Guide to Building a HD HTPC [Text View] - Page 74

nickman789

01-16-12, 02:16 PM

I am running an HTPC that I built based on renethx's March 2011 guide, but for some reason, there is now an about 1 second lag on the audio, which occurred after I reinstalled windows. In other words, the audio is about 1 second after the video.

I am running:
Windows 7 64-bit (SP1)
Intel i3-2100 @ 3.10
AS Rock P67 Extreme4
4 GB RAM
SSD
2nd Spinning HD for Data
ATI Radeon HD 3600
Windows Media Center
Ceton 4-tuner card
Shark 007 codecs

Videos are saved to a second (spinning) hard drive. But the problem occurs even when I run videos off the SSD boot drive.

The problem occurs whether I play through WMC or another video player (e.g., Hulu, Youtube). The HTPC is connected via an HDMI cord to a Sharp 60 in (LC-60e79u).

I have tried the following, all with no luck:

-- updating the video drivers
-- changing the TV and the HDMI cord; no luck
-- uninstalling and reinstalling codecs (tried Shark 007 and CCCP)
-- reinstalling Windows 7

In my ATI settings, I can increase the audio lag, but not decrease it. About a month ago, I installed an SSD. On the prior set up (same hardware, just a regular HD), I was not having the issue. The SSD and a new install of Windows are the only things that have changed.

Any ideas are greatly appreciated.

renethx

01-16-12, 02:39 PM

Are you sure about 3500 ~ 50W / 3870K ~ 60W at video playback? Weird, only 10W difference between them.

If its true than no sense to buy A6-3500
Nothing weird. "TDP (Thermal Design. Power)" is the *maximum* power consumption of the processor, that tells nothing about power consumption at a light work load such as video playback.

Dr.leXus

01-16-12, 02:59 PM

Nothing weird. "TDP (Thermal Design. Power)" is the *maximum* power consumption of the processor, that tells nothing about power consumption at a light work load such as video playback.

I will use HTPC for:

60% - Surfing, Online TV, SD content.
25% - HD content 1080p
15% - Old games, like Burnout Paradise Ultimate, Unreal Tournament 2004, Need for Speed Undercover.

Can you tell which system is better from power consumption and noise level side.

1.
- AMD A8 3870 Black Edition Unlocked 3.0 GHz + integrated ATI Radeon 6550D (TDP 100W)
- ASUS F1A75-M PRO

2.
- Intel Core i3 2100T 2.5GHz (TDP 35W)
- Gigabyte Z68MA-D2H-B3
- ATI Radeon 6670 1GB (TDP 66W)

3.
- AMD A6 3500 2.1 GHz + integrated ATI Radeon 6530D (TDP 65W)
- ASUS F1A75-M PRO

Looks like AMD A8-3870 is better choose compare to Intel i3 2100T for my HTPC. The total power consumption will be lower with A8. Am I wrong?

Randy Mathis

01-17-12, 01:18 AM

I will use HTPC for:

60% - Surfing, Online TV, SD content.
25% - HD content 1080p
15% - Old games, like Burnout Paradise Ultimate, Unreal Tournament 2004, Need for Speed Undercover.

Can you tell which system is better from power consumption and noise level side.

1.
- AMD A8 3870 Black Edition Unlocked 3.0 GHz + integrated ATI Radeon 6550D (TDP 100W)
- ASUS F1A75-M PRO

2.
- Intel Core i3 2100T 2.5GHz (TDP 35W)
- Gigabyte Z68MA-D2H-B3
- ATI Radeon 6670 1GB (TDP 66W)

3.
- AMD A6 3500 2.1 GHz + integrated ATI Radeon 6530D (TDP 65W)
- ASUS F1A75-M PRO

Looks like AMD A8-3870 is better choose compare to Intel i3 2100T for my HTPC. The total power consumption will be lower with A8. Am I wrong?

Is the video card really necessary for the Intel system?

renethx

01-17-12, 01:37 AM

Dr.leXus,

Any of A8-3870K, Core i3-21xx is OK (avoid the "T" version, why (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=20523711#post20523711)). As for gaming, 3DMark06 Basic score:

- Intel HD 2000 (Core i3-2100): ~3200
- Intel HD 3000 (Core i3-2105): ~4200
- A6-3500: ~5400
- A6-3650: ~6000
- A8-3850: ~7200
- Core i3-2100 + HD 6670: ~12000

You shouldn't worry about noise. Just attach a better CPU cooler if you don't like the stock cooler. Check my guide.

rsmclay

01-17-12, 09:14 AM

renethx,

Purchased your guide and love it. You have saved us tons of researching and hours. Thank you.

Question for you. I built the budget Intel system for my bedroom. It is working famously, but the case is extremely noisy. My wife says it sounds like a jet. Its all from the case fan. It runs constantly. Is there something I can do? Quieter case fan. Adjust fan settings some how?

Any help would be appreciated. Get the waf back.

Thanks!

renethx

01-17-12, 09:26 AM

rsmclay

01-17-12, 07:25 PM

renethx

01-18-12, 12:57 AM

Thanks renethx. So do you just turned down the voltage to the fans, which will reduce the sound? Is that how it works? Also, I am assuming the fanmate goes inside the case, zip tied to the case or something. Correct?
Yes. Sound pressure has a close relation to the rotation speed, which is in turn almost proportional to the voltage.

You can attach Fan Mate outside of the case.

mudwiggle

01-18-12, 03:37 AM

Hi Renethx, looking forward to your next guide.

I have a question regarding the Intel DH61AG. Can you run a discrete graphics card from the PCIe 2.0 -X4 socket? An adaptor may be needed, but I'm wondering if it can be done, and if so, what is the likely affect on the video performance for HTPC?

Thanks in advance...

renethx

01-18-12, 04:38 AM

I have a question regarding the Intel DH61AG. Can you run a discrete graphics card from the PCIe 2.0 -X4 socket? An adaptor may be needed, but I'm wondering if it can be done, and if so, what is the likely affect on the video performance for HTPC?
Yes, just make the closed-end socket to open-end. The performance difference is none to little in video playback.

mudwiggle

01-18-12, 04:55 AM

Yes, just make the closed-end socket to open-end. The performance difference is none to little in video playback.

Do you mean cut/file out the closed end?

thanks...

renethx

01-18-12, 05:00 AM

Yes.

mudwiggle

01-18-12, 05:07 AM

Thank you so much renethx. I was going to buy a PicoPSU for a different mini-itx mobo, but when I saw the DH61AG, it allowed me to use an external brick directly. The intention is to try out the igpu of the i3-2100, but add a HD 5670 if needed. Will let you know how I go....

Thanks again.

Dr.leXus

01-18-12, 03:08 PM

Hello everyone, please help to choose right one. Most important are noiseless and power consumption.

1.
AMD A8 3870 Black Edition Unlocked 3.0 GHz + integrated ATI Radeon 6550D (TDP 100W)
ASUS F1A75-M PRO

2.
Intel Pentium Dual Core G850 2.9GHz (TDP 65W)
MSI Z68MA-ED55
ATI Radeon 6570 (TDP 44W)

Any opinions?

scoot13

01-18-12, 09:57 PM

dookeran_3

01-19-12, 07:09 AM

I have purchased your guide and find it very informative. I'm starting to put together an Intel build, and although AMD has it's advantages I am morally obligated to stick with Intel. I'm also thinking of adding a video card instead of using on board and an audio card as well because I DJ on the side and will run Virtual DJ to compile my music lists on this machine then transfer them to my DJ rig . Will also add a Blu Ray later on. I would like your opinion on this build;

Intel i3-2120
GIGABYTE GA-Z68MA-D2H-B3 LGA 1155 Intel Z68 (Is this the right choice seeing that I'm not utilizing the on board graphics? If not, I would prefer to stick with an Asus or Gigabyte boards for alternatives).
Kingston HyperX 8GB (2 x 4GB) SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800)
Western Digital Caviar Green WD10EARS 1TB 5400 RPM
Antec EarthWatts Green EA-430D Green 430W
LITE-ON DVD Burner - Bulk
Video Card: either GT 430/440 or HD 6570/6670
Sound Card: Need the digital out thingy (S/PDIF?) and really reasonable price. Have not bought a sound card in years so am out of the loop on what is good these days.

Thanks in advance

renethx

01-19-12, 04:25 PM

I am slowly building an HTPC after picking up a used Hauppauge 1212 HD-PVR. I'm looking through the thread and getting some great information. I already have installed MediaPortal on my regular PC and by running a USB cable through a wall, I can record from the satellite box and it looks great.

I need a good GPU and I see a lot of them recommended. I found these two and they are both mentioned often in this thread.

#1> MSI GeForce GT 430 - 2024MB, DDR3 (http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/searchtools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=1749412) $80 plus a $15 rebate

#2>Visiontek Radeon HD 5670 - 1024MB DDR5 (http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=6469845&CatId=3669) $100

So I guess my question is... Is a 1G DDR5 card card $20 better (or $35 better if I remember to send that dang rebate in!) for HTPC than a 2G DDR3 card? ...Which one would you get?
There are several cheaper G430 cards such as GALAXY, $30 AR (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814162067), ASUS, $40 AR (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814121397), ECS, $45 AR (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814134121). 1GB RAM is enough for video playback. Make sure to choose memory effective speed 1600MHz or higher.

HD 5670 is better than GT 430 in gaming, but you'd better buy a HD 6670 GDDR5, that's cheaper (SAPPHIRE $82 AR (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102935)) and better.

renethx

01-19-12, 04:57 PM

dookeran_3

01-19-12, 05:05 PM

Which card of those listed would you recommend? I'm mostly streaming video from internet (Veetle, Justin), downloaded movies (using Nero 11) and general purpose computing. Was hoping that a better video card will help with the picture quality for streaming. Also will be using Windows 7 64 bit.

renethx

01-19-12, 08:10 PM

GT 430/HD 6570 (both DDR3) is good enough for video playback. HD 6670 is better for gaming.

tooler40

01-19-12, 08:56 PM

GT 430/HD 6570 (both DDR3) is good enough for video playback. HD 6670 is better for gaming.
What about the fanless 6670 w/DDR3?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814161392

Also, is there really a difference in overall PQ between the GT430 and 6670? I thought I read somewhere that ATI cards have better overall PQ, color, rendering, etc...

scoot13

01-19-12, 10:54 PM

There are several cheaper G430 cards such as GALAXY, $30 AR (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814162067), ASUS, $40 AR (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814121397), ECS, $45 AR (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814134121). 1GB RAM is enough for video playback. Make sure to choose memory effective speed 1600MHz or higher.

HD 5670 is better than GT 430 in gaming, but you'd better buy a HD 6670 GDDR5, that's cheaper (SAPPHIRE $82 AR (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102935)) and better.

Thanks for the clear answer and recommendations. Most all of the DDR5 cards are 1000 memory effective speed. I assume that is okay with DDR5?

renethx

01-20-12, 12:33 AM

What about the fanless 6670 w/DDR3?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814161392

Also, is there really a difference in overall PQ between the GT430 and 6670? I thought I read somewhere that ATI cards have better overall PQ, color, rendering, etc...
GDDR5 is faster than DDR3. You will have more, fancier post-processors with HD 6670 GDDR5 than HD 6670 DDR3, HD 6670 DDR3 than GT 430.

renethx

01-20-12, 12:37 AM

Thanks for the clear answer and recommendations. Most all of the DDR5 cards are 1000 memory effective speed. I assume that is okay with DDR5?
There is no DDR5 yet (DDR4 is under development). Only GDDR5 (based on DDR3 technology). The "effective" speed of GDDR5 is usually 3000MHz--4000MHz. That of DDR3 is 1000MHz--2000MHz.

Ferrino

01-20-12, 05:41 PM

Hi - I just donated for the latest issue and was wondering if I could please get some feedback on this system I'm thinking of building. This will be a HTPC running Windows 7 for watching live tv and recording tv (through a HDHomeRun) and then playing a library of ripped Blurays in MKV format. I'm trying to run everything through Windows Media Center and with a Logitech Harmony remote. I'll need some extra cpu cycles for some webcam monitoring software and maybe some other home automation stuff.

[CPU+GPU] AMD A8-3850
[MOBO] Gigabyte A75M-UD2H
[MEMORY] Corsair Vengeance 8GB (2x4GB) DDR3 1600
[CASE] Silverstone ML03B
[PSU] Antec EA-380D

I'd like to get the system as quiet as possible, so I'm not sure if the stock CPU cooler will work for that. I went for a slightly faster APU as I'd like to not have to buy a dedicated GPU card.

renethx

01-21-12, 03:04 PM

@Ferrino

The max height of CPU cooler allowed inside the case is 70mm. A couple of these coolers:

- Scythe Shuriken 64mm
- Scythe BIG Shuriken 58mm (the inner two DIMMs will be blocked)
- Prolimatech Samuel 17 45mm + Scythe Slip Stream Slim 120 mm Case Fan SY1212SL12H 12mm.

boxterduke

01-24-12, 11:26 AM

boldaslove

01-24-12, 02:45 PM

Renethx, have you or anyone else here used this: http://www.nzxt.com/new/products/fan_control/sentry_lx ?

The last guide I have of yours is from middle of last year so I apologize if you've added it to any recent ones, but just curious. It looks quite handy and fancy-schmancy for a server.

renethx

01-24-12, 03:17 PM

What do you guys think of the i3-2120 3ghz (http://www.canadacomputers.com/product_info.php?cPath=4_65&item_id=039887) in an Antec ISK300-150 (http://store.antec.com/Product/enclosure-itx/isk300-150/0-761345-15121-4.aspx)
Would there be enough room for the cpu fan? I can't find the i3 2100T anywhere.

I also need 8GB Ram to go with the Asus P8H61-I mobo that I'm getting. DDR3-1333. Could you guys point out which one from this site goes well with the Asus P8H61-I
http://www.canadacomputers.com/index.php?cPath=24_311_312_611
Yes, the cooler fits the case fine. "T" version is pointless.

This kit (http://www.canadacomputers.com/product_info.php?cPath=24_311_312_611&item_id=035766) should work.

BTW why do you need 8GB? Unless you edit videos/photos for example, 4GB is enough and the remaining 4GB will be wasted. Core i3-2105+Z68+DDR3-2133 2x2GB is a golden combination for HTPC.

renethx

01-24-12, 03:22 PM

Renethx, have you or anyone else here used this: http://www.nzxt.com/new/products/fan_control/sentry_lx ?
No.

boxterduke

01-24-12, 04:25 PM

Yes, the cooler fits the case fine. "T" version is pointless.
This kit (http://www.canadacomputers.com/product_info.php?cPath=24_311_312_611&item_id=035766) should work.
BTW why do you need 8GB? Unless you edit videos/photos for example, 4GB is enough and the remaining 4GB will be wasted. Core i3-2105+Z68+DDR3-2133 2x2GB is a golden combination for HTPC.
Thanks for the reply. I might do some ripping on the computer and since there is not much difference in price then why not :)
For the ram you picked, do you think the Ripjaws would fit the Antec ISK300-150?

