:

VIDEO CARD: Sapphire HD 4670 GDDR4 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102818), $75
CPU: Core 2 Duo E7400, $120
Cooler: The stock cooler is usually enough as E7400 runs very cool. Or Cooler Master Geminii S, $35 or Xigmatek HDT-SD964, $23.
CableCard: Basically you can't use CableCard in a self-built system. A normal TV tuner: Hauppauge WinTV-HVR-2250, $133 (OEM is cheaper without IR receiver/remote), or Silicondust HDHomeRun (a networked device), $169.
AUDIO CARD: Use the HDMI audio built in HD 4670
Memory: A-DATA ADQVE1B16K DDR2-800 2 x 2GB Kit, $47.
Power Supply: Corsair CMPSU-450VX, $60 AR
Hard Drive 1TB: WD WD1001FALS, $100. Or separate the OS drive from data drives (e.g. WD6400AAKS [100GB partition for OS, the rest for scratch], $70, and a bunch of WD10EADS, $90, or WD15EADS, $135, for data)
Blue Ray Player: LG GGC-H20L (BD/HD DVD read and DVD write), $110 or LG GGW-H20L (plus BD write), $180
Case: Antec Fusion Remote Max, $180. Or any tower case you like (Cooler Master RC-690-KKN1-GP, $70, Antec Nine Hundred Two, $120 etc.)
OS: Windows 7 RC (free through February 2009)
BD player: ArcSoft TotalMedia 3 Platinum, $90
BD ripping utility (optional): SlySoft AnyDVD HD, $121 (liftetime subscription)

bmcent1

06-09-09, 08:26 AM

I tried to do this at work since I ended up with a few extra minutes at the end of the day but a nasty thunderstorm rolled through before I could get everything posted and BING! went the power...

Thanks for posting those links! I will definitely go with those 120mm fans, hard to believe <9 db!

One question on the case... is it easy within Windows (or one of the HTPC apps) to map the volume knob so something useful? The case looks kind of like a receiver, but since I'd be using it more like a jukebox for ripped DVDs, would be cool if that knob could scroll through a list of movies or something similar.

bmcent1

06-09-09, 08:37 AM

Basically I recommend the ATX mid-range Intel/Intel system:

VIDEO CARD: Sapphire HD 4670 GDDR4 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102818), $75

Renethx -
Can you address, briefly, why you prefer the Intel/Intel with Radeon card over the Intel/Nvidia solution? I see there's no adequate combo in the ATX size range, but at mATX, it looks like both options are on the table.

I've always been a little partial to nVidia, and I also see that it seems to perform better on DB@24fps according to your chart on p85.

What are the issues/concerns for ATI with BD@24fps? Do you see them improving soon?

renethx

06-09-09, 09:53 AM

Renethx -
Can you address, briefly, why you prefer the Intel/Intel with Radeon card over the Intel/Nvidia solution? I see there's no adequate combo in the ATX size range, but at mATX, it looks like both options are on the table.

I've always been a little partial to nVidia, and I also see that it seems to perform better on DB@24fps according to your chart on p85.

What are the issues/concerns for ATI with BD@24fps? Do you see them improving soon?
Simply becasue the original poster already has an Intel chipset (P45) mb. ATI@24fps is basically no problem with the aide of ReClock.

hahnyak

06-09-09, 11:55 AM

duff99 and supapowa,

Thank you for your replies and help. I will take both your advice and spend a little more time reading and become more educated. I'm thinking of giving it a shot. I'm leaning toward more a mid system and not premium. If I’m successful, the odds are this won’t be my last system. I’ll probably get hooked if not already.

renethx,

Sorry about the long post and many questions. I will keep my future posts shorter as suggested by duff99. I want you to know I won't be a leach for free info. I understand your research is costly and I plan to contribute a donation soon to help keep it alive.

Thanks to all.

Paul E. Fox, II

06-09-09, 12:37 PM

Thanks for posting those links! I will definitely go with those 120mm fans, hard to believe <9 db!

One question on the case... is it easy within Windows (or one of the HTPC apps) to map the volume knob so something useful? The case looks kind of like a receiver, but since I'd be using it more like a jukebox for ripped DVDs, would be cool if that knob could scroll through a list of movies or something similar.

I haven't seen anything in the software that allows the volume control to be anything other than volume but since I only recently got the IMon software working properly, I don't know. I don't plan on using that anyway since this is completely hooked into my HT and I have other volume options available between the keyboard and the receiver.

stevedlk

06-09-09, 01:38 PM

Hi all,
I hope these don't come off as stupid.
My TV is a 720p plasma. I have resolution set at 768x1360 (ATI 4850)
so I can read the screen, old eyes! The card also lets me set res at 1080X1920. When playing a file and setting it to full screen, I can't see any difference?

When surfing the net or having a lot of white on the screen, I notice the the heat from the plasma is hotter than watching cable or a movie from my stand alone player. Is brighter hotter? I watch In "cinema" mode.

If this is wrong forum please direct me to right one.

ryanmack

06-09-09, 02:09 PM

I have an ASUS M3N78 Pro Motherboard (GeForce 8300) HDMI to an Onkyo TX-SR607 Receiver HDMI to a JVC D-ILA LCOS screen.
1. When I have the display set to its native resolution (1920x1080) I experience overscan. I use the GeForce control panel to do a resize and it looks perfect. The problem is, the JVC display will black-out and resync during certain events, like when Vista UAC needs confirmation. This only happens with the custom resolutions, not 1920x1080.
2. Windows sounds over HDMI are SUPER SOFT, SUPER QUIET. Vista Media Center, Internet Explorer, Media Center with mp3s, etc all play normal levels. It's just the windows sounds that I can barely hear unless I crank-up the AVR volume.

UPDATE: I fixed Issue #1 by swapping my old HDMI cables with 1.3b cables and turning on lip-sync and deep color on the receiver

sokkaNET

06-09-09, 04:16 PM

I have finally bought components to build a new HTPC, I went with the high end Intel/Intel. It includes the GIGABYTE GA-EP45-UD3P motherboard and Zalman CNPS9500cpu cooler.

I have now tried for some time to get this cooler on this motherboard, but I can't see how it's possible to fit.

I would like some advice from someone that already has this mobo and this cooler, to see if there is some tweak, or something that can solve my problem.

According to the instructions, the plastic clip support, is to be mounted "properly orineted on the hinged side of the Socket Lever when installing". If this would be possible, I guess I could change the CPU without taking off the clip support. Anyways, there is no chance it can be mounted like this. The image to the left here (http://www.mypicx.com/06092009/zalman_cooler/), shows that it can't fit.

It is possible to mount the clip support, but only if I rotate it, as seen on the middle picture. However, when it is mounted, I'm supposed to get the clip connected with the lug on the clip support. However it does not fit, as there is a (eletric thingy, but I can't recall what it's called) on the mobo right underneath the lug. On the picture to the left, I have moved the clip support a little to show the thingy.

tlguapo

06-09-09, 05:49 PM

renethx

06-09-09, 09:03 PM

renethx

06-09-09, 09:11 PM

So I think I'll be able to land a GIGABYTE GA-EP45-UD3P mobo with a Core Duo CPU. It comes with a Geforce 8800GTS. Can anyone confirm whether I'll be able to use a DVI to HDMI converter and also get audio sent over the HDMI with this GPA? I've seen how it works on the ATI side, but I can't seem to figure out if it works the same way with the Geforce.
If your graphics card has a 2-pin S/PDIF connector, then HDMI audio is possible by connecting it to the mb's internal S/PDIF connector. The supported HDMI audio would be then the same as the onboard audio codec ALC889A, that is, stereo LPCM, DD and DTS.

Frogger42

06-09-09, 11:23 PM

Hi all,

This is my first post after reading and doing some substantial thought. My end goal that I would like to accomplish would be to have a central media server that serves high definition blu-ray rips to various clients.

My proposed server
CPU: Athlon X2 7750
MB: ASUS M3A78-EM
Graphics Card: Onboard Graphics
Optical Drive: LG Black LG Blu-ray/HD DVD-ROM & 16X DVD±R DVD Burner
HDD: 1 x 500GB SATA Barracuda 7200.12, 2 x 1.5TB SATA Barracuda 7200.11 (more to come in the future as collection expands)
Memory: 4GB (2 x 2GB) Dual Channel DDR2-800 SDRAM
PSU: ??? Suggestions

Here are my requirements:
* Rip Blu-Ray discs to HD
* Rip HD-DVD discs to HD
* Rip DVD discs to HD
* Stream all content to multiple clients (Currently PS3, possible to stream to PopcornHour or other devices?)
* No gaming
* No CrossFire
* No RAID

I currently have a PS3 and a large collection of Blu-Ray and HD-DVD discs, in addition to a collection of standard DVDs. I would like to rip them all to a single source without any compression. I would like to then watch the files from my PS3 and in the future another tv with a PopcornHour. Is this feasible? What kind of hardware do I need? What can I expect for playback from the PS3 or PopcornHour? Will I need an HTPC to realize full HD playback?

Thanks for any and all help.

sokkaNET

06-10-09, 03:50 AM

@sokkaNET

The orientation of the plastic clip support is wrong. The clip support must be rotated 180 degree in the second picture (but this does not matter actually as you have to remove the clip support in order to change CPU anyway). A twist is that you mount the bent side of the clip to the clip support first before attaching the clip support to the mb.

It is possible to mount it while rotated 180 degrees. It is not a perfect fit, but it can be done, be pushing a little bit hard. However, the lug on the clip support will get in contact with the blue metal thing (with the ultra durable text). I guess that's ok.
However, the clip itself will also get in contact with the eletrical thingy, that is placed on the mobo right underneath where the lug is. In fact, it will push the eletrical thingy down a little. Is that ok?

renethx

06-10-09, 04:06 AM

However, the clip itself will also get in contact with the eletrical thingy, that is placed on the mobo right underneath where the lug is. In fact, it will push the eletrical thingy down a little. Is that ok?
Capacitors (http://www.google.com/images?hl=en&q=capacitor) or enclosed inductors (http://www.google.com/images?hl=en&q=enclosed+inductor)? Then no problem.

sokkaNET

06-10-09, 05:06 AM

Capacitors (http://www.google.com/images?hl=en&q=capacitor) or enclosed inductors (http://www.google.com/images?hl=en&q=enclosed+inductor)? Then no problem.

Not sure what it's called. I have uploaded 2 pictures here (http://www.mypicx.com/06102009/more_pics/). It sure is something that is enclosed, so I guess it's not a problem that one of will be pushed a little ?

renethx

06-10-09, 05:39 AM

Not sure what it's called. I have uploaded 2 pictures here (http://www.mypicx.com/06102009/more_pics/). It sure is something that is enclosed, so I guess it's not a problem that one of will be pushed a little ?
Little pushing is no problem unless it cracks the enclosure. (Or rotate the clip support 90 degree?)

sokkaNET

06-10-09, 05:46 AM

Little pushing is no problem unless it cracks the enclosure. (Or rotate the clip support 90 degree?)

Impossible to rotate 90 degrees. Can not fit!

dbone1026

06-10-09, 07:52 AM

I currently have a PS3 and a large collection of Blu-Ray and HD-DVD discs, in addition to a collection of standard DVDs. I would like to rip them all to a single source without any compression. I would like to then watch the files from my PS3 and in the future another tv with a PopcornHour. Is this feasible? What kind of hardware do I need? What can I expect for playback from the PS3 or PopcornHour? Will I need an HTPC to realize full HD playback?

Thanks for any and all help.