==

Seeing your suggestion on a Core i3-2105+Z68+DDR3-2133
Could you recommend a z68 mobo and DDR3-2133 ram? From newegg.ca preferably.

Thanks :)

renethx

01-24-12, 05:15 PM

For the ram you picked, do you think the Ripjaws would fit the Antec ISK300-150?
Yes. (BTW "need" implies "necessity", that's why I wondered.)

There are only two choices, either ASRock or ZOTAC. I recommend ASRock. Any DDR3-2133 2 x 2GB kit is OK.

Northy

01-24-12, 06:50 PM

@renethx

I think your guide is fantastic and I'm wondering when you'll be releasing the latest edition?

renethx

01-24-12, 07:18 PM

I am going to release it (Dec '11+Jan '12) by the end of this month.

tomandbeth

01-24-12, 07:40 PM

Yes, the cooler fits the case fine. "T" version is pointless.

This kit (http://www.canadacomputers.com/product_info.php?cPath=24_311_312_611&item_id=035766) should work.

BTW why do you need 8GB? Unless you edit videos/photos for example, 4GB is enough and the remaining 4GB will be wasted. Core i3-2105+Z68+DDR3-2133 2x2GB is a golden combination for HTPC.

Hello Renethx,

I recently saw the I3-2125 CPU, which is similar to the I3-2105 above but has the on die HD3000 and slightly faster. I realize you are constantly working to improve your guides, and wonder what your thoughts would be on the I3-2125 CPU.

Thank you.

Tom

renethx

01-24-12, 07:48 PM

2125 is slightly faster in the processor part (3.3GHz vs 3.1GHz), but that's not important in video playback. Graphics is identical. So you can go with either of 2105 ($130) or 2125 ($140).

tomandbeth

01-24-12, 07:53 PM

2125 is slightly faster in the processor part (3.3GHz vs 3.1GHz), but that's not important in video playback. Graphics is identical. So you can go with either of 2105 ($130) or 2125 ($140).

Thank you. I evidently missed the 2105 has the same graphics.

boxterduke

01-25-12, 08:27 AM

Yes. (BTW "need" implies "necessity", that's why I wondered.)
There are only two choices, either ASRock or ZOTAC. I recommend ASRock. Any DDR3-2133 2 x 2GB kit is OK.
I am going to release it (Dec '11+Jan '12) by the end of this month.
Thanks for the help renethx. And I'm going to get your latest guide :)

I always come back to this thread, it has helped me last year when I was building my main HTPC. Keep up the good work.

rsmclay

01-25-12, 05:46 PM

This method (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=21185440#post21185440) works with almost every microATX/ATX case with multiple fans.

renethx,

Thanks for this suggestion. I installed tonight, and it has made a drastic difference. I am hoping that it doesn't get warm and quit working, like some of the reviews stated, but otherwise it was a brilliant solution.

Thanks!!!

bent240lv

01-26-12, 04:38 PM

Mfusick

01-26-12, 05:02 PM

I have done a lot of reading her and reviews on other sites. I have decided on my build and will probably buy assasins guide for software setup.

My build :
silverstone GD05 case

Intel I5 2500k cpu

PSU: Seasonic x660

Mobo: ASUS Maximus IV Gen-z/Gen3

SDD: crucial M4 128%+

HDD: WDgreen 3TB

RAM: Kingston Hyper-x 8GB

Gpu: MSI HD6670

I think that's it for now. Any recomendations for a cpu cooler?

The 2500k cooler that comes stock should work fine and be quiet.

I have a spare if you want to grab it cheap.

I replaced my 2600k cooler with Coolermaster EVO 212+ It's light years better- but if your not overclocking don't worry about it.

http://www.maximumpc.com/files/u139222/cmhyper212evo-01-small.jpg

http://www.maximumpc.com/article/%5Bprimary-term%5D/cooler_master_hyper_212_evo_review

here is the review:

basically no $30 cooler can touch it.

I have a coolermaster Cosmos II case though.. if your case is small might want to check the clearance.

renethx

01-26-12, 06:29 PM

Any recomendations for a cpu cooler?
You have to be careful in selecting a cooler, the max height inside GD05 is only 70mm. One of the best coolers for a quad-core processor in GD05 is Prolimatech Samuel 17 + Kaze Maru2 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835185157).

bent240lv

01-26-12, 07:05 PM

Yeah, the coolmaster says it has a height of 6" don't think it will work. Thanks for the advice.

galaxybird88

01-27-12, 11:15 AM

Hi there!

Great guide, thanks for putting it together. I'm working on revamping my HTPC currently and was hoping for some advice. You seem to recommend having your GPU separate from your Mobo.

Does this result in issues when trying to get Sound/Video to a reciever and then Video to a TV? It seems like having onboard graphics makes that a lot easier. One cord to the receiver from the PC, and one from the receiver to the TV.

I've been having a hard time figuring out if the onboard graphics on a given mobo supports 7.1 surround sound. Could you recommend one please?

In the guide:
HDMI Solutions
Intel Core i3/i5 Clarkdale processors (that integrate GPU); to be replaced by the Sandy Bridge processors
in Q1 2011.

From the rest of that guide, it seems like the Sandy Bridge processor is a good bet, but if I want to go for onboard graphics, how can I make sure it will support full 7.1?

Also - why do you shy away from onboard? I understand that you wouldn't get the full graphics capabilities, but my system will have no gaming done on it. Will I still be able to have full 1080p seamless playback?

Thanks for reading!

renethx

01-27-12, 11:51 PM

WMC's AutoPlay feature (different from Windows AutoPlay) enables us to play back BD (ISO or physical disc) with any DirectShow player supporting LAV Source Splitter filter from inside WMC (typically built-in Movie Library+Mikinho Mount Image (http://mikinho.com/projects/) or Media Browser (http://www.mediabrowser.tv/)). Basic flow of the playback is:

1. Select a movie (iso) in the movie organizer and play it.

2. The movie organizer mounts the image and the following screen appears:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=221478&stc=1&d=1314825580

It's up to you and your system what players appear in the screen (via the registry key AutoPlay\Blu-Ray).

3. Select the player you want to use and press Enter. The playback begins. If there is only one player registered in AutoPlay\Blu-Ray, the playback begins immediately without this screen appearing.

4. When the playback ends and the player is closed (often by pressing Backspace key), the previous screen reappears.

Here is how to add a player to the AutoPlay\Blu-Ray list. For example, consider the case of MPC HomeCinema x86. I assume you can play back a mounted BD iso with MPC HomeCinema by "Open DVD...".

1: Create an entry point of WMC for MPC HomeCinema (i.e. create a key in HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion \Media Center\Extensibility\Entry Points).

This can be done by manually creating a key in the registry, but using a graphical UI such as Media Center Studio is more convenient. Media Center Studio is not available for download from the author's site right now, so download the bin folder here (http://hotfile.com/dl/144053336/9e26bc0/MCS_bin.zip.html) (MCS_bin.zip), unzip it and place it in C:\ProgramData\Media Center Studio (actually it does not matter where the bin folder is placed). Create a shortcut to C:\ProgramData\Media Center Studio\bin\MCStudioLauncher.exe, on the desktop for example, and double click it to launch Media Center Studio. Click "Start Menu" in the menu bar, then click "Start Menu" tab. Click Insert > Application.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=235528&stc=1&d=1327732875

Then you will see the following dialog box. Type in each field as in the figure:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=235529&stc=1&d=1327647301

- Title: MPC HomeCinema (or whatever; this will appear in the screen (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=221478&stc=1&d=1314825580))
- Path: C:\Program Files (x86)\Media Player Classic - Home Cinema\mpc-hc.exe
- Arguments: V: (this should be the drive letter of the virtual optical drive in your system). If you use another player, this may need to be "V:\BDMV\index.bdmv".
- Active image: whatever (that will appear in the screen (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=221478&stc=1&d=1314825580)). I used mr.duck's icon (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1497673#post1497673). Inactive image will be created automatically.

Save and close Media Center Studio. To edit fields later, launch Media Center Studio, click "Entry points" in the lower left corner of the window and double click "MPC HomeCinema" icon.

2: Add the entry point created in the above to AutoPlay\Blu-ray (i.e. create a key in HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion \Media Center\Extensibility\Categories\AutoPlay\Blu-Ray).

Right now this can be done only manually (where people have had no clue). Go to the directly C:\ProgramData\Media Center Studio\Images\EntryPoints (the location is fixed wherever the bin folder is). You will see an image file (.png) of the Active image you selected. The file name is the GUID of the entry point just created. In my case it is {ed04868e-bf98-467c-a50f-3137609e3ba7}. Launch Registry Editor (regedit.exe). Go to the key HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion \Media Center\Extensibility\Categories\AutoPlay\Blu-Ray and create a new key with name {ed04868e-bf98-467c-a50f-3137609e3ba7}. Go to the key HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion \Media Center\Extensibility\Entry Points\{ed04868e-bf98-467c-a50f-3137609e3ba7} and copy the value of AppId. In my case it is {e87bf767-1efd-479d-9407-3609df0c9034}. Create a new string value in HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion \Media Center\Extensibility\Categories\AutoPlay\Blu-Ray\{ed04868e-bf98-467c-a50f-3137609e3ba7} with name AppId and value {ed04868e-bf98-467c-a50f-3137609e3ba7}.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=235532&stc=1&d=1327735198

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=235533&stc=1&d=1327648735

That's it.

renethx

01-28-12, 01:44 AM

@galaxybird88

Check the feature tables of the latest guide.

funnyfuka

01-28-12, 12:16 PM

renethx. im getting a file not found message in mpc-hc. my movies are in bluray folder structure rather than iso, will mpc-hc autoplay blurays that are in their folder structure.

renethx

01-28-12, 11:40 PM

renethx. im getting a file not found message in mpc-hc. my movies are in bluray folder structure rather than iso, will mpc-hc autoplay blurays that are in their folder structure.
Many players support the BD folder in HDD as well as BD disc in a physical or virtual optical drive. But WMC and Windows AutoPlay support only BD disc in a physical or virtual optical drive. As Windows 8 supports ISO natively, ripping in ISO may be a better choice than the BD folder, depending on your usage. Of course Media Browser supports the BD folder in HDD, but without AutoPlay, so that you have to use only one player you specified in Media Browser configuration.

funnyfuka

01-29-12, 05:44 AM

Many players support the BD folder in HDD as well as BD disc in a physical or virtual optical drive. But WMC and Windows AutoPlay support only BD disc in a physical or virtual optical drive. As Windows 8 supports ISO natively, ripping in ISO may be a better choice than the BD folder, depending on your usage. Of course Media Browser supports the BD folder in HDD, but without AutoPlay, so that you have to use only one player you specified in Media Browser configuration.

thanks for that information renethx
would you recommend me to convert my BD folder movies to iso
what program would you use to do this if so

renethx

01-29-12, 04:53 PM

thanks for that information renethx
would you recommend me to convert my BD folder movies to iso
what program would you use to do this if so
As I said, it's up to each user. Personally I prefer ISO because of the maximum compatibility/convenience. Ripping BR 3D in folder is not recommended because of a larger file size; ISO is recommended. Some people hate the extra process of mounting the image, but this will be the past story with Windows 8 (and XBMC already supports ISO natively and nobody notices a time lag by this process).

ImgBurn?

Ferrino

01-31-12, 02:11 PM

Hi - guide donor here :-)

I've made a revision to my HTPC build and was wondering if I could please get some feedback on this system? The main change is dropping from a A8-3850 to a A6-3500 as I want to have plenty of headroom to run a picoPSU to get the system quiet. The 160W picoPSU seems to be the strongest one I could find and I think the A6-3500 will actually do everything I need. I want to run the system 24/7, so I don't want to worry about being on the edge of the power supply limit with these picoPSUs.

This is for a Windows 7 build - controlling everything through Windows Media Center. I'm looking for something quiet that will flawlessly play all manner of MKVs (1080p etc.) and play and record OTA television through a HDHomeRun. I don't need any of the fancy rendering algorithms - I just want something that will play as smoothly as my media streamer, which is a WDTV Live Plus.

I've gone for a picoPSU and I believe that with the 65W TDP chip I should have plenty of headroom with this 160W supply? I don't plan to have any dedicated cards and I will run a self-powered HDD. I was not planning to run any case fans as this case appears to be well ventilated. My only question mark is regarding the noise of the supplied AMD cpu fan - I was planning to see how loud it really is before splashing out on a Scythe Big Shuriken.

[APU] AMD A6-3500
[MOBO] ASROCK A75M (micro-ATX)
[CASE] SILVERSTONE ML03B
[PSU] 160W picoPSU (http://www.mini-box.com/picoPSU-192-XT-192W-Adapter-Power-Kit)
[MEMORY] 4GB DDR3 1600 CORSAIR XMS3
[SSD] 80GB INTEL
[HDD] EXTERNAL eSATA (SEPARATE POWER)

renethx

01-31-12, 05:19 PM

Looks good. Another good cooler is Prolimatech Samuel 17 (45mm tall) + SY1212SL12H (12mm thick), that won't block any DIMM.

mathias0030

02-01-12, 06:34 PM

Hi guys,

I'm ready to spend some $3000-4000 for my HTPC. CPU, GPU and other elements are things that are easy for me to choose. What I really need is advice what case should I use. The one I really like is a little bit old fashioned Silverstone Crown CW03-black model. The HTPC will be placed in distance of 4 meters (11,5 feet) from where my seat. I know it might sound stupid but I really wonder if I should spend quite big money for 7" display that I won't see from that distance. Otherwise the look of the case is just for me perfect. I've spent already some weeks bothering myself about the case where the main problem was do I need the display or not. Found also Lian-li PC-C32, PC-C33, and PC-C60 but they all have no display. On the other hand the problem is that Silverstone CW03 is getting old (for example USB 2.0 is installed instead of 3.0). Did you guys had same problems. What was you decision ?.

PS: I don't understand why is the LUXA Case not being produced in black colour. Would be probably choosen by thousands.

whiskeynsoda

02-01-12, 08:38 PM

Hi guys ive looked at diagrams and read posts but i must be dumb.. I built an HTPC a few years ago..now I built a server ( ran out of room)..How to i connect the 2...am I an idiot.. I have WHS2008 on the server and I ran a CAT5 cable from the HTPC to the SERVER. server cant identify network ( my HTPC is on a wireless usb stick) Really i just dont understand how this whole thing works.