Welcome Frogger. For the Popcornhour you will need to wrap your BluRay/HD DVD collection into a container like mkv or ts/m2ts. With Blu Ray you can either just pull out the main m2ts or use a program like Clown_BD or ToNMT to handle to m2ts/ts (if the Blu Ray is branched chain you will need to do this anyhow). If you want to just wrap in mkv you can use MakeMKV or other tools as well. There is no compression involved in this. You didn't mention but of course you will need a decrypter like AnyDVD or DVD Fab to rip your disks.

I haven't really messed around with my PS3 as I have an HTPC that I use to play back my media. The PS3 does not support mkv, so you would need a program like TVersity or PS3 Media Server to transcode if you use the mkv container. Also, and can someone confirm, is there a file size limit on what the PS3 can play back (I thought I read back in the day that it could not play back a file larger then 4GB, not sure if that is true)?

UPDATE - Frogger, just rereading your post, you mentioned playback of Standard DVDs. The PS3 will not handle this in its native format (Video_TS). One option would be to join all the vobs into one large vob using VOBMerge, and then convert to MPEG using VOB2MPG. You will lose the DVD Menu, etc... but will be able to play back on the PS3 without any encoding. Unfortunately the PS3 is not that versatile when it comes to playing back various file formats. The PCH can handle most anything. The stock UI is kinda ugly to deal with but there are a lot of addins that you can use (such as YAMJ) to spruce up the UI. Also, on 15-Jun there should a new PCH model announced (from the looks of it a little more high end that the current A110).

amitabh9

06-10-09, 08:49 AM

Hello

Long time reader of this forum and must say that i truly love it. I am finally upgrading my HTPC, its time to join the HD world.

So i have decided on the following items.

Intel CPU E7400
Gigabyte EP45-UD3P
G Skill 4 gigs ram - Adata is sold out.
Silverstone LC17 - already own
Enermax Liberty 500W - given to me for free
V/C - given to me for free - i think its a ati 4850 or 4870
Windows 7 O/S

I guess my issue lies with cooling. What is a good heatsink/fan that can fit inside the LC17?
Should i live with a stock heatsink/fan?

I was originally thinking of getting the xigmatek s1284. But it doesnt fit. I have contact xigmatek and they recommended HDT-S983. Now, i dont know what to get.

How else would i go about quieting/cooling it. Anyone have any pictures from a LC17 build? specifically around the CPU area

renethx

06-10-09, 09:22 AM

@amitabh9

Xigmatek HDT-SD964 fits the case and the mb fine. The stock cooler is good too.

amitabh9

06-10-09, 09:53 AM

@renethx

Thank you.

Question, as i may be reading the website (xigmatek) incorrectly. The dimensions (HDTSD964) mentioned on the website are "92(W) x 51(H) x 133(D) mm" Is the height 133mm and not 51mm.

My reference is a desktop case, so i believe in my case it would be 133.

Also, do you prefer Xigmatek? what about Scythe Ninja Mini? any thoughts? I guess im just looking for options.

renethx

06-10-09, 10:22 AM

51(H) is the 'height' when the cooler is placed in a tower case. When placed in a desktop case, the height is 133 mm.

Either of them (Intel, Xigmatek, Scythe) is OK.

amitabh9

06-10-09, 10:52 AM

anything better than "OK"

if intel and xigmatek are both "ok" then why spend the extra $50 for third party product in a HD htpc only application?

renethx

06-10-09, 11:06 AM

Xigmatek is $23 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835233014). My 'OK' is not satisfactory (C) but good (B).

amitabh9

06-10-09, 11:19 AM

sorry, my pricing reference is C$.

Thanx for your input. I may lean towards the Xigmatek.

mgsxf

06-10-09, 12:30 PM

Hi all, I'm new to this board and have been reading up this thread.
Thanks Rene for all the support, this is the best HTPC thread ever.

My issue below:
I'm trying to build a HTPC following as close as possible to one of the m-atx mid-range but I couldn't build INTEL/NVIDIA system as there's hardly any 9300/9400 board available at my place.

I would like to stay the intel course, but G45 is a bit too expensive. Can I use just any other cheaper mobo (such as G41/G31) since I'm putting in the Sapphire 4670 ddr4? Or would I be better off with the ATI/AMD set instead?

C E Jones

06-10-09, 01:18 PM

Rene,

Thanks again for this amazing guide and your responses to my questions. My HTPC is now up and running, blu-ray is looking great. I just have on question about cooling. I'm using the Silverstone LC17B case and the Gigabyte Ep43-ED3L motherboard. The case comes with two case fans and both have 3-pin connectors. However, one of the mobo's 2 "system fan" sockets has 3 pins, and the other has 4. There's also a "pwr fan" socket that has 3 pins, and of course a CPU fan socket with 4 pins. I was wondering whether it's possible to plug a 3-pin fan cable into a 4-pin socket. Also, you recommended the Gelid fan y-cable as a way of installing extra fans. According to its specs it has 4-pin connections. Would I be able to use this with 3-pin fans? And would I plug it into the CPU fan socket, then plug the CPU fan and 1 of the case fans to the the two other ends?

Actually the computer is running cool enough with 1 case fan running for now, but I just want to be ready for when I start adding more HDDS and 1 or 2 PCI devices.

renethx

06-10-09, 01:27 PM

I would like to stay the intel course, but G45 is a bit too expensive. Can I use just any other cheaper mobo (such as G41/G31) since I'm putting in the Sapphire 4670 ddr4? Or would I be better off with the ATI/AMD set instead?
There are many cheap, but good G31/G41 chipset mbs. For example, GIGABYTE GA-G31M-ES2L (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128357), $53. E7400 is supported (but only 2 DIMMs, only 4 SATA ports).

renethx

06-10-09, 01:41 PM

I'm using the Silverstone LC17B case and the Gigabyte Ep43-ED3L motherboard. The case comes with two case fans and both have 3-pin connectors. However, one of the mobo's 2 "system fan" sockets has 3 pins, and the other has 4. There's also a "pwr fan" socket that has 3 pins, and of course a CPU fan socket with 4 pins. I was wondering whether it's possible to plug a 3-pin fan cable into a 4-pin socket. Also, you recommended the Gelid fan y-cable as a way of installing extra fans. According to its specs it has 4-pin connections. Would I be able to use this with 3-pin fans? And would I plug it into the CPU fan socket, then plug the CPU fan and 1 of the case fans to the the two other ends?

Actually the computer is running cool enough with 1 case fan running for now, but I just want to be ready for when I start adding more HDDS and 1 or 2 PCI devices.
Gelid fan y-cable works fine with 3-pin fans too. Connect:

Two case fans -> Gelid Y-cable -> SYS_FAN2

and control their speeds by SpeedFan (read Installing and Running SpeedFan (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=12249676#Installing%20and%20Running%20Speed Fan) and Using SpeedFan (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=12249676#Using%20SpeedFan)).

J.C

06-10-09, 02:21 PM

Hi, many thanks for the great post, i've had a good read through especially from p85. I just have a few questions:

1. I wanted to use an old Radeon 3850 512mb card in the mid-range system. Would this graphics card alow me to watch 1080p mkv's?

2. My only confusion really is on the ideal mobo and cpu combo. All I need to do on my system is play (legally) downloaded 1080p content. I'm going with the Antec Fusion case and 4gb of RAM, just unsure of the rest.

Any help would be much appriciated.

James

renethx

06-10-09, 02:27 PM

J.C

06-10-09, 02:34 PM

1. Yes, although its HDMI audio does not support multichannel LPCM.

2. The CPU/mb combo of any system on page 85 should be good to playback 1080p contents.

Thanks for the quick reply.

I'm not too bothered about how good the sound is, its more video quality.

Out of interest do you have a personal favourite at the moment? ;)

ClemsonKev

06-10-09, 02:52 PM

ejkeebler

06-10-09, 03:28 PM

basically i think i'm going with the micro-ATX mid range amd/nvidia as suggested! I was just wondering if I have forgotten anything. I had an SD system and will be upgrading to an HDTV and need to upgrade the computer as well as it is about 5 years old now. Just wondering if anyone any pros or cons with any of this equipment working with SageTV or Windows 7. Or if there are any suggestions or anything I'm missing. Currently I am able to receive SD through a splitter to 3 tuners in my single PC and 1 to the TV. That was plenty of tuners, i think missing 1 will not be noticeable.

Antec NSK2480 Case w/ 380w Power Supply 119.99
ASUS M3N78-EM motherboard - 89.99
Hauppauge HVR-2250 - 112.99
ASUS 9500GT - 64.99 w/ $15 MIR
Crucial 4GB(2 x 2GB) DDR2-800 - 40.99
AMD Phenom II X3 710 - 119.00
Sony Black 2X BD-ROM SATA - 74.99

I have a logitech 880 and will have 2 1TB WD drives.

thougths? anything missing?

renethx

06-10-09, 04:17 PM

Out of interest do you have a personal favourite at the moment? ;)
Athlon X2 5050e+GA-MA78GM-US2H is good.

renethx

06-10-09, 04:23 PM

I already have analog and QAM HD working fine on my PC which I stream to a DMA2200 and xbox360.

Can I add another tv tuner and plug in a feed from a Dish set top box if I buy their turbo HD package?
(Can analog cable, QAM cable and satellite all coexist on Media Center at once?)
DISH channels are ecrypted so that Hauppauge HD PVR is practically the only way to capture recordings into PC (read also TV tuner section on page 1 for other methods).

rajivs

06-10-09, 06:14 PM

Wow a lot of great info.

Would the following configuration suffice if I'll just be watching BD, HD-DVD, DVD, and other stored content? (No games.)

GIGABYTE GA-E7AUM-DS2H (NVIDIA GeForce 9400 HDMI chipset)
Intel Core 2 Duo E8500 Wolfdale 3.16GHz
4Gb RAM

The HDMI will output to a projector.

I may eventually add a superior graphics card for image/video editing.

Thanks

chuckvb

06-11-09, 01:02 PM

I'm looking to help a friend build a system and need some advice on the motherboard. It will be a HTCP mainly but could later be used as a spare gaming machine after the addition of a addin video card. What motherboard would be the right choice on a new build today?

bmcent1

06-11-09, 01:18 PM

So excited to start purchasing the parts and starting my HTPC build, but got caught up on something...

Whether I choose a dGPU or iGPU option (based on one of the low-end or medium) builds recommended on p85...

Does regular audio go out the HDMI cable to the receiver also, or is that ONLY for BD or DVD content?

I really want to play Pandora.com through my HTPC and AVR combo. Will I need a separate audio connection (like an optical cable) to do that or will the HDMI carry audio supplied via a web browser as well?

dbone1026

06-11-09, 01:27 PM

bmcent1

06-11-09, 03:51 PM

renethx

06-11-09, 05:45 PM

Thanks for the affirmation dbone.

Question relating to chipset and video card. I was confused earlier when I said I wanted to build an Intel/Nvidia system. I've always built Intel/Intel systems in the past (CPU and Chipset.) Heck, I built a Cyrix chip based system a long time ago but that's probably before most of ya'lls time ;-)

Is there any benefit to the Nvidia chipset over the Intel/Intel system?

Why does it seem more people are choosing Radeon 4670 over the nVidia GeForce 9500? Seems like 4670 is far more popular/chosen more frequently in this thread.

Why is excellent BD@24fps support mutually exclusive SD support? (Based on the charts on p85)

Does BD@24fps matter if you are using .mkv ripped blu-ray? Is that something you can handle in ripping / transcoding so that it's not a factor during playback?
Performance difference between Intel chipset and NVIDIA chipset is minor. Many people prefer NVIDIA just because of better IGP. In chipset without GPU, Intel is more popular (NVIDIA will be retiring from this area).

GeForce 9500 GT (or any other NVIDIA dGPU) lacks HDMI audio controller. Perhaps this is the biggest reason why ATI is more popular in this forum.