Snootch

02-01-12, 08:48 PM

I've been though 4 HPTC cases in the last 6 years I've had my HTPC running.
From Micro ATX Antec to 2 full size Silverstone ATX cases until I finally saddled on a case that HAS IT ALL. It was a bit pricy but I've never had buyers remorse since the day I took it out of the box.
Full size ATX, large VFD display, full size PSU and GPU support, 2 x 80mm exhaust fans and 1 x 92mm intake fan , soft mounted hard drives and the SEXY looks are the main features that sold me on this case.

http://i105.photobucket.com/albums/m237/Ralph_Piet/S16V_corner_black.jpg

Highly recommended.

Regards,
KC

PS. Did I mention that the manufacturer includes a pair of white cotton gloves in the box

renethx

02-01-12, 09:10 PM

whiskeynsoda

02-01-12, 09:34 PM

So should I run CAT5 from my wireless router to the server....

renethx

02-02-12, 12:54 AM

Yes.

whiskeynsoda

02-02-12, 09:16 AM

Yes.
Thanks renethx...I used your guide to build to build my htpc over 3 years ago....Love it. Hopefully I can figure this out .

jrolmstd

02-02-12, 11:03 PM

I can transfer files at triple digit speeds through out the transfer from my server to my HTPC but the same file barely breaks 15 MB/sec half way through the transfer when transferred from the HTPC to the sever.

Both systems are running win7 64bit. One with a mid range AMD chip (server) the other with a core i5(HTPC) similar memory speeds and size in both. Network testing shows no issue with the cabling. Server is running raid 5, HTPC has no raid.

Looking for suggestions on getting the HTPC --> server transfer speed more in line with the server --> HTPC speeds.

thanks

Mac The Knife

02-03-12, 03:03 PM

^^^ When the RAID5 in the server runs out of cache, the transfer will slow to a crawl because it's having to generate all the parity data in real-time in order to write the data to the disks and empty the cache before it can handle any more data.

Since the HTPC just has a single drive in it, the writes go a lot faster in that direction since there's no RAID parity calculations that need to be done.

Adding an enormous amount of RAM to the server might help assuming the version of Win7 that you have allows that memory to be used for disk caching. And assuming that you can add more RAM than the size of the biggest files that you usually transfer.(Someone with more knowledge of what's possible in all the different flavors of Win7 will need to chime in on this one. You might actually have to have Win7 server edition, I don't know.)

P.S. This is why some people are willing to spend really big bucks on hardware RAID controller boards with fast CPUs on them that are capable of doing the parity calculations without slowing down the write rates.

jrolmstd

02-03-12, 07:08 PM

jmpa

02-04-12, 11:15 AM

renethx

02-04-12, 09:06 PM

Hi,

Great guide. After reading it, I am thinking in buy this:

http://img833.imageshack.us/img833/2876/htpcm.jpg

But i also want to add an Radeon HD6750. I am not a high gamer, i only want be able to play sometimes if i want. The PSU is enouth for it, it says 450W required? What is the most quiet brand for GPU? The memories and PSU are a little expensive, there aren't cheaper solution?

Regards
Even 300W PSU is enough for your system + HD 6750. Antec EA-380D Green is slightly cheaper. If you are not going to use iGPU, then DDR3-1333/1600 is enough. For example, G.SKILL F3-10666CL9D-4GBNS or F3-12800CL9D-4GBXL. HIS H675F1GD is quiet.

jrolmstd

02-04-12, 11:23 PM

Currently I am running RAID5 under the AMD RAIDXpert software to control 7 1.5T drives. Not happy with the file transfer speeds I am getting between server and PC so I am looking at replacing the software RAID5 with a hardware solution.

What cards are currently being recommended for this?

thanks

outspoken

02-05-12, 01:21 PM

i read through the recent free pdf and found it a useful starting point. however, i think it would benefit from having the OS installation and management portion detailed.

would you recommend having a mirrored raid setup for the OS drive?

renethx

02-05-12, 11:00 PM

the same file barely breaks 15 MB/sec half way through the transfer when transferred from the HTPC to the sever.

Currently I am running RAID5 under the AMD RAIDXpert software to control 7 1.5T drives. Not happy with the file transfer speeds I am getting between server and PC so I am looking at replacing the software RAID5 with a hardware solution.

What cards are currently being recommended for this?
For me this seems to be a network problem. A typical transfer rate between two JBOD (i.e. no RAID at all, software or hardware) systems is

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=236378&stc=1&d=1328504120

(One system is A75 chipset + Realtek RTL8111E Gb LAN chip + WD20EARS, another is GeForce 9400 chipset + NVIDIA Gb LAN + Samsung HD501LJ.) All of the following are disabled:

- Energy Efficient Ethernet
- Flow Control
- Green Ethernet
- Interrupt Moderation
- Jumbo Frame

renethx

02-05-12, 11:12 PM

would you recommend having a mirrored raid setup for the OS drive?
No, just back it up (for example, by using Paragon Backup & Recovery 2012 Free (http://www.paragon-software.com/home/br-free/download.html)).

floepie

02-06-12, 06:43 AM

I have an old HD3450 card which is becoming increasingly incompatible with DVXA AVC decoders such as ffmpeg.

I'm now looking for a fairly low end GFX card that can decode all the modern formats including blu-ray. No gaming is done on this machine.

It looks like the following cards probably fit the bill (in order of weak to strong?)

AMD 6450
nVidia gt520
nVidia gt430
nVidia gt440
AMD 6670

Are there any others I'm missing in this range? I'd like to keep it around $60 with passive cooling if possible. Which would you go for? Thanks!

jrolmstd

02-06-12, 07:32 AM

For me this seems to be a network problem. A typical transfer rate between two JBOD (i.e. no RAID at all, software or hardware) systems is
(One system is A75 chipset + Realtek RTL8111E Gb LAN chip + WD20EARS, another is GeForce 9400 chipset + NVIDIA Gb LAN + Samsung HD501LJ.) All of the following are disabled:

- Energy Efficient Ethernet
- Flow Control
- Green Ethernet
- Interrupt Moderation
- Jumbo Frame

Thanks for the feedback on this and I will check these settings. I have used a network tester on all connections now and verified everything is wired correctly. What confuses me about this being a network issue is how I can down load a file (server --> pc)at 105-108 range but across the same connection, I only get 15-20 uploading (pc --> server) the file.

renethx

02-06-12, 07:58 AM

dharel

02-06-12, 12:12 PM

FishLaw

02-06-12, 02:13 PM

Any idea when an updated version of the guide will be released? Been waiting on the new version for over a month now. Thanks.

jrolmstd

02-06-12, 05:53 PM

I made the suggested changes:

All of the following are disabled:

- Energy Efficient Ethernet
- Flow Control
- Green Ethernet
- Interrupt Moderation
- Jumbo Frame

Bounced both the server and the htpc and run my same test with a 20G file I been using. Same results I had before. Download (server > htpc) rock steady between 105MB/sec and 108MB/sec. I watched the upload (htpc > server) with the same file until it dropped below 20 MB/sec (about 1.5 mins into the copy) then killed it.

Any other suggestions?

I am still curious about what RAID cards are being recommended for RAID5 less than 10 drives....

Ferrino

02-06-12, 07:29 PM

renethx

02-06-12, 08:27 PM

Any other suggestions?

I am still curious about what RAID cards are being recommended for RAID5 less than 10 drives....
How about turning your HTPC into a normal AHCI system? At least 60MB/s is guaranteed. A hardware RAID card is recommended only when you want a faster speed. For example, LSI MegaRAID SATA/SAS 9260-4i, $360 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16816118107) or 9260-8i, $520 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16816118105). You will need an empty PCI Express 2.0 x8 (x16 also works) slot.

renethx

02-06-12, 08:29 PM

Any idea when an updated version of the guide will be released? Been waiting on the new version for over a month now. Thanks.
Very soon (December 2011 and January 2012 combined). I am sorry for the delay.

renethx

02-06-12, 08:54 PM

Here's the final system I came up with - please feel free to comment. This is for a Win7-64 build with Windows Media Center: for live TV though a HDHomeRun, recording TV, playback of 1080p MKVs etc...

My main dilemma was over which Llano chip to use, debating between the A6-3500 and the A8-3850. I decided that I probably wouldn't be doing much gaming and so went with the A6-3500 because of the $50 price difference and lower TDP. I appreciate that the 460W Seasonic PSU is overkill for this system, but I want to get the system was quiet as possible and it was actually cheaper than a 150W picoPSU setup and would give me headroom to upgrade in the future. I'm also planning to run the system 24/7 and I have more peace of mind in a brand such as Seasonic.

[CPU+GPU] AMD A6-3500 ($80)
[RAM] Corsair 8GB (2x4GB) DDR3-1600 ($28)
[MOBO] Asrock A75M ($75)
[CASE] Silverstone ML03B ($60)
[PSU] Seasonic X-460 ($90)
[SSD] 80GB Intel 320 SSD ($70)
TOTAL = $403

Extras:
Big Shuriken 2 low-profile cooler ($40)
Western Digital 2TB USB 3.0 External HDD ($113)
For video playback, A6-3650 is enough, there is no difference between 3650 and 3850. The main difference between 3500 and 3650 is the processor speed, which sometimes affects video playback (for example, 1080p60 video playback under LAV Video Decoder [ffmpeg, not DXVA2 copy-back] + madVR; DXVA2 copy-back does not work well with 1080p60).

If you want a system that can play back whatever you throw in, A6-3650 is a safer choice. A6-3650 can operate at CPU voltage 1.250V with no problem, that makes the difference of power consumption between 3500 and 3650 very small, 10W at most at video playback.

A8-3850 is better in gaming (3DMark06 basic scores 6000 vs 7300, 3DMark 11 P800 vs P1100).

Note that with Seasonic X-460 (20mm deeper than the normal PSU), you can't attach an optical drive inside ML03.

floepie

02-07-12, 05:39 AM

and AMD Radeon HD 6570 (for example, HIS H657H1G, $65 (http://www.amazon.com/HIS-H657H1G-Radeon-128bit-Express/dp/B004WOBLAS)).

HD 6450 and GT 520 are a bit too low-end in my taste.

Thank you for the recommendation. My receiver has no HDMI inputs. Do these cards now have SPDIF headers? Or, do I simply continue to use the integrated (mobo) audio SPDIF?

slikos

02-07-12, 06:42 AM

Excellent tutorial thank you!

jrolmstd

02-07-12, 07:58 AM

How about turning your HTPC into a normal AHCI system? At least 60MB/s is guaranteed. A hardware RAID card is recommended only when you want a faster speed. For example, LSI MegaRAID SATA/SAS 9260-4i, $360 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16816118107) or 9260-8i, $520 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16816118105). You will need an empty PCI Express 2.0 x8 (x16 also works) slot.

Thanks for the feedback. The only time this bites me in the a$$ is when I am transferring files to the server. Playback (server(raid5) > htpc) is exceptional. Thinking I will learn to just get a cup of coffee when I have to push files to the server and worry about it when it comes time to expand again...

renethx

02-07-12, 08:34 AM

Thank you for the recommendation. My receiver has no HDMI inputs. Do these cards now have SPDIF headers? Or, do I simply continue to use the integrated (mobo) audio SPDIF?
You have to use S/PDIF on the motherboard (or add a analog sound card).

smokarz

02-07-12, 09:53 AM

hi everyone, what's a good digital tuner for Win7 Media Center?

just need something dependable and deliver good picture quality, and doesn't cost an arm. :p

many thanks!

Ferrino

02-07-12, 11:53 AM

Thanks renethx. I decided to eliminate doubt and just pony up the extra $40 to get the A8-3850 ($120 at Newegg). My CPU cooler is good for around 130W TDP, so I should be fine. BTW, I'm not planning to use any 80mm case fans in my ML03B - hopefully I should be OK with temps - there's a lot of ventilation in there with only a single SDD and PSU in addition to mobo...

Yes, I knew the Seasonic would obstruct an optical drive - I don't use discs, so no problem.

For video playback, A6-3650 is enough, there is no difference between 3650 and 3850. The main difference between 3500 and 3650 is the processor speed, which sometimes affects video playback (for example, 1080p60 video playback under LAV Video Decoder [ffmpeg, not DXVA2 copy-back] + madVR; DXVA2 copy-back does not work well with 1080p60).

If you want a system that can play back whatever you throw in, A6-3650 is a safer choice. A6-3650 can operate at CPU voltage 1.250V with no problem, that makes the difference of power consumption between 3500 and 3650 very small, 10W at most at video playback.

A8-3850 is better in gaming (3DMark06 basic scores 6000 vs 7300, 3DMark 11 P800 vs P1100).

Note that with Seasonic X-460 (20mm deeper than the normal PSU), you can't attach an optical drive inside ML03.

oprig

02-07-12, 05:01 PM

Hello from a htpc guide subscription holder:

I'm in the process of building a system for my living room.

I've gone with the mid-range mini ITX AMD system from the guide (AMD A6-350 processor on a ASRock A75M-ITX motherboard) but replacing the recommended Antec ISK 310-150 case with a Antec ISK 100 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811129095).

Problem is that the heat sink/fan on top of the processor is too large to get one side of the case back onto the chassis! The side of the chassis does have a large (100mm) fan but it's off center to the location of the processor on the motherboard.

So I think I have three options:

1. Return the ISK 100 and get the recommended ISK 310-150 case
2. Find a different heat sink/fan for the processor
3. Run the system without one side of the case (it won't be in view)

What would you recommend?

renethx

02-07-12, 07:28 PM

So I think I have three options:

1. Return the ISK 100 and get the recommended ISK 310-150 case
2. Find a different heat sink/fan for the processor
3. Run the system without one side of the case (it won't be in view)

What would you recommend?
Replacing the stock cooler with GELID Slim Silence AM2 (http://www.google.com/products/catalog?hl=&q=%22Slim+Silence+AM2%22&cid=18366965759027033518&os=sellers#scoring=tp) and undervolting CPU to 1.250V is a solution.