Smooth playback of films (24 fps) at 24 Hz vs. 60 Hz is independent of resolutions (1080, 720, 480 etc.), video codecs (H.264, VC-1, MPEG-2 etc.) or container (Blu-ray [M2TS], MKV, DVD [VOB], MP4 etc.). At the final stage of video processing, all video signals are converted to raw progressive frames @1080, 24fps/1.001. ATI is excellent at 24 Hz, but often needs ReClock.

wlo

06-11-09, 11:34 PM

Hi Renethx,

If GF9500GT video card is lacking the audio controller, will the GF8200 on board video on Asus M3N78-VM mother board as suggested on P85 has this problem too ? I just bought this card and am awaiting for the delivery. I thought it can do at least LPCM supporting 7.1 channel TrueHD/DTS-MA via HDMI and DD / DTS core signal can pass throught HDMI ? Do I need any special (third party) drivers to do the audio part or it comes with the video card already ?

Many thanks.

slowlybuilt

06-12-09, 12:28 AM

I'm really enjoying my HTPC, but the noise is really starting to bother me. I have it behind a huge puffy couch which has about a 48 inch back. It sits about 3 feet from my primary viewing seat but I can still hear it during quiet passages. I've used my SPL meter and read ~56 decibels a couple of inches from the case.

I'm trying to figure out the most economical way of reducing the noise. The case fan I put in is the very quiet Scythe S-Flex 800 RPM. I'm fairly certain that's not the problem.

My PSU came with this case (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811124118) and I'm using the stock fan that came with my AMD Kuma 7750.

I'm hoping I only have to swap out one of these parts to reduce the noise. I'm thinking it is the PSU that is the problem and that I should replace it with this one (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139003) which I can get for $50 after rebate.

Is this the cheapest way to reduce the noise? Is there another way to make my HTPC quieter without spending so much money?

Thanks for any tips anyone has!

*edit*
What about this one (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/rebates/B001LRPNAI/sr=1-1/qid=1244782252/ref=dp_rebates_1?ie=UTF8&m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&s=electronics&qid=1244782252&sr=1-1)? Is this PSU just as quiet? It is only $30 after rebate.

renethx

06-12-09, 03:55 AM

renethx

06-12-09, 04:02 AM

Marc_G

06-12-09, 06:26 AM

slowlybuilt

06-12-09, 06:32 AM

A typical example of 'you get what you paid for'. CMPSU-450VX is very good. This article (http://www.anandtech.com/showdoc.aspx?i=3487&p=44) is a good read.

Check also the rpm of your CPU cooler. If it runs at > 1500 rpm, it may be noisy.

The PSU reviews on anandtech are for the ModXStream 0r MXS from OCZ, the unit I have listed is the StealthXStream or SXS from OCZ. The MXS got favorable numbers, but I can't seem to find infor about the SXS.

During start up my BIOS lists the CPU cooler at >3200, I'm not sure where to find that speed after windows loads. I have however unplugged the PSU cooler while it was running and did not notice much of a change in noise levels, so I'm going to replace the PSU first and see what happens.

I just can't figure out if the OCZ SXS and the OCZ MXS are similar in noise levels. If they are the same, then the OCZ would beat the Corsair by $20 and offer similar performance levels.

renethx

06-12-09, 06:44 AM

During start up my BIOS lists the CPU cooler at >3200, I'm not sure where to find that speed after windows loads. I have however unplugged the PSU cooler while it was running and did not notice much of a change in noise levels, so I'm going to replace the PSU first and see what happens.
Unplugged the CPU cooler? Which mb are you using? Each mb has its own Windows hardware monitor utility. Or use SpeedFan.

slowlybuilt

06-12-09, 07:11 AM

Unplugged the CPU cooler? Which mb are you using? Each mb has its own Windows hardware monitor utility. Or use SpeedFan.

I unplugged the its power cable from the mb temporarily, just to see how much noise it was generating. After this test I reconnected it. The mb is a Biostar TA790GX 128MB.

renethx

06-12-09, 07:37 AM

I unplugged the its power cable from the mb temporarily, just to see how much noise it was generating. After this test I reconnected it. The mb is a Biostar TA790GX 128MB.
Install 'HW Monitor' from the setup CD.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=145074&stc=1&d=1244806614

slowlybuilt

06-12-09, 08:41 AM

Install 'HW Monitor' from the setup CD.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=145074&stc=1&d=1244806614

The CPU fan is running at about 3375, the NB fan (which I think is the header I plugged my case fan into) is running at 875.

Sys is a cool 24C and the CPU is an icy 25C. Well I know that's not super cool, but relatively speaking.

I know the CPU fan is running fast, but after my little experiment, I still think it is the PSU fan this is noise problem.

bmcent1

06-12-09, 09:38 AM

I still think it is the PSU fan this is noise problem.

Probably not the best advice, so follow at your own risk, but...

The other day I booted up an OLD PC and it was very noisy. I wanted to see if the PSU fan was the culprit in my case. My PSU had a fan at the back of the case, I used a ball point pen to stop the fan blades. Unfortunately in my case, the noise was still there, but now I know it is not the PSU fan.

I used SpeedFan and determined the issue was my CPU cooling fan, if I cut it to 25% the noise almost went away. Now, this is a P4 3.2 MHz CPU and I'm guessing it would need to be underclocked and undervolted to run cool with so little fan air movement. I might try an aftermarket cooler if I can still find one for such an old chip.

As a side note, I HATE video card fans. Maybe they have gotten much better, but those used to be the biggest source is high pitched whining noise from PCs I built. I also had one or two of them wear out before any other case fans, and then they took the graphics card out when the cooling was broken (and I didn't know it.)

I'm STRONGLY leaning toward a fanless design for the graphics card in my HTPC. I believe with good case cooling, those cards are designed to run correctly at pretty high temps and work fine with passive cooling.

Paul E. Fox, II

06-12-09, 09:42 AM

Sys is a cool 24C and the CPU is an icy 25C. Well I know that's not super cool, but relatively speaking.

That's about where mine is staying...system is a little higher but not much. My CPU hasn't hit 30C but once as far as I can tell. I checked it last night while I was test ripping an HD-DVD at the highest it hit was 29. System spiked at 34C.

Is that good or bad?

slowlybuilt

06-12-09, 10:00 AM

Probably not the best advice, so follow at your own risk, but...

The other day I booted up an OLD PC and it was very noisy. I wanted to see if the PSU fan was the culprit in my case. My PSU had a fan at the back of the case, I used a ball point pen to stop the fan blades. Unfortunately in my case, the noise was still there, but now I know it is not the PSU fan.

I used SpeedFan and determined the issue was my CPU cooling fan, if I cut it to 25% the noise almost went away. Now, this is a P4 3.2 MHz CPU and I'm guessing it would need to be underclocked and undervolted to run cool with so little fan air movement. I might try an aftermarket cooler if I can still find one for such an old chip.

As a side note, I HATE video card fans. Maybe they have gotten much better, but those used to be the biggest source is high pitched whining noise from PCs I built. I also had one or two of them wear out before any other case fans, and then they took the graphics card out when the cooling was broken (and I didn't know it.)

I'm STRONGLY leaning toward a fanless design for the graphics card in my HTPC. I believe with good case cooling, those cards are designed to run correctly at pretty high temps and work fine with passive cooling.

You probably didn't catch my earlier post, but I actually unplugged the power to my CPU fan while it was running, just to see if that was the cause of all the noise. I put the cover back on my case and returned to my normal viewing spot. The noise level still seemed to be the same. I could have tried the same thing with the case fan, but it is supposed to be very quiet and its only running at 875 rpm. So that really only left 2 things in the case that move, PSU fan and hard drive. And I know the hard drive isn't producing 55 decibels while idle.

snedecor

06-12-09, 10:14 AM

renethx

06-12-09, 10:26 AM

The CPU fan is running at about 3375, the NB fan (which I think is the header I plugged my case fan into) is running at 875.

...

I know the CPU fan is running fast, but after my little experiment, I still think it is the PSU fan this is noise problem.
Once PSU is replaced with a quiet one, then the 3375 rpm CPU fan may bother you. ;)

slowlybuilt

06-12-09, 10:31 AM

Electronic components are generally designed to be resistant to heat.

In my humble opinion, at times people go overboard in trying to get the lowest CPU temperatures possible, at the expense of $ and extra noise.

Extreme temperatures (75-80C) can lower lifetime of components, however, most CPU's are quite happy tooling along at 50-60C.

Your CPU has specified a maximum temperature (either as case temperature on on-die temperature) that the manufacturer thinks it should not exceed. Indeed some will slow down or throttle back when that temperature is reached. Of course, you want to avoid those temperatures.

However, getting a 1 ft tall scythe-ninja-ultra-dominator-arctic-volcano cooler, with 6 fans running at 6000 rpm, just to try to get the CPU temperature below ambient, especially for a HTPC, is wasteful and not needed.

Set that Smartfan setting or Speedfan setting to automatically control the CPU safely 15-20 C from your CPU's maximum temperature, and enjoy the quiet!

This is all my humble opinion. If you unplug your CPU cooler to make it extra quiet, and your CPU fries, it's not my fault. Grin.

Snedecor

Yeah, I'm not going for cool, just quiet without frying my components or my wallet. I'm running the stock CPU cooler that came with my AMD 7750. I was only talking about temps and fan speeds because renethx asked. I really think the problem is my PSU's fan. Which is what I'm fishing for advice on. I'm pretty much sold on the OCZ SXS 400W right now because of the price ($30AR) and the few comments I've found about it online. Anyone know of something that is both as quiet and more economical than that?

slowlybuilt

06-12-09, 10:46 AM

Once PSU is replaced with a quiet one, then the 3375 rpm CPU fan may bother you. ;)

Ugh, that would be the start of my worst nightmare. The never ending upgrade cycle.

Well at least I've decided that I don't need a dGPU. The picture I'm getting from my IGP is much better than I expected. In fact ripped DVDs look better than my old upscaling DVD player and ATSC recordings look better than my old HD cable box and the sound is good.

Other than reducing noise levels the other upgrades on the horizon are Bluray and Dolby TrueHD bitstream, when both become available and reasonably priced. That isn't really high on my priority list right now though. Hard drive capacity on the other hand is. I started with a 1TB drive and after 1.5 months I've only got 250GB left.

My point is, I don't want to fall into the never ending upgrade-itis trap. There are requirements that I have and things that I would like to have. Like can wait, requirements however must be met. I don't need a silent PC, just one that isn't so freaking loud.;)

renethx

06-12-09, 10:46 AM

Anyone know of something that is both as quiet and more economical than that?
Replace the fan. Perhaps the fan is a 80mm 3600 rpm or something like that. Replacing it with a 80mm 2000 rpm fan like this (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835185069) may reduce the noise greatly. Read:

Simple PSU Fan Swap Technique (http://www.silentpcreview.com/Simple_PSU_Fan_Swap_Technique)

sfisher64

06-12-09, 10:50 AM

renethx

06-12-09, 10:51 AM

Ugh, that would be the start of my worst nightmare. The never ending upgrade cycle.
Have you turned on Smart Fan in BIOS? Check your BIOS Manual page 10, Smart Fan Configuration.

You can control the fan speed by SpeedFan too. Read the SpeedFan section of my guide (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=12249676#post12249676).

renethx

06-12-09, 11:00 AM

I recently built an HTPC using the GIGABYTE GA-E7AUM-DS2H motherboard and the Antec Fusion Remote Black Micro ATX Case. I'm currently using it primarily to play Blu-Rays, but also occasionally to play regular DVDs and also video streamed over the Internet. I am also now purchasing a new receiver that can decode Dolby TrueHD and DTS Master Audio (Arcam AVR600) and was thinking that I might want the option of sending audio to this receiver in Bitstream form.

Given this, I have 2 questions: (1) any opinions on whether or not this is a good idea, and if so are there any gotchas I should know about, and (2) I believe the Asus HDAV sound cards are the only option for this, and was wondering if the current HDAV 1.3 sound card (not deluxe -- no need for analog) will fit in my system and work with my motherboard, or if I should wait for the Slim version that Asus has not yet shipped?

Thanks!
Considering the majority of BD movies are 48 kHz, the onboard HDMI audio (supports up to 24 bit 192 KHz) is perhaps enough for most people even if audio is downsampled to 16 bit 48 kHz by TMT/PDVD/WinDVD. If you absolutely want HD audio bitstreaming, you may want to wait for Slim.

Bit depth|Sample rate|# of BD movies|Percentage
24|192|1|0.06%
24|96|8|0.49%
24|48|621|37.84%
20|48|6|0.37%
16|48|665|40.55%
lossy|lossy|340|20.72%

(based on Unofficial Blu-ray Audio and Video Specifications Thread (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=760714))

sfisher64

06-12-09, 11:05 AM

Considering the majority of BD movies are 48 kHz, the onboard HDMI audio (supports up to 24 bit 192 KHz) is perhaps enough for most people even if audio is downsampled to 16 bit 48 kHz by TMT/PDVD/WinDVD. If you absolutely want HD audio bitstreaming, you may want to wait for Slim.

Bit depth|Sample rate|The number of BD movies
24|192|1
24|96|8
24|48|621
20|48|6
16|48|665

(based on Unofficial Blu-ray Audio and Video Specifications Thread (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=760714))

Thanks! Just curious why you suggest waiting for the Slim?

patrick33

06-12-09, 11:07 AM

slowlybuilt

06-12-09, 11:21 AM

Have you turned on Smart Fan in BIOS? Check your BIOS Manual page 10, Smart Fan Configuration.

You can control the fan speed by SpeedFan too. Read the SpeedFan section of my guide (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=12249676#post12249676).

Ok I enabled it, but the settings are a bit criptic.

Control Mode [Manual]
Fan Ctrl OFF(C) [010]
Fan Ctrl On(C) [020]
Fan Ctrl Start(C) [030]
Fan Ctrl Sensitive [050]

What should I change these settings to?

*update*

I went with these settings
Fan Ctrl OFF(C) [020]
Fan Ctrl On(C) [030]
Fan Ctrl Start(C) [010]
Fan Ctrl Sensitive [030]

After startup and launching media center and playing a VOB, the CPU fan hit ~1800rpm and CPU temp was 37C
now after running for a bit the fan dropped to ~1650 and CPU temp is 35C.

I can't really judge the noise level because someone is cutting grass outside. I live in an apt, so I can't really do much about ambient noise. Moving soon though :)

renethx

06-12-09, 11:25 AM

Thanks! Just curious why you suggest waiting for the Slim?
Cheaper.

renethx

06-12-09, 11:30 AM

Ok I enabled it, but the settings are a bit criptic.

Control Mode [Manual]
Fan Ctrl OFF(C) [010]
Fan Ctrl On(C) [020]
Fan Ctrl Start(C) [030]
Fan Ctrl Sensitive [050]

What should I change these settings to?
Read the manual and expriment. ;) Read also my guide to see how smart fan works.

snedecor

06-12-09, 11:32 AM

Here's what I would do to troubleshoot:

Take the motherboard out of the case, and put it on a non-conductive surface.

Take everything off the motherboard except the CPU and heatsink (Make sure it's installed correctly, and the fan is plugged into the CPU_FAN header) , 1 stick of RAM (preferrably one you know works in another computer). This is to make sure that something in the motherboard was not shorted out by the case, or that something is drawing the power supply down. We're going to set up "bare-bones" .

Plug in the Power supply to the Motherboard connections. If you can, plug in the case's power switch wires. If you can't that's OK, we'll get by that later. Plug in the speaker to hear the beep codes.

Since you didn't mention a Video card, I'm assuming your using the built Internal Graphics.

Plug your mouse/keyboard and monitor into the back connectors on the motherboard.

You're now ready to test. You've got the minimun system that should POST (Power On Self Test).

Did you connect the power switch wires, if so, push the power button. If you weren't able to connect the power switch wires, you can short between the 2 power switch pins on the motherboard with a jumper, or just a screwdriver. Touch and let go. Be sure to get the right 2, look at the motheboard manual. You won't get shocked.

Did you get anything when you pushed the power button? Did any fans spin up? Get any beeps from the speaker?

Fans spinning typically mean the power supply is probably good. A single beep is great.

Multiple beeps typically mean that either your ram or your video adapter is not good.

If you got no beeps, and the fans spin, it gets a little hairier. Power everything down, and swap out one RAM stick for another, and re-test.

Still no workie, could be either the motherboard or the CPU. If you have spares from past builds, or another computer, borrow them to test.

Once you get the single beep, and the system complains about no operating system, then is when I typically re-install just the minimum stuff into the case and re-try. If the POST is still good when you've got the MB in the case, one by one, add the other components (other RAM, HD, BD, etc) re-POSTING after each one.

Hope this helps.

Gayle

patrick33

06-12-09, 11:44 AM

cool ill try all that out this weekend.. yeah i am using onboard video, and the fans do spin up as well... i do not have a speaker on the motherboard yet... i guess i should buy one huh lol... thanks for the writeup

C E Jones

06-12-09, 11:49 AM

I bought all of my components this past week and tried to build the thing last night...

HITACHI Deskstar P7K500 HDP725050GLA360 (0A35415) 500GB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s
OCZ Reaper HPC 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1333 (PC3 10666) Dual Channel
LG Black Blu-ray/HD DVD-ROM & 16X DVD±R DVD Burner
AMD Phenom II X2 550 Black Edition Callisto 3.1GHz Socket AM3 80W Dual-Core
SILVERSTONE Black Aluminum / Steel LC10B-E ATX Media Center / HTPC Case
Scythe SCKTN-3000 92mm Sleeve "KATANA3" 3Heat Pipes CPU Cooler
ECS BLACK SERIES A790GXM-AD3 AM3 AMD 790GX HDMI ATX AMD Motherboard
2 Western Digital Caviar Black WD1001FALS 1TB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s
OCZ ModXStream 600W Modular Power Supply

Now... I set everything up and plugged it all in... and then hooked it up to a vga monitor... the motherboard gets power... the hdd spools up and the bluray drive opens and closes... but I have no picture on the monitor... what could I have done wrong?

Thanks in advance.

Before you take the whole rig apart and test everything, you might want to start by testing the RAM. I just had the exact same problem you describe with my new HTPC--everything seems to be running, but nothing on the monitor. I tried taking out each of the two memory DIMMs one at a time, and on the second one the picture came onto the monitor. So my problem turned out to be a bad stick of memory. I RMA'd it to Newegg, got a new kit and was up and running in no time. Checking the memory first saved me a LOT of work in disassembling the entire computer, so it may work for you too! Apparently there's a lot of bad RAM out there--very poor quality control. Mine was from A-Data.

patrick33

06-12-09, 12:11 PM

Before you take the whole rig apart and test everything, you might want to start by testing the RAM. I just had the exact same problem you describe with my new HTPC--everything seems to be running, but nothing on the monitor. I tried taking out each of the two memory DIMMs one at a time, and on the second one the picture came onto the monitor. So my problem turned out to be a bad stick of memory. I RMA'd it to Newegg, got a new kit and was up and running in no time. Checking the memory first saved me a LOT of work in disassembling the entire computer, so it may work for you too! Apparently there's a lot of bad RAM out there--very poor quality control. Mine was from A-Data.

cool sounds good... i have new memory coming my way anyway as i can only fit one of the sticks in because of the stupid heat pipe thing that comes out of the top of it... the second stick wont clear the sata cable out of my bluray

slowlybuilt

06-12-09, 12:11 PM

Read the manual and expriment. ;) Read also my guide to see how smart fan works.

Yeah, I think I get it. The fan has settled at around 1600 rpm and the cpu is 33C. How hot can I run an AMD 7750 without shortening its lifespan?

Also the ambient noise levels have dropped and once again I can hear the HTPC, but the sound is different. Before it had more of a high pitch to it. The sound is now deeper and perhaps a bit quieter since the CPU fan is running slower. But after taking measurements it is still in the 55 decibel range.:(

*update*
The CPU fan is running between 1300-1400rpm and the CPU temp is between 43-45C is this safe?
Settings are:
Fan Ctrl OFF(C) [025]
Fan Ctrl On(C) [035]
Fan Ctrl Start(C) [005]
Fan Ctrl Sensitive [010]

The noise is still 55dB at 6 inches and ~50dB at seating position. I really think it is the PSU. I'm going to look into replacing the fan, but I thought that was dangerous, and that I should just get another PSU

renethx

06-12-09, 12:37 PM

Yeah, I think I get it. The fan has settled at around 1600 rpm and the cpu is 33C. How hot can I run an AMD 7750 without shortening its lifespan?
The max case temperature (the temperature of the center of the heat spreader) of 7750 is 73'C. You are safe if CPU temperature is below that. Personally I wouldn't care of lifespan; perhaps the CPU will work for ten years or more continuously at < 73'C.

slowlybuilt

06-12-09, 12:42 PM

Replace the fan. Perhaps the fan is a 80mm 3600 rpm or something like that. Replacing it with a 80mm 2000 rpm fan like this (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835185069) may reduce the noise greatly. Read:

Simple PSU Fan Swap Technique (http://www.silentpcreview.com/Simple_PSU_Fan_Swap_Technique)

That looks like a fun project, and it is the cheapest way for me to go, but I'm worried that it wouldn't properly cool the PSU and that the fan wouldn't be as quiet as I would like. I suppose it is a cheap PSU and wrecking it wouldn't be a great loss, but I don't think I want to risk other damage.

Hmm, decisions, decisions...

slowlybuilt

06-12-09, 12:44 PM

The max case temperature (the temperature of the center of the heat spreader) of 7750 is 73'C. You are safe if CPU temperature is below that. Personally I wouldn't care of lifespan; perhaps the CPU will work for ten years or more continuously at < 73'C.

So I could safely set the fan on at say, 65C?

renethx

06-12-09, 12:54 PM

So I could safely set the fan on at say, 65C?
Yes. But how about 55'C? :)

renethx

06-12-09, 12:55 PM

That looks like a fun project, and it is the cheapest way for me to go, but I'm worried that it wouldn't properly cool the PSU and that the fan wouldn't be as quiet as I would like. I suppose it is a cheap PSU and wrecking it wouldn't be a great loss, but I don't think I want to risk other damage.

Hmm, decisions, decisions...
Unless your system consumes more than 200W, perhaps 2000 rpm is enough.

slowlybuilt

06-12-09, 01:06 PM

Yes. But how about 55'C? :)

Funny, that's what I went with before I read your post. CPU fan is at 1100-1200rpm and the temp started at 55C and has continued to drop all the way to 47C.
BTW while I was fiddling with the Bios, I saw that the IGP clock was set to 400MHz. I thought that 790GX was supposed to run at 700MHz? It allowed me to up the clock, to 425,450,475,500,533. It suggested upping the voltage at 500 and 533, so I tried 450 and everything seems fine. Is this actually making any difference, or should I just let it be?

slowlybuilt

06-12-09, 01:19 PM

Unless your system consumes more than 200W, perhaps 2000 rpm is enough.

Yeah I think I'm below that, and should still be below that when I add another hard drive. I'll be under 250W for sure.