Ferrino

02-09-12, 03:26 PM

For video playback, A6-3650 is enough, there is no difference between 3650 and 3850. The main difference between 3500 and 3650 is the processor speed, which sometimes affects video playback (for example, 1080p60 video playback under LAV Video Decoder [ffmpeg, not DXVA2 copy-back] + madVR; DXVA2 copy-back does not work well with 1080p60).
Well I ended up going with an A8-3850 to cover my back, but I must admit that I'm a bit lost when it comes to terms such as LAV, ffmpeg, DXVA2 copy-back, madVR etc. Is there some sort of glossary/FAQ somewhere? I have a rough idea of what they do, but I'm unsure what the most popular combinations are. For instance, if I want to view H.264-encoded 1080p24 MKVs with Windows Media Center on a A8-3850 APU, what setup should I use as a minimum (i.e. using the internal WMC player)? Thanks!

jmpa

02-09-12, 07:55 PM

renethx

02-10-12, 01:45 AM

Well I ended up going with an A8-3850 to cover my back, but I must admit that I'm a bit lost when it comes to terms such as LAV, ffmpeg, DXVA2 copy-back, madVR etc. Is there some sort of glossary/FAQ somewhere? I have a rough idea of what they do, but I'm unsure what the most popular combinations are. For instance, if I want to view H.264-encoded 1080p24 MKVs with Windows Media Center on a A8-3850 APU, what setup should I use as a minimum (i.e. using the internal WMC player)? Thanks!
madVR is supported by MPC HomeCinema, but not by WMC internal player. Advanced MPC-HC Setup Guide (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1357375) includes basic setup. You can launch MPC HomeCinema from Media Browser (a movie organizer WMC plug-in).

renethx

02-10-12, 01:48 AM

One stupid question - If I had a TV plasma 3D and have a dedicate bluray 3d player I am able to watch in 3d, right? Now on pc, you need to have a BR optical drive 3d? Or on htpc there are no difference on drive? Because I know the Radeon and Nvidia have both a 3d sytem, what is the difference, if tv already have it?

PS: sorry for the bad english...
Any BD optical drive can read BR 3D. Any of the latest AMD, NVIDIA and Intel GPUs supports MVC (BR 3D video codec) hardware decoding and HDMI 1.4a 3D video format (Frame packing) output.

Ferrino

02-10-12, 12:42 PM

madVR is supported by MPC HomeCinema, but not by WMC internal player. Advanced MPC-HC Setup Guide (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1357375) includes basic setup. You can launch MPC HomeCinema from Media Browser (a movie organizer WMC plug-in).
Thanks - do you think the A8-3850 would be able to handle madVR without an additional GPU?

renethx

02-10-12, 12:47 PM

Thanks - do you think the A8-3850 would be able to handle madVR without an additional GPU?
Yes. Actually if you are not interested in 60fps contents (right now commercial camcorders are practically the only source of 60fps), even A6-3500 is enough for madVR.

boxterduke

02-10-12, 03:42 PM

So I ended up getting the i3-2105 from new egg and a Asus P8H61-I for mobo. It is $100 cheaper than a z68.

I also got the ASUS PCE-N10 wifi card and put it in the PCIe slot however I would get nothing on the screen. I only see the screen when the wifi card is not installed. It looks like the computer thinks the wifi card is a video card since it is plugged in the PCIe slot and it would deactivate the onboard video card.

I went to the bios and selected iGPU and not on auto however it still did the same.

I went and I exchanged the wifi card for a USB one however I was under the impression that it would work with the PCIe 2.0 x16?

no?

renethx

02-10-12, 11:24 PM

renethx

02-12-12, 10:30 AM

Table of Contents

- Llano Lineup
- Configuration
- Clips
- Results
- Conclusion

Llano Lineup

First, the current lineup of Llano APU is:

APU|Cores|Clock|L2 Cache|GPU|Radeon Cores|GPU Clock|TDP|Price
A4-3300|2|2.5GHz|1MB|HD 6410D|160|443MHz|65W|$66
A4-3400|2|2.7GHz|1MB|HD 6410D|160|600MHz|65W|$71
A6-3500|3|2.1/2.4GHz|3MB|HD 6530D|320|443MHz|65W|$80
A6-3650|4|2.6GHz|4MB|HD 6530D|320|443MHz|100W|$115
A6-3670K|4|2.7GHz|4MB|HD 6530D|320|443MHz|100W|$115
A8-3850|4|2.9GHz|4MB|HD 6550D|400|600MHz|100W|$135
A8-3870K|4|3.0GHz|4MB|HD 6550D|400|600MHz|100W|$135

A4-3300/3400 is a dual-core processor with 160 Radeon cores. So both processor and graphics are pretty weak. A5-3500 is a triple core processor with 320 Radeon cores, the same as the discrete Radeon HD 5550. The processor frequency is low (2.1GHz) and the power consumption is low (max 65W). A6-3650 is quad-core with the same graphics as A6-3500. TDP 100W looks pretty high, but it operates at voltage 1.250V with no problem, with much lower TDP. A8-3850 has 400 Radeon cores.

Configuration

I used:

- APU: A4-3400, A6-3500, A6-3650, A8-3850
- Memory: DDR3-1600 2 x 2GB. Memory is used as a system memory as well as video memory. You can use DDR3-1866, but the difference is very small in video playback.
- A75 chipset mb
- OS: Windows 7 x64 SP1
- Driver: 12.1. In CCC > Video, all video post-processors are disabled except for the following three:
+ Color > Advanced Video Color > Dynamic Range: Limited (16-235)
+ Quality > Use automatic deinterlacing
+ Quality > Pulldown detection
- Player: MPC HomeCinema
- Video decoder: LAV Video Decoder 0.45 (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1554374#post1554374) (the latest is 0.46). This version implemented DXVA2 (copy-back) support. I also used ffmpeg decoder of LAV Video Decoder.
- Deinterlacer: DXVA2 deinterlacing via madVR (the default setting)
- Video Renderer: madVR 0.80, in the full-screen exclusive mode, with one of the following quality settings:
+ medium: Bilinear/Bicubic 50/Bicubic 50
+ high*: SoftCubic (softness: 100)/Lanczos (3 taps)/Lanczos (3 taps)
+ high: SoftCubic (softness: 100)/Lanczos (4 taps)/Lanczos (4 taps)

Clips

There are five major video formats in NTSC countries:

|Origin|Format|Output to renderer|Frame interval
SD film|film|480i60|480p24|41.708 ms
SD video|video|480i60|480p60|16.683 ms
HD film|film|1080p24|1080p24|41.708 ms
HD interlaced video|video|1080i60|1080p60|16.683 ms
HD progressive video|video|1080p60|1080p60|16.683 ms

I used the following clip for each of them:

- SD film: Ratatouille (2007) (480i60, MPEG-2, AC3) (http://www.4shared.com/video/jD94Il3N/Ratatouille__2007__2_min_SD_fi.html)
- SD video: Die Zauberflote (2003) (480i60, MPEG-2, AC3) (http://www.4shared.com/video/kgGR9_KU/Die_Zauberflote__2003__2_min_S.html)
- HD film: Iron Man (2008) (1080p24, AVC, TrueHD/AC3) (http://www.4shared.com/video/EB6cj2Qr/Iron_Man__2008__2_min_HD_film_.html)
- HD i video: La Traviata (2010) (1080i60, AVC, DTS-HD MA) (http://www.4shared.com/video/eCsT9qK-/La_Traviata__2010__2_min_HD_i_.html)
- HD i video (VC-1): Life - Plants (2010) (1080i60, VC-1, DTS-HD HRA) (http://www.4shared.com/video/IDgA3Dpn/Life_-_Plants__2010__2_min_HD_.html)
- HD p video: La Traviata (2010) (1080p60, AVC, DTS-HD MA) (http://www.4shared.com/video/1McC98V-/La_Traviata__2010__2_min_HD_p_.html)

I added HD i video (VC-1) because 1080i60 VC-1, although rare, is often hard to play back using FOSS codecs or Windows built-in codec. The desktop refresh rate used is:

- 23Hz for film
- 59Hz for video

Results

I measured during the playback of each clip:

- Number of dropped frames ("DF"; shown in the screen when pressing Ctrl+J). This should be 0, of course.
- Average CPU usage ("CPU"; I used Performance Monitor built in Windows). Higher CPU usage may result in dropped frames.
- Average GPU usage ("GPU"; I used GPU-Z and Excel to calculate average). Higher GPU usage may result in dropped frames.
- Average rendering time ("RT"; shown in the screen when pressing Ctrl+J). This should be well lower than 41.708 ms for film and 16.683 ms for video.

Here is a summary:

http://i442.photobucket.com/albums/qq146/renethx/Graphics%20Card%20Roundup%20-%202012/Llano-madVR1600.png

Conclusion

DXVA2 (copy-back) can't handle HD p video = 60fps contents well (as sated in the release note). Somehow there are occasional dropped frames with ffmpeg decoder implemented in LAV Video Decoder. Using ffdshow Video Decoder (also ffmepg) fixes the problem, but that requires A6-3650 or higher (as decoding AVC at 60fps is pretty CPU-intensive). The only major source of HD p video is commercial camcorder right now anyway and perhaps you will use Media Foundation in WMC to play them back. Any Llano APU can handle HD p video pretty easily under DXVA2/EVR.

As for the formats found in DVD and BD (all except for HD p video), A4-3400 can handle medium quality with DXVA2 (copy-back) pretty easily. All APUs, A6-3500 and higher, can handle high quality setting with either DXVA2 (copy-back) or ffmpeg. (ffmpeg does not support interlaced VC-1 yet.) My recommendation goes to:

- A6-3500, $75 (http://www.google.com/products/catalog?hl=&q=AD3500OJGXBOX&cid=9006107753206955737&os=sellers#scoring=tp), that can handle all video formats in DVD, BD and broadcast smoothly at madVR's highest quality settings. It also supports HD p video (= 1080p60 AVC) and BR 3D excellently under DXVA2/EVR.
- A6-3650, $110 (http://www.google.com/products/catalog?hl=&q=AD3650WNGXBOX&cid=9464476468222982755&os=sellers#scoring=tp), or higher. If you think the triple core at 2.1GHz of A6-3500 is weak, any of A6-3650 and higher is recommended. GPU-intensive AMD's own video post-processors (notably Mosquito Noise Reduction and De-blocking) will work only in these models (if you are interested).

renethx

02-12-12, 10:37 AM

Llano APU dethroned the golden combination of Core i3-2105+Z68+DDR3-2133. :) (DDR3-2133 is only available as 2 x 4GB or higher kit, that is pretty expensive compared with DDR3-1600 2 x 2GB, no need of overclocking, DXVA2 compatible AMD GPUs was implemented in LAV Video Decoder etc.) This will be reflected in the next issue (available very soon). I apologize for the long delay (as usual lately).

mingus

02-12-12, 11:01 AM

renethx

02-12-12, 11:13 AM

Will the i3-2105 be better than my HD 5550? Mostly 720/1080p .mkv and Blu-ray.

Need to do some upgrades on my G31 E8500 HTPC, running out of space. Thinking about a Board/CPU while I'm at it.

Socket 1155 boards with USB3 Headers?
Well, they are equally good in normal video playback. HD 5550 is much better in gaming (as well as video playback with madVR if you are interested).

LGA1155 mb with internal USB3 internal headers are pretty expensive (GIGABYTE GA-Z68MX-UD2H-B3 microATX $150, a bunch of Z68 ATX mb over $150). You may want to wait for Z77 mb (in April).

packetlosss

02-12-12, 05:04 PM

For me this seems to be a network problem. A typical transfer rate between two JBOD (i.e. no RAID at all, software or hardware) systems is

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=236378&stc=1&d=1328504120

(One system is A75 chipset + Realtek RTL8111E Gb LAN chip + WD20EARS, another is GeForce 9400 chipset + NVIDIA Gb LAN + Samsung HD501LJ.) All of the following are disabled:

- Energy Efficient Ethernet
- Flow Control
- Green Ethernet
- Interrupt Moderation
- Jumbo Frame

I agree, it's definitely a networking protocol issue. I have had similar issues where I can go to/from my htpc (W7 ultimate Sp1) to/from my 2008 R2 server with no speed issues (100% of the time). To/From my htpc to other W7 machines it often slows to a crawl (usually it's only one direction that has the issue, depending on the machine). The research I've done so far seems to imply it's a protocol negotiation issue, possibly having to do with W7 homenetwork.

Try this command:
netsh interface tcp set global autotuning=disabled

It seemed to help, although not 100%.

You also might want to remove your network drivers and reinstall and make sure to set it up as a work network (I haven't had a chance to try that yet).

packetlosss

02-12-12, 05:22 PM

PCI Express 2.0 x16 slot should support any PCI Express 1.x/2.0 up to x16. But in some mb, only a graphics card is supported...

According to this thread: http://forum.pfsense.org/index.php/topic,43912.0.html

He got it to work with a NIC installed in the pcie slot on an p8h61-i.
A few things that might be worth trying:
1 - BIOS update
2 - see if there is a BIOS setting to turn the slot down to x2 or x4.
3 - Try a different card, could be a defective card.

jrolmstd

02-12-12, 08:19 PM

I agree, it's definitely a networking protocol issue. I have had similar issues where I can go to/from my htpc (W7 ultimate Sp1) to/from my 2008 R2 server with no speed issues (100% of the time). To/From my htpc to other W7 machines it often slows to a crawl (usually it's only one direction that has the issue, depending on the machine). The research I've done so far seems to imply it's a protocol negotiation issue, possibly having to do with W7 homenetwork.

Try this command:
netsh interface tcp set global autotuning=disabled

It seemed to help, although not 100%.

You also might want to remove your network drivers and reinstall and make sure to set it up as a work network (I haven't had a chance to try that yet).

tried the netsh disabled, uninstalled drivers, installed new drivers from realeck, and flipped it to a work network. No change :confused:

renethx

02-13-12, 11:43 AM

Radeon HD 7700 Series graphics cards (7770, $185 and 7750, $132) will be available on February 14. I would like to include them in the next guide. I apologize for the long delay.

here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=21633423#Results)

Kenshiro 26

02-13-12, 03:25 PM

Ferrino

02-13-12, 08:00 PM

- 23Hz for film
- 59Hz for video

Can I please ask how well the Llano APUs you tested handled the 23hz setting with 23.976 fps film? I see a lot of debate on which chips can handle 23.976 fps files and am hoping that it's straightforward with Llano and the Catalyst drivers. Is it as simple as switching to the "23Hz" mode in Catalyst to get 23.976 output? Thankyou!

investmentcar

02-13-12, 09:30 PM

Just got this deal alert in an e-mail from TigerDirect.

Don't know how it is performance-wise, a good way to get into SSD maybe.

120Gb OCZ Vertex Plus SSD $99 After Rebate. (http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/searchtools/item-Details.asp?EdpNo=1068616&sku=O261-6401&SRCCODE=WEM3005BY&cm_mmc=email-_-Main-_-WEM3005-_-tigeremail3005&utm_source=EML&utm_medium=main&utm_campaign=WEM3005)

Performance and reliability are the specs to look at in SSDs imo. I don't know the answer for either of these on the Vertex but potential buyers check the forums for the specific drives they like: http://www.ocztechnologyforum.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?186-Vertex-Vertex-Plus-Agility-Turbo-Solid-v2-and-Colossus-SSD-Support&order=desc
"Vertex" sounds like it must be an older generation of SSDs. OCZ is up to Vertex 3 now among others.
(burned by my Vertex 2 after 5 months)

renethx

02-13-12, 10:45 PM

Can I please ask how well the Llano APUs you tested handled the 23hz setting with 23.976 fps film? I see a lot of debate on which chips can handle 23.976 fps files and am hoping that it's straightforward with Llano and the Catalyst drivers. Is it as simple as switching to the "23Hz" mode in Catalyst to get 23.976 output? Thankyou!
The clock depends on each individual chip. The worst and best I have seen in Llano chips are:

- 23.97555Hz, a frame drop every 37m
- 23.97585Hz, a frame drop every 1h51m

They are much better than Intel and NVIDIA (only NVIDIA custom resolution can be better). madVR can change refresh rate based on the contents automatically.

renethx

02-13-12, 11:48 PM

|Codename|Radeon cores/CUs|Clock|Memory|TUs|ROPs|Power|Price
HD 7770|Cape Verde XT|640/10|1000MHz|GDDR5-4500 1GB 128 bit|40|16|80W|$129?
HD 7750|Cape Verde Pro|512/8|800MHz|GDDR5-4500 1GB 128 bit|36|16|55W|$110?

Source (http://www.3dcenter.org/news/die-finalen-spezifikationen-zu-amds-cape-verde-radeon-hd-7750-7770). If you are not satisfied with Llano, just go with HD 7750 or 7700.

Update

There are now lots of reviews on 7770/7750 on the Internet. Notably, AnandTech.

renethx

02-14-12, 12:06 AM

source (http://xtreview.com/addcomment-id-20815-view-Radeon-HD-78xx-will-be-presented-in-6-March.html)

jrolmstd

02-14-12, 06:19 PM

tried the netsh disabled, uninstalled drivers, installed new drivers from realeck, and flipped it to a work network. No change :confused:

Last post on this. I set up shared directory on the server that was not in the RAID array. Transfer speeds for the same file tested with in the past hovered around 80 MB/sec where as when the target was a directory inside the RAID array it would bottom out at 15 MB/sec. Would seem to eliminate any networking issue being the cause of this. Looks to be more of an issue with the software RAID being used than anything else...

goetzc

02-15-12, 03:02 PM

Last post on this. I set up shared directory on the server that was not in the RAID array. Transfer speeds for the same file tested with in the past hovered around 80 MB/sec where as when the target was a directory inside the RAID array it would bottom out at 15 MB/sec. Would seem to eliminate any networking issue being the cause of this. Looks to be more of an issue with the software RAID being used than anything else...

FWIW-
I'm using a 3ware 9500s-4lp I purchased on eBay(seller=belmonttr) for $10+s/h. Works great!

Ferrino

02-16-12, 11:45 AM

The clock depends on each individual chip. The worst and best I have seen in Llano chips are:

- 23.97555Hz, a frame drop every 37m
- 23.97585Hz, a frame drop every 1h51m
Wow, had no idea it varied within the Llano series! Thanks.

Another Llano setup question - is there a "sweet-spot" of how much system memory to assign to the on-chip graphics? I have an 8GB DDR3-1600 setup, so maybe 1GB?

ozer19

02-16-12, 11:58 AM

renethx

02-16-12, 12:23 PM

Another Llano setup question - is there a "sweet-spot" of how much system memory to assign to the on-chip graphics? I have an 8GB DDR3-1600 setup, so maybe 1GB?
The max you can assign in Llano is 500MB and it's the one you should set "Frame Buffer" to in UEFI BIOS.

FishLaw

02-16-12, 08:32 PM

please post a new version of your guide!

danbez

02-17-12, 12:55 AM

Rene,

I am facing an issue with my 5670 card - I want to use both the DP and HDMI outputs (one for the Tv, one for the Receiver/projector) but no matter what I do, I can only get the sound from one of the digital outputs (the one activated first). The only way to switch between them is to reboot with either the receiver or the TV turned off, so the sound is assigned to the active port.

After browse different posts it seems to me that NVidia card offer the ability to output sound to 2 different digital outputs. Is that correct? Which model would you recommend for HTPC exclusive use (Live TV, DVD, Blu-Ray)? Any model with DP and HDMI outputs or would I need a DVI-HDMI adapter?

Thanks!

renethx

02-17-12, 01:10 AM

please post a new version of your guide!
Sure, soon.

renethx

02-17-12, 01:14 AM

After browse different posts it seems to me that NVidia card offer the ability to output sound to 2 different digital outputs. Is that correct? Which model would you recommend for HTPC exclusive use (Live TV, DVD, Blu-Ray)? Any model with DP and HDMI outputs or would I need a DVI-HDMI adapter?

Thanks!
Yes, NVIDIA supports dual audio stream (over HDMI and DVI [with a generic DVI-HDMI adapter]). GeForce GT 430, ASUS fanless or PNY 1-slot low-profile. The card also supports dual 1080p video stream. But dual 1080i is difficult (there are not enough shaders for dual deinterlacing).

danbez

02-17-12, 10:41 AM

Yes, NVIDIA supports dual audio stream (over HDMI and DVI [with a generic DVI-HDMI adapter]). GeForce GT 430, ASUS fanless or PNY 1-slot low-profile. The card also supports dual 1080p video stream. But dual 1080i is difficult (there are not enough shaders for dual deinterlacing).

Thanks Rene. Looks like I have some shopping to do today.

Any reason to choose the PNY over the Asus w/fan model below?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=14-121-397&SortField=0&SummaryType=0&Pagesize=10&PurchaseMark=&SelectedRating=-1&VideoOnlyMark=False&VendorMark=&IsFeedbackTab=true&Page=10

renethx

02-17-12, 10:56 AM

Thanks Rene. Looks like I have some shopping to do today.

Any reason to choose the PNY over the Asus w/fan model below?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=14-121-397&SortField=0&SummaryType=0&Pagesize=10&PurchaseMark=&SelectedRating=-1&VideoOnlyMark=False&VendorMark=&IsFeedbackTab=true&Page=10
PNY in case you need a 1-slot (and low-profile) card. If there is enough room for a 2-slot card, ASUS is another option (don't buy this ASUS model (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814121471), DDR3-1200 is too slow). If the case supports full-height cards, go with ASUS fanless.

danbez

02-17-12, 11:03 AM

PNY in case you need a 1-slot (and low-profile) card. If there is enough room for a 2-slot card, ASUS is another option (don't buy this ASUS model (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814121471), DDR3-1200 is too slow). If the case supports full-height cards, go with ASUS fanless.

Thanks!

In terms of fan noise, are both Asus and PNY similar? That's my main concern.

Ideally I should get the fanless one, but it won't fit my case.

renethx

02-17-12, 11:51 AM

PNY is quieter at idle and video playback.

HTPCat

02-17-12, 12:24 PM

You guys are way over my head :)

What would a noob like me choose for a HTPC in order stream his MKV files (3D as well)?

Instead of putting together one, I think I'll be better off buying something off the shelf. Any recommendations? I have a BD Player already.
We are here because we build them, so you probably won't get much help on recommendations on pre-built HTPCs although nowadays many of the PCs on the shelf will work fine streaming mkv files with the addition of some freeware. With the guides here it really isn't too difficult to build a simple, cheap, nice looking HTPC;).

BLOCKMONSTER

02-17-12, 04:16 PM

renethx

02-17-12, 04:45 PM

Can I add a HD 6570 to my Intel G850 setup and get the same perf with DXVA2 as the A6-3500 does by itself?
Yes.

jasjw

02-17-12, 07:21 PM

Hi,

My head is gone reading through all this. Just woundered if someone could advise me on a system that will play 3D ISO, 3D Blu Rays flawlessly through my 3D TV with full HD audio. Thats all it will be used for, Not fussed about gaming.

My main problem would be, the case needs to be no more than around 250cm in depth and it would have to have a remote to make it family friendly. It doesnt really matter on the height and width.

I dont need a Blu Ray drive as I will run it all from the HDD, Also I dont need a HDD as I have a 2tb.

My budget is £250-£350.
Thanks very much.

jrolmstd

02-18-12, 12:28 AM

When I read about how many physical drives a RAID or HBA card will support, I see numbers reaching up to 256 for a 8 port card but when I check out the break out cables for these cards (sas --> sata) I see a cable with 1 connector on one end and 4 connectors on the other end. The 8 port cards only have 2 physical connectors. This would seem to support a maximum of 8 physical drives.

What am I missing here? I am setting up a system with 15 drives. What would the configuration of Raid and HBA cards & cables look like?

thanks

tomandbeth

02-18-12, 12:34 AM

renethx

02-18-12, 01:02 AM

renethx

02-18-12, 01:07 AM

jrolmstd

02-18-12, 01:16 AM

256 can achieved by using multiple SAS expanders such as HP 468406-B21 SAS Expander, $289.

So a SAS expander is used in conjunction with the RAID card? Is it physically connected to the raid card through a cable or is it internal through the PCI slot? Looking to run this under win 7 so maybe not this specific card but something similar?

renethx

02-18-12, 01:40 AM

So a SAS expander is used in conjunction with the RAID card? Is it physically connected to the raid card through a cable or is it internal through the PCI slot? Looking to run this under win 7 so maybe not this specific card but something similar?
RAID card + SAS expanders connected with SAS cables. *Official* HP SAS Expander Thread (http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1484614)

jrolmstd

02-18-12, 01:50 AM

RAID card + SAS expanders connected with SAS cables. *Official* HP SAS Expander Thread (http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1484614)

Got it. Thanks for clarification and link.

smokarz

02-18-12, 11:23 AM

Hi, does anyone have issues or fix for overscan/underscan from ATI card to HDTV/Pojector?

I am using ATI Radeon 5670 via HDMI to AVR to Epson 8100 projector and HTPC image is about 20% smaller. thanks

BLOCKMONSTER

02-18-12, 07:14 PM

Anybody got recommended configs for madVR/LAV on a laptop? Would a i5-2430M with its HD3000 and 4GB 1333MHz ram be enough to do 1080p on the laptop (hdmi to tv)? Or would I have to opt for one with discrete gfx?

varmatheone

02-19-12, 02:03 AM

I am about to order this CPU/MOBO/VGA Combo for my budget HTPC build:

- MSI H61MA-E35 (B3) LGA 1155 Intel H61 with SATA 3 and USB 3 ($60 ish)
- Intel Celeron G530 ($50 ish)
- Galaxy 43GGS8HX3SPZ GeForce GT 430 ($25 AR)

I already have ddr3 1600 RAM, case, SATA 3 SSD and BD drive.

I would appreciate if you could comment on the choice of components for primarily for BD playback, HD streaming and occasional ripping. No gaming what so ever. I have a separate NAS box for storage.

Thanks in advance.

renethx

02-19-12, 02:53 AM

renethx

02-19-12, 02:56 AM

@varmatheone

Good.

HTPCat

02-19-12, 11:13 AM

jrolmstd

02-19-12, 01:11 PM

Stepping up my high-bread file server/PC. I have been running a software RAID 5 solution on a Gigabyte AMD MB but I am just not happy with the drive performance on the 7 1.5T drive array (looking to expand to 15 - 20 drives once drive prices get back to normal). Other than severing files the only other thing the server is tasked with is serving up a HDMI feed for a bedroom TV.

I am looking to move up to a HW RAID solution utilizing Intel RAID Expander Card (RES2SV240) & LSI SAS9260-4I but will alos be running a video card.

I need a MB that will support PCI Express x4 for the Intel card, PCI-Express 2.0 x8 for the LSI card and PCI-Express 2.0 x16 for the video card. Don't plan on using the MB SATA connections other than running a SSD boot drive a Blu-ray player.

Recommendations?

renethx

02-19-12, 01:53 PM

jrolmstd

02-19-12, 02:17 PM

@jrolmstd

RES2SV240 can be placed anywhere in the case; it just requires power from a 4-pin molex (or a PCI Express x1-x16 slot just for power).

Mb with two PCIe 2.0 x8 slots (you don't need x16 for video playback):

- ASRock Z68 Extreme3 Gen3, $125
- GIGABYTE GA-Z68A-D3H-B3, $110
- GIGABYTE GA-Z68XP-UD3, $145

Mb with two PCIe 2.0 x8 slots and a PCIe 2.0 x4 slot:

- GIGABYTE GA-Z68MA-D2H-B3, $120
- ASRock A75 Extreme6 (for AMD), $100
- There are lots of Z68 ATX mb > $190.

If you think onboard video is enough (e.g. Celeron G530, Core i3-2105, AMD A6-3500), you can use any mb with a single PCIe 2.0 x16 (for the RAID controller card).

Thanks for the feed back renethx. I am currently using a GIGABYTE GA-880GA-UD3H MB with a AMD Athlon II X4 Processor (3.0 GHZ) but I was thinking I need to replace it to get the PCIE slots I needed. After reading this I am not so sure I need to.

The MB has HDMI out but will the CPU support it? I would end up serving up HD movies and a HDMI feed from the same server. I do this now but most of the video is off loaded to the GPU...

renethx

02-19-12, 02:25 PM

Thanks for the feed back renethx. I am currently using a GIGABYTE GA-880GA-UD3H MB with a AMD Athlon II X4 Processor (3.0 GHZ) but I was thinking I need to replace it to get the PCIE slots I needed. After reading this I am not so sure I need to.

The MB has HDMI out but will the CPU support it? I would end up serving up HD movies and a HDMI feed from the same server. I do this now but most of the video is off loaded to the GPU...
Radeo HD 4250 in AMD 880G chipset is weak compared with the current IGPs (AMD Llano, Intel HD Graphics), but it can play BD/DVD just fine with hardware decode acceleration (HDMI audio is limited to stereo PCM, DD and DTS).

renethx

02-19-12, 02:32 PM

Wait, you have GA-880GA-UD3H, that has a PCIe 2.0 x16 slot and a PCIe 2.0 x4 slot (physically x16). Then attach the RAID controller card in the x16 slot and a graphics card in x4 (yes, x4 is enough for video playback). I don't think you need to upgrade the entire system.

schloss

02-19-12, 05:43 PM

hi,
im thinking of buying this AsRock ION 3D (£290) http://www.asrock.com/nettop/overview.asp?Model=ION%203D%20Series

I have a few questions though:

1- this issue about bitstreaming DTS/True HD is bugging me. I read this in a review by anandtech: 'The ASRock ION 3D lost points for two reasons. The first and the greatest offender was the inability to bitstream high-end codecs such as TrueHD and several DTS variations.'