Hmm, I think I'm going to go for it.

cartwrij

06-12-09, 09:39 PM

OK - I ran into my first problem on my HTPC. I'm trying to play a bluray on it for the first time (using WinDVD9). I have a horrible audio lag when I'm in full screen mode. And there is severe judder as well. When I have the screen size to be about half my tv size, then it runs fine. What's the issue? I'm using the the mid-range system on page 85 without a dedicated graphics card... here's are the relevant specs:

# CPU: Core 2 Duo E7400 2.80GHz LGA775, $113.
# CPU Cooler: Cooler Master 風神鍛 (Geminii S) RR-CCH-PBJ1-GP, $28.
# Motherboard: GIGABYTE GA-E7AUM-DS2H LGA775 GeForce 9400 mGPU microATX, $130. A cheaper alternative is MSI P7NGM-Digital LGA775 GeForce 9300 mGPU microATX, $110, which is of better value if you don't need an S/PDIF port and an eSATA port.
# Memory: A-DATA ADQVE1A16K DDR2-800 2 x 1GB Kit, $30.
# Graphics Card: ASUS EN9500GT TOP/DI/512M GeForce 9500 GT, $61.
# HDD: Western Digital WD6400AAKS 640GB SATA 3.0Gbps, $70.
# PSU: Corsair VX450W CMPSU-450VX 450W, $57.
# Case: Antec Fusion Remote Black microATX, with LCD/IR receiver/remote, $143

CPU usage is only about 25% at most when running full screen.

Any ideas?

Oh yeah... hdmi out to TC-P54G10 (panasonic plasma), and optical out to a yamaha receiver. In windvd9 I have the audio portion set to 6 channels.

Edit - more info - I'm running AnyDVD HD as well. My bluray drive is: LG GGC-H20L ... and I'm running Windows 7 RC

Edit2 - ok, I might have answered my own question. It's got to be the software player. I played just the title m2ts file from the bdmv/stream folder in windows media player and it plays beautifully.

dustman52

06-13-09, 09:20 AM

Alright I think I'm suffering from information overload. I have a PC up and running with Vista 32-bit, with the TV pack, and HDhomerun, a DVD drive, and tons of Hard Drive space. I want to back up my DVD's to an external Hard Drive to play on this PC. I noticed the software section of the guide is blank. My specs are e7200 processor, 2 gigs of ram, and a 9600gt. I just need a recommendation on some software that would back up and then play these DVDs once they are backed up. Of course of looking for the best bang for my buck, but I'm willing to pony up a little extra if they value is there. Thanks in advance for the help and I apologize for my ignornace.

T0R0

06-13-09, 10:59 AM

Posted this in a thread all it's own but it quickly got pushed back a few pages:

Recap: Building my first HTPC. Going with Renethx's AMD/AMD build for a premium system since I'm a gamer also. Goes like this: Items in red are my only deviations from original suggestion.

CPU: Phenom II X4 955 Black Edition HDZ955FBGIBOX 3.2GHz AM3, $245.
CPU Cooler: Xigmatek Dark Knight-S1283V, $40.
Motherboard: MSI 790FX-GD70 AM3 AMD 790FX chipset ATX, $180.
Memory: G.SKILL F3-12800CL9D-4GBNQ DDR3-1600 2 x 2GB Kit, $60.
Graphics Card: Radeon HD 4890 GDDR5 1GB, $240
PSU: Enermax REVOLUTION85+ 850W ERV850EWT
Case: SilverStone Crown CW03B-MT (LCD and Remote come with case)
Tuner: Homerun
HDD : MY old Raptor, 1 TB Hitachi
LCD: Eventually getting Samsung 55 inch 950 series.

Requiremants: Gaming, Hulu, OTA broadcast, Interent surfing, Playback of everything. I'm not much into ripping but I guess, I'd like the option.

Questions: Ok, So I'm running Windows 7 64. I got like half the stuff already. What I need is a guide on what to do (for idiots) when I have it up and running. I want to use Windows Media Center for my front end. (Did I use the term correctly?)

Also, I really just want the one box in my entertainment center, so no Reciever. The speaker system can be used directly from the PC correct? Maybe using the TV's own speaker for center.

Oh, and those heat pipes sticking out the side on those new 4890 cards,,(toxic and vapor models), Those will still fit in the large case I have correct?

I really need an answer to No.1. I realize Win7 64 is new and not much is out there but any help is appreciated. I have a few .mkv files that WMC isnt even seeing.

Thxs in Advance

bmcent1

06-13-09, 01:17 PM

I just need a recommendation on some software that would back up and then play these DVDs once they are backed up. Of course of looking for the best bang for my buck, but I'm willing to pony up a little extra if they value is there.

I'm a big fan of open source software. But I think you get what you pay for when it comes to ripping software.

I like DVDFab, it seems other here like AnyDVD. Both cost money, I believe AnyDVD is bought with either an annual subscription or a lifetime subscription.

With a toddler around the house, thank goodness for DVD backup software!

As for playback, that's where open source can help.

If you like a slick interface and having some room to tinker, I love Media Portal (http://www.team-mediaportal.com/). Easy to build a menu interface to your movie library just by dropping them into sub folders.

I have also heard VLC (http://www.videolan.org/vlc/) plays many, many formats right "out of the box."

ejkeebler

06-13-09, 04:36 PM

builds but curious about dumping the suggested case and power supply for the NSK2480 and using the power supply it comes with. I already have a Logitech 880 remote, is this power supply too loud or perhaps 380w just isnt quite enough?? This should save me about $80. I'm trying to keep it under $700 for everything inluding $113 for the HVR-2250 and $120 for the 2 1TB drives that only leaves $467 for everything else.

bmcent1

06-13-09, 04:38 PM

wickchucker

06-13-09, 05:15 PM

Out of curiosity, are there one, or a couple good sources of free, legal, HD content to demo a newly build HTPC?

Any web resources for the following would be greatly appreciated:
- 1080p movie trallers
- Top notch FLAC audio demos (either independant artists, or again, clips from popular artists)
- THX / DTS demos (ie, the Robot Cow Herder with rocket boots, the Piano, etc.)

What else to "show off" a new HTPC?

I would suggest the Apple or Yahoo! movie trailer websites. They have 1080p downloads available (there are also plug ins for popular htpc front end like in XMBC, Media Browswer, VMC etc that allow access to those trailer sites from your interface)

Also, there is an open source animated 1080p short film called Elephants Dream (http://orange.blender.org/download) that is free and legal.

A for Flac, try the etree (http://www.archive.org/details/etree)internet music archive for free concert downloads.

saxnix

06-13-09, 05:45 PM

I just need a recommendation on some software that would back up and then play these DVDs once they are backed up. Of course of looking for the best bang for my buck, but I'm willing to pony up a little extra if they value is there. Thanks in advance for the help and I apologize for my ignornace.

Ripping - AnyDVDHD will allow you to do BD's as well as DVD's (if you look at going to BD in the future.

Otherwise, I have used DVDFab Platnum. It is very easy software to use and if you don't care about special features etc, you can just set it to grab the main movie, the english track, and no subtitles. It is very easy to use. (I also see that they have just released a BD version as well).

For managing/playing the collection, if you have Media Center on your PC, you can use it - and a free app like Media Browser (http://www.mediabrowser.tv/) or OML (http://code.google.com/p/open-media-library/)(both free). At their current stage of developement Media Browser is probably further along and simpler to use regarding auto-metadata collection (info about your movie). Check them out and see which you prefer.

LesMoss

06-13-09, 07:29 PM

I would like to use the HEC 8K case http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811121090 for the reccomended ITX system. Will the 120 watt power supply be adequate? If not, can you recommend an ITX motherboard that uses a mobile processor?

dbone1026

06-13-09, 07:48 PM

Ripping - AnyDVDHD will allow you to do BD's as well as DVD's (if you look at going to BD in the future.

Otherwise, I have used DVDFab Platnum. It is very easy software to use and if you don't care about special features etc, you can just set it to grab the main movie, the english track, and no subtitles. It is very easy to use. (I also see that they have just released a BD version as well).

For managing/playing the collection, if you have Media Center on your PC, you can use it - and a free app like Media Browser (http://www.mediabrowser.tv/) or OML (http://code.google.com/p/open-media-library/)(both free). At their current stage of developement Media Browser is probably further along and simpler to use regarding auto-metadata collection (info about your movie). Check them out and see which you prefer.

Agreed. Price of AnyDVD or DVDFab is a bit of a bummer but you will be covered on the DVD and BR front (I have had mixed results with DVFab's ability to rip BR consistently). MediaBrowser with VMC is great. You can also look at MediaPortal and XBMC to name a few.

jtadeo

06-13-09, 08:06 PM

I notice that the first page has a lot of outdated info. Is there a guide for cheap htpc with current hardware and prices?

vamovie

06-13-09, 08:18 PM

hendermd

06-13-09, 08:21 PM

I notice that the first page has a lot of outdated info. Is there a guide for cheap htpc with current hardware and prices?

Go to page 85.

kampswas

06-13-09, 08:27 PM

Renethx- this case is awesome thanks for recommending it, it is superior to my previous Lian-Li which has always been a fav of mine, Now I am a convert!

Case: Antec Fusion Remote Max, $180
I ordered two!

bmcent1

06-13-09, 11:14 PM

I would suggest the Apple or Yahoo! movie trailer websites. They have 1080p downloads available (there are also plug ins for popular htpc front end like in XMBC, Media Browswer, VMC etc that allow access to those trailer sites from your interface)

Also, there is an open source animated 1080p short film called Elephants Dream (http://orange.blender.org/download) that is free and legal.

A for Flac, try the etree (http://www.archive.org/details/etree)internet music archive for free concert downloads.

Great ideas, thanks! Especially like the idea of concert downloads.

davegod75

06-14-09, 05:32 AM

wickchucker

06-14-09, 10:10 AM

hi guys
i have this gateway Gm5478 desktop
spec are: intel core 2 quad @2.40 Ghz 2.39Ghz
500gb harddrive ge force nvidia 9500gt 256mb graphic card
4gb ram
32 bit O P

i have highspeed dsl yahoo internet i believe 1.5mbph

now i want to speed up the downloading
whats the best way
iam thinking about comcast
if i overclock this baby does it make any difference in downloading and uploading
if so,
how can i do it?
please guide me and help
Thankyou so much

Overclocking your processor will have absolutely no effect on your download speeds. Download speeds depends on your internet connection. The higher the Mbps, the faster the downloads. You say you have DSL @ 1.5Mbps. That is pretty low. Cable connections or Fiber connections (like from Versizon FIOS ) are faster. For instance, my connection is with Cox cable and is 12Mpbs. On large file downloads I average 900k/s or more. So go with Comcast if it is available if you want faster downloads.

vamovie

06-14-09, 11:41 AM

Overclocking your processor will have absolutely no effect on your download speeds. Download speeds depends on your internet connection. The higher the Mbps, the faster the downloads. You say you have DSL @ 1.5Mbps. That is pretty low. Cable connections or Fiber connections (like from Versizon FIOS ) are faster. For instance, my connection is with Cox cable and is 12Mpbs. On large file downloads I average 900k/s or more. So go with Comcast if it is available if you want faster downloads.

Thankyou man
thatswhat i am thinking going to comcast

thankyou for the help

Little_Mike

06-14-09, 11:51 AM

Hmmm, not sure what it could be. Here are the steps I did for my W7 x64 install:

http://dbone1026.blogspot.com/2009/06/windows-7-rc-install.html

You have had success playing back these files prior to W7 I assume (just wanted to make sure it is not a network or file prob)?

I did a fresh install of windows and did everything that you did and the steps from hack7mc. Thanks!

I'm in much better shape now, but I'm still struggling with 1080p h.264 files. Also, I can't get external codecs to work for Win 7 MC when playing MKVs. I think this is a known bug correct?? Can you play MKV's and have external filters work?

When I play MKV's through MPC-HC, my CPU still spikes and the video stutters. I noticed on the CCC Advanced software that the hardware acceleration overdrive is NOT kicking in. It just sits at 1-2%. Is this a software problem or a hardware problem? I have the 9.5 ATI CCC installed. I'm not sure if MPC-HC supports HA. I have a pentium D 2.8 processor, so its OK, but not the best. Also using a ATI 4670 512mg DDR3.