Now. What does this mean?
I plan to connect this AsRock PC to my AV receiver via optical out, for the audio. Is the above passage saying that the Asrock PC won't be able to send the audio thats playing on a bluray disc which has TrueHD to my AV receiver?

2- Can i build an equivalent or better system for £300-£350?

3 - will it be able to cope with the most demanding bluray films, with the highest bitrates?

My only use for this htpc is for 1080p bluray films (dont care about 3D). And i want the true audio thats on the bluray film, whatever it may be, dts, TrueHD etc. (which i know my AV receiver can decode).

would really appreciate answers to these questions. thanks!

renethx

02-19-12, 05:52 PM

@schloss

S/PDIF is even worse than ION. The supported audio formats are

- S/PDIF: stereo PCM, DD, DTS
- ION (over HDMI): mulitchannel LPCM, DD, DTS
- The latest GPUs: mulitchannel LPCM, DD, DTS, DD+, DTS-HD HRA, TrueHD, DTS-HD MA

ION is good for 1080p24 contents (~95% of BDs), but not so great for 1080i50/60 (~5% BDs and HD broadcast).

jrolmstd

02-19-12, 06:13 PM

lag0a

02-22-12, 10:35 AM

If Intel Atoms can have the HD3000 or HD4000 that would make an awesome HTPC.

ser_renely

02-22-12, 11:23 AM

Any ideas why I can't get DTS-HD to work with the LAV filters bitstreaming?

I can get it to work with FFDshow.

Unless my receiver is just lying to me?

Ferrino

02-22-12, 12:03 PM

The clock depends on each individual chip. The worst and best I have seen in Llano chips are:

- 23.97555Hz, a frame drop every 37m
- 23.97585Hz, a frame drop every 1h51m

How did you output 23.976 Hz on your Llano test setups, please? I have Catalyst 12.1 installed on my A8-3850 system, but the lowest refresh rate I can set with the default setup is 25 Hz.

renethx

02-22-12, 03:46 PM

How did you output 23.976 Hz on your Llano test setups, please? I have Catalyst 12.1 installed on my A8-3850 system, but the lowest refresh rate I can set with the default setup is 25 Hz.
If your display+AVR supports 24Hz, you should see 23/24Hz in CCC. If your display+AVR supports 24Hz but you don't see 23/24Hz in CCC, perhaps there is an EDID problem.

Ferrino

02-22-12, 04:24 PM

If your display+AVR supports 24Hz, you should see 23/24Hz in CCC. If your display+AVR supports 24Hz but you don't see 23/24Hz in CCC, perhaps there is an EDID problem.
Thanks, I eventually intend to use it with a 120Hz LCD TV which I believe handles 24p film by repeating the frame 5 times, so it should work. It's not currently attached to that display though (I'm setting it up with a basic PC monitor) so that's probably why I don't see the option :-)

treefrog100

02-23-12, 01:36 PM

Noob alert. Okay I'm generally unhappy with overall performance of media streamers. Different ones have different strengths but none are solid for HD video and HD audio over the wide range of codecs, BD menus and such. I was looking at the dunes, and by the time I spend that much, I could build my own, I think. This thread is overwhelming, and it will take me 3 months of Sundays just to get caught up over the last 18 months.

What's the cheapest combo of parts to playback all HD audio (bitstream only) and all popular US HD codecs and frame rates for the best possible 2D video and audio including menus? I have a separate server and need no onboard HDD's other than an SSD for OS and software and a gigabit controller. I may or may not need a BD reader at this point, and I have no interest in 3D at this time in my life.

Also what HT software are most people running these days? I have begun reading some older guides and will buy the new one soon.

I'm sure this has already been discussed so feel free to point me in the right direction.

Thanks!

Mfusick

02-23-12, 02:43 PM

2 x 120mm fan should be enough. You don't have to replace the fans. I recommend

- Zalman Fan Mate 2, $5 shipped (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835118217), a rheostat that can adjust voltage 5V-12V continuously.
- Y-cable (http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=34_289&sort=20a&page=2), connecting multiple fans to Fan Mate 2. There are several options: 3 fans, 4 fans (good for additional fans), 6 fans, 9 fans.
- 4-pin to 3-pin pass-through cable (http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=195), connecting a 4-pin Molex peripheral power connector from PSU to Fan Mate 2; it also has a wire for rpm sensor (connect it to one of the mb fan header to monitor rpm [of one of the case fans]).

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=226384&stc=1&d=1319719940

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=227479&stc=1&d=1320782057

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=227480&stc=1&d=1320782150

(Black is also available.)

Controlling the case fan speed this way can be used with most HTPC cases and highly recommended.

This was a great post.

Thanks

lag0a

02-23-12, 08:54 PM

Is AMD's UVD 3 video engine really old technology compared to Nvidia Pure Video's VP5?
Also how does Intel's HD3000 compare to them?

If you will only use your GPU as a renderer and not a hardware decoder then how would these video engines affect your image quality? I think for deinterlacing I only need IVTC.

renethx

02-24-12, 04:52 AM

VP5 was released later than UVD3. The only major difference is that VP5 supports 4K decoding, while UVD3 or Intel HD 2k/3k does not. The decoders implemented in HD 7900/7700 and Intel HD 2500/4000 supports 4K decode.

The decoder does not affect PQ at all, it just decodes compressed video to raw YCbCr. It's something like this: the file unzipped from a zipped file is identical whatever program you use (7-zip, WinZip etc.).

Mfusick

02-24-12, 06:08 PM

tlwizard

02-29-12, 01:58 PM

renethx

02-29-12, 04:03 PM

Hey renethx

If I'm building an i3-2105 in a Asus Z68 motherboard and want to get madVR to run at it's best... it would cost me the same to upgrade from my 1333 DDR3 RAM to 2133 as it would to upgrade to a low profile video card like the Asus GT 430. Would the video card accomplish what the 2133 RAM + 2105 overclocking would accomplish? Basically, if I was skiddish about overclocking, could adding a video card net me the same results?
There are a couple of ways to get the same results as i3-2105 (with GPU at 1350MHz)+DDR3-2133+Z68:

- AMD A6-3500 or higher + DDR3-1600 + A75
- Any decent system (e.g. Celeron G530 + DDR3-1066 + H61) + GeForce G430 or Radeon HD 6570.

For CPU intensive tasks (e.g. 2D-3D conversion, real-time video transcoding), you might want a better CPU (GPU is irrelevant).

tlwizard

02-29-12, 04:28 PM

There are a couple of ways to get the same results as i3-2105 (with GPU at 1350MHz)+DDR3-2133+Z68:

- AMD A6-3500 or higher + DDR3-1600 + A75
- Any decent system (e.g. Celeron G530 + DDR3-1066 + H61) + GeForce G430 or Radeon HD 6570.

For CPU intensive tasks (e.g. 2D-3D conversion, real-time video transcoding), you might want a better CPU (GPU is irrelevant).Thanks for the response!

So if I'm not as concerned with 2d-3d conversion, would this:

http://216.52.208.185/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814121397

improve SD rendering through madVR with my i3-2105 + Asus P8Z68-M Pro + DDR3-1333 without needing to overclock the CPU?

And from what I can tell with the card, I'll still get 3D video out and HDMI audio as I would with just the motherboard's HDMI out to my 3D TV.

renethx

02-29-12, 04:36 PM

Yes.

tlwizard

02-29-12, 04:44 PM

Yes.Awesome. Thank you so much!

jrolmstd

03-01-12, 03:02 PM

OK, I got the LSI 9260 and the intel port expander installed. Set up the initial RAID 5 with 1.5Tx6 drives, set up in win 7 and ran some tests. Very pleased with the results compared to the software RAID solution I was running. Figured out how to add another drive into the existing drive group and started up the process to expand the group with another 1.5T drive. 8 hours later, 5% completed, estimated time to completion 130 hours :(

Seems incredibly slow and I am concerned that the time to completion is dependent on the size of the drive being added and the size of the drive group. I was only looking to add 1 drive to the group and when I tried to create a new virtual drive under a new group, the only RAID option was RAID 0, not what I was looking for. I assume that I would have had to be adding at least 3 drives to get a RAID 5 option to show up under a new virtual drive..

Is there a better (faster) way of doing this? Does the length of time to add another drive to the group increase with the size of the ARRAY?

renethx

03-01-12, 03:44 PM

I guess you'd better ask in the server forum (sticky), where server professionals gather...

ricabullah

03-02-12, 09:05 AM

My intention is to build a future proof; Ivybridge ready Sandybridge system.

Upcoming Ivybridge CPUs will be supported on existent H61, H67 and Z68 platforms with a BIOS update. My choice will be in favor of Intel Z68 (B3).

And motherboard should have PCI E third-generation expansion ports since future GPUs will take full advantage of PCI-E 3.0. (G3)
http://micro.msi.com/mc2/features_peg3.php

-FYI, MSI only supports G3 on their H61 and Z68 cards:
http://event.msi.com/mb/22nm/

Furthermore, only Z68 from the Sandy family supports SRT. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smart_Response_Technology)

Finally, I have almost decided to this configuration:

Mobo: MSI Z68A-GD55 (G3)

CPU: Intel Core i3 2130 (I may change it with an Ivybridge CPU later.)

CPU Cooler: Thermaltake Frio advanced CPU cooler.

Memory: GSkill 8GB (2*4GB) RipjawsX DDR3 1600 MHz Ram

GPU: iGpu (I may use my existent nVidia card later.)

SSD: OCZ 60GB Vertex3 series SATA 3.0 SSD (for system)

HDD: Seagate Barracuda 1TB SATA 3.0 64MB Cache HDD (for storage)

OS: Win7 64

Thanks in advance for your comments.

EDIT: I might give it a go with SRT with a 500 GB Barracuda and OCZ. This case I will use that 1TB Barracuda for storage separately. But I'm not sure it is gonna give better performance than my above configuration.

EDIT: Additional information on LGA 1155:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGA_1155

EDIT: Ivybridge ready mobos from Gigabyte and Asus:
http://www.gigabyte.com/press-center/news-page.aspx?nid=1048
http://event.asus.com/2011/mb/PCIe3_Ready/

EDIT: Asus seems to me support G3 only on some Z68 models?

mifronte

03-03-12, 06:28 PM

For the MicroATX Mid-Range Build:

01. If noise is not a concern, will the Core i3-2105 cooler be sufficient?

02. Is an Antec EA-380D Green 380W 80 PLUS Bronze be sufficient or do I need the 430W PSU?

03. Can I use G.Skill F3-12800CL9D-4GBXL memory? It is listed on the MB's compatible list.

This won't necessarily be a HTPC, just a general PC which may have to perform some HTPC tasks on occasions.

Thanks.

renethx

03-03-12, 07:08 PM

EDIT: Asus seems to me support G3 only on some Z68 models?
I think there is a great confusion about the support for PCI Express 3.0.

Every H61, H67, P67, or Z68 chipset motherboard with only *one* PCIe x16 (physically and *electrically*) slot always supports PCIe x16 3.0 as long as you use Ivy Bridge. This is because the x16 slot is directly connected to the processor (you can see it easily by looking at the mb PCB), the mb is totally irrelevant here.

If there are two or more PCIe x16 slots, electrically x8 or x16, however, then the mb must use PCIe switches supporting PCIe 3.0 to be ready for PCIe 3.0 graphics. These mb are advertised as "PCI Express 3.0 ready".

Be careful, even lots of hardware review sites don't tell this trivial fact. ;)

renethx

03-03-12, 07:16 PM

jmpa

03-04-12, 08:54 PM

I finally bought and assemble my htpc.
All movies mkv plays great. The picture quality is much better than ion and even hdmi sounds seems better. The i3 2105 is really fast, powerfull and with crucial m4 everything runs really well and smoth.

The only not good point of my htpc is the optical drive (samsung sh b083l) that I bought in sale at 29 euros, but i already regret. In 10 cd audio i tried, 3 make a weird noise, like metalic noise at the background and 1 it simply cant play. The drive don't detect it, is the same as don't have any cd.

In bluray playback I tried 2. One (george michael) played 100% well, the other the optical drive makes more loud sound while is playing and it stutter the image.

I updated the firmware. I also tried format the drive in AHCI and in IDE. All without success.

And i am not able to put external player in XBMC, drive start make a weird noise.

I will put some pictures tomorrow.

Xeriser

03-04-12, 10:34 PM

Will the new guide be available soon?

jmpa

03-05-12, 02:22 PM

My HTPC:
Intel i3 2105
Antec 380W
Gigabyte z68ma-d2h-b3
SSD Crucial M4 64Gb
2x1tb
Gskill ddr3 1600Mhz 2x2gb
Samsung sh-b083l (I don't like it)
http://img221.imageshack.us/img221/1986/05032012373.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/221/05032012373.jpg/)

Thanks for the help. Nice guide.

gsr

03-05-12, 05:14 PM

My HTPC:
Intel i3 2105
Antec 380W
Gigabyte z68ma-d2h-b3
SSD Crucial M4 64Gb
2x1tb
Gskill ddr3 1600Mhz 2x2gb
Samsung sh-b083l (I don't like it)

Thanks for the help. Nice guide.

Make sure you check the firmware version on your M4 drive and upgrade if you don't have the latest:

Crucial M4 SSD Frimware Update Available Now for 5000 hour problem (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1387051&highlight=crucial+m4).

bdlive

03-05-12, 06:12 PM

jmpa

03-05-12, 06:30 PM

What "refresh rate" do you use in intel drive? I use more .mkv files and I put it in 60Hz but to be honest I don't understand nothing about it.
Another thing I notice in XBMC if I have dxva2 enable it dont work well in some movies so I turned it off. Do you have more tips like that?

Make sure you check the firmware version on your M4 drive and upgrade if you don't have the latest:

Crucial M4 SSD Frimware Update Available Now for 5000 hour problem (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1387051&highlight=crucial+m4).

Thks, done :D

renethx

03-05-12, 06:43 PM

I have an older Yamaha RXV-2700 HDMI 1.2a capable AVR and only supports surround LPCM. No DTS-HD support or similar...

Do you guys know if these newer mobos are able to pass both sound and video through the HDMI input of my receiver? Or am I limited to the Optical S/PDIF option for the sound output coming from these boards?

- GIGABYTE GA-Z68MA-D2H-B3 (INTEL)
- GIGABYTE GA-A75M-D2H (AMD)

Thanks!
You can decode all HD audio (TrueHD/DTS-HD/DD+) to multichannel LPCM in PC (instead of in a HDMI 1.3 AVR) (how (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1357375)) and send it to your HDMI 1.2a AVR. Any HDMI solution supporting multichannel LPCM will work:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=238542&stc=1&d=1330330384

renethx

03-05-12, 06:52 PM

What "refresh rate" do you use in intel drive? I use more .mkv files and I put it in 60Hz but to be honest I don't understand nothing about it.
Another thing I notice in XBMC if I have dxva2 enable it dont work well in some movies so I turned it off. Do you have more tips like that?
The ideal refresh rate depends on the content:

- BD movie encoded at 23.976Hz: 23Hz (90% of BDs)
- BD movie encoded at 24Hz: 24Hz (5% of BDs, mainly available in Europe)
- BD video (1080i60): 59Hz (3% of BDs)
- BD video (1080i50): 50Hz (2% of BDs, mainly available in Europe)
- DVD movies (NTSC): 23Hz
- DVD movies (PAL): 25Hz
- DVD video (NTSC): 59Hz
- DVD video (PAL): 50Hz

DXVA2 in XBMC does not work well with Intel graphics.

bdlive

03-05-12, 09:01 PM

You can decode all HD audio (TrueHD/DTS-HD/DD+) to multichannel LPCM in PC (instead of in a HDMI 1.3 AVR) (how (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1357375)) and send it to your HDMI 1.2a AVR. Any HDMI solution supporting multichannel LPCM will work:

Awesome. Thanks!

mudwiggle

03-06-12, 03:07 PM

DXVA2 in XBMC does not work well with Intel graphics.

Is that something that Intel need to fix or the team at XBMC?

I'm using iGPU in i3-2100 without DXVA and it works nicely.

renethx

03-06-12, 06:01 PM

Is that something that Intel need to fix or the team at XBMC?
Perhaps because of the XBMC developers' (or FOSS community in general) lack of interest in Intel graphics.

gtmtnbiker

03-06-12, 06:15 PM

Greetings! Thanks to the OP for putting together this guide. I donated $20. Seems like a lot of sweat has been put into it.

How are the donations these days? The original post shows that you have been getting $100-$200 per month back in 2010. Are you getting better/more donations now such that you're able to fund your research? Thanks again.

renethx

03-06-12, 06:28 PM

ricabullah

03-06-12, 06:52 PM

Once Intel Ivy Bridge and AMD Trinity are released, I will have a negative bank balance...

Dude, it seems to me your destiny as far as Intel and AMD exist. :)
Those, so-called, huge companies must donate to you and the others. Everybody works for them for the sake of a kiss. ( I know, that doesn't match with native English, but hopefully you understand what I mean.)

assassin

03-06-12, 07:11 PM

Thanks for the donation. :)

From: February 6, 2012 To: March 6, 2012
ITEMS SOLD: 68
SALE AMOUNT: 471.46 USD

Once Intel Ivy Bridge and AMD Trinity are released, I will have a negative bank balance...

I mention a few times a month on AVS that people should donate to you for your work.

I know with my free guide here at AVS I have received a grand total of 31 donations in the 13 months I have had and updated my guide (which admittedly is no where near as detailed as yours) for an average of about 2 donations per month.

Needless to say when I started the work on my blog I made it a pay for service. That's the main reason why. There is simply no way I can justify the cost and exorbitant amount of time required in keeping it up without some sort of compensation. And I have kept mine advertisement free as well.

So what am I saying? Donate to renethx or he will be gone (out of necessity).

ricabullah

03-06-12, 08:20 PM

assassin, thanks a lot to you for being so open to us.
And thanks all the respectful guys like rene and you.
Thanks for your works.
However, do not forget we/you are masturbating while the others are making money.
WHERE ARE THEY?
WHY DO THEY NOT SUPPORT YOU WITH (at least) THEIR F*** PREMATURE (as always) HW/SW?

jrolmstd

03-06-12, 10:55 PM

The guide is a great starting point for a system build. So much of the research work is already done that it makes designing your new system way easier (and less costly) than doing all the grunt work from scratch.

Even with that, the real value is Renethx's continued support from within this thread for anyone that asks, even the sponges that do not show their appreciation with donations.

Renethx, I never did care for the consecutive clause much but if you were to setup a lifetime membership to your guide for $50, I would buy the first one to kick it off :D

ps. It would be nice if the lifetime membership was transferable to a new membership if this guide where ever to go private;)

Tyfoon2

03-07-12, 06:54 AM

renethx

03-07-12, 08:37 PM

@renethx;

Very happy with my 'bedroom' small form factor fully passive HTPC based on the asus E45M1-I DELUXE with a M350 Universal Mini-ITX Case. Fits behind the TV perfectly. Thanks for your help on this.

Unfortunately a new investment is coming up and I need to replace my core system that:
a) Acts as the media server for the bedroom system, sonos etc.
b) is on 24/7 (as it also is used to manage all downloading etc.)
c) Is the DVBlink server (IPTV) for bedroom system and other devices (like Ipad etc.)
d) directly connected to my Receiver/TV (HDMI) running WMC (win 7) and used for live TV and all other Media (so core entertainment system)

So in short it's kind of a combo of a mediaserver and normal HTPC. No need to be perfectly quit or beautiful, just to be efficient, powerful (sometimes the un-rarring/parring of files and watching a 3d H264 movie hits the max perf of current system) and reliable (!).

My Q: How can I best mix and pick from your guide to get the best system? I would like to re-use my recently purchased GT-430 but happy to get rid of the rest (based on an intel Core2 6400 @ 2.13)
The answer depends on your usage.

- The max number of HDDs you want. A normal HTPC case can hold 2-8 HDDs. Server cases in my guide: 15-24 HDDs.
- Transcoding: If you do transcoding via DLNA, you may want a quad-core processor.

You may want to wait for the upcoming Intel Ivy Bridge processor (April 29), in particular Core i5 3570K with Intel HD Graphics 4000, $225. A discrete graphics card always consumes 10-15W more. So you may want to stick to integrated graphics (depending on how electricity costs in your area).

Tyfoon2

03-08-12, 02:58 PM

max 8 disks is enough

Any specifics for the PSU for a system that is on 24/7? Found out that these often are not fine with running 24/7 for years.

Thanks for the Intel tip. Will wait, no immidiate need if it keeps running.

Is the new HD4000 comparable with a discrete card (incl. bitstreaming capabilities etc.)?

renethx

03-08-12, 04:50 PM

PSU wastes power to convert AC from the wall to DC, the ratio is called "efficiency". A PSU of higher efficiency (80 PLUS, 80 PLUS Bronze, 80 PLUS Silver, 80 PLUS Gold, 80 PLUS Platinum in the order of increasing efficiency). For example, if the system draws 80W DC (typical usage of your system at video playback),

- A PSU of 75% efficiency has to draw 80W/0.75 = 107W AC
- A PSU of 85% efficiency has to draw 80W/0.85 = 94W AC

The difference is 13W.

Yes Intel graphics is good for video playback including 3D and HD audio bitstreaming.

kesawi

03-08-12, 05:10 PM

I've assembled my new HTPC and am now in the process of configuring the bios and windows. I have a few questions regarding some settings.

I have a Gigabyte GA-Z68MX-UD2H-B3 Rev 1.3 motherboard with revision F13 bios. One setting that I can't seem to find an answer on is what to set the On-Chip Frame Buffer Size to. The default is 64MB+2MB for GTT and it can be set anywhere from 32MB+2MB for GTT to 480MB+2MB for GTT. The manual describes the funcation as "Frame buffer size is the total amount of system memory allocated solely for the onboard graphics controller. MS-DOS, for example, will use only this memory for display." I have 4GB of RAM and whatever value I set it to is deducted from the total RAM available under Windows 7. I'm not running a discrete graphics card. Do I need to set it at anymore than the default.

When installing Windows 7 it creates a user account which is assigned administration rights by default. I would prefer if the access rights for this main user account were changed to a normal user so as to prevent my kids from making changes to the system. Does the active user when running WMC (or associated programs such as PowerDVD, TMT, etc) need to be an administrator?

I've been following Assassin's excellent paid guides (I highly recommend you subscribe to them if you're setting up a HTPC for the first time) and am now up to Guide 2. I wish to complete as much of the software setup on a PC monitor as I can before hooking the htpc to the our HDTV as my partner will not appreciate me monopolising the TV to do so. Can I continue through all the steps in the guide and come back to setting up the HDTV later without having to make too many changes all over the place? I assume setps 1 & 3 in Guide 2 can be done at anytime?

renethx

03-08-12, 06:06 PM

1. Default. This is a bit mysterious, but the driver will intelligently detect physical memory available and allocate necessary video memory.

2. Most operations (e.g. playing back videos, watching TV) can be done without the administrative privilege. The administrative privilege is required to change the system configuration, install a program, update Flash Player, for example. If you log in as a normal user, you will be asked to enter the password of an administrator in this case.

3. I haven't subscribed his guide yet. :) You'd better set up your system as much as possible using your PC monitor (as using kbd/mouse is usually easier in a work desk than in a couch). Do final touch up by connecting the system to AVR/TV. Even then you can control your system (e.g. install a program) remotely from a desktop system if OS of the HTPC is Windows 7 Professional or Ultimate.

jmpa

03-08-12, 06:55 PM

renethx

03-08-12, 07:08 PM

What do you think about picture/audio quality beetween intel hd3000 and ati hd6870?

I said hd3000 was perfect comparing to ion. But now I tried hd6870 that I bought to another pc and omg, the picture quality seems even more perfect. Big range of colours and more smooth. What do you think about it? Is psicological lol?
Many people *think* that AMD is better than Intel and NVIDIA because of post-processing (this poll (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1394416)). :) Eventually PQ is subjective.

jmpa

03-08-12, 09:39 PM

Here is my HTPC with Sapphire HD 6870 (provisionally here, not to keep to much time). The card is HUGE, but really powerfull and PQ is simply great!

Instead of Samsung b083L I spend a "little" more and bought a LG BH10LS38 (bluray burner). I tested it with the same CD audios and blu-rays that samsung couldn't read, and LG was perfect. Played all, really quiet and fast. I'm Happy with it, now just need to check how it burn. It looks well on case, in picture seems to much difference between the black colour, but in life looks better.

What do you think about HDMI cables? I see some really expensive and anothers cheaps. I am using a really cheap one. A better one can make difference in Audio/PQ?

Some pictures (sorry about quality):
http://img254.imageshack.us/img254/2910/09032012375.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/254/09032012375.jpg/)

http://img826.imageshack.us/img826/2519/09032012376.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/826/09032012376.jpg/)

http://img804.imageshack.us/img804/8649/09032012377.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/804/09032012377.jpg/)

http://img263.imageshack.us/img263/4157/09032012383.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/263/09032012383.jpg/)

(My Silverstone case didn't bring 8 yellow rubber to fix HDDs so I needed to put that plastic thing brown (a little ugly but works)

FishLaw

03-10-12, 07:42 PM

So I posted a month ago asking when you'd have an updated version of the guide. You said soon, but there's still no updated guide yet. Any realistic timeline of when this will be updated?

AistairS

03-11-12, 04:44 PM

My current setup is ok for most things except madvr. I am wondering if a discrete gpu would help & if so can you recommend one for my setup below. I would ditch my DVB-T2 card if needed:

Asus E45M1-I DELUXE
Crucial 8GB Gamer
60GB Crucial M4 SSD
1TB Samsung HDD
Antec ISK 300-150
LG Slimline Bluray Burner
Blackgold DVB-T2

Or should i go with a completely new setup ie micro atx with say a Silverstone GD case ?

tomandbeth

03-11-12, 05:02 PM

Xeriser

03-11-12, 07:30 PM

So I posted a month ago asking when you'd have an updated version of the guide. You said soon, but there's still no updated guide yet. Any realistic timeline of when this will be updated?
I have been wondering the same.

Have you contributed to Renethx's guide, enabling him to buy the components that go into his review? Go back a page or two where he summed the dearth of these contribs.
I actually purchased the 4 issue option at the beginning of January so that I could look at the current November/December issue. Then I was going to finalize my configuration with the the January issue, but have been waiting patiently since.

tomandbeth

03-12-12, 01:18 AM

I have been wondering the same.

I actually purchased the 4 issue option at the beginning of January so that I could look at the current November/December issue. Then I was going to finalize my configuration with the the January issue, but have been waiting patiently since.

I have more respect for someone who paid for the guides and patiently waiting than someone who has not (as for the poster I responded to originally, I don't know what their status is.)

I do hear you on the delay. It is frustrating and yet I also see and understand Renethx's frustration with the lack of support - which leads to his inability to purchase components and dedicate time to write a guide from.

I can only siggest at this time that you follow Renethx's posts in other forums to gain insight into whatever answers you need now to build., especially if your question revolves around a particular MOBO (Z68 for example).

wil1972

03-12-12, 07:33 AM

So I posted a month ago asking when you'd have an updated version of the guide. You said soon, but there's still no updated guide yet. Any realistic timeline of when this will be updated?

There are a lot of new components hitting the market now i.e HD 77xx/78xx/79xx and the Z77 / H77 has been released by MSI so I'd say he has his hands full with testing.

renethx

03-12-12, 09:47 AM

I apologize for the long delay of the new release. There have been so few new product this winter (AMD Radeon HD 7900/7800/7700 is the only major one) and even if I updated it every month, there would be very little change of the contents. The release plan is

- March (realistically by 20th): One issue will be released.
- April-June: Intel Ivy Bridge/Z77 chipset (quad core) and AMD Trinity are going to be released. Perhaps I will update the guide every month.

I will make sure every 4-month subscriber gets 4 issues anyway.

Another project is a new thread "Graphics Card Roundup - 2012" (I won't charge you). I already posted part of it:

- Intel HD Graphics 2000 under madVR (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=21009914#post21009914), Intel HD Graphics 3000 under madVR (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=21014311#post21014311)
- AMD Llano APU under madVR (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=21633904#post21633904)
- Stereoscopic 3D support of graphics cards (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=21122837#post21122837)
- HDMI audio summary (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=21702736#post21702736)

The thread will be an expanded version of these posts. The information is hard to find on the Internet (well, it looks like it's only me in the world who is willing to run this type of experiments).

ricabullah

03-12-12, 08:37 PM

I finally built a sandy system:

MSI: Z68A-GD65 G3
Intel: i5 2500K
Gskill: (2*4 GB) ddr3 ram 1600

However, not sure it is really future-proof; there is still a big confusion:
http://forum-en.msi.com/index.php?topic=157236.0

And what if I buy a Z77 board: I will have no PCI slot to put my TV card on:
http://forum-en.msi.com/index.php?topic=157449.0

EDIT: BTW, I haven't run 8 GB ram yet, on my board. (It allows only one 4GB ram on 7/64.)

renethx

03-12-12, 09:17 PM

Future-proof: Depending on the features you are expecting, 2500K may be enough? My current desktop system is 2600K + ASUS Z68 mb and I am not going to upgrade to IVB because 15% performance increase is not worth while.