I'm stumped, and not sure what to do. Any ideas on how to get the HA to work? I think that may fix the problem. Also any help on how to get my codecs to pick up in Media Center would be great too, but I think others are having this problem and there is no fix yet.

Thanks,
Mike

dbone1026

06-14-09, 01:21 PM

I did a fresh install of windows and did everything that you did and the steps from hack7mc. Thanks!

I'm in much better shape now, but I'm still struggling with 1080p h.264 files. Also, I can't get external codecs to work for Win 7 MC when playing MKVs. I think this is a known bug correct?? Can you play MKV's and have external filters work?

When I play MKV's through MPC-HC, my CPU still spikes and the video stutters. I noticed on the CCC Advanced software that the hardware acceleration overdrive is NOT kicking in. It just sits at 1-2%. Is this a software problem or a hardware problem? I have the 9.5 ATI CCC installed. I'm not sure if MPC-HC supports HA. I have a pentium D 2.8 processor, so its OK, but not the best. Also using a ATI 4670 512mg DDR3.

I'm stumped, and not sure what to do. Any ideas on how to get the HA to work? I think that may fix the problem. Also any help on how to get my codecs to pick up in Media Center would be great too, but I think others are having this problem and there is no fix yet.

Thanks,
Mike

I think with W7 they don't give any/much support for external codecs outside of the Windows Media Foundation. You can assign Windows or FFDshow filters using this tool (http://www.hack7mc.com/2009/06/preferred-directshow-filters-tool-for-windows-7.html), don't know what external codecs you had in mind. Using Sharks codecs I have had no issues playing back my 1080p h.264 mkvs. The only ones I have problems with are VC-1 files wrapped in ts/m2ts, this appears to be a known problem. I've used the MPC Video Decoder filter for Vista without problems and gotten HA, but no luck with W7. Possibly right now using a 3rd party filter breaks HA in W7?

Little_Mike

06-14-09, 02:01 PM

I think with W7 they don't give any/much support for external codecs outside of the Windows Media Foundation. You can assign Windows or FFDshow filters using this tool (http://www.hack7mc.com/2009/06/preferred-directshow-filters-tool-for-windows-7.html), don't know what external codecs you had in mind. Using Sharks codecs I have had no issues playing back my 1080p h.264 mkvs. The only ones I have problems with are VC-1 files wrapped in ts/m2ts, this appears to be a known problem. I've used the MPC Video Decoder filter for Vista without problems and gotten HA, but no luck with W7. Possibly right now using a 3rd party filter breaks HA in W7?

I'm really not sure. Using media info, it's a h.264 MKV with AC-3 audio.

i've tried two different sets: one, using haali and coreAVC, and then the ac3 filter.

the other one was using the full Shark007 Package.

Neither seems to work. I can't tell if my computer just isn't good enough, but its an ATI 4670, 3g 400mhz ram, and a Pentium D 2.8. With 720p files, the processor never exceeds 40%. With the 1080p, however, it will spike well above 90%, then stutter. The HA never kicks in. I don't know if the software makes the HA kick in or what, I'm still learning all this. I think if I can get the processor to offboard onto the chip, I'll be set.

Thanks for all the quick replies so far, you have been very helpful.

dbone1026

06-14-09, 02:25 PM

I'm really not sure. Using media info, it's a h.264 MKV with AC-3 audio.

i've tried two different sets: one, using haali and coreAVC, and then the ac3 filter.

the other one was using the full Shark007 Package.

Neither seems to work. I can't tell if my computer just isn't good enough, but its an ATI 4670, 3g 400mhz ram, and a Pentium D 2.8. With 720p files, the processor never exceeds 40%. With the 1080p, however, it will spike well above 90%, then stutter. The HA never kicks in. I don't know if the software makes the HA kick in or what, I'm still learning all this. I think if I can get the processor to offboard onto the chip, I'll be set.

Thanks for all the quick replies so far, you have been very helpful.

Hmmm...I gotta wonder whether your CPU just cannot handle the 1080p content. I am not much of a hardware guy so maybe Renethx can give his thoughts. Playing mkvs in 7MC you should be able to get HA up and running, maybe your CPU is just not strong enough to compensate?

supapowa

06-14-09, 02:44 PM

groovejumper

06-14-09, 03:43 PM

I loosely based my last build on the high end mATX spec, and we're very happy with it as our main living room htpc.

Now, I want to build an extender replacement, the good ole dma 2100 just doesn't cut it anymore (slow, sluggish, doesn't do mkv's well, and just can't deal with h264 in wtv provided by the HD-PVR).

It'll run W7, and will be used for music from the WHS, mkv's and some xvid avi's from the WHS, and recorded tv from both the 4TB main htpc and 8TB WHS.

So here's my list, based on the mini-itx intel/nvidia spec (prices in CAD from NCIX):

Case: Apex MI-008 $63.60
CPU: E5200 $90.17
Cooler: Silverstone NT07 $24.99
Mobo: Zotac GF9300 mini-itx $175.00
RAM: Corsair XMS2 2x1GB PC2-6400 $44.99
HD: Kingston SSDNOW V Series 64GB 2.5" Sata2 - $156.50
IR: Antec Multimedia Station Basic - $48.41

Questions:

1. Since I'm using the external 3.5 bay for the IR receiver, I'll need to mount the SSD on the side, thereby preventing the use of a case fan as I understand it. Is this going to cause me grief, or will the CPU and PSU fans suffice?

2. Note that there's no optical drive, all our media is networked and we'll never need this. So, another option would be to get a 3.5->5.25 adapter and put the SSD in the 5.25 bay, allowing the fan. But maybe I won't need one?

3. The case looks nice, but as I mentioned we have no need for an optical drive, so maybe there's another case that would be good for a system like this? Preferably with some option for IR, either integrated or with an external 3.5" bay? Or even 5.25 if there's also a module that does IR similar to the Antec unit?

Thanks,

g.

Little_Mike

06-14-09, 05:49 PM

I'm going to ask the obvious, but do you have the codecs registered?

Yes I do, well I believe so. When I open up a file, the tray icons show up. The AC-3 icon shows up for the audio as well, so I think I'm good.

It could by my CPU. I'm really not sure how powerful it is. I'm on a Dell DM051 (Deminsion 5150) A07 BIOS with a Pentium D 2.8ghz. I think the Pentium D are the extremely early Dual Core, which came right before the Core2Duo. Even if it is weak, however, i still think that HA should kick in and I should be able to see the activity guage rise up to around 25-30% in the ATI Advanced CCC.

I'll keep trying different things. I may try installing powerDVD 9 and see if I can get HA to kick in.

Thanks for all the help so far, I'm really hoping that I can nail this one down.

sschen

06-15-09, 03:05 AM

Guys

Going to put together a HTPC soon. I was referred here by a friend who based his build on recommended systems on this thread but I noticed post 1 was last updated last year. It is not really practical for me to read through 291 pages of this thread so does anyone know which page (if any) has the most recent recommendations?

Thanks in advance

dbone1026

06-15-09, 04:37 AM

SweetHip

06-15-09, 01:23 PM

Rene and tohers..

I went with the miniITX system:
Zotac 9300
E5200
MI-008

I am using the stock HS fan.. it is pretty much right above the PS and causing my system to shut down every 3min. Would getting another HS slove this issue.. or just i go with a picoPSU?

In the mean time.. can i remove the HS fan(but leave the HS) and place a 120mm fan on the side of this case.. would that work?

anyone have this combo and if so what did they do to fix the PSU and cooler issue..

what is a good low profile heatsink, that can replace the stock one.

WalkinPaul

06-15-09, 02:15 PM

anyone have this combo and if so what did they do to fix the PSU and cooler issue..

what is a good low profile heatsink, that can replace the stock one.

I can't comment on the MI-008 since I used the Silverstone Sugo 05 case. But, I do have the Zotac mini-ITX 9300 board and a Intel E8400. Runs hulu great and plays dvd's smooth as silk. The sugo05 has a 300w power supply that is capable of running a video card like a 4850 or gtx250, etc. But I haven't added one of those yet. The intel stock cooler fits fine in there. The case is larger, but it also holds more. Just my .02 and feel free to ask questions on the mb. Mine is drawing about 45W at idle, measured at the power plug with a break out box and a multimeter. It's also very quiet. I'm using Win7 rc 64. Computer Specs are on my profile page under the "about me" tab.

There is also a thread for the mother board: Here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1111996)

{I didn't find the mb thread until after I purchased the board, so I am including it here for reference to others}

ejkeebler

06-15-09, 07:33 PM

I keep hearing from one side that Nvidia offers the best codecs for HD and Blue Ray playback, but it seems like this entire thread is suggesting the Sapphire. This PC will have an HVR-2250 and runs sageTV for a single TV and play music, ripped blue rays, ripped DVD's and ripped TV content (obviously). I will rarely play games on the PC, and when I will it will be something less intense for sure.

But I am struggling with the ATI/NVIDIA decision. I think I am going AMD if that matters and going for a mid range micro-ATX.

Any suggestions on ATI v NVIDIA? I think I am going with Windows 7 RC1 as well.

bmcent1

06-16-09, 01:12 AM

dbone1026

06-16-09, 04:25 AM

renethx

06-16-09, 08:13 AM

Renethx -
Curious if you have thoughts on my slow video problem.

I've cobbled together a "temporary" HTPC from an old system I had. It was OLD (about 5 years) but it was also among the best money could buy at the time.

Here it is:
ASUS P5AD2-E Premium Mobo (925 chipset)
Pentium4 3.2 GHz
2 GB DDR800 RAM

New additions:
Black WDC drive (minor upgrade to the blue drive recommended in your guide)
Saphire Radeon 4670 video
Windows 7 Ultimate (32-bit)

Overall the system seems quite snappy and I'm loving Win7 so far.

But when I downloaded the 1080p Toy Story 3 trailer from Yahoo (Quicktime format) it plays back rather jerky, more noticeably when there is more movement in the frame, and CPU usage runs between 85% and 95%.

I know it's an older processor, but it IS a 3.2 GHz processor. I thought the video card was supposed to offload and handle the heavy lifting for 1080p.

Do you think I have anything setup wrong or have any suggestions to try?
Simply the QuickTime player does not support DXVA/DXVA2. Even with Athlon X2 7750 2.7GHz, a moderately fast dual core processor, the CPU usage is 60-70% and playback is very jerkey. The video/audio format of the trailer is H.264/AAC. So playback will be easy and smooth with a player supporting DXVA, for example, MPC-HC or TMT3 Platinum.

I assume you already downloaded toystory3-tsr_h1080p.mov (http://movies.apple.com/movies/disney/toystory3/toystory3-tsr_h1080p.mov) 131MB. To play it with MPC-HC, first install Haali Media Splitter (this is essential for MOV HA). Then configure MPC-HC:

- Go to Options > Player > Formats. Look at 'Quicktime file (mov qt amr 3g2 3gp2)' in 'Formats'. Double click 'QuickTime' and select 'DirectShow'. Then DirectShow filters (MPC - Video Decoder) will be used for MOV instead of the QuickTime engine.
- Go to Options > Internal Filters > Source Filters. Uncheck 'MP4/MOV'. Now Haali Media Splitter will be used for MOV instead of the internal splitter filter.

Now CPU usage is 20-35% (Athlon X2) and playback is smooth as butter.

bmcent1

06-16-09, 09:42 AM

Ah! That worked perfectly. Playback is much better now. Thanks!

One more question... I'm not getting any audio. I have the Saphire 4670 care installed (and updated the driver) and I'm using Win7.

Currently there is a red "x" over the speaker icon in the bottom right of the task tray.