And Haswell LGA 1150 new microarchitecture 22nm is coming in 2013. There is no future in IVB. :)

There are still many Z77 mb with legacy PCI slots.

ricabullah

03-13-12, 02:30 PM

Then, let's say my current system is future-proof until 2013. :)
Thanks rene!

smokarz

03-13-12, 09:38 PM

Hi renethx,

i see some of your posts in other threads which give pieces of information on configuring madvr, lav, etc. but couldn't get complete details so i figure i ask here in your thread.

Here's my setup.

HTPC with Athlon II X4 630, 8GB RAM, Radeon 5670
Integra DHC 9.9 pre/pro
Epson 8100 Projector

HTPC -> AVR -> Projector all via HDMI

I installed MPC-HC, Lav codecs, and madVR. I followed instructions on the 'Advanced MPC-HC' thread for installation.

I am having issues with playback. My HD pictures (720p and 1080p) look grainy, has artifacts, and stutter during playback.

I don't think this is due to hardware, so my guess is I must not have configured CCC, Lav, and madVR correctly.

Do you have any suggestions? I really appreciate your feedback with these issues.

Thanks much!

ricabullah

03-17-12, 10:41 AM

I would like to know if it is possible to get multiple display mode with a Liano system? ( MSI A75MA-G55 plus AMD A6X4 3650) -for 3D viewing without having a discrete card + HD audio bitstreaming over an HDMI 1.3 AVR.
like;
Primary. 3D TV over DVI to HDMI adapter+ HDMI 1.4 cable
Secondary: AVR (HDMI 1.3 ) over HDMI to HDMI cable. (1.3 or 1.4)

renethx

03-17-12, 07:32 PM

ricabullah

03-17-12, 07:39 PM

Thanks.
Does it work then?

iGPU for video over an HDMI 1.4 cable,
a disrete card like 5450 for audio over any HDMI cable?

renethx

03-17-12, 07:48 PM

Thanks.
Does it work then?

iGPU for video over an HDMI 1.4 cable,
a disrete card like 5450 for audio over any HDMI cable?
Yes.

ricabullah

03-17-12, 07:58 PM

Thanks rene.
Then, 3D HTPC users (not gamers) will be happy with their SNB iGPUs if they have HDMI 1.3 AVRs?
No need any discrete card for HD audio in multiple display mode with Intel SNB.

renethx

03-18-12, 04:17 AM

Thanks rene.
Then, 3D HTPC users (not gamers) will be happy with their SNB iGPUs if they have HDMI 1.3 AVRs?
No need any discrete card for HD audio in multiple display mode with Intel SNB.
Should be clear from the table (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=21122837#post21122837).

ricabullah

03-18-12, 07:19 PM

The last question:
What commercial 3D player supports Liano iGPU?

renethx

03-18-12, 07:44 PM

The last question:
What commercial 3D player supports Liano iGPU?
At least PDVD11 and TMT5 support it. Llano iGPU is no different from the discrete version of Radeon HD 6xxx (except that it is integrated in the chip and video memory is part of the system memory).

ricabullah

03-18-12, 07:56 PM

Good news, thanks.
My SNB system doesn't work with any player on my frame -sequential Acer 5360 PJ in 3D mode while all players work on my 3D Panny TV. (PDVD12, TMT5, WinDVD11.)

Sammy2

03-20-12, 11:38 AM

amazon $10 GC for $5. (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=21802514#post21802514) Just thought I'd post it here in case it gets missed.

gtmtnbiker

03-20-12, 12:54 PM

I'm looking at the buyers_guide_htpc_11-10.pdf and I think there's a typo in one of the charts.

If you compare Figures 31 & 47, the column for Intel I3-2105, Z68 has an "x" for 720p 120Hz AFS in figure 31 but it's an "O" in figure 47. I think Figure 47 is the incorrect one.

In terms of cost, do one tend to find more bargains/deals with the ATX line of components? I've been following slickdeals.net and it seems that most of the deals are for ATX motherboards, power supplies, cases, etc.

rubberneck92105

03-23-12, 11:28 AM

jmpa

03-25-12, 10:06 AM

ricabullah

03-25-12, 12:27 PM

Well i3 2105 is great but to be honest is to much powerfull just only for htpc. I need another pc to work and i haven't to much money, so i am thinking in buy a h61 motherboard and a intel celerom.

What are the diference in celerom models? What models have hd2000 and hd3000?

None of those Celerons has hd 2000 or hd 3000 but just Intel HD Graphics (SNB).
Here is the comparison chart:

http://ark.intel.com/compare/53414,53415,53416

jmpa

03-25-12, 03:11 PM

None of those Celerons has hd 2000 or hd 3000 but just Intel HD Graphics (SNB).
Here is the comparison chart:

http://ark.intel.com/compare/53414,53415,53416

Thanks. Do you think is it enough with a H61 mb? Is able to play bluray movies?

ricabullah

03-25-12, 04:14 PM

Thanks. Do you think is it enough with a H61 mb? Is able to play bluray movies?

H61 matches to Celerons but Celeron doesn't support inTru 3D (Blu-ray 3D).

drtaau3

03-26-12, 03:02 PM

Need some HELP!!
Went with renethx media server guide from a couple of years ago. Just got it up and running a few months back. Everything was great!

Problem-- Every time I try to rip a movie to the server with clone it fails. (cyclic redundancy error)(drives 5&6)
Drives check out fine though - 6 Western Digital Caviar Green WD10EADS 1TB 32MB
connected with a supermicro aoc-saslp-mv8 firmware (3.1.0.21) card seems to drop drives.
on a GIGABYTE GA-MA780G-UD3H AMD 780G board.
Running W7 32bit
Ripping over network to server, no probs 245 movies so far, then wham!
Just cant seem to figure out what has gone wrong.
Please HELP!! Not sure if I should have even posted here, best thread for htpc though!
Any suggestions, experience, or curse words will be greatly appreciated.

tomandbeth

03-28-12, 12:47 PM

cableuser001

03-29-12, 12:29 AM

Hi, I have a PC that I built with the specs at the end of this message. These days I use it just to store media and not as a HTPC. Below are the symptoms:

1. Once in a while, when I use Picasa or Chrome, the screen becomes blank.
2. There is no video (the backlight seems to be on).
3. The PC runs fine otherwise, ie, I can access it over the network (see folders over the network etc.)
4. I updated the ATI Catalyst drivers, but it didn't help.
5. The monitor is connected to an Acer monitor via HDMI.

Any ideas what's going on. Below are the specs.

Motherboard: GA-MA78GM-US2H (http://www.gigabyte.us/products/product-page.aspx?pid=2995&dl=1#sp)
RAM: PNQ 2x2GB DDR2 800
Processor : AMD Athlon II X4 620

Thanks.

amcdoc

03-29-12, 01:00 PM

tydas

03-29-12, 01:57 PM

DragonQ

03-29-12, 02:23 PM

Do most folks build an htpc and then connect to a network share to watch videos? thats my intent, and I have a whs 2011 server.

Or load movies onto the htpc itself and then stream from htpc to various DUNE, popcorn hour, and wd devices.

Seems like the first solution with network share is the easiest to navigate to me.

thanks in advance to you erudite scholars here. any pros vs cons?
Well if your HTPC has videos on it and you're streaming them to other devices, then your HTPC kinda becomes a server. I like to keep them separate because they're designed for different things and thus have different hardware configurations and priorities:

File Server
- Use as little power as possible
- 24/7 use
- Cheap as possible
- Lots of SATA ports for loads of storage space
- Good cooling since it's in a cupboard and not tended to often
- Linux or Windows Server for stability

HTPC
- Use as little power as possible
- As quiet as possible
- Higher-end components
- Separate GPU for custom refresh rates and high quality hardware deinterlacing.
- 1 SATA port for OS SSD for fast wake/sleep/application launching/etc.
- 1 SATA port for a timeshifting/recording HDD
- BD-RE drive
- Should look nice
- Windows 7 for application support and DXVA2

I think you have to make more compromises if you combine the two, although it is certainly possible.

At some point in the future I plan to move my tuner card(s) to my server also and run MediaPortal TV-Server on it, then have several HTPC clients connecting to it. That way there'd be a central repository for timeshifts and recordings and multiple machines capable of watching TV without each one having a tuner card. They would all only require a 40 GB SSD with no HDD required.

jmpa

03-31-12, 08:31 AM

I already bought the new motherboard - Asus P8H67-M EVO to replace the z68.

Now the doubt is the cpu celeron 530 or pentium 620? It worth it 20 euros more? No 3D, only for 1080p/720p mkv and bluray movies playback.

Thanks

DragonQ

03-31-12, 08:46 AM

Do you have a separate GPU? If so, the G530 is plenty. If not, I'm not sure if either of those can handle 1080i with DXVA2...they probably can but maybe not with high quality MadVR.

jmpa

03-31-12, 12:37 PM

Do you have a separate GPU? If so, the G530 is plenty. If not, I'm not sure if either of those can handle 1080i with DXVA2...they probably can but maybe not with high quality MadVR.

I don't have separate GPU.. Thinking in future maybe put one, but to be honest I don't care MadVR I use XBMC and thats ok for me.. When XBMC allow MadVR without external player I prefer buy a GPU.

DragonQ

03-31-12, 01:11 PM

In that case, the Celeron should be fine. The only differences between the two are that the Pentium is more expensive, runs at 2.6 GHz instead of 2.4 GHz, and has 3 MiB of L3 cache instead of 2 MiB. Wikipedia says something about 3D video, which is uncited.

I recommend using LAV Filters in DXVA2 Native mode when using EVR. :)

amcdoc

04-02-12, 09:17 AM

ghatothkach

04-02-12, 05:47 PM

Then, let's say my current system is future-proof until 2013. :)
Thanks rene!

I guess, future-proof => 4-5 years. Whatever system you build should last for about 4-5 years, then its time for upgrade.

I have a BOXDG45FC based system I built about 3 years back and still going strong... I am eager to upgrade to the $35/- Raspberry Pi from here...

I also have a "work horse" fileserver+video processor using a Phenom IIX4, which I do plan to upgrade sometime in the next couple of years, unfortunately a couple of my drives died at the time of the thai floods (I am in the US) and I am still under water waiting for the HDD prices to get back to normal...
I still managed to get 3x$80/2TB drives, and now have RAID5 on the system.
that drive is still running at $100-120 online currently.

G

coocooc

04-04-12, 11:32 AM

Hello Rene

First thanks for your great efforts in testing, I really appreciate your in-depth hints!

Llano APU dethroned the golden combination of Core i3-2105+Z68+DDR3-2133. :) (DDR3-2133 is only available as 2 x 4GB or higher kit, that is pretty expensive compared with DDR3-1600 2 x 2GB, no need of overclocking, DXVA2 compatible AMD GPUs was implemented in LAV Video Decoder etc.)

Could you please clarify, what you mean by dethroned? The AMD combo has a technical advantage over the Intel one, or both are technically equivalent, but the AMD is available for less money?

At the moment I think about purchasing a pre-built device as I do not have enough experience with low-noise cases and setups. Would you recommend the Zotac ZBOX-ID82 or the ZBOX-ID80? The former one has HD Graphics 3000 and i3 2330M the latter one GeForce GT 520M and Atom D2700. I want to see BD-ISOs and DVD-ISOs mostly but also use the Web with this HTPC with the most demanding task probably HD-Youtube-Streams.

As I like to see foreign movies with subtitles, perfect subtitles are important (that's where the Dreambox is failing, even if movies are converted to MKV). Is there something to care for, e.g. only a certain HTPC-software does this right?

Two sidenotes, that might also influence the hardware choice:
- Is it possible to attach an external DVB-S2 tuner to these devices? It might replace my Dreambox 800 then.
- Is the gaming performance different between the solutions? (Very low priority, just for clarification; it's clear both are poor gaming PCs)

Would it be possible to build something perfomance-wise like the Zotacs for about the same price? I don't care for the small size, but would maybe go this way for lower noise with big fans, e.g. in a SilverStone Grandia. Does anybody know, if those Zotac boxes are noisy?

Thanks in advance for any insight!

jmpa

04-05-12, 08:15 AM

I am already using g530.
The pc works really well, but in xbmc I get a little disappointed. The menus are a little slow, some lag... There are any way to put it working better?
EDIT
Solution is turn on real fullscreen, instead of windowed mode, but still not smooth as i3.

On motherboard I choose iGPU and after I have "iGPU Memory" and it is 64mb. Should I change it?

EDIT2
Bluray disc playback is bad with only g530...
Is cheap but i3 is much better...

DragonQ

04-06-12, 01:53 PM

Are you using DXVA2? I find it hard to believe that the G530 can't handle BD playback.

biker972

04-11-12, 04:46 AM

Well if your HTPC has videos on it and you're streaming them to other devices, then your HTPC kinda becomes a server. I like to keep them separate because they're designed for different things and thus have different hardware configurations and priorities:

File Server
- Use as little power as possible
- 24/7 use
- Cheap as possible
- Lots of SATA ports for loads of storage space
- Good cooling since it's in a cupboard and not tended to often
- Linux or Windows Server for stability

HTPC
- Use as little power as possible
- As quiet as possible
- Higher-end components
- Separate GPU for custom refresh rates and high quality hardware deinterlacing.
- 1 SATA port for OS SSD for fast wake/sleep/application launching/etc.
- 1 SATA port for a timeshifting/recording HDD
- BD-RE drive
- Should look nice
- Windows 7 for application support and DXVA2

I think you have to make more compromises if you combine the two, although it is certainly possible.

At some point in the future I plan to move my tuner card(s) to my server also and run MediaPortal TV-Server on it, then have several HTPC clients connecting to it. That way there'd be a central repository for timeshifts and recordings and multiple machines capable of watching TV without each one having a tuner card. They would all only require a 40 GB SSD with no HDD required.

Hi to all,

I'm really glad that I finally found some great topic about HTPC, but unfortunately I found it after you guys wrote a zillion posts about this subject, and I don't have so much time to read it all.

I'm in dilemma what to do, build one system for HTPC and NAS, or do that in two separate systems...the problem is that two systems need a pretty much more space than one system.

In the quoted post, you said that your plan is to put mediaportal on NAS side (if I understood you well), so the only OS for NAS is windows (right)?
My plan was to put FreeNAS as OS, and Win on HTPC, but I really like your idea to put tuner on server and watch tv on any other device.