If I hover my mouse over it, a popup says:
No Audio Output Device is installed.

I have the HTPC connected to my Pioneer VSX-01TXH receiver via HDMI cable and video is coming over the same cable fine.

If I go
Start > Devices and Printers > Click on my Computer > Hardware
High Definition Audio Controller is at the top of the list and is the only thing with a yellow exclamation mark. It's device status says: This device cannot find enough free resources that it can use.

dbone1026

06-16-09, 09:53 AM

bmcent1

06-16-09, 10:47 AM

Did you install the Realtek HDMI Audio Driver (http://www.realtek.com.tw/downloads/downloadsCheck.aspx?Langid=1&PFid=24&Level=4&Conn=3&DownTypeID=3)?

Thanks for the link. So far, no luck.

I installed the Win 7 audio drivers at that link okay. But when I try to install the ATI HDMI driver I get this error message:

"No Driver was supported in this driver package"

I've tried booting with both enabled and disabled set for the onboard HD Audio on my ASUS P5AD2-E mother board. With it enabled, it also gives two options for "Front Panel" -- AC97 and HD Audio. I tried both of those options as well and keep getting the same error from the HDMI driver installer.

When I look in Win 7 > Devices and Printers > Click on my computer > Hardware Tab ...
If I have the motherboard's onboard HD Audio enabled I see these yellow exclamation marks at the top of the list:
! High Definition Audio Controller
! High Definition Audio Device

If I have the motherboard's onboard HD Audio disabled, I see only this yellow exclamation mark listed:
! High Definition Audio Controller

In both cases, the error for High Definition Audio Controller is:
This device cannot find enough free resources that it can use. (Code 12)

When the on board HD Audio is enabled and High Definition Audio Device shows in the list, it is with this error:
This device cannot start. (Code 10)

I've tried disabling as much of the integrated / onboard stuff in the BIOS as possible (including serial, parallel, and game ports, 1394 firewire, etc.)

dbone1026

06-16-09, 10:53 AM

Thanks for the link. So far, no luck.

I installed the Win 7 audio drivers at that link okay. But when I try to install the ATI HDMI driver I get this error message:

"No Driver was supported in this driver package"

I've tried booting with both enabled and disabled set for the onboard HD Audio on my ASUS P5AD2-E mother board. With it enabled, it also gives two options for "Front Panel" -- AC97 and HD Audio. I tried both of those options as well and keep getting the same error from the HDMI driver installer.

When I look in Win 7 > Devices and Printers > Click on my computer > Hardware Tab ...
If I have the motherboard's onboard HD Audio enabled I see these yellow exclamation marks at the top of the list:
! High Definition Audio Controller
! High Definition Audio Device

If I have the motherboard's onboard HD Audio disabled, I see only this yellow exclamation mark listed:
! High Definition Audio Controller

In both cases, the error for High Definition Audio Controller is:
This device cannot find enough free resources that it can use. (Code 12)

When the on board HD Audio is enabled and High Definition Audio Device shows in the list, it is with this error:
This device cannot start. (Code 10)

I've tried disabling as much of the integrated / onboard stuff in the BIOS as possible (including serial, parallel, and game ports, 1394 firewire, etc.)

Hmmm...I am at a loss. All I did was install the latest GPU driver for the 4670 from the AMD website (http://game.amd.com/us-en/drivers_catalyst.aspx?p=win7/windows-7-64bit) and the ATI HDMI AUdio Device from the Realtek webiste. I never installed the Win7 Audio drivers, I don't know if that is possibly causing a conflict?

sschen

06-16-09, 10:58 AM

A bit of background on what I want to do:

I am building an Miditower ATX based system as I like to be able to use the system to play titles from my HD-DVD/BD collection but this system will be in my office connected to a 24" Dell LCD monitor. The Dell 24" monitor (2407WFP) does not have HDMI port though but does have a HDCP compliant DVI port. I assume I won't have any problem viewing 1080p content on this setup?

Occasionally I may use this system to rip imported BD titles (without English audio or subtitle) to the hard drive so I can use external subs found on the internet in order to view the movie.

I also have an old xbox in my HT room that will communicate to this system through a wireless setup to stream SD movies/trailers downloaded from the internet. I intend to replace the old xbox with a NMT that can stream HD files over wired Gigabit connection.

I was referred in a previous post to look at the suggested system on page 85 of this thread. Based on what I am trying to do, I assume my best bet is to use the ATX system. At this stage, I am looking at the "High End" system. The first thing I noticed is that it uses a Gigabyte Motherboard, GIGABYTE GA-EP45-UD3P LGA775 Intel P45 chipset ATX. I prefer to build this system based on a Asus motherboard. Does anyone know if there is an equivalent Asus motherboard to the aforementioned Gigabyte motherboard.

Also appreciate inputs to the system I am trying to build. Thanks in advance.

bmcent1

06-16-09, 11:06 AM

Hmmm...I am at a loss. All I did was install the latest GPU driver for the 4670 from the AMD website (http://game.amd.com/us-en/drivers_catalyst.aspx?p=win7/windows-7-64bit) and the ATI HDMI AUdio Device from the Realtek webiste. I never installed the Win7 Audio drivers, I don't know if that is possibly causing a conflict?

Thanks for the suggestions and if you think of anything else, let me know!

I don't think it's a driver conflict because I tried installing the HDMI audio driver before installing the Win 7 audio drivers from the same site. When I tried it the first time around, I got the exact same error message from the HDMI installed "No Driver was supported in this driver package"

It wasn't until I saw that trying the HDMI driver install that I went ahead and tried the other Win 7 Audio drivers from the same site.

As I read that error message, it looks almost like it's missing a fill in the blank, as if it means to say "No _______ Driver was supported in this driver package" and it's not getting the fill in the blank from Win 7.

Since I'm seeing a yellow ! next to the HD Audio Controller in the hardware list, I think that could be the reason why the HDMI driver installer isn't seeing a device (if indeed that's the problem.) But I've disabled everything I could in my BIOS and also tried both the Plug-n-Play OS settings of Yes and No and nothing seems to help Win 7 see this Saphire Radeon 4670 card's audio controller correctly.

joe531

06-16-09, 04:30 PM

I'm going to be building a new computer soon. This computer needs to be able to perform HTPC duties like playing back 1080p video although it won't be a dedicated HTPC.

I want to build it using the AMD 7850 CPU and the ECS A780GM-M3 mobo (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813135233). Would this be a good combination? Really the only HD I watch is the OTA/Clear QAM stuff like FOX, CBS, etc. I was going to go with the 5050e CPU but the 7850 costs just a little more.

However someday I would like to be able to use the Hauppauge tuner that connects with component cables. I hear that only does MPEG4, so I'd like to be prepared. A little Blu-ray wouldn't hurt either.

H3||scr3am

06-16-09, 04:46 PM

awesome guide :D I plan to build one of these soon :D

Moritzio

06-16-09, 09:18 PM

@ bFrogger42

For playing back Blu-ray rips on the PS3, I prefer remuxing them to AVCHD format and putting them on a external USB drive. You will need multiAVCHD (http://multiavchd.deanbg.com/) ( for multi-title collections) and/or AVCHD Manager (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=143920) (so swap individual AVCHD folders before playing). Also, the USB drive must be formatted as FAT32. This works very well. I have access to all included audio andsubtitle tracks.

Sorry, I have no experience with the PopcornHour.

-Mo

Hi all,
I currently have a PS3 and a large collection of Blu-Ray and HD-DVD discs, in addition to a collection of standard DVDs. I would like to rip them all to a single source without any compression. I would like to then watch the files from my PS3 and in the future another tv with a PopcornHour. Is this feasible? What kind of hardware do I need? What can I expect for playback from the PS3 or PopcornHour? Will I need an HTPC to realize full HD playback?

dbone1026

06-17-09, 07:44 AM

digitlnoize

06-17-09, 08:05 AM

Hey everyone,

I'm about to upgrade my HTPC and wanted some advice...

I'm currently running a Pentium D 805 (2.667gHz, overclocked 20%). The motherboard I have is ancient and is running an Nvidia GeForce Ti4200. Hence the need for an upgrade.

Surprisingly, this machine handles 720p without a problem. I'm not really interested in doing 1080p for now, mostly just due to the file sizes. We have a PS3 for Blu-Ray's and it's hard to tell the difference from my couch...

Also, we're ditching cable in favor of Hulu and Netflix on demand (and OTA broadcasts). Hulu Desktop is running a little glitchy right now...

I don't currently game on my PC, since it can't run anything, but I'd like to do a little.

I've got a Sapphire 4770 graphics card already (saw a great deal and grabbed it).

I'm considering these choices:

1. Keep my current CPU and just upgrade the MB to another LGA775 MB.

2. Get an LGA775 MB and upgrade the CPU to a newer low-watt model.

3. Get an AMD Phenom (X3-4?) CPU and appropriate motherboard.

4. Go all out and get a Core i7, etc.

#4 is very unlikely. I'm kinda torn between the other 3. I'm not tech-y enough to really know how much of an improvement I'd get from a newer Intel Dual Core CPU running at the same clock speeds as what I currently have...

A little bit of "future proofing" doesn't seem like a bad idea either though...

Thoughts?

bmcent1

06-17-09, 08:09 AM

@ bmcent1 - any luck getting your Audio working? I was actually upgrading an old PC to give to my in laws last night and had a bunch of driver issues (i.e. the yellow exclamation point next to devices on teh device manage page). I just ended up finding those drives and installing manually from the device manager screen. Don't know if this would help you, just another thought

Thanks for the follow-up dbone. So far, no luck. I even tried reinstalling Win7 after updating my BIOS to the latest from the manufacturer. I've got a thread going on the Win7 forums over at Microsoft, so hopeful that if it is a bug, they'll find a way to squash it.

Did any of your devices show a Code 12 error? I don't think I can resolve this by installing 3rd party drivers because it appears to be a resource conflict deeper down in windows. But I can't figure any way to troubleshoot it or reassign IRQs within Win7.

dbone1026

06-17-09, 08:55 AM

Thanks for the follow-up dbone. So far, no luck. I even tried reinstalling Win7 after updating my BIOS to the latest from the manufacturer. I've got a thread going on the Win7 forums over at Microsoft, so hopeful that if it is a bug, they'll find a way to squash it.

Did any of your devices show a Code 12 error? I don't think I can resolve this by installing 3rd party drivers because it appears to be a resource conflict deeper down in windows. But I can't figure any way to troubleshoot it or reassign IRQs within Win7.

Sorry to hear about the problems you have run in to. I never came across the Code 12 error. When I upgraded the old PC from XP to W7 I actually put in a new HDD, so I was missing a bunch of drivers, just went over to Dell.com and downloaded. I agree, it does sound like something more serious then a driver issue, I wouldn't be surprised if it was a big somewhere. I have installed W7 on 4 PCs so far (3 x W7x64 and 1 X W7x32) and the only one I had problems with was the x32 install. Everything loaded fine but 7MC played pixelated. Probably just a driver conflict but just scrapped for the time being.

Good luck getting this resolved and drop a post if you are able to get it fixed as I am sure more people will probably run into the same issue.

an1913t

06-17-09, 11:38 AM

So I've read through quite a few pages here and am still confused and need of assistance. I want to put together my 1st HTPC with the following needs and would appreciate any thoughts or suggestions.

- I will be using this for SD/HD content from an internal BD player and streaming from a 12tb WHS (lots of SD) where all my encoding and storage are done.
- I will not be playing games.
- I have a Samsung LN52A650 that this will be connected to.
- I currently have an older Denon receiver (pro-logic old) that I will continue to use for another year or so before upgrading to something with 7.1
- I want to use Vista or W7 MC as the OS because I'm using MyMovies for streaming off of the WHS
- I would like a tuner card that works with MC - I only have digital air reception (no cable or satelite)

I'm leaning towards a mid-range ATX system per the current recommendations on p. 85 and would like any suggestions as to whether to use the Intel or AMD system (staying away from NVidia based on some of the recent comments). Also, could I get away with a lower end system using internal graphics until I upgrade my receiver to 7.1?

Thanks for any help.

ejkeebler

06-17-09, 12:14 PM

@an1913t

I'm pretty much looking at the same path as you with the exception that my pc will not be getting anything from a server, from everything i read in this thread so far it seems like the mid range micro ATX AMD/AMD offers superior Picture Quality and supports above and beyond what you are doing. I think it's the route I am taking as well and I will also be attaching to a Samsung 52", but the A750 instead.

My only questions that remains for me:

1. I've heard ATI cards have some problems operating in SageTV (which i may be ditching for Media Portal anyway, if I can confirm the TV part of it is comparable to sage)

2. Vista 32 Vista 64 or W7 32 or W7 64 (i read something about a couple of perhaps important codecs dont run in 64 bit windows)

3. Using the Antec 2480 with included power supply vs the Fusion w/ remote and corsair 450.

juda

06-17-09, 01:01 PM

For anyone interested in the Popcornhour as a compliment to your HTPC setup, they just announced their new model, the C200 (http://dbone1026.blogspot.com/2009/06/popcornhour-c200-just-announced.html). It is a little more on the high end compared to the A110.http://***************/9/R/i.jpghttp://***************/9/P/i.jpg

This is awesome thanks..been looking to read about this!

Dagatech

06-17-09, 01:56 PM

@an1913t

If you're not playing games, I'm not sure you even need to go for the mid-range system. I just built the low-end AMD/Nvidia one almost to spec, and it's playing SD/HD content and 1080p mkv's without a hiccup. Don't have a BluRay drive, so can't test that, but I think it would be fine. I have it hooked up to a Samsung LN40B550, and the picture looks great after a little adjustment.

For a tuner card, I got the AVerTVHD Duet (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16815100041) after reading some reviews. Very easy to install, Windows 7 recognized it and downloaded drivers without any prompting from me, and it immediately worked in WMC, no real configuration necessary. However, it isn't recognized by MediaPortal at all, and other front ends apparently have some trouble with it as well. I think it's mostly because it's a new product, but still something to consider.

snedecor

06-17-09, 02:50 PM

renethx

06-17-09, 04:29 PM

However, it seems that HULU, being flash based, does not take advantage of hardware graphics processors, and the low end doesn't do full screen HULU, especially at 1080p resolution.

What is the lowest Intel processor, coupled with the Zotac GF9300 that will easily play HULU full-screen at 1080p size? Will the E7400 do it? I'd like to keep to 65W TDP processors, as I have the MI-008 tiny case, and need a tiny HSF and low power dissipation for the cramped space in the case.

I saw one post by rene that hinted that the E7400 would work. Has anyone done this and been successful? What are your processor loading on full screen hulu playback?

Thanks for the advice.
I am watching Hulu at 1080 with Athlon X2 7750 2.7GHz and GeForce 8300. CPU usage is 65%-85% and playback is mostly very smooth. You will see similar results with E5200+GF9300.

magester

06-17-09, 04:42 PM

- AnandTech (http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=3572)
- x-bit labs (http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/cpu/display/phenom-athlon-ii-x2.html)
- BenchmarkReviews.com (http://benchmarkreviews.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=310&Itemid=63)
- Overclockers Club (http://www.overclockersclub.com/reviews/phenom2x2_athlon2x2/)

and a bunch of others ...

Just like Phenom II X3, you could unblock the blocked two cores and turn Phenom II X2 into Phenom II X4 for free.

- x-bit labs: Unlocking Blocked Cores (http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/cpu/display/phenom-athlon-ii-x2_15.html#sect0)

So, like most, I think the Phenom X2 550 is EXTREMELY attractive because of the ability to unlock two additional cores...

However, I am set on using a Micro-ATX case and on board graphics for my HTPC... Does anyone know of a motherboard that will 1) have sufficient on board graphics for 1080p and 2) have an AMD SB750 southbridge that will allow me to unlock the additional cores?

This is my last piece of the puzzle before pulling the trigger! Any help would be greatly appreciated!

wickchucker

06-17-09, 05:28 PM

I've gathered through the reading of almost all of this thread (or at least since page 85, that the low end intel system plays BD just fine, using, for example the internal GF9300 to offload hardware decoding, making the E5200 work just fine for that.

However, it seems that HULU, being flash based, does not take advantage of hardware graphics processors, and the low end doesn't do full screen HULU, especially at 1080p resolution.

What is the lowest Intel processor, coupled with the Zotac GF9300 that will easily play HULU full-screen at 1080p size? Will the E7400 do it? I'd like to keep to 65W TDP processors, as I have the MI-008 tiny case, and need a tiny HSF and low power dissipation for the cramped space in the case.

I saw one post by rene that hinted that the E7400 would work. Has anyone done this and been successful? What are your processor loading on full screen hulu playback?

Thanks for the advice.

There is a lengthy thread (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1133070&page=5&highlight=hulu)discussing how much power is needed to watch Hulu full screen smoothly. It was determined that CPU is indeed the bottleneck, but I don't think it was ever decided exactly where the cut off was for how much CPU one needed for smooth playback. Some users reported on an E8400 it ran smooth.

etcarroll

06-17-09, 06:28 PM

Watching HULU with an 8400 and HD4670 smoothly.

Cpu is busy, but not maxed out.

dbone1026

06-17-09, 06:51 PM

I have watched Hulu and other online content, AMD 4850e / GPU 4670 and no problems.

bmcent1

06-17-09, 10:35 PM

Sorry to hear about the problems you have run in to. I never came across the Code 12 error.

[...]

Good luck getting this resolved and drop a post if you are able to get it fixed as I am sure more people will probably run into the same issue.

Thanks for your suggestions along the way too!

Unfortunately, I have tried A LOT of things (almost every combination of BIOS settings imaginable ;-), updating BIOS to the latest, reinstalling Win 7 32-bit. No joy.

Understand Win 7 is a release candidate at this point, but now I remember why I went ahead and bought a stand along blu-ray player at the same time I ordered these HTPC parts. At least I can blow off some steam now watching Live Free or Die Hard while I wait (fingers crossed) for MS's coders to come up with a fix! ;-)

I don't believe this is a problem with the Sapphire / ATI driver, I think it's lower level than that. Possibly ASUS's BIOS and Win 7 not playing well together, at least with respect to the ATI 4670 card.

I would expect this would bite anyone using an ASUS P5AD2-E Premium motherboard (and possibly anyone using an Intel i925XE chipset) in combination with Win 7 and the ATI 4670 card. Fortunately, this board is several years old and it probably won't impact many people.

The solution is likely just to upgrade the Mobo, but then I'll probably need new RAM and a new CPU, so the "solution" is basically a new computer.

For anyone who wants to see a more play-by-play of everything tried, you can read this thread over at MS:
http://social.technet.microsoft.com/Forums/en/w7itprohardware/thread/738f84cd-7e53-493e-8616-e866322d9e5e

Maybe even see a solution get documented there sometime! :)

I think I'll give Win 7 64-bit a try and see if it works around this issue. Otherwise, I'll go for a more modern HTPC.

Thanks again for the suggestions!

magester

06-18-09, 12:11 AM

Ok - I just ordered my parts... What does everyone think? (Hopefully I didn't f' anything up) All I need to decide is if I want a DVD burner or a blue ray player...

Antec Black Aluminum / Steel Fusion Remote Black Micro ATX Media Center / HTPC Case - Retail (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811129054)
$159.95

BIOSTAR TA790GX XE AM2+/AM2 AMD 790GX HDMI Micro ATX AMD Motherboard - Retail (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813138140)
$89.99 + $12.99 for 1 year replacement plan = $102.98

CORSAIR CMPSU-450VX 450W ATX12V V2.2 80 PLUS Certified Active PFC Compatible with Core i7 Power Supply - Retail (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139003)
$74.99 --> $54.99 after $20.00 mail in rebate

AMD Phenom II X4 920 2.8GHz Socket AM2+ 125W Quad-Core Processor Model HDX920XCGIBOX - Retail (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103472)
$159.99 --> $19.99 off coupon code so really $140.00

G.SKILL 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 1066 (PC2 8500) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory Model F2-8500CL5D-4GBPK - Retail (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231166)
$54.99

Seagate Barracuda 7200.11 ST31500341AS 1.5TB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drive (bare drive) - OEM (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822148337)
$119.99

- $24.20 Combo Discount
+ Free Shipping

= $618.69
- $20.00 rebate check back in mail = Total purchase price $598.73

How did I do?

tlguapo

06-18-09, 01:35 AM

bodine465

06-18-09, 05:49 AM

Sorry if this has been covered already, but I'm not finding what I need. I put together a system using an Asus M3A78-EM MB, AMD Phenom 9600 quad core CPU, 4 gigs ram, an LG bluray/HD-DVD drive, and a Gigabyte Radeon HD 4350 HDCP ready video card. Using Windows 7 RC. The Antec Fusion V2 I used won't fit in the entertainment center that everything else is in, so it had to placed in a rack on the side of the room. The shape of the room won't allow running the wires along the walls because of a walkway between them. Solution is to run them under the house, which I've already done for a second receiver used for an Infocus projector. Second receiver and projector won't be involved with HDPC.

Here's my question. When I tested out the HTPC using an HDMI cable directly to my 42" Philips LCD, the media center would display and I could play video through it, but I could not see the computer desktop or utilize any apps, like Firefox. When I used an HDMI/DVI cable, desktop displays and all is well. Thing is, I'd prefer to only run an HDMI cable under the floor to the system to utilize video & sound, instead of a DVI cable and a toslink cable. Is there a way to use the computer, desktop and all, through the HDMI cable, or is there some type of movie rights restriction that prevents that? Or did I just screw something up? (Definite possibility) Right now, all of my HDMI video components are going into an HDMI switcher because my TV only has one HDMI input, but I'll be replacing my Panasonic receiver with an AV receiver with HDMI imputs.

That brings me to the bonus question. Pioneer VSX-1019AH-K or Onkyo TX-SR607 ? Have an Onkyo with the projector setup and really happy with it, but the Pioneer is tempting.

dbone1026

06-18-09, 07:16 AM

That brings me to the bonus question. Pioneer VSX-1019AH-K or Onkyo TX-SR607 ? Have an Onkyo with the projector setup and really happy with it, but the Pioneer is tempting.

Don't know if this helps, I have a Pioneer VSX94 and Onkyo 906, prefer the Onkyo.

digitlnoize

06-18-09, 07:47 AM

Ok. I've narrowed down my choices, but would still like some opinions. I've decided to get rid of my current, crappy Pentium D due to bottlenecking issues. Here's what I've got, then I'll tell you what I'm looking to add:

Case: Antec 900 Case (I know it's huge, but it's tucked away behind the TV and you can't see it).
Video Card: Sapphire HD4770
Ram: 4GB DDR2-800
Harddisks: Tons. Mostly WD. 1TB, 500GB, 250GB, 120GB...plenty of space for now.
Controller: Logitech DiNovo

Choices:

MB: GIGABYTE GA-EP45-UD3P http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128358

CPU: Intel Core 2 Duo E8400 Wolfdale 3.0GHz http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115037

Or

MB: GIGABYTE GA-MA790GP-UD4H http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128384

CPU: AMD Phenom II X4 940 Deneb 3.0GHz http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103471

I am leaning towards the Intel setup right now, since it's less heat...but they're about the same price...

Does anyone have better suggestions? Should I downgrade to the 2.8 (or less) gHz Intel processor? That'd save some money...